Prabhupāda: Yes. He is making the theory that life has come from chemicals, by chemical combination, chemical evolution. Darwin's theory is also of that. This is their . . . big, big scientists, they are so fool that life has come from matter. Where is the proof? He was lecturing in California University, and there was one student, he is my disciple, he challenged him that, "If you get the chemicals, whether you can manufacture life?" That answer was, "That I cannot say." Why? You are putting this theory, that life has come from chemical. So science means observation and experiment. Now experimentally prove that the chemicals have produced a life.
Raymond Lopez: They're trying. (laughs)
Prabhupāda: That is another foolishness. When you are trying to be a lawyer or barrister, that does not mean you are barrister. When you are a student of law you cannot say that "I am barrister" or "advocate." That you cannot say. You are trying to be, that is another thing. But while they are trying to be, they are taking the position of leader. That is the misleading. That is described in the <i>Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥi> (SB 7.5.31): "One blind man is trying to lead many other blind men." What is the use of such leading? If the leader is blind, how he will do well to other blind men?
Bob Bourne: Beethoven was deaf.
Prabhupāda: Hmm?
Bob Bourne: Beethoven was deaf.
Prabhupāda: What is that?
Madhudviṣa: Beethoven, the great composer, he was deaf.
Bob Bourne: At least, for part of his life.
Raymond Lopez: But can't you have people doing good for the sake of goodness?
Prabhupāda: But he does not know what is good.
Raymond Lopez: But there are certain people . . .
Prabhupāda: Therefore I say blind. He does not know what is good. Real goodness is to understand God. That is real goodness.
Raymond Lopez: But there are certain things that you don't . . . that are good, that you can accept as being good just by themselves. Now, if you see an old lady who gets run over by a car, you go and help her. Now there are certain things that are good by themselves, I think, and that people will react and do the good thing, even though they mightn't have any concept of God.
Prabhupāda: No. Unless you have got the real platform, how you can do good? Just like our Madhudviṣa Mahārāja was obliged to you. They have done some good in legal affairs. But unless you are a lawyer, legal man, how can you do it? You have a mind to do good, but if you are not a lawyer, how could you do?
Wally Strobes: But there would be a lot of lawyers to do . . .