On the effulgence, shining of Kṛṣṇa's body, there are innumerable universes. Jagad-aṇḍa. Jagad-aṇḍa, this aṇḍa, you were talking of that egg. Aṇḍa means egg, egglike, jagad-aṇḍa. Yasya prabhā jagad-aṇḍa koṭi, and koṭiṣu vasudhādi-vibhūti-bhinnam (BS 5.40). In each universe there are millions and trillions of planets, each one different from the other. Vibhūti-bhinnam. Bhinnam means separate. As here earth is prominent, somewhere the fire is prominent, somewhere the air is prominent, but the whole thing is made of these five elements—earth, water, air, fire—that's all. So why should you deny that "Fire—no living entities"? You cannot live in the fire; you cannot live in the water. Does it mean others cannot? This is foolishness. This is foolish. And Kṛṣṇa says that imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1): "I spoke this philosophy, Bhagavad-gītā, to sun-god." His name is, name is also given, Vivasvān. So Vaivasvata Manu. So either Kṛṣṇa is talking lies... How Kṛṣṇa spoke unless he's a person, living there? Everything is there. We cannot conjecture from here that "Because I cannot live in such atmosphere, therefore others cannot live." No. There are different varieties of living entities, 8,400,000 varieties. How many you have seen?
Therefore you have to take knowledge from the perfect source. Then you can understand. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ gurum eva abhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). This is Vedic injunction. If you want to know perfectly everything, then you must go to the proper teacher. Then you will learn. But how you can imagine from here? A dwarf is trying to touch the moon. How it is possible? That is not possible. The Vedic injunction is, in order to... Tad-vijñānārtham. Higher science. Vijñāna means science. If you want to know higher science—not this science, simply filling of the belly; not this science—higher science, which is above the fulfilling the belly, that, for that purpose, you have to go to guru. Guru means who knows more than you. That is guru. So who can know more than Kṛṣṇa? Therefore we have to accept Kṛṣṇa as guru and learn from Him. Then you'll get perfect knowledge. And Kṛṣṇa also says that tad viddhi. Here Veda says, tad-vijñā... Tat, tat, sat, the real knowledge, transcendental knowledge, tat sat, which is eternal. So here Vedas says that tad viddhi, tad-vijñānārtham, and Kṛṣṇa also says tad viddhi: "You try to understand this transcendental knowledge." Tad viddhi praṇipātena (BG 4.34). Don't go to a guru to challenge him: "I shall see how much my guru knows." Then it will be useless. Praṇipātena.
Rūpa Gosvāmī, when he was in Vṛndāvana, he was known, the most learned scholar. So one mundane scholar came, and he approached Rūpa Gosvāmī and said, "Sir, I want to talk with you on śāstras." So Rūpa Gosvāmī said, "Why talking with me about śāstras?" "Now, you are well known, so well known about śāstra, Vedic literatures. So I want to test you." "So what is the purpose?" "Now, if I can defeat you, then I will be renowned." "All right. I am defeated." So there is no question of talking, because Rūpa Gosvāmī saw, "What is the use of talking with this rascal? He is for material name and fame." "So what do you want?" "Now, if you think that you are less intelligent, then give me in writing." "All right, I am giving in writing that 'This scholar has defeated me.' " So he gave him. (laughs) But Jīva Gosvāmī, his nephew, at the same time disciple, he was standing outside, that... He said, "What is that?" "Now your uncle has already given me in writing that he is defeated." "Let me see." So he took the paper. So he said, "All right, let us talk now." So when he talked with Jīva Gosvāmī, what is his learning? He became defeated. So sometimes, if somebody goes to challenge the guru, the real guru will say, "What is the use of talking with this nonsense? Better say that 'You know better than me.' That's all. 'Go away.' " Upekṣa. Upekṣa. Neglect him, because he has no intention to learn. He has come to simply waste time.