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Punishment (Conv. 1976 - 1977)

Expressions researched:
"punish" |"punishable" |"punished" |"punisher" |"punishes" |"punishing" |"punishment" |"punishments"

Conversations and Morning Walks

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 6, 1976, Nellore:

Prabhupāda: Now, the laws and legislative assembly there are, and there is punishment, there is court—everything there is. That we were discussing last night, that where is the honest men? Why? In spite of laws, legislative assembly, court and everything, the wholesale rogues and dishonest. Then what is the use of this? What is your answer? Why you are checked on the airport just like a culprit, criminal? They cannot trust even a gentleman, although he is educated, may be holding very good office, but still, he is not to be trusted. So this is the result of your so-called function, that there is no honest man throughout the whole world. Then, what is the use of such education? And what is the use of their living? Let them die. No hospital for them.

Room Conversation -- January 16, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Ah. Moghāśā mogha-karmaṇo mogha-jñāna-vicetasaḥ (BG 9.12). (break) .... Kṛṣṇa says simple thing, "You surrender unto Me. You'll get all protection." "No, no. That is not possible. I must do according to my own whims. Why shall I surrender?" "All right, go on. I'll give you facility for executing your whims. You'll get it. You do. Try your..." This is going on. Kṛṣṇa is giving good advice. He'll not accept it. So Kṛṣṇa is so kind, "All right, you do in your own way. I shall give you all facility." This is going.... That facility is māyā, his mind and māyā. He is desiring. That mind is also given by māyā, so that he can punish him very severely. So māyā has given us mind: "Now you go on desiring. After desiring, desiring, I will give you facility."

Hariśauri: Mind is an agent of punishment.

Prabhupāda: Yes, this material mind. You see a madman. He is also acting in his mind. The mind is polluted; he is acting differently. Mind is there, but it is covered by some infection. Therefore a madman is thinking this way, that way, this way, that way. That's all.

Morning Walk -- February 5, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Without varṇāśrama-dharma there is no civilization. Yes. They are trying to abolish this under the name of "caste system." It is not caste system. Caste system, or whatever you call, there must be these four division. Not four, eight. This is general, that brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. Then, according to the brahminical culture, the spiritual, brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. And after sannyāsa, then spiritual life, complete, śuddha-sattva. Hare Kṛṣṇa. So you have to establish varṇāśrama. Varṇāśramācāra. Ācāra. Ācāra. Varṇāśrama ācāra. Yes. Because the aim is... Again we come to the... Just like state affairs going on, but ultimate aim is to keep the government satisfied. Then you'll get everything nicely. Similarly, the supreme government or supreme governor is God. That is your duty, to keep Him satisfied. Then you get all direction, all facilities and life. That is the aim. But these rascals, they do not know what is government or who is the governor. They are doing anything whimsically, and they're punished.

Morning Walk -- February 26, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: ...no more desire of material enjoyment he is fit for sannyāsa. Anyone who sees: "Oh, this car is very nice. This beautiful wife is very... A very beautiful woman is very nice," he should not think of taking sannyāsa. Viṣa-bhakṣaṇād apy asādhu: "Such desires is most abominable, more than taking poison." To commit suicide by taking poison is most abominable thing, because he's going to be a ghost. He'll be punished to become a ghost, those who commit suicide. Or, if one is suddenly killed and he has so many desires, he becomes ghost. Therefore viṣa-bhakṣaṇa, taking poison, and die untimely, is most abominable, or commit suicide. By the material law also, to attempt to commit suicide is criminal.

Morning Walk -- February 29, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Apples and that strawberry. In Russia, I have seen only strawberry. That's all. No fruit..., no other fruit. Fruit means strawberry. These rascals do not see that they are being punished by nature.

Morning Walk -- March 11, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: His instance was that even an associate of Caitanya Mahāprabhu can fall down. And if one falls down, his punishment is that, suicide. There is no other punishment. He must commit suicide. This is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's instruc.... Otherwise he is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's personal servant. He cannot fall down. But Caitanya Mahāprabhu showed this instance that "Even one is My personal servant, he can fall down." And if anyone by any cause he falls down, his punishment is he must commit suicide. This is instruction.

Morning Walk -- March 11, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is another thing. Caitanya Mahāprabhu personally taught this. To be victimized by māyā is possi.... There is possibility.... Just like Jaya and Vijaya. They were gatekeepers in the Vaikuṇṭha. They also fell down, Hiraṇyakaśipu. So this falldown, there is possibility in any moment because we are very small. We can be captivated by māyā at any moment. Therefore we shall be very, very careful. And if you fall down, then punishment is you make suicide. That's all. Then next life we shall see.

Satsvarūpa: But Śrīla Prabhupāda, in The Nectar of Devotion it says devotional service is so pure that there's no prāyaścitta necessary. Just again engage in your service.

Prabhupāda: Yes. This is not prāyaścitta. This is exemplary punishment. He was not liable to be punished, but they played that "This is the.... This should be done."

Morning Walk -- March 14, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: (break) "...beg. They help you. You are keeping Kṛṣṇa's money; you'll be punished. So return it to Kṛṣṇa; you'll be happy."

Morning Walk -- March 14, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: No, no, future means, just like.... This is the law of nature, that if you steal, you'll be punished. So if I say, "Oh, you are stealing; you'll be punished," this is future. Suppose this is the month of March, and if I say, "In the month of July there will be rain." So I know; you know; everyone knows. This is not a future telling. The natural sequence is everyone knows it.

Morning Walk -- March 17, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: This is the punishment, yes. Punishment there is always. But they are so stubborn fools still.

Dharmādhyakṣa: Prabhupāda, the one great brain researcher, he spent nineteen years searching for the memory in the brain.

Prabhupāda: There is a story that two friends talking that, on the point that "How this was cut, separated?" So one friend said, "It is by knife." And the other friend said, "No, it was by scissor." So they went on.... One said, "No! It is knife." He said, "No! It is scissor." So the knife man was very strong. So he took him to the water, that "You say it is knife. Otherwise I shall drown you." (laughter) So he said, "I'll never say." Then he said.... When he was drowning, he was doing like this, (Prabhupāda gesticulates) (laughter) "Scissor, scissor." When he was actually drowned and he had no other means to say, then he was doing like this: "It is scissor. It is scissor." This is their argument. However punished they may be, they'll do this. (laughter)

Morning Walk -- March 17, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: No. It was.... It was punishment. He became so much, I mean, attached with the animal that he forgot his duty in devotional service. That is stated. Forgot. He neglected. Therefore he was punished, but he remembered that "I did it." You cannot neglect your duty. Then Kṛṣṇa is always with you. (break) ...way, a soldier is dying in duty, immediately the government takes charge of the whole family. So that is.... Why not Kṛṣṇa? (break) ...kṛṣṇa viśvāsa pālana. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura has said. You know this song? Avaśya rakṣibe kṛṣṇa viśvāsa pālana.

Morning Walk -- March 19, 1976, Mayapura:

Pañca-draviḍa: What was the Vedic punishment if somebody broke these moral principles?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Pañca-draviḍa: What would be the punishment in a Vedic society if somebody...

Prabhupāda: Oh. Picture, Fifth Canto. You see the description of the hell.

Pañca-draviḍa: Hell. But I mean, within the society itself, there was punishment there also from the king?

Prabhupāda: Everyone who will commit sinful activities will be punished. That is nature's law. Exactly like that: If you infect some disease, you must suffer from that disease. The nature's law is so strict, and it is going on. It doesn't require any supervision. The supervisions are already made so perfect. You infect this disease: you suffer from it. That's all.

Morning Walk -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Activities? These activities are going on. The sun is rising by the will of God; the moon is rising, will of God. You are being punished by the will of God. He is the Supreme.

Cyavana: But they described that people were worshiping and that children were being born...

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Cyavana: Children were being born according to God's will.

Prabhupāda: Yes...

Cyavana: It's described in certain parts of...

Prabhupāda: Children will be born.... If you are.... If the child is sinful, then it will go to the womb of a mother who will kill him. That's all. By the will. By the.... That he should be punished. One who has used contraceptive and abortion method, by the will of God he will enter another mother, and the mother will kill him.

Morning Walk -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: No, it is God consciousness if you understand it, that "I am now being punished by the will of God. I have done sinful activities." That is God conscious.

Guru dāsa: God gives what everyone wants.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guru dāsa: If they desire that, they get that.

Prabhupāda: You wanted this punishment; therefore you get it.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: People are thinking that the punishment is something worse than this, that "This is very nice. We can live here and be happy, and the punishment is in hell.

Morning Walk -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: That.... No, no. That is the nature of the living being, that he is happy by nature because he is part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ (Bs. 5.1). So ānanda is nature, but he is finding, trying to find out nature in sinful life. Therefore he is being punished. That he does not know.

Morning Walk -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: And as soon as there is sickness, that means punishment. So if you want to be punished, then violate the hygienic laws. You can see that there is hospital and medical treatment and medicine—for whom?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Sick people.

Morning Walk -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Cheating. Cheating Kṛṣṇa. Cheating Kṛṣṇa is no business. That is to be punished. You cannot cheat Kṛṣṇa. But if by accident, knowingly or unknowingly you have done something which is not good, that is excused. Sva-pāda-mūlaṁ bhajataḥ priyasya. If you are actually, because you have given so much service to Kṛṣṇa, you have become very dear to Him, so unknowingly you have done, committed sin—excused. Bhajataḥ priyasya. This word is used. You must have to become very dear to Him. Then if you accidentally commit some sin, that is excused.

Morning Walk -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: "This or this." But he knows that "If I do it, I shall be punished."

Conversation with News Reporters -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: We say that not only in India, everyone, you'll starve, because you are rebellious to God consciousness. You must starve. That is the punishment. Just like anyone who is a criminal, he must be punished. That is the law of nature.

Conversation with News Reporters -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Eh? No, no, that is wrong. Every suffering is brought by you, yourself. Just like if you are punished by the high-court judge to be hanged, you don't make the high-court judge is the cause of your hanging. You made a situation; the high-court judge has given you the judgment that you must be hanged.

Morning Walk -- April 8, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Hah, yes. Everyone is trying to get more, and nature's order is that you take only to maintain your body and soul together. That's all. If you take more, then you are thief, you'll be punished by the laws of nature. This is going on. Laws of nature are so fine that by material activities you'll never be satisfied, and at the time of death, he'll lament that "I could not satisfy my desires. Let me take..." "All right, take another body. Satisfy." This is nature's punishment. Karmaṇā daiva netreṇa jantur dehopapattaye (SB 3.31.1). Simple things. We desire, and nature will give you another body. māyā-yantrārūḍhāni. He'll give you, "Ride on this car, you wanted, on this body." And this... This is creation of māyā. Īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe... (BG 18.61). Kṛṣṇa is there, orders māyā, "He wants to enjoy life. Give him this body." "Come on, here is a hog's body, eat nicely, stool. Come on." He did not like to eat prasādam. He wanted something rubbish. "All right, come here. Take this stool." These things are going automatically. The same way, as you infect some disease, immediately the disease is there. You haven't got to manufacture diseases. Because you have infected yourself with the disease germ, "Take this disease." Therefore it is warned, anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam (Brs. 1.1.11), "Don't desire anything except Kṛṣṇa's service." Then you are immune. Otherwise you have to take birth. The Māyāvādī philosophers, they take the Absolute Truth void, so they have no good desires, again they come to material desires.

Morning Walk -- April 13, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: I have seen Gandhi's prayer meeting, and I attended. Utmost, five minutes reading Bhagavad-gītā, then again politics immediately. Immediately politics. I was in Delhi. I attended the meeting when Nawa Khalia (Noakhali?) fast. So this was his prayer. I have seen. And as a result of this, in that prayer meeting he was killed. (Hindi) So nature punishment are there. (Hindi) The last stage of Kali-yuga means you die.

Room Conversation -- April 20, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: And if you spend for your benefit, that is material. Where is the difficulty to understand? Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1), ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ (BG 10.8), bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasām (BG 5.29). Repeatedly says. Kṛṣṇa is the supreme proprietor. So when everything is used for the fulfillment of the will of the proprietor, that is proper use. Otherwise improper use. Just like we have given several times this example, "Keep to the right," "Keep to the left." So you are driving your car. The will is, government will is, "Keep to the right." As soon as you keep to the left, immediately you are criminal. You cannot put this argument, "What is the wrong? I am driving." "No, because you have violated my will, therefore you are..." The government will see. That is criminal. So everything.... Bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasā... He is the proprietor. He is the enjoyer. So because you have enjoyed without His permission, therefore you become criminal. You are punishable. Bhuñjate te tv aghaṁ pāpam. You'll see this verse.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: He enters another body. Suppose if by force I get you out of this room, then you enter another room. That's all. But this is illegal, that you are living in this room.... By force if I get you out, that is illegal. Then I have to await for the punishment, "Why you have driven out this?" So similarly, although soul is immortal, but taking the soul is immortal, you cannot cut anyone's throat. He has got a right to live in that body for some time by the ordained order of the Supreme. I cannot get you out by force. That is sinful. By nature's way, when he gives up this body, that's all right. But I cannot force the soul to go out of this body by killing. That is sinful.

Morning Walk -- April 24, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Sinful activities, duṣkṛtinaḥ. Vikarma. Therefore they will be punished in different forms of life. Therefore we find so many species of life, forms of life. This is punishment. But māyā's curtain, they are thinking, "We are happy." Just like this tree is a punishment, but it has no sense that this is punishment.

Guru-kṛpā: Thinks he's happy.

Prabhupāda: Standing happily for five thousand years.

Guru-kṛpā: Drinking only water.

Prabhupāda: If you are asked to stand here for five hours, you'll feel most uncomfortable. But they are standing for five thousand years, no uncomfortable. This is punishment. Punishment is there, but unaware. So everyone is like that. Anyone in the material world, they are being punished in different degree, but unaware. That is māyā's grace, that although he is punished, he cannot understand.

Morning Walk -- April 24, 1976, Melbourne:

Devotee (2): How can we make them understand they're being punished?

Prabhupāda: You can understand, provided you have got the sense. If you are nonsense, you cannot understand. You cannot understand means you are nonsense. That is the difference between sense and nonsense. That I have already given, the example: the same whip, to the animal it is not suffering, but for a man, simply by seeing it is suffering. It is the question of sense. That is the difference between man and animal. The animal cannot understand that he is suffering. Man can understand. That is difference. If you do not understand, then you are animal. Now, here it is clearly said, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). This is unhappiness. And if you think, "Oh, what is there, unhappiness in dying?" then you are animal. The animal are taken to the slaughterhouse. He is not disturbed. He is eating grass very peacefully. That is the animal life. If you do not understand what is unhappiness, then you are animal. You are not human being. But his unhappiness, that's a fact, to remain in a airtight bag for ten months. If you have no sense, "Oh, what is this?" And still being killed, is it not unhappiness? And if you say, "Where is unhappiness?" then you are a stone. The Bhagavad-gītā says, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi. Janma is unhappiness. First of all you have to remain ten months in a packed-up bag and that also risk your mother will kill you, and still you say, "It is not unhappiness"? Then what is happiness? You are so dull that you see there is no unhappiness in birth. Practically see.

Morning Walk -- April 24, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Yes. You are big cheaters. You don't cheat two rupees, three rupees. Two millions. (laughs) That is accusation, Alexander and the thief. The thief accused Alexander the Great that "What is the difference between you and me? I am a small thief; you are a big thief. That's all. Why you are punishing me? You are a big thief. You are doing same thing." Then he was let loose. "Yes, what is difference? (laughs) I am a big thief." (break) ...means Alexander the Great, actually he was great. Otherwise he is the emperor, and ordinary thief is accusing him and he said, "Yes, I am thief." He admitted. That is greatness. That is greatness. If he was not great, then he would have hanged him or punished him: "Oh, you are so.... You are accusing me?" But no, he accepted. That is greatness. Mistake is one fault, but to accept that "I have done mistake," that is greatness.

Room Conversation -- May 3, 1976, Fiji:

Hari-śauri: Yes. So sinful means punishment. (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Our point is that we are going to live in the future. So if, becoming modern, we forget our future, then what is the use of becoming modernized? Better remain primitive. The business is that in future also we shall exist. If we do not know how we shall exist—either I shall exist as a cat, as a dog, or a tree, or a demigod, or as associate of Kṛṣṇa.... If I do not know.... On account of being modernized, if I remain in darkness about my future, so it is better to remain primitive. What is the use of becoming modernized and forget myself and my future? Becoming modernized, if I become dog in future, so what is the use of modernized? The real business is that I shall take care of my future. Especially in the human form of body. Cats and dogs, they do not know about future.

Room Conversation with Siddha-svarupa -- May 3, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: "So now you have to pay the balance. We did not carry the money, took a check, and immediately pay, now you have detained it. So you give me in writing why you are not paying. Then we shall take steps. We should not be punished." Sometimes they take advantage, "Oh, he is servant(?) class, he must be fool number one." (chuckles) They think it. (break) ...no loss or commission.

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1976, Honolulu:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: (break) ...Śrīla Prabhupāda, is that the scientists have been proven guilty. Now we have to decide what their punishment should be.

Prabhupāda: Nature will punish them. (break)

Devotee (1): ...kind of programs should we develop to defeat the scientists? Just like we distribute books in the street. A lot of times the scientists may not get some of these books.

Prabhupāda: Defeat is that "You are scientist. I don't want death. Please stop it." Ask him. "I don't want disease. Please stop it. Then you are scientist. Otherwise I kick on your face."

Room Conversation -- Honolulu, May 20, 1976 :

Prabhupāda: The gopīs got the information that Kṛṣṇa is coming from Dvārakā, so from Vṛndāvana they went to see Him. And when Kṛṣṇa and Rādhārāṇī met, that Rādhārāṇī lamented that Kṛṣṇa—He was the same Kṛṣṇa and the same Rādhārāṇī—so "this is not a good meeting place. So, if You come to Vṛndāvana, then I shall be happy." So it is inviting Kṛṣṇa to Vṛndāvana. That is the feeling of Caitanya Mahāprabhu, Ratha-yātrā. He is inviting Kṛṣṇa to Vṛndāvana. So in Jagannātha Purī still the same feelings are there. Kṛṣṇa, Jagannātha, from the temple goes to Guṇḍicā. So, Lakṣmī is angry that "Kṛṣṇa is leaving me, He has gone to Vṛndāvana." So she was, she is punishing. That is called Herā-pañcamī. Punishing the servants of Kṛṣṇa. The maidservants of Lakṣmī chastising them, threatened them, "Why without permission?" So they, out of very fearful condition, offering their respect to Lakṣmī, "Mother, you don't be sorry (indistinct), we are (indistinct)." So this, this is the play performed, and Caitanya Mahāprabhu associates they saw, and they enjoyed very much when the maidservant of Lakṣmī was slapping the servant of Viṣṇu. That is mentioned Caitanya-caritāmṛta. All the servants arrested, brought before Lakṣmī, and they are punished. But they came to invite Kṛṣṇa, Rādhārāṇī and other gopīs. And actually they do not go at that time. But this Ratha-yātrā ceremony means Kṛṣṇa is coming from Dvārakā to Kurukṣetra. This is the history of Ratha-yātrā.

Morning Walk -- May 26, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: When it is law, you believe or not believe, rascal, it will be effective, if it is a law. You believe, I don't believe, if I commit theft I'll not be punished. So what is your belief? As soon as you commit theft, you'll be punished. You believe or not believe. That is law. What is the value of your belief? Rascal may believe that "I'm not going to be old man. I shall remain young man." Believe or not believe, must become old man. What is the value of your belief? Trust no future. You believe or not believe, there is future. What is value of your belief? Where do you.... You have complete control? Here the law is "Keep to the right." You don't believe. Now "Why shall I keep to the right? I shall go to the left." Immediately you'll be punished. You have to believe. I'll do wrong way, see the result. Immediately there's ticket. So what is the value of your belief? The law is law. Ignorance is no excuse for law. You have committed something wrong, and in the court you're going to be punished. If you say the clerk, "Sir, I did not know that by committing this act how I shall be, I will have to be punished." That is not excuse. Your ignorance they do not believe; you must go. That is the law. It is called foolishness.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Then with these greedy, rascal, rogue, then how you can be happy? Ha? Needs to be punished only.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Disease already there. Old age is already there. That means God is there. They're being punished, but they are so shameless they'll not accept the truth. Same thing. The (indistinct), they're being punished every moment, every step, "No, God is not there." All right. Wait a few years more, God will show either you are dead or He's dead. (laughing)

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Nature will punish them. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). Nature is Lord's (indistinct) maintainer, he's observing, factually. (indistinct)

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Excuse me. Just like, say, America takes up this idea, that God is the Supreme Father and...

Prabhupāda: Therefore I say (indistinct) God in trust.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: We trust. Justice. Don't trust blindly. Try to understand what is God. That I am... Later on, I have not received any reply.

Morning Walk -- May 28, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Rascal, this weakness..., you are already necessity of so many things. Make all the necessities zero. At last we at least feel necessity of a woman. (laughing) That you cannot avoid. And then you'll be punished with shoes. (laughing) When you'll become a servant of woman, then you, "No, what is the necessity?" Become thief, you'll become rascal, rogue, you'll be beaten by shoes, and everything is gone. Now these are your necessities. Hippies, they have left no necessities, but the woman is there. (laughing) They have necessities there. Nature is so powerful you'll have to feel this necessity, and with this necessity you'll require so many necessities. (Sanskrit) They're talking like madmen. What the madman does not talk, and what the goat does not eat? (laughing) Means rascals.

Morning Walk -- May 29, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: This is their punishment. They are being punished, but if you think that "I am punished," they will die. You must take it "I'm enjoying." This is māyā's energy. They are being punished, but punishment they are taking as enjoyment. Illusion. The conditioned soul is illusioned. This is illusion. He is being punished, and he's thinking "I am enjoying." That is a concession. When he's punished, he may not be woke up with the unhappiness. Therefore he's thinking "I'm enjoying." Actually he's being punished.

Morning Walk -- May 29, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Just like a criminal is put into the prison house for being punished, he will say, "Just see, I am living happily. I haven't got to work. I'm getting my food." (laughing) Such shameless. He does not know that "I am put here for suffering." But he's thinking "I'm so living happily.... I haven't got to work. Other men, they're going to the office, to the factory. I'm eating." (laughing) He forgets actually he's put into the prison house to suffer. He doesn't come to his senses. Therefore again when he's released, again he comes. He thinks that it is.... In Bengal they call social beggars (indistinct) Social beggars (indistinct) just like son-in-law goes to father-in-law's, and he's well received. So they think that prison house is social beggar (indistinct), another in-law's house.

Morning Walk -- May 29, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: They're going to become fish. Now they are being trained up how to become fish. So after this body is finished, they'll take a body of fish. When one becomes fish he doesn't know that this is punishment. He says that it is very nice. Concession by māyā, that he's put into suffering, but he'll think that "I am enjoying." This is mercy of māyā. (break)...anesthetic in surgical operation. Surgical operation, that is suffering, but if you apply some anesthetic, you do not perceive. It is like that.

Morning Walk -- May 30, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Obligation we must follow. That I have already said, that you have obligation to the state, you must pay tax. Otherwise you are criminal. So obligation must be there. If somebody is giving you protection, you must be obliged. If you don't feel obliged, then you'll be punished.

Morning Walk -- May 30, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Stena eva sa ucyate (BG 3.12). In Bhāgavata it is written that everything belongs to God. You take whatever is your necessity. You take more, then you'll be punished. This is Bhāgavata's statement. So now the business is to become capitalist. He's taking more, holding the whole stock, at least in India. It is not coming to the market, and people are starving. So they will be punished. (break) ...also. The excess grain they are throwing it into the sea. So they'll be punished. They are also waiting, (Sanskrit). (break) ...spiritual communism. Don't take more. Just like the natural birds, if you keep one bag of rice here, he'll come, but they will take three, four grains, and they'll go away. And if you ask a man, "Here is some stack of rice." "Ah, I'll take." Immediately finished. One man will take it the whole stack, everything. "Oh, I've got it free. Let me take it." But the birds, they're under natural law. They know, "Ah, I have finished. I have got my belly filled up. I don't require any more." So God has given everything sufficiently. If every man takes whatever he wants absolutely, then there is no difficulty. That is your complication. But why there should be fight? Father's property of every son. He take as much as he requires. Accept father, his property, and take as much as you require. Don't take more. That is real communism. So where is that communism? Who has it? The material nature, the mother, and God is the father. And we are all children. That's all. Plain truth. (break) ...accept this philosophy?

Morning Walk -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: What will the.... That will depend on.... And the result He knows. Just as a lawyer knows that he has done this, criminal, he'll be punished like this. So His position to know the future is always there. Either in this condition or other condition.

Morning Walk -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No, no, machine we are, but still there is independence. That means you are not absolutely independently, relatively. The state, you say we are American-independent. But that does not mean you can do whatever you like. As soon as you misuse, you are arrested, punished. Even the president is not independent. As soon as he misused his power, drag him, "Come out." What to speak of you.

Morning Walk -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes, māyā must keep you, must keep you, must keep you because you are not surrendering fully.

Rāmeśvara: Then he says that "As long as I have all these material urges, I cannot control them. The māyā is insurmountable."

Prabhupāda: No. Māyā is not.... What māyā is? Punishing, that's all.

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Candanācārya: Śrīla Prabhupāda, you once said that if someone is not attracted to chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, that he is being punished by Yamarāja.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Āpana karama bhuñjāye śamana kahaye locana dāsa.

Dānavīr: Śrīla Prabhupāda, sometimes when we're preaching to people that we don't eat meat, fish or egg, they say,"Why not eggs? They're not actually living. It's just a, it hasn't been fertilized."

Prabhupāda: Then that's a rascal. You explain it, explain to him that why they cannot make an egg by chemical composition and give for fermentation and a chicken may come. Why do they not do that? Why they are taking eggs from hens? Why do they not chemically manufacture egg?

Bharadvāja: Must have life.

Prabhupāda: That is rascaldom. If that is a fact, that there is no life, then you prepare egg. What is there? Some white chemicals. A little yellow. You can do it.

Garden Conversation -- June 9, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That you might have forgotten. Because your nature is to forget, you cannot immediately remember what you are doing exactly this time yesterday. That is your... You have forgotten, but suppose you, without any knowledge, you do something criminal. So you must be punished. You may not know. You cannot say in the court that "I did not know by committing this act I'll be punished." So you know or not know. You have done it; you must be punished. You may not know what you have done, but that does not mean you can avoid punishment.

Arnold Weiss: I understand that. It sounds reasonable to me. When we do this act for which we are punished, is it done in this life or done in some prior life?

Prabhupāda: This life or prior life, because you are eternal. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). You are eternal.

Garden Conversation -- June 9, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Illusion is another punishment. We wanted to forget God, and God's illusory energy is giving him facility to forget God. This is called illusory energy.

Morning Walk -- June 9, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is sinful. As soon as you irresponsible, you are sinful. (break) ...soon as you forget the simple truth that you are servant of God, you are irresponsible. Now your suffering begins. (break) ...kṛṣṇa-bahirmukha hañā bhoga vāñchā kare, nikaṭa-stha māyā tāre jāpaṭiyā dhare (Prema-vivarta). Just like as citizen of your state, you have to abide by the laws of the state. As soon as you disobey, you are irresponsible. That's all. You suffer. Good citizen means who abides by the laws of the state. And as soon as you break it, immediately you are irresponsible and you must be punished.

Magazine Interview -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Interested or not interested. Child is not interested for education. But it is the duty of the father to make him educated, sometimes punish him. So a child may be foolish, but how the parents can be foolish? It is not that because the human society is not interested, this should be stopped.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is also another punishment, voluntary.

Hari-śauri: Everybody's doing tapasya, but for their own cause.

Prabhupāda: Hm? Yes. Ugra-karma, ferocious activities.

Room Conversation -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Factually, these rascals are creating magic jugglery. Even during the time of Kṛṣṇa such rascals were there. Pauṇḍraka. So Kṛṣṇa was present, He immediately cut off his head. (laughs) They should be immediately cut off their head, rascals. Yes. That is the only punishment for them. What another news you told me?

Room Conversation -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: Endeavor. Yes. So these things are like that. Not sober. Dhīras tatra na muhyati (BG 2.13). They are not sober. Adhīra. Therefore they meet with so many accidents. You also. As soon as we're in the car, he wants to drive at a hundred miles speed.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: I think it was token punishment, but I'm sorry if you were in the car.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) What is the use? You are not going to serve anyone that we have to go high speed. We can go comfortably.

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: The atheist will suffer. Just like anyone who is outlaw, does not believe in the government's law, he'll suffer. If somebody says, "I don't care for government laws," then he'll suffer. Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate (BG 3.27). He's a rascal. He may say so, like madman, that "I don't care for government and government laws," but naturally he'll be punished. He'll be put into jail and suffer. That he cannot check. He may, with empty words, he can say "I don't care for government," but does it mean that he can escape the government laws? That is not possible. Government will see that "Here is a lunatic rascal. Put him into the jail," that's all. Is it not? Is it not practical?

Devotee (1): He can say also that "What is the difference? You are also..., you have to farm..."

Prabhupāda: That is another thing, you and me, but we are talking of government laws. Whether you'll be punished, I'll be punished, that is different thing. Anyone will be punished. There is no question, "I" and "you." It is not that I am very favorite and you are not favorite. Anyone who will violate the government's laws will be punished. Who can deny it? It is not the question of "I" and "you." Anyone. How you can become independent of the laws? That is not possible. You have to accept God.

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: This is transmigration. As soon as the situation... He is to accept a dog's body. Now a dog is having sex, and the mixture of the two secretions creates a favorable situation, and the living entity is there, and he gets a dog's body. This is the truth. He is destined to get a dog's body. So he's taking the opportunity that "Here is a suitable... " Nature is bringing him. If here it is refused, then he'll go to another place. Therefore contraceptive method is sinful, going against the law of... The situation is created for getting the body by another living entity, but he is transgressing. Then he'll be punished. So many subtle things are there.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: But India, they have given up the real religious system, sanātana-dharma, or varṇāśrama-dharma. Fictitiously, they have accepted a hodgepodge thing which is called Hinduism. Therefore there is trouble. Everywhere, but India especially, they are... Vedic religion... Vedic religion means varṇāśrama-dharma. That is... Kṛṣṇa says, God says, cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭam (BG 4.13). So that is, what is called, obligatory. Just like law is obligatory. You cannot say that "I don't take this law." No. You have to take it if you want to have a happy. You cannot become outlaw. Then you'll not be happy. You'll be punished. So God says mayā sṛṣṭam. "It is given by Me." So how we can deny it? And that is religion. Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). Dharmam means the order given by the God. The God says that cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). "For the proper management of the human society, there should be these four divisions, social divisions." So you have to take it.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:
Prabhupāda: So tapasya means to follow the regulative principles strictly by the higher order and that is human life. And animal life means you can do whatever you like. They keep to the right, keep to the left, it doesn't matter. But their offense is not taken because they are animals. But a human being, if he does not follow the regulative principles, it is sinful. He'll be punished. The same principle. Just like when there is red light, if you do not stop, you'll be punished. But a cat and dog, if he transgresses, "Never mind red light, I shall go," he's not punished. So tapasya is meant for the human being. He must do it if he wants at all progress of life. That is essential.
Garden Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Formerly in the currency, when you go to take some exchange, it was the etiquette of the teller to ask you, "What you want, silver money, gold money or paper money?" It was their duty. If you say "I want gold money," they will pay in gold money. Not only it is written in the paper, "I promise to pay," but the promise was kept. If he wants, "Give me payment in gold," they will pay. And now, to keep gold, hoarding gold, is illegal. So you cannot ask. This is going on, legalized cheating. You have to accept this paper money. That's all. Don't ask for gold. And there is no honesty at all. I can take paper money for my convenience sake, but how you can force me to take paper money? That is not honesty. So dishonesty begins from the government. You cannot keep gold. If you have kept gold, there will be searching, and if it is found that you have gold, you'll be punished.

Garden Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: We are practically seeing it, that material nature... Some infection, this is also material nature, and if you are infected with some contaminous disease, you must suffer. They practically see it. The nature will work. Puruṣaḥ prakṛti-sthaḥ. As soon as we are in this material world... I am living entity, spirit soul, and because I am in this material world, I have accepted this material body under the regulation of the material laws. Otherwise why there are so many varieties of life? Here is a tree. It is standing here. We are human beings; we are also here. But when there is cold blast, scorching heat, we can go into the room, but he has to be standing here for thousands of years. Why this distinction? It cannot move even an inch. It is also living entity. Why he is punished in that way? And when there will be snowfall, pinching cold, he cannot go. But a small ant, it can go from here to there.

Garden Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: There are so many varieties of life, so we have to accept one of them by Kṛṣṇa's desire, Kṛṣṇa's arrangement. Kṛṣṇa says, īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe 'rjuna tiṣṭhati (BG 18.61). He is situated in everyone's heart. He's observing everything. So He orders that "Give him a body like this." Who can check it? Bhrāmayan sarva-bhūtāni yantrārūḍhāni māyayā (BG 18.61). This body is a machine. The machine is given by material nature. Today you may be a very big man, and by your activities, asuric activities, you are so condemned that you have to accept a lower-grade life, a fox, sly fox. "You are very sly to spend others' money in moon excursion. Now you become a fox." So who can check it? Here it is stated, tān ahaṁ dviṣataḥ krūrān (BG 16.19). So you cannot check it. You are not so great scientist. Then how do you say, "There is no God"? You cannot check God's law, so how you can say that there is no God? You can say at your home, "I don't care for government." And when government arrests you and puts you in difficulty, how can you check it? Is it possible? Then why do you submit that? When the police comes and arrests you, you can say, "No, no, I don't care for any officer." You cannot say. Is this not punishment? This tree is standing here for hundreds of years, and it will go on standing for thousands of years. Is it not punishment? So what the atheist will answer, this? Kṛṣṇa says, "I'll put him into this condition."

Room Conversation After Film -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: This is very simple. You see everything, white and yellow. Produce. Chemicals are white. Some chemicals are yellow also. Just like hydroform(?). It is yellow. And soda bicarb, white, or potash cyanide is white. So you have got so many chemicals, combine and pack it in a cell, and put underneath the incubator. Why rascal do not do this? Beat them with shoes. "Rascal, you are cheating in this way." Beat them with shoes. That's all. That is the only punishment.

Hari-śauri: Yeah, that's too good.

Prabhupāda: Hundreds of men demand them, that "Do it, otherwise don't talk nonsense. If you talk nonsense, then we will beat you with all our shoes." Then they'll stop all this nonsense talk. There is no punishment for their cheating and taking money.

Interview with Mike Darby -- June 30, 1976, Wheeling, W. Virginia:

Prabhupāda: Yes. We are coming from Detroit? There are so many factories for four-wheel vehicles, and there is no factory to educate man to the right path. Perhaps... This is our little attempt, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, how to educate to the right path. We are not getting any help, either from the authority... In our own way, as far as possible, we are doing. When people will be educated they will be able to understand who is guru, who is not guru. We can say, but who is going to accept? We say always that they are all rascals, but who will accept our statement? And the state, (if) there had been a department to see what is the qualification of guru, then immediately they would have taken steps. Just like in Kṛṣṇa's time one man falsely presented himself as God. Immediately his head was cut off. Pauṇḍraka. So the state must be very strong to punish the miscreant. But there is no such state.

Interview with Mike Darby -- June 30, 1976, Wheeling, W. Virginia:

Prabhupāda: So it is the duty of the Christians. But they are also... What can I say? They are passing resolution according to the time, changing the instruction of Bible. How they can be fixed-up? Our standard is Bhagavad-gītā As It Is. We accept guru as representative of Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. If he speaks what Kṛṣṇa has spoken, then he is guru. Similar in Christianity, if they actually take care that whether one is speaking according to the Ten Commandments, if he is living according to the rules and regulations of the Ten Commandments, then he is guru. Why people accept them? Because they are ignorant, they do not know who is real and who is fake. But the standard is there. Take for example in the Bible, it is said "Thou shalt not kill." But everyone is killing. Killing is the business of the Christians. They are maintaining big, big slaughterhouse. We are maintaining cows here, and there are others, they are maintaining cows for slaughtering. Why? In these Commandments it is clearly said that "Thou shalt not kill." How they will detect? If they are violating themselves the laws, how they will punish the lawbreaker? "Physician, heal thyself." The physician himself is diseased, and he's going to treat other patients.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: That is also Vedic conception, that sex between man and woman is not the cause of life. Unless the living soul comes in the proper situation, the man's secretion, woman's secretion combined together emulsifies, and it creates a proper situation for the rest of the soul. So contraceptive method means that emulsification is disturbed. It does not create the proper situation; therefore pregnancy does not happen. Or imperfect discharge. The main point is that the two discharges, they create a situation wherein the living entity comes and rests. Then it will grow. Not that that is the cause of life. The mixture of two secretions is not the cause of life. That creates a proper situation, and the life comes. And if the situation is not favorable, the soul cannot stay. It has to go to somewhere else. So by the order of Kṛṣṇa, he was to come to take shelter there, but this man and woman checked it, therefore it is sinful; he is to be punished. Just like one apartment is fixed up for me, and if somebody checks, does not allow me to enter, that is criminal. That is criminal, he is to be punished. Unlawful detention. But they do not know the laws of nature, how it is working. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). The law of nature is working very silently, subtle. But they do not know. Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate (BG 3.27). Rascal is so fool that he thinks that "I can do everything, whatever I like." Similarly, killing of animal. "Life is eternal," one can argue, "then what is wrong? Even I kill, the soul is alive." No, the same argument that this soul was to live in a particular type of body under the laws of nature, and you have checked, and he has to take again a similar body to fulfill the duration. Therefore you have done criminality. I have got lease for live in this room for certain period. If prior to the expiry of the lease, if the landlord drives me away, that is illegal. He will be punished.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Everything is on that principle, that you (are) violating the laws of nature, therefore you are criminal, you have to be punished. You cannot do it. Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: The life comes from the man. The living entity takes shelter of the semina, and the semina is discharged in the womb of the woman, and if the situation is favorable, then the living entity remains there and that body develops. This is pregnancy. And that yoni, that mother, is situated, selected by daiva-netreṇa, by superior management: "This man has worked..., this living entity has worked in such a way, he should go to such and such womb." Then if he goes to a queen's womb he becomes a prince; if he goes to the dog's womb he becomes a dog. The mother gives the body. And the superior's order is there, "Now you must go to the dog's womb. He must go to the queen's womb." Otherwise, how it is from the birth one is prince, another is dog, if there is no superior? Who likes to become a dog? No. But according to his karma, by superior arrangement, he has to take. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu (BG 13.22). He has infected the contamination of material modes of nature, and he must develop a type of body according to that consciousness. Just like if you contaminate some disease, germ, then you must suffer from that disease. This is the mystery of birth. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu. Otherwise, why there are difference of varieties of life? Sat, asat, something good, something bad. That he does not know. He works independently, defies the laws of nature, and becomes implicated. And on account of dull brain, he is punished, "Stand up here for ten thousands of years. Become a tree," that's all.

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:
Prabhupāda: :(BG 7.15)

So asuric life is very dangerous, and it is punishable. This is the position. So we should not become asuric. With all material opulences, just like in the Rāmāyaṇa, Rāvaṇa was called asura. He was materially very advanced. He made his capital made of gold, he was so advanced materially. But he did not care for Rāma, therefore he is called asura, rākṣasa. He was son of a brāhmaṇa, but he did not care for the Supreme Personality of Godhead. He was a learned scholar, materially very intelligent, there was airplane, everything, but he did not care for Rāma, or the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Therefore he is described as asura. So asuras are divided into four classes-duṣkṛtina, mūḍha, narādhama, and māyayāpahṛta-jñāna.

Comments on Bhagavad-gita Play -- July 12, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: ...of this human being, people do not know how they are kept in ignorance. And because we are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, out of His causeless mercy He comes to deliver us from this ignorance. Unfortunately, they are so much engrossed by the illusory energy, they do not take advantage of the instruction of Kṛṣṇa. So therefore this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is being propagated that these dull-headed mūḍha—they are being described as mūḍha, dull-headed; they do not know actual interest of life. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). These dull-headed conditioned souls, they do not know their real self-interest, being influenced by māyā. Māyā is also Kṛṣṇa's energy, so it is her duty to punish the conditioned soul because they have decided to forget Kṛṣṇa. Still, Kṛṣṇa is so merciful, He comes personally, He authorizes His devotees, servants, to enlighten these conditioned souls.

Interview with Newsweek -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Criminals should be punished.

Interviewer: Punished?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Interviewer: How so?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How seriously should they be punished?

Prabhupāda: That you have to consult śāstra. There is direction. It is... Practically it is the same. Just like Manu-saṁhitā, it says that if one is a murderer then he should be killed. Life for life. He should be hanged. That is the old system. The king used to kill a murderer. So that is almost the same punishment.

Interview with Newsweek -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: No, there is no such direct punishment, but it is prohibited. It is prohibited.

Rāmeśvara: There is no direct punishment, but it is prohibited. Part of education and social convention, it is prohibited. Not that the government allows propaganda to be made for illicit sex.

Prabhupāda: The other words, the woman who is chaste, she is very much glorified.

Interview with Religious Editor Of the Associated Press -- July 16, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: At least he must know that "This hammering is my punishment." He knows that "This hammering is not by business, it is my punishment." That is knowledge, that is knowledge. When a prisoner understands that "This hammering business is not my real business, it is my punishment."

Interview with Trans-India Magazine -- July 17, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: They do not know what is progress. That I was talking with your Associated Press, press reporter. Just like they do not know that their material life means they are in the prison house for being punished. They are so dull headed they are taking the activities of punishment as regular life. A man is put into the prison house, and his engagement is breaking the bricks. So he has forgotten that "This breaking of bricks is not my business. I am meant for living freely outside the prison house." So these people, less intelligent people, they think that this material life of working hard day and night, just like the hogs and dogs, is general life.

Conversation at House of Ksirodakasayi dasa -- July 25, 1976, London:
Prabhupāda: The fact is we are completely dependent on the laws of material nature. Even if you defy a little bit, immediately you'll be punished. That is the strict laws of nature. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). So we do not understand. There is no education throughout the whole world how we are being controlled by the material nature and why we are being controlled. Why we are put into this position of being controlled? These questions should be raised. That is human life.
Conversation with George Harrison -- July 26, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: That is the punishment for this age. It is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. There will be scarcity of rain and there will be scarcity of food and heavy taxation by government. And people will become mad on account of these three things. Anāvṛṣṭi, durbhikṣa, karopī.(?)

George Harrison: It's getting dryer in England each year. It's probably going to end up as a desert in another hundred years.

Prabhupāda: They expect like that?

George Harrison: Well, I don't know. I think the whole world's changing. Somebody said it's the pollution, leaves so much..., there's so much of the oceans now with polluted and with oil on the top, there's not so much evaporation anymore.

Prabhupāda: Not in the ocean. It is the sinful activities of the populace. That is real problem. They are all engaged in sinful activities. Especially this innocent animal killing. These are the all reaction.

Radio Interview -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: There is no question of believe. Don't bring this question-belief. It is law. Just like there is government, you believe or not believe, who cares for you? That is government. Similarly, you believe or not believe, there is God. If you don't believe in God and do independently whatever you like, then you'll be punishable.

Radio Interview -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: This is religion. This is religion. So this religion is applicable to everyone, any human being. Why do you bring Christian or Hindu or Muslim, or...? Everyone has to accept that. That is real religion. And this is not religion, "We believe there is no soul of the animal." That is not religion. That is most unscientific. That is not religion. Religion means scientific understanding of the supreme controller. So now if you accept the supreme controller, then if you violate something, you must be punished. Immediately you have to accept. As soon as you accept there is supreme controller, so immediately as you violate the laws of the supreme controller, immediately you are punished. That is nature's law.

Radio Interview -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: You are punished. You are being punished in this way. Actually, I saw in New York, big, big building, they are breaking, again, another skyscraper. "No, I have business. Breaking the bricks," that's all. They think this is very good business. Once constructed, again break it. As child, children, they make a sand house and break it again. This is the occupation.

Radio Interview -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is religion. If you have to accept the supreme authority, then as soon as you violate you are punishable. Very common sense.

Hari-śauri: It's because they're so conditioned by this man-made religion. They think that the scriptures they read is something that's made up.

Prabhupāda: Therefore they change.

Radio Interview -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes. They have made it difficult. Accept the supreme controller, everything is clear. Accept the father, everything is clear. There is mother, there is children, no father. How rascal they have made. How it can be? No experience, and still they will persist, "No father." Can you show me the father? What is nonsense, if you do not see the father, it does not mean that there is no father? Father must be there. You may not have seen, that is different thing. And you can see the father because the father is maintaining the family order. Therefore there is father. From this simple analogy. Just like father gives money in the hand of the mother and she maintains the children comforts. Similarly, whatever comforts we are getting, from the nature's gift, you say that is arrangement of the father. Mayādhyakṣena prakṛtiḥ sūyate sacarācaram (BG 9.10). Clearly said. Father gives order, "Nature, do this way, do this way. He's disobeying, then punish him like this, that's all. Don't give him anything. Punish him." Just like nature is not supplying water. The order of Kṛṣṇa, "Let them suffer for some time." This is going on. You cannot check it, father's order. Common sense. How they can deny the supreme father? Dull-headed fools. Mūḍha. Any fruits you have got?

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- August 9, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Yes, to steal God's property is certainly intelligence. Very good intelligence. They must suffer. Must be punished. For this intelligence they must be punished. (men talking in background) So if they want to hear, these men...?

Hari-śauri: Their idea is that God may have made everything, but now it's for us to divide up and enjoy between us.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Hari-śauri: God may have made everything, but now He has no connection with it now.

Prabhupāda: Why? He has made and He has no connection? What is this rascal theory? He has made everything and He has no connection.

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- August 9, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: No. Therefore you are rascal. Everything is done by somebody. Suppose if you organize one business. That is for your enjoyment. God has created anything, that is for His enjoyment. But you are sons of God, you can enjoy the property of the father as far as you require. Not more than, you cannot take more than that. Then other sons will claim and there will be fight. You live. You are son of God, you live at the expense of God. God has sufficient supply. But don't try to take more and stock. That is folly. You eat, you live very nicely. There is no prohibition. But you cannot take more than what you require. This is Bhāgavata communism. If you take more, you'll be punished. (break) ...our philosophy, Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Evening Darsan -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: You have got independence to misuse your independence. That independence you have got. You have been given intelligence. Now you have got, because you have got intelligence, little independence, you can misuse that. Just like you are all my secretaries. So I give you some independence. You can misuse it. So that misuse is wrong. Then you'll become unhappy. Kṛṣṇa says that sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). Says. He doesn't force you—you must do it. You do it. That means independence. Now it is your choice. You have got independence of misusing it. So independence is a quality inherent in living beings, because he's part and parcel of God. The quality of the father is inherited by the son, even physically. Similarly, you have..., God is fully independent, you have got little touch of independence. Now that independence is properly utilized when you carry out the order of God. That is proper. Ordinarily, every country is independent. Does it mean that he is cent percent independent? No. Then why there is police department? Similarly, we are part and parcel of God. We have got little independence. But if we misuse it, then we shall be punished. So there is no question of independence. Independence, little. That is interdependence, not independence. Why they declare independence? That is their foolishness.

Evening Darsan -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: You can go. It is your punishment. The material body... If one thinks in the prison house, "How one can live without prison house?" That is his misconception. Generally, one is expected to live outside the prison. But because that person is in the prison house since a long time, he cannot think that without prison house one can live; that is misconception. He has no idea of spiritual life, therefore he's thinking like that. Real business is how to get out of the prison. But he's thinking just the opposite way, that "If I do not remain in the prison, how can I eat?" A thief is thinking that "I'm living here very comfortably, without stealing. I'm getting food and shelter, and if I go outside I have to steal again." So it is good life? That is due to ignorance. There is very good life without the prison house. That he does not know. He does not know that there is a spiritual world where a spirit soul can live very comfortably, meeting God every day, talking with Him, dancing with Him. That he has no idea.

Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Yes, God has given you enjoyment, but you cannot enjoy yourself, alone. There are other sons, they will also enjoy. If you interfere with other sons, then you'll be punished. God's son is the lamb, and you let him enjoy, you also enjoy. But if you interfere with his right, then you'll be punished. That is God's law. Sarva-yoniṣu, God is not only your father, he's father of the lamb also. So if by your brute force you want to kill the poor lamb, then you'll be punished. This is natural. You have got your food, you produce your foodgrain and you eat. Why should you eat another animal? God says that annād bhavanti bhūtāni (BG 3.14), you must eat to become strong. But that does not mean you'll eat another brother. Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā (ISO 1), whatever He has designated, you eat like that. You are human being, you can produce food. You grow foodstuffs, rice, wheat, fruit, flowers, vegetables. That is allowed. Annād bhavanti bhūtāni, you produce anna, why should you kill an animal? And offer it to Kṛṣṇa, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam (BG 9.26). He never says that "You give Me an animal." Patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam. So you produce patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalam, and offer to Kṛṣṇa, and then take.

Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:
Prabhupāda: Similarly, God's duty is that. That everyone is God's son, you don't encroach upon other son's right, then you'll be punished. You have got right to live and the lamb has got right to live. Why should you encroach upon his living right? Because you are strong. That is not humanity. The animal is therefore benefit. Let him live and you take the fur. You can use it for your coat, but why should you kill it? The cow is giving milk like mother, why should you kill it? This is humanity, to kill the mother? So in this way we are encroaching the rights of others, and we are becoming subject to be punished by God. This is going on. You may say there is no God, but God is there, you'll be punished. The outlaw they will say, "We don't care for government." You may say so, but government will take action. You cannot avoid it. This is humanity. Good citizenship means one who knows the laws of the state, that is good citizen. If one does not know the laws of the state, he's a fool. He's not a good citizen. One who knows the law, he keeps right and left, he knows this is the order of the government, cars should be driven on the right side or left side. He is good citizen. One who does not know the law of the state, he's not a good citizen. He's a fool, rascal. What to speak of humanity.
Room Conversation -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because God is equal to everyone. He sees that these rascal asuras are misguided, so He sends His representative, He comes Himself, there is śāstras, guidance, and everything. The whole propaganda is how these rascal asuras can be turned into devatā. This is equality in the eyes of God. Very simple thing. Just like government puts a person into prison house. The idea is to correct him. Not that government is enemy of a class of men, they are put into the prison house. Government is equal. But there is department of punishing this... (aside:) (indistinct) Government is equal to everyone, but there is this department of reformation which is called jail department. He's punished so that he may come to his senses that "I have done wrong." But unfortunately there are stubborn criminals, they are not corrected. They go and again come, go and again come. One term finished, another term. One term finished... That is transmigration. One term finished, punishment, and another term begins. He creates another term. So that is daiva netreṇa. That is superior arrangement. Now this rascal has finished his human form of life, now again he has committed so many sins, let him become a dog. Again comes to the human form of life, again one chance is given. This not good, but he does not accept, so again he becomes a tree-stand up for ten thousand years. Nothing is a chance. Everything is under supreme control. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). But he is a rascal. He simply defies and suffers. One man is being slapped with shoes, so he is shameless, he says, "Oh, you have beaten me with shoes. All right, if you touch my wife, I'll sue you." Then the wife is beaten with shoes, then he says, "Oh, you have beaten my wife. All right, touch my son, I will sue you." In this way every member is being beaten with shoes, and he is simply challenging that "I'll sue, I'll sue." This is going on. He's punished one after another, but still he is so shameless that still he defies the authority. That is called asura. They're not very intelligent. "Next time I will see. Wait millions of years, I shall see..." So we have to deal with asuras. This is the position.

Room Conversation -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Huh? Yes. That is devotee. Because God wants it that these rascals may be turned into sane man. That is God's plan. Otherwise why does He comes? Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata (BG 4.7). Huh? Paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām (BG 4.8)—two class, sādhu and duṣkṛtinaḥ. So to punish these duṣkṛtinaḥ there is reformation. That is not God's enemy, reformation. As the father gives slap to rogue child, that is also kindness. So these two processes are going on, paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām.

Morning Walk -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Faith means that you are meant for giving some service to Kṛṣṇa. You should stick to that service, that path, in spite of all impediments. That is the passing of test. Generally, just like we are meant for preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So there may be severe test, but still we shall remain determined. That is wanted. There may be so many impediments, punishment, still you should do that. That is wanted. That is test. Not that as soon as there is some difficulty I give it up. There may be severe test, but still we shall not give it up. We must go on. That is determination.

Morning Walk -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that Kṛṣṇa's solves. Yes, Kṛṣṇa says annād bhavanti bhūtāni: (BG 3.14) produce food grains. You have to work because it is material world. You cannot sit idly. Even if you are a very strong tiger, you don't expect that animals will come and enter your mouth. You have to work for it. This is the world. Na hi suptasya siṁhasya praviśanti mukhe mṛgāḥ. Suppose a lion... He's the king of the forest. And if he says, "It is my order, I'll sleep here and all the animals may come in my mouth." The animals will urine on his face. "Yes, we shall pass urine on your face. We are not going to accept your order." You have to work. Practical, everyone has to work. This is the third nature. Avidyā karma-saṅga. Because here everyone is under ignorance, the punishment is he has to work for his living condition. Work is not very pleasing. It is very troublesome.

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: He is to be punished. His misusing. Suppose in our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement somebody gives us money. He is giving good faith that "It is very good organization." But if I misspend that money, then I am responsible. Then I'll be punished. His business is finished. Kṛṣṇa noted that he has given his hard-earned money for spreading Kṛṣṇa consciousness. If I take that money... Instead of doing Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if I use it for my sense gratification, then I'll be... Then I'll be responsible. What is the use of Kṛṣṇa's money being used in industry? Any purpose outside Kṛṣṇa consciousness... Let this money be utilized for spreading the glories of Kṛṣṇa. But they do not recognize Kṛṣṇa. All the so-called Bhagavad-gītā readers, they want to kill Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation -- August 21, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: It was a very good place. This Prabhākāra helped me. Ninety percent was... But if I did not leave, nobody could drive me, that was a fact. But I thought "Who is going to..., for litigation? She is the governor's wife, and she is pressing through collectors, through..." The manager who was in charge, he had some cinema house. So they had to renew the license, cinema house. And the collector pressed him that "Unless you arrange for this house, we are not going to renew your license." I thought, "Unnecessarily this man will be in trouble. I'll have to pay so many rupees, and she is governor's wife." And that lady came to me in Bombay several times. "You take my press. You have got so many publications." So I said "I can take your press. I have got money. But what shall I do with it? It is letter press. Now printing is done by offset." That press, Associated Press, is very good press. It was... They got so many government contracts. The whole telephone guides were printed there. But because it is letterset press, it is costly. The government got offset press, cheaper price. So that contract was cancelled. So for her nefarious activity she is punished.

Conversation with Seven Ministers of Andhra Pradesh -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad:
Prabhupāda: So at the present moment, our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is that it doesn't matter what kind of state it is, but it should follow the principle of yajña. Yajñārthe karmaṇa. Otherwise, we shall be responsible. Just like, for example, a military man, what is his business? His business is killing. So by the government order he is killing, and the more number of enemies he kills, he gets medal, reward. But the same man, if he kills one man, he'll be hanged—for his own sense gratification. He cannot argue that "In the military camp I have killed so many men and I was rewarded, and now I have killed one man and I am going to be hanged. Why?" The question may be raised. No foolish man will raise the question. That means that killing is under the superior order, and this killing is for your sense gratification. So if you do anything for our sense gratification then it will be stena eva sa ucyate (BG 3.12). He is punishable.
Morning Walk -- August 23, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Food, that is punishment. It is not the... Famine is punishment from the side of nature. She'll not supply to the rākṣasas. That is a punishment. Otherwise, there is no question of population. You may have as many... Just like the birds and beasts. They do not care for... They have got enough food. But they do not violate the laws of the nature.

Morning Walk -- August 23, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: They'll suffer. They'll suffer. Those who are killing the children, they will be killed. They will enter into the mother's womb and they will be killed. They'll be punished. Tit for tat. That they do not know. This way or that way?

Indian man: This way. This way.

Prabhupāda: These rascals, they have no education about this law of nature. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). They're acting very independently. But ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate (BG 3.27). Rascals, ahaṅkāra, vimūḍhātmā. They are rascals. They'll be punished. Just like a thief defies the laws of government, but they are punished.

Meeting with Endowments Commissioner -- August 24, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: No. That one verse is that one does not... Kṛṣṇa's mission is that "Surrender unto Me." Now who does not surrender to Kṛṣṇa? That is stated by Kṛṣṇa.

na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ
prapadyante narādhamāḥ
māyayāpahṛta-jñānā
āsuraṁ bhāvam āśritāḥ
(BG 7.15)

Anyone who does not surrender to Kṛṣṇa, he must be grouped either duṣkṛtina, mūḍha, narādhama, māyayāpahṛta-jñāna, āsuraṁ bhāvam. We do that. Anyone who does not surrender to Kṛṣṇa, he must be grouped among them. And for them, what is their... Tān ahaṁ dviṣataḥ krūrān kṣipāmy ajasram. Find out this verse, tān ahaṁ dviṣataḥ krūrān... If anyone is envious of Kṛṣṇa, then what is his punishment.

Meeting with Endowments Commissioner -- August 24, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: This is their punishment.

Harikeśa: "Those who are envious and mischievous, who are the lowest among men, are cast by Me into the ocean of material existence into various demoniac species of life."

Prabhupāda: And next verse?

Harikeśa:

āsurīṁ yonim āpannā
mūḍhā janmani janmani
mām aprāpyaiva kaunteya
tato yānty adhamāṁ gatim
(BG 16.20)

"Attaining repeated birth amongst the species of demoniac life, such persons can never approach Me. Gradually they sink down to the most abominable type of existence."

Prabhupāda: So this is my request, that our money... There is nothing our money. Everything Kṛṣṇa's. But we are thinking. Because we are asuric. So asuras think like that. Just like Kaṁsa, Hiraṇyakaśipu. "Ha!" Rāvaṇa. "Ha! What is Rāma?" That is asura's. They think like that, and that is asuric. But otherwise īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1). Everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa. Therefore yajña is advised. The sooner you hand over Kṛṣṇa's property to Kṛṣṇa, it is good for you.

Garden Conversation -- September 6, 1976, Vrndavana:
Prabhupāda: So I am thinking like them. Therefore I am morose. For me I have no anxiety." And actually, what Prahlāda Mahārāja... He was thrown to the fire, he was thrown from the hill and underneath the... He didn't care. "Whatever you'll do I'll chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. So how he'll be unhappy for himself? He has already passed all these examinations. His father! Not other. His own father. He's helpless. He's under father's care, and the father is giving so much trouble. All right, if he likes, go on. Everyone expects affection from the father. He's five years old boy. Where he will go? No, no, no, no. "I'll take shelter of Kṛṣṇa and you can go on with your business. I don't care for your punishment."
Room Conversation -- September 7, 1976, Vrndavana:
Prabhupāda: Prabhupāda: To remain in Vṛndāvana, and then next life they will be liberated. In one life all their sinful activities will be punished. Because as soon as animal life is obtained, there is no more further record of the sinful life. The animals cannot make sinful activities more than what is destined by him. But their sinful activity is not taken into account. For this man who is offered this monkey's body, he suffers the inconvenience of monkey life. So his sinful activities are counteracted, and because he came to Vṛndāvana and lived in Vṛndāvana by the mercy of Rādhārāṇī, next life he will be... That is the glory of Vṛndāvana-dhāma. Otherwise what is the explanation of these dogs and hogs and monkeys in Vṛndāvana? If it is dhāma-aparādha, committing offense in dhāma. Dhāma-aparādha. As dhāma-bhajana, if one undergoes devotional service out of Vṛndāvana and one executes devotional service in Vṛndāvana, that is hundred times better. Similarly dhāma-aparādha also. This aparādha, when offense is committed outside Vṛndāvana, that is not so grievous as committing offense in Vṛndāvana. Dhāma-aparādha. So the punishment is there, but the reward is also there. One life makes pardoned. Tat te 'nukampāṁ su-samīkṣamāṇo bhuñjāna evātma-kṛtaṁ vipākam (SB 10.14.8). Therefore a devotee in a reverse condition of life, he understands that "I am punished. Little punished for my previous mischievous activities. So now I am becoming liberated." So he becomes more enthused to worship the Lord, that "You are finishing my sinful reaction of life with slight punishment. Thank you very much. This is devotee. Tat te 'nukampāṁ su-samīkṣamāṇaḥ.
Room Conversation -- September 7, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes, when they come to sense they feel grateful. As dogs they cannot. As dog or monkey they cannot enhance their sinful activities. It is stopped. And whatever they do, that is not taken into account. And to suffer as dog or monkey means counteracting all previous sins. One punishment finished. Then he's fully liberated.

Room Conversation -- September 7, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: But if desire changes, then where is punishment? If he's repentant, then there is no punishment.

Harikeśa: So before they go back to the spiritual world that desire must change.

Prabhupāda: This is forceful change. That is the advantage of Vṛndāvana bhajana.

Harikeśa: That is very good. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: But not that willfully do something wrong. There is punishment. If one unconsciously, without any knowledge, does something wrong, that is excused. But they do willfully. They know it is wrong, still they do it. That is punished. Knowingly. Caitanya Mahāprabhu personally said, asat eka strī-saṅgī. Those who are habituated to illicit sex are punishable. Asat. It is very, very bad. And still if somebody does like that, he is punished. This is going on. "All right." Here illicit sex... The bābājīs, I heard, they say, "What is the wrong there? It is love." They say like that. They take it as love. "Gopī's love," they say. "Gopī's used to do that, used to have illicit mixing, intermingling with Kṛṣṇa. What is wrong?" They'll say. They get support from Kṛṣṇa līlā. Such rogues they are. Sahajiyās. There are many so-called gentlemen, they write books on Kṛṣṇa līlā, paint picture." This is very nice. Kṛṣṇa is advocating illicit intermingling." They take it as support of their sinful activities.

Room Conversation About Gurukula -- November 5, 1976, Vrndavana:

Jagadīśa: The thing is, if we beat him here and keep him here, then all the boys will straighten up because they will see that if they go bad, then this will be their punishment.

Prabhupāda: As you think, you can do. But I wanted to engage in farm work, in digging.

Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Very dark, yes. First thing, there will be no rainfall. Due to the sinful activities of the people, from nature the punishment will be, there will be no rainfall. I have seen already in Europe. Everywhere there is scarcity of rainfall. And on account of scarcity of rainfall, food production will be reduced. They will try to eat meat, killing, and maintain themselves. But that is also not very prospective. How long you will...? The animals will also die. Then in Europe they are doing that, that on account of scarcity of rain there is no grass, so they are thinking, "These animals die for want of food. Let us eat them." This is their intelligence.

Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Remedy is they should admit that there is God. But they do not admit, especially the so-called scientist rascals and atheist philosophers, politicians. They do not accept the authority of God. They think they will be able to manage things in their own way. And they say clearly, "There is no God." But there is nature. You can say, "I don't care for the government but the government force is there; police is there; military is there. Similarly, you may say, "Defy the control of government," but the agent of God is there, the material nature. That will punish you. There will be no rain, there will be no food production, and the rascal governments will take advantage of it, "food relief." They'll tax, as if by taxing they will be able to combat with nature. So three things we'll have to meet: no rain, no food, and government taxes. Then how people will remain in sane condition? They will become mad.

Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Dr. Kneupper: Some punishment.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So because we are punished, therefore we are getting this body.

Dr. Kneupper: Why does man... Why does the soul come into the body in the first place?

Prabhupāda: Punishment.

Dr. Kneupper: But he must have done something...

Prabhupāda: You want to enjoy. Can you understand this? Everyone is trying to enjoy. So enjoy independently means that you don't care for... That is the fact. They don't care for God. So because they don't care for God, therefore they are punished: "You take care of your body." And as soon as you care for God, then there is no material body. Mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti. So God, therefore, teaches us how to get out of this body.

Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Well, in your country there is some adjustment because it is very big country and you are all intelligent people. In other countries they... But even though you have got resources, if you not properly utilize it, then the bad time is coming. You should expect. If your energy is all engaged in manufacturing tires and wheels, then who will go to the... Actually I have seen in your country. Now the farmers' son, they do not like to remain in the farm. They go in the city. I have seen it. The farmers' son, they do not like to take up the profession of his father. So gradually farming will be reduced, and the city residents, they are satisfied if they can eat meat. And the farmer means keeping the, raising the cattle and killing them, send to the city, and they will think that "We are eating. What is the use of going to..." But these rascals have no brain that "If there is no food grain or grass, how these cattle will be...?" Actually it is happening. They are eating swiftly. "The cattle will die. Before they die, let us kill and eat." Actually it is happening. In Italy they killed because the problem is twenty thousand cows. This is going on. They do not care that killing is sinful because they don't care for God. This is going on. And sinful, sinful, sinful, everyone will be punished.

Evening Darsana -- December 3, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: There will be proper rainfall. And if there is proper rainfall, then you get sufficient food grains, not only food grains, other things also. Sarva-dughā mahī, sarva-kāma-dughā mahī. From the earth you can get all the necessities of life. Actually you are getting food grains, minerals, trees, fruits, flowers, everything from the earth. Sarva-dughā, sarva-kāma-dughā mahī. This mahī, when it is soaked with proper rains, it becomes fertile. Therefore we have to depend on the rainfall. There is one verse in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, kāmaṁ vavarṣa parjanyaḥ (SB 1.10.4). Parjanya means rainfall. Rainfall means it is supplying all the necessities of life. And this rainfall will be easy when there is yajña. And nobody is performing yajña; therefore nowadays rainfall is scarcity. In Europe recently I have seen, there is no rainfall, whole Europe. It is on the verge of drying everything. So this punishment will come in this Kali-yuga.

Morning Walk -- December 5, 1976, Hyderabad:

Guest (2): (indistinct) ...must be punished.

Prabhupāda: Eh? Naturally. Suppose if there is some infectious disease, the doctor says, "Don't go there." And if you go there, you'll be infected. You'll suffer. How the doctor can protect you? Doctor's duty is to warn you not to go to that area, "It is now infected with smallpox." But in spite of doctor's instruction, if you go there and if you infect that disease and suffer, then it is your fault. When a man is hanged by the judgment of the court, do you think that the high-court judge is inimical to that person? He's giving judgment to other persons that "This one must make one lakh of rupees from that person." And next judgment, "This man must be hanged.

Preparation for Gita Pratisthana -- December 9, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: What their answer, these rascals? Just like in Europe there is scarcity of water, they proposed to import, rascal. But there are so many oceans. So where is the scarcity of water? But why you cannot use it? Unless there is intervention by the nature's law you cannot do it. Therefore you are completely under the laws of nature. Nature will punish you, nature will reward you, according to your acts. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi (BG 3.27), ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā. You are falsely thinking that you are independent. A slight deviation from the laws of nature will put you into difficulty. Immediately there are... You can close this door. (break) ...population. In any case, one can be punished when the nature's supply is restricted.

Preparation for Gita Pratisthana -- December 9, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Hm, taxation. So that is... You have created problem. When you transgress the laws of nature, this, there is shortage of supply. And the government, on this plea they will tax to mitigate your miseries. Actually they will not be able to mitigate your miseries, but on the plea of your miseries they will levy taxes and divide amongst themselves. So this is another way of punishment because the government is your government. Because you are rascal, so you elect some, another rascal. And they invent ways of rascaldom to mitigate your miseries. To avoid taxation means you become good man and you select your ruler, good men. Then there will be no taxation.

Press Conference -- December 16, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Yes. You cannot interpret on the words of God. You cannot interpret. Just like law. There is law by the government. You cannot interpret in your own way. You have to accept it. "Keep to the right"—no interpretation. You must keep to the right. That is law. If you say, "What is wrong if I go to the left?" Actually if one goes to the left, it is not very... But you cannot do it. As soon as you do it, you are criminal. You'll be punished. That is law. The dharma means dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). This is dharma. If you want a general definition of dharma, or religion, that is given in the śāstra that "Dharma means the law given by God." That is dharma. You cannot manufacture dharma. And because we are manufacturing so many dharmas, mental concoctions, there is no peace. And Kṛṣṇa therefore says that "You give up this rascaldom." Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66).

Morning Walk -- December 25, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That means he could not get any spiritual idea. Asad grahāt. Material existence means accepting something which will not exist, asat. Asato mā sad gamaya. The Vedic instruction is: "Do not remain in this material world, and make your progress..." Asato mā sad gamaya. But people are so accustomed to materialistic way of life that they are reluctant. That is māyā, very strong. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). It is very, very difficult. Māyā tries to punish every conditioned soul, and as soon as there is some attempt to get out of the clutches of māyā, she becomes still strong: "Where you shall go my dear son? You remain with me." Yaḥ devī sarva-bhūteṣu nidra-rūpiṇa sam...(?) In the Caṇḍī, yaḥ devī, he is situated, keeping the conditioned souls in dream. He is simply dreaming, "I'll be happy in this way; I'll be happy in that way." And that is mental concoction. He'll never be happy. Kṛṣṇa said moghāśā mogha-karmāṇo mogha-jñānā vicetasaḥ, āsurīṁ bhāvam āśri... (BG 9.12). Because he has not recognized the Supreme Personality of Godhead, all his hopes and endeavors will be baffled. So even a person like Mahatma Gandhi, he became baffled.

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- December 26, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then be beaten with shoes. When you're successful, then say. Otherwise, I shall beat you with shoes. That's all. That is your punishment. You have not come to the experimental stage, and you are talking, "This is science." Science is experiment and observation. Unless the experiment is practical, practical science... It will be accepted as science when the experiment is successful. Not before that. That is scientific method. First of all, observe. It may be happening like this. But that "maybe" should be confirmed by experiment. Then it is science. Even in colleges there is practical examination. Theoretical and practical. So unless... "We are trying." Everyone will say, "I am trying." "I am trying to become millionaire." When you become millionaire, then say that you are millionaire. You are trying for becoming millionaire and you say, "I am millionaire."

Morning Walk -- December 29, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They cannot believe that other than this method, there can be civilization. This hoggish civilization is real civilization. To become like hog. That is real civilization. And to give up this process, thinking of soul, elevation of the soul, going back to Godhead, simply imagination, brainwashing. How they can understand? Mām aprāpya nivartante mṛtyu-saṁsāra vartmani (BG 9.3). Who can understand this? (Hindi) to return (Hindi) to the cycle of birth and death. You believe that. (Hindi) If you do not in this life achieve the sense of spiritual consciousness then you'll have to go back to the cycle of birth and death. Who will understand this philosophy? Mostly they do not know what is the cycle of birth and death, and what to speak of understanding God. This is the position. This is suar (pig) position. A suar cannot understand. The men have become like that. In the name of so-called civilization. Can a suar understand this philosophy? A man cannot understand. And what is the difference between him and the suar? Suar (Hindi) There is a narration, Brahmā came, and Indra became, by the curse of Bṛhaspati, became a suar. So he was living in the forest as suar. Brahmājī came, "All right, your punishment is now over. You come." "Where shall I go?" "The heaven?" "This is heaven." "You have got your kingdom, heaven. You have come to suffer this life." "No no, I cannot go." "Why?" "Now who will take responsibility for my, this suar?" (laughter)

Room Conversation -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: C.R. Das made a very good speech. I have read all about what he practicing yoga in jail when he was himself written when he came to the minister's court. He felt that everywhere was Kṛṣṇa. Everyone was... He was seeing Kṛṣṇa everywhere. That was his feeling. So he would not be punished by anybody. But God is everywhere. His brother was transported to the... He was to be hanged and then he was transported to (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: (indistinct). (break) This is the fact that yato mata tato patha? Whatever path you accept, that is all right? He said that. Do you think it is bona fide? Kṛṣṇa says mām ekam, and he approves anything.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with Yogi Amrit Desai of Kripalu Ashram (PA USA) -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: And when He learned that he has committed suicide, He did not regret. "Yes, this is the just punishment." You see how much strictly. (break) And He said, asat saṅga. Yoṣitāṁ saṅgī-saṅgaḥ. He said that.

niṣkiñcanasya bhagavad-bhajanonmukhasya
pāraṁ paraṁ jigamiṣor bhava-sāgarasya
sandarśanaṁ viṣayiṇām atha yoṣitāṁ ca
hā hanta hanta viṣa-bhakṣaṇato 'py asādhu
(CC Madhya 11.8)

He was very strict. So this is Vaiṣṇava behavior. Asat-saṅga-tyāga ei vaiṣṇava-ācāra, strī-saṅgī eka asādhu kṛṣṇābhakta āra... (CC Madhya 22.87). So Caitanya Mahāprabhu's sampradāya is very rigid.

Roof Conversation -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:
Prabhupāda: Just like political fight. In the political fight both the parties, they are trying to get supremacy of their own sense gratification. But here the fight, Rāma-Rāvaṇa..., Hanumān's krodha was not for himself. He did not want the Laṅkā kingdom. But because Rāmacandra wanted that "This man should be punished," he cooperated: "Yes." So this is spiritual. In this way, when we purify all our activities, all our sensual activities, then it is right. Otherwise... Just like Arjuna. He purified his senses. A Vaiṣṇava is naturally nonviolent, but in order to satisfy Kṛṣṇa he fought. That is purified. So we have to purify. Our activities cannot be stopped. That is not possible.
Room Conversation -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Woman infidel, they are stoned among the Muhammadans. Christian also. "You have done..." Woman proved unchaste, she was punished. Is it not? The public would stone and kill. You know that punishment? Stoning?

Hari-śauri: Stoning, yes. It's mentioned a lot in early Christian times. They used to stone.

Prabhupāda: Everyone will throw a stone. Very tortuous death, stoning.

Morning Walk -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: How to know it?

Prabhupāda: You can know from Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagavad-gītā. It is open to everyone. If you cannot understand, then go to guru. He will explain to you. "And how to know it?" You cannot say. "Keep to the left" is there. You cannot say that "I did not know the law." You have deviated. Why you have gone to the right? The signboard is there, "Keep to the left." You have gone to the right; you are criminal, must be punished. So Kṛṣṇa comes personally, and He is giving instruction. How can you say, "How to know?" This is criminal. This is criminal to say that you do not know what to do; you do not see God. God has given the law. There is no question how to know. Know it! Tad viddhi praṇipātena (BG 4.34). Tad viddhi. Know it! Why you are neglecting? Tad viddhi. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). That, if you do not... What is called? Ignorance of law is no excuse. You cannot say in the court, "Sir, I did not know the law." Aiye. You know or not know; you have violated the law; you must be punished. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: The ignorance of law... Why? Why this human form of life? To know. Why you do not try to know it? Then you must be punished. Kṛṣṇa said, aśraddhadhānāḥ puruṣā. "If you are neglectful to know," dharmasyāsya parantapa, "this dharma, this science, this duty, what I am giving..." Aśraddadhānāḥ: "Eh! Bhagavad-gītā is..." Aśraddadhānāḥ. There is no śraddhā. Rascals. "Then the result will be mām aprāpya. He does not get Me." Then what is next? Nivartante: "He goes back." Where? Mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani: (BG 9.3) "Again in the cycle of birth and death, birth and death." Again, after millions and millions of years, he'll come, again get the chance of human body, another chance to know. So this is the chance to know. You cannot expect the dog will know, the cat will know. You have got human being. You must know. The signboard, "Keep to the left," is meant for the human being. If the dog goes from right to the left, he is not to be punished, because he has no knowledge. This is common sense. But you cannot neglect. You are human being. You cannot say, "I did not see the signboard. I did not know the law. Therefore, by chance, I have violated." No. No "by chance." You must be punished.

Morning Walk -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:
Prabhupāda: A human being, if he does not become Kṛṣṇa conscious, that means knowingly, he is taking poison, and he must die. Jāniyā śuniyā viṣa khāinu. Sometimes I do not know what is poison. Just like child does not know. He may take. But he'll not be excused. Even a child takes poison, it does not mean the nature's law will excuse him. No. But.... What to speak of child, a human being, if he takes poison, jāniyā śuniyā, then what is to be...? So in the human form of life, you cannot neglect the instruction of Bhagavān. Then you'll be punished. Severe punishment. Tān ahaṁ dviṣataḥ krūrān ksipāmy ajasram andhā-yoniṣu (BG 16.19).
Discussion on Deprogrammers -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: What is that book? (break) Sarvātmana yaḥ śaraṇaṁ śaraṇyam. Factually Kṛṣṇa is the ultimate shelter. If he has taken that shelter, he's free, immune. And that Kṛṣṇa has confirmed here. Ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo... (BG 18.66). If he's not Kṛṣṇa conscious, then if he gives such a duty, he's liable to fall down. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣ... "Because you are giving up all other duties, don't think that you'll be liable to punishment. I'll give you protection." So the conclusion is: if one is not fully Kṛṣṇa conscious, then he's obliged to do his duty. This is the easiest way to become free from all obligation—to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. That, I think, duśyanta-rāja?

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: So that you have made, immoral. Because if He is the proprietor, then He is the proprietor of everything. You have accepted one woman who belongs to Kṛṣṇa. You are immoral. He is the original proprietor of everything, and everything belongs to Him, but He has given you one woman. Tena tyaktena. But no woman belongs to you. So you should stop connection with women. It is immoral. Otherwise every woman belongs to Kṛṣṇa. How you can use Kṛṣṇa's property? That is the disease, that we are trying to enjoy Kṛṣṇa's property. Kṛṣṇa's the proprietor. Bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva... (BG 5.29). He's the bhokta, He's the enjoyer. How you can enjoy Kṛṣṇa's property? That is immoral. And therefore you shall be punished. You are being punished. Because we are encroaching upon Kṛṣṇa's property illegally, therefore we are suffering.

Conversation and Instruction On New Movie -- January 13, 1977, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: Yes, the nine devotional process and how, by each process, one becomes perfect, just like Parīkṣit Mahārāja, simply hearing, and Śukadeva Gosvāmī, simply chanting, reciting Bhāgavatam. So both of them got salvation. Lakṣmī, she is simply pāda-sevanam, giving massage to the lotus feet of the Lord. Arjuna simply made friendship with Kṛṣṇa. Hanuman simply worked as a hard servant. He doesn't know what He is... "Lord Rāmacandra wants it." Then it is done. Jump over. He does not know any philosophy. He has got bodily strength, so whatever Rāmacandra says, he'll do. He was asked to bring that medicine for Lakṣmaṇa. He did not know where to find it. "Take this whole mountain." (laughter) He was not intelligent. "Fight! We have to fight with Rāvaṇa. Then block his whole city by throwing stones and trees and dirt." Everything became blocked. They could not move. So in one side he is born of animal life, he had no higher intelligence, but his staunch desire, that "I shall serve Lord Rāmacandra..." By that... Only this desire made him perfect. Dāsyam. Śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ (SB 7.5.23), so smaraṇam. Prahlāda Mahārāja, five years old boy, how he could protest against such a powerful demon father? He was simply thinking of Kṛṣṇa, "All right, my father is punishing me.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Hari-śauri: Find out where it discounts about punishment and reward.

Prabhupāda: One idea, another idea overlaps. Therefore it appears mysterious.

Rāmeśvara: Now, we're taught in the Bhāgavata that when a soul, when a living being quits his body, if he's in the human body, he's either taken by the Yamadūtas or the Viṣṇudūtas. So this description of their encountering this luminous being, it doesn't seem to fit in with the description of the Bhāgavata.

Prabhupāda: No. Luminous when they are taken by Viṣṇudūtas.

Morning Walk -- January 29, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: So king has the power to chastise him. Just like if this child says, "I don't believe in education," shall I have to accept? He must be punished. He's a child. He can say, "Father, I don't believe in education. Let me play." Will the father allow? Chastise him. That is king's duty.

Morning Walk -- January 29, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Yes. They should be punished. That is the duty of the king. You follow any bona fide religion; you get all protection. But you don't follow; you must be chastised. That is king's duty. A king has no objection whether you are following Christian method or Hindu method. It doesn't matter. But you must have some religion. If you have no religion, then you are animal. You must be chastised. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje (SB 1.2.6). Religion means you believe in God and love Him. That's all, three words, religion. "You believe in God" means know God, what is God. And love Him. That's all. This is religion. So it doesn't matter whether you understand God through Christian method or Hindu method. But you love God and you abide by the orders of God. Then you are religious. Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). Dharma means, religion means, the words of God. So you must know what is God, and you must know what does He say. Then you are religious. It doesn't matter what it is, Christian and Hindu. Gold is gold. Whether you purchase it from a Muhammadan shop or Hindu shop or Christian shop, it doesn't matter. You must get gold. That's all. So whether you have got God? If you have got some fictitious God, then you must learn what is God. What is that? You do not know God, so you must learn what is God. If you refuse to learn, then you must be punished. And if you know God, then it is all right. If you do not know, then you must learn. If you refuse to learn, must be punished. That's all.

Morning Walk -- January 29, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: That's right. Then learn it from me. Otherwise, if you refuse, then you must be punished. That is my duty.

Hari-śauri: You were just saying that a person who's not religious, he's no better than an animal, but he might argue that even the animals have a right to live undisturbed.

Prabhupāda: No, animal... Right to live with animal is subjected to be punished, just to live rightly. Suppose a cow comes with his horn like that. He must be punished immediately, the atrocity.(?) Then he'll be corrected.

Hari-śauri: But there are so many animals living in the jungle who don't...

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. No, jungle, we have no business to go there. We have rejected jungle. Let them live there. But in the human society, if the animal disturbs, it must be punished—with stick.

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: We don't say; you are saying. We don't say. We say that you must be punished without food. You are dying without food. That is your proper justice. We say that. We are not anxious to this daridra-nārāyaṇa-sevā. We are not. We give. Whatever we have got, we distribute prasādam. That's all. We are not concerned about their daridra-nārāyaṇa-sevā. That is not our business. Suppose there are so many persons, they are without food in the hospital. Doctor has prescribed, "No food." What you can do there? Can you show your sympathy? "Oh, so many persons are lying without... Let us give." Then you'll be beaten with shoes.

Room Conversation with Adi-kesava Swami -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is worst. Because I am spirit soul, I am now imprisoned with this material body. It is my unnatural state, and I am eternal, and because I have accepted this material body I have to undergo birth, death, old age and disease. So that is my effort, how to get out of this material body and remain in my original spiritual identity. That is our whole propaganda. We think material atmosphere is our imprisonment, suffering. Material body means suffering. Otherwise I am eternal, blissful, full with knowledge. That is my position. But because I have been impact... (aside:) Again you have the same disease. Attention, you attend, draw there. Don't do that. Very bad habit. Immediately you sit down, you do it. You cannot check it. So actually this is our punishment.

Room Conversation -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Hari-śauri: It's just like when they get taken before Yamarāja at the end of their lives, it says in the Bhāgavatam, they understand all their past sinful activities. Now they're getting punished for it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is allowed. That is within Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Room Conversation with Scientists, Svarupa Damodara, and Dr. Sharma -- March 31, 1977, Bombay:

Dr. Sharma: Yāvad... (Sanskrit) The amount of material you need to fill your belly, that is your own. You can call only that much you own. If you think you own something more, you are a thief and you should be punished. That's what Bhāgavata says. This is the highest kind of socialism one can...

Prabhupāda: This is real socialism. God is the supreme father. Everyone has got right to live at the cost of the father's property. But you cannot take more than that. Then you are a thief. Take whatever you... And even by nature you will find. You just immediately throw one bag of rice, so many birds will come. And they will take one or two grain or something... They will go away. And the human being, oh, he will take five shares, he will take ten shares. And within one hour, ten mounds of rice will be finished. The birds and beasts will not do that.

Room Conversation Meeting with Dr. Sharma (from Russia) -- April 17, 1977, Bombay:

Dr. Sharma: Śāsana means punishment, to check.

Prabhupāda: Yes. We get very much happy when our Guru Mahārāja chastises us. So you are already reading our books. So let us cooperate, and I think if you will preach systematically, the Russian people, they are intelligent, they will appreciate it.

Room Conversation -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That's all. Mūrkhasya lakuṭauṣadhi(?). When a person is fool number one, beat him. That's all. Ḍhol gobara...(?) Tulasī dāsa has said, ḍhol gobara śūdra paśu nārī, ei saba śāsana ke adhikārī. Ḍhol, drum, you have to bring it to the tune by beating, "tung, tung." Gobara. Gobara means fool person. Paśu, animal. Ḍhol, gobara, pa..., śūdra, and nārī, woman. They should be punished to bring them into order. Ei saba śāsana ke adhikārī. Otherwise they will spoil. A barking dog, you cannot pacify him, "My dear dog, don't bark." It will disturb him: "No!" Ḍhol gobara śūdra paśu nārī, ei saba śāsana ke... So anyone who is denying the existence of God, he is a rascal number one and beat him with shoes. Bas. He is being beaten with shoes by nature.

Room Conversation -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. So these animals, they are passing on as big scientists, philosophers, theologician, and so on, so on. We have to stop them. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). This is the qualification of a person who does not accept God: duṣkṛtina, narādhama, mūḍha, māyayāpahṛta-jñāna-although highly educated, no knowledge-āsuraṁ bhāvam āśritāḥ, simply atheist. So as Kṛṣṇa conscious leaders, we have to punish them, chastise these rascals. They are demons.

Room Conversation -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They should severe punishment. Then... We shall see.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So good milk, you give little, not at a time much. Half a cup. So I said these political rascals... Just see. Trouble. They don't want democracy. "And we'll by force remain." Where is the democracy? Indira Gandhi was to give like that. Where is democracy? Vote rejected him that his (her) election was invalid. Still, he (she) would call, "Emergency." People of Kali-yuga, unfortunate, they are controlled by these fourth-class, tenth-class men. All unhappy. Nobody is in peace. That is also punishment because they are godless. Nobody will come to hear us, follow us, and they'll be punished by these politicians. They'll corrupt.

Conversation with M.P., Shri Sita Ram Singh -- May 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Simply nonsense. So what is remedy? Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās te 'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ (SB 7.5.31). All over the world... Of course, we do not want to criticize, but according to śāstra, people will suffer more and more. And they must suffer. Because they are becoming godless, they must suffer. That is nature's punishment.

Room Conversation -- June 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa not only tests but punishes those who are criminals.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Criminals.

Prabhupāda: Like Kṛṣṇa punished Durvāsā Muni. He was criminal against Ambarīṣa Mahārāja. Kṛṣṇa never tolerates. Vaiṣṇava may tolerate. Kṛṣṇa will never tolerate.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I'm going to go now to... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...without guidance of spiritual master.

Letter from Yugoslavia--'Books!' -- June 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Like an ass. Have you not seen the ass? Can anyone work like that? The animal is so small, and the load is ten times than his body's weight. You have not seen? If you weigh the animal's body and the load, the load is ten times more than his body. This is the punishment. And again, the man who is loading him now, he'll have to become an ass and take the load. This is called karma-bandhana.

Room Conversation -- July 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be, this is all...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They shaved the Muslim's head. (laughter) Like with Rukmī. Same punishment was meted out by Lord Kṛṣṇa to Rukmī. We have to follow our predecessors. Kṛṣṇa is the original predecessor. So far, I have not written anything to them because I think they should first send their report. You've been speaking... Actually, what you've been saying is very encouraging. Just like yesterday you said that they have done right, but I'm not communicating any of this to Māyāpur.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. This is not to...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They should first of all send a report before we tell them anything, because we should get the actual facts from them.

Indian man (1): (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: We did not go to shoot them at their house.

Room Conversation With Bharadvaja -- October 16, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Strong eye, but looking third class. (Bharadvāja laughs)

Bharadvāja: We're also showing that human life means responsibility. Even on an ordinary level we are showing that a man may break a law and he's punished, but a dog, he's not punished for breaking man's law. He may cross the street in the wrong place, he is not punished by the law, but the man is. Animals are walking without clothes, but if a man goes out in the street without clothes, he's arrested. So we are making the point here that man is held responsible for his actions, whereas animal is not. And then we show... The conclusion of this is "Therefore human life has responsibility to engage in the pursuit of knowledge and advancing, not degrading himself." Then we want to show that misuse of this human form of life, or giving up that responsibility, has created a chaos in the world, that the world has become full of madness and fear and pain, and the whole civilization is misguided. We want to show on film, side by side, U.N. politicians barking in U.N. and cats and dogs barking in the street.

Prabhupāda: That is explained by Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura. Māyār bośe, jāccho bese.

Page Title:Punishment (Conv. 1976 - 1977)
Compiler:Visnu Murti, Mayapur
Created:11 of May, 2011
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=140, Let=0
No. of Quotes:140