Vaisnavism (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"vaishnavism" |"vaisnavism"

1970 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- December 13, 1970, Indore:

Guest (1): Even physical, bodily, whatever it is, whatever it is, but you must know who your enemies are. Your enemy may be my friend. (part indistinct)

Prabhupāda: That's nice proposal. Unless you find an enemy, how you can fight? So of course, we do not say... We Vaiṣṇavas do not say that there is no need of fighting. We never say. When there is need of fighting we must fight. Rather, somebody in New York, some Goldsmith, he was that, "Why Kṛṣṇa is advising Arjuna to fight, to become violent?" So somebody protests like that. But there is no meaning of protesting against the action of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. That is our view. So we Vaiṣṇavas, we are chanting. It does not mean that when there is need of fighting with avaiṣṇava we shall lack in strength. We can fight. One gentleman inquired from me that "Vaiṣṇavism makes one dull. He cannot act." And, "No. You have not seen a Vaiṣṇava." In the two fightings, great fighting, the Rāmāyaṇa and Mahābhārata, the hero was Hanuman and Arjuna, and they fought.

Guest (1): They fought.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And who can be better Vaiṣṇava than them?

Guest (1): Nobody.

Prabhupāda: So Vaiṣṇava does not mean he is dull. No.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview with Reporters -- November 10, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: ...me that "Your Vaiṣṇavism has killed India." And why? "No, Vaiṣṇava means inactive. They say simply chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and do nothing." Then "You have not seen a Vaiṣṇava," I told him.

Reporter: Pardon?

Prabhupāda: I told him that he has not seen a Vaiṣṇava.

Reporter: Vaiṣṇava.

Prabhupāda: In India there are two major war, Rāma-rājya yudha and kurukṣetra yudha, and there the hero is a Vaiṣṇava-Arjuna and Hanumān.

Reporter: Hanumān?

Prabhupāda: Hanumānjī. Rāma-rājya.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Sir Alistair Hardy -- July 21, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: No, not at all.

Sir Alistair Hardy: Not at all. No.

Prabhupāda: What is his writings? So many speculation. That's all. But it has got little similarity to Vaiṣṇavism. His Gītāñjali...

Sir Alistair Hardy: He had a great reputation in the western world.

Prabhupāda: But his literatures are not read by our... A section.

Revatīnandana: Mostly in Bengal. And because he was accepted in the West, therefore they are very proud of it. But otherwise...

Prabhupāda: The Russians read. I have heard that in your Oxford University there is study of Rabindranath's books? They study?

Sir Alistair Hardy: They study which books?

Room Conversation with Indian Ambassador -- September 5, 1973, Stockholm:

Prabhupāda: So our, our point is that you may express your own op... Everyone has got right to... Especially Mahatma Gandhi, he was actually a great personality. There is no doubt about it. But so far Bhagavad-gītā is concerned, he did not know anything. But from his behavior, it was seen that at heart he was a devotee. Yes. At heart he was a devotee. Yes. Because he was chanting...

Ambassador: Yes, of course, he, of course, shares with you this belief in chants. That we noticed, yes, very much in...

Prabhupāda: That raghupati rāghava rājā rāma.

Ambassador: Vaiṣṇavism.

Prabhupāda: Ah. So that... But maybe for politics, he has explained like that. Now what is that verse?

Morning Walk -- December 13, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: ...could have written a lot of Vaiṣṇava songs, if he were a Vaiṣṇava.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But he borrowed the idea from Vaiṣṇava. His guru, not exactly guru... In his zamindari, Golpur, he was going to a Vaiṣṇava, Baul. But Baul is sahajiyā. So he got the idea of Vaiṣṇavism, but because he was not Vaiṣṇava, he presented his idea in a different way. That is his Gītāñjali. Gītāñjali is the depiction of the idea he got from that Baul.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: His songs are so popular in Bengal.

Prabhupāda: No, all over the world, more or less.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Even I sang some of his songs when I was in Calcutta.

Prabhupāda: There is idea, some Vaiṣṇava idea.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, no. Christianity is Vaiṣṇavism.

Dr. Patel: Vaiṣṇavism? Absolutely Vaiṣṇavism.

Prabhupāda: Anyone who... Mohammedan is also Vaiṣṇavism.

Dr. Patel: Mohammedanism is not Vaiṣṇavism.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Caitanya Mahāprabhu had talk with the Pāṭhānas. He proved that "Your religion is Vaiṣṇavism."

Dr. Patel: Christianity is Vaiṣṇavism 100%.

Prabhupāda: Therefore in Caitanya-caritāmṛta there is. I have already explained that.

Dr. Patel: No, Christianity is 100% Vaiṣṇavism. I have studied Christianity very well.

Prabhupāda: Not hundred percent, but...

Dr. Patel: More or less.

Morning Walk -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Vaiṣṇava shall work hard, undergo all tribulation, for others. He has no problem. A Vaiṣṇava has no problem. Because he has taken shelter of Kṛṣṇa, he has no problem. Kaunteya pratijānīhi na me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyati (BG 9.31). Kṛṣṇa also gives guarantee, "Anyone who has taken shelter of My..., he is saved. I will give him protection." Kṛṣṇa says, ahaṁ tvāṁ mokṣayiṣyāmi sarva... Everything is there. For Vaiṣṇava there is no suffering, personally. But he is very much anxious: "How these rascals will be happy?" That is his business. "These rascals are misled. They are going astray, unhappy. So how they should be happy?" So that is Vaiṣṇava's business. So the Vaiṣṇava, therefore, will have no politics. Politics means planning for one's own happiness. That is politics. So in our society there should be no diplomacy, no politics. Everyone should be eager how to do good to others. That is Vaiṣṇava. If he's planning something, that "I shall be leader," "I shall be doing something," that is not Vaiṣṇavism. That politics is not good.

Morning Walk -- March 24, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That conception is Vaiṣṇavism. And as soon as you simply say that "He is God," that is Māyāvāda.

Guest (2): Yes but we are not... But he has wrongly...

Guest (1): No, Swami Nārāyaṇa, what I told you the principle of Swami Nārāyaṇa is that...

Guest (2): Swami Nārāyaṇa...

Dr. Patel: You have no right to speak.

Guest (1): No, no. What I understand about this...

Dr. Patel: There are three schools of Vaiṣṇavism. But that... In that school, the preaching and everything in the worship is the same, more or less.

Prabhupāda: (break) The thing is... This is the conclusion, that guru may be worshiped as Kṛṣṇa, but the worshiper knows that "I am worshiping my guru not because he has become Kṛṣṇa, but he is the most confidential servant of Kṛṣṇa." That is Vaiṣṇava.

Morning Walk -- March 24, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Some of the manuscripts were found in South India and He brought it and He delivered, that "This is authoritative."

Dr. Patel: As a matter of fact, the Vaiṣṇavism started from South India.

Prabhupāda: Even Śaṅkara was also South India.

Dr. Patel: Cult of Vaiṣṇavism started from South India.

Prabhupāda: All the ācāryas, they came from South India.

Dr. Patel: They are more religious.

Prabhupāda: Vallabhācārya also South India.

Dr. Patel: Vallabhācārya is from North, no?

Prabhupāda: South India.

Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So why did that person say that Janardan Swami Narayan is the topmost?

Indian man (2): (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: No, that Buddhism. That is not Vaiṣṇavism.

Indian man (2): (indistinct) stop them, what he said, (Sanskrit).

Prabhupāda: That is Buddhism.

Indian man (2): But he's not Buddhist, he's Vaiṣṇava.

Prabhupāda: But he's taking the Buddhist philosophy.

Indian man (2): He's not taking the Buddhist philosophy. In what way he has?

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, because in the śāstra, in the Vedas, it is stated that, sometimes it is recommended animal sacrifice.

Morning Walk Excerpts -- May 1, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Dr. Patel: He was a bhakta.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I said in many lectures that Christianism means Vaiṣṇavism. Where is the Christian?

Dr. Patel: Vaiṣṇavism. Totally Vaiṣṇavism.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.

Dr. Patel: Christianity it is really Vaiṣṇavism, but they, unfortunately... The church...

Prabhupāda: Mohamedanism... Mohammedanism...

Dr. Patel: The church has spoiled it.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Room Conversation with Christian Priest -- June 9, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, we have got very regard, good regard, for Christianity. We take it as Vaisnavism. It is explained according to country, time. And the commandments are very nice. The first commandment is "Thou shall not kill," but that is not stopped in the Christian world. Therefore we say that the Christians are not following. Christianity is all right. Those who are professing Christianity, they are not following.

Jyotirmayī: (French)

Prabhupāda: Muhammadanism also Vaiṣṇavism, because Muhammad says, "I am servant of God, Allah." So that is our conception, dāsya-rasa, dāsya. Śānta, dāsya, sakhya, vātsalya, mādhurya. So prayer, offering prayer, that is also bhakti. Śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ smaraṇaṁ pāda-sevanam arcanaṁ vandanam. Just like we are worshiping Deity and somebody is offering prayer—both of them are approved. Prayer, vandanam. Dāsyam sakhyam ātma-nivedanam. So we don't say that this is bad and this is good. No. Both of them are bhakti. To worship the Deity or to offer prayer, the effect is the same. Effect is not different.

Room Conversations -- September 10, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: This is paramparā system. The Gosvāmīs also did it. Nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-nipuṇau sad-dharma-saṁsthāpakau lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau, for the benefit of the (indistinct). We are pushing this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement for the benefit of the whole world, not that for our individual person. Vaiṣṇava, whatever he does, he does for the whole world, not for his person. Bhukti-mukti-siddhi-kāmī, they do for their own person. Karmīs, jñānīs, yogis, for their personal benefit. That is also materialism. Vaiṣṇavism, lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau tri-bhuvane mānyau. Therefore, honored all over the three worlds, their activities and their person. Tri-bhuvane mānyau śaraṇyākarau. Therefore, they should be taken shelter of. Vande rūpa-sanātanau raghu-yugau śrī-jīva-gopālakau. Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura confirmed, ei chaya gosāñi yāra, tāra mui dāsa, "One who has taken shelter of the six Gosvāmīs, I am his servant, nobody's servant."

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with Indian Guests -- April 12, 1975, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: That is our protest. All these misleaders... Perhaps, throughout the whole world, it is the first time—we are preaching Bhagavad-gītā as it is. We are the only institution in the world that we are preaching Bhagavad-gītā as it is, and people are liking it. Before that, for the last two hundred years, so many swamis, yogis and..., they tried to preach Hindu philosophy, Vaiṣṇavism. Not a single person was a devotee of Kṛṣṇa, not a single person. Now you see so many young men. Why? Why this difference? Because we did not present Bhagavad-gītā adulterated. Presented as it is, that's all. What is the use of preaching adulterated things? Everyone wants... That appeals as it is. Therefore we present Bhagavad-gītā as it is. Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). We are preaching the same thing—"Always think of Kṛṣṇa. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. You remember Kṛṣṇa always." This is the simplest process. You see all these young boys. They are chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. And they are becoming purified from the mode of our life. And these swamis and yogis preached so many years, not a single person was purified.

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Materialistic man means he wants all these things in different way. Somebody is becoming God, somebody is becoming philosopher, somebody is becoming scientist, in this way. Real purpose is these three things. Abha-pūjā-pratiṣṭhā. And our philosophy? We don't want anything of this. Just see. Negation. Na dhanaṁ na janaṁ na sundarīṁ kavitāṁ (Cc. Antya 20.29, Śikṣāṣṭaka 4). Say... All denial, "We don't want." That is Vaiṣṇavism. Then what do you want? "We want simply to serve Kṛṣṇa." This is our position. They don't want to serve Kṛṣṇa; they want to imitate Kṛṣṇa. And that is their satisfaction.

Amogha: Śrīla Prabhupāda, many times when I am seeing professors or students also, they seem to think that traditional Hinduism or whatever they think it is, they say that the Māyāvādī philosophy, or monist, they think this is traditional, and..., because there's so many translations of the Bhagavad-gītā and the Upaniṣads they've read, and they're all impersonal. So I was wondering what is the best way to convince them that actually, that is not actually the original tradition of understanding?

Garden Conversation -- June 25, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No, it is possibility. Just like you have got this religious section, similarly, we can have Vedic theological section. That's all. It is a section department.

Dr. Judah: The idea of the college that you have in mind, is this going to be an all-around college, in other words teaching not only, you might say, Vaiṣṇavism, but also English and the other subjects?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Dr. Judah: In other words, a liberal arts college with a religious section in it.

Prabhupāda: No. Just like your association is graduate. So you accept graduates to the Union?

Dr. Judah: Well, will this be...

Prabhupāda: Just like law college. Law college, one joins after graduation.

Morning Walk -- June 30, 1975, Denver:

Satsvarūpa: It was an interreligion meeting, and there were representatives from different Christian..., and he was there for Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇavism or Kṛṣṇa consciousness. But he didn't give any strong argument; he just presented it as if it were another way.

Prabhupāda: What is that way?

Satsvarūpa: Well, he said, he described it very... About Rādhā... That Lord Caitanya is Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa combined.

Prabhupāda: That we say also.

Satsvarūpa: Yes, but the boys who were there, they said it wasn't at all the way you speak. He wasn't saying that ours was the best.

Prabhupāda: No, ours is the best, neither he is best nor it is as it is.

Morning Walk -- June 30, 1975, Denver:

Prabhupāda: What was the subject?

Satsvarūpa: Just world religions with representatives from different religions. Each would speak on their understanding. They asked him what is Kṛṣṇa consciousness or Gauḍīya Vaisnavism.

Prabhupāda: And who asked for the Absolute Truth, that...?

Satsvarūpa: Uttamaśloka dāsa.

Prabhupāda: Hmm. So, they avoided.

Satsvarūpa: Yes, they asked him... Swami Bon said, "Don't speak."

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Satsvarūpa: He asked Uttamaśloka, "Don't speak. You shouldn't..."

Prabhupāda: What right he has got to say like that? It was a meeting. He did not say, "What right you have got to say me?" The president, he was president or what?

Conversation with Professor Hopkins -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: Yes, saṅkīrtana. And Kṛṣṇa is teaching the same thing. Satataṁ kīrtayanto māṁ yatantaś ca dṛḍha-vratāḥ (BG 9.14). Find out.

Prof. Hopkins: So by saying that the Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇavism is, and Caitanya, are the central way of... You are not excluding...

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Prof. Hopkins: You would not...

Prabhupāda: No.

Prof. Hopkins: You are not excluding the Pandarpur tradition of Tukārāma, Rāmanitoba, (indistinct), you are not excluding the Alavars and Rāmancha, but you are saying all of these groups, all of these teachers.

Prabhupāda: Tukārāma accepts Caitanya Mahaprabhu as his guru. Then where is the difference?

Conversation with Professor Hopkins -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: Vaiṣṇava and non-Vaiṣṇava.

Prof. Hopkins: Vaiṣṇava and non-Vaiṣṇava. So it's not a question of sectarian differences within Vaiṣṇavism. (break) And you would see the worshipers of Śiva as impersonalists?

Prabhupāda: Impersonalists.

Prof. Hopkins: You would see... All of them.

Prabhupāda: The Śaivites, the Śaṅkarācārya.

Prof. Hopkins: Śaṅkarācārya, I know he is.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Śaṅkarācārya's theory is the ultimate, the Absolute Truth is impersonal. And one can imagine a personal form for the benefit of the worshiper.

Conversation with Professor Hopkins -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: No, there are devotees. Just like we, we offer all respect to Lord Śiva. We consider Śiva as the best of the Vaiṣṇavas. Vaiṣṇavānām yathā śambhu. And we have got sampradāya from Śiva. He is considered one of the authority of Vaiṣṇavism.

Prof. Hopkins: So you would, you would include...

Prabhupāda: Our conception of Śiva is different.

Prof. Hopkins: Where would Basavana fit in?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Prof. Hopkins: Where would you place Basavana in relation with...

Prabhupāda: Who?

Prof. Hopkins: Basavana.

Morning Walk -- September 30, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Japan also. Well, everyone is against us.

Dr. Patel: No, these boys who are recruited newly. They don't have much about the idea of Vaiṣṇavism.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. That's a fact. But what can I do? They are my helper.

Dr. Patel: They have to be trained up earlier and then let loose. Otherwise, you know, they create it. Because all the bad impressions are for them.

Prabhupāda: No. They'll be trained while working. Not that simply theorizing at home, no.

Dr. Patel: That's right, but I think...

Prabhupāda: They should work, and at the same time, they may fall down, just like a child tries to walk, falls down, again walks, again... Then he becomes complete.

Morning Walk -- September 30, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, Mohammed also has got... Caitanya Mahāprabhu argued in Koran. He proved there is kṛṣṇa-bhakti. He proved with the Pathans. Yes.

Dr. Patel: Otherwise the Christianity is just our way, I mean, absolutely Vaisnavism. It has been wrongly preached and wrongly initiated in India. That is why it has fallen to disrepute. Otherwise Christianity is just Vaiṣṇava-dharma. Nothing else, to my mind, the way I have studied, I mean the New Testament and all the Christian, all the things. Now, the sermon of Christ is nothing but the preaching of Bhagavad-gītā.

Prabhupāda: I never criticized. I simply said that positive side, God consciousness.

Dr. Patel: Christ himself was drunk with God consciousness totally.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 8, 1976, Nellore:

Prabhupāda: (laughs) All fools, rascals, mūḍhas. (break) The Tirupati is a Vaiṣṇava temple, so they should encourage.... Vaisnavism means real religion. All other, bogus, cheating religions. That is.... Dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo atra (SB 1.1.2). Kaitava means cheating. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). They do not know that. What is this land?

Indian man (1): The police superintendent's house.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Police superintendent. They are using the Deity's money, Prabhupāda, to maintain the universities. And in the universities they are teaching birth control and so many other things.

Prabhupāda: So why don't you take them into court?

Interview with Professors O'Connell, Motilal and Shivaram -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Viśvakarmā: ...Professor O'Connell came over to the temple when this, some man came, Ted Patrick, he came to Toronto last year—I think we told you about it—and he took one of our devotees and deprogrammed her. There was big publicity in the paper for an entire week. So Professor O'Connell came forward and spoke on behalf of our movement, saying that he felt that it was a bona fide system of Vaiṣṇavism. He came to the temple and assisted us.

Prabhupāda: O'Connell knows me from a such long time. Yes. We first met in Harvard University. Next he saw me in London, Bhaktivedanta Manor. I think Boston also.

Viśvakarmā: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He's interested in Vaiṣṇava philosophy.

Viśvakarmā: Yes, he wrote his thesis on Caitanya Vaiṣṇavism.

Prabhupāda: So he has got his doctorate?

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes, they are worshiping... This is... First of all, you must forget that this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is not Hinduism. It is Vaiṣṇavism. Vaiṣṇava means Viṣṇu is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and one who loves Viṣṇu or loves God, he is Vaiṣṇava. So Hinduism is not like that. Present conception of Hinduism, they have got so many demigods. Demigods are there in the Vedas, but demigod worshipers, they are all materialistic persons. It is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā that kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ yajanti anya-devatāḥ (BG 7.20). Those who are worshiper of demigods, they are lusty. Kāmuka. And the kāmuka platform is material world, lusty. Everyone is trying to enjoy sense gratification. So demigod worship is for sense gratification. If you worship Durga, then you pray, "Mother Durga, give me name, fame, wealth, good wife, and so on, so on." Dhanaṁ dehi rūpaṁ dehi rūpavati-bhāryaṁ dehi. Simply demanding for sense gratification. So that is not love of Godhead. That is to select one agent of God and exact from him as much as you can for your sense gratification. That is not recommended in the Vedic religion. Vedic religion, although there are demigods, but the ultimate is oṁ tad viṣṇoḥ paramaṁ padaṁ sadā paśyanti sūrayaḥ.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Simply demanding for sense gratification. So that is not love of Godhead. That is to select one agent of God and exact from him as much as you can for your sense gratification. That is not recommended in the Vedic religion. Vedic religion, although there are demigods, but the ultimate is oṁ tad viṣṇoḥ paramaṁ padaṁ sadā paśyanti sūrayaḥ. Those who are sūraya, actually advanced, they see to the Viṣṇu paramaṁ padam. Viṣṇor aradhanaṁ param. The worship of Viṣṇu is the supreme worship. So actually everyone should be worshiper of Viṣṇu. And that is Vaiṣṇavism. So Vaiṣṇavism means for everyone or sanātana dharma. That I have already explained. The human.... The living entity is sanātana. Mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ jīva-loke sanātana (BG 15.7). He is sanātana. God is sanātana. The exchange between God and the living entity is called sanātana-dharma or Vaiṣṇavism. So we are teaching that. We are not teaching Hinduism, Muslimism, Christianism. We are teaching how to love God. That's all. There is no question of proselytization. It is the natural. We are, by nature we are lover of God.

Room Conversation with Professor Francois Chenique -- August 5, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: The difference is, a bhakta, pure bhakta, he has jñāna. But a jñānī may not have bhakti.

Yogeśvara: Once Professor Chenique asked me whether we thought it was possible for a Christian like himself to also realize the perfection of Vaiṣṇavism.

Prabhupāda: Why not? Christianity in Vaiṣṇavism. Christianism is Vaiṣṇavism. Anyone who accepts the supremacy of God, he's a Vaiṣṇava. So Christian, Christianity, "God is great," they say. So that is Vaiṣṇavism, "God is great."

Professor Chenique: Oui, but now the Christians say that God is dead.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Bhūgarbha: Now the Christians say God is dead.

Room Conversation with Professor Francois Chenique -- August 5, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Bhūgarbha: He says just like Vaiṣṇavism is also coherent, but one has to study very deeply. Otherwise, one cannot see it. He said if we examine all the religions and find out the axiomatic truths of every religion, we'll see how they are all coherent.

Prabhupāda: No. The thing is that religion means to understand God. If one does not understand God, then his religion is still defective. Religion means to understand God. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje ahaituky apratihatā (SB 1.2.6). When you understand God and your relationship with God, then it is perfection of religion.

Bhūgarbha: He said that he feels very thankful that you've given him such a long darśana. He's very happy that you've given so much enlightenment in many subjects. He's just passing through with his daughter. He'd like to stay tomorrow to see the installation of the Deities, but he has to go to a Tibetan temple in the south of France. On Saturday he has to be there, so he has to drive, and he said that he's found the Tibetans are also very good devotees.

Prabhupāda: Very good. Jaya.

Room Conversation -- October 3, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: He was the head.

Hari-śauri: (laughs) You were teaching Vaiṣṇavism or...

Prabhupāda: Yes. I wanted to start from there. It was very nice, big house. But this K. Munshi's wife tactfully wanted me to... The Governor's wife. That was a very big house.

Hari-śauri: Oh, there were some politics. I didn't know.

Prabhupāda: But he peacefully took it. I could have fought but I did not like. All the pleaders in Jhansi, they said, "Don't leave." She was pressing through the collectors, to the manager. That house belonged to some zamindar. But it was under the management of another man, Reba Shankara(?). So he was proprietor of one cinema hall. So the governor's wife was pressing him through the collector because the license has to be renewed from the collector. Collector was insisting that "You give that house, Lilavati Munshi. Indirectly. Otherwise, your license will not be issued."

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1976, Vrndavana:

Hari-śauri: Dr. Stillson Judah says, "The Hare Kṛṣṇa movement and more formally the International Society for Kṛṣṇa Consciousness, ISKCON, is a western representation of an important Hindu sect, Vaisnavism."

Prabhupāda: He says, "Important Hindu sect." How they can say whether it is a genuine? Important, not only genuine but important, Vaisnavism.

Hari-śauri: Hm. (continues reading) "...whose worship of Lord Kṛṣṇa, Viṣṇu, in one of His many forms is one of the most important religions of India. The American devotees of ISKCON worship Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Being, the highest Personality of Godhead, whose worship according to the archaeological and epigraphic evidence, is pre-Christian in origin, as found in India's early sacred texts, the Ṛg Veda, Atharva Veda, etc. The detailed history of Kṛṣṇa's incarnation is found in the religious text of the Bhāgavata Purāṇa, and the philosophical basis of the Hare Kṛṣṇa Movement is found in India's most sacred book the Bhagavad-gītā.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: It is natural to serve God, to remain faithful to Him. This is natural. Artificially you are trying to be independent. This is the Māyāvāda... Still, they are trying to become God himself.

Dr. Patel: Sir, after first I met you, some previous time, I made an extensive study of both the sides of Vaiṣṇavism as well as the (indistinct). I think they are falling short of the final (indistinct). Once they say that they are in Brahman, but there is Para-brahman also. That Brahman is nothing but a jyoti of Para-brahman. That they forget.

Prabhupāda: That means knowledge.

Dr. Patel: And I think, sir, even Śaṅkarācārya has not meant that we must be short of that. He was also worshiping, was he not? He was worshiping Para-brahman.

Prabhupāda: He has given a commentary on the Bhagavad-gītā. In the beginning he says nārāyaṇaḥ paraḥ, "Nārāyaṇa is transcendental."

Room Conversation -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: You should know. You have read Gandhi's book.

Dr. Patel: He practiced Vaiṣṇavism. That is what my wife said. Always, daily, to worship.

Prabhupāda: This is not... I do not know what is Gandhi's book, his Gītā lecture. Why don't you purchase them? Explain.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I'll get you some.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He mentioned that, that "My Kṛṣṇa is different imagination. My imagination of Kṛṣṇa is different." That is his position. He imagines. He has... (Hindi) "My imagination of Kṛṣṇa..." This is... How he can believe Kṛṣṇa? Kṛṣṇa is preaching violence, and he's trying to draw nonviolence. The people will challenge, but he makes his own commentation, his own imagination. He said, "My imagination of Kṛṣṇa is different." This is his word.

Roof Conversation -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Mayaiva vihitaṁ devi kalau brāhmaṇa-mūrtinā. (break)

Dr. Patel: The most important group in all Vaiṣṇavas. Vaiṣṇava-bhakti-sat-saṅga anyathā yānti vido apy adhaḥ.(?) Even well-versed man will come down if he does not understand. All the branches of Vaiṣṇavism, they give the same comment.

Prabhupāda: Satāṁ prasaṅgān mama vīrya-saṁvido bhavanti hṛt-karṇa-rasāyanāḥ kathāḥ (SB 3.25.25). Without sat-saṅga, nobody can understand Kṛṣṇa. Bhaktyā mām abhijānāti (BG 18.55).

Dr. Patel: Swami Nārāyaṇa has mentioned this such,

kṛṣṇaḥ tad-avatāraḥ ca

jñeyaḥ tat-tattvam api ca

na tu jīvan rūpa-devādya

bhakta brahma-vido 'pi ca (?)

Even the highest bhaktas, the brāhmaṇa-bhaktas, they should not be worshiped more than Kṛṣṇa, and He is also highest. But the followers, you know what they are doing.

Prabhupāda: They are not followers. If they do not follow their guru, then what kind of follower...?

Conversation and Instruction On New Movie -- January 13, 1977, Allahabad:

Rāmeśvara: There are temples all over India, and... A movie about Vaisnavism, not so much just Hare Kṛṣṇa, but Vaisnavism in general. Now, in the colleges in America they are always eager to have movies about Hinduism, Muhammadanism, Buddhism, for showing to their students, but whenever they have a movie about Hinduism, it is all bogus, many gods, many demigod worship, nature worship. And the people who make these movies for college classes have no conception. So I was thinking, if we make a scholarly movie about Vaisnavism...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Do. You can do.

Rāmeśvara: ...which will convince people that chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa is very accepted in India...

Prabhupāda: You take... You take this. I'll give you hint. You can develop it. Śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ (SB 7.5.23). The beginning is hearing about Kṛṣṇa, Bhagavad-gītā, Bhāgavatam. Big, big sabhā, you'll find many Vaiṣṇavas chanting. They are reciting Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, and hundreds and thousands are hearing.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: So you take this Dacca responsibility. Take that temple. It will be very nice, a great triumph for us.

Gargamuni: Yes. I will go. In a Muslim country to establish Vaiṣṇavism.

Prabhupāda: The temple is nice, and let us renovate it and establish our center, and gradually, if Americans preach there, the Muhammadans will come. If Hindu preach, they'll take otherwise. But when they see the Americans have come, they'll take it little seriously. And now we have got philosophy. At least the educated class will understand. You take that, and it will be a great triumph. My Guru Mahārāja will be pleased. He established that temple, and Tīrtha Mahārāja was selling it. But he has no power to go there. He was exchanging. I told you that that I went to the donor and asked him that "Your temple is being exchanged with a Muhammadan." So they took it seriously, and they stopped it. This temple was donated by one big zamindar. They live in Sababazar.(?) They have got enough property in Dacca, big zamindar, Balihet. How he dared to exchange the temple established by Guru Mahārāja for a house in Calcutta? Just what kind of person he was, just imagine.

Room Conversation with Film Producer about Krsna Lila -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: You say no, but they take it like that. Even a person like Vivekananda, he said long ago that "This Vaiṣṇavism is sex religion." They misunderstand. So just try to understand. This līlā is kept in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam in the Tenth Canto, and middle of Tenth Canto, Thirty-fourth, Thirty-fifth Chapter. So one has to understand Kṛṣṇa first of all. So it is not for ordinary men. So we discourage these things to be discussed or presented even for ordinary men. This is our preaching. It cannot be taken as ordinary film show.

Guest (2): No, sir, he was taking it in different angle, that Kṛṣṇa was by these Vaiṣṇavas.

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Room Conversation Varnasrama System Must Be Introduced -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Vaiṣṇavism.

śṛṇvatāṁ sva-kathāḥ kṛṣṇaḥ

puṇya-śravaṇa-kīrtanaḥ

hṛdy antaḥ-stho hy abhadrāṇi

vidhunoti suhṛt satām

(SB 1.2.17)

By becoming a brāhmaṇa, hearing, hearing, hearing... Or by hearing, hearing, hearing, he becomes a brāhmaṇa. The other qualities, śūdra quality, kṣatriya, vaiśya, means finished. So then next stage is, śṛṇvatāṁ sva-kathāḥ kṛṣṇaḥ puṇya-śravaṇa-kīrtanaḥ, hṛdy antaḥ... Naṣṭa-prāyeṣv abhadreṣu. By this process, hearing... Without becoming a brāhmaṇa nobody is interested to hear. Then, by hearing, naṣṭa-prāyeṣv abhadreṣu, then abhadra, means the base qualities, means ignorance and passion... These are the base qualities. So naṣṭa-prāyeṣv abhadreṣu. When these base qualities are finished almost, not complete, nityaṁ bhāgavata-sevayā, by hearing from Bhāgavata or by serving the spiritual master and Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement-

Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ādi-keśava: All right. We'll arrange that.

Indian man (3): Mahānāmavrata brahmacārī. Which class of Vaiṣṇavism he follow?

Prabhupāda: I don't recognize him as a Vaiṣṇava. If you want more, then I will have to use more strong words.

Indian man (3): No, if he's...

Prabhupāda: He's not a Vaiṣṇava. He's a bogus man! He wants to establish that Jagabandhu is incarnation of Caitanya. Where he got this authority? And he got the title Doctor and so... Why does he not preach in America? Some of our men say it is bogus, purchased title. You can get such title if you pay money.

Conversation: Vairagya, Salaries, and Political Etiquette -- April 28, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: In Los Angeles it is very freely going on. In the name of Vaiṣṇavism they are drawing salary, living comfortably, having sense enjoyment. This is not good, not at all. So you all high officers, you think over it and do the needful.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Vairāgya should be cultivated.

Prabhupāda: Vairāgya... Caitanya Mahāprabhu says clearly that niṣkiñcanasya bhagavad-bhajanonmukhasya. The bhagavad-bhajana, to become devotee of the Lord, means he's disgusted with this material world. For him, bhagavad-bhajana. Just like if I become disgusted with something, I require some change, similarly, bhagavad-bhajana is for him who is absolutely disgusted with this material world. And anyone who has got little interest in material enjoyment, he's not fit for bhagavad-bhajana. He'll have to accept again this material body, either he becomes Brahmā or becomes an ant in the stool, according to his karma. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur deha-upapattaye (SB 3.31.1). He'll have to develop certain type of body according to his desire of enjoyment. This is nature's law. Then where is the question of going back to home, back to Godhead? Why so many varieties of life?

Discussions -- May 20-22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: This is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission,

bhārata-bhūmite haila manuṣya-janma yāra

janma sārthaka kari' kara para-upakāra

(CC Adi 9.41)

This is India's culture. The whole world is in darkness, and they are risking their life in the transmigration of one body to another, mṛtyu-saṁsāra-var... The rascals do not know what they are doing. They are simply taking account of few years. He does not know that he's eternal. A few years, a fragment, a pass, passing way, that's all. A passing flash. And bharam udvahato vimūḍhān. This is Vaiṣṇava philosophy. This rascal... Māyā-sukhāya bharam udvahato vimūḍhān (SB 7.9.43). Śoce tato vimukha-cetasa, māyā-sukhāya bharam udvahato vimūḍhān (SB 7.9.43). This is Vaiṣṇava's concern that "These, what, rascals, they are doing?" That is Vaishnavism. "What these rascals are doing, jumping like monkey, wasting time?" That is Vaishnavism. Para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. These rascals do not know, driving motorcar, "ghata-ghata-ghata-ghata-ghata-ghata-ghata."

Conversation with Surendra Kumar and O.B.L. Kapoor -- June 26, 1977, Vrndavana:

Dr. Kumar: (Hindi) Philosophical background of the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement, so that people may know that this is not a new religion. It's well founded. I've traced the history, the development of Vaiṣṇavism, earliest Vedic period to the present. (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) "The Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is genuine, bona fide." (Hindi) So you are ready? (Hindi) Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) (Hindi conversation) (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The only explanation can be that Kṛṣṇa is in everyone's heart.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Buddhi-yogaṁ dadāmi tam: "I give him intelligence."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In the Kṛṣṇa book there's the part where Lord Brahmā steals away all the calves and children, so then Kṛṣṇa gives Himself instead. So...

Prabhupāda: Not gives. He exands Him.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, I think the general is already covered by this Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Trust committee. That's for all of India. And Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi is especially for encouraging the development of Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇavism in that area-Śrīdhara Mahārāja's nātha-mandira, this Yoga-pīṭha Bhaktivedanta Hall. Different buildings. Supposing one of your Godbrothers may have written some manuscript, he has no money. We can print some books for him so he can sell them, like that, works within the Māyāpur area.

Prabhupāda: That we shall fix up, what to spend.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The Bhaktivedanta Swami Charity trustees would fix that up?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupada Vigil -- November 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda says, in future, henceforward, these people should not be allowed to hold lectures here. Strictly Caitanya Mahāprabhu's teaching forbids. Māyāvādī haya kṛṣṇe aparādhī. You tell them, "You're Māyāvādī. So this is a Kṛṣṇa conscious temple. If you're speaking on Kṛṣṇa consciousness, Vaiṣṇavism..." We don't need their money, neither do we need them to become more prestigious. Rather, they need us. They came here only because of the fact that they're so insignificant that they wanted to be associated with Prabhupāda. Without you they have no substance, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Without your presence the meeting has no substance.

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) Why?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Because you are the only substantial personality amongst all of them. Therefore they know that. We have concluded that they know.