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Spirituality (Conversations and Letters)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Radio Interview -- March 12, 1968, San Francisco:

Interviewer: Only for propagating children.

Prabhupāda: That's all.

Interviewer: Then there is a similarity to Catholicism. The priest is supposed to be celibate.

Prabhupāda: Certainly. Anywhere there is spiritual conception, sex life is not indulged. Anywhere, either it may be Christianity or Hinduism... Sex life is materialism. That is opposite number of spiritualism. So people are trained gradually to refrain from sex life. And in the sannyāsa life he's completely trained. Therefore he's allowed to move in the society for preaching spiritual education.

Interviewer: The whole world has heard of the Maharishi Mahesh. Is he part of your order?

Prabhupāda: No. I have heard so much in the paper.

Interviewer: He is the world's most famous guru at the present time.

Prabhupāda: He's not guru. But he's advertised his name like that (laughs). A guru is different thing. But people are, in your country, in the western part of the country, of the world, people are after some spiritual information. So anyone who comes professing as spiritualist, he is welcome, and if he flatters, then it is very convenient to get followers. So we don't follow exactly in that way. We follow exactly the principles of Vedic ways of life. So in that way, sex life for a sannyāsī is strictly prohibited.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 17, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: These are living, symptoms of living condition.

Guest (1): Living condition. So, but we are not affected by air, which is most required and most special for our use. Because it is abundant, and it will be given to every person at all the times, in all circumstances, therefore we do not keep it under lock and key. Western countries, though they have...

Prabhupāda: No, no. There is no question of Western-Eastern.

Guest (1): No, I was speaking of materialism and spiritualism. I was talking on that point, that though we see, I mean, I don't say have made it, but yet because there is no what kind of life they want, or in our Eastern countries, because they are...

Prabhupāda: No, no. If you study the whole thing in that way—Western-Eastern... There is no question of Western-Eastern. It is the question of the living entity.

Guest (1): Yes, how to live in such a way where there is no dearth of thing as well as there is no continuing of that need that a man becomes lost? That is the...

Prabhupāda: That is the point.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: The conclusion comes in this way, that to remain animals, scientific animals, that's all. The propensities are the same, sense gratification, but the man is trying to make it scientific. That means to remain animal but become scientific, that's all, scientific animal.

Dr. Weir: But at the same time he's a spiritual animal. It's interesting to find that in this twentieth century, science is rather replacing the spirituality. You know people in the past gave religion an enormous importance and science was practically unknown. Now they're going the other way around.

Prabhupāda: That scientific spirituality, that is advancement more than the animals. Otherwise if you simply remain on the (indistinct) eating, sleeping, mating and defending scientifically, you remain animal. But when that scientific research goes to the spiritual thing that is special prerogative of the human.

Room Conversation with Mayor -- November 10, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: But the land where Lord Kṛṣṇa came, Lord Rāma came, Lord Caitanya came, that land is certainly worshipable. That is another thing. In that way...

Guest: In that way I was saying that we talk more of spiritualism here. I don't know whether they talk it in other countries or not. But we do here more.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Other countries all they have got high respect for India as spiritual land. But we are killing, our present government and so-called leaders, killing that state. This is regrettable. They could hold this Bhārata-varṣa to the topmost summit all over the India if after independence they would have organizedly preached Bhagavad-gītā and the Vedic culture. That is my mission. Now whatever you may think of Bhārata-varṣa, outside, India is known as a poor, poorest country, because our ministers go there to beg.

Guest (2): Prabhupāda, you have said that, really, what I read this morning, that if (indistinct) comes, we have to fight. Did you say to the people...

Prabhupāda: Yes. They asked me; I said.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Introduction Speech By Dr. Kapoor and Conversation -- October 15, 1972, Vrndavana:

Dr. Kapoor:...here at Rādhā-Dāmodara. After his long tour of the world in which he got passed the message of Śrī Kṛṣṇa Caitanya Mahāprabhu in the different karmas, to the different nationalities of the world. This return back to homeland of Śrīla Prabhupāda, is particularly significant, because this time he comes back with a host of his western disciples. This signifies to me the meeting of the East and the West, or at least the beginning of such a meeting. This signifies the victory of spiritualism over materialism, of good over evil. This is really a rare moment in history, for for the first time in the history of the world, for the first time at least living memory, Vaiṣṇavism, the message of Vaiṣṇavism, the message of Mahāprabhu, the message of devotion and of pure devotion has been carried to the west and carried so successfully. I am sure that historians of the future will have a lot to say about Prabhupāda and his movement, and they will be even envious of us for living in a time when this movement was begun and for participating in it. I have a secret realization that at this moment, while we are welcoming Prabhupāda, Śrī Rūpa Gosvāmī, Śrī Jīva Gosvāmī, Śrī Kṛṣṇadāsa Kavirāja, whose samādhis signify their eternal presence in the sacred precincts of this temple, are also joining us in welcoming Prabhupāda, and they are showering their choicest blessings upon him. I can hear them saying, "Long live Prabhupāda, long live Prabhupāda." I am sure as a result of their presence, Prabhupāda will live long for many, many more years, to broadcast the message of Caitanya Mahāprabhu all the world over and inspire us to inspire us with a special zeal in our hearts. And I am sure as a result of their blessings he will rise always, from glory(?). I have also a secret realization that Śrī Rūpa Gosvāmī and Jīva Gosvāmī are not only showering their blessings upon Prabhupāda but also upon the western disciples of Prabhupāda that have come along with him and saying that in the process will be realized (?) the message of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu, and surely and steadily advance on the path of peace, happiness, and divine grace.

Prabhupāda: So blessings of Dr. O.B.L. Kapoor. He is a Vaiṣṇava. Although by age he is my younger brother, we are Godbrothers, and for the last forty years perhaps, since he was a student at Allahabad and I was doing some business there, we are known to each other. So his association is a great blessing for us. But this reception is actually not my reception. It is the reception of my foreign students. Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu wanted that His message should be broadcast all over the world, in every village and every town, and my Guru Mahārāja attempted. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura distributed his literature.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Father Tanner: Because you can see the Deity as too strong, repressive, taking away your freedom, your own wishes...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Father Tanner: ... and so you can come to hate the Deity.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Spiritualism means to sacrifice your freedom. That is spiritualism. You have no more freedom. You are simply engaged for God's service. That is spiritualism.

Father Tanner: Why, why, why were we created free?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Father Tanner: Why were we created?

Prabhupāda: You are not free. You are thinking so-called free. You are not free. You are under the stringent laws of nature. You are not free. You are thinking foolishly that you are free.

Father Tanner: But if I am not free...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation with Mister Popworth and E. F. Schumacher -- July 26, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: They do not agree that animal killing is sinful. They do not agree.

Schumacher: It's a very long question, isn't it. I mean...

Prabhupāda: No, it is a simple question. Killing, do you think killing is very good business? Then why it is forbidden, "Thou shall not kill."

Schumacher: No, but sometimes protection is necessary.

Prabhupāda: That is another thing. Generally, you should not kill. But when there is absolute necessity, that is another thing. But generally, this killing process you cannot support, and at the same time, you want to make the society purified. You commit sinful activities; at the same time, you want to purify. How it is possible?

Schumacher: I think a society can survive, and spirituality can survive, even among meat-eaters. It's much more difficult, I imagine, that a society can survive which has animal factories. Now, I would be much more interested whether we can get our friends, the Dominicans, the Jesuits, to agree that this kind of a treatment of animals is just so, beyond the pale. This would be, in the European context, I think, a better test than to challenge the habit of meat-eating, which is also intergrown with all sorts of assumptions. I mean there is the ruling assumption that you need it, which I challenge and you challenge.

Room Conversation with Cardinal Danielou -- August 9, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Oh, he was in fifteen years?

Cardinal Danielou: Oh, yes, a very long time. Oh yes. Very long time. Yes. And after he, he worked in Pondicherry and each year he comes in India. Yes. Yes. He's very well known in India for his works, especially about Indian music, but also Indian spirituality, the yogas, Indian gods and all question concerning India. Yes.

Prabhupāda: Where he is now?

Cardinal Danielou: He's now in Rome, in Rome, in Rome. He, he had especially in Greece language not in French. He lived in Rome, in Berlin. You visited Italy, Italy yourself?

Prabhupāda: Not yet.

Cardinal Danielou: No. Not yet, not yet. France. France...

Prabhupāda: I've got invitation from the secretary...

Cardinal Danielou: Yes.

Room Conversation with British Man -- August 31, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Haṁsadūta: ...if they accept his teaching, that is the meaning of the statement.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Guest (1): Well now, see, what does honestly bother me is, I believe that because there is a spirituality about his message that I have not seen all these years. Is the immortality that he has offered, for instance, me... I must talk in the first person. Is it a universal thing that's happened all through time or is it something that belongs to just when he died?

Prabhupāda: No, universal things are also eternal. Everything, the nature. Nature is also eternal.

Guest (1): I see. Right, I'm beginning to understand that. Another thing I would like to know very much is that I feel, but have no proof, that I have experienced in my, in the things I do, which lead me to believe that my experiences based on a memory I don't understand which, which belongs to previous lifetimes. Now is that, a fa...?

Prabhupāda: Yes, previous life there was. Just like previously, you were a child. Previously, you were a boy. Previously you were a young man. So similarly, we had previous life. Previous life means not exactly in this body but another body. But I am eternal. I live either in this body or in another body. Just like I'm a person, I live in this apartment or any other apartment. The apartment may change, but the person who lives in the apartment, he does not change. Similarly, I am spirit soul. I am simply changing different apartments. But there is a life, because I am eternal, where I haven't got to change apartment. I get permanent residence.

Room Conversation -- September 18, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Although the same thing, but action is different. If you become devotee of Lord Śiva, you'll get opportunity of material opulences. Because Lord Śiva is the husband of Durgā, and Durgā is the superintendent of this material world. So Durgā is under control. If one becomes a devotee of Lord Śiva, then Durgā gives him, eh? Dhanaṁ dehi rūpaṁ dehi rūpavatī-bhāryāṁ dehi yaśo dehi. So you'll get all this, nice position, nice wife, nice power, famous... All this material, not spiritual. So to worship any other demigod than Kṛṣṇa is materialism. That is not spiritualism.

Guest (1): Worshiping Viṣṇu is also material?

Prabhupāda: No. Viṣṇu is not. Viṣṇu is Kṛṣṇa, Viṣṇu the same, expansion. That you have to understand.

Guest (2): Rāma also.

Prabhupāda: Rāma also.

Room Conversation -- September 19, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is very dangerous. Then you will all fall down. If you make a joint mess, if you go and collect something and then eat and sleep, then everything will be... Therefore I do not want to keep separate. The temple worship means there will be regulative principles, that you will have to rise early in the morning, you have to attend class, kīrtana... These things, as soon as you give up all these things, zero. Then it will be like karmīs, as they are, hard labor, collecting money, and enjoying senses. That's all. So that is the pitfall everywhere. In the church, temple, as soon as they get some nice income, then in the name of "priest," "sādhu," "sannyāsī," they do the same thing. Therefore Gosvāmīs, they left everything. That is the danger of viṣaya, viṣaya touch. Viṣaya chāḍiyā se rase majiyā. As soon as we give up this śravaṇam, kīrtanam, then it becomes viṣaya. Viṣaya means materialism. There is no spiritualism. Kṣurasya dhārā, kṣurasya dhārā. Kṣura means sharpened razor. If you are careful, you cleanse very nicely. If you are not careful, immediately blood. Immediately. So the spiritual life is like that. As soon as you become little inattentive, immediately māyā captures, "Yes, come on." Then everything failure. We have got the tendency to enjoy sense. So senses are strong.

Morning Walk -- December 11, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prajāpati: Actually permeate all the media with Kṛṣṇa consciousness propaganda, not simply just writing but actually all aspects of...

Prabhupāda: Yes, you can take advantage of all this media. That we are doing. Just like we are taking advantage of this microphone. We are not rejecting, "Oh, it is material. Why should we take?" Nothing material. Anything used for Kṛṣṇa is spiritual. Material means what is not used for Kṛṣṇa. That is material. You are materialistic when you are not used for Kṛṣṇa. And as soon as you are utilized for Kṛṣṇa, you are spiritualistic. That is the difference. Here we say, "This is material world." This is material world because everyone has forgotten Kṛṣṇa. Therefore it is material world. So if they come into Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then it is spiritual. (break) ...conscious people now challenge this rascal that "We are searching after Kṛṣṇa. We are not searching... We are devotee of Kṛṣṇa, and you are posing yourself as Kṛṣṇa. So show us some Kṛṣṇa's power. We immediately come to you."

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 20, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is not a university education. That is due to their coming to India.

Dr. Patel: They are...? They come to India and... They don't do it there?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes, they come here for spiritual enlightenment, and they meet these rascals, gañjā-eater sādhus. That is the beginning.

Dr. Patel: But they have introduced that in American universities.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. I know. This is the beginning. They learned this... They thought that this is spiritualism.

Dr. Patel: I thought they have taught us.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no.

Jayapatākā: No, they imported...

Prabhupāda: Your gañjā, gañjā-smoker, these so-called sādhus and just like... They have done this. By following these rascals, they are doing it. But they do not know who is sādhu...

Dr. Patel: And LSD was invented by Indians, no?

Mr. Sar: (indistinct) ...other thing, you know.

Press Conference -- April 18, 1974, Hyderabad:

Guest (9): In this context, how do you see the government of India?

Prabhupāda: I do not wish to speak of any particular government. But generally, everywhere the government is not very good. Even in America, the president is not liked.

Guest (5): Swamiji, India is supposed to be a land of spirituality.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (5): How is it that there is so much moral degradation in our country?

Prabhupāda: Because you did not lead them, you did not teach them spiritual books. You allowed them to read Communist books.

Guest (5): Is it the failure of our spiritual leaders?

Prabhupāda: What is a spiritual leader? First of all we have to think..., if the businessman is not spiritual leader.

Morning Walk Excerpts -- May 1, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: This M.N. Raya, you know, who advocated that humanism, for which he was banished by the Communist fellows because the root of M.N. Raya was in Hinduism, no? After all? It is very difficult for us to think about so-called Communism. But religion itself is Communistic.

Prabhupāda: No, no. We, we don't think in terms of Hinduism. We don't think.

Dr. Patel: No. But we have been actually brought up religiously as communists, religious communists.

Prabhupāda: Spiritual communists. Religious, religious upon strict sense of religion. Religion means spiritualism.

Dr. Patel: Yes, spiritual communism.

Prabhupāda: Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). Religion means to abide by the orders of Kṛṣṇa. That is religion. Other things are cheating. If they have no sense of God, they do not know what is God, how to abide by the orders of God, that is not religion. Therefore Bhāgavata says, dharmaḥ-projjhita kaitavo atra: (SB 1.1.2) "All cheating types of religion system is rejected, kicked out from this Bhāgavata." They're all cheating. "I am God. You are God. I am everything. You are..." This is not religion. It is all humbug religion. Go on. (break) ...has written about Kṛṣṇa by Vyāsadeva, and people say, "There was no Kṛṣṇa. It is all fictitious." Vyāsadeva had to take so much trouble for some fictitious. Just see their intelligence. Even no common sense. Why Śukadeva Gosvāmī will take interest? Why Vyāsadeva will write such book? Therefore they do not recognize that Bhāgavata is written by Vyāsadeva. But how they can deny? Bhagavad-gītā, that is also written by Vyāsadeva.

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

O'Grady: But that's unavoidable.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

O'Grady: Because of your physical existence...

Prabhupāda: Unavoidable, yes...

O'Grady: And your personal spiritualism as well.

Prabhupāda: But it can be avoided in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Just like the leaf of lily. It is in the water but it does not touches the water.

O'Grady: I didn't catch that last expression, no.

Bhagavān: Lily leaf.

Yogeśvara: To show how we can live in this world but still be transcendental.

Bhagavān: There's a lily leaf that sits on the water and even though it sits on the water it doesn't get wet.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: First of all, the quality. The quality of Christian is that he must obey the ten commandments. If he does not obey, then where is his Christianity? That is stated, guṇa-karma: by quality and work one becomes Christian or Hindu or Muslim. There must be the quality. But when the spirituality develops either from Christianity or Hindu or Muslim—it doesn't matter—then there is. Find out that verse, sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje (SB 1.2.6). Read it. This is the ideal of equality. Find out.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa:

sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo
yato bhaktir adhokṣaje
ahaituky apratihatā
yayātmā suprasīdati
(SB 1.2.6)

"The supreme occupation, dharma, for all humanity is that by which men can attain to loving devotional service unto the transcendent Lord. Such devotional service must be unmotivated and uninterrupted in order to completely satisfy the self."

Prabhupāda: So our, this movement is to create lover of God. It does not matter whether he follows Christianity or Hinduism or Buddhism or this ism or that ism. One must be lover of God, and that is stated in the Bhāgavata. That is first-class religion which turns the followers to become lover of God, that's all.

Room Conversation with Robert Gouiran, Nuclear Physicist from European Center for Nuclear Research -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: He's observing outside of himself.

Prabhupāda: Then why does he not observe himself, that "What I am?" "Am I this body? Or what I am? Why I am full of anxieties?"

Robert Gouiran: (French)

Yogeśvara: Yes. But actually that's a very interesting way of approaching the problem of spirituality, you see. We are learning that actually everything has some relationship with Kṛṣṇa, or God. So you are a physicist, if I have understood,...

Robert Gouiran: Yes.

Yogeśvara: ...a nuclear physicist. So you have a very highly specialized field of knowledge. So it would be valuable to see also what is the contact of nuclear physics with the...

Guru-gaurāṅga: Spiritual physics.

Prabhupāda: The spiritual physics is... (laughter)

Robert Gouiran: Spiritual physics.

Prabhupāda: Yes, "spiritual physics" can be said.

Room Conversation with Roger Maria leading writer of communist literature -- June 12, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That we are preaching. In Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We are not sitting idly and smoking gāñjā. It is not like that. (French)

Yogeśvara: So what he's saying is that, "Yes, in this connection, I can compliment you (Śrīla Prabhupāda) for the work that you are doing because," from what he has experienced, "most of the people who are coming from India to preach about Kṛṣṇa, talk about Kṛṣṇa to old people or people who actually don't have any use for Hinduism or spirituality except as a kind of diversion or a drug."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Yogeśvara: So I think, if I understood.

Prabhupāda: I agree. I agree. He's right. He's right. He's right.

Pṛthu Putra: He wasn't appreciating exactly.

Bhagavān: Did he appreciate? First of all...

Pṛthu Putra: He doesn't appreciate what we are doing exactly. He says, he says, with his Indian, with his Indian, what he's doing with his Indian, what is the name of it...?

Bhagavān: Francend. (Name of paper?)

Jyotirmayī: Franscend.

Pṛthu Putra: Franscend. He says there is many swami and writer come from India and teach to the people, to the western people, what is Kṛṣṇa, what is Indian philosophy, what is God, but they always teach the people who need to be safe, to be, who need something to be safe, and they take it like just a drug or some kind of a dream just to get something to get safe from the material world. But that doesn't mean their action is concrete. That is his point.

Prabhupāda: But we are not doing that. We are, in the material world, we are teaching Kṛṣṇa philosophy, practicing. All these young men, they are actually twenty-four hours engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We are different from them.

Room Conversation with Mr. Deshimaru -- June 13, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: No understanding of the spiritual. (French)

Pṛthu Putra: He says the concept of Zen is to see spirituality in matter and something material in spirit, in spirituality. That is the concept of Zen, to realize spiritual life according to matter.

Karandhara: What that means... That's just an expression of the idea that everything is ultimately one. You don't have to make value judgments, you shouldn't make value judgments or say one thing is better than the other, that everything is ultimately the same, and the self is also the same as everything. So there's no distinction and there's no objective or conscious awareness of anything because everything is everything.

Yogeśvara: There's no discrimination.

Karandhara: Yes, there's no self. (French)

Pṛthu Putra: He says in the daily life there is varieties. If something wrong, we do something right. But when we are speaking about spiritual elevated life, everything is one.

Prabhupāda: Yes, when the spirit is gone, then your daily life is also gone. (French)

Pṛthu Putra: He says yes, for sure, we all die.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore daily life means so long the spirit is there. As soon as the spirit is gone, there is no more daily life.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: In, in, in your Punjab, in United Province...

Guest (2): At least his (indistinct) approach it is not one sided.

Guest (1): Swamiji, my main question is although spiritualism is the Absolute Truth, can we not in some way make spiritualism in such a way, modify it in such a way, as to help the common people?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (1): The masses.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that we are doing.

Guest (1): They have been steeped in ignorance for such a long time, it will take a long time to bring them into the fold of spiritualism.

Prabhupāda: No, it has been made easy by Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu. That you don't commit sinful activities and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and don't commit sinful life, that's all. And sinful life we have given them, no illicit sex—we don't say, "no sex"—no illicit sex, no illicit sex, no meat eating. Suppose... They are not now eating meat, are they unhealthy? They are known now as bright-faced. So no illicit sex, no meat eating, no intoxication, and no gambling. This is avoiding sinful life. And chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Do you see the result? Do you see the result? Within four, five years how they have advanced. Not that they're Vedantists or they have studied all the Vedas, not that. Simple thing. Have you ever come here in the evening when they perform ārati, kīrtana? Just see how ecstatic it is. Simple thing. Don't commit sinful activities and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, bas. You'll become elevated. Jagāi, Mādhāi, they were—in those days, because they were drunkards, women hunters, meat-eaters—they were considered most sinful. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu delivered them by this process. There were two Jagāi and Mādhāi and now hundreds and thousands of Jagāis and Mādhāis are becoming purified.

Morning Walk -- November 3, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: Kāmaḥ krodhas tadā lobhas tasmād evam... Tri-vidhaṁ narakasya-dvāram.

Prabhupāda: Ah! Yes. Yes. On the material platform, he... The human life is meant for spiritual culture. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. But they have rejected. They are simply busy. Athāto deha-jijñāsā. That's all. Dehātmā-buddhi.

Dr. Patel: I have got little point on this, that after all, the spirituality within you, namely ātmā, cannot remain independently without this body, so you have got to look after the body.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. That is not the fact. If you are actually spiritually advanced, you don't care for it. Deha smṛti nāhi yār saṁsāra bandhana kāhān tānra. It is just like Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī. He had no spiritual... er, material con... He was eating every alternate day a little quantity of butter. That's all. How he was living in Vṛndāvana? So when one is perfectly on the spiritual platform, there is no bodily necessities. That is the sign. Therefore our civilization is to decrease the bodily necessities, not to increase. Control. Control, from the brahmacārī, control, control, control. Ultimately completely control. That is perfectional stage. Tyāgena. What is that verse?

Morning Walk -- November 12, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: You see, anything which is read out of context is no reading. You must read it reference to context. If you read some nonsense somebody must have spoken or written he's not all what he has written or spoken. So if Yaśomatīnandana reads that and Prabhupādajī talks something about the spirituality, no this moment... Because time is short and heart is long, and our heart is beating like muffled drums, so let us fulfill ourself before we die.

Prabhupāda: No, you have got your injection. (laughter)

Dr. Patel: That is not for me. I give only... (laughs) His wife was brought yesterday to me, Yaśodānandana, and she told me that she was operated in the stomach for some growth. "What sort of growth was that? Was it malignant?" And she's suffering. Why don't you send her back or get the reports from the American hospital, what operation was performed on her, and we'll get out? Or she'll suffer all the time. That is the story of injection. Now let us talk. Until you realize God, then you are spirit. Up to then, you are always...

Prabhupāda: "I am Indian." "I am American."

Dr. Patel: More important: "I am a human being and others are lower animals." That is the greatest abhimana.

Prabhupāda: No, that is also.

Dr. Patel: Abhimana.

Prabhupāda: That is also, what is called, false ego. Human being or animal, they are not different, because the body is made of the same ingredient. If you manufacture a dog like a dog, like a man, what is the difference? The ingredient is the same, earth.

Conversation on Roof -- December 26, 1975, Sanand:

Prabhupāda: This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. The synthesis of the covering and the thesis of the soul should be synthesized by arrangement. That we are teaching.

Harikeśa: Dialectical spiritualism.

Prabhupāda: Ye.... Not dia.... Dialectical means keep spiritualism or materialism. It is dialectic. Two sides there are, the material and the spiritual. These ignorant rascals, cats—and dogslike men, they have no information of the thing which is covered. They're simply dealing with the covering. Therefore their knowledge is imperfect, and they're not successful by so many theses. They do not know the real problem. Who is enjoyer? That they do not know. That enjoyer is covered. And they are talking on the cover. That.... In Bengal, it is a proverb, said, that: Sobraniye tanatan.(?) In the.... I think I was talking on this. In the coconut. The coconut sweet pulp and water is within. And they are struggling with the fibers above the coconut. Coconut.... They have got some information coconut is enjoyable, but where is the enjoyable article is there, that they do not know. They have simply information this body, and the coconut's body is covered with fibers. And they are fighting with the fibers. None of these so-called capitalists or, what is called, Communists, they do not know where is the real substance is. Superficially, they are fighting on the platform of fiber covering. That's all. Sobraniye tanatan,(?) this Bengali word exactly. They're fighting just like dogs. Actually they do not know how to become happy, but one dog is barking upon another dog, and they're fighting, attacking, barking-useless. The dogs and cats, they do not know what is the value of life, and they fight on the covering, same fiber, fight. But here is a chance, human being. Therefore dialectic. Dialectic materialism.

Conversation on Roof -- December 26, 1975, Sanand:

Prabhupāda: Lat.... First of all, this is the problem.

Harikeśa: First to find out the problem...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Harikeśa: ...and discuss the problem.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is dialectic. So you can write dialectic spiritualism.

Harikeśa: Dialectic spiritualism. I think they should print this also in Back to Godhead.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Haṁsadūta: It'd make a good article.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Haṁsadūta: It would make a good article, what you've just spoken.

Prabhupāda: So write.

Harikeśa: You so completely destroy the opposition, it's very hard to say anything more.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That you have to prove. You can eulogize your Guru Mahārāja, but you have to learn it and face the public and be strong to defend yourself. That is success. Not by praising your Guru Mahārāja. You'll praise your Guru Mahārāja. That is not very difficult. But be victorious to the opposing elements. Then you will praise your Guru Mahārāja nicely. At home, you can praise your Guru Mahārāja, and Guru Mahārāja be satisfied, "Oh, my disciples are praising me." That is not very.... That is good. Respectful. That is the qualification. But you have to fight. Then your Guru Mahārāja will be glorified.

Conversation on Roof -- December 26, 1975, Sanand:

Harikeśa: Oh, in Russian!

Prabhupāda: They're the greatest atheists.

Harikeśa: Oh, that would be.... A dialectic spiritualism pamphlet in Russian. That's big. Russian. (break)

Prabhupāda: The land is very nice. All flat, flat land. Hundreds of miles.

Indian: It is all tobacco.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Indian: All tobacco.

Prabhupāda: Just see. They're misusing.

Haṁsadūta: You can smell it.

Indian: Smell tobacco.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Harikeśa: Oh, that's why it is. Tobacco. I always thought someone was smoking bidis right downstairs, or something.

Haṁsadūta: ...smell tobacco.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Harikeśa: Virginia smells like this.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Harikeśa: Virginia, in America. There, all they do is grow tobacco now. (break)

Haṁsadūta: .... But on the other hand, they claim that there are certain laws which govern this material nature. This is a complete contradictory position.

Hariśauri: A law means there has to be some compliance to a higher authority.

Prabhupāda: So discuss all these nonsense propositions.

Harikeśa: Somebody...? (break)

Prabhupāda: He has clearly proved that Darwin is a fool. He's wrong. He has not written the word "fool," but he's wrong. (end)

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 12, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that's nice. If the dictator, executive officer, is very nice, religious, then there is no need of this election.

Dr. Patel: Oh, she goes to the temples, all right. (laughs) (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: No, no. She has got the tendency of spiritual life and she requires improvement. That's all. She has spoken in Chandigarh that "Now we require spiritualism." Hm?

Dr. Patel: (Hindi) She is shamming, sir. Shamming. Shamming. She is not truthful to any of her words.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Dr. Patel: She is not truthful to what she says.

Prabhupāda: (break) Any circumstances, they can adjust. (break) Oh, Gaṅgā-sāgara.

Śrīdhara: Yes. That's on the fourteenth, tomorrow.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...stand where there is water then they will manage everything. Water must be there.

Morning Walk -- January 20, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is called worms of the stool. You see? If you take this worm from the stool, "Why you are living in stool? Come here," "No, no. I go back there." You'll see. The pig eating stool, ask him, "Take halavā. Why you are eating?" "No, no. I like it very much." This is māyā.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So sometimes when a devotee goes, joins Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then leaves again and goes back to the material world, its just like a pig going back to the stool.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is stated in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. The materialism and spiritualism is explained by Rūpa Gosvāmī. There is bird, cātaka. So they drink water when the rain falls, and otherwise they will starve. They will never accept any water from this earth.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There is actually such a bird.

Prabhupāda: A devotee will never accept materialism, even if he dies of starvation. You'll see so many still. They are sticking to this principle. There are still many saintly persons in India. They do that. They don't care for any bodily care. "Some food comes; I shall eat. Never mind." Still you'll find. They are sitting in their place and chanting or meditating without any concern for bodily necessities.

Morning Walk -- April 12, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They will agree so many things.

Dr. Patel: They will agree later on that the dialectical materialism is not the right thing, but the dialectical spiritualism is the right thing. What Karl Marx said was wrong. But they have started reading the Vedas and all these, Rāmāyaṇa, Mahābhārata, and...

Prabhupāda: They have got good sympathy for Indian culture.

Dr. Patel: And if they read it, then Karl Marx teaching will go away.

Prabhupāda: And we are getting enquiries from Russia of our books, about our books. We are getting enquiries. I am sending Gopāla Kṛṣṇa to make market of our books.

Guru dāsa: They have some of our books already in Russia.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- April 12, 1976, Bombay:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda? This idea that he was discussing, how we naturally have a tendency to possess something.... If I don't possess the state, I possess the body. Is this the disease?

Prabhupāda: Yes. We have to nullify this, that "I don't possess anything; God possess everything." Then it is perfection.

Dr. Patel: No, that is why, sir, this communism cannot survive, because they say that afterward the state will vanish. It will evaporate. How can it evaporate without spiritualism there at the back? They have a materialistic ideology and material, I mean, there are changes. There is nothing permanent in material. So the communism, so-called material communism, dialectic materialism of Karl Marx, are not full. (break)

Guru dāsa: Your name is man, and Dr. Patel.... You've been given a title, "Dr. Patel."

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda gave an example that if you see a note on the floor...

Dr. Patel: Only name of God has value.

Prabhupāda: Practical application.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda gave the example that if you see a note on the floor, three different people, one person sees it and ignores it, so he doesn't know the proper utilization of the thing. Another person sees it, picks it up and puts it in his pocket. He is dishonest. The third person sees it, picks it up, and seeks out the real owner. So there has to be Kṛṣṇa consciousness; otherwise how do we know who everything belongs to?

Dr. Patel: That is spiritual concern. And spirit itself.... Kṛṣṇa is.... I mean, without Kṛṣṇa there cannot be anything. That is the highest culture.

Guru dāsa: Kṛṣṇa even lets people forget Him.

Dr. Patel: (plane overhead) Vedas say that...

Prabhupāda: (break) ...and prasāda shall be ready. Anyone comes, he may give him. Then it will be nice.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In your article in Back to Godhead about Marx, you call him a nonsense, you call Marxism nonsense.

Prabhupāda: Yes, what is his philosophy? (sic:) Dialectitude?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dialectic Materialism.

Prabhupāda: So, we have written one Dialectic Spiritualism.

Hari-śauri: Harikeśa's.

Prabhupāda: Harikeśa.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, he read it to us. He's preaching, I think in Eastern Europe sometimes. We got a report. Has he written you?

Prabhupāda: Yes. I heard that, but is he being alright or not?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: From the report it appears that he goes occasionally into some eastern European countries. Mostly he's concentrating in England, Germany and Scandinavias. He has a party and they are doing speaking engagements and distributing books. And sometimes he went in which countries?

Devotee: Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Budapest.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He is going to some communist European countries.

Devotee: They make their vans with false bottoms and they hide the books underneath so at the border they do not see. Underneath the van is all your books. When they get in the country then they distribute the books to these centers.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Revolution.

Prabhupāda: It is very nice.

Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Dr. Wolfe: Yes, she lives here. She has worked in a clinic for many years, and exclusively with dying people.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that.... One has to come to this conclusion undoubtedly. And that is education. Her education is now complete, that he (she) has understood, he (she) is trying to explain scientifically that there is life after death. That is complete education. So everyone should try by his education to establish what is already said in the śāstras. That is a fact. When Kṛṣṇa says, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13), one gets another body, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre... (BG 2.20). Kṛṣṇa says there cannot be any mistake. So if scientist, philosopher, establishes the statement of Kṛṣṇa by their scientific knowledge, that is real perfect scientific knowledge. And if he wants to defy the statement of Kṛṣṇa, that is māyā. That is not possible. But he's vainlessly trying to do that. But if one by scientific knowledge establishes what Kṛṣṇa says, that is perfection.

idaṁ hi puṁsas tapasaḥ śrutasya vā
sviṣṭasya sūktasya ca buddhi-dattayoḥ
avicyuto 'rthaḥ kavibhir nirūpito
yad-uttamaśloka-guṇānuvarṇanam
(SB 1.5.22)

That is required. We are publishing one book, Dialectic Spiritualism: Vedic Views of Western Philosophy. We are just going to publish one book, Dialectic Spiritualism. Marx's theory is dialectic materialism (laughs). We are going to establish dialectic spiritualism.

Evening Darsana -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Huh? What is that?

Guest (2): After, you know, the Kṛṣṇa, He has explained to Arjuna all the religion and spirituality, and still a man of the caliber of Arjuna speaks, then he said, cañcalaṁ hi manaḥ kṛṣṇa pramāthi balavad dṛḍham, that verse.

Prabhupāda: That is said in the Sixth Chapter (BG 6.34).

Guest (2): That comes in practical life. One might even say that you try to go to a spiritual area, then all these things do come in everybody's life.

Prabhupāda: No, that was spoken in connection with practicing yoga.

Guest (2): But Arjuna got it due to guru, like Kṛṣṇa means is it possible in this age if one has the right guru, a man, he can elevate himself?

Prabhupāda: You can take Arjuna as guru. Kṛṣṇa spoke to Arjuna, evaṁ paramparā-prāptam (BG 4.2). He directly listened to Him. And he's guru therefore, because the guru is by the paramparā. So he understood Kṛṣṇa. So you take Arjuna's instruction. Make Arjuna your guru. What does he say? He accepts Kṛṣṇa, Param Brahman. So we accept Kṛṣṇa as Param Brahma. Where is the difficulty? Arjuna, by his direct experience talking with Kṛṣṇa, he understood Him that "Kṛṣṇa, you are Param Brahman." So you take the words of Arjuna and accept Him as Param Brahman. Where is the difficulty? Just like the same example, one lawyer giving example, the judgment of other court. That is accepted. So Arjuna is accepting Kṛṣṇa as Param Brahman.

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Bill Sauer: I believe the spirit of life lives on totally in this marvelous planet earth, but I feel the spirit has to be carried and nurtured and improved in the body. So I feel we have to carry the bodies, the material bodies, to the other planets to allow the spiritualism to live there also.

Prabhupāda: That is in the material world. If you want to stay in the material, then you change the material body just suitable for a particular place, atmosphere. But we have got our spiritual body. That spiritual body, without any material covering, you can transfer to the spiritual world.

Bill Sauer: You believe you can transmit that to other planets?

Prabhupāda: Yes. We have to transfer, because we are giving up this body. So you must accept another body. So either in this planet or in other planets or as human being or less than human being... There are 8,400,000 types of body. You have to accept one of them according to your karma. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur dehopapattaye (SB 3.31.1). How the next body is developed, that is depending on our work. If we work like demigod, then we go and get the body of demigod. And if we work like dog, then we get the body of a dog. Nature's. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu (BG 13.22). According to activity and association of the modes of material nature, we get, up and down, different varieties of body. Some of them are low grade, some of them are high grade. That depends on our association with the modes of nature. Nature's work is going on. Just like if we contaminate some particular germs of disease, that disease will develop and we have to suffer. Similarly, by our contamination or association with the guṇa, qualities of nature... There are three qualities, goodness, passion and ignorance.

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Bill Sauer: Well, I could interpret that in another way, not having any background—you'll have to excuse my ignorance—that we are the tool of eternity. We are, through our technical capabilities, the ability to spread life so far among so many billions of stars that there will be eternal life, there will be eternal spirituality.

Prabhupāda: But there is eternal life.

Bill Sauer: But when this planet sits for a billion years at a thousand degrees Fahrenheit, what we know as life will be destroyed.

Prabhupāda: Anything within this material world will be all destroyed. But there is another nature, that is being described. Paras tasmāt tu bhāvo 'nyo 'vyakto 'vyaktāt sanātanaḥ (BG 8.20).

Bill Sauer: But the spirit is manufactured in the body, is it not, sir?

Prabhupāda: Yes, spirit is, but there is a spiritual world also, where you don't require this material body, you remain in your spiritual body.

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Bill Sauer: Sir, may I read you back the, my version of "Materialism Without Purpose"? May I read you "Materialism Without Purpose"? "Mankind's insatiable appetite for material things stems from instinctive desire to pursue technology, which in turn drives civilization to a frenzy of activity. However, without a cause or a purpose," or spirituality, as you say, "the rush and hurry in uncertain directions to uncertain places creates an excess of technological gimmickery. Perhaps this continuing quest for more material goods would be less anxious if the cause of this obsession of mankind were universally recognized. If we saw the ultimate use of technology as an extension of nature with a purpose for the whole life system, perhaps a new life style would evolve. We would see creative natural instinctive satisfying outlet for energies, and we might all collectively attain more peace of mind. The waste of technological gimmickery would then disappear. Hard reality, however, will extinguish our relentless desire for material things if we do not correct the situation ourselves. We will soon run out of resources and power if our technological explosions continues as blind as a raging torrent of water flowing in any direction gravity takes it."

Prabhupāda: Yes, we are carried away by the laws of nature. However you may improve your technological science, you are under the laws of material nature. That you cannot change. But if you revive your spiritual life, then you can change. Otherwise it is not possible. If you keep yourself under the laws of material nature, then you have to be carried away by the laws of material nature, however expert you may be in technological understanding. Because, after all, you are an instrument in the hands of material nature.

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Bill Sauer: In the Western civilization it's opposed. He's saying philosophically, he said "In the mutual reinforcement of these two still-opposed powers and the conjunction of reason and mysticism, the human spirit is destined by the very nature of its development to find the uttermost degree of its penetration and the maximum of its vital force." In other words, spirituality and science already have truth.

Vṛṣākapi: Excuse me, one thing is you should address your questions to the authority. This discussion that you are having will get you nowhere. Unless you apply your questions to the authority, then you will never understand anything. So the authority is Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, and His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta is teaching on that authority. So if you have come here, then you should try to address your questions to His Divine Grace rather than arguing among yourselves, because you will not find any satisfaction in your argument. If you want information, then you must go to the authority.

Guest: Still, the argument was an aspect of the occasion, and it came out of the wisdom that he's here.

Prabhupāda: Acintyāḥ khalu ye bhāvā na tāṁs tarkeṇa yojayet. Things which are inconceivable, do not try to understand by argument. Acintyāḥ khalu ye bhāvā na tāṁs tarkeṇa yojayet. So our process, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, is to take knowledge from the authority. Unless we take knowledge from the authority, however we may go on arguing, we cannot come to the conclusion. The modern scientists, philosophers, they are arguing, but they do not come to the conclusion. If you want to take conclusion... Just like two lawyers are arguing in the court, but the conclusion is given by the authority, the judge. That one has to accept. So we take authority, the Bhagavad-gītā or Kṛṣṇa. He is accepted authority by all the ācāryas, Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, Viṣṇu Svāmī, Caitanya Mahāprabhu, and in the śāstra also, Vyāsadeva, Nārada, Devala, Asita. So our authority is confirmed. So if we take conclusion from the authority, then we benefit. Otherwise, with our limited knowledge, if we go on arguing, then we cannot understand the conclusion. That is not possible. Tarko 'pratiṣṭhaḥ śrutayo vibhinnā. By argument we cannot come to the conclusion.

Room Conversation -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: You can keep, if I like I can take. But vegetable soup.

Hari-śauri: What time would you like breakfast?

Prabhupāda: Half past seven, eight. We are publishing one book, Dialectic Spiritualism. What is that?

Jayatīrtha: Harikeśa Mahārāja's book.

Bhagavān: No, no. Another one Prabhupāda's spoke, the philosophy book.

Jayatīrtha: Oh, the philosophy book will be called Dialectic Spiritualism? Ah, very good title.

Hari-śauri: A Vedic View of Western Philosophy.

Jayatīrtha: Very good title.

Prabhupāda: That's a fact. If one actually interested in real philosophy, they must come to spiritualism. Ātma-tattvam. That is ātma-tattvam. Parābhavas tāvad abodha-jāto yāvan na jijñāsata ātma-tattvam. So long they do not come to this platform of understanding ātma-tattva, whatever rascal they are doing, simply defeat, that's all. Parābhava. Simply frustration and defeat. This very word, parābhava, means defeat. Parābhavas tāvad abodha-jātaḥ. Why he's defeated? Abodha-jātaḥ. Because by birth he's a rascal. Abodha-jātaḥ. And this will continue yāvan na jijñāsata ātma-tattvam.

Room Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: That is everywhere in the eastern part of the world. They are after money.

Dayānanda: And the foreigners who come here also, they are materialistic also.

Prabhupāda: Everywhere materialistic. Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye (BG 7.3). Spiritualistic means siddhi, perfection. Who cares for perfection? Bring money and enjoy. That's all. Who cares for perfection? They do not know what is perfection. They think that you get money, you live comfortably as far as possible, and after death, everything's finished. Is it not? This is the philosophy. Who cares to know that there is life after death and better life, better planet, better world? This is not at all good, it is full of miseries. They are driving all day, car, but they do not think it is tiresome. They think it is pleasure. To have a car and drive whole day, they do not feel that is tiresome. They think "I have got a car, I'm driving, people are seeing. It is pleasure."

Parivrājakācārya: It is madness, how they can enjoy a city like that.

Prabhupāda: But we do not deprecate. We simply say that do whatever you like, but do not forget your real business, self-realization, ātma-tattvam. Self-realization, that is required. And if we live like cats and dogs and again become cats and dogs and pigs, that is not success. But there is chance if one does not know ātma-tattva. Nature's law will work. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu (BG 13.22). Hare Kṛṣṇa. So, your son is sleeping?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: No, this is not my son.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 6, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...Dialectic Spiritualism.

Dr. Patel: You have taken their word.

Prabhupāda: It is not their words, but just to counter...

Dr. Patel: In fact, sir, Engels was a spiritualist, and his chela, Karl Marx, became materialist because he saw, accept poverty all round, due to the industrial revolution. He thought in that way.

Prabhupāda: As if he was ordained to do it.

Dr. Patel: But, well, he felt... He was a philosopher.

Prabhupāda: Such a rascal. He has moved poverty. He was in poverty-stricken...

Dr. Patel: He was extremely poor man. Yes, he died (indistinct). But that is what he thought.

Prabhupāda: That means poor fund of knowledge. That's it. These rascals will never go to the... Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). They do not know this science, these rascals. They manufacture. And we have also learned to manufacture.

Dr. Patel: No, he did only on the Western thought.

Prabhupāda: No, no, Western philosophy... We have learned this art, manufacturing. Just like Vinoba Bhave's has proposed, "I want mukti not in the traditional way." He'll manufacture his own way. This is his intelligence after eighty-two years or eighty-one years. "Not in the traditional, not in the religious way." Just see. He's still hovering in darkness, and he's going to get mukti. This is the position.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: First of all let us understand what is sleeping and awakening. This is the real understanding. The materialistic man, he's sleeping about self-realization. He has no information.

Mr. Asnani: He has no?

Prabhupāda: Information. But the spiritualistic man, he's awakened in that, that this life is meant for self-realization. So the materialistic man, he does not know. He's kept in darkness of night, and the spiritualistic man is awakened. That is the difference.

Mr. Asnani: Why the night...?

Prabhupāda: Night means ignorance, when one sleeps. Yes. And day is awakening. So what is day for the materialistic person, so that is night for the spiritualistic person. And what is day for the spiritualistic person, that is night for the... Just like a spiritualist person, he has sacrificed everything and he is after God, and they are thinking, "These rascals, unnecessarily, empty stomach, wasting, 'Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa,' chant." They are deriding. And he is thinking that "This rascal got this human form of body. Instead of spiritual culture, he's spoiling his life, cats and dogs." That means in the subject matter where the spiritualists were not interested, he is interested. And in the subject matter, the spiritual person, interested, he is not interested. This is day and night.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Mr. Asnani: Oh, I was taking sometime in literary sense. So it was sometimes confusing me.

Prabhupāda: No, it is literally, that yā niśā sarva-bhūtānāṁ tasyāṁ jāgarti saṁyamī. He, spiritualist person, he knows, that "What is the use of the sense gratification? The sense gratification is there in the cats and dogs. Why I am wasting in this way?" That is awakened. What is the difference? A man is having sex life in a very nice apartment, very decorated and nice cot. He is enjoying sex life, that "I am advanced civili..." And the dog is enjoying sex life on the street in presence of everyone. But the enjoyment of sex life is the same. There is no difference either for the dog or the man. So the spiritualistic man, he says that "Why shall I waste my time in sex enjoyment? This is enjoyed by the dogs and cats. I have got this human form of life for spiritual advancement." So saṁyamī: "Stop this nonsense. Let me cultivate spiritual life." Saṁyamī. Saṁyamī means sense gratification stopped. That is saṁyamī.

Morning Walk -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: How nice he has...

Rāmeśvara: His name is Dr. Harvey Cox. He is widely known all over the world as a leading Christian theologian. He has written many books. And he said that Christianity today is synonymous with profit, material gain, accumulation, performance, material success. So it has lost or it has forgotten its original message. And it takes something as exotic as the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement from India to remind a Christian that there's another way of life, based on simplicity and truth and spirituality.

Prabhupāda: He's right. And he's a very important man.

Rāmeśvara: He has joined this society to defend us. He's now traveling different places in the United States to speak on our behalf.

Prabhupāda: He's serious gentleman. That is wanted. Kṛṣṇa will help us.

Dr. Patel: Aldous Huxley is another, he's also very...

Trivikrama: He's dead.

Dr. Patel: He is dead. No? He is dead? How long?

Trivikrama: Since 1962.

Dr. Patel: I had no idea of it. I am reading his books thinking he is still alive.

Trivikrama: He's a Māyāvādī, anyway.

Prabhupāda: Who?

Trivikrama: Aldous Huxley.

Prabhupāda: Aldous Huxley. He is useless. Anyone connected with the Ramakrishna Mission is a useless. Immediately take it.

Arrival of BBT Manager -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: The poll?

Rāmeśvara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: And Dialectic Spiritualism is published?

Rāmeśvara: This year, after the Māyāpur Festival. Hayagrīva hasn't finished working on it completely.

Prabhupāda: How many pages it will be?

Rāmeśvara: Two volumes.

Prabhupāda: Two volumes?

Rāmeśvara: Two volumes, eight hundred pages.

Prabhupāda: Oh? So, big?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Is that Harikeśa's book?

Jagadīśa: Śyāmasundara.

Rāmeśvara: Prabhupāda explaining the different philosophies of the world. This was something that just appeared just before I left Los Angeles. This shows how they are fighting back. This a four-page article... (break) ...as if it is a very nice thing. And they say in the article that the parents have to pay these professionals $25,000 just to steal a devotee.

Prabhupāda: Heavy tax.

Arrival of Devotees -- February 24, 1977, Mayapura:

Rādhā-vallabha: This is the book, conversations between you and Bob Cohen here in Māyāpur.

Prabhupāda: Perfect Question... What about that Dialectic Spiritualism?

Rādhā-vallabha: Hayagrīva's almost finished with that. We'll produce it after the Māyāpur festival.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Rādhā-vallabha: After the festival we'll produce it. Hayagrīva's just finishing now. He's half-finished.

Prabhupāda: So you have not begun printing?

Rādhā-vallabha: No.

Prabhupāda: Then? (break)

Rādhā-vallabha: The type on the spine will be white.

Gargamuni: ...Bangkok I left a copy of The Scientific Basis of Kṛṣṇa Consciousness, and the professor remarked, "Oh, these books we especially want, 'The Scientific Basis.' "

Rāmeśvara: This is very timely, because the President's mother, of United States, just came to India, and it's all over the American press how she was in the Peace Corps. So this book, the copy on the back cover, "A search for meaning carries a young American Peace Corps worker to ancient city in West Bengal..." There he meets you and finds out everything he ever wanted to know. It's very timely.

Gargamuni: Why don't you put the Jimmy Carter quote on it too?

Rādhā-vallabha: This is Satsvarūpa's book.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Buses arrived?

Gargamuni: One has come. The other nine will be at least another half hour or so.

Prabhupāda: Nine bus?

Gargamuni: Ten total.

Morning Conversation -- April 11, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: What happened to that book, Dialectic Spiritualism?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Spiritual Dialectics?

Prabhupāda: Yes, Dialectic Spiritualism.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dialectical Spiritualism. I think Harikeśa was working on that, wasn't he, when he was here...

Prabhupāda: No, no, it is finished. It was being edited by...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, okay, well, I'll write and ask.

Prabhupāda: ...Hayagrīva. But he is doing nothing and taking money.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, they stopped his salary now. "18) The US BBT will experiment with importation of books from India as soon as practical. Gopāla Kṛṣṇa will make further efforts to increase the quality."

Prabhupāda: Yes, quality must be there. It is not yet standard. Unless quality is improved, it cannot be exported and spoil the market.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hm. So those were the resolutions we passed, Śrīla Prabhupāda. (end)

Room Conversation Meeting with Dr. Sharma (from Russia) -- April 17, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. People are everywhere good. Simply some politicians, they make them bad.

Dr. Sharma: The top politicians, they come in the way. They stop these things. They had a yoga class institute set up in the Moscow University, and when they came to bhakti-yoga, they realized that spiritualism's involved. So at the earliest they get rid of this.

Prabhupāda: One book is published, what is that religion?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Anthology.

Prabhupāda: Anthology. So in that book they have given quotation from my books.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. It's just come out.

Prabhupāda: It is very nice.

Dr. Sharma: One day they removed the professor the department of Russian, for arguing in favor (?) of Indian yoga, and he was practicing it and teaching the people. And they got rid of it.

Prabhupāda: So when they get the information...

yoginām api sarveṣāṁ
mad-gatenāntar-ātmanā
śraddhāvān bhajate yo māṁ
sa me yuktatamo mataḥ
(BG 6.47)

There is book.

Correspondence

1947 to 1965 Correspondence

Letter to Sardar Patel -- Calcutta 28 February, 1949:

3. The third item is to take up the harijana movement. This movement is, in the real sense, a spiritual initiation movement and this should be organized in such a manner that people all over the world may take interest in it. The harijana is a word which shall not be used neglectfully as it is done now but attempt should be made to make everybody a harijana. Harijana means the recognized man of Hari the Personality of Godhead and thus he (the harijana) is as important a man as the knight of the king. So harijana movement should be strengthened more scientifically to turn every person who is now mayajana into a harijana. The mayajana is a word which is applicable to a person who is ordinarily engaged in the service of materialistic pursuits, whereas the harijana is the person whose main business is to attain perfection of human life, as Mahatma Gandhi did, by spiritualistic realization. This movement should therefore be conducted under strict disciplinary methods as prescribed by the mahajana or the harijana of accredited merit. In such a movement we shall have full co-operation of the sadhu community in India.

Letter to Mr. Bailey -- Allahabad 14 September, 1951:

The present smoky materialistic or sensuous civilization has to be kindled into the fire of reality or spiritualism. It is neither difficult nor impossible and is much more simpler than any other method. It is just a simple process of fanning the fire in order to get rid of the disturbing smoke. Such fanning process is eternally the same and the one and the empiric speculators have nothing to invent now in it.

Letter to Brother -- Unknown Place September 1955:

I am in due receipt of your kind enquiry and I am glad that you wish to become a member of the League of Devotees for learning the science & techniques of Theism or spiritualism of the highest standard. The Prospectus is enclosed herewith please find & decide for yourself for becoming a permanent member of this noble institution.

Letter to Jawaharlal Nehru -- Bombay 4 August, 1958:

I beg to inform you that your speech on 2/8/58 at the Gurukul University Haridwar, has given me some inspiration to inform you something about Indian culture. The basic principle of Indian culture is spiritualism which defies the external attraction of phenomenal materialism.

You are thinking of adjusting western ways of material adjustment with Indian culture of spiritualism and I beg to give you herewith the clue that materialism conducted with an aim of reaching spiritual perfection, is the right adjustment of human activity.

If the aim of spiritual realization is missed, the whole plan of materialism is sure to be frustrated and that is the law of Nature. The law of nature is so made by a superior authority and no body can surpass the intricacies of material nature simply by partial adjustment of material science. The history of the West beginning from the time of the Greeks and the Romans down to the modern age of atomic war—is a continuous chain of sense gratificatory materialism and the result is that the westerners were never in peace within the memory of 3000 years of historical records. Neither it will be possible for them at any time in future to live in peace till the message of spiritualism just suitable to the present age does not reach their heart.

Letter to Jawaharlal Nehru -- Bombay 4 August, 1958:

Therefore India may not waste her time in imitating the western way of life. You have admitted it that the position of India's culture is of very high order. But at the same time you want to bring in material prosperity of India by scientific advancement of knowledge. And what is that scientific Knowledge? Spiritualism is also advanced scientific knowledge. Material advancement of scientific knowledge cannot give even the desired material prosperity to the people in general without spiritual help. Swaraj of Mahatma Gandhi was adjusted in spiritualism more than materialism. Do you think that horseless carriage or telephonic or radio communication or any other such ephemeral facilities of life, can bring in material prosperity? No it cannot. Material prosperity means that the people must have sufficient to eat or to maintain the body and soul together in sound health for further development in spiritual consciousness which is conspicuous by its absence in the sense gratificatory life of the animal. Do you think that your different plans have brought in that standard of material prosperity or that modern western civilization can bring in that ideal prosperity? Even they are given all the facilities of material need yet the unrest will continue to go on till there is spiritual satisfaction of life. That is the secret of peace.

1968 Correspondence

Letter to Sivananda -- Los Angeles 11 November, 1968:

Regarding your question, about living alone, living alone is a general tendency for a person who wants to get disassociated with the materialistic persons. That is also recommended by the Goswamis in their instructions. It is better to remain alone than to mix with materialistic persons. But this is not applicable when we have the opportunity to get the association of pure devotees. Our program is negative and positive simultaneously. We want to negate the materialistic side and make positive the spiritual side, it is not one sided. If you have no positive standing, negating only will not make you successful. Therefore it is better to remain positively within the society of pure devotees. That is also recommended by the Goswamis. That one should be occupied in activities in the modes of goodness and associate with spiritualistic persons, that will make one's advancement very quick.

1969 Correspondence

Letter to Krsna dasa -- Los Angeles 13 February, 1969:

In the Western World, people are simply interested more in politics because the problems here is materialistic. In the material way of life, people are embarrassed with the thoughts of how I shall sleep, how I shall eat, how I shall mate, and how I shall defend. That is the way of material life. In the spiritualistic life one knows that God has provided food for everyone, so we shall live on whatever things are contributed by the Grace of God. God has provided immense land on this globe, so so we have enough place to lie down. Mating is possible even in the bird's and beast's life, so that is not a problem, and defending is always incomplete. Nobody can defend himself with utmost precautionary methods unless one is protected by the Lord. Therefore, in all circumstances a devotee is cent per cent dependent on the mercy and protection of the Lord, as much as a child is cent per cent dependent on the mercy of the mother.

1976 Correspondence

Letter to Harikesa -- New Vrindaban 24 June, 1976:

Concerning Arabic translations, someone has already done one. He came to me in Bombay. Also, there is no need to give commentary on the Koran. There is no other religion in the world in truth than this Bhagavat-dharma. However, something is better than nothing. The communism book that you have written, they say that there are some words that may be irritating to the communists. We have just finished a book which Hayagriva is editing at present. It is called Dialectic Spiritualism and within that book, your comments can be added if need be for preaching in the Eastern European countries.

Letter to Ramesvara -- Vrindaban 29 October, 1976:

Yes, this book distribution movie should be excluded. Why has this been taken. Even if there is some bad dealing in the family, it should not be exposed.

What about that book Dialectical Spiritualism edited by Hayagriva? Also, the rejection by the BTG staff has somehow or other alienated Dr. Kapoor. You must carefully oversee which articles are being accepted for BTG.

Letter to Radhavallabha -- Vrindaban 24 November, 1976:

I am on due receipt of your letter dated November 15, 1976 regarding the Dialectical Spiritualism book. However, you have called it Spiritual Dialecticism. It should be Dialectical Spiritualism.

Page Title:Spirituality (Conversations and Letters)
Compiler:Visnu Murti, Mayapur
Created:24 of Mar, 2012
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=47, Let=10
No. of Quotes:57