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Spiritual Body (Conversations and Letters)

Expressions researched:
"Krsna's body and Krsna is nondifferent because it is completely spiritual" |"bodies were so spiritual" |"body are complete spiritual" |"body becomes spiritual" |"body can be spiritualized" |"body have become spiritualized" |"body is also spiritual" |"body is completely spiritual" |"body is eternally in spiritual" |"body is made of spiritual" |"body is spiritual" |"body is spiritualized" |"body is transcendental, spiritual" |"body of spiritual energy" |"body spiritualized" |"body that is spiritual" |"body will be spiritualized" |"body's spiritual" |"body, we have to spiritualize" |"spiritual blissful body" |"spiritual bodies" |"spiritual body" |"spiritual body" |"spiritual form within this body" |"spiritual head, body" |"spiritual spark has got body" |"spiritual transcendental body" |"spiritualize this body" |"spiritualized body" |"spiritualizing the present body"

Conversations and Morning Walks

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk at Stow Lake -- March 23, 1968, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: First thing is that calculation of Candra, moon planet, there are different views. Different scientists, they have different views. It is not a standard. They have not agreed to the... Somebody says something, somebody says another thing. Speculation. That's all. But that idea, that it is very low in temperature, that is mentioned in Bhāgavata. You cannot live in the water. You have to qualify yourself. (Sound of ducks). Just see. Their body is made just suitable for the water. So you have to qualify yourself. That is... Just like, in the spiritual sky they can live only spiritual body, and material body cannot live there. Material body is not allowed there. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthā madhye tiṣṭhanti rājasāḥ (BG 14.18). Those who are too much passionate, they are meant to live in this planet. This planetary system, status. There are many other planets like this world. So they are allowed to live here.

Questions and Answers -- September 6, 1968, New York:

Prabhupāda: In the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam Śukadeva Gosvāmī says, itthaṁ satāṁ brahma-sukhānubhūtya dāsyaṁ gatānāṁ para-daivatena, māyāśritānāṁ nara-dārakeṇa sākaṁ vijahruḥ kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ (SB 10.12.11). He is describing when Kṛṣṇa was playing with His cowherds boy. So he is describing that "These cowherds boy—who are they? They are living entities who have amassed volumes and volumes of pious activities." Kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ. "After many, many lives Just like bank balance increases, similarly, one who has increased the balance of pious activities for many, many thousands of lives, oh, such persons are now playing with Kṛṣṇa. They have taken the body of His cowherds boy, transcendental spiritual body, and just they are playing with Kṛṣṇa.

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Hayagrīva: Swamiji? Are there people living on the moon now or were they in other yugas living there? Are they in this yuga living there?

Prabhupāda: No, they're still living there. Yes. As we are living here, they are living there. Yes.

Reporter: And how would you describe these people that live there? Would they be invisible to us or visible?

Prabhupāda: Almost invisible, yes.

Hayagrīva: Spiritual body.

Prabhupāda: Not spiritual. That is also material.

Hayagrīva: Like ghost bodies? Subtle bodies?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg -- May 11, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Allen Ginsberg: Would you like to hear one of the Blake songs?

Prabhupāda: Blake song?

Allen Ginsberg: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes, why not.

Allen Ginsberg: (to Peter) Do you want to sing "Tears Up"? (singing:)

Whate'er is born of mortal birth

Must be consumed with the earth,

To rise from generations free,

Then why have I to do with thee?

The sexes sprung from shame and pride,

Blow in the morn, in the evening die,

But mercy change death into sleep

The sexes rose to walk and weep.

The mother of my mortal part

With cruelty did'st mould my heart,

And with false self-deceiving tears,

Did'st bind my nostrils, eyes and ears

Did'st close my tongue in senseless clay

And be to mortal life betrayed.

The death of Jesus set me free

Then what have I to do with thee.

It is raised, a spiritual body.

Prabhupāda: He believes in spiritual body. That's nice. (laughter)

Allen Ginsberg: It's a,...

Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa Consciousness.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1971, Gorakhpur:

Prabhupāda: Liberated means at the present moment under this material, in this material world, he is accepting material body, and when he is bona fide servant of Kṛṣṇa, he'll be offered a spiritual body. Just like a soldier. A person, so long he's not a soldier, he does not, he is not awarded the uniform. But as soon as he accepts the service as a soldier, immediately he is given the uniform. So you are accepting different bodies in the material world, and that is bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). You are accepting one type of body, it is becoming vāṇīshed, again you have to accept another. But as soon as you become perfectly Kṛṣṇa conscious, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9), then, after leaving this body, he does not come to this material world. He is immediately... Mam eti, he transfers. Similarly, he accepts spiritual body. Is it clear or not? You are accepting material body now, birth after birth. Is it not? That is transmigration. Sometimes you are accepting human body, sometimes you are accepting dog's body, sometimes you are accepting king's body, sometimes you are accepting somebody else. Is it not? Is it clear?

Guest: But Kṛṣṇa has told Arjuna that...

Prabhupāda: First of all, try to clear this. Now, you are accepting different types of body. Is it not a fact?

Guest: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Now when you are Kṛṣṇa conscious, you haven't got to accept a material body. You go directly to Kṛṣṇa and accept spiritual body. Then your life is eternal.

Guest: Then again he will not get material...?

Prabhupāda: No. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). When you are Kṛṣṇa conscious, there is no more accepting material body. Mām eti. And mām eti means whoever goes to Kṛṣṇa, he has as good a body as Kṛṣṇa. That is oneness.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1971, Gorakhpur:

Guest: Soul will not merge into that light, Kṛṣṇa's light?

Prabhupāda: What is that merging? You have got that brain, merging.

Guest: I told that... You have told...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Soul is changing body. Why you are talking of merging? You are changing body, you are individual. I am changing body. I may change to a dog's body, you may change to a demigod's body. That is going on. According to one's karma, he is changing body. Now, when you are Kṛṣṇa conscious fully, this change of body will take place also, but that body will be spiritual. So long you get material body, you have to change, one after another, one after another, one after another. Just like if you have a cheap thing, it goes wrong, you have to purchase another new thing. But if you purchase a real, nice thing it will go, continue for good. Similarly, so long you are getting this cheap body, material body, you have to change. And as soon as you get the most valuable body, spiritual body, there will be no more change. Why don't you understand like that? So that you have to get. That is very simple. Kṛṣṇa says, janma karma me divyam yo jānāti tattvataḥ. One who does not know what is Kṛṣṇa, he thinks that somebody is greater than Kṛṣṇa. But anyone who knows Kṛṣṇa as he is, immediately he gets that permanent body. Simply by knowing Kṛṣṇa. Janma karma me divyam yo jānāti tattvataḥ, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mam eti (BG 4.9). Is it clear? Yes. So you have to do that. You have simply to understand Kṛṣṇa. The whole problem is solved. (Prabhupāda is pounding on the table, stressing points.)

Room Conversation -- August 17, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: Just as sunshine is not covered, it is called cloudy. But this light, whatever light you are seeing, that is also sunshine. That is not different from the sunshine. And above the cloud, there is bright. So matter means when it is covered by something, it is matter. That covering is unconsciousness. That covering is also created of the sunshine, by the same energy. And then, by the same energy it is dissipated also. So the conclusion is living being, when it is covered by ignorance, that is material.

Revatīnandana: But this, the body itself is sort of a manifestation of ignorance.

Prabhupāda: Yes. When the ignorance is gone, then you have got spiritual body.

Revatīnandana: Then I know that I am not this body. Then I know that I am not this body. Now, the question is...

Prabhupāda: Then I am not ignorance.

Room Conversation -- August 17, 1971, London:

Revatīnandana: That's right. So the constitutional nature of the entities that naturally form brahma-jyotir is the same as the constitutional nature of the jīvātmās that are forming the living entities?

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is comparison, a small spiritual spark. That's all. We are spark. So long it does not develop a body... That body is also the same. So it remains as spiritual spark. But because it is spirit, it cannot remain in that impersonal stage. He wants to enjoy. So, so long he has forgotten, he develops a body which is called matter.

Śyāmasundara: Or else he develops a spiritual body? One or the other?

Prabhupāda: No. He is spirit, spiritual identity already. But as we are developing material body, similarly we can develop spiritual body.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: According to the body I create my designations. But one has to become free from all designations. That is called liberated stage. This is own constitutional position. That position is eternal servant of God. That is the real position of every living entity. But because at the present moment the living entity is in contact with matter, so according to the material modes of the body, he's identifying himself with this body. That is called material designation. "I am American." "I am Englishman." "I am Hindu." "I am Muslim." "I am this." "I am that." These are all designations. So real perfection of life is without designations. And that is the real constitutional position. Jīvera svarūpa haya nitya-kṛṣṇa-dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109). Actual, position of the living entity (indistinct) So that is the perfection of life. And human life is especially meant for, to come to that transcendental position, without any designations. Our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is for that purpose. One should be always thinking of Kṛṣṇa or God. That position is perfect (indistinct). And if one keeps himself in that designation-less position, always thinking of himself, as part and parcel of God, then next life he goes back home, back to Godhead. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). After quitting this body he does not come back again to take another material body. He takes spiritual body, or develops a spiritual body and goes back to home, back to Godhead, which means eternal, blissful life of knowledge our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is for that purpose. We are trying to bring all men..., of different dimensions, different divisions, to come to this position, always thinking that I am part and parcel of God. My real position is to serve God.

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Dr. Singh: But is it not possible when the Upaniṣads, when they talk of this (indistinct). So if you... What does that mean?

Prabhupāda: That means you become purified of this material body and you regain your spiritual body. Yogam.

Dr. Singh: (Sanskrit)

Prabhupāda: Cinmaya-śarīra. Ānanda-cinmaya-rasa.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyed sattva yasmād brahma-saukhyam anantam (SB 5.5.1). This advice was given by Ṛṣabhadeva to his sons. "My dear boys, just undergo austerity," divyam, "for transcendental realization." Everyone is going austerity. This boy, I know, he had to go foreign countries to learn this commercial management. So many... So now he's good situated. But everyone has to undergo some austerity for future life. So why not take that austerity for permanent happiness? Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena satt... Permanent happiness, you have to purify your existential body. This body, so long you will accept this material body, you'll have to change it. And as soon as you get a spiritual body there is no question of change. Spiritual body you have already. Simply now, due to our material contamination, we are developing material body. But if we associate with spiritual life, then we shall develop spiritual body. The same example I have several times given, that you put the iron rod with fire, it will develop to be fire. Is it not?

Room Conversation -- July 4, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: Picture. In life have you seen four arms? No?

Devotee child (1): What?

Prabhupāda: One child with four arms, have you seen?

Devotee children: No.

Prabhupāda: No?

Devotee child: (2) We're not pure enough yet. We don't have spiritual eyes.

Devotee child (3): You have to have a spiritual body to see Kṛṣṇa?

Devotee child (2): Can you see Kṛṣṇa?

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Devotee child (2): How does He look like? (pause) Is that how you translate?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Devotee child (1): Is that how you translate books?

Prabhupāda: Oh, he's taking (indistinct)?

Devotee (1): He's just...

Devotee child (1): Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Devotee child (1): How can I serve you better?

Prabhupāda: Read Kṛṣṇa book daily. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Interview -- July 5, 1972, New York:

Devotee: Śrīla Prabhupāda, in our fully developed state in the spiritual sky, are we still one ten-thousandth the size of a tip of a hair like we are now in conditioned state?

Prabhupāda: Your real dimension is mentioned there that you are a spiritual atom. The measurement is one ten-thousandth part of the tip of the hair. That is the seed, or basic principle. Now, on that small particle of spirit soul we have developed this body. We have got human bodies, other has got the elephant body, other has got the mountainous body, but this is external. The real seed is that one ten-thousandth part of the hair. Similarly, as you have developed this material body under different consciousness, similarly when we give up the material connection we shall develop our spiritual body, and in that spiritual body we shall be able to enter the kingdom of God, back to home, back to Godhead. This is the position. This body you have to give up, today or tomorrow or one hundred years after. You have to give it up. The Bhagavad-gītā says after giving up this body, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9), after giving up this body he does not accept any more material body. Then what happens to him? Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti (BG 4.9), he comes to Me.

Interview with the New York Times -- September 2, 1972, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: God is eternal, and we are eternal. God is blissful, and we are blissful. God is full of knowledge; we are also full of knowledge. Unfortunately we are hampered by this material body. Therefore our problem is how to get out of this material body and come to our spiritual body. The spiritual body is there, just as our real body is present underneath our shirt and coat. I, you, and every one of us is a spiritual spark, part and parcel of God, and we are placed within a gross and subtle body. When this particular body is finished, we are carried by a subtle body into another gross body. That is called transmigration of the soul. And when we finally get free from the subtle body also, we go back home, back to Godhead. It is that easy. Human beings therefore should endeavor to get out of this gross and subtle body, attain the spiritual body and go back home. That should be the aim of human endeavor. Not that we should simply live like animals. Animals cannot get out of the gross and subtle body because to extricate oneself one must know in fact what God is. An animal cannot know what God is, but a human being can. That is the opportunity afforded by this body; nature gives us this human body just to understand God, and if we simply use it for animal propensities, we again go to the animal kingdom. That is a form of punishment.

Morning Walks -- October 1-3, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Easygoing, that is actual real life. But that easygoing, you must come to that stage. If you come to a healthy stage, then when you eat you can digest nicely. But unhealthy stage, if you eat, how you will digest? Therefore, you have to cure your disease first of all. Then you eat, it will be digested. So in the material condition, nothing can be (indistinct). Therefore, how it is called conditioned life?

Jayatīrtha: We're bound up by so many conditions.

Prabhupāda: Ah, the conditions. So first of all you come out of the conditioned life. Just like we are trying to go to other planets with so many machines, so many mechanical arrangements. But if you have got spiritual body, you can go anywhere. Anywhere you can go. As Nārada Muni is going, traveling, any planet he likes he is going. That freedom is there, but that is in spiritual body. So you come to the spiritual body first, then you get all freedom. Whatever you like, you can do. Whatever you desire, you can get.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Just like Śrīla Prabhupāda gives the example like Kṛṣṇa consciousness, it might look like poison at the beginning, but at the end it will be nectar.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: We hear that He has got different energies. His energy is one. Viṣṇu-śaktiḥ parā. That is spiritual only. Just like sunshine. That is sunshine. Now we are seeing it is covered with cloud. It is our imperfectness. But there, in the sun, there is no such thing cloud. Experience, practical experience. The sun is not experiencing cloud, although there is cloud. We are experiencing. Similarly, this matter and spirit is for us, not for Him. He, either He comes in so-called material body or spiritual body it is the same. It is the same. For Him it is like that, the same, because it is His energy. He can turn matter into spirit, spirit into matter. That He can do.

Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course -- May 13, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: He is not a dead stone. Then how matter can be the cause of life?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Matter is caused by life.

Prabhupāda: Yes, matter grows upon life. Just like why this body has grown upon me? I am the spirit soul. This is māyā. Just like, this is... I have explained in Bhagavad-gītā. I am putting on this overcoat. The overcoat is made according to the size of my body, but I am thinking, "I am overcoat." This is foolishness. Just like I got my hand, therefore this overcoat is made of warm cloth. It has got a hand also. Because originally I have got hand, therefore the overcoat has got a hand. Similarly, originally I am spirit soul, I have got my spiritual body, and the material body has grown, cut according to the body.

Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course -- May 13, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The spirit soul must necessarily have a body, either spiritual or material.

Prabhupāda: He has got already spiritual body. Material body is his covering. It is unnatural. Real body is spiritual. Just like your coat, this is unnatural. But your real body is natural. Otherwise how transmigration is possible? I am accepting different unnatural bodies. Unnatural means to my constitution. My real constitutional body is servant of Kṛṣṇa. So, so long I do not come to that position, I remain servant of nature and I get so many bodies. According to the nature's direction I am getting body, I am giving it up, again I am desiring something, I am getting another body.

Conversation with Mr. Wadell -- July 10, 1973, London:

Mr. Wadell: Yes, you cannot live without... You do not, as we say, live by bread alone. And in that sense—it may be the sense in which you wish me to take—the sense, what you are saying, that God supplies bread, because bread could be both bread for the spirit or soul...

Prabhupāda: No, bread is material. Bread is material. To maintain your material body, you require material bread. But spiritual body does not depend on material bread.

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: So the iron becomes warm, warmer, and then at last, it becomes red-hot. When the iron is red-hot, it is no longer iron. It is fire. If you touch anywhere, it will burn. Although apparently it is iron rod, but because it has become red-hot, it is fire. Similarly, if you constantly keep in spiritual activities, your outward body, although it is iron and matter, it becomes spiritualized. Try to understand this example. Iron rod put into the fire, when it is red-hot, it is no longer iron rod. It is fire. Similarly this body, although material, if you constantly keep in touch with spiritual activities, then it is no longer material. It is spiritual. The body's also spiritual.

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: When you go to God, you go in your spiritual body.

Father Tanner: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Spiritual body. So...

Father Tanner: But you can be physically healthy...

Prabhupāda: Spiritually, when you get your spiritual body, there is no such material inconveniences. The material inconveniences means so long you have got this material body, you are subjected to birth, death, old age and disease. When you revive your spiritual body, these four things are not with you. No more birth, no more death, no more disease, no more old age. This is the difference between spiritual life and material life.

Father Tanner: Yes, I mean, this, I think, anyone who's in any sense spiritual or religious or ethical would admit because the spiritual body has no parts. So it cannot start to be or cease to be and cannot change within his own entity.

Prabhupāda: No, the spiritual body is there already. Just like you have got your body. The coat is made according to your body. You existed first. Your coat was made later on. Similarly, spiritually, we exist eternally. Now, according to our different types of activities, we get a body, material body. There are eight million, four hundred thousand different forms of bodies. So the spirit soul is transmigrating according to his desire and work to different types of body. This is called transmigration of the soul. ...

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Father Tanner: ...and at the end all spirits will refind themselves in the Deity.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Father Tanner: What...? Would you ever admit that a spirit could fail after his last chance...?

Prabhupāda: That misuse of little independence. That I have already told. He has got little independence. So so long he's engaged in the service of the Lord, he remains in a spiritual body along with the Lord.

Room Conversation with Two Buddhist Monks -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes, after all, Kṛṣṇa's property. But it has come through George... (laughter)

Guest (1): He is lucky person.

Prabhupāda: I am coming, yes. (break) ...dehaṁ punar janma naiti. Such person, those who are fully absorbed in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, such person, after giving up this body, does not accept any more material body. He goes back to Kṛṣṇa. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti (BG 4.9). "He comes to Me." So you cannot go to Kṛṣṇa unless you have your spiritual body. Because the spiritual world and Kṛṣṇa, they are all spiritual. So you cannot enter into fire unless you are fire. So you have to revive your spiritual body, spiritual consciousness. Then, after giving up this body, you enter the spiritual world. So Lord Buddha did not speak anything about the spiritual world, but his philosophy said that "Dismantle this material existence." Nirvāṇa. Nobody has preached that "You become happy here," either Lord Buddha or Lord Christ or Kṛṣṇa or anybody, Śaṅkara. Nobody. But modern materialistic people, they are thinking that "We can become happy by adjustment of our material condition." That is not possible.

Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London:

Lord Brockway: I think the only thing I'd say is this, that whilst the body that you have and I have is different from the body, the material body, when we were a child, it has been a continuous transformation. It hasn't been the ending of one body and the beginning of another. And in the process of change, a, an existence is carried on. It isn't like death, which means that at that point your personality becomes separated from your physical body suddenly, like that. It is different.

Prabhupāda: No. We become separated from the physical body, but we remain in the astral body, or subtle body, mind, intelligence... mind, intelligence and ego. That mind, material mind, material intelligence, you give up when you actually remain in your spiritual body. So this is also a great science. But unfortunately, there is no discussion on this point in any university of the world. But this is a science. So actual human civilization means they should study, they should inquire about this science and be well conversant.

Room Conversation with Graham Hill Former World Champion Race Car Driver -- London, August 26, 1973:

Śyāmasundara: There is no more body? No more body?

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, this body you have got. Just like this hat and coat, vasamsi, this is covering of your body. So you have got already your spiritual body.

Śyāmasundara: Spiritual body.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is now covered by this material element. So emancipation or salvation means you no more get your material body. But your body is already there. Just like in this body, I have got my body. And because I have got a hand my dress has got a hand. Because I have got a leg, my pant has got a leg. So this superficial, external body is simply covering of your original body. The original body is spiritual. So go back to home back to Godhead means you remain in your original spiritual body. You get freedom from this covering of material body. Now that spiritual body you can transfer to so many ways. Read it.

Room Conversation with Graham Hill Former World Champion Race Car Driver -- London, August 26, 1973:

Prabhupāda: Higher planetary system of demigods, yes.

Pradyumna: "Those who worship ghosts and spirits will take birth amongst such beings. Those who worship ancestors go to the ancestors. And those who worship Me will live with Me."

Prabhupāda: Yes. So we can transfer to any form of body. Simply you have to prepare. But if we remain in our original body then you go back to home, back to Godhead.

Graham Hill: How do we attain our spiritual body?

Prabhupāda: You have got already spiritual body.

Graham Hill: I mean, how did I get my spiritual body?

Prabhupāda: Because you are part and parcel of God. God is all spirit. Just like materially, because you have got white body your son has got white body. Similarly, God is all spirit. Therefore you are son of God, part and parcel of God, then you are all spirit. But you have got this material covering because you wanted to come here and enjoy or lord it over the material nature. Everyone is trying to that. Everyone is trying to become a very prominent man in this material world. That is he can lord it over the material nature. So because you desire to lord it over the material nature you have to accept a material body.

Graham Hill: Are all spiritual bodies the same? I mean, is your spiritual body exactly the same as...

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Spiritually you are all the same. Just like as human beings you are all the same but you may have a black dress, I may have a saffron dress, he may have white dress. This is outward covering. This is not myself. Similarly, dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā (BG 2.13). Within this body the spirit soul is there and he is changing different types of bodies. So when he accepts a process, this going back to home, back to Godhead, to Kṛṣṇa, then he hasn't got to accept any more material body. He remains in his own spiritual body. And spiritual body by original constitution it is eternal. Eternal. Nityaṁ śāśvato 'yam, na hanyate hanyamāne (BG 2.20). na jāyate mriyate vā kadācin. This is a description of it.

Śyāmasundara: In the spiritual bodies aren't there also individualities?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.

Śyāmasundara: My spiritual body won't be the same as...

Prabhupāda: Yes, just like father and son. Son is also individual. Father is also individual. Although the son is born of the body of the father, of the mother. But he is individual. He is individual. He can disobey father or he can obey the father. So long he obeys he is happy. When he disobeys he is unhappy. (to child) Is that all right? Eh? You want to be happy or unhappy? Obey your father, that's all. (laughter) Very simple philosophy. Yes.

Room Conversation -- September 18, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So when these dirty things are washed, then you become as Kṛṣṇa as you in spirit sense. So at the present moment, we are with... Covered means with upādhi. Upādhi. Just like your naked body and this body with shirt and coat. When you take away the shirt and coat, you become original body. Similarly, when you stop accepting this plastering process of body, material body, in different shapes, then you become mukta.

sarvopādhi-vinirmuktaṁ
tat-paratvena nirmalam
hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-
sevanaṁ bhaktir ucyate
(CC Madhya 19.170)

When you begin serving Kṛṣṇa in your original spiritual body, that is called bhakti. (break) ...educated person. If you like you can learn all the things. You read our books. You have got our books?

Guest (1): A few books I have got. Kṛṣṇa, I have got it.

Prabhupāda: So you are member?

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1973, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: So don't accept a guru who cannot stop your death. And from guru's side, it is advised, "Don't become guru if you cannot stop the death of your disciple." This is Bhāgavatam's statement. So our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is to stop death, live eternally with Kṛṣṇa, go back to home, back to Godhead. This is our movement. So our guru gives us this opportunity, no more death. Tyaktvā... After leaving this body, you don't accept any more material body. And if you don't accept material body, then there is no death. As soon as your spiritual, you remain in spiritual body, there is no death. There is no birth also. Death is concomitant where birth is there. If the death is stopped, then there is no birth. And if there is no birth, there is no disease, there is no old age. This is the process. So birth, death, old age, disease can be stopped only by Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So if you don't like to be Kṛṣṇa conscious then what is the use of becoming your disciple, and if the guru, if he cannot stop your death, birth and death, then what is your becoming guru?

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 23, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is Māyāvāda. That is Māyāvāda.

Dr. Patel: Even if you say guru is body,...

Prabhupāda: They make also Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa's inside different.

Dr. Patel: Kṛṣṇa's body is different from your body and my body. Kṛṣṇa body is spiritual.

Prabhupāda: Then why do you make a... Once you say that guru is equal to Kṛṣṇa, and again Kṛṣṇa's body and Kṛṣṇa is not different, but guru's body and guru's soul is different.

Dr. Patel: That's right.

Prabhupāda: No. That's not right.

Dr. Patel: Ātmā is, ātmā is guru...

Prabhupāda: That's not right. Please note it. If you compare the guru is God, then you should compare similarity.

Dr. Patel: Similarity, this body and Kṛṣṇa's body are different.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no, no. That is an ignorance. You do not know.

Dr. Patel: Kṛṣṇa's body is spiritual. His, any part of His body...

Prabhupāda: The Māyāvādīs do that, that Kṛṣṇa...

Morning Walk -- February 23, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: I accept it.

Prabhupāda: Then? Similarly, one who is always merged in Kṛṣṇa thought, his body is not material.

Dr. Patel: That way you say.

Prabhupāda: Yes! Yes, that is the way.

Dr. Patel: Now I understand.

Prabhupāda: Because his material body is not working. That is stopped. He's working simply spiritually. Therefore his body is spiritual. The same example: it has become so hot, red-hot, that it is no more working as iron rod. It is working as fire.

Dr. Patel: Because it burns anybody who touches it.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- March 25, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So... So they... Śarīram, śarīraṁ yad avāpnoti. They get different bodies. But they're individuals. They're individuals.

Dr. Patel: They are individuals till there is a salvation. And after, they are...

Prabhupāda: No, salvation means when they have ceased to accept the material body. That is salvation. Śarīraṁ yad avāpnoti. So avāpnoti means it was not, in the spiritual body there was no such thing, but they accept this material body.

Dr. Patel: This morning I read a very good thing from Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, from Eleventh... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...every day say. Every day say. Every day I say that.

Morning Walk -- March 31, 1974, Bombay:

Mr. Sar: Avyaktaṁ vyaktim āpannam manyante mām...

Prabhupāda: Ah! No, Kṛṣṇa has no such distinction as body and soul. Prakṛtiṁ svām adhiṣṭhāya. He comes in His own, original body. Sambhavāmi yuge... Prakṛtiṁ svām. Not this prakṛti. Svām, the spiritual body. That they do not take.

Mr. Sar: Paraṁ bhāvam ajānanto mamāvyayam anuttamam.

Prabhupāda: Paraṁ bhāvam ajānantaḥ (BG 9.11). That Kṛṣṇa is so powerful that He can come in a spiritual body. Otherwise how He remembers millions of years. If His body's changing, it is material, then how He can remember?

Mr. Sar: Nāhaṁ prakāśaḥ sarvasya yoga-māyā... (BG 7.25).

Prabhupāda: Ah. Yogamāyā-samāvṛtaḥ... Therefore He's not manifest except to the devotee.

Morning Walk -- April 11, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. His physiognomy is sac-cid-ānanda vigraha (Bs. 5.1). That we can understand. Sac-cid-ānanda. He is eternal, He is full of knowledge and He is blissful. Sac-cid-ānanda. Your body, my body, is just opposite. It is not eternal, it is temporary. And it is full of ignorance. Therefore we require knowledge. (aside:) Little away, yes. So this is full of ignorance, and there are so many miseries. So Kṛṣṇa hasn't got a body like this. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa's body is sac-cid-ānanda-vigraha. So we can distinguish what is Kṛṣṇa's body and what is our body. (break) ...understand. Try to understand, that what is the nature... That is called spiritual body. So we have got also similar body, but very small, very small. That is covered by this material body. And because in the spiritual body I am person, I have got form, therefore the material elements have taken a form. Just like when your coat is made, it is made according to your body. Because you have got hands, so the coat has got a hand. But the hand of the coat is not real. The real hand is within the coat.

Morning Walk Excerpts -- May 1, 1974, Bombay:

Yadubara: "You have taken your birth in the Yadu dynasty..." (break)

Prabhupāda: ...says, ātma-māyayā. Ātma-māyayā, His own energy. So the material energy and the spiritual, both of them, are His energy. So even if He appears in a material body, it does not act as material body. It act as spiritual body. Just like same example: The expert electrician, he can turn the refrigerator into heater. Is it not? That is the way. Hare Kṛṣṇa. For Him there is nothing, no distinction, because He is absolute. Similarly, to take the side of the devotee and to kill the enemy of Kṛṣṇa, they are all the same.

Room Conversation with Catholic Cardinal and Secretary to the Pope -- May 24, 1974, Rome:
Prabhupāda: If we simply spoil our life like the animals, eating, sleeping, sex life and defending, then the human life is spoiled like animals. The real necessity of human life is to understand God. Not only to understand God superficially, but to understand our eternal relationship with Him, and then prayojana, the ultimate goal of life, is to go back to home, back to Godhead. That is ultimate goal. And if you simply try to understand God, as we get it from the revealed scriptures, then after giving up this body, tyaktvā dehaṁ... Deham means this body. After this death... There are many deaths in many bodies, but after this death, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9), he does not enter again into the material body. In his original spiritual body he goes back to home, back to Godhead. So this is sum and substance of our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, and we have got many Vedic literatures about it, especially the Bhagavad-gītā and Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.
Room Conversation with devotees about Twelfth Canto Kali-yuga, and Conversation with Guest -- June 15, 1974, Paris:

Jyotirmayī: So he's saying that he respects your explanation, but that the Christians, they have another explanation, and that if we...

Prabhupāda: But we must come to the reason before giving explanation. You cannot explain...

Yogeśvara: What is the reason for his incarnation?

Prabhupāda: You cannot explain whimsically. You cannot explain whimsically. If Jesus Christ is son of God, he has... That means he has got spiritual body. You...

French Woman: Yes, we accept that he got the has got spiritual body, but we say that he assumed also a material body.

Prabhupāda: Now, then, then, another thing is: you accept Jesus Christ the only son of God, is it not? So when you pray in the church, you address God, "Oh Father." Then why "only son"?

French Woman: We say that the son is...

Prabhupāda: Then everyone is son.

French Woman: Yes, we say that this is the same God, yes.

Prabhupāda: If I address God, "My father," then I am his son. So why there should be "only son"? (French)

Room Conversation with devotees about Twelfth Canto Kali-yuga, and Conversation with Guest -- June 15, 1974, Paris:

French Woman: Yes, we say that we are adopted sons. (laughter) (French)

Jyotirmayī: They say that they are sons, that all living beings are sons, but by adoption.

Yogeśvara: Adopted son. Yes.

Prabhupāda: So therefore these sons' body and Jesus's body cannot be equal. So adopted son has got material body, not the real son. (French)

Yogeśvara: Their idea is that: Yes, of course, Lord Jesus, being the son of God, his body is spiritual, but because he wanted to take part in the life of the human beings on earth, he actually accepted a material body just to live among men.

Prabhupāda: Why he should accept?

French Woman: But we have a vesper that says that he was died, that he was suffering, and things which show that...

Prabhupāda: But his death... You think that he was died, but he resurrected.

French Woman: But the gospel says that he had died.

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Room Conversation -- June 20, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: And Bhāgavata says pitā na sa syāj jananī na sā syāt, gurur na sa syāt, na mocayed yaḥ samupeta-mṛtyum. There is no need of becoming father unless you train up your child to accept no more this material body. The child should be trained up by the father. The guru should train up the disciple in such a way that the disciple or the child or the student will not have to accept any more material body. (indistinct) The whole Vedic education system how to stop acceptance of material body. That is called mukti. Mukti, the definition of mukti is given in the Bhāgavata, muktir hitvānyathā rūpam. Mukti means when one is able to give up another form of body. He has got his own body, spiritual body, but so long as he has to accept another form of body, he is conditioned. Bhāgavata, muktir hitvānyathā rūpam sva-rūpeṇa vyavasthitiḥ. Mukti means to stay in his original spiritual form. Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is to educate people how to achieve the original consciousness, that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 15, 1975, Mexico:

Prabhupāda: Now, in the human form of life, we should utilize our intelligence that "This constant change of body, how it can be stopped?" And we should remain in our eternal body because I am eternal, but psychologically I am simply changing different forms of body, and at the time of change of body I have to undergo so many sufferings. To remain within the womb of the mother for ten months in packed up condition, it is a very terrible punishment. But for each new birth, we have to undertake this terrible suffering. Sometimes nowadays they're being killed. So to avoid all these dangers, one should try to remain in his spiritual body so that there will be no more chance of accepting material... Find out this, janma karma me divyaṁ yo jānāti tattvataḥ, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti kaunteya (BG 4.9).

Room Conversation with Professors -- February 19, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: No, no, you misused the perfect knowledge. Just like here is perfect knowledge: Bible says, "Thou shall not kill." You are misusing, you are killing. That is your fault.

Professor (Hṛdayānanda): He wants to know if we are born good and then we learn the bad thing?

Prabhupāda: No, so long we have got this material body—you are born good or bad, but when you do not get this material body—you remain in your spiritual body—that is good. Just like...

Professor (Hṛdayānanda): He said, "So no one can be born bad, but by contact with humanity he becomes bad."

Prabhupāda: Then make the humanity good.

Room Conversation with Metaphysics Society -- February 21, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: Fire is sometimes pleasing and sometimes painful. The fire is the same, but circumstantially, it becomes painful and pleasing. Just like in winter season the fire is pleasing. And in summer season the same fire is painful. Now, these feelings of pains and pleasure is due to this material body. Therefore the material body is the cause of pains and pleasure. So if you do not get this material body—you remain in your spiritual body—then there is no more pains and pleasure. So that means the origin of pains and pleasure is to our attachment to this material body. If we can somehow or other get out of this material body, then there is no more pains and pleasure or it is simply pleasure. Therefore in the Vedānta-sūtra it is said, ānandamāyaḥ abhyāsāt. "By nature the spirit soul is joyful." In the Bhagavad-gītā it is also said, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati: (BG 18.54) "As soon as you become spiritually self-realized, then there is no more pains and pleasure." So pleasure means absence of pain. So in your spiritual identity there is no pain, therefore it is simply pleasure. Therefore our endeavor should be how to get our again original spiritual body. Spiritual body is there already. It is covered by the material body, but some way or other, if we stop the covering of the material body, then we are simply in pleasure. Therefore our only attempt in this human body should be how to revive our spiritual body. And that process is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Room Conversation with Metaphysics Society -- February 21, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: So if you simply understand Kṛṣṇa, then you revive your spiritual body.

Guest (Hṛdayānanda): How or why did this spiritual body become covered by the material body?

Prabhupāda: How your body is covered in a different dress when you go to the prison house? When one goes to the prison, he has to keep his dress separately and take the prison dress. So anyone who comes into this material world, he has to take a material body. This is the law. Unless you have got this material body, how you can feel pleasure in material sense enjoyment? Just like on a stage, if you are going to play, you have to take dress according to the play. Therefore this material body is compared with the dress.

Room Conversation with Metaphysics Society -- February 21, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: No, no, whatever consciousness may be, I say that in the Bible it is said that son of God is Christ. His name is Christ. How you can deny the name? No, no, that is their interpretation, "Christ means 'I am.' " They want to interpret in their own way. There is name. How can you deny it?

Guest (Hṛdayānanda): He is saying that you have said that we have a material body and also a spiritual body. So he wants to know if the spirit and matter are born simultaneously or if the matter is born, the material body is born, and later the spirit comes.

Prabhupāda: No, from spirit the matter has come out. Just like God said, "Let there be creation." So God was there and creation later on. So God is spirit and creation is matter.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta:

Rūpānuga: This other question. During the day of Brahmā at the end of every Manu there's a partial devastation of the planets up to earth and celestial, right? Now, at that time there's like a flood, and the animals that are in their particular stage of transmigration of the living entities, their bodies are all killed. Now, at that time, when the end of that period is over, how are the bodies manifest? This is a question Richard Prabhu was asking.

Prabhupāda: There is no body. They are reserved in the Viṣṇu's body. And again, when there is creation, they come out. And therefore matter comes from the spirit. Matter is there, creation, matter. So take advantage of the matter. Just like the cloth is there. You cut it according (to) your body, and there is a coat. The spiritual body is already there. Now the matter is there. Now, from matter, you take. You make your body like a dog, like a ant, like a fish, like a tree, like this.

Morning Walk -- April 7, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: You are not going to get another body of suffering, that is your advantage. And these rascals, they are going to continue one body after another simply suffering. And for the devotees, although they do not suffer, it is just like, the fan is moving, you make the switch off. It is actually not moving, it is by the last force it is moving, but the switch is off. And it will stop, suffering. But you have no such chance, you will simply go on suffering, moving, moving, moving, bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). You shall have to accept one body, suffer, and again give up this body. Another body suffer, because so long as you accept material body, this body or that body, you will have to suffer. Material body means suffering. So those who are not Kṛṣṇa conscious, they will change bodies one after another, and continue to suffer threefold miseries. And devotees, actually they are not suffering, but even if you say they are suffering, so after giving up this body, they are no more accepting material body. They will remain in spiritual body.

Morning Walk -- May 13, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: No, the philosophy is very simple. You don't want suffering, but where is a person who has got this material body is not suffering?

Paramahaṁsa: But then they will say, "Where is a person who has not got this material body?"

Prabhupāda: There, that is unknown to them. There is another world where there is no material body. Everyone is in spiritual body. That they do not know. That is ignorance.

Paramahaṁsa: They don't feel so bad because they think everyone is suffering, so...

Prabhupāda: So nobody feels bad, even the cats and dogs. That does not mean there is no suffering. Cats and dogs... Just like in this car, the gentleman, his wife, and the dog. The dog is feeling more happy.

Radio Interview -- May 25, 1975, Fiji:

Prabhupāda: Therefore our paper's name is Back to Godhead. Don't make any false advancement. You will never be happy. This is our propaganda. It is called nivṛtti-mārga. Nivṛtti-mārga means stop material way of life; begin spiritual way of life and come to Godhead, Kṛṣṇa, back to home, back to Godhead. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). If you cultivate spiritual life, then, after giving up this body... We have to give up. This is material body. And after giving up this body, we can accept..., we can continue our spiritual body or we can accept again material body. That will require our sense how to cultivate. So if we cultivate spiritual life, some percentage, not that everyone will be able, at least the higher class, higher section of the society, if they cultivate spiritual life and remain ideal, so others may follow. This is our propaganda.

Garden Conversation with Dr. Gerson and devotees -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Dr. Gerson: I think here in America that people probably criticize because they're ignorant, and I hope to...

Prabhupāda: That "American" that I have discussed. Those who are in the bodily concept of life, they are not even human being. They are animals. Yasyātmā-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke (SB 10.84.13). One who takes this body, "I am, I am American, I am German, I am Englishman, I am Indian," they are animals. They are not even human being. When you deny, that "I am not American, I am not Indian, not Englishman. I am not this body," then he is in the spiritual body. That's all. And so long he will identify that "I am this body, and because my body is American, therefore I am American," that is animal life. That is not even human life. So that is going on all over the world, identifying the body as self. "I am American, I am German, I am Englishman, I am Indian." The whole United Nation is based on this conception. So where is the unity? If you are thinking as "American" or "Indian" or "Pakistani" or "German," so where is the question of unity? But they have manufactured a false method, United Nations, by lecturing. Just like if you bring a dozen of dogs and ask them, "Live peacefully," will they live peacefully? They will bark, "Ow! Ow! Ow!" So this is going on. If you keep them as they are, dogs, how you can expect unity? So they should not remain as dogs. They should come to become human beings, then there is question of... But they want to keep them as dogs, and at the same time, they want to unite. Therefore it is unsuccessful. Is it not? Is it not unsuccessful?

Dr. Gerson: I couldn't hear.

Devotees: United Nations unsuccessful.

Dr. Gerson: Oh, it is unsuccessful. Yes. I meet many people in the course of my work that are very unhappy because of the frustrations that they experience.

Room Conversation with Dr. John Mize -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Yes. Unless he has got mind, how he misuses intelligence?

John Mize: But he misused that intelligence in his freedom, his independence.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. Mind is there also. That is spiritual mind. Everything is spiritual. There is nothing material. Body spiritual, mind spiritual, intelligence spiritual, he is spiritual, the land spiritual, water spiritual—everything is spiritual. That is spiritual world. Here in the material world, except the spirit soul, everything is material. And he is encumbered with this material atmosphere by twenty-seven stratas, layers. The five elements, gross elements, then ten senses, and then three guṇas... In this way there are twenty-seven layers. He is within, and he has to be taken out. That is called liberation.

Morning Walk -- June 27, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: A temporary life for fifty years or sixty years, they are busy, making very, very, gorgeous arrangement. This is asuric civilization. He does not take it very seriously that "I am encaged in this material body. My first business is how to get out of it and remain in my spiritual body." They get one type of body, and, like cats and dogs, engage, how to keep that body in sense gratification. That's all. (break) ...spiritual education, that "I am spiritual, spirit soul. I am encaged in this body. I want freedom. That is my first business, how to become liberated." No, that question set aside. Now, for the time being, we are walking here, and if there is some misunderstanding, we fight, forgetting that we have come here for walking, say, for half an hour. And why we shall forget our real business? That intelligence is not there. (break) ...India the Indira Gandhi was made as all in all. Now there is a catastrophe. We do not know what is going to happen.

Morning Walk -- September 30, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: Even though we see Him as an ordinary physical body or a human body, but that is divya body, and it is not contaminated by any guṇas.

Prabhupāda: And because it is not contaminated, therefore it is not ordinary body. Therefore anyone who thinks of Kṛṣṇa as possessing ordinary body, he is described as mūḍha. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhāḥ mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritāḥ (BG 9.11). In the ordinary human, this material body, nobody can be controller of the laws of nature. That is not possible. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. Unless one has got spiritual body, it is not possible to be unaffected by this material world. Kṛṣṇa never became old although He lived for a 125 years. He never became old.

Morning Walk -- November 1, 1975, Nairobi:

Devotee(4): Śrīla Prabhupāda, you said that our body was made by (indistinct). Why should we (indistinct)? But why should we come back?

Prabhupāda: Because you have this material body, you have got so many necessities and God has no material body. He has got spiritual body. He has no necessity. Apta kama. He is fully satisfied. He doesn't require to take anything.

Brahmānanda: He doesn't get hungry or thirsty.

Prabhupāda: Neither. Neither of these things because He hasn't got material body. You have got this material body; therefore you have got all these defects.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Press Conference -- April 27, 1976, Auckland, New Zealand:

Prabhupāda: We are wrongly accepting this body. And that kind of acceptance is there in the animals. The dog also thinking that "I am this body." So if I am thinking like that, "I am this body," then what is the difference between the dog and me? We are educating from him that point of view, that the living entity is entrapped within this body, and according to his desire, he's changing different types of body and undergoing continually birth and death. So in order to save him from the cycle of birth and death, one has to understand God, or Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa means God. Then he comes to his real, identical position as spiritual body, and then he lives forever. He lives forever.

Garden Conversation -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Bharadvāja: Śrīla Prabhupāda, we don't have to learn the activities of our spiritual body?

Prabhupāda: Yes, when you are revived. Therefore the Vedic injunction is that now you have got this human form of body, you get up to your original position. Uttiṣṭhata jāgrata prāpta varan nibodhata. This is the Vedic injunction. Jīva jāgo jīva jāgo, Caitanya Mahāprabhu says. Jīva jāgo jīva jāgo gauracanda bole kota nidrā jāo māyā-piśācīra kole. How long you'll sleep? Here is the opportunity. Try to understand yourself. That is self-realization. And go back to home, back to Godhead. Why you are struggling here? Kṛṣṇa is coming. He is also saying the same, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). Why you are rotting in this material world? So for spiritual awakening there are so many attempts by God Himself, by His devotees, by books, so many ways. But we are not inclined. That is our fault.

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Arcita: Śrīla Prabhupāda, just like in this material body there are so many millions of living entities, but there's one living entity, myself, who's thinking that "I am this body." Is it the same way in the spiritual body—there are many living entities in one body but there's one living entity who's thinking that "I am this body"?

Prabhupāda: Explain.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: There's many living entities within the body. Just like there's tiny germs, worms, all kinds of living beings. Because of our attachment, our particular modes of material nature, kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu (BG 13.22), we are identifying with this material body.

Arcita: Is it the same in the spiritual body? Is it the same in the spiritual body? Is the spiritual body actually composed of many living entities, but there's one living entity...

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The spiritual body is identical with the soul. Here in the material world there is duality, inferior and superior. In the spiritual world everything is of a superior nature. There is no duality. There's no material.

Prabhupāda: Petrol smelling everywhere.

Room Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Richard: Okay, okay. You said in the purport that tragedies of life—I'm paraphrasing—tragedies of life such as death of even a close relative are mere incidental occurrences. Is...? But you said earlier that death to you was anything but a mere incidental occurrence, that it was the...

Prabhupāda: No, we are not irresponsible to the death. Death, although we have to meet death, we are making provision that after death we become happy. Happy, of course, for us, even in living condition or dead condition, there is happiness, but it will take time to understand. But taking superficially, death is not very pleasing, so after death, that is mentioned in the Bha.... Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma (BG 4.9), we do not get again a material body. This is final. The material body is the cause of pains and pleasure. So if you don't get the material body, if you remain in your spiritual body, that is real enjoyment.

Interview with Kathy Kerr Reporter from The Star -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Kathy Kerr: Do you consider that going..., your movement then is basically more of an educational movement than a religious movement.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Educational. It is religious, but it is not a man-made religious. Our idea.... I have already explained that our idea of religion means that like the sugar, it must be sweet. It is not that in Europe sugar is not sweet, in India it is sweet. Sugar, wherever it is, it is sweet. Similarly, the soul, the spirit soul is the same everywhere. So he, the spirit soul, is now embodied within this material body, and he is suffering on account of this material body. So we are teaching everyone how to get out of this material body and stay in his original, spiritual body. This is our real movement. This is another way..., another name is liberation. We are suffering within this body. Our suffering means on account of this body. So if there is such science how to continue our life without changing body, that science we are teaching. It is purely educational.

Kathy Kerr: Do you believe then that when your physical body dies, that your spiritual body...

Prabhupāda: That I have already explained, that your physical body as child's body, dead, gone. How you are living? This simple truth we cannot understand. Where is this child's body? Where is that, can you answer?

Kathy Kerr: Child's body?

Prabhupāda: Yes, you had a body, a small child's body. Is it not?

Kathy Kerr: Yes.

Interview with Kathy Kerr Reporter from The Star -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Kathy Kerr: Does that mean then that once the immediate corporal body is dead, the one that you have...

Prabhupāda: Yes. We have to conclude.... This is, what is called, logic, that my, I have changed my body, still I am living. Therefore when I change this body, I shall live. This is the logic.

Kathy Kerr: Does your spiritual body keep the same training that you...

Prabhupāda: Same, that is another.... Just like you are in different type of dress, I am in different type of dress, that is another thing. Dress may be changed in different types, but I, the owner of the dress, is the same. Now a person, the same person, when he's dressed as a high-court judge, he's dealing differently in the high-court. And the same person, after giving up his garment of high-court judge, he talks with the wife and children in a different way, talking. The wife does not address him, "My lord." The wife calls, Mr. John. "John, why you are doing this?" She has no respect, as the respect he gets in the court. Man is the same, circumstance is different.

Interview with Kathy Kerr Reporter from The Star -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Kathy Kerr: If a sufficient number of people could take care of their spirits, could achieve an understanding of the spiritual body and so forth, do you think that that would solve, say for instance...

Prabhupāda: It is not possible that, because, at the present moment the number of educated persons, there are many. Many Ph.D.'s, D.H.C.'s but nobody understands it. You cannot expect a fair number of persons understanding it. It requires little higher brain. But even some percent of the population understands this philosophy, then there will be peace and prosperity. Not that everyone. Just like in my body, not that every part of my body is brain. But if the brain is in order, then other parts of the body will act nicely. The leg is not brain, but if the brain is in order, the leg will move nicely. The difficulty is there is no brain. So without brain, without head, when the body moves it is ghost. So it is ghostly civilization. All ghosts. There is a kind of ghost, perhaps you know, that without head. If a man is chopped of his head, and if he has got attraction, then he becomes a ghost without head. So at the present moment, all these so-called educated civilized men are ghosts without head. You now this, there is some ghosts without head?

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Bill Sauer: I believe the spirit of life lives on totally in this marvelous planet earth, but I feel the spirit has to be carried and nurtured and improved in the body. So I feel we have to carry the bodies, the material bodies, to the other planets to allow the spiritualism to live there also.

Prabhupāda: That is in the material world. If you want to stay in the material, then you change the material body just suitable for a particular place, atmosphere. But we have got our spiritual body. That spiritual body, without any material covering, you can transfer to the spiritual world.

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Anything within this material world will be all destroyed. But there is another nature, that is being described. Paras tasmāt tu bhāvo 'nyo 'vyakto 'vyaktāt sanātanaḥ (BG 8.20).

Bill Sauer: But the spirit is manufactured in the body, is it not, sir?

Prabhupāda: Yes, spirit is, but there is a spiritual world also, where you don't require this material body, you remain in your spiritual body.

Bill Sauer: But if there is no bodies left, they are all burned up, there's no spiritual development.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) No, that is not the fact.

Bill Sauer: So you need to take the bodies somewhere so that... (laughs)

Prabhupāda: No, so long you are in the material world you need to take a material body, but if you are in your original spiritual body, then you remain in the spiritual world.

Radio Interview -- July 27, 1976, London:

Mike Robinson: Are you say that we were perhaps something else before we were born as well? And we keep coming back in something else next time?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Mike Robinson: And how long does this go on?

Prabhupāda: This is going on, this is going on, because you are eternal. According to your work, you are simply changing body. Therefore you should be educated how to stop this business, how to remain in our original, spiritual body. And that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.

Meeting with Italian Printer -- August 5, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Translator: He says this freedom to go anywhere and everywhere...

Prabhupāda: This is one of the items, there are so many others.

Translator: So he's pointing out that when one acts in complete freedom, he follows a path, a definite path to attain a certain truth.

Prabhupāda: You get a spiritual body, that means freedom, no condition.

Translator: But he's asking where we're finding that truth. Can we find it only in the scriptures, in following all the regulative principles we're following day after day, or can we find also that truth by following our own path, by keeping our own freedom to do whatever we like?

Prabhupāda: No, you have no freedom. You have to accept some way for freedom.

Evening Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Attachment maybe, that is not a very important thing. But if there is a process, how to become independent of this body, why should we not take it? That is intelligence. Just like a man suffering from illness, attachment or no attachment, he's now suffering from that illness, but he has put himself into hospitalization under some physician. So that process will cure him and he'll not suffer from this disease. That is the hope. Or that is the fact. Similarly, circumstantially, we may be dependent on this material body, but if there is a process how we can become independent of the body, why should we not take it? The same example, if a man is diseased, he's captured by the disease. Attachment or no attachment, it is difficult. But he must put himself under treatment so that he can be detached from it. That is intelligence. I am caught by the disease. So let me suffer without any treatment. That is not intelligence. I must take the process of treatment by which... That is explained there, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). Take this treatment so that after giving up this body you'll not have any more material body. And as soon as you become free from this material body, there is no suffering. But as soon as you get a material body, you must suffer. So if there is way and means to avoid this material body, and remain in our original spiritual body, why should we not take it. That is intelligence. That is a very simple thing. Read it again.

Evening Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Atreya Ṛṣi: So your question is whether one can enter this kingdom of God with this body.

Prabhupāda: No, that is already explained—tyaktvā dehaṁ. Giving up this body, one can enter in the spiritual world. Viśate tad-anantaram—after death. By bhakti, when he's mature and he gives up this body, then he enters into the spiritual world. Tyaktvā deham, giving up this body. You cannot enter, although by devotional service the material activities of the body will stop, but you have to wait for the moment when this material body is no more existing, then with spiritual body you can enter. Tyaktvā deham, mām eti. Viśate tad-anantaram. Tad-anantaram after death. And if you have got little pinch of material attachment, then you'll have to accept another material body. So we have (to) come to the point that no more I want anything material.

Morning Walk -- August 23, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: That is spiritual life. When you are not enwrapped with this material body, then is ānanda.

Indian man: But that life itself is temporary and then...

Prabhupāda: No, that is not temporary. That is permanent. That is to stay with God. That is permanent.

Indian man: But you will do so only so long as you are in your body, is it not? After you leave the body then probably you might attain mokṣa for a temporary period.

Prabhupāda: No. That is impersonalism. And those who actually go to Godhead, they remain in their spiritual body.

Indian man: Between meditation and kīrtana, which is the easier and...

Prabhupāda: Kīrtana. Yes. Meditation means you'll think of your business and all sleep, snoring. That is meditation. (laughter) (end)

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with Yogi Amrit Desai of Kripalu Ashram (PA USA) -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Trivikrama: And the spiritual body? Spiritual body means...

Prabhupāda: Soul. Spiritual body is now covered with the material body. So anything material, that will not exist. So body is finished; then he has to find new body. Just like the dress is old; it is finished, you take another dress. And when you haven't got to take dress, or this material body, and you remain in your spiritual body, that is called mukti. That can be achieved only in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti (BG 4.9). Mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām (BG 9.25). If you practice Kṛṣṇa consciousness then it is possible; otherwise not. Tyaktvā deham. Everyone has to give up because this body will be old, and one has to give it up. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma (BG 4.9), he doesn't accept any more material body.

Room Conversation -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...aerodrome is near.

Dr. Patel: I reach aerodrome from my place in three minutes. And you (indistinct). (discussion of airplanes and helicopters)

Prabhupāda: Chambur, I stayed there for a week. So almost on head, aeroplanes.

Dr. Patel: They come this way and they, on the head on Santa Cruz. Few of them are like that... (break) ...New York.

Prabhupāda: Kennedy airport? There are two, three airports. (break) ...forget spiritual body. Next time he is going to be dog. That he does not know.

Dr. Patel: (laughs) Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu, sir. Even dog has in his day. There is the dominance of God.

Prabhupāda: No, no. We don't hate dog. We say that this life is meant for getting release from this repetition of birth and death. Otherwise punaḥ punaś carvita... Either you become a dog or a hog or a man or a god. The business is āhāra-nidra-bhaya-maithuna... (break) (bell rings)

Correspondence

1967 Correspondence

Letter to Madhusudana -- San Francisco 30 December, 1967:

Regarding smearing on the Body of Lord Jagannatha: You should always know that the Body of Lord Jagannatha is spiritual. We are given the chance of serving the Spiritual Body and according to Revealed Scriptures, we should serve the Transcendental Body of the Deity just as we try to serve our worshipable personalities. To continue a sense of devotion, it is better to wash the Body of Lord Jagannatha with hot water so that we may have the feeling that Lord Jagannatha is more comfortable. We should offer foodstuffs to the Deity and allow enough time to eat them. These are all transcendental sentiments. At Vrindaban, the Deities are offered foodstuffs and time is allowed as in the case of others. Yes, before offering anything to the Deity you must be satisfied that it is a first class offering and there is no objection if you taste it by smelling. But you should not smell for other purposes. The whole idea is that devotional service should always be immune from sense gratification.

1968 Correspondence

Letter to Madhusudana -- Los Angeles 1 February, 1968:

Yes, the analogy concerning the spiritual body of the Sat-Guru is acceptable, but not in the material sense. In the material world, the gold box and the gold plated box may be different in price, but in spiritual world there is no such distinction. There the gold box and the gold plated box are the same. In material world there is difference between a sweeper and a cooker; in the spiritual world a person who sweeps the Temple and a person who worships in the Temple are all the same. That is absolute knowledge.

Letter to Aniruddha -- San Francisco 9 April, 1968:

There are two kinds of dissolution. One is when Brahma goes to sleep, and another is when Brahma dies. When Brahma goes to sleep, the highest planetary system does not dissolve, the lower planetary systems, beginning from heavenly planets downwards, everything is dissolved. And when the day comes out, they are again created. When the living entities enter into Brahma, or into the Body of Narayana, they keep their own spiritual body, that is very small, 1/10,000 of tip of hair, and when there is again material creation, they manifest again with different kinds of body. Just like a man sleeps at home without any dress, and when he goes out to work, he dresses himself. So similarly in creation, there is different kinds of bodies for working, and whenever there is no creation they remain in their own spiritual body sleeping. No, there is no complete annihilation at the end of Kali yuga, there may be some disturbances, but not complete annihilation. There are thousands of Kali yugas in every day of Brahma, and they come and go just like seasonal changes.

Letter to Nandarani -- Seattle 15 October, 1968:

Regarding your question: The spirit soul of Krishna's entourage, all the associates of Krishna or anyone situated in Vaikuntha the spiritual sky, never mind, either in Vaikunthas or in Krishna Loka, they have no separate body. Just like Krishna has no differentiation between body and soul, similarly, those who are transferred or living eternally in the spiritual sky, they haven't got also such distinction, between spirit and body. The body is also spiritual and the soul is also spiritual. Not only the body, everything, all spiritual. The spiritual world is expansion of Krishna's spiritual or internal energy. So there is no difference of body. But if somebody comes from the spiritual world for material activities, he has to accept the material body, but that is not applicable in the case of the Supreme Lord. Because he does not come to the material world for some material enjoyment. Mayavadi philosophers they also say that when God comes also in the material world, He has to accept the material body but that is not a fact. Because even God accepts a material body, apparently, still He does not act materially. Because both material energy and spiritual energy are under the control of the Supreme Lord; as such, He is completely powerful to transform matter into spirit, or spirit into matter. That is the position. So far associates of Krishna, they are expansion of His spiritual energy.

Letter to Saradia -- Los Angeles 12 December, 1968:

You have asked how Krishna is with the spirit soul in the spiritual world and the answer is that Krishna is the heart of the spirit soul, or spiritual body, So Krishna is never apart from us. Either He remains in the heart of the material body, or He remains in the heart of the spiritual body. This is Krishna's Causeless Mercy to all of His beloved children, or living entities.

1969 Correspondence

Letter to Upendra -- Columbus, Ohio 8 May, 1969:

Regarding your question about the difference between mind and soul, the mind is one of the senses, and the soul is the owner of the senses, including the mind. The mind is material, just like the material body, but when the material coverings are taken away, as we revive our spiritual body, similarly we revive our spiritual mind also. At the present moment, my material mind, intelligence and ego is carrying me in different types of bodies, because mind has different desires, and it carries the soul just like finer air carries the flavor of the flower or some other smell. So the mind is an instrument, and the soul is the worker of the instrument.

Letter to Yamuna -- New Vrindaban 27 May, 1969:

I have received your last three letters, and in the last one, dated 24th May, 1969, you have inquired about the Jagannatha Car. The crimson color with silver decorations is quite all right. There is no strict regulation about decorating the cars. We can decorate the cars very fascinatingly with gold, silver, and other shiny metallic embroidery work as far as possible. The idea is the more we decorate Krishna, Who is nondifferent from His car also, the more we become decorated indirectly. We are compared as the shadow of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and as it is stated in the Bible also, man is made after God. We understand from the scriptures that Krishna has His Vigraha, or Spiritual Body, exactly like a man who has two hands, two legs and all similar features. If you decorate your face, you do not see directly how your face has become beautiful, but when you see the reflection of your face in the mirror, then indirectly you can see the beauty. Therefore, by serving Krishna directly the result of the service indirectly comes to us.

Letter to Vrndavanesvari -- New Vrindaban 6 June, 1969:

For the purpose of delivering the fallen living entities they come here temporarily and then go back when their business is finished, and this is all under the direct order of the Lord. So the appearance of the Lord or the great liberated souls in the material is different from the appearance of the contaminated living entity who is forced to take birth in the material world due to his desire to lord it over the world. In your second question you asked if we will remember the earth, when in Vrindaban, and the answer is certainly. When Narada Muni was talking to Vyasadeva, as you may have read in first volume of our Srimad-Bhagavatam, he was in a spiritual body, but he remembered his previous life and explained it to Vyasadeva. In material life there is forgetfulness, but in spiritual life there is no forgetfulness. I hope this will sufficiently answer these questions for you.

Letter to Rupanuga -- Los Angeles 24 July, 1969:

The spirit souls in the Brahmajyoti, although they have no desire for sense gratification, still they feel inconvenience like the ghost, and they fall down again in the Maya's atmosphere and develop a material body. In the Bhagavat therefore it is said that persons who are impersonalists and do not develop the dormant devotional attitude, their intelligence is not pure, because for want of a spiritual body, they come down again to the material world. In the Bhagavad-gita it is clearly said by the Lord that the only way of not coming back to the material world is to be promoted to the spiritual planets. For the impersonalists there is no such assurance of not falling down in the whole Vedic literature. The conclusion is that without developing the spiritual body and without being situated on one of the spiritual planets, the so-called liberation is also illusion, or it is not complete. A spirit soul who falls down from the Brahmajyoti to the Kingdom of Maya may have a chance of associating with a pure devotee, and then he may be elevated to the spiritual planets of Vaikuntha or to Goloka Vrindaban. From the Brahmajyoti there is no direct promotion to the spiritual planets, and it is clearly stated in the Bhagavatam that such souls fall down: patanty adha.

Letter to Yoland -- Los Angeles 30 July, 1969:

You have asked the question, "What is the difference between a Mayavadi philosopher and a Krishna Conscious person?" The answer is that the Mayavadi philosopher has only imperfect knowledge of God, whereas the Krishna Conscious person can understand Krishna fully. The example is given that a person may know about the sunlight, but that does not mean that he knows about the Sun God within the Sun planet. Within the Sun there is a Sun God, named Vivaswan, and his body and the bodies of the other inhabitants are made of fire. It is the heat from these fiery bodies that gives warmth and light to this universe. So if someone knows something about the sunlight, it does not mean that he has knowledge about Vivaswan. Similarly, from Krishna's Spiritual Body there is the emanation of the Brahma effulgence, but even if they are able to merge into this effulgence emanating from Krishna's Body, are able to merge into this effulgence emanating from Krishna's Body, that does not give them perfect knowledge of the Source of everything. This Source is Sri Krishna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So both the Mayavadi philosopher and the Krishna Conscious person is seeking spiritual advancement, but the Krishna Conscious man is higher because he is going to the Source of everything, including the Brahma effulgence. I hope you will understand this nicely.

1970 Correspondence

Letter to Hamsaduta -- Los Angeles 23 January, 1970:

The next question: the body of a pure devotee is all spiritual and He is not different from His body. That is also a fact. The bodies of all living entities, even though they are not pure devotees, are not actually the bodies of the spirit soul. It is always separate from the spiritual body. The Vedic mantra confirm it by the sound vibration that this spirit soul is always nonattached with the material body. Therefore, we do not see the actual spiritual body of a pure devotee; but what we see, that is matter.

Letter to Hayagriva -- Los Angeles 23 February, 1970:

Some of the Gopis were detained, not allowed to go to Krsna, we accept that the Gopis danced with Krsna anyway, and they went in their spiritual body. Whatever was detained was material body.

1971 Correspondence

Letter to Jayadvaita -- Bombay 17 March, 1971:

14:27: Impersonal Brahman is the constitutional position of ultimate happiness because without coming to the brahma-bhutah platform and remaining engaged in the activities of brahman nobody can be joyful. To realize that aham brahmasmi is the first step of transcendental life. After one is in full knowledge that he is not this body, but is spiritual soul, he can effectually engage himself in the transcendental service of the Lord. It is not that one develops any other identity, but the soul in its liberated existence is Brahman or pure spirit always. You know that each of the successive realizations of the Supreme Personality of Godhead includes the earlier realizations in the order of Brahman, Paramatma and Bhagavan. If you want to go into the sun planet, you have first to go into the sunshine; then you remain in the sunlight. It is not that when you reach the sun planet you will no longer be in the sunlight.

Letter to Jadurani -- Calcutta 19 May, 1971:

Vidura looks like a human being; "self-same body" means looking like material body. Any devotee always is in a spiritual body although it may appear material; Smoke is smoke; When Krishna says unto me, he means unto "me." So he should not be pictured with Radharani,* Why a snake? Being entangled in the qualities of material nature is very subtle, so why a snake?

Letter to Jadurani -- Bombay 8 June, 1971:

You can show in sequence in a painting how Narada Muni is leaving the material body and accepting a spiritual body and entering into Lord Visnu and again coming out through Brahma's heart.

1976 Correspondence

Letter to Vidya -- Vrindaban 25 October, 1976:

In answer to your questions; 1) Tulasi is one devotee who appears wherever there is devotion to Krsna. 2) Tulasi's body is spiritual. 3) Yes, jewelry is alright. 4) If possible. 5) Tulasi leaves should be offered to the Deity. 6) If possible. 7) Yes. 8) Yes. 9) You may cut the dead branches, but what is the necessity. 10) I never said that. 11) No. 12) Yes. 13) Use the wood for beads as far as possible, the balance may be placed within the earth. 14) I said no chemical sprays. 15) Undisturbed means what? 16) Use common sense and if you have none then consult with others. 17) No. 18) Don't try to introduce something new. The most important thing is the love and devotion.

Page Title:Spiritual Body (Conversations and Letters)
Compiler:Rishab, Visnu Murti
Created:21 of May, 2011
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=68, Let=16
No. of Quotes:84