Prabhupāda: Friendship. That is also... There are five kinds of relationship. Just like "God is great." That is simply feeling the greatness of God. Then, when he feels exactly how God is great, then naturally there will be an inclination to serve God. That is called servitude. First neutrality estimation... That is called śānta-rasa, neutral, no activity but simply appreciating, "God is great," simply appreciation. And then servitude. When the appreciation is complete, "Oh, why not serve God? He is so great. He is giving us so many things. Let me return something. Let me do some service of Him." Servitude. That is further development of the appreciation of the greatness of God. And then further development is friendship. Friendship means... Service means I ask you, "Please give me a glass of water." You give me. And friendship means you are thinking, "How my friend will be... Now he may be wanting a glass of water." So before asking me, if you give me, "I think you may require a glass of water," that is friendship. Friendship means feeling friend's welfare always. Suhṛt. Friendship is not simply chatting. Friendship means thinking, "How my friend will be happy?" This is friendship.
Service to God (Conversations)
Conversations and Morning Walks
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
Guest (4) (Indian man): You said the approach to spiritual goal, through this way, Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Rāma. Okay. Now there is another philosophy which has been preached by Ramakrishna and Vivekananda: "The service of man is the service of God."
Prabhupāda: And why not service of God service of man?
Guest (4): No...
Prabhupāda: First of all answer this. If service of man is service of God, why not service of God, service of man?
Guest (4): Okay. It is one and the same thing because within man is within the soul, which is...
Guest (4): Okay. It is one and the same thing because within man is within the soul, which is...
Prabhupāda: So, one thing, suppose that service of God is service of man, then why should you go door to door serving ... If God is service of man, if you say service of man is service of God, then service of God is service of man.
Guest (4): Okay. Fine.
Prabhupāda: That's all. Now if by serving God I can serve whole humanity...
Guest (4): That's good.
Prabhupāda: Then how we can serve the whole by serving the part?
Guest (4): Well, because it is a problem today, and right now, we country...
Prabhupāda: Your argument is that service of man is service of God. That is your point. I say that if service of man is service of God, then service of God is service of man. First of all you yes or no, you say it.
Guest (4): It is one and the same but because I don't know God...
Prabhupāda: Then we serve God. You serve men. That's all.
Prabhupāda: Now, philosophy,... Your argument is service of man is service of God.
Guest (4): It is not my argument. It is argument of Ramakrishna and Vivekananda.
Prabhupāda: Now you are representing Ramakrishna. You are representing Ramakrishna. That's all. I take it.
Guest (4): Because I am also in doubt about... I want to know the truth.
Prabhupāda: The truth is... The example I have given you, that service of the body means service of the stomach. Service of the body does not mean service of the finger.
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is vijñāna. So jñāna knowledge, first knowledge, is what is God, what is God and what is my relation with Him. This is knowledge. Then you... When you act according to that knowledge, that is vijñāna. That is bhakti. When you understand fully well that "God is great, and I am a small minute part and parcels of God," and then you understand that the part and parcel's duty is to serve the whole... Is it not? Just like the finger is part and parcel of my body. Its duty is to serve the whole body. Similarly, if we accept, if we understand, that "I am part and parcel of God; then my duty is to serve God."
Prabhupāda: Go everywhere, every part of the world, and give Kṛṣṇa. That is the best service you can do. And actually, they are now feeling, because they are Indians. Even in India, where there are so many devotees of Kṛṣṇa, but when they saw "These American devotees are so nice," thirty thousand people were coming daily. And what was our magic? This man was asking me, "Swamiji, what magic you have got?" I said, "I have got this magic that I don't tell lie. I don't make 'This rascal is God.' God is Kṛṣṇa. That is my magic. I don't bluff people. Here is God. See God, be with God, serve God. That's my business." Why God should be unseen? You see Kṛṣṇa. If Kṛṣṇa says that "I am taste of the water," while you are drinking water, tasting, "Oh, here is Kṛṣṇa." As soon as you see sunshine, moonshine, "Oh, here is Kṛṣṇa." As soon as there is a nice flavor, "Oh, here is Kṛṣṇa."
Revatīnandana: The point is that there must be direct connection with God. If God's name is there, if God's service is there, if God's form is there, then we are interested.
Prabhupāda: Nirbandhe kṛṣṇa sambandhe. Everything must be related with God.
Sister Mary: Well, if you're relaxing, if you need to relax, and you sit and listen to some music, it doesn't say praise God all the time, but in fact is, because it's beautiful.
Prabhupāda: No, we don't accept anything beautiful without God. Without God, everything is ugly to us. Everything ugly.
Revatīnandana: Just like we have so many beautiful songs and melodies and everything. They're very nice. And we sing these songs. They are glorifying the Lord. And we enjoy like that. Music is there, everything is there, but because it is directly in the devotional service of God, therefore there is this bhakti, there is this devotion there. Devotion to God. Without that, everything becomes void. Tasteless.
Guest (2): Can I get one point straight? Is the Beethoven symphony all right provided it is blessed as an object and a work of art. Is it then all right? Or is it not all right because it doesn't use religious themes?
Haṁsadūta: Originally, music and art were employed only to glorify the Lord in the scripture and...
Prabhupāda: In Sāma-veda, Sāma-veda.
Prabhupāda: We are trying to bring all men..., of different dimensions, different divisions, to come to this position, always thinking that I am part and parcel of God. My real position is to serve God. Just like this finger is part and parcel of my body. The business of the finger is to serve the body. So long it is in normal condition, the finger is meant for serving the body. When the finger is painful or in abnormal condition it cannot serve the body. Similarly, the living entity, being part and parcel of God, when we cannot serve God that is his abnormal condition. And when he serves God that is his normal condition. That is designation-less position. That is our program.
Dr. Weir: Well, I think to each person his picture is different too.
Śyāmasundara: The idea there is that in spiritual activity everything is seen in relationship to God and if you serve God with your every activity...
Prabhupāda: Yes. The same example, just like this finger is part and parcel of body. So long it is attached with the body there's not activities. You cut it from my body, there's no activity.
Dr. Weir: Yes, but you've still got a body.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Śyāmasundara: The God is there and we are His servants.
Prabhupāda: If you are part and parcel of God then we must be active in serving God. That is my analogy.
Dr. Weir: But I don't see the need for analogy. That statement is sufficient.
Prabhupāda: Why not? Why not? There must be a need. If you think, if you know that you're part and parcel of God then you must act for God.
Dr. Weir: You see, I would go the other way round and say that as long as I know that God is part and parcel...
Prabhupāda: Now I do not know what other people give analogy, but my business is that we take it from Bhagavad-gītā that living entities are part and parcel of God. Therefore, just like this part and parcel of my body is active in relationship with this body but if it is cut off from the body, it is no more active. Similarly, those who are not active in rendering service to God, they're as dead as this finger cut off from the body. So they have to be awakened to that consciousness. Just like a tree, you cut it, it has no consciousness to protest. But, even an ant, a small ant, because it has developed consciousness, you try to kill it, it'll protest. Therefore the more consciousness you develop, you become active. That is nature's law. That is nature's law. Developed consciousness does not mean to become dead.
Śyāmasundara: Just like you were saying a while ago that if you were in God consciousness, you need not wear a robe. That's also our philosophy. It's very practical. But your consciousness would be always serving Kṛṣṇa, always serving God in whatever status of life. It isn't necessary to put on a robe first and then do like that.
Dr. Weir: But it helps some people.
Mensa Member: The soul is a very interesting concept, the soul as well, the fact that the soul is quantifiable, that it exists in a smaller part in the larger animals, and a higher part in a higher animals.
Śyāmasundara: No. It's the same size in all entities.
Mensa Member: Oh, it is, is it? But when we reach a point when we don't know whether there are living things or not, you know, the amino acids, and things like that or...
Dr. Weir: Well, I would take up that straight away, fundamentally, that it's perfectly correct to say it's the same size in every (indistinct) has no size.
Prabhupāda: No. It has size. We cannot measure it.
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: When you see Him. (pause) Then you'll understand. Just like when you eat you needn't require to ask anybody whether you are feeling strength or your hunger is satisfied. If you eat, you understand that you are satisfied, you are feeling strength, you're feeling energy. It doesn't require to inquire anyone. Similarly, if actually, if you serve God, then you'll understand that "God is dictating me. God is, I am seeing God."
Brahmānanda: Or God's representative.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Brahmānanda: Or God's representative.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: That is material life.
Bob: You're working towards material gains, not giving up all material.
Prabhupāda: Material life means when you desire to gratify your senses, that is material life. And when you desire to serve God, that is spiritual life. That is the difference between material life and spiritual life. Now we are trying to serve our senses. Instead of serving the senses, when we serve God, that is spiritual life. What is the difference between our activities and others' activities? We are using everything: table, chair, bed, this tape recorder, typewriter. So what is the difference? The difference is that we are using everything for Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all we have to know ourselves. To know ourselves means self-realization: "I am not this body. I am spirit soul." Then what is this spirit soul? Naturally, part and parcel of God. Therefore as spirit soul my duty is to serve God. That is religion, plain thing. Just like this finger is part and parcel of my body. It is serving me. That is healthy condition. If there is any pain—"Oh, this finger cannot scratch. I'm feeling pain"—that is irreligion. So long the part and parcel of my body, the finger, cannot serve me, it is not normal condition. So every living being is part and parcel of God. So long he's unable to serve God, that is his material condition. But as soon as he's engaged actually in the service of God, that is his real liberated position. Same example: If the finger is diseased, it cannot serve. But when it is serving, that is healthy condition.
Prabhupāda: That is not possible. You must be serving somebody. Just like you are serving government, he is serving some office, because service is our nature. So we are not happy because the service is misplaced. When the service is rightly placed, then it is our normal condition. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says that "You surrender unto Me." That is real liberated condition. So our mission is serving God. In this way, that people are suffering on account of their godless life. So we are making propaganda that "Serve God, then you will be happy." We know why he's suffering. The same example: The finger in diseased condition cannot serve me. It has to be treated when there is some pain. Suppose this, the nail, I apply some medicine, cure it so that it can serve me. So the whole world is suffering because he's not fit to serve God. So if he becomes fit to serve God, then all the suffering will be gone. The same example again: When the finger is fit to serve, that means it has no disease. And so long it is diseased, there is pain, it cannot serve.
Prabhupāda: It is suffering. When it is not serving, therefore it is suffering, and when it is serving, there is no suffering. Two things. There cannot be three things. This is very scientific. It is not imagination. The finger is not serving me means it is diseased. It is suffering. So they're not accepting this process. We say that you are suffering because you're not serving God. You serve God, your sufferings will be gone. Do you think our philosophy is all right, or not?
Ian Polsen: I accept it completely. Yes.
Devotee: I think he is also well educated. He understands the truth.
Kulaśekhara: ...go to ārati?
Devotee: No.
Prabhupāda: Hm.
Prabhupāda: Our, this is a fact, that everyone is serving somebody superior.
Ambassador: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Nobody can say that I am not serving anybody. Is it possible?
Ambassador: You're serving God.
Prabhupāda: I am serving, you are serving your state.
Ambassador: Yes.
Prabhupāda: So everyone is serving. Nobody can say that I am not serving anybody. It is not possible.
Mrs. Keating: But we serve God first.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Mrs. Keating: We serve God first.
Prabhupāda: God or anything, we have to serve.
Mrs. Keating: Yes.
Prabhupāda: That is our constitutional position. Just like eating and drinking. You may eat something, I may eat something, but eating is essential. You cannot say that I don't eat. That is not possible. Eating, sleeping, mating, defending—these are the bodily necessities. Similarly, the soul's necessity is to serve someone. Either you serve your country or your society or your family or your community, or at least if you nothing to serve, then you keep a dog and serve it.
Prabhupāda: Suppose I say that I don't serve. That is not possible. That being our constitutional position then, just like my finger, it is serving, always, sometimes doing like that, sometimes doing like that, sometimes doing like that. The finger's business is to serve. As part and parcel of my body, the finger's business is to serve the whole body. Similarly, we are part and parcel of God. Our essential business is to serve God. How do you find this argument? Do you refute this argument?
Mrs. Keating: You serve and you share.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Mrs. Keating: You serve...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Guest (3) (young British woman): Religion, meaning trying to serve God, is any more right than another?
Prabhupāda: This is not religion. This is the only business. Religion is different thing. Suppose... Just like... I have already explained, that you are sleeping, and you have got a good engagement. And somebody's trying to awake you, that "You have to go there. Just get up! Get up!" So this kind of business is not religion. Religion is a, what is a kind of faith, a sentiment. That is different thing. It is the main business of human being. Because we are part and parcel of... Just like a boy, he's very rich man's son. Some way or other, he's out of his home, and he's suffering for want of food, want of shelter. And somebody's giving information that "I know you are such and such big man's son.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Father Tanner: ... and so you can come to hate the Deity.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Spiritualism means to sacrifice your freedom. That is spiritualism. You have no more freedom. You are simply engaged for God's service. That is spiritualism.
Father Tanner: Why, why, why were we created free?
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Father Tanner: Why were we created?
Prabhupāda: No, that is real freedom. Just like this, my finger, is part and parcel of my body. So long the finger serves the body, it is healthy. If it is painful, it cannot serve, then it is unhealthy. Similarly, a living entity, when he cannot serve God, that is his material condition, or unhealthy condition. When he serves God, that is his natural condition. Because he's part and parcel of God.
Father Tanner: Where did we lose the contact with God?
Prabhupāda: When you misused your freedom. You have got little freedom.
Prabhupāda: Part and parcel of God.
Cardinal Danielou: Yes.
Prabhupāda: So the part and parcel of the God, the living entity, it's business is to render service to God.
Cardinal Danielou: To...?
Yogeśvara: (translates)
Cardinal Danielou: Yes, yes, yes. I agree, I agree.
Prabhupāda: Let me finish.
Cardinal Danielou: Yes. And I think that the vocation of each creature is the service of God, yes.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Cardinal Danielou: The service of God.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So when the living entity forgets this business, that is material life.
Cardinal Danielou: That is...?
Yogeśvara: (translates)
Cardinal Danielou: (agrees in French)
Haṁsadūta: But I think the idea is that on one condition, that the people, anyone who is Christian, they agree to follow his commandment, his order, which is so many things—thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not commit adultery-on that condition, he gave his life in the service of God on this condition, to teach this message. Anyone who would accept him, they would become free from sin...
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.
Haṁsadūta: ...if they accept his teaching, that is the meaning of the statement.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.
Prabhupāda: As we know about God, nobody knows in the world. That is a fact. Any person we can challenge that he has no clear idea, what is God, how to contact God, how to... Nobody knows. (break)
Prajāpati: ...a vague notion that they should be serving God, but they do not know how or what will please God.
Prabhupāda: Vague notion must be there because we have got relationship with God, eternal. So that is stated in the Caitanya-caritāmṛta. Nitya-siddha. It is eternally a fact that we are servant of God, but we have forgotten this. So that has to be revived by this śravaṇa-kīrtana, by hearing, chanting. This is the process. Otherwise, the relationship is already there. It is not to be created. It is already there. (break)
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Dr. Patel: We come to you, sir, to serve your disciples in the best way we can do because to serve a disciple is to serve God.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Then, that means it is being developed. That śānta-rasa is being developed to dāsya-rasa.
Dr. Patel: But sometimes disciples don't like our service.
Prabhupāda: They are children. They are children. You see, they are coming from foreign countries. They are being trained up. There may be some deficiencies, but this is the scientific progress. When from śānta-rasa, one develops dāsya-rasa, wants to give some service, there is further development. Then further service, not as ordinary service, but as intimate friend. Then, as paternal, then conjugal. These are the different developments. The principle is there, śānta-rasa, but they are manifested in different stages of development.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Actually the Māyāvādī philosophy was started with Vivekananda. Because I don't find in the Christian faith that they are Māyāvādīs. Their belief is service to God. Of course, they are somewhat Māyāvādīs. But this real strong Māyāvādī was brought from East with Buddhism and Vivekananda's philosophy.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: When I was studying, you know, books...
Prabhupāda: Nirviśeṣa-śūnyavādī.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So this bhakti-yoga means to know God, at the same time, practically employ yourself in the service of God, or in the transaction between God and yourself. That is vijñānam. Sa-vijñānam.
Guest (1): What is the distinction between jñāna and vijñāna?
Prabhupāda: Jñāna means theoretical knowledge, and vijñāna means practical knowledge. Simply to know "God is great," that is not sufficient.
Guest (1): No, that is theoretical.
Prabhupāda: This is the position.
Guest (5): Does God need service?
Prabhupāda: God does not need. You need to serve God. God does not need.
Guest (5): He's not self-sufficient, you mean.
Prabhupāda: He's self-sufficient, but it is for your interest.
Guest (5): He knows before creating people, they'll sin. Then why does He create them?
Prabhupāda: Eh? Eh? He does not create. This is all nonsense question. He does not create. He does not create.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like government knows. Suppose government is creating one city, but he's creating at the same time the jail house. Although there is no criminal at that time. But government knows there are some criminals who will fulfill this jail house. Because you are independent. Everyone is independent. Not absolute independent, but slight independent. So therefore you have the option either to serve God or serve māyā. That's all.
Dr. Patel: Serve God or serve Mammon.
Prabhupāda: That's it.
Prabhupāda: No, no, no, no. You created. Why do you blame?
Guest (5): How I was created, I created this universe?
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. So you were created to serve God, but you do not serve God. You want sense gratification. That is your fault.
Guest (5): He's self-sufficient. He doesn't need service.
Prabhupāda: No, no. Why you are repeating that question like a fool? (laughter) I have answered this. If you disturb in that way, don't question. I have already, that you created everything.
Guest (5): Yes.
Pañcadraviḍa: I try to remember that Lord Caitanya, He informed that the purpose of all Vedic literatures is to acquaint people with their relationship which they have forgotten with God, to teach them how to engage themself in that relationship and to understand that the goal is to come to pure love of God. So when I speak I try to bring that into it also because we are actually speaking from śāstra, so we should acquaint people with the principles of devotional service, tell them that they have forgotten God, that they must serve God and practically how they can do it.
Prabhupāda: No, they will say that "We have not forgotten God. We go to church regularly." And the Mohammedans will say that "We go to mosque. So why we have forgotten God?"
Prabhupāda: "You say. That you have charged, but on what account you say like that? What I have done?"
Nitai: Because you go to church only for one hour all week. The rest of the time is not spent in serving God.
Prabhupāda: That may be. But that does not mean that I do not love God.
Satsvarūpa: Well we don't criticize your love of God, but it can be increased. Kṛṣṇa says in Bhagavad-gītā always think of Him in whatever you do, during your work, during the week. We can teach you how to... You like to go to church? That shows you have some affection for God. We can teach you how, wherever you are, to think of Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: That is already settled. We are also serving. We are preaching Christianity.
Pañcadraviḍa: So then the work we are doing, God is one, we are all serving God, then there should be no objection to assisting us in propagating this love of God all over the world. You are already saying...
Prabhupāda: No, what is that love of God? That is already answered, that "We have also love of God."
Prabhupāda: There are two things. We recommend two things. For the mass of people, this prayer, kīrtana, a prayer. Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma. So this is prayer. Hare means appealing to the energy of God, and Kṛṣṇa is God. "O the energy of God, O God, please engage me in your service." This is the sum and substance of the Hare Kṛṣṇa. Hare: "O the energy of God, 'Kṛṣṇa,' O the Lord, please engage me in Your service." Because we are now engaged in the service of Satan, māyā. I think... Māyā. So therefore we are suffering. Service we have to render. Because we are meant for rendering service. But when you forget God, then you render service to māyā. Therefore it is the prayer to God that "Please pick me from this service and engage me to Your service." That's all. Service is my occupation. I cannot become master. That is not possible. The Māyāvādī philosophers, they sometimes say that "We are now in māyā. As soon as we are out in māyā, then we become master." We do not agree to this philosophy. We remain servant even after liberation. We are servant here and we are servant always. Just like a citizen and government. The government is always master. If you do not accept the laws of government, then you are put into prison. There also you are subjected to the laws of God, or the government. Similarly, either in māyā or liberated, we are always servant, eternal servant. But when we are servant in liberation, giving service to God, that is our real life or real happiness.
Prabhupāda: That's it. So from God's standpoint of view, we cannot take simply that simply to serve the human being is to serve God. Another point is that living entities, the service, according to Sanskrit conception, service is offered to the superior. And to the inferior, mercy. There are two words. Sevā, the Sanskrit word, sevā, and dayā. You know something of Sanskrit?
Monsignor Verrozano: Somewhat, yes.
Prabhupāda: No, as I say, the active principle, I am also the active principle. As I say, the dead body and the living body, difference is, when the active principle is not there, it is dead body. Similarly, I am also the active principle. So 'ham, so 'ham: "I am the same active principle." Ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am Brahman. I am not this material body." That is self-realization. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati: (BG 18.54) "When one is self-realized, then he is jolly." Prasannātmā. He is never morose. He is jolly. Na śocati na kāṅkṣati: "He has no lamentation, no hankering." Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu: "He is equal to everyone, man, animal and everything." And mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām: (BG 18.54) "Then devotional life begins." So without self-realization, there is no question of devotional life. Or those who are engaged in devotional service, they are all... Just like these boys, my students, they are trained up how to be always in devotional service. So one who is engaged in devotional service, he is supposed to be already self-realized. Because he has understood "what I am," yes. And then he sticks to devotional service. Otherwise, he cannot. If one thinks, "I am this body," then he cannot be engaged in devotional service, or he cannot stick. He knows that "I am part and parcel of God. So my duty is to serve God." This is self-realization. And then he engages himself in devotional service.
Prabhupāda: Why not experience? He knows that "I am that active principle." Everyone knows that "I am not this body." When I say, "This is my finger," I don't say, "I finger." So "I," what "I"? That realization, self-realization, that "I am part and parcel of God." So that he knows, that "I am part and parcel of God. So therefore my duty is to serve God." So they are engaged in serving God. So this serving God, or devotional service, is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā... Find out that verse, that:
- māṁ ca yo 'vyabhicāreṇa
- bhakti-yogena sevate
- sa guṇān samatītyaitān
- brahma-bhūyāya kalpate
- (BG 14.26)
So unless one is self-realized, he cannot be engaged in the service of the supreme self. Ordinarily, a master and a servant, a servant knows that "I am engaged by the master. He is giving me food. He is giving me shelter. He is giving me everything for his service." So he is careful in his service.
Prabhupāda: No. Pure consciousness is actually you are. Just like water. Water is pure. When it is comes from the sky, it is clear crystal water. But as soon as it touches the ground, it becomes muddy. Similarly, we soul, spirit soul, we are pure. As soon as we come in contact with this matter, material existence, we become impure. And there are three stages of impurity: goodness, passion and ignorance. So all of them are impure. Unless one comes to the spiritual consciousness—he may be a very nice man—he is infected with the impurity of goodness. He is thinking, "I am very big man, I am very..." That is also impurity. And another man does not know what he is, just like animal, all the animals. That is also impurity. When both of them will come to the clear consciousness that "I am part and parcel of God; my duty is to serve God," that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Prabhupāda: So our real business is how to become free from all these designations. Yes. Then we come to the real consciousness. That real consciousness is that "I am eternal. God is eternal. I am part and parcel of God. My duty is to serve God. And now I am serving also. I am not free from service, but I am serving under designation." Just like you went to fight, because you designated yourself that "I am German." This is an example, that "I must fight, give service to my country." Somebody is thinking, "Give service to my community" or "to my family." Or if there is nobody else, at least "to my dog." So this is going on. So we have to close all these designations and become pure and serve God. And that is self-realization.
Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa movement means, "O the energy of God and O God, Kṛṣṇa, please engage me in your service." Because our constitutional position is to give service. Some way or other, we have been put in the service of the material energy. So this service can be transferred to the spiritual energy. Then our life is successful. That is our philosophy, bhakti-mārga, bhakti-yoga. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam (CC Madhya 19.170). Here we are giving service as Hindu, as Muslim, as Christian, as Jain, as this or that. These are designation. Designation. When we become free of the designation and then serve God, that is called bhakti or devotion. Just like we have manufactured Christian religion, Hindu religion, Muslim religion, this religion, that religion. But when the religion will be without designation—I am neither Hindu nor Muslim nor Christian, but I am servitor of God—that is pure religion.
Pater Emmanuel: Allow you a question? You know that we Christians are also preaching the love of God, and we seek to fulfill the love of God and to serve God with all our heart and soul. And what different from your movement who will the same? And why do you send your disciples in these Christian countries to preach the love of God when the gospel of Jesus Christ is also preaching the love of God, God love?
Prabhupāda: But if you don't mind, I can say that the Christians are not obeying the orders of God. Do you agree or not?
Prabhupāda: Jagannātha will be very much pleased upon you. Yes. Svalpam apy asya dharmasya trāyate mahato bhayāt. Little service to God is taken as great service. Kṛṣṇa is so kind. So we should try always to give the best service, best energy, and you become liberated. Actually we cannot give any service to Kṛṣṇa. He is unlimited. What is the value of our service? But He takes it seriously: "Oh, he is trying to give me some service." Otherwise what service He needs from us? Suppose He has created these big universes, what service we can give? By His will, He can create millions of universes. What service we can give? We... No. These are the chances of service, this Ratha-yātrā.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Law is meant for everyone. Obedience to the state. That is law. Similarly, religion means obedience to God. Then one who has no conception of God, no idea of God, where is religion? That is pretending religion. Therefore in the Bhāgavata you'll find, dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra: (SB 1.1.2) "All pretending type of religion is rejected." And Kṛṣṇa also said the same thing, sarva-dharmān parityajya: (BG 18.66) "You give up all this pretending religion. You simply surrender unto Me. That is real religion." What is the use of speculating on pretending religion. That is not religion at all. Just like pretending law. Law cannot be pretending. Law is law, given by the state. Similarly, religion means the order given by God. That is religion. If you follow, then you are religious. If you don't follow, then you are demon. Make things very simplified. Then it will be appealing to everyone. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is meant for making things very simplified. Accept God, accept your position as God's servant and serve God. That's all, three words. You have no question? These boys?
Prabhupāda: One who is completely free from all sinful activities, they can become pure devotee. So even after becoming free from sinful activities, if one has got some motive, then he is also not pure devotee. Pure devotee means without any material motive: "God is great. I am His subordinate. I must love God. I must render service to God." This is pure devotee. And if I go to God, "Please give me my bread," that is not pure devotee, because he has got some purpose. As soon as his purpose is fulfilled, he may turn nondevotee. Just like one of my German Godbrothers said that in Germany during the last war, Second World War, many women used to go to the church to pray to God to get back their husband, son, or brother. But nobody came back. And they became atheist: "There is no God. We prayed so much, and my father did not come, my brother did not come, my son did not come."
Prabhupāda: Servant. God is supreme, we are all subordinate. God is maintaining us just like father maintains. So it is the duty of the son to be obedient to the father, to act according to his order. Then everything is perfect. At the present moment on account of this bodily concept of life every one of us thinking nationality and duty of nation, duty of the community, duty of the family, so many duties. But actually we, being spiritual, our only duty is to serve God. We are serving; everyone is serving. That is our constitutional position, to serve. But at the present moment we are serving māyā, illusion, and we have to be trained up to serve the Supreme Being.
Prabhupāda: That you have to find out, but here it is already there. Why should do trouble to find out a holy man, another holy man? The holy man says, Muhammad never said that "You chant my name." Then how one can be holy man if he says like that? We have to test whether he is holy man or not. Here is the perfect holy man. He never said that "You chant my name." He said "Chant Allah's name." That is holy man. That is test of holy man. He does not become God, he serves God. That is holy man.
Devotee: (indistinct)
Prabhupāda: All right. Take, give prasādam. All right.
Prabhupāda: What is the meaning of Sufism, literal meaning?
Guest: Well, Sufism in a sense is ah, what bhaktism is in the Hindu context.
Prabhupāda: Bhakti means to offer service to God. Does it mean?
Guest: Oh, absolutely!
Prabhupāda: Then if God is to be served, then He must be a person, otherwise where is the question of serving?
Guest: Well, the Sufis do see that, the personal aspect of the Lord.
Prabhupāda: That is neutrality, that neither spiritual nor material-on the marginal stage. It is called simply realizing how God is great. That is neutrality. But real devotion begins when one understands that "God is so great, I am rendering my service to this world uselessly. Why not render service to God?" That is called dāsyam, beginning of active devotion. We are active in the material world. It is useless. Simply wasting time and making one entangled in repetition of birth and death. Material activities. This is called pravṛtti-mārga. Pravṛtti-mārga means sense enjoyment. And for sense enjoyment we have to accept so many different types of bodies, 8,400,000. Everyone is busy in sense enjoyment. The tiger is busy, the hog is busy, the dog is busy. The man also, if he becomes busy like tigers and hogs and dog, then he's going to become again the same species of life.
Jesuit: Very good. You're kind, talking to me.
Prabhupāda: So we are trying to engage everything in God's service, to make it superior energy.
Jesuit: How do you see helping your fellow man?
Prabhupāda: We are helping. We are making them God conscious. Yes. That is best help. Instead of making them drunkard, woman-hunter, meat-eaters, we are making them Kṛṣṇa conscious. That is the best help.
Jesuit: And do they go out and make other disciples?
Śrutakīrti: He said do we go out and make other disciples.
Prabhupāda: That is religion. That should be developed, that "Whether by my profession, by my business, by my talent, by my capacities..." There are different categories. "Whether I have pleased God?" Then it is successful. If you have pleased God by your legal profession—you are in a different dress—it doesn't matter. You are as good as they are whole time only serving God. Because their business is also to please God. Similarly, if you have pleased God, then even by practicing your law, you are as good as the saintly person. That should be the aim, "Whether I have pleased God with my professional duty or occupational duty?" That is the standard. Let people take up this. We don't say that "You change your position. You become a sannyāsī or you give up your profession and become bald-headed." No, we don't say that. (laughs)
Prabhupāda: But if people would have been God conscious, they would have excused, "Oh, they have come for God's service. All right, you can take." Therefore the first business is to make people God conscious. Then everything is adjusted. Yasyāsti bhaktiḥ, there is a verse in Bhāgavata,
- yasyāsti bhaktir bhagavaty akiñcanā
- sarvair guṇais tatra samāsate surāḥ
- harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇā
- manorathenāsati dhāvato bahiḥ
- (SB 5.18.12)
The meaning is that "Anyone who is God conscious, a devotee, he has got all the good qualities". What we consider as good qualities, he has got. And similarly, one who is not a devotee of God, he has no good qualities because he will hover on the mental platform.
Prabhupāda: We are chanting. Chanting the holy name of God.
Guest (1): Uh huh.
Devotee: Our whole purpose is to serve God and to revive our love for God.
Guest (1): Sure. That's right. I understand that, and, you know, I'm very broad-minded. I always have said... You know, one time in our Methodist church we had a professor that was giving all religions of the world. And this is rather putting it simply and fast, but it was interesting because of all the different religions, even though they all didn't believe in the divine being, Christ being the son of God, in some cases-there's Buddha and so forth—but they all were preaching about going to the same place, so to speak. And it's peculiar.
Prabhupāda: That is called vānaprastha. Pañcaśordhvam vānam vrajet. The vānaprastha life is accepted, generally, after fiftieth year, not earlier. Then the husband and wife travels all over, I mean to say, spiritual sanctified places. In India there are so many places. So in this way, there is no sex in the vānaprastha. Simply the wife remains as assistant. And she also practices austerities. And then the husband, when he is fully mature, he sends wife back to his elderly children to take care of her and he takes sannyāsa. So this is spiritual advancement, and in sannyāsa life, one is absolutely dedicated for the service of God. So in this way his life becomes perfect. And according to his perfection, he gets next birth in higher planetary system. In the upper planets, planetary system, there is Svargaloka up to the third-class man. And then, above that, there are Janaloka, Maharloka, Tapaloka, Satyaloka, Brahmaloka.
Prabhupāda: And if we learn how to love God without any motive, nobody can check our love of God. And if we reach that platform, then we become actually happy. God is the supreme proprietor of everything, He is friend of everyone, and He is the enjoyer. We, being part and parcel of God, our duty is to serve God how He is pleased. Our... Just like part and parcel of our body, this finger, it is always engaged in serving the body according to the desire of the person. Similarly, we being part and parcel of God, our duty is to serve God as He wants service from us. This is perfection. If the finger or any part of my body cannot give service to the whole body, it is to be understood that the part is diseased. Similarly, when we do not give service to God, that is our material condition, or diseased condition, or miserable condition. And if we learn how to love God, how to serve Him, that is our healthy condition.
Prabhupāda: So I am not speaking of these third-class yogis. Real yogi means he has got some power. That is material power. So yogis also want this power. And jñānīs also want salvation from the unnecessary working like ass, the karmī. And karmīs want material profit. So they want, everyone. But the bhaktas, devotees, they don't want anything. They want to serve God out of love. Just like a mother loves her child. There is no question of profit. Out of affection, she loves. So when you come to that stage, to love God, that is perfection. So these different processes, karmī, jñānī, yogi and bhakta, out of these four processes, if you want to know God, then you have to accept this bhakti. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, bhaktyā mām abhijānāti (BG 18.55). "Simply through the process of bhakti, one can understand Me, God." He never says by other processes, no. Only through bhakti. So if you are interested to know God and love Him, then you have to accept this devotional process. No other process will help you.
Prabhupāda: Those who are envious, for them is not Bhāgavata. So any materialistic person, he is envious. It is not meant for the materialistic person. Those who are spiritually advanced, one who has understood that "I am not this body, I am spirit soul, my direct connection is with God, therefore my only business is to serve God." One who has come to this conclusion, he is called paramahaṁsa. Haṁsa means swan. A swan, it has got a quality that if you give the swan to drink milk mixed with water, she will drink the milk and reject the water. She has got the capacity. So paramahaṁsa means one who has taken the essence of the existence, Absolute Truth, he is called paramahaṁsa.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Nectar of Devotion and the Śrī Īśopaniṣad. These books are actually being used in undergraduate courses. These are some of the recommendations, see, offered as an undergraduate course. Mostly... This book is very, very interesting, this, "the complete science of bhakti-yoga." This explains scientifically the science of devotional service to God. That devotional service which is not practiced with reference to the Vedic literatures is simply a disturbance, just as if some chemist walked into an English laboratory or some foreign language laboratory and tried to do something, and he had no knowledge. So the same way, we should try to understand the science of devotional service from the authorities, so that it's not just...it doesn't become simply a disturbance in society. People lose faith in God that way. Śrī Īśopaniṣad also has the same format once again. The Sanskrit, transliteration, word for word. This is a very nice entrance book into Vedic understanding. This is the most important of the Upaniṣads. Many other books we have like that, paperbacks and hardbound. This is being used in many universities in America.
Prabhupāda: Temple University, it is a study book.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Well, they think that God is in the other world, so that in this world we can serve our wife and family, and when we go to the other world we'll serve God.
Prabhupāda: Then God is separated from this world. How much imperfect knowledge it is. God has created this world, and He has nothing to do with. Just see. They say God created this world, but He has nothing to do with it.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: That's a very imperfect understanding.
Prabhupāda: (break) ...you were with Meher Baba?
Prabhupāda: Yes. And then when you are in that stage, then you can become qualified to serve God. Mad-bhakti labhate parām. So bhakti is not so easy. Manuṣyāṇā sahareṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye.
Dr. Patel: It is more difficult than...
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is not difficult, but because they are rascals, they made it difficult. Kṛṣṇa says, "Immediately." Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām eka śaraṇa vraja aha tvā sarva-pāpebhyo (BG 18.66). "I'll give you protection-immediately, within a second." But they'll not do that. That is māyā. Kṛṣṇa says that it is so easy that you can become immediately brahma bhuta. Why you should waste time, many, many lives, to come to this conclusion that vāsudeva sarvam iti sa mahātm sudurlabhaḥ? Why you should waste your time, many lives? Do it immediately.
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. So we admit that, that when we see that "I am separate from..." Then the same example: If the finger thinks that it is separate from the body, that is ignorance, because the finger is required by the body to serve the body. So if he thinks, "No, I'll not serve you because I am different," that is ignorance. That is ignorance. That is going on. These Māyāvādīs, they refuse to serve God. That is ignorance. If they are part and parcel of God or one with God, how you can refuse to serve? That is ignorant. Here the finger is my part and parcel of the body. It cannot refuse to serve. I say; immediately it comes.
A brief account of the life of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu included in this volume illustrates the central theme of the entire text, the loving service of God. A glossary and index to Sanskrit verses and a general index have been added for the convenience of scholars. This monumental work is immensely valuable alike to historians of religion, linguistic scholars, cultural anthropologists, pious devotees, as well as to the general reader interested in spiritual matters. I recommend it highly to every student of Indian philosophy, culture, and religion."
Prabhupāda: Yes. You have to revive your consciousness that you are part and parcel of God. And the part and parcel of God means to serve God. Just like this finger is part and parcel of my body, but it is meant for serving my body. I ask the finger, "Come here"; it is serving me. "Come here"; it is scratching. "Pick up the food. Give it to me"; he is giving it. This is business of the finger. If the finger cannot carry out my order, then it is diseased. And if he immediately carries out order, then it is healthy. Similarly, we being part and parcel of God, we must be ready to give service immediately. Then it is healthy condition. And if we do not, then it is māyā. We are serving. You are serving.
Prabhupāda: Yes. You have to revive your consciousness that you are part and parcel of God. And the part and parcel of God means to serve God. Just like this finger is part and parcel of my body, but it is meant for serving my body. I ask the finger, "Come here"; it is serving me. "Come here"; it is scratching. "Pick up the food. Give it to me"; he is giving it. This is business of the finger. If the finger cannot carry out my order, then it is diseased. And if he immediately carries out order, then it is healthy. Similarly, we being part and parcel of God, we must be ready to give service immediately. Then it is healthy condition. And if we do not, then it is māyā. We are serving. You are serving. Everyone is serving, because our constitution is to serve. Big, big leaders, they are also serving. Anyone you can see. The sun, he is serving. Exactly in the time it is rising by the order of God. Exactly in time it is setting. So everyone is serving. Ekale īśvara kṛṣṇa āra saba bhṛtya: (CC Adi 5.142) "Only master is God, and everyone is His servant." But the diseased condition is that when we do not serve God, we serve something else, māyā, and that is diseased condition.
Prabhupāda: Diseased condition. Impure condition. At the present moment we have discovered so many services-national service, communal service, and this service, that service—but nobody is recommending service of God. This is the diseased condition. Therefore we are suffering.
Reporter (1): So what do you really mean by arousing the Kṛṣṇa consciousness? What does it entail?
Prabhupāda: That means we have to serve Kṛṣṇa. We are serving now non-Kṛṣṇa. Nothing is non-Kṛṣṇa. Something māyā. Just like dreaming. Dreaming, it is also activity. That is false activity.
Dr. Patel: After complete surrender of the buddhi and mind...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dr. Patel: ...all the actions that are done in the service of God is bhakti...
Prabhupāda: Yes. When...
Dr. Patel: Without surrendering...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dr. Patel: ...the actions are not bhakti.
Prabhupāda: That is the example in the Bhagavad-gītā. When Arjuna saw that "Kṛṣṇa wants it positively. Never mind my..."
Prabhupāda: So, the living entity is servant. He may have faith or no faith, he must be a servant. And if you don't become servant of God, then you become servant of dog. That is your advancement of civilization. When there is no service for God, just like here we have got service for God, there is no question of serving dog. But when we forget service of God, then automatically we become service of dog. But service.... I am servant, that's a fact. And voluntarily keep a dog and serve him. They have no master, then I keep a master, dog, cat. You call it by the name, pet. What is a pet? I do service, that's all. So this is our advancement of civilization. We have refused to serve God, and you voluntarily accept to serve dog. Now in India, they are also learning. (chuckles) And formerly, dog keeping, dog there was in the neighborhood. But they were not allowed to enter the room or house. Now, they are keeping dogs just like the Western people keep. They are making dog show and so on, so on.
Prabhupāda: Now we are sitting, so many gentlemen. He's having some paper, and you are serving God. The service is there. Nobody can say, "No, I don't serve anyone." Is there any man? No. That is not possible. You must serve. Constitutionally, you are meant for service, either you are president of the state or is anything. That is your position. That is the beginning of Caitanya Mahāprabhu's philosophy, jīvera svarūpa haya nitya-kṛṣṇa-dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109). All living entities are eternal servant of God.
Ambarīṣa: And all service is the same?
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Prabhupāda: How can it be? All service is the same? Do you think...
Ambarīṣa: Everybody serves in their own way, but it's all...
Prabhupāda: That is.... Unless you come to the service of God, it is wrong.
Devotee (2): I think he's asking, "But if it is service to God, then in God's eyes, all service to Him."
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Reporter: Right.
Prabhupāda: Yes. God, service to God means, just like you put foodstuff in the stomach. Then the service, supplying energy, is distributed automatically. The eyes get service, the ears get service, the hands get service, legs get service, everything. But if you put foodstuff in the eyes, instead of giving service, you make it blind. If you put foodstuff in the ear, instead of hearing, it is blocked. Then that is ignorance. You do not know where to give service. The knowledge, God consciousness, means to know where to give service, so that the service will be automatically distributed. You pour water on the root of the tree and the energy will be distributed to the trunk, to the branches, to the twigs, to the leaves, to the flowers, everyone.
Prabhupāda: Yes. God, service to God means, just like you put foodstuff in the stomach. Then the service, supplying energy, is distributed automatically. The eyes get service, the ears get service, the hands get service, legs get service, everything. But if you put foodstuff in the eyes, instead of giving service, you make it blind. If you put foodstuff in the ear, instead of hearing, it is blocked. Then that is ignorance. You do not know where to give service. The knowledge, God consciousness, means to know where to give service, so that the service will be automatically distributed. You pour water on the root of the tree and the energy will be distributed to the trunk, to the branches, to the twigs, to the leaves, to the flowers, everyone. We are missing their point. This is scientific,
- yathā taror mūla-niṣecanena
- tṛpyanti tat-skandha-bhujopaśākhāḥ
- prāṇopahārāc ca yathendriyāṇāṁ
- tathaiva sarvārhaṇam acyutejyā
- (SB 4.31.14)
So instead of giving service in so many ways—social, political, philosophical, cultural, this way, that way—if you simply learn how to serve God, then everything will be done. So that is our philosophy, and we are laboring for this purpose, that you understand God and give service to Him, then the whole society will be perfect, peaceful.
Kern: But to make a person ask is not the right kind of society. Shouldn't, if a person be the first-class citizen and therefore independent and therefore seek his own so that he could serve God by his own intelligence and his independence.... There's no virtue to be giving; it's more of a virtue to receive.
Jayādvaita: He's suggesting that because we are requiring that a person come to us for food, that somehow this is interfering with his independence.
Prabhupāda: Where is that independence? With his family he can come and take food. What is wrong there? We say that we should not..., we are not simply supplying food. Anyone who is coming, he is getting spiritual education. Not that it is a free hotel. No. It is not that. We give them spiritual education. You come here, you take your shelter, you take your food and learn how to be first-class man. That is our program. Don't be implicated in sinful activities. Be God conscious and live here with us comfortably, take your food. We have got this nice palace.
Prabhupāda: Yes. In need of money, "God, I am so poor. Kindly give me some money." So he's approached God. That is his piety. Although God should not be asked. Pure devotion means God should not be bothered. Simply we shall render service. "God is great. I am His servant. So my duty is to render service without any profit." The profit is there. To be accepted as God's servant, that is the greatest profit.
Scheverman: That's what Jesus said: "Behold the lilies of the field, they neither toil nor spin, and yet not even Solomon in all his glory was arrayed as one of these. Seek first the kingdom of heaven, and all these things—what you shall eat, what you shall drink—shall be added to you besides." Yes.
Prabhupāda: So many people, we have nothing to do with so many people. If you are actually servant of God, so God is there, you are servant. So your transaction is there. Just to carry out the orders of God. That's all. Why do you want mysticism? Just to show some jugglery to the people? You serve God. That's all. And it is very simple thing, what God orders. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). Where is the question of mysticism? There is no question of mysticism. God says "Just always think of Me. Offer your obeisances and worship Me." That's all. Where is the need of mysticism? It is all jugglery.
Reporter: "What is that training process?" Prabhupāda: "That training is the varṇāśrama-dharma, a system of dividing society into four social and four spiritual orders according to people's natural quality. Divide the society according to quality and train people in the principle that everything belongs to God and should be used in the service of God. Then there really can be one nation under God."
Reporter: "But if society is divided into different groups, won't there be envy?"
Prabhupāda: "No, no. Just as in my body there are different parts that work together, so the society can have different parts working for the same goal. My hand is different from my leg, but when I tell the hand, 'Bring a glass of water,' the leg will help. The leg is required and the hand is required."
Prabhupāda: So many things. Foolish men can accept that, "Everyone is God, everyone is guru." That is foolish man's proposition and accepted by fools.
Devotee (2): It is explained in Back to Godhead magazine that (indistinct) serve Kṛṣṇa, serve God. If someone tells you that he is guru (indistinct).
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: So to accept a spiritual master must mean that one is in ignorance and one is enlightened.
Prabhupāda: For ignorance there is no need of guru. An ignorant cannot inquire about God. Intelligent man can inquire about God.
Prabhupāda: No. God talks with whom? That is said. Teṣāṁ satata-yuktānaṁ bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam (BG 10.10). Those who have already become devotee of God and engaged in His service, He talks with him. Not he's a third-class fool. He doesn't talk with him. It is clearly stated, teṣāṁ satata-yuktānām (BG 10.10), one who is twenty-four-hours engaged in the service of the Lord, with love and faith, God talks with him. That is clearly stated. How do you understand that God is talking with him? A rascal fool, who has no business with God? God talks with devotee, very sincere devotee who is already engaged in God's service. He talks with him.
Prabhupāda: He might say, that is another thing. The standard is this. He may say-he's a rascal, he can say so many nonsense. That is not the standard. He says that "God is talking with me." So I have to see whether he's a candidate with whom God can talk. The formula is teṣāṁ satata-yuktānāṁ bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam (BG 10.10). "One who is twenty-four-hours engaged in My service with love and faith, God talks with him." So first of all see whether he's twenty-four-hours engaged in God's service with love and faith. Then you can understand, "Yes, God is talking with him." But he has no preliminary qualification, if he says "I can talk with God," he's a nonsense.
Prabhupāda: "Yes, he may be talking with God." How he can talk? That means you are also nonsense. You do not know with whom God talks. Why do you accept such proposition? If some store keeper says "I have passed M.A., L.L.D.," and I have to accept that? You must know with whom God talks. That means you are nonsense. You are accepting nonsensically. And the person who is constantly engaged in God's service, unless he's trained up by a spiritual master, how can he be engaged? So without spiritual master, one cannot be engaged in devotional service, and without devotional service, nobody's eligible to talk with God. So that nonsense talking, that without spiritual master God talking, and he has become perfect, this is all nonsense. One who believes, he is also nonsense. He does not know God. To raise such question means nonsense. You do not know with whom God talks, therefore you have brought this question. Otherwise, you would have kicked immediately. It is impossible. What do you think?
Prabhupāda: So we should understand what is the duty of the part and parcel. Now, just like this finger is the part and parcel of my body. So what is the duty of the finger? To serve the whole body. I order the finger "Please come here," immediately it does like this. So the finger, being part and parcel of the body, it is the duty of the finger to serve the whole body. When the finger is unable to give any service, then it is diseased. If there is some pain in the finger, I want to use this finger for some purpose, to pick up this flower, I cannot do it, that means it is diseased. Similarly, we living entities, part and parcel of God, when we are unable to give service to the Supreme, that is our diseased condition. That is not normal condition. And when we are actually able to give service to God, that is our healthy condition. So in the materialistic way of life we are diseased. Because we are diseased, therefore we have to accept birth and death. Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyet sattvam (SB 5.5.1). So we have to get free from this diseased condition. Śuddhyet sattvam. Yasmād brahma-saukhyaṁ tv anantam.(end)
Prabhupāda: He's already perfect. Sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26). The one who's trying for others' salvation... That is a devotee's business. Ordinary man cannot do it. Because he's doing that, it is to be understood that he's already on the platform of... Because salvation means to remain his own position. Muktir hitvānyathā-rūpaṁ svarūpeṇa vyavasthitiḥ (SB 2.10.6). Svarūpa is to serve God. So if one is serving on behalf of God, then he's in svarūpa, mukti. Others are acting for his own benefit, but a devotee is acting for others' benefit. Therefore he's already on the platform of liberation.
Woman guest (2): Is it not as good to serve God as a Christian in a church?
Prabhupāda: That is have already explained, that you serve God in any position, but if you want to know about God more, then you have to come here. Now ask any Christian what is God, who is God, what is His form, what He is doing. Can he answer? Nobody can answer. He knows God is great. How great He is, who is that God, they cannot answer. To some extent it is all right, but if you want to know full extent, then you have come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. "Two plus two is equal to four" is mathematics, but if you want to know higher mathematics, you have to go some higher college. "Two plus two" is also mathematics, is it not?
Prabhupāda: Sex outside of marriage is forbidden. Married, full-time devotees may have sexual relationship once a month at a time propitious for procreation. All the devotee's activities are regarded as bhakti-yoga, the yoga of devotion. He regards everything he does as service to God. The name he is given at initiation is followed by the word dāsa, 'a servant.' Full-time ISKCON devotees adopt Vedic dress, one objective being to keep others aware of Kṛṣṇa. Women wear saris, the men dhotis; both may wear shawls. The men shave their heads except for single lock of hair at the back. (See the article, "The Kṛṣṇa Cut.") The lock, called a śikhā, identifies the followers of Kṛṣṇa." Actually no one can imitate us because no one wants to give up their hair, so no one will try to make believe they are devotees. "Shaving the head announces renunciation of material pleasures.
Prabhupāda: "Shaving the head announces renunciation of material pleasures. The tilaka is a mark made with clay-two narrow vertical stripes on the forehead meeting in a triangular swatch on the bridge of the nose. It identifies the body as a temple to be used only in the service of God. Full-time students follow a rigorously monastic life. They arise at four a.m. in the morning, begin four hours of prayer and chanting. At nine o'clock they have breakfast, seated cross-legged on mats on the floor. The men eat apart from the women. During the day devotees work at various preaching programs or at regular jobs. At seven p.m. devotional services are held in the center's temple. In Manhattan this features an ornate shrine including representations of Kṛṣṇa and His consort, Rādhā. Both are costumed sumptuously with elaborate care; both wear festoons of flowers.
Interviewer: Engaged in Kṛṣṇa's...?
Rāmeśvara: Kṛṣṇa's business or God's service.
Bali-mardana: He's setting the example of the previous spiritual masters.
Interviewer: Well, what I was interested in is why... Has he found that three to four hours is the necessary time period to sleep?
Bali-mardana: She's asking why is three to four hours the amount that you sleep. How have you reached that standard?
Prabhupāda: That is not artificially. The more you are engaged in spiritual activities, the more you become free from material activities. That is the test.
Bali-mardana: But aren't they also purified spiritually by doing this?
Prabhupāda: Yes. This spiritual realization means the more you give service to God, you become spiritually profited, in any way.
Interviewer: What are some of the other, aside from...? I mean, I see people selling things. What other practices are involved?
Prabhupāda: Then you stay one day, whole day and night, and see practically, from morning four o'clock to night ten o'clock, how we are engaged in different practices.
Interviewer: You rise at four?
Hari-śauri: Three-thirty.
Prabhupāda: Huh? Ukta, ukta means "said." And sadbhiḥ, "by great personalities." Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktas **, tathā, and "accordingly," tathā means "accordingly," bhāvyata eva sadbhiḥ, those who are actually in transcendental platform, they should accept it. So why? Kintu prabhor yaḥ priya eva... It does not mean Māyāvādī, that he has become God. But kintu prabhor yaḥ priya eva tasya, he is the most confidential servant. He's therefore servant-God. He's God, servant-God. God is master-God. Kintu prabhor yaḥ priya eva tasya. So why he has become priya? That is, Kṛṣṇa says personally, na ca tasmān manuṣyeṣu kaścin me priya-kṛttamaḥ: (BG 18.69) nobody is dearer than him in the whole world. Why? Ya idaṁ paramaṁ guhyaṁ mad-bhakteṣv abhidā... (Bg 18.68).
Prabhupāda: He's living entity, but because he acts very confidentially on behalf of Kṛṣṇa, therefore he's as good as God. This is bhakti. Not the Māyāvādī philosophy that guru has become God. Guru as God, not become. He's servant-God. And Kṛṣṇa is master-God. So the success is that both the Gods, when one is accepted by both the Gods, then his life is success. Guru-kṛṣṇa kṛpāya pāya bhakti-latā-bīja (CC Madhya 19.151). Therefore one has to fix his faith staunchly in the bona fide guru. So if one has got bona fide guru, and if he follows that bona fide guru, then his life is success. This is the process. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair **. So Gurukula means to teach how to become very, very faithful, cent percent faithful, to the bona fide guru. That is Gurukula. So you have to teach like that. By behavior, by life, by action. That is Gurukula. This sum and substance of... Brahmacārī gurukule vasan dānto guror hitam. Where is that?
Prabhupāda: Yes, of coming to the platform of spiritual senses. And when you come to the spiritual senses, then you can understand God, you can understand your relationship with God, you can talk with God, you can serve God, and so on, so on. The same example, just like iron rod as it is, it is not able to burn anything. But when the iron rod is sufficiently hot, red-hot, touch anywhere, it will burn. Similarly, from this physical platform, if you begin these spiritual activities, then stage will come when you'll act only spiritually, there will be no more material activity. That is the stage of bhakti, that is real platform of bhakti, when one is acting only spiritually, there is no material activity. That is the process. So if we adopt that process, it is possible to come to the platform of spiritual sense activity. That is possible. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam tat-paratvena nirmalam (CC Madhya 19.170).
Atreya Ṛṣi: Kṛṣṇa's mercy, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: That's nice. Here is love of God. Whole day he was engaged to serve God, that is love.
Atreya Ṛṣi: We have a nice building for Kṛṣṇa, it's very nice.
Prabhupāda: Where it is?
Atreya Ṛṣi: It is in the middle of the city. It is the one I was explaining to you the other day. So we went to the notary, and it takes a long time, because it's a lot of red tape. And also the lights went off. The lights went off in the middle of writing the agreement. So now we have the agreement, by your grace, it is nice. If you feel good, maybe you can visit it.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Tomorrow morning I'll go?
Prabhupāda: No, that's all right. There is an eternal world, sanātana. That is never annihilated. So when you go to that sanātana-dhāma, God is there, sanātana, and there you live eternally and go on rendering service to God. That is (indistinct). There is no question of oneness. The variety is there, but there the varieties are eternal, here the varieties are temporary. That is difference. Everything is there. So thank you very much.
Devotee: Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Devotee: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (end)
Prabhupāda: Free means desire should be purified. That means desires should be to render service to the Lord. That is real purification. The example is given, just like gold. There are impurities. That impurities, you cannot cleanse it simply by washing. You have to put into the fire. When it is melted then automatically all the dirty things are gone. His natural position is part and parcel of God, to render service to God. So unless he takes up that thing, there is no question of desirelessness. Therefore Kṛṣṇa is demanding, "Surrender." And as soon as he surrenders, then material desires become vanquished. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam (CC Madhya 19.170). Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam (Brs. 1.1.11). Otherwise, the... He cannot rectify one desire by another desire. That is not possible. Then it will produce another desire.
Devotee (2): Śrīla Prabhupāda, this morning we went to this engagement. There was the inauguration of the Vivekananda Society Home, so we went there on saṅkīrtana because we were invited by them. And one swami spoke and he said service to mankind was also service to God. And at the end he also said that Vivekananda used to say that for the housewife, that the cooking pot was becoming God, had become God, had become a God.
Prabhupāda: People applauded. This is foolishness. They do not know how to act. Just like if you pour water on the tree, then it is accepted that you are pouring water on the tree but that is not the process. The process is to pour water on the root of the tree. Practically we... You can make an experiment. Just like here is a tree. You don't pour water on the root but pour water on the leaves.
Prabhupāda: For a father there is no such distinction that "My particular son should be taken care of and other should be neglected or they should be killed." That is not father's view. So if God is the father of all living entities, if you take simply care of the human being, then what of the others? There are so many fallacies in this argument, by taking care of the human being you worship God. There are so many fallacies. Hm? Is it not? So you have to put this argument, that "By serving human society is to serve God"—that is not fact. That may be partially; it is not complete.
Devotee (2): Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda, so he talked (indistinct).
Prabhupāda: I cannot hear.
Devotee (2): He didn't talk once about Kṛṣṇa. He didn't mention once the name of Kṛṣṇa, and he didn't say anything about...
Prabhupāda: God says, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). He never said, māṁsaṁ din māṁ māṁsam.(?) (laughter) If you are God conscious, then you must give. Suppose you are here. If I invite you, then I'll ask you, "Sir, how can I serve you?" If you say, "Give me this kind of food," then that is real service. And you do not like something, and if I say, "Oh, this flesh is very nice. You take it," is that service? God demands this. Patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati. So we are God's servant. We are giving with these groups of food. And after He's eating, we are taking. We are servant. We cannot say, "My dear master, I like this flesh. You take it." That is not service. So therefore fool has to do everything because God wants it. And if you say, "God is nirākāra. He has no mouth, no head, tail," then you can manufacture. But here God says.
Prabhupāda: So any help you want, we'll give. It is very nice. (Hindi)
Dr. Ramachandra: I only want that your movement should utilize my services because I believe service to mankind is service to God.
Prabhupāda: No, no, service to God is service to mankind. If you pour water in the root, then it is service to the tree. And if you pour water on the leaf, then nobody is served. Everything will be dry, that's all. That is imperfect service. If you have got realization of God, why should you give only human being service? Why not tiger? He is also... Kṛṣṇa says, "They are also My sons." That means you discriminate. That is not that... Father will be satisfied when all the sons are given, not partial, not partial. Suppose I have got five children. If you give service to one children, so I'll ask that "Why not other children?" Naturally.
Prabhupāda: No. You should be, should be senses. Just like this aṅguli, I am asking, "Do like this." It is my servant. After all, it is part of the body, it is my servant. If it cannot serve my body then it is diseased. Similarly we are part and parcel of God. If we cannot serve God, that is our diseased condition. The same example. This finger is part and parcel of my body. But I ask finger, "Please come here, to my nostrils." If it cannot do, then it is diseased. It is not in normal condition. So anyone who does not serve the whole, part and whole, he is diseased. He is not in normal condition. Jīvera svarūpa haya nitya kṛṣṇera dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109). Therefore because we have forgotten this relationship with God, declared ourself as God, that is diseased condition. Therefore God comes and He orders, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇam (BG 18.66). "Surrender unto Me. Don't talk nonsense." That is God. So when we agree, that is our perfection. Not to artificially become God, but to agree to serve God. That is liberation.
Prabhupāda: I say any religious stamp, material, there is no benefit. Therefore Kṛṣṇa said sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66). You have to give up all these designations. And bhakti, love of Godhead, or service to God, begins when you are relieved from these designations. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktaṁ tat-paratvena nirmalam (CC Madhya 19.170). When becoming God conscious, you become completely purified, then your devotional life begins. And so long you are entangled with this designation, there is no question of devotional service. Either you Hindu or Muslim or Christian, it doesn't matter. So our business is not that, that we convert a Hindu to a Christian or a Christian to a Hindu. That is not our business. They are thinking, because we dress like that, with tilaka, with māla, they think Hindu.
1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: It is natural to serve God, to remain faithful to Him. This is natural. Artificially you are trying to be independent. This is the Māyāvāda... Still, they are trying to become God himself.
Dr. Patel: Sir, after first I met you, some previous time, I made an extensive study of both the sides of Vaiṣṇavism as well as the (indistinct). I think they are falling short of the final (indistinct). Once they say that they are in Brahman, but there is Para-brahman also. That Brahman is nothing but a jyoti of Para-brahman. That they forget.
Prabhupāda: In this old age-eighty-one years I am—I am working day and night just to preach this Kṛṣṇa consciousness and...
CID Chief: This is absolutely a service to God and humanity. Whatever tendency you have... Whatever comes out of your mouth, word, becomes a religious... It is written, out of which you write books. Out of the produce... From the proceeds of that book, you constructed a... It is wholeheartedly towards the God. Whole life is devoted to God.
Prabhupāda: And for these books, as author, if I would have taken royalty, my daily income would have been one lakh, fifty thousand. I don't take a single farthing. Whatever two cāpāṭis they give, that's all.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the beginning. Then it becomes purified more and more and more and more by service. Sevonmukhe hi jihvādau (Brs. 1.2.234). Then he realizes his position. Svayam eva sphuraty... The more he advances in sevonmukha, by service, God becomes revealed to him. And then buddhi-yogaṁ dadāmi tam. Then as he becomes more confidential, then he is imparted buddhi-yogam, means bhakti-yoga. What is that bhakti-yoga? Yena mām upayānti te. "That bhakti-yoga, by which he can come back to Me." Not that bhakti-yoga means you remain here in this rotten place. Yena mām upayānti te. Teṣāṁ satata-yuktānāṁ bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam, buddhi-yogaṁ dadāmi tam (BG 10.10). He can receive that buddhi-yoga. What is that buddhi-yoga? Yena mām upayānti. So this is required. This is the ultimate goal of life.
Prabhupāda;: Yes. Just like this finger is the part and parcel of my body. So this finger, I say, "Finger come here. Itch here," so it is doing that. And if it is... If it cannot do, then it is diseased. If there is some painless, painfulness or some sore, then immediately I cannot do it. So that means I am part and parcel of God. If I cannot serve God, then I am diseased. That is material condition. So material condition... Suppose this finger is diseased. So you poke up, applying some ointment and going to the doctor. This is one business. And when it is cured, when it is actually engaged in service, that is healthy state. So this social work without serving God is just like applying ointment to the diseased part of the... It has no value, practical value. If it... It has got value, provided it is cured, to serve the whole body.
Prabhupāda: If by serving humanity, you cannot raise him to the standard of understanding he's part and parcel of God and his main business to serve Kṛṣṇa, then it is useless. Śrama eva hi kevalam. So our service to the humanity should be... He is in forgetfulness. He does not know what is his position. If you can raise him to the position that he is part and parcel of God... Unless he comes to the position of serving God, his material condition will continue. Mām aprāpya nivartante mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani. So, dharmasyāsya janma, parantapa. Aśraddadhānāḥ... Like that. Then that service is useless. If he continues, punar api janma, punar, then his service to the humanity useless. Therefore our service to the humanity should be aimed how to awaken his original consciousness, Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Prabhupāda: We are interested how to serve Kṛṣṇa. Our philosophy is very difficult to understand. Suppose you are giving some medical relief, and if I say that "Why you should waste your time by giving medical relief? Why not give him relief from birth and death?" they'll laugh. Is it not? They'll laugh, that "What nonsense he's speaking? This man is suffering. He immediately requires." We don't say that "You don't give medical relief," but why do you forget the real business? That is our.... Vivekananda said, "What is the use of pouring water in tulasī? Better pour water in a eggplant saka. You'll get some eggplant." This is.... Vivekananda said. Eggplant is also a small tree, and tulasī... So if somebody is pouring water on a tulasī leaf for bhakti, he condemns him, "Why you are wasting time? Pour water on this eggplant. Tomorrow you'll get two." (laughs) This is karmī. "God is fictitious. God's service is another sentiment. Do something practical."
Bhavānanda: "Service to man is service to God."
Prabhupāda: He cannot save himself, he is serving man. Our mission is very great. People have not understood yet. Now here is a chance in the court. Let it be prolonged, and let it be threadbare judged. There's a good chance. Let it continue. And in the mode of defense we explain everything. Our defense pleader must be very expert, take instruction from us. We give nice, and he'll place before the court. It will be published in the paper.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We have a very good man.
Prabhupāda: They must know what is the value of this mission, brainwashed.
Prabhupāda: So we should send him a letter of congratulations. "May God bless you for such right judgment. Be... Live long life to serve God." Like that, make a nice... That is our mission.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Very honest and sincere people normally appreciate our movement. Only those who are envious...
Prabhupāda: Envious we don't care for. We don't mind. Never care for them. I didn't care anyone, any times, even my Godbrothers. Neither I care just now. I'll go on with my... Why? We are doing our duty. That's all. Under higher authoritative order. Have no fear. It is not personal gratification. So arrange for Manipur. We shall go. Let us go.
Mr. Dwivedi: He has written books also on tantra-śāstra. And I understand most of these ministers, they were going to seek his blessings. I did not know to whom he gave his blessings, but what I know is that most of these people were going to him. I only... One day I asked him. He's very kind towards me, so I go to him and dine with him. So I told him one day, I said, "Mahārāja, you speak to mahatlal (?) people to give some money to our institution." He said, "Mr. Dwivedi, I do not ask any friends or anybody to do anything for me or to anybody." So then I said, "Mahārāja, then I put one question to you if you permit me." He said, "All right, I permit you." So I asked, "Vivekananda has said that 'Service of God... Service of humanity is service of God.' Do you think it is correct or it is incorrect?" He said, "This is correct." Then I said, "We are running educational institution. Whatever good or bad, leave that aside. But in our own little small way we are rendering little service to humanity. And..."
Prabhupāda: But I may interfere. The... In the Bhagavad-gītā is there such statement, that "Service to humanity is service to God"? Is there any statement?
| Page Title: | Service to God (Conversations) |
| Compiler: | Mayapur, RupaManjari |
| Created: | 04 of Oct, 2011 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=111, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 111 |