Mayavadis (Conversations 1977)

Expressions researched:
"Mayavadi" |"Mayavadi's" |"Mayavadin" |"Mayavadins" |"Mayavadis"

Notes from the compiler: VedaBase query: "Mayavadi" or "Mayavadis" or "Mayavadi's" or "Mayavadin" or "Mayavadins" not "Mayavad* philosopher*"@5 not "mayavadi sannyasi" not "mayavadi sannyasis" not "mayavadi sannyasa"

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 4, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Huh? Yes. Kaivalyaṁ narakāyate. For a devotee, this kaivalya-sukha of the Māyāvādī, impersonalist...

Dr. Patel: Just like naraka.

Prabhupāda: Is the hell for them. What is this nonsense? Who will understand this? Huh? Kaivalyaṁ narakāyate. And heaven, tridaśa-pūrākāśa-puṣpāyate. Heavenly planets, they are will of the wisp. Phantasmagoria. Kaivalyaṁ narakāyate tridaśa-pūrākāśa-puṣpāyate durdāntendriya-kāla-sarpa-paṭalī. Karmī, jñānī... Jñānī wants kaivalya and karmī wants heavenly happiness. And the yogi, yogi wants to control the senses. So he says that "Yes, we know the senses are very powerful." Durdāntendriya-kāla-sarpa-paṭalī. Indriya, it is just like snake. If you play with a snake you do not know at any moment death is there by biting. So although these indriyas are like snakes, kāla-sarpa, venomous serpent, but protkhāta-daṁṣṭrāyate. We have... What is called? Extricated?

Roof Conversation -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Mad-arthe. Mat-para. Mayy āsakta-manāḥ pārtha yogam... This is yoga. Yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ. Yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ. When you take shelter... But these Māyāvādīs... Where is mad-āśrayaḥ? "He is nirākāra." So there is no āśraya. So they cannot perform this yoga because there is no mad-āśrayaḥ. Āśraya loiyā bhaje kṛṣṇa tāre nāhi tyāge.(?) If one takes shelter of Kṛṣṇa and he works under His direction, then he's never forsaken or rejected by Him. He's always under the protection of Kṛṣṇa. Kaunteya pratijānīhi na me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyati (BG 9.31). So that should be our duty. We shall act only to the direction of Kṛṣṇa. Then our activities are purified, and then we are liberated.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Girirāja: But actually they're atheists, or Māyāvādīs.

Prabhupāda: They're ordinary men, third-class men. Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati... (BG 7.3). What they'll understand about Kṛṣṇa, third-class men? Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati. When one is siddha, out of them, one may understand. And how these third-class men will understand Kṛṣṇa? If they want to remain on the third-class position, they'll never understand Kṛṣṇa.

Girirāja: Then why do they imitate?

Prabhupāda: Some motive behind. Or they may be in the lower position. By serving, gradually they'll come to the real position. But if they do not hear what Kṛṣṇa said, then just imitates again, same. So if we decide that "Whatever Kṛṣṇa has said, we have to do it at any risk," that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. "Kṛṣṇa has said. My Guru Mahārāja said. We have to do it."

Morning Discussion about Kumbhamela -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: And besides that, the Māyāvādīs... Eh? Inconvenience.

Gurudāsa: Yes. And they would not appreciate our preaching all the time.

Prabhupāda: Māyāvādī bhāṣya śunile haya sarva nāśa (CC Madhya 6.169). Sarva nāśa.

Gurudāsa: If they have a similar verse to that, then they would be very unhappy.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Gurudāsa: I'm saying if they had, "Do not hear personalists' bhāṣya," they would become very unhappy.

Prabhupāda: Oh. (break) ...that within the Kṛṣṇa's mouth there are millions of brahmāṇḍas, they think it is simply fictitious. Doctor, saheb, you are feeling all right?

Dr. Patel: No, I just ran. I ran a little, so I...

Prabhupāda: Oh, so why don't you sit down?

Morning Walk -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: I had no idea of it. I am reading his books thinking he is still alive.

Trivikrama: He's a Māyāvādī, anyway.

Prabhupāda: Who?

Trivikrama: Aldous Huxley.

Prabhupāda: Aldous Huxley. He is useless. Anyone connected with the Ramakrishna Mission is a useless. Immediately take it.

Dr. Patel: He was connected with Ramakrishna Mission.

Rāmeśvara: On one radio show they quoted from this Dr. Radhakrishnan that when you read Bhagavad-gītā you should not think that Kṛṣṇa is God. So then they say, "So even in India they reject this Hare Kṛṣṇa movement." They say "Look, this is the president of India. He is saying do not take Kṛṣṇa as God."

Prabhupāda: So even in your own country, the priest talks crazily. We should reply that. Why do you go to India? In your country, your countrymen take it.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: Our business is sai vai manaḥ kṛṣṇa-padāravindayoḥ (SB 9.4.18). First of all is mentality. Man-manā mad-bhakto. Mental cure, then physically devotee. "Always think of Me." This is the cure, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto. Beginning: always think of Kṛṣṇa. This is the treatment. It is proved. Mentally he'll be cured. And then physically after. Nice (indistinct). They do not know how things are happening. (japa) Thinking, feeling, willing. First of all thinking, then feeling, then willing, then working. (break) ...and spending for military strength. They are not performing yajña, so how there will be rainfall? There will be warfare, devastation. Most rubbish civilization, modern misleading, soul-killing. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥ (SB 7.5.31). Very difficult to live with them. Still, we have to do this Kṛṣṇa's business. So we have to do our business. Let the dogs bark on. We don't care for it. If we remain sincere to Kṛṣṇa, that is our victory, not the result. Karmaṇy evādhikāras te mā phaleṣu kadācana. We have to act according to direction of Kṛṣṇa, that much. We want to see good result. Even there is no good result, we don't mind. We must be sincere to Kṛṣṇa that "We have done our best." That's all. Without cheating Kṛṣṇa. That is our duty. As servant, we shall not cheat the master. Result, no result—that depends on Kṛṣṇa. We should not be sorry if there is not result. Never mind. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says that "I have brought to Benares hari-nāma, but here they are full of Māyāvādīs. So if it is not sold, all right, I shall take it back." Caitanya Mahāprabhu said.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Just see. Such... They have created this Vivekananda and Cinmayanandas, rascals, so many rascals. They have created such situation that Indian people are mostly in darkness, although God appears here in India. They have executed such thankless task, this Vivekananda, Cinmayananda and so many Māyāvādīs. "Ramakrishna is Bhagavān." And what is his certificate that he is Bhagavān? "He said." No. He said "I am the same Rāma. I am the same Kṛṣṇa." So he is taking shelter of Kṛṣṇa to prove his Godhead. So why not go to original Godhead? Why shall I take the imitation? He is maintaining his position that "I am the same Kṛṣṇa." "So then same Kṛṣṇa is authority. So why shall I not go to same Kṛṣṇa? Why shall I go to you? Your authority is also Kṛṣṇa. So why shall I give up original Kṛṣṇa and take to an imitation Kṛṣṇa? You may be the same, but I am not a very intelligent man. Why shall I go to the imitation? I shall go to the original." Hm? Is it not? "I am not so expert to understand whether you are actual or not.

Room Conversation with Sannyasis -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Satsvarūpa: This is a very good one, from the University of Helsinki. That's right near the Russian border, in Finland. He's a professor of Indian studies, the Department of Asian and African Studies, Professor extraordinarious, Penti Alto. "The Bhagavad-gītā is no doubt the most important and the best known work in the whole of Indian literature. The magnificence of its spiritual concepts and the sublimity of its thinking have secured a great popularity everywhere. It has been edited and commented countless times. The meaning of the text, at least in its main lines, is obvious and clear. The justification of a new interpretation is there, for in my opinion, dependent on the message conveyed by the commentary. The translator and commentator, Swami Bhaktivedanta, represents the Gauḍīya-Vaiṣṇava school, and thus interprets the message of the Gītā 'from the inside.' For example, Shankara in Canto Two"—he means Chapter Two—"verse twelve, interprets the plurality of the being enumerated to be only conventional. And according to the Māyāvādīns, the individuals after liberation merge into the impersonal Brahman. Swami Bhaktivedanta states that Kṛṣṇa here authoritatively emphasizes the eternity of the individuality."

Prabhupāda: Hmm.

Room Conversation with Sannyasis -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam (BG 4.2).

Rāmeśvara: It's clear that for the first time these scholars are understanding the difference between the Bhagavad-gītā and the Māyāvādī conception. It's clear that now you have saved them. Previous to this, all they knew about is this impersonal concept.

Prabhupāda: That is the business of ācārya, sampradāya-rakṣana, to save the sampradāya from falling down. Sampradāya. Sampradāya rakṣana.

Rāmeśvara: After centuries of rascaldom you are giving them the first clear choice.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That was the desire of my Guru Mahārāja. I am just trying.

Satsvarūpa: Another professor that was met is going to with ten students... I have his name, a Professor Kalewart from the University of Loeben in Belgium. He's supposed to go to Kṛṣṇa-Balarāma Mandir on February lst with ten people.

Prabhupāda: He has gone?

Room Conversation with Sannyasis -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Rāmeśvara: Without your activities this man could not have written that... He could not have had that understanding. If you had not started this movement, there would be no difference, no contrast. There would just be Māyāvādī in the Western world.

Prabhupāda: Yes. People heard that Indian philosophy is Māyāvāda. Māyāvādam asac chāstraṁ pracchanaṁ bauddhaṁ ucyate. Caitanya Mahāprabhu repeatedly said, māyāvāda bhāṣya śunile haya sarva nāśa: "He is doomed." Māyāvādī haya kṛṣṇe aparādhi. These are the direct charges against the Māyāvāda. My Guru Mahārāja also, a staunch enemy of the Māyāvāda philosophy. And you are also singing, nirviśeṣa-śūnyavādī. The śūnyavādī are the Buddhist, and nirviśeṣavādī are the Māyāvādīs. Paścatya-deśa, they are embarassed with this śūnyavādī and nirviśeṣavādī. Now we are trying to give them solid personification of the Absolute Truth. Here also, India, they are spoiled by these Māyāvādī. Now it is in your hand, able hands. You are resourceful, intelligent. Spread this Vaiṣṇava philosophy and challenge this Māyāvāda and śūnyavāda. Thank you. Jaya. (devotees offer obeisances) Here is a would-be Vaiṣṇava. (laughs) Very nice. He is a very nice child.

Room Conversation with Sannyasis -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: ...between the Māyāvādī and the actual philosophy of Lord Caitanya. And that review is a credit that your writing is so clear that they cannot fail to understand the point.

Prabhupāda: He has written that "Bhaktivedanta Swami has very convincingly presented." He said that.

Satsvarūpa: Yes. That was the first one.

Hari-śauri: He was writing how you were following strictly in the paramparā.

Rāmeśvara: Some of these scholars write "The message radiates and shines brightly from every page." They're writing like that.

Satsvarūpa: And after describing the whole tradition, he said that the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is the Western branch. So that's a good testimony for our movement, not just the...

Hari-śauri: Not something concocted.

Room Conversation with Film Producer about Krsna Lila -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Just see.

Hari-śauri: "This statement of Parīkṣit Mahārāja's was very much appreciated by Śukadeva Gosvāmī. The answer anticipates the abominable activities of the Māyāvādī impersonalists, who place themselves in the position of Kṛṣṇa and enjoy the company of young girls and women. The basic Vedic injunctions never allow a person to enjoy sex with any woman except one's own wife. Kṛṣṇa's appreciation of the gopīs appeared to be distinctly in violation of these rules. Mahārāja Parīkṣit understood the total situation from Śukadeva Gosvāmī, yet to further clear the transcendental nature of Kṛṣṇa and the gopīs in the rasa dance, he expressed his surprise. This is very important in order to check the unrestricted association with women by the prākṛta-sahajiyā. In his statement, Mahārāja Parīkṣit has used several important..."

Morning Walk -- January 25, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: Sarpaḥ krūraḥ khalaḥ krūraḥ. The two envious... (break) But this sarpaḥ, snake, can be charmed by herbs and mantra, but the man, envious, cannot be. Therefore he's more dangerous than the snake. Khalaḥ kena nivāryate.

Gurukṛpa: Like that Māyāvādī last night.

Prabhupāda: He was a rascal. (laughs) Neither māyāvāda suviravādī, opportunist.

Hari-śauri: He's just a mūḍha, that man last night. (out of car) (break)

Gargamuni: We can walk on the beach. It's a very smooth beach, the sand. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...I was jumping here. (laughter) 1920 or '21, I came. After my appearing in examination, B.A. test, I came here. By that time I was married. I was married in 1918. (break) Because jubilant, I was jumping. When the waves come, I was jumping, the waves passed. There was one guide, he taught me, Babuji, ei sakava.(?)

Room Conversation -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: In India, the Māyāvādīs, they have no idea. "Nirākāra." What is the nonsense, nirākāra? The things are going on, imagination. "You can accept anyone as God." This is going on in India, Hindu religion. They do not know that here is... Kṛṣṇa is God. Only few Vaiṣṇavas, they know what is God. Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu (BG 7.3). Otherwise nobody knows. That is the defect. They do not know God; they do not know what God wants. So where is religion? There is no religion. Bogus. Cheating. They do not know about God, and they do not know what God wants. Then where is the religion? All bogus. They have created something, mano-dharma, mental concoction. Otherwise how they can kill animals, all other religion killing animals. What do they know about God? God... They say, "Supreme father." Eh, and animal has... He's not son. So wherefrom the animal came? If God is supreme father, then He is not father of the animals?

Room Conversation -- February 3, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Yes. So go on with fighting. We are not the Vṛndāvana bābājīs: "No, we are so perfect we do not go out of Vṛndāvana, and chant... Chant or not chant, we have got three dozen widows." This is going on. Sahajiyā. Still they are better because they have accepted Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Lord, than these demons. Our Guru Mahārāja said that although we condemn these sahajiyās, but they are better than the Māyāvādīs because they accept Kṛṣṇa as Supreme Lord. Their character is not good. But still, because they accept Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Lord somehow or other, they are better than these Māyāvādīs.

Bhāgavata: Sahajiyā.

Prabhupāda: Sahajiyā means they have taken everything very easy. That's all.

Room Conversation -- February 16, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Krodha bhakta-dveṣi-jane. That is Narottama Ṭhākura's instruction. You must be very angry, those who are against God and devotee, very angry. Utilize your anger for them. Krodha bhakta-dveṣi-jane. That anger is service. Kṛṣṇa-sebā kāmārpaṇe. For Kṛṣṇa's service one should be mad. Kāma-krodha should be given up, but a bhakta does not give up. Utilize it. A bhakta should be very much for kamut(?) serving Kṛṣṇa. And he must utilize his anger for the bhakta-dveṣi, those who are not devotee. Kṛṣṇa-sebā kāmārpaṇe krodha bhakta-dveṣi-jane. We have nothing to give up like Māyāvādī. Kāma, krodha, lobha, moha, mātsarya. Mātsarya may... That has to be... A bhakta cannot be envious. If a bhakta is angry upon them, that is not envious. That is for good. A bhakta should not be envious. Otherwise how he can preach? He's merciful. Even if he's angry, it is mercy. Therefore this mātsarya has no use for bhakta. Other things, they have use, kāma, krodha, lobha, moha, not mātsarya. Mātsarya is very bad.

Morning Room Conversation -- February 16, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: And he wants to prove nonviolence from Gītā. Just see how foolish he was. If you say publicly that he was a rascal, fool, then you become unpopular. But actually he was a rascal fool. (laughs) Artificial. Kṛṣṇa says, "You fight," and these rascals say, "Nonviolent." He's more than cheating. Māyāvādī.

Hari-śauri: Cheater.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Cheater, one must be due to ignorance. Generally one who is fool, he commits criminality. No sane man does it. Sane means he knows what is what. He does not commit mistake. But to commit mistake means he's insane, ignorant. That is not innocence-ignorance, foolish.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's a difference between ignorance and innocence.

Evening Darsana -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: No, there is no question of dividing

Acyutānanda: Māyāvādī.

Prabhupāda: Sanātana. That is Māyāvāda. Kṛṣṇa says, mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ jīva-loke sanātanaḥ (BG 15.7). Sanātana means eternally they are divided. And Kṛṣṇa says further in the Second Chapter that...

Hari-śauri: Na tv evāhaṁ jātu nāsam.

Prabhupāda: Yes. "You, Me, and all these kings, they were existing—the individual. You, Me, and... They're existing now, and they'll continue to exist." So where there is oneness? All individual eternally, as aṁśa, aṁśī, this finger and the body. You can say this finger is my body, but finger is not the body, whole body. Finger is finger. Not that if Kṛṣṇa's body is eternal, the finger is also eternal. Not that today it is finger, tomorrow is whole body. That is defective, Māyāvāda philosophy. Finger always exists as finger.

Evening Darsana -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: What is that? Braja-jana-rañjana... Huh? Yāmuna-tīra-bana-cārī. Rādhā-mādhava kuñja-bihārī, yāmuna-tīra-bana-cārī. So Yamunā is spiritual. Yāmuna-tīra is spiritual. The varieties, the Māyāvādī cannot understand. Āruhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padaṁ tataḥ patanty adhaḥ (SB 10.2.32). They want varieties, but don't accept spiritual variety. Therefore again material life. No other alternative. Āruhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padaṁ tataḥ patanti. Again material varieties, philanthropic work, political work, this work, that work. First of all they give up-brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā, the jagan mithyā. And again they come out to open school. Why you come here again? Āruhya kṛcchreṇa param..., patanty adhaḥ. Why? Anādṛta-yuṣmad-aṅghrayaḥ. They could not capture the spiritual varieties. Anādṛta. As soon as there is spiritual varieties they think it is māyā. That is Māyāvāda. There is no māyā. Spiritual variety, there is no māyā. Variety is the mother of enjoyment. (others enter-Bengali)

Morning Talk -- April 18, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: But if he's not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he may rise up to that position by endeavor. Then he will fall down. And I have given this example, Nixon and Indira Gandhi. This is factual. To come to take the post of prime minister, to become the president, is not easy job. Āruhya kṛcchreṇa, great hardship. Similarly, the Māyāvādīs, they also undergo severe austerities to become one with the Supreme, impersonalists. Any... I have given the... Karmī, jñānī, yogi, politicians, and everyone—everyone has got some aim. Many rich men, they commit suicide. So this is possi... This is the ultimate result of nondevotee. He may rise up by endeavor to certain position as he imagined, "This is the best position." Just like we are also trying to occupy the best position, to become associate of Kṛṣṇa, to live with devotees. We have got also some aim, and the nondevotees, they have also got aim. But the devotees will never fall down, while the nondevotee will fall down.

Morning Talk -- April 18, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Māyāvādī.

Prabhupāda: Māyāvādī. Otherwise he was a brāhmaṇa and learned scholar, God-fearing, everything.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, he's very well respected still.

Prabhupāda: In my paper I criticized him, "Scholars Deluded." I gave him criticism.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: (laughs) Even then you were doing that. It's always amazing how, to me, you can practically, whenever you meet these big men, you kick them on the head and then you make them like it. Just like this lawyer. You told him, "This dog civilization..." Practically you were telling him that "You are acting like that." But still, he liked it. And at the pandal you were doing the same.

Prabhupāda: Still, the Chief Minister applauded.

Conversation with Patita-pavana -- April 20, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, every sane man will appreciate our effort. Especially from general... Even the Māyāvādīs, they are also praising.

Patita-pāvana: The Māyāvādīs, yes.

Prabhupāda: Even the Māyāvādīs, they are also praising these activities. Yesterday two Māyāvādī sannyāsīs, came, Śaṅkara-sampradāya.

Patita-pāvana: This Arkasomaya...

Prabhupāda: They are taking from this point of view, that India's culture has been so nicely spread that people are taking serious con... That is their appreciation. We have got differences of opinion, philosophy. That is our... But India's culture is being accepted through the world. That they are appreciating.

Conversation with Patita-pavana -- April 20, 1977, Bombay:

Patita-pāvana: Even this Arkasomayaji, his iṣṭa-devatā is Kanaka Durgā from the Kabur district of the Godāvarī in Andhra, and he's a Māyāvādī. I told him, "We have some difference, but please shelve your differences and simply follow our point of view." He said, "That's all right, but I think your guru is the Divine walking the earth, and I must serve him." (laughs) So I said, "Very good. Please come and help."

Prabhupāda: So arrange to receive them. Give them very kindly... If Acarya agrees, that will be great success.

Girirāja: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So both you and Mahadevia together supply... This friend of Mahadevia...

Girirāja: Yes.

Prabhupāda: This facility, the space is the same. Mutual arrangement. And he gets the advantage of the roof.

Room Conversation -- May 8, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Trivikrama: So many places along the way. From the very birth, then all the activities, Aghāsura demon, all of them, all of them.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Even though it's Māyāvādī, still, they are displaying Kṛṣṇa's pastimes. Gītā ślokas are on the walls everywhere.

Trivikrama: Yes. It seems they can't get away from Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Trivikrama: They can't get away from Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they cannot. They can cheat, but with Gītā. They are like Gandhi. He cheated with a Gītā, in the name of Gītā. Even they cannot cheat with Gītā. Bhaja... What is that, Gītā-pravacana?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, Gītā...

Prabhupāda: That is another cheating.

Talk with Svarupa Damodara -- June 20, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Everything is spirit. Sarvaṁ khalv idaṁ brahma. Therefore I say there is no matter. Only matter means when the spirit is not discovered. When people are rascals, then there is matter. When people are intelligent, there is no matter. Sarvaṁ khalv idaṁ brahma. Therefore Māyāvādī philosophy, that "You are thinking you are not God," that is māyā.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Like a kīrtana party now, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: This is kīrtana, going on. You do not understand what is kīrtana. Any topics on Kṛṣṇa, that is kīrtana. Abhavad vaiyāsakī kīrtane. Vaiyāsakī, Śukadeva Gosvāmī, he became perfect by kīrtana. What kind of kīrtana did he do? Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bhāgavata discussion.

Conversation, 'Rascal Editors,' and Morning Talk -- June 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: One time in that article they made a change. Saying that, the whole Vaiṣṇava philosophy became Māyāvādī in that scientific article. So I told them that "You are better than..., a better (indistinct)." It all become Māyāvādī, so it became all mad. That is why I strongly told them that "This shouldn't be the way. If you want to change, you have to consult with those who are writers."

Prabhupāda: So they are doing very freely and dangerously. And this rascal is always after change, Rādhā-vallabha. He's a great rascal. (pause) Read.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Translation: Previously all the great sages rendered service unto the Personality of Godhead due to His existence above the three modes of material nature. They worshiped Him to become free from material conditions and thus derive the ultimate benefit. Whoever follows such great authorities is also eligible for liberation from the material world.

Discussion about Bhu-mandala -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Argument is there when it is conceivable. It is inconceivable. Kṛṣṇa lifted Govardhana. Seven years old, six years old. How it is conceivable? But devotees, they are crying, "Oh, Giri-vara-dhārī." And the Māyāvādīs they say kalpanāyā. The Akhandananda was saying. And Śukadeva Gosvāmī is narrating something kalpanāyā and wasting his time?

Bhakti-prema: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: This is acintya for the Māyāvādīs. They say kalpanāyā. These Akhandananda and other Māyāvādīs, they explain Bhāgavata-kalpanāyā. They are making some imagination that "I am God," but they are alleging us, that "You are in illusion." God, as soon as there is some toothache, he goes to the doctor. He's such a rascal hypocrite. There was some heart attack going on, so Akhandananda, immediately he called one of his chief disciples, that Mishra, Jasri, and he was taken to Bombay hospital. And he's God.

Discussion about Bhu-mandala -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: This is their... Apauruṣeyam. Actually India's culture is going on that way. Mass of people, they are going to Prayāga for taking bath. What do they know? They have received it from authorities that if you take bath in such and such place... Ah, lakhs of people will go. That is India's culture. Without any advertisement, without any means, walking hundreds of miles they are coming, yes, that is their culture. And the government is perturbed that people are so prejudiced. So how to make them forget? This is going on. But they don't listen. They just, "If I take bath I'll..." That is the difference between Western and Eastern. And as soon as there is interpretation, it is Māyāvāda. And Caitanya Mahāprabhu has rejected-māyāvādi-bhāṣya śunile haya sarva-nāśa (CC Madhya 6.169). You see in the Kumbhamela how peacefully they are sitting. They are accepting Vedic culture. So nice atmosphere. Simply by going there you'll be satisfied. That is the difference between East and West.

Room Conversation With Son (Vrindavan De) -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Just see. Such a good certificate.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Satsvarūpa, American-born personal secretary to Swami Bhaktivedanta, presents the official Hare Kṛṣṇa approach." They don't even identify you. They know who you are. You are so well known in these literary circles now that someone says, "Swami Bhaktivedanta." They don't have to say "Founder of ISKCON." They know already from your other books. "...presents the official Hare Kṛṣṇa approach in an articulate and highly serviceable introduction to this immense body of literature. The readings include the Īśopaniṣad, the Bhagavad-gītā and excerpts from Purāṇas, supplemented with a glossary and index. Preliminary essays detail the logic by which his group rejects both the academic experts and the rival approach of advaita-vedānta that Westerners know through the writings of Vivekananda and Radhakrishnan. This is a book long needed to balance out the monist theology that is but one aspect of Indian religious thought." In other words, this is one of the first books to present the Vaiṣṇava viewpoint, not simply the Māyāvādī viewpoint. He says, "It's well needed." That's all he's written.

Prabhupāda: Very appreciated. Very much appreciate.

Room Conversation -- July 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, no, we shall do exactly like karmīs, but not for us. For Kṛṣṇa. That is the difference. Same thing we are doing. Therefore these Māyāvādī cannot understand. "Again form?" The example is just like a man like me, he's diseased, he's suffering. And when they say, "Mother Yaśodās' crying," "So again crying?" He does not know what is this crying. He thinks this crying and that crying the same. Therefore Māyāvādī. They want to make it zero—no crying. But we take it a great blessing, crying for Kṛṣṇa. But they cannot understand. They say, "Again crying? Then what is the benefit?" And this is māyā. You understand? This is the simple understanding of Māyāvāda. As soon as there is crying, they say, "Oh, it is māyā. No crying." Nirviśeṣa-vādī. Crying is a great transcendental pleasure. That they cannot understand, the poor fund of knowledge. Caitanya Mahāprabhu was simply crying. That is love. So that they do not understand, how crying can be pleasure. That is Māyāvāda. All right.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Dr. Kapoor came?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dr. Kapoor was there this morning. I was not there during the part where he spoke, but apparently he spoke some Māyāvādī philosophy, this Dr. O.B.L. Kapoor.

Gurukṛpā: He said that everything is made of molecules, and molecules are invisible; therefore actually everything is invisible. Therefore everything is like a dream, everything is unreal.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is the result of all of his years of study in order to write his book. He's become a Māyāvādī. Or at least his... Mādhava dāsa, our Mādhava dāsa, he got up and completely defeated him.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Doctor Kapoor is really something.

Prabhupāda: He has become Māyāvādī.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda. (laughter) Does that sound possible? It sounds possible, doesn't it? Yes.

Gurukṛpā: He said before he met His Divine Grace Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta that he was a Māyāvādī. Now he's still a Māyāvādī.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He gave up his... He became part of this Nitāi-Gaura-Rādhe-Śyāma group. And how genuine could he be to do that? Anyway, no one took him very seriously.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Bhagavān: He just spoke right before the thing closed. Svarūpa Dāmodara tried to point out how there is a difference between matter and spirit in that one can definitely see the difference between a living body and a dead body. But he didn't actually go in too much detail to defeat his arguments. But I was very surprised that he would come up with such a Māyāvādī statement, that brahma satyaṁ jagan mithyā philosophy. There are not so many scientists there today, maybe twenty. (kīrtana) (break)

Prabhupāda: ...let me pass. (pause)

Hari-śauri: If you're here with us, then that's all we need. Then we can go out and do anything.

Prabhupāda: Tomorrow shall I take the risk of taking little milk?

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Most of them actually agreed to what we say. On Sunday we may have some interesting... First somebody is going to speak against us. There's one Dr. Malvia(?) from Agra. He's a biochemist. He's going to speak against us. Also Dr. Mishra from All-India Institute Medical Sciences, he's going to speak. He's not exactly against, but he's heavily Māyāvādī oriented. Also he tries to compromise the modern scientific concept with the Vedic ideas, which is actually not what we're trying to do. So on Sunday also I'm planning to have about an hour and half as discussion, completely open to all the participants. So on Sunday we expect a little lively discussion.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: 'Cause when you have a big...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, actually we can do that. Dr. Kapoor spoke for about five minutes...

Prabhupāda: Māyāvādī?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Actually he's very much influenced by Māyāvādī ideas, I realized. Then later on, he spoke to me that there is some misunderstanding. I told him that this is not what we have learned from Śrīla Prabhupāda. (end)

Room Conversation With Svarupa Damodara -- October 15, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: ...some way or other it has become successful.

Bhāgavata: There is no question of thinking, Śrīla Prabhupāda. It is a fact. It is reality that you have become successful, because you have converted even now the scientists. Even the scientists are becoming encouraged to take up Kṛṣṇa consciousness, and their minds are being changed. It is history, and we are seeing it right before our eyes. That is another one of your great contributions in your spiritual conquests, that you have converted the scientists. As Caitanya has conquered the Māyāvādīs, you have conquered the scientists. That's why we are very much eager that you shall remain with us more and more, to carry on these conquests, that we can somehow or other in some small way just help you. But your presence is definitely required. Actually all the devotees are just living to see you from time to time, so that they can get your darśana.

Room Conversation -- October 21, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) Aprākṛta, transcendental. Whatever we discuss, that is on the transcendental platform, nothing to do with this material world. The Māyāvādī impersonalist, they cannot understand this. They think this is also material. Then? Read. You are going to read?

Pradyumna: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda. There is just one more point on that verse. He says there are some verses that say upaniṣada puruṣaḥ namo vedānta vedyāya kṛṣṇāya.(?) So Śrīla Baladeva Vidyābhūṣaṇa has raised a question that it says Kṛṣṇa is not seen by the Upaniṣads, but then there's some verses that say He is known by the Vedas, He is known by the Upaniṣads. He says it is proved that the Absolute is able to be known by Vedas, veda-gamyatvam kintu... Then he quotes other verse. It says sakalyena avedatvam, He cannot be known completely through Vedas, only through devotional service

Prabhupāda: Yes. When one is purified by Vedic knowledge, then mad-bhaktir labhate param. Then he is allowed entrance in devotional understanding. Bhaktyā śruta-gṛhītayā. There is a...? Eh? In Bhāgavatam?

Room Conversation -- October 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That is stated in the Caitanya-caritāmṛta: māyāvādī haya kṛṣṇe aparādhī. While discussing with Prakāśānanda Sarasvatī... "Caitanya," "Brahman," that's... Nothing like Kṛṣṇa. Here they are doing, this Akshandananda, and what is his name? Another...? "Brahman Brahman." When they cannot explain anything—"Brahman," bas, finished.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda? Pradyumna Prabhu is here. Would you like to hear some verse?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: The covering matter is inferior.

Śatadhanya: How the Māyāvādī thinks that he can..., that the material energy is false when at every step he's baffled by the material energy?

Prabhupāda: That is his foolishness. Therefore Kṛṣṇa instructs, but he does not take. He wants to remain in māyā and at the same time claim that he is liberated.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Also, modern science tries to compromise... I'm sorry: Māyāvādīs try to compromise with modern science.

Prabhupāda: There is no other way. They cannot make a solution, so they must try to make a compromise.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: And that is Māyāvāda. (break) ...superficially Caitanya Mahāprabhu also a Māyāvādī.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. That was confirmed when He was talking like that. Just like Carl Jung... He's a psychologist. He says that matter is a concept, some sort of imagination that one has in his mind, something like that idea that these Māyāvādīs... They think this is not real.

Prabhupāda: It is not real in this sense: because the spirit is there, therefore it is there. Because there is consciousness, there is ignorance, covering. And if you stop this ignorance, then consciousness is there, pure.

Prabhupada Vigil -- November 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: He is Māyāvādī, this... What is? Akhandananda?

Brahmānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: You met him?

Brahmānanda: I didn't see... You remember you went to that Kurukṣetra meeting?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Brahmānanda: About two years ago? Mainly the same people are here also that were there at that meeting. Then this Swami Cinmayananda...

Prabhupāda: He has not come.

Prabhupada Vigil -- November 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Brahmānanda: But they treated you with much respect, though. They said that they had wanted Your Divine Grace to come because you are also a member of their steering committee. (indistinct) They also had a proposal to produce a series of different books, small books, pamphlets, forty, fifty pages, comprising selections from the Bhagavad-gītā. And these would be for specific types of persons. The books would be Bhagavad-gītā for students, Bhagavad-gītā for businessmen, Bhagavad-gītā for scientists, like that. So they want us to produce the book for the scientists, taking various quotes from Bhagavad-gītā with a short explanation of the verse. So I said one problem is that all the different groups who are assembled here will all have different interpretations of the verses. What about this? And they said, "No, no, we shouldn't interpret." I said, "Well, one reason that the young people are not taking up this Bhagavad-gītā is because they see that everyone is giving a different interpretation. Nobody is presenting it as it is, so they're confused." I was in Kashmir, I was speaking with some young boys. They were telling me they're confused by religion. They don't respect the paṇḍitas in the temples—they're all simply after money. They have no respect for religion, Hindu religion. So I mentioned this to all of them. They are all Māyāvādīs. And they argued with me. I presented arguments. They would not accept it.

Prabhupāda: They want to avoid criticism.

Prabhupada Vigil -- November 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually this is one way that we ought to be able to... First of all, it would be prestigious on our part to stick to our principles, and secondly, actually people will find that we're convinced when they'll see, "You are Māyāvādī, we have no bus... You are not..." At first they may feel offended, that why shouldn't we let everybody speak.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda says, in future, henceforward, these people should not be allowed to hold lectures here. Strictly Caitanya Mahāprabhu's teaching forbids. Māyāvādī haya kṛṣṇe aparādhī. You tell them, "You're Māyāvādī. So this is a Kṛṣṇa conscious temple. If you're speaking on Kṛṣṇa consciousness, Vaiṣṇavism..." We don't need their money, neither do we need them to become more prestigious. Rather, they need us. They came here only because of the fact that they're so insignificant that they wanted to be associated with Prabhupāda. Without you they have no substance, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupada Vigil -- November 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually, Śrīla Prabhupāda, Your Divine Grace and this movement is the only substantial movement left in India now, in the whole world.

Prabhupāda: Yes. You can have signboard: "No Māyāvādīs visit (?) here." (laughter)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Wow. Just like "No dogs allowed." (laughter) Are you serious about that, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hm. (indistinct)

Brahmānanda: If they come and they want to hold meetings, we show them the signboard that "We don't allow Māyāvādīs here."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: "Don't speak of Gītā"?

Akṣayānanda: Yes. "Gītā-pratiṣṭhāna," but "Don't speak of Gītā." It's foolishness.

Prabhupāda: Now the danger is māyāvādi-bhāṣya śunile haya sarva-nāśa (CC Madhya 6.169). So Vṛndāvana is full of Māyāvādīs. Do you accept it? And I am afraid our men may be influenced. Caitanya Mahāprabhu's clear saying-māyāvādi-bhāṣya śunile haya sarva-nāśa. Hm? What is to be done? (break) They are coming to our Vṛndāvana temple, Bombay temple. What is their purpose? They may occupy it? Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, they can't occupy it.

Prabhupāda: So we have to be very careful. Hm?

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Akṣayānanda? And Tamāla?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, they're not going to get in. From now on we're going to have a sign on all of our temples, "No Māyāvādī Meetings Allowed."

Prabhupāda: It is clearly written, māyāvādi-bhāṣya śu... Sixth Chapter. Hm? The Sarvabhauma...

Bhavānanda: One sixty-nine.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, they're attending, Bon Mahārāja, so that means the whole of Vṛndāvana has become Māyāvādī, because they're all attending this meeting. Our men should not attend this meeting any more, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: No, just see the, how they have functioned. It is our place. We should guard. So, and all the men were accommodated in their room?

Akṣayānanda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They could all fit in the meeting room?

Akṣayānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: And who was presiding?

Akṣayānanda: The Aurobindo.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That guy's a pakka Māyāvādī. That Aurobindo man?

Prabhupāda: Aurobind.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. He had a big argument with Brahmānanda. Not a big argument, but he was challenging Brahmānanda that "Kṛṣṇa means the divine consciousness. Kṛṣṇa is not a person. He is the... It is divine consciousness."

Prabhupāda: Māyāvāda.

Akṣayānanda: I have a plan, Prabhupāda. Myself and Bhakti-prema Swami can go there and sit, and if we hear any discrepancies, if we are given a chance afterwards, which we can arrange, to speak something, then we can rectify—in a gentlemanly way, of course. We can rectify. If we sit there, at least we know that they'll be careful what they say. And he can catch any finer points that I would miss, 'cause it's all in Hindi.

Prabhupāda: They are speaking in Hindi.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Akṣayānanda: No, no, he's... No. No, no

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He used to be a Māyāvādī.

Akṣayānanda: Yes. But he understands fully this philosophy and accepts it.

Prabhupāda: So this is the position. The whole Vṛndāvana is full of Māyāvādīs. We have to be very, very cautious and careful. I was there. That Brahmānanda protested against that Aurobindo. And then "Don't speak of Gītā."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, that's what they told him.

Jayādvaita: They shouldn't speak of Gītā. They should speak of whatever other thing they want.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Then why call it Gītā-pratiṣṭhāna?

Jayādvaita: That's Prabhupāda's premise. He's establishing Bhagavad-gītā.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So, if they pay, we shall allow?

Bhavānanda: I don't think so, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Just like yesterday, I was noticing in their afternoon meeting, they had microphone, and you could hear the speakers outside. I was thinking that this Māyāvādī... Someone is speaking Māyāvādī philosophy, it's polluting the boys. Even you don't understand Hindi, the sound vibration itself is polluting. You once told me, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that to even hear Sanskrit Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam from the mouth of a Māyāvādī, it will poison you. Even you don't understand, just the sound vibration coming from that source is polluting. So what is the necessity for us to rent out our facility to them?

Prabhupāda: Tamāla Kṛṣṇa?

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Bhavānanda: Of course, Śrīla Prabhupāda, another view is that we've constructed such attractive facilities here, and the purpose is to attract people to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So if we let out this auditorium in Bombay and here in Vṛndāvana, so those people will come. They may be Māyāvādī... Actually everyone is Māyāvādī today. So it's a good opportunity for preaching if we're strong.

Prabhupāda: Preaching means to convert Māyāvādīs to Vaiṣṇava. Otherwise where is the need of preaching?

Bhavānanda: Preaching also means risk.

Prabhupāda: Yes. No risk. We take money from them. So we get some money. That is our gain. So anything, do very carefully.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So you said we should have a sign, "No Māyāvādī Meetings Allowed."

Prabhupāda: No. If this is allowed free.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh. Well, this wasn't free. They're paying for being here. They're paying to be here.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're paying to hold their program.

Prabhupāda: No gratis lecture allowed. If they pay for, they will talk all nonsense, (laughter) and we don't care for it. These are the considerations. That's all right. Turn me this side.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. Prabhupāda, you should take some rest now, I think. You've been talking a long time. (end)

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) There is good demand all over the world. (Hindi) "Kṛṣṇa is not person; Kṛṣṇa is consciousness." (Hindi) Kṛṣṇa personally speaking, and "He is consciousness." He says, yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata (BG 4.7). "I come down." (Hindi) Māyāvādī. Caitanya Mahāprabhu has condemned, māyāvādi-bhāṣya śunile haya sarva-nāśa (CC Madhya 6.169). (Hindi) Yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. Kṛṣṇa said that "I am speaking to you the old yoga system." (Hindi) ...not my interpretation. (Hindi) (break) Kṛṣṇa is person. Where is that verse in the Tenth Canto?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In the Bhagavad-gītā?

Prabhupāda: Paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān (BG 10.12).

Bhakti-caru: Tenth Chapter.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Bhavānanda: Actually I think you're the only one on the whole planet who is not Māyāvādī-Māyāvādī or influenced by Māyāvādī philosophy. Actually until you came to the West, the only philosophy that had come to America from India was Māyāvādī philosophy. No one knew anything else. (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Each verse is like a separate lecture, Śrīla Prabhupāda. What, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: We shall chant our beads or read book?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Which would you like?

Prabhupāda: For me, everything is all right.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So we can chant japa for a little while.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And then we can read again. All right?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (devotees chant japa) (break)