Prabhupāda: We do not say. We say this material world also the energy of Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ khaṁ mano buddhir eva ca, bhinnā me prakṛtir aṣṭadhā (BG 7.4). He claims, "It is Mine," so how you can reject it? We cannot say anything Kṛṣṇa's is false. There is some purpose. I give this example, this finger: here is sensation, and here is no sensation. But both of them belongs to my body. Matter means where there is no Kṛṣṇa sensation. That is matter. And as soon as there is Kṛṣṇa sensation, it is spirit. Our Gosvāmīs' formula is that. Prāpañcikatayā buddhyā hari-sambandhi-vastunaḥ. Everything has got relation with Kṛṣṇa. So . . . eh?
Dr. Patel: That is the highest, I mean, fulfillment of prema-bhakti.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Prāpañcikatayā buddhyā hari-sambandhi . . . mumukṣubhiḥ parityāgo. Mumukṣubhiḥ, this mokṣa-vāñchā, they said, "It is false." So mumukṣu . . . parityāgo phalgu vairāgyaṁ kathyate. It is not real vairāgya. He does not know what is vairāgya.
Indian man: . . . get up.
Dr. Patel: Vaiṣṇavas vairagis to take care all your mind, senses and body, from that . . .
Prabhupāda: Everything Kṛṣṇa's. That . . .
Dr. Patel: Kṛṣṇa's. That is right.
Prabhupāda: Mānasa deha geha yo kichu mora, arpiluṅ tuwā pade. All as soon as it is surrendered to Kṛṣṇa, it is all spiritual.
Mahāṁśa: Sanātana Gosvāmī, at first he wanted to commit suicide. Caitanya Mahāprabhu said: "This body is not yours."
Prabhupāda: Yes. "How you can make suicide? You have already dedicated your body to Me. You have no right." This was the Caitanya Mahāprabhu's . . . you cannot neglect it. This is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's version. When one comes to this understanding, that "Everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa, everything has emanated from Kṛṣṇa," ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ (BG 10.8), "and everything can be used for Kṛṣṇa," then real understanding—sarvaṁ khalv idaṁ brahma (Chāndogya Upaniṣad 3.14.1). That is wanted.