Prabhupāda: So in this way at Advaita's house He remained for some time. Say about a fortnight. And during that time, in the beginning, His mother came and His mother became so much sorry. That scene you have to describe very nicely. Mother seeing that her son has taken sannyāsa, no more He'll come to house. So (s)he was crying. And Caitanya Mahāprabhu fell on his(her) feet and begged, "My dear mother, yes. This body belongs to you. This body should have been engaged for your service. Unfortunately I've done a mistake. I have already taken sannyāsa. Please excuse Me." In this way. That scene described in the Dilip Kumar's house, that Caitanya is consulting mother, that is a false scene. The actual scene is that after accepting His sannyāsa, His mother came to see Him at Advaita's house.
Beg (Conv. 1967 - 1975)
Conversations and Morning Walks
1967 Conversations and Morning Walks
Hayagrīva: What do you mean He wouldn't address him because He was a sannyāsī?
Prabhupāda: Sannyāsīn, the restriction is the sannyāsī should not beg from pound-shilling man or see them. That is a restriction. Women and men of pounds-shillings-pence.
Hayagrīva: But I thought Rāmānanda Rāya was a devotee.
Prabhupāda: But he was devotee, but undoubtedly, but outwardly he was a governor. Outwardly. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu did not go him, but he understood that "Here is a nice sannyāsī." He came down and offered his respect and sat down before Him. And there was acquaintances, and Lord Caitanya said that "Bhaṭṭācārya has already informed Me about you. You are a great devotee. So I have come to see you." And then he replied, "Well, what devotee? I am a pound-shilling man, politician. But Bhaṭṭācārya is very kind to me that he has asked Your Holiness to see me. So if You have come, so kindly, kindly deliver me from this material māyā."
1968 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. Take some prasādam.
Guest (2): Thank you very much.
Prabhupāda: So you did not question anything, if you have got any doubts?
Guest (2): I beg your pardon? (devotees explain Prabhupāda's question) Do I have any doubts? Divine Master, you have made me able to read my heart. I have no pretensions to speak one way or another. There is no doubt.
Devotee: She said there is no doubt.
Prabhupāda: That's all right.
Prabhupāda: They will collect those paddies only. Just like birds, they collect. They collect those paddies, and that they will eat, not even beg, ask anybody for any morsel of food. So completely... And in the Bhāgavata, Śukadeva Gosvāmī recommends that "Oh, this open field is your bed, this is your pillow, this is your pot, and the water in river is sufficient water, the tree is full of fruits, and in the cave, there is sufficient apartment. So why should you go, anyone, to ask for your shelter, for your food?" Kasmād bhajanti kavayor dhana-durmadandhān: "Why should you approach the materialistic, puffed-up, monied men to give you some help?" So Śukadeva Gosvāmī was strictly following this, strictly following, completely independent. That is not possible at the present day. (chuckles) If we imitate, that will be not good.
Prabhupāda: No, no. A sannyāsī should always take in his hand. That is the system. Not in a plate. That means if you take in a plate, you'll take much. (laughter) So in hand, he cannot take much. Kara-pātrī. That is the instruction. But in this age such strict laws cannot be followed. The Bhāgavata says that when there is flat grass cushion, why should you ask for bedding? When you have got natural pillow, this hand, why you ask for a pillow? Then when there is river, so much water, why do you stock water? When there are fruits in the tree, why do you go and beg? When there is cave, why you are searching after apartment? (laughs) When the old garments are thrown in the street, then why you are searching after clothing? These are the instructions. Completely free. Kasmād bhajanti kavayo dhana-durmadandhān (SB 2.2.5). Why should you go and flatter these monied men? That is complete independence. But those days are now gone. (laughs) It is a different age. Los Angeles, I think it is a good place. Hm? What is your...? Your problem solved?
Journalist: Oh, Vedic. I beg your pardon.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Journalist: You'll forgive me if I...
Prabhupāda: That's all right, that doesn't...
Journalist: I don't mean to offend you.
Prabhupāda: Sometimes I do not follow your accent. That is difference of country. That doesn't matter. Yes.
Journalist: And from that literature, Vedic literature, it is stated in that, that there are people on the moon.
Prabhupāda: Oh yes.
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: You may become everything. But if you have not that propensity to hear something about God, then all these are śrama eva hi kevalam (SB 1.2.8), simply laboring, laboring, laboring. That's all. That means wasting time. Dharmasya hy āpavargyasya (SB 1.2.9). Now, people are generally inclined to execute religious principles to make economic development. Just like in your Christian religion they go to church and pray, "Oh God, give us our daily bread." That is mainly economic development. Not only here. In India also the temple go, "My dear Kṛṣṇa, please keep my family well," or this or that. Economic problem. Generally, people, they become religionist... Therefore modern politicians, they say, "Why should you..." Just like the Russians. They say, "Why should you go to church for begging, 'Give us our daily...' oh, you come to us. We shall give you sufficient bread." The Bolshevists, they make propaganda like this. They go to village to village and ask the village men, "Oh, you pray to your church, pray, 'O God, give us our daily bread,' So have you got your bread?" "No, sir." "All right. Pray to us." They have taken a truck full of bread and... "Take bread. Take bread. As much as you like."
Prabhupāda: He wants a cheap, cheap price. (Break) I don't believe all these things they have... They have come here to beg, to make money. You see? Their mentality cannot be good.
Haṁsadūta: I have a letter for you from Gopāla Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Oh. Gopāla Kṛṣṇa is a good boy.
Haṁsadūta: Oh, he's very nice. Oh, he's getting so nice. He wants to come.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. Because he is serving.
Himavatī: He lives in our house now.
Haṁsadūta: He lives with us now. You know we have another house, the whole house, and almost everyone now is a devotee there. And they're eating prasādam.
Prabhupāda: Gopāla Kṛṣṇa is very nice boy. You give him good protection, and he will turn very good help. Sevonmukhe... This Kṛṣṇa consciousness can be, I mean to say, appreciated only by service. There is no other, no other way. Sevonmukhe hi jihvādau (Brs. 1.2.234). You cannot catch Kṛṣṇa by any way, by your riches, by your beauty, by your..., because He excels everything.
Hayagrīva: Beg pardon?
Prabhupāda: Maṭha command will be Hṛṣīkeśa.
Hayagrīva: Maṭha commander?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Now you want to stay here. You are not staying here?
Hayagrīva: I'll be staying here ...
Prabhupāda: Yes, that's all right.
Hayagrīva: ...permanently, temporarily at least, for a while.
Prabhupāda: Then? Why temporarily? You can... As gṛhastha, you can build a small house and stay with your wife and children. You remain the president of this center. That will be nice. Yes. As there are many—in all centers there is one president—similarly, you remain president of this center.
Prabhupāda: As I am moving, he will move. And if some other boys who are determined to remain brahmacārī, not to marry...They can also take up. Brahmācari and sannyāsī is meant for moving. Yes. Gṛhastha cannot move because they have to earn. They have to maintain. But the brahmacārīs, they will go and beg contribution. A sannyāsī will make the situation favorable. Just like if now a little more, Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is known, if some brahmacārī goes, that "We come from the..." Just like in San Francisco it happened. One of our brahmacārīs was arrested. So when he was taken into police custody, the officer said, "Oh, he is Swami's man. Let him go. Let him go out." Yes. Actually happened so. Similarly, in New York also happened. They were arrested in the subways, and when they were taken in the police custody, he also, "Oh, they are doing nice work. Let them go." (chuckling) So we must make the situation—people will know that they are doing some good work. And when the brahmacārīs go there to beg some contribution, they will be glad: "Oh, yes, they are doing nice work."
Prabhupāda: "What is that?" "Now I can understand that You will also leave this world very soon. So I cannot tolerate that. So best thing is that before You'll go, I go. And my another request is that You shall stand before me, and I shall leave this body." So Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, "Oh, if that is your desire, that will be all right. That is not difficult." So next day, when Caitanya Mahāprabhu came, Haridāsa Ṭhākura said, "Sir, today I wish to leave. So You please stand before me." So Caitanya Mahāprabhu also could understand that he's leaving. So He asked His devotees to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, and in the presence of Caitanya Mahāprabhu he left. Then Caitanya Mahāprabhu took this body, and Himself He went... He carried the body. He was very stout and strong. And He was dancing and... Then He went to the seaside, and He bathed the body, and in His own hands He buried Caitanya, uh, Haridāsa Ṭhākura's body within the sand. So that burial place is still there in Purī, Haridāsa Ṭhākura's samādhi. Then He personally went to the shopkeepers and begged prasādam. "You give Me some prasādam." All people gave Him so many things. Caitanya Mahāprabhu was so well-known.
1970 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Similarly, a renounced life, sannyāsa, if he is following the regulative principles, that is sannyāsa āśrama. Not that imitating somebody, I put on a saffron dress and I become a sannyāsī and by begging I live. This has killed the whole Hindu society or the sanātana-dharma society. Unqualified persons, they do not know the regulative principles but for solution of economic problem they dress themselves. This is Kali-yuga. They will pass on simply by the dress without any knowledge. So here also, although Ajamila was born of a brāhmaṇa father and he was strictly following the regulative principles of a brāhmaṇa—that will be stated—but he fell. He fell in love with a prostitute And therefore his characters were lost. Naṣṭa-sadācāraḥ. The reason is why? Dāsyāḥ saṁsarga-dūṣitaḥ. Because he associated with a prostitute, therefore his all regulative principles became lost. And as soon as you are lost of regulative principles then you take to all kinds of sinful activities.
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. Now, one point is that earning or begging-beg, borrow or steal—that is not happiness. Because to acquire a standard of happiness you have to beg, you have to earn, or you have to steal, so that is not happiness.
Guest (1): No. What I am saying is that as long as a man lives...
Prabhupāda: But we are not talking of "as long as man lives." He lives eternally.
Guest (1): Yes, it is eternal.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Guest (1): And it is eternal bondage there.
Prabhupāda: No. Bondage for so long you are in this material bondage.
Guest (1): In some form...
Prabhupāda: No, first of all you have to understand in the spiritual.
Guest (2): I understand your position and I have from the beginning said most respectfully. I beg to submit and what my submission is that, as a seeker of knowledge, I come to you. Now...
Prabhupāda: No, no, that... Do you know what is the process of seeking knowledge? Do you know that?
Guest (1): No.
Prabhupāda: No, first of all answer me. You are seeking knowledge...
Guest (2): The thing is...
Prabhupāda: No, you also hear me. First of all let me know what is the process of seeking knowledge. You cannot make your own process.
Guest (2): The concepts have changed. You are making a change from the...
Prabhupāda: No, no. First of all you know that I am speaking from Bhagavad-gītā.
Prabhupāda: But then He doesn't say. You say, "If you follow me." Now it is your discretion to follow Him or not to follow Him. Kṛṣṇa said this to Arjuna. That does not mean everyone of the world, like Arjuna, surrenders to Kṛṣṇa. That is not possible. Anyone, if he says, even Kṛṣṇa, or God, says, it is not that everyone follows that. That independence you have got. But our philosophy is that Kṛṣṇa says, "You surrender unto Me," and we are imploring, we are begging persons, that "You please surrender to Kṛṣṇa." Now it is your discretion. Whether you surrender to Kṛṣṇa or Lord Śiva, that is your discretion. But our preaching method is we are trying to preach in the world, "Please surrender to Kṛṣṇa." That is our position.
Prabhupāda: Yes, I am answering. As I told you that this propaganda is meant for creating some brāhmaṇas all over the world because the brāhmaṇa element is lacking, so one who seriously comes to us, he has to become a brāhmaṇa. So he has to adopt the occupation of a brāhmaṇa, and he has to give up the occupation of a kṣatriya or a śūdra. But if one wants to keep his profession, at the same time wants to understand also, that is allowed. Just like we have many professors. There is Howard Wheeler, professor of Ohio University. He's my disciple. So he is continuing his professorship. But whatever money he's getting, almost he's spending for our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. For gṛhasthas, those who are householders living outside, they are expected to contribute fifty per cent of the income for the society, twenty-five per cent for the family, and twenty-five per cent for his personal emergency. After all, in this world, if we live... So far we are concerned, we are sannyāsī, but you are a professor. If there is some emergency, you cannot go to beg. But I am a sannyāsī.
Prabhupāda: You are not speaking correctly. I beg... We beg... With great respect I beg to submit, you are, that you are not speaking correctly. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is stated, cātur-varṇyaṁ māyā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ: (BG 4.13) "These four orders of brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra is created by Me according to quality and work." There is no mention of birth. There is no mention of birth.
Prof. Kotovsky: Yes, I agree with you that this was addition of late brāhmaṇas who tried to...
Prabhupāda: No, that, that has killed the Indian culture. You see? Otherwise there was no necessity of division of this Pakistan. Not only that, from history, perhaps you know, this whole planet was Bhāratavarṣa, and it was controlled by one flag up to Mahārāja Parīkṣit. Gradually they separated, separated. This is the history. And late, lately they have separated Pakistan. So Bhāratavarṣa is now crippled into a small piece of land. Otherwise this whole... According to our scripture, Vedic scripture, this, this whole planet is called Bhāratavarṣa.
Interviewer: Five, six years ago. I beg your pardon. To this part of the world, you did not come to a part of the world where religion was lacking as such, you know. In the United States of America we have many religions, and I think people in this country like to believe, in great majority, that they are religious people, people who believe in God, who devote themselves to some form of religious expression. And I wonder what your thinking was. What do you think that you could add to the already living religious expression in this country by coming here and adding your own philosophy to it?
Prabhupāda: Yes. When I first came to your country I was guest of an Indian friend at Butler.
Interviewer: In Pennsylvania.
Prabhupāda: Pennsylvania. Yes. So although it was a small county, I was very much engladdened there were so many churches.
Interviewer: Beg your pardon?
Prabhupāda: Any religion. Because God is one. It is the science of God. The "two plus two equal to four," it is understood by everyone. It is not that it is to be understood by the Christian, not by the Hindus. "Two plus two equal to four" is a fact for everyone. Similarly God is fact for everyone. Now how to love God. This is the only process. That is.
Interviewer: Now do you claim then that your way of loving God is the way to love God?
Prabhupāda: Yes. At least for this age.
Interviewer: For this age?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Not fifteen, sixteen.
Interviewer: Five, six years ago, I beg your pardon.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Interviewer: ...to this part of the world, you did not come to a part of the world where religion was lacking as such. In the United States of America we have many religions, and I think people in this country like to believe in great majority that they are religious people, people who believe in God, you know, who devote themselves to some form of religious expression. And I wonder what your thinking was. What do you think that you could add to the already living religious expression in this country by coming here and adding your own philosophy to it?
Prabhupāda: When I first came to your country, I was guest of an Indian friend at Butler.
Prabhupāda: Any religion.
Interviewer: Beg your pardon?
Prabhupāda: Any religion.
Interviewer: Any religion.
Prabhupāda: Because God is one. It is a science of God. If two plus two equal to four, it is understood by everyone. It is not that it is to be understood by the Christian, not by the Hindus. Two plus two equal to four is a fact for everyone. Similarly, God is a fact for everyone. Now, how to love God, this is the only process. That is.
Interviewer: Now, do you claim, then, that your way of loving God is the way to love God?
Prabhupāda: Yes. At least for this age.
Prabhupāda: One moment. We must clear.
Interviewer: Beg your pardon?
Prabhupāda: We are not concerned how one man deal with another man.
Interviewer: Not as part of your Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement?
Prabhupāda: No, no.
Interviewer: Because we...
Prabhupāda: No, this is not important, because we know, as soon as one understands how to deal with God, he'll automatically deal with other men very nicely.
Interviewer: But, you know, let's take the Christian religion, for an example.
Prabhupāda: I do not know.
Interviewer: You know the ten commandments for example.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.
Prabhupāda: No, no. Other countries all they have got high respect for India as spiritual land. But we are killing, our present government and so-called leaders, killing that state. This is regrettable. They could hold this Bhārata-varṣa to the topmost summit all over the India if after independence they would have organizedly preached Bhagavad-gītā and the Vedic culture. That is my mission. Now whatever you may think of Bhārata-varṣa, outside, India is known as a poor, poorest country, because our ministers go there to beg.
Guest (2): Prabhupāda, you have said that, really, what I read this morning, that if (indistinct) comes, we have to fight. Did you say to the people...
Prabhupāda: Yes. They asked me; I said.
Guest (2): That's what we want to hear now, you know.
Prabhupāda: So these messages are very nice?
Reporter: Sir, I beg your pardon, sir. We are very poor specimens.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Reporter: If, as you said, sir, we are all, everybody is Kṛṣṇa conscious in India, still I can say we are to (indistinct) problems here. We are very poor specimens. I won't talk in all other...
Prabhupāda: But you do... Don't you... You have not heard Kṛṣṇa's name?
Reporter: We have heard...
Prabhupāda: No, no. You have not heard Kṛṣṇa's name? Then why you are not Kṛṣṇa conscious?
Reporter: We are conscious of the Kṛṣṇa's existence.
Prabhupāda: Outside..., out of India they ask us this question, that "In India, how many Kṛṣṇa conscious?" Every Indian is Kṛṣṇa conscious. Every Indian is Kṛṣṇa conscious. But he's trying to forget by artificial means.
Prabhupāda: Everyone Kṛṣṇa conscious. Who does not know Kṛṣṇa?
Reporter: That's right, sir, that is we are very poor specimens. I mean every...
Prabhupāda: No. By force you are trying to forget Kṛṣṇa, that's all.
Reporter: Sir, I beg your pardon, sir. We are very poor specimens.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Reporter: If, as you said, sir, we are all, everybody is Kṛṣṇa conscious in India, still I can say we are to (indistinct) problems here. We are very poor specimens. I won't talk in all other...
Prabhupāda: But you do... Don't you... You have not heard Kṛṣṇa's name?
Reporter: We have heard...
Prabhupāda: No, no. You have not heard Kṛṣṇa's name? Then why you are not Kṛṣṇa conscious?
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, the composer of this song, he says that "you get out of all kinds of dangers," jay sakal bipod, gāi bhaktivinod, jakhon o nām gāi. "If you simply take to chanting this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra." And at last he says, rādhā kṛṣṇa bolo sañge calo: "Please cooperate with Me," Lord Caitanya says, "and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa." Ei mātra bhikhā: "I am asking all this. I am begging." So our mission is like that. The same thing. We are asking people without any argument or political purpose or social or... No. Simply we are asking that you chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. That's all. Wherever we are opening our branches, it is our only business that we are requesting people to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa or Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa. We don't want anything. We don't want to do any business, but we are simply spreading this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra because people are being washed away. māyār bośe, jāccho bhese. They are being washed away, khāccho hābu, always in trouble. Khāccho hābuḍubu bhāi. Jīv kṛṣṇa dās e biśwās korle to'ār duḥkho nāi: "But if you try to understand that your position is eternal servitude to Kṛṣṇa, then your all troubles are over."
Prabhupāda: (laughter) No one will pay. So then therefore I thought that to purchase one, two house, so that as Vṛndāvana property, because I am maintaining now the whole institution by begging. But when Vṛndāvana and Navadvīpa deities are there, there is no income.
Sumati Morarjee: No, there won't be any ... both places...
Prabhupāda: In Bombay we can go to you..."Mataji we have no more money, please give me some."
Sumati Morarjee: No, that is different, but these things...
Prabhupāda: Yes, so, but Vṛndāvana and Navadvīpa I want to make some provision. So I'm negotiating for that. This is one business.
Prabhupāda: Gītā Press also tried to preach Gītā since forty, forty years. But Bhagavad-gītā was, published by Gītā Press, was not in the Western countries. And we published this Bhagavad-gītā As It Is in 1968. It is now all over the world. And the Macmillan Company, the biggest publisher of the world, they are taking interest. Not only this book. For this book they are taking gradually all our books. So our point is: present Kṛṣṇa as it is. That is real Indian culture. Don't present Kṛṣṇa adulterated. Your country will be glorified. The whole world will accept that India has got something to give. You are simply now beggar. So I have come to this country not to beg, but to give. That is my mission. And they are feeling, "Yes, we are getting something substantial."
Prabhupāda: Yes. Not lot of. Some books he has written. So our request is to the Indians especially that we have got something to give to the world. Simply don't beg. Give something. Then you will be honored. You cannot compete with them by technology, by learning here. That is not possible. If you can give them something, that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Guest (2): How far is saṁskāra powerful like...?
Prabhupāda: Well, saṁskāra you can change in a second. Saṁskāra may be powerful. (indistinct) Kṛṣṇa assures you, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi. He will give you protection. Saṁskāra means you did some sinful activities and you are suffering. But He gives you protection. Sarva-pāpebhyo. Then what is the meaning of saṁskāra? You can change your saṁskāra immediately by surrendering to Kṛṣṇa.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. He was my intimate friend. So in their house, old Tīrtha Mahārāja went to beg some alms—they are very rich man. So, he informed me that "One nice sannyāsī came to our house," and he was invited, "in Ultadanga there is Gauḍīya Maṭha, so he has invited me. I wish to go there. Why don't you come? Let us go together." He was my very intimate friend. So at that time I was a little pessimistic (?), "I know all these sādhus there, I am not going." So he forced me, "Oh, why not come? Let us go." "All right, let us go." So I went to see His Divine Grace Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Ṭhākura in 1922 in that Ultadanga building, and that time Prabhupāda was sitting on the roof. There was small house (indistinct) room, and we were welcome, because they thought Naren Mullik was very rich man and he has contributed some money. So, we went to see Prabhupāda, offered our obeisances. So immediately he said that "You are all educated young men, why don't you preach Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu's message throughout the whole world?" So I replied him, "Sir, we are dependent nation, who will hear our message?
Prabhupāda: Bombay light, yes. Bombay light, that is during my householder life. I opened an office in Bombay for my business and... The (indistinct) Gauḍīya Maṭha was established by us. I am one of them. Śrīdhara Mahārāja also. And we made two parties for begging, collecting alms. Śrīdhara Mahārāja, myself and Gosvāmī Mahārāja. That time he was Atula, Atulacandra Gosvāmī. So I took them to some of my friends, chemist friends, doctors friends. So I collected about five hundred rupees to this. Śrīdhara Mahārāja would speak, I introduced, and Gosvāmī, at that time Gosvāmī Mahārāja would canvass (laughter). In this way three combined together, in one day or two days we... At that time five hundred rupees was (laughing) big amount.
Popworth: I found this the other day, and you'll forgive me making this point, but when I was in discussion, it was impossible for me to make a point without being interrupted so frequently that I failed to make my point at all. Now, can I beg for courtesy for our guest to listen to what he has to say. Then answer him.
Revatīnandana: But... Just that this is interesting, that the solution is there...
Schumacher: But you haven't heard the problem yet.
Revatīnandana: But the problem is that people cannot understand the solution. They cannot understand.
Prabhupāda: But one thing...
Revatīnandana: Why they cannot understand?
Prabhupāda: Mister, yes... I forgot your name.
Pradyumna: ...yad-apāśrayāśrayāḥ śudhyanti tasmai prabhaviṣṇave namaḥ. Translation: "Kirāta, Hūṇa, Āndhra, Pulinda, Pulkaśa, Ābhīra, Śumbha, Yavana, and the Khasa races, and even others, who are addicted to sinful acts, can be purified by taking shelter of the devotees of the Lord due to His being the Supreme Power. I beg to offer my respectful obeisances unto Him."
Prabhupāda: What is the purport?
Pradyumna: Uh. "Kirāta. A province of old Bhāratavarṣa mentioned in the Bhīṣma-parva of the Mahābhārata. Generally the Kirātas are known as the aboriginal tribes of India. And in modern days the Santal Parganas in Bihar and Chota Nagpur might comprise the old province named Kirāta."
Prabhupāda: They're black.
Harry: Well, that's all right, as long as you say so. But I have got to go soon. I've got some writing to do.
Prabhupāda: All right.
Harry: But if there's anything that you feel that you want to ask me or...?
Prabhupāda: Certainly, when we are in difficulty, we must take shelter of you. What can we...?
Harry: Beg your pardon.
Prabhupāda: Office means their business is office. But your business is begging. Your business is not office. Your business is not... They have to direct so many things from there. That we can do. Besides that... Anyway, even they have got office, they come from in Bombay, Calcutta, even from hundred miles away. So if there is no such program, Deity worship, regulative principles, then it will be a joint mess. Hotel. Transcendental hotel. And transcendental fraud. This will go on. The business will be transcendental fraud, and life will be transcendental hotel. (Break) ...twenty, twenty-five. So these women devotees, they are given cāpāṭis by the bābājīs. Kṣurasya dhārā. Actually it is like that. A sharpened razor, A little inattention, immediately blood. Kṣurasya dhārā niśitā duratyayā durgaṁ pathas tat kavayo vadanti (?). That is the risk. Nowadays modern civilization, as we are accepting, there is jeep, there is telephone, everything is there. One can conduct his activities from anywhere.
Prabhupāda: Yes, dadāti. That I have already explained. Dadāti. He must give. Give. Everyone goes to God to beg, "God, give us our daily bread." But one must go to God to give Him. If I do not give bread to Kṛṣṇa, he will be starving. This is devotee's mentality. Yaśodāmāyī, Yaśodāmāyī is thinking, Kṛṣṇa, "If I do not feed Kṛṣṇa well, my child will die." This is devotion. Otherwise everyone is asking from Kṛṣṇa. But Yaśodā-mā is thinking that "If I do not maintain Kṛṣṇa properly, He will die." Therefore he (she) is always trying to supply everything, mākhana, miśri. So real love begins when you try to give God. Everyone is trying to take from God, "Oh father, give us our daily bread." This is not pure devotee. This is good because he has approached God, but this is not devotion. It is not devotion, it is..., means business "God, give me something, then I will love you." Is it not?
Prabhupāda: That is special favor. In the beginning I was thinking, "Now my godbrothers, they have taken sannyāsa. They are begging from door to door. Why shall I beg? Let me earn money and start Kṛṣṇa consciousness." But that never happened. So I had to... I was obliged to take the dress of my godbrothers and preach, instead of earning money. Yes. Some astrologer told me that I should have been a man like a Birla. And I got all those chances in the chemical line, to become... Now I am bigger than Birla. That's all right. But even in business field, there were signs that in money things... I got so many good chances. But everything... Dr. Kartika Candra Bose he appreciated my activities, "Very intelligent boy." He certified to my father-in-law. This is the way of becoming rich man.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, yes. Prāpti-siddhi. Now we are flying by aeroplane. A yogi can fly without any instrument. As Durvāsā Muni, he went even Vaikuṇṭha-loka. Not Vaikuṇṭha-loka. Within this planet, there is one planet where, Śvetadvīpa, Lord Viṣṇu lives. He went there and saw Lord Viṣṇu personally to request him to save him. He refused, "No, I cannot. You go to Ambarīṣa Mahārāja, beg pardon of him. If he pardons, then you will be saved." So to a devotee, innocent devotee, he had to fall down on his lotus feet, "Please save me." So what is the power of yogi?
Devotee: Is the pure devotee more merciful than Kṛṣṇa?
Prabhupāda: Oh yes, yes. Because Viṣṇu could not excuse him, but as soon as he came to Mahārāja Ambarīṣa, fell down, and "You take all my assets of pious activities. You be saved immediately." That is Vaiṣṇava. When he begged, humble, "Mahārāja Ambarīṣa, you save me, I am in danger." "Yes, you take all my pious activities' result. You be saved immediately." That is devotee. Viṣṇu refused, "No, I cannot give you protection." Therefore he is more merciful, although he was attacked, he was harassed. Just like Arjuna. Arjuna was merciful, "Let them enjoy. I don't want to kill them." Kṛṣṇa said, "You must kill. You must kill.
Prabhupāda: You cannot say, "Mr. President, I don't agree with you. Therefore I shall not accept your order." No. You have to. You agree or not agree. That is supremacy. So when we judge the supremacy from material standpoint of view, we find that these things are the symptoms of supremacy. So all these symptoms must be in full extent in God. That is Supreme Person. God is great, God is the supreme controller. How He's supreme controller? So these are the symptoms. Therefore the definition of God given by Parāśara Muni.
- aiśvaryasya samagrasya
- vīryasya yaśasaḥ śriyāḥ
- jñāna-vairāgyayoś caiva
- ṣaṇṇam bhāga itiṅgaṇa
- (Viṣṇu Purāṇa 6.5.47)
From Bhagavān, the other word is bhāgyavān. Bhāgyavān means fortunate. One who has got the symptoms of supremacy, he's called fortunate. The supreme fortunate is God. Lakṣmī. Lakṣmī-sahasra-śata-sambhrama-sevyamānam (Bs. 5.29). Here we are begging little favour of goddess of fortune, but Kṛṣṇa is always worshiped by many thousands of goddess of fortune. That is Kṛṣṇa's position.
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is good. Whatever possible facility is available from any person, we beg for it for Kṛṣṇa's service, not for our personal benefit. (break) ...they forget Kṛṣṇa. They forget Kṛṣṇa. When they go to worship some other demigod, they forget Kṛṣṇa, kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.20), because they have got so strong material desires that they forget Kṛṣṇa. That is harmful. Antavat tu phalaṁ teṣām (BG 7.23). They get some benefit out of the demigod, but that will not stay. Alpavat, er, antavat. Antavat tu phalaṁ teṣām. But if you take Kṛṣṇa, then it is not antavat, it will go on increasing. If you take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, it will never end. It will increase. Ānandāmbudhi-vardhanam, increasing. The ocean does not increase, but Kṛṣṇa consciousness is such a great ocean that it increases only. Ānandāmbudhi-vardhanam.
Guest (1): I beg your pardon.
Prabhupāda: How you can serve whole universe?
Guest (1): How can you serve the whole universe?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Guest (1): You love the beings that you find yourself...
Prabhupāda: You love? To whom you love?
Guest (1): Whoever you're with.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Guest (1): Whatever, whatever...
Prabhupāda: That is... Suppose you love me. You love the whole universe? Why this false impression?
Guest: Not by begging or mercy. Even the Gujarat, the people people which they have done, how they have got this liberty or whatever it is, is all by fighting, by firing back to government. Otherwise the government has the majority of the assembly. Congress Party (indistinct). How they will resolve it? It is the first time there is a majority of the members of assembly could be resolved because people do not want it. It's unconstitutional, but yet, (indistinct) constitutional method has been adopted because they...
Prabhupāda: And they have smashed the speaking.
Guest: Yes.
Yaśomatīnandana: The Hindustan people lied doing that.
Guest: Nothing lied. They will say a lie is nothing for the sake of liberty.
Prabhupāda: What is that liberty? Therefore we have to educate public.
Guest: I beg your pardon?
Prabhupāda: Then you are not spiritually improving.
Guest: No, but that is how they will give me reply, and I can tell them.
Prabhupāda: That is not very strong reason.
Guest: No, but what I say, they may be a strong, but I say I am stronger than them.
Prabhupāda: No, that they will understand that because you are one of them and this is the...
Guest: No, no. I...
Prabhupāda: ...that your idea means our idea, carried.
Prabhupāda: Yes, to understand Kṛṣṇa is not so easy job. First of all, so many millions and millions of living entities are there. They are not interested. They are just like animals: "Eat, drink, be merry and enjoy." Nobody's interested what is the success of life, siddhi. They do not know. They think, "If I..." Now, especially in this age, if you can eat sumptuously then it is siddhi, all siddhi. Yes. Udāraṁ bharita, svārtham udāraṁ bharita. That just we see people are so lazy. If they can eat their daily food some way or other, begging, borrowing and stealing, just like animals...
Dr. Patel: They have got ūdara-śiṣṇu-parāyanaḥ.
Prabhupāda: Parāyanaḥ. So they think, "Now my day's business is finished. Now I have eaten." And dakṣyaṁ kuṭumba-bharaṇam. And if one man can maintain a family of four, five, men, "Oh, he's Mahārāja Dakṣa." Mahārāja Dakṣa, you know? He was a great personality. He was performing yajñas. So this is Kali-yuga.
Prabhupāda: No more demand. "Whatever by Kṛṣṇa's grace comes, that's all right. And not comes, it doesn't matter." The other śloka also, nirāśī, That is bhakti. Otherwise how one can be satisfied in any condition of life unless there is bhakti? That is the test. The test is that he has got something. Yaṁ labdhvā cāparaṁ lābhaṁ manyate nādhikaṁ tataḥ. If he actually achieves Kṛṣṇa, then he does not think that anything better than this. That I see amongst these Europeans and American boys and girls. They have seen it, that "It is better than our so-called material life." Therefore they have been able to give up. Just like this boy Girirāja, he is very rich man's son. His father gave him a special car. His father is a big lawyer in Chicago. So he gave up everything. Now he is begging daily, although he is earning at least fifty-thousand rupees per month. But he has no... He is just like beggar. He doesn't care for his father. There are many like this. Bhaktiḥ pareṣānubhavo viraktir anyatra syāt (SB 11.2.42). These are the test. Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: That is described in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Nṛnāṁ santi sahasraśaḥ. (break) ...self-realization. Nṛnāṁ santi sahasraśaḥ. Apaśyatām ātma-tattvam (SB 2.1.2), who cannot see what is the ātma-tattvam, what is the path of self-realization. Gṛheṣu gṛhamedhinām. Therefore it is the duty of the sannyāsī... Sannyāsī does not mean that he will beg for fulfilling his hungry belly. Sannyāsī means he must enlighten—that is sannyāsī—in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. (break) ...rājendra nṛnaṁ santi sahasrasaḥ apaśyatām ātma-tattvaṁ gṛheṣu gṛha-medhinām (SB 2.1.2). This is the Sukadeva Gosvāmī says that śrotavyādīni rājendra (SB 2.1.2), subject matter for hearing nrnam, for the human being, nṛnāṁ santi sahasraśaḥ, thousands of... Just like in the newspaper in the morning, thousands of varieties of news they will attend, and ask them to attend the maṅgala ārati for self-realization, "No, that is not... You are disturbing, nonsense." This is gṛhamedhi. Gṛheṣu gṛhamedhinām. Vedic culture is that one must rise early in the morning. And even Kṛṣṇa in His gṛhastha life, immediately He rose up.
Prabhupāda: And this is the position of the preacher. Even if you are disappointed, you should not stop your preaching. You should go on with your business.
Girirāja: "He told them that they should not be sorry for being refused by the brāhmaṇas. Because that is the way of begging. He convinced them that while one is engaged in collecting or begging, one should not think that he will be successful everywhere. He may be unsuccessful in some places but that should not be cause for disappointment."
Prabhupāda: (break) ...tama dāsa Ṭhākura has said, karma-kāṇḍa jñāna-kāṇḍa, kevala viṣera bhāṇḍa. Bhāṇḍa. It is a pot of poison. Karma-kāṇḍa, karma-kāṇḍa process and the jñāna-kāṇḍa process, karmīs and the jñānīs... Karma-kāṇḍa jñāna-kāṇḍa, kevala viṣera bhāṇḍa: "Both of them are poison pots." Jñāna-kāṇḍa also.
Prabhupāda: Yes, at the last stage. When he was asking for water, they have given horse urine. He died like that. (break) Now he has gone to hell, America is there. Just see. Just see the position of regency. The Nixon, when he was in the office, oh, he was a big man, he was a responsible man. Now he is kicked out, he is begging, and America is going on. Where is the need of this responsibility? For several months he was asked that "You give up your responsibility." The rascal will not do. "No, without me, America will go to hell." Just see. This is responsibility.
Yogeśvara: All of these big politicians, they seem to fall very ill afterwards.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Yogeśvara: They seem to become very sick. Nixon is also ill.
Prabhupāda: Not only sick, they die very soon.
Prabhupāda: That is the beginning of our talk, that you are spirit soul.
Professor Durckheim: I beg your pardon.
Prabhupāda: You are spirit soul, not this body. That is the beginning of our talk. (German)
Vedavyāsa: He said that your answer that we are not this body, that we are spirit soul, it is not our real answer to our actual problem.
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Vedavyāsa: He said that if you said that we are fleeing, fleeing from the actual problems which we have now...
Prabhupāda: Actual program, the actual program is there. (German) (break)
Vedavyāsa: He's speaking of the gradual process of self-realization. First of all...
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Prabhupāda: So one must be engaged in devotional service, practical. So these our boys and disciples, they are always...
Bishop Kelly: I beg your pardon, your grace. I didn't quite catch what you said.
Prabhupāda: I said that if one engages himself in the service of the Lord some way or other, then the revelation, the original dormant God consciousness and love of God, becomes revived. Exactly in the same way: the psychiatrists, they treat the crazy fellow by talking, talking, talking some way. So if we talk of Kṛṣṇa, then the original Kṛṣṇa consciousness is revived. That is also stated. You find out in the Bhāgavata, śṛṇvatāṁ sva-kathāḥ kṛṣṇaḥ puṇya-śravaṇa-kīrtanaḥ hṛdy antaḥ stho hy abhadrāṇi... (SB 1.2.17). Yes, purport. So this is very important thing. Therefore we have published so many books about Kṛṣṇa—to hear. Hearing, hearing, hearing, and... Just like man is sleeping. You talk loudly, and he will be awakened. Yes.
Prabhupāda: Everything they do. In our childhood we had a house for rental. There was a man. He was a professional beggar. You see? So other members of the house, they'll go to their office. He'll dress himself just like a sannyāsī and go for begging. (laughter) That was his business. (pause) Here in your country there is no such opportunity, but in India there is good opportunity. If you make a dress of sannyāsī, you can go anywhere, and you'll be respectable. They'll give you for eating.
Bali Mardana: Especially they prey on the women.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Bali Mardana: In Delhi I went to one minister's house to get some papers. I could see in the back of the house the lady was entertaining some sannyāsī with sweetmeats and drinks.
Satsvarūpa: Our men have to change their dress before they go out, brahmacārīs. That's the only way they can beg in this country.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Umāpati: Śrīla Prabhupāda? We, because of our fallen condition, do require many mechanical means by which we can offer one another respects and to teach one another examples of scripture. For example, we are asked to bow our bodies down to show respects, or to call one another "prabhu," to understand that each person is a spiritual master to the other. How is a... How are the boys and girls to learn these things in manners of decorum and manners from the sannyāsīs, for example. How are they to offer respects to their godbrothers. And, uh... (break)
Prabhupāda: You can. You behave like that, others will learn.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, yes. Old people should be instructed to forget what they have learned. He sādhavaḥ sakalam eva vihāya dūrād caitanya-candra-caraṇe kurutānurāgam. This is the formula of preaching. Prabodhānanda Sarasvatī, he is begging to the people, dānte nidhāya tṛṇakaṁ padayor nipatya kāku-śataṁ kṛtvā cāham bravīmi: "Taking a straw in my mouth, with folded hands and flattering you hundred times, I am submitting one request." "What is that?" This is the process of approaching these rascals, old fools who have learned something and does not like to forget. So he says, he sādhavaḥ: "Oh, you are such a nice learned scholar-devotee, so my request is that whatever you have learned, please forget." Sakalam eva vihāya dūrāt: "Kick them out." "Then? What shall I do?" Caitanya-candra-caraṇe kurutānurāgam: "Please turn your attention to the teachings of Lord Caitanya." He sādhavaḥ sakalam eva vihāya: "You are very great personality. So my request to you: you forget or kick out whatever you have learned." That is the first business.
Prabhupāda: It's... Especially, we are Indian. It is advertised that we are poverty-stricken. All over the world this is advertised. Wherever I go, they say, "Oh, you are coming from India?" (laughter) Because they are simply begging, the government. But who is dying? There is... Dying is going on, but that death is going on in other countries also. They are dying, committing suicide. And maybe some persons are dying out of starvation. You cannot stop death. Suppose you have got enough food. That means that everything is solved? In America there is enough food. Why they are coming hippies? There is no shortage of food. Nothing... Everything is abundant, but why they are becoming hippies? They are lying down on the street, on the park and I have seen in London, the St. James Park. They are sleeping, and the police is kicking: "Hey! Get up! Get up!" So why? The English nation is not poor nation. The American nation is not poor nation.
Prabhupāda: So God is eternal. That I have already explained. And we living entities, we are also eternal. How the son can be otherwise? If the father is eternal, the son is also eternal. The son cannot be... Because son is the expansion, part and parcel of the father, so all the qualities of the father are there. The only quality difference is the father maintainer and the sons are maintained. That means the father has got unlimited resources to maintain the sons, and the sons, they have no resources. They are maintained by the father. This is perfect philosophy. Otherwise, if you are self-sufficient, then why you go to church and beg father, "Give us our daily bread"? That is... That means you are maintained. You are begging the father, "Please maintain us." So if the Supreme Being, who is maintaining millions of trillions of living entities, He is great, or the living entities who are maintained by God, they are great? Therefore God is great, and we are subordinate. This is natural conclusion. How you can go otherwise? If you are self-sufficient, why go to church and pray, "God, give us our daily bread"? Are you independent?
Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...men, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya. First, second, third. Then fourth is the śūdras. And the fifth, caṇḍālas: no Vedic culture. They are caṇḍālas. So the Europeans, they were kṣatriyas originally. On account of Paraśurāma's massacre process, they fled from India to European side. And Greece and Rome, they were given—I think, Turkey also—given to two sons of Mahārāja Yayāti. They refused the order of the father. The father was very licentious. So he begged from two sons that "You give me your youth." They refused. So therefore they were banished in this part of the world.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Into England.
Prabhupāda: Not England. Greece, Rome, Turkey. Next to India, they were civilized. So European race mostly come from that part. Caucasian. Kaśyapa Muni. Central India. Er, central... What is called? Asia, Asia.
Prabhupāda: I can create one airplane, but God has created very, very big airplanes like these planets, and they are floating in the sky without any power crisis. That is God's creation. Here we are floating the airplane or running the car with the power, petrol, given by God. You cannot manufacture petrol. Just like in your country there is enough stock of petrol. But you have not created it. So who has created? Your creative power is to drill and get the stock. So much creative power you have got. But you cannot create petrol. Then the Americans would not have come here to beg petrol. That is the difference. You can create something by the ingredients given by God. You can create this table. Because wood is given by God, the instrument is given by God, and the intelligence given by God, the hand is given by God, so in this way you create the table. Then whose property it will be, your property or God's property? Whose property? If I give you wood, instrument, your salary, and you create something, the ultimately the thing created, to whom it should belong?
Prabhupāda: But they... They must explain. Just like in Vedic literature the same idea is there. (aside:) Don't lean. I am begging excuse. I am old man. But you should sit down like that Guru Mahārāja. So we know what was the word, oṁkāra. Praṇavaḥ sarva-vedeṣu. (break) So oṁkāra is the word. So what is the Christian word?
Prajāpati: Again there's no absolute authority. In the vast Christian tradition we have Origen saying one thing and Saint Francis saying another. Widespread... That's why it is not a science that we can go to like we can to Śrīla Prabhupāda for an exact answer, Bhagavad-gītā, exact absolute authority. In the Christian tradition it is simply defined as faithful men understanding themselves in the light of the scripture, in the light of the tradition.
Prabhupāda: No, that is because you are our student. Suppose our preachers meet the theologicians. How to prove that theology is not the means? Theology... Generally, you say it is speculation. So our point is that nāyam ātmā pravacanena labhyo na medhayā na bahunā śrutena. The ātmā, Kṛṣṇa, cannot be understood or approached, pravacanena, simply by logical arguments.
Rāmeśvara: Always. That in the beg..., that eternally there is gas in the atmosphere, in the universe.
Prabhupāda: Wherefrom the gas came?
Rāmeśvara: Well, they say... They believe that it always existed.
Prabhupāda: Always existing.
Rāmeśvara: Yes, that's their idea.
Satsvarūpa: Just like we say God is svarāṭ, they say that the matter is svarāṭ.
Prabhupāda: Yes, in... Not svarāṭ. We never find a gas is svarāṭ, matter is svarāṭ. They... Just this body. Has this body come out itself? Because the soul is there, the body has developed. Therefore the cause of this body is the soul. The body is not independent. And the soul goes away. Then body's no more independent. It cannot move. It becomes just like dust. "Dust thou art; dust thou be-est." (break) ...like this body is moving now, but it is not independent. It is dependent on the soul. The soul goes away; it does not move. So how it is independent? And everyone knows that because the soul takes shelter within the womb of the mother, the body develops. If the child comes out dead, it does not develop. Therefore matter is dependent on the soul, living being.
Prabhupāda: All right, parasite or not, but we are not working and getting our food.
Tripurāri: They say because we're begging from them. They are buying for us.
Prabhupāda: So why don't you stop? You are forced to give us. You stop. If we are begging from you, you stop it. But you cannot stop. You have to give us. We are showing that we are beggar, but we are taxing, exacting tax from you. You can think whatever you like.
Makhanlal: The government is also begging.
Prabhupāda: Yes. No, if we are begging, then you stop it. That is in your hand. We are not depending on you.
Amogha: Yes, but the Buddhist monks, when they beg, they simply accept whatever alms they receive, and if they receive meat then they'll eat that, and if they receive some raw grains then they eat that. Actually that is a higher state of renunciation.
Paramahaṁsa: And if they receive some cigarettes they'll smoke them.
Amogha: Yes, and if they receive-they'll take anything, they are so renounced. So isn't that more spiritual?
Prabhupāda: They have no idea what is spiritual. Buddhist religion is not a spiritual. It is material. If you kill me then I feel pain; therefore I shall not kill you. This is.
Amogha: Recently we received a letter from a Chinese man in Singapore. He wants all of your books. He wants to know how much.
Prabhupāda: Oh? You have supplied?
Prabhupāda: You are ātmā, I am ātmā, we are not one. You are individual, I am individual. I don't agree with you, you don't agree with me. So how one?
Kim: I beg your pardon?
Prabhupāda: How it is one?
Amogha: He says that you are individual and he is individual, so how can they be one?
Kim: How can they be one? I see. Yes. I was wondering how the ātman is associated with each individual. Is it the... Isn't it right to say the person is the ātman?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Kim: The person is the ātman. And to each person there is one ātman associated.
Prabhupāda: You are a person and I am a person. You are changing bodies and I am changing bodies.
Amogha: I was talking to one Buddhist monk, and I asked him, "What is your actual practice? What is your daily schedule?" And he said, "Well, we get up around sunrise and go out with our begging bowls and fill it up and then come back at about 11:00 to the temple. And then we sit down and eat everything in the begging bowl. And then we take rest." I said, "What about the rest of the day?" And he said, "Well, that's all free, open time."
Amogha: Śrīla Prabhupāda, we are distributing Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam and in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam you explain that it's best to start from the beginning and go gradually. So...
Prabhupāda: No, anywhere you can see.
Amogha: So we can distribute any canto.
Paramahaṁsa: Usually what happens is a person who gets, say, the Second or Third or Fourth Canto, if he reads that, then he will want to start from the beginning, and he'll buy the First Canto.
Prabhupāda: Rascal. So your brain is causing disaster; still you are developing brain? (laughter) Your brain is causing bankruptcy, and still you want to develop this rubbish brain? Begging money, "You give us money so that we can maintain"? And what is the use of this brain? Burn this brain. Advise him that "You better burn your brain so that you may not create any more disaster." To keep his brain, one animal must be sacrificed. And the brain work is this, that they are creating disaster. What is the use of this brain?
Paramahaṁsa: He says that the brain of man is bigger because man has been eating meat for so long.
Prabhupāda: Another rascal. That is the difficulty. The world is full of rascals and demons. And they are leaders. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥ (SB 7.5.31). "A blind man is leading other blind men."
Prabhupāda: Balance is that you should be reciprocal exchange. What you haven't got, you give me; what I haven't got, I give you. This should be the process of exchange. Then the world will be united. When there is exchange of gifts. But our India followed the principle for begging. "Give me men. Give me money. Give me wheat. Give me rice. Give me war materials." Simply begging. So we must give something. This is the first time we are giving something. Otherwise, India was a beggar simply to the western countries. For their technical education they are going to the western countries, and when there is war, they are asking America, "Please give us war materials." And when they give war materials to Pakistan we become envious. But you are also taking rice, ḍāl for this(?). So why should you remain beggar?
Prabhupāda: Power. He must have power, influence. Why he should beg vote, "Give me vote, give me vote, give me vote," begging? Where is power? If he is begging vote, where is power? Formerly the kings... Just like they used to take sword. "If you don't accept me, then I shall kill you." This is power. Śauryaṁ tejam...
Devotee: Dhṛtir, determination.
Prabhupāda: Determination, and yuddhe ca apalāyanam. Now when there is war, these politician will remain in their room safely. They will not go to the war. And why these people are voted for political post? Formerly the king would first of all stand. To the other side also, the king is there and this side also. The fight is going on. If the king is killed, then the victory is there. Yuddhe ca apalāyanam. The formula is there. So these classes of man should be on the administration, not anyone coward, nonsense, and by hook and crook they get some vote and take the political leader... How you will find peace?
Prabhupāda: No, I am not parasite. Your master. How do you say parasite? I am not going to beg from you. Parasites?
Brahmānanda: Parasite lives off another.
Prabhupāda: No, parasites means if I take others' property, others'. If I enjoy others'..., that is parasite. But we are not enjoying others' property. We are enjoying our father's property. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1). Kṛṣṇa is the proprietor. Why do you say parasite? And we are good children of Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, "Don't work, I shall give you everything." (laughter) Actually, Kṛṣṇa says that, that "Why you are working so hard?" Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām...: (BG 18.66) "You just under Me, I shall give you protection, whatever you want." And we are getting everything. Why parasite?
Prabhupāda: And I have known many instances. In Calcutta one very rich man's son in the evening he would take his bath and dress nicely, and he would go to the Howrah station and beg, cheat men: "I have lost my purse. Will you kindly help me?" And any gentleman: "He has lost..." And he will go to the restaurant and eat and go home. That was his habit. He was a very rich man, but his habit was this. So we have to change the habit by changing the heart. You know very well. Many thieves, they have committed many times theft and put into the jail. So he knows that "If I commit theft, I will go to the jail." He has practically seen it, and he knows it. Still, he steals. Why? Because heart is unclean. So this process will cleanse the heart. Unless he cleans the heart, you cannot stop criminality simply by laws. Laws are already known. The professional thief, he knows the law. The professional murderer, he knows the law. But still, he commits because heart is unclean.
Prabhupāda: First of all try to understand that you depend. The... After man and woman unite, there is children, and the man goes away, and you are embarrassed. The woman is embarrassed. Why? Why this is, is made possible? A man and woman unites, and the woman becomes pregnant, and the husband goes away. Then the poor woman is embarrassed with the child. She has to beg from the government. So do you think it is very nice thing? The Vedic idea is that woman should be married to a man and the man should take charge of the woman and the children independently so that they do not become a burden to the government or to the public.
Woman reporter: Do you think the social unrest...
Prabhupāda: I am thinking like this. You give me the answer. Simply you go on questioning. I question you, do you think this burden to the government or the public is good?
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the nature. You take even in the dogs. The dogs they also take care of their children. The tigers, they take care of the children. So in the human society, if the woman is made pregnant and the man goes away and she is embarrassed, she has to beg from the government, that is not a very good situation.
Woman reporter: What about women who do not have children?
Prabhupāda: Well, that is also another unnatural thing. Sometimes they use contraceptives. They kill children, abortion. That is also not very good. These are all sinful activities. These are sinful activities, to kill child in the womb. And take shelter of abortion. These are all sinful activities. One has to suffer for that.
Woman reporter: Is the social unrest in this country caused because...
Prabhupāda: Because of these things. They do not know that.
Prabhupāda: So she is already dependent on nature's law that man is free from becoming pregnant and the woman has to take the burden. Then where is the independence, equal right? Equal right means sometimes man may become pregnant, sometimes woman may become pregnant, but why only woman should become pregnant and the man goes away and she has to take care of the children, beg from government or this and that? Is that independence? Eh?
Satsvarūpa: For them, the independence has become contraception. "I don't have to have the child," they say.
Prabhupāda: That means you commit another sinful activity. Then you become dependent on nature. You'll be punished. The punishment goes to you. In this way... And the whole thing becomes cumbrous. So where is the benefit of equal right, independence? Phalena paricīyate. We have to see the result of every action—whether the result is beneficial. If the result is not beneficial—the action is not beneficial. There is cases of rape cases. The victims are women.
Prabhupāda: Therefore they do not believe next life. Finished. (break) ...gentleman, he was very well known, brother of Rabindranath Tagore. Rabindranath Tagore was poet, and he was artist, Abanindranath Tagore. In our childhood, in a meeting, he said that "Why should we bother about the next life? Let us enjoy this life." I remember that. Most people think like that. Carvāka Muni advised like that. Ṛṇaṁ kṛtvā ghṛtaṁ pibet. "Just enjoy life." "I have no money to enjoy." "Beg, borrow or steal. Bring money. Purchase ghee." "I will have to pay." "Ah! Why do you think like that?" "Then next life I will suffer." "Don't think like that. Your body will be finished. Who is coming here again?" What is that tower?
Kīrtanānanda: Lighthouse.
Prabhupāda: Lighthouse for the river?
Prabhupāda: All right, trying. But you women, you cannot see that this so-called equal right means cheating the woman. Now I say more clearly that a woman and man meets. Now they become lover. Then they have sex, and the woman becomes pregnant, and the man goes away. The simple woman, she has to take charge of the child and beg from government alms, "Please give me money." This is your independence. Do you admit this is independence, that the man makes the woman pregnant and he goes away without any responsibility, and the woman cannot give up the child, she maintains, begging from the government or she tries to kill the child? Do you think it is very good independence? What is your answer?
Woman: To... Whether or not it is good to kill a child? Is that the question?
Prabhupāda: Yes, they are killing now, abortion.
Ravīndra-svarūpa: He wants to know that kind of independence.
Woman: For the child?
Ravīndra-svarūpa: This is liberation. She has an affair with a man, and she gets pregnant. The man leaves. Then she has to beg alms from the government to support the child...
Prabhupāda: Or kill.
Ravīndra-svarūpa: Or she kills the child. So is that good or bad?
Woman: Well, she has made the choice to have...
Prabhupāda: That means, that is 34 ounce. You have made your choice to kill your own child. Is that very good choice?
Sandy Nixon: It's the worst crime you could commit.
Jayatīrtha: Her brain is getting larger. (laughter)
Prabhupāda: Do you think it is very good business?
Prabhupāda: Yes, they do not take the responsibility. They go away. They enjoy and go away. And the woman has to take the responsibility, either kill the child or maintainer, begging. Do you think begging is very good? In India, although they are poverty-stricken, still, they do not remain independent. They remain under the husband, and the husband takes all responsibility. So she has neither to kill the child nor go to beg for maintaining the child. So which is independence? to remain under husband is independence or to become free to be enjoyed by everyone?
Sandy Nixon: That's not where the freedom is anyway.
Prabhupāda: So there is no freedom; still, they think that they have freedom. That means under some plea, the men are cheating the women, that's all. So in the name of independence, they have agreed to be cheated by another class. This is the situation.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Now, Nixon is there, but when he was on the office, he was thinking, "Without me America will go to hell." But he has gone to hell; America is there. (laughter) Just see. Just see the position of the... You can see the Nixon. When he was in the office, oh, he was a big man. He was responsible man. Now he is kicked out. He is begging, and America is going on. Where is the need of this responsibility? For several months he was asked that "You give up your responsibility." The rascal will not give: "No, without me America will go to hell." Just see. This is responsible.
Yogeśvara: All of these big politicians, they seem to fall very ill afterwards. They seem to become very sick. Nixon is also sick.
Prabhupāda: Not only sick, they die very soon.
Yogeśvara: Radhakrishnan was paralyzed.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Brain paralyzed.
Brahmānanda: "May it please Your Excellency, enclosed please find one copy of my letter addressed to Śrī Jaya Prakash Narayanji. I wish that both of you may sit together and agree to join together to work on the basis of the instructions given in the Bhagavad-gītā. It is practical and good for India as well as for the whole world situation. The whole world is expecting to receive something from Indian culture. Why not push this movement and solve the complete problems of India? I hope you will take this suggestion seriously and do the needful without delay. Thanking you in anticipation. I beg to remain..."
Prabhupāda: So letter is already there. (Bengali)
Lalitā: ...after Mojīva's(?) incident. She is very... (Bengali)
Prabhupāda: So now what shall I write?
Lalitā: (Bengali) He was busy for the world organiza..., but he has left everything.
Prabhupāda: So shall I refer to your name? (Bengali) So take the... So "Your Excellency, Śrīmatī Indira Devi..." Indira Gandhi or Indira Devi?
Member: You can beg them (indistinct) everything nice with you.
Prabhupāda: (aside:) Sometimes this side, sometimes that side. Near the head. (about fan?)
Member: I not praising of Swamiji, I think no, so many saints are in India, so many great ṛṣis are there. Nobody were able to propagate or bring this consciousness among the people of the worlds as you did. It is a great credit to India. That is what I feel personally.
Prabhupāda: Do you think like that?
Member: Yes, I feel. In the heart of hearts I feel like that. I am very happy to see you and have your blessings. And I think that the whole world will be blessed or be benefited by your presence. I think we must take opportunity of utilizing your service and get benefit. That is what I feel.
Prabhupāda: ...devatā bhaktāḥ, te 'pi mām eva kaunteya yajanty avidhi-purvakam. They give examples, as the gopīs worshiped Kātyāyanī. But that is not avidhi. They went to Kātyāyanī for getting the favor of Kṛṣṇa. They prayed to mother Kātyāyanī, "Please be favorable to us so that Kṛṣṇa may be pleased upon us." Others go to beg from Kātyāyanī some material benefits, but the gopīs, they did not ask for any material benefit. And therefore that is vidhi.
Dr. Patel: Gopīs... Those who worship with Kṛṣṇa with sort of a sexual intention, but they became beyond the, I mean, guṇas, nirguṇa (Hindi), because Kṛṣṇa was nirguṇa. That is the thing.
Prabhupāda: Yes. They became purified. That is simply so they are purified.
Professor: Yes. No, no, I understand. I understand. I know where your argument is going to. But any case, let us beg to differ. Because... Let us accept it. I just want to say I agree with you in this sense. I agree with you in this sense, Swami, that if we do not pay attention to the religious side, then we keep the people in darkness. We have to, on the religious side too. (someone entering) Professor Olivier, the rector. (introducing) ...And this is our Swami Bhaktivedanta.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The principal of the university, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Hare Kṛṣṇa. How are you?
Professor: And Mister (indistinct) Singh from Pietermaritzburg, and Professor Maharaj you know. And all the other ladies and gentlemen.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Would you like to sit beside Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Professor: Yes.
Prabhupāda: So you can explain what I was talking.
Prabhupāda: Yes. There is no happiness. (pause) Nobody can remain lazy, because he will be hungry. So how he will remain lazy? He'll have to go somewhere, begging food, and he'll say, "First of all work. Then get your food." He'll work. So there is no question of remaining lazy. Just like the hippies. They do not work, but when they do not get food from anywhere, they go and work. Is it not? So he will be obliged to work.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: That is the incentive, then.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Devotee (2): Some of them steal. Instead of working, they steal their food.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Steal... When he is arrested, then he has to work in the prison. That's all.
Harikeśa: Chopping rocks.
Prabhupāda: Beg. Sell book. That's all. Otherwise how you get finance?
Jñāna: One idea is to have a farm that we sell fruit or vegetables, like that.
Prabhupāda: If you open farm for financial help, then it will not be successful. You should take to farming for supporting yourself. That's all. Grow your own food. Grow your own cloth. There is no need of financial help from outside. You get your food grains sufficiently, rice, dahl, wheat, vegetables, milk, sugar. Bas You get everything. From these five, six items you should be economically free. That you have to do, not for trade to get money. Then it will be failure.
Indian lady (3): Can we purchase the house for our own staying?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Because this is necessary. You must have some shelter; you must eat; you must cover. That is necessary. So you do it. Grow food first of all to feed yourself sumptuously. You must get strength, and that is needed. But not for trade. The policy should be that you should be self-sufficient and save time for advancing in Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Prabhupāda: We shall do it otherwise. Why shall I please Kṛṣṇa? We are making scientific progress. What is the use of bringing God?
Devotee (2): Because we shall never become perfect or see the answer.
Prabhupāda: That is begging the question.
Indian man (3): For spreading the name of the Kṛṣṇa, in the world.
Prabhupāda: No, no. It is not the question of guru. Guru is doing all right. Why you should be so much anxious and feel obligation to please Kṛṣṇa?
Indian (4): Everybody has to serve somebody, so Kṛṣṇa is the reservoir of all pleasure and everything exists from Him. So instead of serving anybody, we should serve the Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: "That's all right. Without serving Kṛṣṇa, I am getting pleasure by drinking wine.
Prabhupāda: There everyone is poor, begging. You are talking theoretically. I went to Moscow. The taxi driver was wanting something excess. They are so poor, begging, "Give me something more." They are so poor. Most of the people, they are walking on the street. There is no taxi. Nobody can pay for taxi. This is their situation.
Harikeśa: Yes, but why should somebody be rich and I be poor? What gives him the right to have money?
Prabhupāda: That is everywhere. That is called, that... He is born in a rich family; I am born in a poor family. So why this is happening?
Harikeśa: Yes, that's unfair. I mean, I should take his money.
Prabhupāda: No, no, not unfair. This is nature's arrangement, uccavacca. Why one has become animal? Why one has become man? The same living entity.
We prayed to Kṛṣṇa, "Please give your protection." That is for Viṣṇu's purpose. (break) ...Bhagavad-gītā, arto 'rthārthī jijñāsur: when one is in distress, he comes to Kṛṣṇa. So that is not pure bhakti. Pure bhakti means, "I shall not take a farthing from Kṛṣṇa; I shall give everything to Kṛṣṇa." That is pure. "I shall not take any return from Kṛṣṇa." Prahlāda Mahārāja says, "I am not a merchant, that for my service I take some return for it." No. But sometimes when, since we are not pure devotees, we have no other alternative than to beg Kṛṣṇa for some material benefit. That is also good. They have said, catur-vidhā bhajante māṁ, sukṛtinaḥ, that pious. Although they are not pure devotee, but they are pious. But the duṣkṛtinaḥ, they do not approach Him. That is the difference.
| Page Title: | Beg (Conv. 1967 - 1975) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, RupaManjari |
| Created: | 25 of Jul, 2011 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=85, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 85 |