Vivasvan (Conversations 1976 - 1977)

Expressions researched:
"Surya" |"Surya's" |"Surya-narayana" |"Suryadeva" |"Vairaja" |"Vivasvan"

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 20, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: He came one sūrya-grahaṇa occasion. (break) ...in America. That is better than calling a government. What is the government? I don't care for them, these politicians. In America I never attempted to see the politicians, secretary and... Never attempted. I was sitting down under the tree and playing my dundubhi.

Dayānanda: Yes. For one year the Marquis of Zetland was interested, and then what is the use? After that, then finished.

Prabhupāda: Finished.

Dayānanda: Just five hundred pounds spent in two years, and then nothing.

Prabhupāda: Then nothing.

Morning Walk -- April 16, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: Vivasvān.

Prabhupāda: Yes. "But You are of my age. How I can accept this?" And immediately answer was that "Both of us were present. You have forgotten. I have not forgotten." Bas. Accept it. He did not challenge, "How is that? I have forgotten? You did not forget?" And that is nonsense. That is nonsense.

Dr. Patel: Śādhi māṁ tvāṁ prapannam.

Prabhupāda: Yes. As soon as he questions like that, "How is that You have not forgotten? I have forgotten?" it is not good. Then he is not fit for making question. He should not have made question. (break) ...saw the gosvāmī?

Dr. Patel: Have you got them here?

Prabhupāda: I think we have got, eh?

Garden Conversation -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Why, in different season, the day is longer and shorter?

Rakṣaṇa: The time that Lord Vivasvān takes to travel across the sky differs.

Prabhupāda: Who travels? You say.(?) Sun is fixed up, they say.

Devotee: According to their theory, it is fixed up.

Prabhupāda: According to our theory.... We don't say theory. According to Bhāgavata statement, in this season, the sun runs slow. In the other season, the sun runs fast. That is understandable. But if the sun is fixed up, why in some season if is going fast and some season it is going slow?

Mādhavānanda: Their theory is because the earth is tilted on an axis, that during the winter season the sun is hitting at a different angle, and therefore it's different time. They say that the earth is rotating also, and the axis is turning from one side to the other, so that north is sometimes...

Interview with Mike Darby -- June 30, 1976, Wheeling, W. Virginia:

Hari-śauri: From 4.1?

śrī bhagavān uvāca

imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ

proktavān aham avyayam

vivasvān manave prāha

manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt

(BG 4.1)

"The Blessed Lord said: I instructed this imperishable science of yoga to the sun-god, Vivasvān, and Vivasvān instructed it to Manu, the father of mankind, and Manu, in turn, instructed it to Ikṣvāku."

Prabhupāda: So Kṛṣṇa instructed first to the sun-god. Sun-god instructed his son, Manu; he instructed his son, Ikṣvāku. In this way things are coming. Then read the second verse.

Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: And in this connection we actually wanted to also study Bhaktisiddhānta Prabhupāda's...

Prabhupāda: Sūrya-siddhānta.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But where is that book?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Pradyumna told me that it's available in Bengali, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: If it is available, get it. (indistinct) He was one of the authorities about sun movements.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I heard that it will be very...

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) He got this Sūrya-siddhānta, Siddhānta Sarasvatī. He was very expert astrologer.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So we were thinking that there must be some more information there.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) There are (in) Calcutta many... Some of them still, living or dead I do not know. But in India, in Benares you'll find many astrologers. You said in your book that the sun is the nearest planet?

Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) He's a person, sun-god. That is described in the Bhagavad-gītā, imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1), a person. That is his planet. He is the predominating Deity. And similarly moon. And the kṣatriyas, they are coming from these two planets. As it is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, vivasvān manave prāha manur ikṣvākave... Ikṣvāku is the sūrya-vaṁśa, the kṣatriya family coming from the sun.

Yadubara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, we're taking this from the Bhāgavatam. Won't they just think that this is myth?

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) is myth? Who believes you? If you don't believe me, I don't believe you. Finished.

Yadubara: So we should present our side.

Interview and Conversation -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: How did you get the information?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: In the card catalogue. I think Pradyumna found it. Pradyumna, three, four, five of us went there to see the library. Actually we went to discuss that Sūrya-siddhānta and some of the astronomical calculations. We wanted to check in the library, but they didn't have anything. We found some.

Prabhupāda: Found?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I found one Bhāgavata-purāṇa, it was printed in sometime 1901. Their summary of Bhāgavatam, they also described the planetary system, earth first, then... No. Yes, earth, then sun, then moon, like that, in circles.

Prabhupāda: They are... Just see. Their all activities are in Arizona. That's all. That is disclosed yesterday. He has...

Interview with Religious Editor Of the Associated Press -- July 16, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: We do not belong either to the Hindus or Christian or Jewish. We belong to Kṛṣṇa or God. Kṛṣṇa means God.

Interviewer: Yeah, but you use the Hindu scriptures.

Prabhupāda: That is another thing. Just like we say the sun, sūrya and you say the sun, the "sun." But the subject matter is the same. You say the sun in the sky as s-u-n, "sun." And we say in India sūrya. S-ū-r-y-a. So the name may be different but the object is the same.

Interviewer: In other words, do you think the India-originated religion is, serves its particular purpose in the Western society? I mean, does, is it of particular value in a rather technological society, the Hindu tradition?

Interview with Trans-India Magazine -- July 17, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: First of all, we do not accept anyone as guru if he's not competent to understand Bhagavad-gītā and preach it also. He's not a guru. The guru's definition given in the Bhagavad-gītā, imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1), in the Fourth Chapter you'll find, vivasvān manave prāha manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt.

evaṁ paramparā-prāptam

imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ

sa kāleneha mahatā

yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa

(BG 4.2)

Kṛṣṇa said to Arjuna, "My dear Arjuna, this Bhagavad-gītā philosophy or yoga system, first of all I spoke to the sun-god. And then he spoke to his son, Manu. Then Manu spoke to his son Ikṣvāku." In this way the knowledge comes down from the spiritual master to the disciple or from the father to the son. So unless one comes in this disciplic succession, he cannot become guru. Therefore I do not know all of them. All the swamis and yogis who came here, they do not belong to this paramparā system, so therefore they are not bona fide guru. They are presenting themselves as guru, but they are not guru.

Room Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Still there are there?

Parivrājakācārya: A few, a few temples here.

Prabhupāda: They are fire worshipers, Sūrya. (indistinct) Their marriage ceremony is just like Hindus. (to someone else) Namaskāra, Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Parivrājakācārya: The language is very...

Prabhupāda: You have taken prasādam?

Parivrājakācārya: The whole language here is very similar to Sanskrit, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: You can read this also. This is in Sanskrit. (to Iranian student:) You understand English? Very good. Your country is very nice. So nice food, fruits.

Press Interview at Muthilal Rao's House -- August 17, 1976, Hyderabad:

Harikeśa: Vivasvān manave prāha.

Prabhupāda: Ah, vivasvān manave prāha manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt, evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). So where is rājarṣi? That is the difficulty. Where is that brāhmaṇa, where is that kṣatriya, where is that system? Now anyone can capture the political power by hook and crook, that is another thing. But it is meant for the rājarṣi, imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ. Where is their training? The politician, where he is trained up as ṛṣi? There is no such service.

Interviewer (4): Has there been any official opposition to your movement in any country?

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Morning Walk -- August 31, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: ...simply, prabhāsmi śaśi-sūryayoḥ. Why they cannot see? Here is prabhā of the sūrya. Where is the difficulty? Prabhāsmi śaśi-sūryayoḥ. (break) ...this man thinks about death?

Indian man (3): Well, modernized man is mostly either afraid of the death or he doesn't know of the death.

Prabhupāda: Afraid of death everyone. There is no doubt. Unless he's a madman.

Indian man (3): But then a... I don't think anybody believes he will be afraid even there is a change of birth or change of body.

Prabhupāda: They may say so, but actually they are. As soon as there is some signal of death they are very much disturbed.

Indian man (3): I don't think one should be afraid of death.

Prabhupāda: No, afraid means...

Letter to Sai Baba -- September 13, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (dictating:) So one has to accept the statement of Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, how He is originally the puruṣa or person. Impersonal Brahman is expansion of the rays of His personal body, exactly like the sunshine is expansion of the rays of the sun-god Vivasvān. Vivasvān is a person in the sunglobe and Kṛṣṇa is also a person who spoke the philosophy of Bhagavad-gītā long, long years before He spoke the same to Arjuna. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1). Therefore the conclusion is that originally God is always a person. Impersonal Brahman is emanation from the personal God. In other words, God, personal God is not from impersonal Brahman, but impersonal Brahman is from the personal God. That is confirmed in the Bhagavad-gītā as follows.

Garden Conversation -- October 9, 1976, Aligarh:

Prabhupāda: "One has to take shelter of Me." That is Kṛṣṇa conscious movement. We are giving equal chance everyone. It doesn't matter what he is. Kṛṣṇa says, māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ. Pāpa-yoni means low class, poor, uneducated, ugly, no education. That is pāpa-yoni. So they can be raised. Kṛṣṇa says. How? Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya. If he is engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Therefore it is the topmost welfare activities in the human society. Anyone can be raised. There are different grades of life all over the world. Some are black, some are white, some are ugly, some are poor. Varieties. Some are trees, some are plants, some are aquatics, some are birds, beasts, insects. Different varieties of life, 8,400,000. Some of them demigods, Brahmā, Indra, Candra. Very, very powerful. Just like this sun, that is also a planet, and the chief person is the sun-god Vivasvān. We get all this information. There is. These rascals, they do not know what are these planets, what are the arrangement.

Garden Conversation -- October 9, 1976, Aligarh:

Prabhupāda: No king, no ruling. Therefore chaotic condition. Otherwise, according to God's plan, every planet there is one chief person ruling. So in the sun there is a person. His name is given in the Bhagavad-gītā. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān. His name is Vivasvān. And his son is Vaivasvata Manu. Vivasvān manave prāha. These things are there. And his son, Ikṣvāku. And from Ikṣvāku, the kṣatriya-vaṁśa... In India still, the kṣatriyas are known, two dynasties, one from sun, one from the moon. Candra-vaṁśa, Sūrya-vaṁśa. Still, they are. So the kṣatriyas are coming. One dynasty is coming from the sun, another... So moon is not desert. These are simply rascals. They do not know anything, and rascals believe that the moon is desert, and the sun is desert. Only this planet is full of variety and beauty. No. We have to take lessons from the śāstras. So anyone can be raised to the highest platform.

Press Interview -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: He is not a scholar. He's a rascal. We have to follow the ācāryas. The ācāryas never said. There are so many ācāryas. They never say. So, we have to follow, ācāryopāsanam, not the rascals. We cannot worship the rascals. Worship ācāryas. They are guide. So śāstra says... Find out sa evāyaṁ mayā te 'dya yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. Purātanaḥ, Kṛṣṇa says that imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1), "I spoke this science to Vivasvān, the sun-god." So if you calculate sun, this sun, Vivasvān, is the father of Manu, Vaivasvata Manu. And if you take, calculate, it becomes forty millions of years. So this Bhagavad-gītā is spoken, according to the Bhagavad-gītā, according to the version of Kṛṣṇa, forty millions of years ago. Now He says that science was known to the people by paramparā. And that paramparā is lost somehow or other. Therefore as... (break)

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Evening Darsana -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam: (BG 4.2) "First of all I said to Vivasvān." The predominating deity in the sun planet is called Vivasvān. His name is Vivasvān. So he spoke to his son Manu. Manu spoke to his son Ikṣvāku. In this way He describes, sa kāleneha mahatā yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa: "That paramparā system is now lost. Therefore I am speaking you the old truth." Yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. That is nothing new; the same thing. And if we give up this paramparā system, then yogo naṣṭaḥ. So nobody is taking this Bhagavad-gītā in the paramparā system. He is interpreting in his own way. Therefore it is already naṣṭaḥ; it has no value. So this is going on. Yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa. So because... Why we have to take from the authority? Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). Because guru means he presents the truth as it is. And as soon as you interpret, it is naṣṭaḥ; it is spoiled. They are reading Bhagavad-gītā, but they do not take this instruction, that "I am presenting Bhagavad-gītā in a way which is spoiled." And they're insisting. So if you think that Indira Gandhi... I think so also because I have heard so many times. Why not...? His (Her) position is very nice. If he (she) actually follows the instruction of Kṛṣṇa, his (her) position will be more secure. That is sure. Let her take this.

Room Conversation with Two Indian Guests -- January 27, 1977, Jagannatha Puri:

Prabhupāda: They go to other temples also.

Guest (1): Many.

Prabhupāda: But pure Vaiṣṇava, they worship only Kṛṣṇa. But the Hindu dharma, they worship anyone—Gaṇeśa, Devī, and Lord Śiva and Sūrya. At least Śaṅkarācārya limited within these five. Now their descendants, they say, "If you worship stool, that is also God." They say like that. You know that? Eh?

Pradyumna: Yeah, I've heard that.

Prabhupāda: They have gone so down, that "Even with your faith if your worship stool, that is God realization." (Bengali) Just become Prahlāda Mahārāja. Just go, persecution like Prahlāda Mahārāja. Then you talk of. You are not Prahlāda Mahārāja. You are ordinary person. Your business is mām ekam śaraṇaṁ vraja. Kṛṣṇa never said, "He Prahlāda Mahārāja, God kambha(?), so you also worship kambha(?)." Never said, Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, mām ekam. That is Gītā.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Gargamuni: Sunday is first. It is the sun. Then Moonday, Moon.

Prabhupāda: That is all over the world, Sunday first, Monday second. Ravi, Soma.

Pradyumna: Vahni-maṅgala, Sūrya-maṅgala, Soma-maṅgala in arcanā.

Prabhupāda: In arcanā also the...

Pradyumna: Oṁ anvahni-maṅgalaya dāsa-kalātmānenava om an arka-maangalaya dvadāsa-kalātmānena va om an soma-maṅgalaya sodāsa-kalātmānenava.(?)

Prabhupāda: Sūrya-maṅgala above.

Pradyumna: Before, below. Then comes Soma-maṅgala. Soma-maṅgala, last.

Prabhupāda: That's...

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Vahni-maṅgala, Sūrya-maṅgala, Soma-maṅgala.

Prabhupāda: So let us do something, (laughs) Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, we can meet the any scientist also.

Hari-śauri: We need a Kṛṣṇa conscious astronomer now too.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Hari-śauri: Then that will be complete.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Actually we started looking some on this astronomy thing. About this Sūrya-siddhānta. Sadāpūta is especially interested because he's a mathematician. So normally astronomy is subject of mathematics. So he found this copy in Princeton just recently, last month or so. There we found that the idea is very similar to modern science in the Sūrya-siddhānta. But we heard that Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta Prabhupāda translated Sūrya-siddhānta, but we are not getting a copy of it. So he asked me to look in Calcutta, and some astrologers.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: My Guru Mahārāja was a great astronomer.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I think that would be our proper research, to look into it.

Prabhupāda: From Sūrya-siddhānta he got the "Bhaktisiddhānta." He got this title Sūrya-siddhānta. So when he became Vaiṣṇava... A Vaiṣṇava he was as a Bhaktisiddhānta.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We saw some translations in English, Sūrya-siddhānta. That was in Library of Congress in Washington. But the translation there was very... Was not good. It was all wrong interpretations.

Prabhupāda: Who translated?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Some English authors, outsiders.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Pradyumna: There's copy of Sūrya-siddhānta by Bhaktisiddhānta in London at India Office Library. They have a copy in Bengali.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: In Bengali?

Pradyumna: Yes, they have original, these. But they do not let... They have a funny... You cannot copy the whole book with a xerox there. You only can see it and copy by hand. They won't let you do it. But there's a copy there, Samadhi Press.

Prabhupāda: It must be very old paper.

Pradyumna: Yes, very old.

Room Conversation about BTG the Moon -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, "sun-god" means he lives in the sun.

Prabhupāda: Vivasvān manave prāha. And Manu, his son, his family and...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: House.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is there. You are scientist. You are very expert, more than Kṛṣṇa. Therefore you believe like that.

Hari-śauri: Then if we accept your reasoning, then show us practically where there is life in fire.

Prabhupāda: You cannot see, rascal, because you are rascal. Therefore you cannot see. You have to hear. That is also... Because you are rascal, you cannot see. You simply... Just like you have not seen your father. Rascal, who can see? Who is that rascal who can see his father? You have to hear from the mother. You rascal, you cannot see your father. Why you are claiming that "I want to see my real father." That is not possible. You have to simply hear from the mother. That is only source. Similarly, you are rascal, everything is, you, imperfect, so you have to hear from the authority. That is only source.

Conversation with Vedic Astronomer -- April 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Candrama has... Candrama has got his own light. It is not reflection.

Indian Astronomer: Not reflection. It has its own importance. But about the lights...

Prabhupāda: As sūrya is blazing, similarly, candrama is also blazing, but it is surrounded by cool cloud. Therefore it is so soothing. But it is above the sun planet, so far it is stated there.

Indian Astronomer: Natural... Naturally sūrya, our astronomy says, sūryaḥ agni (Sanskrit). Vedas say, (Sanskrit). Because the nakṣatras only.

Prabhupāda: So when you begin this diagram?

Indian Astronomer: After going my town.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Room Conversation With Son (Vrindavan De) -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Sūrya-siddhānta.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We are going to consult some other texts to get the full picture.

Prabhupāda: And what is from Bhāgavata? The sun movement?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's just like there's a couple of things that we want to get very clear. Like it's described that one of the axles...

Prabhupāda: Uttarāyaṇa, dakṣiṇāyana. This Sumeru Mountain... So six months, northern side; six months, southern side.

Room Conversation -- October 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Where is...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Juice? They're just making it, Śrīla Prabhupāda. It says here that "The moon is in the eighth house, which is very bad. The patient may not recover." Then he gives various planets which are also not well aligned. He says the conjunction of another two planets is very bad. "Hospitalization and ill health are intensified in the present year. The days which are not good is when the moon passes in the 22nd to the 23rd of nakṣatra, which are 27th to the 28th of September," that's already passed, "The 24th to the 25th of October, then some days in November and December." He says, "Sūrya will apply for Rahu on Saturday, the 8th of October." That's today. This is very bad, this day. Today is Ekādaśī. "Sūrya will apply for Rahu. Brashna, Lagnesh, Mangal, in the eighth house. The medicine will not give any relief. The native will make a fight for life as Sūrya-Mangal are good friends, and Saturn, or Śani, and Śukra are enemies.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Pradyumna: "27th, 28th September."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's past.

Pradyumna: "And 24th, 25th October, and 20th, 21st, 22nd November, and 3rd and 4th December. In the praśna-lagna, lord eighth house, enemy of Saturn, Sūrya will apply to Rāhu." This is coming now... This is past. That is on 28th...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Eighth October.

Pradyumna: Yes. That was 8th.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Praśna-lagna.

Pradyumna: "Sūrya will come, transited Rāhu." This was on 8th October.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Strength of lagna."

Pradyumna: Now he is telling in this praśna-lagna some points. When he did this praśna, lord of lagna was Maṅgala, or Mars. This lord of lagna is in eighth house. That is not a good sign. First he says, "The strength of lagna means nil." Lagna means health. Lagna means the personality and the health. So strength of lagna, strength of health-nil. "Two, seventh house. Seventh and second house are disease-strong." Health is weak and disease is strong. "Posited in tenth house. The native will not come up..."

Room Conversation -- October 21, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura therefore said, miche māyār bośe, jāccho bhese. The whole world is being washed away by the waves of material nature. Māyār vasana. Vairaja.(?) When we understand that everything is being washed away... That is viśva-rūpa. Kṛṣṇa went... From mouth everything is coming out. If you want to stop it, then this is the chance, human life. Hm. This is viśva-rūpa. (break) ...the same field. (break) (kīrtana)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Chant loudly. (kīrtana gets louder) (break)

Bhavānanda: Very early this morning. (break) Tamāla and all of us have met and thought that "Let us..." Our position is to serve you according to your desire. Since you didn't request any medicines, we felt that we shouldn't try to... From what we've seen, today you've rested very much deep sleep, and the vomitous nausea has disappeared. But you haven't passed very much urine today. One reason is that you were taking that mild dialysis medicine. For the past three days you've been taking medicine to help you pass urine. So usually when you stop taking that medicine, it takes a day or two for the urine function to start naturally again.