Later on (Conversations 1969 - 1975)

Expressions researched:
"later on"

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation Including Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.2.1-34 Recitation & Explanation -- April 1, 1969, San Francisco:

Gargamuni: Well, how can we begin to serve you so that you'll be pleased?

Prabhupāda: (laughs) That I shall tell you later on. (laughter) Do you think I am not pleased?

Gargamuni: I don't know.

Prabhupāda: Oh, you must know it. How can you say that I am not pleased? How you know it that I am not pleased?

Gargamuni: Well, we cause you so much anxiety and everything.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Gargamuni: We cause you so much anxiety due to our faults.

Prabhupāda: Therefore I am pleased with you. Why I have given up all my anxieties of the sons and daughters who is born from my body, and why I am taking and transferring... (end)

Room Conversation -- April 12, 1969, New York:

Brahmānanda: Oh, he's so attached.

Prabhupāda: Yes. "She'll go later on. She'll go." So he went back. The father used to..., went back. In this way, several times. Then it was agreed that the girl would go there, father's house, and the father took the girl in the morning, and in the evening Tulasī dāsa went there. (laughs) His wife chastised, "You are so rascal fool that I have come this morning and you have, evening you are here? You have so much attachment for the skin?" Just like husband and wife talking. That struck him very badly, and he immediately left that place and went to... Left home for good. Yes. And that was the initiation that he took up writing about Rāma. That is Tulasī dāsa's life. Just being, I mean to say, hurt by the words of wife, that "I love her,"... Later on he understood, "Yes, she is right. So why should I be so much attached?" She uttered this (indistinct), "If you have got so much attachment for this skin and bone; if you had so much attachment for Rāma then your life would have been different." So he took it seriously. "Why not attachment for Rāma?" So he became a great devotee of Rāma, Tulasī das. His book, Rāma-carita-mānasa. "Thinking always of Rāma," that is his book. It is very famous book, and that is the only important literature in the Hindi language, Rāma-carita-mānasa. It is very popular in India. Village to village. Practically Gītā Press has flourished simply by selling the Rāma-carita-mānasa and Gītā. Gītā and Rāma-carita-mānasa. Two books. Millions of books they print and sell, this Rāma-carita-mānasa and Bhagavad-gītā. So he has written that din ka dakini. In the daytime she is just like what is called, witches. Witch? Witch?

Room Conversation -- May 10, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Child: How many arms does Lord Nṛsiṁha-deva have?

Prabhupāda: That you shall know later on. Not now.

Janārdana: I've read in Bhagavad-gītā that he who knows the self does not do action nor causes action to be done. So what is the soul's, the spirit soul's, relationship to actions performed both in material consciousness and in spiritual, in Kṛṣṇa consciousness?

Prabhupāda: Material consciousness means forgetting God. When one forgets God, that is material consciousness. Material consciousness is called māyā. Actually one should not forget. But if he forgets somehow or other, that is material consciousness. Naturally nobody forgets his father and mother. But if, somehow or other, he forgets, that is a special circumstances and that is called māyā, illusion. Just like any one of you who are existing, you must have a father and mother. That is a fact. Without father and mother, your existence cannot be. Now, if you cannot say who is your father and mother, if you do not know, this forgetfulness, this is called māyā. Actually it should not happen, but somehow or other, if you are asked, "Who is your parents?" You cannot say. This is called māyā. But there must be some father and mother. Without father and mother, there cannot be an existence. You cannot deny that.

Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg -- May 14, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Vidya, the goddess of learning, Sarasvatī. In our childhood we used to worship Sarasvatī: "Please, mother, give me pass this examination." That was our prayer. So other students, they laughed very loudly. They thought that "Caitanya has come out very victorious within a second." He said, "No. Stop." Then He stopped all these talkings, and... "So you are so... I have to talk with you. You are very learned." Ordinary formalities. Then he went away. And he was also great worshiper of mother Sarasvatī. Then he began to pray to Sarasvatī, "Mother Sarasvatī, by your grace I have become victorious in so many places. And what is this, that I am defeated by a boy who is a grammar student?" So he began to pray, and mother Sarasvatī informed her (him) that "He is God, my husband. So you speak means I speak. So how can I defeat my husband? That is not..." (knock at door) Come on. Come on. (someone enters) Yes, come. Yes. You can put there. (someone offers obeisances) Put there. All right. Put there. That's all. Very good. So then he further did not attempt to talk with Him. He went away, and the mother Sarasvatī advised him that "You surrender unto Him. That will be your nice role. Yes." So later on, he became a great devotee of Lord Caitanya, Keśava Kāśmīrī.

Room Conversation With John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison -- September 11, 1969, London, At Tittenhurst:

Prabhupāda: Everyone says. All authorities. Śaṅkarācārya says. Rāmānujācārya says. Those who are really authorities, those disciplic succession is going on. In India, there are five sects. Actually two sects. Vaiṣṇava and Śaṅkara. So the Vaiṣṇava accept Kṛṣṇa as the authority, and Śaṅkara accepted Kṛṣṇa authority. There are no third sect. Practically, actually, there is one sect, the Vaiṣṇava. Anyway, later on, later ages, Śaṅkarācārya established his sect. But Śaṅkarācārya accepts that kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam: (SB 1.3.28) "Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead," in his writing. And at his last stage of his life he said, "You rascal fools, what you are dealing with? That will not save you." Bhaja govindam: "You just worship Kṛṣṇa." Bhaja govindam bhaja govindam bhaja govindam mūḍha-mate. Mūḍha-mate means "You rascal." (laughter)

1970 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- November 7, 1970, Bombay:

Guest (9): No, believe Him as a you are a servant and serve Him. Or you believe that you are mother to Him.

Prabhupāda: No, that is second. First of all surrender. Then what way you shall surrender, that is different thing, another stage, more confidential. First of all there is surrender. First of all you enter this house or this room. Then you ask, "How can I serve you?" That is different. First of all there is no surrender, or without surrender, full surrender, there is no entrance in Kṛṣṇa. No entry. Because those who revolted against Kṛṣṇa, those who wanted to become Kṛṣṇa by imitating Him, they are here in this material world. Icchā-dveṣa-samutthena sarge yānti parantapa (BG 7.27). (Hindi) Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19), creation, that all the living entities who have come into this created world, they have revolted. They wanted to become Kṛṣṇa, to imitate Kṛṣṇa. Therefore they have given the chance, "All right, you become Kṛṣṇa. You do whatever you like. I will give you facilities. You want to become Brahmā? All right, you become Brahmā. And you want to become the worm of stool? I will give you the facility." So these living entities are rotating. Sometimes he is becoming Brahmā, sometimes becoming the worm of stool, sometimes this, sometimes that. In this way he is changing body. This is material world. Or when he comes back again, back to Godhead, yad gatvā na nivartante tad dhāma paramaṁ mama (BG 15.6). Then you'll haven't got to come back. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti kaunteya (BG 4.9). So we have to prepare for that position, how to go back to home, how to go back to Kṛṣṇa and engage ourself in His service. Then the question of either as mother or friend or... That will be considered later on. First of all let us try how to enter kingdom of God. That is condition, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ (BG 18.66), that "You surrender unto Me fully, giving up all your other engagements. Then I take charge of you." Ahaṁ tvāṁ mokṣayiṣyāmi. Mokṣa is there. For a Kṛṣṇa-bhakta is nothing, mokṣa, or liberation. He'll do it. He'll look after it.

Room Conversation -- December 13, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: Then what?

Guest (1): Then just to prove... (indistinct) According to me, when Lord Kṛṣṇa... (indistinct) When the ātmā goes into the trance, the mind goes into the trance, and into the śuddha-sattva, then he gets the vision of all, past, future, and present.

Prabhupāda: First thing that you said, that Bhagavad-gītā was given in seven verses, and later on, Vyāsadeva has expanded. Now, suppose accepting that Vyāsadeva has expanded, do you find any difference between Vyāsadeva's explanation and the original seven verses?

Guest (1): No. Of course, that is... (unintelligible)

Prabhupāda: Then, accepting even that Vyāsadeva has expanded, so there is no difference. Therefore, even if we take the Bhagavad-gītā as it is presented by Vyāsadeva, so there is nothing to be said against it.

Guest (1): Nothing.

Prabhupāda: Just like Caitanya Mahāprabhu, he gave us only eight verses, Śikṣāṣṭaka. But our Gosvāmīs, they have written volumes of books on that eight verses. But there is no difference of the writings of the Gosvāmīs and the original eight verses. That is not very important thing.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- July 18, 1971, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: I have got great-grandchildren.

Mohsin Hassan: You have two sons?

Prabhupāda: I have two sons. I have three sons..., two sons, two daughters.

Mohsin Hassan: They were, I was told, associated with Gandhi. What's your relation with Mahatma Gandhi?

Prabhupāda: Gandhi, in my young age I was Nationalist, so I followed Gandhi. I was interested. Later on, when I met my spiritual master, I became disinterested with this temporary, ephemeral things. So this is permanent. Kṛṣṇa consciousness is permanent. It is very long(?) (non?) subject matter. We are simply dreaming. All these activities are just like at night we dream, but they are all false. Whatever you dream at night, they're not facts; they're false. Similarly, these are also daydreams, these activities. Daydream. They're also false. The only thing what we can actually take benefit out of it is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That's a fact. It will take some time. (end)

Room Conversation -- July 20, 1971, New York:

Devotee (1): You're not going to be working this immediately? I want to get...

Prabhupāda: No, no, if you want to join, join it.

Devotee (1): I want to do it nicely, so it's not in your way.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Devotee (1): No, just later on I can do it.

Prabhupāda: Why later on? Now. (indistinct)

Pratyatoṣa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, I just wanted to ask you about, I'd like to get you a tape recorder. I wanted to get a real, real nice one. And I was thinking of getting one that has four channels. You could record four channels simultaneously or you could record if you want to one channel at a time.

Prabhupāda: Stanberg? Stanberg?

Pratyatoṣa: Well, no, it's a Sony, it's a Sony Professional.

Devotee (4): Eight track. It has eight track.

Pratyatoṣa: It'll work anywhere in the world.

Prabhupāda: Oh!

Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville:

Interviewer: This is being recorded on videotape, so it will be broadcast later.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Interviewer: Not right now, but later on... (break) ...very little about this...

Prabhupāda: (laughs)

Interviewer: Yes. So if I ask questions which, you know, sound sort of ignorant...

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Yes, I shall...

Interviewer: ...I ask your indulgence. Thank you.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (laughs)

Interviewer: You are the expert, and I know very, very little about this.

Prabhupāda: Expert is Kṛṣṇa. He is expert (indistinct). (laughs)

Interviewer: The expert is Kṛṣṇa. Yes. That much I understand. Yes. In fact Kṛṣṇa is everything. (Prabhupāda chants japa) (break)

Prabhupāda: ...so he is authorized.

Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London:

Sister Mary: You see, two, two things... You can't...

Prabhupāda: No. Concentrate, concentration automatically. If I chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and I hear, that is concentration. That is concentration. Immediately.

Sister Mary: But you can't read or talk to someone.

Prabhupāda: There is no question of reading. We are simply asking to chant. Reading will come later on. Just like a small child, he's taught... In our educational system they chant... What is that? That...? (Hindi) Pahara pahara.(?)

Indian man: Pahara. Alphabet. A.I.E.

Prabhupāda: They chant. By chanting, by hearing they learn. "A,B,C," like that. "2 plus 2 equal to 4." We did it in our childhood. One boy will chant like that. "2 plus 2 equal to 4." And we shall repeat. "2 plus 2 equal to 4." So repeating three times, I understand 2 plus 2 equal to 4.

Sister Mary: Do you find that the chant goes on in your heart?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Revatīnandana: Do you find that the chant goes on in your heart?

Prabhupāda: Why not? Why not?

Sister Mary: It goes deeper and deeper?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Everything we hear, it goes to the heart. If I call you by name, it does not go to my heart? "You rascal. You stupid." You hear. Does it not go to my heart? Why I become angry unless it goes to my heart. If "rascal," "stupid," and all these bad names go to my heart, why God's name will not go to my heart? If by calling you by ill names you become angry, that means it goes to your heart. Why not good name? It goes. It enters through the ear and goes to the heart.

Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes. As they hear, they became purified, and that dormant consciousness becomes awakened. Yes. Awakened. That chance we are giving. We are chanting and others are hearing. By this process, chanting and hearing, both of us will be benefited, awakening our original God consciousness.

Revatīnandana: At the stage of awakening, when you're waking up, when you're becoming cured of the diseased condition, you sometimes have to restrict your diet. Later on, when you are healthy, you can take all kinds of foodstuffs in the proper way. But while you're getting over a disease you have to restrict your diet. Therefore we hear things that are directly concerned with Kṛṣṇa's name, form, activities. Later on, then we'll be able to see God in a flower, God in everywhere. Otherwise we'll see the flower however we enjoy a flower because we're not at that healthy stage. So therefore there are regulations that we follow for curing the disease. That means for a little while we restrict the diet. Then when we're healthy...

Prabhupāda: Just like these flowers. These flowers the devotees are bringing to their spiritual master, to God. They are not enjoying. Ordinary man, if he gets a flower, he'll put it in the pocket. How... You see? That is the difference of God consciousness. The flower is the same, but use is different.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Dr. Weir: I assure you, Swami, that the reverse was true. I went to Oxford. I sat at the feet, as we would put it, of one of the most tiresome men I ever met in my life. He gave me an extraordinary distaste for law. Any law I've learnt has had to be learned the hard way by, you know, looking up statutes, looking up cases. So I regret to say, that I have my own personal experiences...

Prabhupāda: That is, that is... Of course later on, in the beginning you are a student of a lawyer.

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: That's all right. It was recorded. That fighting is going on even in the family. We see between husband and wife also there is sometimes fighting. That is not taken into account. But the major wars in the history of the world... Because India, or Bhāratavarṣa, means the whole world. Now it is cut into pieces. Just like twenty years ago, Pakistan is cut. This planet is called Bhāratavarṣa. Formerly it was known as Ilāvṛtavarṣa. Later on, after the ruling of Mahārāja Bharata... You know Mahārāja Bharata. After his name, this planet is called Bhāratavarṣa. And up to the Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira, there was one ruling all over the world. One king in this (indistinct). Then gradually... Why? The culture was lost. The Vedic culture was lost. Up to Mahārāja Parīkṣit, the Vedic culture was kept intact. Just like Mahārāja Parīkṣit, while he was going on tour of the Western countries, he saw one black man was trying to kill one cow. He immediately took his sword, ""Who are you? You are killing cow in my kingdom?" So that culture we have lost. Immediately he began, "With this sword I shall kill you."

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation Vaisnava Calendar Description -- March 11, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So he was defeated. He was defeated and the matter was informed to Rūpa Gosvāmī, that "Your nephew and your disciple, Jīva Gosvāmī has defeated that learned scholar. So Rūpa Gosvāmī became a little angry superficially, that "Why did you bother? He was taking..." So some people say that Jīva Gosvāmī was rejected on this ground by Rūpa Gosvāmī, but that is not a fact. He was very glad that Jīva Gosvāmī defeated him, but he superficially said, "Why should you take so much trouble and bother? He might have gone with that certificate." But it is the duty of the disciple that even the spiritual master, or senior ācārya, they agree to be defeated, it is the duty of the disciple to see that his spiritual master and superior is not defeated. That is the instruction we get from Jīva Gosvāmī's behavior. This is one of the important, and later on when Jīva Gosvāmī established the Rādhā-Damodara temple in Vṛndāvana, but he had no sons because he was brahmacārī, so some of his gṛhastha devotee was entrusted with the management of the Rādhā-Damodara temple, and they are still going on by their descendants.

Room Conversation Vaisnava Calendar Description -- March 11, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, special observance means to discuss about the life and works of Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, thats all. Then 26th September, Ekādaśī. Then 10th October, Vijayā-daśamī, appearance date of Śrīla Madhvācārya, and the victory day of Lord Rāmacandra. So there is no fasting, but in the evening we should celebrate some feasting and discuss about the life and works of Śrī Madhvācārya as well as Rāmāyaṇa incidents where Rāma and Rāvaṇa fought.

The next day is Ekādaśī, that is means 11th October. Then 12th October is Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī, there is no fasting, but we should have discussion of Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī. Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī happened to be the only boy of his father and his uncle. He was a very rich man's son, but he left home for Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu. His life should be discussed as follows, that from the beginning he was very much detached to worldly life. So his father and mother saw that this boy is very much detached, he should be immediately married with a beautiful wife. So that was done—he was given a very nice house and beautiful wife—but still he was very much detached. So when he was a householder he met Nityānanda at Pāṇihāṭī and he prayed Lord Caitanya to take him with Him. At that time Caitanya was sannyāsī. Lord Caitanya instructed him, that "Don't be in a hurry, gradually Kṛṣṇa will give you a chance to be aloof from these worldly affairs." He was very intelligent even though he was detached from worldly affairs, but from his activities it appears that he was very intelligent also in worldly affairs. While somehow or other, for political reasons, his father and uncle were to be arrested by the minister of the region(?), Muslim government, and his father and uncle hided themselves to avoid the arrest. Then the agent of the Nawab, he arrested Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī. So "Tell, where is your father and uncle, otherwise you shall be tortured." So he did not answer anything, but after some time when he was in arrest, he very politely presented his case to the minister, "My dear sir, I know my uncle, father and yourself, you are very intimate friends and treat each other as brothers. So sometimes there is some quarrel between brothers, that I can understand. But so far I am concerned, I am equally affectionate to my father, uncle as well as to yourself. I am also your son." In this way, when he very politely presented, the minister became very much affected, and he began to cry, "Yes, this boy is very nice." So he immediately released him and told him that "Yes, we are brothers. Now if you settle up our disagreement that will be very nice." So he was released and he made a settlement between the minister and his father and uncle, so in that settlement he showed his worldly intelligence very nicely. He was not a, ah, less politician; his management was so nice. So that means a Vaiṣṇava is not less intelligent, he can manage anything. But that does not mean that he is attached to anything. This example we get from Śrī Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī. Even in his household life he managed things very intelligently, but later on he left home. He was guarded by the watchman of his father and uncle, but he somehow or other got out of their watch and guard(?), and directly went to see Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu, and when Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu saw him coming to His shelter, He very much welcomed him, and He said, "Raghunātha, you have been saved by Kṛṣṇa from the hole of stool.

Room Conversation Vaisnava Calendar Description -- March 11, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So Caitanya Mahāprabhu became very much glad to hear that Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī is practicing so much renunciation. So all of a sudden one day He went to his room, "Raghunātha, I did not see you for so many days." Then He found out in a pot those collected rice were kept and immediately He took it, "Oh, you have got very nice rice here," and began to eat. Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī immediately caught His hand, "Sir, it is not fit for Your eating." "Oh! I am eating so nice, you say it is not fit for Me?" That means Lord Caitanya encouraged him that "Don't be discouraged that this is bad, or this is not fit. I can eat, anyone can eat." In this way Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī was elevated to a very exalted position amongst the Gosvāmīs. He is known as Dāsa Gosvāmī because he belonged to the kāyastha family and other Gosvāmīs, they belonged to brāhmaṇa families. Therefore, in order to keep his position as subordinate to the brāhmaṇas, he was known as Dāsa Gosvāmī. But it does not make any difference whether a brāhmaṇa is a Gosvāmī or a non-brāhmaṇa is a Gosvāmī, he is equally respected. This Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī later on, after Lord Caitanya's disappearance he went to Vṛndāvana to associate with the other Gosvāmīs, and he remained mostly at Rādhā-kuṇḍa, and he passed his days at Rādhā-kuṇḍa. His tomb is there still in Rādhā-kuṇḍa and he has got established a temple, that is Raghunātha Dāsa Gosvāmī's temple. All the Gosvāmīs established some temple, separately.

Room Conversation with Maharishi Impersonalists -- April 7, 1972, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: He was kṣatriya, king. He promulgated this philosophy, ahiṁsā, when there was unnecessary killing of animals. According to Vedas, animal can be killed in sacrifice. That also to give a new life. But people misinterpreted and they began to kill animals like anything with the evidence of..., "In the Vedas animal killing is sanctioned." So Lord Buddha appeared, just being compassionate to the poor animals. Sadaya-hṛdaya-darśita-paśu-ghātam. Sadaya. He became very compassionate, that "All these poor animals are being killed unnecessarily." So he promulgamated a new type of religion-ahiṁsā paramo dharmaḥ. "Don't commit violence. If I pinch your body, you feel pain. You should not pinch others." That is his religion. So, but, he... Because others, they will argue, "Oh, in the Vedas..." As I told you, that Vedas is the evidence, so "Here is... Animal killing is ordered. How you are stopping it?" Therefore he said, "I don't care for your Vedas." And because he did not care for the Vedas, therefore in India, later on, nobody accepted Buddha philosophy. Therefore Buddha philosophy has gone outside India-China, Burma, Japan—because here in India they are very strong in the standing of Vedas. Śaṅkarācārya established that "This Buddha philosophy is non-Vedic. It cannot be accepted." That was Śaṅkarācārya's propaganda. So by the propaganda of Śaṅkarācārya the Buddhism were driven away. There are so many things that one has to study. So Lord Buddha, we accept him as the incarnation of God. And his name is mentioned in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavata. And his business is also mentioned: sammohitaṁ sura-dviṣām. His business is to cheat the atheist class of men. That cheating is not cheating. It is for the good. Just like the father sometimes cheats the small child. You see? So that does not mean father is cheater. "Well, he has got some business to do that. That's all." So when I say Lord Buddha cheated, we don't mean that Lord Buddha was a cheater like ordinary man. No. He had to accept some means to lead them to God worship. He is God. So all the Buddhists... I have seen in Japan. Their temple is as good as Hindu temple. They have got Lord Buddha's statue. They offer lamps, and they sit down. They read Buddha philosophy. It is exactly Hindu temple.

Room Conversation -- April 2, 1972, Sydney:

Śyāmasundara: "The three categories of devotional service which Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī describes in Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu are listed as devotional service in practice, devotional service in ecstasy and devotional service in pure love of Godhead. There are many subheadings in each of these categories. Generally it is understood that in the category of devotional service in practice there are two different qualities, devotional service in ecstasy has four qualities, and devotional service in pure love of Godhead has six qualities. These qualities will be explained by Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī later on.

"In this connection, Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī suggests that the person eligible for Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or devotional service, can be classified by his particular taste. He says that devotional service is a continual process from one's previous life. No one can take to devotional service unless he has had some previous connection with it. For example, suppose in this life I practice devotional service to some extent. Even though it is not one-hundred-percent perfectly performed, still, whatever I have done will not be lost. In my next life, from the very point where I had stopped in this life, I shall begin again. In this way there is always a continuity. But even if there is no continuity, if only by chance a person takes interest in a pure devotee's instruction, he can be accepted and advance in devotional service."

Prabhupāda: This is the point. Preaching means this. Even one has no previous record of service, still, if he meets a pure devotee, he becomes enthusiastic. Therefore preaching required. Otherwise, one can say that whatever he has done last life, he will begin from there.

Interview -- July 5, 1972, New York:

Guest (1): Well I agree with that, but I still... The perfect person that is going to speak to me is God? Is that...

Prabhupāda: That, that we'll have to find, find later on. First of all the principle should be accepted that unless we hear from the perfect person, our knowledge is imperfect. First of all you have to agree to this point. Therefore you are going to your schools, colleges, universities, because at home who could learn everything? So why you are going to school, colleges and universities? That is not possible. Therefore the Vedic injunction is that in order to know that perfect knowledge, one has to approach the proper person, who is know as guru.

Guest (1): That's what I was getting at.

Guest (2): (aside) Could I ask a couple of questions now?

Devotee: Please. Yes.

Guest (2): Swami, please, I don't want to interrupt. I want to try and ask you a few questions (indistinct). I'm with (indistinct). Swami, what do you think accounts for the..., your popularity, popularity of the..., the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement sweeping America?

Prabhupāda: Because it is not due to my personality. I am presenting the truth as it is. It will appeal. Just like if you prepare some foodstuff with nice ingredients, it will be appealing to everyone, and if you prepare something obnoxious, it may be appealing to a certain section, not to all.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Same thing when they discovered atomic bomb, they did not know what's going to happen. This Einstein proposed the equation that a small mass can be converted to a tremendous amount of energy, like his equation that energy is equal to the mass times the square of the velocity of light. So he from his theory found that this is happening, this is a physical law. So if we have a small amount of mass, and if we subject to this equation, then there will be a tremendous amount of energy. But later on it happened that they used the knowledge in the wrong direction. So many people got killed. And at the moment, the so-called genetic engineering...

Prabhupāda: That also they do not understand properly, because they do not see the spiritual energy. Just like we know that within this body there is a small bit of spiritual energy, spark, which is ten thousand part of the tip of the hair. How small it is. But due to its presence within the body, the body is working so nicely. We know that, that how a small particle of spiritual energy can work so wonderfully. They do not know it.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So nowadays the scientists are also thinking that there have been so many mistakes, so...

Prabhupāda: They will find out.

Morning Walk -- October 15, 1972, Vrndavana:

Śyāmasundara: ...tell us a little bit about the temple as we move?

Prabhupāda: Yes. This temple was constructed by Śrīla Jīva Gosvāmī, one of the first disciples of Lord Caitanya, and this is Narottama Samādhi. Here is Kṛṣṇadāsa Kavirāja Gosvāmī entombed, and here is Rūpa Gosvāmī entombed. Later on, several other devotees, they are not entombed like them. Flowers from their body, they were placed. It is called Puṣpa Samādhi. But here, the original bodies.

Devotee (1): Ah. This is Kṛṣṇadāsa Kavirāja's body?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Devotee: Original bodies.

Prabhupāda: And that side, the original body of Śrī Rūpa Gosvāmī. (break)

Śyāmasundara: ...a well?

Prabhupāda: Yes. This is the original well.

Morning Walk -- October 15, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) Rūpa Gosvāmī was a minister. So after retirement he, under the instruction of Caitanya Mahāprabhu, he came to Vṛndāvana.

Indian man: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: Rūpa Gosvāmī. So formerly they were living under trees. That I have already described in Caitanya-caritāmṛta. Later on, when Jīva Gosvāmī constructed this temple, he is nephew and disciple, at that time Rūpa Gosvāmī also, he lived with his disciple. Actually, this temple belongs to Jīva Gosvāmī, and Rūpa Gosvāmī's temple is at...

Śyāmasundara: We saw it.

Prabhupāda: ...Govindajī.

Śyāmasundara: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: And Sanātana Gosvāmī's temple is at Madana-Mohana. But when Jīva Gosvāmī was here, naturally—they were elder uncle—so lived together, and because they, all of them lived here, so other Gosvāmīs, Gopāla Bhaṭṭa Gosvāmī, Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī, all of them used to meet here. And Gopāla Bhaṭṭa Gosvāmī used to live (indistinct), and all other Gosvāmīs used to be here. And this is explained, Rūpa Gosvāmī bhajana, that chant (indistinct).

Introduction Speech By Dr. Kapoor and Conversation -- October 15, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So blessings of Dr. O.B.L. Kapoor. He is a Vaiṣṇava. Although by age he is my younger brother, we are Godbrothers, and for the last forty years perhaps, since he was a student at Allahabad and I was doing some business there, we are known to each other. So his association is a great blessing for us. But this reception is actually not my reception. It is the reception of my foreign students. Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu wanted that His message should be broadcast all over the world, in every village and every town, and my Guru Mahārāja attempted. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura distributed his literature. I think, in 1896, he sent his first book, Teachings of Lord Caitanya, and I saw in McGill University that book. And I do not know. That was the year of my birth also, 1896. So somehow or other, later on, I came in contact with Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Gosvāmī Mahārāja in 1922, and he immediately asked me that "Why don't you go to the foreign countries and preach Caitanya Mahāprabhu's blessings." So I was little surprised. Especially at that time, I was very young man and I was newly married. I got one son also. So it was my mistake that I did not take up the words of Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Gosvāmī Mahārāja immediately. I thought that "I am now married. Let me settle down." Perhaps if I would have joined from 1922, by the blessings of Guru Mahārāja, I could do more preaching work. Anyway, it is better late than never. After my retirement, I was living in the Keśī-ghāṭa, Nāthagrāma(?) Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa Temple. But this Gosāijī, Gauracanda Gosāijī, he asked me, "Why don't you come here?" So I left that place. I came here. And with some arrangement, I took this room.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 28, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Devotee (1): Today is Wednesday. They meet on Thursday. I'll go see her today.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Devotee (1): They meet at 6 o'clock and our meeting is 7 o'clock so maybe I should invite them because I don't think there will be time to go there. If you would like to stay a few more days I can arrange for more meetings.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Devotee (1): In the Theosophical Society, not everyone, but one leader I spoke to, the others too maybe liked it, (indistinct) (pause) Should we go to the same place for the walk? It is too far...?

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) (break)

Devotee (1): (later, on the walk) Yes. Easy Journey, Topmost Yoga, Back to Godhead.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa trilogy, you have got?

Devotee (2): I have volume 1 and volume 3, but my volume 2, they are all finished. But I've ordered them from Karandhara. (pause) (end)

Morning Walk -- March 1, 1973, Jakarta:

Devotee (1): So there's no spiritual motive.

Prabhupāda: Later on it became political, because as soon as the spiritual power, culture become diminished, the whole thing became material. So people wanted material advantage, so separated from Vedic culture. Just like Buddhists. Buddhism was a Hindu culture. But Lord Buddha wanted to stop animal sacrifice. In the Vedas, animal sacrifice is recommended under certain conditions. He even denied that, "No that also cannot be done." So therefore they are separate from Vedic culture. After all these, all these religious systems-Mohammedanism, Jewism, then Christianism, Buddhism—they are at a stage not more than 2,000 years. And before 2,000 years, what was the culture?

Devotee (1): The Christians here, get money from America. In Bali, where there's many Hindus live, they convert many people by saying, "If you become a Christian, you'll have good economy with us."

Prabhupāda: And that is the Christian propaganda.

Room Conversation -- March 17, 1973, Mayapur:

Śrīdhara Mahārāja: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Yes, so at that time Vinode Bhai, later on Keśava Mahārāja, he informed that "Prabhupāda is going to Mathurā tomorrow morning and he will speak Hari-kathā this evening. Anyone who wants to remain may remain or otherwise they may prepare to go to see Śeṣaśāyī." So at that time, I think only ten or twelve men remained. Out of them Śrīdhara Mahārāja was one of them, and I thought it wise, "What shall I see, this Śeṣaśāyī? Let me hear. Prabhupāda will speak, let me hear." So Prabhupāda marked that this boy...

Śrīdhara Mahārāja: (indistinct) to listen to him (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: He, because he's a vaikuṇṭha person who could understand that this boy is eager to hear, so he very much appreciated. So when we came back to Allahabad, so Ganeśa Babu, he introduced me, that "Here is a nice devotee." So Prabhupāda immediately replied, "Yes, I have marked him. He does not go away, he hears." This (indistinct), "Yes, I will accept him as disciple." Then I was initiated. In this way our relationship with Gauḍīya Maṭha developed, and gradually as it developed, the other side diminished. Then, there are long history, it will take time, but I had the opportunity of associating with His Holiness. For several years I had the opportunity. Kṛṣṇa and Prabhupāda liked it to prepare me.

Morning Walk -- April 21, 1973, Los Angeles:

Brahmānanda: Gāndhārī.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Brahmānanda: Gāndhārī, wife of Dhṛtarāṣṭra.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So later on such devoted wife was lacking. So the system was, some cases, they were forced to die. So these things have been elaborately explained in the, that book, and Britishers stopped it. So the Indians were uncivilized. Britishers made them civilized. Everything was misinterpreted. Yes.

Brahmānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But they do not know the inner meaning...

Prabhupāda: No, inner meaning is there. But they would not explain that. Simply the dark side, they would explain. And prove that the Indian civilization was very crude and primitive. It has no enlightenment. That was British propaganda. Even during national movement, they bribed one American woman, and she wrote a book: "Mother India." Do you know that?

Morning Walk -- April 21, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Oh, it was nice. Very nice students were coming out.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The moral standard was very good?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. We respected our professors like our fathers. The relationship between the student and the professors was very good. I had one Scottish professor, Dr. W.S. Urquhart. He was my nice friend. He was professor of philosophy, psychology. Later on he became vice-chancellor.

Brahmānanda:Calcutta?

Prabhupāda: Calcutta, yes. A very perfect gentleman. Kind-hearted. Sometimes we joked. We were taking this, what is called, peanuts. So the professor was passing. So some of our friends remarked: (Bengali) So he thought that professor did not know Bengali. So immediately he turned: (Bengali). So we became very much ashamed. Yes. So all the professors from foreign countries, they were instructed to learn Bengali language, local language. That was the system. All officers, big officers, educate... (Aside) Good morning. ...big educationists, they were to learn the local language. And they used to learn Bengali. Especially in Calcutta. There was one professor, Mr. Scrimgeour. He was professor of literature, English literature. So while teaching one English literature, he was giving parallel passage from Bankim Candra Chatterjee. Yes. "Your Bankim babu says like this." He used to say like that.

Morning Walk -- April 21, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Oh, Yes. In Calcutta, there are two colleges, Presidency College and Scottish Churches College. All respectable families, son will go there, Scottish Churches College, Presidency College.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They started almost at the same time?

Prabhupāda: No, no. It is very old. Presidency College is government, and Scottish Churches College, by the Scottish Church missionaries. There was one priest, Duff, his name was Duff. He started in Srirampur, a small educational institute, Duff Institute. He was a Scotsman. Later on, all the Scottish missionaries combined together and they started this Scottish Churches College.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Still now the schools are respected now.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Still now they have good names,...

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Yes, yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Presidency College and Scottish Church College.

Prabhupāda: Now they are ruined due to this Naxalite movement. Subash Bose was in our college.

Morning Walk -- May 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So did you not protest?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. Then there was... After his lecture... It was a one hour long seminar, and there was question and answer. So they invited questions. Nobody asked.

Prabhupāda: So you did not ask?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, I asked later on. I asked, that "Your topic is about origin of life, but you are not talking about the origin of life. So there is no basis of your argument."

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Then I asked, "Supposing I give you the chemical materials, say, the molecules likes amino acids and the big molecules like DNA and RNA..." These are the molecules, which they think necessary for the maintenance of life. "Supposing I give you all these chemical compounds, then do you think that you will be able to put life into it. If you get all the chemical materials necessary, but will you be able to put life into it?" Then he said, "I do not know."

Prabhupāda: Then why you are talking nonsense? (laughter) Then? People did not laugh?

Morning Walk -- May 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Just see. Very good. Yes. You have to go and lecture all the universities, calling these rascals fools. That will be our mission. They do not know anything and talking all nonsense. That's it. There was nobody to challenge till now. Now we are creating persons to challenge these rascals. That is our credit. Till now whatever nonsense they are talking, people thought, "Oh he is a big scientist." Now our scientist will protest against them, stop them talking all nonsense. That is what we want. If a lay man like me goes and protesting, he may say that "First of all you come to my level, then I shall talk with you." Now, he cannot talk with you like that. Because you are on the level. So challenge all this nonsense. Why they talk nonsense? So later on, other persons, they did not talk with you?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, the chairman of the department, he was telling later on that "About theology let us talk later on." So he dispersed the meeting after that. Theology, they thought, that I was talking on theology.

Prabhupāda: It is not theology, it is science.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, it is science. But he was assuming like that because his business is to protect the... This is outside speaker, comes from outside the university.

Prabhupāda: So how do you say it is theology?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: He was just commenting like that, that...

Prabhupāda: So you should have presented, "No, it is not theology. I am talking on the scientific basis."

Morning Walk -- May 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because there is no solid background.

Prabhupāda: No. (pause, japa) You and Dr. Rao just make a combination, world-touring. I shall give you all expenditure. And go to the universities, scientists, and talk with them. Our kīrtana party also will go. We challenge all scientists, "Come on." We shall pay all expenditure. Ask Dr. Rao to come and join. Just like in Calcutta University, all the students... No, one leader student, he came. He talked about economic development, and he said that "Our students did not derive any faith by your theological statement." So I told them that "Because you are all rascals, therefore you could not." I told them freely. Because in the Bhagavad-gītā... Because they are student of Sanskrit. And in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). "So you are amongst these. You are duṣkṛtinas, sinful, lowest of the mankind, and the university is responsible for creating such rascals." So professors clapped and later on they said, "Swamiji, you have rightly said." All the professors said. And so far economic question is concerned, the birds, beasts, animals, they have no economic concern. Why you have got? You are less than bird and beast, you have created this economic problem. Harer nāma harer nāma (CC Adi 17.21). Where is the economic question? The small birds, tiny birds, they are solving their economic question, coming (makes sound:) "bup, bup," finished. They are not stocking, they are not thinking of tomorrow, but are satisfied. They have got eating, sufficient eating, sufficient sex, sufficient intelligence to defend. As soon as we go, immediately they fly away. That is defense. They know how to defend them. They immediately understand, "They are human beings, stronger. They may do some harm. Let us fly away." So these things are everywhere, eating, sleeping, mating and defending. There is no scarcity. Only scarcity is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That we have to preach. Theology... Logy means science, is it not?

Room Conversation with David Wynne, Sculptor -- July 9, 1973, London:

Śyāmasundara: How much time do you need to?

David Wynne: Oh, not very long. Two days maybe. But it'll have to be a bit later on.

Śyāmasundara: That's...

David Wynne: Maybe if...

Śyāmasundara: Any time.

David Wynne: August or (indistinct), I've got to go back to Morocco.

Devotee: Do you translate now?

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Devotee: You will translate now?

Prabhupāda: Translation? Yes. Everything is ready. Who has taken that Caitanya-caritāmṛta?

Śrutakīrti: Must have been Pradyumna.

Prabhupāda: He has not come back? Why he hasn't?

Śrutakīrti: Yes, he's returned with his suitcase. And yours is at the airport. They would not give it to him because it was in my name. So they gave a form. I have to fill out the form and then anyone can pick it up.

Śyāmasundara: Well, we can go tonight. Make out the form.

Śrutakīrti: (indistinct) are open all twenty-four hours.

Śyāmasundara: Yeah. Make out the form. I'll go right now.

Prabhupāda: First of all phone if they're open.

Śyāmasundara: Twenty-four hours.

Prabhupāda: Oh. Then that's all right. Then do it. I think you have to pay some money.

Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Small children cut up. And there was another case in Calcutta. The, one Chinaman, he was eating human being. And then... (break) ...some Kancawala (?) (beggar) him called, and then captured and killed him. This was going on. Later on, when police enquiry was made, so many human...

Guest (2): Bones...

Guest (4): Skeletons.

Prabhupāda: ...bones, skeletons was found. In Africa there are still cannibals.

Guest (4): Oh, yes.

Kṛṣṇa-bhāminī: In South America as well.

Prabhupāda: South America also? In India also.

Guest (1): That, these...

Prabhupāda: Yes. In Assam side.

Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: No. Knowingly means that every Indian knows that Kṛṣṇa is accepted as the Supreme Personality of Godhead. At least... The every Indian, at least Hindus, they perform Janmāṣṭamī, accepting Kṛṣṇa. But still, they will not accept Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Personality. They'll bring many other competitors. "Why Kṛṣṇa shall be...? I have got Durgā. I have got this, Śiva. I have got that. I have got that. I have got that." This is going on as Hinduism. So many gods. So many gods. Although the Vedic literature says, kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1). In Bhagavad-gītā... Everyone reads Bhagavad-gītā. Bhagavad-gītā it says, Kṛṣṇa says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat: (BG 7.7) "There is no more superior than Me." Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ: (BG 10.8) "Everything is emanation from Me." Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). These things are there, but they'll not accept. Therefore they are offenders. Otherwise where is the difficulty? God is one. That is accepted. Eko brahma. God cannot be two. God is one. Nityo nityānāṁ cetanaś cetanānām ekaḥ (Kaṭha Upaniṣad 2.2.13). One nitya, one eternal, one living being..., that is Supreme. We are living being. We are also nitya, eternal. But he is nityo nityānām. He is the chief of the nityas. He's the chief of the living entities. So that is chief. Kṛṣṇa personally says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). "There is no more superior living being than Me." So these things are there in the Vedas. And they are supposed to be Vedic scholars, but they do not know the simple thing. So in that way they are ignorant. They read the Vedic literatures, but they do not understand, or they misinterpret in a different way for their own purpose. So they are, they're offender. Otherwise, there is no difficulty. This Māyāvāda philosophy has created this situation, that "God is impersonal, and, everyone can become God, or everyone is God." This Māyāvāda philosophy has created this havoc. Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu has recommended that māyāvādī haya kṛṣṇe aparādhi. "All the Māyāvādīs, they are offenders to Kṛṣṇa." Therefore they cannot make any progress in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That difficulty is there—offenders. And later on, there are so many institutions. They say that "You can create your God. You can become God." That is going on. "Whatever you think as God, that is God." So how one can make progress under these circumstances? One gentleman was arguing with me... He was supporting Rama-Krishna Mission. He said, "Even stool I consider God. It is God." (laughter) He came to this point. "If I worship stool as God, then it is also God."

Room Conversation With Three College Students -- July 11, 1973, London:

Student (1): Is that what you're trying to do in your movement?

Prabhupāda: No, my movement... I am talking of yoga syst... What is my movement, that we shall discuss later on. First of all the question was the yoga. You asked me that. Yoga means to control the mind and the senses. So if one is not able to control the mind and senses, he does not know what is the meaning of yoga. That... You read Bhagavad-gītā? Bring Bhagavad-gītā.

Revatīnandana: Do you understand the necessity of controlling the mind and the senses? Can you see why it is necessary?

Student (1): Yes. Sort of. Not to the full extent I don't see how it's necessary to a full extent, because I can't control the mind and senses.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Call Pradyumna.

Room Conversation With Three College Students -- July 11, 1973, London:

Pradyumna: ...yan māṁ vadasi keśava, na hi te bhagavan vyaktiṁ vidur devā na dānavāḥ: "O Kṛṣṇa, I totally accept as truth all that You have told me. Neither the gods nor demons, O Lord, know Thy personality."

Prabhupāda: Just see. Immediately he understands Kṛṣṇa. Sarvam etad ṛtaṁ manye: (BG 10.14) "Whatever You have spoken, I accept it," Then there is no difficulty. And You are accepted by Devala, Nārada, Vyāsa, and You are speaking Yourself, and later on, all the ācāryas have accepted. Then I'll follow: mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ (CC Madhya 17.186). I'll have to follow great personalities. The same reason mother says, this gentleman is my father. That's all. Finish business. Where is the necessity of making research? All authorities accept Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. You accept it; then your searching after God is finished. Why should you waste your time?

Student (1): Say we say that Kṛṣṇa is God. Right?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Student (1): Then do you believe that there are other ways, apart from the way that you're going, to get to Kṛṣṇa?

Prabhupāda: Yoga means to understand Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Father Tanner: Yes, I mean, this, I think, anyone who's in any sense spiritual or religious or ethical would admit because the spiritual body has no parts. So it cannot start to be or cease to be and cannot change within his own entity.

Prabhupāda: No, the spiritual body is there already. Just like you have got your body. The coat is made according to your body. You existed first. Your coat was made later on. Similarly, spiritually, we exist eternally. Now, according to our different types of activities, we get a body, material body. There are eight million, four hundred thousand different forms of bodies. So the spirit soul is transmigrating according to his desire and work to different types of body. This is called transmigration of the soul. ...

Father Tanner: You would hold that the spirit is eternal...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Father Tanner: ...in the sense that in the beginning all spirits were contained within the Deity,...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation With David Lawrence -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes, you have to eat. That is the technology.

David Lawrence: Perhaps a parrot's beak would be a very good thing to grow.

Prabhupāda: So give them this... You use your technology.

David Lawrence: Thank you. You know, I think that later on it may well happen, you know. (eating) Our boys don't eat meat, anyway. They eat baked beans the whole time. We have a generation in our country who could eat virtually anything, but they insist on sugar drinks and baked beans. Have you come across these strange English things? Baked beans? Most peculiar.

Prabhupāda: Baked beans?

Śyāmasundara: Baked beans.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Śyāmasundara: Beans...

David Lawrence: Haricot beans, put them in a tomato sauce.

David Lawrence: Haricot beans.

Śyāmasundara: In the oven.

David Lawrence: This is one of the English spiritual journeys. You know, they believe this is one of the greatest things to do, don't they.

Prabhupāda: Sometimes invite them all and give them prasādam. Nice boys.

Room Conversation with Dr. Arnold Toynbee, Famous Historian, at his home or office -- July 22, 1973, London:

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes, yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So they were feeling the... Actually, in India... In our childhood, we know. Every Indian felt very secure. They never expected that Britishers will go. They were so sympathetic. And now they... This is the pulse felt by that statistics officer. They are not very much satisfied with the present system of government. British administration was very much appreciated by the Indians. Even Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura appreciated. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, he has written in something, somewhere, that "The Britishers also very nice because they don't interfere with the religious affairs." So as soon as they changed their views and tried to divide the Hindus and Muslims, the British Empire lost. According to Queen's declaration, the Britishers pledged that "They will not interfere with your religious affairs." Later on, for political purposes, when they interfered with this Hindu-Muslim question, then the British Empire lost.

Room Conversation with French Journalist and UNESCO Worker -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: I work at night, writing books. My work is going on. At night, I write. (break) In the UNESCO, to understand God or spiritual life, they do not think it a necessary?

Dr. Inger: Well, that's a very, very important question. I think that the real trouble is that all of them are bureaucrats, sitting in offices, creating more jobs for other officers. I was one of the earliest members. I came when Dr. Radhakrishnan was the, was our president. And... At the very early stage. In those days, there was that feeling, that some importance should be given, but because it became a governmental organization, because every religion thinks that they should have a part to play in it, what they did was, they brought out, in ten volumes, a scientific and cultural history of mankind. But it has, it's only incidentally philosophy, only incidentally religion. The only religious books that have come out are those that have been translated. Old books like the second book to the East, for instance. Max Muller's books. And they have been reprinted. And occasionally a few translations have been done from Tulasidāsa or some other philosophers, rewritten, like Śaṅkara later on. But, but all of those have been done because somebody else has commissioned them. But otherwise, there isn't... Except they have had some meetings in various placed. But at none of these meetings do they really discuss the problem that of the, well occasional people, occasional philosophers, they never really discuss that. I think because the word, religion, I think probably is the stumbling block...

Prabhupāda: No, apart from religion. Religion may be sentiment or some emotion. That is another thing.

Room Conversation with Anna Conan Doyle, daughter-in-law of famous author, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: You may not, but nature is different. Just like a child does not hope that if he puts his finger in a fire, it will not burn. But nature is so strict, it doesn't care for the child or the old man. It will burn. I may prove very innocent, but nature doesn't care for that. Nature doesn't care for that. Nature will not show any mercy for the innocent child. No. That is nature. Is it not fact? If a child puts his finger on the fire, nature will not consider that: "Here is a innocent child. He may not be burned." No. Equally. Therefore nature is very strong. We cannot avoid the control of the nature. If you do something, it must acting, react in the same way. The same... If you put your finger in the fire, it must react, burn it. Nature is so strong. So as soon as you violate any law of nature, you'll be punished. That is... Just like God... State police is there, engaged by the government. As soon as you violate law, the police will arrest you and give you punishment. Similarly material nature means the police of God. As soon as you violate God laws, it will give immediately punishment. That is material nature. It is always punishing us. Because we are, one after another, we are violating the laws of God. Therefore she's always punishing. That is her business. Mother nature is described as Goddess Durgā, and she has got a trident in her hand. That is punishment. Three kinds of miserable condition. Adhyātmika, adhibhautika, adhidaivika. Adhyātmika, pertaining to the body and mind, adhibhautika, miserable condition offered by others, and adhidaivika, miserable condition offered by higher authorities. Just like if there is no rain, you cannot do anything. Your so-called science and advancement of knowledge will not be able to help. Or if there is over flood. That also you cannot do anything. Therefore you have to accept there is a controller of this raining. It is not under my control. That is nature. But nature is working under the direction of God. Behind the background of nature is God. Just like background of police force is the government. Similarly, background of the stringent laws of nature is God. That they do not understand. They're struggling with the natural laws. And that struggle they are taking as advancement. That's all. It is a struggle. But they're taking it as advancement. This is called illusion. It is not advancement. It is simply struggle. But they're taking it as advancement. Such a great, powerful man like Napoleon, Hitler, they struggled only. Later on, they vanquished. So what to speak of others? Such big, big men, they struggled against the nature, but they vanquished. Nature is there. Nature is always victorious. So we have to own over victory over the nature. That is only possible if you take shelter of Kṛṣṇa. Otherwise, not. Do you think we are right in our statement.

Discussion about Guru Maharaji -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Then you have to make propaganda against that, that simply pushing two eyes... Anyone can push two eyes and there is natural some light. Is that the proof that he has become God? You are so foolish? And you say that God is, God has created the universe. So what he has created? What he has done, wonderful thing? That simply by pushing your eyes, you see some light, and you become God? You have become so foolish, European brain? You have no intelligence. Preach against him. What is the proof that he is God? Now, those who do not know anything about God, they can be convinced. Just like—what is called?—agnostic. The agnostic... Sometimes we say that there is a creator because everything, just we say, everything, whatever we have got in our experience, it is created. So this gigantic universe or one or many, there must be one creator. This is one hypothesis. So that creator, if I accept this man, whether he can create something, such wonderful? Has he done so? In this way, you have to make propaganda. So far our position is, we accept God, Kṛṣṇa, on the authority, as well as by the action, both. We, we make hypothesis that there must be a creator. Vedānta says: "Yes, there is a creator." And Kṛṣṇa says, He says: "I am the creator of everything." And when He was at, on this planet, He did so many wonderful things. And He is accepted by big, big stalwarts. Just like Arjuna accepts. He heard Bhagavad-gītā. So before that, Nārada accepts. Vyāsadeva accepts. Great... Later on, big, big ācāryas accept. So these are the proof. But what proof he can give that he's God, that we shall accept him God? Simply he shows some light. We have to make some propaganda. That will be our (indistinct). And he has to be... If we remain silent, then whatever he says, that means we are accepting. So we should not allow this man to grow popularity. We must make propaganda wherever meeting is there. I can kick on the face of this (indistinct). I can urine on the face of... What can he do. Let them. Let him come. If he's God, then let him kill me by his power. When I go to kick on his face, let him stop me, then I shall accept that he's God. So why don't you do that? He's saying God. You just kick on his face, if he can do something... In this way, make some counter-propaganda. If we allow him to go on, then so many people falsely being misled.

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

Pradyumna: "Andhra. A province in Southern India mentioned in the Bhīṣma-parva of Mahābhārata. It is still extant under the same name. Pulinda. It is mentioned in Mahābhārata, Ādi 174.38, that is the inhabitants of the province of the name, Pulinda. This country was conquered by Bhīmasena and Sahadeva. The Greeks are known as Pulindas, and it is mentioned in the Vana-parva of the Mahābhārata that the non-Vedic race of this part of the world would rule over the world. This Pulinda province was also one of the provinces of Bhārata, and the inhabitants were classified amongst the kṣatriya kings. But later on, due to their giving up the brahminical culture, they were mentioned as mlecchas, just as those who are not followers of the Islamic culture are called kafirs, and those who are not followers of the Christian culture are called heathens. Ābhīra. This name also appears in Mahābhārata, both in the Sabhā-parva and the Bhīṣma-parva. It is mentioned that this province was situated on the River Sarasvatī in Sind. The modern Sind province formerly extended on the other side of the Arabian Sea. All the inhabitants of that province were known as the Ābhīras. They were under the domination of Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira and, according to the statements of Mārkaṇḍeya, the mlecchas of this part of the world would also rule over Bhārata. Later on, this proved to be true, as it was proved in the case of the Pulindas. On behalf of the Pulindas, Alexander the Great conquered India, and on behalf of the Ābhīras, Muhammad Ghori conquered India. These Ābhīras were also formerly kṣatriyas within the brahminical culture, but they gave up the connection. But the kṣatriyas who were afraid of Paraśurāma and had hidden themselves in the Caucasian hilly regions later on became known as the Ābhīras, and the place they inhabited was known as Ābhīradeśa. Śumbha, or the..." (break)

Prabhupāda: One Yavana fought with him, Kālayavana.

Professor: Because usually the Yavanas is considered as being Greeks.

Prabhupāda: Greeks.

Professor: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

means this body."

Professor: But he didn't write it...

Prabhupāda: Well, it is not widely read, but this has become a fashion, to give his own interpretation. Yes.

Professor: Yeah, that's right, the fashion. That's the word. That's right.

Prabhupāda: But Kṛṣṇa was not a so, I mean to say, ignorant, that He left something to be interpreted later on by another rascal. No. That was not Kṛṣṇa's intention. What Kṛṣṇa says, that is final. So we accept in that way. Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). So we appeal to the people that "You think of Kṛṣṇa. You become a devotee of Kṛṣṇa." All these disciples, they have been taught like that. "You offer obeisances to Kṛṣṇa." Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī. "You worship Kṛṣṇa." That's it. And by doing that, they are advancing. Advancing. And before me, for hundreds of years or more than that, the Bhagavad-gītā was known to the European and American countries. As you say, there are so many trans...

Professor: Yes.

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Twenty-thousand? Oh.

Haṁsadūta: Yeah, we also have so many small books.

Guru-gaurāṅga: These books are all by Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Later on they will write.

Professor: Eh?

Prabhupāda: Later on they'll write. Yes. For the time being, I am writing.

Haṁsadūta: Each disciple writes one book.

Professor: No.

Prabhupāda: And we are printing 100,000 of these small books at a time.

Professor: Each of them, or...?

Prabhupāda: Yes, each of them. And as soon as they brought books in saṅkīrtana, people take it immediately—"Give me one, give me one, give me one..." That's... These books, we charge fifty cents. They pay easily.

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

Professor: So do you think it is possible, for instance, to have the husband being involved in this movement and not his wife?

Prabhupāda: No, wife also involved. Everyone is involved. The child is also involved. You'll find in our class a small child dancing to the tune. Yes. We have opened one school for children in Dallas. All the gṛhastha-bhaktas, those who have got children, we send there. Have you got pictures of Dallas? So there we have got very nice building, and, about, for the present, about near about hundred students. They're simply taught Sanskrit and English.

Professor: Nothing else.

Prabhupāda: Nothing else. Later on, little geometry, geography, mathematics. They're not meant for outside work. They're meant for as soon as they learn Sanskrit and English, they'll read these books.

Professor: I see. But to get the initiation, you have to be how many years old?

Prabhupāda: At least ten years.

Professor: Ten years.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Ten to twelve years. That is the Vedic system. Twelve years old. He can be initiated.

Room Conversation with Indian Ambassador -- September 5, 1973, Stockholm:

Ambassador: Yeah, from the embassy, but we have got some, some people we can straight-away issue. In some cases they would refer to India. But if we make a positive recommendation, they will agree.

Prabhupāda: So that I do not know. But visa is given by the embassy, from the local place.

Paramahaṁsa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, would you like prasādam?

Prabhupāda: Later on.

Ambassador: Much too early.

Prabhupāda: So they have done nice?

Ambassador: They have done so well, you know. I feel...

Prabhupāda: So you kindly eat all of them.

Ambassador: I feel privileged(?), but I can't eat them all.

Prabhupāda: No, no. It is only two.

Ambassador: I'll eat only two parāṭās.

Prabhupāda: Ah, two parāṭās.

Interviews with Macmillan and various English Reporters -- September 12, 1973, London:

Prof. Gombrich: Then that was after the university?

Prabhupāda: Yes, that was after my retirement.

Prof. Gombrich: I see.

Prabhupāda: But in student life I had knowledge in Sanskrit, and that was utilized later on.

Prof. Gombrich: Yes, of course. And do you return to Vṛndāvana often?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Every year I go there, during the month of October.

Prof. Gombrich: Do you have a particular āśrama there?

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Yes. Now we are constructing our own temple also, very big temple. You had been in Vṛndāvana?

Prof. Gombrich: No, I haven't, I'm afraid. No. And do you think that the message of Kṛṣṇa consciousness or Kṛṣṇa Caitanya is very different from the message of realizing God which is promulgated in other religions, for instance the Śaiva religion or...?

Prabhupāda: No I don't think so. Any religion, you follow nicely. Just Christian religion, there is God consciousness. So actually it is not this religion or that religion. People have given up religion. All over the world they have no more interest in religion. And especially I see that in your London that so many churches are vacant. Nobody's going there. So thing is that there is no more regular teaching of religious system. It has become a profession like. Neither the teachers are serious, nor the students are serious. So our principle is that not this religion or that religion. Whichever religion you may like, you can follow, but we want to see whether you are God conscious. If you are not God conscious, then we take it simply useless waste of time, these so-called religions. Śrama eva hi kevalam. You understand Sanskrit.

Room Conversation -- September 18, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda:

yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke

sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ

yat-tīrtha-buddhiḥ salile na karhicij

janeṣv abhijñeṣu sa eva go-karaḥ

(SB 10.84.13)

Go-kharaḥ. Go means cow, and kharaḥ means ass. Those who are living life, the bodily concept of life, they're simply go-kharaḥ, just like cows and asses. So, at the present moment, it is a civilization of go-kharaḥ. They may be proud, advanced, civilized man, but the śāstra says that "You are all asses and cows." And we speak on the basis of śāstra. Don't be angry upon... We see all the cows and asses. (break)

aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ

prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase

gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca

nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ

(BG 2.11)

"You are talking like a very nice, learned scholar, but no learned man talks like this." That means "You are a fool." (laughter) He's friend, so He's talking very mildly that "You are, you are trying to talk like a learned scholar, but actually no learned scholar speaks like this." That means, "You are a fool."

dehino 'smin yathā dehe

kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā

tathā dehāntara-prāptir

dhīras tatra na muhyati

(BG 2.13)

Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ. Nobody knows. Dehāntara-prāptiḥ, from one body to another, we are doing that, every moment, but these rascals, they do not know. I was a child, I was a boy. Where is that body? It is gone. It is a fact. I am in a different body. Dehāntara-prāptiḥ. Still, they won't believe that there is life after death. Dehāntara-prāptiḥ we are experiencing in this life. But they won't believe that after this deha, there is another deha. That they won't believe, such dull-headed. (Hindi) Are they dull-headed or (are) they intelligent scholar and scientist? What is your opinion? What is your opinion? You are practical man. (break) That is later on, so 'ham. First of all, understand what you are aham, then so 'ham. You do not know what is aham. So these rascals, they do not know aham, and they're speaking, so 'ham. (break) When you understand yourself, then you understand God also. Then you'll understand that God and yourself are of the same ingredient, so 'ham. Just like if I say, so 'ham. "I am just like Indira Gandhi.

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1973, New Delhi:

Śyāmasundara: People stopped purchasing...?

Prabhupāda: No. Just like Dr. Bose's laboratory. So Dr. Bose's laboratory, I was manager. Then I took his agency, very good terms. I was earning money like anything. But the next manager, he became envious. He began to poison Dr. Bose, to cut off our relationship. So it happened. Then, when I was Dr. Bose's agent, I become so much famous that Bengal Chemical, the biggest chemical factory, he, they wanted to give me the agency. If I would have taken that agency, I would have been the richest man in the chemical world. You see. But they made some condition. So I did not accept it. I wanted in my condition. That is the very little... But I was puffed-up, that "I am such a big... And this man is flattering. So I must get my condition fulfilled." So I did not accept it. The Smith Stanstreet gave me agency. Because in my work, in Dr. Bose's laboratory, I did it very creditably. So every other manufacturers, they became attracted to me, how to get me. The Smith Stanstreet Company, Bikepala(?) Company, Bose's, Bengal Chemical Company, they all wanted me. And I thought, "Oh, everyone wants me." So, so I refused. And later on there was a clique between Dr. Bose and me. So I lost everything. Then I started my own laboratory. Somehow or other, there was something, and...

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1973, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: That intelligence gives me, Kṛṣṇa, "You do this." Buddhi-yogaṁ dadāmi tam. Yes. And in my materialistic life, He was taking away my intelligence. Just like this Bose, Bengal Chemical agency, I should have accepted immediately. Such a big concern. Simply by sitting, I would have brought ten thousand rupees per month in those days. But there was no good intelligence. I thought, "No, I cannot accept your terms. You must accept..." Because I was at that time young man, puffed-up, no brain, no sober brain. They were so attracted with me. They would have given later on all facilities, but I did not accept. Similarly, Smith Stanstreet, they were also very good company.

Room Conversation -- November 4, 1973, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: There are many instances but this is the injunction of the śāstra. And practically also. Suppose a man is a medical practitioner. He may be born in a brāhmaṇa family or śūdra family. Nobody wants to know to which family he belongs to. If he sees that he is a medical practitioner, he has passed the MD examination and that he is practicing then people accept him as doctor, medical man. Nobody asks him, "Are you a brāhmaṇa, then I make my treatment with you?" Nobody asks that. So, this is śāstric injunction. Then later on this caste brāhmaṇism, śūdraism made the whole thing, whole Hindu culture, Vedic culture spoiled.

Guest: Quite right.

Prabhupāda: That is the.... Now it is the duty of the secular government.... Now if somebody is claiming that, "I am brāhmaṇa", then government should force him to become actually a brāhmaṇa. That is government's duty, that is secular state. Not that let people go to hell, we don't care for them, that is not required.

Guest: Yes, but if a brāhmaṇa is not behaving...

Prabhupāda: If you are claiming to become a brāhmaṇa, you must act as a brāhmaṇa.

Room Conversation -- November 4, 1973, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Demon. Demon. (laughs) Prahlāda Mahārāja when he was asked, "Take benediction, whatever you like", he said, "Sir, what benediction I shall take? I have seen the benediction of my father. He was so powerful even the demigods trembled by his red eyes and You finished it within a second. So what is the value of this benediction? Kindly engage me in Your service." Then Prahlāda Mahārāja he did not ask anything for himself, but later on he asked Nṛsiṁha-deva, "Sir, my Lord, one request I can make. My father was great demon, he was against You, but still I pray that his liberation will be granted."

Guest: Very nice of him, very good of him.

Prabhupāda: (laughs)

Guest: To save his father.

Prabhupāda: So Nṛsiṁha-deva replied, "Don't be worried about your father. Not only your father, but your father's father, his father, up to 14 generations because a devotee like you, because you are born in this family, 14 generations they are also liberated." Best service. If your daughter can give best service to your family by becoming a devotee. She gives service to you, to your husband, to your husband's father, your father, that is the śāstric injunction.

Morning Walk -- December 4, 1973, Los Angeles:

Karandhara: No, I'm talking about the individuality...

Prabhupāda: No, no. Individuality... There are so many proofs, there are so many proofs, how you can say it is not?

Devotee (2): By their own laws.

Prabhupāda: No, no, not that. It is different subject. That something is missing within the body, therefore it is dead. So what is your answer? We say something is missing. We shall decide what is that something later on. That something is missing. If you suggest that something is chemical combination, then you do it. Therefore do not know. I say something is missing. If you know, then you replace that something, then you'll know.

Karandhara: What do we say that something is?

Prabhupāda: No... That everyone, any layman can understand, that this dead body is unconscious because something is missing. Any layman can understand. If you know that, then you replace it. I don't say I know, but I say something is missing.

Hṛdayānanda: Jaya.

Prabhupāda: You have to accept also that. But if you know that something, then you replace it. Otherwise you also do not know. Then why you are talking of big, big word? You do not know.

Morning Walk -- December 5, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No. It is, it is... We should push Kṛṣṇa consciousness as disinfecting agent. They're all infected, the whole world. So by chanting you disinfect.

Umāpati: Just by our presence chanting then?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore chanting is so important. Philosophy later on. First of all, ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12), cleansing the heart.

Devotees: Jaya.

Prabhupāda: Cleansing the heart. So by hearing this chanting their heart will be cleansed gradually. Then they will understand the real position.

Umāpati: Oh. Jaya.

Hṛdayānanda: Oh, Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: So we have to do this chanting, not sit down in a solitary place, chanting himself. No, not like that. You are to vibrate the sound for the benefit of others.

Morning Walk -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Karandhara: They haven't taken care of things here.

Prabhupāda: Just see how rascaldom is going on. What is the use of our going there? "Things are going on..." Suppose in another state, something is going on. So are you interested? Going... Let them go. What is the benefit out of it? You spend so much money, public. Simply to see. "There is a crack." Last conclusion: "There was a crack." Just see how they are spoiling hard-earned public money. Because there is no good leader, all these rascals are benefiting, taking their money, and enjoying, and giving bluff information to the public. This should be stopped. Immediately this should be stopped. What is their contribution? The same thing: a dog is already barking, and because they're imitating barking, they're being awarded Nobel Prize, "Oh, how you can bark nicely!" This is going on. There is life already. It is practical. Everyone sees that a man and woman combines and there is child, life, another life. And now, foolishly they want to prove that life comes from matter. And as soon as we offer that "You take this matter. Produce," "That we shall see later on." Just see. In this way, they're spoiling money. So because there is no good leader, these rascals are not stopped.

Room Conversation with Latin Professor -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So they give medicine. And they give some astrological hint also. So in this way people gave them some contribution. That is their livelihood. So this... All the systems were made very easy on account of this Vedic injunction. So therefore we take Vedic knowledge as perfect, and we understand everything by Vedic knowledge about God, about His place, about His activities. And God comes as incarnation. He sends His representative. Then it is corroborated. And that is perfect knowledge of God. Kṛṣṇa's, God's feature—everything is described in the Vedas: Brahma-saṁhitā, Yajur-veda, Sāma-veda, like that. And when Kṛṣṇa descends, He practically demonstrates all the symptoms of God. So then we accept God. And it is confirmed by authorities. Just like Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa Himself says that "I am the Supreme." Arjuna accepts, the direct listener from God. And later on, the ācāryas, big, big ācāryas, who control the society, just Śaṅkarācārya, Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, they accept. Latest, Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He accepts. So our guru-paramparā all accepts Kṛṣṇa. And Kṛṣṇa describes Himself. So where is the difficulty to understand God? The symptoms are there in the śāstras. And those symptoms are visible in Kṛṣṇa. Just like everyone can understand, "God is all powerful." So Kṛṣṇa showed that He is all powerful.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Yaśomatīnandana: This is, is this the later half of his life?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Yaśomatīnandana: Is this the later half of Brahmā's life?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Everyone is advancing means he's going to die later on. Not only Brahmā, everyone one of us.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But they calculate that it's only 4.5 billion year old, the earth.

Prabhupāda: Let them calculate, but who cares for that? They cannot calculate even one day of Brahmā.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So we do not accept this?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We do not accept this.

Prabhupāda: How can I accept it? Because in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brahmaṇo viduḥ: (BG 8.17) "The Brahmā's one day is equal to one thousand combination of yugas." The combination of yuga means forty-three-hundred thousands of years. So such thousand times makes Brahmā's one day of twelve hours. Similar period, his night. Then day and night, it becomes full twenty-four hours. Then such thirty twenty-four hours makes one month. Such twelve months makes one year, and such hundred years he will live. So how you can calculate? It is beyond your arithmetical calculation. We have to go through the śāstras. So this is in one universe. And there are millions of universes and millions of Brahmās. And all of them live, taking the advantage of one exhaling of Mahā-Viṣṇu. Yasyaika-niśvasita-kālam athāvalambya jīvanti loma-vilajā jagad-aṇḍa-nāthāḥ (Bs. 5.48). All these Brahmās. So just see. How you can calculate? That is inconceivable. That is inconceivable.

Morning Walk -- December 11, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes, they have become fools and rascals. That's all.

Yaśomatīnandana: So significant, this prayer. The whole world, including India. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...difficulty is that because they are poverty stricken, they want some money now. They are thinking that "About God we shall think later on."

Yaśomatīnandana: Is it all right to blame the government in public, Prabhupāda, in India?

Prabhupāda: No, what is that government? Government is elected by the public. If public is polluted, the government must be polluted. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Public votes somebody, "Take charge of government." So if the public selects somebody nonsense, the government must be nonsense.

Yaśomatīnandana: Yes. In other words, to tell the public that "You should elect God-conscious leaders to have a better society."

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. That is our propaganda, that "This is the standard of leadership. So if you elect first-class leader, then your government will be first-class. But if you elect some rogues and thieves, drunkards, then how you can expect good government?" This is natural. After all, democracy means the public elect. The public does not know how to distinguish the rogues and thieves. Therefore the rogues and thieves take the advantage of it and, somehow or other, and take vote and sit on the presidential chair. That is difficulty. Just like our propaganda is... We are not making any propaganda in the beginning, that "Stop this cow slaughter." We are educating people, "Don't eat meat." If people become educated, automatically the slaughterhouse will be closed. This is our propaganda. "Don't drink." So if people give up drinking, automatically the drinking business will be closed.

Morning Walk -- December 21, 1973, Los Angeles:

Guest (1): And when they see that the conditions and the things in the world as they are, they don't fit in with their theories, then they change their theories.

Prabhupāda: No. So they are opportunists. They are not learned scholar. Our proposition is that five thousand years ago Kṛṣṇa taught that "I am the Supreme." So Arjuna accepted, paraṁ brahma, paraṁ dhāma: (BG 10.12) "Yes, You are Supreme." Then all the ācāryas later on, Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, even Śaṅkarācārya, all accepted. "Yes," kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). Then after that, ācārya system, Lord Caitanya accepted, "Yes, Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Lord." So after Caitanya, five hundred years, all the ācāryas, they are accepting. So we are accepting or teaching the same thing. No change, no change. Nityaḥ śāśvato 'yam. If there is change, that is not nitya, that is not śāśvata. That is circumstantial. That is material.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 12, 1974, Los Angeles:

Umāpati: They have nothing more to lose.

Prabhupāda: "But if you chant, you will be gainer. So... And what is the harm? You chant and see the result."

Umāpati: But they must follow the four regulative principles too.

Prabhupāda: You can advise. Even they do not follow, they will later on follow, by chanting. Yes.

Nara-nārāyaṇa: At our Sunday program, generally, the guests do not follow the four regulative principles, but when they come, they become very blissful.

Prabhupāda: But one thing. When you make your propaganda, you must have the facility for chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. Or you are simply going to speak? No chanting?

Prajāpati: No, we'll always have chanting. We will not speak without first chanting.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, your Gokule said, "What Bengal thinks today, others will think tomorrow."

Dr. Patel: That's right. Even in Mara-mari (?) also, you think only... (laughs)

Prabhupāda: Yes. Actually, this independence movement was started from Bengal. Partition of Bengal and the movement started, Surendranath Bannerjee. Gandhi admitted, "Father of nation is Surendranath Bannerjee." Yes. And later on, actually, if you don't take other, the independence came through a Bengali, Subash Chandra Bose.

Dr. Patel: Yes.

Mr. Sar: Right.

Dr. Patel: Not even... Philosophy also. Gaurapāda,(?) the grandson of Śaṅkarapāda. Gaurapāda, Gaurapāda was, he's Govindapāda and Govindapāda is Śaṅkarācārya. So that also you will see that some Śaṅkara's greatest sire was a Bengali gentleman.

Prabhupāda: Now taking too much, too much taking in political part. Aurobindo, Aurobindo, he was a politician.

Dr. Patel: Great politician. He was a humanist also.

Prabhupāda: Yes, but he left. "This is no good." I must take to yoga practice.

Morning Walk -- February 22, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Guṇa, guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ. Not by birth. Guṇa-karma. Just like you are kṣatriya, but because you have acquired the qualification of medical man and you are working as a medical man, therefore you are medical man. Nobody asked you, "You are a kṣatriya or a brāhmaṇa." You are a medical man.

Dr. Patel: Medical... You know, I think medical work is it brahminical or śūdric also?

Prabhupāda: That we shall consider later on.

Dr. Patel: (laughs) 'Cause I'll not say now so that I will drive out my doubt about me.

Prabhupāda: It is half-brāhmaṇa.

Dr. Patel: No, that is all right. At least, little brāhmaṇa is good.

Guest (2): It is vaidyic. All vaidyas are brāhmaṇas.

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, vaidyas means father brāhmaṇa, mother śūdra. That is vaidya.

Dr. Patel: They are sūtas.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- February 22, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) Now Americans are seriously considering about this movement. There are so many writings.

Dr. Patel: You are... As a matter of fact, you are improving their lot. The present boys, in American universities, they are all LSD smokers. The other day I said that, and that boy said that LSD went from India and so I became violent. Forgive me. I felt sorry later on. Because I should not have expressed my temper before you...

Prabhupāda: No, the...

Dr. Patel: But I held in a little more temper than that also. When somebody tells a wrong thing.

Prabhupāda: No, this gañjā, gañjā went from here.

Dr. Patel: That, because it is produced in India.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And they made a chemical composition of gañjā. That is LSD.

Dr. Patel: No, no. LSD is not chemical. It is a synthetic.

Prabhupāda: Therefore similar effect. Because they are scientific. So instead of importing gañjā from India, they invented some chemical composition...

Morning Walk -- March 3, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: So that signboard... (break) Yes.

Nitāi: What's the story behind the rediscovery of Māyāpur?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Nitāi: Is there some story related to the way in which Māyāpur was found by Jagannātha dāsa Bābājī?

Prabhupāda: The Ganges is going sometimes that side, then this side. So it was under the impression that original Caitanya Mahāprabhu's birthsite is now under water. Or there were many theories and suggestions. Later on, Jagannātha dāsa Bābājī said that "Here is the..." Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Nitāi: In previous days, it was a very big city.

Prabhupāda: (Bengali)

Indian: Ācchā. (end)

Morning Walk -- March 9, 1974, Mayapura:

Brahmānanda: The preaching necessitates that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because if there is no other alternative, what can I do? In the beginning I had no disciples. So I was cooking myself. So one gentleman, he... Later on, he became my disciple. He gave me some place. I was cooking. And in the refrigerator, I saw there was meat. (laughs) So I asked: "What is this?" He said, "It is for cats. I don't take meat." "All right. (laughter) I'll do (?)." So of course, I stayed there for three, four days. And if I cry, "Oh, I have violated my rules and regulations..." Rules and regulations can be violated when there is urgent necessity of service, not whimsically or for one's sense gratification. And that is, of course, in our present..., with the permission of the spiritual master, not one should think, "Oh, I have become so much great devotee, I can violate all the rules and regulations." No, you cannot. If there is need of violating rules and regulations, you must take permission. Now we have no temple. Under the circumstances, we are doing that. So you construct the temple as soon as possible so that people may not criticize you. (break) ...for all gṛhastha devotees, you should begin preaching amongst the gṛhasthas. It is not forbidden for the gṛhasthas to preach. Because preaching is required everywhere. Arjuna was gṛhastha. So yei kṛṣṇa-tattva-vettā sei guru haya (CC Madhya 8.128). One must know the science of Kṛṣṇa. Then you can become preacher.

Morning Walk -- March 9, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Guest (1): Because they would leave their work and start praying.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Guest (1): Then the work was stopped, and later on, it was sorted out. They were allowed to do their worship.

Guest (2): (break) ...cultured under, say, very comfortable circumstances. This has a relation to constant inquiries from public, specially young men, at the entrance of our mandira, our, this building, these days. I was sort of doing, helping them for entrance and exit. In that course, many young people specially they asked, "How could people living in so much comfortable circumstances could hear and ask for bhakti."

Prabhupāda: Then does it mean that those who are...?

Guest (2): I, knew... Yes... Yes...?

Prabhupāda: Those who are in uncomfortable situation, they are big bhaktas? (laughter) Can you show me that because they're in uncomfortable situation, they have become big bhakta? Is that the proof? What is this land?

Morning Walk -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Everyone should be expert. The leaders must be expert and the worker must be expert so that they may follow the instruction of the leader. If the leader says something and the workers, "Hm, I shall consider it, later on," then how the leader will execute his leadership? Both of them should be cooperating and know that "We are all working for Kṛṣṇa." Somebody was coming back and going... Coming this side or... Our men? No.

Devotees: No. (break)

Ātreya Ṛṣi: ...woman.

Prabhupāda: Ah?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: There are so many... So few compared to other religions, but we make so big propaganda always...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Because...

Prabhupāda: It is admitted, Hare Kṛṣṇa movement it is admitted.

Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: First of all varṇa. And āśrama, then, when the varṇa is perfectly in order, then āśrama. Āśrama is specially meant for spiritual advancement, and varṇa is general division. It must be there in the human society, or they're on the animals. If varṇa is not there, then this is a society of animal. And when the varṇa is working perfectly, then we give them āśrama. Varṇāśrama. That is later on.

Hṛdayānanda: First they should be taught a skill.

Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all, the whole society must be divided into four varṇas. Otherwise, there will be chaotic condition. That is what is the position now. What is he, what he has to do, one does not know. And there are so many unemployment. But if you organize the society into varṇas, there will be no question of unemployment.

Room Conversation -- March 16, 1974, Vrndavana:

Harikeśa: So all of my activities, unless they are directly following your order, are more or less a concoction of my mind.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...office, you cannot contact the proprietor directly. There are subordinate officers. Through them you have to take the proprietor's help. The office master is there. You have to satisfy the office master. You cannot directly approach the proprietor. If you satisfy the office master, then your promotion and other things is all right. But if you want to... I have got practical experience. One of my friend, he was working in office. So the proprietor was there and many other employees were there. So that my friend, he suggested something to the proprietor, and the proprietor immediately dismissed him: "Oh, this man want to suggest me. Dismiss immediately. Give him his pay he will require." In that I have got practical experience. He later on became so sorry. Now it is the process. So this is practical. We should not try to approach directly Kṛṣṇa. That is not the right way. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, gopī-bhartuḥ pada-kamalayor dāsa-dāsa-dāsānudāsaḥ: (CC Madhya 13.80) "I am the servant of the servant of." So you have to serve your immediate master, dāsa-dāsānudāsaḥ, servant of the Supreme Lord. If you want to jump over the original master, that is not good. Then you will be dismissed like, like my friend.

Morning Walk -- April 7, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So who will take dowry like this? (laughing) And how many? Four hundred elephants. Who can maintain four hundred elephants? Nowadays horses and elephants are not selling because nobody can maintain. Yes.

Yaśomatīnandana: Only the zoos.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...animal-eaters, later on, they will not find animals to eat. They will eat themselves. Because animals are not being maintained, they may be, according to Darwin's theory, extinct.

Satsvarūpa: In the US and everywhere they maintain them just for slaughter. So will that dwindle out?

Prabhupāda: Yes, slaughtering, slaughtering. When there will be no more, where this question of slaughtering?

Yaśomatīnandana: Yes. When there are no more animals, where will reproduce?

Prabhupāda: They maintain elephant also for slaughtering?

Satsvarūpa: No.

Morning Walk -- April 7, 1974, Bombay:

Satsvarūpa: What about programs at schools and colleges?

Prabhupāda: Because they are innocent. The children, they are innocent. So if possible, give them some enlightenment, kṛpā, to become merciful upon them. So far children are concerned, they hear, they try to learn. Just like in Dallas, whatever we say, they accept. They do not protest. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Then?

Girirāja: "Vasudeva thought of his wife as follows: 'For the present let me save the life of Devakī and later on, if there are children, I shall see how to save them.' He further thought..."

Prabhupāda: This is the consideration. By policy if he could save his wife, that first. He was following like that...

Girirāja: " 'If in the future I get a child who can kill Kaṁsa, just as Kaṁsa is thinking, then both Devakī and the child will be saved, because the law of providence is inconceivable. But now someway or other let me save the life of Devakī.' " (break)

Prabhupāda: ...jumps. In the village also there is experience, when there is fire, it jumps over another house, leaving one house in the middle.

Morning Walk -- April 16, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Her mother sent him to become a śūdra. So he had to correct it again, but he is fortunate enough that he has come forward to correct himself. That is...

Yaśomatī-nandana: My question is Prabhupāda, that these boys and cows are viṣṇu-tattvas. They are not jīvas.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, viṣṇu-tattva, certainly. That will be explained later on. They...

Dr. Patel: Even jīva-tattva is part of viṣṇu-tattva. Everything comes from Viṣṇu.

Prabhupāda: No. (break) ...between viṣṇu-tattva and jīva-tattva...

Dr. Patel: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: Viṣṇu-tattva. They are viṣṇu-tattva. They are the spirit soul, they are varieties. Mamaivāṁśa. Just like aṁśa. Suppose if you break one brick, some fragments come out. All the fragments are not of the same size. There are different size. Similarly, although all the living entities are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, their constitution of impotence are different. (break) There are divisions, divisions, subdivisions. Yes.

Press Conference -- April 18, 1974, Hyderabad:

rabhupāda: Vision of God you can see also. Here is vision of God.

Guest (1): In the sense of seeing the Lord in their own heart?

Prabhupāda: No, no. That is, of course, later on. First of all see here is God, vision of God. Everyone can see. It is public. Why you ask my disciples? You can see also. No, no. That like, vision of God, here is Kṛṣṇa.

Guest (1): That is physical vision.

Prabhupāda: That's all. Physical means vision; your vision is also physical. Your vision is not spiritual. Whatever you see with your eyes, that is physical. That is not anything beyond physical.

Guest (1): See with spiritual eyes.

Prabhupāda: Spiritual eyes, that's all right. But first of all you have to see whatever eyes you have got. You have got physical eyes. Why you are talking of spiritual eyes?

Morning Walk -- April 20, 1974, Hyderabad:

Satsvarūpa: Some devotees have it as a chronic condition, though.

Prabhupāda: Then he is animal.

Satsvarūpa: But still, he's doing lots of good devotional service.

Pañcadraviḍa: He may even be manager.

Prabhupāda: Then they will get some chance later on. What is that devotee, if you do not follow the regulative principles? The business is that if one day you cannot, but finish. The next day you must finish. Now, for eating, he is very eager, and for sleeping, he is very eager, and for finishing chanting, he has no eagerness. Then he is animal. It is simply an excuse. Yesterday you had no time? You were very busy? All right. Today you forget your sleeping and eating. Finish it. That is wanted. (break) And only for chanting, you have no time. This is not allowed. This is not allowed. This is cheating, that "I am so busy."

Pañcadraviḍa: Most of these devotees in Hyderabad, they are chanting twenty-five rounds a day or more.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. If you can chant more, that is good.

Interview with Minister -- April 26, 1974, Tirupati:

Minister: That is by (Hindi).

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) Therefore there must be side by side propaganda who can maintain the temples. (Hindi) Oh, this is anna-prasāda, so I will take later on. (Hindi) That temple is being constructed under whose supervision?

Minister: That Ganapati Sthapati, in our state.

Indian man: Sthapati is a temple engineer. He will lay out the plans as per the (indistinct) śāstra and as per the rules laid down for the construction all temples in India. No other (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: He has gone there? No.

Indian man: Once he had been to New York. They are now preparing all these idols, etc. They will be sent by sea.

Prabhupāda: So what Deity will be installed there?

Indian man: Lord Veṅkaṭeśvara, Subrahmaṇiya-sat(?) Swami, Gaṇapati, Vighneśvara.

Minister: And Pancai Tattva.

Prabhupāda: Pancai?

Morning Walk Excerpts -- May 1, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: That is the point Śukadeva comes.

Prabhupāda: No, Śukadeva later on came.

Dr. Patel: Yes, after that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So we should be always engaged in Kṛṣṇa-kathā. Oh, danger is always there. This is a place...

Dr. Patel: You must act like Parīkṣit.

Prabhupāda: You don't care for danger. You go on chanting. That's all. Padaṁ padaṁ yad vipadām (SB 10.14.58). This is a place where padaṁ padaṁ vipadām: every step there is danger. How much dangerous position you'll save? Better go on chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. That's all.

Passerby: Hare Kṛṣṇa!

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...and some European, one European was coming. So as soon as we face to face, so I had to get down. They forced me.

Morning Walk -- May 9, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: No, no, but even for Vaiṣṇavas, sāṅkhya...

Prabhupāda: Sāṅkhya is required, but the cause of sāṅkhya must be understood, cause of all causes. Sāṅkhya philosophy is our philosophy, Vaiṣṇava, because it was enunciated by Kapiladeva. Later on, the atheist sāṅkhya, they wiped out God. (break) Na brahmā na rudra ca. These are the Vedic mantras. (break) Koṭi-brahmāṇḍa-vigraha. Koṭi-brahmāṇḍa-vigraha. Innumerable universes are there in the body of Kṛṣṇa. (break)

Dr. Patel: Now they are not... The government is telling lies, that some people have come to work, and they have... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...bindu sama, suta mitā ramaṇī samāje, sohe viṣere mana, tahe samarpala, ābrahma yuga hobo kono kāj.(?) This is Vidyāpati's song, that "We are seeking water in the desert." Taṭala saikata. Saikata, means the sandy beach and very hot. So then water is required. But we get little water. What is that? Suta mitā ramaṇī samāje. In the society, friendship and love, we are seeking that happiness, and it is exactly like seeking water in the desert. Although there is little happiness, but what is the comparison? Vāri bindu sama. I want water, but it is a drop of water. Vāri bindu. Hare Kṛṣṇa. So when there is requisition of water like seas and ocean, what this one drop will do? He admits there is little happiness, but this happiness is nothing that we want in comparison. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Taṭala saikata, vāri bindu sama, suta mitā ramaṇī samāje, tahe viṣere mana, tahe samarpala, havana yughamala na kāj. Mādhava āmāra pari nama nirasa (?): "Therefore, my Lord Kṛṣṇa, I see my future is hopeless, and therefore I surrender unto You. There is no other way." Mādhava āmāra pari nama nirasa, tuhu jagad taraṇa, dīna dayāla, ataeva tohari varosa (?), that "I have no other hope. Simply hope you are." Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...is better, the breathing air.

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

O'Grady: Incredible. What about in Rome? What kind of... Do you think they're going... Well, they're asking about problems with the police and getting (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: That problem is everywhere.

O'Grady: Everywhere.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Police sometimes harass us, and they become later on tired and do not do anything. (chuckles) Arresting, arresting, they become tired.

O'Grady: They become tired.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

O'Grady: The system gives up. That's a marvelous solution. Because I feel very tired with the system myself. So there's something wrong with the system as being. So maybe you can give me some advice how to beat the system. Because I assure you, here in Rome...

Prabhupāda: But you Irish people, you are never tired to fight. (laughter)

Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: Historic.

Dhanañjaya: Not historical, more philosophical. And he writes many papers for the Catholic Church, for the Vatican.

Prabhupāda: I was also student of philosophy in 1916 to 20 under professor Dr. W.S. Urquhart in Calcutta, Scottish Churches' College. He was my professor. Later on, he became vice chancellor, very big philosopher. We read Dr. Stephens Metaphysics. What is your special subject for study?

Richard Webster: Well, it's rather difficult to say. I suppose medieval philosophy.

Prabhupāda: Medieval.

Richard Webster: From a modern point of view.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Richard Webster: From a modern point of view.

Prabhupāda: Modern.

Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome:

Richard Webster: Well, may I ask a question? I find in medieval European philosophy two different attitudes and..., which I find difficult to reconcile perfectly. That is to say the earlier Christians, up to the thirteenth Century, I suppose, were practically only thinking about God, nothing else but God so that nature or the human being, or any... everything else, tended to disappear altogether as also in some Indian philosophy, I think. And then, later on, with more modern science and so on you've got a different attitude in the Christians themselves, that is to say an attitude of acceptance towards subordinate things so that they became independent and finally, of course, broke away altogether so that nowadays we have science without God at all. But there was a sort of period in the late middle ages when St. Thomas Aquinas, who stopped thinking about God, only about God, and gave his attention to science, so they say. Well, there was a sort of conflict there. I don't quite know what to say about it whether I'm on one side or the other. That is to say if I were to (indistinct) the earlier Christian or (indistinct) There was Aquinas, for instance, who was a saint, but he would pray into the world, if you like. I wondered whether you would disapprove of that or...

Prabhupāda: Yes, these different types of philosophers are always there, not only in the medieval age, in the previously also. It is said, na cāsāv ṛṣir yasya mataṁ na bhinnam. "A philosopher is not a philosopher if he does not present a different view." (laughter) This is stated in the Bhāgavata. Tarko 'pratiṣṭhaḥ śrutayo vibhinnaḥ (?). Tarka, by argument, logic, you cannot come to the right conclusion because you may be a good logician and then you meet another logician who is better than you. So his arguments may be stronger than your argument. Therefore, simply by arguments or logical premises, you cannot approach the Absolute Truth.

Morning Walk at Villa Borghese -- May 26, 1974, Rome:

Yogeśvara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, can we take a picture here please?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Kirāta-hūṇāndhra-pulinda-pulkaśā ābhīra-śumbhā yavanāḥ khasādayaḥ (SB 2.4.18). So the Kirātas, they were always slaves of the Āryans. The Āryan people used to keep slaves, but they were treating slaves very nicely. Later on it degraded. Otherwise, slaves were kept just like family members.

Bhagavān: They had no resentment.

Prabhupāda: No, they were very happy. Just like you keep a dog. It is slave but it is very happy under the protection of good master.

Bhagavān: Actually, they like to work hard.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they like to work hard and they want good protection. That is their happiness. Even still in Africa, the servants, domestic servants, Africans, I have seen in Indian family, they are very happy. They are very happy, and the master also takes care of them. They want to eat sumptuously, and that's all. They have no other ambition. They don't want any motorcar or like this, no. And they work very nicely, domestic work, very clean. But sometimes they steal. That is their habit. My father used to say, "If you do not allow the servants to steal, so don't keep." Don't keep servants. "A servant who does not steal, he is not a gentleman. He must steal."

Room Conversation with Monsieur Roost, Hatha-yogi -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Śabdād anāvṛttiḥ. In the Vedānta-sūtra there is, "By hearing the sound, one becomes immortal." So...

M. Roost: It's like japa-yoga.

Prabhupāda: That is later. That is later on. For beginning you have simply to give submissive aural reception. That is the first beginning. Sthāne sthitāḥ śruti-gatāṁ tanu-vāṅ-manobhiḥ. Our process is jñāne prayāsam udapāsya. I know something or I can know the Supreme by my knowledge. As I am something, I am very important, our process is to forget this first of all. This is called humbleness, submissive. Generally, the jñānīs, yogis, they are thinking that they can do something by their own endeavor. Our process is different, that "I am limited. My endeavor is limited. My knowledge is limited. So I cannot realize the unlimited by these limited resources." This is our first submission, jñāne prayāsam udapāsya, that "I am limited; I am not unlimited." That's a fact. So how can I know the unlimited by my limited activities? This is our first submissiveness. Just like in the Vedic literature it is stated that Mahā-Viṣṇu, the plenary expansion of Govinda, from His breathing innumerable universes are coming and going. Yasyaika-niśvasita-kālam athāvalambya jīvanti loma-vilajā jagad-aṇḍa-nāthāḥ (Bs. 5.48). So we cannot conceive even of this universe. And innumerable universes are coming and going during the breathing period of Mahā-Viṣṇu. And that Mahā-Viṣṇu is the plenary expansion of Govinda. So this is the position of Govinda. So therefore our process is not to try by our limited endeavor to understand the unlimited. This is our first proposal. Better be submissive and hear from the Lord or from the representative of the Lord about Him. Jñāne prayāsam udapāsya namanta eva. Call Nitāi.

Room Conversation with Prof. Regamay, Professor of Sanskrit at the University of Lausanne -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Ahiṁsā, because at that time people were killing animals in the name of yajña. Just like in the Christian world the order is not to kill, but still, they are killing. So this misuse of scriptural injunction is always going on. A class of men there are who abuse the scriptural injunctions and go on with their own motive. So there was a period when people, under the protection of Vedas... Because Vedas, animal sacrifice is recommended for certain purpose, to test the proper chanting of Vedic mantras. The animal was not killed. The animal was put into the fire. Then again it would come out with new life. That is the proper chanting of the Vedic mantras. So for that purpose, animal sacrifice... Just like in biological laboratories, they experiment on the body of animals, frogs, guinea pigs. Similarly, a similar experiment was made, how the Vedic mantra is being properly chanted. The test was that animal should be put into the fire, and if the Vedic mantras were properly being chanted, then that animal would come with a new body. So an old cow or bull was put and he would come with fresh body. That was the purpose. Now later on, they began to eat meat by so-called animal sacrifice. In that period Lord Buddha appeared. About him it is, description is there, sadaya-hṛdaya darśita-paśu-ghātam. The Lord became compassionate on the animals, as they were being killed unnecessarily.

Morning Walk -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Yogeśvara: Their program is that if a child's problems come from the wrong kind of conditioning, then he should be given the opportunity in childhood of a good family, good education, and so on, and that way there won't be bad reaction later on in life.

Prabhupāda: That means he should be given chance for better conditioning. Conditioning must go on. It cannot be said that "Let the child be given freedom." No.

Yogeśvara: Yeah, that's what they say. They say it's freedom when there is a lack of bad conditioning.

Prabhupāda: That is... Bad condition is good conditioning. Where is freedom? From bad conditioning you are suggesting good conditioning. That is not freedom. Just like you are in the prison house, you are badly conditioned, but the so-called freedom—you are still conditioned under the laws of the state. You are not free. But from bad conditioning to good conditioning. And if you obey the state laws, then you are good citizen. But you are conditioned. How you think of freedom? That is your foolishness. Just like a servant. He is in some mercantile firm. He is trying to seek out some government service. But he cannot be free.

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Not Giridhārī. That is later.

Devotee: Rādhā-Gopīnātha.

Prabhupāda: Gopīnātha, yes. So Gopīnātha temple, Madana-Mohana temple, Rādhā-Dāmodara temple, Śyāmasundara and Gokulānanda, Gokulānanda. These are old seven temples. Later on, other big, big temples. Raṅganātha temple and Gaekwad (?) temple, like that, Jaipur temple. They came into existence. But there are five thousand temples in Vṛndāvana's city, municipal area. Practically each house is a temple. In every house there is Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa Deity and being worshiped by some devotees. The Ārya-samājī movement... You know something about Ārya-samāja?

Professor La Combe: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Dayananda Sarasvati, he made vigorous propaganda against temple worship. Nobody cared. (laughs) Nobody...

Professor La Combe: Even now, nowadays, now they are...

Prabhupāda: No, their influence is gone, Ārya-samāja.

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Because the church could not help them in understanding God. The Christian church has no idea what is God. Therefore there is no name of God. Actually, they have no idea about God. Is there?

Devotee: I was raised up a very strict Catholic, going through Catholic school till I was fifteen years old, but I could not... They were trying to teach love of God, but I could not see that they were also loving God. Even the head priest, he was found having illicit sex relationships with one of the young nuns, and she became pregnant by that and he had to leave. They quietly sent him away without anybody knowing, but later on it came out.

Prabhupāda: That is going on everywhere.

Devotee: And I saw, "What is the point? They are not even loving God." They were teaching loving God, but I could not see it.

Prabhupāda: He said that Vivekananda was doing that. You said? Just tell him.

Nitāi: That once I met a little old lady on the streets of Denver when I was distributing books.

Prabhupāda: Old lady.

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Nitāi:

na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ

prapadyante narādhamāḥ

māyayāpahṛta-jñānā

āsuraṁ bhāvam āśritāḥ

(BG 7.15)

"Those miscreants who are grossly foolish, lowest amongst mankind, whose knowledge is stolen by illusion and who partake of the atheistic nature of demons do not surrender unto Me." It is said in the Bhagavad-gītā that simply by surrendering oneself unto the lotus feet of the Supreme Personality Kṛṣṇa, one can surmount the stringent laws of material nature. At this point a question rises. How is it that educated philosophers, scientists, businessmen, administrators and all the leaders of ordinary men do not surrender unto the lotus... (break) ...Manu, Vyāsa, Devala, Asita, Janaka, Prahlāda, Bali, and later on, Madhvācārya, Rāmānujācārya, Śrī Caitanya and many others who are faithful philosophers, politicians, educators, and scientists etc. surrendered unto the lotus feet of the Supreme Person, the all-powerful authority. Those who are not actually philosophers, scientists, educators, administrators, etc., but who pose themselves as such for material gain, do not accept the plan or path of the Supreme Lord. They have no idea of God. They simply manufacture their own worldly plans and consequently complicate the problems of material..."

Prabhupāda: Everyone comes, they say, "Why people are suffering?" They are concerned with the people suffering. Actually not. That is a plea only, as if he has taken the task of minimizing the suffering of humanity. He poses himself as very philanthropist. Actually, he cannot do anything.

Room Conversation with devotees about Twelfth Canto Kali-yuga, and Conversation with Guest -- June 15, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: That is... When we pray, offer pray, it is stated that that is his, one of the qualifications. Sada... Nindasi. Nindasi yajña-vidher. The animal sacrifice is recommended... Some of the sacrifices or all of them... So that animal sacrifice was not meant for eating. Just to give them new, rejuvenated life by the Vedic mantras, to test that whether Vedic mantras are being chanted properly. And because at the Kali-yuga there is no such expert brāhmaṇa, all sacrifices are forbidden. So later on, as they deteriorated, they began to offer sacrifices, and if anyone wants to stop it, they will say, "Oh, it is recommended in the Vedas." Just like these rascals, Christian: "Oh, Christ ate fish. Therefore we must maintain slaughterhouse." Just see how rascal they are. Supposing Christ ate somewhere fish. Therefore they would maintain regularly slaughterhouse of cows. This is their brain.

Morning Walk -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Haṁsadūta: No.

Prabhupāda: And why people do not take it?

Haṁsadūta: They are just foolish.

Prabhupāda: If by following these five principles one can be saved from all problems of life... Still, people will not take it. Just see, strong māyā. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). (break) What was the later on talk?

Haṁsadūta: With her? She just left. But the other old lady, who was appreciating your movement, she was singing and dancing all night. She was incredible. Singing and dancing and playing karatālas.

Prabhupāda: At present Christian religion is made easy. Christian religion made easy. What is that? Now, first of all Christ has taken out contract that "You go on committing all sinful life. I am guaranteeing you will be saved." Is it not?

Haṁsadūta: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Or...? What is that?

Satsvarūpa: Yes.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: So he was thinking in terms of designations, that "I am... I belong to the same family. The other side, they are my cousin-brothers. They belong to the same family. So why shall I fight? Let them enjoy." From material point of view it is very good man. But Kṛṣṇa condemned him. Aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādān: (BG 2.11) "You are talking very high words, but you are fool number one." That is the first, because he was talking on the platform of this bodily concept of life. But after hearing Bhagavad-gītā, when he understood that "I am not this body; I am eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa. My duty is to obey the orders of Kṛṣṇa," then he fought. Superficially, he remained the same soldier. But in the beginning he was a soldier for his designation of this body, and later on, he became a soldier to carry out the order of the Supreme. That is the difference. So when we act to carry out the orders of the Supreme, that is self-realization, not for this body.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 4, 1975, Hawaii:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Oh, yes, it was packed.

Kīrtanānanda: Packed every night, seventy-five, eighty people. (break)

Jayatīrtha: I went to that New York storefront first of all, and I was a Māyāvā... Well, I was a rascal. So they called me a rascal, so I became very offended. (laughs) Later on, I saw that they were right.

Prabhupāda: And you called them rascal? No.

Jayatīrtha: No. I knew that they were not rascals. They looked very pure. I just left. (break)

Prabhupāda: The sunshine has covered 93,000,000 miles all round, so the sunshine is big or the sun is big?

Kīrtanānanda: The potency is in the sun.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore Kṛṣṇa is big, not the Brahmān. And within the sun globe there is sun-god, Vivasvān. They do not know all these. They think the sunshine is the...

Room Conversation with Woman Sanskrit Professor -- February 13, 1975, Mexico:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Professor: I heard that you were a chemist before.

Prabhupāda: I was not chemist, but I was manager in a big chemical factory. Therefore, automatically, I learned something of chemist. And later on I started my own chemical factory.

Professor: You were belonging to Bengal?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Professor: And you were having also a guru there?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, certainly. Without guru how can you...

Professor: Yes, naturally.

Prabhupāda: He is my guru. Show the photo.

Devotee: It's just above you, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. He is my guru.

Room Conversation with Metaphysics Society -- February 21, 1975, Caracas:

Guest (Hṛdayānanda): He is saying that you have said that we have a material body and also a spiritual body. So he wants to know if the spirit and matter are born simultaneously or if the matter is born, the material body is born, and later the spirit comes.

Prabhupāda: No, from spirit the matter has come out. Just like God said, "Let there be creation." So God was there and creation later on. So God is spirit and creation is matter.

Guest (Hṛdayānanda): He has understood from what he thinks is Indian philosophy that you cannot give God a name because that would be limiting God.

Prabhupāda: No, you don't give God name. But God is named by His action. Just like Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa means all-attractive. Kṛṣṇa means all-attractive. That is the quality of God, that He is all-attractive. Similarly, Allah. Allah means "the great." So God is great; therefore He is called Allah. So actually God has no name, but according to His action, He has name. That's all right. You can...

Guest (Hṛdayānanda): He thanks you very much, and he considers it a great privilege to have been here today.

Prabhupāda: Thank you for your coming here. (end)

Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Guest (1): The number of cells that he comes equipped with is less than the normal and number of enzymes that must be equipped in certain proportions do not come in the right proportion so that the later functioning is not to the mark. Therefore full and cognitive ability is very much affected. So what we are trying to do is—hopefully in the next five years we can do it—is to define a critical period. We do not know yet what is a critical period. We are talking of a very large time, large span of time, but most probably it is only a few months period in which if the baby is supplied very well, at least then our system will not be affected. His body may be affected. By the lunch program in a school they have been able to improve very much the physical characteristics of the body but if the mental mischief has been done, it is done. It cannot be corrected later on. So...

Prabhupāda: No, now this killing of the babies are going on.

Guest (1): You mean abortions.

Prabhupāda: Yes, and not abortion, killing, regular killing. Sometimes they kill, the doctors. So it is going to be supported, like that, scientific research?

Room Conversation with Tripurari -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: When you were with Maharishi? Come here.

Doug: I joined the Maharishi in 1969, and at that time I was living in Washington, D.C. And his national director came, gave a lecture, and they said that they needed some help because they didn't have a center there. So I organized the movement out of my parents' house. I had the center, and I established lectures at all the colleges and started the movement there. And later on, they finally sent some full-time teachers, and they established a center there. And then I started to be with Maharishi and his different courses and doing extensive meditations for long periods of time. And then eventually he formed a committee. This was in 1971-72. He started to form a college called M.I.U., Maharishi International University. And he started to invite educators, and he wanted to... And he also had this...

Prabhupāda: "M.I.U." means Maharishi...?

Doug: Maharishi International University. And so he started to formulate a curriculum. He was trying to present Vedic studies in Western terms. And so he formed this council of the executive called his executive council. It was called The 108. It didn't have 108 people, but this was what he called us.

Prabhupāda: One hundred...?

Doug: The 108. He called it The 108, but the official term was the executive council. And that's what I was with...

Prabhupāda: How many students are there?

Doug: How many students do his meditation?

Prabhupāda: No, the university?

Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- March 13, 1975, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Yes, we are in trouble. Even last war, when the trouble was too much, they began to go to the church. Even Churchill. And one gentleman—he is my Godbrother in Germany—he told me, after this war many German men and women became atheist. Everyone went to the church and prayed. Especially women prayed for return of their husband, brother, father. And nobody returned. So they thought, "There is no God. So forget about all these things." People became atheist. So this risky civilization is going on. They don't want to know what is God, neither they want to satisfy Him. And our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is just the opposite, that "Here is God. You satisfy Him." That's all. "Never mind what you are, but by your occupational duty you satisfy Him. That is perfection." This is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. And this is taught in the Bhagavad-gītā. Kṛṣṇa ultimately said this: sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). In the beginning He said, yat karoṣi yat juhoṣi yad aśnāsi yat tapasyasi kuruṣva tad mad arpaṇam: (BG 9.27) "Do it for Me." Yat karoṣi. It doesn't matter what you are doing. And very good work or bad work or anything, when He says, yat karoṣi, means "Whatever you are doing, do it, but the result give Me." Kuruṣva tad mad-arpaṇam. This is His desire. And at last again He said that sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja. This is the instruction of Bhagavad-gītā, and if somebody would say that "Simply I have to satisfy You? Then I have to satisfy others also. If I do not do, then I will be sinful," that, Kṛṣṇa says, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi mā śucaḥ: (BG 18.66) "Don't worry. If there is any reaction, not doing other duty, simply to surrender to Me, and if there is sinful reaction, then I'll give you protection. Don't worry." This is the conclusion. And we are presenting Bhagavad-gītā as it is, that's all, without any malinterpretation. Everyone is interpreting in his own way. But we are not interpreting. We are presenting Bhagavad-gītā as it is. And it is becoming effective. Bhagavad-gītā was studied in the Western countries since a long time, since seventeenth century—but not like this. Before me, many swamis, yogis, they came to the Western countries, and most of them spoke on Bhagavad-gītā, but not a single person was a devotee of Kṛṣṇa. But now they are becoming by hundreds because the Bhagavad-gītā is presented as it is. This is the comparison. We have got Christians, Mohammedans, then Buddhist, Africans. Everyone we have got in our society, all very devout executor of our mission. Now here is Mr. Attar. Now he is Atreya Ṛṣi. Whatever he is earning, he is spending for Kṛṣṇa. Saṁsiddhiḥ hari-toṣaṇam. He is trying to satisfy Kṛṣṇa. That is wanted. So in the dictionary it is stated, "Kṛṣṇa is a Hindu god." He is not a Hindu god; He is God. But He appeared in India. He remained in the Vedic culture. Lord Buddha was also Hindu. And he was in Vedic culture. Later on he spread his own mission. That is also Hindu culture, ahiṁsā, nonviolence. Lord Buddha... keśava dhṛta-buddha. The same Kṛṣṇa, His powerful avatāra, Lord Buddha. Keśava dhṛta-buddha-śarīra jaya jagadīśa hare.

Room Conversation with Canadian Ambassador to Iran -- March 13, 1975, Iran:

Prabhupāda: So when that cooperation was withdrawn, naturally they could not... They were trying to the last point, but when the Subhas Bose's organization, INA... You have studied that Indian history. Yes. INA. Indian National Army. So this National Army was formed by Subhas Candra Bose outside India with the cooperation of Hitler and Tojo. He's formed that, what is called, Indian government outside India, the INA, the soldiers... The INA soldiers means all the soldiers that were arrested in the battlefield, they were given to Subhas Candra Bose, either by the Japanese or by the Germans. So the soldiers took this opportunity; they voluntarily surrendered to the enemy. So when the Britishers understood that the soldiers, Indian soldiers, are now noncooperating, then they decided, "No, no more. It is not possible." So they voluntarily withdrew, that Sir Sirpiting(?) Lawrence, the secretary of state for India. Then they voluntarily settled up. And they settled up means the last parting kick was partition-Pakistan and India. And they partitioned in such a way that these two people will fight everlong. That is going on. They are very good politicians. So after all, it is all... There is a verse in the Bhagavad-gītā:

sarvasya cāhaṁ hṛdi sanniviṣṭo

mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca

vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyaṁ

vedānta-vid vedānta-kṛd ca aham

(BG 15.15)

Kṛṣṇa said that "I am in everyone's heart." Sarvasya. Sarvasya ca aham hṛdi. Hṛdi means the heart. Sanniviṣṭaḥ: "I am there." So He is witnessing everything. So Britishers would have been... They were accepted by the Indians very nicely. People liked, because after the Mohammedan period, when the Britishers came, they did something which was very, very nice for the Indians, and the Indians, they liked them very much. Later on, they became too much greedy. For their own men they wanted to sacrifice everything Indian. So that Jalianwala-bagh. Then the Gandhi came and took this vow that "The Britishers must go, quit India." So Britishers got a very good opportunity for world unity under British Empire. But their only policy was that to exploit others and enrich London. That was their bad policy, yes. They should have ruled for the benefit of the people. Then British rule was very nice.

Morning Walk -- March 15, 1975, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: The sacrifice means the animal slaughter has to be done in the mosque, is it not?

Devotee: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Devotee: It has to be made under special conditions. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...later on they turned into Vaiṣṇavas. (break) Young preachers, hopeless (break) ...real thing and people follow then everything is possible.

Devotee: Yes, then you can rule the world.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break)...combined together it is very pleasing. (break) Eh?

Devotee: Tehran used to be very beautiful before there were so many cars. Very clean, very clear. The land, and when I was a child the land was very cheap here. So, now it is very, very expensive and very polluted with cars.

Prabhupāda: Due to the cars?

Devotee: Yes.

Devotee: Everyone was a farmer, now everyone is a factory worker.

Devotee: Yes. It was very nice, very clear and very nice.

Prabhupāda: Again, let them become farmers.

Conversation with the GBC -- March 27, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: I am giving you the appointment. Do it.

Haṁsadūta: We can consult with him later.

Jayatīrtha: So we'll discuss it and try to find out the details...

Atreya Ṛṣi: Put it in the agenda, this membership plan, immediately.

Jayatīrtha: ...later on

Prabhupāda: These complaints are not at all good. They have become very serious. Complaint must be stopped. Why they are...? Now print cheap edition here and give them books. Sell also.

Rūpānuga: They cannot accuse of being cheating.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Rūpānuga: They cannot accuse us of cheating them.

Prabhupāda: It is not good at all. Why there is complaint?

Jagadīśa: So make the agenda.

Jayatīrtha: I have nine points on the agenda so far.

Jagadīśa: What is it?

Jayatīrtha: The...

Prabhupāda: Just like Śyāmasundara. He was appointed the BBT member. And what he is doing?

Jayatīrtha: There's been a very high attrition rate on GBC...

Conversation with Devotees -- March 31, 1975, Mayapur:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That is a big... That's the reason. It's a big mistake. I had a discussion with one man. So I was stating that Mādhavendra Purī found this Deity, Gopāla, but their teaching is that Vallabhācārya found the Deity. I said, "No, Mādhavendra Purī handed the Deity over later on for worship, but it was he who found the Deity and originated the worship on Govardhana, and all the villagers..."

Prabhupāda: It has been confirmed in the court that this Deity belongs to Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇavas. There was big case amongst themselves, and the court gave judgement that "This Deity belongs to the Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇava."

Acyutānanda: Oh. When was that court case?

Prabhupāda: Say, about four, five years ago. No, about ten to fifteen years ago.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Recently.

Acyutānanda: Who represented the Gauḍīya...?

Prabhupāda: Nobody, but from the history it was found that it belonged to Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇava. That... In Delhi one lawyer is there. He knows. He told me.

Conversation with Devotees on Theology -- April 1, 1975, Mayapur:

Brahmānanda: Tamāla Kṛṣṇa is taking a bath.

Prabhupāda: So they were giving role number according to admission. So I did not know that. So my role number was 105. So I thought it very incon... "I have to sit down after one hundred students?" So I took one certificate from Dr. Karttika Chandra Bose, who became, later on, my boss. Because he was our father's friend, so "Give me one certificate in this way, that I am hard of hearing. I must be given first row seat." So he gave immediately certificate. What is that?

Śrutakīrti: Some juice.

Jagajīvana: Some juice and some watermelon, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Oh, all right. Give it.

Acyutānanda: What does theology say?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Acyutānanda: What does theology mean.

Prabhupāda: Just explain.

Room Conversation -- April 4, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Maybe that Nixon thought: "If some settlement can be done, without fighting..." Therefore he went to Russia.

Devotee (1): Yes.

Prabhupāda: Later on. He went to China also.

Bhagavān: Yes.

Prabhupāda: But they are uncompromising. The communists, they, they are staunch enemy of the capitalist. Their whole philosophy is against God and against capitalism. So if America becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious and fights, they have got strength plus God's blessing. They'll come out victorious. Fight is going on. We cannot stop. But if the American people take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness and fight with the communist, they'll come out victorious. Then the menace of communistic movement will stop. And we want that. We want that these demonic communists should be finished. The Russians, as people, they are not communists. They are not communists. A certain class. Just like in India, a certain class is communist. The mass of people is not communist. They cannot become communist. It is not possible.

Room Conversation -- April 4, 1975, Mayapur:

Devotee (1): Russia.

Prabhupāda: No. The Bangladesh, they were Bengalis. Although the whole Pakistan, including Bangladesh and the other part, West Pakistan, East Pakistan, Bangladesh... So actually, Bangladesh is bigger than West Pakistan. They should have taken the government, majority. But the West Pakistan, by force they were ruling. They are not majority. So after all, they are Bengalis, maybe Muslim. They're intelligent than these Punjabis. Punjabis, they have got bodily strength, not brain. So these Bengalis, in Mujjhamat Raman, that was his demands, that: "We are majority. Why they should govern us? We should govern over them." This is the movement. So, but they're already in power. So how to throw them out of power? So he negotiated in India, that: "You help us to separate from..." And India's interest is that Pakistan becomes weak by separation, that is India's interest. So India agreed to help them. How to help? They organized a false, er, soldiers. You know? What is called? Bahini. Mean a freedom soldier. They organized freedom soldier. And India consulted Russia. Russia was friendly, that: "We want to help Bangladesh." So they said: "Yes, you help. If there is fight, then we shall help you." This was the... So these bahini, sanan bahini, sandana bahini, or something like that, they organized, "freedom soldiers." The freedom soldier means Indian soldiers. They entered Bangladesh because East Bengal, West Bengal. And they started this freedom soldier. But this is Indian soldier. Pakistan could understand that, that where this Bangladesh will get so nice soldiers? It is Indian soldiers. So when the movement was increasing, then Pakistan was in a very precarious condition. So they wanted American help. The Americans also said: "Yes." So they got American planes, American... to crush down this Bangladesh. And the Bangladesh means Indian soldiers. So later on it was discovered. So Pakistan attacked directly India. That was to go on, increase. But when the Americans were helping, these Pakistani, the Russians also came. So it was going to be a, the same, Third World War, immediately. So Americans considered something, that: "Let us take some time." Therefore the war was stopped. Otherwise it was already started. That policy is going on.

Morning Walk -- May 7, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: Compromise, yes. There was too much strain between Hindus and Muslims, so he wanted to make a compromise. Actually there was only Vedic culture all over the world. As the things deteriorated, new systems of religion came in. Either the Sikh religion or the Christian or this religion, Muslim religion. They are, what is called, deformed type of religion. Religion is that sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ (BG 18.66). That is religion. These are later on deformed.

Gaṇeśa: So is that according to time, place and circumstance we must discriminate in our eating?

Prabhupāda: What?

Gaṇeśa: According to time, place and circumstance we must discriminate whether to eat meat, whether to eat the vegetables?

Prabhupāda: Yes, you must eat. But when good things are available, why should you eat bad things? You must be pacified.

Morning Walk -- May 8, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: Australian, that's nice. Learn this art and preach. There is good potency in your country. You are also not poverty. Kṛṣṇa says, imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). Rājarṣi means very rich, kings. He never said, "All the bungees understood it. All the wretched class understood it." He never taught. It is meant for the leaders of the society, opulent kings and leaders. It is meant for them. Poverty-stricken man cannot under... But there is no bar, there is no hindrance. But this is especially meant for the opulent person. Otherwise why Kṛṣṇa says imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ? And He instructed first to the sun-god. He is not ordinary person. He instructed later on to Arjuna. He is not ordinary person. Because one important person learns the science, he will preach it all over the earth. Caitanya Mahāprabhu has directly said they are not ordinary persons. So unless one is materially not ordinary, he cannot preach. All the Gosvāmīs, they were coming from respectable... And where Gauḍīya Maṭha came? These are third-class men, no position in their past life.

Morning Walk -- May 13, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: ...change your views victimized by these rascals. The rascals are very strong. (break) In the Sixteenth Chapter of Bhagavad-gītā it is said, pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ janā na vidur āsurāḥ. Asura. Asura, demons, demonic civilization, demonic people, they do not know what is pravṛtti and what is nivṛtti. Pravṛtti means material civilization, and nivṛtti means spiritual civilization. The modern man does not know. They are neither educated about this pravṛtti and nivṛtti. And we are speaking on nivṛtti, and all of them are in the pravṛtti. So they cannot understand. It is foreign to them. They have no idea what is spiritual life, spiritual civilization. Five thousand years ago Kṛṣṇa spoke of all these things very clearly. Later on, the things, from the beginning of Kali-yuga, the things are deteriorating, and therefore different types of religion has sprung up. The Buddhism, Christianism, Mohammedanism. They are not perfect understanding of religious principle. And gradually the number of so-called religious section are increasing. Our Mr. Nanda is presenting another religion, mānava-dharma. Everyone is manufacturing. And Vivekananda is supporting, "Yes, every type of religious system is as good." This is nonsense. Actually, they do not know what is religion.

Morning Walk -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Amogha: But all knowledge comes from the Vedas.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Greek history is about three thousand years. (break) ...During the time of Mahārāja Parīkṣit's grandson. Mahārāja Parīkṣit was the grandson of Yudhiṣṭhira, and Yudhiṣṭhira ruled over five thousand years ago. So the Yayāti... Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira's grandson is Parīkṣit. His son is Janamejaya. And his son is Yayāti. And his son started Greek and Roman Empire. So therefore the Greek history is not more than three thousand years. Mahārāja Yayāti banished his two sons to the European quarters. Mleccha-yavana. Later on they became yavana, from Vedic culture deviated. This is the history.

Amogha: He sent them there for conquering?

Prabhupāda: Huh? No. He gave him, that "You take that place."

Amogha: Oh. "This is your kingdom."

Prabhupāda: Yes. Every, all world was emperor, the Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira and the family. Sa-sāgara. Sa-sāgara means "including all the oceans." That means the whole world. There was one flag only during the time of Mahārāja Parīkṣit. And he first saw the cow-killing maybe in Africa or in Arabia. One black man was trying to kill a cow, and Mahārāja Parīkṣit was on tour, and immediately he punished him. That is Kali. The black man means Africa. Or where other place, black men?

Morning Walk -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: How, one after another, how one is born out of the... That is... How the brāhmaṇas were there, kṣatriyas were there—everything in Vedic... These Vedic mantra means the history of human society. And the origin is God, Kṛṣṇa, Nārāyaṇa. There are other mantras wherein it is stated, eko nārāyaṇa āsīt. "Only Nārāyaṇa was there." Neither Lord Śiva nor Brahmā. Later on, they came. When he first cites the mantra, vande mahā-puruṣa te caraṇāravindam, śiva-viriñci-nutam (SB 11.5.33). Śiva means Lord Śiva, and viriñci means Brahmā. All of them offer respect to Nārāyaṇa. Indian astrology was taken by the Arabians first. The one, two, three, four, five, six, these figures were taken from India, up to nine, then zero. Then you make all mathematical, arithmetical calculation.

Amogha: The Arabic numerals came from India?

Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all they took the one, two, three, four, five, six, seven...

Śrutakīrti: The Romans had a very complicated system.

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) If you write 1975 it will become so big. (laughter)

Morning Walk -- May 18, 1975, Perth:

Amogha: Predominant.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They are taking care only of this body which is—dead or alive—it is not subject matter of seriousness. I shall tell you later on.

Amogha: Excuse me.

Prabhupāda: I'll tell you later on.

Amogha: Okay.

Prabhupāda: (taking prasādam) (indistinct) But it has got some arrangement, it does not fall down.

Amogha: Yeah, well they accept that also. They say only if there is no such arrangement, then it will fall down.

Prabhupāda: That means conditional. And who makes that condition? That means ultimately you have to accept the existence of God.

Morning Walk -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: You are taking of country, but the śāstra takes of the planets, not of the country. Your idea is very crippled: country, national. But śāstra is not... There is no such thing as national. They take the whole universe as a whole. They consider from that angle of vision. These crippled ideas, "state," "national," has come later on. There was no such thing previously. One planet or universe, like that. Just like last night the girl was astonished that "How this planet can be governed by one king?" It was being actually done. And the whole universe is being governed by Brahmā, one person. So one must know how to govern.

Morning Walk -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: God is not order-supplier. Otherwise everyone is praying. Just like in the last war, everyone went to church and prayed for saving the life... mostly woman, because all men in Germany especially, everywhere, they went to the war front. So all the women, they went to the church for praying for their husband, for their brother or father. But nobody came back. And later on, they became atheist: "Oh, there is no God." Because God did not supply their order, therefore there is no God. "If God agrees to my proposal and He supplies things as I want, then there is God. Otherwise there is no God." That means God is under my condition. This is going on.

Room Conversation with Dr. Copeland, Professor of Modern Indian History -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Yes. I joined this Gandhi's.

Dr. Copeland: You did? Had you met Gandhi?

Prabhupāda: I met several times, but not as personal interview. But I liked his movement, national movement.

Dr. Copeland: Why?

Prabhupāda: Young men, everyone likes politics. (Dr. Copeland laughs) Actually, later on, I did not like. When I was mature, when I met my Guru Mahārāja, then I thought all these things bogus. It has nothing, no value. Social movement, political movement, they are simply wasting time. Real movement is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Dr. Copeland: Why do you think a large number of people followed Gandhi? Why did they like him?

Prabhupāda: Well, large number of people followed Lenin. They are not important. Neither Lenin is important, nor their follower is important. So I don't think Gandhi's followers are as many as Lenin's. So these things are not important.

Room Conversation with Dr. Copeland, Professor of Modern Indian History -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Dr. Copeland: Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: They did not elect a first-class man, and later on, they could understand. So everywhere it is going on. Vox populi, the people, are less intelligent. They do not know whom to vote. And besides that, votes can be purchased. They do purchase by paying according to the country. So what is the value of this vote?

Dr. Copeland: Um, when...

Prabhupāda: Now, what is your opinion? A third-class, fourth-class man, if they vote, do you think it has any meaning?

Dr. Copeland: Well, I don't define the people first, second, third, and fourth class like you do, obviously.

Prabhupāda: You don't find? You don't find first person...?

Dr. Copeland: Well, I'm not as willing to judge other people. I'm not willing to say whether you're first, second, or third class, just as I'm not willing to say...

Prabhupāda: No. At least, you are educationist, you are professor. According to the modern society, you are one of the first-class men. Do you think your position and the lower class man, the same?

Room Conversation with Director of Research of the Dept. of Social Welfare -- May 21, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Hmm? (break) ...is not for his own interest, for everyone's interest. That is honesty.

Director: What if he's misguided? The world changes and since that book was...

Prabhupāda: Simply because they did not follow. Just like in India, this is the character of the brāhmaṇas that later on gradually the culture was lost since the last one thousand years, because India was subjugated by foreigners. The Mohammedans, they introduced some of their culture. Then the Britishers came. They intr... everyone wants an interest. The Britishers, when British rule came, their Lord Macauley's(?) private report was that "If you want to keep them as Indian Hindu, you will never be able to rule over." So it was British government's policy to condemn everything Indian.

Director: But you said before that they didn't allow drinking, the British.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Director: It's only now that... Didn't you say before?

Prabhupāda: Yes, the British allowed. British, very carefully, because they directly did not put hands on their culture. But underground. And when they are now trained up, now they are openly doing. But the training was by the Britishers. In gentleman's society there must be drinking. This was the introduction.

Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: There was a great devotee in South India. He was a treasury officer. So he took money from the treasury and constructed very nice temple. (laughter) Yes. Later on, he was caught, and he was put into jail by the Nawab. At that time the Mohammedan king, Nawab, he saw in dream that two boys, very beautiful, they have come to the Nawab: "Sir, what money he has taken, you can take from me and release him." So the Nawab said, "If I get my money, I can release him." Then, when his dream broke, he saw the money on the floor, and nobody was there. Then he could understand that he is great devotee. He called him immediately, that "You are released, and you take this money also. Whatever you have already taken, that's all right. And now this money also you take. You spend as you like." So devotees sometimes do like that. Actually nothing is private property. That is our philosophy. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam: (ISO 1) "Everything belongs to God." That's a fact. Under the influence of māyā we are thinking that "This is my property."

Morning Walk -- May 23, 1975, Melbourne:

Śrutakīrti: No, the food. They grow food for the animals, but then they kill the animal.

Prabhupāda: Just see. They can grow food both for the animals and for human being. Instead, they are simply growing food for the animals and killing them. Tā'ra madhye jihwā ati, lobhamoy sudurmati. You sing this before taking prasādam. The tongue is the greatest enemy and greedy. Tā'ra madhye jihwā ati, lobhamoy sudurmati. For the satisfaction of the tongue they are risking their own life and committing sinful life to suffer later on. Therefore the first-class man's first duty is to śamaḥ, controlling the mind. If one can control the mind, that "If I can live with grains, food, and milk, why shall I kill the ani...?" this is controlling the mind. They cannot control even this small thing. "Live and let live,"—this policy they do not follow. "Live and kill others." "Live at the cost of others."

Australian devotee 1: Śrīla Prabhupāda, it says in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam that the weaker are the subsistence of the strong. So therefore human beings, they feel justified...

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the... but where is the human consciousness? A tiger cannot understand this. He will kill a lower animal. But you are not animal; you are man. You should have this discrimination, that "If I can live otherwise very nicely, why shall I kill animal?" That is humanity.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: If you remain unclean, all diseases will come. Where is the cure?

Harikeśa: They also have this thing where they're freezing bodies just before they die.

Prabhupāda: That is another nonsense.

Harikeśa: Later on, they will unthaw them...

Prabhupāda: Later on.

Harikeśa: ...when they find the cure and cure it.

Siddha-svarūpa: They promised that man? (laughs) So they are doing good for that person?

Prabhupāda: Everything, "Later on. Wait. Take this post-dated check." "And where is money, sir?" "Wait. You have got the check. That's all right."

Morning Walk -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: This is nudie beach?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The nude beach.

Revatīnandana: It used to be.

Bahulāśva: ...on one side

Revatīnandana: At one time they made it legal to be nude here, and then later on, they repealed the law again.

Jayatīrtha: Venice? It is still nude, Venice Beach.

Revatīnandana: Is it still? Really.

Jayatīrtha: You can either come wearing clothes or not wearing clothes to this beach.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Lucky we come early.

Sudāmā: Just like the monkeys.

Revatīnandana: Oh, it was in Laguna that they repealed it.

Prabhupāda: But why, then, the lavatory they have made distinction for woman and for men?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Now in the colleges there's no more distinction.

Morning Walk -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Indian guest: San Jose, San Francisco (Hindi), southern peninsula. (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) It is jumping of the monkeys. In my book, it was published in 1958. (Hindi conversation) I don't believe all these rascals. Otherwise, how could I write? Later on, in San Francisco some press reporter asked me, "What is your opinion?" And, "This is all foolish waste of time and money." It was published. (break) We are conditioned. We call ourself "conditioned soul." So whatever condition is made by nature or by God, you cannot overcome them. That is futile attempt. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). You cannot surpass the condition of material nature. Foolishly, you may declare very great independent. But completely under the grip of material nature. Everything, there is a process. Just like you have come to U.S.A. You have come through a process, immigration. Can anyone come here without going through the process?

Indian guest: No.

Room Conversation with Dr. John Mize -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Dharmādhyakṣa: In other words, Śrīla Prabhupāda, without practice of the method, it's very difficult to understand the philosophical concepts.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, yes. Therefore it is said that without becoming a brāhmaṇa, nobody should touch Vedas. That is a... Without becoming brāhmaṇa...

janmana jāyate śūdraḥ

saṅskarād bhaved dvijaḥ

veda-pathad bhaved vipro

brahmā jānātīti brāhmaṇaḥ

These are the different stages. Everyone is born śūdra. Śūdra means the life of lamentation. He does something and laments. This is śūdra. He does not know how to perform, but by whims he does something and laments later on. This is śūdra. And brāhmaṇa means na śocati na kāṅkṣati. He never laments, neither hankers. That is brāhmaṇa. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati, samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu (BG 18.54). Find out this verse, brahma-bhutaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati.

Room Conversation with Dr. John Mize -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Bahulāśva: Śrīla Prabhupāda, did you speak about Kant's philosophy in that book also? Yes? He is very popular.

Prabhupāda: Yes, Kant is very popular. I was also a student of philosophy. In my student life my professors were all Europeans. I was student of Scottish Church's College in Calcutta. So one professor, Dr. W.S. Urquhart, he was our professor for psychology, metaphysics. Later on, he became the vice-chancellor of Calcutta University. A very nice gentleman.

Dharmādhyakṣa: Dr. Mize finds that he's chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa a little in the shower now. When he takes a shower, he chants a little.

Prabhupāda: One press reporter in the Berkeley University in the beginning, he wrote his article and he wrote that after hearing this Hare Kṛṣṇa for a few minutes, I came home chanting all the road, "Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa." He gave this report.

Dharmādhyakṣa: I think many scholars have a hard time realizing how just by chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa...

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is so nice and so easy.

Morning Walk -- July 2, 1975, Denver:

Harikeśa: The Brahmavādīs have some possibility of advancement?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Harikeśa: What is that thing that enables them to advance?

Prabhupāda: That you will know later on. First of all try to understand this. Don't try to understand everything in a moment. That is foolishness. (break) That argument is clear?

Ambarīṣa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That if you call it a machine, how the machine can grow?

Ambarīṣa: The machine is changing at every second.

Prabhupāda: You say two things: "Growing" and "machine." So that is incomparable. Machine cannot grow.

Ambarīṣa: Jaya. (break)

Brahmānanda: ...many machines. You get another machine, another one, and another and another.

Prabhupāda: So I have changed so many machines. So death means another machine. Where is the difficulty?

Morning Walk -- July 10, 1975, Chicago:

Jayatīrtha: ...that half of the people are disqualified already because they're women. It's not so bad.

Prabhupāda: No, no, it is not bad. It is good. Now our policy should be that at Dallas we shall create first-class men, and we shall teach the girls two things. One thing is how to become chaste and faithful to their husband and how to cook nicely. If these two qualifications they have, I will take guarantee to get for them good husband. I'll personally... Yes. These two qualifications required. She must learn how to prepare first-class foodstuff, and she must learn how to become chaste and faithful to the husband. Only these two qualification required. Then her life is successful. So try to do that. (Car doors open, walk begins) Ordinary education is sufficient, ABCD. This is all nonsense, so big, big, sound education and later on become a prostitute. What is this education? (laughter) To make them prostitute, it doesn't require education. (break) Yesterday we saw in the television how these rascals are wasting time, talking nonsense. There was nothing, valuable talk. Foot... No, no, hand... What is that? Handprint? And the addicted murder? That was the case? (break) Within two weeks, two divorces.

Room Conversation with writer, Sandy Nixon -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Woman: He spoke to you spiritually?

Prabhupāda: So this is my (indistinct). That's all.

Woman: At what point was it that he told you to do this? It was very late in your life that you...?

Prabhupāda: Yes. When I was twenty-five years old I met him first. On the first meeting he ordered me to this. So at that time I was married man. I had two children. So I thought, "I shall do it later on." But I was trying to get out of family life. It took some time. But I was trying my best to carry out his order. In 1944 I started magazine, Back to Godhead, when I was gṛhastha. Then I started writing books in 1958 or '59. In this way in 1965 I came to your country.

Woman: You have said that you are very small and that you are not God, and yet it appears to me as an outsider that the devotees treat you as if you were God.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is devotee's duty. Just like a government officer. Personally he is not very important, but so long he executes government order, he should be respected as government. That is the way. Even a ordinary policeman comes, you have to respect him because he is government man. But that does not mean he is government. He is respected. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktas tathā bhāvyata eva sadbhiḥ **. If that man thinks that "I have become government. People are respecting me," then he is foolish. So... But it is the etiquette. If the government man comes, you should respect him as government.

Morning Walk -- July 17, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: That's all right. But you must know what is your father. A man's father is dead—that does not mean he can say that "I have taken my birth without father." That you cannot say. Father may be dead. That is..., we shall discuss later on. First of all you have to accept that mother cannot give birth without father. Who is that father? (break)

Bahulāśva: ...nature has generated everything on its own. Just like we say that Kṛṣṇa...

Prabhupāda: Where is that nature, generating everything? Where is that nature? Show me.

Paramahaṁsa: They give the example of the corn. Corn doesn't have to have a... They say corn produces the seeds as well as the...

Prabhupāda: Then wherefrom the corn came?

Paramahaṁsa: From itself. You see, they theorize that naturally...

Prabhupāda: Theorize, theorize. But we say corn is produced... When the seeds are thrown on the ground, then corns are produced. Wherefrom... The corn is not dropping from the sky.

Morning Walk -- July 18, 1975, San Francisco:

Bahulāśva: They create big disturbances.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...can be solved by understanding these three items: God is the proprietor; He is the enjoyer; He is friend of everyone. They are acting just the opposite way: "I am the proprietor; I am the enjoyer; I am the friend. Because I am God." This is their... Everyone is becoming friend—ultimately proves to be enemy of the country because he is not friend. President Nixon took votes by pretending friendship, and later on, he proved enemy. This is going on. Everyone knows. Gandhi pretended to become friend, but he proved to become an enemy. Otherwise why he was shot down? Unless one thought him as enemy, why he was shot down? This is going on. Nobody can become friend except Kṛṣṇa.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But a pure devotee is a friend to all.

Prabhupāda: Because he carries the message of Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is friend, and he is carrying the friendly message. Therefore he is friend. If there is a nice friend and if somebody gives information of that nice friend, he is also friend. Therefore nobody can become friend except Kṛṣṇa's representative. The material world is: "I am your enemy, and you are my enemy." This is the whole construction of the material world. So how the enemy can become friend? It is pretension, cheating.

Morning Walk -- July 21, 1975, San Francisco:

Baradrāj: So knowledge is not necessary for faith but faith is necessary for knowledge.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore devotee, without any knowledge he becomes devotee. That faith, only faith. The devotee advances. Jñānaṁ ca yad ahaitukī. Later on, they become automatically full of knowledge because they have strong faith. That is also stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Teṣām evānukampārtham aham ajñāna-jaṁ tamaḥ nāśayāmy: (BG 10.11) "Because he is faithful, therefore I help him how to get knowledge." Again you come to that. Mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca (BG 15.15). Everything is there.

Jayādvaita: Your lecture yesterday was so nice, Śrīla Prabhupāda, everything, so many ideas from Bhagavad-gītā, all explained and put together so nicely.

Paramahaṁsa: Blind faith is the belief that little...

Prabhupāda: Blind faith, without... That I have already explained. Immediately, why do you forget? He shows me, "Prabhupāda, come this way." So I have no faith. Why shall I go? Then I have stop here, finished, movement finished. So you have to keep faith blindly. And if the man who is giving direction, he is perfect, then your faith will make you advanced. But if you go to a rascal cheater and if you have faith, blind faith, then you are lost.

Morning Walk -- July 21, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: Ah. Śraddhāvān, That is required. If he has no faith, then he remains in darkness.

Devotee (6): If we save the common people by giving them prasādam, how can we save the impersonalists?

Prabhupāda: That will come later on. (break) ...ists will not come. They will never come because they do not believe in the personal feature of God. Unless very hungry, he will not come because he does not believe in prasāda, does not believe in God.

Bahulāśva: Just like yesterday those impersonalists wouldn't come on the stage. When they saw your opulent vyāsāsana and so many devotees offering your āratik, they realized if they came to the stage, they would have to sit at your feet. Therefore they wouldn't come. This one Swami Satchitananda... I have a friend who's a member of his movement. So this yogi told him that if you want to know how to receive the spiritual master you should go watch the Hare Kṛṣṇa devotees when they greet their guru at the airport... Then you will learn what is the proper way to...

Prabhupāda: Who says?

Bahulāśva: Swami Satchitananda told him that. (laughter)

Yadubara: He cannot give instruction, so he has to...

Prabhupāda: No, he was rejected. But then appealing, then he was reinstated.

Morning Walk -- July 24, 1975, Los Angeles:

Rādhāvallabha: We have also got a method of conquering death. We are planning now to freeze... When there is some illness that will cause death we will freeze the body, and when the cure for the disease is discovered we will wake it up.

Prabhupāda: That is same as death. That freezing itself is death, but the rascal does not know that it is death.

Rādhāvallabha: But later on we will thaw the body out and cure it.

Prabhupāda: "Later on," that is their post-dated check.

Paramahaṁsa: But then they say this, "In a hundred years, when we discover the cure, then we will bring you out and cure you."

Hṛdayānanda: Or eat him.

Prabhupāda: So you will never discover the cure, and he will never come out. Now somebody was saying that this freezing, the body within, they decompose. The parts of the body are separate. That is... As we have... You take the frozen vegetable. It is tasteless. It is decomposed.

Room Conversation -- July 31, 1975, New Orleans:

Nityānanda: What will stop?

Prabhupāda: The devil's workshop, without proper engagement there is devil's workshop.

Devotee: Someday I'll take, later on...

Brahmānanda: They have difficulty in understanding how all the varieties can cooperate, because they don't have the center. They don't have a center; therefore to have varieties cooperating is difficult for them to understand.

Prabhupāda: Center to please, just like we have kept these varieties of flowers, to please me.

Brahmānanda: Because you're the center.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Brahmānanda: But they have not center.

Prabhupāda: Therefore I have given center, Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation with Devotees -- August 1, 1975, New Orleans:

Prabhupāda: And all criminals.

Brahmānanda: Yes. All criminals, prostitutes, and hippies.

Prabhupāda: Because the government is paying for that, and they are now thinking that "What to do about crime?" This is rascaldom. You act in such a way, then repent later on.

Brahmānanda: There was one boy from Sweden, he was our devotee. And then he fell into māyā. He returned to Sweden. Now he's getting from the government fifty dollars a week. So he's using that money to buy drugs. So now he's completely trapped.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Brahmānanda: He gets money regularly, and he can never get out of the habit.

Prabhupāda: In your country also. One keeps a girlfriend, the girl's getting welfare, and he is purchasing drugs, and then their husband goes. I have seen. Some of our students have been. I have seen them.

Morning Walk -- September 1, 1975, Vrndavana:

Brahmānanda: In the past. They have done something in the past and now they are suffering.

Prabhupāda: "In the past" means in this life. So as soon as you do something wrong, you must suffer, either by government's laws or by nature's law.

Brahmānanda: They're thinking that "If I earn much money now, then later on in my life, everything will be very comfortable."

Prabhupāda: That's all right, but this is the fact. If you earn money by black market and if you are arrested, then your all comfort will be finished.

Aksayananda: In the Kṛṣṇa book there is one king...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Aksayananda: He says, "I worked so hard for enjoyment, but I have no time to enjoy."

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) This is going on. They do not understand that this world is meant for suffering. We have discussed little in that topic with Śyāmasundara. Just like they invented the communistic idea. Does it mean the communists are not suffering? They are suffering more. They have no liberty. They have lost their liberty, the whole people. They are so much pressed by the government that there is no liberty at all. The younger generation, they cannot go out, so much suffering. I may live even in a big house, but if you say, "You cannot go out. Then you'll be punished," that idea will be suffering—"Oh, I cannot go out."

Morning Walk -- September 9, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: They have been forced to forget Hare Kṛṣṇa by the so-called rascal leaders. Otherwise India is meant for chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, the whole India. (break) ...scandalous these Māyāvādīs and next the politicians, killing the spirit of India. These Māyāvādīs teaching "Why you are after God? You are God." That's all. And he says, "Yes, I am God. Why shall I worship God?" This is the... And becoming God, when they do not get any relish of becoming God, then the politician says, "It is all useless. Come to the political field. Take daridra-nārāyaṇa-seva. That's all, finished." The Māyāvādī creates the field of atheism, and later on, the politician make them perfect atheist.

Indian man (2): I am also building a small temple in my place here. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...bharaṇena vā. Nidrāya hṛiyate naktaṁ vyāvayena ca vā vayaḥ (SB 2.1.3). Vayaḥ means age. They are wasting their, this human form of life, duration of life, at night either by sleeping or by sex. Nidrāya hṛiyate naktraṁ vyāvayena ca vā vayaḥ. And in daytime... Divā cārthehaya rājan... In daytime—"Where is money? Where is money? Where is money?" And when he gets money, how to spend it for kuṭumbha, not for Kṛṣṇa. They get money sufficiently, and as soon as he is asked to spare some money for Kṛṣṇa, "No, the law is that I should give money to my sons. The law is." Even our devotees are saying like that. "The law is that I must give to my son, not to Kṛṣṇa."

Morning Walk -- September 15, 1975, Vrndavana:

Vāsughoṣa: Once I went to one Gauḍīya Matha in South India, and I showed them a picture of our Deities in Hyderabad. They said, "This Kṛṣṇa is white." So later on I told that story to Acyutānanda Swami, and he said, "Do you know what I tell those people? I say, 'No, Kṛṣṇa is not white. You just can't see Kṛṣṇa.' " So like that, sometimes we are criticized by them for Kṛṣṇa in the Deity being white. (break)

Hari-śauri: ...Kṛṣṇa's energy is all-spiritual, then why in Bhagavad-gītā does Kṛṣṇa make a distinction—"My separated material energy"? Why does He say, "separated"?

Prabhupāda: Separated... Just like I am talking and this will be reproduced as it is, although it is separated.

Hari-śauri: So He's not personally present there.

Prabhupāda: Yes. When you replay, the same voice will come, but I am not there. So if you want to utilize this separated energy for Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then it will help you. Just like the Deity. Everyone knows it is stone, but why we are worshiping stone?

Hari-śauri: It is Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is as good as Kṛṣṇa. It is not worshiping the stone. Huh?

Morning Walk -- September 30, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. They have become more than Śaṅkarācārya.

Dr. Patel: They have seen the...

Prabhupāda: Just like later on, the Gandhi's disciples became more than Gandhi, more than Gandhi. That's all. Gandhi planned village organization, and Jawaharlal Nehru planned industrialization. And everything failed. There is no money, and he wanted to establish industry like America.

Dr. Patel: But he did not understand economics, sir. What is money after all? Money is nothing but the labor transformed into materials. We had the huge labor of sixty crores of people. He was capable of transforming that labor into material unfortunately and...

Prabhupāda: Anyway, they changed the Gandhi's program.

Dr. Patel: That is what Gandhi understood, but he did not.

Prabhupāda: How he can understand? He wanted to utilize to become prime minister.

Morning Walk -- October 2, 1975, Mauritius:

Brahmānanda: What is the harm of being a cat or a dog?

Prabhupāda: That is later on. First of all you do not know; we know. That is the difference. If somebody knows there is government, he is better than the outlaws who don't, doesn't care for the government. He is better position, a good citizen. Who accepts that there is government is good citizen. And one who doesn't care for the government, does whimsically everything, he becomes criminal. And then he is punished. That is the difference.

Brahmānanda: So if we all became devotees there would be no punishment.

Prabhupāda: No. He'll be protected. Kṛṣṇa says, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi (BG 18.66).

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: You've given the example that the rat in the mouth of the cat and the kitten in the mouth of the cat is two different things. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...side.

Cyavana: From the hills, from these mountains. There are lakes and reservoirs and it comes down. There's a lot of rainfall on certain parts of the island all year.

Devotee (2): Śrīla Prabhupāda, you were speaking of anarthas and one of the lesser age boys was wondering... He's asking why we shouldn't take tea.

Prabhupāda: Because intoxication. You become addicted. You are asking because you cannot give up tea. Therefore you are asking. Therefore it should be given up. You become servant of tea. Otherwise there is no question of asking. His asking means you want to drink. That means he has become servant of tea. Our original position—we are servant of God. So we are going to be servant of God. So if we remain servant of this material world, we cannot become servant of God. (break) ...unnecessary are advertised and people become victimized.

Morning Walk -- October 3, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: Britishers were advertising outside India that "Indians are uncivilized. Therefore we are making them civilized. Therefore we should stay there. Don't object." Because United Nations, they were asking, "Why you are occupying India?" So they used to forward this argument, that "These people are uncivilized. We are making them civilized." (laughter) Now, how there should be Sir Jagadish Chandra Bose? Therefore they used to suppress always. Everything Indian wanted to do, they would suppress: big businesses, this mining... They would suppress. This Morarji, Sumati Morarji, her father-in-law started that... He had to face so many impediments from the Britishers to start the shipping company. Formerly there was no shipping company, Indian. Now, before that, there was shipping, not shipping company, but navigation was there from India to Rome, Greece, Turkey, there was regular business of spices and fine cloth. Later on, this large-scale shipping industry, that was done by the Europeans. So when Indian wanted to start, they would supress. The Tata iron industry, he had to face so many difficulties. Formerly, even if you wanted to bring some iron frame, it would come from Sheffield.

Morning Walk -- October 7, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is rascaldom. They'll...

Harikeśa: They say He must be a very old man. He must be very old with a big, long beard.

Prabhupāda: So that we shall consider later on. He is a man like. First of all accept that. Then whether He is old or young, we shall consider later on. First of all accept that either old or young, He is a man like, shape, form. Then we shall talk other things. Then what is the use of talking with them, with a rascal? That is the point. There is no use, talking with these rascals. Waste of time.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But there's practically no one to preach to if we don't preach to them.

Prabhupāda: They are rascals. What is the use? That is advised, prema-maitri kṛpopekṣā, four things. Preacher—there are four things for him. One thing is he should love God. He should make friendship with devotees. He should preach amongst the innocent, and he should kick on the face of the atheist. Upekṣā. "Hut! (laughter) I don't like you." That's all, no business with him. This is preacher. Preacher should love God; preacher should make friendship with devotees; preacher will preach amongst the innocent, poor; and those who are atheist, nonbeliever, kick on his face. Don't care for him. "Go away. Get out." That's all. That much mercy upon them. "Get out, rascal." But sometimes we take the risk of talking with these rascals also. That is our mercy. But according to śāstra, they are to be kicked out. They are not to be taken care of because it is waste of time.

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Tea?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Nobody would drink tea, no family. We have seen it. And for drinking, for drinking tea, drinking wine, regular propaganda was done. There was a tea taxes committee. Men these foreigners, they began to grow tea in India in the beginning for exporting to Europe and America… Later on, they began to pay some tax to the government. That was known as "tea taxes committee." The tea taxes committee, in order to popularize drinking tea, they used to hold stall, just like here in park and public places, and they would prepare very tasty tea and distribute free.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Free.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And advertise, "If you drink tea, then you will not feel very much hungry. Your health will be improved," and so on, so on. In this way they distribute pamphlet and giving free. Just like we distribute prasādam, they used to distribute very tasteful tea, and people liked it: "Oh, it is very nice." Then they began to drink. Vigorous propaganda. And culturally, in our school days they wrote… One Mr. N. Ghosh, he, bribed by the Britishers, he wrote one book, England's Work in India. So all the, just like Sati rites…

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Sati rite.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That "Later on, after the death of husband in some places the wife was forced to go to the fire, so the Britishers stopped it. And they introduced railway for going to the pilgrims and so many, and they constructed bridges to make easy to go from one country to another." And people took it very seriously, that British government is very nice. And they were publishing in outside country that "India is uncivilized. We are making them civilized. And as soon as they are civilized, then we hand over the charge to them. That is our noble mission." And they were exploiting. All raw materials was being taken away and the necessities of India, especially cloth, was being supplied. And the local weavers, their hands cut off. So many thing they, tainting… And everything bad. Just like Jawaharlal Nehru. He became a first-class victim.

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Prabhupāda: Victim of European propaganda. He used to take "Anything Indian, bad. Anything Indian, bad." Not only he. Later on, all the so-called educated persons, they took it for granted that "Whatever is done in London, that is first-class, and whatever is Indian original, that is all bad." And they controlled the native princes. So many things. It is a big history, how they killed India's original culture. And then Hindu-Muslim riots, friction, fighting between Hindus and Muslims and dividing them.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: You said that the British instigated the Muslims.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: How did they do that?

Prabhupāda: Oh, you… Nowadays you pay somebody, and he will do anything. So they appointed this Jhinna. He found that he is a very, intelligent lawyer. He was in the Congress. So there was dissension. There must be. So once this Jhinna was to be the president of the Congress, and the Patel, he frustrated. So Jhinna became angry, and at this moment the Britishers took it. He was a very intelligent barrister. So he instigated that, "You form a party, Muslim league. And whatever money is required for propaganda, we shall pay." So regular subscription was raised from all big, big British companies, mercantile, to pay him: "Whatever money, you organize the Muslims against the Hindus." And he did it.

Morning Walk -- October 28, 1975, Nairobi:

Jñāna: When they ask us about Lord Caitanya, "Who is this Lord Caitanya?" what may we tell them?

Prabhupāda: "Yes, you'll understand. Please kindly chant Hare Kṛṣṇa now. You'll understand." When we say, "Follow the instruction of Caitanya," means chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. What Caitanya said? Caitanya said, kīrtanīyaḥ sadā hariḥ: (CC Adi 17.31) "Always chant Hare Kṛṣṇa." That's all. So you'll know Caitanya, what He is, later on. For the time being, Caitanya says that you chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. You do it, and then you will be able very easily. At the present moment, simply if you want to know—I explain Caitanya—it will be not possible for you. Better chant. Take His instruction. Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa... Where they are going? To work?

Girl devotee (1): Yes.

Prabhupāda: What is the time for their joining?

Indian man (2): Between six-thirty and seven o'clock.

Prabhupāda: And how long they'll work?

Morning Walk -- November 19, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then how you will take this instruction when Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65)? If they do not take Kṛṣṇa, then how this instruction will be taken?

Girirāja: It can't be.

Brahmānanda: Well, rasa-līlā is more important than those instructions. (Prabhupāda laughs)

Yaśomatī-nandana: Actually, the real scholars of Bhagavad-gītā, they admit that later on this Bhagavad-gītā came out, which was stressing more on bhakti.

Prabhupāda: Later on.

Yaśomatī-nandana: Later on. These scholars, these mundane scholars, those who have studied Bhagavad-gītā, they accept that Bhagavad-gītā is based around bhakti principle.

Prabhupāda: So how it came later on?

Yaśomatī-nandana: That they are rascal. That they don't.

Prabhupāda: And what was the beginning?

Yaśomatī-nandana: All these Vedas and everything.

Prabhupāda: No, Bhagavad-gītā? They say, "later on."

Brahmānanda: Who was the first...

Yaśomatī-nandana: He says that it was the Vaisnavites who introduced Bhagavad-gītā.

Prabhupāda: Then why Śaṅkarācārya has accepted Bhagavad-gītā? He is not a Vaiṣṇava.

Morning Walk -- November 21, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...proposition is not migrating. That is due to increase of population. The civilization means the culture. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya.

Dr. Patel: (break) ...really spread toward the east in Indonesia and Indochina, all those places, which were again overtaken by Islam later on.

Prabhupāda: Islam is also...

Dr. Patel: History, it has spread. Even Bali Islands today are practicing Hinduism.

Brahmānanda: Aryan means change in consciousness to God consciousness.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Brahmānanda: This means all over the world there can be an Aryan culture.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is right.

Morning Walk -- November 29, 1975, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: And he said "Hare Kṛṣṇa"?

Indian devotee (1): Yes. "Hare Kṛṣṇa." He said "Hare Kṛṣṇa." And he told me that "You come later on, and we will sit and talk."

Prabhupāda: So go and sit and talk. What is his grievance?

Devotee (1): His wife is very devoted. She has a small Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa. She is... (indistinct)

Tejās: He is a very dirty man. His wife sometimes likes to give even a little flower, and she is afraid he will beat her if she gives anything to the temple.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...sign? Rāmacandra?

Tejās: Garuḍa and Hanumān.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Tejās: Rāmacandra, Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa, Garuḍa, and Hanumān.

Prabhupāda: (break) Unnecessarily there are so many parties, and they fight one another. This is democracy. Today is ekādaśī?

Tejās: Today.

Morning Walk -- November 30, 1975, Delhi:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I read in the papers yesterday that the crime rate has gone up in United States.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That must. If everyone is a criminal, so how the crime rate can decrease?

Harikeśa: Everybody cheats as much as possible, on income tax and everything.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Even President Nixon had cheated on his income tax return, but they caught him later on.

Prabhupāda: No, it is not cheating. It is... The income tax department is a cheating department, so everyone tries to avoid this cheating department. That's it.

Ambarīṣa: Yes. People hire lawyers, very expensive lawyers, just to find loopholes in their tax statements.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The cheating begins from the government. They are giving some paper and asking people, "Here is ten thousand dollars." This is cheating. "I promise to pay." But when the government is failure, where is the promise? Who pays? This is cheating.

Room Conversation -- December 14, 1975, New Delhi:

Harikesa: He says that if you renounce now, you can enjoy later. That if you take some austerity now, like meditation, abstaining from certain things, that later on you can enjoy sex life unlimitedly, have clear intelligence unlimtedly, and ultimately become the...

Prabhupāda: The Mahesh Yogi, TM. Transcendental meditation. But I don't think they say that if you undergo austerities you...

Harikesa: No, that was in the beginning they were saying...

Prabhupāda: Oh now he has changed!

Harikesa: Now he has changed, because it was too unpopular.

Prabhupāda: It is business.

Bhāgavata: Rajneesh is also like that.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Bhāgavata: Rajneesh, same philosophy.

Prabhupāda: Hm. But they do not know; na te vidu svartha-gati hi viṣṇum; these rascals they do not know what is the actual aim of life. They are, in the groups of ordinary men, they are doing some business opened this transcendental TM shop, that's all. Cheating. Cheating. All of them are are going on, cheating. Nobody knows the real interest is to go back to home, back to Godhead. Nobody knows. Ask any so-called sādhu, yogi, swami—they do not know. They read Bhagavad-gītā but they do not understand. (sic:) Yad jñātv na nivartante tad dhāma parama mama, so what do they understand, these... tyaktv deha punar janma naiti mam eti so'rjuna. They do not believe all these things, therefore they say.. Swami Chinmayananda says that whatever is necessary we shall accept; other ślokas we shall reject. This is his, this rascal's philosophy. As if Kṛṣṇa says something superfluous. They say like that. And the other day some gentleman came, "It is ficticious writing... You were present?

Haṁsadūta: Hm.

Morning Walk -- December 23, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Similarly, He likes to worship His devotee. Sometimes the father takes the child on his shoulder. Does it mean the child is more important than the father? They say the Vālmīki Rāmāyaṇa, there is no such incidence as Rāmacandra worships Śiva. It is later on, interpretation. But even if He does so, what is the wrong here?

Harikeśa: That later-on Rāmāyaṇa has caused some havoc.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Harikeśa: That later-on interpretation?

Prabhupāda: Yes, the Śaivaites, they want to make Lord Śiva the exalted Supreme Person. In South India there is good propaganda. That is always going on.

Lokanātha: When Lord Śiva says in Purāṇas that mukti-pradapaḥ sarveṣāṁ viṣṇu... (sic)

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Lokanātha: Purāṇa, the same Lord Śiva says there is no other liberated besides Viṣṇu.

Devotee: ...engagement, one devotee commented that the reason that Lord Rāma worshiped Lord Śiva was because He wanted to kill Rāvaṇa and Rāvaṇa was a devotee of Śiva, so Lord Rāma worshiped Śiva in that respect.

Prabhupāda: Hm? What is that?