There is no question (Conversations 1974)

Expressions researched:
"no question" |"there can be no question" |"there could be no question" |"there is no question" |"there was no question" |"there will be no question" |"without any question"

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 3, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes. One has to take information from the authority. That knowledge is perfect. And these rascals, philosophical, scientific speculation, all useless waste of time.

New Devotee: I live in Long Beach and I will be going to school soon, but I'm...

Prabhupāda: Hm. We don't accept any speculative knowledge. We want final conclusion of the experienced person. Nṛpa-nirṇītaḥ, this word is used. Nṛpa-nirṇītaḥ, it is concluded. Kavibhir nirūpitaḥ. Idaṁ hi puṁsas śrutas..., tapasaḥ śrutasya vā. Avicyuto 'rthaḥ kavibhir nirūpitaḥ. Nirṇītaḥ... These words are... It is already concluded. There is no question of argument. In the Vedic literature, these words are used, nṛpa-nirṇītaḥ, nirūpitaḥ.

New Devotee: I should abandon...

Prabhupāda: Nāsato vidyate bhāvo nā..., asataḥ vidyate bhāvaḥ. What is the next line? So, we take things which is conclusive. The scientists, they are making experiment, where is the beginning of life. Misled. They are thinking life is from matter. They have no experience. Still, the rascal Darwin gave a theory. They are persisting on it. They have no practical experience that life is coming from matter. That is called vṛścika-taṇḍula-nyāya. You have no experience in your country. We have got. Sometimes you'll find, scorpion is coming out from the stack of rice. You have seen it?

Karandhara: I haven't seen it, but I have heard of the example.

Morning Walk -- January 5, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That means they do not know how to stop suffering.

Bali Mardana: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: The... Here is one class, they're trying to become very strong to tolerate suffering, and other philosophies, they're making everything zero. There is no question of not suffering, but making zero. No suffering, nor neither suffering. Suffering or not..., both of them abolished, dismissed. This philosopher is... "This suffering cannot be dismissed. Therefore you be strong to tolerate it." Other philosophers they say, "There is suffering, so make it zero." But both of them have no information that there is real life where there is no suffering. Still there is life. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. There is life, but no suffering.

Bali Mardana: They're like owls.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (pause)

Bali Mardana: There's a river. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...duḥkha-nivṛtti. Ultimately, stop of all sufferings. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Ānandamayo 'bhyāsāt (Vedānta-sūtra 1.1.12). Simply ānanda. Dancing with Kṛṣṇa, rāsa dance. Supposing if there is such life—dancing and eating and chanting, no suffering. So would anybody deny that? Is there any such fool?

Bali Mardana: Yeah, they're all denying.

Prabhupāda: Ah?

Morning Walk -- January 11, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No, therefore I say desirelessness means to desire for Kṛṣṇa. That is desirelessness. Even if you... We are not after mukti. We, we can go to the hell to serve Kṛṣṇa.

Gurukṛpā: Mama janmani janmanīśvare...

Prabhupāda: Ah! Mama janmani janmanīśvare bhavatād bhaktir ahai... (Cc. Antya 20.29, Śikṣāṣṭaka 4). That is... There is no question of desirelessness. We desire for Kṛṣṇa. That is desirelessness. Just like a diseased man, if he desires for healthy life, is that bad thing? To desire for further disease, that is desire. That is bad. Therefore I say, you cannot give up desire. That is not possible. You have to purify your desires. But when you desire for Kṛṣṇa, that is desirelessness. To become free from disease, that does not mean you have to stop eating. In the diseased condition, you are eating. As soon as you want to desire, that "Let me, give me this nice food," but you cannot eat on your diseased condition. It will be tasteless. You simply desire, but you cannot enjoy. But same you, man, when the disease is gone, you enjoy that same food very nicely. When you are free from disease, you just ask for rasagullā. You'll taste it. But when you are diseased, the same rasagullā will not be tasteful. That is the condition. The desire which gives you happiness, that is wanted. The desire which gives you distress, that is not wanted. Therefore Bhāgavata begins with dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra: (SB 1.1.2) "The cheating type of religion is rejected." Because in every religion there is some desire for material objective, up to mukti. Bhukti-mukti-siddhi-kāmī. General people, karmīs, they want pleasure, material pleasure. The jñānīs, they want mukti, and the yogis, they want siddhi. They're everyone beggars. And a bhakta kicks them all out. "We don't want anything. Simply Kṛṣṇa. That's all." Therefore he's desireless.

Morning Walk -- January 12, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No. We should preach that "Stop these things. No illicit sex, no gambling, no meat-eating." Practically you teach them. This is the real social problem.

Umāpati: Should we also try to introduce legislation immediately to close the slaughterhouses?

Prabhupāda: No. If you want good men, good leader, you must be free from all these, I mean, sinful activities. Otherwise there is no question of good leader, or good man. There is no question. First principle is this. Just like a patient, he must abide by the prescription, that "You must do this, you must do not this." Then there is cure. And simply if he goes on in his own way, then there is no value of consulting a physician. So the first program is that "If you want really good leader and if you want to become yourself also good, then you must give up these four sinful activities. Otherwise, all your scheme will be failure."

Umāpati: So we would tell the people that if we were elected we would try to close the slaughterhouses.

Prabhupāda: No, no, that is different thing. Why you should say, revolting something. You say that "Don't eat meat." That is slaughterhouse closing. If you say that "Close your slaughterhouse," they will think that these are, what is called?

Umāpati: Radical.

Prabhupāda: Ideal, radicalist, idealist. But if you can induce them... That is also another process...

Umāpati: Through influence.

Morning Walk -- January 15, 1974, Hawaii:

Prabhupāda: Just see. Let them come and live here. Produce foodstuffs, have cows, fruits, flowers, live peacefully, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa; but they won't allow. Americans, yes, they have got so much land. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam, tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā (ISO 1). Whatever is Kṛṣṇa's property, you can... You are Kṛṣṇa's son; you can utilize it. But one son is prohibiting, "No, no, you cannot enter here." This is the problem. The so-called nationalism is dangerous. Just see how nice flowers, fruits, plant. Everything is there, complete.

pūrṇam idaṁ pūrṇam adaḥ

pūrṇāt pūrṇam udacyate

pūrṇasya pūrṇam ādāya

pūrṇam evāvaśiṣyate

(Iso Invocation)

There is no question of overpopulation at all. These rascals have created like that. Hare Kṛṣṇa. They're coming from our temple?

Sudāmā: Yes. Jayaśrī is here also.

Prabhupāda: Oh. (japa) Thank you. Jayaśrī joined when I first came here?

Sudāmā: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Feeling all right? I think you joined when I first came here?

Jayaśrī: Yes.

Morning Walk -- January 15, 1974, Hawaii:

Prabhupāda: They are rascals. Therefore I always say, "Kick them on their face with your shoes, so-called scientists." "Accident." There is no question of accident. Mūḍha. Therefore they have been described in the Bhagavad-gītā as mūḍhāḥ, rascals, narādhama. Narādhama, the lowest of the mankind. Because they got this opportunity to appreciate the work of Kṛṣṇa, but they avoid it, they are narādhama. No, they are so big, big graduate, scientists, and..." māyayāpahṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.15). Their real knowledge is taken away, simply childish proposing something, so-called scientists. Real knowledge is to see everywhere Kṛṣṇa, mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). The supervision of Kṛṣṇa. That is real knowledge. Not only to appreciate, but to explain it also. Kaniṣṭha-adhikārī will appreciate, but cannot explain how it is being done. Madhyama-adhikārī will explain. That is preacher. And uttama-adhikārī, he thinks that everyone knows, everyone knows. He does not see that somebody knows, somebody does not know. He sees everyone knows. That is uttama-adhikārī. He does not make any distinction.

Bali Mardana: He does not preach.

Prabhupāda: Eh? No. He's paramahaṁsa. Does not preach means he preaches, but he comes to the second-class platform. The first-class platform means he does not make any distinction between devotee and nondevotee. He sees everyone is engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service.

Bali Mardana: Does he consciously come from the first-class to second-class.

Morning Walk -- January 18, 1974, Hawaii:

Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be, there is discretion. As soon as you say evolution, then evolution means there is also some arrangement that "You shall act like this, and he shall act like this."

Sudāmā: Some people already believe, "Well, we already have so much water." Just like when we sweat, there is already water there. There's no question of drawing it from the... like the trees.

Prabhupāda: Why do you draw water? Why you draw water from other source? If you have got water? If you haven't got water, that's all right. Is that sufficient?

Sudāmā: No.

Prabhupāda: Then?

Satsvarūpa: Their idea of the arrangement is that everything is meant for man, for his exploitation and enjoyment.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Satsvarūpa: Everything is meant for man's, he's the chief living entity. That's their understanding of the arrangement. The tree may have to do this, but we can drink it another way.

Bali-mardana: Man uses his intelligence.

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, no. Bhaktas are not ajñānī.

Dr. Patel: Myself, I don't talk of others.

Prabhupāda: No, no, yourself also. A bhaktas, they're not ajñānī. That is rascaldom. If says the bhaktas are ajñānī, that is rascaldom because Kṛṣṇa says, teṣām evānukampārtham aham ajñāna-jaṁ tamaḥ, nāśayāmi (BG 10.11). If Kṛṣṇa helps him to become jñānī, then how he's ajñānī? It is a, ignorance, they say bhaktas are not jñānīs. Without jñāna, there is no question of bhakta. Jñāna-vairāgya-yuktayā (SB 1.2.12). Bhakta means he's already qualified with jñāna and vairāgya. That is bhakta.

vāsudeve bhagavati

bhakti-yogaḥ prayojitaḥ

janayaty āśu vairāgyaṁ

jñānaṁ ca yad ahaitukam

(SB 1.2.7)

It is a mistaken idea, the bhaktas are not very advanced in knowledge.

Dr. Patel: Bhaktas are...

Prabhupāda: They have got real knowledge. They have got real knowledge. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). When they have surrendered to Kṛṣṇa, they are really jñānī.

Dr. Patel: But some of the absolutely ignorant people, they have become, but...

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is my point. If you can avoid death, disease, old age, then you are well. You cannot avoid all these things. You must become old man, you must die, you must be diseased; where is the meaning of this well? It is simply concoction. (break) Where is happiness? Where is well-being? That they do not know. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. That they do not know. Just like a man lying on sick bed, and some friends come, "How are you?" "Yes, today I am well." What is this "well"? You are lying on the sick bed, hospital, and you are speaking, "Yes, I am well." (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. There is no "well." So long you are subjected to birth, death, old age and disease, there is no question of "well." When you can avoid these things, then you are well. (break) ...but our independence. What is that independence? No rice, no geha. What is this independence? (break) (Hindi) "godless civilization" saba boka mare hai, bās. (break) ...take shelter of Kṛṣṇa, everything is false. You cannot escape. (Hindi) The death is there. Mṛtyuḥ sarva-haraś cāham (BG 10.34). So at the end everything will be taken away by Kṛṣṇa in the form of death. Mṛtyuḥ sarva-haraś cāham. (japa) Everyone, especially the karmīs, they think that they will live forever.

Mr. Sar: Yes.

Prabhupāda: This is the most wonderful thing. Because everyone is dying, but the man who is not yet dead, he thinks that he'll live forever. This is the most wonderful thing. Ahanyāhanya lokāni gacchanti yama-mandiram, śeṣaḥ sthitam icchanti kim āścaryam atha param (?). He does not think that "I'll have to die. So what I am doing?"

Guest (1): Swamiji, may I ask one question?

Morning Walk -- February 20, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So they are innocent people. They have imitated. Our, these so-called sādhu says that Lord Śiva used to smoke gañjā. That is their... So they have become Lord Śiva. Lord Śiva drunk the whole poison ocean and he kept it here. So you drink one drop of poison. But these rascals, they compare with Śiva, with Kṛṣṇa. "Kṛṣṇa danced with girls. Therefore we must have." These Māyāvādīs do that. I know.

Dr. Patel: You are... You have to... I've been... That is what I have, as one of the members of the Vaiṣṇava family, think, that you have to worship God not with the body consciousness, but with the soul consciousness. Then there is no question of Kṛṣṇa dancing with girls. It is a higher soul embracing the lower souls to him. Plain it has been...

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Dr. Patel: That is what we have been taught from our early days.

Prabhupāda: These rascals, they do not know what is Kṛṣṇa or what is Kṛṣṇa's behavior.

Dr. Patel: And that is right. Even for them. I have no objection if you call me a Māyāvādī.

ṟ229 Prabhupāda: Yes, a Māyāvādī. I know.

Dr. Patel: I have no objection...

Prabhupāda: I know! I know certainly. I challenge you. In Karachi, there was Oṁ-sampradāya. And they were calling for young girls and your...

Morning Walk -- February 20, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, I don't...

Mr. Sar: You know, they forget that this will be sukṛtina. Bhakta should be sukṛtina first, and then bhakta. That they forget. So it happens, you see, in all the...

Prabhupāda: No, this thinking, that "I am as good as Kṛṣṇa," this Māyāvāda philosophy has done so much havoc.

Dr. Patel: The highest philosophy of all is that you must give your ego. So there is no question of "I" remaining there. Even in bhakti-yoga and in jñāna-yoga, the real jñāna-yoga. Falsehood, anything can be... Even in bhakti-mārga also there are rascals, you know, who have done all sorts of humbug things.

Yaśodānandana: They are Māyāvādīs.

Prabhupāda: They were Māyāvādīs. The bhakti-mārga... They call bhakti-mārga. They are actually Māyāvādīs.

Dr. Patel: So you can get that degeneration from anywhere.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What about the philosophy that Kṛṣṇa actually never danced with the gopīs, but Kṛṣṇa's the Supersoul and the gopīs are souls, but there is actually no dancing; that is simply allegory.

Prabhupāda: Who says that?

Morning Walk -- February 23, 1974, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You mean he actually said that?

Dr. Patel: Not actually, he's... (?)

Prabhupāda: No, that's all right.

Dr. Patel: There is no question of action. It will also act, how much we are religious, only God knows.

Prabhupāda: (japa) (break) ...there is there. Jñāne prayāsam udapāsya namanta eva sanmukharitāṁ bhavadīya.

Dr. Patel: Up to now, I think this is the best part I have run across. One of the best parts. And that, that particular līlā of Kṛṣṇa is the most thrilling one. No?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: And when Brahmā saw Kṛṣṇa with four... and Viṣṇu with four hands and all, all, even in cows and boys, the calves and everything, then it was the height of the whole philosophy. You have read it?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: He? No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. I, I...

Dr. Patel: But you must have read it in English, in those two volumes of Kṛṣṇa.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Morning Walk -- February 23, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Is there any evidence? There may...

Dr. Patel: Brahma-vid brahma eva bhavati.

Prabhupāda: That is all right. That is another thing. Just like I gave the example: if you associate with fire, you also become fire. That is another thing, brahma-vid. But here is no question of brahma-vid. Ignorance. Ignorance. Because brahma-vid, the Brahman, Supreme Brahman, says that "Those who are worshiper of demigods, they have lost their intelligence." So how he becomes...? A man who has lost his intelligence, how he can become brahma-vid? Brahma-vid is so easy thing? It is possible for a man who has lost his intelligence and he becomes brahma-vid?

Dr. Patel: Brahma-vid cannot be attained by intelligence.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Dr. Patel: You have got to go beyond intelligence, mind and everything.

Prabhupāda: Well, we are beyond intelligence, beyond all rascals. We are beyond. That is another thing. Therefore we say... (end)

Morning Walk -- March 5, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: ...no woman can... (break) So I took it very a cheap price. There was no question of woman. I kept my office there. And the address was Multani temple. It is a temple. Multani temple, Grant Road. And in my retired life my office was there, Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa temple and Delhi, Chippiwada. And my residence was Rādhā-Dāmodara temple. And before that, that Keśī Ghāṭa. Who has seen that? You have...?

Devotee: Oh yes.

Prabhupāda: That was also temple. Yes.

Indian devotee: Kṛṣṇa has arranged.

Indian devotee: Very nice side, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: I lived in that house for seven years. And then I came to Rādhā-Dāmodara temple.

Devotee: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Which way? (break) ...stayed in that Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa temple, Malliks. And still I am living in temple. So Kṛṣṇa has arranged nicely, from the beginning of my life, temple. Which way? This way? (break) Medhi, this is called medhi, this rod, center. So the, the bull is bound up with it and he goes round, goes around. All day. So gṛhamedhī means center is home, and he goes round. Throughout the whole life. They are called gṛhamedhīs.

Hṛdayānanda: This is called medhi.

Morning Walk -- March 6, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: So the Brahman realization is like that. Every living entity, he wants ānanda. Ānanda means just like we are walking together, talking together. This is ānanda. If I would have walked alone, it would have been no ānanda. I do not like. Nobody likes. So ānanda means there must be entourage. Therefore ānanda is with Kṛṣṇa. When we play with Kṛṣṇa, we dance with Kṛṣṇa, talk with Kṛṣṇa, serve Kṛṣṇa, take care of Kṛṣṇa, then there is ānanda. And simply to become one with the Brahman, then you will have to fall down again. Therefore jñāna-kāṇḍa is not perfect. And karma-kāṇḍa is, you can migrate from one body to another or one planet to another. You'll be brahmāṇḍa bhramite. You have to wander. And jñāna-kāṇḍa means you merge. That is also intolerable. Therefore unless you come to bhakti-kāṇḍa, there is no question of real life and bliss. That is the conclusion.

karma-kāṇḍa jñāna-kāṇḍa, kevala viṣera bhāṇḍa,

amṛta baliyā yebā khāya

nānā yoni sadā phire, kadarya bhakṣaṇa kare,

Kadarya. This is kadarya. So many nice food. Yes. And before this movement, in Europe and America, they were eating all these kadaryas. So many type of kadaryas. Their food is only to boil the meat. And when it is boiled, mix with little salt and black pepper and take it. Is it not?

Siddha-svarūpānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: And after eating meat, then seven hundred years old loaf. Cut it and add with little butter. That's all. And then take wine. Bās. Kadarya bhakṣaṇa kare. Now they're eating rasagullā. Am I right or wrong?

Devotees: Right.

Morning Walk -- March 6, 1974, Mayapura:

Jayapatākā: So human life was no advantage. Only because you have come, now it can be advantage.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Jayapatākā: Human life is no special advantage. Only if you come, the spiritual master comes, then it can be some advantage.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore Vedic injunction is gurum eva abhigacchet: "You must go to a bona fide spiritual master if you want to make your life perfect." There is no question whether I shall go or not. "You must!" That is the beginning of human life. Otherwise animal life. He has no spiritual master. He's not going to obey anyone. He's working in his own whims. That is animal life. Real life here begins.

tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum eva abhigacchet

samit-pāṇiḥ śrotriyaṁ brahma-niṣṭham

(MU 1.2.12)

This is the Vedic injunction. You cannot do anything without abiding the orders of spiritual master. That is surrender. How nice water it is. (break) And there are many thousands, you'll find. And we are thinking, "Oh, if I go away, who will feed my son? Who will feed my daughter?" He'll never think that "If so many animals are fed by the Supreme," eko yo bahūnāṁ vidadhāti kāmān, "He's supplying all the necessity why not for me or for my other children?" It is māyā that one thinks that "Without me...," Just like Gandhi was thinking. Unless he was killed... He was always thinking, "Without me, India will be spoiled." India will be spoiled. It was spoiled. Therefore you wanted sva-rājya... And after his death, it is also spoiled. So India's karma will have to suffer, either Gandhi's there or not there. Prakṛteḥ kriya... Prakṛteḥ: Everything is being done by the material nature. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ, by, dictated by different modes of nature. Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate: (BG 3.27) The rascal, being bewildered by, he's thinking, "Without me, everything will be spoiled. I am the director. I am the director!" So I requested Gandhi, "Now you come out of this turmoil, politics. Just preach Bhagavad-gītā." No. He'll be killed. That's all. This is the way. Going on. Even a Gandhi commits mistake, what to speak of others. What is the effect of this sva-rājya. The effect of sva-rājya is that people are starving. That's all. At least, British government would not allow like this. That's a fact.

Morning Walk -- March 7, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Everyone will understand. Hare Kṛṣṇa. That is proved. We are going to Africa. We are going to Canada, Europe, America. Everyone chants Hare Kṛṣṇa. That is the language. When a young man and young woman loves one another, there is no question of language. My Guru Mahārāja used to say that "Suppose you are in a foreign country. You do not know the language. But when there is fire, you get friends without any language." You see? In the beginning of British rule, there were not very many English-knowing Indians so a clerk in his office was working. So monkey came and he scattered the office papers. So after the monkey was driven away, he was collecting the papers. In the meantime, his English boss came. "What is this, man?" So he could not say. He began to jump. You see. "Monkey, sir. Monkey, sir. (laughter) Monkey, sir." "All right. All right. That's all right." Simply to inform, without any language, you can jump, "Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa." And he will understand. Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa... (Bengali)

Guest: (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: (break) (Bengali) Hare Kṛṣṇa and dance. Do this. (break) ...and for constructing four buildings like that. (break) Kṛṣṇa took part in politics. So what is His politics? What is His sociology? What is His culture?

Guest: Support the right minority?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Morning Walk -- March 7, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: There is no question of minority. Support the right person. Kṛṣṇa supported Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira in place of Duryodhana. So formerly it was monarchy. That is perfect politics. This democracy is useless. It has proved. One man, the king, he should be properly educated how to rule, what is the aim of ruling, how the people will be, I mean to say, culturally elevated, what is that culture. (break) There was a consulting board of learned brāhmaṇas and saintly persons. They would advise the monarch how to rule.

Jayapatākā: This is... This is the land here.

Prabhupāda: This is the land?

Jayapatākā: Yeah, we're walking over it. We're going through... (break)

Śyāmasundara: Elizabeth, in England, she's got a..., what she calls a "think-tank" or a board of advisors who meet and advise her on different policies.

Prabhupāda: Privy council.

Śyāmasundara: Something like that. It's called a "think-tank". She's named it. It's presided over by Lord, Lord Goodman.

Prabhupāda: No, no. The thing is, unless the people are Kṛṣṇa conscious, either this board or that board, that will not help. First of all, people should know what is the aim of life, what is culture, how the human activity should be directed. The people should know first of all this. Otherwise, changing from frying pan to the fire, it is useless. That is going on. That change, revolution, is going on. Just like the Russian people, they changed the Czarist government into communist government, revolution, but still, they're unhappy. They're trying to change by another revolution. This is going on. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). This is described in the śāstra as "chewing the chewed." Or the same simple philosophy: "This side of stool is better than that side."

Morning Walk -- March 9, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda:

māṁ ca yo 'vyabhicāreṇa

bhakti-yogena sevate

sa guṇān samatītyaitān

brahma-bhūyāya kalpate

(BG 14.26)

"Anyone who has joined devotional service, avyabhicāreṇa, without any reservation, he is already liberated." There is no question of liberation for him, brahma-bhūyāya kalpate. He's already in the Brahman platform. This is bhakti. For a bhaktin, there is no question of liberation. He's already liberated. A millionaire is already rich. He doesn't require to become rich. It is automatically. (break)

Guest (3): (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: It is just to give His personal example that a sannyāsī should not be very much intimately mixing with rich men. That is by His personal example. He was a sannyāsī. He refused to see a king because a king is supposed to be always busy in material affairs. So if... For the general people aspiring to go back to home, back to Godhead, for them, to mix with the materialistic persons is forbidden. Viṣayiṇāṁ sandarśanam atha yoṣitāṁ ca (CC Madhya 11.8). Those who are viṣayī, simply engaged in sense gratification, and yoṣitām... Yoṣitām means women or enjoyable things.

Guest (1): Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hmmm.

Guest (1): Many religious institutions, they welcome the rich peoples. Those who are coming by cars, and those who are coming gorgeously, and they are donating much to the institutions, they are welcomed by the people, management of these institutions. And this is your version. It is just contradictory. I accept your version. It is quite, quite right. And I hope our institution must do not like that. This ISKCON must not do like that. The well-to-do peoples who come, they'll get more... (break) ...more receptions, more congratulations. I request it must be your direction that our institution ISKCON must not do like this. And it is your... (laughter)

Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:

Hṛdayānanda: First they should be taught a skill.

Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all, the whole society must be divided into four varṇas. Otherwise, there will be chaotic condition. That is what is the position now. What is he, what he has to do, one does not know. And there are so many unemployment. But if you organize the society into varṇas, there will be no question of unemployment.

Hṛdayānanda: But from the very beginning there should be taught Bhagavad-gītā and...

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Hṛdayānanda: From the very beginning we should teach Bhagavad-gītā?

Prabhupāda: Yes. But our, our position is that we are above varṇāśrama. But for management or ideal society, we are introducing this. We, so far we are concerned, Kṛṣṇa conscious men, we are above varṇāśrama. But to show the people that we are not escaping, we can take part in any order of life. That is our position. Just like if I brush somebody's shoes, that does not mean I am shoemaker. My position is the same. But to show how to do it... Just like a servant is doing. The master is, "Oh, you cannot do. Just see." Just like I show you sometimes how to mop. So I am not a mopper, but I am showing how to mop. So our position is like that. We do not belong to any varṇa and āśrama. But we have to show these rascals. Just like Dhruva Mahārāja. He, he was perfect Vaiṣṇava, but when he was king, he was fighting like anything. Not that, "Oh, I am now become Vaiṣṇava. I cannot kill." What is this? He killed like anything. When the Yakṣas attacked his kingdom, he was killing like anything then the Yakṣa-rāja came and asked him to pardon this. He immediately accepted. So he wanted to give him some benediction, that "You are so great that simply on my request, you have stopped killing these rascals, Yakṣas. So you can take some benediction from me." He said, "That's all right. Thank you. You give me the benediction that I may be a pure lover of Kṛṣṇa. That's all." This benediction he asked. Although he was so powerful and, the Yakṣa-rāja, he could give him the wealth of the whole universe. But he made that, "Thank you very much. You give me this benediction that I may remain a pure devotee of Kṛṣṇa." This is Vaiṣṇava. He is doing everything, but his aim is to please Kṛṣṇa. Similarly, even if we take to varṇāśrama, we do not belong to any... Just like Kṛṣṇa says, mayā sṛṣṭam. "I have inaugurated." But Kṛṣṇa has nothing to do with varṇāśrama. Similarly, if we act as varṇāśrama, still, we have nothing to do with the varṇāśrama.

Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You should remain always sannyāsī within. Outwardly, for others' convenience, you may do something. Similarly, we are accepting this varṇāśrama. We are not varṇāśrama; we are above varṇāśrama. But to give others facility to come to the stage of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, this program must be done.

Hṛdayānanda: Prabhupāda, generally in colleges in the West, they charge some fee for going to the college. What is our position?

Prabhupāda: No, we don't charge any fee. There is no question of money. Because the brāhmaṇas, they'll teach free. They require money because they have to give fat salary to these rascals. But we haven't got to. And even we have to feed them, we produce our own grain. So where is the question of taking money? So therefore it is required, somebody must produce food. Then there is no necessity of money.

Hṛdayānanda: The vaiśya students will produce the food.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Satsvarūpa: Should our children who are at gurukula, when they grow up, should they go to that varṇāśrama college, or...?

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. They should go.

Hṛdayānanda: We'll start it right away.

Prabhupāda: Varṇāśrama college means for grown-up students. College means for grown-up students.

Hṛdayānanda: Is there a minimum age for beginning such a college?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Ten to twelve years.

Morning Walk -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So similarly, if the government cannot utilize, it comes to us. We shall work. Is it not good?

Gupta: Very good.

Prabhupāda: There must be some law like that. The government has taken from the public because it is not being worked out. Now we shall work. Give us this land. (Hindi) "You have taken from the public. Why should you not give us?" So that there will be no question, even government does not, we shall go and occupy, occupy, and go on tilling. What the government will...? Public will support us.

Gupta: Again it is being distributed to their relations, those who are in the power, and then they do not work again.

Prabhupāda: Again

Gupta: Then it remains...

Prabhupāda: Then whatever field is not being worked, we occupy them, and begin to work. And invite all the unemployed, "Come and join us. We shall give you food, shelter, everything." (break) ...how Kṛṣṇa is setting example. Kṛṣṇa is saying that "I have already arranged the result of this fighting. Everyone will be killed." Nimitta-mātraṁ bhava savyasācin. But still, He is inducing Arjuna to work. Not that He's already (indistinct), "I am your friend, Kṛṣṇa. Everything will be done." "It will be done, but you have to work."

Gupta: Maybe a friend or not.

Morning Walk -- March 16, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Coffee, tea, and so many other things.

Devotee: Oh, toast. Toast.

Prabhupāda: Toast. And they will, the (indistinct) will be stopped. As soon as the belly is loaded... But they are accustomed. After eating they are (indistinct) not easily. (break) ...for sevait say (?) is for the Kanpur wala. (break) ...then there is no question of fighting, otherwise we shall take criminal and civil (indistinct—break) ...seven hundred.

Gurudāsa: Seven hundred. (break)

Devotee: ...renovate these rooms, or just in general?

Prabhupāda: Huh? General.

Devotee: General.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That veranda, that, whatever he likes we shall, we will spend. We'll pay the bills (indistinct).

Devotee: Yes. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...to give us the temple portion free, and purchase the land for balance. (break) ...negotiate, but we have no sufficient men to manage. (break) ...unless you can utilize.

Gurudāsa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That is (indistinct) fifty lakhs, twenty-five, that is beyond us. We can spare up to two lakhs, that's all. (break) ... be able to manage. (break) ...people.

Morning Walk -- March 17, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: ...that they're planning the same plan as they did. This is the preliminary sign.

Gupta: Swami Mahārāja, our program should enter the streets in the houses of different people and saṅkīrtana should be start from there, and...

Prabhupāda: So do it! So don't speak. Now organize. Now there is no question of speaking. Practical. Everyone should take a leading part, and the saṅkīrtana nuisance should be started from Bombay. So Balavanta Prabhu, you are taking?

Balavanta: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes (break) ...assistants selected, so many sannyāsīs, and do it. You take the leaders.

Balavanta: Yes. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...idea.

Balavanta: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That is intelligence. (break) And we shall pollute the whole world with this nuisance.

Devotees: Jaya. Haribol. (breaks)

Prabhupāda: ...become an exemplary gosvāmī to give fight to the gosvāmīs here. You are, how many years you are in Vṛndāvana? Huh? How many years you are here?

Guru dāsa: Two and half years.

Room Conversation -- March 20, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: This will be propaganda and to invite people to come and let them give in writing that "Here the Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa temple must be there." Take thousand, millions of signatures. So prove that it is not nonsense. It is the most essential thing. This way. And so far traffic is concerned, now, there is big road. So make two gates, in and out, this side, so there is no question of traffic convenience. In this way, do presentation. That is my suggestion. And this letter will not be very much effective.

Guest: ...jī? May I submit a matter?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest: This about propaganda and collecting the signatures in the lakhs will not only take a lot of energy of the devotees, but it will take more time also. It is, in the city of Bombay, it is not practicable. Because people are very busy, and around the clock everybody is counting every second which he spends and more so, it's difficult for people to devote time towards a sat-saṅga or to sign the letter that they had no objection and on the contrary, the action of the police commissioner is condemnable, undesirable. That will take a lot of time. And I think by writing them a letter, by of our reconsidering, we lose nothing.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Guest: By writing them a petition.

Prabhupāda: But if... It has no effect.

Morning Walk -- March 23, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: And therefore I am pointing out your defects.

Dr. Patel: That's all right. I am prepared to correct it.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: But you, you keep mum. If I don't excite, you don't speak. So which way I shall excite you? (laughter throughout)

Prabhupāda: No. There is no question of excitement. When you put a question, I shall answer it from the śāstras. Just like it is, it is any child can understand. If I ask a child, "What is this?" "Hand." "What is this?" "Head." "What is this?" "Leg." Does he say, "Body"? So you are speaking less than a child. (laughter)

Dr. Patel: Hm. That is what I am. That is what I am. That is what I am.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Any child, if you ask him, "My dear child, what is this?" He'll say, "It is hand." "What is this?" "It is head." "What is this?" "Leg." Does he say, "All body"? You are speaking like that.

Dr. Patel: Like... How shall I speak? Shall I beat your body?

Prabhupāda: No, no. (laughter) Don't speak.

Dr. Patel: Where is the right way?

Prabhupāda: No, no. Any gentleman says... It is right? If I ask a child, "What is this?" What he'll say? "It is hand." Will he say, "It is head"? Then? You are speaking like less than a child.

Dr. Patel: That is what I am.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Now, Mr. Sar!

Morning Walk -- March 25, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Why it is? That is my question. (break)

Guest (1): God is the knower everywhere.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Guest (1): He's there every time. Bhūtvā bhāvyo bhavat prabhuḥ (?). God was in the past, present. He's ev... He is in the past, as well as present, in the future. There is no question of...

Prabhupāda: No, no. I was also. I am also nitya.

Guest (1): No, we are not nitya.

Prabhupāda: God is nityo nityānām.

Guest (1): I mean... Nityānām. But we are jīva. As long as I am jīva. I don't...

Prabhupāda: Ah, then dvaita-vāda. Then dvaita-vāda.

Guest (1): Dvaita-vāda has to come. As long as you're in the body, you are dvaita. You cannot say when you are in the body that you are the God.

Prabhupāda: No, no. We are always dvaita.

Guest (1): As long as you are in the body, if you have got the body consciousness, then you're always in dvaita.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Body, body, body is...

Guest (1): No, what I mean, Swamiji...

Morning Walk -- March 25, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, that is not bhakti.

Dr. Patel: When you are not thinking, the, the thought automatically comes.

Prabhupāda: No, that is not bhakti. You cannot think of that "God may do like this." No.

Dr. Patel: No, no. God does like that. Why He do?

Prabhupāda: No, you say that "You order Kṛṣṇa what you think."

Dr. Patel: I don't say you order. You... Automatically He fulfills your desire. There is no question of your ordering.

Prabhupāda: Therefore we should be desireless.

Dr. Patel: Desireless, yes. But desireless...

Prabhupāda: Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam (Brs. 1.1.11). That is bhakti. Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam. Anyābhilāṣitā means "As God desires, let it happen." Not according to my desire. That is bhakti. As soon as you impose your desire, that is not bhakti. Why should you impose your desire? God is ready to fulfill the desire of His devotee immediately. He's so ready. But a devotee never desires. He does not like to bring God to fulfill His desires. No, that is not a pure devotee.

Guest (1): But he has surrendered and he feels that "God gives me what we require."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: (Gujarati) But now the, now the sun is rising earlier and earlier. That is why. (break)

Morning Walk -- March 26, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: We are mūḍha, and they are big mūḍhas. That's all.

Dr. Patel: That's right. (break) (Indians talk in background) (break)

Prabhupāda: There is no revolution because that is one. Everyone is in agreement with God. That is spiritual world. Therefore there is no question of revolution.

Dr. Patel: If everyone was in agreement with God, there would not have been all sorts of quarrel and Māra-mārī and this... (break)

Prabhupāda: Everyone is not. That is the defect. Everyone is not in agreement.

Guest (1): Actually, they divided into camp... (break)

Prabhupāda: They do not know how these things coming, and how to amend it, how to reform. (break) ...countries, they are not happy.

Dr. Patel: They are not happy because the communism is not in the right. Communism is Cārvāka philo... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...others, they're also in the same background.

Dr. Patel: No, certain basic amenities are necessary. That is, has been provided in the Hindu religion. What we have to... (break) We have to remind them to follow your philosophy and that is... (break)

Prabhupāda: So you first of all follow. You first of all follow. Then you teach them.

Morning Walk -- March 27, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Fruitive activities. They do not accept this: ā-brahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ punar āvartino 'rjuna (BG 8.16). They'll not. "No, no. We shall go to..." Just like these rascals are going to the Candraloka. Candraloka. (laughter) Now other rascals supporting them: "Oh, now we are..." (laughter)

Dr. Patel: The Americans rascals are going there.

Prabhupāda: No, many other rascals are going also. And Indian rascals are supporting that, "Oh, now science is so advanced. Now there is no question of this Bhagavad-gītā. Now we have to go to the moon planet."

Dr. Patel: That, that... I told you that story? Those astronauts who have gone on... (break) I have read it.

Prabhupāda: The astronautics...

Chandobhai: It is so said like that. The astronauts, they were all talking of philosophy only and nothing else, after coming from Moon.

Prabhupāda: The astronautics... That Russian... Even Nehru went to receive. Just see, such a rascal minister we have. An astronaut is to be received. (break)

Dr. Patel: All astronauts...

Prabhupāda: ...he was received by Nehru? Eh?

Dr. Patel: Might have. All astronauts, they have got no sex desire. All of them. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...still asiddha... So do you mean to say by avoiding sex life one becomes siddha?

Morning Walk -- March 31, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: All your actions and their effects, which are collecting on you... (break)

Guest (5): ...knows the procreating from the first word or some people would exercise their so-called free will and choosing sin, and still He creates them. If He were not to...

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. There is no question of choosing. As soon as you associate some infections disease, it is not the question of disease. You must be diseased. This is the law of nature. If you infect the smallpox disease, then you must be suffering from smallpox. That is law of nature. Not that your father has created small pox disease for you. Try to understand like this. You infect yourself. (break) ...giving him chance.

Dr. Patel: But you, as a jīva, is so much engrossed in the māyā, in the tree, in the fruits of it, that you don't heed...

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Dr. Patel: ...what (Hindi?) says.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. That is the... That is the disease. Now, Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ... (BG 18.66). Who is caring for Him?

Dr. Patel: So you stop this looking down and look up.

Prabhupāda: Who is caring for Him? That is independence. Now you suffer.

Dr. Patel: And once you look up and when you realize that this is all...

Prabhupāda: Then you become...

Morning Walk -- April 1, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Eh? Yes. Tapo divyaṁ putrakāḥ (SB 5.5.1).

Dr. Patel: Eighty-one sons. Eighty-one sons.

Prabhupāda: Jaya. It is... Human life is meant for tapasya, but where is tapasya? They are simply teaching, "Yes, here is contraceptive method. Take." No,... Wine shop...

Dr. Patel: They give it free of charge in the...

Prabhupāda: Yes. So there is no question of tapasya now. Therefore the whole population is pigs, hogs and dogs. How you can expect peace and prosperity in this society? That is not possible. It is a society of pigs and hogs. Śva-viḍ... Śva-viḍ-varāha uṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ. If somebody says, "If the..., it is a society of pigs and hogs, then what about these leaders?"

Dr. Patel: They are bigger hogs and pigs.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That's all. That is stated: śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ (SB 2.3.19). He's also a big paśuḥ. That's all. Otherwise how he can dare to see that "Bhajan is nuisance"? Because it is paśuḥ. He's not even a human being. Otherwise how he dares say like that? (break) ...reply that dacoit. If I reply, then I have to call him, "You are a paśuḥ."

Dr. Patel: And he told me...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: ...Girirāja, that he wants to reply separately.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...why...

Morning Walk -- April 5, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: Sañjaya uvāca... (break)

Girirāja: "Sañjaya said to Dhṛtarāṣṭra: O King, after hearing these words from the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Arjuna trembled, fearfully offered obeisances with folded hands and began, falteringly, to speak as follows."

Prabhupāda: So without seeing viśva-rūpa, simply by abiding by the orders of Kṛṣṇa, if we act, then there is no question of trembling.

Dr. Patel: So we must not try to see the viśva-rūpa, to tremble.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel:

arjuna uvāca

sthāne hṛṣīkeśa tava prakīrtyā

jagat prahṛṣyaty anurajyate ca

rakṣāṁsi bhītāni diśo dravanti

sarve namasyanti ca siddha-saṅghāḥ

(break)

Girirāja: "O Hṛṣīkeśa, the world becomes joyful upon hearing Your name, and thus everyone becomes attached to You. Although the perfected beings offer You their respectful homage, the demons are afraid, and they flee here and there. All this is rightly done." (break)

Prabhupāda: Siddha, there is a Siddha-loka. So they can fly from one planet to another without any machine, siddha-saṅgāḥ. Means the aṣṭa-siddhi yogas, they have got naturally.

Morning Walk -- April 8, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So the only expense... (break) ...intention of Kṛṣṇa.

Girirāja: Kṛṣṇa and yog...

Prabhupāda: (break) ...he says, this mantra, nāyam ātmā bala-hīnā na labhya, he says, "Unless you very, become very stout and strong, there is no question of advancement in spiritual life. Therefore we should first of all eat meat and become very strong, and then we'll be spiritual realized."

Yaśomatīnandana: Who says that?

Prabhupāda: Vivekananda. (break) ...physical strength. (break)

Yaśomatīnandana: ...Dvārakā.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa was transferred to Vṛndāvana. Not other (indistinct).

Yaśomatīnandana: Kṛṣṇa had other brothers and sisters besides Balarāma and Subhadrā?

Prabhupāda: We hear only two. (break)

Devotee: Once I asked you that question in 1968, and you answered that Subhadrā sat on Kṛṣṇa's lap and smiled. That was her activity.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...maybe. Go on reading. (break) ...asac chāstram pracchanaṁ bauddham ucyate. The Māyāvāda is a very dangerous philosophy. It has made the whole world atheistic. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. Māyāvādam asac-chāstraṁ pracchanaṁ bauddham ucyate. They cannot understand that this is a dangerous philosophy.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...even the richest man, their wife has no bangles. You see? And they are jewelries. Jewelries. Cow, butter, throwing butter like anything, and silk sari and enough food grains. What is more want for material advancement? That is real material ad... You have got everything, material needs. (break) If a man can feed his wife and children, then he is successful. There is no question of charity. There is no question of charity. But here it is said they were also giving in charity. (break) ...stopped to become real brāhmaṇa and give instruction to the society, and they also stopped giving charity to the brāhmaṇas. So therefore the society is so fallen. There is no instruction from the brāhmaṇas and no charity from the kṣatriya and vaiśya. (break) ...proṣita bhārtṛkā. By the dress a woman is recognized. When she does not dress very nicely, it is to be understood that her husband is out of home. When there is the vermillion, that means she is married. When the, what is called, division? Siti. Siti is in this side, then she is prostitute. The dress, when the woman dresses with white dress, they are widow, no husband. Yes, in this way by dress...

Indian man: Yes. You can recognize here. But now they are changed completely.

Prabhupāda: Yes. When the girl has no this covering, that means she is virgin. She is not married. In this way all the signs are there. This is prosita bhartrka. Prosita-bhartrka means one whose husband is not at home, outside. Then she will not dress, she will not take regular bath, so that people may know that her husband is not at home.

Śrīdhara: She won't take bath?

Morning Walk -- April 11, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Why they should interpret? Interpretation is required when there is no understanding. If the matter is clearly understood, why interpretation? This is rascaldom. Everyone understands this is called glass. And what is the use of interpretation? Here is a glass. Everyone can understand. Or spectacle. No, no. This is meaning this. Why? If the thing is clearly understood, there is no question of interpretation. You cannot give. Suppose if you go to the court, if the thing is clearly understood that "This man has committed this criminal activity, he should be punished," so where is the difficulty? No. If somebody... "No no. This 'He should be punished' means not now, after three hundred years he should be punished." Is that interpretation? He should be punished immediately. That's all.

Indian Man (1): It's not like that. The material thing we can see from our...

Prabhupāda: You are material, not spiritual. You are a material fool. Why do you interpret foolishly?

Indian Man (1): There's no doubt about it.

Indian Man (2): According to their brain and knowledge, they must have...

Prabhupāda: That means rubbish brain, rubbish brain. You go, interpret and change the law. You go in the law court and you interpret in your own way. Can you interpret in the law court? "Sir, I have got a different interpretation." "Get out. Get out, rascal, from this..."

Indian Man (1): No, no. Even the judges in the Supreme Court in India, they go after the interpretations, they go and they become also one with the...

Morning Walk -- April 11, 1974, Bombay:

Indian Man (1): No, no. Even the judges in the Supreme Court in India, they go after the interpretations, they go and they become also one with the...

Prabhupāda: No, no. That is extraordinarily. When the meaning of the law is not very clear, that takes place. But when the thing is very clear, there is no question of interpretation.

Indian Man (1): Why there is a fight? Because both the things, both the lawyers, they take it in different way and so they come to the judge.

Prabhupāda: That's right. But it is not different in such a way that you call a spectacle a something else.

Indian Man (4): Bhagavad-gītā is really...

Prabhupāda: Yes, but it said in the Bhagavad-gītā clearly, it is said clearly, imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān: "I told this philosophy to Vivasvān." Where is the difficulty to understand? Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre samavetā yuyutsavaḥ: (BG 1.1) "In the dharma-kṣetre, kuru-kṣetre, two parties willing to fight, they assembled." Where is the difficulty to understand? Why these rascals should interpret in a different way?

Indian Man (1): These are all... They are not interpreting that particular word.

Prabhupāda: They are doing.

Morning Walk -- April 19, 1974, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Mahāṁsa: And then develop.

Prabhupāda: Building is not very important. Work is important. Activity is important. I started my movement not with buildings, but real activity. So building is opulence. You can do without opulence. You can start anything, even underneath a tree. There is no difficulty. (break) They will allow our men?

Mahāṁsa: I went. They did not ask any questions.

Prabhupāda: No, there is no question of asking, but is there any hint from their side?

Mahāṁsa: I have not heard that they, Tirumali, they refuse foreigners.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that's all right. (break) So far reporters, they agree that others have no right to comment on this. (end)

Morning Walk -- April 20, 1974, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Is that all right?

Satsvarūpa: Eternally liberated and eternally conditioned.

Prabhupāda: Eternally liberated, they never forget Kṛṣṇa. There is no period throughout the existence... There is no question of existence. It is their all existence. Never touched by māyā, forgetfulness. That is nitya-mukta. (break)

Pañcadraviḍa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, you were talking that a person, he can come up to that position of nitya-mukta by either following the principles of sādhana-bhakti or causeless mercy, or you said there was also the question of kṛpā, the kṛpā-siddhi, that one can attain perfection...

Prabhupāda: No, that is sādhana-bhakti.

Pañcadraviḍa: One gets mercy by sādhana-bhakti.

Prabhupāda: Yes. In the stage of sādhana-bhakti... Sadhana-bhakti is for the conditioned soul. And siddha. Siddha means they are already mature. Siddha means nitya-siddha.

Pañcadraviḍa: (break) Also, Prabhupāda you said that if one does not worship Pañca-tattva, whatever actions he performs, even if he is so-called Kṛṣṇa-bhakta, is to be considered offensive.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- April 22, 1974, Hyderabad:

Satsvarūpa: The other important point is that we love God not for getting some reward. You say that the other important thing is that this person claims to be pious, but he approaches God for material reward.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is business. That is not love. I go to somebody and flatter him to get something. Just like a shopkeeper does also like that. He flatters the customers in so many ways to sell goods so that he can make some profit. So there is no question of love.

Akṣayānanda: But that "I am following Jesus Christ and I am a vegetarian," so that's all right, isn't it?

Prabhupāda: I am following Jesus Christ?

Akṣayānanda: That "I am a vegetarian. I do not eat meat. I don't kill. I do not kill."

Prabhupāda: Oh, therefore I am a better Christian, better than you. Love... Therefore the Bhāgavata is perfect. Bhāgavata says that... Bhagavad-gītā says... Kṛṣṇa says that patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). So we are obeying Kṛṣṇa. We offer patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ. And we eat the remains of the foodstuff. Therefore we love. That is the proof. But you are not loving Jesus Christ because you are disobeying the order.

Pañcadraviḍa: How disobeying if the person says, "I am vegetarian. I do not kill. I am a Christian, but I am vegetarian, I do not kill animals?"

Prabhupāda: Then you are all right. But they... Who put forward the argument that "You are also killing vegetable?" Then how can kill vegetable?

Nitai: In Bhagavad-gītā Kṛṣṇa... Just as you quoted.

Morning Walk Excerpts -- May 2, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. (laughing)

Girirāja: Another thing we were discussing yesterday is that in Goloka there are no demons.

Prabhupāda: No. There cannot be any demons. Then how it is Vaikuṇṭha? Vaikuṇṭha means without any anxiety. So the situation of anxiety is created by the demons. Therefore, when Kṛṣṇa wants to fight, He has to come down here because there is no question of fighting. There is no chance of fighting. Everyone is devotee. A devotee will never agree. But they will agree Kṛṣṇa's fight, but here, in this field.

Girirāja: But the sentiment of anxiety or fear for Kṛṣṇa, is that sentiment in Goloka?

Prabhupāda: No. There is no such thing. That is separation. Just like gopīs, they are full of anxiety: "Oh, Kṛṣṇa has gone to the pasturing ground." Their anxiety is there. Just like Rukmiṇī, she was thinking, "Oh, Kṛṣṇa may not give me up. He is talking in this way." She fainted. So anxiety is there. So the anxiety is that one may not be separated from Kṛṣṇa. That is the anxiety. And actually there is no separation, but the feeling of separation out of ecstatic love. Just like one who has got love for the other person, beloved, he always thinks like that, "My beloved may not be separated from me." This is ecstasy of love. Just like a miser man who has got much wealth, he always thinks, "My money may not be lost. My money may not be lost." Out of his too much attachment for the money, he thinks like that. Is it not? "How shall I protect this money? How shall I protect this?" To earn money is also troublesome. To keep money also troublesome. And when it is lost, that is also troublesome. This is the position. But there is no such thing, loss, but the anxiety is there. We shall return from here? (break) ...vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām. So both the sādhu and the duṣkṛtina, by Kṛṣṇa's two activities, act differently to the devotees and to the demons. They realize. That is their achievement. By punishment, this Kāliya realized, "Oh, Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Lord." And devotees, by out of love, they realize. Therefore Kṛṣṇa is Absolute. In either process He is realized. Mama vartmānuvartante manuṣyāḥ pārtha sarvaśaḥ. If one is sincere, then they gradually make progress. Yes. (break) ...vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām.

Morning Walk -- May 9, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, no, there are many scientists like..., but generally they think in their way. Just like modern scientists, they are trying to prove: from chemicals, life.

Indian Man (2): Jagadish Candra Bose, he was a great scientist. (Hindi) He can answer how many wise (?) He can answer.

Dr. Patel: There is no question of... He cannot make even a grain of sand. Scientists, if they say that they are making, that is wrong. They are finding out what is already admitted.

Prabhupāda: No. Some of them say, "Now there is no need of God. Science is everything." Even Dr. Radhakrishnan was saying in a meeting.

Dr. Patel: No, what is science?

Prabhupāda: Science means...

Dr. Patel: Science means knowledge. And knowledge is there. Knowledge means God.

Prabhupāda: Practical...

Dr. Patel: But we are trying to honor the knowledge which we have not now known...

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: Purport.

Nitāi: This verse is a reply to Arjuna's third question: What is the means of attaining to the transcendental position? As explained before, the material world is acting under the spell of the modes of material nature. One should not be disturbed by the activities of the modes of nature; instead of putting his consciousness into such activities, he may transfer his consciousness to Kṛṣṇa activities. Kṛṣṇa activities are known as bhakti-yoga—always acting for Kṛṣṇa. This includes not only Kṛṣṇa, but His different plenary expansions such as Rāma and Nārāyaṇa. He has innumerable expansions. One who is engaged in the service of any of the forms of Kṛṣṇa, or of His plenary expansions, is considered to be transcendentally situated. One should also note that all the forms of Kṛṣṇa are fully transcendental, blissful, full of knowledge and eternal. Such personalities of Godhead are omnipotent and omniscient, and they possess all transcendental qualities. So, if one engages himself in the service of Kṛṣṇa or His plenary expansions with unfailing determination, although these modes of material nature are very difficult to overcome, he can overcome them easily. This is already explained in the Seventh Chapter. One who surrenders unto Kṛṣṇa at once surmounts the influence of the modes of material nature. To be in Kṛṣṇa consciousness or in devotional service means to acquire the equality of Kṛṣṇa. The Lord says that His nature is eternal, blissful and full of knowledge, and the living entities are part and parcel of the Supreme, as gold particles are part of a gold mine. Thus the living entity's spiritual position is as good as gold, as good as Kṛṣṇa in quality. The difference of individuality continues, otherwise there is no question of bhakti-yoga. Bhakti-yoga means that the Lord is there, the devotee is there and the activity of exchange of love between the Lord and the devotee is there. Therefore the individuality of two persons is present in the Supreme Personality of Godhead and the individual person, otherwise there is no meaning to bhakti-yoga. If one is not situated in the same transcendental position with the Lord, one cannot serve the Supreme Lord. To be a personal assistant to a king, one must acquire the qualifications. Thus the qualification is to become Brahman, or freed from all material contamination. It is said in the Vedic literature: brahmaiva san brahmāpyeti. One can attain the Supreme Brahman by becoming Brahman. This means that one must qualitatively become one with Brahman. By attainment of Brahman, one does not lose his eternal Brahman identity as individual soul.

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: Absolute has no internal or external. That is Absolute. If there is internal and external, it is not Absolute.

O'Grady: I don't mean in time, and I don't mean in space. I mean in time in the sense that one is born and one dies, etc., that is, in one's own time, one's own Absolute, ultimately the Absolute that one finds for oneself.

Prabhupāda: No, we are not absolute. We, when we are situated in the absolute platform, then we are absolute. Now we are in the relative world. Here there is absolutism, but the sense is not so elevated to understand the absolutism. So so long we are under the control of time, there is no question of becoming absolute.

O'Grady: So therefore there is a life beyond time.

Prabhupāda: That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā.

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: No.

O'Grady: And then he comes to me and asks me and says, "You went to school and you read big books. Tell me who told God." And so I have no answer.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the difference between God and me.

O'Grady: That's the difference between being seventy and thirty-nine.

Prabhupāda: No. There is no question of... That is explained in the..., that Bhāgavata, Brahma-sūtra, who is God, first of all. Who is God?

O'Grady: Who told God?

Prabhupāda: No, no. First of all, "Who is God?" Then we shall ask, "Who told God?" (chuckles) That God... That is the Vedānta-sūtra, athāto brahma jijñāsā: "Now we should enquire about God, what is God, who is God." Unless you know who is God, how can you raise the question, "Who instructed God?" If you do not know God, then the question does not arise, "Who instructed God?" Is it not? Yes. So therefore God is explained in the Brahma-sūtra, janmādy asya yataḥ: (SB 1.1.1) "God is He from everything comes, emanates." That is God. That God is explained in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, janmādy asya yataḥ: (SB 1.1.1) "The Supreme Being from whom everything emanates." Now, what is that Supreme Being? What is the nature of the Supreme Being? It is a dead stone or a living being? That is also explained. Janmādy asya yataḥ anvayād itarataś ca artheṣu abhijñaḥ sva-rāṭ (SB 1.1.1). "That God is fully cognizant of everything, directly and indirectly." Unless He is fully cognizant of everything, directly and indirectly, He is not God. So then the same question comes, as you said, that "Who taught God?"

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: Ah... Because we are part and parcel... Just like son born of a particular father, he has got the symptoms, so because there is loving propensity in God and we being part and parcel of God, therefore we have got this loving propensity. This is the conclusion. Unless the loving propensity is there in God, where we get it?

O'Grady: Maybe it's generated in you by the need...

Prabhupāda: No, there is no question of "maybe." It must be, must be.

O'Grady: Oh, very... Yes, I accept the strong word.

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is no question of... Because we have defined God, janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). God is He wherefrom everything emanates. That is God. So love, love or even fight. The fighting propensity is also there in God. And loving propensity is also there in God. But His fighting propensity and loving propensity—absolute. Just like in the material world we have got experience, fighting propensity is just opposite the loving propensity. But in God, either fighting propensity or loving propensity, they are one and the same, therefore He is absolute. That is the meaning of absolute. Just like we get from śāstras. The so-called enemies of God who is killed by God, he also attains perfection.

O'Grady: Yes, the vengeful... Yes, that I understand, the avenging God of Biblical imagination as against... Is it possible to do it all on your own, alone?

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

O'Grady: A friend, for example, yes.

Atreya Ṛṣi: A real friend.

O'Grady: Well, if one says he's a friend, that's how he feels. A friend is a friend. There's no question of...

Atreya Ṛṣi: True well-wisher.

O'Grady: There's no question of being half-real friend or unreal friend. A friend is a friend.

Prabhupāda: Yes, the best friend is the spiritual master because he saves from the blazing fire of confusion. That is best friend.

O'Grady: The problem is to find this friend. The problem is to find this spiritual master.

Prabhupāda: No, there is no problem. The problem is if you are sincere. Yes. That is stated. Because actually you have got problems, but God is within your heart. Īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe arjuna tiṣṭhati (BG 18.61). God is not far away. God is within your heart. So if you are sincere, then God will give you spiritual master. If He knows that now you are sincere, then He will give you a spiritual master.

O'Grady: O.K. Thank you. That I know.

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

Atreya Ṛṣi: Yes. But when you give the results of that for God, that's the perfection of your work.

O'Grady: I know that. I'm aware about that. And when you come in from working on the land and you are eating your dinner, you must do it with the same involvement as you worked the land with, if that is your purpose of...

Yogeśvara: You could say, with the same consciousness.

O'Grady: Yes, with the same consciousness, with the same dedication, with the same devotion, absolutely. And when there's supposed to be singing, the same way, enjoying yourself the same way, and when you're relaxing, you've got to do it with the same devotion, absolutely. No question about it. Otherwise you're being irresponsible. We should go. Thank you very much.

Prabhupāda: Thank you very much for your coming.

O'Grady: We'll see you on Tuesday, hopefully. (guests leave) (end)

Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: No. Our recommendation is that whatever position you are, you can chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. So even the workers in the factory, they can chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. What is the difficulty? Even in factory, they take some leisure hours. So why not sit down for five minutes, ten minutes, and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa? Where is the difficulty? Apart from the work they are doing, we are recommending, "Whatever is done is done. You chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Then everything will be all right." Where is the wrong?

Yogeśvara: But eventually it's understood they must stop their industry.

Prabhupāda: There is no question of stopping. If that is their livelihood, how they can stop it? That is not possible. But they can add this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra chanting. Then things will be adjusted. It is not possible to stop different methods of livelihood. That is not possible. If one can stop, it is well and good, but even he does not stop, he can chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra.

Yogeśvara: But ultimately isn't our idea that the city complexes shouldn't remain, that things should become more spread out to farm and rural areas?

Prabhupāda: Yes, naturally. If this man is fed up with this industry, he can go back to village and produce his own food. But he is attached to this industrial activity because he is thinking that "We are getting more money for wine and woman and meat. Let me enjoy." That is the perfect, imp... But if he chants Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra, his consciousness will be purified and he will be made not interested this kind of work. He will go back to village and produce food. This is French?

Atreya Ṛṣi: No. It is new, 62 the new American. (BTG?)

Morning Walk at Villa Borghese -- May 25, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: That's all. Because I did not earn this money, I have printed. I am prepared to twenty rupees. So he says, "Why shall I pay ten rupees? I must wait for the customer, for twenty rupees, and hoard it." Even there is sufficient stock, he will not sell. Therefore the other man, who is honest, he is suffering. This is going on. So to stop this inflation, the government must stop this paper currency. Then the inflation... There will be no more inflation. But that they will not do. They want to cheat people. "In God I trust. Take this paper and you be satisfied that you have got thousand dollars." That's all. This cheating is going on. Why should you pay me paper? Give me real dollar, in gold. That they have none. They haven't got. That's all. They will employ laborers and cheat them by paying these papers, and this rascal will think that "I am getting more money." That's all. Since this world has taken this paper currency, the situation has degraded. Formerly there was barter exchange. That was very good thing. Still in Indian villages, the remote villages, there is barter. Yes. He has produced some grains, paddy. He will bring to the storekeeper. And the storekeeper will take, "For so much oil, you have to give me so much paddy." So he will weigh and keep it and give him oil. So he will arrange to sell the paddy. But for the villagers, he brings the paddy and he takes. They require little salt, little oil, some spices. That's all. Otherwise they have got their own thing. They have got dahl, their rice, wheat, everything. They have produced. In this way, still there are, Indian villages. There is no question of scarcity.

Morning Walk at Villa Borghese -- May 25, 1974, Rome:

Satsvarūpa: We should go on the walk. The cars are coming on the road.

Prabhupāda: So we shall walk? (break) ...containing three passengers, wasting petrol. Similarly, hundreds and thousands and millions of cars and buses are running all over the world, simply wasting petrol.

Bhagavān: When there was the oil crisis in the United States, they were giving reports how some person would go in his car, go ten miles in a big car to buy one pack of cigarettes.

Prabhupāda: Stick to your own place and grow your food. There is no question of transport. Little transport is required, that bullock cart. Kṛṣṇa was being carried on bullock cart. There is no use of petrol. Use simply the bull. They are already there. Utilize them. No. The bull should be sent to the slaughterhouse. Petrol should be used.

Atreya Ṛṣi: They try to solve every problem by transportation, by airplanes, cars. For example, we had this big conference in Montreal. From all over the world came... (end)

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1974, Rome:

Bhagavān: Now, recently, in the last war in the Middle East, Saudi Arabians raised the price of the oil over double now, I think, as a pressure to the western countries to do things in their favor. Now they realized that the market for oil is in such great demand that they don't have to lower the price after the war, but they are going to keep the price. And actually the price is still increasing. So this is causing inflation.

Prabhupāda: So this problem will be solved as soon as we are localized. Petrol is required for transport, but if you are localized, there is no question of transport. You don't require petrol. Suppose in New Vrindaban, we stay, we don't go anywhere. Then where is the need of petrol?

Bhagavān: Petrol they also use for heating. And electricity.

Prabhupāda: No, heating. Heating we can do by wood. By nature.

Dhanañjaya: I remember, Śrīla Prabhupāda, you were saying that all we require is some oxen, and the oxen can carry.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The oxen will solve the problem of transport. That bullock cart. Just like Kṛṣṇa, when He was transferred from Gokula to Nandagrāma, so they took all the bullock carts, and within a few hours they transported them, the whole thing, their luggage, family member, everything.

Bhagavān: How far can a bullock cart travel in one day?

Prabhupāda: At least ten miles, very easily, very easily. And maximum he can travel fifteen miles, twenty miles. But when we are localized, we don't require to go beyond ten miles, five miles. Because we have created a rubbish civilization, therefore one is required to go fifty miles for earning bread, hundred miles, hanging.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: But there is no food. Never mind, you starve, but get your atom bomb. That's all. This is civilization. There was a cartoon. Somebody approached some politician, and he said, "Yes, I know there is food problem. So I cannot say what can I do for you, but from next week, you will have television." This is their program, "From next week you will have television." As if television will minimize my hunger. This is the civilization. Hare Kṛṣṇa. So you ask problem, I will answer. Your energy, problems of energy, petrol, it will be automatically solved. If we are localized, there is no question of petrol.

Bhagavān: You say in the, I think it's in the Second Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, that by doing so much drilling into the earth, they actually disturbed the rotation of the earth.

Prabhupāda: Yes, we can think like that. Just like the plane, aeroplane, is flying. There is sufficient petrol stock. Is it not? So the world has got sufficient petrol stock. If you do not know how it is being used, maybe due to this petrol, it is floating. And if you take away the petrol stock, it may drop. Everything is there. There is a purpose. Pūrṇam idam (Īśopaniṣad, Invocation). There is full purpose. Not that whimsically petrol is there within the earth. There is some purpose.

Devotee: What they do, Śrīla Prabhupāda, is take the petrol out and put salt water, because they know there can be a imbalance. And then they put salt water in the holes.

Prabhupāda: But water cannot produce gas. Petrol produces gas. Maybe due to that gas, it is floating. Because we have got practical experience. When there is gas, you can float anything.

Morning Walk -- May 28, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: No, there is no question of extended. You keep yourself in a limited solution. And then, when it is appreciated it will be automatically extended. You don't touch the extended. You become ideal civilized man. Others will follow.

Yogeśvara: Well, for example, ultimately, we want to live locally. These cities are not necessary.

Prabhupāda: No, you make the best use of a bad bargain. We shall depend more... Just like in New Vrindaban. They are coming to the city for preaching. So not absolutely we can abstain immediately because we have been dependent so long, many, many lives. You cannot. But the ideal should be introduced gradually. And make it perfect more and more and more and more. But there is possibility. Possibility if you live locally and make your arrangement, you get your foods... The real necessity is, bodily necessity is, eating, sleeping, mating and defending. This is necessity. So if you can eat locally, you can sleep locally, you can have your sex life also locally and you can defend locally, then what is the wrong? These are the necessities. We are not stopping this. We are not stopping, "No more sex life." That is nonsense, another nonsense. You must have. Marry. That's all. So you can marry locally and live. Where is the difficulty? Defend. If somebody comes to attack, there must be men to defend. And eating and sleeping. Where is your difficulty? Manage locally, as far as possible. After all, these are the necessities of body. So it can be solved locally. Is it impossible? To solve the bodily necessities? What do you think? Is it impossible?

Room Conversation with Biochemist, Dr. Sallaz -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:

Dr. Sallaz: Ah, yes. I meant this world. Matter is the earth. Be careful. I don't mean life in general...

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Now, this is the point that my spiritual master is bringing out, that the material energy is inferior, and in order to have a spiritual revolution you have to understand the superior energy which is eternal, without birth and without death. So, of course, there is no question of destruction for the soul.

Dr. Sallaz: Destruction in our occidental language and practically, which is not yours.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Destruction in simple terms, just as we know something has a beginning and something has an end. That is destruction. So in Vedic terms that which has a beginning and has an end is called material, and that which has no beginning and no end, but is existing nonetheless, that is called spiritual or superior energy.

Dr. Sallaz: Of course. This cannot be destroyed.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That cannot be destroyed.

Dr. Sallaz: That cannot be destroyed. It can disappear from the living people, Christian or other of this world, but not at all.

Prabhupāda: Then what do you mean by spiritual revolution?

Dr. Sallaz: It is to see, to look, for the real truth, the simple truth. The very simple truth. And to abandon our way of life aiming only for money, power and material things, to go back to simple living and especially to living with up.

Prabhupāda: Living with?

Room Conversation with Biochemist, Dr. Sallaz -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: But is that very good intelligence? Suppose you are searching after one million dollars. You are working little by little, little, and if somebody says, "Here is one million dollar. You take it," Why don't you take it? (French)

Yogeśvara: He says it's a moral question. He already has his guru, and his guru has died. He's gone over to the other side, and he can't change gurus.

Prabhupāda: But there is no question of changing guru. If he is actually searching after the truth, then why he is denying the truth when it is delivered? (French)

Yogeśvara: He would have to be sure that it was the actual highest truth.

Dr. Sallaz: The real truth, eternal truth. Because you see...

Prabhupāda: That is... That we are... (French)

Yogeśvara: This is what the conclusion we came to yesterday with that other guest, that he says they have also find truths in China, they have also found truths in other scriptures.

Prabhupāda: So what is that truth? (French) (break) ...is that reality?

Yogeśvara: He says he himself, he doesn't have the words to describe it.

Prabhupāda: If you cannot describe the reality, then you have not received the reality. (French) (break) That means, as soon as you say you cannot describe, then you have no idea what is the reality.

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Yogeśvara: (translating) ...jīvo jīvasya jīvanam (French)...

Prabhupāda: There is no jīvo jīvasya jīvanam. Here Kṛṣṇa says, "Give Me these things, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam." There is no question of jīvasya jīvanam.

Yogeśvara: (translates)

Prabhupāda: Just hear. Kṛṣṇa is ordering, "Give Me this food."

Yogeśvara: (translates) Patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati. (translates)

Prabhupāda: So we take Kṛṣṇa prasādam. We don't directly do anything. Kṛṣṇa says, "Give Me this foodstuff containing of vegetables, fruits, flowers, grains." So we offer them and then you take. If there is any sinful activity there, it is Kṛṣṇa's, not mine.

Yogeśvara: (translates)

Frenchman: (French)

Prabhupāda: (aside) Why don't you open this?

Yogeśvara: He says, "That may be so, but in the Bhagavad-gītā Kṛṣṇa orders Arjuna that 'You must kill.' "

Prabhupāda: You must kill always. Where is that...? Where is that quotation?

Room Conversation with Robert Gouiran, Nuclear Physicist from European Center for Nuclear Research -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Healing? Where is healing? You are dying, and where is the healing?

Robert Gouiran: You don't think that people could have a gift for healing?

Prabhupāda: There is no healing in the material world. There is disease always. There is no question of healing. Their healing is temporary. I am suffering from some disease. You give me some medicine. Does it mean that there will be no more disease? You heal that temporary disease. Again another disease. So where is the healing? So this is to be thought, that... Healing, that is the problem. There is no healing. There is always disease, this disease or that disease. If you prefer this disease heal, you are cured, and there will be no more disease, then you are profited. Another disease. You heal this, another disease. You heal this, another disease.

Robert Gouiran: So you think we can't help people?

Prabhupāda: Eh? You cannot! Can you help people to stop death? Or to stop disease? Or to stop old age? I am becoming old, can you stop?

Robert Gouiran: I think so.

Prabhupāda: That is foolishness. If you think that you can stop my old age growing, then that is foolishness. It is not possible.

Robert Gouiran: I think there is a misunderstanding there.

Prabhupāda: No, no. I am... A man grows old, can you stop it?

Morning Walk -- June 6, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: ...only barrier. The meat-eaters cannot understand.

Satsvarūpa: He said, "Let us go on to higher topics. We've just been talking so long about meat-eating."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Satsvarūpa: You said: "Well, if you're sinful, there's no question of going on to a higher topic."

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is specially mentioned in the Bhāgavata: vinā paśughnāt.

nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānād

bhavauṣadhāc chrotra-mano-'bhirāmāt

ka uttamaśloka-guṇānuvādāt

pumān virajyeta vinā paśughnāt

(SB 10.1.4)

Everyone can understand the truth except the rascals who are meat-eaters. Vinā paśughnāt. Paśughnāt. Paśu means animals, and ghna means killer. Christ therefore first says, "You shall not kill." These rascals are killers from the very beginning, and they're continuing. Vinā paśughnāt (SB 10.1.4). Those who are paśughna, they cannot understand. They're thinking, "We are doing very good work, philanthropic work, opening hospitals and public roads, and every ten years, we are fighting and killing all the men population." They're happy. They are taking credit for these big, big buildings, but this is duṣkṛtina because simply these buildings are meant for committing sinful activities. That's all. "Wine, women, meat-eating, gambling. We are civilized." (break) ...this Geneva very many churches.

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: In Vedic culture, what would King Parīkṣit do?

Prabhupāda: We don't find any illicit sex. They were having more than one wife. So there was no question of illicit sex. If one wife is pregnant, then the man, he goes to another wife. Man has got that tendency. So as soon as she is pregnant, she is kept separate. Even we have seen. When the girl is pregnant, she goes to her mother's care, does not live with the husband. What is that?

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Off in the distance.

Prabhupāda: A girl is pregnant, suppose, then, during her pregnancy period, ten months, there is no sex, and unless the child becomes six months old, there is no sex. The thing is that in the modern world, sex life has become the only pleasure. They do not know anything else. Therefore everything is discredited. And another thing is they are afraid of keeping more than one wife for population. But if they produce sufficient food, where is the question of overpopulation? Another thing they have made, especially in the western world, they don't want to produce food because they know, "We shall kill one animal and eat. Why take so much trouble? Let me increase industry, and I shall push my button. Money will come. And the slaughterhouse there. We shall eat." So they are getting money. By money, they are getting women to the choice. They are getting food, meat, and they're enjoying drinking. So money has become the whole thing. "Bring money some way or other and enjoy."

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1974, Geneva:

They have no such ideas. "There is nothing after death. So so long I am living, let me enjoy by the tongue, by the genital and by the belly. Use the tongue for eating anything which is palatable, which I like. Never mind what it is. And then genital also. Bring as many women..." This is civilization, modern. There is no question of sinful life or pious life, next life. (laughs) Another, their theory is that only on this planet there is living entities... (break) If there is sufficient rain in the desert, it will be also hot. (break) ...tells us in the śāstras how to live comfortably and advance in spiritual life. And they should give advice to others. That is the business of the Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau. Nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-nipuṇau sad-dharma-saṁsthāpakau. Lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau tri-bhuvane mānyau śaraṇyākarau. This is the description of the Gosvāmīs. They are well versed in all different types of Vedic scriptures just to establish a peaceful society sad-dharma, very nice gentleman, peaceful society. Lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau, for the benefit of the whole human society. Therefore they are honored all over the world. This is gosvāmī business, not to exploit (indistinct) live like irresponsible man, eat, drink, be merry and enjoy.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda, their philosophy is that this is all there is, this life. After death, it's finished. And so they're trying to enjoy, enjoy, enjoy.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: That is their ignorance. They do not know what is responsibility.

Devotee (3): They would say that so many have taken God realization as a responsibility following some Christian church or something like that, but they are also frustrated.

Prabhupāda: We are not frustrated. We are not frustrated. Are you frustrated? (laughter) How the rascal says frustrated? If you take false thing, then you will be frustrated. If you take real path of God realization, there is no question of frustration. It is ānandāmbudhi-vardhanam, increasing pleasure. No frustration.

Devotee (3): But they'd say that no one has real information of God.

Prabhupāda: You have no, rascal, because you are rascal. I have got. You just wash my feet and I will inform you.

Devotees: Jaya! Haribol!

Prabhupāda: You do not know how to swim, that does not mean I do not know. Is it a very honest statement? "Nobody can swim because he does not know." But if anyone knows how to swim, then why do you say that no one has done? You do not know, you accept that.

Devotee (3): Everyone thinks in terms of their own relative position.

Room Conversation -- June 11, 1974, Paris:

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda, in the western countries now, the young people, when their parents grow old, they generally send them away to old age homes. So if they have no compassion even towards their own parents, that they would send them away, then how can we educate them to protect the cow which is just like mother if they're even willing to practically kill their parents?

Prabhupāda: So there is no question of protecting. We shall protect. Simply we ask them that "Don't purchase meat from the slaughterhouse. We shall supply you the cow after his death." Where is the wrong?

Satsvarūpa: Not enough meat.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Satsvarūpa: Not enough meat fast enough, they're eating so much beef.

Prabhupāda: No, fast, fast. Fast means you have to eat the cow's flesh. So how you can make it fast? The cows' number are the same. So it will remain the same. Simply you wait for the natural death. Where is the restriction? You have got a limited number of cows. Either you wait for the death, or you kill it at once, the number of cows are the same. So we simply request you that you don't kill them. Wait for the natural death and take it. What is the wrong? The number of cows is the same. You cannot increase it. Increase or decrease, the number of cows is there. So we simply request you that so long they're alive, let us take it's milk, and give nice foodstuff to the human society.

Yogeśvara: If they don't kill it, they'll be even more cows.

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: So this is the position. As soon as you point out, "This man is dishonest," and you scrutinize, everyone is dishonest, then where is dishonesty? It is all honesty. Because if the whole business is dishonesty, so there is no question of honesty? Let it go on. That is the public opinion. Why one should be unnecessarily honest? If the whole world is dishonest, and the dishonest world is going on, then where is the harm? What is the use of becoming... The same thing: "It is folly to be wise where ignorance is bliss."

Jyotirmayī: That is exactly what people are saying now. They say "What's the use of being organized and good and sane? Everybody is dishonest now."

Bhagavān: We have to give them a place to go where they can come if they want.

Prabhupāda: Just like Parīkṣit Mahārāja gave Kali four places. He could not find out. First of all he gave him four places, that "These four places you can go." But he could not find out such place. So he was embarrassed. So now there is no question of finding out. Everywhere you go, the same four principles. Formerly, it was very difficult to find out a place where these things are going on. Now everywhere you go, these four things are main principles of life. So therefore they cannot very much appreciate these prohibitory principles, that "What is wrong there?"

Devotee: It is just the opposite now. Now there is no place where Mahārāja Parīkṣit can go to find out a spiritual atmosphere.

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: No, he cannot give up these bad habits.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: You said in Geneva that no one has died from giving up cigarettes or illicit sex. So it is not so hard to do.

Prabhupāda: No, it is not hard. Now the Christian church is giving liberty, man to man marriage. Most unnatural.

Devotee: Previously they didn't allow divorce. The first principle was there is no question of divorce. Then so many people began leaving the Catholic Church. So then they allowed divorce. And then they did not allow abortion. So again so many people left the religion. Now they allow abortion. And now they are allowing man to man marriage.

Prabhupāda: Just see.

Devotee: They compromise just to keep their followers.

Bhagavān: It's a matter of money.

Prabhupāda: And that is freedom. So Rāya Rāmānanda left because such freedom is not allowed here. So we have to allow this freedom like the church? (laughs)

Bhārgava: There was one survey done by a college, a university, Michigan State, and Rūpānuga Mahārāja researched it and said 94% of the people in America, they believe there is a God, but only 35% will go to church. They are not very much interested in the churches anymore. They don't trust them. But 94% believe there is God.

Prabhupāda: Because the church could not help them in understanding God. The Christian church has no idea what is God. Therefore there is no name of God. Actually, they have no idea about God. Is there?

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Yes, he took with him three women. One of them was Sister Nivedita.

Devotee: Also you told us in India about Aurobindo and Ramakrishna. Aurobindo went also. Aurobindo, when that French woman came, he also fell to her, but just to cover it up he has called her "Mother" because in India, when you call someone "Mother..."

Prabhupāda: No, everyone knows he is mother and he is father.

Devotee: Yeah, right. And they don't think... There is no question of sex. When they think of mother and father, they don't think of these things. Also with Ramakrishna. He also had his divine mother. You told us a story in Calcutta that he was very debauched. In a village he used to chase the young women. And his brother actually made him famous.

Prabhupāda: It is very difficult to, not to be victimized by woman. It is very difficult.

Yogeśvara: Unless you are victimized by Kṛṣṇa first.

Prabhupāda: Yes. One who is, I means, what is called, captivated by the beauty of Kṛṣṇa, then he is not victimized.

Morning Walk -- June 17, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Everything is worst. Sinful is sinful. Disease is disease. This body, either it is living or it is dead, it is not very important thing. Now see. And the whole world is after this body. Kṛṣṇa says, "The body, either dead or alive, it is not a subject matter for serious consideration." Now see. And what the world is going on? Simply for bodily... Body means senses. It is very difficult to the, for the western people to understand that body is not important thing; the soul is important thing. First of all, they do not know what is soul and then consideration of importance. This is their position. And if one cannot understand what is soul, what he will understand about God? Soul is a minute particle of God. If one cannot understand about this minute particle, then what he'll understand of the Supreme? In the laboratory, if you can test a little sample, just like take a little sea water, analyze, you chemically test, then you can understand what is the composition of the sea water. But if you have no knowledge even a small drop of sea water, how you'll understand the sea, what... That is their position. They do not understand even the sample of spirit soul, as we are. Simply they are trying to cover it. "There is no soul. There is no soul. Life is generated from matter." Although they cannot prove it. A fool's paradise. The fools, rascals, they are explaining the living force in some way, and other fools are accepting. This is the position of western countries, Europe and America. It is a fool's paradise. It is paradise, certainly. Very, very, big, big building and advancement, but all rascals and fools. Fool's paradise. (pause) And if you call a fool a fool, he'll be angry. Mūrkhāyopadeśo hi prakopayati na śamyati (?). (pause) (break) ...so many, so much production, but if nature's law can stop this production, then the question of over-population. If the nature likes, it can produce three times, four times this production. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi (BG 3.27). After all, nature is producing. We do not know how to deal with nature. Therefore there is scarcity, and we say, "over-population." There is no question of over-population. There are so many hundreds and thousands of birds within this forest, other animals. They have no problems of over-population. Eh? (pause) All these men, who are living in these villages, so what is their means of livelihood? Agriculture or industry? Or service?

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: No, as I say, the active principle, I am also the active principle. As I say, the dead body and the living body, difference is, when the active principle is not there, it is dead body. Similarly, I am also the active principle. So 'ham, so 'ham: "I am the same active principle." Ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am Brahman. I am not this material body." That is self-realization. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati: (BG 18.54) "When one is self-realized, then he is jolly." Prasannātmā. He is never morose. He is jolly. Na śocati na kāṅkṣati: "He has no lamentation, no hankering." Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu: "He is equal to everyone, man, animal and everything." And mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām: (BG 18.54) "Then devotional life begins." So without self-realization, there is no question of devotional life. Or those who are engaged in devotional service, they are all... Just like these boys, my students, they are trained up how to be always in devotional service. So one who is engaged in devotional service, he is supposed to be already self-realized. Because he has understood "what I am," yes. And then he sticks to devotional service. Otherwise, he cannot. If one thinks, "I am this body," then he cannot be engaged in devotional service, or he cannot stick. He knows that "I am part and parcel of God. So my duty is to serve God." This is self-realization. And then he engages himself in devotional service.

Professor Durckheim: I say, master, that when you say he knows, you don't speak about this knowledge.

Prabhupāda: Which knowledge?

Professor Durckheim: You came already... You say "believe and by this know that I am participating in the great divine person." And yet I didn't experience it.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: So that different principle, for a devotee is already realized. Because a devotee never thinks of this body, that "I am this body." He thinks "I am...," ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am spirit soul." So without that realization, there is no question of devotional life. So that is first understood. That instruction is being given by Kṛṣṇa to Arjuna, that "You are considering very seriously on this body, but a learned man does not take this body very seriously, either dead or alive." That is the first realization. So everyone in this world, they are concerned with this body, dead or alive. When alive, they take care of the body in so many ways, and when dead they erect big statue upon it. So that realization is this body. When it is alive, very nicely dressed, nicely groomed, nicely everything on account of this body, and when dead, then again the statue, the tomb, that's all, but missing the active principle. He is taking care of this body even after death by erecting very nice memorial, but he has no knowledge where the active principle has lost. That is ignorance.

Professor Durckheim: When I was a young man, I was four years in the World War. Forty-eight months almost in the foremost front. And I was one of the two officers...

Prabhupāda: In First World War? First World War?

Professor Durckheim: World War I, 1914 to 1918.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: That's it. So this we can experience, that as soon as the spirit is entered into the womb of the mother, they develops skin and the child develops body. So this is very practical, that first of all, not that simply by sexual intercourse a child is born. Then every the time sexual intercourse would have caused pregnancy. No. Unless the spirit soul is there, there is no question of developing body. Therefore it is natural that the spirit soul creates this flesh and bone and other things and develops into body. There is no difficulty to understand.

Dr. P. J. Saher: Yes, but I think the professor was asking how in our time in the case of a word, as far as spirit becoming flesh, not in the face of an ordinary child. I think I have understood your point?

Professor Durckheim: Yes, in principle. You see sometimes, it seems to me, I might be wrong, that there is one difference between Eastern wisdom and Christian way to think that whereas in the Eastern way, we have to become rid of our body, to be liberate from our body, whereas Christian sense means to realize the spirit within the body. (German)

Prabhupāda: Now, what is our suffering?

Professor Durckheim: I am sure it can be reconciled, but I am interested to know how do you see this question.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. That everyone can understand. It is very easy. Now, just like we have already heard from Bhagavad-gītā that I am the spirit, I am within this body. So my sufferings are on account of this body. This is a fact. Because I have entered into this body, material body, there are my sufferings. Therefore my business should be how to get out of this body. Is it clear or not?

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Many life or this life. In this life you understand that "My sufferings are due to this body. Then how to get out of this body?" If you acquire this knowledge, you know the tricks, then you get immediately.

Professor Durckheim: May I say that way, that you say, if you, for instance, or I want to go out of this body, it doesn't mean that I will have to kill my body, but to realize that my spirit is independent from my body.

Prabhupāda: No, no. There is no question of killing. You be killed or not killed, you have to go out of this body and accept another body. That is nature's law. That you cannot avoid. It is not necessarily that first of all you have to be killed. No.

Professor Durckheim: No. Certainly not. But I have tried to become independent from my body.

Prabhupāda: Yes, you can become. (German)

Lady: Have you got some points in common with the Christians?

Professor Durckheim: Lady says that there are some common points with the Christians who also certainly want to become independent from this body which wants material life only.

Prabhupāda: Yes. It doesn't matter whether it is Christianity or Hinduism or Muslim or... Knowledge is knowledge. Wherever knowledge is available, you must pick up. So knowledge... Now let us explain, that knowledge has no color. Knowledge is knowledge. It doesn't matter whether Christianism or Hinduism or Mohammedan. Now, this is a knowledge, that every living entity is imprisoned within this body. This knowledge is equally good for Hindus, Muslim, Christian or everyone. There is no question of Christianism or Hinduism. The soul is imprisoned within this body, and the problem is birth, death, old age and disease on account of this body. But we want to live eternally, we want full knowledge; we want full blissfulness. To attain that goal of life, we must get out of this body. This is the process. (German) (break)

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Yes, anyone came; we feed. That much... There were many refugees, so we fed them.

Prof. Pater Porsch: But that automatically answers the question of this gentlemen also, the body in the service of other people, you see...

Prabhupāda: No, we give food. Anyone come and take food. Here also. There is no question of Bangladesh. Let anyone come and take food. In our Māyāpur center we especially give food distribution on Saturday and Sunday. At least five thousand people come. So all humanitarian work is included.

Lady: Thank you very much.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Thank you. (some guests leave) So now we have come to Germany. You cooperate and make it a great success for the general benefit of the whole humanity. We have got arts, music, literature, culture, food, everything.

Prof. Pater Porsch: I think it will also help to quite a considerable extent for the removing of prejudices and for a better understanding of...

Prabhupāda: No, this is the only platform where all people, all religion, all culture, can unite. This is the only place, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We practically see how they are becoming successful. In Africa also, within the villages they are responding. (break) ...distinction.

Devotee: (showing Śrīla Prabhupāda's books) This is Spanish, Chinese.

Prof. Pater Porsch: (indistinct) Chinese.

Room Conversation with Scientists -- July 2, 1974, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: This is the cycle, that we should produce immense food grain both for the animals and for men. And there should be cooperation. Just like the cow and bull. The bull helps plowing. That is the original system. Now they have invented tractors, what is called? Tractor?

Madhudviṣa: Cultivators.

Prabhupāda: And the bulls are being killed. Why they should be killed? Engage them in tilling the field. They will have occupation. And the man also will have occupation. There is immense land. So there will be no question of unemployment. And the machine, it works hundreds of men's labor and hundreds of men become unemployed. So unemployed means devil's workshop.

Dr. Muncing: I think that the situation which would apply to the Asian area, whilst I don't know it in complete detail, it's my impression that we have used very nearly all of the Australian area that is suitable for tilling the soil and growing food grains. There are vast areas of Australia that have very little rain, or if they have rain it comes intermittently. And it's my impression that the Australian area... The area that's used for growing grains in Australia couldn't be vastly increased. It couldn't be doubled, for instance. On the other hand I accept that it might well be possible to double the amount that comes off the present area. And of course, that's something that C.S.R.O. is working towards.

Dr. Harrap: I think you could add to that, Roy, that an attempt to grow grain in large areas of Australia would significantly damage the ecology, and from reading your writings, I suspect that this would be completely unacceptable to your way of thinking, that one doesn't disturb the natural life cycles of innumerable creatures in order to grow more grain because the terrain is just not suited to the grain growing.

Morning Walk -- July 9, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: And actually they are lovers of dog. And still, he's professing "I am religious." This is not cheating.

Hṛdayānanda: Yes, it's cheating. Imposter.

Prabhupāda: Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje (SB 1.2.6). Unless one becomes a devotee of God, there is no question of religion. It is all cheating. By opening hospital, schools,... There are thousands upon thousands upon thousands upon thousands of years, the hospitals and schools are being opened, philanthropy. What is the result?

Bali Mardana: Atom bombs.

Prabhupāda: Atom bomb. Result is atom bomb.

Hṛdayānanda: You're the only one, Prabhupāda, who dares to criticize hospitals and schools. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Yes, so many people came to request me... Even Dr. Ghosh. Eh? You know.

Satsvarūpa: He wanted you to open a medical dispensary.

Prabhupāda: "No, no, we are not going to waste our time in that way." I frankly told him. We have no extra time to waste like that. What he thinks very big project, we say it is waste of time. (laughter)

Jayatīrtha: Yes.

Hṛdayānanda: Jaya. It is a completely revolutionary idea.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I cannot allow anyone he's waste his valuable time of human life.

Morning Walk at Marina del Rey -- July 12, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Eh? Harer nāma (CC Adi 17.21).

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The result of this violation of the laws of nature is that...

Prabhupāda: No, they cannot violate. That is not possible. There is no question of violating. Simply childish attempt. That's all. You cannot violate it. That is not possible.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But they are... They are planning to make a... (laughter)

Prabhupāda: That is childish. That is childish. "They are planning." That is childish. Although they are being repeatedly baffled, still trying. This is childish.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They have already timetable worked out.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That in two thousand years they are going to make...

Prabhupāda: Yes, so that he'll not live for two thousand years. Then the bluff cannot be shown. Violation is not possible, sir. That is not possible. Therefore Bhagavad-gītā says, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). You are trying to violate, but here are the four principles. It is not possible. You cannot violate. There is death; you cannot violate this. As soon as the time will come, you must die. Finished, all your scientific research. Four millions, trillions, and you can say, at that time there was no civilized man. At that time man was dying and animal was dying. And at this time man is dying and animal is dying. So what improvement you have made? There is no improvement.

Room Conversations -- September 11, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: To the qualified physician, not to the storekeeper. Similarly, first thing is, when you want to solve the problem, you must go to the right person. First of all you have to select. So we understand that Kṛṣṇa is the right person. So therefore, it is guaranteed. He knows everything. Others, they do not know. May know to some extent, not perfect. The first thing is that we have to select from whom. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). In Vedas it is stated in order to solve the problem or to understand the situation, you should go to the guru. So who can be better than Kṛṣṇa as guru? He taught, He gave lessons to Brahmā, the original living creature in this universe. Tene brahma hṛdā. He gave lessons to Brahmā how to create. Therefore, who can be better guru than Kṛṣṇa? Or even Brahmā. Brahmā, (indistinct) he has created this universe, but He taught Brahmā. And Kṛṣṇa is accepted as the supreme guru. To take instruction from Him or His pure representative, that is wanted. Otherwise, there will be trouble(?). You cannot compare any ordinary person with Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is the original guru, instructor. You do not know about Kṛṣṇa, that is a different thing. But if you want to solve your problems, you must approach the guru. That is the Vedic instruction. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). This verb is used when you must: no excuse, gacchet, vidhiliṅ. In Sanskrit there are different forms of verb. So when vidhiliṅ is used, that means you must. There is no question of alternative. You must. So Kṛṣṇa is the original guru. Tene brahma ādi-kavaye, ādi-kavi. Ādi-kavaye means ādi-kavi, the original learned scholar. How much brain he has that he has created this universe, Brahmā. He has created the demigods, he has created the planets, so who can (indistinct)? And he was instructed by Kṛṣṇa. So who can be a better guru than Him? And so far you are concerned, you cannot (indistinct). You have not solved any question. Therefore required, they say, revolution. Problem is not solved. We are accepting one wrong process, and after going through it for some time, we want to change it. That is not solution. That means you do not know how to make it solved; you're simply trying this method, that method, this method, that method. That is (indistinct).