Varnasrama and training
Expressions researched:
"training"
|"train"
|"trained"
|"training varnasrama"
|"varna and asrama"
|"varnas"
|"asramas"
|"asrama"
|"varna"
|"varnasrama"
|"varnasrama-dharma"
|"varnasrama"
|"Varna Ashrama"
Srimad-Bhagavatam
SB Canto 1
SB Canto 2
SB Canto 3
SB Canto 4
SB Canto 5
SB Canto 7
SB Canto 8
SB Canto 9
Sri Caitanya-caritamrta
CC Madhya-lila
Lectures
Bhagavad-gita As It Is Lectures
Srimad-Bhagavatam Lectures
Festival Lectures
General Lectures
Correspondence
1972 Correspondence
1975 Correspondence
Conversations and Morning Walks
1970 Conversations and Morning Walks
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: ...technological college. Similarly, this is another college, varṇāśrama college.
Satsvarūpa: For the public in general?
Prabhupāda: Eh? Yes. Anyone. Just like engineering college is open for anyone. He must be ready to take up the training. Similarly, this varṇāśrama college, he must be ready, the student, must be ready to take up the training.
Hṛdayānanda: Would it be for a particular age group?
Prabhupāda: Yes, any education, from childhood. Yes. Education means from childhood. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Kaumāra ācaret prājño dharmān bhāgavatān iha [SB 7.6.1]. The... How... We are getting so many sannyāsīs, they should teach. Teaching should be done by the sannyāsīs. Just like in missionary school, the fathers teaches.
Hṛdayānanda: How would it be different than gurukula?
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Hṛdayānanda: How would it differ from gurukula?
Prabhupāda: Gurukula is only for the small children. Preliminary, primary. And when the children are grown up, they should be sent to the varṇāśrama school or college for further developed training.
Prabhupāda: But Kṛṣṇa's grace, Caitanya Mahāprabhu's grace, they are being now trained up. Now you be trained up and revise the whole edition of the western civilization, especially in America. Then a new chapter will come in. This is the program. Therefore varṇāśrama school required.
Hṛdayānanda: So Prabhupāda, in this varṇāśrama college, is it true that there will be no need, for example, for teaching material history and mathematics and...?
Prabhupāda: No, there is no need. History, we simply read Mahābhārata, history of the great men, Pāṇḍavas, how they were fighting for the good cause, how they were reigning. That history. Not this rascal history. If you study that history millions of years, what is that history and what you'll learn from that history? You learn history of the really great men, how they worked, how they ruled. That is a... You study history of Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira.Prabhupāda: Then similarly, like that. Like that. I am doing that. I am teaching how to mop the floor.
Satsvarūpa: Then it becomes easy.
Prabhupāda: But I must know everything because I am a teacher.
Hṛdayānanda: So, for example, if I become a teacher at varṇāśrama, say, the first teacher at the varṇāśrama college, then I have to also become expert at how to fight, how to...
Prabhupāda: Not all of you, but some of you must be, must learn the art of fighting also. But in a practical you are not going to fight. If required, you can fight. I say that we are above all these varṇāśrama, but we must train others or ourself also for material activities, everything, under these divisions.1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Brahmānanda: I think the governor was asking about the varṇāśrama college.
Prabhupāda: Ah. Varnāśrama college, that training factual brāhmaṇa. And the government should be, as I explained to you, that if one is proclaiming himself as a brāhmaṇa, he must act as a brāhmaṇa. If one is proclaiming as a kṣatriya, he must act as a kṣatriya. Otherwise, there will be no restriction, and a śūdra will claim to be brāhmaṇa. That will create a disturbing situation.1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Kathy Kerr: Ah. Very well. Okay, I understand that this is an extension of Hindu religion. Is that not correct? No, it's not. Does it have any basic tenets of the Hindu religion?
Prabhupāda: There is no such word as Hindu religion. You do not know. There is no such word as Hindu religion, at least in the Vedas. The religion is translated into Sanskrit as "characteristic." Religion is not a kind of faith. Just like chemical composition. Sugar is sweet—that is religion. Sugar must be sweet. Sugar cannot be pungent. Or chili must be pungent. If chili is sweet, we reject it, and sugar is pungent, you reject it. Similarly, our Vedic system is to train the human being to the ultimate goal of his life. That system is called varṇāśrama-dharma, gradually training the person how to become perfect human being and understand the goal of his life. That is our activity. It is not meant for any particular sect or particular nation. No. It is meant for the whole human society, how to make them perfect in the goal of his life.Reporter: "But one of the premises of the American system of government is that if a leader has too much power, he will inevitably become corrupt."
Prabhupāda: "You have to train him in such a way that he cannot become corrupt."
Reporter: "What is that training process?"
Prabhupāda: "That training is the varṇāśrama-dharma, a system of dividing society into four social and four spiritual orders according to people's natural quality. Divide the society according to quality and train people in the principle that everything belongs to God and should be used in the service of God. Then there really can be one nation under God."
Reporter: "But if society is divided into different groups, won't there be envy?"
Prabhupāda: "No, no. Just as in my body there are different parts that work together, so the society can have different parts working for the same goal. My hand is different from my leg, but when I tell the hand, 'Bring a glass of water,' the leg will help. The leg is required and the hand is required."Reporter: "So if we don't choose our leaders by popular election, how will society be governed?"
Prabhupāda: "You require brāhmaṇas, kṣatriyas, vaiśyas and śūdras. Just as when you want to construct a building you require engineers. You don't want sweepers. Isn't that so? What will the sweeper do? No. There must be engineers. So if you follow the division of varṇāśrama, only kṣatriyas are allowed to govern. And for the legislative assembly, the senators, only qualified brāhmaṇas. Now the butcher is in the legislative assembly. What does he know about making laws? He is a butcher. But by winning votes he becomes a senator. At the present moment, by the principle of vox populi, a butcher goes to the legislature. So everything depends on training. In our Kṛṣṇa consciousness society we are actually doing that. But in the case of politics they forget it. There cannot be just one class. That is foolishness. Because we have to engage different classes of men in different activities. If we do not know the art then we will fail, because unless there is a division of work there will be havoc. We have discussed all the responsibilities of the king in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. The different classes in society should cooperate exactly as the different parts of the body do. Although each part is meant for a different purpose, they all work for one cause, to maintain the body properly."Dr. Patel: (Hindi) We allowed everyone to be here unawares. If public corporation, trading company, becomes the ruler of this country, I don't understand how it could be.
Prabhupāda: Because we have no, that cātur-varṇa system. Cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ [Bg. 4.13]. You have given up Kṛṣṇa's instruction, now you have to suffer. You do not train brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. So anyone who is in power, he is good. That is Kali-yuga. Kali-yuga means anyone gets vote, he's in power. They can misuse the power. There is no kṣatriya.
Dr. Patel: I think that is a wrong system (much airplane noise-indistinct) this open Democracy is not a (indistinct) by consensus...
Prabhupāda: No, no. Now, either democracy or monarchy, the population is śūdra. So either you make it democracy or any "crazy," śūdra will be on the power.1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
Satsvarūpa: But at least if there is extreme exploitation by a king or dictator it can't be changed. But the people...
Prabhupāda: There cannot be exploitation if things are made in order. Just like kṣatriya should be trained up as kṣatriya. Then he is king. Not that a bhangi by vote becomes a king. This is education.
- śauryaṁ tejo dhṛtir dākṣyaṁ
- yuddhe cāpy apalāyanam
- dānam īśvara-bhāvaś ca
- kṣātraṁ karma svabhāva-jam
- [Bg. 18.43]
Hari-śauri: But in Caitanya Mahāprabhu's practical preaching He only induced them to chant.
Prabhupāda: That is not possible for ordinary man.
Hari-śauri: What, to simply induce people to chant?
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Hari-śauri: He only introduced just the chanting.
Prabhupāda: But who will chant? Who'll chant?
Satsvarūpa: But if they won't chant, then neither will they train up in the varṇāśrama. That's the easiest.
Prabhupāda: The chanting will be there, but you cannot expect that people will chant like Caitanya Mahāprabhu. They cannot even chant sixteen rounds. (And) these rascals are going to be Caitanya Mahāprabhu.
Satsvarūpa: No. But if they at least will chant and take some prasāda...
Prabhupāda: Chanting will go on. That is not stopped. But at the same time the varṇāśrama-dharma must be established to make the way easy.
Hari-śauri: Well, at least my own understanding was that the chanting was introduced in the age of Kali because varṇāśrama is not possible.
Prabhupāda: Because it will cleanse the mind. Chanting will not stop.
Hari-śauri: So therefore the chanting was introduced to replace all of the systems of varṇāśrama and like that.
Prabhupāda: Yes, it can replace, but who is going to replace it? The... People are not so advanced. If you imitate Haridāsa Ṭhākura to chant, it is not possible.
Satsvarūpa: We tell them go on with your job but chant also.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Thākaha āpanāra kāje, Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura. Āpanāra kāja ki. Caitanya Mahāprabhu recommended, sthāne sthitaḥ. And if they do not remain in the sthāna, then the sahajiyā's chanting will come. Just like the sahajiyās also have got the beads and..., but they have got three dozen women. This kind of chanting will go on. Just like our (name withheld). He was not fit for sannyāsa but he was given sannyāsa. And five women he was attached, and he disclosed. Therefore varṇāśrama-dharma is required. Simply show-bottle will not do. So the varṇāśrama-dharma should be introduced all over the world, and...
Satsvarūpa: Introduced starting with ISKCON community?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriyas. There must be regular education.
Hari-śauri: But in our community, if the..., being as we're training up as Vaiṣṇavas... Prabhupāda: Yes.
Hari-śauri: ...then how will we be able to make divisions in our society?
Prabhupāda: Vaiṣṇava is not so easy. The varṇāśrama-dharma should be established to become a Vaiṣṇava. It is not so easy to become Vaiṣṇava.Page Title: | Varnasrama and training |
Compiler: | Visnu Murti |
Created: | 9 of jan, 2008 |
No. of Quotes: | 59 |
Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=18, CC=2, OB=0, Lec=19, Con=17, Let=3 |