Prabhupāda: So similarly, every living entity is Brahman, but paraṁ brahma is one. That is Kṛṣṇa. And therefore in the Brahma-saṁhitā it is confirmed, īśvaraḥ paramaḥ krsnaḥ (Bs. 5.1). Kṛṣṇa is... Everyone īśvara, more or less controller. Lord Śiva, Lord Brahmā, Indra, Varuṇa, Vāyu, Candra, Sūrya. There are so many. They're all demigods. Say, almost God. But they are not Supreme God. Supreme God is one. Sometimes people who do not know the purpose of Vedas, they say, "The Hindus are worshiper of many gods." That is nonsense. Actually those who are followers of Vedas, they worship Kṛṣṇa, only Kṛṣṇa or Viṣṇu. Tad viṣṇoḥ paramaṁ padaṁ. Ṛg mantra. Tad viṣṇoḥ paramaṁ padaṁ sadā paśyanti sūrayaḥ. And in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyam (BG 15.15). What is the purpose of Vedas? To understand Kṛṣṇa. One who does not understand Kṛṣṇa, his Vedānta philosophy is nonsense. However you may advertise that "I am Vedāntist," is a pakka nonsense.
Vivasvan (Conversations 1969 - 1975)
Conversations and Morning Walks
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Forgot, you forgot. That is your nature. You forget so many things. You cannot remember what you were doing exactly at this time yesterday. Can you remember immediately? Forgetfulness is our nature. We are very minute; therefore our..., we are subjected to the quality of forgetfulness. Just like Arjuna. Arjuna was asking Kṛṣṇa that "How I can believe that you told this philosophy of Bhagavad-gītā to Vivasvān?" He said that "In... I, first of all, I told to Vivasvān." So in reply to that question, Kṛṣṇa said that "Both you and I had many, many births before, but you have forgotten; I remember." That is the difference between the Supreme Lord and ourself. He does not forget. He remembers everything, past, present, future, all, but we forget. That is the difference between God and living entity. We are subjected to forgetfulness. So we forget; again, if it is reminded, we remind. That is our nature. So at the present moment we are forgetful of our eternal relationship with Kṛṣṇa. And then, by good association, by constant chanting, hearing, remembering, we again revoke our old consciousness.
Prabhupāda: And if you approach the sun globe and if you penetrate into the sun, if you have got strength to go into the... Just like you are trying go to the moon planet. If you have got really scientific strength to go within the sun planet, then you'll find there is sun-god. That information we get from Bhagavad-gītā. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1). "I told the sun-god Vivasvān first." So therefore there is a person. And why not a person? Your imagination is not ultimate truth. We get information from Kṛṣṇa, there is a person, Vivasvān. So there is a person, he's sitting there. Person, globe, sun, sunshine. Which is important? Which is important?
Allen Ginsberg: The person, the globe or the sunshine?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Allen Ginsberg: (laughs) I don't know.
Prabhupāda: Yes. There is śāstric information. He is incarnation of Nārāyaṇa, Sūrya-nārāyaṇa. He is powerful. He is driving in four horses. He has got chariot of four horses and very powerful. Yac cakṣur eśa savita. Savita, his name is Savita. The Gāyatrī mantra is oṁ bhur bhuvaḥ svāḥ tat savitur varenyam bhargo devasya dhimahi. That is worshiping the sun-god.
Allen Ginsberg: Do you use Gāyatrī mantra also?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Allen Ginsberg: I know some of it. Oṁ bhur...
Prabhupāda: Yes. Oṁ bhur bhuvaḥ svaḥ tat savitur varenyam bhargo devasya dhimahi dhiyo yo naḥ pracodayāt. This Gāyatrī, this is called.
Prabhupāda: This science of Kṛṣṇa consciousness was understood by disciplic succession. Paramparā-prāptam. Imaṁ vivasvavate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam: "My dear Arjuna, don't think that this Kṛṣṇa consciousness science I am speaking to you is something new. No." Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam: (BG 4.1) "It is eternal, and first I spoke to sun-god." Vivasvate. Vivasvān manave prāhuḥ: "And Vivasvān said to his son, Manu." Manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt: "And Manu also transferred this knowledge to his son, Ikṣvāku." Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam: (BG 4.2) "In this way, by disciplic succession, it is coming on." Sa kāleneha yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa: "But in due course of time it is now broken. Therefore I am speaking to you again." So a mantra should be captured from the disciplic succession. According to Vedic injunction, sampradāya-vihīnā ye mantrās te nisphala mataḥ: "If the mantra does not come through disciplic succession, then it will not be active." Viphala. Mantrās te viphalāḥ. Viphala means "will not produce result." Mantrās te viphalāḥ mataḥ.
1970 Conversations and Morning Walks
Guest (9): Different stages? Are there different stages?
Prabhupāda: Different features. Just like Sūryaloka or Sūryadeva or Sūrya-raśmi. (Hindi)
Guest (9): I see.
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) Different stages. (Hindi)
Guest (9): You have to try to come in second arya. (?)
Prabhupāda: Then second, paramātmā-jñāna. Then bhagavad-jñāna.
Guest (9): (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) That is the pure bhakti. (Hindi) my family, my...so many responsibility, (Hindi).
Guest (9): It is very difficult to give up.
Prabhupāda: It is difficult, but there is way.
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is śakti-tattva. We have to take expansion according to the tattva. Substance and categories; in which category. The substance is Viṣṇu, and all other tattvas are categories. So devatās, they are śakti-tattva, śakti category, the same category as you are. The same example. Just like here a government officer, he is also Indian gentleman, you are also Indian gentleman, but he has got his power on account of his high qualities. Similarly you can become also Durgā. You can become Indra, Candra, Sūrya. So qualitatively the ant, you are a learned brāhmaṇa, they are all the same category.
Dr. Singh: (indistinct), you mean our High Commissioner?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dr. Singh: Yes, and he is also very much..., he does sūrya-namaskāra and things of that nature.
Prabhupāda: Anyway, he wants to help me, but he cannot.
Dr. Singh: Why can he not?
Prabhupāda: I do not know.
Dr. Singh: I'll write to him. I'll write to him.
Prabhupāda: So anyway, give us some place in London.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Good citizenship means living under the direction of the government. That is good citizenship. Similarly, human life means to live nicely under the direction of God. The cats and dogs, they cannot understand. But the human life, (pause) That first verse: imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam, vivasvān manave prāha manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt (BG 4.1). So what is your explanation of this verse?
Guest (2): You want to explain this into er... Do you want to explain this?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam, vivasvān manave prāha manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt (BG 4.1).
Prabhupāda: Just like...
Guest (2): So actually they have acquired it from one source.
Prabhupāda: Yes. One link. So that is being deviated. What Kṛṣṇa said to Vivasvān, to the sun-god now everyone is speaking in his own way, not in that way.
Guest (2): That's right.
Prabhupāda: Therefore it is deviated. The Bhagavad-gītā, the Chapter, Fourth Chapter explains that you cannot understand Bhagavad-gītā by your own interpretation. You must follow the instruction of the original speaker of Bhagavad-gītā. The original speaker is Kṛṣṇa. So what Kṛṣṇa says, they have to follow it. Then it is Bhagavad-gītā. Otherwise if you interpret it in a different way then it is not Bhagavad-gītā. Now, what Kṛṣṇa says we have to understand it philosophically, ethically, scientifically, any way, any angle of vision.
Prabhupāda: So will you explain me in English some of the Fourth, Fourth Chapter.
Scholar: This what you got in it? What you got? Fourth Chapter.
Prabhupāda: What is the subject matter?
Scholar: About yoga has been taught by Vivasvān, and Vivasvān taught to Manu, and Manu taught to Ikṣvāku.
Prabhupāda: So only the translation is there?
Scholar: Yes. Translation and some explanations.
Prabhupāda: What is that explanation?
Scholar: He said that Vivasvān is the personification of Sūrya, the sun-god. He was the first man created by Brahmā and he learns yoga from (indistinct) himself. And then we..., Vivasvān taught yoga to Manu, who is the creator of the law, and of institutions. Just explaining only the, who is Ikṣvāku, who is Vivasvān, and so on. There's no philosophical explanation. Just word by word explanations. Because of course if you compare...
Prabhupāda: But er... He said that indirectly, in the Bhagavad-gītā, the original verse can you read? Original verse?
Scholar: Śrī Bhagavān uvāca: imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1).
Prabhupāda: Yes. This Bhagavān uvāca.
Prabhupāda: Śrī Bhagavān spoke. But you told me Brahmā.
Scholar: No. Śrī Bhagavān spoke, telling people, telling Arjuna that yoga has been taught by God to Vivasvān.
Prabhupāda: God, God, "By Me." He said that "I taught."
Scholar: Yes.
Prabhupāda: But where the translation that God said Brahmā... Bhagavān said that this was spoken by Brahmā.
Scholar: By him, no, explanations...
Prabhupāda: No, not explanations. First in the translations.
Prabhupāda: That is all right.
Scholar: Yes. It's mentioned there.
Prabhupāda: Bhagavān, that Bhagavān said that "I spoke." Is that?
Scholar: Bhagavān said that yoga has been taught by Me to Vivasvān.
Prabhupāda: That's nice.
Scholar: Yes. And then Vivasvān taught it to Manu and so on.
Prabhupāda: That's all right.
Scholar: Yes.
Prabhupāda: This is nice translation.
Prabhupāda: This is nice translation.
Scholar: Yes.
Prabhupāda: But you had explained...
Scholar: ...that Vivasvān is the personification of Sūrya and he is the first man...
Prabhupāda: What do you mean by personification?
Scholar: As the embodiment of Sūrya. So Sūrya is supposed to be...
Prabhupāda: No. He says that "I spoke to Sūrya, Vivasvān." Vivasvān.
Scholar: Vivasvān. Yes.
Prabhupāda: So Vivasvān is a person.
Scholar: Vivasvān. Yes.
Prabhupāda: So Vivasvān is a person.
Scholar: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Vivasvān is a person, not the personification. What is the translation, explanation given?
Scholar: Vivasvān, in Indonesian is, Vivasvān (Indonesian) is supposed to be...
Prabhupāda: Now what he has translated.
Devotee: "The Blessed Lord said, 'I instructed this imperishable science of yoga to the sun god, Vivasvān. Vivasvān instructed it to Manu, the father of mankind, and Manu, in turn, instructed it to Ikṣvāku.' "
Prabhupāda: Now what is the explanation?
Prabhupāda: This Vivasvān is the original person of the kṣatriya family, Sūrya-vaṁśa.
Scholar: Sūrya-vaṁśa.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Eh?
Devotee: Does he mention Vivasvān here? Should I read it?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Scholar: The sun is the king of the planets and the sun god (at present of the name Vivasvān) rules...
Prabhupāda: At the present moment, the president or the predominating person, his name is given, Vivasvān.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Scholar: From Sūrya-vaṁśa.
Prabhupāda: Not from Sūrya-vaṁśa. He's the origin of Sūrya-vaṁśa.
Scholar: Origin of Sūrya-vaṁśa.
Prabhupāda: Ah.
Scholar: A thing about the Bhagavad-gītā also mentioned here, in the second verse. It's mentioned also that the Bhagavad-gītā is the oldest yoga. It's the oldest...
Prabhupāda: No, the thing is... The explanation: Vivasvān is personification of Sūrya. No. He's person.
Scholar: Person. I see. Yes. Person and ...
Prabhupāda: His name is Vivasvān.
Prabhupāda: The predominating deity in the sun planet, his name is Vivasvān.
Scholar: Vivasvān, yes. And he's supposed to be the originator of...
Prabhupāda: He's the original person for the... There are two kinds of kṣatriyas. One coming from the sun-god, and the other is coming from the moon god, candra-vaṁśa, sūrya-vaṁśa.
Scholar: That's a very good correction for us. (Indonesian)
Prabhupāda: Personification means he... From the explanation it appears that actually there is no person.
Scholar: Yes. Originally there was person.
Prabhupāda: Not was, is, is still.
Scholar: Is still.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Their life is long duration.
Prabhupāda: There are kings, son of the Manu, they lived for eight, eleven arbuda years. One arbuda years means ten crores. One crore means ten millions. Ten million. So ten million years makes one crore. Such eleven crore years... There is history (indistinct) one of the Manus, he reigned over for eleven arbuda years. One arbuda means ten millions of years. So Vivasvān, Vivasvān he's living for so many years. Just like Brahmā's age is mentioned in the Bhagavad-gītā. You find out the verse, sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brahmaṇo viduḥ (BG 8.17). What is the Chapter?
Devotee: Chapter 8, 17.
Prabhupāda: Chapter 8, 17th verse.
Devotee: Sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brahmaṇo viduḥ (BG 8.17).
Prabhupāda: Now what is the translation?
Prabhupāda: So Kṛṣṇa, if you cannot meet Kṛṣṇa, you can meet with Kṛṣṇa's representative. Kṛṣṇa may not be physically present, but His representative is physically present. You can talk with him. That is the system of Bhagavad-gītā. Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). Paramparā. Kṛṣṇa says that "I talked with the sun-god." Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1). "First of all I talked with the sun-god." Vivasvān manave prāha. "Then he talked with his son, Manu. Then Manu talked with Ikṣvāku. In this way..." Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam, there is a disciplic succession. So if you can be in touch with that disciplic succession, then Kṛṣṇa's representative is there. If you talk with the Kṛṣṇa's representative, then you talk with Kṛṣṇa. Just like in office, there are different departments, and the, there is a man, departmental-in-charge.
Prabhupāda: Just like this sun, the sunshine, the sun globe, and within the sun globe. In the Bhagavad-gītā you'll find, the Fourth Chapter, the person sun, whose name is Vivasvān, he was instructed by Kṛṣṇa. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1). You are a Sanskrit scholar.
Professor: No, I'm afraid not.
Dharmādhyakṣa: That was the gentleman whose works he translated. In other words, the gentleman that he worked for was the Sanskrit scholar.
Prabhupāda: I see. So... Oh, you have no seat? They are giving him? All right. So from Bhagavad-gītā we understand that Bha... Just like in this planet we are so many persons, or the President Nixon is the President. Similarly, in every planet there are living entities, and the President of the sun planet is called Vivasvān. So he was instructed by Kṛṣṇa long, long ago.
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: That is good. One who desires well-being(?)...
Guru dāsa: Yes.
Prabhupāda: ....he is called Sūrya.
Guru dāsa: Yes.
Prabhupāda: So he is determined(?).
Guru dāsa: Yes. And he is not motivated.
Prabhupāda: No.
Guru dāsa: He is very good, good. Kapoor also is increasing more and more, very much favorable. (indistinct) also is favorable. He is nice.
Prabhupāda: Where is the moisture? It is clear shine. Where is the moisture? (break) (laughter) It is not fire. It is a brilliant body. It is not fire. (break)
Satsvarūpa: ...body of Vivasvān?
Prabhupāda: Whole planet, I mean the population, they're so bright.
Satsvarūpa: Sometimes in your lectures you explain the living entities can live there because they have bodies of fire.
Prabhupāda: Fiery. Not fire.
Guru dāsa: Fiery.
Prabhupāda: Now, that is explained that prabhāsmi śaśi-sūryayoḥ. Śaśi means moon, and sūrya means sun. Prabhā. So as soon as in the morning you see the sunshine, there you see Kṛṣṇa.
Dr. Patel: "I am the very light of sun and moon."
Prabhupāda: Why do you say, "I don't see Kṛṣṇa"? Kṛṣṇa says, "I am here, that, as prabhāsmi śaśi-sūryayoḥ," But why don't you see?
Guest (3): God is there. But we want to see original form of Lord Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: No, no, no. That will take three millions of years to understand. (laughter) That is already explained. Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye, yatatām api siddhānām (BG 7.3). That is not so easy.
Prabhupāda: Mayy āsakta. You just try to increase your attachment for Kṛṣṇa. And the process is being explained in the Seventh Chapter. That is the only way. (break) ...sun is open to be visible by everyone. And Kṛṣṇa says, "I am the sunshine." Why do they say that "I do not see Kṛṣṇa?" Here is Kṛṣṇa. And you take the water, taste it. That salty taste is Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...prabhāsmi śaśi-sūryayoḥ. The prabhā of sūrya is there, and the water is there. You can see immediately Kṛṣṇa. Immediately.
Guest (5): Why did He create suffering when He could have created a permanent paradise on earth?
Prabhupāda: Eh? Eh?
Guest (5): Why did God create suffering...
Prabhupāda: No, no, no. That I have already explained. When you infect some disease, you suffer. That is your creation.
Prabhupāda: But just like Kṛṣṇa says, "They are just like moon." Just see. Nakṣatrāṇām ahaṁ śaśi. So śaśi means the moon. Moon is like one of the stars. So if you say the stars are sūrya, then there is contradiction. How the moon and the sun can be equal? But actually, that is not. According to our Vedic astronomy, there is one sun only in one universe, although there are millions of universes, we cannot count. So there are millions of suns. That is another thing. But within the universe there is only one sun, and by the brilliance of sunshine, all these stars and moons are glittering. Just like moon shining, being reflected by the sun, similarly, all the stars they are glittering, being reflected by the sun, not that all of them are different suns. This theory is refuted.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Must be frightened. Now, suppose all of a sudden, if you see a very big person, you will not be frightened? Because you are not accustomed to see that.
Dr. Patel: Anādi-madhyāntam ananta-vīryam ananta-bāhuṁ śaśi-sūrya-netram paśyāmi tvāṁ dīpta-hutāśa-vaktraṁ... (BG 11.19)
Prabhupāda: Now here is one important thing: śaśi-sūrya-netram. The śaśi, the moon, and the sun are the two eyes of God. Now in Brahma-saṁhitā it is also confirmed yac-cakṣur eṣa savitā sakala-grahāṇām. So in the Upaniṣads it is said, "When God sees, then you can see." So this... When the sunrise is there, that means when God sees, you can see. In the darkness you cannot see. And still, you are proud of your eyes. Yes. Without God seeing, you cannot see. And still, these rascals are proud of their eyes. "I can... Can you show me?" How you can see? First of all you have to see through the Supreme. And another significance is that you cannot hide yourself from the seeing of the Supreme. You cannot make anything hiding. Because even in the womb there is sunshine, sunlight. So He is seeing there. Apart from being the Paramātmā, from materially also, His eyes are always there. So you cannot do anything hiding. That is not possible.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dr. Patel: Shall I read again?
Prabhupāda: What is that line?
Dr. Patel: There are so many lines. I will again. Aneka divya... Divi-sūrya-sahasrasya bhaved yugapad utthitā...
Prabhupāda: Ah, this is the comparison now, that divi, "In the sky, if there were thousands of suns at a time, then the brilliance of the virāṭ-rūpa could be understood." This is an example.
Dr. Patel: He saw everyone in him.
Dr. Patel: Paśyādityān vasūn rudrān aśvinau marutas tathā (BG 11.6).
Prabhupāda: Now, first of all, he's saying that paśyādityān. Ādityān, plural number. Not only one, plural number. Ādityān means the Sūrya...
Dr. Patel: Sūrya and all those twelve sons.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, ādityān. So here they cannot estimate the influence of one Āditya, and here he is showing all the Ādityas.
Dr. Patel: Within Him.
Prabhupāda: Within Him. That is Yogeśvara.
Dr. Patel: All ādityāns, vasūns, rudrān, aśvinau and the Marut. Bahūny adṛṣṭa-pūrvāṇi paśyāścaryāṇi bhārata.
Prabhupāda: Not also. He is person. This all pervasive influence or all pervasive feature is His expansion of energy. The same example: The sunshine is the expansion of energy of the sun globe, and the sun globe is the place for the sun-god. The sun-god is a person, and sun globe is the place where this sun-god lives, and sunshine is the expansion of the energy of the sun disc. Try to understand it very... Because this question is very complicated. People cannot understand. You try to understand this. God, Kṛṣṇa, is originally a person. Brahmeti bhagavān iti. Brahmeti paramātmeti bhagavān (SB 1.2.11). Just like if you want to see the sun-god, there is a person. His name is also mentioned in the Bhagavad-gītā, Vivasvān. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1). He is a person. Now you cannot see the person so easily.
Prabhupāda: No. The same thing means he is a rascal teacher. He is not teacher. He is cheater. When a cheater takes the place of a teacher, he explains differently. And when a teacher is there, he will explain rightly. Where is the difficulty? I have several times said that "Where is the difficulty to understand Bhagavad-gītā?" There is not a single line which is very difficult to understand. Just like Kṛṣṇa says, imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam: (BG 4.1) "I first of all said this philosophy to Vivasvan, the sun-god." So where is the difficulty to understand this line? Where is the difficulty?
Indian Man (1): No difficulty in understanding. Interpretation...
Prabhupāda: Yes, but it said in the Bhagavad-gītā clearly, it is said clearly, imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān: "I told this philosophy to Vivasvān." Where is the difficulty to understand? Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre samavetā yuyutsavaḥ: (BG 1.1) "In the dharma-kṣetre, kuru-kṣetre, two parties willing to fight, they assembled." Where is the difficulty to understand? Why these rascals should interpret in a different way?
Indian Man (1): These are all... They are not interpreting that particular word.
Prabhupāda: They are doing.
Yaśomatīnandana: There is nothing like Kurukṣetra, they say.
Indian man (4): That is another group of people, their own brain creation. That we should not...
Prabhupāda: What right you have got to interpret?
Minister: And Pancai Tattva.
Prabhupāda: Pancai?
Minister: He is Rasa,(?) Sūrya...
Prabhupāda: Oh, pañcopāsanā. (break) He is Rāmānuja-sampradāya?
Indian man: Yes, Vaiṣṇava sampradāya.
Prabhupāda: But the Rāmānuja sampradāya do not recommend pañcopāsanā. In the Rāmānuja sampradāya there is no pañcopāsanā.
Indian man: No, these are built by Hindees (?) and other custom. This temple is giving only Vighneśvara and Veṅkaṭeśvara. But the construction of other temples, they are raising funds.
Prabhupāda: Yes. And śrutayo vibhinnaḥ. Literatures are also, authentic literatures... Śrutayaḥ means authentic literature, which is acceptable. They are also various type. Just like Vedas. There are four Vedas: Sāma-Veda, Yajur-Veda, Atharva-Veda, Ṛg-Veda. Then the Upaniṣads are there. Then the Vedānta-sūtra is there. So if we study all this Vedic literature or any other similar literature, it is very difficult to find out the Absolute Truth. Śrutayo vibhinnaḥ. And if we take the philosophers, so one philosopher differs from another philosopher. Na cāsāv ṛṣir yasya mataṁ na bhinnam. Therefore, to approach the Absolute Truth, God, is very difficult subject matter. Therefore our principle is mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ (CC Madhya 17.186). Mahājana means the recognized persons, recognized by the Supreme Lord, such persons we follow. We have got a list of recognized persons, just like Lord Brahmā, Lord Śiva, the Manu. Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā, Manu's name is there. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam, vivasvān manave prāha (BG 4.1), this Manu. So Manu, then Kapila, then Prahlāda, Janaka, Vyāsadeva, Śukadeva Gosvāmī, Yamarāja. In this way there are twelve mahājanas. And we receive knowledge from either of them. That is bona fide philosophy. That is called paramparā system. The original teacher is Kṛṣṇa and from Him the sun-god, Vivasvān, learned it. He spoke to his son, Manu. Manu spoke to his son, Ikṣvāku. In this way the paramparā system is coming. And that is bona fide. This is our philosophy, to accept knowledge from the perfect person or his bona fide representative.
Prabhupāda: Yes, He is divine essence. God is divine essence, just like you have volumes of milk and you churn it, then you get so much butter. So the butter is the essence of the milk. Similarly, the spirit is vast, all-pervading. The example, another example, is just like the sunshine universally spread, very big. Then you concentrate the sunshine, it is sun globe. And if you still concentrate, you will see within the sun globe there is sun-god. So he is the essence of this light, the sunshine light, the sun globe light, and the person—sun-god, Vivasvān, he is person—he is the essence among all this light. That is explained in the Brahma-samhitā, yasya prabhā prabhavato jagad-aṇḍa-koṭi (Bs. 5.40). The whole creation means expansion of the bodily rays of Kṛṣṇa. Yasya prabhā prabhavato (Bs. 5.40). By expansion of the bodily rays of Kṛṣṇa, this Brahman, yasya prabhā prabhavato jagad-aṇḍa-koṭi-koṭiṣv aśeṣa-vasudhādi-vibhūti-bhinnam, tad brahma (Bs. 5.40).
Prabhupāda: The sunshine is not final. You have to penetrate to the sunshine and reach the sun globe and go within the globe and see that there is the sun-god. But that requires strength how to enter into the sun globe and see this. But there is the information in the Bhagavad-gītā: imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam, vivasvān manave prāha (BG 4.1), "I first of all instructed this yoga system of Bhagavad-gītā to the sun-god." The sun-god is there in the sun planet, and if you have got strength, you can go there and see. But you cannot go, although it is material. So similarly, in the spiritual world there is the Supreme Spirit, Supreme Being, He is spiritual, concentrated, essence of light. That is ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate (BG 10.8). He is the origin of everything. And He says, yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata (BG 4.7). Find out this verse. Find out. Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata, tadātmānaṁ sṛjāmy aham.
Prabhupāda: 4,300,000 years, one yuga.
Pṛthu Putra: (French)
Prabhupāda: Multiply by 72. So that is the age of Manu. So, at least so many years before, Bhagavad-gītā was spoken to Manu's father, Sūrya. Sūrya, the Sun-god.
Pṛthu Putra: (French)
Prabhupāda: Sun-god. So how many millions?
Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: About 120,000,000 years ago.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Pṛthu Putra: (French)
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Kīrtanānanda: The potency is in the sun.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore Kṛṣṇa is big, not the Brahmān. And within the sun globe there is sun-god, Vivasvān. They do not know all these. They think the sunshine is the...
Guru-kṛpa: The sun is different than Vivasvān?
Prabhupāda: Not different. Just like the sunshine is not different from the sun globe. Sun globe means all the inhabitants there, they are glowing. Therefore the whole planet is glowing.
Guru-kṛpa: Vivasvān, he is...?
Prabhupāda: He is also glowing.
Guest (4): Lord Kṛṣṇa says in Gītā that, to Arjuna, that when Sūrya is uttarāyana, people who die, they'll go to Candraloka, and come back.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So you quote that. Then it is perfect. You don't require to make research. Your research is no good because your senses are imperfect. I have no proper vision. If the light is stopped, I cannot see. This is the position of my eyes. So what is the use of my seeing? It is conditional. So one who is conditional, how he can give perfect knowledge? One who is not conditional, he can give perfect knowledge. Therefore we have to approach somebody who is not conditioned. Then we get perfect knowledge.
Prabhupāda: Koriho mane āśā. Do not try to research anything. That is final.
- ar na koriho mane āśā.
If the guru is perfect, your knowledge is perfect. And how guru becomes perfect? He has heard from his guru. That's all. Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam (BG 4.2). Kṛṣṇa is the original guru. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam, vivasvān manave prāhu (BG 4.1). This is paramparā system. You hear... Just like Lord Brahmā heard from Kṛṣṇa, tene brahma hṛdā ādi-kavaye. He gave the knowledge to Brahmā. Brahmā distributed the knowledge. Therefore Vedic knowledge is perfect. The Vedic knowledge comes from the Supreme Person. Vedāham. Vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyaṁ vedānta-vid vedānta-kṛt cāham (BG 15.15). So Vedic knowledge is coming from Kṛṣṇa, and it is received by Brahmā, and then Nārada receives. Then Vyāsadeva receives. Then he gives us all these Vedic literature. We understand. That's all. It is not by so-called rascal's research. Research means they are rascal. That's all.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Absolute. Then there is no more defect. Everything is perfect. That is stated, dhāmnā svena sadā nirasta-kuhakaṁ paraṁ satyaṁ dhīmahi. Nirasta-kuhakam, where there is no defect, that is vaikuṇṭha-dhāma. Dhāmnā svena nirasta-kuhakaṁ paraṁ satyaṁ dhīmahi. The absolute truth, we offer our respectful... That is the beginning of Bhāgavatam. Nirasta-kuhakam, where these defects cannot enter. Just like sunshine, in the sun, darkness cannot enter. There is no possibility of darkness going there. Is it possible? So similarly, in Kṛṣṇa, kṛṣṇa sūrya-sama; māyā andhakāra (CC Madhya 22.31), there is no question of defect there.
Rūpānuga: Read that other verse.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: In this respect I wanted to phase this on (indistinct) that ultimate research, that brahma-jijñāsā.
Gaṇeśa: Does that mean that Vivasvān is more powerful than Lord Brahmā?
Prabhupāda: No. Vivasvān was begotten by Brahmā.
Amogha: Some Kali-yuga swans.
Prabhupāda: Black swans. Bhara nitya bhayamāyā. They are also aware how to protect their interest. Every living being knows how to eat, how to sleep, how to have sex, and how to defend from fear. These trees I find in America. Here, they are scented. What is called, these? Canada.
Gaṇeśa: They look like a maple tree.
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is maple tree.
Gaṇeśa: I don't think it's quite the same.
Amogha: No. It's maple tree, but you can't get any maple syrup from this kind. A special kind.
Prabhupāda: I have given the example. Just like this sunshine is coming from the sun globe. Within the sun globe there is the president of the planet. Just like here on this planet you have got some president. Here there are many presidents, because it is hodgepodge, chaotic. But there everything is systematic. There is one person, his name is Vivasvān. He's the predominating deity. Kṛṣṇa went to see him and talked with him about Bhagavad-gītā. He's a person, and there the people, they are also persons. Just like in this planet. But here the body is predominantly made of earth, and there the body is predominantly of fire. Therefore it is so glowing. The glowing temperature, heat and light, is coming from the person, their body is made of glowing heat or fire. There are five material elements: earth, water, fire, air, and ether. In some planet the earth is prominent, in some planet the water is prominent, in some planets the fire is prominent. So the sun planet is prominent with fire. There the bodies made of the inhabitants there are fire.
Prabhupāda: (break) ...worm and the sun. When the sun is arisen, the glowworms, automatically finished. (break) ...motto, "Kṛṣṇa is sun." You know it? Kṛṣṇa sūrya-sama. So when Kṛṣṇa sun is there, all these glowworms' lightening will be finished. (break) ...this sun always shining. Then these glowworms will be finished. (break) ...that Sikh, Bhajan? What is that?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yogi Bhajan.
Prabhupāda: Ah ha. He came to invite me.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Really? In Hawaii?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: No, no. (break) ...our practice, then they are defeated. That they... (break) What they can do? But at heart they know what is their value. (break) ...and push on. You will come victorious everywhere. (break) ...sūrya-sama, māya andhakāra yāhān kṛṣṇa, tāhān nahi māyāra adhikāra. If you remain seriously in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then these people will have no, I mean to say, right to come before you. Adhikāra. They will remain far away. (break) ...how to make my watch right time?
Jayatīrtha: Oh. It's 6:32. We can change it.
Prabhupāda: You have talked with Rāmeśvara that we are not any more going to send cash money.
As soon as you forget Kṛṣṇa, then māyā is there, "Yes, please come here." Finished. There is no two, er, three. māyā, Kṛṣṇa. If you are not in Kṛṣṇa, then you are in māyā. And if you are in Kṛṣṇa, there is no māyā. Yāhān kṛṣṇa, sūrya-tāhān, nāhi māyāra adhikāra. That is our Back to Godhead motto, "Where there is Kṛṣṇa, there is no nescience."
kṛṣṇa sūrya-sama, māyā andhakāra,
- yāhān kṛṣṇa tāhān nāhi māyāra adhikāra
- (CC Madhya 22.31)
You understand Bengali?
Harikeśa: I know that verse.
Prabhupāda: That's... You know it eternally?
Prabhupāda: That is their theory. Then there is no more difference. In the preliminary stage, when I am not perfect, I am worshiping some imaginary form of God. But when I become perfect there is no need of worshiping, I become one with God. This is impersonal. Now, actually, the Supreme has no form so they recommend whichever form you like to worship you can select out of these five. But their destination is the same. So somebody likes "I worship Śiva," somebody says "I worship Gaṇeśa," somebody says, "I worship Durgā," and Sūrya, or somebody says, "I worship Viṣṇu." So this Vaiṣṇava is impersonalist. You'll find amongst smārta brāhmaṇas there are also some of them Vaiṣṇavas, but they are impersonalists.
Prabhupāda: If we preach, it will be all right. That is going on perpetually, darkness and light. If you bring light, darkness will go out, will be driven away.
- kṛṣṇa sūrya sama māyā andhakāra
- yāhan kṛṣṇa tāhan nāhi māyāra adhikāra
- (CC Madhya 22.31)
Just like now there is sunshine. Although it is not very bright, but still the darkness of night has gone away. So bring in Kṛṣṇa consciousness; it will go away.
Indian Man (2): In Hardwar I have been recently, and I met one of my uncle's wife. My uncle's father was a very big mahanta. He was having quite in a big numbers, maybe in lakhs or you can say million, half million to million disciples. And what he was using in whole life, the disciple's money, for his own pleasure or his wife and children's. And at the end of it he took his sannyāsa. Only just few years after that, he died. And I found there in a lot of mahantas, they have a temples, they are using there lot of jewels, gold, and money, and they have a business, like that. And thousand of educated people visit, and they believe that this is all they are doing, show off, and there is no God.
Prabhupāda: Yes. (Bengali) Imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). Find out this verse.
- imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ
- proktavān aham avyayam
- vivasvān manave prāhur
- manur ikṣvākave...
- (BG 4.1)
Ikṣvāku rājarṣi, Rāmacandra-vaṁśa... (Bengali) ...originator of the dynasty of the Sūrya-vaṁśa. Kṣatriya... (Bengali) ...Sūrya-vaṁśa and Candra-vaṁśa.
Harikeśa:
- sri bhagavān uvāca
- imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ
- proktavān aham avyayam
- vivasvān manave prāha
- manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt
- (BG 4.1)
"The Blessed Lord said: I instructed this imperishable science of yoga to the sun-god, Vivasvān, and Vivasvān instructed it to Manu, the father of mankind, and Manu in turn instructed it to Ikṣvāku." Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2).
Prabhupāda: Imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ.
Prabhupāda: Yogo naṣṭaḥ paran. Rājarṣaya... (Bengali) ...third-class, fourth-class rogue... (Bengali) It was the primary qualification that one must be a graduate; then he can understand what is law. Similarly, if one is actually brāhmaṇa by qualification, then he can understand what is Vedas. Similarly, Kṛṣṇa was interested to speak to the rājarṣis. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān. He told to the... First of all He spoke to Vivasvān, the king of the sun planet. That picture is there?
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Find out. First of all He spoke that... If you take history of Bhagavad-gītā, then it comes to forty millions of years ago, at least, He spoke Bhagavad-gītā. How do you calculate? The calculation is there. Any intelligent man can calculate because Brahmā's duration of life is mentioned there. Sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brāhmaṇo viduḥ (BG 8.17).
Prabhupāda: So one yuga means forty-three lakhs of years and multiply it one thousand. That is Brahmā's duration of one day. Now, in one day there are seven Manus. So Vivasvān Manu's age can be calculated—at least forty millions of years ago. So the Bhagavad-gītā is not a new thing. It was spoken five thousand years ago to Arjuna. That was not the first speaking. He says, "I first spoke to Vivasvān, the sun-god." Yes, show him. (Bengali) ...I am manufacturing something. Everything is there. "If you simply follow, a great, wonderful thing will be done." She is now in a position. Simply she has to take the instruction of Bhagavad-gītā and apply it practically. And that is not very difficult. Just like the Bhagavad-gītā says, annād bhavanti... Parjanyād bhavanti bhūtāni. Make this program, immediately.
Lalitā: The reaction will start.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Gaṇapati, Viṣṇu, Lord Śiva, Sūrya and Devī.
Dr. Patel: No, there are no Devī's here.
Prabhupāda: No, Devī's..., But their principle is this, that "God incarnation, impersonal. You imagine some form." Sādhakānāṁ nityārthāya brahmaṇo rūpa-kalpanaḥ.
Dr. Kalpana: (Hindi) They have got one Datta.
Prabhupāda: Dattātreya.
Dr. Kalpana: Dattātreya, yes. Then no doubt there is Hanumān because of the Rāma Mandir. Then there is Gaṇapati. (break)
Prabhupāda: ...goats before Kāla-bhairava.
| Page Title: | Vivasvan (Conversations 1969 - 1975) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, RupaManjari |
| Created: | 13 of Nov, 2012 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=53, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 53 |