Just like these karmīs. It is very distinctly visible wherever you go, so many congested work (?). All buses and cars are running, so many luggages being loaded in the street. Bharam udvahato. Great humbug, you see, great humbug. Prahlāda Mahārāja said māyā-sukhāya bharam udvahato vimūḍhān (SB 7.9.43), actually they are taking so much trouble for loading these big, big cases, but because they're getting, say $40.00 a day, they say, think, "I am enjoying. I am enjoying." Actually he's working so hard, just like ass or hogs, day and night, but because getting some money and with that money because he is gratifying his senses, he thinks "I am happy." This is illusion. Illusion. He does not know what is real happiness for a second. The illusory material world happiness means sex life, that's all. How long does it stay? Say for minutes. But they're working so hard. This is called illusion. Actually he is being killed, but he thinks that "I am enjoying." This is illusion. Opposite.
Sense gratification (Lectures, Other)
Expressions researched:
"gratification of the senses"
|"gratifying his senses"
|"gratifying me senses"
|"gratifying my senses"
|"gratifying our senses"
|"gratifying senses"
|"gratifying the senses"
|"gratifying their senses"
|"gratifying your senses"
|"sense gratification"
|"sensual gratification"
Lectures
Sri Brahma-samhita Lectures
Festival Lectures
So ceremony, apart from ceremonial function, let us try to understand the philosophy of Lord Caitanya. So Lord Caitanya thought it... Not thought it. This is a fact, that this sort of life, seek material happiness... Material happiness means sense gratification. That's all. Actually, according to Bhagavad-gītā... Not according to Bhagavad-gītā—that is a fact according to any authoritative statement. Sukham ātyantikaṁ yat tad atīndriyaṁ grāhyam (BG 6.21). Śrī Kṛṣṇa says that sukham ātyantikam. Ātyantikam means the super, superhappiness, ātyantikam—means that which you cannot excel more... That is the final point. That sort of happiness is not possible to achieve... Happiness... First of all, you must understand, happiness means sense gratification, happiness. You can understand it very easily. If I get some nice foodstuff, because I satisfy my taste, palate, I feel happiness, "Oh, very nice food I am eating." Similarly, you take any of your sense organs, when it is satisfied according to the sense object, it is called happiness. So the sum and substance of happiness is to satisfy the senses.
So we are trying to clear the consciousness without any cover, without any color. Just like there is water, pure water. Take sea water. It is very clear. But if you take clear water and if you color it, then it is colored water. It is not pure water. Or if it is not distilled, if you add some chemical, sugar or salt, then the taste is different. That is not the real taste of water. Just like if you thirsty, if you want water, if I give you some adulterated water, you are not satisfied. If you get clear water, pure water, then your thirst is quenched: "Oh, I am satisfied." Because the taste is there in the clear water, not in the colored water. Similarly, Kṛṣṇa says sukham ātyantikaṁ yat (BG 6.21). That superhappiness, super-sense gratification, can be achieved by your transcendental sense, not by these covered sense.
They may say like that, but our, because we have nothing to do with them, our business is to satisfy the Supreme. That is my real sense gratification. I have got my senses. As soon as I use it for my satisfaction, it is material. And as soon as I use them for Kṛṣṇa's satisfaction, it is spiritual. That's all. Try to understand the distinction between material and spiritual. Material means I have to act. Acting means I have to act with my senses, with my desires, with my thinking, feeling, willing, so many things, because that is original. You cannot stop your thinking, feeling, willing, working, because that is your original nature. You are living entities. If you have no thinking, feeling, willing, desire or working, then what is the difference between you and the stone? You are not stone. Some philosopher are trying to make you stone, but that is not possible. You cannot become stone.
So we have come to that spiritual platform. We have to give up our, this sense gratification process, and that is the teaching of Lord Caitanya. And Caitanya Mahāprabhu practically demonstrated how to adopt that life of pure sense gratification or pure utilization of the senses. He said, jīvera svarūpa haya nitya kṛṣṇa-dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109). Jīvera svarūpa haya means the real nature of the living entity is eternal servitor, eternal servant of Lord Kṛṣṇa. The same thing, what Kṛṣṇa taught in the Bhagavad-gītā, Caitanya Mahāprabhu taught also in His, this Bhāgavata-dharma teaching, and practically He showed how to do it. That is His special. Lord Kṛṣṇa said, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja: (BG 18.66) "You give up all your material engagements. Simply just surrender unto Me. I shall give you all protection from all reaction of your past sinful activities."
So persons who are too much attached to sense gratification, and they have made it their conclusion that "We shall be happy within our family life or this social life..." Vidyāpati sings, tātala saikate vāri-bindu sama suto-mita-ramanī-samāj(?). Our society means... Society, friendship, and love. There must be woman, must be children, suto-mita-ramanī-samāje. So there is some pleasure, undoubtedly. Otherwise, why people are working so hard to stick to this position? Vidyāpati sings that tātala saikate vāri-bindu sama suto-mita-ramanī-samāj(?). There is undoubtedly some pleasure, but that pleasure is so insignificant that it can be compared: a drop of water on the desert. Desert, if you want to utilize desert to make it a garden or productive field, you have to pour water. The whole ocean water you have to pour there. Now, if somebody says, "All right, you want water. Now take this one drop water," then what it will do? Similarly, our heart is hankering after so many things. We are hankering... Actually we are hankering after Kṛṣṇa, but we do not know. We are trying to satisfy our hankering in so many ways in material life.
We are very much proud of possessing material things, material acquisition, but when Kṛṣṇa comes... Just like Mahārāja, Prahlāda Mahārāja saw Hiraṇyakaśipu. His father also saw Nṛsiṁha-deva. This Hiraṇyakaśipu was very clever as the materialists, scientists, are very clever. Cleverly they are inventing so many things. What is the idea? The idea is "We shall live forever and enjoy sense gratification more and more." This is called atheistic advancement of civilization. So Hiraṇyakaśipu was typical materialist. Hiraṇya means gold, and kaśipu means soft bed, cushion. So materialist persons, they are very much fond of gold and enjoying sex. That is their business. So Hiraṇyakaśipu is the typical example of this materialistic person. And Prahlāda Mahārāja, prakṛṣṭa-rūpeṇa āhlāda. Āhlāda means transcendental bliss. Ānanda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhāvitābhiḥ (Bs. 5.37). Living entities' real identification is prahlāda, blissfulness. But on account of material association, we are in miserable condition of life. So... (aside:) Stop these children.
His first question is that Kṛṣṇa is Paraṁ Brahman. Kṛṣṇa is Paraṁ Brahman. That is accepted by Arjuna in the Bhagavad-gītā. Paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma, paraṁ brahma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān (BG 10.12). Paraṁ Brahman, the Supreme Absolute Truth. Now, in this material world there are different features of sense gratification. Sattva-guṇa, rajo-guṇa, tamo-guṇa. So the gopīs and Kṛṣṇa, whether they are a loving affairs or pastimes of this world? That is his question. Just like here young boys and young girls meet together, they try to enjoy life. Whether Kṛṣṇa's līlā, Kṛṣṇa's pastimes with the gopīs, is the same thing? No. That is the philosophical presentation. He gives the reason that Kṛṣṇa is Paraṁ Brahman, but here in this material world we see that parama-brahma, to become attached to Paraṁ Brahman or to realize Paraṁ Brahman, a person, an intelligent person, gives up everything within this world. That is the philosophy of Lord, I mean to... Śaṅkarācārya. He says that this world is false. Paraṁ Brahman is... Brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā. So cultivate yourself to realize Paraṁ Brahman. And his process is sannyāsa. Give up, renounce this world.
We Vaiṣṇava philosophers, we say no. This world is not false because it is emanation from the real, the absolute real. How it can be false? It has got its proper use. One who does not know its proper use, for them it is false. They are after something false. But those who know the value of this world... Hari-sambhandhi-vastunaḥ. Everything has got some connection with the Supreme Lord. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1). Everything is in connection or has relationship with the Supreme Lord. That is our philosophy. We don't say that this speaker, microphone, is false. Why it is false? The microphone is produced out of the energy of Kṛṣṇa. This matter, this iron, or this wood, that is a production of Kṛṣṇa's energy. If Kṛṣṇa is true, Absolute Truth, then His energy is also true. And anything produced of His energy, that is also truth. But as the energy is utilized for the energetic, similarly anything produced by Kṛṣṇa's energy should be utilized for Kṛṣṇa. That is our philosophy. So we don't say that false. We say reality. Therefore in Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement we accept everything, but accept everything for service of Kṛṣṇa. Nothing for my sense gratification. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We do not say that "This world is false. Give up."
In the Manu-saṁhitā it is said that prakṛti, or strī, never deserve to be independent. Na strī svātantryam arhati. So as soon as the living entity is accepted as prakṛti, then it is to be understood that she is under the control of the supreme puruṣa, Puruṣottama. Kṛṣṇa is Puruṣottama. And Kṛṣṇa has been accepted as the puruṣa by Arjuna. Paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān, puruṣaṁ śāśvatam (BG 10.12). It is not that Kṛṣṇa has become puruṣa now, and before that He was impersonal. No. Kṛṣṇa is puruṣaṁ śāśvatam, eternally He is puruṣa, eternally He is enjoyer. He's never enjoyed. You cannot enjoy Kṛṣṇa, or God, for your sense gratification. That is not possible. He can use you for His sense gratification. That is bhakti-mārga. The bhaktas, they never claim to be puruṣa. They are always subordinate. Mama janmani janmanīśvare bhavatād bhaktir ahaitukī tvayi (Cc. Antya 20.29, Śikṣāṣṭaka 4). This is bhakti-yoga.
So we have to find out ways how to turn the current. The current is sense enjoyment. Material life means the current is sense enjoyment, and this current has to be turned-sense enjoyment of Kṛṣṇa. Sense enjoyment is there, but the material civilization, the misled civilization, is that the sense gratification is taken personal. When this sense gratification will be turned towards Kṛṣṇa, then our life is successful. Just like gopīs. Apparently it appears that gopīs, they were attracted by young boy, Kṛṣṇa, and for their sense gratification they made friendship with Kṛṣṇa. No. That is not the fact. The fact is that gopīs used to dress themselves nicely because by seeing them, Kṛṣṇa will be satisfied, not that for their sense gratification. Generally a girl dresses also to attract the attention of the boy. So the same thing is there but it is Kṛṣṇa's sense gratification, not the gopīs'. The gopīs did not want anything. But Kṛṣṇa will be satisifed. That is the difference between lust and love. Love is there, only possible, when it is diverted towards Kṛṣṇa. That is love. And beyond that... Not beyond that... Below that, everything is lust. So we should always remember this. The senses are not stopped, but when the gratification of the senses is directed towards Kṛṣṇa, that is bhakti, or love. And when the sense gratification is directed towards personal self, that is lust. This is difference between lust and love.
So Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Ṭhākura knew this art, how to turn our activities for the satisfaction of Kṛṣṇa. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Therefore I... "Wonder thy ways to turn our face, adore they feet, Your Divine Grace. Forgotten Kṛṣṇa, we fallen souls." Why we are fallen? Because we have forgotten. Our relationship with Kṛṣṇa is eternal. Unless it was eternal, how you Western peoples could be devotee of Kṛṣṇa? Artificially you cannot be a devotee of Kṛṣṇa. The relationship is there eternally. Nitya-siddha kṛṣṇa-bhakti. By the process it is now awakened. Śravaṇādi-śuddha-citte karaye udaya.
Oh, why he is going away? Ask him to come. (someone goes out) Please, please take prasāda. Give him first. (break) Human life is not for, I mean to say, playing, sense gratification. Very important life. So Kṛṣṇa says manuṣyāṇām. But they do not know. Foolish people, they do not know. They are simply wasting life in sense gratification. They are thinking, "By sense gratification we shall be happy." One day the cruel death will come, at once give him a slap: "Come on! Go! Finish your business. No more human life. Become a cat and dog." So these risks are there. So we should be very responsible. So we are not responsible. Kṛṣṇa says, "They are not responsible." Therefore manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu (BG 7.3). Out of many thousands of people, a person desires to utilize his human form of life very nicely. Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye. Kaścit means somebody tries to make his life perfect. And yatatām api siddhānām (BG 7.3). And among such millions of persons who are trying to make his perfect, one can understand Kṛṣṇa.
Just like if there is a murder case and there is a conspiracy, so it is not the man who has directly killed some person, he is arrested, but everyone who is in the conspiracy, they are all arrested. That is the common law. So in that sense everyone is butcher. Besides that, because a person is killing some cow or some animal, we are calling butcher, but mostly they are killing their soul. Anyone who is unconscious, who is ignorant of his spiritual identity, identifying himself with this body and misusing this opportunity of human form of life simply for animal sense gratification, they are also butchers. If killing of some living entity is butchery, then how great a butcher is he who is killing himself? He is killing an animal, but he is killing himself. Ātma-hā. Ātma-hā, self-killing, out of ignorance. Everyone is in ignorance. Any sinful activity is done out of ignorance. So ignorance is no excuse. The butcher is killing animal because he does not know what is the effect of this killing. Similarly, persons who do not know what is the value of this human form of life and simply spoiling it just like animals, they are also butchering themselves.
Arrival Addresses and Talks
It has become very satisfactory that so many devotees, boys and girls, are taking part in this great movement, Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. It is very important movement because it is correcting the human civilization. There is a great defect in the modern civilization, and people are accepting this body as self, and based on this mistake in the foundation, everything is going wrong. The basic principle of civilization—accepting this body as the soul—is the beginning of all problems. The great philosophers, scientists, theologists and thoughtful men, they do not know what is the defect. Recently I was in Moscow. I had a talk with a big professor of Indology, Professor Kotovsky. So he was speaking that "Swamijī, after this finishing, annihilation of this body, everything is finished." So I was astonished that a learned professor who is posing himself on a very advanced post, he has no idea about the soul and the body, how they are different, how the soul migrating from one body to another. And everyone is accepting this body as the self, and "There is no life after death; therefore make the best use of this bad bargain and enjoy sense gratification as far as possible." But this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is checking this wrong progress of human civilization. Our first proposition is that "You are not this body; you are spirit soul. Some way or other, you are in contact with this material world, and you have got this material body, and under illusion, you are accepting something which you are not."
Yes. And our men, all our men should write. Otherwise how we shall know that he has understood the philosophy? Writing means śravaṇaṁ kīrtanam. Śravaṇam means hearing from the authority and again repeat it. This is our business, śravaṇaṁ kīrtanam viṣṇoḥ (SB 7.5.23), about Viṣṇu, not for any politician or any other man. Śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ, about Kṛṣṇa or Viṣṇu. So that is success. Hear and repeat, hear and repeat. You haven't got to manufacture. Any one of us, simply if you reproduce the purport which I have given in the Bhāgavata, you become a good speaker. What I am doing? I am the same thing, writing the same thing so that modern man can understand. Otherwise we are repeating the same thing. They are repeating also same thing, sense gratification. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). But because that is material, they are not getting happiness. But the spiritual thing, we are chanting the same Hare Kṛṣṇa, simply repeating, but we are getting transcendental bliss. What we are doing? Same "Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa." So process is the same, the subject matter is different. So why you are behind publication? Now all the big men are here. Why our books are behind? Why? Here the editors are there. I don't think there is any scarcity.
Nitāi:
- kāmasya nendriya-prītir
- lābho jīveta yāvatā
- jīvasya tattva-jijñāsā
- nārtho yaś ceha karmabhiḥ
- (SB 1.2.10)
"Life's desires should never be aimed at gratifying the senses. One should desire to live only because human life enables one to inquire about the Absolute Truth. This should be the goal of all works."
Prabhupāda: Kāmasya nendriya-prītiḥ. Purport?
Nitāi: "The completely bewildered material civilization is wrongly directed towards the fulfillment of desires in sense gratification."
Prabhupāda: Simply wine, women and beach, and sporting and jumping like monkeys, this is the... We require little satisfaction of the bodily demands. That's all right. But not for this purpose. The bags have come?
Harikeśa: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Oh, then that's all right. There is oil.
Nitāi: "In such civilization, in all spheres of life, the ultimate end is sense gratification. In politics, social service, altruism, philanthropy and ultimately in religion or even in salvation, the very same tint of sense gratification is every-increasingly predominant. In the political field the leaders of men fight with one another to fulfill their personal sense gratification."
Prabhupāda: In India, these are all foreseen. I have already discussed all this. Then?
Nitāi: "The voters adore the so-called leaders only when they promise sense gratification. As soon as the voters are dissatisfied in their own sense gratification, they dethrone the leaders. The leaders almost always disappoint the voters by not satisfying their senses."
Prabhupāda: Then the protest meeting, procession. But nobody will be able to satisfy them because they do not know how to keep the mass of people satisfied. They do not know. Lokasya ajānataḥ vidvān cakre sātvata-saṁhitām. These rascals, they do not know. All set of rascals, the so-called philosophers, scientists. I have always said they are rascals. Now they are coming, "What to do?" They will face so many problems, "What to do?" This is the beginning. The whole world will be in chaos if they do not take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So many "What to do?" will come. Just tell them, "And here is the remedy." Now it is the time for preaching. They are thinking. They were sleeping. Now they are thinking, "What to do?" They were blindly following sense gratification. Now it has come to the stage, "What to do?" "What to do?" This is athāto brahma jijñāsā: "Now enquire about Brahman." This is the statement.
Prabhupāda: That is also another sense gratification, to become one with the Supreme.
Nitāi: "But the Bhāgavatam says that one should not live for sense gratification. One should satisfy the senses only insofar as it is required for self-preservation..."
Prabhupāda: We don't say that "Stop altogether." No. We say, "No illicit sex." We don't say, "No sex." So we should indulge in sense gratification as far as it is required for the maintenance of the body, and balance time, we shall save for brahma-jijñāsā. This is civilization. Otherwise it is animal civilization. So that has come now. So the American people, the leaders, they are now thinking, "What to do?" And call big, big men, and give our program, "Here is to do. Come here to do." This is opportunity. Then?
Nitāi: "Because the body is made of senses, which also require a certain amount of satisfaction, there are regulative directions for satisfaction of such senses, but the senses are not meant for unrestricted enjoyment. For example, marriage..."
Prabhupāda: That is not enjoyment. Just like sex indulgence. If you indulge in more than necessary, then you will be impotent. Nature will stop. You know impotency? That will be there. Impotency. This homosex is also another sign of impotency. They do not feel sex impulse to woman. They feel sex impulse in man. That means he is impotent. It is impotency. So things are coming so rubbish now. This is the time for preaching our program, standard.
Now this progeny is bother. It is sense enjoyment, homosex. Progeny, they don't want. They're not interested. Only sense gratification. This is another sign of impotency. When after enjoying so many women, they become impotent, then they artificially create another sex impulse in homosex. This is the psychology. So people are degraded so much. Especially in the... Everywhere, not specially this or that. Everywhere. This is Kali-yuga. But thoughtful leaders, they are thinking, "What to do?" That's very good sign. And take advantage and give them program exactly to the direction of Bhagavad-gītā. Then the world will be saved. Otherwise it is doomed. It is a fact. This is the opportunity for preaching. You can take that paper and heading. There are so many headings. Each heading reply. We are the only persons who can give solution. There is no other group or any man in the world. We are only. So let them take advantage of our knowledge and apply in the society to the ben... That's all right. Now all the sannyāsīs have got the good opportunity to preach. So where is the key? Keep it. (end)
Now, if you study the lower grade of life, they are having all these things without any plan for economic development. Lower grade, just like animals, say, other lower grade... Lower grade means less than the animal or the aquatics, the plants, the insects, the birds, then come to the beast, then come to the human form of life, civilized. Uncivilized, then civilized. In this way there is a gradation. So this happiness, sense gratification, that is already there. Prahlāda Mahārāja says, sukham aindriyakaṁ daityā deha-yogena dehinām. The sense gratification is there in different bodies, but the standard may be different. Standard means our calculation; otherwise, the standard is also the same. The sex life between dogs and sex life between human beings, the pleasure is the same. There is no change. There is no change. You don't think that when the dogs on the public street enjoy sex life their standard is lesser than our sex life in a very nice decorated apartment, and so many things, nice dress, nice bedding. No. The pleasure is the same. Just like if one has got typhoid fever. It is not that the poor man will suffer more than the rich man. No. The fever temperature is the same. The doctor, after taking temperature, he will say the temperature is the same. It does not mean that because the rich man has got typhoid fever, his suffering is less than the typhoid fever for the poor man. No. That is not possible. So we think that the standard of sense gratification is pleasure. No. The standard of pleasure of this eating, sleeping... We are taking pleasure in eating nice foodstuff. Just now Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja gave me... And another animal, he's also eating something very abominable to our consideration. Just like the pig eating stool. He's also getting the same pleasure. So economic development does not mean that you can improve the quality of pleasure. That is not possible. Therefore I was speaking that the dog is running with four legs and we are running with four wheels, but it does not mean the pleasure of running is different. The dog is also enjoying by running here and there—perhaps you have seen sometimes—with four legs. And we are also. The standard does not improve. The superficial change. I may think that this is advancement. No. That is not advancement, because the real thing is that your sense pleasure.
Initiation Lectures
So Kṛṣṇa said that "You give up all your engagements." That did not mean that Kṛṣṇa..., Arjuna gave up his engagement as a military man. To give up all other engagements means to give up the engagements of your sense gratification. Instead of... At the present moment, with all our activities we are trying to gratify our senses. That's all. And surrender to Kṛṣṇa means the beginning of satisfying the senses of Kṛṣṇa. That is called bhakti. This is the definition of bhakti. What is that bhakti? Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktaṁ tat-paratvena nirmalam (CC Madhya 19.170). One has to become free from all designations. So long we are in the material conditional life, we have got various designations—"I am Indian," "I am American," "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim," "I am Christian," "I am this," "I am that," so many designations, "I am nationalist," "I am Communist," "I am socialist," so many designations. So sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66), means you have to give up the designations. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam. Now I am thinking, "I am nationalist," "I am Communist," "I am American," "I am Indian."
So it may belong to my father and mother. Or if I am a slave, then it may belong to my master. Or even if I am not slave, because I belong to some state, this body belongs to the state. Immediately if the state calls, "Come on. You sacrifice your body in the Vietnam," oh, you have to do that. So in this way, if you analytically study, you'll see the body does not belong to you. Then why should you be so much dexterous to satisfy? Just try to understand. I am not interested to satisfy the senses of your body; I am interested to satisfy the senses of my body. But if this body does not belong to me, then why should we be so much expert in satisfying the senses? Therefore they are called pramattaḥ, intensely intoxicated. It is philosophical vision that "This body does not belong to me." Therefore Kṛṣṇa's name is Hṛṣīkeśa. I am claiming this hand "my hand," but as soon as it is paralyzed it is no more my hand; it is physician's hand or Kṛṣṇa's hand or somebody's hand. So in this way we have to study. This is called philosophical vision. So Bhāgavata says they are mad after sense gratification, as a result of which he's getting different types of body. Because body does not belong to him. Just like if you pay different types of rent, you get different types of apartment. If you pay nicely, you get very good apartment in New York, in Fifth Avenue or something like that. Or if you cannot pay, then... Similarly, we are getting this apartment, body, under different condition. So we should understand that we have to get such a nice body that no more we'll have to change. That should be the destination of one's progress. That they do not know.
Everyone is trying to become happier, the karmīs, jñānīs, yogis, devotees, because in the material world there is no happiness. So the karmīs are trying to be happier to increase their sense gratification. So one man has got hundred dollars income. He is trying to be happy, more happy, by increasing the income to a thousand dollars, because his sense gratification is not sufficient in one hundred dollars. He wants thousand dollars. So if one takes to devotional service, but, "My income is hundred dollars. Kṛṣṇa, give me thousand dollars," so this is not pure devotion. Kṛṣṇa can give. Why thousand? Millions of dollars He can give. But anyone who asks from Kṛṣṇa for this material benefit, he is not a pure devotee. And unless one is pure devotee, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. By devotional service, if you want material prosperity, Kṛṣṇa can give you. Kṛṣṇa can... Whatever you want, Kṛṣṇa can give you. But that is not pure devotion. Dhruva Mahārāja went to obtain his father's kingdom in the beginning, but at the end he said that "I don't want." That is the benefit. If anyone has got any desire for material benefit and takes to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, Kṛṣṇa can give him, but the benefit is that one day he'll come to the stage he'll ask nothing from the Lord. Whereas, if anyone goes to demigods to ask some material profit, he will get, but it will be finished, and he'll never come to the stage of transcendental platform, that he has no material necessities.
So you have to please Rāmacandra in that way, to kill all these cheaters, Rāvaṇas—those in the form of sannyāsī, in the form of priest, or religionist, (who) are trying to cheat the Lord. Their only business is, "There is no God. God is impersonal. God is void"—some way or other to say there is no God. All these propositions, "God is void," "God is impersonal," means indirectly to say there is no God. So this is Rāvaṇa's policy. And in order to please Rāmacandra, oh, we have to kill this atheist class of men who try to cheat Rāmacandra and take away His Lakṣmī, Sītā, the goddess of fortune... The materialistic persons, they are trying simply to accumulate wealth, and so they come to Rāmacandra. They want money. That is Sītā. Money is goddess of fortune. So the materialistic persons, their policy is to take, earn money like anything, and employ it in sense gratification. That is their policy. But our policy is to take away the money from the atheist and employ it to the service of Rāmacandra. Just like Hanumān. Hanumān was fighting not for his personal. He was trying to recover Sītā from the hands of Rāvaṇa to bring her again to the side of Rāmacandra. That was his policy. So devotee's policy should be that "These atheists, materialists, karmīs, they have taken Sītā, all the goddess of fortune, money, for their sense gratification, and we, following the footstep of Hanumān, the great devotee, Vajrāṅgajī, we have to fight with this atheist class of men, and snatch from him Sītā and place her again on the side of Rāmacandra." So we may make plan. As they are making plan to take away all the money, we have to also make plan to take the money from the Rāvaṇa and employ it for Kṛṣṇa. Of course, we are not going to cheat them, but our policy is pacifying him, that "Your money is not... Whatever you are thinking, your money, it is not your money. It is God's money, Kṛṣṇa's money. If you kindly spare for Kṛṣṇa's service, then your life will be successful. Otherwise, you will be killed like Rāvaṇa." This message we can convey to all the Rāvaṇas. So Rāmarañjana means find out the ways and means how to please Rāmacandra and how to vanquish the Rāvaṇas. That's all.
So general instruction is that this marriage is being taken place in front of Kṛṣṇa, His devotees. There is no written agreement, but this promise is agreement, that none of you who are going to be married, there is no question of separation. This Kṛṣṇa consciousness marriage does not mean sense gratification. No. The marriage is for producing nice children, Kṛṣṇa conscious children. Because at the present moment the population is not being produced very nicely; therefore there is disturbance of peace all over the world. But if there are Kṛṣṇa conscious children, they'll grow up and they will possess all good qualities. So peace automatically will come if people become Kṛṣṇa conscious, because they become highly qualified, without committing any sinful activities. If such population is there in the world, there is no question of disturbance. Everyone will be peace, peaceful and happy. So our marriage, Kṛṣṇa consciousness institution encouraging marriage, on this ground: not to produce cats and dogs, but to produce highly qualified devotees. So you should always remember that. And there is no... Once married, there is no question of divorce or separation. That you should remember. We don't allow any divorce and separation. The husband and wife, there may be sometimes disagreement, but according to Vedic literature, when there is fight or disagreement between husband and wife, it should be neglected. Nobody take it seriously.
Similarly, when our love for Kṛṣṇa will be gliding down like that, without any cause... Without any cause... Generally... The same example again, that spontaneous love does not depend on any cause without. Cause is there. Cause is there, love. There is no other cause. So it is called ahaituky apratihatā. Ahaitukī means without any cause. Just like we generally go to the temple, to the church, with a cause. Just like in Christian church they go. There is cause: "God, give us our daily bread." The cause is bread. "Therefore I have come to church." But when you go to church without any cause, that is real love. "God will give me bread; therefore, let me go to church," this is also nice, but this motivated faith may be lost. If we approach God for some material benefit, for personal sense gratification, that may break at any time. So that is not real love. Real love is without cause. And apratihatā. Apratihatā means which cannot be checked. My love for God cannot be checked by any material condition. Nobody can say that "Because I am poor man, I have to work so hard, I cannot love God now." People say like that. "We shall wait. When I get millions of dollars in my bank balance, then I shall take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Now let me earn money." You see? This is not bhakti or attachment. Mayy āsakta. Mayy āsakta manāḥ pārtha yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ. Mad-āśrayaḥ means "under My protection." Kṛṣṇa says. So taking shelter of Kṛṣṇa or His representative... Mat means "My man" also. Mad-āśrayaḥ, take shelter of Kṛṣṇa or His representative, and try to practice the yoga by which you will have spontaneous love for Kṛṣṇa.
This word is very important, that, ahaituky apratiyatā. Apratiyatā means "without any (indistinct)." Because, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness is meant for the soul, not for the body. So far body is concerned, that is according to your past karma, it is destined. Sukham aindriyakaṁ daityā deha-yogena dehinām. Prahlāda Mahārāja says, that here in this material world we are after sense pleasure—everyone—birds, beasts, animals, aquatics, human beings, even the demigods—anyone who is within this material world, he is concerned with the gratification of the senses in different degree. But the aim is sense gratification. Therefore, we are given by the laws of nature—not, nature is not independent—by the superior order of the Supreme Personality of Godhead... Supreme Personality of Godhead as Paramātmā is sitting in everyone's heart: īśvaraḥ sarva-bhutānāṁ hṛd-deśe (BG 18.61). It specifically mentions, "it is within the heart," hṛd-deśe 'rjuna tiṣṭhati. So I am also there, and Supersoul is also there. So, the Supersoul's business is to witness: anumantā, upadraṣṭā. That is mentioned in the Bhagavad-gī... The Supersoul is simply observing what I am doing, and he is the supreme witness, upadraṣṭā. And anumantā. As I desire... Not according to my desire, but because I desire I have been given the freedom to desire. But without the sanction of the Supersoul I cannot do anything.
This is the process. Kṛṣṇa bhuliya jīva bhoga vāñchā kare. We all living entities, we have come here within this material world, to enjoy, to lord it over the material nature. It is going on, everyone can understand, that, What is this market? If you go to (indistinct)? Then what is the business there? The business is that everyone wants to enjoy this world to the full satisfaction. Either you call it "industry" or "trade" or "business" or "high-court." What is the aim? The aim is that, "I want to enjoy." This is individually. To take it nationally, statewide, one state wants that my (indistinct) must be extended-sense gratification. First of all you give your self gratification, then extended—my family, my sons, my grandsons, they will enjoy—make such arrangements. This is nature. And then you extend it from family-wise to community-wise from (indistinct) nationalize. Then international also—that we human being, we should combine together and send all the animals to the slaughterhouse and eat them. Their combined effort. What is that? Who is arranging?
Two things are going on. You cannot expect here in this material world simply income. There must be expenditure. So two things, they are known as sukha and duḥkha Sukha means "happiness" and duḥkha means "distress." So, as Prahlāda Mahārāja says, that this sukha and duḥkha-happiness and distress—is already destined. And soon as I get a certain type of body, my life's happiness and distresses are fixed up. That's all—you cannot change it. That is called destiny. But, the ātmā is—although encaged within this body—is always separated, apart from. Just like I give you so many examples: that a dog—the body is dog's body—it must be as dog. But even a dog can be made a devotee—it doesn't matter. Because he has got the body of a dog it does not mean that he cannot remain a devotee. It can be trained. As you train the dog how to bite others, at night, so you can train the dog also how to become devotee. Therefore this is training. This child is being trained up from the beginning of his birth, in the association of devotees. So if it is possible for one child, many thousands and millions of children can be taught in the devotional... What is (indistinct)? But there is no chance; there is no chance. And the Bhāgavata says that if you cannot train your children to become free from birth and death, don't beget. Pitā na sa syāj jananī na sā syāt, na mocayed yaḥ samupeta-mṛtyum. That is called rascaldom. Don't beget child. Or, "Go enjoy sense gratification and use some contraceptive method." No. The (indistinct) should be that "I am a human being, so I must have a child who must be human being." What is that human being? Jīvasya tattva-jijñāsā. Here (indistinct) we have discussed last night. Tattva-jijñāsā. Everyone should be interested to enquire—athāto brahma jijñāsā, or tattva-jijñāsā, what is the aim of life, what is the absolute truth?
So renouncement, simply giving up something, is not very good idea. You must have something better. Paraṁ dṛṣṭvā nivartate (BG 2.59). If you get something better, then you give up something inferior. Our Vaiṣṇava philosophy, renouncement means renouncement of sense gratification. The Māyāvāda sannyāsa means karma-tyāga, simply reading Vedānta philosophy, sāṅkhya philosophy, and everything given up. But our Vaiṣṇava philosophy is giving up the wrong thing and accepting the right thing. Side by side. Simply if I give up, it will not stay very long time. If I simply by sentiment give up, brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā, "This world is false and Brahman is the real, reality," so there are so many sannyāsīs, we see, they give up the so-called mithyā world and come to the Brahman realization by meditation, by meditation, meditation... Then meditation means hospital and school. Because there is no Brahman, there is no reality. So after much meditation, (he) comes to the conclusion that "Now I am a sannyāsī. I must open schools, college and daridra-nārāyaṇa sevā and goat-nārāyaṇa killing." This kind of sannyāsa has no meaning. Daridra-nārāyaṇa sevā. By killing goat nārāyaṇa. Goat is not Nārāyaṇa. Simply daridras are Nārāyaṇa. If you accept one as Nārāyaṇa, why should you not accept the other as Nārāyaṇa?
That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā: anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyāsī (BG 6.1). Na niragnir na cākriyaḥ. One who has given up... A sannyāsī is not supposed to cook. Ni, niragniḥ. And na niragnir na yogī. But anāśritaḥ karma-phalam. Tyāgī means karma-phala tyāga. This is tyāga, real tyāga. Suppose you are working. You are doing some business and getting lakhs of rupees' profit. If you can give up that profit for Kṛṣṇa, that is sannyāsa. Otherwise, "I shall enjoy fully the profit and I have become a great devotee"? No. Sannyāsa means, as it is stated, anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ. Karma-phalaṁ. There must be some karma-phala, whatever you do. There must be some result, bad or good. So anāśritaḥ, without taking shelter of the result of activities, kāryaṁ karma karo... "It is my duty." Just like Arjuna did. Arjuna understood that Kṛṣṇa wanted the fight. He took it, kāryam, that "I, this, this, I must do. This I must do. Kṛṣṇa wants it. Because my business is to satisfy Kṛṣṇa. I cannot become nonviolent as I wanted to become falsely, 'Kṛṣṇa, I don't want to fight with my cousin-brothers, my nephews, my grandfather.' That was my sense gratification." Kṛṣṇa immediately said, "What kind of nonsense you are talking, that you won't fight, won't fight? This is not good." Kutas tvā kaśmalam idaṁ viṣame... "What kind of nonsense you are speaking? You have come to fight in the battlefield, and now you are talking that nonviolence. So don't talk all this nonsense because you are My friend, My cousin-brother. It does not look well." Anārya-juṣṭam asvargyam akīrti-karam. (BG 2.2) "These things are done by the anaryas, not by a gentleman." Anārya-juṣṭam akīrti-karam. "You, this, this will be infamous for you. Don't do like that." Then He explained to him Bhagavad-gītā. And when he understood, then he took sannyāsa. What is that sannyāsa? Kariṣye vacanaṁ tava (BG 18.73) "Yes, I'll fight." That's all.
So this renouncement, for preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that is real sannyāsa. Just like when I went to your country, actually sometimes I had to live in a hell according to our Indian standard, Vedic standard. So what can be done? Hell or heaven, I have to do my duty. It doesn't matter. Factually... I do not want to describe those things. So this sannyāsa means do not care for personal sense gratification—"Oh, this is inconvenience. This is convenience." Simply go on preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So this sannyāsa. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyāsī yogī. He's yogi, he's sannyāsī in everything, who is simply working for Kṛṣṇa. There will be some result, loss or gain. So if there is loss, that is Kṛṣṇa's. If there is gain, that is also Kṛṣṇa's. Not that loss is Kṛṣṇa's and gain is mine. No. Not like that. Everything Kṛṣṇa's. We have to work for Kṛṣṇa. So, so take this mantra.
Ṛṣabhadeva. Ṛṣabhadeva is the father of Mahārāja Bhārata, under whose name this planet is called Bhāratavarṣa. From Mahārāja Bhārata. Formerly, the king of Bhāratavarṣa... The whole planet was called Bhāratavarṣa. So this... Before that, it was known as Ilāvativarṣa. So Mahārāja Bhārata, the eldest son of Ṛṣabhadeva. Ṛṣabhadeva was incarnation of God. So He advised His one hundred sons, "My dear boys, tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyed sattvam (SB 5.5.1)." Before retirement and making Bhārata Mahārāja the emperor of the world, He gave them advice. It is the duty of the father. Generally, we do also. Before retirement, the instruction is given by the father how to rule over the kingdom or manage the business. Anyone, as it is. So retirement was compulsory. Not that unless he's shot dead he's not going to retire. No. This was not Vedic civilization. At the present moment there is no Vedic civilization. Nobody is going to retire unless he shot dead. But Vedic civilization was not like that. Retirement compulsory. Brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. Four divisions of spiritual order. Human life is meant for spiritual realization. And sense gratification is animal life. This meeting is for the human beings, not for the cats and dogs. They cannot come here, neither they will understand what is going on here. A human body, human being, has the chance to understand the philosophy of life as it was enunciated by Ṛṣabhadeva.
He said, "My dear boys, this human form of life," ayaṁ deha, this body... Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājām. Everyone has got body. The Brahmā has got body and the small insect, it has got also body. The spirit soul is encaged in this material body. So lower than human being up to the animals, there are so many forms of life. Jalajā nava-lakṣāṇi sthāvarā lakṣa-viṁśati. In this way, varieties of life. But Ṛṣabhadeva said, "Now you have got this human form of life, don't spoil it like the hogs and dogs simply by sense gratification." Sense gratification is available by the hogs and dogs also. That was the instruction of Ṛṣabhadeva. And what is the duty of human life? Tapo, tapasya. Tapasya. Voluntarily accepting some inconvenience. That is called tapasya. Generally, we want loke vyavāyāmiṣa-madya-sevā nityasta jantu. Jantu, when one is not on the platform of spiritual understanding, they are called jantu. Jantu means anyone who has got life. The cats and dogs, they have also got life. So loke, in this material world, vyavāya āmiṣa madya sevā. Vyavāya means sex indulgence, sex life. And āmiṣa means meat, fish, egg-eating. Āmiṣa. Therefore vegetarian diet is called nirāmiṣa, not āmiṣa. So it is general tendency of the living being to become āmiṣa, to eat meat. That is the general laws of nature. Jīvo jīvasya jīvanam. One living entity is the life for another living entity. Ahastāni sahastānām. There are animals, two-legged animals, and there are four-legged animals.
General Lectures
So this is the greatest service to the human society, to get out them from the darkness of ignorance. That is the greatest gift. If you put him into the darkness... Suppose a man is suffering from disease and he is asking, "Sir, I am very hungry. Give me some food." If you give him some rasagullā or some very nice foodstuff, neither he cannot eat, neither he can enjoy. And by supplying such things you are making him more and more diseased. You have to cure the disease. Then give him. That's right. So there is no curing process. Simply sense gratification. I want to satisfy my senses, and if somebody talks about my sense gratification, oh, I receive him very nicely. You see? And as soon as one says that "You are diseased. You cannot satisfy your senses without restriction. Then you will continue your disease," "Oh, this is not good. This doctor is not good." This is going on. You want to be cheated; therefore there are..., so many cheaters are coming. Just like this Maharishi came. "Yes, enjoy your senses. Enjoy. Simply pay me thirty-five dollars. I give you some mantra." People gave him thousand, millions of dollars, and at the end both of them became dissatisfied. He said, "It is failure," and who were followers, they left him. So what is the use of? Don't try to be cheated. If you want to be cheated, then Kṛṣṇa will send you some cheater. And if you want to be really profited, if you simply think of Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa... (end)
Spiritual in the sense... Just like... This example also I have given several times. Just like you put an iron rod in the fire. When it becomes warmer, warmer, red hot, it is fire. It is no longer iron. Similarly, when you are completely absorbed in Kṛṣṇa consciousness and service, you are completely spiritual. Your material activities... Because your material activities have stopped, therefore your body is no longer material. Materialism means... Just try to understand. Material..., what is materialism and spiritualism. Materialism means sense gratification, and spiritualism means to love God. That's all. Personal sense gratification. Here the relationship is just like a girl or a boy. The so-called love is temporary. That's all. There is no love. As soon as there is some discrepancy of sense gratification, oh, there is separation. There is divorce. There is separation. Because the so-called love is based on sense gratification. That is materialism. And when there is no sense gratification, the satisfaction of the lover only, that is spiritualism. So in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, when your business will be only to satisfy Kṛṣṇa, then you must know that your senses and your body have become spiritualized. Actually, in higher platform, there is nothing material thing. Higher platform means when a person sees nothing but Kṛṣṇa as everything. Even himself, he's also Kṛṣṇa. (end)
You have served your senses so many lives, life after life, 8,400,000 of species of life. The birds, they are also under senses. The beasts, they are also under senses. The men, human being, and everyone, the demigods, everyone within this material world, they are after senses, serving the senses. But Kṛṣṇa says that "You just surrender unto Me. Just agree to serve Me. Then I take charge of you." That's all. Ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi mā śucaḥ. Because by the dictation of the senses we are committing sinful activities life after life; therefore we are in different grades of bodily presentation. Don't think that everyone is of the same standard. No. According to one's own work he gets a type of body. So these different types of bodies are due to different grades of sense gratification. So sense gratification is there in the hog's life also. Why he has been offered a body of the hogs? So much sensuous that it has no discrimination who is mother, who is sister, or who is this, or who is that. This is practical, you'll see. The dogs and hogs, they are like that. In human society also there are many who don't care who is mother, who is sister, or who is this. The senses are so strong. And this is our cause of all miseries, try to understand. The threefold miseries that we are suffering, that we are trying to make a solution, is due to this dictation of the senses. Therefore Kṛṣṇa is there. Kṛṣṇa is there. His name is Madana-mohana. If you try to transfer your love from sense to Kṛṣṇa, then you see the result. Immediately you'll find. Sevonmukhe hi jihvādau (Brs. 1.2.234). So this false endeavor, that "I want to be master of all I survey," "I am the monarch of all I survey," this attitude should be given up. Every one of us is constitutionally servant. Now, at the present moment, we are servant of the senses.
Now here is some important points, that in our self-realization, those who are grossly on the material platform, they think that this body, "I am this body, I am this body." Body means the senses; therefore my satisfaction means the satisfaction of the senses-sense gratification. This is the grossest form of self-realization. This body is also self. The body is self, the mind is self, and the soul is also self. Self, the synonym. The body and the mind and the soul, three of them are called self. Now in the grossest stage of our life we think that this body is the self. And in a subtler stage we think that the mind and the intelligence is the self. But actually, self is beyond this body, beyond this mind, beyond this intelligence. That is the position. Those who are grossly on the bodily concept of self-realization, they are materialists. And those who are on the concept of mind and intelligence, they are the philosophers and poets. They are philosophizing or giving us some idea in poetry, but their conception is still wrong. When you come to the point of spiritual platform, then it is called devotional service. That is being explained by Caitanya Mahāprabhu. (aside:) Go on.
So the monkey... You have no experience. In India we have got experience. Each and every monkey has got at least hundred girls with him. Hundred, one hundred. So what we able to enjoy? Every, each, they have got party, and each party, one monkey has got a least fifty, sixty, not less than twenty-five. So a hog's life, they have got also dozens of... Dozens. And they have no distinction, "Who is my mother, who is my sister, who is my relative." You see? So they're enjoying. So do you mean to say that human life is meant like that—like monkeys and hogs and cats and dogs? Is that perfection of human life, to satisfy sense gratification? No. That we have enjoyed in various forms of life. Now? The Vedānta says, athāto brahma jijñāsā. This life is for inquiring and understanding Brahman. What is that Brahman? Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ brahma or parama, īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1). And Kṛṣṇa is Para-brahma. Brahman, we are all Brahman, but He is Para-brahman, the Supreme Brahman. Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1). Just like you are all Americans, but your President Johnson is the supreme American. That is natural. Vedas says that the supreme of everyone is God. Nityo nityānāṁ cetanaś cetanānām (Kaṭha Upaniṣad 2.2.13). Who is God? He is the most perfect eternal, He is the most perfect living force. That is God. Eko bahūnāṁ vidadhāti kāmān.
Upendra: Prabhupāda, can you explain mahāmāyā and yogamāyā? Was Arjuna under yogamāyā or mahāmāyā?
Prabhupāda: Arjuna, when he was thinking in terms of his personal sense gratification, he was under mahāmāyā. And when he agreed to execute the order of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, then he's under yogamāyā.
Upendra: How is it Arjuna, if he was eternally liberated...
Prabhupāda: Because he is living entity, he is marginal. There is chance of... Marginal means... I have explained several times. Just like the land. Between the ocean and the land, there is a portion of land which is sometime merged within water, sometimes it is land. So a living entity's position is like that, marginal energy. He may be under the influence of yogamāyā or he may be under the influence of mahāmāyā. When he is under the influence of mahāmāyā, that is his conditional life. And when he is under the influence of yogamāyā, he's free. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. (kīrtana) (end)
So we should be responsible. This human form of life should not be wasted simply for sense gratification. That sense gratification facility is in every... Even in the cats and dogs, there is that facility. By nature it is already arranged. But the special qualification of this human form of life is to know himself, and to try to understand that "Why I am in miserable condition? Wherefrom I have come? Where I have to go? What is God? What is this world?" This is called Vedānta. Vedānta means to understand all these things.
So Veda means knowledge and anta means the last stage of understanding. So last stage of understanding is Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam or Vedānta. So our request... Our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is that we are requesting everyone that you do not spoil your life in pursuit of sense gratification like animals, but think that this life is very responsible life. You try to understand yourself, what you are, why you are put into this miserable condition of material existence, if there is any remedy. There is remedy. So we must take advantage of it and make our life successful.
The senses are blunt, ignorant. Ignorance and passion, the covering. But if you come out of this ignorance and passion, you come to the platform of goodness, then you can understand a little. Not fully. Then again you have to surpass, transcend the platform of goodness, which is called śuddha-sattva, without any tinge of material qualities. That position. Just like we are on the surface of this planet. There is chance of being covered by the cloud. There is clear sky sometimes, sometimes covered. But you go above, little above, say, seven miles, or just you go by plane seven miles above, then there is no chance of cloud. Everything is sunlight. Everything is sunlight. Similarly, so long you remain in the lower platform of ignorance and passion, it is very difficult to understand what is the science of God. Therefore you have to come to the platform of goodness, and there you'll understand what is sun, what is sunlight, without any interruption. So for that reason, just like you have to go by some plane, by some machine seven miles up to be completely in pure sunlight, similarly, you have to attempt... You have got... Kṛṣṇa, or God, has given you the senses, the mind, the intelligence. You have to use them. If you use them for gratifying your senses, then you go down and down and down to the animal life. And if you use them for understanding God and His kingdom and your life, your relationship, that is also possible. So both way you can use your intelligence, your mind, your senses. Both ways.
So Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura, representing ourself, he is lamenting, "My dear Lord, I have spoiled my life. I have simply spoiled my life." Why? This life, this human form of life, manuṣya-janama pāiyā, rādhā-kṛṣṇa nā bhajiyā. This human form of life was meant for understanding what is Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa and worship Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa or Lord, His energy, whatever you call. Hare Kṛṣṇa or Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa, Hare Rāma, the same thing, the Lord and His energy. So, "Instead of making contact with Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa, I am simply spoiling my life in sense gratification." So he's lamenting, hari hari biphale janama goṅāinu: "Uselessly I have spoiled my life." Why? What is your lamentation? He says, golokera prema-dhana, hari-nāma-saṅkīrtana. This chanting of Hare Kṛṣṇa, this transcendental vibration is not any material thing. It is imported from the transcendental abode, golokera. Goloka means the transcendental abode of Kṛṣṇa. Golokera prema-dhana. From there, the transcendental abode of Kṛṣṇa... Just like the sunshine, wherefrom it has come? From the sun planet. Everyone knows it. Although you cannot go there, it is far, far beyond your reach, but you can understand that the sunshine is coming from the sun globe. There is no doubt about it. Similarly this vibration, this shining, is coming from Kṛṣṇa, Goloka. Golokera prema-dhana. And prema-dhana means this chanting is in love with Kṛṣṇa. Golokera prema-dhana, hari-nāma-saṅkīrtana, rati nā janmilo kene tāy. "I've no attachment for this." Why should one be attached to this? That is explained in the next line: viṣaya-viṣānale, dibā-niśi hiyā jvale. Hiyā means heart. Our heart is always burning. Why? In touch with this material sense gratificatory process. No sense gratificatory process is giving me satisfaction. I'm trying this way, that way, this way, that way, that way. You see? Just like people are trying sense gratification in so many ways. They have come to the last point, naked picture, naked dance. What is called? That short, what is called?
So why I want that I shall be happy in this way? I make my own plan: "My nation will be happy in this way." This is called saṁsāra, adānta-gobhir, because I want to satisfy my senses. Adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisram. And the position is punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). Punaḥ punaś carvita-car..., carvita-carvaṇa means chewing the chewed. Something is chewed and thrown away in the street, and if somebody comes and chews again that thrown away article, he cannot get any juice out of it. Similarly, we are making plan, but because it is on the platform of sense gratification, the whole thing is coming to the four principles of animal life—eating, sleeping, mating, defending—that's all. That means in a circle, coming to the same animal platform. The distinction between animal and man is that... Man and animal, they have got common platform of these four principles of life: eating, sleeping, mating, and defending. The only extra qualification of man is that he can come to understand what is Kṛṣṇa and what is God. That is his special qualification. But because they are trying to keep themselves within the limit of sense gratification, they're coming again and again to that same platform, eating, sleeping, mating, and defending, without Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So this is the secret how to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. We should not limit ourself under certain area. And how it is possible? That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that "I am eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa, or God." That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
"ISKCON members speak knowingly of happiness. Don't followers of Kṛṣṇa consciousness ever get angry?" Yes. They can get angry. Why not? They're very much angry to the nondevotees: "You rascal! Why you have not, are not surrendering yourself to God? You rascal." Yes. We are angry. This anger is service of Kṛṣṇa. How can I give up anger? But we use anger in a different way, not for our sense gratification: "Why you have not paid me such and such money?" No, we don't say like that. "Why you are not Kṛṣṇa conscious?" That is our anger. So the anger can be utilized in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Everything can be utilized in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Why should I give up anger? Kṛṣṇa is also angry, and I am son of Kṛṣṇa. So anger is in me because I have got the qualities of my father. So how can I give up anger? But I use anger only for Kṛṣṇa. So we do not leave anything, but we utilize everything for Kṛṣṇa. That is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness philosophy. So (reading:) "Don't followers of Kṛṣṇa consciousness ever get angry?" Yes, we get angry. Why not? We are not artificial. Human nature is to become anger, sometimes satisfied, sometimes... So we utilize this. We are angry when one is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, when he's against God.
So anyway, this hog worship was anticipated long, long ago. Otherwise how they could be described in the Bhāgavatam, which was compiled at least five thousand years ago? Anyway, the idea is that beautiful life, beautiful education, beautiful situation, should be utilized for beautiful end, not degrade to the platform of hog worship. That is not very palatable thing at least. So Ṛṣabhadeva says, "My dear boys, the sense gratification process after hard work day and night is available in the hog's life. That is not a very important thing. This human form of life is meant for a different purpose." And that purpose he explains, that tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena sattva śuddhyed yasmād brahma-saukhyaṁ tv anantam: (SB 5.5.1) "This human form of life is meant for austerity and penance." You will find in the history of Vedic literature, there were many, many exalted emperors and kings. They also gave to the, led to the practice of austerity and penance. Dhruva Mahārāja, Prahlāda Mahārāja, Ambarīṣa Mahārāja, Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja—they were all kings. They were called rājarṣi. Rājarṣi means although they were king, most opulent, still, they were great sages. So the same thing is advised, that those persons who have got this opportunity of the spiritual, human form of life, with facility for economic welfare, with facility for giving very nicely everything—the opportunity should be used for better life. Ye tapo divyam (SB 5.5.1). Tapasya, austerity. A little penance. Just like our students. They are practicing... (break) ...is also explained, tapo divyaṁ yena śuddhyet sattvam. Sattvam means pure existence.
So the self-realization process is to be achieved by this human form of life. That is... Our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is indicating everyone. We are teaching that "Don't spoil your this rare human form of life simply by engaging yourself in the matter of sense gratification." Because sense gratification ample, or sufficient sense gratification opportunity you had even in the hog's life. Because we have migrated, we have evolved from hog's life also. Sometimes we had been a hog or a dog or something like that. Now we have come to this stage of life, this life should not be spoiled like the cats, dogs and hogs. But we should have some restraint and realize ourself. This possibility is there simply by chanting these sixteen words: Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare/ Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare. This is possible. This is practical. Since I came to your country in 1965... Of course, for one year I was traveling here and there, but in 1966 I established first my class in New York at 26 Second Avenue. Then there were many branches now. We have got about sixteen branches all over the country. And these students, they are chanting, and they have taken to the austerity. I don't accept any cheap student or cheap disciple. My first condition is that there is no illicit sex life, there is no intoxication, there is no gambling, and there is no meat-eating. These four principles are there, but all my students in these twenty, about sixteen centers—one in London, one in Germany—but you will be surprised that all these boys and girls, they have taken to this austerity very seriously. They're not drinking even tea or smoking a cigarette.
So far our living condition is concerned, we are in different platforms. So we have to first of all stand on the transcendental platform. Then there is question of transcendental meditation. In the Bhagavad-gītā, in the Third Chapter, you'll find that we have got different status of conditional life. The first is indriyāṇi parāṇy āhur... (BG 3.42). Sanskrit, indriyāṇi. First thing is bodily conception of life. Every one of us in this material world, we are under this bodily concept of life. I am thinking Indian, "I am Indian." You are thinking you are American. Somebody's thinking, "I am Russian." Somebody's thinking, "I am somebody else." So everyone is thinking that "I am this body." This is one standard, or one platform. This platform is called sensual platform because so long we have bodily conception of life, we think happiness means sense gratification. That's all. Happiness means sense gratification because body means senses. So indriyāṇi parāṇy āhur indriyebhyaḥ paraṁ manaḥ (BG 3.42). Lord Kṛṣṇa says that in the material concept of life, or bodily concept of life, our senses are very prominent. That is going on at the present moment. Not at the present moment; since the creation of this material world. That is the disease, that "I am this body." Śrīmad-Bhāgavata says that yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma ijya-dhiḥ (SB 10.84.13), that "Anyone who has the concept of this bodily understanding, that 'I am this body...' " Ātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātu. Ātma-buddhiḥ means concept of self in this bag of skin and bone. This is a bag. This body is a bag of skin, bone, blood, urine, stool, and so many nice things. You see? But we are thinking that "I am this bag of bone and skin and stool and urine. That is our beauty. That is our everything."
Then many holes come out of that pealike form—that becomes our eyes and other nine holes. In this way the body is developed in seven months. Then the child gets consciousness, and he feels very much inconvenience. Therefore moves this side, that side. Then, if he is fortunate, he prays to God, "My Lord, please save me from this inconvenience, this position." Just imagine, airtight packed. In this way he comes up and cries, and again grows. But after coming out, he does not..., he forgets in what position he was. But mother, father takes care. He forgets, again grows. So this evolution is going on. In the material stage of our life, we have got birth, growth, sustenance, by-product, then dwindling, then this body vanishes, again accepting another body. This is called cycle of birth and death. But in this human form of life one can understand what he is, what is this world, who is controlling, what is God, what is his relationship with God, what is this time factor, what are his activities. These things are to be learned, not that simply like animals, cats and dogs and hogs, whole day working for getting food. You see? And satisfied only by some sense gratification, business finished. No. That is animal life. Simply people are engaged for eating, sleeping, mating, and defending. That is the modern trend of civilization. Everyone is busy how to eat and how to sleep nicely in big palatial building, nice apartment, very good room, sleeping, the business of sleeping. And economic condition, developing the business of economic condition, means the business of eating. And defending—either you defend with atomic energy or with your nails and claws, the process is defending. That is in the animal life also. And mating, sex intercourse or sense gratification.
The Ṛṣabhadeva says that "People have become mad after sense gratification." Pramattaḥ. Pramattaḥ means mad. Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma (SB 5.5.4). And they are doing which they should not have done, but they do not know that "By doing nonsense things we have got this body, which is so much miserable." And still, he's preparing for another miserable body.
So this is not very good. These things are there. Although people have no interest in all these questions and answers, but it is our mission to awake people to the Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Although it is not possible that cent percent people will accept this or try to understand, but if one man can understand, one woman can understand, then our mission is successful. The subject matter is very difficult, but we are prepared to convince any man to this understanding provided he is serious to understand. But we don't... Very little, very few men are interested to understand this philosophy seriously. Simply they are busy with process of sense gratification, and if somebody comes, "All right, you go on with your sense gratification. You simply meditate for fifteen minutes, and within six months you become God," these bluffs like this will be accepted very easily. But we are not meant for giving people false information. We are trying to give you information from authoritative scriptures, Vedas. And if you are fortunate enough, you will take this information, try to understand by your reasoning, by your logic, and adopt it, and your life will be sublime. Your life will be successful. Otherwise you will be put into the cycle of birth and death and going on, and sufferings will continue.
So, he was Prime Minister of that Emperor Candragupta, and he has many moral instructions and social instructions. In one of his verses, he says that āyuṣaḥ kṣaṇa eko 'pi na labhyaḥ svarṇa-koṭibhiḥ. Āyuṣaḥ, "of your duration of life." Suppose you are twenty years old. Today is 19th May, and there was 4 p.m. Now, this time, 4 p.m., 19th May, 1969, gone. You can never get it back even if you are prepared to pay millions of dollars. Just try to understand. Similarly, even a moment of your life is wasted for nothing, simply in the matter of sense gratification-eating, sleeping, mating and defending—then you do not know the value of your life. You cannot get back even a moment of your life by paying millions of dollars. Just try to understand how much valuable is your life.
So our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is no religious movement or any sectarian movement. This movement is to see everyone, every human being, not only human being, even the animals, everyone be happy. Sarve sukhino bhavantu. And the process is very simple. Very simple. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. That you have already seen. This chanting is not at all difficult. Anyone, even a child was sitting here, he was just trying to clap and understand. It is immediately appealing, because this vibration is from the platform of the soul. Try to understand that we have got different platforms of our life. In the beginning we understand that this body, "I am this body." Therefore, so long the bodily concept of life is there, we are interested in sense gratification, because body means the senses. And when we fail to achieve any gratification by indulging in the senses, then we become philosophers or thoughtful. That is the mental platform. Indriyāṇi parāṇy āhur indriyebhyaḥ paraṁ manaḥ (BG 3.42). Because these senses are centered round by, of the mind. Mind is practically the controller of the senses. So when you fail to achieve real, I mean to say, pleasure from the senses, we go to the mental platform: poetry, philosophy, similar, songs. But you have to transcend even the mental platform. That is intellectual platform. Above that intellectual platform, your soul is there. So you have to immediately come to the platform of soul, and you'll be happy.
So Ṛṣabhadeva recommends that human form of life is specifically meant for austerity, regulative principles, not to do anything according to whims. Very regulative life, that is human life. We require, so long we have got this body, we require four things for maintenance of the body: āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunaṁ ca. We require to eat something, every one of us. We require to sleep; therefore we must have an apartment or sleeping place. That may be very nice or... But we must have some place to sleep, shelter. So eating, sleeping. Then some protection, defense, and sense gratification. We have got our senses; they want some satisfaction. So these are, these principles are bodily needs. These are not the needs of the spirit soul. So long we have got this body, we have to satisfy it, but not, I mean to say, unrestricted. That is not human life. That is the difference between human life and animal life. But at the present moment human life has become more than animal life. The animals have restricted periods of sense gratification, but the human life has no restricted... So Ṛṣabhadeva is instructing, "This should not be done." If you want to purify your existence, then you have to live under restriction. Just like a patient, a diseased fellow. If he wants to be cured, he must live restricted life under the direction of the physician; otherwise, he is sure to die, or he is sure to suffer, prolonging the disease. He must. So Ṛṣabhadeva advised His sons, "My dear boys, if you want to purify your existence, then you have to live a restricted life." Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyed sattvaṁ yasmād brahma-saukhyam anantam (SB 5.5.1).
In the Garga Upaniṣad it is said, etad viditvā ya prayāti sa brāhmaṇa. Etad aviditvā ya prayāti sa kṛpaṇa. Brāhmaṇa, brāhmaṇa means broadminded, liberal. So one who... Everyone will die. The cats and dogs and human being, everyone will die. But the Garga Upaniṣad says that if one dies after understanding the science of God, then he is perfect. He is brāhmaṇa. His life is broader, mahātmā. And if one dies without understanding this, he is kṛpaṇa. Kṛpaṇa means miser. Miser means... Suppose if you have got millions of dollars. If you cannot utilize it, if you simply waste it, then you are kṛpaṇa, miser. You do not know how to spend money. Similarly, we have got this body which is worth..., not millions-trillions and more than that, because we can realize in this life what is our relationship with God, what is God. We can understand. But if we don't do that, simply we waste our time in sense gratification, then we are kṛpaṇa, miser. We are losing our opportunity. So these things are there. So in whatever way you like, either this evangelistic way or this way or that way, try to understand what is God and what is your relationship with God and try to invoke your dormant love of God. Then your life will be perfect. That is our mission. If you have got your own method, that's all right. You take it. Otherwise we are giving this method, very simple. You take it. Your life will be sublime. That is our request. Yes?
Vande rūpa-sanātanau-raghu-yugau śrī-jīva-gopālakau. This movement is pleasing both to the dhīra and adhīra. There are two classes of men. Dhīra means those who are advanced in spiritual consciousness, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, and adhīra means those who are advancing in the process of sense gratification. So these two classes of men... Dhīrādhīra-jana-priyau. Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is so nice that we can please both classes of men, the dhīras and the adhīras. Anyone we invite. I have spread this movement not restricting them, that "You can enter in my class after being qualified." No. Whatever you are, come. Dhīrādhīra. You come, chant, have musical instruments, plays, enjoy, dance, take prasādam and go home. And if you like, you read literatures, if you are intelligent. So everything was given to them. And they are American boys and girls. They are intelligent, qualified. So they are coming.
Nānu sakṛd ucaritena nāmābhyasena kathāṁ sarva-pāpa-kṣayaḥ syāt, śraddhā-bhakty-avṛtyād eva vidhānaḥ. Tathā hi, sāyaṁ prātar gṛṇan bhaktyā duḥkha-grāmād vimucyate. He's giving quotation from many scriptures in which it is stated, sāyaṁ prātar gṛṇan... Sāyaṁ tri-sandhya, morning, noon, and evening, prātar gṛṇan, daily chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra. Sāyaṁ prātar gṛṇan bhaktyā, with devotion and faith, duḥkha-grāmād vimucyate. Duḥkha-grāmād means volumes of miserable condition of life. One can avoid volumes of miserable condition of life simply by chanting. Anudinam idam ādareṇa śṛṇvan iti. When it is stated anudinam ādareṇa, with great care and attention one should chant. Not that we should utilize the chanting of holy name for my sense gratification, that "I commit sin, and again I chant, and it will be counteracted. So again I chant, again I commit." No. That is not allowed. Anudinam. Śrīdhara Swami... Anudinam idam ādareṇa śṛṇvanti. Or śṛṇvan ādareṇa, with great care. Because the name, the holy name, and the person Kṛṣṇa—Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa's name—they are identical. So one should be so much careful and, I mean to say, faithful that as soon as you are chanting, you should know that "Kṛṣṇa is dancing on my tongue." Therefore how much careful and respectful we should be. It is very responsible(?).
Let me stay here for some days." No. The death is so cruel that one day, all of a sudden, it will come and say, "Please get out immediately." So if I could not finish my business during that time, and if I am kicked out, then just imagine how much loss we suffer and what kind of fool we are. The modern civilization, they do not know this. They think that "This body has come out all of a sudden by accident"—and the body means the senses—"and let us enjoy the senses to the best capacity. That is perfection of life." The whole world, especially the Western country, their ideology, philosophy, is this, hedonism. "Enjoy this life very comfortably, as nicely as possible." But that is a great defect and great mistake. Those who are in gross sense enjoyment platform, it is very difficult for them to understand. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, bhogaiśvarya-prasaktānāṁ tayāpahṛta-cetasām (BG 2.44). Those who are too much attached to material sense enjoyment, bhoga... Bhoga means material sense enjoyment. And roga, roga means which puts impediments to sense enjoyment, or diseased condition. You cannot enjoy life in diseased condition. (aside:) Don't make that sound. Hear first of all. So bhoga, roga, and there is another word, yoga. These are Sanskrit words. Bhoga. Bhoga means enjoying sense gratification. Roga means diseased condition, where, when we cannot enjoy. And yoga means to get out of this bhoga and roga and go back to home, back to Godhead. That is called yoga. Bhogī, rogī, and yogi. (laughter) Yes. Bhogī means they are interested in sense gratification, and rogī means those who are suffering.
That is a regular argument we meet everywhere, that if everyone becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, then how this world will go on? How our maintenance will be earned? That answer is given by Prahlāda Mahārāja, that here in this material world, our happiness is in relationship with our senses, sense gratification. Suppose if I put one nice rasagullā, sweetmeat, in my mouth, my tongue tastes it very nicely a kind of sense gratification, so I think I am happy. Similarly, you can study the relationship with all other senses. Especially in this material world our sex sense, the happiness from the sex life is considered to be very high, and people are struggling hard for that happiness. That is also stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham (SB 7.9.45). Gṛhamedhi means those who are too much attached to this worldly life. Their point of happiness is sex life, maithunādi. But it is tuccham, it is very insignificant.
The ultimate, tad viṣṇoḥ paramaṁ padam, they know it. But the daityas who do not know it, their preaching is required. So Prahlāda Mahārāja is instructing, "My dear daityas, my dear daitya friends," that "you are busy after the sense gratification. That has become your only business, how to gratify the senses." Sukham aindriyakaṁ daityā deha-yogena dehinām. Deha-yogena. So that your happiness has already been fixed up on the creation of your particular type of body. Just like a man is born or a dog is born. So according to the dog's body, he will have particular type of sense enjoyment. If one has got the hog's body, so according to that body, he will be inclined to eat stool. If you offer a hog one side stool and one side halavā, he will prefer to take the stool, not this halavā, because his body has been made for that type of happiness. Just try to understand; it is very scientific. The standard of happiness is according to the body you have got. So Prahlāda Mahārāja says that this sense gratification process is already fixed up. You cannot increase it or decrease it. That is stated here. Sarvatra labhyate daivād. Daivāt means by the arrangement of the Supreme. That is arranged. Sarvatra labhyate, sense gratification. Now take for example the hog. He is also busy in sense gratification. He is eating stool and becoming fatty, and as soon as there is sex desire, without any discrimination he enjoys many she-hogs, never mind sister or mother. Because the life is so made that he will enjoy in this way.
So Prahlāda Mahārāja says that according to the body, your happiness and distress or enjoyment. We do not know what is our happiness. According to body, I think this is the standard of happiness. Somebody thinks that "By eating such-and-such thing, I will be happy," just like the hog. And somebody thinks "No, this is not." One man's food, another man's poison. So everything is food and everything is poison according to the body. One thing is poison for me, but the same poison is food for others. That is for enjoyment. Therefore Prahlāda Mahārāja says that don't bother about that thing to satisfy your senses; that is already fixed up according to your body. Instead of wasting your energy in that way for so-called happiness, you just try to understand what is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, what is Bhāgavata-dharma. Just engage your energy. It is very nice instruction. People are busy all over the world for having a certain type of sense gratification. Prahlāda Mahārāja says, "Don't bother yourself for that. It is already there; you will get it."
You cannot enjoy it because on account of your fever the tongue is saturated with bile, and you taste sweet things as bitter. Similarly, we have got our senses, that is all right, but we cannot enjoy our senses in the diseased condition of material life. Therefore Bhagavad-gītā says, sukham ātyantikaṁ yat tad atīndriyam grāhyam (BG 6.21). If you want happiness, even sense gratification, that is not possible when your senses are covered by these material elements. We have got our senses, that is a fact. We have got our desires, we have got our mind, we have got our other senses, but this is now covered by the material elements. This is called dress. Just like if you are simply dressed, and if you want to enjoy sense gratification, it is not possible. You have to undress yourself, you have to become naked yourself. Similarly, if you want to sense gratify, then you have to purify your this material existence. Sarvopādhi vinirmuktaṁ tat-paratvena nirmalam (CC Madhya 19.170). You have to become purified. Śuddhyed satya yeṇa brahma-saukhyam anantam (SB 5.5.1). If you purify yourself, then by that purified senses you enjoy brahma-sukha. Brahma-saukhyaṁ tv anantam. Ananta means there is no end. Here, if you want to enjoy your senses in this material world, there is end. You cannot. The highest sense gratification in this material world is sex life, but you cannot enjoy sex life perpetually. For some moments—then it is ended. But brahma-saukhyaṁ tv anantam. But if you want to enjoy brahma-sukha... That is also sense gratification, but that is ananta. Ananta means there is no end. Ramante yoginam anante. The yogis... Yogis means the bhakti-yogī, because of all yogis, the bhakti-yogī is the best. That is the statement by Kṛṣṇa in Bhagavad-gītā.
The highest yogi is bhakti-yogī. These boys and girls that have taken this bhakti-yoga, they are the topmost yogis. So yoginam ramante. They also enjoy. Ramante yoginam anante. But their reciprocation of sense gratification is with the ananta, the supreme unlimited. Ramante yoginam anante satyānanda. That is real happiness, satyānanda. Here in this material world, that is mithyānanda, but real ānanda is to reciprocate with the Supreme, just like Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa līlā. So ramante yoginam anante satyānanda-cid-ātmani. And that is not material. Cit. That is spiritual, cid-ātmani. Iti rāma-padenāsau paraṁ brahmābhidhīyate (CC Madhya 9.29). Therefore rāma, rāma means to enjoy spiritual bliss satyānanda. That is, that should be the aim of human form of life. Human form of life is a chance to come back to the real platform of transcendental bliss. And if we waste our time simply for animal sense gratification like dogs and hogs, then you are wasting your time.
Kṛṣṇa says Himself that "Out of many, many millions of people, one may be interested how to make life successful. One may know what is the aim of life." That is called siddhi. Yatatām... Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye. Everyone is interested how to earn money or how to gratify senses. That is the modern civilization. Here is a competition of sense gratification. I'm gratifying my senses in one way, and all others, they are trying to imitate me or compete with me though they hate me. This is going on. Everyone is trying to be the lord of all I survey. That is competition. Why I want to become the lord of all I survey? Because I want to gratify my senses to the greatest extent. This is going on. But actually our position is not to lord it over. Our position is to be lorded by the Lord. That is our position, actually. If you don't agree to be predominated by the Supreme Lord, then you shall be predominated by other agent, other energy, the material energy. I met one great professor in Moscow. The subject matter was freedom, Communism. So my last question was that "You people, Communists, you have surrendered to Lenin, and we have surrendered to Kṛṣṇa. Then where is the difference? You have selected a personality like Lenin or Stalin or Marx. We have selected a personality, Kṛṣṇa.
So you can do that—there is no objection—but don't forget your original culture, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, which was taught by Kṛṣṇa Himself five thousand years ago in the Bhagavad-gītā, man-manā bhava mad-bhakta mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru: "Always think of Me, always worship Me, always offer your respect unto Me, then you will come back to home, back to Godhead." Sarva dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja: (BG 18.66) "Just try to surrender unto Me only," mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi mā śucaḥ. Our sufferings are due to our sinful activities. We cannot surpass the vigilance of material nature by committing or by executing sinful life. That is not possible. Therefore in our movement we ask everybody, especially our serious students, to refrain from four kinds of sinful activities: illicit sex life, intoxication, gambling and meat-eating. These are the pillars of sinful life. If you think that you are enjoying life by indulging in these four kinds of sense gratification, that means you are implicating yourself. The chance of human body which you have got now to develop Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if you misuse it and indulge in sinful life, then next life is waiting as cats and dogs. That is nature's law. But if we forget the nature's law, if you simply become puffed-up by false education, that is another thing. You can do that. But real fact is this: vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni yathā vihāya (BG 2.22).
So the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam therefore begins with the first aphorism of the Vedānta-sūtra, janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1), the Absolute Truth. Vyāsadeva has given you Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam after his mature experience. He wrote all the Vedic literatures but he was not happy. So when he was not in his mood, he was deeply thinking that "What is the defect in my writings that after writing so many Vedic literatures I am not feeling very happy," at that time his spiritual master happened to appear before him, and he explained that why he was not happy. He explained that "You have touched many subject matters about dharma, artha, kāma, and mokṣa-religion, economic development, sense gratification and liberation—but you have not explained about the Supreme Personality of Godhead; therefore you are feeling unhappy." So Vyāsadeva, after writing Vedānta-sūtra, he, by the instruction of Nārada Muni, his spiritual master, he compiled this Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is explanation of the Vedānta-sūtra. Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is explanation by the same author. Vyāsadeva is the author of the Vedānta-sūtra, and he explains what does he mean by the Sūtras. That is very nice. The author explains his mind. That is perfect explanation.
"Out of many millions of persons, one is interested to make his life successful. And out of millions of successful persons, one can very rarely understand what is God." That is the statement in the Bhagavad-gītā. Actually, we find that people are generally interested with economic development, sense gratification. That's all. At least, I am traveling all over the world; I see people are very busy for searching out food and shelter. But according to Vedic scripture, it is said that food and shelter is already there, given by God. Because there are 8,400,000 species of life. Out of that, human beings are very few, 400,000 species of life in different planets. And out of them, civilized men, they are very, very few. But God is giving food to everyone actually.
Just like you are God conscious, so you have invited us to hear because you..., the good qualities are there. So without God consciousness there cannot be any good qualities. We are trying to educate people to be honest, to be gentle, fair-dealing, but actually, the result is people are becoming dishonest, miscreant, rogue, thief, due to (lack of) God consciousness. Just like in the airport, all gentlemen are searched out. What does it mean? That every one of us (is) dishonest. That is to be understood. So what the education has produced? Simply dishonest men. Why? Because godlessness. That's all. And they are trying to become... Every state is trying to become secular: "Don't talk of God. Don't talk of God." Then what you are? That is animal society. The animal society has no talk of God. There is only talk of how to fill up the belly. That's all. That is the business of hog. Śāstra says, nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke kaṣṭān kāmān arhate viḍ-bhujāṁ ye (SB 5.5.1). Viḍ-bhujām means the hogs, the stool-eaters. The stool-eater is also working very hard day and night and gratifying senses. So does the human civilization is meant for imitating the hogs and dogs to work very hard day and night and gratify the senses? That's all? This is the only program at the present moment.
So there are so many rules and regulations. Those who are interested in yoga, you will find in the authorized books, yoga indriya-saṁyamaḥ: "The aim of yogic power, yogic success, is to control the senses." Our senses in this material world have been described as venomous serpents. Indriya-kāla-sarpa-paṭalī. Kāla-sarpa, cobra, black cobra. So these indriyas are like that. Indriya means senses. As soon as touches, immediately it makes him poisonous. And that is the cause of our material conditional life. The more we are indulging unrestrictedly in sense gratification, we are becoming more and more entangled. Therefore those who are very much addicted to the bodily necessities of life, for them this haṭha-yoga system... Haṭha-yoga system means yama, niyama, aṣṭāṅga-yoga. It is called aṣṭāṅga-yoga. Yama, niyama, āsana, prāṇāyāma, dhyāna, dhāraṇā, pratyāhāra, samādhi. These things are in the aṣṭāṅga-yoga. The first thing is yama-niyama. One must have regulated life. That is called yama-niyama. Then practice āsana. There is mechanical process of sitting which will help you; concentration of the mind, āsana. Then praṇāyāma, concentration of the mind. Then meditation. So meditation is not so easy thing. Unless you practice the preliminary necessities of meditation, you cannot concentrate. Even if you sit down closing your eyes, either you will sleep or you will think of other things which are more important, you think, more important in your life. So the yoga system is practically not very helpful. Helpful means we cannot execute this system very nicely.
Daivī hy eṣā. You cannot surpass the stringent laws of material nature. That is not possible. Practically, the modern so-called scientific world, they are trying to conquer over the laws of nature. That is not possible. You forget that. Peacefully forget that. It is not possible. You will never be able. Because we believe in the words of Vedic scripture, daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14), you cannot conquer over the laws... (break) "...conquer over the laws of nature, then my liberation is stopped. How it will be possible?" Yes, you can do that. Kṛṣṇa says, mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te: "Anyone who fully surrenders unto Me, he can overcome the stringent laws of nature." See practically. The laws of nature, the āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunam... Apart from other laws of nature, I become hungry; I require to eat something. I require to sleep. I require to have sense gratification. So these are laws of nature. But people who are accustomed to bad habits, it is very difficult to overcome them. But those who are in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they are actually overcoming the stringent laws of nature. These are practical.
One cannot take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness unless he is completely washed of all sinful activity. So we forbid four things because they are pillars of sinful activities: illicit sex life, intoxication, meat-eating, and gambling. Unless one gives up these four sinful activities it is not possible to approach Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa clearly says in the Bhagavad-gītā, yeṣām anta-gataṁ pāpam. Pāpam means sin. One who has finished the sinful activity... And these are four pillars of sinful activity. So we have to voluntarily give up these habits. That is called austerity, penance. The human life is meant for austerity and penance, not for increasing the items of our sense gratification. That is animal life. Human life is meant for restraint. Laws are for the human being. When you go to the street—"Keep to the left"—this law is meant for human being, not for the dog. The dogs can go from left to right; he has no punishment. But if you go from left to right, violating the rules or violating the color, symbol, signal, then you will be immediately arrested because you are human being. So all the laws or injunctions are for human being. So human being, human life, is very responsible life. As you cannot violate the state law, similarly, you cannot violate the laws given by God. That is called dharma. Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). Religion means the laws of God. If you violate, then you are punished. That's all. All right. (end)
So without understanding of God's science, Kṛṣṇa-tattva, or the science of Kṛṣṇa, the life is simply animal life because animals, they do not understand what is science of Kṛṣṇa, or God. Therefore human society without God consciousness, without any knowledge of the science of God, it is animal society. Actually it is happening. The world is now full with so many problems, so many difficulties, because the chance of human life is being misused. The intelligence of... Higher intelligence... We have got higher intelligence than the animals. The animals also live on this land, but they cannot utilize their intelligence for constructing a nice building, nice garden or industry or trade or car, because they have no brain. But the human being has got higher brain, higher brain capacity. That should be utilized not only for bodily comforts... Bodily comforts, the animals, they are also trying. Bodily comforts means to eat, sleep, to have sense gratification and to defend. So that is being (done) by the animals also, in their own way. So if we simply devote our time for these animal necessities of our life, then we are no better than animals. The higher intelligence should be utilized to know God, or Kṛṣṇa. When we say "Kṛṣṇa," Kṛṣṇa means God. Simply, generally to say God, but we give "Kṛṣṇa," the actual name of God, the actual residence of God, the actual activities of God, actual form of God, actual associates of... So many things we give. So simply to know God... Just like to simply to know one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, mathematic. Mathematic means nothing but one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine. That's all.
"Out of many million of persons, one is interested how to make this life, human life, successful..." Everyone is interested how to enjoy senses, sense gratification. But that is the business of the animals. The animals, they do not know anything beyond their sense gratification. Āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunaṁ ca, sāmānyam etad paśubhiḥ narāṇām. The sense gratification business is equal in human being and animal. The animal eats, and human being also eats. The animal sleeps, a human being also sleeps—maybe in nice compartment, but the sleeping business. The animal eats directly anything, whatever he gets; we make palatable dishes for satisfaction of our tongue. We kill many animals and eat them. So that may be the difference. Otherwise the eating business of the animal and the human being is the same. Similarly, sexual intercourse. The dog can freely have sexual intercourse on the street. The hog can have sexual intercourse on the street and without any discrimination whether mother, sister, or anything. That is hog life, dog life. But a human being has the same sexual desires but little decently. That is the difference. So the śāstra says that if you become simply engaged in these four kinds of business—eating, sleeping, mating and defending—then you are no better than animal. Your business is brahma-jijñāsā. Try to understand what is Brahman. That is your business. The Kṛṣṇa replies in the Bhagavad-gītā, brahmaṇo ahaṁ pratiṣṭhā. Even if you want to understand the impersonal Brahman, you have to search out wherefrom this effulgence is coming. That is Kṛṣṇa.
We have got this human form of life, developed consciousness to understand God, not increasing the comfort from bullock cart to motorcar. No. Not for this purpose. The so-called scientists, they are thinking that we are advancing in civilization from the primitive form, transport by bullock cart to motorcar. But that is not actually advancement. We are missing the point that this human form of life was meant for realizing God, realizing self. But we are misusing that higher intelligence and consciousness for manufacturing motorcar. And they are very much proud of advancement. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). This is described in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavata in one verse. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ. These rascals, they do not know what is the aim of life. They are captivated by the external energy of God. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās te 'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni-baddhāḥ. They are led by blind leaders. All these materialistic leaders, the politicians, the scientists, the philosophers, the technologists and so on, businessmen, so on, so on, and all these material—they are all blind and they are leading other blind. So what will be? The result will be catastrophe, because both of them are blind. If one man is with eyes, he can lead another thousands of men, blind men: "Please come. I shall help you crossing the road." But if the leader is also blind and the followers are blind, then what is the result? That is happening. They are thinking that "By bodily comfort, by sense gratification, we shall be happy." But that is not possible. We do not know. Actually we have no knowledge. Dehāntaraṁ-prāptiḥ.
No. You have got only four needs. You want food, you want shelter, you want sense gratification, and you want defense. That's all. Āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithun. These needs are there even in the animals. They also eat, they also sleep, they have also sex life, and they also defend in their own way. So you need these four things. So you can arrange for these four things, but not extraordinarily. People are increasing their needs artificially; therefore they are in trouble. And as soon as there is accumulation of more things... If you accumulate more than your need, I also imitate to accumulate more than my need, there is competition. That competition is going on. And that is the cause of war. Those who are aware of the history, the two big wars in your Europe was started by German people because they are very much envious of the English people. The Germans, they could not do business throughout the whole British Empire. We know, Indians. So they are very much envious of these British people, and therefore they started two big wars, world war. So if we collect more... Now the British Empire is finished. So if we collect more, if you want to acquire more, then other becomes jealous. And in this way, our jealousies increase, and that is the cause of war, that is the cause of fight. But if you are satisfied with your minimum or maximum needs, nobody will be jealous. Just like an elephant is eating forty kilos of foodstuff at a time. We cannot eat even one-fourth kilo, but we are not envious of the elephant because we know he needs to eat so much. Neither the elephant is envious to us. So whatever you need you can collect, you can eat—but don't take more. Then according to the God's law, you become criminal, you are punishable. That is God's law. (break) It is a common sense. You eat; I eat. It is a common philosophy. So I must eat what I need and you must eat what you need. That's not a very big philosophical problem. Everyone knows what you eat. But don't eat more. Suppose I can eat so much. And if I eat more, then I get indigestion. That is the punishment of the laws of nature. I get dysentery. Then I'll have to starve for three days because I've eaten more.
Importance of this movement is this, that we do not know what is the aim of life. The modern civilization, all over the world, especially in the Western world—nobody knows what is the actual problem and what is the aim of life. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā. The Bhagavad-gītā says, "The real problem is janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9), that birth, death, old age and disease, these are the problems." If you take birth, then you will have to die. Anyone who takes birth, he must have to die. And so long, between birth and death, there is old age and disease. Actually, these are the problems. So far we are concerned, living entities, every one of us, that is described in the Bhagavad-gītā. Na jāyate na mriyate vā kadācit: "The living entity is never born, never dies." Nityaḥ śāśvato 'yaṁ purāṇo na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre: (BG 2.20) "The living entity is eternal, ever-existing and very old, and," na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre, "it does not die after the annihilation of this body." But the modern civilization, they are thinking that "This body we have got somehow or other, a lump of matter, and so long we have got this body, let us enjoy life, sense gratification." This is atheistic theory.
If you want really peace, then you develop your dormant love of God, Kṛṣṇa. Then you'll be happy. Otherwise you'll never be happy. Because we want to love somebody. That is natural. So we have placed our loving propensity in so many things, even to cats and dogs, but that will not satisfy us, because that is sense gratification. That is not real love. Real love is to love Kṛṣṇa, love of Kṛṣṇa. So this is the highest philosophy of life, highest perfection of life, how to learn to love Kṛṣṇa. The Vṛndāvana means simply loving Kṛṣṇa. The cowherds boy, the gopīs, the Nanda Mahārāja, Yaśodāmayī, Rādhārāṇī—the only focus is to love Kṛṣṇa. That's all. This is Vṛndāvana. Vṛndāvana does not mean a city or town or this or that. Vṛndāvana means where everyone is in love, in intense love with Kṛṣṇa. So you have come to Vṛndāvana. Try to learn how to love, intensified love, Kṛṣṇa. That is perfection of life. And that is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's contribution. Kṛṣṇa-prema-pradāya te (CC Madhya 19.53).
So you are all fortunate. You have come to Vṛndāvana, perhaps for the first time in life. So it is very good opportunity. Vṛndāvana-dhāma. Aprākṛta, cintāmaṇi. Similarly, you are coming from Navadvīpa. That is also cintāmaṇi-dhāma (Bs. 5.29). These two dhāma, places, are not ordinary places. Don't make dhāma-aparādha. As there are offenses against chanting the holy name, similarly, there are offenses in dhāma, that in the dhāma one should not perform any sinful activities in the dhāma. In the dhāma, if you chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, then it increases thousand times. Similarly, in the dhāma, if you commit offenses, it increases thousand times. So dhāma, one should be very careful not to commit any sinful activities. Illicit sex, or intoxication, meat-eating and gambling—these are the sinful activities. So Vṛndāvana-dhāma, aprākṛta dhāma. Those who are attached to viṣaya, sense gratification, they cannot see what is Vṛndāvana. They cannot see what is Vṛndāvana. They cannot understand what is Kṛṣṇa and Rādhā, those who are viṣayī. Viṣaya means āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunaṁ ca. This is viṣaya, material objectives. They cannot. Therefore Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura sings,
- viṣaya chāḍiyā kabe śuddha ha'be mana
- kabe hāma herava śrī-vṛndāvana
Visaya chadiya, one who has become detestful to this material enjoyment, they can see what is Vṛndāvana. Those who are attached to material enjoyment, they cannot see what is Vṛndāvana. These are the process.
We should understand this way, that none of our senses belong to us. It is given to us for proper use. Therefore, because it is given to us by the Supreme Lord, Kṛṣṇa, the master of the senses, it should be utilized for Kṛṣṇa. This is bhakti-yoga. We should know that "Although we have got all these senses, it has been given to us for use, but the senses do not belong to me." Therefore Kṛṣṇa's name is Hṛṣīkeśa. Hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-sevanaṁ bhaktir ucyate (CC Madhya 19.170). Bhakti means when we, you use your senses, hrsikena... Hrsikena means "by the senses"; hṛṣīkeśam, "the master of the senses." Hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-sevanaṁ bhaktir ucyate: "This is called bhakti." At the present moment, under the condition of material nature, we are using our senses for our sense gratification. That is called conditional stage. And we are becoming subjected to so many changes of circumstances in different bodies. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). We are creating a different situation by utilizing senses for our personal sense gratification, and we have become bound up, bound by the laws of nature. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā. Yajñārthe karma anyatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). Karma-bandhana. Yajña. Yajña means Viṣṇu, yajña-puruṣa. If you work for Kṛṣṇa, then you are doing right; otherwise you have become implicated. Yajñarthe karma anyatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). This is the teaching of Bhagavad-gītā.
Gṛha-vratānām. Gṛha, there are different meanings of gṛha. Especially gṛha, we mean the home, house. Gṛha-vrata and gṛhastha, they are two different. Gṛhastha means although he is in gṛha, household life, his purpose is to go back to home, back to Godhead. They are called gṛhastha. And whose only purpose is to live at home-decorate the home, decorate the wife, decorate the children and make money to live very comfortably—they are called gṛha-vrata or gṛhamedhi. They are not gṛhastha. Gṛhastha means although he's living with wife, children, family, but his purpose is how to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, how to go back home, back. They are called gṛhastha. So gṛhasthāśrama is as good as other āśramas. There are four āśramas. Vedic civilization means four varṇas and four āśramas. Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, and brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha and sannyāsa. So those who are not following this principle of varṇāśrama-dharma, living like cats and dogs, they also live with wife, children. That sort of living is called gṛha-vrata. Gṛha-vratānām. Matir na kṛṣṇe: "They cannot become Kṛṣṇa conscious." Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā mitho 'bhipadyeta gṛha-vratānām. Why? Now, adānta-gobhiḥ. Go means senses. Go means cow. Go means land also. So anyone who has taken the vow of sense gratification... That is the modern world, that "Somehow or other, satisfy senses." They cannot control the senses. Adānta-go. Adānta. Dānta means control. Adānta, not controlled. Adānta-gobhiḥ. So what is that? Viśatāṁ tamisram: "They are going towards hell," because this sense gratification process, unrestricted sense gratification process, he is creating a situation of different mentality and that mentality will be prominent at the time of death, and according to that situation he'll get his next birth.
If you don't make your choice, if you miss this opportunity, then you are committing suicide. You are knowingly drinking poison. As Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura says, hari hari biphale janama goṅāinu: "My Lord Kṛṣṇa, I have wasted my time without any meaning, without any good result." Why? No, manuṣya-janama pāiyā rādhā-kṛṣṇa nā bhajiyā, jāniyā śuniyā viṣa khāinu: "I got this human form of life. It was an opportunity to worship Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa, but I did not do it. I simply wasted my time in sense gratification. This means knowingly I have drunk poison." So anyone can drink poison if he likes. Nobody can check. But it is a fact that if one does not become Kṛṣṇa conscious in this human form of life, he is drinking poison knowingly. That's a fact.
These things are there in the śāstra. We have to execute tapasya, austerity, to purify. Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyed sattvam (SB 5.5.1). So it is not a formality. It is a process to become free from this material bondage and go back home, back to Godhead. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti (BG 4.9). We should be very serious, not that to take initiation as a matter of fashion, but it should be very carefully and seriously done. (break) Human life is meant for this purpose. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. If you do not inquire about Brahman, if you simply inquire, "Where is food? Where is sense gratification...?" The whole world is going like that. Anywhere you go, the inquiry is, "Where is sense gratification? Where is sex? Where is safety, and where is eating?" This is the inquiry generally. The cats, dogs, birds, beast—everyone is inquiring like that. In the morning you'll find the birds are chirping, "Now it is morning. Where we have to go to have our necessities of life?" This is the inquiry of this material body. But when you get this human form of body, the inquiry should be different. Explain this.
Departure Talks
That is the recommendation of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Premā pum-artho mahān. Pum-artho means puruṣārtha, or the goal of life. The goal of life in the material world, generally, not for the animals but for the human being, the goal of life, generally-religiosity, economic development, sense gratification and liberation. Dharma, artha, kāma, mokṣa (SB 4.8.41, Cc. Ādi 1.90). Some people are interested to become pious, religious, because by becoming pious and religious their economic development will be automatically there. And some of them are interested in simply in economic development for satisfaction of the senses. And some of them—they are considered to be the topmost-interested in liberation. But a Kṛṣṇa conscious devotee, he is not interested in either of these four items. He is interested how to love Kṛṣṇa. That is pure devotion. That is paneama-puruṣārtha (?). So people do not know it. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). People do not know it generally. If one is very pious man, he wants to be religious, moralist, religious. And others, karmīs, they are interested how to develop economic position. And others, they are simply interested in sense gratification. This is material world. And when these materialistic persons are disgusted, then they want liberation. Their liberation means to become one, merge into the existence of the Supreme. That is not very difficult. They give the example that the water mixes with the vast mass of water, and they become one. But that is not the fact. You can make an experiment that you take a little red water and put it in the ocean. The ocean does not become red. So chemically also, the water, they are composition of molecules of water. But it is mixed with water. That is a fact, but there is another process which evaporates the water. Suppose you are mixed with the water. The Māyāvādī philosophy, that "We... Let us mix with the big water. Then I become big..." Because here in the material world he tried to become big in so many ways but he could not become big, therefore he wants to merge into the biggest, Brahman, so that he thinks that he will become... He is already Brahman. So the Brahman effulgence is combination of so many sparks of living entities.
Philosophy Discussions
Śyāmasundara: So in a sense this is spirit.
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is spirit actually. But because I have no sense of Kṛṣṇa, I am taking it as matter. Just like sometimes people criticize that "You are spiritualists, you hate materialism, why you are using this table, why you are using this typewriter, microphone." But our reply is that it is not matter, it is spirit. But when you use it for your sense gratification then it is material. Just like prasādam—the people will say "What is this nonsense, prasādam, we are taking also dahl, rice, capātī, how it becomes spiritual?" They can argue like that and sometimes they do that. But, they do not know that we are accepting this dahl, rice, capātī in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Actually it belongs to Kṛṣṇa. They, you cannot produce dahl, rice, it is Kṛṣṇa's production; everything is Kṛṣṇa's production. But when you forget Kṛṣṇa, his relationship with Kṛṣṇa, then it is material. Therefore you revive the relationship with Kṛṣṇa, you offer to Kṛṣṇa, then you understand Kṛṣṇa has eaten, now let us take. Therefore it is spiritual. The consciousness is spiritual.
Śyāmasundara: If we look back-say our written history goes back three thousand years—if we look back within that span, according to Darwin, our levels of consciousness are getting increasingly higher.
Prabhupāda: No. We say lower. We say lower. Degraded.
Karandhara: They're basing their quality on whether there's a better level of consciousness and what is more (indistinct) sense gratification.
Śyāmasundara: Technical advancements, scientific. Actually, morality...
Prabhupāda: ...is degrading.
Śyāmasundara: ...hasn't evolved. The ancient Greeks had a much higher standard of morality than the British or Darwin's time.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: (indistinct) degrading (indistinct). We see every day, every moment.
Prabhupāda: So we have seen in our childhood, they're also. No voucher or receipt. I'll tell you one little story. My father was dealing in cloth. So supposing he has come, my customer, he wants so many things. So I haven't got stock all of these things, but I wrote down his order, that you are market broker, I say just get these things immediately from the market. You go to the particular person who has got the stock and you order him to my shop, "Such and such you send me." So you have ordered for say twenty, fifty men. So their men are coming with a load of cloth, and he'll simply ask the firm's name: "This is Rajaram (indistinct)?" And someone declares, "Yes, yes, yes." But no voucher. He simply asks whether this firm is Rajaram (indistinct), and somebody nods, "Yes, yes." So he drops the bundle of cloth. It may be five hundred, or thousand rupees' worth or more than that. So similarly, many porters drop, because I require so many things. Now, you are my broker, you come, you see the stack of cloth, you ask my clerk, "Just credit this from such and such firm." But firm has sent without any voucher, without any (indistinct), and the porter simply asks whether this is the same firm, and somebody nods and we (makes noise like stamping something), that's all. Then you come, you pick up so many bundles, "Just note down, 'This has come from such and such firm.' " You note down. Then my clerk notes it. This is transaction. And out of many such bundles, you find that you did not order this, "Wherefrom it came? It is not mine." So we set aside.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the...
Hayagrīva: This is the real meaning of creative evolution.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Everyone is in ignorance due to long separation from God. In the material world the living entity has forgotten his relationship with God; therefore his activities are only sense gratification, like the animals. And when he is given lesson, instruction how to become God conscious, how to love God, that is activity, and that is real life. Otherwise it is animal life. The religion is a kind of faith, sentiment, but when the religious system is understood on the basis of good logic and philosophy, that becomes perfect understanding of God. Without philosophy, religious understanding is sentiment. That sentiment does not help anyone very much. It continues for some time, then people become disinterested in the matter of religion. So religion means, as it is stated in the Bhāgavata, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, how one has learned to love God. Then it is religion. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje (SB 1.2.6). Adhokṣaja means we do not see God eye to eye at the present moment in our physical condition, but still, hearing about Him, we can develop our dormant love for God. That is real religion.
Hayagrīva: Bergson saw the greatest obstacle to this creative evolution to be the struggle with materialism, and he felt that politics and economic reforms cannot help matters.
Prabhupāda: No. These are different subject matter. It... Politics or economic development can help, provided it is guided properly. Otherwise, if the politics, economic development is aimed at understanding God and our relationship with God, then politics is all right. Otherwise it does not help at all. But this, so far Vedic civilization is concerned, the society is divided into eight division, varṇa and āśrama. So the sannyāsī, the brāhmaṇa, they are meant for educating the others to develop dormant God consciousness. And the kṣatriyas, they are to support these teachings of God consciousness because that is the objective of human life. But unfortunately, they have forgotten everything. They think simply taking care of the body and live comfortably and enjoy sense gratification. That is animal civilization; that is not human civilization.
Śyāmasundara: Quantity or...
Prabhupāda: No. The happiness, greater happiness, yeah, quantity you can say.
Śyāmasundara: Quantity, quantity of happiness is greater.
Prabhupāda: Yes, greater happiness. So that greatest happiness can be perceived by transcenden... Happiness means satisfying the senses. Real... Happiness means satisfying the senses. So sense gratification. But the actual sense gratification, the greatest sense gratification is to be derived by your transcendental senses, not these gross senses. Sometimes these gross senses... Take for example rasagullā. You are eating but after eating four, five or ten you'll feel, "No more." That is not ātyantikam happiness. Happiness means you are enjoying something, you increase more and more and more enjoy, more enjoy, more enjoy, more enjoy. That is happiness. So whether this man knows what is happiness, that is the... He does not know what is happiness. He thinks in terms of sense gratification.
Śyāmasundara: Physical senses.
Prabhupāda: Physical. But physical senses cannot actually cannot give you the greatest happiness. Just like a man is sensuous. So he can enjoy one woman, two women, but he cannot enjoy unlimitedly. But our standard of happiness means "which is increasingly unlimited." That is happiness. Therefore it is said, ramante yogino 'nante satyānande cid-ātmani. Those who are yogis, they enjoy. So enjoyment... Without enjoyment, nothing is relished. Just like you are taking to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, there is some enjoyment, transcendental bliss. Otherwise how you can stick to it? So real happiness means "which is increasingly unlimited." That is happiness. Temporary happiness... Vidyāpati sings, tātala saikate vāri-bindu-sama suta-mita-ramaṇī-samāje, that we are trying to enjoy in this material world, happiness in the society, friendship and love. Suta-mita-ramaṇī-samāje, friends, children, wife, like that. That is in the society. But Vidyāpati says, "Yes, there is happiness undoubtedly, but that happiness is just like a drop of water in the desert. Desert means it is hankering after water. Dry desert, he requires water, but if you go there and put a drop of water, "Now here is water." So our, we are, who are hankering after so great happiness that these rascals' sense gratification happiness is not giving us. It is just like a drop in the desert. Therefore we are changing, changing simply. The same thing, punaḥ punaś carvita-car... The same thing, we do not know what is real happiness so simply changing the posture. Now woman should be mini-skirted. Why they should be fully dressed? (laughter) Now they're also trying. Ultimately they're coming to the position of (indistinct) (laughter). Just see. Here, here in the (indistinct). They are attracting tourists by showing the vagina(?). That's all. This is happiness. They have no other information. "Come on, here is vagina, open. This is their standard of happiness. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham (SB 7.9.45), most abominable thing they have taken as happiness. So what do they know about happiness? These so-called philosophers, they do not know what is happiness. And why they are philosophizing about happiness? Happiness is also our aim, but that happiness is different from this happiness. Just like a hog is enjoying happiness eating stool. No man will be happy by eating stool neither he will agree to enjoy such happiness. It is the standard of happiness according to the body.
Prabhupāda: So that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We have invited our students, and when they actually practice Kṛṣṇa consciousness, the result is immediately there. Just like you all European and American boys, you were eating meat, and other things were practiced, but since you have taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, you have left it. So by practicing, we see the practical result; therefore this is most practical.
Śyāmasundara: What about, for instance, people who are practicing sense gratification, and they find it very practical to gratify their senses. Does this mean that it is meaningful or real?
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is real. But by sense gratification we will gradually glide down to the hellish condition of life. Therefore sense gratification should not be allowed unrestricted. That is practical. If you eat more, you suffer from indigestion. If you have more sex life, then you get tuberculosis. This is practical. If you indulge in intoxication, then gradually you become a nonsense, crazy. Therefore when we say that "Don't do this," this is practical.
Śyāmasundara: So it is a matter of degree which is more practical than something else. Sense gratification or communism or any other "ism," it's practiced (indistinct) effect, but that effect...
Prabhupāda: But if it has bad effect then what is the use of it? It must have good effect. Effect must be there, but if it is bad, that is not practical. The effect must be good and continuous.
Śyāmasundara: He says that... This is a quote...
Prabhupāda: Just like in the śāstras it is stated that the human beings, they are being controlled by the modes of passion, so they love to work very hard. And that hard working, they think it is happiness. Actually, everyone is working hard day and night, and because he is getting some money in return, he is thinking that "I am becoming happier." In exchange of a little money he is accepting that hard working is very good. But śāstra says that this hard working for some sense gratification is being done by the hogs and dogs. They are also working hard, and getting some remuneration for food and sense enjoyment. So that business is there already. So does it mean that a human being also works so hard, as a hog, simply to get his food and sense gratification? Suppose a big builder is working hard and getting money. But what will be the result of his work? A little food and sense gratification. A beggar also, he's getting the little food and sense gratification. Then why he's happy working so hard? What is the use? That sense, it does not come to him. He thinks, "I am happy. I am happier than the beggar because I have got so much money, I have got such a big building." But what is in relation to you? You are eating the same four capatis and have your sex life with your wife, that's all. What is the better advantage you are getting than the hog and poor man? This is because he is in the modes of passion, he is thinking, "I am happier than him." This is called māyā, or illusion.
Śyāmasundara: How does worship of Viṣṇu solve social problems? Just like in Calcutta there are more social problems than practically anywhere.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Viṣṇu... In the Viṣṇu Purāṇa, it is said that varṇāśrama-dharma. Varnāśramācāravatā puruṣeṇa paraḥ pumān (CC Madhya 8.58). Any man who executes this varṇāśrama-dharma, he satisfies Viṣṇu. The varṇāśrama-dharma is there, and the brāhmaṇas, kṣatriyas, the vaiśyas, and the śūdras. So according as they are prescribed, how the brāhmaṇas should live, how the kṣatriyas should live, how the..., then there is no trouble. The whole problem is solved. But they have killed the varṇāśrama-dharma. They are now all śūdras. The śūdras, how they can make solutions? Śūdras means nonintelligent persons. So what they can do? They are running on democratic government voted by the śūdras. So what these rascal śūdras will do? They require... Śūdras are meant for serving the higher sections—brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya. And if the śūdras are given government... Just like we are seeing, in Africa they have been given independence, but they have not improved. The Englishman is still controlling, the Indians are still controlling. And what is the meaning of their so-called self-ruling? We have seen it, still they are poor, because they are śūdras. Śūdras have no brain. In America also, the whole America once belonged to the Red Indians. Why they could not improve? The land was there. Why these foreigners, the Europeans, came and improved? So śūdras cannot do this. They cannot make any correction. Now people are becoming śūdras by so-called education. So they cannot make any solution of the problems. If that daiva varṇāśrama again established, then the whole problem will be solved. That was the plan of my Guru Mahārāja, daiva-varṇāśrama city. Daiva varṇāśrama means that it is stated by Kṛṣṇa, guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). By qualification, by the work, one should be brāhmaṇa. By qualification, by work, one should be kṣatriya. By qualification, by work, one should be vaiśya. By qualification, by work, one should be śūdra. When this order is established, that is called varṇāśrama-dharma. Then Viṣṇu, Lord, will be happy, and He will give us... He is already giving. Eko bahūnāṁ yo vidadhāti kāmān. Actually, He's giving us all the necessities of life. But because we are now śūdras and devoid of devotional service, so prakṛti is controlling the supply. That is the difference. That is stated in connection with Pṛthu Mahārāja. Pṛthu Mahārāja, because there was not enough production, he wanted to kill the pṛthvī. So he says that "That's all right, but I am controlling because production is meant for performing yajña. These rascals, the demons, they are simply eating. They are not performing yajña. Therefore I am controlling." Saho yajña pratiṣṭhita. The whole plan is that the living entities, especially the human beings, they are meant for performing yajña. Yajña means to satisfy the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Viṣṇu. The Bhagavad-gītā also says, yajña-dāna-tapaḥ-kriyā na tyājam. You cannot give up these three things, even if you are in the renounced order of life. Yajña-dāna-tapaḥ-kriyā. It is just like our Vaiṣṇava sannyāsīs, they are performing saṅkīrtana yajña and they are distributing Kṛṣṇa love. And to keep themselves fit, they are observing the rules and regulations and chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. This is yajña-dāna-tapaḥ-kriyā. Following the rules and regulations and regularly chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, that is tapasya. And this is the best dāna, charity. Just like Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He was eulogized by Rūpa Gosvāmī: namo mahā-vadānyāya kṛṣṇa-prema-pradāya te (CC Madhya 19.53). "You are the most munificent incarnation because You are giving love of Godhead." So those who are distributing the idea of love of Godhead, they are the best charitably disposed man. So we, we have not given up yajña-dāna-tapaḥ. That is not to be renounced. Because a sannyāsī is renounced. Renounced means he should renounce his sense gratification, not renounce these things, yajña-dana-tapaḥ.
Śyāmasundara: So he proposes these three stages of existence. The first one we talked about is the aesthetic stage of noncommitment—simply sense gratification and speculation. The second stage he says that a man makes a leap in commitment and begins to concern himself or involve himself with the world on an ethical level. And the third stage is the religious stage, or self-realization. But in the second stage he says that "The despair of life has lead one to the commitment to make choices, to commit himself to action and to enter into life's involvement and become ethically concerned; that suddenly he's turned within himself and in his passion and freedom and decision or subjectivity, then he begins to find himself."
Prabhupāda: What does he find?
Śyāmasundara: This may be likened to the people who do pious works, or the people who do good to others, who are morally committed to life, on that level. To feed others, clothe others, like that. They say that that is a step higher than simply sense gratification and speculation. He says that "This is a move in the right direction toward authentic selfhood, and eventually this way we will understand what I am. And because we are at last doing something, we are involved with life, then we are no more abstract. We are existing." Then we are existing. That someone who is doing all sense gratification and mental speculation, they are living abstract life, abstract life, external life. Simply waiting for the enjoyment of life and speculating what is the meaning of things, that is abstract life, and this being committed to action or decision-making is called existence. This is the first step toward real existence. So in this ethical stage he says that by the very act of making decisions that we become aware, that we become more and more aware, and that decision-making means awareness. And if we make choices about anything, that means that we are becoming aware.
Prabhupāda: What is the decision? Why people become moral—to feed the poor, like that, humanitarian? What is the decision, ultimate decision?
Śyāmasundara: He says that it's not so much the fact of the decision but how the decision is made: if it's made with integrity and self-confidence.
Prabhupāda: How the decision... Why, how the decision is made, that I still don't know. How? Why? Why they make such decision? One man is running on a slaughterhouse. He's killing only. Another man is after humanitarian work, giving food, giving them chance to live. So what is the ultimate decision?
Prabhupāda: But our point is that we do not know genuinely. What we know, that is foolishness, that is asses' knowledge. Just like ass knows that "I am this body. I am the servant of this washerman." So this knowledge, like this. So he has made the decision. The ass has made this decision that "I shall take a morsel of grass and whole day I shall carry tons of cloth of this washerman." He has made this decision, that's all. Then is it that the decision is very nice? This is asses' decision, that's all.
Śyāmasundara: They say that rather than indulge in unrestricted sense gratification or spend our life speculating about...
Prabhupāda: So why not unrestricted sense gratification, if one makes that decision?
Śyāmasundara: Just because it becomes boring.
Prabhupāda: Ah?
Śyāmasundara: He says because unrestricted sense gratification becomes boring and full of despair and...
Prabhupāda: That is boring, then he, he must give that aim of life which is not boring.
Śyāmasundara: He says the only..., that it is not boring if one becomes actively engaged somehow with life, you see. He gets a purpose in life and chooses to act on that purpose.
Prabhupāda: How you make such choice, that is the point. Whimsically.
Śyāmasundara: No. He says this choice is made through inward, subjective, passionate search, and it will come out.
Prabhupāda: So that inward, subjective, just like these Bowery bums—what is called?
Devotees: Bowery bums.
Devotees: Bowery bums.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So they have made decision as soon as they get some money, purchase one bottle whiskey and drink it, and lie down.
Śyāmasundara: Then he would say there is no decision being made there. There is no commitment to any ethical decision there. That is just sense gratification. He says the next higher level above unrestricted sense gratification is to take up a cause, a good cause, and determine...
Prabhupāda: So how he'll make it a good cause? The good cause is relative. You think something good cause, I think something good cause, so what is really good cause? Who will, who will decide that this is good cause?
Śyāmasundara: He says that the good cause is determined when we begin to anticipate death. He says that if we lived every moment as if we might die soon in anticipation of death that we will make the right decisions. That then the value, the real value of things will come out.
Prabhupāda: That is not possible, because we see that in the slaughterhouse the animal is seeing that "Next life is mine." What decision he can make? And still he is standing there and does not go away.
Śyāmasundara: Yes. That the self...
Prabhupāda: And he accepts that self is eternal, integrating past, present and future.
Śyāmasundara: Yes. Well, this is the next level. This is the third and highest level. He said that first of all there's the aesthetic level of unrestricted sense gratification, but this ends in despair. Then comes the ethical level, when one decides, "Well, I will take a cause, good cause, and I will commit myself to it and act upon that." Then he comes to the development of the religious stage, or the highest stage. When he, his decision-making power is so advanced that...
Prabhupāda: In other words, he's supporting our movement.
Śyāmasundara: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Because we are in the topmost stage.
Śyāmasundara: He does. The modern philosophers, his foIlowers like Sartre and Camus and people like that, they have only followed his lower development stages. They have not thought of this aspect of a religious stage. He said that the ethical stage is typified by a regard for duty, but this advances to the religious stage when there is obedience and commitment to God. And the chief symptoms of this stage...
Prabhupāda: So it is not that he is supporting our movement?
Śyāmasundara: No, no. He does. He says that the chief symptoms of the religious..., when one is advanced to the religious stage, are suffering and faith.
Prabhupāda: Not always suffering. (indistinct) We are, we in religious. Suppose we are in the topmost. Does it means that we are suffering?
Hayagrīva: As far as defining love, what is love—people speak of love—he says, "If someone asks what is love, Paul answers, 'It is the fulfillment of the law.' Love is a matter of conscience, and hence it is not a matter of impulse and inclination, nor is it a matter of emotion, nor a matter for intellectual calculation. There is only one kind of love." And he says that is spiritual love.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Love in the material world is impossible. In the material world everyone is interested for his own sense gratification. The love between man and woman, young boy and young girl, that is not love, that is lust, because both the parties are interested in sense gratification. But that is not love. Love means the parties, they will not think of his own sense gratification but the sense gratification of the beloved. That is pure love. That is not possible in the material world, but we see the example of love in the picture of Vṛndāvana. In the Vṛndāvana village, everyone—man, animals and fruits, flowers, water, everything—they are only for loving Kṛṣṇa. They do not want any return from Kṛṣṇa. That is real love, anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam (Brs. 1.1.11). If one loves God with some motive, that is material love. Pure love is simply to satisfy the desires of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Therefore in the material world the love, word "love," is misused. The propensity of lusty desires is going on as love. Real love is only with God—individually, collectively, anyway. And that Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, He is the supreme object of love, either by adoration or by serving or making friendship with Him, or loving Him as child, or loving Him as beloved—there are five different relationships: śānta, dāsya, sākhya, vātsalya, mādhurya—that is real love.
Prabhupāda: I could not follow. Old man is perfect?
Hayagrīva: No. But an old man can see the course of life, can see life in its entirety, the ages...
Prabhupāda: As far as different, old men have got different experience. We have seen in Western countries old men, they still follow the path of sense gratification. So where is his experience? Unless there is training, simply to become old man is not sufficient. Training is required. Old man, actual old man should take renunciation. That is Vedic plan. At the end of life one should become a sannyāsa and completely devote his time and energy to understand and serve God. So unless there is training from the very beginning as brahmacārī, simply by age one is not mature. That is not correct.
Hayagrīva: He says it's customary to call youth happy and age the sad part of life. This would be true if it were the passions that made a man happy. Youth...
Prabhupāda: Happy, happiness to the modern standard means sense gratification. So that sense gratification continues even in old man. So actually he requires training and acquirement of knowledge. There is a word in Sanskrit, vidya tam (indistinct). One can become old man even without age. That means it is knowledge that is counted, not the age.
Hayagrīva: There's an expression, "The old fool."
Prabhupāda: Old fool, yes.
Hayagrīva: Continuing on this, God's personality, these are his recollections of his spiritual encounters. He says, "But here I encountered a formidable obstacle. Personality, after all, surely signifies character. Now character is one thing and not another, that is to say, it involves certain specific attributes. But if God is everything, how could He still possess a distinguishable character? On the other hand, if He does have a character He can only be the ego of a subjective, limited world. Moreover, what kind of character or what kind of personality does He have? Everything depends on that, for unless one knows the answer, one cannot establish a relationship to Him."
Prabhupāda: His character is transcendental character, not like the material character. Āprakṛta. It is said, just like bhakta-vatsala, He is very kind to His devotee. This kindness is, is one of His characteristic. Similarly, He has got unlimited qualities, and according to that transcendental quality He is sometimes described, but all those qualities are permanent. Whatever qualities and character we have got, they are minute manifestation of God's character, because we have got character also. That is only a minute manifestation of God's character. He is the origin of all character. That is described in the śāstras. He has got also mind, He has got also feelings, He has got also sensation, He has got senses, sense perception, sense gratification. Everything is there. That is unlimitedly, and we, being part and parcel of God, we possess in minute quantities all the God's quality. Actually our characteristics, qualities are simply atomic manifestation of God's quality. The original qualities are in God.
Prabhupāda: Therefore the Vedānta gives for him: athāto brahma jijñāsā. Now we have got enough to eat, enough to enjoy. Now we inquire about Brahman. This is the business we should (indistinct). So this is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. We are giving knowledge about Brahman, or the Supreme. We are not concerned about giving you some scientific invention, some this invention, that invention. We are giving the ultimate benefit. Now, just like I have come to America with this hope, that "Americans are not properly (indistinct), they have no (indistinct) problems. If I go there, if I speak to them about Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they will be able to take." So if we, the human society, has come to such standard, then the next point is, now they should eat peacefully, sleep peacefully and sense gratification peacefully and, making the mind peaceful, inquire about the Supreme Absolute. This is ideal life.
Śyāmasundara: This will provide the stimulus which will..., so the people will react favorably, to behave favorably, simply by performing these activities?
Prabhupāda: The experience is... We have got experience that this material world is full of misery. Everyone will (agree). Otherwise why he is trying to adjust? Now we have got information from Bhagavad-gītā,
- mām upetya tu kaunteya
- duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam
- nāpnuvanti mahātmānaḥ
- saṁsiddhiṁ paramāṁ gataḥ
- (BG 8.15)
Kṛṣṇa says, "Anyone who comes to Me, back to home, back to Godhead, he does not come again to this material world which is full of misery." Mām upetya kaunteya duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam, nāpnuvanti... (BG 8.15).
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Devotee: That is their whole thing. All their philosophy tries to have good sex life so that they don't have to think that they will be punished. So if I can have this freedom then I am right.
Prabhupāda: Yes. The real point is sense gratification. Freedom of sense gratification. That is their point. But these fools, they do not know that by sense gratification you are entangling yourself in repetition of birth and death.
Śyāmasundara: So Skinner nonetheless allows himself some relaxation. He drinks vodka and tonic in the late afternoon (laughter) and sees an occasional movie. He reads George Simon detective novels once in awhile and enjoys the company of friends. He has two children and his grandchildren. There is a note from his diary: "Sun streams in (indistinct) room. My hi-fi is midway through the first act of Tristan and Isolde. A very pleasant environment. A man would be a fool not to enjoy himself in it. In a moment I will work on a manuscript which may help mankind. So my life is not only pleasant; it is earned or deserved. And yet, yet, I am unhappy."
Prabhupāda: In that sense he is a truthful man. Yes. Truthful.
Śyāmasundara: He wants to... He is trying to understand.
Prabhupāda: He cannot. That is not the way of understanding. The Vedic way is that you first approach a guru. That is the Vedic way. He cannot personally search for the truth. That is not possible. (end)
Śyāmasundara: So that's all.
Prabhupāda: That's all.
Devotee: Is it not a fallacy to think that by adding sense gratification we will decrease the demands, desires for more?
Prabhupāda: That is not possible. Adding sense gratification means adding ghee, pouring ghee on the fire.
Devotee: Yes. But some has to be there as the senses, which they're denying. The basis of their ideology is that conflict brings about growth or progress. If they want a peaceful society, they're still trying to get rid of their conflicts.
Prabhupāda: That we have discussed in the beginning. Conflict must be decided by higher intelligence. Just like I have given yesterday, there is conflict between two litigants and the high-court judge decides. So conflict there must be, but it must be decided by higher authorities. That's all. Otherwise it will go on. If you don't go to the higher authorities, then it will go on. It will never end, conflict.
Revatīnandana: It also follows from his philosophy that if somebody defeats him and throws him out, that other person was right.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Revatīnandana: He was wrong.
Prabhupāda: That is right.
Hayagrīva: In his Politics, Plato changes his mind later in life. In the beginning he believed that in an ideal state the leaders should possess nothing of their own, neither property nor family. He felt that they must live together in a community where wives and children are held in common to guard against corruption, bribery and nepotism in government. He felt that the elite philosophers should mate with women of high qualities in order to produce the best children for positions of responsibility. Now, how does this view of common wives and children correspond to the Vedic version?
Prabhupāda: Yes, Vedic civilization is that, that putrārthe kriyate bhāryā. A man should accept a wife for putra, for son. Why son? Putra-piṇḍa-prayojanam: a putra should be responsible for offering piṇḍa, so that after death, even by mistake or somehow or other I am in a wrong position, by the piṇḍa I am elevated. This is idea. So marriage is for having good son, that's a fact, who will deliver me even if I am in the hell. Therefore the śraddhā ceremony in there. So even the father is in hell, by this śraddhā ceremony he will be delivered. This is the idea. So unless one has got son, nobody is going to offer him śraddhā oblation, and even one may be very benevolent, but it is not expected. But it is the duty of the son, as it is said, putra. Pu means there is a hell pundama (?). The hell's name is pundama, pun. So I mean, pu and tra, tra means one who delivers. If by chance I am put into pundama naraka trayate, one who delivers me from that hellish condition of life, he is putra, and for this kind of putra I accept a wife, not for my sex enjoyment. And it is confirmed in the Bhagavad-gītā, one who uses his sex for these religious activities, that "I shall get good father, a good son who can deliver me," then marriage is required. Otherwise it is useless. Dharmāviruddho kāmo 'smi. Kṛṣṇa says, "Sex life which is not against religious principle, that is I am." And sex life which is, which has no religious principle, that is sense gratification leading one to hell. So this theory: that we should marry, we should have sex life for creating good progeny. And my Guru Mahārāja used to say—he was a sannyāsī brahmacārī—but he said that "If I could produce really Kṛṣṇa conscious children, I can use hundred times sex life. Otherwise why shall I use my sex for cat, producing cats and dog?" He has said like that. So the śāstra also says, pitā na sa syāt janani na sa syāt: the father's, mother's duty is how to rescue their children from the cycle of birth and death. That is real father and mother. Otherwise cats and dogs, they are also father and mother. That is not wanted. Vedic culture is different. Produce children for such education and such accomplishment that he can be saved from the cycle of birth and death, and the putra should be such qualified that even his father goes to the hellish condition of pundama, he will deliver him. That is the idea of becoming father and family.
Hayagrīva: Continuation of Aquinas. Aquinas felt that the monastic vows of poverty, celibacy and obedience gave one a direct path to God but that they are not meant for the masses of men. He conceived of life as a pilgrimage through the world of the senses, through the world of nature, and to the spiritual world of God's grace. These, when a..., when one enters a monastery he takes a vow of poverty, chastity and obedience, these three vows.
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is called tapasya. According to Vedic instruction one must take to the path of tapasya. Tapasya means voluntarily self-denial, sense gratification denial. That is tapasya. Tapasā brahmacaryeṇa (SB 6.1.13). Tapasya, our austerity begins with brahmacarya, celibacy, no sex life. That is the beginning of tapasya. Tapasā brahmacaryeṇa śamena damena vā, controlling the senses, controlling the mind. Then tyāgena, renouncement or giving in charity, whatever you have got, for the service of the Lord, tyāgena; satya-śaucābhyām, by following the path of truthfulness and remaining cleansed; yamena niyamena vā, by practice of mystic yoga. In this way one makes advancement towards spiritual kingdom or spiritual world. But all these can be totally performed simply by engaging oneself in devotional service. That is also stated: kecit kevalayā bhaktyā vāsudeva-parāyaṇāḥ (SB 6.1.15). If one becomes devotee of Lord Vasudeva, Kṛṣṇa, then simply by executing devotional service he attains the result of austerity, celibacy, and mystic yoga practice, and the result of charity, truthfulness, cleanliness—everything attains simultaneously, without separate effort. Therefore our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is spreading devotional service. By one stroke, the candidate can attain the results of all other processes.
Hayagrīva: Well, he says no one can hate God, but what about Kaṁsa and others?
Prabhupāda: That is demonic. Naturally one is in love with God. He should love God. But when he is in māyā he thinks himself as separate from God. Instead of loving Him, he thinks himself as separate from God. Instead of loving Him, he thinks that God is hindrance, my competitor of sense gratification, therefore avoid God, kill God, I become absolute sense gratifier. Anyone who hates God means he is a demon.
Hayagrīva: Spinoza writes, "The more we understand individual objects, the more we understand God." Is this the proper process? Wouldn't you say that the more we understand God the more we understand individual objects? Which is uh...
Prabhupāda: Anything you take, that is perfection of knowledge in God. Which thing is not related with God? Everything is related with God. In the material world anything you will take it is made of the five elements, but these five elements, they are expansion of God's energy. So intelligent person sees in everything with reference to God's expansion of energy. That is the position of devotee. He does not think anything separate from God. And as he is lover of God, devotee of God, he wants to engage everything, because if everything is God's property, that should be used for God's benefit. This is devotee's conception. The asuras, they have no conception of God. Neither they are obedient to God, neither lover of God. He thinks the material world is for his enjoyment. He cannot see the material world is expansion of God's energy. Therefore anyone who uses the material product for his personal benefit, he is called a thief. Just like I have created something. If somebody use up that something and does not think of the proprietor, he is a thief. Thief means, in our childhood we got a definition of thief, that anything taken without the permission the property is theft. That is very nice. So anything in this world has reference to the expansion of energy of God. So if you do not take everything as prasādam, then you are thief and you are punishable. A thief is always punished. So therefore those who are enjoying things without reference to the God, they are all demons and they are punishable. They are thieves.
Hayagrīva: And Locke argues on behalf of private property given to man by God. That is to say a man may have a certain stewardship over a certain amount of property. Is this in compliance with the Īśopaniṣadic version?
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā: (ISO 1) everything belongs to God. Just like the father has got many sons and the father is the proprietor of the house. He gives one son, "This is your room," the other son, "This is your room." So the obedient son is satisfied what the father allows to him. Others, those who are not obedient, they want to disturb other brother that "This room also belongs to me." That creates chaos and confusion in the world. The United Nations, they have created a society for unity of the nations, but actually that is not unity. That is another way of encroaching upon others' property. Therefore there is no peace, unless they accept God is the Supreme proprietor. And we must be satisfied with the allotment God has given to us. Then there is no trouble. But the trouble is that we are not satisfied with the allotment given to us. That allotment can be understood by language or similar culture. So why one should encroach upon others' property which is allotted by God? That creates disturbance. So this so-called modern civilized man, first of all they create disturbances, and then they want to make some adjustment. Of course, for the good of a certain people, if somebody encroaches... But they do not know what is good. They encroach upon others' property for their personal sense gratification. Otherwise, if for the good of the local people somebody, some (indistinct), just like the Aryans, they conquered over many islands or places, but that was for the good of them. Just like the Pāṇḍavas, they also ruled over, but the Pāṇḍavas were God conscious devotees and they made everyone enlightened in God consciousness. That kind of encroachment. Just like Lord Rāmacandra went to Ceylon, or Lanka, and conquered over it, because Rāvaṇa was a demon. So He conquered, Lord Rāmacandra conquered over the property of Rāvaṇa, and gave it to Vibhīṣaṇa, but He did not take anything. Just like Kṛṣṇa conducted, managed this Kurukṣetra war personally, but the kingdom was given to Yudhiṣṭhira. He did not encroach. So this kind of encroachment is all right, that everyone should be Kṛṣṇa conscious, everyone should be highly elevated in spiritual life. For spreading this civilization, encroaching on others' property is quite fit. But if one encroaches upon others' property for self-aggrandizement, for stealing for his own sense gratification, that is sinful.
Hayagrīva: So much for Locke.
Prabhupāda: Hm. That's all. (end)
Hayagrīva: So that there's no question of independent liberation?
Prabhupāda: No. Therefore that is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā, yajña-arthāt karma. Only for yajña or Kṛṣṇa you should work. Yajña-arthāt karma, anyatra karma-bandhanaḥ. Otherwise you are entangled. This is freedom, to work for Kṛṣṇa; then you are not under entanglement. This is..., there are many practical examples. Just that a soldier, he is killing, his business is killing, and the more he kills he gets recognition. But as soon as he kills one man on his own account, he is murderer. Just like when... The soldier's business is to kill, and so long he is killing for the satisfaction of his state, of the government, he is getting recognition medals. The same soldier, as soon as he kills one man for his own sense satisfaction, he is a murderer, he is to be hanged. This is the karma-bandhanaḥ. The business the same—killing. But one killing is on the order of the state and one killing is for his sense gratification. So killing business is the same, but the position is different. Similarly, when you act for Kṛṣṇa, that is not karma-bandhanaḥ; that is freedom. And when you act for yourself, that is karma-bandhanaḥ. That is the teaching of Bhagavad-gītā throughout. Arjuna was thinking, "Killing, and suffer the sinful activities," because he was thinking on account of himself. But when he understood that "I am induced to kill on behalf of Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa wants this fight," then he accepted Kṛṣṇa's proposal. That is not karma-bandhanaḥ. That is not killing. One has to understand this.
Prabhupāda: He recommends these things?
Hayagrīva: So he believes that through..., by providing the people with sense gratification the government can keep people from acting in an antisocial way.
Prabhupāda: That means he is also of the same category. No, that will not help. Just like, the example is given in this connection, that when there is fire, if you think that putting more and more ghee the fire will extinguish, that is not possible. To keep the society in order they must be educated according to his capacity, and they should be engaged for common benefit. That is required. Not that to encourage them in their bad habits things will be done nicely. No. That is not possible.
Hayagrīva: He ultimately believes in bringing people under control. He says, "If there is any purpose or direction in the evolution of a culture, it has to do with bringing people under the control of more and more of the consequences of their behavior."
Prabhupāda: Yes. Human life is meant for control. That is the Vedic process, tapasya, because the aim is spiritual perfection. If we allow material activities according to the desire of the people, then they forget spiritual identity altogether. So that aim of life in the human form of body is missing, that Vedic civilization is how to raise one to the spiritual platform. Otherwise he remains an animal. First of all we must know what is the aim of life, and then the question of organization. If you do not know what is the aim of life, material adjustment will not make the condition of the society very good.
Hayagrīva: Well, his conception of religion is that of the..., having, playing some music, and uh, daliance with the supernatural, intellectual aesthetic enjoyment. He says, "What else does organized religion provide?" Religion is a form of, sort of enjoying art.
Prabhupāda: No. Art is there, and singing is there, dancing is there, but that is based on spiritual conception. That is the difficulty in the Western countries, that they are not fully aware of the conception of religion. Therefore Bhāgavata says that cheating religion, dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavaḥ. There is no purpose, simply a recreation of different nature in material life. That is, means, they do not know, except sense gratification, any other engagement. They think religion is also another kind of, type of sense gratification, "So we can perform it." And actually that is going on. Whenever there is some festival they change the daily way of life into some more eating, drinking, and dancing, like that. But religion means to understand God and our relationship with God and live in God practically. That is real religion. That is the aim of life.
Purports to Songs
So why I am taking so much trouble?" Therefore the revealed scripture advises that "You have to maintain your body. That's all right. But for simply material comforts, you should not devote time more than it is absolutely required." That means don't increase your bodily necessities. Don't increase your bodily necessities. That was the standard of Indian civilization. They did not, the sages and saints, they did not advise to increase the necessities of the body. They, I mean to say, planned the social system in such a way that people should be satisfied only for, by the bare necessities of life. We require some eating, we require some sleeping, or shelter place, and we require some sense gratification, and we require some protection from enemies. Yes? Come. Ah hah! Ah ah haha, ah hah! Come in. Come in. (end)
Once chance is given to become Kṛṣṇa conscious so that one may get out of the cycle of birth and death. Therefore he advises that this life, this human form of life, is very important, durlabha. Durlabha means... Duḥ means with great difficulty, and labha means obtainable. So foolish people, they do not know what, how much important this human form of life. They are simply wasting in sense gratification like animals. So this is very instructing, that he is training his mind that "You engage your mind in the worship of Lord Kṛṣṇa." Durlabha mānava-janama sat-saṅge. And this training of the mind is possible only in good association, sat-saṅga. Sat-saṅga means persons who are simply, cent percent, engaged in the service of the Lord. They are called sat. Satāṁ prasaṅgāt. Without association of devotees, it is impossible to train the mind. It is not possible by the so-called yoga system or meditation. One has to associate with devotees; otherwise it is not possible.
In other song also Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura says, hari hari biphale janama goṅāinu: "Anyone who does not approach Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa through the relationship of Nityānanda, his life is uselessly spoiled." Se sambandha nāhi jā'r, bṛthā janma gelo tā'r. Bṛthā means useless, janma means life, tāra means his, and sambandha means relationship. "So anyone who has no relationship with Nityānanda, he is simply spoiling his, the boon of human form of life." Why he is spoiling? Se paśu boro durācār. Se means that; paśu, animal; durācār, dura, misbehaved, mostly misbehaved. Because without our elevation to Kṛṣṇa consciousness through the mercy of Lord Caitanya-Nityānanda, the life is simply animal propensities. That's all. Sense gratification. And Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura says that ordinary animal, he can be tamed, but a human being, when he is animalistic, when he has simply animal propensities, oh, he is horrible. He cannot be tamed. Ordinary cats and dogs, even tiger, can be tamed. But a human being, when he goes out of his way, because human life is meant for being elevated to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if he doesn't take to that, then his higher intelligence will be simply misused for animal propensities, and it is very difficult to tame him.
Therefore he requests everyone, bhajo bhajo bhāi, caitanya nitāi: "My dear brothers, I request you. Just you worship Lord Caitanya and Nityānanda." Sudṛḍha biśwāsa kori': "With firm conviction and faith." Don't think that this chanting and dancing will not lead you to the desired goal. It will because there is assurance of Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu that you will get all perfection by this process. Therefore Locana dāsa Ṭhākura says that "You must have firm faith and conviction." It will act. Bhajo bhajo bhāi, caitanya nitāi, sudṛḍha. Sudṛḍha means firm. Biśwāsa kori', with faith and conviction. But what is the process? The process is viṣaya chāḍiyā, se rase majiyā. If you want to be Kṛṣṇa conscious under that process, then you have to give up your engagement of sense gratification. That is the only restriction. You cannot do that. Then it will be very nice. If you give up sense gratification and come to this stage, then it is sure that you will reach to the desired goal. Viṣaya chāḍiya, se rase majiyā, mukhe bolo hari hari: "And you have to simply chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, 'Hari Hari,' that's all, without any motive of sense gratification."
So even if we cannot enthuse animals, we can enthuse at least human being to this path of Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra chanting. Paśu pākhī jhure, pāṣāṇa vidare. And it is so nice that even the most stonehearted men will be melted. Pāṣāṇa vidare. Pāṣāṇa means stone, and vidare. Pāṣāṇa, even stone, will melt. It is so nice. But he regrets that, viṣaya majiyā: "Being entrapped by sense gratification..." Viṣaya majiyā, rohili bhuliyā. He's addressing himself, "My dear mind, you are entrapped in the sense gratification process and you have no attraction for chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa."
Viṣaya bhuliyā, rohili majiyā, se pade nahilo āśa: "You have no attraction for the lotus feet of Caitanya-Nityānanda. So what can I say? It is only..." Āpana karama, bhuñjāya śamana: "I can simply think of my misfortune only that Yamaraja, the superintendent of death, he is punishing me in this way, that he is not allowing me to be attracted to this movement." This is the statement of Kahoye locana-dāsa: "This is the statement of Locana dāsa Ṭhākura." (end)
When we speak of Kṛṣṇa, "Kṛṣṇa" means Kṛṣṇa with His devotees. Kṛṣṇa is never alone. Kṛṣṇa is with Rādhārāṇī. Rādhārāṇī is with the gopīs. And Kṛṣṇa is with the cowherd boys. We are not impersonalists. We do not see Kṛṣṇa alone. Similarly, Kṛṣṇa means with Kṛṣṇa's devotees. So Kṛṣṇa consciousness means to keep association with the devotees of Kṛṣṇa. Viṣaya viṣama viṣa satata khāinu. And he says that "I have drunk always the most dangerous poison of sense gratification." Viṣaya viṣama viṣa. Viṣaya means sense gratification. Eating, sleeping, mating, and defending. These are called... These four principles are called viṣaya. And viṣama means dangerously. And viṣa means poison. If one is simply engaged with these four principles of life, just like animals. Then it is to be supposed that he's simply drinking poison. That's all. Viṣaya viṣama satata khāinu. "I know this (is) poison, but I am so much intoxicated that I am drinking this poison every moment." Gaura-kīrtana-rase magana nā painu. "And I could not merge myself into the saṅkīrtana movement started by Lord Caitanya." Oh, that is actually the fact. Those who are too much attached to materialistic way of life, or always drinking the poison of sense gratification, they are not attracted by the saṅkīrtana movement.
| Page Title: | Sense gratification (Lectures, Other) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, Mayapur |
| Created: | 20 of Dec, 2011 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=114, Con=0, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 114 |