In our school days, if a boy is making trouble, the teacher will ask him, "Stand up on the bench." So the stand-up punishment... The trees, the plants, they are stand-up punishment. (laughter) "Stand up here for five thousand years." You see? There are many trees, they are standing up for five thousand years, seven thousand years. In California I have seen one tree, they say it is seven thousand years old. So just imagine. If the teacher punishes a boy to stand up for few minutes, how much troublesome it is, and if one is ordered to stand up for seven thousand years, so just imagine what is the punishment. So that is punishment. These trees and plants, because they committed very sinful activities, they... Naked, to become naked, is also another criminal activity. Therefore, by nature's law, the trees, the, they are standing up naked. They do not dress. Similarly, if a human being does not dress, does not cover, then what is the difference between the trees and the human being? It is the human being who requires to be properly dressed. That is the law of nature. If we violate, then the punishment is: "All right, you become tree and stand up naked for ten thousand years." This is the nature's law. You cannot violate the nature's law. And we are completely under the laws of nature. You cannot say that "I don't care for." No. You may say, foolishly, but you are, you are. Just like nature's law is that you must die. Can you say, "No, I shall not die"? Can you say boldly, "No, no, I shall not die. I am now scientific. I have got my science, I shall not die." The nature's law is: you must die.
Punishment (Lectures, SB cantos 6 - 12)
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Lectures
Srimad-Bhagavatam Lectures
So it will never end, even if you give lifelong service. Just like I have given the example: Gandhi gave lifelong service according to his own. Hitler gave lifelong service. Napoleon gave lifelong service. But their ultimate end was very, very regrettable. Nobody realized his service. He was punished. This is material world. We have to understand very clearly, and we have to take lesson from this verse that we may go on serving our lusty desire, greediness, anger, and so on, so on, but we will never come to the end and become happy. When one comes to the point that "I have rendered service in so many ways. So neither I am happy nor the person to whom I have served, they are happy. Then what is the remedy?" That is discussed in the Vedānta-sūtra philosophy.
I have already explained. Mind, intelligence, and ego—this is subtle body. Everyone has got his mind, everyone knows. But we cannot see. The intelligence... Everyone has got intelligence, but we cannot see. Similarly, subtle body is invisible. Ghost means when the living entity remains in the subtle body, do not get another gross body—they are very sinful—they create disturbance. But we cannot see. That is ghost. Ghost means that those who are too much sinful, they do not get this gross body. They are punished with the position, to remain in the subtle body, at least for some time. That is ghostly life. Therefore you will see, ghostly-haunted places, something is being done, but how it is being done, you do not see because you cannot see the subtle body. But you will see something is being carried in the air. It is not something being carried. It is being carried by the subtle body. But I have no eyes to see the subtle body. That is practical. I do not see your mind, but you have got your mind. You do not see my mind. You can see my mind by the action. That's all. The subtle body is there. Gross body, subtle body. Death means finishing of this gross body, and liberation means no more association with the subtle body, only spiritual. That is called liberation.
Today we shall discuss a very nice historical event, the story—history or story, whatever you call—of Ajāmila and his salvation. Before this chapter in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam there has been a very elaborate description of different kinds of hellish punishment. So far the Śrīmad-Bhāgavata is concerned, it contains the information of all other planets within this universe. So we get information of one planet which is about 800,000's of miles away from this planet. In that planet the Yamarāja or the personality or demigod who, I mean to say, tries the person who are very much sinful and gives him punishment... Just like here you have got the magistrate who tries the criminals and gives punishment according to the gravity of criminality, similarly there is no reason to disbelieve that in this vast kingdom of God, why there shall not be a magistrate like that?
So as your energy can produce so much wonderful thing, why not Kṛṣṇa's energy, or God's energy, is very strong? Yes. It is very strong. Just like you are also energy, but why you are not strong? Just like when you are criminal, when you are in the custody of police energy of the government, you are weaker. You are all the, one of the energies of this government. The whole population is the energy of the government, producing. This is an example. But one energy is civil population, another energy is criminal population, and another energy, the government. So the criminal population means against the principles of government. And civil population means law-abiding principle of government. And the law order energy means to punish the criminals.
So here Mahārāja Parīkṣit, he was very godly person. He was so great devotee that there is no comparison. He is... So he is asking, after hearing the hellish punishment of the criminals, he is asking,
- adhuneha mahā-bhāga
- yathaiva narakān naraḥ
- nānogra-yātanān neyāt
- tan me vyākhyātum arhasi
He is addressing Śukadeva Gosvāmī. He has accepted Śukadeva Gosvāmī as his spiritual master. Therefore he says, mahā-bhāga, "the most fortunate man." You have to select a spiritual master, the most fortunate man.
So the Vaiṣṇava, I mean to say, Mahārāja Parīkṣit, he was very much distressed when he heard about the hellish punishment of the criminals. So he's asking him, mahā-bhāga, "My dear fortunate." He's asking Śukadeva Gosvāmī... Śukadeva Gosvāmī was naked. He was so renounced that after his birth, he left his home. And he was traveling, wandering, and when he met Mahārāja Parīkṣit he was only sixteen years old and naked, but he is accepted as the spiritual master of this great king because he was full of knowledge. It is a question of knowledge.
Just like a man is imprisoned, and if your friend or relative is imprisoned, by somehow or other you get him released by hook and crook, so when you are again captured you are again severely punished, both the men. Is it not the law? So how can you give relief to the suffering person who is condemned? If in your state law a man suffering in the prison and if you feel sympathy or you may try to give him release and get him out by some hook and crook means, then both of you will be punished. Is it not? So how can you avoid the punishment by God's law?
You have read in the Caitanya-caritāmṛta that one Buddhimanta Khan, he was formerly... He was very rich man and Nawab Hussain Shah was the servant when he was not Nawab. So he was menial servant. So he stole some money as servants are generally habituated. So he whipped him with his cane. So that whipping stripe was on his back side. When he was Nawab, so his wife saw it and inquired, "What is this scar?" So he replied the whole story, that "I was formerly a menial servant to this Buddhimanta Khan and I did something wrong. So as my father, he punished me. That's all.
"So what kind of atonement I have to do?" So the bhaṭṭācārya advised him that "You take one kilo of lead and melt it and drink it, and that is your atonement." You see? So he said, "How it is possible?" "This is the atonement for such sinful activity. Yes." Just see. For the last five hundred, six hundred years... Why...? For thousands of years the Hindu society is so fallen. Therefore so many Mohammedans have increased here. They are not imported. In this way the Hindu population, they have been forced to accept Mohammedan religion. You see? By the Mohammedans. Just like Aurangzeb. He imposed one tax for the Hindus. So all the poor men class, to avoid the tax they became Mohammedans. And there was so much punishment by the Hindus. And so he became a Mohammedan, so-called Mohammedan, by the diagnosis of the bhaṭṭācārya. So this kind of prāyaścitta was current during the fallen days of the Vedic society.
So people, they know that "There is resultant action of this kind of sinful activity." He knows. Even if he does not know, he sees. Just like a man who has stolen, committed theft. One sees that he is arrested or he is punished, he is put into the prison, and still, he commits stealing. He knows. So similarly, we are hearing from the śāstra that "If you commit this sin..." Just like māṁsa. Māṁsa, this very thing, means, māṁ sa khadati. Therefore flesh is called māṁsa. "The animal which I am killing, he will have the right to kill me and eat me." That is going on, repetition: "I kill you this life. Next life you kill me. In this life you have become a cow or goat. Next time I'll become a cow or goat. You have the right to kill me." This is called karma-bandhana.
So dṛṣṭa-śruta yat pāpam. So this kind of sinful activities, janānn apy, everyone knows. Yesterday we were speaking of seeing and hearing. These experiences gathered by seeing and hearing is very important. This is tangible. So these two words have been used, dṛṣṭa-śruta: "by hearing and by seeing." Everyone knows that there is sinful reaction. Janānn apy. What is that? Ātmano ahitam, ātmanā: it is disastrous for his self. He has to undergo so much punishment.
So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means we are preaching the cult of Bhāgavatam. It is a scientific method. So there were many discussions, and in the Fifth Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam there is a chronological description of people suffering due to different kinds of sinful activities. Unfortunately, at the present moment people are unaware. They are kept in darkness. Therefore each and every sinful activity, there is punishment. They do not believe in the next life, but they can see practically in this life that if you violate a little laws of nature, you'll be punished immediately. Immediately punished. Just like I have got some pain in this finger, I scratch some nail, that I should not have done. Immediately there is reaction, I'm suffering. Every... You cannot do anything whimsically. As soon as you do it, there is reaction. Take for example just like salt. Salt is necessary.
So why don't you see? People have become so rascal that they do not think of sinful activities. By nature's law it is so strict that you have to follow the laws given by God. If you don't follow, then you'll be punished. Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). Dharma means the laws given by God. That is the simple description of dharma. If you do not know what are the laws of God, then that does not mean you'll not be punished. Innocence of law is no cause for excuse. If you go... Suppose if you have done something criminal without your knowledge, and if in the court you say, "My lord, I did not know this law, that committing something criminal like this I would have been punished." So that is no excuse. Ignorance of law is no excuse. Nature's law is so strict. Just like a small child, if a child puts his finger on the fire, the fire will not excuse the child: "Oh, he is an innocent child. He does not know." No. It must burn, never mind it is child. So there is description of different types of punishment in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam for different kinds of sinful activities. Therefore, after hearing the description... Parīkṣit Mahārāja is a Vaiṣṇava. Vaiṣṇava is very sympathetic. If actually there is any welfare worker, that is Vaiṣṇava. This Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is going on. The Vaiṣṇavas are taking so much, I mean to say, trouble. Just like in Melbourne our, these preachers are being punished regularly. They are taken to the jail, and still they are doing their duty. Still they are going for saṅkīrtana. Just like one side they are violating the so-called laws of the state, they are being punished. Similarly, important laws of God, if one violates, how you cannot be punished? This is an instance. Must be punished.
"I heard that people suffer such-and-such kind of punishment for such-and-such kind of sinful activities. So how to get them released from this suffering?" Just like a friend, suppose another friend for criminal activity is put into jail, but the friend is thinking, "Anyway, my friend is now put into jail, suffering. How to get him released?" That is friend's action—father, mother or friend. Similarly, Vaiṣṇava, Vaiṣṇava is patitānāṁ pāvanebhyo vaiṣṇavebhyo namo namaḥ. We offer our respectful obeisances to Vaiṣṇava because Vaiṣṇava is meant for delivering the fallen souls. That is Vaiṣṇava's business. They have taken so much trouble just to deliver the fallen souls from the sinful activities, and those who are being punished, to save them, this is Vaiṣṇava's business. So Parīkṣit Mahārāja, not for himself, but for others he inquired this question: "My dear Śukadeva Goswāmī, I understand that these people are suffering so many different types of punishment. But how to rescue, rescue them? Is there any method to rescue them? If there is, kindly describe, kindly describe." Adhuneha mahā-bhāga yathaiva narakān naraḥ. Adhuna—now; iha—in this world; mahā-bhāga. Mahā-bhāga, the Śukadeva Goswāmī is described, mahā-bhāga, most fortunate.
So Parīkṣit Mahārāja addressed Śukadeva Goswāmī as mahā-bhāga, the most fortunate. Because he's perfect Vaiṣṇava, therefore he addresses, "My dear, the most fortunate," mahā-bhāga. Adhunā, "Now," yathaiva narakān naraḥ, "these people are suffering in the hellish condition of life. How they can be rescued?" Nānā ugra-yātanān. Very severe punishment they are undergoing. People cannot see. They have no eyes to see, you see? They suffer in great calamities, and still they cannot see that "I am suffering." Just like when you pass through the streets of Australia, we go daily, morning walk, big, big skyscraper buildings have been constructed, and people are making plans, designs, working very, very hard, lifting so many heavy things.
So any slight deviation from the law and we are put into undesirable condition. That is a fact. Just like here, according to Vedic principle, the laws are given by Manu, Manu. From Manu, the word manuṣya has come, or "man." And there is Manu-saṁhitā. In the Manu-saṁhitā it is stated that if a man commits murder then he should be hanged. He should be hanged. That is followed by every human society. Why? Because the sinful activities which he has enacted, if he is punished in this life, then he'll not so suffer again in the next life. His punishment will be finished. So that is a favor. If a murderer is hanged, then that is a favor shown by the government, because the next life you'll not have to suffer.
Third time you will be severely punished. So these people who are thinking, "By going to the church, by confession, I become free from all sinful activities, and then let me go again, commit the same thing for the whole week, come again and confess," this is not very good business. (laughter) This is not very good business. Similarly, if you think also, you are chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra means you become free from all sinful reaction of life. But if you think that "I have got an instrument, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, so let me commit all sinful activities, then I shall chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, it will be nullified," no. That is the greatest offense. That is the greatest offense. Out of ten kinds of offenses, this is the greatest offense. Nāmno balād yasya hi pāpa-buddhiḥ. So God can excuse you once, twice, thrice, not more than that. Then you will be punished. Because you are knowingly criminal, your punishment will be very severe. So those who think that "This atonement, confession, or chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa is the counteraction of our sinful activities," they're greatest sinners. They're greatest sinners. They'll be severely punished. Just like a police, a policeman, a constable, if he commits theft, he's severely punished. He's to detect criminality, but he becomes himself a criminal, then he's very highly punished. That is the law.
So here Śukadeva Goswāmī says that unless one atones his sinful activities done in this life, then he has to accept severe punishment in the next life.
So Parīkṣit Mahārāja says that "I accept that unless one atones, then he'll be punished, but what is the value of this atonement?" Just like a man falls diseased. He's habituated to some certain habits, and he falls diseased on account of that. He knows that "I committed this mistake in respect of my healthy condition, so I'm now punished by this disease. He knows and he has suffered, but why he commits again? This is the question. Why he commits again? So Parīkṣit Mahārāja says that dṛṣṭa-śrutābhyaṁ yat pāpaṁ jānann apy ātmano 'hitaṁ (SB 6.1.9). A person knows that this is not good for him. For example a thief. A thief knows that stealing is not good. It is against law, and against our revealed scriptures also. No religious book or scriptures will say that "You go on stealing." No. Neither the state laws also allows stealing. A man knows. And suppose he's stolen in the past and he was punished or he sees that one who has stolen property, he is arrested by the police and he's being taken into custody.
This is the conclusion. And if he lives like ass and cow, without any knowledge, without knowing the values of human life, then he must be subjected to sinful activities and will be punished one after another, accepting different types of bodies.
The different types of bodies means that is our punishment. We may think it as happiness, but as soon as you accept a material body, you are subjected to the four principles of material distresses. What is that? Janma, mṛtyu, jarā, vyādhi. You may think that you are very scientifically advanced—"There is no more distress in my life"—but Kṛṣṇa says, "No. If you are intelligent, then you should think of these four principles as distresses." What is that? Birth, death, old age and disease.
So there is no solution for them made. The so-called scientists and philosophers, they do not..., "Oh, death is natural. What is this? I'll have to, I'll die." But when there is warning, "Now death," there is... I have, everyone has seen that as soon as there is earthquake, they began to scream, "Oh, now I'm going to die." As soon as there is any shaking in the airplane, they begin to scream. (laughter) He's afraid of death, but he says, "Oh, that is not a problem." He has got his experience that at the time of death it is very severe punishment. Therefore Bhagavad-gītā says, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam: "You may be satisfied with your foolish idea that you are very happy, but if you are intelligent then you must always keep yourself..." The Cānakya Paṇḍita also said that those who advancing in spiritual life, they should place before him that "Here is death," just before him. And those who are karmīs, like ass, they'll always think that "I'll never die." The spiritualist always thinks that "I am dying, dying, dying, going to die next moment." And the karmīs, he should think that "I'll live forever." Otherwise he cannot work. He cannot. Unless he is put into this ignorance that he'll never die, he cannot work.
So not that all living entities are going to the hell, but some of them. Some of them. Because most of the living entities, they are less than the human being—8,400,000. So eight millions they are below the human standard of life, human being. They are animals. Jalajā nava-lakṣāni sthāvarā lakṣa-viṁśati. Nine lakhs, hundred thousand in the water, different types of forms, body. Then insect... Then plants, trees, then insect, then birds, then beast, then human being. This is the evolution. So these eight million different forms of body below the human being, they are not punishable because they are animals.
Suppose one is very pet son of his father, and he commits murder, and he thinks "If there is any punishment my father will suffer." Will it be done? Will it be done? When he is arrested, if he says, "No, you can release me. You can arrest my father because I am very pet son of my father," so will the government will do that, that you have committed murder and your father will be arrested? No. This is quite unreasonable. You have committed murder, you must be hanged. Nor your father nor your son nor your brother. This is the law. So that is the law. If you commit sinful life, then you must suffer, not anyone else. But we are thinking like that: "That let me go on doing all nonsense and somebody for me will suffer." No, that is not the law.
You have got practical experience that if you violate the law of the state you become criminal and punished. But if the cats and dogs or animals, they violate the law, they are not punishable. Therefore human life must be very responsible. Yes. So Śukadeva Gosvāmī says, "My dear king, if before one's next death whatever impious acts one has performed in this life with his mind, words, and body are not counteracted through proper atonement according to the description of the Manu-saṁhitā and other dharma-śāstras, one will certainly enter into the hellish planets after death and undergo terrible sufferings as I have previously described." So just like in our ordinary life if we commit some sinful activity and if we plead in the court, "My dear judge, I did not know the law," so this kind of pleading will not help him. Ignorance is no excuse. Therefore human life is distinct from animal life. If we live in human life without caring for the supreme laws, then we are destined to suffer.
So there was the king in Bengal at that time. He was known as Nawab Hussein Shah. Formerly he was a Mohammedan servant to a big Hindu landlord. So this boy servant committed some theft so the master punished him by striking with a cane. So the striking mark of the cane was there on his backside. So one day the Nawab's wife, Begam, saw the mark and inquired from her husband, "What is this mark?" So the Nawab described that in his childhood, when he was a servant of that Hindu gentleman, Buddhimanta Khan, he beat him with that cane and that mark is there. So the wife of the Nawab, Begum Sair(?), she requested that "You kill this man. Otherwise people will blaspheme you." The Nawab, however, declined. "No, no, this cannot... This is not possible. He was my master, just like my father. He chastised me. There was no fault." So the wife then requested, "At least make him a Mohammedan." So the Nawab, to satisfy his wife, he agreed, "Well, that is not very difficult task." So one day he called Buddhimanta Khan and sprinkled the water on his body.
The Mahārāja Parīkṣit said, "One may know that sinful activity is injurious for him because he actually sees that a criminal is punished by the government and rebuked by people in general, and because he hears from the scriptures and learned scholars that one is thrown into hellish condition in the next life for committing sinful act. Nevertheless, in spite of such knowledge one is forced to commit sins again and again, even after performing acts of atonement. Therefore what is the value of such atonement?" (break) Parīkṣit Mahārāja was ruler, the king. He knew everything practically, that so many citizens committing criminal act were imprisoned and punished. Still, they, after coming back from the jail, prisonhouse, again committed. So on the whole, Parīkṣit Mahārāja did not like, the process of prāyaścitta is ultimately beneficial to the people.
We get experience by two methods, by seeing and by hearing. Just like a criminal, thief, he has seen that previously a man who stole, he was arrested by the police and punished and he has heard also from authorities, from lawyers, that "Stealing is bad. If you are arrested you will be put into the prison."
He therefore protested against this so-called atonement. Therefore he describes like this, dṛṣṭa-śrutābhyāṁ yat pāpaṁ janānn apy ātmano 'hitam (SB 6.1.9). Everyone knows that "I am stealing; it is not good for me," but even though he is put into the jail as prāyaścitta, again he comes back and does the same thing. Then what is the meaning of this legal punishment or prāyaścitta? Therefore Parīkṣit Mahārāja says that
- kvacin nivartate 'bhadrāt
- kvacic carati tat punaḥ
- prāyaścittam atho 'pārtham
- manye kuñjara-śaucavat
- (SB 6.1.10)
He gave very good example, that "This prāyaścitta or legal punishment is like kuñjara-śaucavat." Kuñjara means elephant, and śauca, taking bath. So kuñjara, the elephant, dips itself into the water and takes bath very thoroughly, and as soon as it comes on the land, it takes some dust and throws over his body. The purpose is that unless one is fully convinced that "Sinful activities are very, very abominable for me," he cannot give it up.
If Bhagavān likes, such persons should be punished. But Bhagavān excuses. That is another thing. So Bhagavān is Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). Nobody should try to become equal to Him. That is not possible.
So here Śukadeva Gosvāmī is addressed as mahā-bhāga. Mahā means great, and bhāga means fortunate. Because he is very fortunate, he is describing Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Again Bhāgavatam, the same word bhaga comes. Bhagavat. Bhagavat. Vat, this word, is used when the meaning is "possessing." Asty arthe vatup. Bhagavān, bhāgyavān and bhagavat. Bhāgavat means one who has power to possess the Supreme Lord. He is called bhāgavata. There are two kinds of bhāgavata: one is grantha-bhāgavata and one is person bhāgavata. A devotee, he is called bhāgavata, and the book in which the pastimes or characteristics of Bhagavān is described, that is called Bhāgavata. So this Śrīmad-Bhāgavata... Śrī means beauty. Again vat. Bhagavat, Śrīvat. Śrī means very beautiful. So every śloka you'll find very, very beautiful. Five thousand years ago these verses were written. There is no comparison. Nobody can write such verses even up to date. It was written by Vyāsadeva, Veda-vyasa.
So mahā-bhāga yathā eva narakāt naraḥ. So this is Sixth Canto. In the Fifth Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam there is description of the hellish condition of life. According to the... Just like there is punishment according to criminality, similarly, there is punishment by nature's law. According to impious life, there is punishment.
So this education is lacking now. They are... Everyone is thinking that he's independent, he can do whatever he likes. That is not possible. Then you'll be punished. Nature's law is so strict, stringent. Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). You cannot escape the stringent laws of nature.
So narakāt naraḥ. We should always remember that if we commit some sinful activities there is punishment. That has been described in the previous chapter, Fifth Canto. Therefore Parīkṣit Mahārāja... That is Vaiṣṇava. Parīkṣit Mahārāja is Vaiṣṇava. He is very unhappy that so many living entities, they are rotting in this naraka, hellish condition of life.
So here Parīkṣit Mahārāja, out of compassion, he inquired from Śukadeva Gosvāmī, "These persons, they are rotting in the naraka. Is there any means to deliver them?" That he's saying. Nānā ugra-yātanā. Ugra-yātanā. These are described. We find also, there are many persons, they are suffering ugra-yāta. Ugra means severe, severe punishment. There are living entities, they are suffering so many ugra-yātanā. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means to save people from the severe punishment of materialistic life. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Caitanya Mahāprabhu's movement, Kṛṣṇa's movement, is to save.
So one has to suffer. People, they do not believe next life because they want to avoid this botheration. But there... You cannot avoid this botheration. If you do not go according to law... As there is punishment even in this state of our life—if I commit some sins, criminal activities, the state will punish me—similarly, if we do something which is punishable, I may avoid the state law, but I cannot avoid God's law. That is not possible. I can hide myself, cheating others, or committing theft, and that, thereby I save myself from the punishment of the state laws, but I cannot save myself from the superior law, the law of nature.
So here Parīkṣit Mahārāja says that... It is not that if I say "There is no God," there will be no God, and whatever I do, that will not be, I'll not be responsible for that. That is atheistic theory. Atheists do not want God because they're always sinful, and if they think of God, that there is God, then there is a great risk of punishment. They shudder. Therefore they deny God. That is their process. Because if they forget God, there is God, then there is no punishment.
Very intelligent question. "My dear sir, Śukadeva Gosvāmī, I can understand that one should take care of his sinful reaction and atone for it as prescribed in the śāstras. But my question is that," dṛṣṭa-śrutābhyāṁ yat pāpam (SB 6.1.9), "one sees that due to this sinful activity one is suffering." Dṛṣṭa. Dṛṣṭa means actually personal experience, face to face. How is that? A man has killed somebody, murder, and he's going to be hanged. Everyone sees it. Then why does he commit the same thing? He has seen it that "My friend committed a murder." Or forget murdering..., committed something else which is against the law of the state, and he's punished.
So we are responsible. Even if we kill one mosquito, we are responsible. It is not man-made law, that "If you kill a human being, then you are punished, and if you kill another animal, you are not punished." This is man-made law, according to our convenience. "We have to eat the animal; therefore there is no punishment for animal killing." But God is for everyone the same. Every living entity is part and parcel of God. So they have been given an opportunity to undergo the punishment or enjoyment. You cannot disturb him. You cannot disturb him. Just like you are living in an apartment according to your position, but if I forcibly I ask you, "Go out of this apartment," then I will be punishable by the law. I have no right to get you out from that apartment. Similarly, every living entity by the laws of nature, all laws of nature, is imprisoned or allowed under certain apartment, either in the body of a tree or a human being or demigod or cat or dog. These are all ordained. So you cannot get out the living entity, soul, by force from that body. Then you will be punishable. The living entity is never killed, but you have no right to get him out from that body. That is sinful. If you argue that "What is the harm if I kill one animal, because it is said, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre: (BG 2.20) 'The living entity, soul, is never killed even after the annihilation of this body'?" that is all right. But you cannot force him. Just like if you get one person, by force, get out from his apartment—he is not dying, of course, but still, it is criminal because you are forcing to go out of the apartment. So that is the law of nature. You cannot force anyone to get out of the body. Then you are punishable.
So the punishments are different.
So according to degree of sinful activities... So degree, the most sinful activity, according to Vedic information—to kill a child, to kill a woman, to kill a brāhmaṇa, and to kill a cow. This is very abominable punishment. Child, brāhmaṇa, cow, and woman, they are to be given protection by the laws of Vedic instruction. They have to be protected. So this should be very carefully done. Strī-śūdra-dvija-bandhūnām (SB 1.4.25). Strī, they are considered either as innocent as the child or as innocent as the animal.
So Nawab disagreed. Nawab said, "No, no. He treated me just like my son, and I accepted him as my father. It is not possible to kill him." Then the queen suggested that "At least you make him a Muhammadan. Then that will be the punishment." So the king, or the Nawab, said, "All right, I shall make him." Because in those days, to make a Hindu a Muhammadan, it was very easy. The Muhammadans they have got a pot, it is called badna. So if the Mohammedan takes little water from the badna and sprinkles upon a Hindu, then Hindu community will immediately reject him, "Oh, he has become Muhammadan." This was the Hindu community. Therefore so many Muhammadans were there in India, and ultimately, by the British policy, they divided. They were not actually Muhammadans coming from Turkey or from West. They were lower-class Hindus. But the Hindus were so foolish that if a Muhammadan sprinkled some water in this way, so he becomes Muhammadan and he is rejected, in this way the Muhammadan population was there.
So atonement is prescribed in every scripture. Even in Christian Bible there is atonement. So in other scriptures also there is atonement. Just like a man who has committed murder, he must die. "Life for life." This is atonement. When the government punishes a murderer with capital punishment, death, that is a mercy upon him. That punishment is accepted practically all over the world from time immemorial. So there must be atonement. So if a person who has committed murder, killed somebody else, then if he is punished by death, then the sinful activities which he has committed, that is counteracted. Otherwise he will have to suffer next life very severely, four times. So people do not believe even in the next life, and what to speak of atonement and punishment. They are kept in darkness. Otherwise they would have been... If they would have followed actually the injunction of the śāstras... First of all one should not be killing anyone. In the Bible also it is said, "Thou shall not kill." Why it is forbidden? Because if he kills, he'll have to suffer. But they do not care for it. Therefore they suffer.
So Śukadeva Gosvāmī said that "Whatever punishment I have described in the Fifth Canto on account of different sinful activities, one has to suffer that unless he commits..., unless he performs atonement." This is the... Na ced ihaivāpacitiṁ yathāṁhasaḥ kṛtasya kuryān mana-ukta-pāṇibhiḥ.
I have explained several times. There are three modes of material nature, and when you mix up, then it becomes three into three equal to nine, and again mix up, nine into nine, eighty-one, and again mix up Every minute particles, there is account. You cannot avoid. Material nature's punishment you cannot avoid. Even little, whatever you have done, it will be punished. Automatically the rules and regulations are there. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-sangaḥ asya sad-asad-janma-yoniṣu. Why there are so different varieties of life if there is no some judgment behind it? There must be. Otherwise everyone should have been of the same bodily feature, same standard of life, same opulence. No. So many grades, because the modes of material nature are different, different mixture.
So here it is said that doṣasya dṛṣṭvā guru-lāghavaṁ yathā (SB 6.1.8). Doṣa. Still people in India, they go to a bhaṭṭācārya, that "Sir, I have done this sinful activity. What is my atonement?" Amongst the Christian also, they go to the church. So guru-lāghavaṁ dṛṣṭvā. Guru means heavy. We use this word guru. Guru means heavy. So according to the criminal activities Just like a man has stolen some fruit from a fruit shop, his criminality is not equal to the man who has committed murder—one he has killed one man. This is guru-lāghavam. So there is punishment according to the heaviness and lightness of criminal activities.
Santoṣa: "I have actually seen that one who becomes a criminal by committing sinful acts is punished by the government's law, but although rebuked, he does the same thing again. One also hears from the scriptures spoken by learned scholars that committing sin throws one into hell in the next life. Nevertheless, although he has received full experience through seeing and hearing, which are the sources of practical knowledge, he is forced repeatedly to commit sins and again perform acts of atonement. What then is the value of such atonement?"
Prabhupāda:
- dṛṣṭa-śrutābhyaṁ yat pāpaṁ
- jānann apy ātmano 'hitaṁ
- karoti bhūyo vivaśaḥ
- prāyaścittam atho katham
- (SB 6.1.9)
This is intelligence. Mahārāja Parīkṣit is Vaiṣṇava, and his inquiry was: "How these men who are rotting in this hellish condition can be relieved?" That was his question.
If one is sinful, then he must be punished.
Just like here it is said, dṛṣṭa. Dṛṣṭa means by direct experience. Direct experience everyone has seen, that a thief, he is arrested. This is our direct experience. He has committed theft, and therefore he is arrested by the police. It is our direct experience. And śrutābhyām, by hearing from the lawbook or scripture, whatever you take... In the lawbook it is stated that "You commit a theft, then you will be punished, imprisoned, for six months. Or if you commit murder, then you will be hanged." This is called śrutābhyām, by hearing. We have got two senses: one, by the knowledge-acquiring senses, and practical working senses. So dṛṣṭa means our eyes are working, and we see that a criminal is arrested and he is punished. And śruta means knowledge-gathering.
So the whole world is going on like that, full of asses. Not only asses, but like other animal... That past sinful activities or present sinful activities. The past or present doesn't matter. If one is sinful, then he must be punished.
Just like here it is said, dṛṣṭa. Dṛṣṭa means by direct experience. Direct experience everyone has seen, that a thief, he is arrested. This is our direct experience. He has committed theft, and therefore he is arrested by the police. It is our direct experience. And śrutābhyām, by hearing from the lawbook or scripture, whatever you take... "O my dear lion, O king..." Lion is considered as the king of the animals, paśu rāja. Actually, he is the king in the jungle.
"Mahārāja Parīkṣit said: One may know that sinful activity is injurious for him because he actually sees that a criminal is punished by the government and rebuked by the people in general, and because he hears from the scriptures and learned scholars that one is thrown into hellish condition in the next life for committing sinful acts. Nevertheless, in spite of such knowledge one is forced to commit sins again and again, even after performing acts of atonement. Therefore what is the value of such atonement?"
In every religious system there is a process of atonement. In Christian religion there is a process of atonement called confession. The Parīkṣit Mahārāja is practical politician. He said that... He had also experience that a criminal is punished and again he commits the criminal act. Nowadays we practically see also that government has enacted so many laws against criminality, but criminality is going on without any stoppage. We have got practical experience, as we have explained last night, that in the airport the security checking is going on for everyone, which means that after so much education, every one of us, we are dishonest.
So this is the practical instance that if one becomes devotee of the Lord, all the good qualities manifest in his body. Therefore Śukadeva Gosvāmī replied to Parīkṣit Mahārāja that "You are saying right that simply by atonement, simply by punishment, one cannot become honest." Practically speaking, if you simply enact laws to make people honest, it is impossible to do that.
The atonement is there in every religion. In the Vedic process there is atonement, but what is the use of this atonement if he does not cease committing the same sinful activity? Just like practically we see a thief. So he knows that "I am committing theft. I shall be punished if I am arrested." He knows it; otherwise why he goes silently at night and break? He knows it well that "If I am arrested I will be punished."
So śrutābhyām. Śruta means... Just like we are hearing the śāstra, so he has heard it from the lawbooks that if one commits theft he'll be punished. And he has seen also that a person who has committed theft, he is arrested by the police, so he was being taken to the prison house.
He has been punished. Still, he commits the same thing, again goes to the jail. A patient, he has suffered from the disease on account of certain bad habits and he has gone to the doctor. He has paid much money and suffered injection, operation, and still he is doing that. Therefore Parīkṣit Mahārāja said, "What is the value of this prāyaścitta?" Prāyaścitta, kind of punishment.
So this is very important question. The world, whole world nowadays... I say sometimes that in the airport it is proved that... (break) ...punishment the practice of committing criminal activities is going on. This is very intelligent question, and Parīkṣit Mahārāja will reply... Śukadeva Gosvāmī will reply. But this is student. Just see how intelligent question is put.
This is man-made law, defective. But there cannot be defect in God-made laws. God-made law, if you kill an animal, you are equally punishable as you kill a man. That is God's law. There is no excuse that he..., when you kill a man you are punishable, but when you kill an animal you are not punishable. This is concoction. This is not perfect law. Perfect law. Therefore Lord Jesus Christ prescribes in the Ten Commandments: "Thou shalt not kill." That is perfect law. Not that you shall discriminate that "I shall not kill man, but I shall kill animals." This is cheating one's self. The God laws will not excuse.
This is called karma-bandhana. Karma-bandhana means being locked up in one's material activities. Yajñārthe karmaṇaḥ anyatra karma-bandhanaḥ. Yajña, Viṣṇu..., if you act for Kṛṣṇa, beyond this, whatever you act, you'll be under bondage. Just like I'm killing some animal, eating, enjoying, so it is karma-bandhana. I am being locked up with my action so that I shall become again a cow or goat, and this man, this cow and goat will become man, and he will kill me and eat. You believe or not believe—that's a different thing. But these are the Vedic statement. And, practically, we are seeing that life for life. Why? Unless there is some meaning, why this punishment is there? Life for life.
One man is suffering from venereal disease, and it is painful. Doctor gives some painful injection. Some way or other, he's cured, but again he's attacked with venereal disease, again comes to the doctor. There are many instances like that. A man has committed theft and he was punished. He was taken to the government custody and he was punished for six months or one year. And comes back. Again he commits the theft. Why? This is intelligent question. So, so Parīkṣit Mahārāja inquires from Śukadeva that 'Atonement, that's all right. You are prescribing atonement. That is all right, to counteract the sinful activities. But why a man commits again the same sinful activities? What is the remedy for that?"
Therefore Vedas are called Śrutis. Śruti. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum eva abhigacchet samit-pāṇiḥ śrotriyaṁ brahma-niṣṭham (MU 1.2.12). So śruta, śruta means hearing from authoritative sources, either you take a scripture or lawbook. So one knows that in every śāstra, every scripture, every lawbook, man is warned: "Don't commit theft; you'll be punished. Don't tell lie; you'll be punished. Don't do this; you'll be punished. Don't kill. Thou shalt not kill. Otherwise, you'll be punished." But nobody's caring. Why? What is the remedy for that? Everything is there. Dṛṣṭa, practical experience, and śruta,... Śruta means heard also from authoritative sources. So he says, dṛṣṭa-śrutābhyāṁ yat pāpam (SB 6.1.9). Everyone knows it, jānan, everyone knows that this is pāpa, this is sinful activity. Everyone knows. Nobody can say that "I do not know that is sinful activities." Who does not know that stealing is sinful, committing murder is sinful, or so many other things? So Parīkṣit Mahārāja inquires that dṛṣṭa-śrutābhyāṁ yat pāpaṁ jānann apy ātmano 'hitam (SB 6.1.9). "And he knows that 'It is not good for me; if I steal I'll be arrested, I'll be punished, I'll be put into jail. That is not a very comfortable life.' He knows that." Karoti bhūyo vivaśaḥ. "But he commits again and again, vivaśaḥ, as if forced by something, forced by something." Karoti bhūyo vivaśaḥ prāyaścittam atho katham (SB 6.1.9).
For the time being, when he's punished, he thinks, "I shall not commit what mistake I did." But as soon as he's out of the danger, he commits again. So kvacin nivartate abhadrāt. Nivartate means he refrains, abhadrāt, from abominable activities. Kvacic carati tat punaḥ. And again sometimes he commits the same thing. Punaḥ. Therefore habit is second nature. It is very difficult.
So criminality we have described. Everyone knows "This is not good," but he is punished. Again he does that. So Parīkṣit Mahārāja said, "What is the use of this atonement?" He further explains in this verse that kvacin nivartate abhadrāt. Abhadra means unclean, wrong things. Bhadra means right thing. Bhadra and abhadra. In India bhadra means gentleman and abhadra means uncivilized man. So sometimes he does like gentlemen and sometimes like foolish rascal. Kvacin nivartate 'bhadrāt kvacic carati tat punaḥ (SB 6.1.10). After coming from the prison house, jail, he decides, "No more I shall commit. I shall now become gentleman." But as soon as his friends, criminals, again mix with them, he again commits the same sinful activity. So in this condition, atonement, if he cannot change his character, so what is the use of this atonement? Prāyaścittam atho 'pārtham (SB 6.1.10). Apārtham means useless. If he cannot change his character, change his mind, then the punishment or prāyaścittam is apārtha, useless. How useless? Manye, "I think it is as useless as kuñjara-śaucavat."
So this is going on. Actually it will be explained in the next verse. Parīkṣit Mahārāja puts a very intelligent question, that "What is the use of this kind of prāyaścitta, atonement? It has no use." So as the student is intelligent, the spiritual master is also gradually giving him more intelligence. First of all, for ordinary man the atonement, punishment, he proposed. But when the student, intelligent student, Mahārāja Parīkṣit said, "It is useless," then next proposal is,
- karmaṇā karma-nirhāro
- na hy ātyantika iśyate
- avidvad-adhikāritvāt
- prāyaścittaṁ vimarśanam
Avidyā. If somebody is kept into darkness, then there is no use of this punishment or prāyaścitta. So he proposes that the man in darkness should be educated. Vimarśanam. Vimarśanam means cultivation of knowledge, culture. So where is that culture? There is no culture. We propose that the beginning of culture is no illicit sex.
Rejecting the process of atonement because it involves fruitive activities, karma. Karma. I have committed some sinful activity, then other, another karma to punish me. So here it is said by... One karma cannot be nullified by another karma. Karma means activity. They are going on, passing resolution after resolution and laws after laws, but things are in the same position. They are not changing. Therefore it cannot be checked in that way. Karmaṇā karma-nirhāra. Now Śukadeva Gosvāmī is suggesting the platform of speculative knowledge. When it has failed that a thief repeatedly committing criminal activities, repeatedly he is being punished but he is not corrected, then what is the remedy? That is vimarśanam, speculative knowledge. Progressing from karma-kāṇḍa to jñāna-kāṇḍa, he is proposing prāyaścittaṁ vimarśanam: real atonement is full knowledge.
You cannot drive your car on the left side. That is offense. "Keep to the right." You cannot drive your car when there is red light, or yellow light. You have to follow the restriction. But the dog, if it keeps to the left or crosses the street when there is red light, it is not punished, because it is animal, dog. But if you violate the laws, you'll be punished. Why? That means you have got advanced consciousness. If you do not follow the rules and regulation, then you are nothing but animal. Human being, human life means voluntarily accepting the laws, the rules and regulation. That is human life. But now the propaganda is that everyone, one wants to be free, no regulative life. This is animal life. Just try to understand. The regulations, lawbooks, restrictions, they are meant for human being, not for animals. And if you want freedom from all restrictions, then you come to the animal life. Therefore Śukadeva Gosvāmī recommends first tapasya. If you want to stop the problems of life, then you have to accept the life of austerity, tapasya.
So Bhāgavata, Parīkṣit, Śukadeva Gosvāmī, the next step... Next step means to become cultured. First of all prāyaścitta: "You have done this wrong; you should be punished." But the punishment will not rectify him. And that is practical. There are so many rules and regular punishment. In common cases... Just like every day the police is giving a ticket to the motor driver; still, the same thing is going on. So to keep oneself in darkness and makes rules and regulation will not help. Just like your government has admitted that they have spent millions of dollars, they could not stop the intoxication habit of LSD. That's a fact. But in our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement one who joins, he gives up immediately. That's a fact. What is the difference? The difference is that to stop one kind of karma by karma will not help. Therefore it is said, karmaṇā karma-nirhāra. One kind of activity is criminality, and one kind of activity just to punish him, this will not stop criminality. This is the real fact. He must be in knowledge. Cultivation of knowledge required. He must come to the senses, that "I am suffering. Every time I commit some criminality, I am punished. This is not very palatable. So why I cannot stop it?"
This is the beginning of human life, that unless you come to this knowledge... athāto brahma jijñāsā. This is called brahma-jijñāsā. So that is possible in the human form of life. A dog cannot. A dog comes within your room, and you drive him away, you punish him, and still, with some plea he will come.
There is somebody is creating disturbance, injury to others—it is the government's duty, kṣatriya's duty, to punish him immediately, or, if required, to kill him, immediately. That is kṣatriya's duty. So one demon was very much disturbing the ṛṣis in the jungle. So they came to Daśaratha Mahārāja to get some relief. Kṣatraṁ dvijatvaṁ ca parasparārtham. He said, "My dear King Daśaratha, I have come to you for some help. The disturbance is going on." Just like we go to the government for police help if there is some disturbance, this is the duty of the government, kṣatriya. So "We are having sacrifices, penances for the whole humanity. Now we are disturbed. You save us." Kṣatraṁ dvijatvaṁ ca parasparārtham. This is required.
If you want to elevate... Our topics began... The people are suffering. Although one knows that "This is not good, what I am doing," he has heard, he has seen also the effect of it... The same example: A man who has stolen some property, he's arrested. And he knew it, that "If I steal, I'll be punished." But he has done it, the same thing. He knew it. He heard it from the police courts, that stealing is not good. He knew it. He heard it from authorities. Still he has done it. So Parīkṣit Mahārāja's question is, "What is this atonement?" If he, although knowing and hearing, completely in knowledge, still he's forced to do something, to steal, or to something criminal, what then is the use of putting him into the jail and atonement? He'll come again and again do the same thing.
And therefore we see so many varieties of men. Each one is a person. You cannot find anyone exactly similar to the other, because everyone has got his personal propensities. And according to the personal propensities and desires, Kṛṣṇa is giving us different opportunities, and that is different body. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa (SB 3.31.1). Just like in the court, the..., everyone is judged as person, not wholesale. The judge not says that "Now all you have come here"—some of them are complainants and some of them are respondents—"so you stand together. I give this judgment." No. Everyone is personally judged. And everyone is given reward or punishment personally. So where is the question of imperson?
So in order to become free from this criminality, there are so many prescriptions in the śāstras. They're called tapasya. The beginning is the tapasya. Tapasya means just like a thief wants to steal others' property, but if he thinks at the same time, "No, no, it will be criminal. Father has said it is criminal. I shall not steal others' property," this is tapasya. Because I have got the inclination to steal, to usurp other things, but if I restrain myself by the order of father or the śāstras, the laws... Just like a thief. He knows that if he steals, if he takes others' property, he'll be arrested and he will be punished.
Well, criminal is criminal, greater or smaller. Just like in India it is said that if you have stolen a khira, a cucumber, or you have stolen a hīrā, a diamond, you are equally punishable.
So therefore they do not know what is the aim of life, and the nature's law is, unless you come to the point of understanding what is the aim of life, the nature will go on punishing you in so many ways. Little mistake, you'll be punished. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). We have come to this material world, disobeying the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So just like police: as soon as you become outlaw, the police will take you and the police will go on punishing you unless you become lawful. This is the... So without understanding "Why I am put into the jail?" if I simply think that "It is all right. Let me remain here and suffer the punishment," jail life is not for happiness. That is, everyone knows. Jail life is for punishment. Similarly, in this material world everything is punishment, but by the illusory energy you are thinking, "This is all right." Every step there is punishment.
The same thing: unless you become law-abiding to the laws given by God, you'll suffer. That is nature's way. The same principle: unless you become lawful, the police will give you punishment. Similarly, material nature, that is explained in Bhagavad-gītā, puruṣaḥ prakṛti-stho 'pi bhuṅkte tad-guṇān. We are suffering because in the material there are threefold miseries generally: adhyātmika, adhibhautika, adhidaivika. That is permanent. Besides that, extra miserable condition due to the age, due to the climate, due to the condition of life. So we have to study these things. Why... The human life begins when he begins to say "Why?" Kenopaniṣad. "Why I am suffering?"
It is, according to Vedic scripture, the sinful persons are taken to the superintendent of death, and there, according to his different volumes or proportion of sinful activities, a living entity is punished. The spirit soul is taken in that planet where the Yamarāja is there, and in the subtle form... Subtle form means the spirit covered in the subtle form of mind, intelligence and false ego, he is put into various trouble. Sometimes, just like we are also, even in this life, we are put into such troublesome position in dream. That is our experience. Suppose we are put into some narrow space and I am just going to be suffocated, or I am in the face of some dangerous animal, or deep into the ocean. Sometimes we dream like that. A similar punishment is given after death, and when the living being or the living entity becomes accustomed to such habit, then he is put into the womb of a certain type of animal or man where that suffering will continue. He is made into practice.
But here it is said that a person, for a short period, if he becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, sakṛt, manaḥ, if his mind is somehow or other placed on the lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa, then, even in dream he'll never see what is the punishment in the planet of Yamarāja. That means a Kṛṣṇa conscious person is guaranteed not to be touched by the Yamarāja or his attendants or his police force or constables. They... A living entity is taken away. After his death, if he's sinful man, then his soul is taken away by force. He doesn't want to... Through a desert. These things are described.
You cannot eat more what you can digest. The law of nature immediately will try to inflict punishment upon you. This is practical experience. You have to eat as much as you require. If you eat more, then you get indigestion, and if you eat less, then you become weak. You have to eat exactly what you require. That is the law of nature. Similarly, these Kṛṣṇa consciousness boys and girls, they're being taught not to eat more, not to eat less; not to enjoy senses more, not to enjoy less. Similarly, the paramahaṁsa life is a regulated life.
So here, how the person of whose history is mentioned here became irregulated and how he was to be punished, this story is narrated. Kindly hear.
Five thousand years before, Parīkṣit Mahārāja gave the Kali-yuga four places. First of all he wanted to kill Kali. Then he begged pardon, "Sir, I am also your praja, a citizen in your kingdom. So it is my business to kill these animals. So why you are punishing me? So give me protection. What can I do?" So Parīkṣit Mahārāja allowed, "No, you cannot do in my kingdom. You have to go out." So Parīkṣit Mahārāja was the emperor of the whole world, so the Kali, he said, "Sir, you say go out of your kingdom, but where is not your kingdom? Everywhere, throughout the whole world, where shall I go?" Then he designated that "You stay in these four places." "What are those places?" "Now, where illicit sex, brothel, prostitutes are going on.
So Yamarāja is the superintendent or the judge for considering what kind of punishment should be given to a certain sinful person. After death, those who are sinful, they are taken to Yamarāja for judgment, what kind of punishment one has to be given. And those who are pious devotees, they are taken charge by the Viṣṇudūta. I think the Christian doctrine, that in this life either you go to hell or go to heaven. Is it not?
So this is the chance. We should not neglect. So if we misuse this human form of life like animals, then we are punishable. Then you have to go to the Yamarāja and he'll judge what kind of body you'll get. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa (SB 3.31.1). Just like if you are criminal, then you are put into the magistrate's court and the magistrate decides what kind of punishment you must be given. So don't think you are, we are, every one of us, independent. No. No independent. And after death you are completely under the grip of material nature. That time you cannot say, "I don't care for anyone." No, you have to care. You can falsely become proud so long this body is there.
He has to supply water. There is no need of yajña." In other words, Kṛṣṇa is not in favor of any type of demigod worship. No. In the Govardhana chapter He stressed: simply the Supreme Personality of Godhead should be satisfied. That is stated everywhere, in Bhagavad-gītā also, kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.20). So Indra, when his yajña was stopped, so he tried to punish the inhabitants of Vṛndāvana by torrents of, incessant torrents of rain for seven days—havoc. The whole Vṛndāvana was to be drowned under water, and Kṛṣṇa immediately lifted the whole Govardhana Hill. And He stood seven days without taking any food and protected all the inhabitants of Vṛndāvana. Now God is displaying as God.
So what is the difference between dog and me? The only difference is that dog has no religion; I've got religion. So if I give up religion, life of religiosity, then I am equal to dharmeṇa hīnāḥ paśubhiḥ samānāḥ.
So this Ajāmila, on account of bad association with prostitute, he lost his character and he became thief, cheater, somehow or other being punished. So in this way, while he was maintaining his children and family, then the time of death came. That will not wait, that "I have not finished my duty, family duty. Please wait few years more." "Oh, that is not possible." So kālo... Atyagāt. Kālo atyagāt mahān rājan aṣṭāśīti āyuṣaḥ samāḥ. He became very old, eighty-eight years old, aṣṭaśīti. Aṣṭa means eight, aśīti means eighty-eight. In this way, aṣṭāśītyā āyuṣaḥ samāḥ. So at that time he had ten sons. Tasya pravayasaḥ putrāḥ. He begot so many children, number is ten.
Therefore purposely they commit sinful activity and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa to counteract. That is also greatest offense, that "Because I am chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa..." Just like some government officer, because he is in higher post... Just like the other day I cited the high-court judge. So "I shall take opportunity of taking bribe on the strength of my superior post in government service." According to law, that is greatest offender, the greatest criminal according to law. If a police man kills, his offense and his punishment is greater than an ordinary man killing. That is the law. Knowingly. So the "Nārāyaṇa," the constant chanting of "Nārāyaṇa," on account of the name... Nowadays the fashion is that we do not keep the name of our children in God's name.
So everyone is proposing "I believe." That's why the government law is there, that "If you do this, you'll be punished like this." That is government law. Suppose you have stolen something, committed theft, you must be punished for six months' imprisonment. So you believe or not believe, the law will act. If you say in the court, "I believe," what is the meaning of your belief? There's no question of belief. Law is law. Ignorance is no excuse. If you go in the court and if you're punished, so if you say, "My lordship, I believe like this. I'll not be punished. So you're punishing me," so that is no excuse. You believe or not believe, the law is law.
So he was attached to the son, always chanting "Nārāyaṇa." "Nārāyaṇa, please come. Nārāyaṇa, please eat. Nārāyaṇa, please sit down." So at the time of death he loudly chanted, "Nārāyaṇa." He thought his son will save him from the hands of these Yamadūtas. But immediately Kṛṣṇa's attendants immediately came there, Viṣṇudūtas. And immediately they ordered, "You Yamadūtas, carriers of order, stop, you cannot do it." That is stated here. Yama-preṣyān viṣṇudūtā vārayām āsuḥ: "Do not touch him." Ojasā: "very strongly." "If you touch, then you will be punished. Don't do it."
So here is Dharmarāja. Just like we have got magistrate. So magistrate's duty is, when a criminal is brought before him, to judge what kind of punishment he should be allowed. Justice there is. Similarly, this Dharmarāja means the criminals are brought before him. Dharmarāja is appointed magistrate by the Supreme Lord. So everyone, after death, he is brought before Dharmarāja, the Yamarāja, and he judges what kind of next body this criminal will have. That is Dharmarāja. He is judged by his work. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur deha-upapattaye (SB 3.31.1). Just like the magistrate punishes the criminal, what kind of punishment he should be awarded, how he will be allowed to live within the prison house. Just like a political prisoner. In our country just now they have... So many big, big leaders have been arrested. But they are not put in the same level of ordinary criminals. They are given all facilities. They are given nice house, servants and newspaper. They are given all facilities of indepen..., outside life, according to the position. They are called first-class prisoners. And there are similarly second-class prisoners, third-class prisoners. So this is judged by a person.
Just like police comes with his warrant of magistrate—nobody can check it. If somebody wants to check it, then he will be punished. The whole government force is behind the warrant of the police. Nobody can check it. If there is riot, then government will bring military forces to accept. So this is called ruling. So we are under these rulings. However foolishly we may declare we are independent, that is our completely foolishness. When the warrant is there, you cannot check it. The whole power is behind. Either you become the great scientist or philosopher, when the warrant of death will come from Yamarāja, there is no power to check it. Therefore they were surprised, that "Who is this foolish?" But they saw that the persons, they are coming from Vaikuṇṭha. They had different features, so beautiful, four handed, nicely decorated. So they were surprised.
That is not the business. So Yamarāja is in charge of punishing according to the gravity of sinful activities. He's meant for punishing. That is just like superintendent of police or something like that, big officer, inspector general of the police department or the minister in charge of law and order. Everything is there in imitation, yato vā imāni bhūtāni jayante, janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). Wherefrom you get this idea? There must be minister in charge of law and order. Where you get this idea? The idea is there from the original government. And there is the director or the minister in charge of law and order. The Yamarāja is minister in charge. They say it is mythology, it is man's creation.
There is no value of this "I believe," "I think," "I conjecture." You can do that, but things are going on. The government is very, very strong. Little deviation from the law, you'll be punished. Little deviation. Nature's law, they are so systematically set up that automatically... Just like the same example I've given: you'll infect some disease, automatically you'll have to suffer from the disease. Not that somebody's come to ask you that "You have infected this disease. Now you have to suffer from this." No. The machine is so perfect that as you have infected this disease... This is practically we know. So all of a sudden one gets cholera. So the doctor says that you are very bilious, or cholera (indistinct). So nature's law is so perfect.
So you are suffering. You are maintaining so many slaughterhouses, and when it will be mature, there will be war, the wholesale murder. Finished. One atom bomb—finished. You'll have to suffer. Don't think that "Innocent animals, they cannot protest. Let us kill and eat." No. You'll be also punished. Wait for accumulation of your sinful activities, and there will be war, and the America will drop the atom bomb, and Russia will be finished. Both will be finished. Go on now enjoying. It takes time. Just like even if you infect some disease, it takes time. Not that immediately you infect, and immediately the disease is there.
So from Africa, if anyone goes anywhere, they require yellow fever injection. So if you haven't got yellow fever injection, then even in the airport, there is arrangement, you have to wait in the quarantine area for six days. You'll not be allowed. So this is... As you have got the laws and the punishment in this government, so why do you think there is no punishment and there is no God? This is utopian. Don't think like that. Utopian. There is God, there is his government, there are his agents, there are witnesses, and... Otherwise why there are different varieties of life? Different varieties of life. Why? Eight million, four hundred thousand species of life. Everyone is a living being. The trees are living being, the fishes are living being, the ants are living being, the mosquitos are living being, and the human being also living being, the demigods also living being, the cats, dogs—everyone is living being. It is simply in different dresses. They're living beings. But why they are situated in different position? According to karma, punished.
So we should be very careful. This is... This human form of life is a chance to make your choice, whether you are to go on being punished like this in different forms of life or whether you shall go back to home, back to Godhead.
So this Ajāmila... We have already described his life—cheating, roguism and prostitute-hunter and so many things, that is his life. So he's subjected to the punishment, to be punished by the Yamarāja. So his order carriers have come to take him away. But, in the meantime, the Viṣṇudūtas came and asked them, "No. Don't touch him. Don't touch him." So they were surprised: "What is this?" Therefore they are asking, ke yūyaṁ pratiṣeddhāro dharma-rājasya śāsanam: "Who are you, interfering with government's law? Who are you?" They are surprising. "Nobody has checked us." Just like police... They come... Police comes to somebody's house, everyone knows there is some business, serious business. Who will ask the police, "Why you are entering here?" No. Nobody has right. (indistinct) But why this punishment? Just to save him from so many other punishments. That is the law in Manu-saṁhitā, that a murderer is killed, then his all sinful activities, reaction of life, finishes by that killing, by that hanging. Otherwise next life he has to suffer so many things. So when the king orders a murderer to be killed, it is his mercy. It is his mercy. Because he saves him from so many other entanglement. Better kill him so that his sinful reaction is finished. Similarly, Yamarāja, the sinful man taken to the Yamarāja, he is put into suffering, the same principle as a prisoner. He has to suffer for a time, six months or one year or sometimes more than that, just to atone for his sinful activities. So nobody can check. You can imagine that "There is no God, there is no Yamarāja, there is no punishment.
Why you are doing this wrong thing? We have come to discharge our duties, and you are forbidding us." Means they could understand that "They are so powerful, they have stopped us to touch Ajāmila's body. If we forcibly do, they can punish us." The Yamadūtas could understand. Therefore politely asking that "You are so gentle, so good-looking, so nice. Why this is your business, that you are forbidding us in discharging our duties?" Kim arthaṁ dharma-pālasya. Dharma-pāla: "We are also acting not whimsically. We are working under the Dharmarāja, Yamarāja, who is justice, how to make judgment against the sinful man. He is appointed for this purpose, and we are just carrying out his order." Then "You look so gentle and highly exalted. Why you are forbidding us? This is very..." kim arthaṁ dharma-pālasya kiṅkarān no niṣedhatha.
"Now explain who is subjected to the punishment of Yamarāja. You have come here to take away this Ajāmila to the court of Yamarāja. But first of all explain who is actually subjected to go to the court of Yamarāja for being punished." This is the question, and we shall discuss tomorrow about the answer. Hare Kṛṣṇa.
They challenged, the Yamadūtas challenged: "Who are you, interfering in our business? We have come to arrest him." So, before talking, the, the counterchallenge was that "You spoke that 'We are servants of Dharmarāja. So it is his jurisdiction... This person is impious. So this is the jurisdiction of Dharmarāja. He has to try the case and give him punishment, criminal department, law and order. So, you cannot interfere with us.' " Therefore the challenge is replied by Viṣṇudūtas that "If you are actually representative of Dharmarāja, who tries the case of dharma and adharma, first of all explain what is dharma and what is adharma."
He does not know what is the philosophy. If you do not know the philosophy of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if you simply mark your body with tilaka and kaṇṭhi, then you are not proper servant, you are not qualified. So tilaka, mala, is necessary. Just like a policeman. A bogus man, if he dresses like a policeman, he is not a policeman. He must know what is the police law, criminal law, who is to be punished, who is not to be punished, what is criminality, what is innocence. All these things he must know.
Nitāi: What is the process of punishing others? Who are the actual candidates for punishment? Are all karmīs engaged in fruitive activities punishable, or only some of them?
Prabhupāda:
- kathaṁ svid dhriyate daṇḍaḥ
- kiṁ vāsya sthānam īpsitam
- daṇḍyāḥ kiṁ kāriṇaḥ sarve
- āho svit katicin nṛṇām
- (SB 6.1.39)
So first question was, brūta dharmasya nas tattvaṁ yac ca adharmasya lakṣaṇam. When there is some vicāra, judgment, it must be done very nicely. A criminal is judged before the magistrate. He is taken just to make proper judgment, "Whether this man is punishable? He committed some criminal activities." The circumstances, the condition of the mind—everything should be judged. This is called judgment. So who is punishable? Deśa-kāla-pātra. There is consideration, deśa-kāla-pātra. Deśa means situation, and kāla, time, and pātra, and the subject. Just like a child, he takes one fruit here. So he is not punishable. According to Vedic system, a child, a woman, a brāhmaṇa, a cow and a saintly person, they are not punishable. Cow, woman, saintly person, brāhmaṇa and child—they are beyond all laws. Even they commit some... They do not do. They have no criminal purpose.
No, that's all right. (some devotees say "Jaya!" and applaud) So, children are not punishable. (laughter, more applause) Neither the women. (more applause, laughter) Hm. But don't take advantage. (laughter) And here we have got these brāhmaṇas, saintly persons, women and children. So who is to be punished? (laughter) Yes. Kathaṁ svid dhriyate daṇḍaḥ. So the judge must know who is to be punished. That is judgment. Kathaṁ svid dhriyate daṇḍaḥ sthānam. Deśa-kāla-pātra: according to time, according to circumstances, according to the subject, everything scrutinizingly judged, not whimsically. Nowadays it is the time for emergency. Anyone can be punished without any judgment. But this is not good position.
Then daṇḍyāḥ kiṁ kāriṇaḥ sarve. Kāriṇaḥ means fruitive actors, those who are working for getting some profit. So sometimes with getting profit we make some undesirable activities which is called black market. So that is punishable. There are system... Of course, I cannot quote from where, but it is the system that a merchant, highest profit he can take for exchanging—not more than twenty-five percent. That is the highest. If one merchant takes more than twenty-five percent profit, then he is punishable.
Therefore, if a newspaper seller creates some disturbance on the street, the police can punish, but when one is selling Back to Godhead, he is not punishable. (laughter) This is the difference. But nowadays these rascals, they do not know whom to punish, whom not to punish. They take, "All right, you are selling Back to Godhead. You must come police custody." So our are not punishable although doing the same thing. This is judgment.
Then the animals, they are also working hard day and night for their necessities of life. But if an animal steals something from your house or takes some eatables, he is not punishable. India you will find in the bazaars. There is crowd, and the cows enter there, and they eat the vegetables to their heart's content. But he is not punishable. Still the cow is not punishable. But if a man takes one potato without the permission, he is punishable. So the animals are not punishable. All the lawbooks are meant for the men, for the human being, not for the animals. Just like in your country the police law is: "Keep to the right your car." But if a animal goes, keep to the left, it is not punishable. So everyone not punishable. Then again, human being, all of them, not punishable. Those who are criminals, those who have violated laws, they are punishable.
So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is Vedic movement, authorized. Veda-praṇihito dharmaḥ. If one becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, then he knows what is dharma and what is adharma. He knows who is punishable, who is not punishable. In this way, if you follow the principles of Kṛṣṇa consciousness... It is in a different way. Not different way; Kṛṣṇa name is there. When I registered this association, many friends requested me that "Why you are, nomenclature, this 'Kṛṣṇa'? Make it 'God consciousness.' " And "No." As soon as I give "God consciousness," all the rascals will bring so many false God. Therefore it must be definitely stated, "Kṛṣṇa consciousness." So try to follow Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Then you will be situated in the Vedic civilization, and you will know everything properly. Yasmin vijñāte sarvam idaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavati. If you understand Kṛṣṇa, then you understand everything. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Devotee: (leads chanting, etc.) Translation: "What is the process of punishing others? Who are the actual candidates for punishment? Are all karmīs engaged in fruitive activities punishable, or only some of them?"
Prabhupāda:
- kathaṁ svid dhriyate daṇḍaḥ
- kiṁ vāsya sthānam īpsitam
- daṇḍyaḥ kiṁ kāriṇaḥ sarve
- aho svit katicin nṛṇām
- (SB 6.1.39)
So challenge was replied that "You are representing Dharmarāja. So you have come here to take away this person, and we are prohibiting. So you have challenged us. So first of all explain your position, whether you know what is dharma and what is adharma, who is punishable, under what circumstance one is punished, and one who is punished, where does he go?" Actually, all these descriptions are there in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, different types of hellish life, what kind of sinful activities are punished by what kind of hellish condition. Everything is there. In the Fifth Canto, everything is there. There are different planets where Yamarāja is there, how a dead man or the soul is taken there, the path—everything is in detail there.
You are now curing physical disease, but when you take up curing material, I mean to say, spiritual disease... Yes. Try to bring all people to the normal spiritual life. All their suffering is due to abnormal spiritual life, all suffering. Because, I was discussing with my disciples just now, nature's law is so subtle and so acute, that a little violation will be punished immediately. You know. You are medical man. Little violation will immediately subjected to the punishment. This is God's law. There is a word in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, uru-dāmni baddhāḥ. Uru. Uru means very strong and dāmni means rope. Just like if you are tied up with a strong rope, hands and feet, as you are helpless, our position is like that. This very word is used, uru-dāmni baddhāḥ. Na te viduḥ... And such baddha, conditioned souls, they are declaring freedom: "I don't care for anyone. I don't care for God." How much foolishness. Just like sometimes naughty children, they are also bound up. Yaśodāmayī also bound up Kṛṣṇa. That is an Indian system, or everywhere, that tied up. And that small child, when it is bound up, if that child declares freedom, how it is possible? Similarly, by the laws of mother nature we are bound up. How you can declare freedom? Every part of our body is being controlled by some controller. That is stated in the Bhāgavatam. Even your, this eyelid moving, that is also under some controller.
If you are representative of Yamarāja, who is supposed to be one of the authorities of religion, then you must explain what is religion, dharma, and what is nonreligion, or adharma, because, according to this principle, one is punished or rewarded. If you become religious, then you are rewarded, and if you are irreligious, then you are punished." That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā also:
- ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthā
- madhye tiṣṭhanti rājasāḥ
- jaghanya-guṇa-vṛtti-sthā
- adho gacchanti tāmasāḥ
- (BG 14.18)
How a man is going to heaven or hell, one can understand from the direction of the scriptures, just like you can understand how a man is going to be punished or rewarded within this material world. If you see somebody is working very hard, doing nicely, you can conjecture that "This man will be happy." Say, for example, if a boy is studying very nicely, you can conjecture that "This boy will rise very highly in his future life." And similarly, if a boy is whiling away his time by playing, you can understand, "This boy is being spoiled."
So he says, kathaṁ svid dhriyate daṇḍaḥ kiṁ vāsya sthānam īpsitam. (SB 6.1.39) "According to punishment and reward, a man, a living entity..." Living entity means this daṇḍaḥ, this punishment and reward is meant for the human being, not the animals. Animals are not supposed to be under the stringent laws of material nature. Just like in ordinary way, all the state laws are applicable to the human being, not to the animals. Because if an animal goes to the wrong path or if an animal takes away something from your possession, he is not punished, neither anybody goes to complain in the police court. Similarly, human being... That is also civilized human being, advanced, civilized... That is stated here that daṇḍyāḥ kiṁ kāriṇaḥ sarve āho svit katicin nṛṇām. Human being... That is also very few human being, because those who are supposed to be advanced, the Aryans... The Aryans are called the advanced human being. The civilization means Aryan civilization. So katicin nṛṇām. This very word is used here. Not all human beings. Those who are..., they are also punished.
Mālatī: Śrīla Prabhupāda, you said that the animals are not subject to the laws of the state, that if they steal something, they are not punished. But in our country, even if a person has a mouse in his house, a little mouse, he sets some trap and he kills him for stealing food.
Prabhupāda: That is not punishment. That is to stop the disturbance. By law... There is no such law that "When there is a rat in your house, you should catch it and kill it." Law does not say. Is there any law like that?
Mālatī: No.
Prabhupāda: Then that is another thing.
You will find in The Nectar of Devotion. There was law that... He said that, (chuckles) "If I do not find any one of my citizens with tilaka, then I shall punish him." So everyone, out of that fear, they used to have this tilaka. And they were looking all Vaiṣṇavas. (laughs) Although they had no very much faith in Viṣṇu, but out of fear of the state orders, they were having tilaka. So sometimes authority orders are accepted in that, out of fear. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (pause) I was thinking of Doctor..., yourself. You are a little late today? Yes. Let us stop here.
That is ignorance-rooted, ignorance, heart, rooted in the heart. That can be... Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu recommends ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). You have to cleanse your heart. Then, when your heart is cleansed, then you will say, "No, no. No more I am going to do this. I have suffered so much. No. No." That is real knowledge. Unless your heart is cleansed, then, even though you know that "By committing theft I will be punished," you will commit, because the heart is not clear. Even though one knows that "By doing this, I will suffer," still, he will do that. That distinction is always there. Therefore the only method is this cleansing process in this age, Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra.
So anyone who has accepted this body, daihyasya, and whatever he is doing, it is all being witnessed by so many witnesses. How can you avoid? How you can do something very secretly? That is not possible. Everything is being noted. And so punishment or reward, you will have to accept because you are not independent. We foolishly say independent. "We don't care for anybody. There is no God." But there is death. That you have to believe. So that death is God. Kṛṣṇa says, ahaṁ mṛtyuḥ sarva-haraś ca. One who does not see God during lifetime, so he will see God at the time of death. So there is no question of not seeing God. Here is God, Kṛṣṇa. He is standing. He is so merciful. He has come to this temple so that we can take the advantage of seeing Him, But we are seeing Him still idol or something, stone or wood. He does not know that because we cannot see now at the present moment without being wood or stone or something material, so Kṛṣṇa has very kindly come to me so that I can see Him in a form which I can see. That is His mercy. We have repeatedly said this.
They take the analogy: just like a criminal in the court is convinced when there is sufficient witness, not that I have complained against you, and you go to the court, you are punished. No. My charges against you should be corroborated by sufficient witness. So the Christian religionists, they do not believe in the next birth, transmigration of the soul, something like that. So they do not believe also in the fruitive activities' resultant action of our past life. This very word "witness"... It is my personal experience. I was student in the Scottish Churches College, and we had to attend half an hour Bible class.
So how you can escape God's eyes? Sarvataḥ pāṇi-pādaṁ tat sarvato cakṣuḥ. Everywhere God's eyes are there. So you cannot escape. You are wanting witness? Here are so many witnesses. How you can hide your sinful activities? That is not possible. You can hide yourself from the material laws, that "The police has not seen me. Then I may escape." No. God's law you cannot do that. That is not possible. So we should remember it, that when we act sinfully, then there are so many witnesses, and we have to be punished. You cannot escape. Kaṁ kuḥ svayam. Svayam. These are so many gods, witnesses, and over and above them svayam, the Personality of Godhead in His Supersoul feature Supersoul means God is present in everyone's heart. Not only heart, He is everywhere present, even within the atom.
Nitai: "The candidates for punishment are those who are confirmed by these many witnesses to have deviated from the prescribed regulative duties. Everyone engaged in fruitive activities is suitable to be subjected to punishment according to his different sinful activities."
Prabhupāda:
- etair adharmo vijñātaḥ
- sthānaṁ daṇḍasya yujyate
- sarve karmānurodhena
- daṇḍam arhanti kāriṇaḥ
- (SB 6.1.43)
So we have discussed about the witnesses last, yesterday. You cannot conceal anything from the eyes of God. That is not possible. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, sarvato pāṇi-pādas tam. God has His eyes, heads, legs, hands everywhere. Therefore He is all-pervasive.
Everyone is deserving to be punished, beginning from Lord Brahmā down to the ant, every living entity. Daṇḍam arhanti. And the final daṇḍam... Daṇḍa means punishment. The final daṇḍa is death. Everywhere, anywhere you go within this universe, planetary system... Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthāḥ: "Those who are in the modes of goodness, they are elevated to the higher planetary system." And madhye tiṣṭhanti rājasāḥ: "Those who are under the spell of passion, they keep within the middle planetary system." And those who are most abominable, they are given to the lower planetary system. Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthā madhye tiṣṭhanti rājasāḥ, jaghanya-guṇa-vṛtti-sthāḥ (BG 14.18). Jaghanya means very abominable guṇa, in the darkest region of ignorance.
So Prahlāda Mahārāja, durlabhaṁ mānuṣaṁ janma. So mānuṣaṁ janma, durlabhaṁ: "very, very difficult to obtain it." So somebody says, "What is the benefit? Everyone dies, and man also dies." But Prahlāda Mahārāja says, "Yes, that is fact." Durlabhaṁ mānuṣaṁ janma tad apy adhruvam arthadam: "Although it is temporary, but you can achieve the great success of life." That is int Arthadam, arthadam. Artha means some meaningful. If we don't use it as meaningful life, then we are punished, again go to Either go to back to home, back to Godhead, or go to dog's and cat's life. We have to select now. Jaghanya-guṇa-vṛtti-sthā adho gacchanti tāmasāḥ (BG 14.18). If you practice only tamo-guṇa, then you go to hell again.
So in this way we are misguided by so many rascals and forget God, and that is sinful life. That is the sinful life. Therefore it is said, etair adharmaḥ vijñātaḥ: now as soon as you are sinful, you have to be punished. That is nature's law. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). It is not that God has to come personally to punish you. When God comes personally to punish you, then you are not ordinary. (laughter) Just like He came to punish Rāvaṇa, Kaṁsa. They are not ordinary. But ordinary person, a little headache is sufficient to finish him. He doesn't require to bring God. God's agents, there are so many agents. One agent is sufficient. So in this way there are different grades of punishment. Just like first-class, second-class, third-class prisoner. They are all punished in the prison house, but some of them are first class, some of them are second class. So similarly, within this material world it is called durgā. Durgā means fort, and the superintending deity is called Durgā, goddess material nature.
Pradyumna: Translation: "The candidates for punishment are those who are confirmed by these many witnesses to have deviated from their prescribed regulative duties. Everyone engaged in fruitive activities is suitable to be subjected to punishment according to his sinful acts."
Prabhupāda:
- etair adharmo vijñātaḥ
- sthānaṁ daṇḍasya yujyate
- sarve karmānurodhena
- daṇḍam arhanti kāriṇaḥ
- (SB 6.1.43)
So you can say that "God is dead" or "There is no God," but that is not the fact. The atheist class of men, they want that there may not be any God; they can do whatever they like. That is not possible. Just like in a small state there are so many CID, police and so many other depart..., detectives, just to find out who is transgressing the law.
So anyone who is serving always Kṛṣṇa, or God, he is dharmī; he is in dharma. And who is not serving is adharma. Because a duty... It requires treatment. This finger, part and parcel of my body. I want to get some service from the finger, but if the finger is diseased or due to some pain or some injury it cannot serve the body, it requires treatment. This is natural. Similarly, punishment means treatment. Why government has opened so many prison house? So this punishment... Government does not desire to keep the prison house open and inviting, "Please come here." No, that is not the policy. Policy is that "One who is outlaw, diseased, he should be brought here and corrected."
So Yamarāja is for this purpose. When we are punished that is no envious envy on the part of God or His agent; it is our correction, I think the Yamarāja, er, the Yamadūtas said in the beginning that "We have come to take Ajāmila just to correct him." So dharma and adharma... Our real dharma is to serve God. That is our real duty. And as soon as we neglect this permanent service or occupation, then we are liable to be punished.
Nitai: "O inhabitants of Vaikuṇṭha, you are all sinless, but those within this material world, they are all karmīs acting piously or impiously. Both kinds of activities are possible for them because they are contaminated by the three modes of nature and must act accordingly. One who has accepted a material body cannot remain inactive, and it is inevitable for one acting under the modes of nature to be sinful. Therefore all the living entities within this material world are punishable."
Prabhupāda:
- sambhavanti hi bhadrāṇi
- viparītāni cānaghāḥ
- kāriṇāṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sti
- dehavān na hy akarma-kṛt
- (SB 6.1.44)
So dehavān we have explained several times. Deha means the body, and vān means one who possesses. Asty arthe vatup. This vat-pratyāya is affixed when there is the meaning of possessing. Therefore Bhagavān. Bhāga means opulence, and vān means one who possesses.
Pradyumna: Translation: "O inhabitants of Vaikuṇṭha, you are sinless, but those within this material world are all karmīs, whether acting piously or impiously. Both kinds of action are possible for them because they are contaminated by the three modes of nature and must act accordingly. One who has accepted a material body cannot be inactive, and sinful action is inevitable for one acting under the modes of material nature. Therefore all the living entities within this material world are punishable."
Prabhupāda:
- sambhavanti hi bhadrāṇi
- viparītāni cānaghāḥ
- kāriṇāṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sti
- dehavān na hy akarma-kṛt
- (SB 6.1.44)
This material world is karma-kṛt—you have to do something. Kṛṣṇa has explained that "Without acting, you cannot even maintain your body and soul together." Śarīra-yātrāpi te na prasiddhyed akarmaṇaḥ. If you become idle, then you cannot even maintain your body.
If you break this law, you will be punished. You can say, "What wrong I have done? Instead of going to the right, I have gone to the left. Both ways there are roads and streets." The government says, "No, I ordered you to keep to the right. You have violated. You must be punished." Simple thing. This is adharma: "You have violated the laws of the government. You must be punished." So a dog, of course, if he violates the law, he is not punished. The punishment is meant for the human being, because he has got developed sense. He cannot violate the laws. If he violates... All the books, laws, everything—education, culture, philosophy, science—it is all meant for the human being, not for the cats and dogs. So the human being must know what is the actual law. That is dharma. Therefore in the human society there is some form of dharma. Either you are Christian or Hindu or Muslim or Buddhist, throughout the whole world, any civilized nation, they have got some dharma or religious system. Why? Through it, you should understand what is the goal of your life. If you do not know that, then proportionately, as you are ignorant, fool, you will be punished. You will be punished.
So nature's way, evolution... The punishment is beginning from the aquatics. Then gradually, gradually, by evolutionary process, nature gives the chance that from aquatics you become plants and trees; then from plants and trees you become insect, reptiles; then from that, you become bird; then from that, you become beast; and from that beast, you become human being.
Just like an outlaw. He is thinking that he is free from the jurisdiction of state laws, and he is working irresponsibly, but when he is arrested, then he has no independence. He has to undergo the punishment. Similarly, in this life we may think very independent, "Whatever we like, we can do." That is foolishness. You cannot do that. If you do it wilfully, then you will be punished. That they do not know. Punished means by a different body. If a man, human being, is punished to stand up like as a tree for five thousand years, just imagine how much great punishment it is. And that is possible. Just like in the śāstra it is stated that those who want to remain naked, they are punished in the next life to become tree, that "You wanted to be naked. Now you stand naked." The trees, they do not dress; neither they have the opportunity. Nobody goes to dress them. So they stand naked for so many hundreds and thousands of years. This punishment is awaiting. Human being is not supposed to be naked. That is civilization. They must cover. But if one wilfully does not cover, becomes as dull as the tree, then he gets the next body as tree. This is punishment.
Therefore a human being should be very, very cautious and conscious. They should not do anything irresponsibly. And how to work with responsibility and how to work irresponsibly? Therefore śāstra required. Śāstra, these books, Vedic knowledge, books, why they are? So that a human being may take advantage of it and he act responsibly or irresponsibly. If he works irresponsibly, then his punishment is awaiting, lower grade of life.
So how to keep oneself always with Kṛṣṇa, that is the aim of human life. And if we do not do that, that is sinful. Then we become punishable, that "You were given the chance to understand yourself, Kṛṣṇa and your relationship with Kṛṣṇa. You did not take this chance." Oh, he is punished: "All right, you become again animal, again in the cycle of birth and death." So we should be very, very careful. Do not think that "We are independent, and we can do whatever nonsense I like." That is very risky life. Do not think like that, foolishly. There is a regular... There is Yamarāja. Because we are sons of Kṛṣṇa, when Kṛṣṇa wants that "These My sons, rascals, are suffering in this material world. Let them come back home," therefore He comes personally. Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata, tadātmānaṁ sṛjāmyaham (BG 4.7). He desires that, that "These rascals, they are rotting in this material world, birth after birth. Let them come back." Because He is more affectionate. So... And if he does not utilize this human form of life to take the advantage of going back to home, back to Godhead, that is sinful. Then he is punished.
So the conclusion is that everyone should take to this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement; otherwise, he is awaiting punishment by Yamarāja.
He became always attached to that. Therefore the nature's punishment was that he had to accept the body of a deer. But he was conscious, not that naṣṭa-janma-smṛtiḥ. He did not forget what he was. He understood that "I was engaged in advancing in spiritual consciousness. Unnecessarily I became attached to this animal. Now I have got this animal body." So he was keeping himself always with the devotees. That was his advantage. Then the next life he again took birth in a brāhmaṇa family, and he remained just like a dull. He was very much afraid to mix with the society so that he may not be misled. Therefore his name was Jaḍa Bharata. Jaḍa means dull. People used to think him as the dull-headed fool. But he was conscious of his position. He kept himself like that. Then Rahūgaṇa, the King Rahūgaṇa, understood that "He is keeping himself as dull, but he is most intelligent, advanced in spiritual consciousness," and there was talk. And so, in next birth Bharata Mahārāja, Jaḍa Bharata, got his salvation.
We do not understand that this deha, this body, is always kleśada. Kleśada means giving pains. For the time being, we may feel some pleasure, but actually it is a reservoir of pain, not pleasure. The example is given in this connection... Formerly, this was done by the government servants to criminal, to take a man in the middle of the river and drown him, and catching his hair, and when he's almost suffocating, then they again draw from the water and he takes little rest and again put him into the water. So that was the system of punishment. Similarly, whatever little pleasure we are feeling, that is exactly similarly the man, when he's taken from the water, that's all. Again he's to be drowned. This material world is like that.
Just like a criminal: he has got the dirty things within the mind, that "If I get such and such things, I'll be happy." And he takes the risk of criminality at the risk of life. A burglar, a thief goes, he knows that "If I am captured, I'll be killed, I'll be punished, I'll be handed over to the police," and so on, so on, and still he goes and steals. Why? That is śāstra, nūnaṁ pramattaḥ: he has become mad after sense gratification. Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ. Pramattaḥ means mad. Why he's taking so much risk? Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma yad indriya-prītayā (SB 5.5.4), simply for sense gratification. That's all. Simply for sense gratification.
Just like Hiraṇyakaśipu. Prahlāda Mahārāja so many times requested, "My dear father, why you are becoming atheist? By His grace you have got so much power. Just submit to Him." "No. There is no God. I am God." So this is called demon. In spite of being punished in so many ways, they will deny the existence of God. So they are... Those who are not devotee, they will be agitated by the māyā, by Madana, by Cupid, by so many other illusory things. But if one becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, then nothing can. Because Kṛṣṇa conscious person is not in want. He is not in want. So long we will be in want, our mind will be agitated. Therefore Prahlāda Mahārāja advised that, sadā samudvigna-dhiyām: "Those who are always agitated..." Everyone is agitated.
So there is no question of overpopulation. Overpopulation, there is no question of. If Kṛṣṇa has overpopulation, He is competent to supply them food. But it is the nature's restriction. When we become godless, the nature's trouble will be there. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). Just like the flood is going on in many parts of the world. So this is due to our sinful life. Nature is punishing. Adhidaivika. You cannot control. Nature will punish. Why nature is punishing? Because we are godless. That is nature's business. The more we become godless, the more we'll be punished by the laws of nature. Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā. You cannot surpass. You make many scientific plans to overcome—it is not possible. Then how it is possible? Mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti. Unless you surrender to Kṛṣṇa That is your business.
A sinful man cannot earn money honestly. Just like a thief: because he has adopted the means of earning money by sinful activities, he cannot take to honest work. He can work, but he is accustomed to steal. He knows that "This work is not good." If he is arrested, he will be punished. He has seen that one thief arrested and punished, and he has heard also that if one steals, he will be punished. And he has heard also from the śāstra, either law book or Vedic literature, that "Stealing is not good. It is punishable." But still, he does it. That means a sinful man cannot restrain himself from sinful activity. He has to do it. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo asya sad-asad-janma-yoniṣu (BG 13.22). Unless you give up the particular situation with the modes of nature, it is not possible for him to restrain himself from committing sinful activities.
He acts according to his own whim. That is described here: svaira-cāri. Svaira-cāri. Svaira-cāri means "I will act according to my whims. I don't care for any authority." That is called svaira-cāri. No. The laws are meant for human beings. Even on the street, as soon as you go out on the street, immediately the law is there: "Keep to the right. Keep to the left." And if you violate, immediately you'll be punished, immediately become criminal. Similarly... This is government law. Similarly, law given by the Supreme Lord.
So without obeying the instruction of the śāstra, he has fallen down. Although he was born in the brāhmaṇa family and educated nicely, but on account of bad association he fell down from the standard of human ideal life. Therefore he is punishable. Not only he, every one of us. The human fom of life is specially meant for going back to home, back to Godhead. The animal life... By progressive evolution, they come to the human form of life, and when one is, the living entity is on the platform of human form of life, he has got his responsibility.
These things are going on, very hard labor like the asses. So this is also another punishment. The more punishment is awaiting, Yama-daṇḍa, at the court of Yamarāja. Not only they are suffering here, but they will be taken to the Yamarāja. And there, according to his work, abominable work, he will be punished. Therefore the Yamadūtas said, tata enaṁ daṇḍa-pāṇeḥ sakāśaṁ kṛta-kilbiṣaṁ neṣyāmaḥ. "Now it is our duty." Just like police force, they are engaged to arrest the criminals and take him to the court or to the police officer for necessary action, so these Yamadūtas, they have given sufficient reason that "This man has committed sinful life; therefore he is punishable."
So, the fact is, this is nature's law. Nature's law is that if the human being does not follow the injunction of the śāstra and he acts whimsically, independently, then he becomes punishable, exactly in the state laws, if you violate the laws... You are not independent. If you violate the laws, you'll be punished. Similarly, dharma means the laws of God. Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). So if you violate the laws of God, the principles of dharma, then you will be punished.
So we cannot violate the laws of God, or dharma. Then we'll be punished. The punishment is there, awaiting, by the laws of nature. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). The laws of nature is to punish you. So long you are not Kṛṣṇa conscious, the laws of nature will go on punishing you—three kinds of miserable conditions: adhyātmika, adhibhautika, adhidaivika. This is the law. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). You are thinking independent, but that is not the fact. We are dependent, completely dependent on the laws of nature. And laws of nature means laws of God. What is prakṛti? Prakṛti is acting under the direction of Kṛṣṇa. Just like a police constable is working under the direction of magistrate or superior office, similarly, prakṛti is giving us various types of miserable condition of life directed by the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ suyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). Kṛṣṇa says, "Under My superintendence the laws of nature is working." And what is the laws of nature? That in the human form of life, if you do not endeavor to understand what is God, what you are, what is your relationship with God, what is your duty—these things, if you do not learn, then you are punishable immediately.
As soon as you forget Kṛṣṇa and you want to act independently, then immediately you are captured by māyā and you are punished.
So when you come to this senses, that "I am punished by māyā on account of my forgetting Kṛṣṇa consciousness; therefore my duty is to come back again to Kṛṣṇa consciousness and be saved from the punishment of the material nature," that is human duty. You cannot say that "I don't want Kṛṣṇa consciousness." If you don't want, then you must suffer. If you want to save yourself from suffering, then you must take to Kṛṣṇa. It is a question of "must." It is not your option. Your option is there. Because you are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, you have got little independence. But if you misuse that independence, then you are punishable. You cannot. Just like everyone has got little independence to violate the laws of the state. You can do that, but that is punishable. So if we take the risk of being punished, then we can violate the laws of nature or laws of God.
So here the same thing is stated, tata enaṁ daṇḍa-pāṇeḥ sakāśaṁ kṛta-kilbiṣam: "He has acted sinfully; therefore he is punishable, and he must be taken to the Yamarāja." Neṣyāmo akṛta-nirveśam. Nirveśam means... Suppose I have committed some sins. I must be arrested. Sometimes a great criminal voluntarily goes to the police and surrenders because he knows, "I will be arrested, and if I surrender immediately, my punishment may be lesser." So you cannot escape the punishment. So punishment... Suppose you have stolen something. You must be punished for six months' imprisonment. That is the law. If you have killed somebody, then you must be killed. You must be hanged. This is the law. So that is called nirviśeṣam, to counteract. If I have stolen some property, then I must suffer imprisonment. This is counteracting, prāyaścitta. If you have infected some disease, then you must suffer for some time from that disease. So akṛta-nirveśam: "So he has not neutralized his sinful activities." Yatra daṇḍena śuddhyati: "Because he has not nullified his sinful activities by atonement or other measures, then he must be punsihed. Then he will be purified."
So punishment is also purification. Purification. Same law: If you infect some disease, then you must get that disease and you must suffer from that disease. That is your punishment.
So punishment is also purification. Purification. Same law: If you infect some disease, then you must get that disease and you must suffer from that disease. That is your punishment. Therefore you should be very much careful not to infect any disease. Similarly, don't infect the material qualities, rajo-guṇa and tamo-guṇa. Remain in sattva-guṇa and try to elevate yourself from sattva-guṇa to transcendental stage, brahma-bhūtaḥ. Then life is successful. Otherwise we shall be repeatedly punished so long we have got the tendency to enjoy material happiness and get another body, one after another. We shall be punishable by the Ya mache piche. It is the Bengali poetry.
So the speeches of the Yamadūta, assistants of Yamarāja, was thus finished, arguments. The argument was that "This man, Ajāmila, born of a brāhmaṇa father, although acquired all qualification... He was qualified brāhmaṇa, not simply born of a brāhmaṇa father, but qualified brāhmaṇa, with full knowledge of Vedic instruction, nice character, very gentle and silent and offering respects to elderly persons, spiritual master, father. In this way he was perfect brāhmaṇa. But due to his contact with a prostitute he lost his all good qualification. And later on, he had to earn money by hook and crook, and thus he degraded more and more, and therefore his sinful activities are now responsible for his punishment, and we shall take him to the court of Yamarāja."
A master is supposed to be the supreme enjoyer of the establishment. But actually nobody is the enjoyer. Kṛṣṇa is the only enjoyer. Bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva-loka-maheśvaram (BG 5.29). He is the proprietor. So when we forget this relationship with Kṛṣṇa, that "I am eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa," then he becomes servant of the senses, or māyā. So by becoming servant of the senses he follows the dictation of the master senses and goes down to the darkest region of illusion and becomes subject to the punishment of Yamarāja. This is the substance.
Why you are forcing me to become Kṛṣṇa conscious? I can do whatever I like. There is no need of your preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness. I am independent. I don't believe in the next life." That is the general statement of the rascals and fools. But the fact is different. If you don't take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then Yamadūtas Then you'll be punished. You cannot avoid. You are completely dependent on Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme, and you are the servant. You have declined to serve Kṛṣṇa; therefore you must be punished. This is the nature's way. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī (BG 7.14). You cannot escape. You can not escape the mundane, man-made laws, but you cannot the God-made laws. That is not possible.
So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement we are pushing on. We have no such distinction. Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu. Not that "They are Europeans. They cannot take to this religion." This is in the andha-kūpa, andha. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās te 'pīśa-tantrya uru-dāmni baddhāḥ (SB 7.5.31). Such class of men are subjected to the punishment by the Yamaduta. Otherwise, paṇḍitaḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). Paṇḍita, they should be equal.
Evaṁ te bhagavad-dūtā yamadūtābhibhāṣitam, upadhārya. They listened to the words of Yamadūta very carefully, upadhārya, not that haphazardously they heard, no. Their reason, their everything, that "This man was like this, and he must be carried to Yamarāja for punishment..." Why punishment? No, to make him purified, it is said. Punishment required. This is nature's law. Just like if you have infected some disease, the punishment is you must suffer for it. The punishment is good. If you have infected some disease, and when you suffer, that means you become purified from the disease. Suffering is not bad, to become purified. Therefore when a devotee suffers, he does not take it illy. He thinks that "I am being purified. I am being purified."
So we should be very careful to stick to Kṛṣṇa consciousness without being agitated or deviated in any circumstances of life. Then we will not be liable to the punishment of Yamadāta. That is the incident happening here. Slightly he became Kṛṣṇa conscious at the end of life and chanted "Nārāyaṇa"—immediately the Viṣṇu, Bhagavad-dūta came: "Oh, he has chanted Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra. That's all right. Let him take back home, back to Godhead."
So the conversation between the Yamadūta and Viṣṇudūta... So this material world is for Yamaduta, and the spiritual world is for Viṣṇudūta. We have discussed all these points. So in the material world, more or less, we are susceptible for being punished by the Yamadūtas or Yamarāja, not all. Who are punishable? They are nondevotees, those who are sinful. So anyone who is not following the principles of religion, they are to be punished, because the human form of life is meant for executing religion. Not the animals.
So if we do not follow religious principle, then we are punishable. You cannot escape. Exactly if you do not follow the state laws, then you are punishable, criminal. Similarly the original law or original controller, the original king is Kṛṣṇa, Viṣṇu. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31).
So about this Ajāmila, these Yamadūtas, they came to take him away to Yamarāja, but the Viṣṇudūtas said, "No. He is not to be taken away. He is now cleansed of all sinful activities. You do not know that; therefore you are not giving him justice." So yatrādaṇḍyeṣv apāpeṣu daṇḍo yair dhriyate vṛthā: "One who is not punishable, if he is punished, that is injustice. So you should not take him away. He is not punishable." Yamarāja is there for punishing the sinful men. So all of them are not sinful. There are many pious men.
So reducing their bodily strength and memory. That is also fact. We cannot memorize very sharply. People are becoming more and more dull. No more very brilliant scholars are coming out, philosophers, mathematicians. And duration of life, everyone knows it is reducing. In India the average duration of life is thirty years. So this will reduce. And dharma, sense of religiosity, that will also reduce and become more and more punishable by the Yamarāja. Yamarāja is there.
Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira, Mahārāja Parīkṣit... Parīkṣit Mahārāja was going on a tour. These Pāṇḍavas, they were the emperor of the whole world. So he saw that a black man was trying to kill a cow. So immediately he took action: "Who is this man trying to kill cow?" So he chastised him, punished him. He was going to kill him, but he saved himself, that "This is my time. I am Kali-yuga. I am the representative. So this is my business, to kill cow. So what can I do?" Then he said that "You better get out. Otherwise I shall kill you." "So where shall I go?" "Now, out of my kingdom." "Then where is not your kingdom? The whole world is your kingdom. Where shall I go? I am also your subject.
We are getting these fruits from earth. We are getting foodstuff from the earth. We are getting minerals from the earth—everything. Sarva-dughāṁ mahī. So nature will supply you sufficiently, provided you follow ideal life. Otherwise nature will punish you. There will be no supply.
These are all described in Śrīmad Bhāgavatam. The nature was not supplying sufficiently, and then Mahārāja Pṛthu, the personified Prithivi, he was going to kill her, punish her. King's business is, if somebody is doing wrong, then the king must punish. So he was prepared to punish Pṛthvī. She submitted that "King, why you are trying to punish me? It is my business when people become demons, I restrict my supply." So this is nature's law.
So people are being misled. Lokas tad anuvartate. He has taken the position of śreyān, big leader, big scholar, and he is decrying Kṛṣṇa. So what people will do? They are helpless. They will give, "Oh, Mr. such and such said it is fiction. Kṛṣṇa is imagination." This is going on. In Vṛndāvana you'll find so many big, big Māyāvādīs. They're explaining that this Kṛṣṇa concept is an imagination, and people are thronged together to hear him, in Vṛndāvana, and what to speak of other places. So this is the position of the world, and they are suffering and they will continue to suffer. Nature will punish them. Yamarāja will take them. That is their next life. So you try to save them. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.
So here it is, the same thing said, that yasyāṅke śira ādhāya lokaḥ svapiti nirvṛtaḥ. The child is sleeping in the womb of the mother, and the mother is killing. Then where to take shelter? Similarly, this example is that "This Ajāmila, he might have committed some sins without knowledge. Now he is no more sinful because he has chanted the holy name of Nārāyaṇa, and he is not to be punished." That is the purpose of the Viṣṇudūta. "So why you are dragging him, trying to take him to Yamarāja to punish him? You do not know that he is innocent.
Now, the question may be... The Viṣṇudūta asked the Yamadūta, "You don't touch him. Don't try to take him away. He is now clean of all sinful reaction. You cannot touch him." Yamadūta is meant for the unclean, sinful men, not for the pious, clean men. Criminal department is meant for the unclean, not for the honest gentlemen. Similarly Yamarāja is meant for punishing the sinful men. So apparently he was sinful man. He did everything. But the Viṣṇudūta came to deliver him.
We have been discussing Ajāmila's upākhyāna after finishing the speeches by the Yamadūta, assistants of Yamarāja, the superintendent of judgment after death. Yamarāja is one of the appointed officers, mahājanas. He's a Vaiṣṇava, but his thankless task is that he has to punish all the sinful activities. That is his position. Just like superintendent of police, he is also a government officer, responsible officer, respectful servant of the government, but the task is simply to chastise the sinful persons. So if such person is required in ordinary government, why not a similar personality in the government of the Supreme Person? Because from the Vedānta-sūtra we understand that everything that we experience within this world, they are emanation from the Absolute Truth. So this intelligence, that one person should be in charge of the criminal department, has come from the Absolute Truth. Otherwise there was no possibility. It is not an human invention. We should always understand, whatever we experience within this world, that is emanation from the Absolute Truth. As Kṛṣṇa says, ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ: (BG 10.8) "I am the original source of everything that you experience."
So the assistants of Yamarāja charged that "This man was throughout his whole life a sinful man. Therefore he is punishable and we must take him to the Yamarāja."
Durvāsā Muni, when he committed offense at the feet of Mahārāja Ambarīṣa. Mahārāja Ambarīṣa was a gṛhastha, a kṣatriya, and king. He had to rule over the kingdom. But because he was devotee, he was very respectful. So Durvāsā Muni, he was a great yogi. He became very much envious of this king, Ambarīṣa Mahārāja, that "He is ordinary gṛhastha, dealing with politics, and I am a great yogi, known all over the universe, and he is more respected than me?" So he wanted to punish him to show him his yogic power. Sometimes the yogis, they get some power and misuse it for personal sense gratification. That is the pitfall of yogic perfection. Aiye. When one gets little power he misuses it and thereby falls down. So this Durvāsā Muni also, what to speak of other paltry yogis, even Durvāsā Muni, he became envious.
His idea was to punish him some way or other. "Give the dog bad name and hang it." This was his policy. So he was to give some bad name. So he became angry that "I am your guest and you have already taken, broken your ekādaśī fasting. So I shall teach you."
So he immediately ordered... He plucked one hair and a great demon came. So Durvāsā Muni made his caricature of yogic power, and Ambarīṣa Mahārāja was a devotee. He did not know anything, such magic. He was pure devotee, that's all. So he could simply stand: "All right. I am faulty. You can punish me."
So sinful activities, it is punishable. You cannot violate the laws of nature. Prakṛti is very strong. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). Just like the government has police department, military department, law courts. Why? Because not all the citizens were good citizens. There are many outlaws. So more or less, whoever is in this material world, they are outlaws. Outlaw means they do not abide by the laws of nature, and therefore they are punishable.
The first punishment is that we have got this material body. This is the first punishment.
Otherwise, he'll be attracted by the modes of ignorance and passion. Etāvatālam agha-nirharaṇāya. Agha means the reaction of sinful activities. Every one of us, anyone who is in this material world, he is sinful. Without being sinful, nobody is here in this material world. If he's not sinful, then he'll be immediately transferred. Yeṣām anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ janānāṁ puṇya-karmaṇām. Immediately transferred to the spiritual world. He has... Just like a person who has finished his criminal punishment, immediately he is released from the prison. Similarly, a person who is freed from the resultant action of sinful activities, he immediately becomes liberated. Therefore anyone who is in this material world engaged in fruitive activities... Not the devotees. That is another mistake. The devotees are also here, but they are always in Vaikuṇṭha. Brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26). So anyway, the general process is that instead of, I mean to say, following the religious rituals for diminishing or getting out of the sinful reaction, one is recommended to accept bhakti-yoga, beginning with the chanting of the holy name of Kṛṣṇa. That is the conclusion.
I do not wish to kill, but we are, having situated, we are, being situated in material condition of life, we are unconsciously killing so many living entities. Therefore, according to the Vedic rites, the injunction is that one has to perform yajñas, sacrifices. And without that sacrifice you'll be liable to be punishment for that unconscious killing of small animals. As such, those who are actually fearful of a sinful reaction of life, they perform yajñas. But here it is said that the mahājanas, the great leaders of religions, without knowing this simple method of getting out of sinful life, they take to so many yajñas prescribed in the Vedas.
I mean to say, "within the jurisdiction of my punishment." It is clearly said, yama-daṇḍa. Those who are devotees, they are out of the jurisdiction of ruling of Yamarāja. It is especially stated here, te me na daṇḍam arhanti: "They are not liable for my punishment. Even they commit some mistake or fall down, or even they commit a very sinister, sinful activity, still, they are not under my jurisdiction." Kṛṣṇa also says in the Bhagavad-gītā, api cet sudurācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). But this concession... There are many other concessions. Kṛṣṇa says that "Anyone who is engaged in devotional service, if unintentionally he commits some mistake and offense, I excuse."
So these are special cases, not that because Kṛṣṇa promises to excuse... Because Kṛṣṇa says that "Even though he has committed such sinful activities, still, he's a sādhu," and although Yamarāja says that "Those who are engaged in devotional service, they are out of my jurisdiction of punishment," so we should not take advantage of this concession.
So simply become Kṛṣṇa devotee, your life is successful. That's all. You are well protected and you are very recognized. Your qualities, your everything becomes all transcendental, immediately. It is so nice. Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām (BG 18.66). "I'll give you." That is... These are things are stated. Tān nopasīdata harer gadayābhiguptān naiṣāṁ vayaṁ na ca vayaḥ prabhavāma daṇḍe. "They are not our candidates and neither we have got any power to punish them. Even he's in wrong, that is not our jurisdiction. That is Kṛṣṇa's jurisdiction. Kṛṣṇa will see to it what to do, even if he's wrong." That is called departmental punishment. That is Kṛṣṇa's departmental punishment. Not outside. "Kṛṣṇa may punish him or excuse him; that is Kṛṣṇa's business, not ours." Therefore a devotee knows, when he's fully surrendered to Kṛṣṇa, if there is some punishment from the side of Kṛṣṇa, they accept it as mercy of Kṛṣṇa. Tat te 'nukampāṁ susamīkṣamāṇaḥ (SB 10.14.8). They have the eyes to see that "This is mercy of Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa has put me into some dangerous position. That is Kṛṣṇa's mercy." And actually it is so. By a little inconvenience, immediately he's rectified.
So you cannot do that. You are not allowed to kill even an ant. Just like in any state suppose one man is useless; he is not doing anything. So you cannot kill. The state will take step. You will have to be hanged. You cannot say that "This man was useless; it has no utility for the society. Therefore I have killed him." No. That is consideration of the human being. That is man-made law. But God-made laws, any living being, if you kill, the same punishment. But that we do not know on account of our uncontrolled senses. Adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisram. We do not know that by killing innocent animals we are going to the darkest region of hellish life. Actually that is happening now, hellish life. The child is in the womb of the mother; it is hellish condition, with stool, urine, it is floating. And there also the life is not safe because at the modern advanced civilization the child is being killed even by the mother. This is going on.
Just like the trees are standing in our compound. They cannot move an inch. Is that very good life? So if I am asked to stand at a place for five minutes, it becomes troublesome. And they are standing for five thousand years. Just see the punishment. So there are so many forms of life. There is no science to understand why there are varieties of life, why this tree standing in front of me in miserable condition and I am sitting in this room very comfortably. It is also a life; I am also a life. Why? Who is arranging for this different status of life? These are to be understood. And everything is there, clear, in the Bhagavad-gītā. If you take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, study Bhagavad-gītā, and then after studying we study Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, then our life is successful. So every father, every state, every guardian, every guru, every, everyone, relative, should educate his dependent in Kṛṣṇa consciousness to give them chance to be liberated from this bondage of miserable condition of material life.
Just like a citizen of a state who has violated the laws. He is also obeying the laws in the prisonhouse, forced: "If you don't obey, then you will be punished." That is called prison life. And if you become obedient to the laws, then you are not outlaws. You are free, out of the walls of the prisonhouse.
Similarly, knowingly or unknowingly, if we do something wrong, we have to be punished. This is the law of nature. There was an instance, one muni, he was brought to Yamarāja's court and he was..., judgment was given that this man should be punished by śūla. Śūla means one iron rod pushed through the rectum and it will pierce through the head. But the man was condemned to death, and this is the punishment. So the, he was a sage, muni. So he asked the Yamarāja that "Throughout my whole life, I never did any wrong. Why you are punishing me in this way?" So Yamarāja replied that "You have forgotten. In your childhood you pierced one ant with a needle. You have forgotten. Therefore you are being punished." So of course, he became..., Yamarāja became Vidura because the sage also punished him, that "For my childhood criminality you are punishing me in this way. So I also punish you, that you have no sense, you have to take birth in a śūdra family." Anyway, either in childhood, or knowingly or unknowingly, if we do something wrong... There are many other instances. Just like some contaminous disease: either a child or a grown-up man, if he infects himself with that contaminous disease, some way or other, the disease will manifest and he has to suffer.
One has taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but on account of immature Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if he falls down, falls down like that, then he gets... Yoga-bhraṣṭaḥ sanjāyate śucīnāṁ. But if one purposefully commits mistake and sinful life, "Now I am chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. I can do all sinful life. It will become counteracted," that rascal will be punished very, very much. Nāmnād balād yasya hi pāpa-buddhiḥ. "I am living in Vṛndāvana. Oh, it is dhāma, so let me do all nonsense. It will be counteracted." They'll be these cats and dogs and monkeys in Vṛndāvana. Dhāmāparādha. Dhāmāparādha. Of course, Vṛndāvana's influence will be there, but at least one life he has to become the hog and dog in Vṛndāvana.
So first twenty years, twenty-five years, or twenty years, because education begins from five years... Up to five years the child is given full liberty—whatever he likes, he may do. Lālayet pañca-varṣāṇi. It is said that you can give liberty to the child only for five years. And tadayet daśa-varṣāṇi. And as soon as he is on the fifth year, you must be very strict on the child, on the boy, so that he may not be spoiled. Very strict. Simply engage him in proper education. Tāḍayet daśa varṣāṇi. And prāpte tu ṣoḍaśe varse. And as soon as he is on the sixteenth year... Ṣoḍaśe means sixteenth year. Prāpte tu ṣoḍaśe varṣe putraṁ mitravad ācaret: the son, the boy should be treated as friend. No more punishment.
Unless there is law-maker, how there can be law? Take for example your state laws. As soon as you say that this is law, "Keep to the right," you have to accept there is a law-maker under whose direction this law is being carried out nicely. If you don't carry out, then you are punished. Similarly, nature's law is not ultimate. There is law-maker, and that law-maker is God. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram: (BG 9.10) "Prakṛti," means nature, "is working under My superintendence, under My superintendence." How you can deny? If there is nature's law, who made this law? You see that the clock is running very nicely, the machine is going on, but that is not the ultimate. There is a maker of the clock or watch. Without understanding the maker, simply if you understand the clock only, that is not sufficient knowledge.
That's all right, but innocence is no excuse of law. If you say that "Somebody misled me to go to the left side" in the court, oh, that does not mean that you will be saved from the fine. So you have to become such intelligent person that you may not be misled by others. You have got the intelligence. Why should you be misled? Then what is the meaning of this human form of life? And you have to be educated. You have to take the opportunity of education so that you may not be misled. Why do you agree to be misled? Then you must agree to take the punishment also. If you, by innocence, put your hand on the fire, so fire will not excuse you. So innocence is no excuse. You have to be learned. Therefore we are here to give proper education to the people.
Pradyumna: (leads chanting, etc.) "Translation: If a person too attached to the duties of family maintenance is unable to control his senses, the core of his heart is immersed in how to accumulate money. Although he knows that one who takes the wealth of others will be punished by the law of the government, and by the laws of Yamarāja after death, he continues cheating others to acquire money."
Prabhupāda:
- vitteṣu nityābhiniviṣṭa-cetā
- vidvāṁś ca doṣaṁ para-vitta-hartuḥ
- pretyeha vāthāpy ajitendriyas tad
- aśānto-kāmo harate kuṭumbī
- (SB 7.6.15)
So, vitteṣu nityābhiniviṣṭa-cetā, if we become too much attached for getting money, that is the material world. There is no satiation. Idaṁ prāpta, that Bhagavad-gītā word: "I have got so much money, now my bank balance is so much, and I shall get further money and my bank balance will be like this." This is the demonic mentality. We shall require money, yāvad artha-prayojanam, whatever is absolutely necessary, that much money I must get. That is order. That is an order. We cannot take more than what is necessary. This is actually spiritual communism. If everyone thinks that "Everything belongs to God and I am son of God, so I have got right to enjoy the property of my Father, but as much as I require, not more than that," this is spiritual communism, bhāgavata communism.
Similarly, we should also learn that Kṛṣṇa has given us this belly, so He has provided also the eatables. That is real philosophy. It is not recommended that you get more than what you require. No. Yāvad artha-prayojanam. Especially for Kṛṣṇa conscious persons. Everyone has got right to claim what is absolutely required. In the Bhāgavata, it is stated if anyone takes more than that, then he's a thief and he's punishable.
The definite example is Ajāmila. Ajāmila separated himself from the Supreme Personality of Godhead by performing many sinful activities and was condemned by Yamarāja to be very severely punished, but because at the time of death he chanted the name of Nārāyaṇa, although he was calling not for the Supreme Lord Nārāyaṇa but for his son named Nārāyaṇa, he was saved from the hands of Yamarāja. Therefore, pleasing Nārāyaṇa does not require as much endeavor as pleasing one's family, community and nation. We have seen important political leaders killed for a slight discrepancy in their behavior. Therefore pleasing one's society, family, community and nation is extremely difficult. Pleasing Nārāyaṇa, however, is not at all difficult; it is very easy.
They could not pacify Hmm, and saṁrambhaṁ sudurāsadam. Sudurāsadam, very, very difficult. Once we are condemned by Kṛṣṇa, it is very, very difficult to rise up again. Mūḍhā janmani janmani (BG 16.20). Life after life we shall be condemned. That is our punishment. So don't do anything which will make Kṛṣṇa unhappy. Simply engage yourself in the service of the Lord. Very simple thing. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). Simply always think of Him. Do not think anyone, anything else. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam (CC Madhya 19.170). Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam (Brs. 1.1.11). Just try to maintain your service for Kṛṣṇa. There is twenty-four hours' engagement, and try to follow it. Do not neglect it. That will make your life successful.
Pradyumna: Śrīla Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura has sung in his prema-bhakti-candrikā, 'krodha' bhakta-dveṣi jane: anger should be used to punish a demon who is envious of devotees. Kāma, krodha, lobha, moha, mada and mātsarya—lust, anger, greed, illusion, pride and envy—all have their proper use for the Supreme Personality of Godhead and His devotee. A devotee of the Lord cannot tolerate blasphemy of the Lord or His other devotees, and the Lord also cannot tolerate blasphemy of a devotee. Thus Lord Nṛsiṁha-deva was so very angry that the great demigods like Lord Brahmā and Lord Śiva and even the goddess of fortune, who is the Lord's constant companion, could not pacify Him, even after offering prayers of glorification and praise. No one was able to pacify the Lord in His anger, but because the Lord was willing to exhibit His affection for Prahlāda Mahārāja, all the demigods and the others present before the Lord pushed Prahlāda Mahārāja forward to pacify Him.
Prabhupāda: So, in the material world, kāma, krodha, lobha, moha, mada, and mātsarya, these things are condemned. And for a sādhana, (?) means a neophyte devotee, he is advised to give up these low grade habits—kāma, krodha, lobha, moha, mada, mātsarya. But people may question, "Wherefrom these lowgrade qualities came? Kāma is low grade, admitted, but wherefrom it came?" In the Vedānta-sūtra we get the reply, janmādy asya yataḥ: (SB 1.1.1) "Everything that we experience, it comes from God." So... (aside:) You stand that side. You are standing. They can stand.
So Brahmā, Lord Brahmā, he is supposed to be the first living being within this universe. Lakṣmī became afraid; Brahmā also became very afraid. Therefore Brahmā requested Prahlāda Mahārāja that "You go forward, my dear son, and appease the Lord. You can do because for you He has appeared in this fierceful feature. Your father offended Him in so many ways by teasing you, by punishing you, by putting you into difficulty. Therefore He has appeared in very angry. So you can appease Him. We cannot. It is not possible."
Vaiṣṇava aparādha is a great offense. You know Ambarīṣa Mahārāja. He was a devotee, and he Durvāsā, he was very proud of his yogic power, and he committed offense at the feet of Ambarīṣa Mahārāja, and he was punished by Kṛṣṇa by sending the sudarśana-cakra. And he wanted help from so many, Brahmā, Viṣṇu. He could go directly to the Viṣṇuloka, but he was not pardoned. He had to come to Vaiṣṇava, Ambarīṣa Mahārāja, fall down at his lotus feet. And he, of course, Vaiṣṇava, immediately excused him. So Vaiṣṇava aparādha is great offense, hātī-mātā. So we should be very careful about Vaiṣṇava aparādha. We should not Arcye viṣṇu śilā-dhīr guruṣu nara-matir vaiṣṇava-jāti-buddhiḥ. The vaiṣṇava-jāti-buddhiḥ is also another offense, great offense.
She is Vaiṣṇavī. She is great devotee of Kṛṣṇa. But she has accepted a thankless task, to punish. The policeman is a sincere government servant, but he has accepted a task, nobody likes him. (laughs) If some policeman comes here, immediately you shall feel disturbed. But he is the sincere servant of government. That is the position of Māyā. Her business is to punish these rascals who have come to enjoy here. (laughter) You see? But she is a sincere servant of God.
It is a post, thankless post. Nobody thanks, everyone derides, you see. But she is a great devotee. She tolerates and punishes. That's all. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). She only wants to see that "You become Kṛṣṇa conscious, I leave you, that's all." Police business is that "You become law-abiding citizen; then I have no connection with you." So far. "And so long you are not a law-abiding (citizen), I shall kick you as much as possible." So Māyā's business is like this. And we are complaining, "Why you are kicking? Why you are kicking?" "Yes, I shall kick you because you are not Kṛṣṇa conscious. I shall make you Kṛṣṇa conscious by kicking, kicking, kicking. That's all. That is my business." Our business is to implore, tṛṇād api sunīcena. Our preaching method is not kicking. Our preaching method is, dante nidhāya tṛṇakam, by taking a grass in the teeth, padayor nipatya, falling down on the feet, and kāku-śataṁ kṛtvā ca ahaṁ bravīmi, and flattering you hundred times, I'm just submitting one thing: "Become Kṛṣṇa conscious." That is our process. And Māyā, his process different. (S)he'll say, "Why you shall become Kṛṣṇa conscious? You just enjoy and I shall kick you very nicely. That's all." And he accepts, "Yes, you kick me and let me enjoy, but I am not going to these Kṛṣṇa conscious persons." (laughter) You see? Practically, Māyā's business, our business is same, but her process is different, our process is different. The people like her process.
And especially His devotee, Prahlāda Mahārāja, was being tortured. Kṛṣṇa appeared as Lord Buddha because people tortured these ordinary animals. Sadaya-hṛdaya-darśita-paśu-ghātam. We pray in that keśava dhṛta-buddha-śarīra. The meaning is that He appeared as Lord Buddha, being compassionate on the animals, who were being tortured by the human being. Of course, there is law to punish them, but sometimes the Lord becomes very much tortured Himself when His sons, or may be animals, they are tortured. Otherwise, how He is father of everyone? You see.
The high-court judge has simply given the judgment that "He should be hanged. He has committed murder. He should be hanged." Therefore your commitment, you committed murder, that you caused your hanging, not that high-court judge is your enemy, and he is giving you order to be hanged. You are the cause of your hanging. Similarly, God is impartial. He can give the judgment that "This man has committed this offense. He should be punished like this." These are common reasons.
Yes. So they are first-class yogis. Even they are... Just like Prahlāda Mahārāja. He was first-class yogi because he was always thinking of Kṛṣṇa, Nārāyaṇa, and he was not afraid of his father's punishment, chastisement.
So Prahlāda Mahārāja analyzes that "These things cannot help you." If you think that "I am very rich man. I can purchase God..." Generally they think so, that by riches one can purchase God. Then dhana abhijana. Abhijana means aristocratic family, big connection with big, big men.
That is your dharma. Jīvera svarūpa haya nitya kṛṣṇa dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109). If you don't serve Kṛṣṇa, then you are immediately culprit, immediately punishable. That is going on. Māyā is engaged to punish.
- kṛṣṇa bhuliya jīva bhoga vāñchā kare
- pāsate māyā tāre jāpaṭiyā dhāre
As soon as. As soon as one tries to become independent without serving Kṛṣṇa, that means he is in māyā. He's in māyā. Immediately māyā is there. Just like as soon as you become a criminal, a thief, immediately you are under the jurisdiction of the police, immediately, without the... You may hide yourself for time being, but immediately you have become criminal. Similarly, as soon as one is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he's immediately a criminal, punishable.
So this is the test. This is the test, that as soon as one is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, immediately he comes to the group of sinful activities, rascaldom, lowest of the mankind, māyayāpahṛta-jñānā, all knowledge taken away, and he's an asura, Hiraṇyakaśipu's family, Hiraṇyakaśipu's category. So this is not optional, that "If I don't take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that is my wish, my desire." No. If you desire in that way then you'll be punished. You become immediately... You cannot say, "It is my optional. I may become a thief; I may remain honest. That is my option." No. As soon as you become thief, you are punishable. Similarly, anyone who is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he's immediately punishable. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). The punishment will go on in various ways. That is going on. Ei rūpe brahmāṇḍa bhramite kono bhāgyavān jīva (CC Madhya 19.151). The punishment... This is punishment. That is presented by Kṛṣṇa. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). This duḥkha, janma-mṛtyu, repeatedly to take birth and die, this is punishment.
One day he went to collect some flowers and some wood from the forest for his father's worship. His father was worshiping Deity, and he was helping. On the path he saw that one śūdra and his wife, without any shame, they were embracing and kissing. This young boy became attracted. Therefore this system, that loving exchange or affairs should not be exhibited on the street. This is not very civilized form. In India it is not at all allowed. It is calculated indecent. There is punishment by law.
That is also stated in the Sixteenth... Tan ahaṁ dviṣataḥ krūrān kṣipāmy ajasram andha-yoniṣu: (BG 16.19) "Those who are envious, asuric, demons, I put them in such abominable life that they'll never be able to understand Me." That is the greatest punishment. For a living being, if he forgets God, Kṛṣṇa, in any condition of life, it is the greatest punishment. They're thinking that "We are happy without this nonsense God consciousness, Kṛṣṇa consciousness." They are the most condemned, most condemned.
Several times I have given you this example: especially Lord Jesus Christ, he was not fearful. When he was punished to be crucified, he never cared for it. So these are... There are many examples in the history, in the scriptures, that those who are Kṛṣṇa conscious or God conscious, they are not fearful. Prahlāda Mahārāja himself. He was five-years-old boy, and his father was teasing him, "Oh, you cannot become Kṛṣṇa conscious. Who is Kṛṣṇa?" Atheistic: "You cannot do that. It is my order." He several times pleaded, "My dear father, why you are talking like this? You are also servant of Kṛṣṇa." So he never cared for it. Ultimately he wanted to kill his five-years-old boy, and Lord Nṛsiṁha-deva appeared. And this prayer is in connection with that.
So the asuras, the atheists, are just like vṛścika and sarpa, scorpion. Without any reason they occupy somebody's country, somebody's place, and kill somebody. This is going on. In the Manu-saṁhitā it is stated that when a king hangs some murderer it is a great favor to him. It is a great favor to him. In every country, in every civilization, the punishment is "Life for life." If you have killed somebody, then you shall be killed.
But I have no fault, but you are biting me. The vṛścika, scorpion, and snake, they do that, without any offense. A man is passing, an animal is passing—unnecessarily it bites, without offense. A man is sleeping—it bites. Therefore they are very dangerous. Similarly, there are men also like the snake—without any fault, they bite, without any fault. If I do something faulty, you can punish me, bite. But without any fault, if you bite me... So therefore Cāṇakya Paṇḍita says, sarpaḥ krūraḥ-khalaḥ krūraḥ sarpāt krūrataraḥ khalaḥ. Such person is called khala, envious, jealous.
One is potency; another is potent. That is the difference, potent and potency. So "Such Ramā, the goddess of fortune, she also could not get this compassionate mercy or causeless mercy." So he's feeling proud that "You are so affectionate to Your devotee." Therefore Lord's name is bhakta-vatsala. He can offer to His bhakta any position, more than Himself. Just like Mother Yaśodā. She is bhakta, and Lord has given her the position for punishing Him. Mother Yaśodā is threatening Kṛṣṇa that "Kṛṣṇa, You were very naughty. Now I shall bind You." So Kṛṣṇa, out of being afraid, was crying. So Kṛṣṇa has given the position to the bhakta that "You chastise Me. I'll accept it." This is bhakta's position. This is Kṛṣṇa's causeless mercy. He can do that.
So He has delivered: "All right, take this facility." But what is the advantage of this facility? The facility is... You know. The tigers, they do not get food every day. He has got the facility to suck blood, but... All the implements he has got, but there is no chance. Because every animal knows, "In that part of the forest there is tiger," they do not go, so he starves. He starves. You'll find so many rich men, they have got enough money, but they cannot eat more. They cannot eat more.
So this kind of facilities, it is our foolishness. It is not facility. That is punishment. Real facility is how to serve Kṛṣṇa. That is real facility. So we should always ask, beg. That is the Caitanya Mahāprabhu's instruction.
The Māyāvādī philosopher cannot understand this. They think that anyone who comes in this material world, he falls under the influence of māyā. That is right for the small living entities, as we are. That is not correct for the Supreme. Therefore they misunderstand Kṛṣṇa in His activities, especially when He dances with the gopīs. Therefore a neophyte person should not try to understand Kṛṣṇa's dancing with the gopīs immediately, because they do not know Kṛṣṇa. So here if we do something against the moral principles, we are liable to be punished.
Therefore you see the whole world, they are sometimes fighting as enemies, and sometimes they are trying to make the United Nation. You see practically. Sometimes vaira, enemies, and sometimes maitram, friend. But this is all illusion. They will never become friendly. It is not possible. This contradiction will continue, sva-para-vairam, and create situation—"You suffer; I suffer. I snatch your ears and you snatch my ears," that's all. You have seen the punishment between the two boys? So we shall create this enmity and so-called friendship and then suffering. This is going on.
There is no doubt about it. But does it mean if one has got very good and rich and able father and mother one can be happy, the children can be happy? No. That is not so. Bālasya neha śaraṇaṁ pitarau nṛsiṁha. That is also Prahlāda Mahārāja's statement, that "Simply because there is kind father and mother, therefore the children will be happy? No. That is not possible." So actually, if the child is destined to suffer, the good father-mother cannot give him shelter. That is not possible. Suppose one is condemned by the court to be punished, capital punishment, to be hanged. The father-mother may be very big man or rich man. If he pleads in the court, "Sir, whatever you want, I'll give. Kindly do not condemn my son to be hanged," that cannot be checked. This is not possible. Nobody can show favor against the will of the Supreme.
These five items, according to Manu-saṁhitā, or Hindu law, they have no offense. They have no offense. They cannot be criminally prosecuted. Excused. If a brāhmaṇa has committed some fault or a woman has committed some fault or a child has committed some fault or a cow has transgressed the law, oh, there is no punishment for them. Dayā. They should be shown always mercy. They require protection, especially. These five items have been especially enjoined that they should be given protection. That is required in human civilization. Cow protection is very important. Woman's protection is very important. Brāhmaṇa's protection is very important. Children's protection is very important. Of course, nowadays there is protection for children, of course, from the state. But that is also artificial. There is killing process also.
| Page Title: | Punishment (Lectures, SB cantos 6 - 12) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, Mayapur |
| Created: | 11 of May, 2011 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=181, Con=0, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 181 |