Travel (Conv. 1977)

Expressions researched:
"travel" |"traveled" |"traveler" |"traveler's" |"travelers" |"traveling" |"travelings" |"travelled" |"travelling" |"travels"

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: "What will be benefit by this if I make my son a Vaiṣṇava or a brāhmaṇa?"

Dr. Patel: No, but Vaiṣṇavas are born in the family. They did not become sādhus. Why should they?

Prabhupāda: No, no, they do not give much importance to the movement.

Jagadīśa: Haṁsadūta Mahārāja was describing that while they were traveling kīrtana, in one village one of the village boys wanted to join them. So he was living with them, and they were arrested by the village people and detained, and the boy was sent home, because of the same thing.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Jagadīśa: Here in India also.

Dr. Patel: What is that conspiracy, sir, in America?

Prabhupāda: They are planning how to stop this movement in so many ways.

Dr. Patel: By some sort of physical force or something like...

Prabhupāda: Not physical, but... What is the idea?

Jagadīśa: Propaganda.

Prabhupāda: Propaganda.

Morning Discussion about Kumbhamela -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Where is the location?

Gurudāsa: It's on what's called Gangadwip. But that's new place. It's an island that just appeared this year, splitting the Ganges in two. You know, Jushi is here, and Gangadwip is here. And the place where we were last year is here. We were here last year, Gangadwip is here, and Jushi is here. And... But I've been sending out and going out on saṅkīrtana, so that will make up for our location. It's not so bad, but I want to paint a true picture. It's not so good, nor is it so bad. And there's thirteen tents. We have three bigas of land, sand. And we've made a tin enclosure all the way around. And we had a Swiss cottage tent for yourself. Swiss cottage means a room about this large from the end of the almirah to the wall and about this wide. And then a middle room about from here to the wall, and then another small room. But I was not satisfied with that, so I took that tent down, and when I left a day and a half ago I told Bhāgavata dāsa and Jagat-guru Mahārāja, who are there, to erect a straw house for you, bigger. So they are, I hope, doing that. The difficulty was that we had no money, and therefore I've come and am going back. I had a few hundred dollars in traveler's checks which I cashed and gave it to them to keep going.

Prabhupāda: Straw house is not good.

Morning Discussion about Kumbhamela -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Oh. So there is facility for exchanging dollars?

Gurudāsa: Yes. I'm trying to cash this draft. I went to three banks, and as I say, I had some traveler's checks, and because there was no money there I cashed my own traveler's checks and left it with them, so they... You want dollars into rupees? Yes, that's possible.

Prabhupāda: What is the rate?

Gurudāsa: It was 8.78 the other day. It fluctuates from day to day, but 8.78.

Prabhupāda: That is good rate, 8.70...

Gurudāsa: Better than before. That was for traveler's checks. It may be slightly less for cash.

Hari-śauri: Yes. Traveler's checks are always higher.

Gurudāsa: So I'm going back today. As soon as Gopāla Kṛṣṇa gives me the lakṣmī, money, I'll go back. Bhāgavata's doing a very nice job.

Prabhupāda: We have to go to Orissa, Bhuvaneśvara, afterwards.

Morning Walk -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: He's right. And he's a very important man.

Rāmeśvara: He has joined this society to defend us. He's now traveling different places in the United States to speak on our behalf.

Prabhupāda: He's serious gentleman. That is wanted. Kṛṣṇa will help us.

Dr. Patel: Aldous Huxley is another, he's also very...

Trivikrama: He's dead.

Dr. Patel: He is dead. No? He is dead? How long?

Trivikrama: Since 1962.

Dr. Patel: I had no idea of it. I am reading his books thinking he is still alive.

Trivikrama: He's a Māyāvādī, anyway.

Prabhupāda: Who?

Trivikrama: Aldous Huxley.

Prabhupāda: Aldous Huxley. He is useless. Anyone connected with the Ramakrishna Mission is a useless. Immediately take it.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Rāmeśvara: They think they have achieved a higher standard of freedom by traveling all over the world...

Prabhupāda: Where is your freedom? Where is your freedom if for your livelihood you have to go a hundred miles? Where is your freedom? Why you are illusioned? For your bread, you have to go hundred miles off, either by car or by train. So where is your freedom?

Rāmeśvara: The freedom is in leisure time. They have a lot of leisure time.

Prabhupāda: Where is leisure time? You rise early in the morning and start for your office. Where is your leisure time? All imagination. I have seen in New York. They are coming from the other parts, starting early in the morning, two hours in the ferry and two hours in the cars, and standing two hours. What is this? Leaders, rich men, can think like that, that "I have leisure," but a worker, lower class, they have no freedom. That is illusion, and we are trying to give freedom to everyone. That is freedom. You are forced to go to the factory and work there in a hellish condition of life. Is that freedom?

Rāmeśvara: There must be still education so the people will... Say we are one day...

Prabhupāda: No education, no. Education will be required only for the guiding class: brāhmaṇas, kṣatriyas, not for anyone, śūdras. They are two only. Others will... What education required? Suppose if you produce... If you..., you are accustomed to agriculture, cow protection, there is no need going to college and schools. If you remain illiterate, still you can do.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: Well, there is? Why? You are so rich country, why? Why it is happening? Not small minority.

Rāmeśvara: And we have our vacations. We can travel anywhere in the world and visit, sightsee.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. But you cannot say that everyone is very rich. That is not... We admit your contribution, but... The other day I was saying that aeroplane is contribution, but it is not safe. So long it is flying, it is all right, but any moment... Similarly, this civilization will be contribution like that. It is not safe. Because this life, you are enjoying very good house, very good society, but next life, if you are going to be a tree by nature's law, then what is the value of your this life?

Rāmeśvara: "But I believe in God. I go to church every Sunday, and I confess."

Prabhupāda: But you go to church, but you don't do anything what God says.

Rāmeśvara: "I am taught that God gave us all of these fruits to enjoy."

Prabhupāda: Not to follow His advice. You are so great devotee that you simply enjoy God's gifts, but what He says, you don't follow. You are such a great devotee. "I enjoy my father's property, but I don't care for his advice." (aside:) Ask your mother to learn how to make kachoris from Kulādri. Is that all right? (train slowing) Bulahanipur.(?) Somebody wrote me a letter from this place, Bulahanipur.

Conversation and Instruction On New Movie -- January 13, 1977, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: And what you can do? You can show some temples or you can show some meeting of Bhāgavata recital. That's it, two things.

Rāmeśvara: Yes. And also festivals like Ratha-yatra, millions of people coming, big public festivals. I was thinking that Bhargava and Yadubara can travel together in India, because Bhargava has been to many places.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: And they'll also appreciate beautiful photography showing the beauty of India. They'll appreciate that also. And beautiful temples.

Prabhupāda: Artistic.

Rāmeśvara: Yes, it'll show the higher religious culture of India. That will impress many people in America. They think of India as so backwards, but they'll see that they have these beautiful temples.

Prabhupāda: So that is due to British propaganda. British propaganda was that they were staying in India to make India civilized.

Room Conversation -- January 20, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: So wind you cannot move. That is not safe.

Gargamuni: No, if there's no wind, then they can't move. And they have to have these men to... They walk on the shore and push the boat, and it takes so long, and there's so many villages that they can do. They can do thirty thousand books in one month if they had a boat which could travel freely.

Prabhupāda: Then what will happen to this boat?

Gargamuni: No, we can use both. But we want to expand the program.

Prabhupāda: Hm. So I have no objection. Money can be supplied, but it may not be another burden. That's it.

Gargamuni: No, we'll investigate the ship because in Calcutta is a very big center of shipbuilding.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Gargamuni: They build big ships there. And we don't have to limit our traveling simply in the river. We can also go along the coast of Bengal and also Orissa. There's so many villages.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Gargamuni: In India there are 500,000 villages. So we need so many men for going.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And we want that all these village people may come daily and hear and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Gargamuni: They were in Assam, one of our traveling parties, and they met a Gauḍīya Math temple managed by Mādhava Mahārāja. And there were three or four brahmacārīs in the village, and they had the whole village actually engaged. They saw some of the activities. So they were engaged in making the village Kṛṣṇa conscious in their way. So similarly, we can do the same. Prabhupāda: Yes.

Gargamuni: Just like Gaura-Govinda, he's bringing many villagers here.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. He's good preacher.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: India is good field. Yes. India is good field.

Gargamuni: At least, we can use one hundred travel... You once told me and Tamāla that we should have a hundred jeeps and send them all over India, one hundred jeeps.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Now you are seeing that there is possibility of preaching. And even if he cannot speak local language, still he'll be received.

Gargamuni: Yes. And all of our magazines, at least in Bengal, are being... (break)

Rāmeśvara: ...to organize the whole world to cheating, then, it seems, we can be given the intelligence to organize it for Lord Caitanya.

Prabhupāda: You can also cheat them. (chuckles) From māyā's way, bring then to Kṛṣṇa's way. That's all. That is also cheating. Tell them, "Yes, you live like this."

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Pāpī tāpī jāta chilo, hari-nāme uddharilo. That is the beginning. And He enthused Indians, "Take this knowledge and distribute." Bhārata bhūmite haila manuṣya janma yāra (CC Adi 9.41). That is Kṛṣṇa Caitanya.

Rāmeśvara: That was the period when all the Europeans became very interested in traveling all over the world, and they discovered America, and they were very interested in coming to India for the spices. There was a great interest in India. Actually they say this man Columbus, he landed in America because he was looking for India, trying to cross the ocean, and he found this land America blocking his way.

Hari-śauri: That's how those islands became the West Indies, because he was looking for India, and he went West, and he hit some islands, and they call them the West Indies. Then later they went to America.

Prabhupāda: West Indies are South America.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: ...enjoy the senses, material senses. You have the desire, but you have no instrument.

Hari-śauri: I had this experience myself of being out of the body. Of course, it was under intoxication, but I was floating in the air, and I could see my friends talking and I could see my own body on the bed lying down. And again I came back.

Rāmeśvara: Sometimes in the West they call this "astral travel." That's the word they give.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Astral means subtle.

Rāmeśvara: Now they describe traveling in this subtle state. They say it is exceptionally easy. "Physical objects are no barrier, and movement from one place to another can be rapid, almost instantaneous."

Prabhupāda: Hm. They can fly even.

Evening Conversation -- January 25, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: A little Jagannātha prasāda also.

Hari-śauri: Yes. They can bring some. I traveled for a month myself on a boat. I went from England to Australia on ship.

Prabhupāda: One month? Only?

Hari-śauri: Twenty-eight days.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Through Atlantic.

Hari-śauri: Yes. We had to go Atlantic and right 'round the tip of Africa and across the Indian Ocean, because the Suez Canal was finished then. It was blocked by the war.

Prabhupāda: Suez Canal still not open?

Hari-śauri: No.

Evening Conversation -- January 25, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: Gandhi was actually very sexually inclined. In his autobiography he was written that when his father was dying, he was having sex with his wife. After finishing sex with his wife, then he came to see his dead father. He has admitted. And his association with his granddaughters, granddaughter-in-law, that is also this... A new book has come out?

Satsvarūpa: Yes. He says it tells about that even after he pledged to be brahmacārī he traveled with some young girl.

Prabhupāda: No, even when he was old man and leader he would go, keeping, resting his hand on two young girls. That means he was very fond of sex. There is no doubt about it. What business he...? He is speaking of "Mahatma" Gandhi. He could not get the help of two young men? Why two young girls?

Room Conversation -- January 26, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: Train also. So how you can be happy? This is their civilization. You study. I have studied in your country, everywhere. This is civilization.

Gurukṛpā: Our printing man from Dai Nippon... The printing man who was doing our book from Dai Nippon, he would come to the house at eight-thirty at night. And he lives... Every day he travels two hours to Dai Nippon in the morning and at night another two hours.

Prabhupāda: Just see. Many. Why Dai Nippon?

Gurukṛpā: But this was eight-thirty at night he came.

Prabhupāda: No, Bombay, Bombay, Calcutta.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: But this girl, (laughs) she travels all over the world, spending her own money or society money?

Satsvarūpa: Society. She's the only one who's actually regular that is doing it good.

Prabhupāda: No, she is very responsible. Whatever I say, at least she tries to do it best. That is her qualification. Nei, everyone is doing. Nobody's...

Satsvarūpa: Yes. Nanda-kumāra wanted to do that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Nanda-kumāra, as a sannyāsī, he should better preach. I have no objection. It is up to you to decide. I don't give much credit to the scientists. I give them credit as far as they deserve. It is not that I don't give them credit. Why shall I not? But they deny the existence and they say "We shall conquer over nature, and we shall make according to our necessity." These rascals I challenge.

Room Conversation -- January 29, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Hari-śauri: Yes. There's unlimited field.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Sanskrit is very difficult. But when I have given in English language, you can convert into any other. English is known everywhere. This is international. So far I have seen—I've traveled all over the world—English language is understood. Sometimes they purposefully avoid. Otherwise, they understand. I have seen in Germany. They understand English, but they hate talking.

Satsvarūpa: In France, too. In France they don't speak English.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Satsvarūpa: They don't want to.

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is agitation in Canada.

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: What is the prospect, Hong Kong? I don't think there is any.

Hari-śauri: Bangkok.

Prabhupāda: Er, Bangkok, yes.

Yogeśvara: No, my personal conclusion after a few weeks there is that either there should be a traveling party doing that part of the subcontinent... Otherwise, if there is a gṛhastha couple with some experience, we could have an information center in this one house. Because it's not expensive. Living there is very cheap. There is good foodstuffs and rent is not expensive.

Prabhupāda: Now, this house, we can continue to live there?

Yogeśvara: We can continue to rent. Rent is only $175 a month, including utilities. So it is not at all expensive.

Prabhupāda: And it is a very nice house.

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Preaching work is meant for the sannyāsīs, not for the married persons. Sannyāsī and brahmacārī, they go... (microphone rattling) Married couple also go... Generally it is meant for that. So if you have got sufficient men for preaching work, so you can make one center here and traveling...

Yogeśvara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So. GBC... What I can do?

Hari-śauri: The second language is French, isn't it?

Yogeśvara: Not too much French. English there is. Is there a GBC for Thailand?

Prabhupāda: Every GBC is for everywhere. Let it be considered in the next meeting.

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Then not many devotees are there in the farm?

Yogeśvara: There are maybe thirty-five devotees traveling, saṅkīrtana devotees, and then...

Prabhupāda: Centering that farm?

Yogeśvara: Centered at the farm. They come back maybe once every two months. And then there are about eighty devotees at the farm, of which forty are children. Of those children, twenty or twenty-two are Gurukula children. The others are too small.

Prabhupāda: So nobody is engaged in production, fruit, flowers, grains, milk?

Yogeśvara: There are not many full-time devotees doing production, maybe four full time.

Prabhupāda: And why part time?

Yogeśvara: Part time, everyone is trying to do an hour a day.

Prabhupāda: So what they do, others?

Morning Room Conversation -- February 16, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Recent publication?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I don't... I'm not... I don't think that actually the BBT did this binding. This is done by someone else, but somehow I managed... It was in my office, so I brought it with me. But it's very nice to get the small pocket-size book but with a hard cover. For traveling it's very handy. On the back it gives mention inside of..., what the binding is.

Prabhupāda: Where it is done?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In USA. "Permabound" it's called.

Hari-śauri: That's like that plastic cover-type stuff.

Prabhupāda: It is half-bound.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Real intelligence you see in the flower. How intelligently colorful it is made. Every nature study. Study this machine, how intelligent. And just the hand, coming up, this finger, because we have to capture something, the nail is required. If it would have been all skin, you could not capture. How... And every machine is coming automatically. You study your body. And if the same machine, you producing a machine like that, automatically coming out, one thing, male machine, one female machine, and they'll bring another machine. Where is that? And here God has made such a nice machine. He says, bhrāmayan sarva-bhūtāni yantrārūḍhāni (BG 18.61). That is also not made by God. It is made by God's agent, māyā. Now, see how God is intelligent. God's servant māyā, God says, "Give him a machine like that." Immediately she gives, supplies. Clearly says, bhrāmayan sar... "He wants to still travel in this material world, bhrāmayan. He wants to go there. Then all right, give him a machine." He's so kind. He's sitting within your heart. You want to do something. And He's so kind, because you are son, beloved, He says, "These are not required. Better come back. Live peacefully." You'll not hear. "No. I..." Just like naughty child. "All right, Māyā, give him. Give him." This is meaning.

Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Explain.

Satsvarūpa: You explained that whatever a person is thinking, that's his desire. At the time of death the desire is very prominent, so he takes a body according to that desire. And then you described exactly how it happens, that the subtle body carries the soul, just like the air carries the aroma of the flower into the semina of the man to the woman who supplies the ingredients, and the body comes out. In this way he travels from one body to another.

Hari-śauri: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda. (end)

Room Conversation about BTG the Moon -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: No, on our part.

Hari-śauri: That's not... The traveling there is not the strain. It's doing the programs and seeing so many people. That's a big strain.

Prabhupāda: That is not... Strain is traveling.

Hari-śauri: But that traveling means when you're there you have to travel to this program, travel to see that man, travel...

Prabhupāda: No.

Hari-śauri: It always...

Prabhupāda: I like to sit down in one place. I am not going to...

Hari-śauri: But still, for the programs they always... Every time we go somewhere they want you to come to this temple and then they want you to do this program here and there.

Prabhupāda: No, that I...

Hari-śauri: And they know you're always too merciful to not do it.

Room Conversation -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Ādi-keśava: I was wondering, I've been... While in New York I've been worshiping the Deities, Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa, but now, because of this case, I'm forced to travel more between some of the temples and because of the legal work. So I was thinking to take some Deities with me to worship wherever I go.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Sannyāsī is not required.

Ādi-keśava: All right.

Bhakti-caru(?): Are there any mūrti, having?

Prabhupāda: No. A sannyāsī's not required. Caitanya Mahāprabhu, when he was traveling, He was not carrying any Deity. Deity worship is specially recommended for the gṛhasthas. That is compulsory.

Room Conversation -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Hm. Just like our Rādhā-Dāmodara temple, it was established... This temple was established by Jīva Gosvāmī. He was brahmacārī. So how these gosvāmīs, they are worshiping? He had no sons. It was... The temple was established by him, but the worship was transferred to the gṛhasthas bhakta. So they are doing by generation. All these Vṛndāvana temples, Govindajī temple, Rādhā-Ramaṇa temple, Rādhā-Dāmodara. Rādhā-Ramaṇa temple, he was also brahmacārī, Gopāla Bhaṭṭa. He did not marry. Jīva Gosvāmī was brahmacārī. Sanātana Gosvāmī and Rūpa Gosvāmī, they sannyāsīs. So how these gṛhasthas got this sevā? They were disciples, gṛhasthas. So gṛhastha disciples were meant for worshiping Deity. And others, they are meant for preaching. This is the primary principle. So if you are engaged in preaching... Deity worship, it must be done in scheduled time, this time, this time, this time. Then that is very difficult for you. Caitanya Mahāprabhu did not do that. He was traveling alone, preaching, preaching. So it will be great burden to carry Deity. But in preaching work, when you are many, you are carrying Deity in the bus. That is good, there are others, some nice engage, that is temple life. But personally if you carry some Deity, it will be troublesome. It will be hampering your preaching work.

Room Conversations -- February 20, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: We have to do so many things always.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But at the same time traveling may not be so...

Prabhupāda: Fruitful.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Prabhupāda's health. It may not be so wise.

Prabhupāda: If Manipur is prepared to help me... What is this? The same tablet? No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I've gotten a week's supply of these other tablets. I got the prescription filled.

Prabhupāda: Keep it here.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That has given me great relief.

Room Conversations -- February 20, 1977, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Really?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because he is director.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You were also traveling.

Prabhupāda: No, I was not traveling. The wife was traveling.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: His wife?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore doctor became fortunate. He got very good wife.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But you were most fortunate.

Prabhupāda: Huh? (break) I think so.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And your wife wasn't so good.

Prabhupāda: Because she was always against Kṛṣṇa... My father said like that, that "You are so fortunate that you don't like your wife. Don't try to marry again."

Room Conversations -- February 20, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: No. If you have sufficient nice stock, anywhere you go, you'll take up.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But you have to have men who can offer the books.

Jayapatākā: We'll have four traveling parties.

Prabhupāda: Just like this Gītār Gān. Wherever we are going, selling.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Imagine... All I'm trying to say is if we had more men, the distribution would increase tenfold, hundredfold.

Prabhupāda: Men will come by distribution.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. I was just trying to raise that point.

Jayapatākā: But the difficulty is that the men that are coming, they're not suitable for leading the party. We don't have any men coming, but theoretically when they come, the better class, they could distribute. But for leading would take several years. But their party leaders...

Prabhupāda: It doesn't matter. Let them be leader.

Evening Darsana -- February 25, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: So about ten rupees, Indian ten rupees.

Bali-mardana: Although the rate in India they give less, for some reason, because it was just devalued. So it's about 8.90 for cash, about 9.70 for Australian travelers checks.

Prabhupāda: No, the Amer..., is ten rupees. It is one kilo?

Bhāgavata: This is two kilos. Four pounds, 6.5.

Prabhupāda: So about five rupees per kilo. Very cheap.

Bhāgavata: That's forty rupees... No... Kg...

Bali-mardana: Forty per kg.

Bhāgavata: No. It's forty rupees for two kgs.

Bali-mardana: Yes. Twenty.

Bhāgavata: Twenty rupees per kg. If you tried to buy some ghee in India now, butter ghee, you'd have to pay about twenty-five rupees.

Bali-mardana: But this... The export... The Australian ghee in Australia is cheaper. This is export quality, is much higher quality. Higher...

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Bali-mardana: ...price.

Prabhupāda: Higher.

Evening Darsana -- February 25, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: This ghee should be distributed in all our Indian centers.

Devotee (5): There is a nice picture of our Deities we have in Australia in our bus.

Bali-mardana: This is our traveling bus. They distribute prasādam all over Australia, with Gaura-Nitāi. They have cast...

Devotee (5): They were made in Australia.

Bali-mardana: The Deities were cast in Australia.

Prabhupāda: Hm. The face is not very good.

Bali-mardana: Not very good.

Prabhupāda: Anyway, it is nice.

Room Conversation -- February 25, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: (laughing) They chant. Very good. Do that.

Bali-mardana: We have a bus. They travel all over just for distributing prasāda.

Prabhupāda: Now, on this subject matter, you GBC decide how to do it and do it practically.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is the real business of talking.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. How the supply will come, and everything, make program and do that. There will be no difficulty. Kṛṣṇa will supply you everything. No difficulty. Actually Kṛṣṇa is supplying. Now we are known all over the world, "very rich." Is it not?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes.

Prabhupāda: (laughing) "Fabulously rich."

Room Conversation 'GBC Resolutions' -- March 1, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Very good arrangement.

Satsvarūpa: As for Jayatīrtha, he will keep England in his zone, but he is also going to take a zone in the United States, which he finds that he can travel to without much difficulty, which is the Mid-West of the United States, including Detroit, Chicago, Minneapolis, and a little center, Ann Arbor.

Prabhupāda: So you have all agreed to. That's nice.

Satsvarūpa: Harikeśa Mahārāja will mostly retain the same zone of Eastern European countries, Germany, Switzerland and Scandinavian countries.

Prabhupāda: So you have discussed Hare Kṛṣṇa, er, Harikeśa's activities, reviewed? It is all right?

Rāmeśvara: No. That is yet to be discussed under saṅkīrtana techniques.

Room Conversation with GBC members -- March 2-3, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Nice.

Satsvarūpa: A vigorous program to be undertaken by the GBC in India to introduce Bengali and Hindu books to secondary schools. Gargamuni Mahārāja's traveling party... (break)

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Ready in also two months. And by Janmāṣṭamī we will have a Hindi Gītā, Kṛṣṇa book and the whole First Canto.

Rāmeśvara: Jaya.

Prabhupāda: We are very glad. That's nice.

Satsvarūpa: Brahmānanda Swami will prepare a list of devotees he requires for Africa, and every zonal GBC will supply a good man as required. Next year the GBC members Brahmānanda and Jayatīrtha will report how the manpower is being engaged.

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Room Conversation with GBC members -- March 2-3, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: So what is my maintenance? Two cāpāṭis, that's all. (laughter)

Rāmeśvara: This is a special fund, Prabhupāda, for paying for any travel plane fare for the whole group that travels with you.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Satsvarūpa: Resolved: All properties purchased, even those personally transacted by GBC members, should be cleared through the property committee. The property committee will add Rāmeśvara Mahārāja along with Jayatīrtha for the US.

Rāmeśvara: We were already on it. Both of us were on it.

Prabhupāda: And here?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What about in India, Prabhupāda wants to know.

Rāmeśvara: Tamāla Kṛṣṇa's already a member of the property committee, and he'll be in India unless Prabhupāda sends him.

Jayatīrtha: Should anyone else be added in India?

Prabhupāda: Property committee means the GBC and Tamāla Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation with GBC members -- March 2-3, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Subject matter. This is for subject matter committee. Subject, committee of subject.

Satsvarūpa: Then today there was some new selection of assignments. One: That Jayapatākā Mahārāja be made acting GBC along with Gurukṛpā Mahārāja, both be co-GBC managers of Bengal and Orissa. And Gargamuni Mahārāja be GBC of the traveling party going to colleges and libraries for sales in India and Asia and the Mid-East. Gargamuni should first go to countries around Iran and evaluate his work... And his work will be evaluated, and if done nicely, then he can enter Iran also.

Gargamuni: I have to go to Iran in order to sell the vehicles. Where am I supposed to go? That's a stupid proposal. I wasn't here for that. (laughter) It's a stupid proposal.

Jagadīśa: That wasn't the main part of the proposal.

Gargamuni: Well, that clause is stupid.

Rāmeśvara: We can discuss that.

Satsvarūpa: But the general assignments are agreeable, is that Iran...

Gargamuni: Yes. We're going to have to go in.

Hṛdayānanda: So we can arrange it.

Prabhupāda: We have got very good encouragement from Budapest. You have read that letter. That means there is very good potency of our movement being accepted in communistic countries. Just read that letter.

Room Conversation with GBC members -- March 2-3, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: All right.

Satsvarūpa: A legal committee of Balavanta, Ādi-keśava, and Rāmeśvara will investigate whether certain techniques are legal or illegal according to the laws. Then one of the popular means to distribute books is by women's party. A party of women will travel under the care of a man devotee. But in taking care of the women, we have noted that some of these parties have been preaching a false philosophy of the relationship of the man who's taking care of the women, and that philosophy is that the saṅkīrtana leader is the eternal husband and protector of the women in the party. We want that this philosophy should be rejected. If a man is taking care of a number of women in a saṅkīrtana party, he should be regarded as the son as well as a representative of the spiritual master, of Śrīla Prabhupāda, and not the husband of these women.

Prabhupāda: Husband, but why he does not marry them? (laughter)

Room Conversation First Day in Juhu Quarters -- March 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Money's, Kṛṣṇa's supplying; so there is no question of scarcity. Finish it as soon as possible. There is no question of money supply. Yes. So Lokanātha Swami, your bullock cart program, how it is going on?

Lokanātha: I have got just one letter from them when I was in Vṛndāvana. They were doing good, but there was not enough men with them. I left five boys when I left Māyāpur for Vṛndāvana. One of the boys, when he came to know that I am not traveling, he decided not to go. And one other boy was approached and was asked to stay in Māyāpur. So there are only three boys on the bullock cart.

Prabhupāda: Nobody is joining?

Lokanātha: Yeah, the boys who are on the party, they are confident that in Bengal they should get some more boys to join. That's what they wrote to me. So I did not get any more reports. They are pretty good boys, they should be doing...

Prabhupāda: It is difficult to make one devotee. That is... Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye (BG 7.3). So if two, three men are there, that is sufficient for preaching also. You have to sit down any place and chant, and people will join. Local men. Not permanently, but at least to continue chanting.

Room Conversation -- March 31, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Our Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja, he refused to take charge, Madhudviṣa. I was little hopeless. And Brahmānanda encouraged me. "I will do." And then silent. "Give him fifty dollars. Give him fifty dollars." And his policy was that where he will get this money? He is beggar. Fourteen lakhs? Whatever one, two lakhs he gives, that's all. I told him friendly that "I have no so much money. Immediately I can collect four lakhs. I shall give you two lakhs against your money, and two lakhs I shall spend for construction. Of course, within three years I shall fill up." He thought that whatever two lakh, one lakh comes, he will not be able to... That was his... I knew that I had no money, but I never thought that "I shall not be able to do." That I was confident. So it's a great history. So many things happened. It is all Rādhā-Rāsavihārī's līlā. Otherwise it is... Now next program, your: make a strong party and you travel extensively all over the world, amongst the scientists, and whatever amount is required, I shall spend. What do you expect monthly expenditure will be without any difficulty, a whole party? How many you want to travel?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: To start with, three of us should travel. Three scientists can travel together, and if it is necessary...

Prabhupāda: You are recruiting other scientists also?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Supposing you were recruiting, how many would you make ideally at...

Prabhupāda: And here is one philosopher also. He knows perfectly well English, Sanskrit, Vedas. Where is he? I don't find him.

Room Conversation -- March 31, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Recruit two others and make it at least five, and travel all over the world. All institutions, all universities, all scientists. If you have got commodity, deliver. It is not a bluff, gold manufacturing. It is not that. Actual fact. That day, your presentation was very nice. Any scientist will be convinced by such presentation, learned speeches. So now at least five men, and estimate what will be the expenditure. I shall arrange. Don't worry.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I will submit that at the time of opening our this temple, and we will make...

Prabhupāda: For expenditure there is no worry. What will be the rough expenditure?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: It will depend on what part of the world we are traveling.

Prabhupāda: You travel all over the world. Why part of the world? We are not preaching part. Pṛthivīte āche yata nagarādi grāma. (CB Antya-khaṇḍa 4.126) We are concerned. Nothing shall be left over.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja can give us some hints about travel, some experience in traveling.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Maybe ten thousand dollars.

Prabhupāda: Sanctioned. I will give you ten thousand. Do it.

Room Conversation -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: As soon as he meets Dr. Karan Singh. I told him to make detailed arrangements and give detailed report. You are eager to go there, I think.

Prabhupāda: Not very eager. I was eager only that if I simply get regular appetite, then the..., I can get some strength to work, that's all. So ask them to give me little orange.

Bhavānanda: Our only concern is that in the traveling to get to a place where you may get some strength—may not—that you will lose strength in the traveling. Without a guarantee.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That's a fact.

Bhavānanda: You would like some orange, Śrīla Prabhupāda? Anything else?

Prabhupāda: A little salt.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Having Bhavānanda around is... (break)

Prabhupāda: (telling story?) You have taken my watch.

Room Conversation -- April 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Rāmānuja preached. All the ācāryas preached.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, either in writing or by traveling and speaking. You have done both, though.

Prabhupāda: That is the duty of ācārya. Otherwise he is not... Not that three dozen ācāryas in Māyāpur. Each one has a temple and a few dozen... Not few dozen—one dozen disciples. Bring some rice and eat. They are ācārya. That day I said that, khāi laya khasi bhaja,(?) then everybody became angry. Collecting some money, taking to the holy place, collecting fifty rupees and keeping twenty rupees and spending thirty rupees. This is... In this way they are making livelihood, ācāryas. They say, "Whatever is in our capacity, we are doing." The capacity means when they are speaking that the cockroach is as good a bird as the Garuḍa. Cockroach is also a bird and Garuḍa is also a bird.

Room Conversation -- April 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So we have got very nice diamond. Try to sell. But if there is a purchaser, he will purchase. Otherwise not. It is our duty to canvass. But we cannot sell iron instead of diamond.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I was just wondering about this, that we may be traveling around, and even here Your Divine Grace is not so fit for going to all of the ceremonies. Maybe you would like it if we were to keep a little Deity here.

Prabhupāda: Where?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In your apartment.

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You don't need...

Prabhupāda: Hm. The Deity is there, fixed-up. That's all right. I was keeping Deity with me, but a constant change of this servant.

Room Conversation -- April 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: It is inconvenience.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Especially now, anyway, if we do this tīrtha traveling, then it will be difficult. That will be very nice. I think that I can start to make up an itinerary, that... There is a couple of devotees who have traveled a lot.

Prabhupāda: Now you try to manage the whole world organization and all GBC men. Suppose I am not there. Manage very nicely. Independently. Not to create havoc. But really to manage. I am still present; I will give you direction. Don't spoil it. We are in very good, prestigious position. That is sure. Don't spoil it. So much hard labor. I started with very humble condition. Now it has come to this, such exalted position. You don't spoil it. That is my request. Increase. That will depend on your character, behavior, preaching. Everyone knows. Everyone is astonished. Without any help, I started. Only asset was sincere... Everyone knows it. Otherwise how it is possible?

Morning Conversation -- April 11, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So while we are still here, he can come here in the daytime for working with me. Prabhupāda said. And even when we're traveling, after you get your copy corrected, you can send it to him, and he'll write out a fair copy and then send it for printing. Plus he can do his own translating work also. That'll be good. Otherwise Gopīnātha would be slowed down if he had to write everything once again.

Prabhupāda: He is doing nicely. He has got control over language.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: One advantage I see also is that because he's been to the West, he is not so enamored...

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Because he has already been to the West, his mind is not so much agitated with thinking to get something from this movement.

Prabhupāda: No.

Morning Talk -- April 18, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: When Viṣṇujana had his bus they were traveling in Texas...

Prabhupāda: Viṣṇujana Swami committed suicide, I think.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What?

Prabhupāda: Viṣṇujana?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: There is no information.

Talk with Svarupa Damodara -- April 18, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Due to this rain, they'll have good food... (break)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: ...very comfortable for traveling. It's very good for the crops. And I also have two offers of land in Manipur to build a temple, Hare Kṛṣṇa temple, from two places. One is right in the middle of the town, and one is little away, about seventeen miles. And I'll show you the map, the place. It's..., lot of it is sort of competitor. They wanted a temple built in one of these lands that they offered, so the two groups are...

Prabhupāda: If people cooperate, we can have two temples. Kāmaṁ vavarṣa parjanyaḥ (SB 1.10.4).

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Actually the land, the second land, it is on the hillside. From there you can see the whole of Manipur, because it is... The land is like this...

Prabhupāda: Scenery.

Conversations -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's an article in the Times of India yesterday about foreign travel as a center to expand.(?)

Prabhupāda: There Hare Krishna movement is nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, it says that "The Hare Krishna movement is responsible for promoting knowledge of India and India's culture abroad." I mean, it is farce, because according to this article, we have to now come up with seventy crores of rupees and spend seventy crores in three years. So we cannot come up with seventy crores of rupees. Neither anyone could build that quickly. I mean, it's a farce. How could anyone build a temple of that proportion, a planetarium of that size, in three years' time. I mean, anybody who knows about building will know. We can't even build this building in three years.

Prabhupāda: It will be fantastical. Therefore they, "It is going to meet the same fate." (pause) You do not know what is the temple will be? You do not know?

Conversations -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Therefore I say you have done independently, whimsically. This is... This is to be stopped. You are acting too independent.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I'd just like a point of clarification, 'cause I don't understand. What exactly is your engagement? I see that you're traveling all over India. What exactly are you going...? Has Prabhupāda told you to travel like this continuously, all over...?

Patita-pāvana: No, he told me to go South India and find some paṇḍitas.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And now you're planning to go to Delhi.

Patita-pāvana: No, no, Surabhī Mahārāja has asked me to do some press releases for the newspapers.

Prabhupāda: So Surabhī Mahārāja has asked. So you are conducted by Surabhī Mahārāja.

Conversation with Tamala Krsna about Yadubara -- April 22, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Hm? What shall I advise? I have no experience about this. You do. But this scientific film should not be done independently.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: His reason for coming to India this time was to give you that film and to now make a film about India. He proposes to travel to holy places and festivals to show people engaged in the nine processes of devotional service. "My first immediate trip," he says, "would be to Trichur, Kerala, to show the Puram Festival, where thousands of people join in a procession through the streets. A Deity of Kṛṣṇa is carried on an elephant. At some of these big festivals there may be many non-Vaiṣṇavas. Is it all right to show these people? Or should we only show Vaiṣṇavas in this movie?"

Prabhupāda: No, no. But what will be the benefit of our taking photograph of other procession? There are so many processions like that. So what will be benefit?

Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 23, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So by train, where it is convenient?

Mr. Dwivedi: If we travel by car, then Gwalior will be better. Or even if we get down at Jhansi, that will also be very nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Which is better by car, from Gwalior or Jhansi?

Mr. Dwivedi: Just the same. Just the same. Gwalior will be slightly convenient in this way that you get down at Gwalior, then I have my own house at Gwalior, so at our own house we have little rest, take our food and then start. The plane also reaches there from Bombay, say, about 12:30 or so.

Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 23, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...and wait till it cools down. Better to travel, say, about four o'clock. By then the sun is going down. It's cooler.

Prabhupāda: Or we can start in the morning.

Mr. Dwivedi: Or we can start in the evening, spend the noon there at my house, and, say, we start about four o'clock... When I left Gwalior just three, four days back it was, Gwalior itself was, also quite pleasant.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What about staying overnight in your house and leaving the next morning?

Mr. Dwivedi: That will also be quite fine.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Morning is the best time for...

Mr. Dwivedi: Morning, evening, anytime is quite good. In the morning... Of course, morning is always cooler, like that.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And then we can rest up a little bit.

Mr. Dwivedi: Yes. Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If we have to travel by car after long train ride, it will be exhausting to Prabhupāda, for everybody.

Mr. Dwivedi: So even if you want to travel by car, then...

Prabhupāda: No, we can get our car from Delhi.

Second Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 24, 1977, Bombay:

Mr. Dwivedi: And then I also desire, as Your Holiness is going, that press should be briefed right from Bombay. Why should I wait from Gwalior... Because I expect some people a few hundred miles off from Gwalior will also be traveling up to meet Your Holiness. So if they know beforehand in papers of Bombay it is better. Therefore I have requested my friend, Mr. Goswami, to give me two or three blocks. If it comes out that way, for our purposes also, he'll need it, and here also I shall try to make correspondence to one or two papers there, that they should ready to send their representatives over there, that way.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Supposing that Mr. Jetthi is not available, do you have some second choice?

Mr. Dwivedi: Then my second choice will be on Mr. Nanda. Mr. Nanda also knows me.

Prabhupāda: Nanda knows me very well. Nanda...

Mr. Dwivedi: He also knows me, and he wanted to start a yogāśrama over there but for himself, and he had a mind.

Prabhupāda: I don't think... If Jetthi does not come, then don't attend from any other.

Second Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 24, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: You book whichever date is just convenient. That's all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda, may I ask you a question?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If you're going to be traveling a full day, from Friday to Saturday...

Prabhupāda: Friday-Saturday?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, you're going to be traveling Friday afternoon and evening and Saturday during the day. Then you're going to get into Gwalior. Probably we'll arrive at the house by five or six at night, evening.

Kārttikeya: Three o'clock.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. The train arrives three. You won't reach the house till 4:30 or five, by the time we get out of the train and get to the house. I'm trying to make this following point.

Prabhupāda: No, no... From the station how far it is, the house?

Mr. Dwivedi: My place for staying?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Second Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 24, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: The point I'm trying to make is simply this, that you're going to be traveling for a full day. The next day, you're going to be traveling for three hours. Whether you're going to feel strong enough to do the program the same evening or whether we should arrive...? The program may begin Sunday night, but my point is that we should arrive and you should have enough time to rest before you start preaching that same night. 'Cause I think it's going to be exhausting that you travel all day, then again you travel that morning, and then the same evening you have to give a program for two hours. That's exhausting. Why not let us arrive one day earlier, but the program can begin Sunday, as Mr. Dwivedi's suggesting? But let us arrive a day earlier, so you can you have a little rest there.

Second Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 24, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then we get rest the whole night.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, we get rest for, say, twelve hours' rest. But then you have to travel again to go to Pauri district, which may be exhausting.

Kārttikeya: Seventy-five miles.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I can't say what... I mean, we don't know. It's a winding road. It may get you tired for traveling.

Prabhupāda: Winding?

Mr. Dwivedi: Not very winding. There are two roads. There are two roads. There is is one road which is little winding. There is another road, but we have to travel eighteen miles more. Not winding, Agra-Bombay road. So there is a straight Agra-Bombay road also. But we have to take an extra eighteen miles more drive.

Kārttikeya: Eighty?

Mr. Dwivedi: Eighteen. One-eight.

Prabhupāda: So that is not...

Second Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 24, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then? What is the problem?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, my point is that you're going to have to travel Sunday morning to get there, and then hold a function Sunday evening, so whether that's going to be tiring? That's all I'm bringing out.

Prabhupāda: The morning, how many hours?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Travel...

Mr. Dwivedi: Three hours.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Three hours.

Prabhupāda: And that's all right.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: All right. I've seen it, that three hours' traveling can be very tiring.

Prabhupāda: What do you want to make?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: My proposal is that you should be able to rest before the program begins, sufficient rest.

Kārttikeya: You have to go on Wednesday then.

Prabhupāda: Then you arrange for Wednesday.

Second Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 24, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) If you agree to cooperate with me, you'll see immediately. Because I want to deliver the real thing, therefore in my feeble health I am prepared to go. If one man can understand, that I want to see. I am traveling all over the world to see that at least one man may understand. They have spoiled the whole situation by misinterpreting, by malinterpreting, and by bringing some rascal and pose as leader. The whole world is spoiled. If you want to preach some rascal philosophy, you do. Why you take Bhagavad-gītā? That is cheating.

Mr. Dwivedi: If we can preach something genuine... This life is so small. What...? Why...? Why should we be after something which is adulterated? Why not preach genuine, if at all we preach?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Talk -- April 25, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And I told him, "Cow's milk?" He said, "Yes, we can arrange." Everything he has. They have basmati rice. He says, "That's all we eat is basmati rice." Nice āṭā, and everything they say...

Prabhupāda: No, their climate is very nice. So you could accept it. If such things are available, now you'll get appetite and your health will increase.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually it's a fact. I remember that when I was traveling in Bhopal, and even in Bihar also—Bihar is similar climate; Bihar is similar—that I got a much bigger appetite in the summertime.

Prabhupāda: Bhopal is better than Bihar.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Better. Very dry. He is known to everyone for many hundreds of miles around. He's a very well known man because he's...

Prabhupāda: No, he is a sincere worker. Therefore he approached me. From Vṛndāvana, Gwalior is very near, within hundred miles. So Viśvambhara can transfer, come, come there to..., to see. Let us first of all settle up. My, this farming program, theoretically there is no comparison. But practically people are accustomed in different way. To bring them to the program it will take some time. Otherwise my program is assured happiness, happiness assurance, if they get... Have your own food grown. Keep cows. Have your own crops. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Conversation: Vairagya, Salaries, and Political Etiquette -- April 28, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Because they have no valid philosophy. It is simply official. They have nothing, no knowledge, no nothing, simply that dress and cloth. That's all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Just like the original... When Jesus was there and he had twelve disciples, they simply gave up everything and traveled with him and tried to preach. So they were renunciates, living simply whatever they could take, nothing more, and devoting their lives to God. But the followers later on, more and more they added the degree of sense gratification, till now you can't see any renunciation at all within their order.

Prabhupāda: No, they are drinking. They are having homosex. They are encouraging homosex, giving man-to-man marriage. You know that? This is going on. Doing everything nonsense.

Conversation with Vedic Astronomer -- April 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Useless.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: To fly him from Madras to here and back is twelve hundred rupees, and Patita has been traveling for months all over India. Who knows how much they have spent on him? And he doesn't have the intelligence to ask the questions which Your Divine Grace just asked. Otherwise he could have known from the beginning that the man doesn't know a thing.

Prabhupāda: He cannot, cannot explain.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This man will not be able to. I mean, the things you were saying, he was thinking... When you started to describe them, he was thinking it had to do with the individual soul. He said that "You're des..." You said, "No, I'm talking about the universe." He said, "Oh, the universe."

Prabhupāda: He does not know anything. Now he goes away. He goes back and he... Why he has come?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: For your blessings, twelve-hundred-rupee blessing. There are learned men in India. There's no doubt. There must be learned men.

Prabhupāda: All bogus.

Short Dissertations -- May 24-25, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: This is our thesis.

Jayapatākā: And educated young people, they're very... They're very susceptible to being devotees. When we traveled in one city, two people joined with us and traveled with us and said they'll be shaved and everything. Very easily they give up. Even when I returned in Māyāpur about five or six new young men had joined. In the twenty days I was gone Bhavānanda Mahārāja had enlisted about five or six men and about fifteen gurukula students and two families. And they were all very enthusiastic. They want to go and preach also. Things are improving.

Prabhupāda: So building work is finished?

Jayapatākā: They're just finishing the top waterproofing, jalja(?). They're building that now. That'll be finished in fifteen days.

Prabhupāda: Others things are going on.

Conversation Pieces -- May 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So give it to the Deity and distribute prasādam.

Mahāṁśa: Yes. It got a little spoiled while traveling. The tomatoes were squashed, but some of them are ripe.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. It doesn't matter. So what is your news?

Indian devotee (1): So we also gained a farm. We have started cultivating now.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa is giving you good chance. Develop farm and have temple. Go on enthusiastically.

Mahāṁśa: This morning I read in the newspapers about the exodus to village soon by the Prime Minister, and there the Prime Minister says that he is eager on developing village programs to establish agriculture facilities and village programs.

Prabhupāda: That is real work. If the Prime Minister has got this thing in his brain, then I can understand that he can do so.

Conversations -- May 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: He's traveling from college to college. So I'm sending him our brochure and the timetable that... I plan to spend about..., till the next Māyāpur festival to do all the India program, finish all over India programs.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: And after that, I plan to do Europe for five months. So I already discussed with Pṛthu-putra. We have one scientist devotee in England. His name is Jñāna dāsa at Bhaktivedanta Manor. He wrote me a letter. He told me that he can make all the engagements in Europe in the scientific departments. So I was about to write him a letter. He also asked me... (end)

Discussions with Devotees and Conversation with Dr. Ghosh -- June 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca (BG 15.15). Jaya. (Bengali) Or if you like, you can travel with him, but your translation must be main work. If you like, you can go to the foreign countries along with him. (Bengali) So that program you planned, he can come.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. I suggested to Dr. Sharma that first of all we hold that conference in Vṛndāvana and come here. So we can announce some nice topics, so he can also speak. And we can invite some scholars. They can also speak. We can have open discussion, exchange of ideas and philosophy, so that we expose Kṛṣṇa consciousness on this scale. So Prabhupāda wants that Bhaktivedanta Institute is also here in Vṛndāvana along with the Bhaktivedanta Gurukula, an institute for higher studies, and there be one office in the gurukula building so that...

Prabhupāda: No, I request you all that you keep this building always busy with some conference, with some meeting, with some... It shouldn't remain vacant. And for expenditure, I shall arrange. There is no want.

Room Conversation -- June 18, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Read something.

Bhakti-prema: And they can travel only 800 miles high, the birds in the sky, but according to Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, after 800 miles there is air to breath for a human being. But there is air for ghost and piśāca and other different species. But if we move... There are Siddhas and Cāraṇas. They are also living there. And above that, there is Rahu planet. That means 80,000 miles high.

Prabhupāda: That means Rahu planet we have connection.

Bhakti-prema: Yes. Rahu. And above that Rahu there is sun planet, and Sumeru mountain has connection with that because it is hurling again...

Yaśodānandana: It says right here.

Prabhupāda: Do it nicely.

Conversation with Surendra Kumar and O.B.L. Kapoor -- June 26, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: What is the news?

Surendra Kumar: Is he permanently staying there?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, traveling around.

Surendra Kumar: Because I know two very powerful Indians who have settled there.

Prabhupāda: The sales report, book report.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Book sales report?

Prabhupāda: Hm. (background conversation about Ghanaśyāma and preaching in Communist countries)

Surendra Kumar: Actually, what you are doing nobody else has been doing in the past.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- July 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. This is a fact. And the books are selling very nice, hm, Bengali?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yeah. Now there's about seven or eight parties traveling around India, simply doing book distribution.

Prabhupāda: That is our aim.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jayapatākā Mahārāja, Gopāla Kṛṣṇa. That was never before. Now that is going on. They have vans just like in America, and they travel, city to city, distributing the books.

Prabhupāda: That is real program. You must always be fit. So he has taken how much, loan?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jayapatākā Mahārāja? Well, he's taking two different loans. One loan is for vans. Took fifty thousand rupees. He's now paid off ten thousand. Every month he's sending regularly five thousand. He's done that regularly now. And then he's taken another loan...

Prabhupāda: For printing books.

Conversation about Old Days in Calcutta -- July 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: In Bengal there was professional guru. They travel from one house to another. Our paternal guru was coming like that.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You had a professional guru also?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You had a paternal guru?

Prabhupāda: Yes. I was initiated by that professional guru at the age of twelve years. Later on I rejected him.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I wonder if he had any thought that his disciple, Your Divine Grace, would be one day such a devotee all over the world. You always said that's the perfection of a guru, if he has good disciple. So your professional guru had a best disciple.

Prabhupāda: Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Gosvāmī later on, when I was young man, manager in Dr. Bose's laboratory... That my friend, Narend Mullik, he took me. There is direction. For real guru one can give up this professional guru.

Room Conversation about Mayapura Attack Talk with Vrindavan De -- July 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm. Go and take rest. (break) Because I am very much fond of traveling, touring, they might have caused some danger. So Kṛṣṇa has detained me. What do you think?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think you're right, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Yes. Actually the GBC, we all were thinking that it might be dangerous for you...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...to travel.

Prabhupāda: They would have been very glad that "Here is the old rascal who has spoiled our children." They could charge, and drag me to the courts and give me trouble. Therefore a restriction on me.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Restrict, that instead of myself, he has to restrict: "Do this way."

Room Conversation about Mayapura Attack Talk with Vrindavan De -- July 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Three hundred dacoits attacked our temple, and there was fighting, and five of the devotees were in the hospital. Bhavānanda Mahārāja, he was arrested 'cause he fired a gun. He shot two of them and put them in the hospital, so they arrested him. And that's all he told me. Three hundred dacoits attacked. He said Jayapatākā is now there. Jayapatākā wasn't there. He was traveling and preaching. So he's there now. He's sending a report to you, a more detailed report. And they want... Jayapatākā Mahārāja wants Śatadhanya Mahārāja to go immediately there because Bhavānanda is in jail, arrested. And they want Prabhāsa to come, because the gun, the gun that Bhavānanda Mahārāja used is in the name of Prabhāsa. And Gopāla Kṛṣṇa is going there tomorrow. He's also going there.

Prabhupāda: So why attacked?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, the only thing we could guess is that now the government is Communist.

Room Conversation-Recent Mail -- July 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: They're all superexcellent.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "I hope that they meet with your approval. We are now in the process of completing a reproduction of the saṁsāra display for the twofold purpose of museum publicity, a special photograph to be taken by a famous photographer..." It's funny. You told him not to do this, but they went ahead and did it. "...and an exhibit to be displayed at the Los Angeles First Annual Ratha-yātrā festival grounds. This saṁsāra diorama has an outstanding response from the general public, and we hope to make it available to many centers for the preaching work in the near future. In connection with this I had an idea of constructing traveling trailers housing one such exhibit, complete with lights and sound, explaining the process..."

Prabhupāda: Oh, it will be very nice.

Room Conversation about Grhasthas -- July 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: There it can be done. Just like you have four rings, and hang it, and very slowly.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: After They're installed, can They still be taken for... Sometimes They have special festivals. Is that all right? Because They've always traveled. They're not like a marble Deity. It's different. (pause) Your translating work is becoming a very regular thing now in the afternoons. Everybody I write to, I tell them that you have doubled your translation work, keeping with the doubling of book distribution. We got quite an encouraging letter just now, a full report from Dhṛṣṭadyumna Mahārāja about all the different things in...

Prabhupāda: Get this fan.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Fans? Encouraging report from Dhṛṣṭadyumna Mahārāja about all of the things that he's in charge of. It's very nice.

Prabhupāda: In New York.

Room Conversation about Grhasthas -- July 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Paramānanda's the president of the farm, and he's the sannyāsī there. And he's also in charge of the Rādhā-Dāmodara office. While Tripurāri Mahārāja travels in the field, he heads up the office. And the office is in a city right near the farm. So he goes half the week to the farm, half the week to the office to manage. Remember I mentioned, Dhṛṣṭadyumna's brother is an architect. So they're planning the farm for building it. It's called a model community. They're going to make it New Varṣāṇā Model Community. Everything will be planned out ahead of time—where the cows will be living—from the point of Vedic conception. It won't be hodgepodge. And they feel that it will gain tremendous interest amongst the prominent persons of America who want to visit a model community. Many universities and schools will send groups of students to visit and see. That's their idea.

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Room Conversation -- July 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Four. The same thing.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Just like you go from India to New York, you leave India at, say, one or two in the morning, three o'clock in the morning, Delhi, and you reach New York three o'clock in the afternoon same day. Twelve hours. Actually you've been traveling twenty hours or more, but it's twelve hours only on the clock. It's a very nice experience. You feel like you've put something over on the material energy. It feels like you've gained something, gained time.

Prabhupāda: The more you go, western side, you save time. The more you go eastern side, you add time.

Room Conversation -- July 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm. That's a fact.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You're not... By nature you've never been inactive. We can begin the activity by airplane travel and then a little car journey to the temple, and then we can carry you around in certain places. Like at the New York farm. Oh, we can give you wonderful ride in the palanquin. That's very appealing. If you go on the palanquin in the fresh air. No? That'll be, I think...

Prabhupāda: No, activity will give appetite.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, it has to. Change of atmosphere gives appetite also.

Prabhupāda: So let us artificial activity. I think this is a nice arrangement.

Room Conversation -- August 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Difficult.

Surabhī: Difficult. Yes. After three months, and he said that you will travel again then. But he said there is no absolute danger.

Prabhupāda: So. There is some sense.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Everybody's saying the same thing like this.

Surabhī: And he would like a report of these nine days that are going on now, and then he wants to study again more to give more information. I was there on the fifth.

Prabhupāda: So give him a place to send to...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He works by numbers, not by astrology. He's not an astrologer.

Prabhupāda: Oh, so he knows my birth date and year.

Room Conversations Bangladesh Preaching/Prabhavisnu Articles by Hamsaduta -- August 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Big, big words, that's all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "On the other hand, books like Arabian Nights, Gulliver's Travels..."

Prabhupāda: Whose Arabian Night?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Fairy stories like the Mahā..."

Prabhupāda: Who's talking Arabian Night?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says, "Fairy stories like Mahābhārata, Rāmāyaṇa, Bible, Koran, Pilgrim's..." Oh, this man... "Pilgrim's Progress, Jataka stories, astrology, palmistry, numerology, theology, demonology, etc., are the products of subjective thinkers. While the former are factual, the latter are all fictitious. Some of the marvelous achievements of mankind in recent years are the liberation of atomic energy, radio telescopy..."

Prabhupāda: What is value of atomic energy? A man is dying; you have accelerated his death. That's all.

Room Conversation With Madhudvisa and others -- August 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So I wanted to return again.

Śrutakīrti: If not for the traveling, it would certainly be the best place to be for your health. I remember last time when you were sick, you recovered very well in Hawaii.

Prabhupāda: Let us see. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa wants me, wants to go back to...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I was encouraging Prabhupāda to... I said that if he goes to the Western temples, that the welcome from his disciples would be so much that he would live for hundreds of years.

Prabhupāda: You can... Go a little... (Bengali)

Śrutakīrti: Tamāla? Śrīla Prabhupāda wanted to see the candles.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Śrutakīrti: These are what we've just started.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Room Conversation -- October 9, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Eh? Unlimited.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And you have to lead us, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I am prepared, provided Kṛṣṇa allows me.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Today you said Kṛṣṇa is giving you the choice.

Hari-śauri: In the Bhāgavatam you mentioned that Nārada Muni has the free will to travel anywhere within the universe-spiritual or material. So you must also have the same ability.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Today we were discussing how nice a devotee you are, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that you are so faithful servant and devotee of Lord Kṛṣṇa that He allows you to do whatever you want, because He knows that you'll do everything for Him.

Prabhupāda: Viṣaya means material activity. One side is viṣaya chāṛiyā, se rase majiyā. One has to give up material activities and engage himself in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. This is one side. Another side, my Guru Mahārāja said, kṛṣṇa sevāi, yāṅhā kahe anukūla, viṣaya boliyā tāṅha haya bhula. Anything which is favorable for kṛṣṇa-sevā, if we give up that business as viṣaya, that is mistake.

Room Conversation -- October 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Give me little detail.

Bhavānanda: The Show Cause, our Show Cause, has been submitted, and the hearing was set on the seventh, last Friday, but the ADM cancelled it until next month on the 18th. And all of us who were involved in this shooting case, we also appeared in court on Friday, and the judge magistrate released us for traveling in India and preaching. Before that we had been restricted to Nadia district. We hadn't been allowed to leave Nadia. The magistrate said that we are free to travel within India for preaching work, which was good. And the next date has been set for the 29th of December, and on that date we'll most likely be discharged from the case.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hm. Discharged. The case will be dropped.

Bhavānanda: The case against us will be dropped and case will be brought against the Muhammadans for attacking the temple.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In other words, it seems that it's reversed.

Bhavānanda: It's reversing.

Prabhupāda: Rākhe kṛṣṇa māre ke.

Room Conversation -- October 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I remember when we were in Māyāpur last, Śrīla Prabhupāda, before going to the Bombay pandal. Every morning we would take you upstairs, and you would sit in the sun, and Bhavānanda Mahārāja would massage you for two hours. Remember? You said you were getting your strength from that sun and the massage. It's also very nice to take you around. Even as you say it's wonderful how we do it, but we like to take you in any condition, traveling.

Subhaga: (Bengali)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually, Śrīla Prabhupāda, the motive behind which we do everything is to please you. You must be present to accept whatever service... We are not very good servants, but whatever little we do, we do for you. Without you being present, we would lose our very reason for working hard and serving.

Prabhupāda: (Bengali with Subhaga)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Now you can go to your respective...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda? Do you want to take rest now for a while? Little rest. You want kīrtana or anything?

Prabhupāda: Not now.

Room Conversation -- October 12, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Magistrate wants my presence?

Jayapatākā: No. It is not required that you talk to him. There's no... Everyone says that there's no case for that. The previous ADM said that actually the person that was doing it is this woman district magistrate. That woman is quite inimical to us. So there's very strong talk that after Durgā Pūjā she'll be transferred. If she's transferred, then our situation would become much better, I hope, by Kṛṣṇa's mercy. She's just trying to harass us, but actually she has no legal scope. Indian Overseas Bank came out, the additional general manager, to Māyāpur, and he's very eager to open up the branch at Māyāpur also, because they have already in Bombay. I think... They have here also? I don't know. But he was eager to open a branch there. They have made us an application. The Central Bank sent a letter, withdrew their application for opening the bank. Right now the Gurukula, they have just finished their examinations. Their examinations were writing an English sentence in Sanskrit and writing Sanskrit in English and similar type tests. They, most of the students got seventy percent on the examination. Then the bigger children went out on saṅkīrtana with the two traveling parties, one to Darjeeling. In Darjeeling they sold seven thousand books in less than ten days. They had very good reception in Darjeeling. And one party is still in Bihar. They did four thousand books.

Prabhupāda: Bengal book.

Jayapatākā: In Bihar—they were doing the border of Bengal in Bihar—so they did both Hindi and Bengali.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Pradyumna: Oh, I'm sorry. "We have noticed that the periods are all negative until March or April 1978, and main trouble was due to Śani. We have suggested that the blue sapphire be tried, and he should keep it, putting." He should keep it on. "Hospitalization and travels indicated. The only remedy in this case is to do mahā-mṛtyuṁ jaya japa and havana. Previously also, now also, we have recommend: Śiva is the presiding Deity of Śani, and with this the native will be able to overcome disease and life span increases. Astrologically, it is up to eighty-one years, four months, approximately. Japa and havana..."

Kīrtanānanda: What is up to eighty-four years?

Pradyumna: Eighty-one years, four months.

Kīrtanānanda: Is what?

Pradyumna: That is astrologically the length of life approximately.

Prabhupāda: So this japa, mahā-mantra-japa, and Bhāgavata-pāṭha, that I am doing.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And what?

Prabhupāda: Śrīmad-Bhāgavata-pāṭha. So either read Bhāgavata or chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. And let me lie down like this, that's all, as it is going on. Huh? Can you make this program?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This program is already going on.

Room Conversation With Dr. Ghosh -- October 16, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (Bengali)

Dr. Ghosh: I don't know how he... I don't know. He went to my son-in-law's at Lucknow, got all the informations and then, oh, I don't know how he followed, how he could find me. He went to Loretto Convent there. Two of my granddaughters are there. Inquired from them, "When your grandfather is coming?" And they told him. And the next day we met him at Loretto Convent. (laughs) What was...? A wonderful thing. Then he gave me the message. I at once... Within two hours, I started. Oh, it was a very travel from...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How you came? By what means?

Dr. Ghosh: By that rocket bus. Sixteen hours it took us from Siliguri to Calcutta. Terrible, bone-breaking. I never did that in my life, sixteen hours by bus. In Calcutta, Calcutta the greatest thing. With Lord Kṛṣṇa's blessings He could otherwise. This is the third flight that we got. We couldn't get before that. This morning we got a flight without a great...

Prabhupāda: Rocket bus?

Dr. Ghosh: Ha, from Siliguri to Calcutta.

Room Conversation -- October 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Where you are preaching now?

Acyutānanda: I was in Calcutta during the Māyāpur affair. Then I went to South India. Now I'm going to America. My stay in India may be terminated. And I received American passport. I'm able to travel now. Rāmeśvara Prabhu is sending me a ticket.

Prabhupāda: Huh? Rāmeśvara?

Bhavānanda: Rāmeśvara Mahārāja is sending a ticket for him to go.

Prabhupāda: Oh. So you can go now, America, eh?

Bhavānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That's good. You attended the conference?

Acyutānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: You liked?

Acyutānanda: Oh, yes.

Room Conversation -- October 20, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So Upendra will make it? All of the devotees are very excited about your travel plans, Śrīla Prabhupāda. (laughter) Maybe Bhagatji will come also.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (laughter) He likes the Māyāpur.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bhagatji had not heard yet, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Bhagatji had not been informed yet of your traveling plans.

Prabhupāda: No, you are proposing. (Bhagatji and Tamāla Kṛṣṇa discuss quietly)

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We're just discussing your traveling. Because it is cold in the wintertime.

Bhagatji: (indistinct)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's another reason though. The main thing is that this room, the rooms in this house don't have so much ventilation like Māyāpur does. Very good. Prabhupāda is always laying in one room, if he gets air then it's good. Passing air, you know, ventilation. He's been in the same room now for a long time. Change of place is nice. Plus all of the things are grown fresh there, so Prabhupāda might get some appetite. Very nice vegetables grown there, fresh. Anyway, he's thinking about it. He said you will come with him. Prabhupāda quoted that verse. You were quoting that verse that Māyāpur and Vṛndāvana are..., are the same. Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi? What is that verse?

Prabhupāda: Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi jebā jāne cintāmaṇi tāra hoy braja-bhūmi bās.

Room Conversation -- October 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: What do you think?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Just conditions, Śrīla Prabhupāda, will be proper?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Traveling by train? It will be a little difficult, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Upendra: Of course, Prabhupāda came from London, and the doctor said he couldn't come.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Upendra: The doctor in London... You came from London, and then you came from Bombay to Vṛndāvana in very weak condition.

Prabhupāda: So weak condition...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: It will be little warmer in Māyāpur. In Māyāpur the weather will be a little warmer. Also the air is fresher in that sense.

Bhavānanda: Śrīla Prabhupāda, here is Tamāla.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: (offers obeisances) Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: So you think over transferring me to Māyāpur.

Room Conversation -- October 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: There is ample space.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think change is good also sometimes. So we should make that program?

Prabhupāda: I think so.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, traveling with you is a great pleasure for us, Śrīla Prabhupāda. It's always very exciting to travel with you.

Prabhupāda: And in Māyāpur, if you keep me in my quarters, and take little care, that's all. Take little care, that's all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Lots of care.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We're all at your disposal, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "No king was ever served like this," you said.

Prabhupāda: Here in one room, always closed.

Room Conversation -- October 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Or I shall go there to take their dust of feet.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Take the dust...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Of their feet. I think this is the right plan, Śrīla Prabhupāda, because by then, by March of April, it will be time for you... The festival will be there. And then, with hundreds and hundreds, maybe thousands of ISKCON Vaiṣṇavas from all over the world, you will be better. And then with a great contingent we will travel around the world.

Bhavānanda: Jaya.

Devotees: Jaya. Haribol.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Here is Bhakti-prema Swami.

Prabhupāda: Oh. So Bhakti-prema, you are also coming?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda's thinking to go to Māyāpur. He says are you also coming with him?

Bhakti-prema: Certainly, Mahārāja.

Prabhupāda: So let us go in a team. (laughter)

Room Conversation -- October 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Where? Śrī Raṅgam.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So the man must be very... He's not so smārta. Because he will allow Westerners to live with him, he's favorable. So Smara-hari, one of the devotees here... We felt that if we do not find from Jalan or anyone a good kavirāja in Calcutta, then let us send two devotees to Śrī Raṅgam to meet with this head pūjārī and get his help for finding out a proper Rāmānuja kavirāja and bring him to Māyāpur. And immediately let us go to Māyāpur. Why should we sit here waiting here? Because actually we don't find any benefit from waiting here. The idea was to give change of climate, and what is the purpose of waiting for that to happen? Because we're not gaining anything by staying here except that the weather is becoming colder, so it becomes more and more dangerous to travel in cold weather. And as far as bringing a kavirāja goes, now we've already seen there's not going to be one in Vṛndāvana, so at best, we'd have to bring him from Delhi. But whether a man has to come from Delhi or come from Śrī Raṅgam, he's going to have to come and visit and stay with us. And once the treatment begins, if we get a Delhi kavirāja, he's going to have to keep coming down here. We don't want to have to stay here for more than one or two weeks. But the treatment is going to be longer than two weeks. So then we'll be stuck here. If we depend upon a Delhi kavirāja we'll be stuck here. Best thing is someone from Calcutta, because then they can come frequently to Māyāpur. But in the event that we cannot get someone from Calcutta, then we should take the help of one kavirāja from South India. And your dream was that it was a Rāmānuja kavirāja who was preparing the medicine. I think that after it's prepared he may administer the medicine for some time, but afterwards we can find another kavirāja. If he has to return to South, then another kavirāja may continue the treatment.

Prabhupāda: There is no treatment.

Room Conversation -- October 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, there is no explanation. He must be sincere, the kavirāja, and must know how to do it. That's all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: On one hand, we didn't want to take Bhakti-caru Mahārāja away from you, because he's serving properly, and this is the best thing. I can see that you also don't want that. So then we can find... It's good if one Indian devotee goes with Smara-hari. But there are others that we can find. No, we can find someone. That's not... You don't have to tax yourself for that, Śrīla Prabhupāda. But this is our idea, that why we should wait here? The longer we wait, the colder the weather becomes. And what advantage do we gain by waiting here? There's no advantage gained. You could say "Well, because if we wait here and I get the medicine immediately, and I start to take the medicine, then I will become stronger." But our feeling is that strength will take time. So just by waiting for two weeks, the strength will not increase so significantly to make traveling less risky. Traveling is risky if we are not careful. If we take great care, then traveling will not be risky.

Prabhupāda: So by plane or train?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: By plane or train? Well, I think that... I think train is better.

Room Conversation -- October 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I mean there are other points also. Whether they'll have a wheelchair that can be wheeled through an aisle in an airplane? See, on the train we can carry you quite easily. Plane traveling just becomes a very... It's a sophisticated situation. And I don't want to take you in a stretcher in a plane. I don't like that idea. I don't think it's nice in any way, you know. It's all right if we take you in a wheelchair, and then you can sit down and lay down in the seat. That's no problem. But how to get through the aisle? You remember when we went to London you had to walk. They say they have... Foreign airlines say... I remember they used to say they had some wheelchairs.

Upendra: It's not exactly a wheelchair. It's a little tiny seat that they strap down.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. Who knows that they'll have it? What's the guarantee? He can't walk. You want to go by plane? Because it's two hours? That's a big advantage. (Prabhupāda coughing) Do you want a little miśri-jala, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: So that bus, they have stopped?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Room Conversation -- October 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Then arrange for that.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah? It's a lot easier. Plane travel is easier.

Prabhupāda: Ah, ah.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's no doubt about that. It's so much easier and so much quicker.

Room Conversation -- October 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Hari-śauri: Private plane? Yes, and then it would have to be a propeller plane, too. They're hellish. Phew! We traveled on those to Chandigarh.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This country you can't do these things like that. So...

Brahmānanda: Then directly from Dum Dum to Māyāpur?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Then we go direct from Dum Dum to Māyāpur. We don't even have to go into Calcutta. Is that all right? So do you agree, Śrīla Prabhupāda, with the idea then, that the sooner we transfer there, the better, to Māyāpur? As far as the kavirāja goes, let us see if we get a local man from Calcutta, failing which, Smara-hari plus one other devotee will go to Śrī Raṅgam, and from a very reliable kavirāja, in their presence, they will have it made. Smara-hari, you see, is from Gurukṛpā and Yaśodā-nandana's party, so he has got experience sitting and watching people making the silver onto the throne. He knows how to sit and watch not to get cheated.

Prabhupāda: No, the thing is the man who would prepare, he must be experienced. That is wanted. And sincere. Then it will work, either you prepare there or here. When our men...? (devotees talk among themselves softly about who should go to Śrī Raṅgam)

Room Conversation -- October 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, no, he sees or not sees, does not matter.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So should I send... I mean right now, there's any need to inform him not to come here?

Prabhupāda: No need.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Let him come anyway if he's coming.

Prabhupāda: No, he's traveling. His secretary... The news?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, he hasn't given any indication.

Prabhupāda: Tell.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. Okay.

Prabhupāda: My sister is going back?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: When?

Bhakti-caru: When we first planned that we'll go by train, then she wanted to come in the same train actually. But now I think that many of our devotees will be going by train, so she can go with them on the train.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. She will (indistinct).

Room Conversation -- October 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Something. Anyway, before we leave I'm going to speak with Bhagatji. Bhagatji is the one who gave the gold and pearls to Vanamali. So I think Bhagatji will be able to recover it. We'll leave this medicine with Bhagatji, and he can give the medicine to Vanamali and take the money. So Smara-hari will be leaving today, just now. And we've already spoken with Delhi, and they're already going to purchase the airline tickets. Either we will leave Wednesday... Today is Monday. Either we will leave Wednesday or we will leave Friday. We're not going to travel on Thursday. And they've already informed Calcutta and Māyāpur.

Prabhupāda: Who will go with me?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Your Divine Grace, Bhavānanda Mahārāja, myself, Bhakti-caru Mahārāja, Śatadhanya Mahārāja, Upendra Prabhu, Svarūpa Dāmodara, Bharadvāja. That'll be on the plane. Then in the train, Pradyumna, Arundhatī, some other devotees also. So eight of us will be going on the plane with you, seven plus Your Divine Grace, and you will have three seats. Altogether, we're purchasing ten seats. So I don't think there will be any difficulty. We're going in full team. Scientist is with us. In case of any special knowledge, Svarūpa Dāmodara will be there. Bhavānanda with his gun. (laughter) Full team. I think it will be a nice journey, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: I hope.

Room Conversation -- October 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That we shall have in..., conveniently, not immediately. Immediately there is Bombay.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. (Hindi) And the mayor, ex-mayor, has given telegram. Where is that telegram? This is a telegram... It says, "Pray God, Kṛṣṇa, to give you long life to spread Indian culture in every nook and corner of the universe. Signed Raji K. Ganatra, ex-mayor of Bombay." He's very convinced, Śrīla Prabhupāda, about Your Divine Grace and this movement, because he traveled around the world and stayed as a guest at our temples, and he was amazed to see how this Indian culture had actually been transplanted and taken root in all of these countries all over the world. He could not believe it. He was so amazed and impressed. He said that he's seen genuinely that this Indian culture has been taken up in true spirit.

Hari-prasāda: This is the first movement that has started (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hari-prasādaji said that...

Hari-prasāda: No Prabhupāda, this was the first mission which had started...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- October 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Hari-prasāda:. No, air-conditioned train, at this time you can travel.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Now he's a little weak.

Hari-prasāda: No, this all cough and all these things could be... In dry climate it can be...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But unless he's a little stronger, to travel...

Hari-prasāda: Yes, little strength, if he goes. That vaidya, kavirāja can come from Bombay. He had treated my father-in-law for about four-five years.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Who is that?

Hari-prasāda: He is Bhayernathji(?), Pandit Bayernath.(?) He is friend of (indistinct). He's a very good Ayurvedic. (break)

Prabhupāda: Svarūpa Dāmodara?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Stop the medicine.

Room Conversation -- October 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Trivikrama: But how can Prabhupāda travel?

Devotee: But Prabhupāda cannot travel, because any movement will disturb his kidney.

Prabhupāda: He cannot come?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, it will be the same as the man from Delhi. He can't come and stay here and give up his practice. He stays in Calcutta, so... He won't be able to simply come and then... He'll leave, and then we won't be able to consult. The idea is that the man has to be here every day.

Prabhupāda: No. If he Rāmānujī kavirāja gives makara-dhvaja, that is the last. If he...

Bhavānanda: He'll only have to come once, you mean, and prescribe makara-dhvaja.

Prabhupāda: No... (break) ...said there is a good kavirāja?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I don't know how it is that approved this one, but according to Gopāla, Jayapatākā says that he's arranged one Rāmānujī kavirāja.

Prabhupāda: Where?

Bhavānanda: Calcutta.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...tomorrow probably. (indistinct) ...loan... Actually we're not loaning him that money. That money is being given as a gift to him. He was willing to pay it back. I said, no, this is a gift from you to him for improving his business. I said actually it's meant for each of the family members. I told him, "You use it now for improving your business. Then if business increases, you can eventually pay each one of them the money that they should have gotten." He said, "Very nice." And I explained to him what squandering meant. Now it is very clear. I told him that "You can use the money each month that you get. And all of you can use it for three things: for purchasing property, increasing business or buying government stocks." I said, "Prabhupāda's point is that whatever he's given you, it should increase in its value. He wants to see that it increases." And now it's very definite, so... Again I explained to him how there should be no difficulty with this, getting this... He's a little lazy. He's lazy. I could see that when he thought that the money was a donation, I think it came in his mind that "Even if the business deal doesn't go through, I still get the money." He should be encouraged, but his tendency is to be a little lazy. They should not be given money easily, too easily. Otherwise they won't work hard. He's also getting some money, he told me, from a fixed deposit in Calcutta from the BBT which he uses for travel expenses. He says gradually he will be paying some of that money back. He said that's why he sent you sometimes... He recently sent 870 rupees. He says that he's using it for travel expenses, and he may pay it back. I didn't know if you had arranged anything regarding that. You expect him to pay that money back, or not necessarily? It should be.

Prabhupāda: No, I expect.

Room Conversation -- October 29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, not necessary.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. (break) ...appreciative of Your Divine Grace and of ISKCON. Adri-dhāraṇā reports that while they were traveling together, during the ten hours they were discussing your Society's activities around the world. And the Shastriji was saying how the effect of Kṛṣṇa consciousness is so transcendental that even if a person is mleccha-yavana, he can become a pure devotee by chanting of the holy name. And he said therefore he feels that the work which you are doing is the most important work being done by anyone in the whole world. He's very favorable towards you and towards ISKCON and the devotees. (break) ...has to admit that, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that your work is the topmost of anyone on this planet. (break) (kavirāja and Prabhupāda, Bhakti-caru—Hindi)

Bhakti-caru: He's saying that the more Śrīla Prabhupāda sleeps, it's better for him.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Really. He's sleeping a lot. Today you were sleeping a lot, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Kavirāja: (Hindi)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He took three spoonfuls.

Kavirāja: (Hindi)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda, did you have any problem with the stool today? There was not so much passing, I think.

Bhakti-caru: Not at all today.

Prabhupāda: Stool? No.

Room Conversation -- October 29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Bhakti-caru: Four or five days he agreed to stay. But he says that in four or five days Śrīla Prabhupāda won't be able to travel. It will be at least ten to fifteen days. At that time...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Anyway, let us see. Maybe we can convince him to stay.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: A bit longer.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We should try. Śrīla Prabhupāda? I had meeting with that lawyer? That man is wonderful. He is the first lawyer I have ever met that I honestly feel is an honest man. That Jagadish...

Prabhupāda: Agarwal.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Is that his name? Agarwal? From Mathurā. Whew! Very high class man, thoroughly gentleman.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Noble-minded.

Room Conversation -- October 29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So you guide him with his...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes. I told him that you want me to help him in every way, and that there's no doubt we will do that in every way.

Prabhupāda: So about that traveling?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Travel exp... I talked to him, and I explained to him that he's taken ten thousand rupees for traveling expenses and twenty-five thousand rupees books, thirty-five thousand rupees, and he's paid six thousand rupees in two years. I said, "This is not good business." So he said, "Then stop the traveling money." I said, "I'll stop it temporarily. You start paying some money. Then again we can give you the money." I said, "We want to give you the money, but do some business first." So he said, "All right." No, he's pretty pleased to get this big amount now for making this contract. This is a big amount that he got, half a lakh nearly. From this, he can make more profit, and then he'll pay it back by April, and then we'll give him nine thousand rupees free donation. Each of them gets nine thousand rupees as per your original scheme. So they are being looked to nicely. Actually there's no difficulty. They have very few expenses.

Kavirāja: (Hindi)

Bhakti-caru: Śrīla Prabhupāda? (kavirāja chants viṣṇu-mantra) (Bengali) (Prabhupāda drinks something) Śrīla Prabhupāda? (Hindi—Prabhupāda, Bhakti-caru, and kavirāja) (break)

Prabhupāda: I think whatever money you give Vrindavan for business, he'll spoil. He has already spoiled. They are getting, altogether, about two thousand rupees even without any business—his mother, one thousand, and they four, 250 each. So let them chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and eat and sleep. That's all. He has already spoiled.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Bhavānanda: Or if someone's going on traveling saṅkīrtana in that area, 'cause we always know where they're going, they can take and deliver if they're going near. No problem. But the magazine is so attractive that the postal clerks, they cannot resist taking it home to their family. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: You can get advertisement. But we don't want it.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I don't think.... It diminishes the prestige of the publication. By Kṛṣṇa's grace we have no shortage of money.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Have it. So we shall construct a Yoga-pīṭha Bhaktivedanta Hall.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hm. Yoga-pīṭha Bhaktivedanta Hall.

Bhavānanda: Oh!

Prabhupāda: And we have a bookstall there. Make it like that.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Where is podda? (?)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Your sister. I'm just calling right now. (break) (long pause-Śrīla Prabhupāda is sleeping) ...of the different businesses of Vrindavan? Well, first of all he was getting money for traveling expenses. So I have written a letter to Mr. Bekkar, the manager of the Central Bank of India at Camac Street, informing him that henceforward the interest from the fixed deposits in the name of BBT should be stopped from giving it to Vrinda Book Company, and instead the money should be transferred by mail transfer to the Central Bank of India, Gwalior Tank Road, to BBT account. I gave all the details. That's one letter. Then furthermore, I also addressed a letter to the Punjab National Bank, Brabourn Road, informing them that the Rs. 500 should be stopped from being given to Shrimati Radharani De, because... I didn't mention this, but the reason is that she'll be getting one thousand rupees from Indian Overseas Bank. And I'm sending that letter...

Prabhupāda: Oh... Has Indian Overseas arranged?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Ha.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: 'Cause you're giving him about, he gets about 800 rupees a month from the BBT for travel expenses.

Prabhupāda: Mm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So I have some experience with myself as organizing books distribution.

Prabhupāda: Hm, hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So when we would spend with our Rādhā-Dāmodara party, we used to spend about five thousand dollars a month for travel expenses, but for that five thousand dollars we would make a hundred thousand dollars.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In other words twenty times whatever we spent on travelling...

Prabhupāda: And if he does not give substantial order then stop it.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Do like that and I fully depend on you. If he's not giving business what is the use of?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He is spen... I think he's just taking the money and using it for some other business. He can't be spending 800 rupees and not doing any business.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And if he's spending the 800 for travelling and not booking order then what is the use of spending the 800 rupees?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Tell him frankly.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: Then stop everything.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I told him. I said, "You think about it tonight and tomorrow we'll talk again."

Prabhupāda: Hm. Hm. Do everything very cautiously.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh yes.

Prabhupāda: It is not that out of affection we shall squander money.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Oh, so if he has to do business, he has to pay cash and he'll give fifty percent.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If he was getting the business, he would have paid your BBT some money.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In over a year he has paid two or three thousand rupees. That's not business. He's taking 800 rupees a month for so long for travel expenses, and he's paid maybe two or three thousand rupees total. I mean it's crazy business.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Anybody can see it's not good business.

Prabhupāda: So stop it all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I talked with him in a nice way though. I said, "Now you tell me, Vrindavan." I gave him the points. I said, "So you think about it tonight and you let me know tomorrow." I'm talking in a nice way with him because I feel that in... I want them to be happy. I can see they're not so intelligent so they should not...

Prabhupāda: At least five thousand rupees business must be given otherwise... That's all.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Immediately there should be business. If a man spends nearly a thousand rupees for travelling every month, he must be making fifteen, twenty thousand rupees. But he is not giving any money at all to the BBT. So where's the one thousand rupees going that he's given? He couldn't be using it for...

Prabhupāda: So we have given in charge and now stop it.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He was giving him travel money now for about two years. And he hasn't given any money to the BBT out of it so I, I really question. I'll talk with him further.

Prabhupāda: You deal.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, I know how to do this because I was doing the saṅkīrtana, so I know what should come from the money he's spending. It's the same idea as anywhere in the world. You spend, it's business, business, whether it's dollars or rupees. I'll try...

Prabhupāda: That man who has kept, he's working as assistant, he is plundering.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, I think so.

Prabhupada Vigil -- November 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, most of this traveling that we're going to do, you will be laying down.

Prabhupāda: That laying down and this laying down, that is different?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, then we have to think of what the alternative is. Staying here means being subject to the possible care of this assistant who you saw the other day, 'cause this kavirāja will not wait any longer. He can't stay here any longer. We can try and convince him to stay, but I don't know how successful we will be. And he may give his medicines, but if some unforeseen difficulty develops, then it means that we are under the care of this other person.

Bhavānanda: This palanquin parikrama is very rough. You're bouncing up and down. You're going swinging sideways.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: (aside:) It's not as rough as traveling to Māyāpur, though, not one tenth as rough or one fiftieth. You know, all you got to do is go on a rough road. It's nothing. This palanquin is smooth compared to that, going slowly and being carried. I think the main point, Śrīla Prabhupāda, is that we have to consider going as opposed to staying here with the possibility of being at the..., under the care of this other kavirāja. That to me is the choice. This kavirāja will give medicines... First of all, we can try to convince him to stay, but failing that, he's giving a series of medicines which he expects will be proper according to the condition. But naturally the condition can change on any date. Then what will we do?

Prabhupāda: I say no medicine.

Prabhupada Vigil -- November 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: At least there is risk of life.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: By traveling.

Prabhupāda: I see that.

Bhavānanda: We've also seen, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that while you've been here in Vṛndāvana without this kavirāja, your condition has steadily deteriorated. Now he's come, and there's some slight improvement. We can speak to him about staying, but it's highly unlikely that he'll be able to stay away from his practice for any time longer. Then, if your condition turns again, then what do we do? There's also risk.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Risk is there, and risk is here. So better take the risk here.

Bhavānanda: And chance of survival is here and chance of survival is there. But where is the...

Prabhupāda: No. Provided you reach there. There is survival or whatever it may be, but whether there is arrival? The best thing is no medicine and kindly give me some (sic:) circumambulation and leave me to the fate.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Bhakti-caru: Do you understand? He's saying that "As a physician, in this condition, I wouldn't advise you to go. But if you desire to go there, then I have enough confidence in my medicine, and since you have the will, so I can assure you I can take you over there safely. Now it's up to you whether you want to go or whether you want to stay." He's saying that if you stay here for ten more days, then you'll become strong enough and you can travel. And he's willing to come back again after about a week, and then he'll stay here for a day or two and then take him.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I think that's a good idea. Don't you, Mahārāja?

Bhakti-caru: Śrīla Prabhupāda is saying that... Śrīla Prabhupāda wants to stay here, but we want him to take...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He wants to stay here, that's a fact.

Kavirāja: (Hindi)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What is that?

Bhakti-caru: Water intake, liquid.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How much urine has he passed since six o'clock this morning? Six o'clock this morning?

Prabhupāda: Brahmānanda.

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's another report, from Africa. Should I read it? It says, "The saṅkīrtana movement in the dark continent." This was written by Jalakāra and Śyāmalāl. Śyāmalāl is a Bengali devotee, Śrīla Prabhupāda. You may remember him from Calcutta? He's gone to Africa to preach, and he and this other boy Jalakāra travel together all over Africa.

Prabhupāda: Yesterday... No, yesterday some prominent men, Dalmiya. Who came?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dalmiya was here, Rāma-Kṛṣṇa Bajaj, Śrīmān Nārāyaṇa, and some gentleman from Auroville Society was here to see you. I think they were participating in that conference, Gītā-pratiṣṭhāna.

Dr. Kapoor: I was also invited. I'm sorry I couldn't come because my wife was very ill.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dr. Kapoor could not attend. His wife was very ill, he said. He couldn't attend the conference. Śrīla Prabhupāda, maybe you should rest now a little bit. Okay. (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: I'm tired.

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That is another thing.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Traveling now should only be undertaken for health purposes.

Prabhupāda: That is welcome. But at the present moment, I don't see any such... (Bengali)

Kṛṣṇa dāsa Bābājī: (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: Why Tamāla Kṛṣṇa gone?

Śatadhanya: I'll get him, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Bhakti-caru: Śrīla Prabhupāda? (Bengali)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Bābājī Mahārāja also I have consulted that "Being afraid, don't move me in the hospital." He also says, "No, don't do."

Room Conversation -- November 6, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. They must be tired. They traveled all night long. The kavirāja didn't sleep at all, I heard. Is that true, Jayapatākā?

Jayapatākā: Yes. The flight was three hours delayed. Three hours he was sitting, and he didn't leave Calcutta... 8:00 flight left at 10:30, 11:00, and arrived in Delhi 1:00. Then it took to 5:00 to get here, so he's quite tired.

Prabhupāda: It did not start on time.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, three hours delayed.

Jayapatākā: The flight was late.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So everyone can take rest now.

Jayapatākā: Just seeing Your Divine Grace gives us so much strength.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If you can just request Kṛṣṇa to allow you to stay, Śrīla Prabhupāda... Everyone wants you to stay. (end)

Room Conversation -- November 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So you come at four, have kīrtana (?). (break) I wish that you GBC manage very nicely and consider I am dead and let me try to travel all the tīrthasthāna. Without any responsibility. If I become recovered from this malady I shall come back and then I shall die in, what is it when the dead body is there, let them bring to Māyāpur and Vṛndāvana. I am thinking in this way. Bring little medicine and no medicine, little milk, and travel one place to another and if there is death, what is the lamentation? My age is ripe. In the open air and bullock cart or during daytime, eh? Or you can say semi-suicide, although living what consider me dead for the time. You manage and nowadays there is in India ample sunshine. So during daytime I shall travel and nighttime you make a camp under a tree. In this way let me travel all the tīrthas. I am thinking in this way. What is your opinion?

Bhavānanda: Śrīla Prabhupāda, we promise that we'll manage everything to the best of our ability.

Prabhupāda: No, no, you are managing, I know, but you are all important men and unnecessarily you are bound up. You cannot go. So Lokanātha party has got some experience and let me go. In India the climate is now good. If I recover, it is very good. You know. So what is the wrong? If I die, then the body will be brought either in Vṛndāvana or Māyāpur, that's all. And if I live, it will be a great end of a life. You are all experienced.

Room Conversation -- November 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: They have got experience Indian, you can go village to village and, arrangement as you may, but it is trouble taken, and I am no longer, you manage. If I live, I can come again. I shall be very glad.

Devotee: Previously it was mentioned that there was some risk in travelling.

Prabhupāda: What is that risk? Nowadays there is no risk. What is the risk? Mm?

Devotee: Well from the medical point of view it's something with the organs or something, I don't know exactly but it's been considered.

Prabhupāda: This is my proposal and...

Jayapatāka: That would be after you gained some strength, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Yes. If I (have) free air and free movement why sunshine (?) and I can come back again in a year.

Jayapatāka: You will be translating while you're travelling?

Prabhupāda: No, yes and no.

Room Conversation -- November 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Ha.

Bhavānanda: Only factor at this point is not to take any unnecessary risk.

Prabhupāda: No. As I think free, so I remain. Mm. Then when I am sane man, I shall come back again either Māyāpur or Vṛndāvana or Bombay, any other.

Jayapatāka: You would travel by a minibus.

Prabhupāda: Mm?

Jayapatāka: You would travel by a bus.

Prabhupāda: That you think of.

Bhavānanda: We will all sit down and discuss the different arrangements that have to be made, plans that have to be made. It's a very nice idea. Real sannyāsa life.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Mm. You have tried doctor, kavirāja, medicine, everything. Everything has failed. Now suppose I am taking the risk of death, what is wrong? When the..., I am dead you go India, within India, you go and bring the body either in Māyāpur or Vṛndāvana. Māyāpur the land is already there. Vṛndāvana I think on the gate side, that's all. That's wherever you like you'll do.

Room Conversation -- November 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm. You make me flat. (break)

Jayapatākā: We heard that Your Divine Grace had a dream that a kavirāja of the Rāmānuja-sampradāya would treat you and bring you back to strength, and this kavirāja says that in a very short time, following the treatment, you would regain your strength. Although he hasn't got all of the medicines yet, but within a day or two they'll all be prepared, and he says within fifteen days you should be quite improved in strength. So far, he seems to have been quite sincere.

Prabhupāda: No, no, he's sincere. I'll drink milk. Whatever strength is obtainable, there will be.

Jayapatākā: Like to follow the same treatment, only while traveling.

Haṁsadūta: So we should meet and make a program for going around Vṛndāvana.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Haṁsadūta: You want to begin tomorrow morning?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- November 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Devotee (1): If Prabhupāda travels in a van it would be very bumpy. He should have a big bus.

Haṁsadūta: Let's discuss it.

Prabhupāda: Bus?

Devotee (1): A big bus.

Prabhupāda: No, no, bus will be not good. Bullock cart.

Bhavānanda: Bullock cart.

Jayapatākā: That is very bumpy.

Bhavānanda: Your Guru Mahārāja used to have bullock cart travel from Hulorghat (on the bank of the Ganges in Māyāpur) up to the Caitanya Maṭha. You told me you put a nice mattress down in the back and a cover, and you lay down there. You even told me once to go to Calcutta that way. You lay down, at night; you go little bit, little bit; and in the morning, when you wake up, you're in Calcutta.

Prabhupāda: Bullock, you get the cow dung.

Room Conversation -- November 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Not four, five, six...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's how long it takes to go around Vṛndāvana by bullock cart. It takes three hours walking at a good pace, and it takes at least five or six hours, Lokanātha says, by bullock cart. How...? We couldn't even go a half hour just around this temple.

Prabhupāda: No, I traveled. It takes two hours in the morning.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Walking.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But not by bullock cart. That's when a man walks very quickly you can do it in two hours, but by bullock cart it will take five hours. We have... You had difficulty even doing a half-hour parikrama around this temple. You became very faint. Whether you think that you can go five hours in a row?

Prabhupāda: From Mādhava Mahārāja's Maṭha, bring Kṛṣṇa dāsa Bābājī.

Room Conversation -- November 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's quite a big experiment to make, going to Govardhana the first day, Śrīla Prabhupāda. You feel confident that you can travel nine hours in a row on a bullock cart?

Prabhupāda: I am sleeping here.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Lokanātha: He says he's sleeping here.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But this is not a bullock cart.

Prabhupāda: The same thing.

Room Conversation -- November 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, let them take their time. They do that. It is very nice picnic.

Lokanātha: From my village there is this pilgrimage called Pandarpur. This is sixty miles. And still, old men, they just travel, walk. Every ekādaśī they go.

Prabhupāda: Just see.

Lokanātha: Every ekādaśī they go to Pandarpur, have darśana of Charukmari(?), and return on foot.

Haṁsadūta: You have assured us that in one day you're not going to die, and you want to make this experiment, so we should do it.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Haṁsadūta: We'll do it with great enthusiasm. Your Divine Grace is infallible. So if you say that it will help and cure you, then that must be a fact. You've never been wrong about anything, Prabhupāda, so you must be right this time also.

Prabhupāda: So let us make experiment. Don't hesitate.

Room Conversation -- November 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Lokanātha: When we were traveling from Vṛndāvana to Māyāpur we stayed many times. Outside we'd live under the tree. It's nice.

Bhakti-caru: Yes, but if just one window is open at night, Prabhupāda starts feeling cold in spite of the blanket.

Lokanātha: You are making mundane.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: It will be very cold in the early morning hours.

Haṁsadūta: We'll bring the van, and Prabhupāda can stay in the van overnight, or we'll find some place.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: All the āśramas will be overcrowded.

Pañca-draviḍa: We can sleep around the van. Prabhupāda is like a desire tree. He satisfies everybody.

Lokanātha: That cart could be turned into house. Have bamboo sticks, cover it with...

Prabhupāda: So begin to plan.

Room Conversation -- November 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, Śrīla Prabhupāda, I'll tell you, I'm getting so upset sitting in the room upstairs. I mean I just... I was walking around... Two of the devotees told me this road is so bad that if you go on this road, you're going to be jolted back and forth. The road is terrible. I just can't understand, Śrīla Prabhupāda, why it has to be tomorrow that we have to go. If anybody wants you to travel, I do. My whole desire is to take you all over the world. I want to take you on parikrama, but why do we have to go when you're in this condition? I can't understand it. It just... I was standing outside. This kavirāja, he has worked so hard. He's so much disappointed. He can't understand why he... He says that now, today, you've taken half a kilo of milk. No mucus has is being produced. No stool is being passed. He says tomorrow he wants to give you a medicine that will begin to build the milk into muscles. He's going to get you to a point where you can take two kilos of milk a day. And he says very soon you'll be able to have the strength to actually do parikrama. So why are we throwing everything out the window, that we must go tomorrow? I cannot understand.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Bhakti-caru: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Bhavānanda: Thank you, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: I cannot refuse all your request.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...the bullock cart to Vṛndāvana. You were thinking to travel again, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Not now.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Some pain? Oh, here he is. Here's Lokanātha, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Lokanātha?

Lokanātha: Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: You are coming back?

Lokanātha: Yes, we came back from saṅkīrtana. We had kīrtana in the town, Vṛndāvana, Loi Bazaar and Banke Bihārī temple, that route. We had a bullock cart filled in with Gurukula school children, and there was a big group of devotees chanting and dancing in front of the cart, and there was also van, making announcement, inviting people for our afternoon program of ārati, kīrtana, and prasādam distribution.

Prabhupāda: So go.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Since a long time I have got a desire.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hm. Prabhupāda's had this ambition for a long time.

Lokanātha: Travel in the holy places. So you'll be doing in...?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, we can discuss.

Jayādvaita: Lord Balarāma, He did that. He went to all the holy places. So in the same way, if you can get a little strength from Kṛṣṇa and Balarāma here in Vṛndāvana, then you can... Lord Balarāma was going to all the different places.

Prabhupāda: I give you idea. Where is Lokanātha?

Lokanātha: Yes, I'm here, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: What is called? Front party.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What kind of party?

Prabhupāda: Front party.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: In this way.

Lokanātha: Ye. This kind of program we have done before also. Whenever we had big group traveling, we always send two devotees out, or sometimes four devotees.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We also did that with our Rādhā-Dāmodara program. That is the way of traveling-advance booking.

Lokanātha: Yes, so the main party does not lose time in finding or looking for the place.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're not inconvenienced in any way.

Lokanātha: Right. So that advance party could wait at the gate of the...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Wherever. But that's the idea.

Prabhupāda: And when you go in procession, have kīrtana.

Lokanātha: Yes. That would be nice.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Lokanātha: And most of the holy places are connected with good roads. During our preaching we also visit holy places. When they're on the way, we pass through them. And if we travel not very fast, with good drivers, it won't be much...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bhakti-caitanya Swami is the fit driver for your vehicles, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Is that all right? I know he would want to come. Is that all right, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He's expert, Bhakti-caitanya Swami. He knows how to arrange everything also.

Jayādvaita: These vehicles can supply electricity so that when you stop...

Prabhupāda: Purchase at least four vehicles.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Four what, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: At least four vehicles.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You will be the leader.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You're the leader of the party.

Lokanātha: So I have a vehicle. They also could travel with us, and in the same town they will do nagara-saṅkīrtana all day long and distribute books?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Lokanātha: I think that it will make our program complete. We have membership team, we have scientist visiting the scientists, and our boys will go door to door, house to house, and spread your message.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: With book distribution and saṅkīrtana.

Bhavānanda: I think that the Māyāpur book distribution team now has some heavy competition.

Lokanātha: With Prabhupāda's traveling saṅkīrtana and book distribution. Also our party is well equipped to do evening programs. So there will be lot of senior devotees, and advance party could arrange programs and do different big temples or different public meetings.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You want that, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hm hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But, Śrīla Prabhupāda, you should not overexert yourself.

Prabhupāda: No.