No better than (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"no better than"

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview -- February 1, 1968, Los Angeles:

Interviewer: Utopian-like, where there is no harm, no..., all is good, and...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Now, this our process is chanting. It is very innocent. If you sit down and chant with us, you have no loss, no harm, but there is great gain. You see? By chanting, you gradually cleanse your heart and you can realize what is God. That is the greatest gain. Human life is meant for knowing God. The animals, they cannot know, although the bodily demands of the animal and the human being are the same. The animals, they sleep; man also sleeps. Animal, they eat; man also eats. The animal, they are also afraid of some enemy; man is also afraid of some enemy. The animals, they mate with the opposite sex, and men also do that. But what is the special significance of man? He can understand about God, but the animal cannot. Therefore if a man does not take to this understanding, he is no better than animal. A man who has no God consciousness or Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he is no better than animal because he has no other business than the four principles of bodily demands. So that is also prevalent in animal kingdom. Therefore this is a privilege for human being, to understand about God, and as such, in every human society there is some sort of religious principle. This religious principle means to understand God. Either you take it, Christianity or Judaism or Hinduism, every religion is trying to understand God according to their capacity. So without this understanding, means Kṛṣṇa consciousness, human life is as good as animal life.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation Including Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.2.1-34 Recitation & Explanation -- April 1, 1969, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: Now, what is the purpose of religion? Why human society...? In human society, why there is some sort of religion? The animals, they have got no religion. Therefore if human society gives up the process of religion... Doesn't matter what religion he professes. It doesn't matter. If he doesn't care for religion, that society is no better than animals. That is animal society. Because animals, they have got no religion. So human society, if they have no religion... Must have some religion. It doesn't matter whether Christian or Buddhism or Hinduism or anything. A human being must follow. That is civilized. That is the behavior of civilized world. At the present moment they are neglecting. But in every country, either there may be temples or churches or mosque, people were very religious-minded before this age. I was very much satisfied when I came to New York... no, not only New York. First of all, I went to Pittsburgh, Butler. In that Butler County there were at least one dozen churches, very nice churches. That's a small county. So I was very much satisfied. "Oh, the American people are very religious.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: These rascals are... I'm doubtful whether they are going to moon planet or some hell planet. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇā (SB 5.18.12). Our only formula is anyone who is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he has no good qualities—we reject him, whatever he may be. He is rejected from the list of good men, immediately. He may be president or he may be this or that, it doesn't matter. Because he is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he is a third-class man, that's all. This is our certification. (break) These skyscraper buildings are no better than caves. They live here, and here is bathroom, here is kitchen, here is (indistinct) room, three inches. (laughter) Is that advanced civilization? Advanced civilization means every man must have sufficient space to live. Why do you create this path? People will recreate, they will feel repressed, so space is required for refreshment. So what is this civilization? Three inches room.

Room Conversation -- October 25, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: We have published one brochure. (break)

Pañca-draviḍa: ...nicely in the Kṛṣṇa book about the sacrifices of Vasudeva. Where Lord Kṛṣṇa speaks and says to the assembled sages and ascetics that "Seeing you is the perfection of these eyes and perfection of life," and that "Those persons who go to the holy places only to take bath there or to see the Deities in the temple, they are no better than animals like the ass." I've been thinking that how you have presented this ISKCON movement as an assembly of devotees all over the world so they don't even have to go to the holy places. Simply by walking into one of your temples is like walking into Vṛndāvana and having the association of these great ascetics and sages, because your teachings are (indistinct). (break)

Prabhupāda: ...picture?

Indian man: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Similar Deity we'll have in this London Berkshire Palace.

Indian man: They don't look like the Deities, they look like boy and girl.

Prabhupāda: Yes, Kiśora-Kiśorī.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- April 20, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They know that the wave is coming. They run because they know that the wave is coming.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And they know how to go forward and come back. Who has taught them this discipline? Kṛṣṇa is there, within. Sarvasya cāhaṁ hṛdi sanniviṣṭho mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca (BG 15.15). Kṛṣṇa is dictating: "Now you go forward. Now you come back. Here is your food." He's giving intelligence. Sarvasya cāhaṁ hṛdi sanniviṣṭho mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca (BG 15.15). He's giving direction in every living entity, but when a human being, He gives direction, if he surrenders, that: "Go this way. You'll come to Me." Dadāmi buddhi-yogaṁ taṁ yena mām upayānti te. And that is human intelligence. So far these lower animals are concerned, they are given, being given intelligence how to eat, how to sleep, how to mate, how to defend. But a human being, if he engages himself in the service of the Lord, then Lord will give intelligence how to come back to home, back to Godhead. This is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. That is the condition. Teṣāṁ satata-yuktānāṁ bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam (BG 10.10). "Only to those who are engaged in devotional service with love and faith, I give him intelligence how to come back to home, back to Godhead." Therefore, after coming to human form of body, we must awaken our intelligence about understanding the Supreme Lord. And if we take up the process sincerely, with love, then Lord within will give you dictation: "You come this way, come this way, come this way." Otherwise, not. The first condition is: teṣāṁ satata-yuktānām. Therefore we are trying to engage all our disciples to be engaged twenty-four hours in devotional service. Then his life will be successful. That is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Satata. Satata means always, constantly. Just like we are walking, but we are engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Others are walking. They're wasting time. But we are, we are walking, but, at the same time, we are engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We are eating. We are engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We are sleeping. We are engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We are working... Always. Then Kṛṣṇa will see: "Now he's serious. Let him have some intelligence, how he can come back to home." This is the process. And the pleasure of sense gratification, oh, that is also known how to do it by the hogs and dogs. They know. The hogs are eating everything, up to stool, for sense gratification. So the human being, if they have no discrimination, they can eat anything and everything for sense grati..., they are no better than hogs. What is the difference between hog and human being? The hog has no discrimination of eating. Anything it will eat, up to stool. So if a human being becomes like hog, without any discrimination, he will eat anything, that is advancement of civilization? Advancement of becoming hog. That's all. And they like, actually. The hippies, they like hogs.

Morning Walk -- April 26, 1973, Los Angeles:

Brahmānanda: ...seems very dark.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Idle brain is a devil's workshop. If they're not directed, then think like devil. We are thinking rightly because we are taking direction from Kṛṣṇa, the most perfect. Therefore our thinking has meaning. And what is the value of their thinking? It has no value. Now we are thinking... Just like, take the first instruction, that within this body there is the proprietor of the body. You can go on thinking: "Then am I this body?" So you can think on your finger. "I am this finger?" The answer from the within will come: "No, you are not finger. It is your finger. It is your finger. You are not finger." If I am finger, then if I cut my finger, why shall I not die? If I am finger? Therefore it is my finger. Just like I'll never think that I am this stick. It is my stick. That is thinking. That is thinking. If I wrongly think that I am this body, then your whole thinking process is wrong and they are thinking like that, that we are this body.

yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke

sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma ijyadhīḥ

yat-tīrtha-buddhiḥ salile na karhicij

janeṣvabhijñeṣu sa eva gokaraḥ

(SB 10.84.13)

So such kind of thinking is done by the asses and cows, yasyātma-buddhiḥ. One who is thinking: "I am this body," he's no better than the animal, ass or cow. They're all thinking like that: "I am this body." They're asses. And the whole world is suffering by thinking like that. "I am American, I am Indian, I am Russian, I am this, I am that." That's all. We must know how to think. Then our thinking will produce some good result. If I do not know how to think, then what is the use of my thinking? A mad man is also thinking: "I am the emperor." Does it mean that he's emperor? Sometimes, I have seen, a madman falls flat on the street. "Nobody can check me." So motor driver, they become little cautious, he's a rascal, madman. So madman's thinking, what is the value of madman's thinking? They're all mad. Piśācī paile jana mati chana hana.(?)They're a ghostly haunted person. As he's mad, similarly those who are entrapped by this material energy, they're all madmen. If I think that, "I am this coat, I am this shirt, I am this cloth," am I not mad? The body's just like shirt and coat. Vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni yathā vihāya (BG 2.22).

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Direction, yes. That is said, mayādhyakṣena prakṛtiḥ: (BG 9.10) "Under My direction." So if it is possible for a common man like me, how much it is possible for God? That we have to understand. Now I want to go to India, London. Now everything arrangement is made. I can go immediately. So similarly, if God wants to do something, why He has to do something? Everything, as soon as He desires, everything is there. He wants "Let there be material creation." There is, immediately. This is God. We are thinking in my terms. "Oh, such a huge universe! How a person can create? Where he got this tool? Where he's got the hammer? And how he constructed it?" I am thinking like that. Because I am limited, I am thinking in my limited way. So I am denying, "There is no God." Therefore we have to first of all understand acintya, inconceivable power. Then we can understand God. If I think, "God may be..." That kūpa-maṇḍūka, that frog is thinking, "It may be little bigger than this, little bigger than this." So how you can understand Atlantic Ocean within the well? So these rascals are all frogs. So they are thinking in their own terms, God. And because they cannot accommodate, "There is no God, finish." The same example: the rabbit, "Close the eyes, there is no danger." Finish. That's it. They are no better than the rabbits, these so-called scientists. Closing the eyes, there is no God. You have to smash them by their, Tora lati na, tor śilā torna amora tora bāṇi dāntera gora.(?)

Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course -- May 13, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: (About tennis players) How people are kept into ignorance. Life is so valuable, and they are wasting time in that way. Life is valuable, how life should be utilized, what is the object of life—they do not know anything.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Without knowing that the soul is eternal, everybody would be acting like this.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is... Bodily concept of life means animal life. The animal does not know. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). Go-kharaḥ. Go means cows, and kharaḥ means ass. One who is in the, under bodily concept of life, he is no better than animals. So when the animal talks of knowledge, an intelligent man laughs. That is our position. The animals, they are talking of knowledge.

Paramahaṁsa: At least, the animals live by certain codes. They do not kill unless necessary. They only eat when necessary, whereas man, he kills unnecessarily, eats unnecessarily. So forgetting God, we are even lower than animals.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore we suffer also, more than the animals. (pause) So Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is not a bogus religious sentimental movement. It is a scientific movement. So now it is up to you to prove this. Then you will be actually Kṛṣṇa conscious.

Room Conversation -- July 9, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: External. Adhyaki(?). (indistinct) ...one is interested in the body not in the soul. So he is a fool. This, this sculptor, he is simply interested in the outward body, he has no knowledge of the soul. And he wants to become a very famous man, remaining in the category of asses. Because one who is in the bodily concept of life, he is an ass. Go-khara, khara means ass. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). Yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke (SB 10.84.13). Anyone who is in the bodily concept of life he is no better than animal. The cats and dogs, they are also in the bodily concept of life. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). So he has not advanced beyond these cats and dogs because he is in the same conception, that I am this body. A dog cannot understand that you are not this body. So similarly, if the human being cannot understand that he is not this body, what is the difference between him and the dog? So śāstra says sa eva go-kharaḥ: (SB 10.84.13) he's no better than the cows and the asses. That's all. And actually it is a fact. The first instruction of Bhagavad-gītā, they cannot take it, and they're scholars. That is the most regrettable situation that these fools and rascals under the bodily concept of life, they are become authorities. Actually they are asses.

Room Conversation with David Wynne, Sculptor -- July 9, 1973, London:

David Wynne: It has.

Prabhupāda: Five thousand years ago, it was all perfect. The whole world, this planet, was being ruled by one king. And they were all happy. That is in the history. Five thousand years ago. Maybe less, in three thousand years ago the history was different. The difficulty is that as soon as one is lost of his culture, he becomes an animal. Dharmeṇa hīnāḥ paśubhiḥ samānāḥ. That is the difference between human being and animal. Human being must be with culture. Animal cannot be cultured. So a human being without culture, he's no better than animal. That culture is lost. They have missed the aim of life.

Revatīnandana: They think they have culture.

Prabhupāda: What is this culture? A human being is killing so many animals, innocent animals, is that culture? They are less than animals. Who kills? The tiger kills, ferocious. A human being killing innocent animals... In Christian religion, therefore: "Thou shall not kill." But they are killing only. Where is the culture? Killing culture. That is not culture. What do you think?

David Wynne: It must be so. Yes.

Room Conversation -- September 2, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Therefore I say that these universities, educational institution, all over the world, they are simply concerned with this body. According to our Vedic culture, to remain satisfied with the bodily necessities of life is the business of animals. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13).

yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke

sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ

yat-tīrtha-buddhiḥ salile na karhicij

janeṣv abhijñeṣu sa eva go-kharaḥ

(SB 10.84.13)

These are animal conceptions. So anyone who is accepting this body as the self, he is sa eva go-kharaḥ. Go means cows and kharaḥ means asses. So this civilization based on the bodily necessities of life is animal civilization. Because we are not this body, we are spirit soul, as it is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā: dehino 'smin dehe. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). The soul is within the body and it is transmigrating from one type of body to another. Even in this life. Just like I was in the baby's body, I was in a child's body, I was in a boy's body. Those bodies are gone. But I remember that I was in such and such bodies. But I am now in a different body. Therefore, although my bodies have changed so many times, I am cognizant, I know that I had such and such body. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ. To transmigrate from one body to another. This is the authoritative statement of Bhagavad-gītā. There are so many serious students of Bhagavad-gītā. Just like Mahatma Gandhi, his photographs were always with the Bhagavad-gītā, standing. But he was not a leader of understanding what is soul. He was simply concerned with the body. This nationalism is concerning this body. Bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ. Bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ, ijya, ijya means worshipable. On account of this bodily concept of life they have taken that this earth or the place where the body is born, that has become worshipable. That is nationalism. Bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ. Sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu. And from my body there is relationship with my wife, with my children, therefore they are my own men. There are hundreds and thousands of women, but one woman who has got bodily connection, she's my wife. I have to do so many things for her. Similarly children, the bodily connection. The whole material civilization, nationalism, socialism, this ism, that ism, everything based on this bodily concept of life. But one who is in bodily concept of life, he is no better than cows and asses. So in the human form of life, because of the developed consciousness, there is inquiry, what I am. What I am. Am I this body or I'm something else other than this body? This is natural inquiry, and the Vedānta-sūtra begins from this inquiry.

Room Conversation -- September 2, 1973, London:

Guest (1): What is God to a layman, like me.

Prabhupāda: Layman, well, layman means, we already explained, he's no better than animal. Because layman means one who thinks that "I am this body." He's layman. He has no other information. So layman is equal to animal. So layman's education, layman's advancement is decoration of the dead body. If you decorate a dead body, you can feel satisfaction. But others will laugh, that "What a fool he is, he's decorating a dead body?" Bhagavad-bhakti-hīnasya jātiḥ śāstraṁ japas tapaḥ, aprāṇasyeva dehasya maṇḍanaṁ loka-rañjanam. Layman's business is decorating this dead body, that's all.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 13, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: They are all, so far we have studied all these philosophers, they (indistinct). They are lacking in knowledge. The main difference is that they consider the body as the self, and on that wrong basis they theorize (indistinct). If your basic standing is wrong, then how you can deliver the right? Therefore in Bhāgavata, Śrīmad Bhāgavata, it is said that yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ: (SB 10.84.13) "Anyone who considers this body as his self is no better than the ass and the cow." What is your philosophy? You consider this body as the self?

Guest (1): I... Oh, no.

Prabhupāda: You?

Guest (2): No.

Prabhupāda: Very good. So we begin by (indistinct)?

Śyāmasundara: Uh, from the Rādhā Dāmodara. I don't know.

Guru dāsa: I've got three keys to that room open.

Śyāmasundara: Perhaps Subala has already made arrangements.

Prabhupāda: So, what is your philosophy?

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...there is human form of life. If you do not know, then you remain animal. Āhāra-nidra-bhaya-maithunaṁ ca samānam etad paśubhiḥ narāṇām: "Eating, sleeping, sexual intercourse, and defense—this is there in the animals." And if you remain in that jurisdiction only—eating, sleeping and sexual intercourse and defense—you are animal, no more than animal. Why you are thinking that you are more than animal? You are animal. This is the śāstric injunction. You are no better than animal because your business is eating, sleeping, sexual intercourse and defense. Whole world is busy.

Guest (1): And then, Swamiji, this birth control, that means going against the...

Prabhupāda: They are more than animals.

Guest (1): No, no, that just means going against the will of the God.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, yes.

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Guest (1): Because God wants to bring them as human...

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is a chance. Suppose if somebody's given chance to take opportunity and if you kill, that's a great sin. You cannot do that. You are obstructing his natural progress. Is that birth control (Hindi) European countries mai (?), he hasn't got soul, lump of matter, (Hindi) (break) As soon as you forget the duty of human life, then you are nothing but animal. This is the verdict of Hindu dharma, that if you do not properly behave as human being, you are no better than animal. Dharmeṇa hīna, (Hindi) ...will give him an animal body. This is nature's work. Yes, again come, again come (Hindi) But he does not do that.

Morning Walk -- April 7, 1974, Bombay:

Girirāja: "Unless we have a particular type of body, we cannot enjoy or suffer according to our mental proclivities inherited from the previous life." (break)

Prabhupāda: ...another example. Asaṅgo 'yaṁ puruṣaḥ. It is said that this living entity is untouched by this material body. Asaṅgo 'yaṁ puruṣaḥ. So the example is given that the moon reflected on water appears to be moving, but moon is separate from that movement. (Hindi) Go on. (Hindi) (break) ...good example. Unnecessarily he thinks that "I belong to this country, I belong to this society." That means he creates another body. And if he knows perfectly well that "I do not belong to any of these bodies," that is brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). That teaching required, that every being is unattached to this body. Therefore yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape... Anyone who is maintaining himself under bodily concept of life, he is no better than the animals. (break) The demonic person does not accept any good lesson. Mūrkhāyopadeṣo hi prakopāya na śāntaye. Because he is foolish, if you give him good advice, he will be angry. Still, we have to do that.

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

O'Grady: Very much so. Very badly, very bad now, very bad. What do you do about that? And that's a serious question. Is it morally correct to be sitting here, for me to be sitting here...

Prabhupāda: You see, so long people will remain under the bodily concept of life, that "I am this body," "I am Irish," "I am English," "I am American," "I am Italian," so long this misconception will go on, fight will go on. You see? Yasyātmā-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātu... There is a verse in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Just like you cannot stop fighting between the dogs and cats. Why there is fighting? Because the dog is thinking, "I am dog." The cat is thinking, "I am cat." Similarly, if I think as Irishman, "I am Englishman," it is the same thing. As the dog is thinking, "I am dog," so if I think, "I am Irishman," "I am Englishman," I am no better than the dog. So as we cannot stop the fighting between dogs, similarly, so long people will remain in bodily concept of life, the fighting cannot be stopped.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: No, no. A human being should be considerate. Everyone has got religion. Either he is Hindu or Muslim or Christian, it doesn't matter. There must be discrimination between sinful activities and pious activities. Human being should be engaged for pious activities, not for sinful activities. That is human society. If the human being does not discriminate what is pious activities and what is sinful activity, that means lack of brain. He has no brain. He is no better than the animals.

Yogeśvara: Perhaps to make it clear for you, one of the natural results of this system is that a man that might be considered today impoverished, as you were mentioning for example some of the problems, a poor man, by our standards, is not necessarily poor if he is Kṛṣṇa conscious. For example, in the Vedic culture, we are learning that a man is considered to be wealthy if he simply has a small patch of land and a cow and God consciousness. Because his God consciousness will lead him to be satisfied by growing his own foods, taking milk from the cow. This is wealth, according to Vedic standards.

Prabhupāda: Therefore cow is specially recommended, go-rakṣya, because very important animal to the society. If those who are meat-eaters, they can eat the hogs and dogs, they can eat. The Vedic injunction is not prohibiting them. If you actually... Actually, a human being does not require to eat meat. He has got many other substitutes. But still, if he wants to eat, let him eat the less important animals. Just like dog, hog. From the social point of view it has no utility. But why killing cows? It is delivering such a nice nutritious food, milk. Not only milk. According to Vedic system, the cow is so important, even the urine, even the stool, of cow is important.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Yogeśvara: Maybe he will tell them at his meeting.

Prabhupāda: (laughter) But he could not defend that he has got brain, yes. So however these men may declare very, very big, we know that "You have no brain. You are as good as animal." Therefore Bhāgavata says, śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ: (SB 2.3.19) "These classes of men are no better than the dogs, hogs, camels and asses." Bhāgavata school will not approve of these rascals as human being. They are so strict. If one is not on the platform of God consciousness, he is not human being. He is animal. That's a fact. But we should not hate the animals because our mission is to bring them to the human consciousness. You cannot expect that your audience should be all highly brain. No. Preaching is required because they have no brain. Therefore your duty is to tolerate all difficulties and bring them to the sense of brain. Not that "These people are animals; we shall not mix with them." Then you have no missionary activities. Then you sit down in a place and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Then don't open centers. That is also dangerous. If we imitate Haridāsa Ṭhākura, "Let us all chant and do nothing," then the māyā, the women, they are very expert. They could not conquer over Haridāsa Ṭhākura, but she'll conquer upon you. And become victim. Therefore we have to be active. We cannot imitate Haridāsa. Anyone who has imitated the Haridāsa Ṭhākura, he has fallen down. He has fallen. He must fall down because imitating the highest personality, for which he is not fit. Therefore he's going to fall down. When by preaching, by chanting, we will be expert, then it is possible. So whether Bhagavān is coming or not?

Guru-gaurāṅga: He missed his airplane.

Morning Walk -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Therefore they are rascals. He is controlled in every step, and he is thinking... Therefore rascals. In spite of this big, big house, nice road and good car, they are rascals. But he thinks falsely. He thinks that he is independent; He will not die. Then why does he think like that, like a foolish man? As soon as māyā kicks on his face, he will die. That's all. Immediately. "I have got some business, sir." "No, no, you must die immediately." And still, he thinks that he is not controlled. What is this nonsense? We shall go that side? That is knowledge, that "In spite of my all so-called advancement of civilization, I am controlled." That is knowledge. That is the beginning of knowledge. Then he should think how to get out of it. That is intelligence. And if, like cats and dogs, he thinks that "I am not controlled," then he is no better than cats and dogs. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni (BG 3.27). By prakṛti, by nature, he is pulled by the ears, "Come here!" "Yes, sir." "Come there!" "Yes, sir." And he is thinking, not controlled. As soon as he eats little more than he requires, "You must starve three days!" And he is not controlled. Just see. How much foolishness. And they are getting Nobel Prize. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥ (SB 7.5.31). Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ (SB 2.3.19).

Room Conversation -- June 11, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Jātu. What is...? Even for some time, they did not hear. Purport?

Nitāi: "The general mass of people, unless they are trained systematically for a higher standard of life in spiritual values, are no better than animals, and in this verse they have been particularly put on the level of dogs, hogs, camels and asses. Modern university education practically prepares one to acquire a doggish mentality to accept the service of a greater master. Like the dogs, after finishing so-called education, the so-called educated persons move from door to door with applications for some service,..."

Prabhupāda: At least, we have got this experience in India. There are so many unemployed, educated. Because they have been educated as dog, they must find out a master. Otherwise, they have no independent power to work. Dog, unless he finds out a very nice master, it is street dog, loitering in the street.

Room Conversations -- September 10, 1974, Vrndavana:

Devotee (2): They'll all be cheated.

Prabhupāda: No, not a single person. Actually he remains slave, artificially he thinks that "I am master." Just like Nixon was thinking. He was actually slave of the nation, but he was thinking, "I am master." When he was pressed too much, he had to admit, "Yes, I am your slave." He was pressed. Rather, oppressed. Nobody is thinking. Idam adya mayā labdham imaṁ prāpsye punar dhanam. Everyone is thinking, "I have got now so much money (indistinct) ...lot of money, so who is better than me?" (indistinct) She has become poet. Nonsense number one, and she is poet. Does not know the human psychology or animal psychology. The human psychology, animal psychology, that you have seen on the road, the sex. The animal does not require any education. The animal knows how to use sex; the man knows how to use sex. Where is the difference? Simply she is animal, she does the sex intercourse in a public street, animal (indistinct) an apartment, very nice apartment (indistinct). It is (indistinct), either you are dog or a human being, the fact is. He also sleeps. He sleeps on the street anywhere, and we sleep in a nice apartment. He also eats, and the human being also eats. He eats the stool and we eat very nice, palatable foodstuff. That sleeping propensity is there, sex life is there, and he is also afraid of enemies. Where is the difference? Difference is that dog cannot be taught Kṛṣṇa consciousness but a man can be taught. That is the difference. So if man does not take advantage of this human life, how to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, then he is no better than a dog. He has no (indistinct)

Devotee (1): So her poetry is just like the braying of the ass.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Professors -- February 19, 1975, Caracas:

Professor: I don't care who is the owner of my body. I know that it is not going to be eternally mine because this body is going to corrupt, is going to die, and we will have to bury it so that everybody will be happy. But I don't care about that because I...

Prabhupāda: That is animal. That is animal. That is animal conception. That is animal conception, that a dog doesn't care. Similarly, if you don't care, then you are no better than the dog.

Professor: I would not agree with that.

Prabhupāda: Why not? Because your conception, the dog conception, the same.

Professor: Well, you were saying beforehand...

Prabhupāda: No, no, the dog doesn't care whether he is the proprietor of the body or not. So if I don't care, then what is the difference between dog and me?

Professor: The difference between dog and men is a very slight one, that men can think, that men can reason.

Prabhupāda: So, you say slight; we say nothing. Unless one has got this transcendental knowledge, he is no better than the dog.

Room Conversation with Psychiatrist -- February 22, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: The physical defect... Just like a driver of the car, and when his car is damaged, the driver becomes very sorry that "My car is now broken, damaged," but is the driver the carriage? Sometimes a valuable car is damaged and the proprietor or the driver, he becomes very sorry, almost half-dead, "Oh, my car is lost." So this is due to his too much attraction for the car. When the machine car stops (it) does not mean the driver is damaged. But he thinks, "Now, I am finished. My car is damaged." But although he is not the car, he thinks that he is damaged. So that is mental disease. He is different from the car, but he thinks that he is damaged by the damage of the car. And if he knows correctly, that "What is that? I will get another new car," what is the cause of suffering? The driver is not the car, but on account of his too much absorption, identifying the car with him, he suffers. So if the psychiatrist informs him that "Why you are sorry? You are not the car," then he is cured. So the modern civilization defect is that he is not this body, but he does not know it. Therefore, in the Vedic literature it is said, yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke: (SB 10.84.13) "Anyone is identifying himself with this body which is made of material element," yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu, "and in bodily relationship he is thinking his family is protector, his nation is protector, in this way, one who lives, he is no better than the animal." Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā... You find out this verse, aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase.

Room Conversation with three Trappist Monks, Psychologists from the University of Georgia, and Atlanta Lawyer, Michael Green -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta:

Guest (1): ...at the present time in this country to 10% of the people. They don't have jobs. They are let out. They can't...

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, every country, every country. Now, just like you are highly educated. Your country could not give you service. You are coming here. And that is śūdra. One who cannot live independently, he is śūdra. Paricaryātmakaṁ karyaṁ śūdra-karma svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). Kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ. In this age, everyone is practically śūdra, because nobody can live independently. So we are producing mass śūdras. Therefore it is in chaotic condition. The Communist is the last word of the śūdras. The Communist philosophy is that "We are worker. We have all the power. We must have all the power." And that they are doing. And because they do not want to obey any authority, therefore they are denying existence of God. This is the tendency of the modern society. Not only they do not know what is God, and they are trying to disobey the orders of God. So practically there is no religion. And without religion human society is animal society. Dharmeṇa hīnā pasubhiḥ samānāḥ. "Human being without any ideas of religion, God, he is no better than animal." That is the difference between animal and human being. Animal eats, we eat; animal sleeps, we sleep; animal have sexual intercourse, we have; animal also defends, we also defend. These are common features. And what is the special feature? The special feature of human being—that he can understand what is God. So if he does not understand God, he is animal, because the distinction between animal and man is being avoided. So far other activities are concerned, they are the same as of human being and as of animal. But what is the distinction? The distinction is that in the human society there is an endeavor to understand God, and the animal society, there is no such endeavor. So when the so-called human society becomes devoid of God consciousness, it is animal society. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is meant for raising the human society to the real platform of human society, not to keep them in the animal platform. Try to understand God and love Him. This is the substance of Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.

Interview -- March 5, 1975, New York:

Reporter: Swamiji, I have one other question for you, please. By definition, it seems to me anyway, and I think to other observers, and sympathetic observers at that, that you have asked your spiritual children to leave the outer world in the West and to go deep within the heart of ISKCON, within your heart and the heart of the Supreme, to accomplish what you've set as their goal. What about outer service to humanity in this incarnation?

Prabhupāda: This is the best humanity's service. They were all fools and rascals and we educated them for spiritual understanding. The material... If I think "I am this body," then I am no better than cat and dog. That is going on. "I am American." "I am Indian." "I am Hindu." "I am Muslim." "I am Christian." Only this bodily relationship. But suppose you have come to me, can I ask you whether you are body or something else?

Reporter: Swamiji, perhaps the deficiency is in my question. Let me rephrase the question, if you'll permit. And I realize there isn't much air to breathe. Hare Kṛṣṇa. But I will make the question brief. My question has to do with karma-yoga in the outer world, for instance, in New York City. From what I understand, your disciples do not pursue the professions. Is that correct?

Prabhupāda: No, we are also, we are also karma-yogī. We are also eating, we are also sleeping.

Room Conversation with Kim Cornish -- May 8, 1975, Perth:

Kim: One more question. What do you think of the use of drugs as an aid?

Prabhupāda: Drugs? That is another side of madness. Just like, human being, after the evolution of 8 million forms of bodies, he comes to human body to understand philosophy, these Vedas. So instead of utilizing life for that purpose, he wants to become again like the cats and dogs, and therefore he takes drugs. He is already cat and dog. He's no better than cats and dogs, because he has no interest in this knowledge. He was meant for this knowledge but he remains like cats and dogs, therefore he is not satisfied, therefore he takes drugs to forget himself. This is the philosophy of drugs. He was meant for becoming satisfied by taking this knowledge. He does not get the chance. Nobody leads him to this knowledge. He remains like cats and dogs, but as a human being if he lives like cats and dogs, he'll never be happy. Because there is no happiness, therefore he takes drugs, to forget. This is the drug philosophy. Drug philosophy means to forget one's present suffering. He must suffer, because his consciousness is developed. He must take this Vedic knowledge, but he does not take. Therefore he is dissatisfied, and to counteract the dissatisfaction he takes drugs. This is drug philosophy.

Room Conversation with Carol Cameron -- May 9, 1975, Perth:

Carol: Would the intellect be helpful in knowing God?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Unless you have got the necessary intellect, then you are no better than the animals. The animals have no intellect to understand God, but the human being has got that intellect. That is the distinction between animal and human being. (break) Sleeping, the human being also sleeps; they also sleep. Then sex enjoyment: the human being also enjoy, and the animals also enjoy. And protection from fear or becoming fearful—the human being is also fearful and arranges for protection, and the animal also does. So far the primary necessities of life, that is equal in animal and human being. But the human being has a special intellect developed than the animals that he can understand what he is, what is God, what is this cosmic manifestation, and what is the aim of life, how we should conduct. These things are prerogatives for the human being. The animals have no such prerogative. So if we do not utilize these special intellectual activities, then we remain animal. We do not make any development. So at the present moment they are improving the method of primary necessities of life—eating, sleeping, mating and defending. They are thinking the dog is eating on the floor; if we can eat on table, chair and nice dish, that is advancement of civilization. They are thinking like that. The dog is sleeping on the floor, and if we sleep in very nice apartment, very decorated, that is advancement of civilization. The dog is having sexual intercourse on the street without any shame, and we are also coming to that point already. And if we have sex intercourse in the name of love and so on, so on, that is advancement. And dog is defending with his jaws and nails and teeth, you are defending with atomic bomb, therefore we are advanced. But they have forgotten that the human being has got this special intellect to understand God. That they are not doing. Just like you are going to be a doctor in anthropology.

Morning Walk -- May 10, 1975, Perth:

Amogha: Next time when there is a war, then they will feel more inclined to fight, knowing that there may be a tree for them.

Prabhupāda: It means, this is government deceiving. The man is not there. And even if he is there, suppose the soldier after dying for his country has become a tree, is it a very good reward? (laughter) How foolishly they are thinking. We have to point out their foolishness. That is our business. They are working very hard, undoubtedly, but they are working foolishly. Śrama eva hi kevalam (SB 1.2.8). The result is simply they are becoming tired. That's all. Because they are not working intelligently, like monkey, he is busy all day. What is the value of your busy? You'll find the monkey is never sitting idle. He's always busy, "eḥ, eh, eh." (imitating monkey) So what is the result of that busyness? He's a monkey. And they claim to be coming from monkey, these rascals. So we can see that your monkey's quality is already there. (laughter) You have not improved more than monkey, because you are working uselessly. They are theorizing that they have come from monkey, and as soon as you say that you are monkey, they become angry. Just see. They are claiming that we are coming from monkey. And if you say you are monkey, no better than monkey, then they are angry. Just see.

Room Conversation with Alcohol and Drug Hospital People -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: Because it is sinful. It is sinful. According to Vedic conception, these four things are sinful activities, four pillars. Just like four pillars, the legs of this table, similarly, illicit sex, meat-eating, intoxication, and gambling are the four legs of sinful life.

Guest (1): What do you consider illicit sex?

Prabhupāda: Illicit sex means animal life. The marriage is in the human society, not in the dog society. So if one has illicit sex, that means he is no better than dog.

Guest (2): I don't quite understand that. Did you say that illicit means sex between people who are not married?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Sex is allowed only married couple. And that is also only for begetting child.

Guest (1): Married under what law? Under what religion? Under what religious law?

Prabhupāda: There is in Bhagavad-gītā, that dharmāviruddhaḥ kāmo 'smi. Find out. You can come here and read.

Paramahaṁsa: Which was that? Dharma...

Prabhupāda: Dharmāviruddhaḥ kāmo 'smi.

Paramahaṁsa: Dharmāviruddho bhūteṣu?

Prabhupāda: No, dharmāviruddhaḥ kāmo 'smi. Dharma-aviruddha. You know that verse.

Morning Walk -- May 18, 1975, Perth:

Śrutakīrti: Yeah, we are leaving at twelve-thirty. So we have two hours. That is sufficient.

Prabhupāda: Hm. The world is full of rascals and fourth-class men. That is our verdict, Kṛṣṇa's verdict. A human being does not know God, he's no better than dog. He is dog. Who knows God? There are so many scientists, philosophers, now everywhere. And they are discussing on sex philosophy, homosex philosophy, Darwin's theory. All third class, fourth class, they are controlling. Now they are gradually coming to chaotic condition, and their problems, engage so many big, big officials how to solve. Oh, why you created problem, first of all? You third-class, fourth-class men, you have created problem, and now we are trying to make solution—another problem. And because you are the same fourth-class men, how you can make a solution? You have created the problems. The man who creates problems, can he make solution? So you are the same fourth-class man, how you can make a solution? Bring first-class man. But there are no first-class men. All rogues and rascals. Things are becoming bad to worse, and still they'll claim, "We are first class."

Morning Walk -- May 23, 1975, Melbourne:

Australian devotee 4: Why, then, Śrīla Prabhupāda, is a person given a human body then, if they...

Prabhupāda: Yes, that means better conscience. He can consider so many things. "Why I am dying? I do not want to die. Why there are so many miserable condition?" We are covering because there is miserable condition of this winter. I don't want to suffer from cold. Therefore I am covered. So this is struggle for existence. The human being can understand that why there is struggle? Why not I am happy naturally? This question must be there. Otherwise he is cat and dog. The dogs do not inquire all these things. Then if you have no such power to inquire and understand, then you are no better than dog. And if you are happy to remain cats and dogs, that is your business. But a real human being, he will never be happy. That is human being. Everyone is trying to improve his material condition. Therefore the motor car is going here and there, here and there. Why they are trying? Let them remain satisfied in any condition. The modern economic law is that create new necessities of life.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1975, Honolulu:

Bali-mardana: Yes, but by Darwinism they become reduced to just animals, no better than monkeys.

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is meant for the monkeys, not for any sane gentleman. Sane gentleman will think that "I have become now... By evolution I have come to this stage human being. What is next? And that is sane.

Guru kṛpā: That is a good argument.

Prabhupāda: He will think, "What is next? Is it finished here?" The rascal says, "No, after finishing, everything is finished." What is this? If there is evolution—you have come to this stage —then what is the next stage? That is natural. That is answered in the Bhagavad-gītā. Yānti deva-vratā devān (BG 9.25). Now you can go to the moon planet if you try. Moon planet, sun planet, Venus and so many. If you become serious. And you can go to God's planet, mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām. Now you select where will you will go. But there is spiritual planet. But what is their theory? That after finishing this body, everything is finished.(?) They do not believe in the next life.

Morning Walk -- July 16, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: Again chance.

Bahulāśva: This has become a very popular subject, psychology. About 80% of the students take a class in this. And they took a survey, and the reason most students take this class is to find out more about who they are themself. So it is the closest thing in the west to self-realization.

Jayatīrtha: They've found out that "I am no better than the animal"? That's the conclusion?

Dharmādhyakṣa: One school. Then there's another school. They say, "How can you base a theory of human nature on animals?" They do not like this. They are revolting against making man an animal.

Bahulāśva: Bhagavad-gītā gives the best psychology.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bahulāśva: How to control the mind to uplift the self.

Prabhupāda: (break) So why the dogs cannot construct such building? (break) ...psychology? Why they haven't got the same psychology?

Press Conference -- July 16, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: America, or any other part of the world, we are all spiritual being. We cannot be satisfied only with the bodily necessities of life. Naturally there is question, "What I am? I am simply this body or something else?" That question naturally comes in human mind. That is very good. A dog cannot think like that. Therefore in the human life it is necessary to question: "What I am? Why I am put into miserable conditions of life? I do not want it, but it is forced upon me. If there is any remedy, what is that remedy?" These questions are very big questions. So unless you, a human being, is awakened to these questions, he is no better than animal.

Bhaktadāsa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, what effects are the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement having on the Christian-Judaic culture or the traditional religious culture?

Prabhupāda: We are speaking of religion. Religion means to know God and to love God. So does the Christian-Jewish religious system deny this? Then where is the difference? If Christian religion is meant for understanding God and try to love Him, the same thing we are preaching. The same thing, Jewish religion may be preaching. And where is that religion who denies the supremacy of God? What is that religion? Is there any religion in the world who denies the supremacy of God? We say, "Religion means the laws given by God." This is our definition.

Morning Walk -- August 7, 1975, Toronto:

Indian Man (2): Prabhupāda, these people, dogs, mostly are atheist? Atheist, they take the birth as the dog?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Unless one is atheist, how he takes to dog? Theist takes to God, and they takes to dog. That's it. Not only animal dog, but they associate with a human dog, two-legged dogs. There are four-legged, and there are two-legged dogs-human being, but dog. He is also like dog, although he has got two legs and they have got four legs. In the parks it is by law prohibited to take dog, but he is dog. He violate the dog's law. Therefore he is no better than dog. (break) ...defect of modern civilization—they are keeping people as dog, and they want to make them human beings by law. They are thinking, "If we impose this law, things will be all right." But how things will be all right? If you keep them dog, how the things will be all right? So we are training from dog to humanity. That is our special activities. We do not keep them as dog. We bring them to become godly. Then things will be all right. Other so-called gurus, they keep the disciple to remain as dog. Please pay him, and he... Asikbada—he will be all right. This is going on. (break) ...our class begin?

Brahmānanda: What time do the Deities open?

Viśvakarmā: Usually the Deities open at seven.

Prabhupāda: So we shall go back?

Viśvakarmā: Yes.

Morning Walk -- October 2, 1975, Mauritius:

Brahmānanda: So both the devotee and the nondevotee, they are both in the same position. They both...

Prabhupāda: They... And the devotees know that we are under the control of the Supreme, but you do not know. You are cats and dogs, and the dogs do not know, the cats do not know, you do not know. Therefore you are no better than the cats and dogs. And we know that there is God; there is controller. Therefore we are not cats and dogs. We are equal to the cats and dogs. You do not know; therefore you remain cats and dogs. We know.

Brahmānanda: What is the harm of being a cat or a dog?

Prabhupāda: That is later on. First of all you do not know; we know. That is the difference. If somebody knows there is government, he is better than the outlaws who don't, doesn't care for the government. He is better position, a good citizen. Who accepts that there is government is good citizen. And one who doesn't care for the government, does whimsically everything, he becomes criminal. And then he is punished. That is the difference.

Press Conference -- October 2, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means we are trying to eradicate this conception of life, bodily conception of life. The animals... An animal, he is also thinking, "I am dog," "I am cat," "I am cow," "I am ass," on account of this bodily concept of life. And if we human beings, we also remain in that bodily concept of life, then we are no better than the animals. So if we remain animals, there cannot be any peace. You bring a dozens of dogs, and if you keep them, they cannot be improved. They will remain as animal. They have no capacity. And if you ask them to live peacefully, it is not possible, because they are animals. Similarly, if we human beings, although we are not animals, but we are not being educated as human being, and therefore we remain as animal, so how there can be any peace? The animal eats; we eat. The animal sleeps; we sleep. The animals have sex life; we have got sex life. The animal defends; we also defend. So if we remain engaged only on the principles of four demands of body, then we remain animal. Our extra education requires that "I am not this body; I am spirit soul." And there is necessity of the soul. If we don't come to this platform, then we remain animals. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means we are trying to bring human being to the platform of spiritual consciousness or real human being.

Room Conversation with the Rector, Professor Olivier and Professors of the University of Durban, Westville -- October 8, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: He remains an animal. Just like a dog is thinking, "I am dog." So similarly, if I think, "I am Hindu," then what is the difference? Or if I am thinking, "I am this or that," with the bodily conception of life... Yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke (SB 10.84.13). If one is thinking in terms of bodily conception—"I am this body"—and based on this foundation, sva-dhī kalatrādiṣu bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ, our family, society, national, so many things we are building up on this bodily conception of life... So,

yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke

sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ

yat-tīrtha-buddhiḥ salile na karhicij

janeṣv abhijñeṣu sa eva go-kharaḥ

(SB 10.84.13)

Such person is no better than the cow and the asses because he is giving his identification with this body, which he is not. And Vedic realization is ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am not this body; I am spirit soul."

Room Conversation with Bill Faill (reporter) -- October 8, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: They are in darkness. Therefore this movement is very important to take the civilized man from the darkness because everyone is thinking, "I am this body." So long we are in this bodily conception of our life, we are no better than animal. The animal, they keep themselves always in bodily conception: "I am dog," "I am cat," "I am cow," "I am this." If we also keep in that platform, then where is the difference between dog and me?

Faill: There is none then.

Prabhupāda: The dog is barking. He is thinking, "I am dog. I am appointed here as watchman, watchdog, and as soon as somebody is passing, 'Yow! Gow! Gow!' " So, and similarly, if I keep myself in the dog mentality and act like that—"Why you have come to this country? Why you have come to my jurisdiction?" the same dog mentality.

Faill: Is it vital to follow certain eating habits? I mean...

Prabhupāda: Yes. The whole process is how to purify ourself. So by... according to eating, the purification also... I think Mr. Bernard Shaw, he wrote one book that "You Are What You Eat." And that's a fact. We constitute our bodily atmosphere and mental atmosphere according to eating. So our Kṛṣṇa conscious movement recommends... Not the movement recommends. It is recommended in the śāstra that to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, you eat the remnants of foodstuff left by Kṛṣṇa. Just like opposite way: if a tuberculosis patient eats something and if you eat the remnants, then you will be infected with the tuberculosis bacillus. Is it not? So similarly, if you eat kṛṣṇa-prasādam, then you infect Kṛṣṇa consciousness. This is our process. We don't take anything directly. We offer to Kṛṣṇa. Then we take kṛṣṇa-prasādam. That helps us. We do not take anything... We cannot take anything from the restaurant or from the shop. No. We prepare everything, offer to Kṛṣṇa. Then we take.

Morning Walk -- October 19, 1975, Johannesburg:

Indian man (1): And that comes through lack of spiritual knowledge, Swamiji?

Prabhupāda: Yes, no knowledge. No spiritual knowledge means he is animal. That's all. Sa eva gokharaḥ. This is the final verdict. One who has no spiritual knowledge, he is no better than these cows and dogs. That's all. Therefore guidance of the brāhmaṇa required. Why the brāhmaṇas are selected to guide? Because they have got full vijñāna, jñānaṁ vijñānam āstikyam, therefore.

Indian man (1): It is very necessary for the brāhmaṇas. We must have brāhmaṇas in the society.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. You are very intelligent. Therefore we are creating some brāhmaṇas. We are not creating the busy fools. No.

Morning Walk -- November 3, 1975, Bombay:

Indian man (7): Attention.

Prabhupāda: Full attention. And attention means with good intelligence, (dog barking) not foolishly. (Hindi) That "You are not body. Why you are fighting?" Will they hear? (Hindi) That "My dear dog, you are not this body. Why you are fighting?" He will never understand. Similarly, if a man does not understand, he is no better than the dog.

Dr. Patel: śuni caiva śva-pākeṣu paṇḍitaḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18).

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore we like everyone. We do not reject anyone. Dog cannot understand the philosophy. Therefore we call him and give some prasādam. (laughter)

Dr. Patel: So if we take also prasādam, don't... (laughing)

Prabhupāda: Therefore prasāda distribution is one of our program.

Dr. Patel: For?

Prabhupāda: For everyone.

Morning Walk -- November 4, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: That the consciousness comes after the combination of...

Prabhupāda: We are talking of this verse, that if this is the composition of the body, these things are available anywhere. Why don't you create life? Therefore he is no better than the dogs. He has no intelligence that "How this combination of blood, urine, stool, and bone, and muscle can create life?" They are thinking that a combination of matter can bring life force. That is the so-called scientists' theory. So these things are available in large quantity, so why don't you create life? Therefore go-kharaḥ. Their intelligence is not better than the cows and the asses from the very beginning. If they are not cows and asses, how they can think of that combination of these material things can bring in life? When a man dies, find out if there is scarcity of stool or scarcity of urine or scarcity of blood. Bring it and inject it. These rascals, they cannot do it, and still they are calculating urine examination, blood examination and this examination. (laughter) No, I am not saying. It is śāstra. (laughter) Take this dead man's body, and whatever urine and stool is there, examine, and then inject, and come him, let him back, come to life. Then I will understand that your examination of the stool, urine is perfect. This is common question. So long the soul was there, you are very expert to examine stool, urine and this and that. But when the soul is gone... Now the stool is there; urine is there. Why don't you examine and give life? This is our challenge.

Morning Walk -- November 16, 1975, Bombay:

Indian man (3): What is your idea about the secularism preached by our government of India and the policy of secularism? What do they mean by that? That means they say that there is no place for religion.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Dharmena hina paśubhiḥ samana. As soon as there is no religion, the population-animal, that's all. That is going on. Because there was no religion, therefore the government has to declare emergency. (laughter) Because all animals. So they created first animals, then emergency. This is going on. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Why emergency? If there is human being, then why emergency? All animals. To control the animals you require some special measure. This is the proof that they're animals. Otherwise why? Hare Kṛṣṇa. That is long, long ago said, dharmena hina paśubhiḥ samana: "When you give up religion, you are no better than animals."

Morning Walk -- November 16, 1975, Bombay:

Brahmānanda: Increase the population. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Our plan is the best because before meeting such catastrophes, go back to home, back to Godhead. This is the best. They are seeing the catastrophe, but they have no way to escape. That is the difference between them and ourselves. Jaya. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. (break) ...said that "There is no need of God, but there is need of girl, of a girl." He said that. Then what is the difference between a scientist and a dog? The dog also does not know what is God, but another female dog he wants. Huh? What is the difference? Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). Then it is proved that he is no better than animal. The animal requires another opposite sex, but he does not know God. Then where is the difference? (break)

Brahmānanda: You know that the Detroit house, the house in Detroit? The president, he wrote in his letter. I neglected to ask you. He wanted to have a name for that temple.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walks -- January 22-23, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) How they are bringing ruination. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥ (SB 7.5.31). The blind men led by another blind man. It is not new. In the Bhāgavata therefore it is warned that "Don't follow hog philosophy." Viḍ-bhujāṁ ye. This kind of philosophy, that for sense gratification, laboring whole day and night, writing books, philosophizing and all these things, it is meant for the hogs, not for human being. Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke kaṣṭān kāmān arhate viḍ-bhujāṁ ye (SB 5.5.1). This kind of civilization is meant for the hogs. So they are exhibiting that they are no better than hog.

Śāstrījī: Śuddhyed yasmād brahma-saukhyaṁ tv anantam. Brahma-saukhya, ananta-brahma-saukhya. (break) (sings Bengali verses)

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) Don't manufacture knowledge. Take knowledge from Bhagavān. And that is our business. (Bengali) Don't order Bhagavān. Just follow Bhagavān. That is wanted. (Bengali) Don't write concocted poetries. That is not beneficial. Simply follow. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, yāre dekha tāre kaha kṛṣṇa-upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). That is your business, not to give upadeśa to Kṛṣṇa, "Kṛṣṇa, do this." Nāciye nāciye āile gopāla: "My dear Gopāla, please come to me, nāciye, dancing." And the Gopāla is father's servant. Ordering, "Gopāla, come," nāciye nāciye, "my sense gratification." It is all nonsense. Why should you ask Gopāla to come to you? (Bengali) You cannot order. You must follow. (Bengali) ...to carry out the order of God, not to order God to carry out my order. That is mistake.

Morning Walks -- January 22-23, 1976, Mayapura:

Harikeśa: Pigs don't like to live in a clean house.

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is a story in Bhāgavata that Indra was cursed to become a pig. So after some time there was mismanagement in the heavenly kingdom. Brahmā personally came, "Indra, anyway, you became pig. Now you come with me." "Huh? How can I go? I have got so much responsibility." Then he was killed and took to heaven. So any life, any abominable condition, everyone is thinking, "I am perfect." This is called māyā. Any abominable condition, he is thinking, everyone is thinking, that "I am perfect. I have nothing to advance." This is called māyā. They do not know what is perfection. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). The ideal perfection they do not know. They are trying that "We shall make this pig life adjusted to civilized life." Is it possible? Pig life and adjusting to civilized life? Hare Kṛṣṇa. So we shall get down? (break) Nobody will accept. But if you explain that "You are no better than pigs and hogs and asses," then they will accept. So we have to take the idea from Bhāgavata and explain it for their understanding. That is wanted. (break) People are working so hard. Is it pleasure? But why they are working? They are working with the only hope that "Night, I shall go home, eat nicely and have sex with my wife." That's all. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham (SB 7.9.45). Otherwise why they will work so hard? Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...Los Angeles we have got a plant like this next to my window. That land for others, but it comes to my window.

Morning Walk -- April 24, 1976, Melbourne:

Devotee (1): Chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa...

Prabhupāda: (break) ...difference between animal and man. Therefore if one is not spiritually advanced or has no spiritual sense, he's animal. He is not human being. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). The verdict is already there. Sa eva go-kharaḥ. He is nothing, no better than the cows and asses.

Devotee (3): Often the devotee thinks that he's more unhappy than the karmīs because he knows he's unhappy.

Prabhupāda: Then that means he is not a devotee.

Devotee (3): He's not a devotee.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He's not devotee. Devotee means the first sign will be happy, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). If he's not prasannātmā, he's a rascal. He has not entered even devotional life. He's outside. That is the test. Just like Dhruva Mahārāja. When he saw Viṣṇu, he said, "Everything is all right. I don't want anything." Svāmin kṛtārtho 'smi. That is Vaiṣṇava. And if he is still in want or unhappiness, that means he has no spiritual life at all. He is simply making a show.

Morning Walk -- April 26, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: All rascals. They are not ācāryas.

Guru-kṛpā: Last night this boy sits down and immediately he says, "I am a Hindu." I said, "What is this Hindu business? We are not interested in Hindu." Then he said, "Well, you do not know." "How you can say we do not know?" "Well, I was born a Hindu." So I said, "So how you know what I was born? What does that matter, where we were born? A learned person doesn't speak birth." Representing himself as very advanced or something. "Okay, you become Brahman, but we think that that is hell. That is no better than hell for us. And that is the liberation that the demons get. So we are satisfied to chant Kṛṣṇa's name, and we never want to become one. We would rather go to hell, because in hell we can chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, but in the Brahman we cannot chant."

Prabhupāda: Staunch adherent. (break)

Guru-kṛpā: ...in Bhāgavatam, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that when a devotee, he sees a banyan, fruit of a banyan tree, and there are so many seeds within that fruit, and each seed can mean one tree and one tree means millions of fruits, and in this way the devotee can appreciate Kṛṣṇa. But the jñānīs, they go on speculating, and they can never relish anything. The devotee can simply relish how Kṛṣṇa has done everything in the material nature.

Prabhupāda: We can go here? No. And no...

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes. It is a little distance there.

Room Conversation with George Gullen, President of Wayne State University -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Everyone's body is temporary, either human body or cat's body, dog's body. But the human body is important because in the human body we have developed consciousness by which we can understand what is God. The cats and dogs, they cannot, they haven't got that developed consciousness. Therefore if we do not use this developed consciousness for understanding God and our relationship with Him, then we are no better than cats and dogs. Cats and dogs cannot be educated about God, but a human being can be educated. That is the distinction between animals and man. But modern education is keeping them in ignorance about God, so they are no better than cats and dogs. And how can you bring peace among cats and dogs? Can you bring in peace calling all the dogs of your city and sit down peacefully? No, that is not possible. So if we keep our citizens like cats and dogs, then how we can expect peace?

George Gullen: We are much in ignorance about those matters, I understand that, and...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Complete ignorance, like animals. So the leaders of the society, if they are serious about advancement of human civilization, they must take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness; otherwise, they'll be baffled.

Interview with Kathy Kerr Reporter from The Star -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Kathy Kerr: Do you advocate then that one deny the body? Like comforts and so forth, in order to...

Prabhupāda: No, why deny the body? Just like you are putting some type of dress. So dress is not unimportant. But real importance is you, the person. So where is that education about the real person? They are simply engrossed with the dress. This is going on. Such kind of mentality is there even within the cats and dogs. He's also thinking "I am this body." If a human being does not understand this fact, that he is not this body, he is changing his body, but he is spirit soul, then he is no better than the cats and dogs. We do not want to keep the human society in the category of cats and dogs. We want to raise them to the real understanding of his identification. That is our mission. It is neither Hindu religion or Muslim religion or.... This is science.

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Kulādri: What if one has material desire? How does he gain the desire for spiritual knowledge?

Prabhupāda: That means you are cats and dogs. The dog has no inquisitiveness. Therefore you are no better than the dog. The dog never comes to a spiritual master, "Give me some knowledge." Therefore you are as good as the dog. That is your qualification.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: So all different aspects of material knowledge...

Prabhupāda: You have to learn from a superior person.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But now there is distinction between two types of knowledge. If knowledge means understanding...

Prabhupāda: No, no. Any knowledge, if you want to get it, you must receive it from a superior person. That is the law. That I already explained. If you want to steal, if you want to become a thief, you have to learn it from an expert thief. So any knowledge. Knowledge means you have to learn it from a superior person. And what to speak of the knowledge of God. That is the ultimate knowledge. Yesterday we were speaking that Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja learned how to make samosas. Now that knowledge is distributed. So every knowledge, you have to learn it from an expert. That is called guru. Guru means expert. Heavy. Who's knowledge is heavier than your scanty knowledge. You have to learn knowledge. Guru means heavy. Therefore Vedic injunction is tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). You must. Abhigacchet, this word is used when the sense is "must." Not optional, that I may go or I may not go. No, you must. This is Vedic injunction.

Garden Conversation -- June 27, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: That is the purport. Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsu śreya uttamam (SB 11.3.21). One has to go to guru when one is inquisitive. Jijñāsu. Jijñāsu means we want to know so many things; that is our nature. Child also wants to know. He asks his parents, "What is this, father? What is this, mother?" That inquisitiveness is there in everyone. So when one wants to know about the Supreme, then he requires a guru, or spiritual master. It is not a fashion that "Everyone keeps a guru; let me also have a guru." Not like that. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). "In order to understand the transcendental science, one has to go to guru." Jijñāsu śreya uttamam. After artha,... Just like generally, naturally, one goes to temple, church... Four classes of men. One is needy: "O God, give us our daily bread." One thinks... Actually, that is the fact. God gives us bread. So traditionally we are trained up. So we go to God, "Give us our daily bread." Similarly, one who wants to know what is God. Just like in our society, in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they see that these boys, young boys, they have given up everything, they are after Kṛṣṇa. What is this Kṛṣṇa? That is intelligent. Why they are after this Kṛṣṇa? Then he has to go to a person, guru. In this way, there are many circumstances. But the real purpose is to know the Supreme. One who is inquisitive or anxious to know about the Supreme, then there is necessity of guru. Otherwise, what is the use of it? One who is not inquisitive to understand the Supreme, he has no business for a guru. But everyone has necessity to understand the Supreme. That is human life. A dog cannot inquire what is God, because he is dog. But a man can do that. He has got that developed intelligence. So if a man does not inquire about the Supreme Truth, he is no better than a dog. If one does not seek after spiritual master, he's a dog. He's in the standard of dog. Because that inquiry is the particular business of human being, to inquire about the Supreme. If he does not inquire, then still he's on the platform of dog. First of all, you have understood it or not? So any human being with developed intelligence must go to a spiritual master. If he does not go, then he's still in the animal platform. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). Abhigacchet means he must. If he does not, then he is in the animal platform.

Conversation with Prof. Saligram and Dr. Sukla -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: It is a machine manufactured by the material nature under the order of Kṛṣṇa. So actually it is not my body, it is Kṛṣṇa's body. Kṛṣṇa has given us. He has given you a particular type of body, He has given me a particular type of body, so many. Yantra, machine. Just like on a machine, motorcar, we sit down and travel here and there. So we wanted to travel in a certain way so we require some machine, and Kṛṣṇa has given us this machine manufactured by material nature. Mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ suyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). So Kṛṣṇa is within the core of heart of everyone. He knows what I want. He's giving us facilities. We wanted to enjoy this material world, and He's still giving direction, "All right, you want to get this facility, sit down on it and travel as you like." So we are getting different machines. Sometimes the human body machine, sometimes dog machine, sometimes cat machine, sometimes demigod machine. We are desiring all these things. American machine, Indian machine. When you are in Indian machine you are thinking "I am Indian. My business is to satisfy Indian interests." You Americans are thinking "This is American machine; it should be used for America's benefit." These are upādhi. Upādhi means designation. Neither I am Indian nor American nor cat nor dog. But as soon as I get a particular type of body, I think that I am cat, I am dog, I am Indian, I am America, I am black, I am white, this. This is our position. And people are struggling on this understanding, "I am this body." So long we think like that, "I am this body," we are no better than cats and dogs. He is also thinking "I am this body." Is it not? What do you think, Mr. Sukla? If I think I am this body, the dog is also thinking "I am this body," then where is the difference between the dog and me? What do you think, Mr... How shall I address you?

Evening Darsana -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Our men's productive. There must be food production, otherwise how the society will live. That is also a requirement. Good direction required, good government required, good production required, and good worker required. You can explain that there is no understanding of spiritual life. That they are missing the opportunity of human life.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: This Kṛṣṇa consciousness is a spiritual culture, and basically speaking the human society begins from dharma, or accepting the principle of God. Dharma begins with this acceptance of the principle of God, that human beings, their activities, have to be regulated. Just like in human society there is marriage. This is according to scripture. Every scripture regulates there must be marriage. This is dharma. It regulates certain activities that should be done, certain activities that should not be done. And basically speaking this is the beginning of human civilization; otherwise, they're simply living in a civilization of gross sense gratification which is in reality no different or no better than the society of animals. So from dharma, human society begins and generally... You can see practically that dharma generally focuses... People are taking that dharma is for the basis of economic development. This is proven practically because in pioneer times in America for example, people they were simple going to churches and synagogues, and temples and all kinds of things, what have you. And economic development was going on very nicely, in fact, economic development could not have gone on unless there was this principle of religion. People were very, practically speaking... In a pioneer situation people are very barbaric, struggle for existence—you know, you're in the country, there is no road, there's no cities—everyone is very, simply interested to maintain themselves. But by churches and things of this nature, people saw the need for a civilized give-and-take way of living—economic development. Then gradually, the ideas developed further and further, but in modern days we can see that people are having economic developments and there's no need for God, they think at least. In other words, people are no longer attending churches, synagogues, things of this nature, because they are making sufficient money without the need of religion. Therefore, the basic principle is being missed that human life is not simply meant for economic development. Human life—we analyze, we can say that...

Prabhupāda: Human life is meant for making a solution of all material problems.

Interview with Newsweek -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Interviewer: But there are some very intelligent men who are not spiritually enlightened, perhaps even men who understand that they are not, or the body is not all, the body is dead and there is something else. Why aren't these men spiritually aware?

Prabhupāda: If one does not understand this simple thing, that he is not body, then he is no better than animal. That is the first understanding of spiritual platform. If he thinks that he is body, then he is in the same category as the animals.

Rāmeśvara: Her question is... Suppose someone has some faith in life after death, and he also may be an intelligent man by material standards. Why isn't he automatically...?

Prabhupāda: No, material standard is no intelligence. Material standard is that "I am this body. I am American. I an Indian. I am fox. I am dog. I am man." This is material understanding. Spiritual understanding is beyond that, that "I am not this body." And when he tries to understand that spiritual identification, then he is intelligent. Otherwise he is not intelligent.

Interview with Newsweek -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: They have been described as mūḍha. Mūḍha means asses. So this is the first understanding, that one should not identify with this body.

Interviewer: What understandings come after...?

Prabhupāda: Just like dog. Dog understands that he is body. If a man also understands like that—he is body—then he's no better than the dog.

Interviewer: What other understandings come after this one?

Bali-mardana: After you realize that you're not the body, then what comes next?

Prabhupāda: Ha! That is intelligent question. Then one has to find out that "I am engaged only in this bodily concept of life. Then what is my engagement?" That is the inquiry of Sanātana Gosvāmī, that "You have relieved me from this material engagement. Now let me know what is my duty." For that reason one has to go to the spiritual master, to know, understand that what is his duty now. "If I am not this body, then what is my duty? Because I am busy whole day and night for this body. I am eating, I am sleeping I am having sex, I am defending—these are all bodily necessities. If I am not body, then what is my duty?" That is intelligence.

Interview with Religious Editor Of the Associated Press -- July 16, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Suppose if you are utilizing this coat, you are taking care of it, but if you think that you are coat, then you are doomed.

Bali-mardana: If you use the body you should take care of it but if you think that you are the body, then you are doomed, then it is foolishness. But you naturally you take care of the body, but you should still don't identify with it.

Interviewer: Well you know, Your Grace, the spiritual quality is an important part of life of course...

Prabhupāda: Yes, otherwise the animal. If the man does not understand the value of his spiritual quality then he's no better than the dog. The dog does not know.

Interviewer: What do you think of Jimmy Carter?

Bali-mardana: Jimmy Carter is the Presidential candidate.

Prabhupāda: I do not know. What is the (indistinct) is I do not know, neither I...

Interviewer: Not aware of that.

Bali-mardana: Doesn't care about politics.

Interviewer: But isn't, that's part of what I'm thinking about, that you and your movement tend to separate people from concern with what's going on in the world, like that's a Presidential election and Jimmy Carter is the democratic candidate. This is a disregard of what's going on in the world. Isn't that an example of it?

Prabhupāda: No, the thing is that there were many Presidents before, what is this name of this?

Bali-mardana: Jimmy Carter. He is not President yet.

Evening Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Goal is there, because spirit is important. Without spirit, matter has no value. This is a material box, but because it has no spirit, it has no value. It has value, comparatively, but not as valuable as a human being because there is no spirit. You can move, if you like, you can go immediately, but this, for many thousands of years it will lie down here. It cannot move. Because there is no spirit. Therefore spirit is important. So this distinction is possible to understand in the human form of body. What is the distinction between a human being or a living man and this box? The distinction is that the living being has the spirit soul within and the box has no spirit soul within. Now if we take care of this box outwardly, that we should take; similarly if you take care of the body only, then where is spiritual culture? If you take care of the four principles of bodily necessities, eating, sleeping and sex and defense, then where is spiritual culture? The aim should be spiritual culture, at least for human beings. The cats and dogs, they cannot understand what is the distinction between spirit and soul, er, spirit and matter, but a human being can understand. This is spiritual side, this is material side. The spiritual side is important. Therefore the goal is how to understand the spiritual side. That is the goal. If we don't cultivate the spiritual side, simply we take care of the bodily side, then we remain animals. And because people are taking only care for the body, this is animal civilization. Human civilization means to take care of the spiritual side. If there is no such attempt to take care of the spiritual side, simply for the material side, then we are no better than the animals. Because they cannot take any care of the spiritual side. They can take care of the material side.

Evening Darsana -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: The people are not aware of these things, neither they are interested to know that the soul is more important than the body. This is the beginning of the Bhagavad-gītā. Still, they are placing themselves as learned scholars in Bhagavad-gītā. But sticking to the body. And one who is sticking to the bodily concept of life, he's no better than sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). The whole civilization is going on this understanding of body. And then Kṛṣṇa begins that instruction, dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). That is very vividly explained, that the soul is important because it is eternal, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). Don't think by the end of the body the soul is also ended. It will continue, and it accepts another body, tathā dehāntara-prāptir dhīras tatra na muhyati (BG 2.13). So who is caring for this knowledge? Suppose I have got to... It is fact, we have to change this body. But what body I am going to change, who is considering? He's thinking of this body only, but he has to change. The science is there, but nobody is caring to know it. And still, they are proud of their education. And Kṛṣṇa condemns: nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ. So they are keeping themselves on the bodily concept of life and posing themselves as pandit. A person identifying himself with the body, he's go-kharaḥ, and he's posing himself as paṇḍita. This is the position.

Garden Conversation -- October 14, 1976, Chandigarh:

Indian man (4): My first identification is my own body.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is ajñāna. So long you are identifying with the body, you are no better than the animal. So we are doing that. We are fighting. "I am Indian. You are Englishman. You are this. You are that. You are..." Simply we are fighting, like cats and dogs, they fight. So that is ajñāna. How you can be prasannātmā? So when one becomes actually situated in spiritual life, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). That is the... In this way when you make further progress, when you actually understand that you are eternal servant of God, then you surrender. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). This situation takes many, many births to cultivate. And when he actually understands, jñānavān—not fools, rascals—then māṁ prapadyate, vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). That mahātmā is very rare to be found. So bhakti is not so easy. Sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ. It is not so easy. It takes many, many births to come to the understanding that vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti (BG 7.19). Sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ. Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ bhajanty ananya manasaḥ (BG 9.13). This is mahātmā.

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1976, Vrndavana:

Hari-śauri: Yes, hawker.

Prabhupāda: So he was, "Here is a book of cow protection, cow protection." He has written one book to take care of the cows. So one old man called him, "What you are selling?" Now, "I am selling this book." "What is that book?" "Maintaining the cow." So, "Why you are selling? First of all give this book to your mother because you are no better than cow, so she will learn how to give you protection." That means he wanted to impress upon him that "Cow protection doesn't require any education. You have written a book? So you are such a rascal, cow intelligence. Better give this book to your mother. She will maintain you. Don't sell it. Everyone knows how to give cow protection." So similarly, this sex literature, there is no need of sex literature. Sex literature is there in Sanskrit also. That is how to restrict sex. For what purpose one should indulge in sex, that is called Kāma-śāstra. I have seen this Freud philosophy became so prominent that sometimes in the year... 1940's maybe. So one young woman was traveling, and another young man was traveling. So they began to discuss about sex very openly. And both of them unknown. Still, they engaged themselves in discussing the sex literature, without any shame.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 4, 1977, Bombay:

Girirāja: He just said that "I will not follow religion in the traditional sense."

Prabhupāda: That means another condition. From frying pan to the fire. (laughter) Dharmena hīna paśubhiḥ samaḥ. As soon as you give up religious principles, you are no better than animal. That means he will manufacture. The same disease. "I'll not follow the traditional." This is their death block. That they always think that "I am independent. I can manufacture my way. I can become happy in that way." They're always thinking like that. And in a meeting with hundreds of men claps, that he is his liberated. "Now it is approved." Who is approving? That is criticized by Bhāgavata. Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ (SB 2.3.19). This. They are animals and they are applauding another animal. That's all. Big animal. Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ. These ordinary persons, they are paśu and they are applauding. The man who is applauded, he's another big paśu. That's all.

Morning Walk -- January 29, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: That's right. Then learn it from me. Otherwise, if you refuse, then you must be punished. That is my duty.

Hari-śauri: You were just saying that a person who's not religious, he's no better than an animal, but he might argue that even the animals have a right to live undisturbed.

Prabhupāda: No, animal... Right to live with animal is subjected to be punished, just to live rightly. Suppose a cow comes with his horn like that. He must be punished immediately, the atrocity.(?) Then he'll be corrected.

Hari-śauri: But there are so many animals living in the jungle who don't...

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. No, jungle, we have no business to go there. We have rejected jungle. Let them live there. But in the human society, if the animal disturbs, it must be punished—with stick.

Satsvarūpa: What about say a Buddhist who practices ahiṁsā...?

Prabhupāda: Now, Buddhist... I say there is no question of "Buddhist," "Christian." One must know what is God.

Room Conversation -- February 16, 1977, Mayapura:

Pradyumna: It's Canto Five, Chapter Five, verse number seven. "Even though one may be very learned and wise, he is mad if he does not understand that the endeavor for sense gratification is a useless waste of time. Being forgetful of his own interest, he tries to be happy in the material world, centering his interests around his home, which is based on sexual intercourse and which brings him all kinds of material miseries. In this way one is no better than a foolish animal."

Prabhupāda: Yes. Maithunyam agāram ajñaḥ. The selection of words in Bhāgavata are, from even literary point of view, perfect. Padaṁ padaṁ yad vipadāṁ na teṣām (SB 10.14.58). Bhavāmbudhir vatsa-padaṁ paraṁ padaṁ padaṁ padaṁ yad vipadāṁ na... This is literary. Samāśritā ye pada-pallava-plavam. Again plavaṁ plavam. Anuprāsa. This is literary, anuprāsa. Samāśritā ye pada-pallava-plavaṁ mahat-padaṁ puṇya-yaśo murāreḥ. Padam. Bhavāmbudhir vatsa-padaṁ paraṁ padaṁ padaṁ padaṁ yad vipadāṁ na teṣām. Just see literary arrangement. And full of meaning. This is Bhāgavatam. Any way you study, from literary point of view, from knowledge, from philosophy, from social, every-perfect. Therefore lokasya ajānato vidvāṁś cakre. Vidvān. One who has learned, Vyāsadeva, vidvān, the first-class learned person. The sātvata-saṁhitām—for the devotees, Vedic cream. Nigama-kalpa-taror galitaṁ phalaṁ idam (SB 1.1.3). Nobody can be like Vyāsadeva; He's incarnation of Nārāyaṇa. Where is such scholar throughout the whole world? Is there?

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That means you are not intelligent. That is the proof. "Beyond your intelligence"—that means your intelligence is not yet perfect. You're lacking in brain. (aside:) I see so many workers simply loitering. They are doing nothing. What can be done? So many. Simply they are taking money. Doing nothing. I see. There is nobody to see. They take advantage. Seventy-five percent of the workers, they are doing nothing. But the Gītā explains that within this body there is something. Not body itself is moving, but dehinaḥ asmin dehe. Within this body there is the real power, dehī, who has got this body. That is there. And because he is there, the body is changing. They cannot understand. No brain, exactly like the dogs and cats. The dog cannot understand that "Within my body, I am." They cannot. Therefore you are no better than dogs. And actual fact is you are not this body. You are within this body. It is a dress. In so many ways Bhagavad-gītā teaches, but you have no brain. Then where is brainwashing? You have no brain to understand your real position.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Why he said dhīra, sober, cool-headed? These rascals are cats and dogs. They are not civilized, even big, big professors, they say, "Swami, after finishing this body, everything is finished." Has he got brain? And they're Communist leader. Identifying with this body. This is the actual platform of that body, dehātma-buddhiḥ. And they're described in the śāstra as no better than the asses. So next point will be that where you think beyond your capacity, we begin our education from there, seeing the... Our education begins from that. First of all try to understand what is spirit. Then it will... And our whole process is how to transfer one person from the material platform to the spiritual. Therefore they are thinking "brainwash." The fools, they cannot understand where our education begins. Where they have failed, we begin from there. Where they are disappointed, that "This cannot be answered," so on, we begin from there. So who is intelligent? We are intelligent or they are? We are trying to bring man from this gross misunderstanding, misidentification platform, to come to the spiritual platform. Then he understands what is the spiritual kingdom, the spiritual life that is eternal, blissful. Then he will understand. And that is all new to these dull-headed rascals. And they are thinking... It is the same, different subject matter.

Evening Darsana -- May 13, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: (aside:) Don't talk. Why you are talking? So our real trouble is that we have become conditioned by the material identification, "I am this body." Everyone is thinking, "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am brāhmaṇa," "I am sannyāsī," everything, identification with the body. That is the dirty thing. So one has to purify, that "I am neither American, neither Indian, nor brāhmaṇa, or so many designations." Then it is called cleansing the heart. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam (CC Madhya 19.170). That is mukti, when you don't identify with this material body. And so long you identify with this material body, either you become a sannyāsī with some beard or a gṛhastha without some beard, the same thing, identifying with the body. So ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12) means to become free from the bodily designation. And śāstra says, yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke (SB 10.84.13). This body is composition of three dhātu, kapha, pitta, vāyu, according to Āyur Veda; and according to medical science, it is skin and then muscle, blood, bone, and marrow, stool, urine, those, combination. So I am not this combination of stool, bone, skin, blood. But people are taking that. When they are diseased, they take care of the body. Of course, it is not that we should not take care. But that is superficial. Real care should be taken of the soul within the body. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe (BG 2.13). Dehinaḥ, dehī. Dehinaḥ and deha. So anyone who is identifying with this body in either... According to Vedic civilization, the bodily identification is divided into eight: brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, and sannyāsa. Varṇāśrama-dharma. So human civilization begins, according to Vedic understanding, when there is varṇāśrama system. Otherwise it is not human civilization. Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is stated, cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭam (BG 4.13). This system should be followed. Then, gradually, one has to come to the spiritual. Chaotic society cannot help us. There must be systematic social order: brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, cātur-varṇyam, and brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, and sannyāsa. Sannyāsa is not voluntary, but it is compulsory. At the last stage one must take sannyāsa. After fiftieth year one must take to vānaprastha, vanaṁ vrajet. This is system. So... System of purification, how to become designationless. And if we keep the designation, then, śāstra says, sa eva go-kharaḥ: (SB 10.84.13) "One who keeps the bodily designation, he's no better than the cows and the asses, animal." So Caitanya Mahāprabhu recommends that... Caitanya Mahā... This is the shastric, Vedic culture, that we have to purify ourselves from the bodily designation.

Morning Talk -- June 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You see everything. That means the body is finished. The body is finished. Childhood body is finished. Why do you say "He is my son"? Although this previous body is finished, he has got another body. You are confident. Otherwise how you say "Here is my son"? Body has changed, but your son is there. And your friends say, "Oh, he is your son? Oh, I saw him, little boy." And he could not identify. The father knows that he is the same. That is the difference. The other man, he could not believe that child has become so grown up, young man. Father knows it. "No, he's the same child." That is the difference. Unless one understands this very first instruction, eternity of life, so-called scientists, philosophers—all nonsense. All rascals. Animal. The animal even. The so-called scientists, they are no better than the animals. That's all. They cannot understand the very simple thing. Animals cannot know. Otherwise any sane man can understand. (break) As soon as he changes the cloth, it is... No, I can change this cloth. That does not mean... I am the consciousness. Vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni... They never try to understand this. What is their advance? You are supporting these rascals. That means you do not understand about the soul. Do they not?

Śatadhanya: Yes. Nobody.