Pillar (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"pillar" |"pillarlike" |"pillars"

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg -- May 11, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Farming, agriculture, that is nice. There is a proverb: agriculture is the noblest profession. Is it not said? Agriculture is noblest, and Kṛṣṇa was farmer, His father.

Allen Ginsberg: The cow.

Prabhupāda: Cow, yes. And in Vedic literature you'll find, a man is... Richness of a man is estimated by the possession of grains and cows. Dhanyena dhanavān. If he has got sufficient quantity grain, then he's to be... Formerly, even still in India, when a daughter is offered to a family, they will go and see how many morais(?) there are. Grain stock. If he sees that he has five, six, big, big grain stock, then he can... "Oh, this is nice house." You see? "They can feed." So in India still, the arrangement is that every family has got at least two years grain in stock. You see? And cow at least one dozen. No economic problem. And actually, that is the fact. You keep cows and have sufficient grains, whole economic problem solved. Eating. And sleeping, you can take some wood and four pillars. Of course, in your country it is not...

Allen Ginsberg: It's very cold.

Prabhupāda: Very cold. (laughing) India, all the year they are lying on the flat sky.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Television Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Interviewer: Men or women. There is place for women in the religion too isn't...?

Prabhupāda: Woman and man have got the same right. Just like we are getting married boys and girls. They're following the same principles. The same principles. So these are the four pillars of perfect life. And if we indulge in these things, illicit sex life, meat-eating, and intoxication, and gambling, then they become the four pillars of sinful life. And If we take them away, then they become, the prohibited portion becomes the pillars of perfect life.

Interviewer: Now I would like to ask you one more question and I would like to ask you to end the program by chanting your mantra of Hare Kṛṣṇa. One more question, though. In the six years that you have been in this country, in the United States, have you been encouraged or discouraged?

Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Prabhupāda: No, man and woman has got, have got the same right. Just like we are getting married boys and girls. They are following the same principles, the same principles. So these are the four pillars of perfect life. If we indulge in these things—illicit sex life, meat-eating, intoxication and gambling—then they become the four pillars of sinful life. And if we take them away, then they become, the prohibitive portion, becomes the pillars of perfect life.

Interviewer: Now I would like to ask you one more question, and I would like to ask you to end the program by chanting your mantra of Hare Kṛṣṇa. One more question though. In the six years that you have been in this country, in the United States, have you been encouraged or discouraged?

Prabhupāda: I am encouraged.

Interviewer: Encouraged? Why?

Prabhupāda: Because so many devotees are coming daily.

Interviewer: So many? You say so many. You know, we have maybe, what, two dozen people sitting here. But of course there are...

Prabhupāda: We have got sixty centers.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview -- July 5, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: This is the cure: I am making good character. Don't you see their face? Some of them were hippies, frustrated, wretched condition. Now they are known as bright faces, serious character. They don't have any illicit sex. They don't eat meat. They don't have any intoxication. They don't engage in gambling. These are the four pillars of sinful life. If you allow people to indulge in sinful life, how you can expect good citizen? That is not possible. Their character must reform. So we have taken from the root. We are making men of character, knowledge, sincerity, God conscious. Don't you appreciate it?

Guest (2): Will they be able to function in a society as working individuals?

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is nothing prohibited. Simply you have to change your consciousness, that's all. We are also eating, we are also sleeping. Many of our students are householders; they have sex. So there is..., nothing is prohibited, but regulated for higher achievement. That is our program.

Guest (2): Have you asked the government for money? President Nixon?

Prabhupāda: No. What is the use of asking? Who will give me? Why shall I be refused? If you think this, this movement is serious, good, then you come forward. I cannot approach the government and the government says no. I don't think it is good for the government.

Guest (2): Do you see yourself then as the savior of American youth?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Certainly. It is saved already. Why? It is not future, it is present, practical.

Conversation with Bajaj and Bhusan -- September 11, 1972, Arlington, Texas, At Their Home:

Prabhupāda: It is said in the śāstra, striyaḥ sūnā pānaṁ dyūtaṁ yatrādharmaś catur-vidhāḥ: "Four kinds of sinful activities: illicit sex life, striyaḥ; sūnā, the animal slaughter; pānam, intoxication; dyūtam, gambling." These are the four pillars of sinful life. So you have to break these pillars of sinful life. Then you can understand Kṛṣṇa. They have broken. On my word they have broken the first four pillars and therefore they are advanced.

Guest (4): I have had several people ask my why I don't eat meat and why Indians, some Indians don't eat meat. And I could not give them a convincing answer.

Prabhupāda: But that is there. It is stated in the śāstra. These are four sinful activities. (break) ...upadekṣyanti tad jñānaṁ jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ. You have to take knowledge from tattva-darśī, jñānī, not from some people, nonsense. What is the value of some people?

Guest (5): How to identify a true learned man?

Prabhupāda: That you have to become a learned man. If you are a fool, how you can understand who is learned man? You have to become a learned man. Is it not? Otherwise you will be cheated. Anyone will come—"I am learned man. I am God"—and you will be cheated, if you do not know what is God, what is learned man. So first of all you have to become learned man. Then you will understand who is learned man.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course -- May 17, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Research means you admit that you are all fools and rascals. Research meant for whom? Who does not know. Otherwise where is the question of research? You do not know. You admit that. So so many mystic powers are there. You do not know how it is being done. Therefore you have to accept inconceivable power. And without accepting this principle of inconceivable power, there is no meaning of God. Not like that Bala-yogī became a God. So these are for the rascals, fools. But those who are intelligent, they will stress the inconceivable power. Just like we accept Kṛṣṇa as God—inconceivable power. We accept Rāma—inconceivable power. Not so cheaply. One rascal comes and says, "I am incarnation of God." Another rascal accepts. It is not like that. "Ramakrishna is God." We do not accept. We must see the inconceivable mystic power. Just like Kṛṣṇa, as a child, lifted a hill. This is inconceivable mystic power. Rāmacandra, He constructed a bridge of stone without pillar. The stone began to float: "Come on." So that is an inconceivable power. And because you cannot adjust this inconceivable power, when they are described, you say, "Oh, these are all stories." What is called? Mythology. But these great, great sages, Vālmīki and Vyāsadeva and other ācāryas, they simply wasted their time in writing mythology? Such learned scholars? And they have not interpreted that it is mythology. They have accepted it as actual fact. There was forest fire. All the friends and cowherd boys, they became disturbed. They began to see towards Kṛṣṇa: "Kṛṣṇa, what to do?" "All right." He simply swallowed up the whole fire. This is inconceivable mystic power. That is God. Aiśvarya-vairāgya-yaśo-'vabhodha-vīrya-śriyā. These six opulences in full. That is God. That inconceivable power, inconceivable energy or mystic power, we have got also. Very minute quantity. So many things are going on within our body. We cannot explain. The same example. My nails are coming exactly in the form. Although it is spoiled by disease, again it is coming. I do not know what machinery is going on, and the nail is coming, exactly fitting the position and everything. That is coming from my body. So that is mystic power.

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Father Tanner: What I didn't understand is how this is covered by your four pillars, the four...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Father Tanner: Which of these would cover lying?

Prabhupāda: Lying?

Father Tanner: Yes, telling lies.

Prabhupāda: That I have already explained.

Father Tanner: Yes. But which of those four pillars...?

Prabhupāda: All of them. All of them. Just like one is indulging in intoxication. He may say that "I am very pure." But how one can become pure, he's addicted to intoxicants? So I heard from one of my disciples that there is a hospital in U.S.A., and five thousand priests are there for curing their intoxication habit. Do you know that?

Father Tanner: I didn't know that number, but I know that there are hospitals and sanatoriums...

Prabhupāda: So if the priest is going to hospital for curing his intoxication habit, he's hypocrite.

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Guest (1) (British young man): You said that the four pillars that you follow are outward manifestations. They belong to a material person.

Prabhupāda: Outward manifestation?

Guest 1: Hm.

Prabhupāda: So outward manifestation... Just like outwardly, iron rod, it is iron. Iron. Do you follow me?

Mrs. Wells: Yes, iron.

Prabhupāda: But you put the iron in the fire...

Mrs. Wells: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So the iron becomes warm, warmer, and then at last, it becomes red-hot. When the iron is red-hot, it is no longer iron. It is fire. If you touch anywhere, it will burn. Although apparently it is iron rod, but because it has become red-hot, it is fire. Similarly, if you constantly keep in spiritual activities, your outward body, although it is iron and matter, it becomes spiritualized. Try to understand this example. Iron rod put into the fire, when it is red-hot, it is no longer iron rod. It is fire. Similarly this body, although material,

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: The whole civilization is a plan of cheating others. That's all. And they're all sinful. According to our Vedic understanding, there are four things sinful, pillars of sinful life: illicit sex, unnecessary killing of animals, intoxication and gambling.

Mother: But you can lead a very happy life still, eating...

Prabhupāda: No. Our students are trained in that way.

Mother: There are a lot of very good people in the world.

Prabhupāda: Just see. You can see from your son. They can sit down anywhere. They can lie down. There is no artificial living. They are satisfied with nice foodstuff made from vegetable and milk. And chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, holy name of God.

Mother: I see he's happy. But, you know, he came from a very happy home. So he should be happy, shouldn't he?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Mother: Very happy home. Brothers and sisters. And we've all been very happy. And I hope he will remain happy.

Prabhupāda: He's still happier.

Morning Walk -- December 11, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: If you can educate the people. "Don't vote for the rascals. Just try to understand who is the real man, who is the real leader."

Hṛdayānanda: So political program is very important.

Prabhupāda: Yes. If public is educated to select right type of leader, then automatically... And it is very easy thing that "Leader must be faithful. A leader must know what is God and how to trust in Him. And he must be free from all sinful activities. The pillars of sinful activities are these." This is our propaganda.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 15, 1974, Hawaii:

Satsvarūpa: These white pillars?

Prabhupāda: Yes... (break) ...and papaya is very good for breakfast. (break) ...better than Los Angeles.

Bali Mardana: Oh yes.

Sudāmā: You like it?

Prabhupāda: Oh yes.

Bali Mardana: Actually, Hawaii is supposed to be the center of... It's right between the East and the West, between Japan and U.S.A. and Australia.

Prabhupāda: Yes, marginal.

Bali Mardana: It is a good headquarters for you.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bali Mardana: For USA, 'cause then... It is very easy to come from the mainland.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So make a headquarters.

Morning Walk -- February 22, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: (Hindi for few sentences) This is, I tell you. That was a sort of a... We did not know how to act. (two people talking at once) This is how... Some people didn't... Some section of the people. Now Sonara, Sonara... So... They would not have earned. Otherwise they would not have touched anything. (Hindi) I told the people that did not know. They did it unaware. And we got a shock when we learned next morning that temple was demolished. Not only the pillars were cut by gas...

Yaśomatīnandana: For this temple, they raise so much objection, there is so much hassling, hassle.

Dr. Patel: They object because, you see. (Hindi) If you, if your enmity is created, even your good qualities, I would look down at that. That is what these people are doing some how or other. I don't know how.

Prabhupāda: Doṣam icchanti pāmarāḥ.

Dr. Patel: Hm.

Prabhupāda: Guṇam icchanti... (Hindi)

Dr. Patel: These are pāmarāḥ. That, all this thing happened because that man, that... What is his name? Who happened to be now the minister of the neighborhood corporation. Mahaprema. He was supported by this Nair, the owner of this property. And then there was some difficulty in the finalization of the deed(?). So Nair it took a wrong turn, and this man were instigated to do all nonsense, and he went and did his worse, which he should not have done. And he still keeps on doing on that.

Morning Walk -- April 11, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then why do you interpret if you cannot see with your own eyes? You are blind. Why should you interpret? A blind man is interpreting? What is this nonsense? The blind man is just, "Oh, the elephant is big pillar."

Indian Man (1): Same thing will say that elephant is only trunk.

Prabhupāda: That's it. This kind of interpretation, what is the meaning?

Indian: They don't have that complete view of the whole.

Prabhupāda: If you are blind, you accept that "I am blind man. I cannot study what is this elephant," that is another thing. That is good. And if you are blind and by blind eyes you, "Oh, elephant is a pillar."

Indian Man (1): Some other blind will say the trunk...

Prabhupāda: So the blind man has no right to interpret. That is the point. Blind man... You are blind man.

Press Conference -- April 18, 1974, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: So everything, solution is there in the Bhagavad-gītā, and we are trying to spread this knowledge of Bhagavad-gītā all over the world, and people are accepting. Now we have started in America a political party, "In God We Trust." So they are doing very successfully. People are accepting. They are criticizing the so-called leaders. After Nixon, people are disgusted with the so-called leaders. So we are teaching them what kind of leaders should be selected. The king, the public leader, the brāhmaṇa, and... At least these three men, they should be free from the four kinds of sinful activities. If they are personally sinful, how they can lead other people? That is not possible. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥ (SB 7.5.31). If a man is himself blind man, how he can lead other blind men? That is not... It is dangerous for both of them. So the leaders, the politicians, the king, the brāhmaṇa, they should be very much pure, without any sinful tinge of life. And the pillars of sinful life is illicit sex life and meat-eating and intoxication and gambling. Now, unfortunately, the leaders are teaching people how to enjoy illicit sex life, meat-eating and intoxication. Then how the society can be happy? It is not possible. If you become criminal or if you infect some disease, you must suffer. Similarly, in the material world there are three guṇas: sattva-guṇa, rajo-guṇa, tamo-guṇa. So if you associate with sattva-guṇa, then you become enlightened. If you associate with rajo-guṇa, then you are, I mean to say, pushed through passion. And if you are in ignorance, then you do not know what is right and wrong. Kāma-lobhādayaś ca ye. The symptoms of rajo-guṇa is excessive lust and greediness. And sattva-guṇa, they are in knowledge.

Morning Walk -- May 29, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: He is such a foolish that he knows that he will not be able to stay in this, but "Why I made this house so strong, durable? I could have made some temporary house, some four pillars, that's all. But why I am anxious? But I want that a building should be so strong it will endure for so many years." But what about you? What is your guarantee? That knowledge, they will not take. This is their illusion. We don't say that you have done wrong. Utilize it. Be comfortable, seated, and use your time for taking that knowledge.

Dhanañjaya: They are constructing these buildings in defiance of the existence of God.

Prabhupāda: Not defiance. Out of foolishness. They have got some energy for better purposes, but they are not utilizing it for better purposes,—for some things which is illusion. That's all. They have got intelligence. This construction of building requires good intelligence, but they're lacking this intelligence, that "I have constructed this house very nicely, but I will not be able to live in it."

Dhanañjaya: Actually, they don't live in there. No one lives in these buildings. These are office buildings. Even they don't live there. They simply work.

Prabhupāda: That is also living, for eight hours daily. We don't condemn, but our proposal is that you have got higher intelligence. Utilize it for higher purpose. The construction of dwelling place, it is known even to the birds and the beasts. The mouse also knows how to live within the earth. They make a hole. According to their capacity they make there. The birds also, they make their nest also, to live comfortably. So this intelligence there.

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Yogeśvara: Doesn't that make us rather exclusive, that we have some facility for spending all of our time meditating and purifying our lives? Doesn't that make us a rather exclusive group of people? If only those who are completely pure can engage in service, that means only people like us who have time to sit and meditate...

Prabhupāda: What meditation? The thing is that here it is stated, "Unless one is free from all sinful activities, he cannot be engaged in My service." And the pillars, according to Vedic, pillars of sinful activities... Just like four pillars. One is this meat-eating, the other is illicit sex, the other is gambling, and the other is intoxication. So unless we break these four pillars of sinful life there is no meaning of meditation or worshiping God. You cannot ignite fire, at the same time pour water on it. So sinful life means destruction of spiritual life. So once you begin spiritual life, and other way you begin sinful life, then how it will be? It is counteracted. There is no progress.

Morning Walk -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Paramahaṁsa: What does it mean when they say that failure is the pillar of success?

Prabhupāda: Yes. For whom? Who is actually searching after success? Not for the fool. Anyone who is trying for attaining success, for him, failure is also success because he's making progress. Harer nāma harer nāma... (CC Adi 17.21). God says, "Many ways." That's all right. But why does He says that "If you want to know Me perfectly, and without any doubt, then this is the process, bhakti"? Other processes are there but by those processes you cannot understand. Just like practically, call anyone, so-called yogis, so-called jñānīs, they'll not understand Kṛṣṇa. They'll not understand Kṛṣṇa. So all other paths that are recommended, by those paths you cannot understand God perfectly and without any doubt. Therefore God says clearly, bhaktyā mām abhijānāti yāvān yaś cāsmi tattvataḥ: (BG 18.55) "Actually, what I am, that can be understood by bhakti-yoga." Other systems, you'll... I explained that last night. That is partial understanding. That is not full understanding.

Room Conversation with Mr. Tran-van-Kha, and President & Members of the Society of Buddhists in France -- June 15, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: He was Hindu in the beginning. Come on. He was Prince, then He become renounced and He was known as Lord Buddha. So Lord Buddha also started His system for stopping animal killing. Lord Jesus also said, "Thou shall not kill." Unfortunately the animal killing is not stopped. We are therefore teaching our followers: no meat-eating, so that if people stop meat-eating, automatically animal killing will be stopped. According to Vedic system, there are four pillars of sinful life, just like this table is on the four pillars. So one pillar is illicit sex, another meat-eating, another intoxication, and another gambling. So at least the brāhmaṇas, the priestly heads of religion, the king and the public leader, they should stop these four sinful activities. The leaders of the society they must be sinless. Then the human society will make nice progress. In the Bhagavad gītā it is stated: yad yad ācarati śreṣṭhas.

Morning Walk -- June 17, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: What is there? He is digging? (break) Just see the fun.

Devotee: Of all the four pillars of sinful activity, is meat-eating the worst?

Prabhupāda: Everything is worst. Sinful is sinful. Disease is disease. This body, either it is living or it is dead, it is not very important thing. Now see. And the whole world is after this body. Kṛṣṇa says, "The body, either dead or alive, it is not a subject matter for serious consideration." Now see. And what the world is going on? Simply for bodily... Body means senses. It is very difficult to the, for the western people to understand that body is not important thing; the soul is important thing. First of all, they do not know what is soul and then consideration of importance. This is their position. And if one cannot understand what is soul, what he will understand about God? Soul is a minute particle of God. If one cannot understand about this minute particle, then what he'll understand of the Supreme? In the laboratory, if you can test a little sample, just like take a little sea water, analyze, you chemically test, then you can understand what is the composition of the sea water. But if you have no knowledge even a small drop of sea water, how you'll understand the sea, what... That is their position.

Reporters Interview -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: The sinful, yes. Four items we prohibit our students. They do not indulge. Illicit sex life, meat, fish, egg-eating, intoxication up to cigarette smoking, drinking tea, coffee, and gambling. These are the four pillars of sinful life. So unless one gives up these four things he cannot understand what is God, what is God's kingdom, what is our business. Nobody can understand.

Guest (2): Drinking tea and coffee also?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. It is also intoxication.

Guest (3): Your Divine Grace, in a lot of scriptures I read there is a lot of references to breath and the breath as being the...

Prabhupāda: Breathing.

Guest (3): Breathing...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (3): ...it's a source of God. And there are some yogas which concentrate on the breath.

Prabhupāda: Yes. There are different airs within the body and controlling the airs and putting this soul... Soul is already floating in the air. So the yogi mystic process can bring the soul from different places, and then they bring it here and they ascertain where he has to go, and then, from this hole... What is called, this hole?

Morning Walk -- July 9, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So they have mentioned, "American Hindus." (chuckles) (pause) It is a dead blow to the material civilization: "No drinking and no intoxication, no meat-eating, no gambling, no illicit sex." Their whole civilization is finished. Because they stand on these things, four pillars.

Jayatīrtha: Yes.

Prabhupāda: They have no other...

Kṛṣṇa-kānti: Therefore we must present a better civilization.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Kṛṣṇa-kānti: We must present a better civilization.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Not better or best. The civilization. Everything is all false, cheating. Everything, everything is cheating. Without this Kṛṣṇa consciousness, all other consciousness, they're simply cheating. That is called māyā, illusion. If you remain in any other consciousness except Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that means you are in illusion. You are misguided. That is explained in the second verse of the First Canto. Dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra paramo nirmatsarāṇāṁ satāṁ vāstava vastu vedyam atra: (SB 1.1.2) All kinds of cheating religious system is kicked out." That is the second verse. Projjhita, completely cleansed of all cheating type of religion.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

came from India, and he developed. Therefore it is called Indo-European civilization.

Paramahaṁsa: The scientists and the archaeologists are very amazed to find the structures, the buildings that they had in their civilization. They can't understand how they were built, such huge pillars and gigantic stones. They don't know how they were put into place.

Prabhupāda: Similarly, the Jagannātha temple is also like that. They suggest that they manufacture, and then they surround with sand, then further manufacture. And when it is complete the sand is taken away. Otherwise how it is put into...? The sand is stacked just like this. The temple is being manufactured, and the sand is thrown all side, and when it is finished, the sand is taken away.

Devotee (1): The temple is manufactured in the sand?

Prabhupāda: No, as usual. Just like they dig well. They dig well. They begin immediately, and then you dig the earth, and the structure goes down. Then again, then again, like that. They were experts, they were experts, to construct... Labor is cheap. That time, practically there was no labor cost. At the present moment, on account of factories, the labor cost has increased. Otherwise the laborers, they were, they have no sufficient employment. So two annas, four annas. I was paying labor, four annas, say, in 1930s. Four annas. In Allahabad I was paying four annas. He would work whole day. In Bombay eight annas.

Room Conversation with Alcohol and Drug Hospital People -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: Because it is sinful. It is sinful. According to Vedic conception, these four things are sinful activities, four pillars. Just like four pillars, the legs of this table, similarly, illicit sex, meat-eating, intoxication, and gambling are the four legs of sinful life.

Guest (1): What do you consider illicit sex?

Prabhupāda: Illicit sex means animal life. The marriage is in the human society, not in the dog society. So if one has illicit sex, that means he is no better than dog.

Guest (2): I don't quite understand that. Did you say that illicit means sex between people who are not married?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Sex is allowed only married couple. And that is also only for begetting child.

Guest (1): Married under what law? Under what religion? Under what religious law?

Prabhupāda: There is in Bhagavad-gītā, that dharmāviruddhaḥ kāmo 'smi. Find out. You can come here and read.

Morning Walk -- May 21, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: You, why do you believe on your seeing? That is the defect. That is the defect of the Westerners. They are very deficient; still they say, "I cannot see." What is your seeing power? Suppose if Nārada comes, some demigods come, but you cannot see. Just like when Lord Nṛsiṁha-deva appeared, Prahlāda was seeing. "Is your God here?" "Yes." And he could not see. So why do you believe so much on your seeing? You have to attain seeing power. That is very good example, Prahlāda... Hiraṇyakaśipu asking Prahlāda, "Where is your God?" "My God is everywhere." "He is on the pillar?" "Yes." So he was seeing, but he was not seeing. He became angry and broke the pillar. "Let me see, where is your God." This is the position. So one has to create the eyes to see things. Not that whatever eyes you have got you can see everything. No. Just like motorcar is being driven, a child is seeing that the car is running automatically. And the father is seeing, "No, there is driver."

So the seeing of the child and seeing of the father is different. In our childhood we were thinking that in the gramophone box there is a man. And the fan there is a ghost. (laughter) I remember quite. "How these records are being played? There must be one man. He is singing." And the electric fan was running, I was thinking there is some ghost. This is the way.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 3, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That is in the Bhagavad-gītā. (break) ...line there will be pillars? No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Arches. Just like on your veranda.

Prabhupāda: Oh, arches.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Exact same pattern. It will keep the same pattern.

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Sudāmā: But on this one time should we bathe directly?

Prabhupāda: No, you can bathe śālagrāma.

Sudāmā: Bathe śālagrāma.

Prabhupāda: Bathe the śālagrāma-śilā.

Sudāmā: Place Him... Place the Deity there and śālagrāma in front of Them and then bathe śālagrāma.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...made so gigantic and so opulent. And we make Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura on the gate? How foolish they are. The doorkeeper?

Room Conversation With Radha-Damodara Sankirtana Party -- March 16, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: You know, if Kṛṣṇa is virāḍ-rūpa, so big mouth, so big belly, that, whatever you give, that is not sufficient. So here we are spreading Kṛṣṇa's mouth very widespread. Here is the plan for Māyāpur temple. This is the.... This is only residential quarter. Real temple is not yet constructed. It will occupy 350 acres of land. So you are the pillars of this construction work. We are doing all your construction work on your contribution. So go on preaching and distributing books. If we get the.... We are.... Books are.... As your pushing on the sale is very nice, then the customers are also there. These are American Express? No, no.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Barclay's Bank.

Prabhupāda: Now everyone is issuing these traveler's check.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But these are issued differently. In American Express, they charge some money, but these are freely given.

Prabhupāda: Ācchā? Then why the American Express will remain if people will go there? Free service to the constituent, those who are customer.

Conversation with News Reporters -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is pious life. No illicit sex, no meat-eating, no intoxication, and no gambling.

Reporter (1): No?

Prabhupāda: Gambling. These are the four pillars of sinful life. So if we want to know God, we must be free from sinful life. This is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā.

yeṣāṁ tv anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ

janānāṁ puṇya-karmaṇām

te dvanda-moha-nirmuktā

bhajante māṁ dṛḍha-vratāḥ

(BG 7.28)

If you want to be God conscious, then you must be free from all sinful activities. God is pure. If you want to approach God, then you must be pure. If you remain impure, you cannot understand.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1976, Vrndavana:

Yaśodānandana: Prabhupāda, there has been discussion amongst many of the members of the press and the Sanskrit editors regarding the actual place of Nṛsiṁha's pastimes. So I told them that on the occasion of our travel to South India we visited this place Ahobilam, and the paṇḍitas, they have scriptural reference from the Brahmāṇḍa Purāṇa and the Nṛsiṁha Purāṇa that the place is actually mentioned there, and it has been recognized by Rāmānujācārya and many of the great Ālwār saints. And yourself have already told me twice personally that this was the actual place where it happened. And on top of the mountain there, there is the pillar, iron pillar, which is the symbol of the spot where Lord Nṛsiṁha killed Hiraṇyakaśipu. So for the benefit of all of these devotees, they were just requesting your actual confirmation.

Prabhupāda: Confirmation or no confirmation, Nṛsiṁha-deva is our worshipable Deity, that's all. Why you are bothering where He killed Hiraṇyakaśipu? You worship Him, that's all.

Yaśodānandana: They just wanted...

Jayādvaita: The question came up because they have some pictures, photographs from these places, and we wanted to know if they were suitable for publishing or not.

Prabhupāda: So why you are bothering with that? Let it be accepted or not accepted. Worship Him.

Akṣayānanda: Not that important.

Prabhupāda: That is the important thing. (break) A man is diseased. He has gone to the physician. So whether is the first duty to investigate wherefrom the disease came or to cure him? Which is important?

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1976, Vrndavana:

Yaśodānandana: I missed it. I could not get my cappalas (sandals) off in time. They were lost. But that is okay.

Prabhupāda: No, no, it is not okay. It is not at all okay. Then you go and sit down. Don't.... That is very risky. Then let us go to the road. (break) Maybe.

Jayādvaita: (break) ...that just as a capitalist sees money everywhere and a lusty person sees sex life everywhere, devotee sees Kṛṣṇa everywhere, even in a pillar.

Nalinī-kānta: I've been reading a lot in the different books about envy. You say that people kill cows only out of envy. I was wondering if you could give a definition of what envy is. I don't understand why they would kill animals out of envy.

Prabhupāda: Envy means the cow has got right to live. He does not allow the cow to live. That is envy. You cannot understand this? Suppose you are walking. You have got right to walk, I have got, and if I kill you, you cannot walk. That is envious. Everyone has got right to live. Just like the camel. God has given their food. They are accustomed to eat these thorny twigs. So Kṛṣṇa has given that. Let them eat and live. Why should you interfere with his living condition? (break) Do not interfere with others' right. Why should you? (break) ...think we shall take the car in Bombay?

Room Conversation with Siddha-svarupa -- May 3, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: So we are instructing: no intoxication. So those who are flourishing by selling cigarettes and wine and liquor, they do not... "Immediately kill him." Oh, yes, in this way. "If they, the movement goes and becomes very strong, then our business will be lost. Kill him." So naturally they will be enemies. The same thing, the Kaṁsa saw that "This my sister, now she is married. So although it will take some long time, but here is the cause." So they are thinking like that. No meat-eating, then all slaughterhouses will be closed: "They're enemy." Although there is no such symptom that slaughterhouse is going to be closed, but they'll think like that. They'll think like that, the same way. There is no ex... (break) ...pregnancy, first, second, third, then eighth, and the child will go, take birth and... They are thinking like that. So the modern civilization, we are everyone saying. Because you have forbidden: no illicit sex, no intoxication, no meat-eating, no gambling. The whole Western world living on these four pillars. Just see our position. And the same conscious way, everyone is thinking, "If this movement goes on, then how all these nightclubs will go on? How all breweries will go on? How all slaughterhouse will go on, cigarette factories will go on?" This is all foolish. So you cannot expect that we will get more, many friends. That is not possible, because the world is full of Kaṁsas, demons. So we have to struggle and... In the face of so many obstacles we have come to this standard that there is one Hare Kṛṣṇa movement; it is very dangerous to the modern way of life. That much is great, advance. They're feeling the pulse. Now when they are meeting, state obstacles. Everywhere we are meeting obstacles. In Singapore.

Room Conversation -- June 24, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: But I see the marble pillar?

Kīrtanānanda: Yeah, it has a marble altar.

Prabhupāda: The same altar?

Kīrtanānanda: No, no.

Prabhupāda: That is the beginning of New Vrindaban, yes. All right.

Devotees: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda!

Conversation with Prof. Saligram and Dr. Sukla -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Devotee: Is it true or not true that Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta said that failure is the pillar of success and (indistinct)?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: I don't know exactly if Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Prabhupāda has used this saying....

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Failure is the pillar of success. But generally speaking, to paraphrase it, it means that we should learn from our mistakes.

Prabhupāda: Hm. That is success. If we learn our failure and try to rectify it, that is (indistinct).

Devotee (3): I asked Prabhupāda the other day, because Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura says, "Forget the past, it sleeps and never the future dream at all. Live with times that are of thee, and progress thee shall call." So I asked Śrīla Prabhupāda, is it possible to forget the past? Śrīla Prabhupāda said, "No, that would not be possible, but we can think like this, that 'I have done so many foolish things,' and rectify it. Not that we should remain fools. Then what would be the value of our experience? Just like a child, he can put his finger in the fan and it hurts. So then he learns not to do it again.

Press Interview at Muthilal Rao's House -- August 17, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that we say practically. What is the use of "ism," manufactured by imperfect senses. We have got defects. Our..., we commit mistake. Who is the person who does not commit mistake? None. We accept this body, which I am not, this is called pramada. Pramada vipralipsa,(?) without any perfect knowledge you want to teach. That is cheating. Vipralipsa. And karnapada(?), our senses are imperfect. So how you can give perfect knowledge with all this imperfection? Unless you become perfect, you cannot give perfect knowledge. So any knowledge given by any imperfect person, we reject immediately, useless waste of time. And actually that is the fact. If you are blind, you cannot see. You say, "Here is the elephant, a big stambha, pillar," by seeing his leg, by touching his leg. But elephant is just like a pillar? That is our speculation. Andha-kūpa, what is called? Kūpa-maṇḍūka. A frog in the well is trying to study Atlantic Ocean.

Devotee: Kūpa-maṇḍūka.

Prabhupāda: Kūpa-maṇḍūka. What you know about the Atlantic Ocean who's living within three feet of land, water? Kūpa-maṇḍūka.

Interviewer (?): (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: Upastha means...

Interviewer (?): (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: Samāsa. So we are imperfect, just like they are going to study the planets. What they will study from here? This kind of knowledge has no value, speculation.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa says one who is completely free from sinful life, he can become perfectly a devotee. So these are the four pillars of sinful life. Yeṣāṁ tv anta-gataṁ pāpam (BG 7.28). Oh, it is nice park.

Rāmeśvara: But because this is the age of Kali, even if the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement spreads and even captures governments, how can we stop individual people from doing this? (car stops)

Prabhupāda: No. You cannot expect cent percent will be sinless. But there must be an ideal section—"Oh, here is..." That is wanted. That is wanted, not that you can expect cent percent ideal.

Gargamuni: Gate's locked?

Hari-śauri: So that ideal should be the persons who are living in our āśramas.

Rāmeśvara: No, they're in there.(?)

Gargamuni: That's our man. He jumped over the fence to get the gate open open.

Rāmeśvara: But now, suppose there is some businessman, and he knows that everybody is wanting this sex. So he is making movie or writing a book describing these things.

Prabhupāda: These things were formerly restricted-censor board.

Talk with Svarupa Damodara -- June 20, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That Dr. Kapoor, your Godbrother? There's an article that was published in Back to Godhead. So he proves that spirit can be brought out of matter, provided that the bhakti, the brāhmaṇa, the person, develops brahminical qualities to the point of purity. And he uses the example of Prahlāda Mahārāja, that because Prahlāda Mahārāja had developed such a pure love for Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa came out of a material element, the pillar, to prove Himself: "Here is God." So spirit came right out of matter. So Dr. Kapoor used the point that if you want to see spirit, qualify yourself. Then you'll be able to see spirit. You can make spirit come right out of matter.

Prabhupāda: That is sarvaṁ khalv idaṁ brahma.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Actually that's a good example, that, the one that we are using, same simile, that in order to study this life being nonphysical, so the experiment also has to be nonphysical, not that directly we observe just like any other material experiment. So those conditions necessary have to be fulfilled in order to conduct this experiment. So they become very quiet. The audience doesn't..., becomes serious, at the same time quiet. Let them think, "Yes, these things are part of the clear thinking and at very high level." So that since these experiments are nonphysical, the conditions necessary must be very subtle. And the... Because the diet that man eats also plays a very important role, and the brain has to be very clean, and the habit must be very clean. Otherwise these experiments...

Prabhupāda: Anartha-nirvṛttiḥ. This is called anartha-nirvṛttiḥ. Ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu-saṅgaḥ tato bhajana-kriyā, atha anartha-nirvṛtti syāt (Cc. Madhya 23.14-15). Ceto-darpaṇa-marjanam (CC Antya 20.12). Śṛṇvatāṁ sva-kathāḥ kṛṣṇaḥ puṇya-śravaṇa-kīrtanaḥ, hṛdy antaḥ-stho abhadrāṇi (SB 1.2.17). These are abhadrāṇi. Vidhunoti.

Room Conversation With Madhudvisa and others -- August 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So remain as gṛhastha and render your service. There is no harm. If one could not proceed, it doesn't matter. Failure is the pillar of success. Then try. Again you shall try. Where is Śrutakīrti? How are you?

Śrutakīrti: Very well, thank you.

Prabhupāda: Śrutakīrti is also gṛhastha. So jointly you can work and improve this movement. That is our ambition. Gṛhe bā banete thāke, hā gaurāṅga bole ḍāke, narottama māge tāra saṅga. "Either he remains at home or as a sannyāsī, if he is devotee of Lord Gaurāṅga, I want his association." That is Narottama Ṭhākura's... Gṛhe bā banete thāke, hā gaurāṅga bole ḍāke, narottama māge tāra saṅga. So follow the principles, and whichever position is suitable. Don't be carried away by the waves of māyā. Capture Caitanya Mahāprabhu and you'll be saved. Is that all right? Don't leave us. You are quite... At least you made advance. You are one of the important devotees. So don't lose that position now. Manage in the position you want to remain. Now Gaurasundara has also come. So I'm glad to see that you are... Your bunch of hair is long. Yes. Cut it. So give them place to stay nicely.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prasādam.

Prabhupāda: Prasādam. And remain here for some time. Of course, according to my horoscope, these days are my last days. But if Kṛṣṇa saves, that is a different thing. They have calculated eighty-two years and two days?

Room Conversation -- October 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Hari-śauri: This is a palace that they're building in our New Vrindaban farm community. This is built by our own men. This is not complete yet, but it's being built, the dome. Kīrtanānanda Swami is in charge. These are the devotees. Everything is being made by our men. They learned how to cast concrete, how to make these pillars, archways. This marble laying is all done by our men. They came here and learned, and they have a marble shop. This is the kīrtana hall inside. This is on the walls. Here's the floor. This is onyx and marble together. This is pressed concrete, sculptured. This is a support piece, little decorative. This is a guesthouse that was built by the devotees. This is another new building they're building now, and this is present installation and silos for storing cow fodder. You want to sit up, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: I can sit down for some...

Hari-śauri: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda? Rāmeśvara Mahārāja wanted to show you some very nice things from the BBT, I think your Godbrothers would also be interested to see.

Prabhupāda: Bring him.

Rāmeśvara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, these are pictures of the new paintings for Tenth Canto, Volume Two.

Prabhupāda: Bring some prasādam for these men.