Marriage (Conversations 1973 - 1974)

Expressions researched:
"marriage" |"marriageable" |"marriages" |"married" |"marries" |"marrige" |"marry" |"marrying" |"matrimonial" |"remarriage" |"remarried" |"remarry" |"wedlock"

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 28, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: Flag. It is flag.

Guest (1): Flag? (indistinct) It is better to do like this?

Devotee: Yes.

Guest (1): And some Indian gentlemen only married here (indistinct) and...

Prabhupāda: This is temple. Temple.

Guest (1): Yes. Temple.

Prabhupāda: Lord's temple.

Devotee: The Lord's temple. Temple of God.

Guest (1): (Japanese)

Devotee: Yes.

Guest (1): This quite different Japanese, Asian sometimes but European made never like this only female, lady like this Europe.

Prabhupāda: No. It is sacred thread, sacred thread.

Morning Walk -- April 19, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But they never talk about the soul, the nature of the soul, the consciousness existing within the living.

Prabhupāda: No, because there is consciousness, therefore the living being can create. Because I am conscious, I am thinking of marrying, begetting children. Because I am conscious. And because there is no consciousness, therefore this wood cannot think that he'll beget. The original consciousness, in the Vedas, it is said: eko bahu syām. God says: "I'll become many," so because there is consciousness, therefore He's saying that: "I shall become many." Without consciousness, there is no question of by-products. (Pause) Now they are supplying water to these green trees. Why they do not supply to that wood, and get it green?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: 'Cause from experience they know that it is not going to grow.

Prabhupāda: That means nonsense, that there is something else. Because the same tree, now it is growing, watering, but when it will be dead, you pour water... The medicine is the same. Why it is not doing now, and why it was doing formerly? Then what is the thing that is lacking in it?

Brahmānanda: Similarly, if there's a dead body and they just add some chemicals, that doesn't necessarily mean it will come alive again.

Prabhupāda: No. No. Chemicals are already there. If you say that the chemical is the cause of life, that chemicals are there. Because other lifes are coming. How do you say the chemical is wanting.

Morning Walk -- April 30, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Never use this china clay. Never. No respectable gentleman will use china clay. Still. So if a poor family is in need of money, immediately he can take one Benarsee sari, or some metal utensils to the pawn maker. He'll immediately offer some money. "Yes." So these are conveniences. Investment was in gold ornaments. Still we have seen that so many jewelry shop, silver dishes shop, ornament shop. Still. Every marriage, the father must give at least fifty tolās. I was not a rich man. Still I had to give to my daughter fifty tolās of gold during marriage. Fifty tolās. Two and a half tolās makes one ounce. So what is the value of fifty tolās?

Karandhara: Twenty-five ounces? Right now that's worth about two thousand, three hundred dollars.

Prabhupāda: Just see. So that is her stock. Strī-dhana. The husband cannot touch. Then it is criminal. So in case of need, she can convert the ornaments into money. Sometimes there is disagreement with the husband. So she has got some stock. The father gives some ornaments. The father-in-law gives some ornament. The relatives also, during marriage, they present some ornaments. So if he, if she gets hundred tolās of gold, that means at least five hundred...?

Karandhara: Almost five thousand.

Morning Walk -- April 30, 1973, Los Angeles:

Karandhara: Almost five thousand.

Prabhupāda: Oh, five thousand dollars. She has got some assets. That is called strī-dhana. Strī-dhana means "woman's property." Nobody can touch it. Only, according to Manu-saṁhitā law, strī-dhana... Now they are changing. Strī-dhana, the son cannot touch, the husband cannot touch. Nobody can touch. But, after her death, the daughters will share that money. Because formerly, the daughters could not get share of the father's estate. Only the dowry which is given by the father at the time of her marriage. That much. But she could not claim any estate share. Therefore at the time of marriage, the dowry by ornaments, saris. Hundred pieces of sari. If one is rich man. All Benarsee sari, costly. And woman's nature is that if she gets good ornaments, saris, good food, she's satisfied. She doesn't want anything. She'll never become faithless to her husband. So these things are disappearing. Now rich man, rich man's wife, no ornament. (indistinct). Only the widows, they were without ornaments. Any woman who has got husband must have ornaments. Otherwise, insult. So individual liberty, individual prosperity, everything is disappearing. By the scientific improvement. That's all. This is the net result. Now in your country, that... What is that? Draft board? Eh?

Karandhara: Draft board?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Calling young men to fight.

Morning Walk -- April 30, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So that is the property of the ocean.

Prabhupāda: No, everything has got some quality and beauty. Just like Cāṇakya Paṇḍita says: nārīṇāṁ bhūṣaṇaṁ patiḥ. Woman, the personal beauty is not beauty. When she has got a husband, then she's beautiful. How scientific it is. All these girls in your country, without husband, they're all morose, unhappy. They have no fixity of husband. Is it not?

Brahmānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The woman population is greater everywhere, and if they have no husband, they're very sorry. I have studied in this country. They're very unhappy without husband. Therefore I introduced this marriage in our society. Now in our society see all the women with children, how happy they are.

Brahmānanda: Oh yes.

Prabhupāda: They have got Kṛṣṇa, they have got husband, they have got children. Now, happy they are. They're working hard for beauty of the home, for the temple. And now last night that Mukunda's cousin sister came. How unhappy she is.

Brahmānanda: Yes. You could also see the child.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- April 30, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh, that girl was Mukunda's...?

Prabhupāda: Cousin sister. Without husband, woman is very, very unhappy. Therefore according to Vedic system the father has got a very responsible duty to get the daughter married. It is a responsibility of the father. In the absence of father, elder brother. Now the scientists have given them contraceptives. Don't marry and use contraceptive. This is scientific advancement. And the contraceptive user of girls, they're never beautiful. Natural beauty... Natural beauty's lost. Did you mark it? Between a woman having natural children, her beauty's better than the girl using contraceptives. It is natural. As soon as you check natural system, you become in difficulty. The... Still the system is current. Kṣatriyas, kings, when they are married... You have seen, Kṛṣṇa's father's marriage... So many women also were given.

Brahmānanda: Yes, in charity.

Prabhupāda: Because always women population is greater than the man. So those who are kings, they could maintain more than one wife. So not only one wife, another three dozen maid-servants. They are freely mixing with king. They got also children. But they were not, I mean to say, eligible for throne. Only the married wife's son. This is, this was the system. Just like Vidura. Vidura happened to be a son of such maid-servant. So she had, he had no claim on the throne. Dāsī-putra. They were called dāsī-putras. They were maintained. Just like in royal family, but they have no claim on the throne.

Morning Walk -- May 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That's a fact. I have several times explained that in higher sense there is no matter. Did I not? So life and matter equal, that can be accepted, but there is superior and inferior position. Just like Kṛṣṇa is life, I am also life. Kṛṣṇa is also person, I am also person. Kṛṣṇa has got... What Kṛṣṇa, propensities He has got, I have also got. Kṛṣṇa wants to love another girl, so I want to love. A girl wants to love another boy, so Rādhārāṇī wants to love Kṛṣṇa. So everything qualitatively are all equal, but Kṛṣṇa can marry at a time millions of wives. You cannot maintain even one wife. That is the position. Nityo nityānāṁ cetanaḥ, Vedas say. That is the difference. He is life, I am also life. All the life symptoms, there is in Kṛṣṇa and there is in me, but still I am inferior, He is superior. And that is the law, that the inferior should be subordinately serving to the superior. Therefore we want to..., our business is to serve Kṛṣṇa, although qualitatively we are one. That inferior, superior, that is the difference between God and the living entity.

Morning Walk -- May 14, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So material is created from the superior.

Prabhupāda: Creator is one. It is always superior. Whatever is created, that is created by Him. Kṛṣṇa says, ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ (BG 10.8). "I am the creator of everything." So bad or good, everything. Bad and good, that is your creation. Kṛṣṇa's creation everything good. God is good. What you think bad, for God is good. Therefore we cannot understand Kṛṣṇa. He's doing something. In our consciousness it is bad, but we do not know that for him there is no such thing as good and bad. That we do not know. Kṛṣṇa is marrying 16,000 wives, somebody's criticizing, "Oh, He's so much fond of women." But we do not see the other side. He has got the power to expand Himself into 16,000 forms.

Paramahaṁsa: If this mist of material nature is temporary, then why bother to disentangle oneself from something transitory?

Prabhupāda: Why do you take covering? Does man walk naked?

Paramahaṁsa: No.

Prabhupāda: Why do you take covering? You know everything will be cleared after few hours. Why do you cover?

Paramahaṁsa: It is dangerous now.

Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Guest (8): And I must say they are advancing more than me, really. I am still the same stage; by Prabhupāda's grace, they are advancing more, get up early in the morning, four o'clock, take bath...

Prabhupāda: No, this kind of family life is very suitable. This is wanted. All the wife... His wife is very nice girl. And she is good devotee. So if wife is favorable, then everything is favorable. Household life means cooperation with wife. Na gṛhaṁ gṛham ity āhur gṛhiṇī gṛham ucyate. Just like we are also living within a room, gṛha. But we are sannyāsī. What is the difference between gṛhastha and sannyāsī? He lives with his wife. Gṛhiṇī gṛham ity āhuḥ. Gṛhiṇī means "the wife is gṛha." So if the wife is favorable, devotee, then there is no use of giving up family life. That's all. We have got so many married couples. Just like this boy. He's married. His wife is there. They are favorable. Both husband and wife, they have dedicated life for Kṛṣṇa. So it is very nice. It is not that he has to become sannyāsī. No. Why? There is no necessity. Gṛhe vā vanete thāko. Either you become sannyāsī or gṛhastha, the life must be dedicated for Kṛṣṇa. That's all. That is required. And for Kṛṣṇa's sake, if we have to give up something, is that very difficult job? If Kṛṣṇa wants that "You give up this habit,"... Just like Kṛṣṇa says... If you become devotee of Kṛṣṇa... Now, Kṛṣṇa says, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). So Kṛṣṇa wants that patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalam, "Vegetable, milk, rice, grains, you can give Me." So you have to please Kṛṣṇa. You live on this, what Kṛṣṇa says, and take Kṛṣṇa's prasādam. That's all. (People coming in) Aiye.

Room Conversation with Educationists -- July 11, 1973, London:

Guest (1): Yes.

Prabhupāda: Oh. So whenever you find time, you can come, or, if you like, you can live with us. We have got ample place. Girls and ladies, they live separately. Boys and gentlemen, they live separately. Those who are married, we have got apartments for householders. And gradually, we are improving, I mean to say, arranging further facilities. First of all you try to attend our class in the morning and inquire all about your doubts. Have some clear idea what is this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Read our literatures as far as possible. You have taken some book, I see, I saw. And if you agree to this principle, we take charge of you. You haven't got any botheration, how you'll get prasāda. We shall arrange for that...

Guest (3) (young British woman): Religion, meaning trying to serve God, is any more right than another?

Prabhupāda: This is not religion. This is the only business. Religion is different thing. Suppose... Just like... I have already explained, that you are sleeping, and you have got a good engagement. And somebody's trying to awake you, that "You have to go there. Just get up! Get up!" So this kind of business is not religion. Religion is a, what is a kind of faith, a sentiment. That is different thing. It is the main business of human being. Because we are part and parcel of... Just like a boy, he's very rich man's son. Some way or other, he's out of his home, and he's suffering for want of food, want of shelter. And somebody's giving information that "I know you are such and such big man's son. Why you are loitering in the street? Why don't you go back to your home, back to your father?" So is it not the best business. So everyone is suffering. That I have already explained, how they are suffering. We are trying to save his suffering by dispatching him back to home, back to Godhead. This is our business. So it is not religion. It is the most important humanitarian work. What do you think?

Haṁsadūta: Yes.

Room Conversation with Two Buddhist Monks -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: That's nice. She is your eldest daughter?

Guest (1): No, she's my sister.

Prabhupāda: Sister. Oh, I see.

Guest (1): She's getting married on this day. (Hindi for few sentences)

Guest (2): No, I can't remember. About thirty-one as well.

Prabhupāda: You often then really come here?

Guest (2): No.

Prabhupāda: This is first time you are coming?

Guest (2): First time I've been here, yeah.

Prabhupāda: Oh. What is this, "K.C.C. Ghee"?

Guest (1): Ghee.

Śrutakīrti: Ghee. I don't know where it's from.

Prabhupāda: K.C.C?

Śrutakīrti: Nairobi, Kenya. It was made and packed by...

Haṁsadūta: Brahmānanda.

Room Conversation with Malcolm -- July 18, 1973, London:

Paramahaṁsa: Oh.

Prabhupāda: That is not possible. It is very difficult. One saṁskāra, that initiation saṁskāra, and marriage saṁskāra-two, three saṁskāras, can be done, not the ten. It is not possible. Now the circumstances will not allow. It is very difficult.

Śyāmasundara: One thing that Malcolm and I were talking about before was that, he was lamenting that our educational system nowadays in the west, material education, practically spoils the child to understand spiritual life.

Prabhupāda: Why in the West? Everywhere.

Malcolm: More in the West because the child is more constrained in his molding.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The whole defect is that we are missing the goal of life. Therefore we do not know how to conduct business with the goal of life. At the present moment, in every field, they are missing the goal of life.

Malcolm: They seem oppressed by weight of number, that there are too many.

Prabhupāda: No, goal is one.

Malcolm: No, people.

Prabhupāda: No, people do not know the goal. That is the defect of modern civilization. Not modern, that is the defect of material existence.

Room Conversation with Reporter from Researchers Magazine -- July 24, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: That is vikarma. If you act sinfully, against the injunctions of the śāstra, then it is sinful, that is vikarma. And akarma means which does not produce any other result. That is akarma. Karma, akarma, vikarma. Yes. But generally we act, we indulge in karma to get some result. And that is karma. That is not vikarma. Vikarma, when you act against the principles of sinful activities, no, no, when you act as sinful activity, just like striyaḥ sūnā (Sanskrit). Four kinds of sinful activities are described in the śāstras: illicit sex life. You can not indulge in sex life without marriage, that is illicit, that is sinful. So killing animals unnecessarily, that is sinful. Then intoxication, that is sinful. And gambling. These are sinful activities. So when you do not obey the orders of the śāstra and engage yourself in sinful activities, that is vikarma, you're becoming bound up being entangled. Therefore bhakti is the safest platform, because you do not produce any more karma. Whatever karma you have to act, it is finished in this life. Karmāṇi nirdahati kintu ca bhakti-bhājām (Bs. 5.54). Otherwise, beginning from ant, up to the Brahmā, everyone is bound up by the reaction of karma.

Room Conversation with Reporter from Researchers Magazine -- July 24, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Ah.

Reporter: And I will stay two or three more years.

Prabhupāda: So, you are family man?

Reporter: Yes, this is my wife.

Prabhupāda: You're married here.

Reporter: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Children?

Reporter: One child.

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Reporter: And we have called our child Mukti.

Prabhupāda: That's nice. (everyone laughs) But another thing, (everyone laughs). Rūpa Gosvāmī says bhukti-mukti-spṛhā yāvat piśācī hṛdi vartate. Manifested..., that so long the piśācī... Piśācī, you know?

Reporter: Yes, yes.

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Mother: Well, this is very good, sir, that you find this, and I say, this is not my argument... Yes. Hmmm.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Not practical also. I have seen the animal killers. They do not understand what is God. That is a fact. Neither they have got brain to understand it.

Mother: But you don't need brain if you're not going to study or to do anything further. If you just sit and sleep like...

Prabhupāda: No, we are studying. Because we are preaching, we are studying that. The animal eaters, they cannot have any conception of God. The brain is so dull.

Mother: What about your children? Where do they? Do they go to school?

Prabhupāda: Why not.

Mother: Are they edu...? Do they go to schools, your children?

Prabhupāda: They have now grown up. My grandsons are going to school.

Mother: Well, I didn't mean yours in particular. I'm talking now of all of you. I'm not talking of you particularly. I'm talking of all of you. All your children, the married devotees...?

Prabhupāda: Yes, our children, we have got our own school. All these boys, they have got their children. They are gṛhasthas, householders. So we have got our nice school at Dallas, very big school.

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Mother: In other words, your temple... Do you call it your temple or a church?

Prabhupāda: We call temple.

Mother: A temple. And are these married and...?

Prabhupāda: Yes, there are married, there are sannyāsīs, there are brahmacārī, all kinds of people. It is not restricted. You see. So many children. They're having children. We are taking care of them. Everything.

Mother: Now, do you have these temples in India?

Prabhupāda: Oh yes.

Mother: Because I myself haven't been to India, but my parents were there. And the Indian contingent from Dunkirk was billeted in my home in 1940, just before my marriage.

Prabhupāda: Oh. There you see. Oh.

Mother: And we had all the Indians there after Dunkirk waiting for more Indians to come and join them. And we had the Hindus and the Mohammedans and the sweepers, and they all had their own houses. And they recovered from all the war damage, and they went off within about twelve months. They went off in '41, back to...

Prabhupāda: There was some bombing in Calcutta, nothing more.

Mother: Hm. Ah, but these Indians were fighting in France.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that is another thing.

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

Professor: That's it, the point, yes.

Prabhupāda: Because they don't find any suitable place.

Professor: No.

Prabhupāda: That is the difficulty.

Professor: Yes. But this gentleman told me that he is married, for instance.

Prabhupāda: He is married. So we have got so many married couples.

Professor: Your wife is here?

Yogeśvara: Yes.

Professor: In the same society?

Yogeśvara: Yes.

Professor: And in the same...

Prabhupāda: She also translates.

Yogeśvara: My wife translates, and I design the book.

Professor: So do you think it is possible, for instance, to have the husband being involved in this movement and not his wife?

Prabhupāda: No, wife also involved. Everyone is involved. The child is also involved. You'll find in our class a small child dancing to the tune. Yes. We have opened one school for children in Dallas. All the gṛhastha-bhaktas, those who have got children, we send there. Have you got pictures of Dallas? So there we have got very nice building, and, about, for the present, about near about hundred students. They're simply taught Sanskrit and English.

Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: This is Vedic knowledge. So you'll get everything perfect. Therefore, how there can be any history? That is the difficulty. We are speaking everything, of the spiritual. Therefore, it is sometimes very difficult for the gross materialist. They are so dull-headed, they cannot understand.

David Lawrence: The British Association which is, many people regard an irrelevant bunch of scientists, who meet once a year, one of the good speeches was in fact given on the question of the value of human life. And one of the points was made there by somebody who has had to talk to these girls who come in to have abortions, some cases their third and fourth abortion, and they're not married of course. And saying that many of the girls regard an abortion in the same way as they regard a shampoo for their hair.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

David Lawrence: "O, well you know, hair's got to be washed, we wash hair. Womb's got to be cleaned out, we clean the womb out." Just like that.

Prabhupāda: And where is movement in the shampoo? That means that human beings are simply being put into ignorance, animal kingdom. This is modern civilization.

Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: But we don't find in the history of spiritual world the love between the gopīs and Kṛṣṇa broke at any time. That is the difference.

David Lawrence: Yes,yes. Whereas one in three of the Western marriages, so they say, is destined to break.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

David Lawrence: That's what they say now, one in three. It's the latest figures.

Prabhupāda: The same thing is there, but they are dragging this lusty affairs to Kṛṣṇa. Generally, the rascals, they paint Kṛṣṇa's picture with gopīs so that their lusty activities may be supported—Kṛṣṇa also had like that. This is misunderstanding. They do not take into calculation: Here, so-called love is lust and it breaks. But in the gopīs' love with Kṛṣṇa there is no breaking but increasing of love. So how they can compare Kṛṣṇa's love with gopīs with these lusty affairs?

David Lawrence: I must admit, yes, I've read far enough on to see that and I think this is...

Prabhupāda: When we make analogy, the points of similarity must be there. But these rascals are so dull-headed that they have not even logical arguments. Where are the points of similarity? That we are comparing these lusty affairs of this material world with the affairs of Kṛṣṇa and the gopīs? Where is the similarity?

David Lawrence: There's never mention of lust or of any animal desire at all is there?

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Therefore I have already explained. There must be a class of men like me. They are called brāhmaṇa. They should help others. One who cannot rise so early, they will help him by his knowledge. He, the man who cannot rise early in the morning and cannot take the brahminical principle, śūdra, kṣatriya, vaiśya, he should be helped with the knowledge acquired by the brāhmaṇa. Just like the same example. The leg. Leg is not brain. The brain will give direction to the leg, "You go this side." Then it is perfect. The leg has no brain, but the brain is there. If he takes the advice of the brain and goes... Just like... It is called the logic of blind and lame. There is a lame man and there is a blind man. The lame man cannot walk, and the blind man cannot see. They should join. The blind man took the lame man on his shoulder, and the lame man giving direction, and the blind man is going nicely. So by the cooperation of the blind and the lame, the work is done perfectly. Andha-kañjatā-nyāya. Similarly, it is not required that everyone has to become brāhmaṇa. Neither it is possible. So if the brāhmaṇa and the śūdra combine together, work, then both their lives will be perfect. Here you cannot expect everyone as brāhmaṇa, in this material world. That is not possible. Because in the material world three qualities are working. So one may be brāhmaṇa, another may be kṣatriya, another may be vaiśya, another may... So they should cooperate. Then everyone's life will be perfect. That is the program. That is cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). So the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means we are creating brāhmaṇas. So others, they should cooperate. Then their life will be also perfect. Just like these people are preaching that "You chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra and refrain from sinful activities." So if people take advice from these men, simple thing... Chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra is not difficult. Anyone can chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. And no illicit sex life. No... Even one cannot follow these restrictions, if he chants, he will be benefited. But if he chants and follows these restrictive rules, then he will be perfect in this life. And that is not difficulty. Suppose if I do not eat meat. We are not eating meat. We are not dying. We are eating so many nice things, prepared from vegetables, grains, milk. So that is not very important thing, that one has to eat meat and commit sinful life. So anyone can avoid it. They are not smoking, they are not drinking, they are not dying. So without smoking or without drinking, nobody will die. There are many things. No illicit sex. Why illicit sex? You are human being. You should have taken a woman as married wife and live peacefully. Why illicit sex? So still, if he cannot follow the four rules and regulations, if he agrees to chant only, then all other good qualities will come.

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1973, New Delhi:

Devotee: Bhāgavata.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

tyaktvā sva-dharmaṁ caraṇāmbujaṁ harer

bhajann apakvo 'tha patet tato yadi

yatra kva vābhadram abhūd amuṣya kiṁ

ko vārtha āpto 'bhajatāṁ sva-dharmataḥ

(SB 1.5.17)

Tyaktvā sva-dharmaṁ caraṇāmbujaṁ hareḥ. Just like many of our disciples, as a matter of civilized man they should have remained at home, obedient to the parents, get married and live peacefully with father and mother. Of course, European, American boys, they do not do that. But it is expected that should be like that. Just like yourself. You should have lived with your father. He also. But you did not do this. So take it for granted, out of sentiment, you took to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Tyaktvā sva-dharmam. To live family life, peaceful life, obedient life to the fathers and mothers, this is called sva-dharma. So one gives up this sva-dharma, tyaktvā sva-dharmam, and takes to Kṛṣṇa consciousness gone... Not many, a few. So Bhāgavata says, yatra kva vābhadram abhūd amuṣya kim: "What is the wrong there?" Even if he has fallen down, half-way, still there is no wrong. He has gained something. That much service which he has already given to Kṛṣṇa, that is recorded.

Morning Walk -- December 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is material life. As soon as they get some opportunity, they will have sex. That is the only hope. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukham (SB 7.9.45). Here the only happiness is sex. Otherwise they are working so hard like asses. Why? Only for that sex. The only aim is "I will enjoy sex at night." That's all. That is the only aim. Yan maithunādi. It is stated in the Bhāgavata. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham. They are attracted with the most abominable thing, sex life. Yes. Tuccham. Tuccham means very abominable, very insignificant thing. The position of the sex, the... How nasty it is! Just like crows, they enjoy in a nasty place. That is stated in the Bhāgavata. Tad vāyasa-tīrtham. Vāyasa means crows. The crows, as they enjoy... (break) gṛham andha-kūpam, ātma-pātam. As soon as you fall down, you are killed. You are killed. This example is given. That is stated in Bhāgavata. When a woman comes to serve you, you must know it is covered well. As soon as you fall down, then you are finished. Hitvātma-pātaṁ gṛham andha-kūpaṁ vanaṁ gato yad dharim āśrayeta (SB 7.5.5). Therefore in the Vedic system first brahmacārī, become brahmacārī. Learn how to avoid sex, celibacy. That is first instruction. And if you are completely unable, all right, get yourself married. Otherwise there is no need of sex life. Why one should have sex life?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Then how to continue the species?

Prabhupāda: Why you will continue? You finish it, this condemned world, where you are simply suffering. Why should you continue it?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because that is the laws of nature.

Morning Walk -- December 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Hṛdayānanda: He said like putting gas on the fire.

Prabhupāda: Ah. So increase the fire. Yes. But because we have got this body, we have to utilize it to make the best use of a bad bargain. Therefore marriage is allowed, gṛhastha life is allowed, not for increasing sex life, but to finish it as soon as possible.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But, Śrīla Prabhupāda, even in the very lower forms of life, there are some species, they reproduce without any sex? It's called asexual reproduction.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Oh yes. These bugs, bedbugs, they produce by this blood. You kill...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We cannot check reproduction.

Prabhupāda: No, how can you check? There are so many living entities. They have come to this material world to enjoy. So the reproduction must go on. Just like you cannot stop the jail. You come out, but another is ready to enter it. That is not possible.

Morning Walk -- December 7, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Not cheap! Their imitation... They are going to the... They're spending millions and millions. It is very dear, costly. First thing is imitation, and that imitation is very, very costly. Very expensive. So that is their foolishness. They'll be satisfied with the imitation which is very costly.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They work so hard. Śrīla Prabhupāda, there is a nice incident. There is a scientist from France, Pasteur. When he was about to be married, the same day, he forgot his own marriage day because he was working in his laboratory, doing experiments. So one of his friends reminded him, "Oh, Pasteur, your marriage day is today so you come out from the lab and you have to go there." Then he went out and got married,

Prabhupāda: There is a Bengali proverb, yāṅra loke bie naya, para lokera ghumnaya: (?) "The man who is to be married, he has forgotten, and the neighbors, they are not sleeping, 'Oh, that man will be married. That man will be married.' " But he has forgotten.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So people are saying that "See how sincerely he's working. Take his example."

Prabhupāda: Yes. So who is not sincerely working? He's working for some money. That's all. So everyone is working for money. What is the difference? If he's not paid for that, he'll not work. Just like a dog is working for the master, for the bread. That's all. So he's working not for himself, not for others, but for his money. Or some ambition. Prestige. That's right. (break) ...where? On the beach you are seeing?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: About ten miles from here.

Prabhupāda: In Bombay also, therefore it is two miles, three miles from Juhu.

Morning Walk -- December 8, 1973, Los Angeles:

Bali Mardana: The demons at Kṛṣṇa's time could not even accept Him as God, what to speak of the demons now.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Karandhara: Therefore they say, What is the platform of objectivity in determining what's God?"

Prabhupāda: This is definition. God has show in himself, exhibited Himself. He married sixteen thousand wives. Where is that person who can marry sixteen thousand wife and expand himself in sixteen thousand bodies? Where is that person?

Karandhara: They say no such person exists.

Prabhupāda: Therefore He is there. He is God, the superexcellent.

Karandhara: But they say He never did that. That's impossible.

Prabhupāda: He did it. There is a mention in the history.

Karandhara: George Washington didn't do anything which was out out out of the conception of belief.

Prabhupāda: No, out of conception, he had no power to do it. He had no power to do it.

Morning Walk -- December 18, 1973, Los Angeles:

Jayahari: It is just like the scientists. They cannot accept the existence of the soul until they see it.

Prabhupāda: No, that is explained. Why you are repeating that? You have no seeing power, still, you are boast of seeing. That is your rascaldom. That is your rascaldom. Yes. There was a question in a newspaper. A child is asking his father, "Father, you were a girl or a boy in childhood?" Because he has no distinction what is the boy, what is the girl, therefore he is asking that nonsense question. Now, my second son, when he was four years old, we were passing, and there was a big marriage party. You know how marriage party goes?

Girirāja: Oh yes.

Prabhupāda: So he was asking. Very intelligent boy, he was asking, "What is this? What is...?" So I also explained, "This man is going to marry." So in this way, after, "Father, you were married?" He asked me. So this nonsense question is there. He does not know, "Without marriage, how I am come into existence?" So these questions are like that, childish questions. It has no meaning. (break) ...the Vedic injunctions is tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). One must approach guru. Guru means heavy, who knows perfectly. You must go there to learn. And actually it is happening. Why the children are sent to school? When he becomes educated, the same eyes, same hands, same legs, same body, but he becomes educated. What is the different between educated and not educated? Because he has heard from authorities. That's all. This is education. Without going to school, he is not considered to be educated. Why? Because he did not hear from the authorities. Therefore he is uneducated. Let him learn everything. He has got the eyes. He has got the senses. Why he is sent to school? Why? Tell me, why? He has got the eyes. Why he is sent to school for education?

Devotee: To hear from the authority.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 5, 1974, Los Angeles:

Devotee (4): Who should, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Śrutakīrti.

Devotees: (indistinct)

Devotee (5): He got married yesterday.

Yaśodānandana: I heard yesterday he was married.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Yaśodānandana: He went to officially. I... We tried yesterday to convince him, but he would not listen.

Prabhupāda: Officially he's married now.

Devotee: Yes. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...seen that one who is married, he's lamenting, and who is not married, he's also lamenting. Is it not? Ah? One who is married, he's thinking, "Why did I marry? I would have remained free." He's lamenting. And who is not married, "Oh, I did not accept wife. I would have been happy." (laughs) (Hindi) There's a Hindi... It just like (Hindi). One who has eaten, he's also lamenting, and who has not eaten, he's also lamenting. (break) Tṛpyanti neha... That is said in Sanskrit. Tṛpyanti neha kṛpaṇā bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ (SB 7.9.45). Kṛpaṇā, by one's sex life he gets some children and he's... As soon as there is child, there is suffering. The child is suffering and the parents also suffering to take care. So, again he begets another child. Therefore it is said tṛpyanti neha kṛpaṇā bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ. Behind this child-producing there is so much difficulties and trouble. He knows that. But again pro... Doing the same thing. Tṛpyanti neha kṛpaṇā bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ. Therefore a sane person, kaṇḍūtivan manasijaṁ viṣaheta dhīraḥ. Therefore one who is dhīra, one who becomes sober, he tolerates the sensations, itching sensations. It is after all itching sensation. So one who can tolerate the itching sensation, he saves so much trouble. But one who cannot, he's implicated, immediately. Either illicit or legitimate, it is trouble. Yan maithunādi... That is the only happiness in this material world. That is only happiness. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham (SB 7.9.45). One who wants to remain in this material world, his only happiness is sex life. He has no other happiness. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham. And that is very abominable, tuccham happiness. What is this happiness? But they cannot understand. Kaṇḍūyanena karayor iva duḥkha-duḥkham. Itching, between the two hands. It produces so many bad results, but he's not satisfied. "All right, I've done once, that's all right. One children is all right, one or two." But no, then contraceptive, abortion, so many things. But the māyā is so strong, it will induce, "Yes, do this." Again implicated. (break) Becoming master of the dog, he has become servant of the dog.

Room Conversation -- February 13, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You're having strong teeth.

Dr. Kapoor: They are, so long as you don't know that I have not real ones. (laughter)

Devotee: That is māyā. (more laughing by Dr. Kapoor)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi).

Dr. Kapoor: She was here only a couple of days ago. My youngest son was married on the 20th of this month...

Prabhupāda: Ah, yes, I heard.

Dr. Kapoor: So they came in that connection.

Prabhupāda: (Hindi).

Dr. Kapoor: I have two sons and two daughters. The eldest one is the one you know.

Prabhupāda: Oh, in Kanpur.

Dr. Kapoor: In Kanpur.

Prabhupāda: Dhawan.

Dr. Kapoor: Dhawan, Dhawan. Yes, she also knows you very well.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes, I was Dhawan's guest sometimes.

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Guest (3): But Swamiji, sexual intercourse after marriage is against law of Manu?

Prabhupāda: No, that is also... There is law. You cannot have sexual intercourse with wife as you like, no. That is also illicit sex. Then... When the woman is in menstrual period, after five days, you can have once. As soon as she is pregnant, no more sexual intercourse. This is human being. Not that like animal. Animals also, they have got restrictions. You see? The lions, they have sexual intercourse once in life. Once in life. Brahmacārī. You see? So as soon as you violate the laws, then you are animal. Because law is meant for man. Just like "Keep to the right" and "left" in the road. It is meant for human being, not for the dogs. Dog, if he keeps right or left, it is not under law. But if you keep your car instead of left to the right, then you are criminal. (pause) So which way we have to go?... Human life begins when he understands what is dharma. That is human life, beginning. Aushikha (?) (Hindi) Jaiye aur Hindu religion hai, Muslim religion hai, Christian religion hai, Buddhist religion hai, Jewish religion hai. The religion must be there. But when we give up this religious process, then there is no more human life; it is animal life. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- February 20, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: No. That is because of degeneration of the lower fellows. They are not understanding the real teaching of Bhāgavata.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I have heard about that, about the Vallabha-sampradāya. Yes. I do not know whether it is fact. I have heard.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, about?

Dr. Patel: He belonged to Vallabha-sampradāya.

Prabhupāda: I do not know. I have heard that after marriage the girl was offered to guru.

Mr. Sar: No, that is not in Vallabha-sampradāya.

Dr. Patel: No, no, no.

Mr. Sar: No, on ours... Not on Gujarat side.

Dr. Patel: Nowhere, nowhere. It is all hearsay. I don't think it would be possible.

Mr. Sar: You see it is a...

Dr. Patel: Maybe a lower community...

Mr. Sar: No, no. Ignorant folk may be decepted like that when they say, "Well, I am Kṛṣṇa, you are gopīs. So let us enjoy."

Prabhupāda: Ah! Ah!

Mr. Sar: So ignorant folks... No, no. I tell you, this is the ignorant folks. That is likely to happen in all religions.

Prabhupāda: No. Our Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura punished one Viṣikiṣeṇa. I'll tell that story. It is a fact. One avatāra came. And he was doing that in the village. And they complained to the police officer. And it went to the High Commissioner. And then Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura was that time Magistrate. So the Commissioner knew that he is a pious man. So he entrusted the matter. And it was a long story. I'll tell you some time.

Morning Walk -- February 22, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: She was not coming back from that Mohammedan. Only Gandhi intermediated.

Dr. Patel: Mahatmaji played a fool with her. Being a bania he said that one wanted to, had to be a Muslim. So Mahatmaji said he would ask that man to become a Hindu. "If he becomes Hindu, I don't mind. You marry her." And that fellow, the Muslim, would not become Hindu. And then he ran off. That is how it happened.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break)

Dr. Patel: ...of the Hindu culture as we have suffered from Muslims.

Prabhupāda: No, it is all gone.

Dr. Patel: That is why, that is why you don't speak much of Muslims. But they are rogues and rascals, lower than...

Prabhupāda: No, we don't hate Muslims. I have got many students, Muslims.

Dr. Patel: No, we don't hate. I mean, what they have done in past, their forefathers. They have demolished so many temples. Because they did not... They were all (Hindi).

Prabhupāda: And this is all going on. Even in the Kurus' family, the other party, how much wrong they did to the Pāṇḍavas. They insulted their wife, they took their kingdom, and so many... They sent them to the forest, banishment. What did they not do? It is not the question of Hindu-Muslim. It is the question of the man, who is concerned.

Morning Walk -- February 23, 1974, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: To sacrifice.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That if you want to eat meat and chicken, then you first of all sacrifice before that deity. So at least they'll be restricted from eating meat purchased from slaughterhouse. But this rascal civilization, one side they're advertising "Stop cruelty to animals," another side they're opening unrestricted slaughterhouse. Just see. One side they're allowing marriage of woman every week, another side contraceptive. Just see their contradiction. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...there is animal sacrifice in the church. Is there any such pre...?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Jews, they have got.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. That was one of the things that Jesus was against.

Prabhupāda: Shocked. Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That the Jews were sacrificing animals in the temple. (pause)

Nitāi: Excuse me. (Microphone ruffles)

Prabhupāda: Don't come very near.

Nitāi: I'm sorry. (break)

Prabhupāda: No, no. People will know our position.

Morning Walk -- March 4, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: ...every payasā you should spend for Kṛṣṇa. Not that "Kṛṣṇa is giving money. Let us squander it as much as we like." Then there will be scarcity. (break) What is that?

Jayapatākā: This is a short cut.

Prabhupāda: Oh, all right. (break) ...pūjyante dhanya yatra sucancitam (?), "Where a rascal is not worshiped, where foodstuff is kept very carefully," and dam-patyoḥ kalaha nāsti, "and when there is no fight between husband and wife, or family-wise," tatra śrīḥ svayam āgataḥ, "there goddess of fortune is always present." Hare Kṛṣṇa. This is the principle given by Cāṇakya Paṇḍita, the greatest politician and moralist. Mūrkha means who is not pure devotee of Kṛṣṇa. He's a mūrkha or mūḍha. Not that ABCD learned. ABCD learned is no use. And another śloka, Cāṇakya Paṇḍita says who is learned man. Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu: "One who does not think of any illicit sex life." Mātṛvat... Every woman-mother. Except his married wife, every woman is mother. Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu para-loṣṭravat "And others' money, just like garbage." Nobody touches. Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat, and ātmavat sarva-bhūteṣu: "And one who sees like himself all other living entities, he's paṇḍita, he's learned." Not by MA, Ph.D. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...yaḥ paśyati. Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu. (break) ...nihāram iva bhā... It is called nihāra. As long, as soon as the sun becomes strong, immediately, everything finished. Just see. This... What is called fog, or...?

Jayapatākā: Just like when you came to the West, Prabhupāda, you cleared away the fog.

Prabhupāda: At least, I tried for that. Whatever is done it is done by Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...keeps intelligent to the sincere servant. Otherwise, everything is done by Kṛṣṇa. So if you, one is sincere to Kṛṣṇa, he will act everything rightly because the direction is... Buddhi yogaṁ dadāmi tam. The perfect direction is there. I do not know why people denies to take direction from Kṛṣṇa. He gets perfect direction. But he does not like to take. What is this tree?

Jayapatākā: The imli, I think.

ePrabhupāda: This is the position. "You wanted to become a sera. All right, you become a sera. Jump over some animal and immediately suck his blood." All facility is—the nails, the teeth-given. But is he happy? But everyone thinking that "If I could become like this, I would have been happy." So Kṛṣṇa gives all chance. "All right, you become this." This is transmigration. This is transmigration. (break) ...yathāndhair upa... We are thinking something like that, and Kṛṣṇa is giving us chance, "All right, you take this chance; you become like this." Ye yathā māṁ prapadyante (BG 4.11). But it will not make you happy. Therefore ultimately says, sarva-dharmān. "You give up all this rascaldom. What I speak, you can accept. That is your dharma." Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇam... (BG 18.66). That will be beneficial for you, the most confidential instruction. There is that story that one old woman, she was suffering. And she had to collect woods from the forest and sell in the market. So one day, how do you say, she was praying to Kṛṣṇa, or God, that "Kindly help me. I am in very poverty-stricken." So one day, she was carrying that load of fuel. It fell down. So nobody was there to help him. So she began to cry, "Who will help me?" So she began to pray to God "Kindly help me." And God came: "What do you want?" "Who are you, Sir?" "I am God." "Kindly help me to take this burden on my head." Yes. "All right." From God, she's asking, "Please help me to get this burden on my head." That's all. So everyone is going on, "Let family be very happy, my son be married. He may... Let him pass MA examination." But it is the same thing, "Give me the burden on my head." This is the prayer. Mūḍhāḥ. Na māṁ prapadyante mūḍhāḥ (BG 7.15). The life was meant for understanding Kṛṣṇa and worship Him, and he's asking, "Give me the burden on my head." Therefore mūḍha, rascal, fool. He's asking something which will never make him happy, even by merging into the effulgence, Brahman effulgence. It will never make him happy. But he does not know. Therefore he's mūḍha, rascal.

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Morning Walk -- March 6, 1974, Māyāpur

Morning Walk -- March 12, 1974, Vrndavana:

Hṛdayānanda: Should devotees be formally designated in a particular occupation?

Prabhupāda: Eh? No. Devotees are devotees. Actually devotees are above this brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. But for management of material things, we have to divide. Just like in the body there are divisions. There are... Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa was acting as a kṣatriya. In His boyhood, He was acting like a vaiśya. But Kṛṣṇa is neither kṣatriya nor, nor brāhmaṇa. This is the example. He was a cowherd boy. That is business of vaiśya. And when He was fighting in the battlefield, He was a kṣatriya. He was marrying as a kṣatriya. So although He was acting sometimes as kṣatriya, sometimes as vaiśya, but He's neither of these. So devotee is like that. He may act in any position, but He is above all the material conception of life. That is perfection. Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa...

Nitāi: Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Nitāi: What should the kṣatriyas be taught?

Prabhupāda: Kṣatriyas should be taught that he is manager. He must see that everyone is engaged. And if there is any fight, they must come forward to fight. This is kṣatriya's business. There may be fight. Somebody may attack us. Not that chanting, "Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa..." No. They must come forward. "Yes, we are prepared to fight." That is kṣatriya.

Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:

Hṛdayānanda: But never the cow.

Prabhupāda: No. Cow... The śūdras, they can take a goat and sacrifice before the deity, goddess Kālī, and then eat. Nobody should be given unrestricted freedom to eat meat. Or wine. If one is adamant to drink wine, then there is Caṇḍī-pūjā, Durgā-pūjā. That means restriction. That means restriction. Under certain condition. Similarly, sex life—marriage. That is also sex life, but under condition.

Satsvarūpa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, is this school for women also, or just for men?

Prabhupāda: For men. Women should automatically learn how to cook, how to cleanse home.

Satsvarūpa: So they don't attend varṇāśrama college.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Varṇāśrama college especially meant for the brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya and vaiśya. Those who are not fit for education, they are śūdras. That's all. Or those who are reluctant to take education-śūdra means. That's all. They should assist the higher class.

Hṛdayānanda: Would the brāhmaṇas learn Sanskrit?

Prabhupāda: Eh? Not necessarily.

Hṛdayānanda: Not necessarily. Just more philosophy.

Prabhupāda: Just like I am translating all the books, similarly, any book of knowledge can be translated into different languages. Not that one has to learn Sanskrit.

Morning Walk -- March 17, 1974, Vrndavana:

Guru dāsa: One who works hard for Kṛṣṇa day and night and one who controls his senses.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the first thing. Vāco vegaṁ krodha-vegam udara-vegam upastha-vegaṁ manasa-vegam, etān vegān yo viṣaheta dhīraḥ pṛthivīṁ sa śiṣyāt (NOI 1). One who can control these kinds of urges, vāco vegam, talking nonsense—that is called vāco vegam. Krodha-vegam, anger. Urges of the mind. Mind dictates, "Do this, do that." Then udara-vegam, eating vegam. "Eat more, more, more." Udara-vegam. Upastha-vegam. Genital. When one can control these six vegān, urges, then he is fit for becoming gosvāmī, and he can make śiṣya all over, śiṣya, disciple, all over the world. Pṛthivīṁ sa śiṣyāt. This is gosvāmī. Not that a business. (Hindi) Is there any mention Bhāgavata-saptāha in the Bhāgavatam? There are so many big, big commentators. They have never recommended. But this business is going on. They are holding Bhāgavata-saptāha and bringing money and employing it for the sons', daughters' marriage very opulently. And the, their supporters, they're also invited. They say, "Oh here is a gosvāmī." This is going on here. (break) ... of gosvāmī, there is not a single gosvāmī. At least visible. Where is that vāco vegaṁ krodha-vegam udara upastha-vegam (NOI 1) control? And where is that pṛthivīṁ sa śiṣyāt, all world-wide?

Guru dāsa: Yes, disciples...

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) Ah, where is that? Śiṣya.

Devotee: You are.

Morning Walk -- March 27, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...seven years. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Dr. Patel: (talking constantly in background to somebody else) And these boys are very good students because they are... (break) ...this dating business. I hate this word date itself. Eh?

Prabhupāda: Well, this hating... You hate for something, he hates for something else. That is going on.

Dr. Patel: But this dating... That is why I to... I mean, I did not see my wife before I married her. And we were very happy all the life. (break)

Prabhupāda: That is not happening nowadays. Now, when... One girl is visited many times, and she becomes pregnant. Then marriage takes place.

Dr. Patel: Then only...

Guest (1): By force you marry.

Prabhupāda: Otherwise, there is no marriage.

Guest (1): Now they are, they questioned and they call this the modern day...

Prabhupāda: (break) ...of the same quality.

Guest (1): That is the now. That is how.

Prabhupāda: How the mother can do that! Birds of the same feather.

Morning Walk -- March 27, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: How the mother can do that! Birds of the same feather.

Bhava-bhūti: It's predicted like that in the Bhāgavata.

Guest (1): But the vibrations of these boys, what... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...done? Therefore we have got the Dallas school.

Guest (1): I mean the Indian method of arranging marriage, by the parents is the best. (break)

Prabhupāda: I have got them married. Although I am not their parents, I asked that "You marry this." They accepted.

Guest (1): That is the right way.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) Jagat... Jagat-tāriṇī.

Bhava-bhūti: Oh yes.

Prabhupāda: What is the name, Jagat-tāriṇī?

Viśākhā: Dīna-tāriṇī?

Prabhupāda: No, no, Jagat-tāriṇī?

Bhava-bhūti: Jagat-tāriṇī, yes.

Prabhupāda: Who...

Bhava-bhūti: And Bhūrijana.

Prabhupāda: He married Jagat-tāriṇī. She was a famous artist. So she came to me to surrender, that "I shall become your disciple."

Morning Walk -- March 27, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Guest (1): She was painting in that film?

Prabhupāda: No, no. She is another girl. She's Jadurāṇī. So this Jagat-tāriṇī, after some days, I asked her that "You go to Japan. There is my disciple, Bhūrijana. You go and marry him." So she did not see the boy, did not know anything about. And she was very rich. Still, on my order, she went to Japan and married that boy.

Dr. Patel: And is she unhappy?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: Very happy.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (1): That's guru-vacana.

Dr. Patel: No, no. That guru and... Gurudeva... (break)

Prabhupāda: No. I did not like my wife. Still, I had to marry her. (laughter)

Dr. Patel: And you had not bad days all your life. Or you were quarreling? I am sorry to intrude.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: Were you?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: So you are quarrelsome even now. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: My wife... I admit she's very nice lady. But I did not like her. (break) ...if he becomes so, he cannot become Aurobindo Ghosh. If he becomes attached to the wife up to the point of death, he never becomes Aurobindo Ghosh.

Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:

Indian man (2): That is what he says...

Prabhupāda: That's... You see? He does not know what is the scheme of Vedas. You cannot stop meat-eating all of a sudden. But you can raise some restriction. These rascals who are meat-eaters, if you say, "Don't eat meat," he'll never do that. Therefore, "Yes, you can eat meat, just after offering to the goddess Kālī," and in this way, that means, once in the month, that means restricted. Restricted. So, Vedas means they're taking gradually, not that, like a foolish, "You don't do this." You cannot do that. That is Vedic authority. The Vedas are meant for everyone. Those who are meat-eaters, you cannot stop them all of a sudden. Similarly, drunkards. You cannot stop them, drunkards, "Don't drink." They'll not hear you. Therefore restriction. "Yes, you can drink, after offering to the devī," and that means restriction. So what is the meaning of marriage? Because sex like the cats and dogs, stop it. Just get married. In this way, otherwise, you may say "No marriage." Just like, the other day these sannyāsīs come, because saw woman was sitting, they'll not enter. But I saw their teeth was so unclean, and the dress was never washed. But they have got this restriction, no seeing of woman.

Morning Walk -- April 1, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That's all right, Brahma-light. But the Brahma-light, according to Bhāgavata philosophy, even one enters in the Brahman effulgence, still he falls down. Still he falls down. Arūhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padaṁ tataḥ patanty adhaḥ anādhṛta-yusmad-aṅghrayaḥ (SB 10.2.32). Unless one is fixed up in the personal form of the Lord, there is chance of falling down. They fall down actually. We have seen so many sannyāsīs. Just like at the present moment, Korpatali(?). He's now busy in politics.

Dr. Patel: One man married in America, some sannyāsī.

Chandobhai: Citrabhānu, Citrabhānu.

Dr. Patel: Citrabhānu, or... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...one is God.

Bhāgavata: Citrabhānu.

Chandobhai: Citrabhānu, yes.

Bhāgavata: Brahmānanda Swami met him in Mombassa, Śrīla Prabhupāda, and he was speaking all this nonsense. Then he went to America... (break)

Chandobhai: ...icchanto brahmacaryaṁ caranti.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- April 4, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: They do not have that mind fixed on Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they cannot. Why they cannot? Adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamiśram (SB 7.5.30). This gṛha-vrata means their sense enjoyment. This gṛhastha life is a concession for sense gratification, license. Actually, it is not required. Sex life is not required. But those who cannot avoid the sex life, they are given some license, "All right, you enjoy sex life, marry one woman, remain as faithful husband and wife." So unless one determines that "This is not my life, gṛha-vrata..." Apaśyatām ātma-tattvaṁ gṛheṣu gṛha-medhinām (SB 2.1.2). In another place it is said also, by Sukadeva Gosvāmī, one who cannot understand what is his self-interest, apaśyatām ātma-tattvam, actually what is needed, what is the need of the soul, gṛheṣu gṛha-medhinām... The gṛha-vrata and gṛhamedhi, these two words are for persons who are too much attached to this worldly life. So this determination already is there, that "Kṛṣṇa is the original cause of everything." Iti matvā bhajante mām. One who understands this perfectly well, he can be engaged in the matter of rendering service to Kṛṣṇa. Otherwise it is very difficult. Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato va.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: He is in the heart of a dog also. Then dog is also Kṛṣṇa. So why one should go to the temple? He can worship his dog at home. If this logic is all right. (break) ...the verdict of the Rāmakrishna mission, "You can worship whatever you like. That is God." And therefore they have manufactured this word, daridra-nārāyaṇa. (break) Jāta-karma-saṁskāra, saṁskārād bhaved dvijaḥ. Saṁskāra, reformatory method, begins before the birth. Before the birth, when the father and mother have sex, that is called garbhādhāna-saṁskāra. That is also another ceremony. It is not a hidden fact. So saṁskārad bhaved dvijaḥ. Otherwise it is birth like cats and dogs. That is Vedic civlization, saṁskāra before the birth and immediately after the birth, then one after another. This is called jata-karma; then nāma-karma; then when he is grown boy, upanayana-saṁskāra, dīkṣā-saṁskāra; then when he is grown up and marriage... Marriage is also another saṁskāra. In this way there are daśa-vidha-saṁskāra. So unless one goes through all the saṁskāras, he is not accepted as higher caste. He is śūdra. In a brāhmaṇa family, if the garbhādhāna-saṁskāra is not taken, so it is said that immediately the whole family becomes śūdra, no more brāhmaṇas. Then where is garbhādhāna-saṁskāra is going on? Nobody takes care of garbhādhāna-saṁskāra. Still, they are declaring that "I am brāhmaṇa." Therefore the conclusion is kālau śūdra-sambhavaḥ: "Everyone is śūdra." (break) ...no education. Still, one is called paṇḍitji. What is the meaning of this "paṇḍitji?" If he is not learned, then why do you call him paṇḍitji? (laughing) (break) That paṇḍiya is also another form of paṇḍita.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...even the richest man, their wife has no bangles. You see? And they are jewelries. Jewelries. Cow, butter, throwing butter like anything, and silk sari and enough food grains. What is more want for material advancement? That is real material ad... You have got everything, material needs. (break) If a man can feed his wife and children, then he is successful. There is no question of charity. There is no question of charity. But here it is said they were also giving in charity. (break) ...stopped to become real brāhmaṇa and give instruction to the society, and they also stopped giving charity to the brāhmaṇas. So therefore the society is so fallen. There is no instruction from the brāhmaṇas and no charity from the kṣatriya and vaiśya. (break) ...proṣita bhārtṛkā. By the dress a woman is recognized. When she does not dress very nicely, it is to be understood that her husband is out of home. When there is the vermillion, that means she is married. When the, what is called, division? Siti. Siti is in this side, then she is prostitute. The dress, when the woman dresses with white dress, they are widow, no husband. Yes, in this way by dress...

Indian man: Yes. You can recognize here. But now they are changed completely.

Prabhupāda: Yes. When the girl has no this covering, that means she is virgin. She is not married. In this way all the signs are there. This is prosita bhartrka. Prosita-bhartrka means one whose husband is not at home, outside. Then she will not dress, she will not take regular bath, so that people may know that her husband is not at home.

Morning Walk -- April 12, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No necessary, necessary, necessary because mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja. That is the path of bhakti. It is also confirmed, bhaktyā mām abhijānāti (BG 18.55).

Indian man (1): Bhakti is in the mind, in the heart.

Prabhupāda: No, not in the mind. No, no. Bhakti is in the heart, but there must be... Just like if you have got love for me in the heart, it must be demonstrated. Just like a husband and wife. The wife is says, "Now we are married and I have got love for you. Let me remain here. You go to your home." The bridegroom comes, "Now we are married and I love you, you love me. You go home, I remain here." Is that very good proposal?

Indian man (1): No, but this...

Prabhupāda: This is nonsense. (laughing) "I have got bhakti, but I don't do anything for You. You go home." So that is not bhakti. Bhakti must be exhibited by activity. That is the definition of bhakti. Śravaṇam kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ smaraṇaṁ pāda-sevanam (SB 7.5.23). So these are the nine different ways of expressing bhakti. First thing is śravaṇam. Śravaṇam. Śravaṇam kīrtanaṁ, chanting and hearing. Of whom? Of Viṣṇu. Śravaṇam kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ. Not of any other one. The Māyāvādī philosophers, they say that "We can chant anyone's name, either I chant of any demigod's name or any name."

Morning Walk -- April 12, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is avidhi-pūrvakam. That is said, avidhi-pūrvakam, "Not in order."

ye 'py anya-devatā-bhaktā

yajanti śraddhānvitāḥ

te 'pi mām eva kaunteya

yajanty avidhi-pūrvakam

That is not vidhi. Vidhi is here. Śravaṇam kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ smaraṇaṁ pāda-sevanam. The first word is Viṣṇu, of Viṣṇu, not of any other. So these are the demonstration of bhakti. Śravaṇam kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ smaraṇaṁ pāda-sevanam arcanaṁ (SB 7.5.23). This is arcanā. Just like we perform in the morning, in the evening, at noon, arcā-vigraha. Viṣṇu, arcayam, Viṣṇu. It is not idol worship. Arcayaṁ viṣṇu-śilā-dhiḥ. If one thinks the arcā-mūrti, the worshipable Deity in the temple, as stone or as wood, arcayaṁ viṣṇu-śilā-dhiḥ guruṣu nara-matiḥ... To accept guru, in the paramparā system... All the gurus in the paramparā system... Evaṁ paramparā prāptam (BG 4.2). Nara-matiḥ, consider him as ordinary human being... In this way there is a list. Vaiṣṇave jāti-buddhiḥ. A Vaiṣṇava, a devotee: "He is brāhmaṇa Vaiṣṇava. He is American Vaiṣṇava. He is śūdra Vaiṣṇava." No. When one is Vaiṣṇava, there should be no distinction by the caste. Vaiṣṇave jāti-buddhiḥ. In this way there is a list that should be avoided. So these things required. If actually... The same thing, that if a girl is married to the husband, she must be always engaged in the service of the husband. That will be appreciated. If she says, "Sir, now we are married. You go home and I remain at home," there will be no prayojana-siddhi. The real purpose of marriage is to get children. Putrārthe kriyate bhāryā. So if the husband and wife simply love within the mind and there is no action, there is no prayojana-siddhi. We should be practical, not simply theoretical. So love between two persons, there must be exchange of loving feelings. These are the exchange of loving feelings. Unless the exchange loving feelings are there, that is not love. That is theoretical.

Morning Walk -- April 12, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That's all right. But that is the system. That is the system. You should begin. That... That is described in the Bhāgavatam. The First and Second Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam are the two legs of Kṛṣṇa. That is the beginning. Janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). These professional reciters, they read Bhāgavata. They jump over immediately to the face. The Tenth Canto is described as the face of Kṛṣṇa. So you cannot go immediately to the head. You must begin from the feet. First Canto, Second Canto. Therefore there are nine cantos, and then Tenth Canto. And the Kṛṣṇa's rasa dance, that is the smiling of Kṛṣṇa. So you cannot ask the superior to take the facility of his smiling. Smiling will be when he is pleased. The difficulty is that the Māyāvādī philosophy, they do not accept the form of the Lord. And they do not know how to behave with the form. Of course, there is no difference between Kṛṣṇa's face and Kṛṣṇa's feet. There is no difference. But still, the system must be followed. Pāda-sevanam. It is very important verse. Śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ (SB 7.5.23). When one has heard, when one has properly chanted, he has little experience of the transcendental form of the Lord, then his service beginning. Just like I engage one servant. So gradually he is given service. "First of all this, first of all that, then..." Again and again, again, again. The same example can be given, that the husband and wife. Formerly, when I was married, my wife was eleven years old. So (laughing) an eleven years old girl and I was at the same time twenty-one, twenty-two. One day I captured her hand. She began to cry. A little girl, you see? So gradually, gradually. I know... When my brother-in-law, sister's husband, used to come... In the beginning, the girls were very... My sisters were same age. So they would meet the husband, offering a little pan or little sandeśa. (break) ...after this. Then niṣṭhā. Then he has got a firm conviction that "Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and my duty is to serve Kṛṣṇa." That is called niṣṭhā.

Morning Walk -- April 16, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: There also, there is life. There is life.

Indian Man (2): Unfertilized, but then... (break)

Prabhupāda: She became widow at the age of eighteen years. So my father engaged her in worshiping Deity. My father was worshiping, and she was the assistant. Of course, she had two children by that time. Yes, go on. (break) ...Kṛṣṇa, and Kṛṣṇa is all attractive. So immediately they attracted the other cows, although they were not actual mother. (break) ...doctor in Calcutta, young man, he married the daughter of a very rich man. So his father-in-law gave him a motorcar, so he advised... He was a businessman. He advised that "Even if you have no practice, you simply ride on this car and go around."

Dr. Patel: (laughter) He's a typical Bengali. (Prabhupāda laughs)

Prabhupāda: So actually, by his going round, he increased his practice. (Indians talking Hindi)

Prabhupāda: (break) ...between demigod. Demigods are also expansion, but that is separated expansion, separated expansion, vibhinnāṁśa. In the Varāha-Purāṇa it is said, vibhinnāṁśa. And here, svāṁśa, personal expansion.

Room Conversation -- April 26, 1974, Tirupati:

Wife: Yesterday I saw you in the temple, I and my daughter.

Prabhupāda: Yes. How many children you have got?

Indian man: I have got three sons and four daughters.

Prabhupāda: All daughters, sons.

Indian man: Three sons, three daughters are married. This daughter is to be married. She is a doctorate. She has got M.Sc., Ph.D., in nuclear physics. She went to England for one year.

Prabhupāda: Where did you stay in England?

Daughter: Liverpool.

Prabhupāda: Liverpool. I think we have got our branch.

Daughter: Manchester, I have seen, Manchester.

Prabhupāda: Manchester you have seen? Oh. Manchester, Liverpool, and London... London we have got two.

Indian man: London, in London I have got my son. My son is there.

Prabhupāda: Oh. What he is doing?

Indian man: He is employed there. He's an accountant, cost accountant.

Prabhupāda: Oh. So your children are also... (laughs)

Room Conversation -- April 26, 1974, Tirupati:

Prabhupāda: Oh. So your children are also... (laughs)

Indian man: I have got another boy in West Germany.

Prabhupāda: West Germany. Berlin?

Indian man: No, he is in Frankfurt.

Prabhupāda: Frankfurt. Oh, yes. Frankfurt is a big city. Sons are all married?

Indian man: The last son is not married. Two sons are married. Three daughters are... This daughter is to be married. We are trying, not able to get a suitable groom, you see. With your blessings I hope we will succeed.

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) Nowadays it is very difficult job to get married. (everyone laughs)

Wife: Suitable.

Prabhupāda: Well, suitable cannot be. There is no suitable.

Indian man: Difficult to find.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Formerly, as the girl is grown up, any boy.

Indian man: We used to marry at the age of ten, eleven. That is... Those days have been forty years back.

Prabhupāda: I was also married. My wife was eleven years old.

Indian man: My wife was eleven when she was married. I was only sixteen when I was married. Only a difference of four or five years.

Room Conversation -- April 26, 1974, Tirupati:

Prabhupāda: Yes. And before that, I heard my father-in-law, he was eleven years old, and my mother-in-law was seven years old. My eldest sister was born at nine years old. And I was born after her marriage.

Indian man: Those old days are finished.

Prabhupāda: All right, thank you. (end)

Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: Wine is sanctioned?

Richard Webster: I don't mean to get drunk. I mean to...

Atreya Ṛṣi: Wine, for today's Roman Catholics, they think it is sanctioned.

Prabhupāda: They think so many other things also. Just like Roman Catholics, there is example: they have allowed marriage between man to man. Do you know that?

Richard Webster: No.

Prabhupāda: Yes. In New York there is a paper, Watchtower. They publish a monthly magazine. I have seen in that magazine. They are condemning that the priests have allowed marriage, man to man. And...

Richard Webster: In New York maybe. Not in Rome.

Prabhupāda: Christianity does not mean in New York it should be different and Rome it should be different. Then nobody is following.

Morning Walk at Villa Borghese -- May 26, 1974, Rome:

Bhagavān: He must steal.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is their satisfaction. So you must allow them. In old zamindar family, they will pay the manager five rupees per month, salary, and allow them to steal. That was simply a token salary that "You are servant." And the manager was so clever, he would steal, but he would not spoil the property of the master. He will manage very nicely that he will extra, make extra income and steal. The master will not be touched. Master will be happy. Master knows that "I am paying him five rupees. That is nothing." And he is constructing big building, getting his sons and daughters married very luxuriantly. Master is... Even fifty years before, there was a zamindar, Raja Manindra Candranandi. He was very magnanimous man, making various charities. So if somebody will complain, "Sir, your this servant is stealing like this," he would be very angry. The man who complains, he will be angry upon him, "Why do you come and complain?" He will not accept any complaint. Rather, he will be angry with the man who complains.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1974, Rome:

Yogeśvara: There was a report in the New York Times that last year alone in the United States there were over 300,000 abortions, and more than two-thirds were performed on girls under twenty years of age.

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is civilization. Poor girls, they are victims. These rascals are enjoying without any responsibility of marriage. And sex impulse is very strong between thirteen years up to thirty years. So people take advantage of it, and the poor girls become victim. So many anomalies. This is a doggish, demonic civilization. This is not civilization at all. They are not interested. They do not know what is the aim of life. First mistake is that "I am this body." This is doggish. Just like the dog is barking. He is thinking, "I am a big dog here. Don't come." Similarly, if a man thinks, "I am a big American, I am great Englishman," then what is the difference? The dog is also thinking like that. And Vedic civilization says, "No, you are neither dog nor human being." Ahaṁ brahmāsmi: "I am spirit soul." This is Vedic civilization. One is being trained up to understand this philosophy, that "I do not belong to this, any material condition. I am Brahman part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa." Where is that conception?

Bhagavān: Now they have... the other day in the paper that India exploded its first atomic bomb.

Prabhupāda: Yes, and therefore yet it has become very great.

Morning Walk -- May 28, 1974, Rome:

Yogeśvara: But that's not possible for the mass of people.

Prabhupāda: No, why not possible? We have got so many, just like Śukadeva Gosvāmī. He remained completely brahmacārī, although naked he is. He is. He doesn't require, and neither he is agitated. Just like when he was passing, the girls were taking bath. They did not take care. They knew that he is not at all affected by any woman. And when his father was going, they covered. So father inquired, Vyāsadeva, a personality like Vyāsadeva, said, "Why you covered? I am old man, and my young son he was passing naked." They said that "He is paramahaṁsa. He has no agitation of the mind. But you are gṛhastha. You live with woman. You have got distinction, man and woman." So this is civilization. What is the use of sex life? It is simply entanglement. Therefore, at the last stage, one is supposed to become sannyāsī. What is sannyāsī? Vānaprastha, sannyāsī, brahmacārī—no sex life. Out of the four different status of life, the brahmacārī has no sex life, the vānaprastha has no sex life, the sannyāsī has no sex life. Only the gṛhastha. That means it is prohibitory. It is allowed—it is simply concession to the person who cannot remain without sex life. It is simply a concession. Otherwise, according to Vedic civilization, there is no need of sex life. Because it is entanglement, simply entanglement. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tucchaṁ kaṇḍūyanena karayor iva duḥkha-duḥkham (SB 7.9.45). The example has been given. There is itching between the two hands. That's all. That means the itching disease is increased. This has been the description of sex life. Tṛpyanti neha kṛpaṇā bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ. Although behind the sex life there are so many troubles, but still the rascals do not cease. Either illicit sex or legal sex... Legal sex you beget children. There are so many troubles. You have to raise them nicely, you have to give them education, you must be situated nicely. That is the duty of father. Otherwise, he would go on, begetting like cats and dogs, no responsibility. Just like some of our students, immediately married and again, "Give me sannyāsa." What is this? Irresponsible, that's all. Irresponsibility. So these things are not required at all. These things are not required. Bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ. After marrying they see it is very great responsibility. "Now let me take sannyāsa." That's all. Why you marry? Because he finds that after marriage there are so many difficulties. So irresponsible man. So after there is difficulties; that's a fact. So why should you go to the difficulty? Therefore the conclusion is the married life is not required. But if you cannot tolerate, all right, get this concession, live very gentlemanly. This is marriage. Otherwise for higher sense, higher elevation... High elevation, of course, one who is actually on the higher elevation, he is married or not married, it doesn't matter. But on the whole, the sex life is not necessary.

Morning Walk -- May 28, 1974, Rome:

Yogeśvara: So these Italian women are complaining now that their husbands are abusing them, so why can they not get divorced?

Prabhupāda: Why do you marry?

Yogeśvara: Obviously, they wanted sex in the beginning, but they didn't know it was going to be so much trouble.

Prabhupāda: That is our point. Then why do you marry? Just begin Kṛṣṇa conscious, and you will find, without sex, you will be happy.

Yogeśvara: But what do we advise such women?

Prabhupāda: Whatever they, others women, they may take lesson from them that, "If these woman are suffering or these men are suffering, why should we marry?" There is a Bengali proverb, dekhe sekhe and tekhe sekhe (?). One who is intelligent, he can see what is happening, he becomes cautious. And one, when actually experienced, then he becomes cautious. Less intelligent. So if it is not good, why you are marrying? Why you are induced by sex life? Stop it by Kṛṣṇa consciousness. If you devote yourself, the whole life, in Kṛṣṇa consciousness you will not be agitated by any sex life. And that is yad-avadhi mama cetaḥ kṛṣṇa-pādāravinde. If one is actually advanced in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he will deride, "Huh! Nonsense! What is this?" That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, advancement. The only remedy, prime remedy for all solution, is Kṛṣṇa conscious. That we have to say. So answers are all right or not?

Yogeśvara: No, very nice. (laughter)

Morning Walk -- May 28, 1974, Rome:

Yogeśvara: Well, for example, ultimately, we want to live locally. These cities are not necessary.

Prabhupāda: No, you make the best use of a bad bargain. We shall depend more... Just like in New Vrindaban. They are coming to the city for preaching. So not absolutely we can abstain immediately because we have been dependent so long, many, many lives. You cannot. But the ideal should be introduced gradually. And make it perfect more and more and more and more. But there is possibility. Possibility if you live locally and make your arrangement, you get your foods... The real necessity is, bodily necessity is, eating, sleeping, mating and defending. This is necessity. So if you can eat locally, you can sleep locally, you can have your sex life also locally and you can defend locally, then what is the wrong? These are the necessities. We are not stopping this. We are not stopping, "No more sex life." That is nonsense, another nonsense. You must have. Marry. That's all. So you can marry locally and live. Where is the difficulty? Defend. If somebody comes to attack, there must be men to defend. And eating and sleeping. Where is your difficulty? Manage locally, as far as possible. After all, these are the necessities of body. So it can be solved locally. Is it impossible? To solve the bodily necessities? What do you think? Is it impossible?

Satsvarūpa: No, it's very simple.

Room Conversation with Monsieur Roost, Hatha-yogi -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Occidental means eastern, er, western? Yes.

Nitāi: Western.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They are all western. They have taken to it. They have given up all such habits. In the beginning they were coming to me with their girlfriends, boyfriends. I said, "No, you cannot stay like that." So they agreed. I have got them married personally. They have got children. If you want to live as gṛhastha, live. If you want to live as vānaprastha or as sannyāsa... So generally, young men, young girls, I get them married. There is no harm. Married life, sex life, that is allowed in the śāstra. But not illicit sex. That is not allowed. If one remains sinful, he cannot make any progress of spiritual life. That is not possible. This is bogus, that you remain sinful and at the same time make spiritual progress. That is not possible. Otherwise, why there is distinction of sinful and pious life? You must be pious life. And the basic principle of pious life is this, avoid these four sinful life: illicit sex, intoxication, gambling and meat-eating. They are sinful life. So one cannot make any progress in spiritual life who is habituated to act sinfully. That is not possible.

Room Conversation with Monsieur Roost, Hatha-yogi -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

M. Roost: I am according, but how to understand, how to measure...?

Prabhupāda: This is plain understanding. Just like physician says that "If you eat these things, then you will not be cured." A physician should straightly speak to the patient, "You should not do this. Then you will be cured." If he does not agree, then he will not be cured. It is like that. If you remain sinful, then you cannot make any spiritual progress of life. That is going on. All the swamis, yogis, and... Don't mind. I have seen. They keep them in the sinful life and talk very, very, big, big words. That will not help. Sinful life must be stopped. Then yoga practice will be successful. Yuktāhāra-vihārasya yogo bhavati siddhiḥ. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. If you are yogi, if you want siddhi, then you must eat and sleep and accept things—yukta. Yukta means "as it is required, not more than that, not less than that." That is yukta. We don't say that you stop. No, we don't say. We give them eatables. We don't say there is no sex life. Sex life is there. But married, simply for begetting children. Otherwise, no sex life. Not for sense gratification. If these things go on... In New York there is a yogi. I do not wish to name his... But in the paper it was published that he was having sex with his disciple. Is it not?

Nitāi: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 6, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: When I first came to America, Butler, in Pennsylvania, that is small county, but at least one dozen churches I found. I very much appreciated, that the people are not... And they're going regularly, churches. I was invited in many churches. I was...

Yogeśvara: To lecture?

Prabhupāda: Yes. The, the girl, that, my friend's son's wife... He's Indian. He has married an English girl. So I was guest at his house. So that girl, Sally... Selly or Sally?

Yogeśvara: Sally.

Prabhupāda: She was arranging so many meetings. She was very intelligent girl. So churches, many churches, she... Some of the churches purchased my books.

Yogeśvara: Recently, one of our saṅkīrtana parties went to Butler, Pennsylvania, and one of the devotees met a priest on the street. He said: "Oh, yes, I remember your spiritual master. He was here."

Prabhupāda: So I was giving lectures. They have churches. That means God conscious persons there. I never criticized church, mosque, never. Because whatever it may be, at least there is God consciousness. So they're good. In details... But when they disobey... I criticize only these rascals, disobey the commandments. Otherwise, we have no... We don't criticize.

Morning Walk -- June 6, 1974, Geneva:

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Many of the young people now, they look to the Bible for instruction, but they don't like to go to church at all. They feel that the church is hypocritical.

Prabhupāda: Hypocritical, simply hypocritical. All these priests and cardinals and popes, they're all hypocritical. Getting high, highly salaried, high salaries, and drinking wine. And in America there is a hospital, five thousand drunkard priests are admitted there to cure their drinking habit. That was published in a paper. And they're sanctioning man to man marriage. That was published in that, what is that? Watch?

Satsvarūpa: Watchtower?

Prabhupāda: Watchtower. Yes.

Guru-gaurāṅga: They did a survey among the Catholic priests...

Prabhupāda: What is this? They do not fight. Why there is soldier? (laughter) What nonsense. Why there are soldiers? The neutral? 1939. This is Second World War. And First World War, 19...

Yogeśvara: (reading) "Dedicated to the soldiers of Geneva who died in the service of their country."

Prabhupāda: So that means it was attacked?

Guru-gaurāṅga: Probably defending banks or things like that. Civil.

Prabhupāda: Two wars, 1914 to 1918.

Morning Walk -- June 6, 1974, Geneva:

Satsvarūpa: Even if he was mleccha, he can become brāhmaṇa.

Yogeśvara: Actually, the chemists also say that there are four types of blood, A, AB, O, and something like that. They give it four names.

Prabhupāda: And according to Hindu system, the marriage was taking place finding, examining the girl's constitution and the boy's constitution so that there may not be disruption. Everything was there.

Yogeśvara: The Vedic system is so scientific.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. That is human civilization. That is Āryan civilization. Vedic civilization means Āryan.

Yogeśvara: Hitler also wanted to produce a pure breed of Āryans, but artificially. He just said anyone who is German-born, they are the pure Āryans.

Prabhupāda: But so much freedom in sex, how the blood can be pure? (break)

Yogeśvara: ...but Kṛṣṇa-prasādam?

Prabhupāda: Then he's neutral always. He's not affected by all these qualities.

Yogeśvara: I guess the blood becomes purified like that. (break)

Prabhupāda: I said that "You scientists, you are simply wasting time." Did I not say that, last night?

Yogeśvara: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1974, Geneva:

Satsvarūpa: The parents were twelve or thirteen. The children were healthy. But this magazine said that children are healthy if the parents are from twenty-one to thirty-six.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: In the Bhāgavatam, you said that by the age of sixteen, a girl should be married, or twenty-four for a man. We were just reading that...

Prabhupāda: That is the maximum.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: We were just reading that.

Prabhupāda: The point is that supposing this twenty to thirty-six years is nice age... For women. But before twenty years, she is sacked, and her health is broken. What she'll produce, children? Because this is... The girls, from twelve years, thirteen years, nowadays, they begin sex.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: That's true.

Prabhupāda: Is it not?

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: That's true.

Prabhupāda: So before she reaches twenty years, twenty times she must have taken contraceptive method. And that means her health is ruined. What she'll produce? They are given in the schools, colleges, contraceptive tablets. And they are prohibiting, "Don't get child before twenty years." What is this nonsense? This is the difficulty. All rascals, they have taken leadership. Women should, should be allowed to beget children as soon as they're able. But as soon as the pregnancy is there, there should not be any sex life. They have got sex life in pregnancy also. So many things, we have... We can guide them all, all these rascals. From śāstra, we can guide them. Therefore immediately human society, a class of men who are fully conversant with the Vedic conclusion required to guide these rascals, socially, politically, in every respect.

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1974, Geneva:

Guru-gaurāṅga: They have made studies and that if a woman gives birth at the age less than twenty there are more chances that she die according to their statistics.

Prabhupāda: Their statistics in the western world... Inductive knowledge is always imperfect. They have not seen in India. My wife gave birth at the age of fourteen years. She is still living. She is ten years younger than me. So sixty-eight, sixty-nine, she is. She gave birth child at the age of fourteen. In 1918 I was married, and 1921 she gave birth the child, my first son. And she was never unhealthy; neither she had to go to the hospital for maternity hell. Natural delivery of child. Hare Kṛṣṇa. This illicit sex, even with wife... If sex life is indulged after the period of menstruation, that is also illicit sex. There are so many rules and regulations about sex life in Vedic culture. That is real use of sex life. In the Bhagavad-gītā, sex life, He says that dharmāviruddhaḥ kāmo 'smi. "Sex life which is under regulative principle of the Vedic knowledge," Kṛṣṇa says, "I am that sex life. I am that sex life." And beyond that, that is illicit sex life. And yesterday I was reading that dharma... When there is irreligious sex, then it increases varṇa-saṅkara, unwanted population. So the modern civilization, they're letting loose the women for prostitution, and they want nice children. That is not possible. Why this park is kept like this?

Guru-gaurāṅga: It's more of a forest, I think.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: The basic principle is to check population. Now, if they follow the Vedic principles, automatically the population is checked. Just like brahmacārī. So if the, both the boys and girls remain brahmacārī, then where is the unwanted population? Where is the question of this contraceptive method?

Nitāi: No need.

Prabhupāda: No need. Then when the brahmacārī is allowed to become gṛhastha, he can keep more than one wife if he's able to provide them nicely. Here they marry today and tomorrow divorce. The... No meaning of marriage. Simply prostitution. Because he does not need a wife. His sex life is satisfied in so many ways. So why he should be affected, attached to wife? And why the wife should be attached to the husband? Therefore divorce. It is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Dam-patye ratim eva hi. In the Kali-yuga, married life means sex life. For sex satisfaction, they'll marry. Otherwise, there is no need of marrying. That is... Svīkāra eva codvāhe. Marriage means that they, both of them agree that "We shall live together for some time." These things are happening, already foretold. By agreement, "Yes, we shall live together." That is marriage. "And then I may divorce." Actually, they do not know what is the meaning of marriage. All dependent on sex. Rati. Rati means... Dam-patye ratim eva hi. Vipratve sūtram eva hi: "To become brāhmaṇa means just have a thread only."

Room Conversation -- June 11, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bhagavān: Or like the politicians, they are afraid to speak because they are afraid that they will be voted out or get no more money to support their...

Prabhupāda: Yes. They're after money. So they are less than śūdras. That is the cause that Christianity has fallen down, that they cannot speak straightly, or otherwise... It is straight commandment, "Thou shalt not kill." And because people are killing, they're... Now they are give man-to-man marriage, what to speak of other things. The priests, they are sermonizing this man-to-man marriage. Just see how degraded they have become. Whether any conception... At least, outside America, nobody knows that a man can be married with another man. What is this? And they're supporting it. You know that?

Bhagavān: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So what is their standard?

Yogeśvara: Did he say anything before he left?

Jyotirmayī: Yeah, he said that he was in the, he was promulgating a law. So I asked him if he was going to help promulgate a law against cow-killing. So he said...

Prabhupāda: Now, this is our proposal, that why you should kill cow? Cow may be protected to take milk, and use this milk for so many nice preparations. Then, so far meat-eating is concerned, so every cow will die. It is a fact. So you wait a few days only. There will be so many dead cows. So you take all the dead cows and eat. So where is the bad proposal? If you say that "You are restraining us from meat-eating," no, we don't restrain you. We simply request you that "Don't kill. When the cow is dead, you eat it."

Morning Walk -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: They feed them every time, whenever they do something.

Prabhupāda: No, after catching them from the forest, they kept within the bars, and no eating for at least one week. Then the trainer comes. Only whips. He comes, and open the doors and only: (makes sound) Flosh, flosh, flosh. So already he's hungry, weak, and he's whipped. In this way, he becomes fearful. As soon as the man comes, he becomes fearful. Then he gives him little food. In this way, after all it is animal, he thinks that "This man is my God. He can save me. He can kill me." Then he takes to him. Whatever he says, he takes. Similarly, if you do not give the ingredients for sense enjoyment, the mind will be controlled. That is the beginning. You simply... Don't give... The mind wants, "Now let me go to the restaurant." "No, sir." Beat him with shoes. Instead of going to the restaurant, he beats the mind with shoes. Then mind will not again say, "Go to the restaurant." That is called swami, gosvāmī. One who can control his mind, that is gosvāmī. We giving the title "Gosvāmī" But if you cannot control your mind, then you are unfit. Go means senses, and svāmī means master. One who can control the senses and master, he is gosvāmī. (pause) ...definition of gosvāmī there: vāco vegaṁ krodha-vegaṁ manasa-vegam udara-vegam upastha-vegam, etān vegān yo viṣaheta dhīraḥ pṛthivīṁ sa śiṣyāt (NOI 1). You have to control the impulse of speaking, vāco vegam, the impulse of becoming angry, vāco vegam, krodha-vegam. Then manasa-vegam, force of the mind. Then udara-vegam, the belly. Belly, already, although it is filled up, and as soon as there is some nice... Please fill up again, again. This you have to control, udara-vegam. Udaropastha-vegam, genital. In this way, one who has controlled all these forces, he is able to make disciple all over the world. Otherwise, not this rascal guru. As soon as he saw one very beautiful secretary, "Oh, let me enjoy." And he's guru. So these are cheating. And people want to be cheated. Therefore the cheaters are there. (break) ...fourteen years old. A fourteen years old cannot be induced to marry a twenty-six years girl. That is unnatural. And by medical examination, it is found that he's at least thirty-two years. It is declared in the medical, and still, the rascals following him. That he's cheating by talking false things. So in one sense, the Western boys and young generation, they are actually hankering after some spiritual life. So any Indian, so-called sādhu and guru comes, they go there. But they are cheated unfortunately. So you make your society so strong that you be not cheated, and others may not cheat. Then it will be first-class. And if you make another society of cheaters and cheated, there is no profit. Therefore you have to follow the rules and regulations very strictly and become serious. Then you'll be ideal. People are in need of some spiritual energy. Therefore, as soon as some swamis or guru comes, they flock together to get some food. But these rascals are cheating. So you don't do that.

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Yogeśvara: Isn't the kṣatriya qualities that he is to be trustworthy?

Prabhupāda: No. When there is political game, everyone does everything to gain his victory. In politics, these things are allowed. Just like killing, fighting, kṣatriya's fighting. That killing is allowed. But killing is not allowed generally. Kṛṣṇa has killed so many. If you take from moral point of view, He's sometimes immoral. He has killed His maternal uncle, Kaṁsa, and Śiśupāla, Śiśupāla, his cousin brother. And Balarāma killed Rukma. Once He saved him, and another time, that Aniruddha's marriage, or something like that... Balarāma killed Rukma, the brother of Rukmiṇī. They were family relatives. But there was some misunderstanding in chess playing that other party, Rukma, he was cheating by tricks. The Balarāma became so angry, they killed him. So in politics amongst the kṣatriyas, these things are not uncommon.

Devotee: But isn't that not good because the politicians nowadays, when they are running their campaign, they say so many lies and everything to the public, that "When I am elected I will do this and I will do that," and they do so many... They pay off so many people in order that they can become elected. So always the good persons are... I guess they also have to cheat in order to get in position, but usually the...

Prabhupāda: Therefore we have stopped our political activities. It is not good. It will be hampering to our spiritual understanding.

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Devotee: And he told me that "Swamiji will not be successful in his movement because he will not allow free love." I just saw him in San Francisco before I went to India two and a half years ago. We were trying to get him to come back to the temple.

Prabhupāda: No, he cannot give up these bad habits.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: You said in Geneva that no one has died from giving up cigarettes or illicit sex. So it is not so hard to do.

Prabhupāda: No, it is not hard. Now the Christian church is giving liberty, man to man marriage. Most unnatural.

Devotee: Previously they didn't allow divorce. The first principle was there is no question of divorce. Then so many people began leaving the Catholic Church. So then they allowed divorce. And then they did not allow abortion. So again so many people left the religion. Now they allow abortion. And now they are allowing man to man marriage.

Prabhupāda: Just see.

Devotee: They compromise just to keep their followers.

Bhagavān: It's a matter of money.

Prabhupāda: And that is freedom. So Rāya Rāmānanda left because such freedom is not allowed here. So we have to allow this freedom like the church? (laughs)

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: That is the astonishment. In India, they give me credit this, that "How it has become possible that these European boys, American boys and girls, they have taken to this path?" That they are surprised.

Yogeśvara: We don't have a very good reputation in India?

Prabhupāda: Very good reputation that you have become perfectly Vaiṣṇava.

Devotee: No, he means the western people themselves.

Prabhupāda: "They must be cynic, crazy, another edition of hippies." Like that, they say like that.

Devotee: They think that... They won't allow even a westerner to marry their daughter, because the westerners have a reputation of marrying for a week and then flying away. So they think like that of the people. Even our own men, sometimes the Indian girls wanted to marry the brahmacārīs, the American brahmacārīs, but the parents would not allow because they said, "After you are married a week, he will just run away back to his country and leave you here." So they are thinking like that about the westerners, that they, the life is so fast.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Another brahmacārī saved.

Prabhupāda: One of our man has done so. You know that Rāmānuja? The Mexican boy?

Devotee: There's that boy in Bombay he married one Indian girl.

Prabhupāda: He is staying.

Devotee: Jagat-puruṣa.

Prabhupāda: He has not left as yet. But he can leave any moment. (laughs) No. He is not American. He is devotee. Therefore he is reliable.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Professor Durckheim: And they are working in the society, they are working...

Prabhupāda: We are working, we are writing these books and selling them. That's all. This is our work.

Professor Durckheim: I see.

Prabhupāda: We have no other... Even in the Indian Parliament, the question was raised that "How is that this international society is spending lavishly? What is their income?" There is a rumor that Americans are sending these CIA, what is this? (everyone laughs) Rascal people, they think the CIA has come to dance and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. (everyone laughs) So, of course the reply was given that we have no information that these people are CIA but we know that they are maintaining themselves by selling their literature and public contribution. That's all. And we have got 102 centers like this. This is not very... If you go to our Los Angeles center, New York center and other, Vṛndāvana center and Navadvīpa center, not less than 200 men are there always. And we are providing with their food, shelter. We give education to their children. We are getting them married. We don't allow these boys to live as friends. No. "You get yourself married." Yes. (German) Here is a girl, Kausalyā. I picked her from Hawaii. Now you can ask what she was and what she is now. Now she's married. She's happy. She has everything here. Life is there. (pause) Hare Kṛṣṇa. So I think you are all learned gentlemen, you should give us support and cooperate with this movement. It is very nice movement. That is my request to you.

Room Conversation -- June 20, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Devotee: (reads translation to Bg. 7.11 in German)

Prabhupāda: Sex life, married couple, that is alright, not otherwise, that is sinful.

Devotee: Śrīla Prabhupāda, just this objection was that in this statement of Bhagavad-gītā doesn't clearly say no reason you should not have sex life outside of married life, they say they state religious principles, but this is...

Prabhupāda: Religious principles means married life, otherwise cats and dogs. What is this? If everyone has without any limitation sex life, then what is the difference between cats and dogs? Religion means you are not cats and dogs because religion is in the human society, not in the cats and dogs' society.

Guest: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Yes, in the spiritual life there is no sex life. In the spiritual world there is no sex intercourse. There is no sex life. Although there is man and woman, there is no sex intercourse. By chanting the glories of God there in the spiritual world, they get so much great pleasure that is far beyond this pleasure of sex life. If you have something best then you forget low grade pleasure. So this sex pleasure is lower grade pleasure. It is not pleasure, it is illusion, but in material world this is the greatest pleasure. Therefore everyone they are coming back to this sex pleasure, everyone. Even so-called religionists and swamis, they are coming down to the sex pleasure. Because in this material world that is the only highest pleasure. So, so long one will be attracted by the sex pleasure it is still in the material world. And when one will be on the platform to spite (spit) on sex pleasure, then his spiritual life begins. That is stated by Yāmunācārya. (Sanskrit). Yāmunācārya, a great saintly person, he was formerly big king, so he said, "Since I have become Kṛṣṇa conscious and enjoying, since that time, as soon as I remember even sex life, I spite (spit) on it and my mouth becomes turned." (laughter) This is the test. Not that you become very advanced spiritualist and at the same time advance in sex life. That is not. (Sanskrit) That is the test that as soon as you are advanced in spiritual life, all these materialistic habits will be rejected automatically. This is the test. Four things are material demands-eating, satisfaction of the tongue or belly and satisfaction of the genital, āhāra, and sleeping and to become a good defender, defense measure. These are material necessity. And the one who is spiritually advanced, these things will be reduced, almost nil. What Christ says, Jesus Christ about sex life? What does he say?

Devotee: Only in the married life.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- June 20, 1974, Germany:

Devotee: Only.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Devotee: And in the future it will pass completely.

Devotee: So even if you are married sex life can be material too.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is also regulated. When the wife is menstrual period, so after five days you can have sex life and as soon as she is pregnant, no more sex life. So, sex life is meant for progeny, not for sense pleasure. Even the animals, dogs, cats, they have a period for sex life and as soon as the female dog is pregnant, no more sex life. In certain months of the year they have sex life, not all the year. So even the dogs they follow regulation and we human being, we do not follow. The dogs have no restriction. The female dogs are naked and they can capture anyone, anywhere, but they do not have unless there are certain period. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Therefore in spiritual life restricted regulated sex life, is essential.

Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:

Pater Emmanuel: I agree with all my heart.

Prabhupāda: I think those who are Christian priests, they should cooperate with this movement, chant the name of Christ or Christo and stop animal killing. This is according to Bible. This is not according to my philosophy, but their Christian philosophy. Simply let them do it and see how the situation becomes nice.

Pater Emmanuel: I am very thankful to you for this...

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. (everyone goes out-end of this discussion) (Break)

Guest: (German)

German devotee: (devotee translates for German man) Where is it written in Bhagavad-gītā that sexual intercourse is only allowed in married life? Is there any statement in Bhagavad-gītā?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. Find out, dharmāviruddhaḥ kāmo 'smi. Dharmāviruddha. Dharma, d-h-a-r, dharmāviruddhaḥ kāmo 'smi.

German devotee: Yes, Seventh Chapter.

Prabhupāda: Yes, Seventh Chapter. (end)

Room Conversation with Reverend Gordon Powell, Head of Scots Church -- June 28, 1974, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Always. Then they'll be freed from birth, death, old age and disease.

Reverend Powell: And... Were the papers correct in reporting you as... Well, they reported opposite things that... But you, of course, hold to transmigration, I gather. And this is... Death really doesn't happen. It's a change of form. Is that it?

Prabhupāda: Yes. As soon as the..., everyone dies, so a devotee, after death, in his transcendental form, he goes, back to home, back to Godhead.

Reverend Powell: Thank you. I take it from what you've just been saying, Your Grace, that this explains what is said here in the..., referring to illicit sex as being anything that's not in marriage and not for procreation within marriage.

Prabhupāda: Only, the sex allowed only for begetting nice children.

Reverend Powell: You don't feel that...

Prabhupāda: And beyond that, sex, that is illicit sex.

Reverend Powell: And that is out.

Prabhupāda: That is not good.

Room Conversation with Scientists -- July 2, 1974, Melbourne:

Dr. Harrap: It's a complete food in itself.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Those who are meat-eaters, they can eat other non-important animals, but cows must be saved, even from economic point of view. Here it is said that go-rakṣya. It does not say, Kṛṣṇa, "elephant-rakṣya." Elephant is a big animal, and at least fifty times more than cow, there is flesh. But it is not recommended. But the cow protection is recommended because it has got the miracle food, milk, and from milk you can prepare hundreds of preparation, all nutritious, full of vitamin A and D. So therefore it is recommended, go-rakṣya. It is not that meat-eating is stopped. Meat-eaters may kill other non-important animals but don't kill animal, er, cow. And besides that, from moral point of view, we are drinking milk from the cow, so she is mother. According to Vedic understanding there are seven kinds of mother: ādau mātā, real mother. Ādau mātā, guru patnī, the wife of guru, spiritual master. Ādau mātā, guru patnī, brāhmaṇī, the wife of a brāhmaṇa. Brāhmaṇa means the most intelligent class of men in the society. Who are brāhmaṇa, that is also mentioned there in the śāstra. So his wife. Ādau mātā, guru patnī... In general the understanding is, except your wife all woman is your mother. That is the instruction of Canakya Paṇḍita. Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu: "All women should be treated as mother." Para-dāreṣu. Para-dāra means others' wife. So every woman was married. It is compulsory. This is the Vedic system, that every woman must be married. It is the duty of the father to see the daughter is married, must be married. It is called kanyā-dāya. You cannot evade this responsibility. You must. The father's duty is, as soon as the girl is grown-up, immediately some boy must be found out and handed over: "My dear boy, I give you this girl in charity. You take care and give her protection." This is marriage. And he agrees, "Yes, I take charge of this girl." In our society, we get married.

Room Conversation with Scientists -- July 2, 1974, Melbourne:

Madhudviṣa: The Australian government in the latest Gazette has recognized the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement as a bona fide religion eligible to perform legal marriages.

Prabhupāda: And the other day Reverend Powell came. He also has given his announcement in the paper. What is that?

Satsvarūpa: "Don't be alarmed at the Hare Kṛṣṇas." (laughter) Reverend Gordon Powell...

Guest (2): Yes, if we were alarmed we wouldn't be here.

Prabhupāda: No, actually we are pledged to give something substantial to the human society. This is our mission. We are not that group, that showing some magic and take some fees and... It is not our business. We have got so many literatures full of treasurehouse of knowledge. We have to distribute that. Not bluffing, showing magic or this or that, miracles. No. We are not this. It is an institution for giving knowledge to the human society. The first beginning of knowledge is that at the present moment, people, although very much proud of their advancement of knowledge, he does not know what is the active principle of life.

Room Conversations -- September 10, 1974, Vrndavana:

Devotee (2): Bhaumāsura?

Prabhupāda: Bhaumāsura, something like that. They all of them became Kṛṣṇa's wife. They prayed to Kṛṣṇa to be rescued from the hands of... Then Kṛṣṇa rescued them, killed that Bhaumāsura, and excused them, then they were set free. Then their plea that "We are set free, that's all right, but we cannot go home because we were kidnapped. So we shall not be married. Nobody will accept us." "Then what do you want?" "You become our husband." "All right." Kṛṣṇa becomes (indistinct). This is going on. Somebody is thinking of money, somebody is thinking of woman. These two things, money and woman, and whole struggle (indistinct). The Musselman nawabs, they used to keep... That one nawab, they have got his quarters in Lucknow, he had 160 wives. Even in recent, you know this (name withheld)? His elder brother, (name withheld), practically he is the origin of the (name withheld) concern. So I was a guest of the (indistinct). So he has got three wives—one Bengali wife, one (indistinct) wife, and his original wife being Jain. He had three, four wives. And each wife's establishment, ten thousand rupees per month. So he is earning money and he is spending it. Earning money by black market, this way, that way, and his whole day's business is that go to some wife's house, remain there for some hours, then next wife, remain there for some hours, and he thinks, "I am a king." Still he is living. He is of my age, old man. And each wife has got dozens of children. They're not his.

Room Conversations -- September 11, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Their center is sex—this sex or that sex or that sex, even ordinarily. In Paris, Paris you know it is a city of prostitutes. On the roads there are prostitutes. Where we have got our temple, so many prostitutes are standing. And those who are prostitute-hunter, they go to Paris. From our childhood I know about one family physician. We are at that time boy, 8 or 10 years old. He was talking with his another Muhammadan friend how he toured many countries and how many different types of prostitutes he tasted. This was his talk. So he was talking of Paris, "Though you are boy...," this we could understand." This is the talk. Old men, retired men, they will also talk of the sex (indistinct), and they will enjoy. Now they could not enjoy sex, but by talking... And we have practically seen when we were young, our grandmother-in-law, my mother-in-law's mother, old lady, she would talk freely about sex. She will ask me, "You capture the breast of your wife." She would make a pun and enjoy. "You do like that, you do like that." She teaches like that. We were... I was twenty, twenty-three years, so I was just married, but she will enjoy sex. She had other grandchildren. My father-in-law were two brothers. So my father-in-law, he was younger brother, and his elder brother, her daughter also the same age, she would enjoy (indistinct) son-in-law. (break) Ministers, prime ministers. The minister, famous.