Prabhupāda: Independence means that you may obey me or not obey me. It is not my flaw. Otherwise, independence has no meaning. Independence has no meaning. If I give you independence . . . just like Kṛṣṇa is giving independence to Arjuna, "Now I have explained to you. Now I give you independence. Either you accept or not accept, that is your position." So if this independence has no such quality, accept or . . . that is not independence. If one has to be forced by the law of God, that is not independence. Then one does not know what is the meaning of independence.
Yogeśvara: Then why has He given us independence if . . .
Prabhupāda: Yes, He must give, because we, He, He has got . . .
Yogeśvara: . . . if we misuse it?
Prabhupāda: He has got, He's the Supreme Independent, and living entities are part and parcel of God. Therefore we must have independence. Otherwise, how it be he becomes perfect part and parcel?
Guru-gaurāṅga: And so if he did not have independence, that would be the flaw.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That will be the fault.
Bhagavān: That makes everything complete.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Independence means that you can do or not do. That is independence.
Bhagavān: Their definition of perfect is wrong. Just like this boy's definition of a poet . . .
Prabhupāda: He's a rascal. He's simply bogus. He's trying to . . . there are so many parties like that. They're four or five, they make a group and imitate these Beatle. As if . . . Beatles have made money; they'll also make money. That is the . . . and speak all nonsense. That's all. These are crazy fellow. So independence means that you can do or not do. Just like you, as a nation, American nation or English nation, you are all independent. But why you go to the jail? Is it government's fault that you go to the jail? Therefore government has fault? Why is this nonsense question? When a man, instead of going to the university, goes to the police custody, is it government's fault? Is it?
Haṁsadūta: No.
Prabhupāda: Then? It is a commonsense affair. The God has given you independence. If you do something wrong, against the will of God, then you must suffer. Therefore we find so many varieties of living entities, in different grades of life. That is due to misuse of independence.
Yogeśvara: Very popular today is the idea that if we are use . . . misusing our independence, it's because of our upbringing, our childhood, our society; something is wrong in our psychology. Not that it's soul, not that it's a question of spiritual problem, but material one, that our parents were cruel or our society, our education was imperfect or something. But not spiritual problem.
Prabhupāda: So that is independence. Your parents were cruel; therefore you have revolted against the parents. That is your independence. Why you revolted against parents? Because you have got the independence.
Shivananda: What shall we say to someone, Prabhupāda . . .
Prabhupāda: Otherwise, if you are doing stereotyping, then in spite of your father being cruel, you would not declare independence and go away from home. Because you have got this independence, therefore you can understand that, "Why shall I obey this father? I go out." That is independence. They do not understand the meaning of independence.