Prabhupāda: Then His renunciation of householder. He became sannyāsa. Now when He was, after taking sannyāsa, when He was going towards Vṛndāvana, He became always almost mad. So Nityānanda, He was with Him. When He saw that Lord Caitanya is in ecstasy, He misled Him just to... His plan was that "I shall take Lord Caitanya to the house of Advaita, and then I shall call His mother to see Him for the last time. If Caitanya goes away from this very point His mother will not be able to see Him." So out of sympathy He said, "Well, Śrīpāda Caitanya, this is not, this side is not Vṛndāvana. You go..." He just misdirected Him. So... And He sent one man to Advaita to receive Him that "He has taken sannyāsī, just try to make arrangement to receive Him. Then we shall meet." So when He came near the house of Advaita He saw that Advaita was waiting. So then He, I mean to say, came to His sense. "Oh, I am misled? I have come to Advaita's house? How is that Nityānanda? You showed Me this way Vṛndāvana." Then He said, "Oh, wherever You stay, that is Vṛndāvana." Now Advaita says, "All right, please come to my house." So he received Him and took Him there and sent news to His mother that "Your son has now taken sannyāsa. Now if you want to see Him for the last time please come and see." So in this way at Advaita's house He remained for some time. Say about a fortnight.
Madness (Conversations 1967 - 1973)
Expressions researched:
"mad"
|"madlike"
|"madly"
|"madness"
Conversations and Morning Walks
1967 Conversations and Morning Walks
Hayagrīva: First scene.
Prabhupāda: Yes. This is the, in the fifth act, ecstasy. At night Caitanya Mahāprabhu would become mad in separation of Kṛṣṇa. He would dash His head on the floor. Sometimes He would write with His nails and sometimes He would go away. Although the house was locked, He would go away, and sometimes He would be found amongst the cowshed of Jagannātha Purī. Sometimes He would be seen in the seashore. One day it was so found that He fell in the ocean and some fisherman caught Him in the net. And as soon as He was in the net and the fisherman touched Caitanya Mahāprabhu, he also began to dance, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare.
Prabhupāda: Then when he inquired, he told him that "I have caught this morning a big fish and since then I am dancing. I do not know. I got mad. Perhaps I have been caught by some ghost. So I do not know." So Swarup Damodar just to pacify him, "Yes. I am just driving away ghoul, mean to say, ghost. Don't worry. Where is that fish? Let me see it." And when he saw that fish was caught in the net, and it was Caitanya Mahāprabhu.
1968 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: I think that is described in the first part of our Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. That story is there, how he convert, how he became Nārada. (break)
Mālatī: Twice a month he would visit his father. His father is a demon. So Tore carries in his pocket one nice picture of Swamiji and one nice... On the back is written, tava kara kamala vare. And he sits and says that under his breath because if his father heard, his father gets mad.
Prabhupāda: This is the age for injecting Kṛṣṇa consciousness. If children are taught Kṛṣṇa consciousness from this age, the face of the world will be different. (break) ...but they are not Hindus. They have got also obstinacy like that. (break) It is very important. "I thought in that way. When my mother died, as the devotees of the Lord think, I also thought in that way. What is that? 'Oh, it is a grace of the Lord. My mother is now dead.' Because she is the, I mean to say, real cause of my nonfreedom.
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Oh, you have?
Allen Ginsberg: Yes. I got inside the temple. I was silent and made believe I was a mad, a madman. I had long hair, and I had pyjamas, white khadi, khadi cloth.
Prabhupāda: Just like some Punjabi.
Allen Ginsberg: So I went inside. And when anybody came to ask me anything, because I was afraid of opening my mouth...
Prabhupāda: There is no enemy of a dumb. Bhuvar śatru nyāya.
1970 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Simply, wherever you go, (makes traffic noise) "sonh, sonh, sonh, sonh," and "gonh, gonh, gonh, gonh, gonh." Up in the sky, "gonh, gonh, gonh, gonh," and in the street, "sonh, sonh..." And then, when digging, "gut-gut-gut-gut-gut-gut-gut-gut-gut!" (laughter) Is it not? Don't you feel botheration. But they are thinking, "Oh, America is very much advanced in machine." And when there is that garbage tank? "Ghon-ghon-ghon-ghon-ghon-ghon-ghon-ghon-ghon!" (laughter) So many sounds are going on, always. Eh? Of course, you have got very nice city, nice roads everywhere. But this trouble... You have created so many troubles. And there are news that one lady was a patient. She became mad for the sounds. And I think they are thinking very seriously how to stop all these sounds. Is it not?
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: One priest in Boston, he issued leaflet regretting that these boys, he saw our students. He appreciated that these boys are so much after God and they're our boys. We could not give them. Actually the same boy was, one year or two years ago, he was not going to church, was not interested in God consciousness, but now this same boy is mad after God. And he's twenty-four hours in God consciousness. They're chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra twenty-four hours.
Prabhupāda: That is called, first of all bhāvaḥ, then prema, prema, kṛṣṇa prema. That is our high perfection. Just like Caitanya Mahāprabhu is speaking that "I am seeing everything vacant without Kṛṣṇa." Śūnyāyitaṁ jagat sarvaṁ govinda-viraheṇa me. That is the last stage of perfection. You become mad about, after Kṛṣṇa. So that will take time. This is the process. But faith is the beginning. Yes. And that faith is also explained by the author of Caitanya-caritāmṛta: śraddhā-śabde viśvāsa sudṛḍha niścaya. Faith means such faith that firm faith, sudṛḍha, niścaya, certain. Kṛṣṇa bhakti kaile sarva-karma kṛta haya. This is faith. Therefore Kṛṣṇa said that sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). So faith means to believe in the word of Kṛṣṇa, that "Surrendering to Kṛṣṇa I will get everything. Now, I am free. This is my perfection." That is called faith. Kṛṣṇa said that sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). Now, if I say unto you that "You give up everything, come with me," unless you have got firm faith, how can you do it? That is faith. That faith has to be increased, and then it will reach to the stage of love.
Dr. Singh: (Sanskrit)-mukha.
Prabhupāda: Yes, (Sanskrit)-mukha. And one American lady, when she saw these boys are chanting on the street, she was surprised. She said that "Are you Americans?" She was surprised. One priest, when I was traveling from Los Angeles to Hawaii, one priest in..., gentleman there sitting, out of his own accord he came to me and began to talk with me that "Swamiji, I see in the face of your students brightness. How you have created brightness?" He admitted that. Another priest, Christian priest in New York..., in Boston, he issued a pamphlet that "These boys and girls, they are our boys. But we see they have got this nice qualification, they are mad after God, but we could not give them." So it is a process. The madness after God is there in everywhere, in every heart.
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
hari hari biphale janama goṅāinu, manuṣya-janama pāiyā, rādhā-kṛṣṇa nā bhajiyā, jāniyā śuniyā biṣa khāinu People are already mad, and the so-called rascal leaders making them more and more mad. That's all. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās (SB 7.5.31). So-called scientists, so-called religious leaders, all rascals. If we say that all rascals, we are only intelligent, (laughter) they will not be very happy. But that will be fact, try to understand it.
Prabhupāda: This is the process. By chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra they will be God-realized. Just like these boys. Four years ago they did not know what is meant by Kṛṣṇa. So now they are so perfect. Of course, we cannot be perfect anyway, but they are far, far better than any Kṛṣṇa-bhakta in the world. Even Indians, they say, "Oh, they are better than us." And what is the process? Simply they are chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. This is practical. By chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra they are becoming God-realized. Even last night we had meeting with the Christian fathers. They very much appreciated. And in Boston one Christian priest issued literature, that "These boys, they are our boys. They are so mad after God, but we could not do." So this is... Why they have become so? Simply by chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. So anyone chants will get this status. This is practical. Not only... In anywhere. We have got many Chinese, many Japanese, Africans, and Canadians and Europeans, and Australia also, we have got many Australian boys. So wherever we are chanting, it is being effective. The real purpose is to realize God. So that is being done. So we have to accept the method recommended for a particular age and time. Then we become successful.
Prabhupāda: Questions were intelligent. So all these frustrated boys and girls in the Western world, they are all good candidate. You have to organize to give them; they are searching after.
Śyāmasundara: It seems like that it's the nature of all living entities to be mad after something.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Love. That I explained—love. We have got our love in store. But instead of loving Kṛṣṇa, we have distributed the love in so many ways, and frustrated. Love is there in store. That is reserved for Kṛṣṇa. And we are trying to love Kṛṣṇa, that I explained. Why I am loving this body and this apartment? Ultimately he goes to Kṛṣṇa. But that you do not know. You are actually trying to love Kṛṣṇa. But because nobody is giving him Kṛṣṇa, he's crying.
Śyāmasundara: So one who is mad after something else material, mad after this or that...
Prabhupāda: It is perverted.
Śyāmasundara: And he must transfer his love..., madness to Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: That madness should be for Kṛṣṇa.
Śyāmasundara: So how is that madness transferred?
Prabhupāda: By this devotional service. You practice it to love Kṛṣṇa. And then when you come to the actual stage, you will be mad after Kṛṣṇa. This is the process to bring to you..., bring you to the platform.
Śyāmasundara: No other way can replace...
Prabhupāda: Bhaktyā mām abhijānāti: (BG 18.55) by devotional service. Neither by jñāna, yoga, karma, no, that will not touch. You cannot become mad after Kṛṣṇa by any means except by this devotional service. Therefore, we are so much conservative. Because if we are actually after Kṛṣṇa, then we must accept the real method.
Śyāmasundara: Then you become automatically mad after Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Yes. The more you practice, the more you become mad.
Devotee (2): As in that verse, "Thus by the higher self conquer the lower... Thus with the higher self conquer the lower self and curb the insatiable enemy known as lust."
Prabhupāda: Higher self? I don't follow.
Devotee (2): That verse in the Gītā?
Prabhupāda: No, this is Bhakti-rasāmṛta-sindhu. You will find in Nectar of Devotion. Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyaṁ jñāna-karmādy-anāvṛtam (Brs. 1.1.11). You have read this Nectar of Devotion?
Devotee (2): Yes.
Prabhupāda: That means they are rascals. They do not have clear eyesight, clear insight. They do not know whether they are degrading or developing. Just like the flies, with great force they will go into the fire. They think they are making progress, they are going to the light. They think; otherwise how they are going? Such kind of advancement. They are going to die, be annihilated, and they still, "Oh, we are going force, by force we are going to the light. Here is darkness, there is light." This is their philosophy. Just like a mad driver drinking drives recklessly to die, that's all. But he is thinking, "Oh, I am going with so much great speed." He does not know that he is going to die after few minutes. And that is their development.
Indian: This is an old place, Vṛndāvana. Śrī Kṛṣṇa Caitanya Mahāprabhu came here and sat under this tree nearly five hundred years back. He sat under this tree and meditated: Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare/ Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare, until midday. Several days He chanted His name and came here and sat. This tree is the old tree of Dvāpara-yuga. Under this tree, Rādhikā and Kṛṣṇa both met once. This is written in Param-Gita(?) For this reason Kṛṣṇa Caitanya Mahāprabhu came here with this reason. He came here and sat under this tree and recited the name Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa. When He sat here once, one Vaiṣṇava, name Kṛṣṇadāsa, name Kṛṣṇadāsa, he saw, at night, he dreamt of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu and became mad to see Him, and he crossed the Yamunā River, Keśīghāṭa, and gradually came here and saw the glorious silhouette of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu, and he made his obeisance to His feet, and Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu touch him, and he became mad with Kṛṣṇa-prema, and then Mahāprabhu, from this place, Kṛṣṇa Caitanya Mahāprabhu came, went to Rādhā-kuṇḍa, but displayed the name of this before that time.
Prabhupāda: He went to Rādhā-kuṇḍa?
Indian: Rādhā-kuṇḍa. He went there and asked the old gentlemen of that place that "Where is Rādhā-kuṇḍa and Śyāma-kuṇḍa?" But none of them (indistinct) Rādhā-kuṇḍa.
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, discovery of Rādhā-kuṇḍa.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Ah. So you can understand English then. So (Sanskrit). Duṣkṛtinaḥ means... kṛtiḥ means meritorious, very meritorious. But duṣkṛtiḥ. Whatever merit he has got... Nowadays at the present moment the civilization is so mad that everyone as human being... Any human being he has got some merit because he is not cat and dog. He's a man. As a man he has got brain, better than the cats and dogs. That's a fact. And actually they're doing so many things. Just like this picture. It is a very meritorious workmanship. So everyone can do some meritorious workmanship. But when that workmanship is diverted to, for the use of sinful activities... Just like one man is very meritorious, he's planning to form a party how to plunder. This requires merit. Without merit you cannot form a party. But the merit is being used for plundering, for harassing, for so many other sinful activities. So that is called duṣkṛtinaḥ. Merit is there but the merit is being misused for sinful activities. Therefore duṣkṛtiḥ. Just like modern scientist. It is meritorious that they have discovered the atomic bomb. The merit is used for killing.
Prabhupāda: Idle brain is a devils' workshop. Because they have no Kṛṣṇa consciousness, their brain is a workshop of the devil. That's all. Harer nāma harer nāma... (CC Adi 17.21). (pause) And without culture men are becoming rogues and thieves, uncultured. Communist movement. Atheistic... Everywhere, nobody's happy. The government's duty, first duty should be that everyone is happy. That is described in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, during the time of Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira. Even there was no natural disturbances. No excessive heat, no excessive cold. No anxiety. People are dying now out of anxieties. They're becoming mad, committing suicide, drinking liquors more and more. Just for anxiety. When they cannot solve any big problem, "Bring bottle." Is it not?
Prabhupāda: Corpse, yes. You require everything, full body. You require head, you require arms, you require belly, you require legs. But if you have got simply the belly and legs, then it is a dead body. It cannot work properly. The brain is lost; therefore they are mad after so much advancement of civilization. They are exactly like cats and dogs. As soon as you enter some country, dog, watchdog: "Wowf! Wowf! Why you have come? What is your position?" ("Where is your visa?"?) This is dog's business. This is dog's business. (laughter) And they have set up immigration department. But it is a dog's business, watchdog. I say it is watchdog's business. A first-class gentleman is being searched out pocket, whether you have got revolver. Cannot be trusted, all these educated rogues and thieves. So what is this advancement of civilization? It is civilization? No sober man, no intelligent man, all cats and dogs, thieves, rogues. Is that civilization? It is not civilization.
Prabhupāda: No, no. Sub... We believe in the subjugation, because...
Krishna Tiwari: Well, I do not believe in the subjugation.
Prabhupāda: That is your madness, because you know.
Krishna Tiwari: No, no. No way, no way you can say that. (laughing)
Prabhupāda: No, no, don't be upset. You said that you are under the laws of nature.
Krishna Tiwari: I am.
Prabhupāda: Therefore you are under subjugation.
Krishna Tiwari: But, but I do not believe these kind of "authority" words.
Prabhupāda: You believe, you believe. When, when the laws of nature will force upon you death, you must believe.
Prabhupāda: The, the priest also, he's surprised, that "They are our boys. They did not come to church, never cared for religion. And now they are after God, mad after God. What is this?" They are surprised.
David Lawrence: Well, I think a lot of our boys could understand it, having been to a service, you know, attended ārati, and they...
Prabhupāda: So that is, that is due to our strict following the principles. That is making them stout and strong in spiritual platform.
Prabhupāda: Ceta etair anāviddhaṁ sthitaṁ sattve prasīdati. In this way, as the heart becomes cleansed, he revives his quality of goodness. And when he's situated in the quality of goodness, the other two qualities, passion and ignorance, cannot infect him. By this process. Rajas-tamo-bhāvāḥ. Rajas-tamo-bhāvāḥ. The example is kāma-lobhādayaś ca ye. When one is too much affected with the rajo-guṇa and tamo-guṇa, passion and ignorance... What is this kāma? Lusty and greediness. These are the symptoms of rajas-tamo-guṇa. So then therefore we see that all people are lusty and greedy. So as soon as he becomes cleansed, come to the standard of goodness, these two qualities cannot affect him anymore. Tadā rajas-tamo-bhāvāḥ kāma-lobhādayaś ca ye (SB 1.2.19). One has to take the process. And it is simple process. Simple... And that, that is actually happening, in our practical experience. They say, they say... They are all rascals, fools. They can say anything and everything. Pāgale kim abole chāgale kiṁ na khāoyā. In the Bengali it is said: A madman, what does he not speak? He speaks any nonsense. And a goat, what does he not eat? So if you keep a madman... They are keeping them mad... That is our protest, that why you are keeping all people mad, crazy, nonsense? And you are also teacher, university? They have no knowledge that what is the aim of life.
David Lawrence: You know the manifestations obviously of Kṛṣṇa consciousness and kīrtana and so on. Seems to be obviously you regard as a scurrilous or wrong-headed or a dull-headed field of people who regard His manifestations of God consciousness as verging on madness, or temporary madness. What would you say about that. Obviously you would reject it.
Prabhupāda: When a man is himself mad, he'll find others mad.
David Lawrence: Yes, true. (laughter) Yes, he sees a reflection of himself.
Prabhupāda: If one is himself deaf, he'll think others are deaf. So ātmavat manyate jagat, everyone thinks the whole world is like him. Therefore they think Kṛṣṇa also like him. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam (BG 9.11). That is condemned in the Bhagavad-gītā that "These rascals, because I come in human form to benefit them, they take Me as human being." That is mentioned. But these things are taken like that by the mūḍhas. Mūḍhas means rascals, asses.
Prabhupāda: And that is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam: anāvṛṣṭi, durbhikṣa and kara-pīḍita. One side, there will be no rain, and there will be scarcity of food grain, and government will tax heavily. In this way, people will become mad and they will give up their hearth and home and go to the forest. This is the foretelling also. This is going to happen. Actually, people are being perplexed in that way. There is scarcity of food, and there is scarcity of rain, and government tax is increasing every year.
Dr. Hauser: You see, when I met George, he was a very, what do you call it, person that hadn't found anything very specific in life. He floated about very much and he... Now when I met him yesterday he was very, he seemed very happy and very sure of himself and what he was doing, and that made me very happy. I thought that was something very nice. I liked him very much.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa consciousness is the original status of the living entity. Just like a son is conscious always that "I am the son of such and such person." This consciousness is natural. So living entities, when they come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness... Because we are all parts and parcels of Kṛṣṇa. It cannot be broken. A person may go mad. But when he's cured, he immediately understands that "I belong to such and such family, such and such gentleman's son." That is natural. Similarly in the contact of this material nature, the spiritual spark, living entity, he's in madness. You are a psychiatrist. You know very well. Every man is more or less a madman.
Dr. Hauser: Oh yes. But that's very often a symptom of a, of a psychosis that they feel that they are persecuted by, by foreign powers or by...
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Foreign powers, yes. So this is called ghostly haunted. So our material conception of life, this is also ghostly haunted, madness. "I am Christian. I am Hindu. I am Muslim. I am Englishman. I am German." These are all conception of ghostly haunted. Because spirit soul is pure. In the Vedic language it is said: asaṅgo 'yaṁ puruṣaḥ. The spirit soul has no connection with such designations. Just like in dream we see so many things. But it has nothing to do with me. So this is night dream. At night, we forget all these things about the day dream. "I am this, I am that. I am this family-member. I am his father. I am his husband." And so on, so on. At night, when dream, are in a different situation. And we forget everything. And again, in daytime, we forget everything of the night dream. We come another dream. So this is also dream. That is also dream. I am simply observing. In daytime I am seeing some dream, gross dream, and at nighttime I'm seeing some subtle dream. But seer, I am. Under different condition, I am seeing different things. I think you treats this madness. He's sees things in different way, in different positions.
Prabhupāda: So everyone is mad. Anyone who is in material contact, he is mad. So we are trying to take him out of this dreaming condition. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Dr. Hauser: But does he stop dreaming? I mean, substantially, does he stop, stop, does one stop dreaming?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Stop means... Because dreaming means that is not my actual occupation. Dreaming means that. I am separate from the dreaming condition. So if one stops this dreaming condition, then he's cured.
Dr. Hauser: But the dreaming of the night also has another function, according to my...
Prabhupāda: No. Dreaming at night, dreaming at day. The same thing. The pattern is different. Pattern is different. If you think that you are Englishman, you are Swedish, or if you are Hindu, you are Muslim, that is also dream. You are none of this. As much as you are none of those dreaming things at night. But due to our madness, sometimes we take: "This is fact," sometimes we take: "That is fact."
Prabhupāda: Reflection. I, in morning walk, the sun was reflected in a glass exactly it is brilliant as sun. So I showed him: "This is called māyā, illusion. There is no sun, but it appears like sun. Exactly. And it is illuminating also." Reflection of the moon. So one who is less intelligent, he'll see: "Oh, here is a sun, another sun." So he's a madman. One who sees the sun reflection in the glass as sun, he's illusioned. He's mad. So our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is also psychiatrist movement.
Prabhupāda: Real duty is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is normal duty. All, all other duties are abnormal duties, crazy duties. Just like pāgala, they're all crazy.
- piśācī pāile yena mati-cchanna haya
- māyā-grasta jīvera haya se bhāva udaya
Anyone who's under the clutches of māyā, or madness, what is the value of his duty? Śrama eva hi kevalam. He's simply spoiling his time. That is stated in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.
- dharmaḥ svanuṣṭhitaḥ puṁsāṁ
- viṣvaksena kathāsu yaḥ
- notpādayed yadi ratiṁ
- śrama eva hi kevalam
- (SB 1.2.8)
Just like you have come here, a little tendency for hearing about Kṛṣṇa. Your life is succ..., on the path of success. And there are other, millions, they're not interested. So, for them, the śāstra says, "They're simply working like cats and dogs."
Prabhupāda: So we have no experience below zero degrees. But in Europe, America, there is places. In Russia also, below fifty degrees. But they do not stop their business. They know that "Winter season has come. It will go away again." So devotees, even they are in distressed condition, they know, "It has come due to my bad activities in the past. It will go away. Let me suffer and finish it." Just like if you become, all of a sudden, infected with some disease. So what? You'll go mad? No. You know that "I have infected this disease. Let me suffer a few days. It will go away. That's all." This is the mentality of the devotees. They are not disturbed. And if he's not disturbed, then he's fit for becoming liberated.
Prabhupāda: Not to speak like mad man. That you are scientists, you are, "We shall solve all the questions." This nonsense thing should stop. They should come to God and understand what God says. Then their life is successful. God Himself is speaking in the Bhagavad-gītā. Just try to understand. This is not meant for the dogs and cats; this is meant for persons like Arjuna. Because Bhagavad-gītā was taught to Arjuna—for enlightened, ah, topmost class of men. They'll understand. Imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ. Evaṁ paramparā prāptam (BG 4.2). So be yourself amongst the topmost intelligent class of men and try to understand Bhagavad-gītā. Then you'll be happy.
Prabhupāda: But you have taken the knowledge, why cannot you describe it. That means although you have got your Guru Maharaja, still you are in darkness. So what is the use of this Guru Maharaja? You are in darkness because you cannot explain. You're asking me to go to Guru Maharaja. But if you are enlightened, why you cannot explain? Therefore you are in darkness. They are useless as guru. You have not... He's a garu. He's garu.
Yaśomatīnandana: Garu is mad, crazy.
Prajāpati: They claim to see light inside, Śrīla Prabhupāda, but we say, "If we hit you on head, you will see light inside also."
Prabhupāda: Yes, that everyone sees. What is your credit? If I kick on your face, you will find the light. So come here, I shall kick on your face and you'll see the light. (laughter) There is no need of Guru Maha...
Yaśomatīnandana: His disciples are usually very naive and very foolish.
Prabhupāda: Unless they are foolish, how they can go there? Anyone who goes there, that means he is a foolish. That is the test. "A man is known by his company." Because all these rascals and fools go there, therefore he is a fool and rascal. It is concluded.
Prabhupāda: So what does...? But that means they do not understand what is meant by religion. They are thinking religion means some fanatical faith. They are meaning that. That is the whole world conception of religion. But actual religion we are now preaching, actual, what is religion. Religion means... Just like Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekam: (BG 18.66) "Give up all rascal religion. Surrender unto Me." So who is a sane man who will deny, "No, I don't surrender to God"? Who is a sane man? He must be insane. Anyone who says that "I don't like God, I don't like to surrender unto Him," then he must be insane. He has already surrendered. He is going on under the condition of surrender, but it is not done very... Just like a prisoner. He is already surrendered to the government. Still, he says, "I don't care for government." This is the position. He's a madman. The state arrests him, kicks him, and puts him in the jail. Still, he says, "I don't care for government." So what can be done? "We don't care for the government." Just like Gandhi started civil disobedience movement, disobedience to the government laws, but all the whole stock was put into jail and they were beaten with shoes. But still, they said, "No, we are..." This is an example. Similarly, everyone is obeying, surrendering to God. But because they are rascal and fools, they are denying that we have surrendered. This is their position, madness. nobody can stay without surrendering to God. It is not possible.
Umāpati: Well, in a madhouse, a sane man is the only one considered mad.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So, "It is folly to be wise where ignorance is bliss." That is already there. So we have to act by the order of Kṛṣṇa, not by the votes of the madmen. Just see the fun. Everyone is under control. Who is free? It is simply illusion. They are thinking, "I am free." Nobody is free. Under the stringent laws of nature, and still, he is thinking, "I don't care for God." This is madness. This is madness. Already under the laws of God, but still, he's protesting, "No, I don't care for God. There is no God." So we have to save these madmen from further deterioration. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.
Karandhara: One of their chief philosophers, his name was Camus. So after he was propounding this philosophy and writing many books, one night he was driving in his car, and he decided that "There's no meaning, so why not just drive my car off a cliff?" So he just drove his car off a cliff, finished himself off.
Prabhupāda: Mad, madmen.
Karandhara: But his books are in colleges especially. Millions and millions of students accept his books as practically gospel.
Prabhupāda: What is the subject matter of the book?
Karandhara: Subject matter of his books, that life is ultimately absurd. There is no real meaning to it. We place our own meanings on it, but those are...
Prabhupāda: So you are trying... Why you are trying to explain it? Why you are trying to explain it?
Karandhara: Yes, actually he is trying to make reason out of the absurdity.
Prabhupāda: To prove absurd is his reason? That means absurd reason.
Prabhupāda: Yes, they must be, because they do not know what is to be known. Their knowledge is imperfect.
Karandhara: Nietzsche, Freud, they all died madmen.
Prabhupāda: Madman means when one becomes frustrated, he becomes mad. That is the...
Karandhara: But the people, after them, they think that their lives were very great. They read their books and accept their authority.
Prabhupāda: There are two classes of men. We don't say their life was great. So therefore I say, who will settle? I am right or he is right? Always you will find the madman will say, "I am right." Another man say, "You are not right; I am right." Then who will settle up? That is the point. You will find always these two classes of men. You say you are right, I say I am right.
Viṣṇujana: In this country they have the venereal disease. One out of ten men is suffering gonorrhea.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Long ago one professor, medical professor, he said, he was Englishman—that in our country, 75% students are suffering from venereal disease. Colonel Megor (?). Yes. Colonel Megor. There must be venereal disease because sex life is so cheap. There must be venereal disease. And venereal disease, once infected, it brings so many other diseases, one after another, one after another. The cancer is also due to that. Madness. Yes. And the Vedic civilization knew it. Therefore first restriction: sex. Brahmacārī. First beginning, brahmacārī. No sex life. You see? Just to save. This venereal disease is mentioned in the Āyur-veda. It is called phiraṅgāmaya. Phiraṅga means "white Europeans." It is diseased... And medical science also says that it was begun from dog. The girls, they have sex life with dog and there is the beginning of venereal disease.
| Page Title: | Madness (Conversations 1967 - 1973) |
| Compiler: | Rishab, Mayapur |
| Created: | 25 of May, 2011 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=49, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 49 |