Prabhupāda: They are keeping the machine. What you will study the machine? Machine, according to his karma that particular person, this machine is given by God. Just like if you pay good price, you get a good machine. Similarly, bhrāmayan sarva-bhūtāni yantrārūḍhāni māyayā (BG 18.61). So God is supplying him the machine and the circumstances to work. They do not find out the man who is working on the machine; they are studying the machine. Such a foolish attempt.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: So they work only with matter, so they forget about spirit.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is their folly. Therefore they are rascal. That is described in the Bhāgavata, yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke, sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). They are animals, so what knowledge we can expect from these rascal animals? They are animals. They may pass on as big, big scientist to another animal, but they cannot pass on as big scientist to us.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: They have to be spiritualized to pass.
Jayatīrtha: Just like so many times on . . . (indistinct)
Prabhupāda: We . . . anyone who is simply understanding this matter, we immediately accept him as an animal, that's all. The animals take it.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: But majority of the people are all like that.
Prabhupāda: So therefore they are all animals—fools, rascals. Abodha-jāto, they have been described—all rascals, fools. Parābhavas tāvad abodha-jāto yāvan na jijñāsata ātma. So long they do not come to the point of understanding spirit soul, they are simply rascals. And whatever they are doing, simply being defeated actually. The so-called scientific research, simply their defeat. What they have gained? That is stated in Bhāgavata. Parābhava.
Parābhava means defeat. So long they do not come to the understanding of self, the spirit soul, they are simply rascals and fools. And what the rascals and fools can become victorious? They will never become victorious. They will always be subdued by the laws of nature. Parābhava, defeat simply. Whatever scientific discoveries, there is simply defeat, not conquering.
That old scientist, he could not check his old age, so what is the value of his scientific discovery? He could not check his growing in age, so what is the value of scientific advancement? He will die. They cannot check death, they cannot check old age.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Nobody can check death.
Prabhupāda: Then what is the advancement? The real problems are there. Parābhavas tāvad. Parābhava, simply defeat, wasting time being defeated by the laws of nature. They cannot understand anything properly.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Then why don't they search for real knowledge?
Prabhupāda: That is the . . . therefore they are rascal. Why they are rascal? They will not take real knowledge. Just like children: obstinate. The father says: "Don't touch, don't touch this." But he says: "No, touch," and he touches. As soon as he touches it, he makes (makes noise like one in pain).
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Burned.
Prabhupāda: That is their foolishness. They will not take the experience of Kṛṣṇa; they will manufacture their own experience. That is their folly. Therefore they are called . . . they have been addressed as mūḍhāḥ. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). Lowest of the mankind, mūḍhāḥ, they do not surrender . . . (indistinct)
So they will not take the intelligence given by Kṛṣṇa. They will manufacture their own intelligence. This is their folly. Therefore, they are rascals. Our process is all the big ācāryas, they are taking knowledge from Kṛṣṇa, Vyāsadeva, Kṛṣṇa's representative or guru. That is our process. And they are manufacturing their own laws.
They do not know the system; they take it as dogmatic. Just like we speak of Vaikuṇṭha from experienced knowledge. They won't believe it. But they do not know what are these planets, still they will not believe it. They cannot say anything except their home planet. Even they do not know what are the . . .
They have not studied all the corners of this planet. Therefore they sometimes say: "Oh, this discovery, this is our first discovery." Discovery means they do not know so many things. That is discovery. When they come to know, "Oh, it is working like this . . . (indistinct) . . ." But the things are there. So they do not know so many things, still they are scientists.