Jayatīrtha: Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma (SB 5.5.4). That the right one?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Jayatīrtha:
- yad indriya-prītaya āpṛṇoti
- na sādhu manye yata ātmano 'yam
- asann api kleśada āsa dehaḥ
- (SB 5.5.4)
"When a person considers sense gratification the aim of life, he certainly becomes mad after materialistic living and engages in all kinds of sinful activity. He does not know that due to his past misdeeds he has already received a body which, although temporary, is the cause of his misery. Actually, the living entity should not have taken on a material body, but he has been awarded the material body for sense gratification. Therefore I think that it is not befitting an intelligent man to involve himself again in the activities of sense gratification, by which he perpetually gets material bodies one after another." Purport? "Begging, borrowing and stealing to live for sense gratification is condemned in this verse because such consciousness leads one to a dark, hellish condition. The four sinful activities are illicit sex, meat-eating, intoxication and gambling. These are the means by which one gets another material body that is full of miseries."
Prabhupāda: They do not know. When you can say, they'll think, "What these people are talking?" They are so dull-brained. They cannot understand anything. We are taking it immediately, accepted. It is so serious. And you, on the general public, if you speak? "All nonsense they are speaking." Dull brain. By eating meat and intoxication they have lost their all human brain tissues. Such a condition. Still, some professors receiving and giving some applause. That is. Otherwise, who is understanding? The brain is so dull in the modern world.
Jayatīrtha: It's called a vicious cycle. Because the brain is so dull, therefore they can't understand how to stop performing these activities; and because they don't stop performing these activities, therefore the brain remains dull. In this way they are caught up.
Prabhupāda: No, pramattaḥ, that we can see. Pramattaḥ, mad. And everyone, especially in the Western country, so many madmen. The hippies, their whole sect, mad. Pramattaḥ. Then so-called businessman, so-called scientist, so-called philosopher—everyone is mad. And kurute vikarma, all sinful activities, especially the slaughterhouse. Horrible. Everyone is taking share of these sinful activities. They're fighting amongst themselves—this party, that party, Communist party, Fascist party, then barking in the United Nation and so on, so on. All mad. At least we must know it. Or we are talking nonsense, they are all right. What is your conviction?
Bhagavān: We are seeing that more and more we are having to preach to younger and younger people.
Prabhupāda: Those who are innocent.
Bhagavān: Yes. In the colleges even it is very difficult.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Bhagavān: In the colleges now. Before, it was not so difficult. Now they are becoming . . .
Prabhupāda: Spoiled, all spoiled. All spoiled.
Bhagavān: Now many devotees are younger, sixteen, seventeen years old, not so spoiled.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore Prahlāda Mahārāja said, kaumāra ācaret prājño dharman bhagavatān iha (SB 7.6.1): "From the very beginning." How they are spoiling the opportunity in the whole educational system, social system, political system. Let us do our duty. What can be done? Is there any purport?
Jayatīrtha: Yes, I read part of it. I'll go on. "In the Vedas it is said, asaṅgo hy ayaṁ purusaḥ. The living entity is not really connected with this material world, but due to his tendency to enjoy the material senses, he is put into the material condition. One should perfect his life by associating with devotees. He should not become further implicated in the material body."
Prabhupāda: Therefore Kṛṣṇa consciousness that, "Stop further implication."