Prabhupāda: ...sinful activities, fishing. Just see. Killing another animal. Beginning of life, of the day. Such a nice civilization they have created: waste of time and sinful activities.
Killing animals (Conversations, 1974-1976)
Expressions researched:
"animal"
|"animals"
|"kill"
|"killed"
|"killing"
|"kills"
Notes from the compiler:
VedaBase query: "kill* animal*"@5
Conversations and Morning Walks
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:
Prabhupāda: No, from the First Commandment it appears that they were not very enlightened because why does he say "Thou shall not kill"? That means they were killers.
Dr. Patel: They were killing. (laughs)
Prabhupāda: They were killers.
Dr. Patel: Otherwise, they would not have said, "Thou shall not kill."
Prabhupāda: Why the first commandment is there, "Thou shall not kill"? They were fighting and killing amongst themselves. Not very advanced nation. And he was horrified when he saw that the Jews were killing animals.
Dr. Patel: In the temple.
Prabhupāda: In the temple.
Morning Walk -- March 12, 1974, Vrndavana:
Prabhupāda: So much, lying vacant. They have taken it into consideration that "What is the use of working in the land? Better kill one animal and eat easily." Because he doesn't care for sinful activities. The... "If I can eat the cow, why shall I take so much trouble to till the...?" This is going on, all over the world.
Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:
Prabhupāda: Four principles essential. Essential. But only the śūdras or the kṣatriyas... Just like kṣatriyas, they have to learn how to kill. So practically, they should go to the forest and kill some animal. And if he likes, he can eat also. If he likes, he can eat also.
Hṛdayānanda: What he kills.
Prabhupāda: Yes. But not from the slaughterhouse. Those who are kṣatriyas, they can, they're allowed sometimes to eat meat. It is understood Bhīma, Bhīma also eating sometimes meat. Bhīma. Amongst the Pāṇḍavas, only Bhīma. Not others. So if the kṣatriyas, they want to eat meat, they can be allowed on particular occasions. But they must go to the forest and kill the animal. Not that for meat-eating regular slaughterhouses should be maintained. This is all nonsense, degradation. If you want to eat meat, you go to the forest. And the śūdras, they also sometimes eat meat. Or the caṇḍālas.
Hṛdayānanda: But never the cow.
Prabhupāda: No.
Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:
Prabhupāda: Four regulative principles compulsory.
Hṛdayānanda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: But if some of the kṣatriya or the śūdras, they want, so that is our prescription: "Go to the forest and kill some animal and eat that." That's all. You can kill one boar. Some disturbing elements, you can kill. You can kill some tiger. Like that. Learn to kill. No nonviolence. Learn to kill. Here also, as soon as you'll find, the kṣatriya, a thief, a rogue, unwanted element in the society, kill him. That's all. Finish. Kill him. Bās. Finished. So other will see, "Oh, the ruler is very strong." And others will... One killing will be lesson for many hundreds and thousands.
Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:
Yaduvara: How would the kṣatriyas kill the animals?
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Yaduvara: How would they kill? With guns or bow and arrow?
Prabhupāda: That, as it is suitable. It is not that because the kṣatriyas were killing by bows and arrows formerly, you have to continue that.
Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:
Prabhupāda: Now, my point is that Buddhism was rejected from India because he's decried the authority of Vedas.
Indian man (3): So this fellow also will be rejected.
Prabhupāda: That... Yes, immediately. Because he does not accept the authority of Vedas. That is real knowledge. Nindasi yajña-vidher ahaha śruti-jātam Yes, yajña, I mean to say, criticize the yajña-vidhi. Yajña-vidhi you cannot criticize. Yajñārthāt karmaṇo 'nyatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). Karma-bandhana. So yajña must go on, and the vidhi must be followed. That is real acceptance of Vedic knowledge. If you manufacture your own concoction, "This is good, this is bad," that will not help you.
Indian man (3): Vetas pi pavitranam svadhinam ca tasam api, vedanam ca na kartavyam nindha saddhya...(?)
Prabhupāda: But why he's making nindā? You don't eat, even it is... Now in the first you said, you don't..., you cannot kill animal, even if it is...
Indian man (3): I, I follow even though you said that you kill it for the sake of yajña, I am not going to kill it, that's all. That is my personal...
Prabhupāda: No, no. That you can do. But you cannot decry the Vedic laws.
Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:
Indian man (2): You want us to eat meat by saying that the Vaiṣṇavas..., we won't do it.
Prabhupāda: The Vaiṣṇava is forbidden.
Indian man (2): But then, this is a Vaiṣṇava way, forbidden to eat the meat.
Prabhupāda: That's all right. But therefore you cannot decry the Vedas.
Indian man (4): But this is not Veda, you see? If you kill an animal and sacrifice in the way of...
Prabhupāda: That is Vedic injunction. Sacrifice is done...
Indian man (4): This is tantra, not Veda. Vedas don't want. And there used to be animal living again after killing it...
Prabhupāda: No, no.
Indian man (4): Are you able to do it?
Prabhupāda: No, no.
Indian man (4): So this is tantra. He wants to decry the tantra, not Vedas.
Prabhupāda: Hm.
Indian man (4): By tantra they're verily killing animals to eat them away for the pleasure of their teeth, for the pleasure of the tongue.
Prabhupāda: Tantra, tantra... I do not know what kind of tantra...
Dr. Patel: ...does not believe in killing animal and eating it even... Vedas say you can eat, I will not. And I don't mind decrying the Vedas that way, if you say so, sir. (indistinct) Vaiṣṇava, I don't think I can allow anyone to be killed. I'm very sorry to say this.
Prabhupāda: Hm.
Dr. Patel: If the Vedas say "Kill," I won't. I won't, don't want that.
Prabhupāda: That is Buddhism.
Dr. Patel: I don't mind you call me a Buddhist or a fool, but I won't kill an animal, being a Vaiṣṇava myself.
Prabhupāda: That's all right, but the thing is that you may not like something, but you cannot decry the authority of the Vedas.
Dr. Patel: This is not decrying the authority of Vedas.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.
Dr. Patel: ...excuse me, I will bring the Vedas before you. I have studied.
Prabhupāda: You can manufacture your own way...
Dr. Patel: I'm not manufacturing, I'm not manufacturing. Nowhere Veda say you kill the animals, and eat them away. They, our forefathers were so clever as to kill them and bring them living again.
Prabhupāda: Every sacrifice, every sacrifice there is written in injunction of Vedic...
Dr. Patel: Sacrificing means you're sacrificing your own...
Prabhupāda: You may mean something, but actually, that is not the meaning. That is the difference. You may mean something. The point is that you may follow. In the Vedas there are different ways, but you cannot decry the authority of the Vedas. That is the point.
Dr. Patel: The ideal Vaiṣṇava will not say this. The ideal Vaiṣṇava. Even Vedas say to kill an animal anytime, I won't. I won't kill it, I won't eat it. I'll not eat even in England as a student of London University-meat.
Prabhupāda: I'm recommending you to eat meat?
Dr. Patel: No, you eat the..., indirectly so.
Prabhupāda: All right.
Dr. Patel: I'm very sorry.
Prabhupāda: It is very difficult to talk with you. Therefore you cannot take any lesson.
Dr. Patel: No, I'm not taking this lesson, going to kill an animal to eat it. That lesson in no way I will take.
Prabhupāda: That is meant for others!
Dr. Patel: Ācchā! Not for me.
Prabhupāda: All right.
Dr. Patel: Otherwise, as a Vaiṣṇava you can't...
Prabhupāda: I don't say that Vaiṣṇava. Why I'll say? Why you talk like that?
Dr. Patel: (indistinct) Swamiji told his disciples not to take meat.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:
Prabhupāda: You cannot reject the rascals and fools. That is the way.
Dr. Patel: But he is rejecting rascals and fools.
Prabhupāda: Gradually, gradually. Just like...
Dr. Patel: As a Vaiṣṇava we can't tolerate meat.
Prabhupāda: That is all right, but...
Dr. Patel: I can...
Prabhupāda: ...you cannot...
Dr. Patel: ...not mix it. They go, sometimes, and feed (indistinct).
Prabhupāda: Even they go, that does not mean they're going to kill animal.
Dr. Patel: But suppose an animal is killed and prasāda is offered, they won't take it.
Prabhupāda: No, no, yes.
Dr. Patel: Yes, sir, that is what it says, "Don't take this prasāda even if it is offered."
Prabhupāda: But I cannot say to stop animal sacrifice before the deity Goddess Kālī. That I cannot say. I cannot disobey. I may not take it.
Dr. Patel: That is what he means to say, but...
Prabhupāda: But you cannot say that I reject...
Dr. Patel: "My followers do not take meat even kālī-yajña."
Prabhupāda: You cannot dictate on the Vedic authority. Veda...
Dr. Patel: Kālī temple, Kālī temple is not Vedic, but it is Tantric, Tantric.
Prabhupāda: That you say, that you say. Not tantra. Tantra is also within the Vedas. Just like we have got Nārada-pañcarātra.
Dr. Patel: That's right, but we are following Nārada-pañcarātra, aren't we?
Prabhupāda: Tantra.
Dr. Patel: All of us. All Vaiṣṇavas in India, Nārada-pañcarātra is very pivot around which we all live on.
Prabhupāda: We are not advocating meat eating. You do not understand. We are saying that even if you don't eat meat, you cannot decry the arrangement in the Vedas. That you cannot do.
Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:
Prabhupāda: Do you think that killing is bad?
Indian man (2): No, no, no... Yes. Whatever Kṛṣṇa says is right, and whatever we say is wrong. We say kill the animal is wrong. Kṛṣṇa says kill the animal is right. Okay?
Prabhupāda: No, Kṛṣṇa, I mean to say, do you mean to say killing an animal is bad, and killing a man is not bad?
Indian man (2): No, if Kṛṣṇa says, "Kill the man, kill this man," then it's right. If I say "Kill this man," is wrong.
Prabhupāda: I mean, Kṛṣṇa killed some animals, also.
Indian man (2): Then it is right. Whatever Kṛṣṇa does is right, because He has the power to create, I know.
Prabhupāda: That's right, that's all right.
Indian man (2): There is nothing that's killed. What is killed? Kill is body, ātmā is sanātana.
Prabhupāda: You abide by the order of Kṛṣṇa.
Indian man (2): That is what we are abiding, but that is...
Prabhupāda: Not killing and not killing.
Dr. Patel: That is what I say.
Prabhupāda: These are material conceptions. If Kṛṣṇa says, "You kill," you should kill.
Morning Walk -- April 6, 1974, Bombay:
Nivṛtta-tarsaiḥ means one who has ceased material desires. He can chant. He can glorify. But it is not for ordinary mundane people. Nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānād bhavauṣādhi chrotra-mano 'bhirāmāt (SB 10.1.4). And this chanting is bhavauṣādhi. There is some... (break) ...of holy name or glorifying the Lord is the medicine for this material disease. Material disease means repetition of birth and death. To stop this repetition of birth and death, this is the only remedy. And this is used by liberated persons. So such a nice thing, who can refrain from it? Vinā paśughnāt: (SB 10.1.4) unless one is animal killer, one cannot cease from this business. Therefore animal killing is so sinful.
- nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānād
- bhavauṣādhi chrotra-mano 'bhirāmāt
- ka uttama-śloka-guṇānuvādāt
- (pumān) virajyeta vinā paśughnāt
- (SB 10.1.4)
Morning Walk -- April 22, 1974, Hyderabad:
Pañcadraviḍa: But if the man says, "I am Muslim; how you can say I am disobedient to the laws of God? I am following my own religion?"
Prabhupāda: No, no, we shall come to the Muslims next. First of all let us talk with the Christians.
Satsvarūpa: We are always arguing with them. They say they are following. They are allowed to kill animals.
Pañcadraviḍa: "I am accepting Christ. Therefore I am saved. I am following closely Christianity."
Prabhupāda: No, no. If you love God, then why you are disobeying His order. That is my charge, first thing. God says, "Thou shalt not kill," but why you are killing? This is the charge I give to the Christians.
Morning Walk -- April 22, 1974, Hyderabad:
Pañcadraviḍa: How disobeying if the person says, "I am vegetarian. I do not kill. I am a Christian, but I am vegetarian, I do not kill animals?"
Prabhupāda: Then you are all right. But they... Who put forward the argument that "You are also killing vegetable?" Then how can kill vegetable?
Nitai: In Bhagavad-gītā Kṛṣṇa... Just as you quoted.
Prabhupāda: The thing is that we must eat something. And vegetables also have got life. The nature's way is that one living entity is eating another living entity. It may be animal or it may be vegetable. The question is the obedience to the order of God. So when Jesus Christ says that "Thou shalt not kill," it means bigger animals. Killing is applied, from dictionary, if I kill a man, if I kill an animal, then this word is used. So he meant like that. And that is very reasonable.
Morning Walk -- April 22, 1974, Hyderabad:
Prabhupāda: Because I am eating another living entity, that does not I can eat another man. So therefore Kṛṣṇa has specifically mentioned, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). After all, we have to eat. And if you take that all killing is the same, even by ordinary law, if I kill one tree, and if I kill one man, does it mean it is of the same degree? Even taking killing of plant, so there are comparative. But it is also necessity that we must eat something. So therefore here, perfect thing in the Bhagavad-gītā, that He says that "You offer Me." "Offer Me" means "After My eating, you shall eat." Yajña-śiṣṭāśinaḥ santo mucyante sarva-kilbiṣaiḥ. Even by killing vegetable, you are also as sinful as killing animal, but because we offer to Kṛṣṇa, therefore we are not sinful. Kṛṣṇa wants it. Just like Kṛṣṇa wanted Arjuna to fight and kill the other party. Therefore Arjuna is not infected with the sin. So here Kṛṣṇa is asking, "Give me this foodstuff," and Kṛṣṇa knows that I will eat the remnants of the foodstuff. So I am not responsible.
Morning Walk -- April 22, 1974, Hyderabad:
Pañcadraviḍa: But when Jesus said, "Thou shalt not kill," he meant humans; he did not mean animals.
Prabhupāda: That is your interpretation.
Akṣayānanda: But Jesus was a shepherd and there were many, many sheep. What did they do with all the sheep?
Prabhupāda: They eat?
Pañcadraviḍa: They must.
Prabhupāda: They must. That is your inference.
Pañcadraviḍa: What else...? In the middle of desert...? Babylon, Israel is all desert country. What will they do with sheep? They are not making wool coats.
Prabhupāda: Then why he has said, "Thou shalt not kill"? Then hypocrisy. Then you reject Jesus complete. He is a hypocrite. Yes. That is the conclusion. How can you follow hypocrite? Huh? Is that all right? If Jesus Christ himself killed animals and he said, "Thou shalt not kill," then he is a hypocrite. Then he cannot preach. He is a hypocrite. You are bringing Christ for condemnation
Morning Walk -- April 22, 1974, Hyderabad:
Pañcadraviḍa: "But we say that when Christ said, Thou shalt not kill, and you say it refers all living beings, we say that is your interpretation because Christ is coming to teach fishermen. He never told them to give up their occupation. They continued to live as fishermen. Continued to live as sheep herders. He knew that killing was going on. Therefore his statement, 'Thou shalt not kill,' must refer to human beings because he was living in the community. He was teaching by his example."
Prabhupāda: But I can say, "Why not to the animals? You can eat fish only." Then I'll write book like that. Jesus Christ allowed the fishermen to fish, so then you can fish. Why you are killing cows? That will be my argument. If you are actually following Christ, all right, you can take fish, but why you are killing animals, and other animals? Why you are going that "Because Christ has allowed some fish killing, therefore everyone should be killed"? What is this nonsense? You follow strictly. All right, fish-killing.
Morning Walk -- April 22, 1974, Hyderabad:
Pañcadraviḍa: What is the difference between fish killing and goat killing?
Prabhupāda: Then everyone will say what is the difference between animal killing and and man killing?
Pañcadraviḍa: There is big difference between animal killing and...
Prabhupāda: Why big difference?
Pañcadraviḍa: If a man goes into the road he runs over a dog, there will not be so much punishment. But if a man goes into the road, he runs over...
Prabhupāda: That you have made, your laws. You have made that, if you kill a man and if you kill an animal, that is not equal. That is your... But that does not mean when it is said, "Thou shalt not kill"... This is no argument.
Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome:
Prabhupāda: People drink for intoxication. Just like in medicine, so many drugs are used. Even opium is used. Yes. Morphia is used. But they are not used ordinarily. For a specific purpose. Even snake poison is used, but that does not mean snake poison should be used perpetually. So for benefit of the body under particular circumstances something may be recommended, but that is not for general use or for intoxication. That is condemned. Just like animal killing is sometimes prescribed in the yajña. The purpose is different. But that does not mean unrestricted animal killing in the slaughterhouse should go on, no. That is sinful. So if we violate the laws perpetually, then how we can consider as belonging to a certain group of religious system? There must be principles.
Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome:
Prabhupāda: There is enough land, enough possibility, enough water. Now utilize them and produce food grain, eat nicely and live peacefully and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and go back to home, back to Godhead. This is our philosophy. Why there should be industry? You want to eat after all. Instead of eating this flesh, killing poor animals, why don't you produce food grains, fruits, flowers, food grain, and take milk from the animals and produce milk products, all nutritious food, all nice food, and be happy and remember God for His kindness. This is civilization.
Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome:
Prabhupāda: In Africa and Australia, they are killing the animals and exporting. So in other countries they are getting meat to eat, and so they are very free to produce bolts and nuts by industry. They don't require to produce food because from Africa and Australia they are getting meat. This is going on. Instead of producing food, people are interested in producing motor car bolts and nuts.
Morning Walk at Villa Borghese -- May 25, 1974, Rome:
Prabhupāda: What you have produced, that's all. Very simple thing. Everyone was engaged producing. There was no necessity. And here the rascals are advising, produce bolts and nuts, tire, and drill petrol. They are not producing food. And the so-called government men, they are levying taxes, and they are enjoying. They haven't got to produce food. They are killing animals, eating, and digesting with wine. And then woman. That's all. This is their business. And food price is increasing daily. They don't mind because they will print paper, and to the supplier they will give paper. That's all.
Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: Now the so-called, the priestly society, priestly society, they are amending the Biblical injunction according to their whims. Just like in the Bible, the injunction is, "Thou shalt not kill." But the priestly class and all classes, they are simply killing. So how they can guide? They are keeping regular slaughterhouse for killing. So how they can guide? I have asked so many Christian gentlemen, including priests that "Your injunction is that 'Thou shalt not kill.' That is Lord Jesus Christ's order. Why you are violating this?" They give me vague answers. Directly it is said, "Thou shalt not kill." And the whole world is simply killing poor animals, and keeping up-to-date slaughterhouse.
Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: You simply enjoy what is allotted to you. Don't encroach upon other's property. This is God's injunction. You enjoy. As human being, you enjoy life. You have got food grains, fruits, flowers, milk. Enjoy life. Offer to Kṛṣṇa. Enjoy life. Why should you kill animal? That is God's... Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā. He says patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam (BG 9.26). Why do you go to kill animals? That is not enjoyment. That means you suffer, therefore you are suffering. You are creating suffering. So this man is at least informed that they have no brain.
Morning Walk -- June 2, 1974, Geneva:
Guru-gaurāṅga: Some time ago I read in the papers that they had so much milk and so much butter that the government proposal was kill the cows.
Prabhupāda: Kill all the animals. Oh, just see. They will not give to others.
Bhagavān: The farmers were complaining that their prices weren't competitive cause there was so much milk.
Prabhupāda: The price is the standard, not that goods are required. They want money for purchasing wine. This is the difficulty. They are not satisfied simply by eating sufficient. They want money for woman and wine. This is their philosophy.
Morning Walk -- June 2, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: I have several times said that the, still the whole world can produce so much grains and foodstuff, ten times of the population can be fed, ten times. In Africa, in Australia, and even in America, so much, I means, prospect of producing food. But they will not cooperate. They will kill the animal. They will throw the grain to the sea, and claim, "It is my land. It is my property."
Room Conversation with Prof. Regamay, Professor of Sanskrit at the University of Lausanne -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: The atheist class of men, we're advocating "There is no God." So He appeared before them... And they were killing animals like anything. So Buddhadeva inaugurated the non-violence. So therefore He is God Himself, and He is teaching, "There is no God." This is rather cheating.
Room Conversation with Prof. Regamay, Professor of Sanskrit at the University of Lausanne -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:
Prof. Regamay: Now there are some schools of Buddhists who are worshiping Buddha like a God.
Prabhupāda: Yes, He is God. He is God. They don't accept Buddha as incarnation of God. But from Vedas we understand that He is incarnation of God.
Prof. Regamay: But he brought to the world the ahiṁsā, but I think ahiṁsā appears already in the Bhagavad-gītā. But there was ahiṁsā also by the Jains.
Prabhupāda: Ahiṁsā, because at that time people were killing animals in the name of yajña. Just like in the Christian world the order is not to kill, but still, they are killing. So this misuse of scriptural injunction is always going on. A class of men there are who abuse the scriptural injunctions and go on with their own motive. So there was a period when people, under the protection of Vedas... Because Vedas, animal sacrifice is recommended for certain purpose, to test the proper chanting of Vedic mantras. The animal was not killed. The animal was put into the fire.
Room Conversation with Prof. Regamay, Professor of Sanskrit at the University of Lausanne -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: So Buddha, Lord Buddha, his only mission was to stop the sinful activities of animal... Ahiṁsā paramo dharmaḥ. He was teaching that. But these rascals, they would show the evidence... Just like Christians says that "Lord Jesus Christ ate fish" or something like that. Because Lord Jesus Christ ate fish, therefore they should maintain slaughterhouse. This is their reasoning. The other day somebody questioned me that... I said that killing of animals is sinful activity. So somebody questioned that "Lord Jesus Christ ate fish," somewhere. So I said that He is powerful. He can eat the whole world. But you cannot imitate. You have to follow his instructions, what he says.
Room Conversation with Prof. Regamay, Professor of Sanskrit at the University of Lausanne -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: So Buddha wanted to stop this nonsense, who were eating and killing animals on the strength of Vedas. They did not know what is the meaning, but they would say in the Vedas it is stated, paśavo vadhyaḥ sṛṣṭaḥ: "The animals are created for being killed." And what purpose it is killed? They, without knowing... Actually, they wanted to satisfy their tongue by eating the flesh, but they would give Vedic evidences. So to stop this nonsense business Buddha said that "I don't care for your Vedas." Nindasi yajña-vidher ahaha śruti-jātam. Śruti-jātam means Vedic injunction.
Room Conversation with Prof. Regamay, Professor of Sanskrit at the University of Lausanne -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: Just like Lord Buddha. He did not explain anything about God. He said, "Just obey me and stop this animal killing." Therefore this much sufficient for him, that's all. The lower class students, one plus two equal to three, two plus two..., that much mathematics, not higher mathematics. Higher mathematics is not possible to understand.
Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: You can love animal. You are not animal. Animal... Just like we are discussing about theosophy because we are grown up, and the child, he cannot understand. That does not mean we shall be unkind to the children. He may be ignorant, the animal may be ignorant, but I am not ignorant. How can I kill the animal?
Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:
Yogeśvara: (translates) There's a story. Someone asked Lord Jesus to describe how we should love all people. Describe... Just like a man who has one hundred sheep and there is one of them who has gone astray, he is lost, so the man leaves aside all of his other hundred sheep to go looking for that one sheep. So in the same way, he says, we must take care of the people who are suffering. The minority, those who are suffering, they must receive food, they must be given help and fed.
Prabhupāda: That's all right. But why you should kill animal?
Young Swiss Man (3): At the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā...
Prabhupāda: And Christ says, "Thou shall not kill." Why you are killing? From the very beginning disobedience. How you can become Christian?
Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:
Yogeśvara: Why do we make the distinction between not killing animals and plants? Why do we kill plants?
Prabhupāda: We do not kill plants also. We take... Of course, by nature's way some living entity is the food for another living entity. Jīvo jīvasya jīvanam. That is the nature's way. But if you give that argument, then I can say, "Why you are killing cows? Why don't you kill your own children?" If that is the way, that "Because I have to eat some animal," so why go outside? Just inside the family there are so many animals. You can kill them and eat. there must be discretion. Apart from this point of view, we Kṛṣṇa conscious people, we do not kill even a plant because, Kṛṣṇa says-find out this-patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26).
Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:
Yogeśvara: Why do we make the distinction between not killing animals and plants? Why do we kill plants?
Prabhupāda: We do not kill plants also. We take... Of course, by nature's way some living entity is the food for another living entity. Jīvo jīvasya jīvanam. That is the nature's way. But if you give that argument, then I can say, "Why you are killing cows? Why don't you kill your own children?" If that is the way, that "Because I have to eat some animal," so why go outside? Just inside the family there are so many animals. You can kill them and eat. there must be discretion. Apart from this point of view, we Kṛṣṇa conscious people, we do not kill even a plant because, Kṛṣṇa says-find out this-patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26).
Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:
yogeśvara: He says, "But then Kṛṣṇa says, 'Why are you afraid to fight? After all, the soul is eternal, but the body is only temporary.' So isn't that a justification..."
Prabhupāda: But Kṛṣṇa does not say, "Therefore you open slaughterhouse and go on killing animals."
Morning Walk -- June 6, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: Everyone can understand the truth except the rascals who are meat-eaters. Vinā paśughnāt. Paśughnāt. Paśu means animals, and ghna means killer. Christ therefore first says, "You shall not kill." These rascals are killers from the very beginning, and they're continuing.
Morning Walk -- June 8, 1974, Geneva:
Prabhupāda: A girl is pregnant, suppose, then, during her pregnancy period, ten months, there is no sex, and unless the child becomes six months old, there is no sex. The thing is that in the modern world, sex life has become the only pleasure. They do not know anything else. Therefore everything is discredited. And another thing is they are afraid of keeping more than one wife for population. But if they produce sufficient food, where is the question of overpopulation? Another thing they have made, especially in the western world, they don't want to produce food because they know, "We shall kill one animal and eat.
Morning Walk -- June 9, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: Reaction. Everything... Yajñārthe karmaṇo yatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). Whatever you do, you are bound up by the reaction. That is nature's law. (break) ...and occasionally there will be big war, and they'll kill themselves. That's all. Now they are killing animals. That is a separate from human being. But time will come, the human beings, they will kill themselves, one another. Not only one, two, but wholesale. Daily, millions or thousands will be killed. They want to avoid war. For that reason, they invented the United Nations. Eh?
Room Conversation -- June 11, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: Simply we request that "Don't..." You propagate this. "Don't kill, don't maintain the slaughterhouse." It's very sinful. It has got very awkward reaction on the society. Stop this slaughterhouse. We don't say that you stop eating meat. You eat meat, but don't take it from slaughterhouse. Or don't by killing. Simply wait, and you'll get the... How long the cow will live? Their maximum age is twenty years. So not that you have to wait for twenty years. There are many cows, eighteen years, sixteen years or ten years. So wait for that much time. Then you regularly get dead cows and eat. What is the wrong? You make this propaganda. You may, for few years, may not get. By that time, you can eat some dogs and cats. (laughter) Yes. The Koreans, they are using dogs. Where is the difference between you and the Korean? You can eat also dogs for the time being. Or hogs. You eat hogs. We don't prohibit killing of these small animals. We don't sanction, neither prohibit. But especially we request cow protection because it is ordered by Kṛṣṇa.
Room Conversation -- June 11, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: We don't stop food, producing food grains. But we want to stop these killing houses. It is very, very sinful. Therefore in Europe, so many wars. Every ten years, fifteen years, there is a big war and wholesale slaughter of the whole human kind. And these rascals, they do not see it. The reaction must be there. You are killing innocent cows and animals. Nature will take revenge. Wait for that. As soon as the time is ripe, the nature will gather all these rascals, and club, slaughter them. Finished. They will fight amongst themselves, Protestant and Catholic, Russian and France, and France and Germany. This is going on. Why? This is the nature's law. Tit for tat. You have killed. Now you become killed. Amongst yourselves. They are being sent to the slaughterhouse. And here, you'll create slaughterhouse, "Dum! dum!" and killed, be killed.
Room Conversation -- June 11, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: If you... Mām... This meaning, the flesh, is Sanskrit word is māṁsa. Mām. Mām means "me." And sa means "he." "I am killing this animal. I am eating. And he'll kill me and eat." This word is reminding that "You are killing this animal, and eating. So this animal will kill you and eat you." This is the meaning of māṁ sa. Māṁ sa khādati iti māṁsa. "He'll be given the opportunity to kill you." And when the animal is sacrificed before the goddess Kālī, this mantra is cited to the ear of the animal that "You are giving your life before goddess Kālī. So next life you are getting the chance of human being." So he's promoted. Because he is being killed before the deity, goddess Kālī, so he is elevated, and he's given the chance that "This man will become animal, and you'll kill him." So after understanding this mantra, who will be ready to kill another animal? This is the mantra. While sacrificing an animal, this is the mantra. The priest will say in the ear that "You, Mr. Goat, you are being killed before this goddess of Kālī. So your benediction is that you have to undergo so many lives before coming to the human form of life, but because you are sacrificing, as a reward for this, you get immediately human life." So he's not loser. "And this man who is killing you, he'll become a goat like you, and you have the right to kill him." This is mantra.
Room Conversation -- June 11, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: In connection with that, I have discussed the animal killing. So all these meat-eaters, they are responsible for killing the innocent cows.
Room Conversation with Monsieur Mesman, Chief of Law House of Paris -- June 11, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: So our recommendation is, "Don't kill cow." Take milk and make thousands of preparations, all nutritious and very healthy. They do not know how to use cow. Instead of killing, if we take, let the animal live and give us milk, and from the milk, we make hundreds of preparations. The milk is nothing but blood, transformation of blood. So we take the blood by killing the animal, but we do not wish to kill such an important animal, but they take the blood in form of milk and make preparation. And those who are flesh-eaters, let them wait for the death of the cow. Then let them eat the flesh, not living condition. So we are making preparation that keep the cows, protect the cows, and when the cow dies, the flesh-eater may take it away. So he can take the skin, he can take the hoof, he can take the horn, he can take the flesh, everything, whatever he likes. Because when it is dead, it is no more useful for us. So the others, who are interested with the skin, in the flesh, in the hoof, they can take it. And they get it free. Without any cost. Because after death, we don't want it. So this is our program. Let the cows live. We take sufficient milk. We are getting milk, one thousand pounds. One thousand pounds daily in our, one center, New Vrindaban, Virginia. So we are making various preparations from the milk, and they are very happy, and the cows are also happy. So this is one of our programs, to stop killing this important animal. And the flesh-eaters may wait a little until the cow dies.
Morning Walk -- June 13, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: Prabhupāda: This is called māyā. He cannot face the actual situation, but, covered by some māyā, he accepts. This is another example of māyā. Directly killing the animal he cannot tolerate, but when it is covered by māyā, the same danger, he accepts.
Room Conversation with Mr. Deshimaru -- June 13, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: So far we know, Lord Buddha is considered as incarnation of God. He was sympathetic with the animal-killing. So he wanted to stop this animal-killing.
Room Conversation with Mr. Tran-van-Kha, and President & Members of the Society of Buddhists in France -- June 15, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: Nindasi yajña-vidher ahaha śruti-jātam. Śruti-jātam means Vedic rituals. Śruti means Vedas. It is learned by hearing. Why He decried the Vedic rituals? Sadaya-hṛdaya darśita-paśu-ghātam. You are so much compassionate by seeing animals sacrificed. Animal Killing. Sadaya-hṛdaya darśita-paśu-ghātam. Ghātam means killing, so He wanted to stop this animal killing, sinful life. Keśava dhṛta-buddha-śarīra jaya jagadīśa hare. My Lord, You have appeared now as Lord Buddha, I offer my respectful obeisances unto you.
Room Conversation with Mr. Tran-van-Kha, and President & Members of the Society of Buddhists in France -- June 15, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: He was Hindu in the beginning. Come on. He was Prince, then He become renounced and He was known as Lord Buddha. So Lord Buddha also started His system for stopping animal killing. Lord Jesus also said, "Thou shall not kill." Unfortunately the animal killing is not stopped. We are therefore teaching our followers: no meat-eating, so that if people stop meat-eating, automatically animal killing will be stopped.
Room Conversation with devotees about Twelfth Canto Kali-yuga, and Conversation with Guest -- June 15, 1974, Paris:
Prabhupāda: In old age he'll be crippled like that. Then he said that "I am also going to be like that? No. What is the value?" Then he began meditation, how to stop old age. Then he gradually became very great, saintly person, and studied Veda, karma, and by bad karma, one becomes subjected with material tribulation, and the most of the bad karma, he thought, was killing of animals, so he wanted to stop this. That is Buddha's... "Stop animal killing." Sadaya-hṛdaya darśita-paśu-ghātam.
Room Conversation with German Women Philosophers -- June 17, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: Now suppose a tiger kills an animal, and a man kills thousands of animals in a day in the slaughterhouse. Is he not sinful?
Morning Walk -- June 19, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: We shall go straight or right?
Haṁsadūta: Right. (break) He has taken safety place, and from safety place he is killing other poor animals. That is not shooting. The kṣatriyas, they will shoot tiger face to face. Previously Jaipur Mahārāja, he used to go to the forest, and so he would simply fight with the tiger with a sword.
Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: Yes. So they are always engaged in devotional service. So unless there is some realization, how they can engage their time in this way? (break) "You are human being. You can eat. I have given you fruits. I have given you vegetables. I have given you food grains. I have given you milk, very nutritious, palatable, containing all vitamin ABCD. And why should you kill animals? Why should you give trouble to the others?" This is self-realization, that "Here is another self.
Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: The animals, they are not coming to eat your foodstuff, your fruits. They are, rather, producing milk not for drinking themselves. They are giving you, and you have no obligation? The milk produced by the cows, it is taken by the human being. They do not drink it. So they are giving milk. And after death, you are taking their skin. So every way they are serving. The stool, cowdung, we have stacked here. I have seen. There also fertilizer. In so many ways they are giving you service, and you are killing the poor animal. What is the human civilization? Therefore Lord Buddha wanted to stop animal killing first. When there was too much animal killing, the incarnation of Lord Buddha was there to stop animal killing. In Buddhism there is no animal killing. Although they are now killing animals, but originally Buddha religion means non-violence. Also Lord Christ also said, "Thou shalt not kill." And Kṛṣṇa says, ahiṁsā. So in no religion unnecessary killing of animals is allowed. Even in Mohammedans, they are also... Kurvāni. Kurvāni means they can kill animals once in a year in the Mosque. So everywhere animal killing is restricted.
Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: My idea is that all our centers should be self-supported. We do not like that idea that for your support you have to go 100 miles to get your bread. That is a very dangerous drawback. You produce your food locally and then support yourself. The main problem is what to eat, where to sleep. So we get some place and support ourself by producing our own food. We have already begun in New Vrindaban, New..., West Virginia, Virginia, and similarly in other centers, we are producing our food, grains, vegetables, fruits and milk. That is sufficient. But we don't kill any animals. That we don't do.
Morning Walk -- June 20, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: Oh. So these Germans were tribe people, uncivilized?
Haṁsadūta: Yes, before Christianity, Europe was completely uncivilized.
Prabhupāda: Oh. Therefore the order is "Thou shalt not kill." Simply their business was killing. Uncivilized persons, they kill animals and eat. So due to past habit they could not forget this killing business. This is the proof that this system of religion was preached among the crude people, not civilized.
Morning Walk -- June 22, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: The animals, they are living in their own atmosphere, and these people, they come to kill them. Killing business has become very prominent at the present moment, and therefore they are being killed in the womb of the mother, abortion and killing child. That they do not know. Nature will not excuse you. You are killing; you'll be killed within your mothers' womb. You'll never see the light of the sun. You go on being killed, one after another, as many animals you have killed. They do not know. And time will come in this age when there will be no food and man will kill man and eat. That time is coming. Yes. They are now killing animal, but animal lives on this grass and grains. When there will be no grass, no grains, where they will get animal? They'll kill their own son and eat. That time is coming. Nature's law is that you grow your own food. But they are not interested in growing food. They are interested in manufacturing bolts and nuts.
Morning Walk -- June 22, 1974, Germany:
Satsvarūpa: The scientists are making artificial food; so they're not that worried.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, that is... That I say bolts and nuts. That artificial food means bolts and nuts. Somebody told me that they have manufactured artificial butter and by eating they were vomiting. They're vomiting. There is ample butter supply. Why these rascals are interested in manufacturing artificial butter to show their scientific brain? Just see how they are rascals. They can get, huh? Just like Kṛṣṇa was stealing His mother's butter and throwing it to the monkeys. Butter can be produced in that way, that everyone can eat sumptuously. No. "Kill the animals and artificial butter you eat and vomit." That's all. Just see their intelligence. And they are proud of their advanced civilization. The same example, that a man barking as a dog, people will go to see it by purchasing ticket. (German translation).
Prabhupāda: And they do not see the natural dog is barking. Artificial, they pay ten dollars ticket and see how a man is barking like a dog. Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa. You, at least, introduce in your country: "Chant Christ's name and stop animal killing." This is from Bible. This is not that I am asking. Bible says, "Thou shall not kill, and glorify the name of God."
Guest (1): Ahiṁsā.
Prabhupāda: Just in the beginning Christ says, "Thou shall not kill." That is the beginning of religious life. The animal killers cannot understand what is God. It is not possible. There is a statement in the Bhāgavata, viṇa paśughnat.
Morning Walk -- June 22, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: Who can remain aloof from the chanting of the holy name of God unless he's an animal killer?" Yes. Animal killers cannot understand what is God, what is God's name. That's not possible. (pause) Kṛṣṇa, what to speak of killing animal, He was embracing animal every morning, every... Yes. He was embracing.
Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: actually, if Christians are lover, they must stop immediately this animal killing.
Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: Why they understand like that? That means that Lord Christ was not sufficiently educated to use the right word, "murder"? Does it mean so? There are two words, killing and murder. Murder is especially meant for the human being. So do you think that Christ was not learned enough to use the word murder instead of "killing"? "Killing" means any kind of killing, especially animal killing. Otherwise you should have frankly openly used the word, "Thou shall not murder." Even if it is meant like that, so does it mean that he was preaching amongst the murderers? They are very first-class men? They are all murderers? Therefore the injunction. This kind of interpretation does not appeal to us.
Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:
German devotee: (translating for Pater Emmanuel:) To eat plants, is it not killing? To eat vegetables, is it not killing?
Prabhupāda: Then vegetable killing and animal killing is the same?
Pater Emmanuel: It's not the same. Not the same. But human killing and animal killing is also the same.
Prabhupāda: So we are not killing. Our Vaiṣṇava philosophy, we do not kill even vegetable because our Kṛṣṇa says... Find out this verse. Patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26).
Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: So we offer Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa wants: "Give me this foodstuff," so we offer the foodstuff to Kṛṣṇa, and we take it. Therefore, if for killing this patraṁ puṣpam there is sin, that is Kṛṣṇa's sin, not my sin. (German) But Kṛṣṇa, God, apāpa-viddham, sinful reaction cannot take place to Him. Apāpa-viddham. Pāpa means sinful. Just like the sun is powerful. It can absorb urine, but you cannot drink urine. (German) So the injunction is tejīyasāṁ na doṣāya (SB 10.33.29). One who is very powerful... Just like a king. He orders, "Kill this man. Murder." He commits murder regularly, chopped up. But he is not under the law, being hanged, because he is very powerful. But an ordinary man, if he commits murder, he will be hanged. When there is fight the commander in chief says, "You kill them," and the soldier kills and he gets gold medal. But the same soldier, when he kills a single person at home, he is hanged. Therefore this injunction, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam (BG 9.26), "This vegetables give Me. I shall eat, and you take the prasādam." So we are not sinful.
Pater Emmanuel: And Kṛṣṇa cannot give the same permission for the animals?
Prabhupāda: Yes, the animal kingdom in the nature's way... Just like the grass is the food of the cow, and the cow is the food for man, but not for civilized man, religious man. The crude man. (German) (break) The perfect human being is described: śamo damas titikṣā ārjavam. Find out. (break) ...killing of animals and child, Christ's name. Then it will be perfect. I have not come to teach you, but to request you that your Christian religion prohibit this and encourages chanting of name of the Lord. So you kindly do it, that's all.
Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:
Prabhupāda: I think those who are Christian priests, they should cooperate with this movement, chant the name of Christ or Christo and stop animal killing. This is according to Bible. This is not according to my philosophy, but their Christian philosophy. Simply let them do it and see how the situation becomes nice.
Morning Walk -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne:
Prabhupāda: One who is killer of animal, he cannot understand the spiritual science." Vinā paśughnāt (SB 10.1.4). This is the statement. Paśughna means the animal killer. Therefore the first prohibition is stop this animal killing. Otherwise, this dull brain will not be able to understand. They are not fit for understanding. Mūḍha, mūḍha. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ (BG 7.15). Duṣkṛtina means always engaged in sinful activities. They have got brain but their brain is being utilized only for sinful activities, they are called duṣkṛtina. Kṛtī, kṛtī means good brain, and duṣkṛtī means brain is being utilized for sinful act. Therefore they are mūḍha. In spite of good brain, they are rascals, because brain is being utilized for sinful activities, how to set up up-to-date machinery for killing animals. Brain is being used for this purpose. Any animal can be killed with ordinary knife, but they're manufacturing latest machinery. Their brain, rascal brain is being used for that purpose. And what they will understand? They are preparing their road for going to hell. What they will understand about spiritual matters? Nature will not excuse. That is not possible. (break) That is sufficient for your being killed. Yes, sir. Wherefrom these laws come unless there is God's laws? Everyone will be killed. They are thinking that "We are not going to slaughterhouse to kill. They kill; we purchase." The Buddhist says like that. Everyone says like that. Therefore, according to Vedic scripture, those animal-eaters, they should kill them personally so that they can see how much suffering is there, so he will stop.
One who is killer of animal, he cannot understand the spiritual science." Vinā paśughnāt (SB 10.1.4). This is the statement. Paśughna means the animal killer. Therefore the first prohibition is stop this animal killing. Otherwise, this dull brain will not be able to understand. They are not fit for understanding. Mūḍha, mūḍha. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ (BG 7.15). Duṣkṛtina means always engaged in sinful activities. They have got brain but their brain is being utilized only for sinful activities, they are called duṣkṛtina. Kṛtī, kṛtī means good brain, and duṣkṛtī means brain is being utilized for sinful act. Therefore they are mūḍha. In spite of good brain, they are rascals, because brain is being utilized for sinful activities, how to set up up-to-date machinery for killing animals. Brain is being used for this purpose. Any animal can be killed with ordinary knife, but they're manufacturing latest machinery. Their brain, rascal brain is being used for that purpose. And what they will understand? They are preparing their road for going to hell. What they will understand about spiritual matters? Nature will not excuse. That is not possible. (break) That is sufficient for your being killed. Yes, sir. Wherefrom these laws come unless there is God's laws? Everyone will be killed. They are thinking that "We are not going to slaughterhouse to kill. They kill; we purchase." The Buddhist says like that. Everyone says like that. Therefore, according to Vedic scripture, those animal-eaters, they should kill them personally so that they can see how much suffering is there, so he will stop.
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Morning Walk -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne
Room Conversation with Scientists -- July 2, 1974, Melbourne:
Prabhupāda: Those who are meat-eaters, they can eat other non-important animals, but cows must be saved, even from economic point of view. Here it is said that go-rakṣya. It does not say, Kṛṣṇa, "elephant-rakṣya." Elephant is a big animal, and at least fifty times more than cow, there is flesh. But it is not recommended. But the cow protection is recommended because it has got the miracle food, milk, and from milk you can prepare hundreds of preparation, all nutritious, full of vitamin A and D. So therefore it is recommended, go-rakṣya. It is not that meat-eating is stopped. Meat-eaters may kill other non-important animals but don't kill animal, er, cow.
Room Conversation with Scientists -- July 2, 1974, Melbourne:
Madhudviṣa: Give a napkin. It's a sweet preparation called gulab jamin. It is all prepared just from milk which has been made into curd, and then the curd has been fried in ghee, cooking ghee, and then after it has been fried, it has been soaked in sweet water and it is very palatable. It's called a gulab jamin. It is a very famous delicacy of Indian cooking. It requires great skill and art to prepare these. And as our spiritual master said, there is actually hundreds and hundreds of food which can be prepared from this, like the cheese you have there. Even cooking cheese and spicing it with asafoetida and ginger, meat taste can be simulated very, very nicely.
Prabhupāda: This cheese as it is you take, it is as beneficial as meat.
Madhudviṣa: Protein.
Guest (2): Yes, yes. Similar protein.
Prabhupāda: So why the animal should be killed? Take milk.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Room Conversation with Professors -- February 19, 1975, Caracas:
Guest: It's some story that when Buddha was about to leave his body, he said that... Anyway, the conclusion of the story is that he also considered himself imperfect.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the greatness of Buddha. Because his followers were imperfect, he could not say more than what they could understand. Therefore he said that "I am imperfect." His mission was to stop animal killing. But people are very much accustomed to animal killing, so he did not say higher things that they could not understand. For them, if they could stop animal killing, that was perfection.
Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:
Prabhupāda: First of all, killing is sinful. Christ said, "Thou shalt not kill." That is sinful, it doesn't matter whether you kill cow or goat or anything. But from economic point of view, cow is very important because it supplies milk. And milk preparation, we Indians know how many you can get nice milk preparation. Dahi, rābṛi, this, that, Huh? But how nutritious, how palatable. And that is good for human being. First thing is that why you should kill if you have got sufficient food, eh? Patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam (BG 9.26). Eh? Vegetables, fruits, then food grains, then sugar, everything is there sufficient. At least we Indian, we know we can prepare hundreds and thousands of preparations, nice palatable, enjoyable. Why should you go to kill the animal?
Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran:
Prabhupāda: When we have got so many things to eat, why shall I go to kill an animal, eat it? So these are anartha. Anartha means "without any meaning." So these things become vanquished. If one is actually engaged in devotional service, the first symptom will be that he is not interested in things which are unwanted, artificial. These are the stages.
Morning Walk -- April 6, 1975, Mayapur:
Prabhupāda: Animals, you can eat if you like. But there was no slaughterhouse. If you like, you can kill your own animal and eat. That was open. But the state did not maintain any slaughterhouse. And the third-class, fourth-class men, they would eat. So simply by saying that "You don't eat," they will not accept that. They're free, but the state would not maintain the slaughterhouse. At the present moment also, if the slaughterhouse are closed, then immediately seventy-five-percent meat-eating will be stopped. They maintain slaughterhouse. That is the most sinful activity.
Morning Walk -- May 7, 1975, Perth:
Prabhupāda: If you are slaughtering animals and you are comparing that killing of the vegetables and the killing of the animals is the same, then killing your son and killing an animal is also the same. Why do you discriminate? Just kill your own son and eat.
Paramahaṁsa: He's a human being, though.
Prabhupāda: Ah, therefore there is discrimination. Discrimination is the better part of valor. Whom should we kill? It is all right. Jīvo jīvasya jīvanam. But there is important. If you eat vegetables there is no crisis, you can go on. It is a fact that an animal is eating another animal. It may be vegetables or animals, but they are disturbing. Therefore it is said, "As it is allotted." You should eat such and such. Not that indiscriminately you can eat everything. If you think killing of an animal and killing a vegetable is the same, then killing of your son and killing of animals or vegetable is the same. Why do you discriminate? What is your answer?
Gaṇeśa: So if we discriminate between the animals and the plants, well what about the discrimination between the human beings and the animals? Is it not all right to kill animals and not human beings?
Prabhupāda: No. You discriminate actually. You do not kill human beings, but you kill animals. Similarly you discriminate: instead of killing animals, kill vegetables.
Morning Walk -- May 7, 1975, Perth:
Prabhupāda: Balance of diet can be done by grains and vegetables. Why should we kill animals? We know that, the balance can be done. You learn from us that balanced food can be done.
Amogha: But in the Bible it says that God gave animals to the man.
Prabhupāda: For protection. Not for eating. Rascals. Bible does not say that you kill animals. Then Jesus Christ is a hypocrite. His commandment is, "Thou shalt not kill." If he allows killing, then why does he say, "Thou shalt not kill"? Then you prove that Jesus Christ is a hypocrite. Are you following a hypocrite? Nonsense.
Paramahaṁsa: So we understand. We will stop eating meat, but we can still eat fish and eggs. Because there are plenty of fish and plenty of eggs.
Prabhupāda: That is also better than killing animals.
Morning Walk -- May 7, 1975, Perth:
Guest: The government doesn't charge anyone with crime for killing an animal.
Prabhupāda: Government means they are full of rascals. Government by the people. So you are all rascals, the government is also rascal. Your democracy means government by the people for the people. So all the people are rascals, beginning from the Pope down to the common man. Therefore the government is rascal.
Room Conversation with Carol Cameron -- May 9, 1975, Perth:
Carol: I would like to know why in the beginning why you came to the West. I know a bit about your background, but not very much. Why you saw the need to come.
Prabhupāda: That I was speaking. Of course, it is very strong words. That Western people they are claiming very civilized, but I have got objection. Therefore I have come to the West. Because, for example, the animal-killing. The Western people are mostly Christians. Now, Lord Jesus Christ said that "Thou shall not kill." But the result was that two thousand years passed, but the people of the Western countries, they are still killing. So when they have accepted Christianity? What is your answer?
Room Conversation with Carol Cameron -- May 9, 1975, Perth:
Prabhupāda: All right. That means you are killer of human beings. THat means, in the beginning, you are all killers of human beings. And therefore you killed Jesus Christ. That is not very good qualification. Killer of human being... He said "Thou shall not kill." Where he says that "Thou shall not kill human beings"? That is your interpretation.
Śrutakīrti: That's obvious he meant only human beings, because he himself was killing animals.
Prabhupāda: Christ was killing animals?
Śrutakīrti: Well, he instructed his own disciples to distribute the fish. So he was also involved in killing of animals.
Room Conversation with Carol Cameron -- May 9, 1975, Perth:
Prabhupāda: But supposing Christ distributed fish, but did he say that we shall maintain regular slaughterhouse for killing animals?
Śrutakīrti: He was against that. He threw the men out of the temple, because they were selling lambs in the temple to be offered at the altar. So he kicked them out, saying this temple is not a place for selling animals for slaughter.
Morning Walk -- May 10, 1975, Perth:
Prabhupāda: You have become so civilized rascal that your business is to kill other animals and eat. You are so civilized. You are still in the crude form of human being, just like in the jungles, the aborigines, the Africans, they do not know how to develop civilization—crude methods, eating the animals. That also, they are not so uncivilized that they keep slaughterhouses. You are so uncivilized that you are keeping slaughterhouses, regularly. These Africans and other jungle people they eat meat, but they directly kill. They have no such civilization as to maintain a slaughterhouse. The tigers eat meat, but they do not keep a slaughterhouse. And you are civilized. You are keeping slaughterhouse. Why should you keep? The government shouldn't allow you to keep slaughterhouses. If anyone wants to eat meat, let them eat like tigers and others. Individually, kill one animal—a lower animal, not cows. This should be the government law. You can kill one insignificant animal, like pigs or goats. It has not very much use. You kill it in your home, before your children and family, and eat. The government may not have any objection. But why should you maintain slaughterhouses?
Room Conversation with Justin Murphy (Geographer) -- May 14, 1975, Perth:
Prabhupāda: So śamaḥ means keeping the mind always equipoised, and damaḥ, the controlling the mind. And suppose if... I have to eat something to live. So God has given me so many nice foodstuff: food grain, fruits, milk. Why should I kill an animal unnecessarily, for the taste of my tongue?
Room Conversation with Justin Murphy (Geographer) -- May 14, 1975, Perth:
Prabhupāda: God has given us so many. So why should we maintain slaughterhouse, killing other animals? So a first-class man will not do that. First-class man will think that "I want to eat something to keep myself fit. If by natural products I can keep myself fit, why shall I kill another animal?
Morning Walk -- May 17, 1975, Perth:
Prabhupāda: They are doing so many things. They are killing cows for their own benefit. So many animals they are killing. Birds.
Morning Walk -- May 18, 1975, Perth:
Prabhupāda: Christ said, "Thou shalt not kill." They killed Christ. This is the position.
Amogha: When Buddha came, did most people follow Him?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Amogha: And they stopped their (indistinct).
Prabhupāda: Yes. In their religion animal-killing is strictly forbidden.
Room Conversation with Journalist -- May 19, 1975, Melbourne:
Prabhupāda: We don't say, "No sex," but "illicit sex," we forbid. Similarly we forbid meat-eating. We don't say that "Don't eat," we simply say that "don't eat meat." You can eat other things, just like we are eating so many nice things.
Journalist: Why not meat?
Prabhupāda: Because it is sinful, you are killing all animals. Your Christian religion says, "Thou shalt not kill." Why you are killing?
Room Conversation with Director of Research of the Dept. of Social Welfare -- May 21, 1975, Melbourne:
Prabhupāda: Just produce food grains. The animals can also take, you can also take. Why should you take animal?" That is recommended in the Bhagavad-gītā.
Director: But where the winters are long, people have to kill animals to have something to eat over winter.
Prabhupāda: Well, but you should have... I am not speaking for India or Europe. I am speaking the whole human society. Just try to understand.
Room Conversation with Director of Research of the Dept. of Social Welfare -- May 21, 1975, Melbourne:
Prabhupāda: So we have got food grains, we have got fruits, we have got milk. By combination of milk and food grains we can prepare so many nice palatable, full of vitamins. Why we should kill the animal? Let the animal live and take it's milk and prepare nice food, full of vitamins. Milk is nothing conversion of blood. So why do you take the blood by killing? Take the blood in a different form, milk. This is our program. Let the animal live peacefully, and if you are meat-eaters, let the animal die and you eat.
Morning Walk -- May 23, 1975, Melbourne:
Prabhupāda: Kill animals. Just see the policy. Instead of growing natural food, they will kill animal. Purposefully sinful life.
Śrutakīrti: But they still have to grow food for the animal. They're growing the food, but they give it to the animal.
Prabhupāda: Fruit?
Śrutakīrti: No, the food. They grow food for the animals, but then they kill the animal.
Prabhupāda: Just see. They can grow food both for the animals and for human being. Instead, they are simply growing food for the animals and killing them.
Morning Walk -- May 23, 1975, Melbourne:
Prabhupāda: A tiger cannot understand this. He will kill a lower animal. But you are not animal; you are man. You should have this discrimination, that "If I can live otherwise very nicely, why shall I kill animal?" That is humanity.
Morning Walk -- May 23, 1975, Melbourne:
Australian devotee 2: Śrīla Prabhupāda, in New Zealand we have a situation where the main industry is killing animals, the biggest industry, yet there is so much rain, so much nice atmosphere over there. Why is this? Why is there such a nice atmosphere but they are killing so many cows? Is that that they are innocent and they do not know and so Kṛṣṇa is not punishing them so much?
Prabhupāda: Yes, they will be punished.
Morning Walk -- May 23, 1975, Melbourne:
Australian devotee 5: "Why don't you let the vegetables die naturally before you eat the vegetables?"
Prabhupāda: Vegetable? We are not talking of vegetable; we are talking of animals. Why don't you kill your father? Old father, useless, kill him and eat.
Morning Walk -- May 23, 1975, Melbourne:
Prabhupāda: Every one of us will die," but seeing also, they do not see. And that is madman. Pramattaḥ paśyann api na paśyati. That the animal, he is seeing that "One animal is being killed. Next time is mine," but still eating grass. He has no anxiety. This is called pramattaḥ paśyann api na paśyati. This is animal life, that even though fact is there, they will close their eyes. That's all. This is animal life.
Morning Walk -- May 31, 1975, Honolulu:
Prabhupāda: Unless one is meat-eater, nobody can be disinterested in God's affairs. Only the meat-eaters, vinā paśughnāt, killers of animal. Nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānād bhavauṣadhāc chrotra-mano-'bhirāmāt (SB 10.1.4). This glorification of God is especially done by persons who are completely free from material attachment. Nivṛtta-tarṣair upagiyamanad bhavauśādhi (SB 10.1.4). And it is the medicine of getting free from this material bondage. Bhavauśādhi. And it is also very pleasing. Otherwise why they come to hear the Hare Kṛṣṇa? It's such a nice thing. Who does not like it unless he is a killer of animals? So even the killer of animals, they also hear. It is so nice. Only the gross killers, most abominable, they do not hear it.
Room Conversation with Yogi Bhajan -- June 7, 1975, Honolulu:
Prabhupāda: Heroism. That is... Just like Mahārāja Parīkṣit. He was going on his tour, and he saw one black man was trying to kill a cow. Immediately he took his sword, "Who are you? You are trying to kill cow in my kingdom?" This is called heroism. Now, where is that hero? And they are becoming president. How he will command? He is not hero. Everyone has right to live. Why they are killing animals? This is heroism. As soon as he saw that a rascal is going to kill a cow, "Why you are doing this?" Immediately he took his sword. Heroism. Then?
Room Conversation with Dr. John Mize -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:
Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa has given us so many nice things. Why should we kill the poor animals? That's not good. Because na samaḥ, there is no such vision, samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu. He is not a brāhmaṇa. He is giving the dog a bad name and hang it. Animal has no soul. What is this? Animal has no soul?
Bahulāśva: Sometimes they argue that we're killing the vegetables.
Prabhupāda: That's all right. Vegetable has also life but we are not killing. When you pluck out the flower, the tree is not killed. When you take a fruit, the tree is not killed. When you take grains, automatically they die. Then you take the grains. There is no question of killing. But even it is killing, it is not as murderous as killing a cow. Why the state hangs a man when he kills a man? The man can plead that "So many animals are being killed every day. If I kill one man, what is the wrong there?" The punishment is that "You have killed one important animal." Therefore the Bhaga..., kṛṣi-go-rakṣya, that cow should be protected because it is a very, very, important animal.
Garden Conversation with Professors -- June 24, 1975, Los Angeles:
Prabhupāda: We are also working. It is not that we are simply sitting down and chanting. Because we are chanting, therefore we are loving everyone. That is a fact. These Hare Kṛṣṇa chanters, they will never agree to kill any animal, even a plant, because they know everything is part and parcel of God. Why unnecessarily one should be killed? That is love.
Garden Conversation with Professors -- June 24, 1975, Los Angeles:
Prabhupāda: Sometimes force is required. So that killing is not bad. When the enemy is aggressive and you are killing, that killing and poor animal who is supplying milk... You are drinking milk, your mother, and you are killing. This killing and that killing is not the same thing. According to Vedic civilization the cow is to be given special protection. Why it is recommended for the cow? It does not say of other animal. When animal killing is required according to Vedic civilization, those who are meat-eaters, they are allowed to kill some insignificant animal like deer, goat, pigs. It is for the animal eaters, not for all. But if one is bent upon... And there are persons, they want meat-eating. So for them these unimportant animals are recommended. But cow is very important animal.
Garden Conversation with Professors -- June 24, 1975, Los Angeles:
Prabhupāda: For meat-eating a cow should not be killed. This is not very good civilization. If you are..., you must eat meat, then you can kill other animals. They, those who are the kṣatriyas, they were sometimes going to the forest, killing the deer. They are allowed. Because they have to learn how to kill. So by killing animals, they used to practice.
Morning Walk -- June 28, 1975, Denver:
Prabhupāda: A slaughterhouse, what is the meaning of this particular word?
Devotee (2): They're killed brutally.
Harikeśa: A specific place where all the animals are killed.
Prabhupāda: Yes. All of a sudden many animals are killed at once. So this is also slaughterhouse. When there is need, many animals will be brought into war and killed. It is slaughterhouse. And the foolish animals, they are thinking, "We are now very comfortably situated." He forgets that "I am going to be slaughtered." Mṛtyu-saṁsāra-sāgarāt, the ocean of slaughterhouse. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, mṛtyu-saṁsāra-sāgarāt. A slaughterhouse, being accepted as... It is called mṛtyu-loka. Mṛtyu-loka. So still, they are taking it as very comfortable place. This is their intelligence: a slaughterhouse is being accepted as very nice place. What is the answer of these animals who are going to be slaughtered?
Morning Walk -- June 28, 1975, Denver:
Prabhupāda: War means it is bringing all the animals together and kill them, finish. And that is happening every few years after years. The Napoleon is coming for killing, and Hitler is coming for killing. Sometimes Nelson is coming for killing. But here in India the God comes for killing. Lord Rāmacandra came for killing the Rāvaṇas and Kṛṣṇa came for killing the Kauravas.
Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:
Prabhupāda: Now countries which are overpopulated, they are not allowed to utilize the vacant land, neither people are being trained how to produce food grain. They are being trained up, technology, to produce motor tire. And nobody is interested to produce food grain. So without taking food grains, they are killing animals, and they are eating, short cut. They do not know killing of animals is sinful activity. This is the... Man is advanced; we can grow food. This killing of animals is for the non-civilized society. They cannot... They do not know how to grow food. They were killing animals. When man is advanced in his knowledge and education, why they should kill?
Room Conversation with writer, Sandy Nixon -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:
Prabhupāda: God has given to the human society so many things to eat: nice fruits, nice flowers, nice grains, first-class milk. And from milk, you can prepare hundreds of nutritious foods. But they do not know the art. They are maintaining big, big slaughterhouse and eating meat. No discrimination. That means they are not even civilized. When man is not civilized, he kills one animal and eats because he does not know how to grow food. Just like we have got one farm land, in New Vrindaban. So we are preparing so first-class preparation from milk, the neighbours they come, they are astonished that from milk such nice preparation can be done, hundreds. So that means they are not even civilized, how to prepare nutritious food from milk. Milk-accepting that cow flesh and blood is very nutritious, that we also admit—but a civilized man utilizes the blood and meat in a different way. The milk is nothing but blood. But it is transformed into milk. And again, from milk you make so many things. You make yogurt, you make curd, you make ghee, so many things. And combination of these milk products with grains, with fruits and vegetables, you make similar hundreds of preparation. So this is civilized life, not that directly kill one animal and eat. That is uncivilized life. You take the-accepting that cow's flesh and blood is very nutritious—you take it in a civilized way. Why you should kill? It is innocent animal. Is simply eating grass given by God and supplying milk. And from milk you can live. And the gratefulness is that cut his throat? Is that civilization? What do you say?
Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach:
Prabhupāda: You are also destroying so many cows daily, although you are human being. Do you consider that "Why this cow should be slaughtered?" They are also living beings. So what about the animals? If man can slaughter so many animals daily, then if a tiger kills another one animal, what is the wrong there? That is the distinction between man and animal. Everyone has to eat somebody, and nature's law is one living being is eating another living being. Jīvo jīvasya jīvanam. So the snake is eating the frog, the frog is eating another small animal or some flies, and the snake is eaten by the mongoose, and the mongoose eaten by somebody else, by cat or by dog. So this is the law of nature. Therefore the human being is suggested that "You should take Kṛṣṇa prasādam.
Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach:
Prabhupāda: If you want to eat meat, you can kill insignificant, small animal, but don't kill cows. There are other animals-hogs, pigs, goats, lambs or birds, so many, fish—if you are at all interested in meat-eating; but don't kill cow.
Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach:
Prabhupāda: Why should men kill cows for their selfish purposes? Why should men not be satisfied with grains, fruits and milk, which, combined together, can produce hundreds and thousands of palatable dishes. Why are there slaughterhouses all over the world to kill innocent animals? Mahārāja Parīkṣit, grandson of Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira, while touring his vast kingdom, saw a black man attempting to kill a cow. The King at once arrested the butcher and chastised him sufficiently. Should not a king or an executive head protect the lives of the poor animals who are unable to defend themselves? Is this humanity? Are not the animals of a country citizens also? Then why are they allowed to be butchered in organized slaughterhouses? Are these the signs of equality and fraternity and nonviolence? Therefore, in contrast with the modern, advanced, civilized form of government, an autocracy like Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira's is by far superior to so-called democracy in which animals are killed and a man less than an animal is allowed to cast votes for another less than animal man. We are all creatures of material nature.
Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach:
Prabhupāda: Nature's arrangement... In this material world you cannot eat without working. Even if you are lion-lion is considered to be the most powerful animal—he has to capture one animal. He cannot think that "Let me sleep, and the animal will come automatically in my mouth." It is not possible. You have to work; this is the material world. So that work is simple work. If you have got land... Everyone has got land. You just work little, and it will produce your food grains. And the food grains will give food to the animal and man. The animal, cow, he will eat the grass, and you will take the grains. Why should you kill the animal? You haven't got to arrange for his food. You produce paddy. The plant, when it is dried, it is good for animals, and you take the grains. Why should you kill him?
Room Conversation -- July 31, 1975, New Orleans:
Prabhupāda: One must eat something. The nature's law is that sahastānā... Sahastānām ahastāni. And catuṣ-padam. That is the arrangement by nature's way, that animals, they have no hands. So the primitive life, so they become food for the primitive natives or uncivilized man. They kill some animals and eat. And why civilized man do so? He can produce his food. God has given him land. He has intelligence. Just like our temple commander was telling us. He has got immense opportunity... Just explain to them about you are producing with the farm.
Morning Walk -- August 6, 1975, Detroit:
Prabhupāda: Those animals sometimes kill children also, small children. (break) ...padaṁ yad vipadam: "Every step there is danger." This is place. (break)
Morning Walk -- October 5, 1975, Mauritius:
Indian man (4): Swamijī? It is prohibited to consume, consume flesh, meat. It's because there is soul in the body and if we kill it, therefore we are doing a sin. I think it's because that we can't consume meat according to the Vedic literature. But what about plants, Swamijī?
Prabhupāda: Plants also, you... They are also killed. They are also killed. But this is... Plants are killed by the order of Kṛṣṇa. Therefore you are not responsible.
Indian man (4): Therefore, if we say that we can kill some animal by the order of Kṛṣṇa...
Prabhupāda: Yes, then you are not responsible. Suppose I kill one snake by the stick. The stick is not responsible; I am responsible.
Morning Walk -- October 5, 1975, Mauritius:
Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa says, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). Patram means vegetable, leaves; puṣpam, flower. In this way, whatever He says, you collect and offer to Him and take prasādam. Then you are not responsible. And if you collect for yourself even patram without offering to Kṛṣṇa, if you take, you are responsible for killing. It doesn't matter whether you kill a big animal or a small plant. You are responsible.
Morning Walk -- October 19, 1975, Johannesburg:
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But with the tire tubes and nuts and bolts they can make a tractor. And the tractor can help produce food, they think, much faster.
Prabhupāda: No, that is waste of energy. Because you are eating the bulls, therefore you require a tractor. Otherwise you don't kill the bulls. This animal will do the business of tractor.
Morning Walk -- October 19, 1975, Johannesburg:
Prabhupāda: Sometimes you take shelter of God and sometimes of your election power. If you are so firm believer in God, then why election? Let God elect. Why you take part in election? Huh? Let God elect the prime minister. Why you are busy in giving vote? (break) God elected Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira. Hm? His plan was that Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira should be king, not Duryodhana. So He killed all the Duryodhana's party and selected Yudhiṣṭhira: "Sit down here." That is God's election. So why you elect? Depend on God.
Indian man (1): And that comes through lack of spiritual knowledge, Swamiji?
Prabhupāda: Yes, no knowledge. No spiritual knowledge means he is animal. That's all.
Morning Walk -- October 25, 1975, Mauritius:
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: So by birth they want to make better men. They can't make them by culture.
Prabhupāda: No, culture... They adopt real culture. What do they know about culture? They're killing their own children in the womb, and they're cultured? Worse than the animals. The animals do not do that. These rascals, they are cultured? So wretched and fallen, and they are claiming to be cultured.
Harikeśa: So you can't culture a superior man unless you are one yourself.
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Harikeśa: It's not possible to culture a superior man unless you are one yourself.
Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all be yourself a cultured man, a gentleman. You are worse than animals. What animals cannot do, you are doing.
Morning Walk -- October 25, 1975, Mauritius:
Harikeśa: The rhinoceros or hippopotamus or some... You're trying to shoot some big animal, and if you can't do it everybody will say, "Oh, he could never do it anyway." And if he does it they all praise?
Prabhupāda: No, no, to kill animal is not very heroic. Nonsense. Innocent animal wandering and you kill. "Oh, very great hero." Again he deserves to be kicked on the face. All action, they are simply rewarded with kicking on the face. Why should you kill animal? Ātmavat sarva-bhūteṣu. If you are killed, you feel pain. Why should you kill others unnecessarily?
Morning Walk -- October 28, 1975, Nairobi:
Brahmānanda: Usually their philosophy is that anyone has the liberty to do whatever he likes as long as it doesn't hurt another, as long as it doesn't infringe on another's liberty.
Prabhupāda: Then how you are killing the animals? (break) ...eat meat, therefore you are killing poor animals. Why you are interfering others' life? (break) ...the best park here. (break) Here there is no such park.
Morning Walk -- November 17, 1975, Bombay:
Prabhupāda: Buddhism also was a necessity for the time being. They are not for all. Emergency. Just like it is going on, "emergency." It is not necessity, but sometimes we have to take emergency. Otherwise how Vaiṣṇavas are worshiping Lord Buddha? Eh? Nindasi yajña-vidher ahaha śruti-jatam: "You are always deriding the Vedic principles," śruti-jatam. Sadaya-hṛdaya-darśita-paśu-ghāṭam. This is emergency, that "You have become so much compassionate upon the poor animals because they are unnecessarily being killed." Keśava dhṛta-buddha-śarīra, jaya jagadīśa. He is glorifying, keśava dhṛta-buddha-śarīra, but showing that "You are deriding Vedic principles." So how is that, if one derides Vedic principle, at the same time, jaya jagadīśa hare?
Dr. Patel: Because the Vedic principles were not properly understood by those people at that time.
Prabhupāda: No, no, no. He directly said, "I don't care for the Vedas." Lord Buddha says. So who will worship a person who directly says, "I don't care for your Vedas"? Shall you go to worship a Buddhist or Mohammedan? No. This is emergency. Sadaya-hṛdaya-darśita paśu-ghāṭam. He cannot deride the Vedic principle, but it was necessary at the time. Otherwise these rascals will not stop.
Dr. Patel: Today, sir, the more animals are being killed than what they were killed in those days in the name of religion. Today it is in the name of the civilization
Prabhupāda: Because... No, no. Now there is no religion. "Secular." There is no religion.
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Morning Walk -- January 4, 1976, Nellore:
Devotee (3): (break) The Christians say that God has given us certain things to enjoy. Just like I was talking to one Christian about eating meat, and he said, "Well, I enjoy eating meat."
Prabhupāda: So, the tiger will say he will enjoy you. Why do you protest against the tiger?
Acyutānanda: In the Bible it says that everything was for the enjoyment of man. Man is sovereign over the animals.
Prabhupāda: Enjoyment does not mean that you kill him.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Enjoy means protection. It means protecting, not eating.
Prabhupāda: Go-rakṣya. You protect the cows and take the best food in the world, milk. That is enjoyment. Not foolishly to eat the cow.
Indian man: I am reminded, Swamijī, of one day, the tussle between two Muslims. One happened to be a high-court judge and another Fossil(?), he was always propagating that there should not be animal killed for human purposes and all those things. So on one platform I was the organizer. This high-court judge had been invited, and he began to say animal kingdom is meant for exploitation by human being.
Morning Walk -- January 4, 1976, Nellore:
You protect the cows and take the best food in the world, milk. That is enjoyment. Not foolishly to eat the cow.
Indian man: I am reminded, Swamijī, of one day, the tussle between two Muslims. One happened to be a high-court judge and another Fossil(?), he was always propagating that there should not be animal killed for human purposes and all those things. So on one platform I was the organizer. This high-court judge had been invited, and he began to say animal kingdom is meant for exploitation by human being. And this man flared up: "Where do you get in Koran? You are talking some nonsense, though you are high-court judge." It was a problem for me how to manage this high-court judge, presiding high-court judge, and this man who was a public man. Then he convinced that "Don't say all these things. Where are the passages?
Morning Walks -- January 22-23, 1976, Mayapura:
Prabhupāda: In Arabia they were to eat animal but to save him from so many dangerous and sinful life—he has to kill so many goats—better kill one life, a camel or a cow. Camel is big animal. So if you kill one animal, camel, it is equal to fifty goats.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What about a cow?
Prabhupāda: A cow is also big animal.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So they say like that?
Prabhupāda: Yes... They don't say cow. They say better kill one big animal. "So instead of becoming sinful for killing so many animals, you better kill..." And that is also sacrificed in the mosque, and that is called koravāni. Restriction is there.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So there's no... The karma for killing many goats is more severe than killing one cow.
Prabhupāda: No, no. You become responsible for each and every animal.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Irrespective of what kind of animal.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Now if you can serve the purpose by killing one animal, why should you take the risk of killing many animals?
Morning Walks -- January 22-23, 1976, Mayapura:
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Cow is going to die naturally, anyway.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Then, if you want flesh, take that dead body and eat.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Why don't they see this, that just by killing a cow you don't get more cows. They're going to die anyway.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Everyone is going to die, but they are so voracious, they do not wait up to the death, and they have theorized that "Dead animal is dangerous to health. Now kill while it is in life."
Harikeśa: Yes, they think like that.
Prabhupāda: Yes, but... They have got so many nonsense philosophy. But if that philosophy is supported, when you kill the animal, he becomes dead. (laughter)
Sudāmā: Yes, they call it "fresh meat."
Prabhupāda: Just see. "Fresh dead." Just see. The rascals are so fools that unless you make him dead, you cannot eat. So why do you theorize that a dead animal is not good?
Harikeśa: Well, 'cause he had to die from some cause, and that cause is...
Prabhupāda: Cause, all right. It is also cause. You are killing, that's all.
Harikeśa: The knife is clean, whereas the germs are...
Prabhupāda: That's all right. Formerly the Hindus, they used to purchase meat and cook it in Ganges water. (laughter)
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, boy.
Harikeśa: Purify it.
Prabhupāda: They thought, "Now it is..." And you will still find in Calcutta, "Hindu butcher." That Hindu butcher is pure. You have been in Calcutta? So they are going on.
Morning Walk -- April 9, 1976, Vrndavana:
Prabhupāda: Brāhmaṇa means perfect gentleman. A rogue, thief, cannot become brāhmaṇa. (laughs) Brāhmaṇa is perfect gentleman. Who feels for others, that is gentleman. Who does not feel for others, for his sense gratification, he is a rogue. A brāhmaṇa, a gentleman, must feel that "Why there should be animal killing?" That is gentleman. If you are killed, you cry and you are.... Hundreds and thousands of animals you are killing on the plea that they have no soul? Lowest class, narādhama. They have been described as narādhama. So narādhama civilization, how he can be happy? There must be frustration.
Morning Walk -- April 10, 1976, Vrndavana:
Nalinī-kānta: I've been reading a lot in the different books about envy. You say that people kill cows only out of envy. I was wondering if you could give a definition of what envy is. I don't understand why they would kill animals out of envy.
Prabhupāda: Envy means the cow has got right to live. He does not allow the cow to live. That is envy. You cannot understand this? Suppose you are walking. You have got right to walk, I have got, and if I kill you, you cannot walk. That is envious. Everyone has got right to live. Just like the camel. God has given their food. They are accustomed to eat these thorny twigs. So Kṛṣṇa has given that. Let them eat and live. Why should you interfere with his living condition? (break) Do not interfere with others' right. Why should you?
Morning Walk -- April 15, 1976, Bombay:
Dr. Patel: We are killing the body and not... The soul is inkillable.
Prabhupāda: No, no, no. Don't go to the philosophy. First of all come to the practical. (Dr. Patel laughs) Come to the practical point of view, that after all, you have to eat; otherwise you cannot live. Āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunam. So if you have to live another living entity, then how you can practice this ahiṁsā? Mean on the basic principle, the ahiṁsā paramo dharma, where is ahiṁsā? You have to kill. Either you kill vegetable or animal, you have to kill. Then where is the standing of ahiṁsā? That is my point.
Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:
Prabhupāda: My point is.... Just like the two points here: chastity and nonviolence. But this is not being carried out.
Guest (3): Well, we agree.
Prabhupāda: Then where is the prophet and where is the followers?
Guest (3): Well, see, the prophet is teaching the people about this and teaching them to live it.
Prabhupāda: That means people are not obeying the prophet.
Guest (3): Well, people are. We are.
Prabhupāda: Then how it is said that.... How they are killing animals? How the women are unchaste?
Morning Walk -- June 5, 1976, Los Angeles:
Prabhupāda: As soon as you become animal killer, Kṛṣṇa consciousness finished. Parīkṣit Mahārāja, vinā paśu-ghnāt. Except the persons who are killers of animals, everyone will be interested.
Morning Walk -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:
Duryodhana-guru: Śrīla Prabhupāda, in the Seventh Canto you mention that there are certain species of human life for whom certain sinful activities they don't receive any reaction.
Prabhupāda: Yes, uncivilized, they are like animals.
Duryodhana-guru: So they can perform, like, let's say for example, intoxication or meat-eating, and they won't receive any sinful reaction?
Prabhupāda: Yes, oh, yes. No. Because they are uncivilized. And you claim to be civilized and you are killing animals? Must be responsible.
Morning Walk -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:
Prabhupāda: The life is there. You make some arrangement that it will not take part. That is another thing. If it is a fact that the egg is not life, then why you rascal do not manufacture a chemical egg and get a chicken? Why you rascal talking nonsense? That is our challenge. We say "rascals" not without consideration, because actually they talk like nonsense. Rascals. They cannot do, and still they'll insist they will do. That is rascal. Is it all right? (laughs) South, South America, er, South Africa, there are so many factories of begetting chicken.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The Rainbow Chicken Factory.
Prabhupāda: Yes, the chicken factory, but they're taking the eggs from chicken. Why not manufacture small egg and give to the fermentation and come? There is no question of killing animals. Why they are taking?
Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:
Prabhupāda: In the jungle, the barbarians, they do not know how to produce food, how to utilize milk. They can kill animals. That is also not like this, by machine you kill thousands of cows. They did not know this. For their simple eating they might have killed some animals, not particularly cow. Perhaps they were not killing cows because they were getting milk. Other, nonimportant animals. But what is this civilization? I learned that in South Africa, before killing the cows, they take the last drop of milk, and then it is sent to the slaughterhouse. They are so expert that if there is still little milk, take it before her death. Is that civilization, that you are taking milk...? So Vedic civilization is as you are drinking milk from the cow, she's your mother. Actually she's mother. But what is this civilization, killing mother? Hm? Is that civilization? Take from mother whatever she can deliver up to the last drop of milk, and then kill her. Advanced civilization, scientific. Killing scientifically. This is not civilization.
Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:
Prabhupāda: In the jungle, the barbarians, they do not know how to produce food, how to utilize milk. They can kill animals. That is also not like this, by machine you kill thousands of cows. They did not know this. For their simple eating they might have killed some animals, not particularly cow. Perhaps they were not killing cows because they were getting milk. Other, nonimportant animals. But what is this civilization? I learned that in South Africa, before killing the cows, they take the last drop of milk, and then it is sent to the slaughterhouse. They are so expert that if there is still little milk, take it before her death. Is that civilization, that you are taking milk...? So Vedic civilization is as you are drinking milk from the cow, she's your mother. Actually she's mother. But what is this civilization, killing mother? Hm? Is that civilization? Take from mother whatever she can deliver up to the last drop of milk, and then kill her. Advanced civilization, scientific. Killing scientifically. This is not civilization.
Garden Conversation -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:
Prabhupāda: Sense gratification is animal civilization. And sense control is human civ.... Sense gratification is not human society. Sense gratification is not human civilization. That they do not know. Their central point is sense gratification. That is the defect. They are running on an animal civilization as human civilization. That is the defect. Sense gratification is animal civilization. And actually they are animals. If they can kill their own child, it is animal. Just like cats, dogs, they kill their own child. What is that? It is animal civilization. Who was talking that child is put into the, what is that, left luggage?
Garden Conversation -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:
Prabhupāda: Milk is nothing but transformation of the blood. So instead of taking the blood, take the transformation and live nicely, like honest gentlemen. No. They are not even gentlemen. Rogues, uncivilized. If you want to take meat, you can kill some insignificant animals like hogs and dogs which have no use. You can eat them, if you at all eat. That was allowed, hogs and dogs are allowed. Because no gentleman class will take meat. It is lower class. So they were allowed, "All right, you can take hogs, śvapaca." Lower class of men, they were taking hogs and dogs. Still, they are taking. So if you want meat, you can kill these unimportant animals. Why you are killing the animal whose last drop of milk you require? What is the sense?
Garden Conversation -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:
Prabhupāda: If you kill the cow you get the meat only one time. But if you allow the cow to live and take milk, and from milk you can make hundreds and thousands of preparations. That is enjoyment, real enjoyment. In Delhi, there are shops, very respectable shops. One side salt, and one side sweet. But the salt side or sweet side, they're all based on ghee. This preparation, dahibarā, so nice. Combination of grain and yogurt. So introduce this. They do not know. It is a new type of civilization we are trying to introduce for the benefit of the human society. They do not know it. Crude civilization. Primitive. Kill an animal and eat. And when you are civilized, you are supposed to know so many things; why should you kill the animal? You utilize the animal. This milk is taking the blood without killing. That is humanity. You are eating beef because of the blood. So if you take the blood in a different way, you get the same benefit. And if you are still ambitious to eat the meat, flesh, just wait, it will die, you take at that time. Why so hurry? Everyone will die, there is no doubt about it. So you take the dead body and eat. Why do they not?
Garden Conversation -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:
Prabhupāda: nd we have got everything. We have got feasting, dancing, chanting, philosophy, clean and spotless life.
Hari-śauri: Friendship, everything.
Prabhupāda: Yes. No animal killing. We are not envious of anyone.
Conversation with Clergymen -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:
Prabhupāda: So, we have to teach people how to refrain from sinful activities. Then, when he's pure, then God will reveal. If we keep them in sinful life, at the same time we want to preach them, it will not be possible. In the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam it is said that those who are animal killer, they cannot understand about God. Vinā paśu-ghnāt. So if in the human society unnecessary animal killing is encouraged, he will never be able to understand what is God. The greatest sinful activity, paśu-ghnāt. So in human society, unnecessarily animal killing is going on. So they are entangled in sinful activities; therefore they are unable to understand what is God.
Kern: Are you speaking specifically about all animal killing, Your Excellency? Or, how do you speak of animal killing? In other words, vegetarian living, is that what you're speaking of?
Morning Walk -- June 16, 1976, Detroit:
Prabhupāda: Christ says "Thou shall not kill," then why do you interpret? "Christ ate meat, therefore we shall open slaughterhouse," this is rascaldom. This rascaldom (indistinct). Because maybe somewhere he has eaten fish, therefore, by following in his footsteps, we shall open slaughterhouse and kill thousands of animals daily. The evidence is Christ has eaten fish. Do they not say that? And they are Christians. All others are sinful (indistinct), that's all right, why don't you kill (indistinct). Several times these Christians (indistinct).
Garden Conversation -- June 23, 1976, New Vrindaban:
Prabhupāda: Patient is always rascal fool. You cannot expect him to be intelligent. He must agree to the physician's directions. That is intelligence. He must know that he's diseased, he must follow the instruction of the physician. That much will help him. Unless one is rascal, he does not fall sick. As soon as you violate the hygienic principles, you become sick. All commit sinful activities on account of ignorance. So therefore the best advancement of civilization is not to open hospitals, but to give them a lesson that they may not fall sick and go to hospital. That is real...But they do not know. They keep the mass of people in ignorance, they fall sick and they come to hospital and number of hospitals increase, they think it is advancement. This is their idea. So even the Christians, religious persons, they also open hospital to give relief to the patient. So that is not the program. The program is why he should fall sick and come to the hospital? Precaution is better than cure. One comes to the hospital for cure, but why not take the precaution so that he may not have to come to the hospital for cure? That is Vedic civilization. They have different prescribed rules and regulations so that a person may not fall sick. The modern idea is that "Let them fall sick; we have got hospitals and treat them, and they'll be cured." But he is cured, again he falls sick. That is going on. They have no program for precaution. They have program for cure. But actually, precaution is better than cure. We are taking precaution. The other fools, rascals, they are thinking, "What these people are doing? They are (indistinct) to have no this program, that," according to them. Just like our Vivekananda, he prescribed, daridra-nārāyaṇa-sevā. The same thing—hospital. We kill all animals, and the hospital patient is given the meat for improvement of the health. But he does not know that this is not curing; he is become implicated in his karma. He has to be killed again, and eaten by the other animals. That he does not know. They do not accept karma-phala. Eh? The result of fruitive activities, (indistinct). But you will have to accept. There is no excuse. If you contaminate some disease, you must suffer from that disease. There is no excuse. So kriya(?) karma, you have to enjoy or suffer the result of karma. Karma-bandhana. But when you act for Kṛṣṇa, then you are mukta. Yajñārthāt karmaṇo 'nyatra loko yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). Karma must be there. If you work for Kṛṣṇa, then it is all right, and if you act for your sense gratification, then there is bondage. If you do not take education, if you remain fools and rascals, then you will suffer and create disturbance for others also. Therefore everyone must be educated, good citizens. It is good for him, good for others. (long pause) So you go on reading.
Room Conversation -- June 24, 1976, New Vrindaban:
Prabhupāda: Our real business is how to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. So simply for improving the condition of life, the necessities of life, if I forget my real business, is that intelligence? Therefore it is said duṣkṛtinaḥ. Kṛti means merit. But merit is being utilized for sinful activities. Take for example the meat-eaters. When man was... The uncivilized man is still there. In the uncivilized way they are living in the jungle. They require to eat something. So they stone over an animal going, and the animal dies, and then they eat. Now instead of killing the animal by stoning, if you have discovered scientific machine in the slaughterhouse to kill the animal, is that improvement? If you think this is advancement, "Now we have discovered very technical machine. Instead of stoning one animal killing, it takes so much time, hundreds and thousands of animals you can kill in one hour," do you think that is improvement? That is going on. They think this is improvement. When we were uncivilized, we were stoning some animal and killing and eating, now we are, business is the same—animal killing and eating. But we have improved the machine how to kill. This is going on. This is going on as advancement of civilization. Hmm? What is your answer? Is that advancement of civilization? Now you are civilized, instead of killing the animal, you just take milk from it without killing and make so many nice preparations, and that is civilization. But killing is sinful. You have no right to kill any animal, even an ant. Because you cannot give life to anyone. It is nature's law, God's law. So infringement on the laws of nature or God, it is sinful activities. So you are utilizing your merit for this sinful activity. Therefore it is called duṣkṛtinaḥ. Merit is there, but it is utilized for sinful activities. That is defect of the modern civilization.
Morning Walk -- June 27, 1976, New Vrindaban:
Prabhupāda: Animal-killing is only allowed when it is absolutely necessary, for medicine. Suppose by killing one animal hundreds of lives are saved, so that is allowed. One preparation is chagalaka-ghṛta. It is prepared... A live goat is put into the ghee with other ingredients, and that is a good medicine for tisis(?).
Room Conversation After Film -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:
Prabhupāda: the meat-eaters cannot be stopped. They will eat meat. So they can kill the small animals, unimportant, not cow. Kṛṣṇa says, go-rakṣya. He never said lamb-rakṣya or hog-rakṣya. (laughs) You can eat hog. If it is decided that you must eat meat, then you can eat a nonimportant animal. We have no objection.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Or at least, as you said this morning, wait until the cow dies naturally.
Prabhupāda: That is another. Otherwise, if you want to kill, you kill less important animal.
Hari-śauri: Chickens.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Give protection to the cow, the source of milk.
Hari-śauri: In most rural districts formerly, even just sixty or seventy years ago, they used to do that. The used to keep a hog or some animals for killing. They would fatten them up and kill them.
Prabhupāda: Still in India, the low class, they keep hogs for killing. And they publicly kill the hog by burning outside the village skirt.
Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:
Hari-śauri: The thing is, people are mad after meat.
Prabhupāda: Madman...
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But they still get it.
Prabhupāda: But he'll get meat.
Hari-śauri: But then their argument is that if we don't have big, big slaughterhouses, then there won't be enough supply.
Prabhupāda: No why should...? After all, the animal is going to die. It is not for..., he's permanently. Why should you kill?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But they kill the animal first in the slaughterhouse and then do whatever they have to do.
Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They sell meat..., for one pound of meat, they can get sometimes two dollars, three dollars, four dollars. So much money...
Dhṛṣṭadyumna: But the government has inspectors, a team of inspectors. No meat can be sold unless it is inspected, and then they want to examine the conditions.
Prabhupāda: So let them inspect. What is the wrong there? It should be open. If the inspection, there is nothing wrong, then they can do this business.
Hari-śauri: Generally, though, their inspection is when the animal is alive, they check to see that he has no disease. Then they can be killed. But if an animal dies naturally, then generally it is to be supposed that it dies from some malfunction within the body, that there may be some diseases or whatever. So then...
Prabhupāda: That is artificial.
'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:
The law of nature is working very silently, subtle. But they do not know. Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate (BG 3.27). Rascal is so fool that he thinks that "I can do everything, whatever I like." Similarly, killing of animal. "Life is eternal," one can argue, "then what is wrong? Even I kill, the soul is alive." No, the same argument that this soul was to live in a particular type of body under the laws of nature, and you have checked, and he has to take again a similar body to fulfill the duration.
Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:
Prabhupāda: take the example of Christ. But because he ate fish, so because we eat vegetables, therefore a good cause for eating father and mother? For killing child?
Devotee (2): Śrīla Prabhupāda, they say that only the human has a soul, therefore it's wrong to kill humans. But other animals you can kill because there is no soul. That is their argument.
Devotee (3): They'll ask what should be killed and what shouldn't be killed for eating? Where do we draw the line?
Prabhupāda: No, you, we are speaking go-rakṣya. That is not point of view of killing. There are other animals. We do not say that you stop. If you want to eat some meat, at least don't kill cow. You can kill other insignificant animals which has no importance. Cow has got special importance because it supplies milk, and milk is very essential food that is... From the childhood, a child lives on milk, and there are many saintly persons, they also live by drinking milk. Milk is very important item in the human society, and it supplies all vitamins. Even if you say that "Meat-eating is essential for me," you can eat other animals, but don't kill cows. That is our proposal. Give protection to the cows. Kṛṣṇa mentioned specifically, go-rakṣya. He does not say that you don't kill, but you give protection to the cows. And if you want to eat meat, you can kill other animals. On the whole, paśu-hiṁsā, any animal killing, is not good for spiritual life. And so far vegetable is concerned, everyone has to eat something. So if you can eat vegetables, that does not mean because somebody is killing vegetables, he should kill his own father and mother on that plea. So cow is mother because we are drinking her milk. So you cannot put any argument in favor of killing mother. If you... Anyone who supplies milk from the body, she is mother. According to Vedic civilization, cow is one of the seven mothers. There are seven mothers: the real mother, ātma-mātā guroḥ patnī, the wife of spiritual master; then queen, rāja-patnikā. Ātma-mātā guroḥ patnī brāhmaṇī, the wife of a brāhmaṇa. In this way, especially, seven mothers, dhenu, dhenu means cow, and dhātrī, nurse, she is also mother. So from that point of view, cow is mother, and you cannot kill on any ground the mother. That is not good reasoning. You are taking the last drop of milk.
Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:
Guest (1): Prabhupāda? For every animal except the cow, you said, like a..., does a person have to pay off a one-to-one ratio for the animal killed? He just has to come back one time for, like, killing a goat? Is it just one time then, instead of many times?
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: His question is that is there some formula, that if you kill one animal or one thing then you get killed in the exact same ratio? You kill one thing, you get killed once. So in other words, if you are responsible for killing hundreds and hundreds of animals throughout your lifetime, does one have to take birth hundreds and hundreds of times and be killed?
Prabhupāda: Yes. For killing, you cannot kill even vegetable.
Evening Darsana -- July 10, 1976, New York:
Prabhupāda: It is my order that you stop if you love me." Here is... You cannot open slaughterhouse, giving reference to the Vedas or any sacrifice, either in the Muhammadans, Jews and everyone. They also make sacrifice. One day in the year they sacrifice. It is not that they recommend open slaughterhouse. This is all nonsense, rākṣasa. That sacrifice also recommended in this sense, that you cannot stop animal killing; there will be a class of men who'll eat meat. To give them some concession, so this is recommended, "All right, if you want to eat meat, you sacrifice." Amongst the Hindus, just like Kālī-pūjā, Durgā-pūjā, the animal-eaters, they are given this concession, that "If you want to eat meat, you just worship Goddess Kālī," and this Goddess Kālī worshiping is recommended on the amāvasyā, on the dark moon night, one day in a month, and the dead of night. So if one goes on eating meat in this way, one day in a month and dead of night, then he automatically will give it up. "So much botheration. Better give it up." Actually denies. "Yes, you can eat once in a month and at the dead of night, when everyone will sleep, nobody can hear the screaming of the animal." These are the recommendations. That is indirectly denying. If one is intelligent, he'll accept it that "Why so much botheration for eating meat? Better give it up."
Room Conversation -- July 10, 1976, New York:
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's a special article about prasādam, Prabhupāda, called "Food for the Gods." "Of all the ways of getting to heaven, or nirvāṇa, or whatever your ideal place may be, the Hare Kṛṣṇa way is one of the most pleasant. Believers of this faith are convinced that you can eat your way into higher spiritual realms. Of course, this doesn't mean that food itself is sacred and the more you eat the holier you are. To begin with, there is a strict prohibition against the killing of animals, so meat, fish and eggs are not included in the diet at all of the Kṛṣṇa devotees. Furthermore, there are many special rules for preparing the food which may be offered to Kṛṣṇa to be blessed by Him and therefore to bring blessings to anyone who partakes of it." Should I read this whole article?
Prabhupāda: Um, hmm.
Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:
Prabhupāda: We are interested in eating Kṛṣṇa prasādam. If Kṛṣṇa says "Give Me meat," we shall give Him. But He does not say. He says patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). Meat-eating is sinful, that's a fact, amedha, tāmasika, but if you remain in the darkness of ignorance, you cannot improve your spiritual life. Tāmasika. It is described in the Bhagavad-gītā, rājasika, tāmasika, sāttvika. Therefore we should eat sāttvika, and that is also after offering to Kṛṣṇa. Then we are free from all sinful reactions. And if you want to implicate yourself in sinful activities, then you can eat whatever you like. But either you eat meat or vegetables, if it is eaten for my satisfaction of the tongue, you become implicated in sinful activities, and you have to suffer the reaction. The animal you are killing, he'll kill also you next life. Then you become bound up.
Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:
Prabhupāda: Atheist class of men, they did not recognize existence of God, so He became one of them. Sadaya-hṛdaya darśita-paśu-ghātam. This atheist class, they were killing animals in the name of yajña like anything. So yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati (BG 4.7), so He came as Buddha to stop this animal killing. His real business was stop the animal killing, that these rascals are going to hell in the name of religion, so at least stop their activities of animal killing. So therefore he started the mission, ahiṁsā paramo dharma: "Don't kill animals." But in the Vedas there is recommendation, in the yajña, as you were saying, that there is..., animal killing is recommended. So people presented that "Here is animal killing recommended in the yajña." Therefore he denied the authority of Vedas. Nindasi yajña-vidher ahaha śruti-jātaṁ sadaya-hṛdaya darśita-paśu-ghātam. So this Buddha incarnation is cheating the atheist class of men. He said that "Don't kill animals. If you are killed you feel pain. Why you should kill animals?" That was his mission, to stop animal killing, sinful activities. So what was your question?
Indian man (4): I just asked why he has preached impersonal form of God.
Prabhupāda: Yes, because they were all godless, so he said, "There is no God, but you stop this animal killing." That was his mission. And he said, "There is no God, but whatever I say, you accept." So they agreed. But he is God. That is cheating. Superficially he said there is no God, but he is God. Somehow or other, if people stop animal killing and accept Lord Buddha, then he becomes at least one step forward to God realization. So in a cheating process he made good to others.
Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:
Dhṛṣṭadyumna: "Lord Buddha, a powerful incarnation of the Personality of Godhead, appeared in the province of Gayā (Bihar) as the son of Añjanā, and he preached his own conception of nonviolence and deprecated even the animal sacrifices sanctioned in the Vedas. At the time when Lord Buddha appeared, the people in general were atheistic and preferred animal flesh to anything else. On the plea of Vedic sacrifice, every place was practically turned into a slaughterhouse, and animal killing was indulged in unrestrictedly. Lord Buddha preached nonviolence, taking pity on the poor animals. He preached that he did not believe in the tenets of the Vedas and stressed the adverse psychological effects incurred by animal killing. Less intelligent men of the age of Kali, who had no faith in God, followed his principle, and for the time being they were trained in moral discipline and nonviolence, the preliminary steps for proceeding further on the path of God realization. He deluded the atheists because such atheists who followed his principles did not believe in God, but they kept their absolute faith in Lord Buddha, who himself was the incarnation of God. Thus the faithless people were made to believe in God in the form of Lord Buddha. That was the mercy of Lord Buddha: he made the faithless faithful to him. Killing of animals before the advent of Lord Buddha was the most prominent feature of the society. They claimed that these were Vedic sacrifices. When the Vedas were not accepted through the authoritative disciplic succession, the casual readers of the Vedas are misled by the flowery language of that system of knowledge. In the Bhagavad-gītā a comment has been made on such foolish scholars. The foolish scholars of Vedic literature who do not care to receive the transcendental message through the transcendental realized sources of disciplic succession are sure to be bewildered. To them, the ritualistic ceremonies are considered to be all in all. They have no depth of knowledge. According to the Bhagavad-gītā, the whole system of the Vedas is to lead one gradually to the path of the Supreme Lord. The whole theme of Vedic literature is to know the Supreme Lord, the individual soul, the cosmic situation and the relations between all these items. When the relation is known, the relative function begins, and as a result of such a function the ultimate goal of life of going back to Godhead takes place in the easiest manner. Unfortunately, unauthorized scholars of the Vedas become captivated by the purificatory ceremonies only, and natural progress is checked thereby. To such bewildered persons of atheistic propensity, Lord Buddha is the emblem of theism. He therefore first of all wanted to check the habit of animal killing. The animal killers are dangerous elements on the path of going back to Godhead. There are two types of animal killers. The soul is also sometimes called the animal, or the living being. Therefore both the slaughterers of animals as well as those who have lost their identity as the soul are animal killers. Mahārāja Parīkṣit said that only the animal killer cannot relish the transcendental message of the Supreme Lord. Therefore if people are to be educated on the path of Godhead, they must be taught first and foremost to stop the process of animal killing as above mentioned. It is nonsensical to say that animal killing has nothing to do with spiritual realization. By this dangerous theory many so-called sannyāsīs have sprung up by the grace of Kali-yuga to preach animal killing under the garb of the Vedas."
Prabhupāda: Now there are so many rascals in this dress of sannyāsī, they are eating meat. That is going on. They say, "What is the wrong of eating meat? Can eat." They eat meat. Then?
Dhṛṣṭadyumna: "The subject matter has already been discussed in the conversation between Lord Caitanya and Maulana Chand Kazi Shaheb. The animal sacrifice as stated in the Vedas is different from the unrestricted animal killing in the slaughterhouse."
Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:
Prabhupāda: Suppose it is recommended that animals should be sacrificed in the Vedic ritualistic ceremony. Does it mean that you shall open regular slaughterhouse? Just as the Christians say that Jesus Christ ate fish, therefore they are right in opening big, big slaughterhouse? Maybe Lord Jesus Christ ate fish in some awkward circumstance, but that does not mean that he is recommending to open slaughterhouse. In the Ten Commandments he says, "Thou shalt not kill." When there is absolute necessity, there is no other food, that is another thing, but if there is sufficient other foodstuff, why should you kill? They are not even human being, those who are animal killers. Vinā paśughnāt (SB 10.1.4). Those who are animal killers, they are not even human being, what to speak of religious system. Nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānād bhavauṣadhāc chrotra-mano-'bhirāmāt ka uttamaśloka-guṇa (SB 10.1.4). If you are animal killer, your God consciousness is finished. You'll never be able to understand what is God. Then your life is finished. This life is meant for understanding God, and if you are animal killer, then your God understanding is finished.
Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:
Dhṛṣṭadyumna: "The animal sacrifice as stated in the Vedas is different from the unrestricted animal killing in the slaughterhouse. Because the asuras or the so-called scholars of Vedic literatures put forward the evidence of animal killing in the Vedas, Lord Buddha superficially denied the authority of the Vedas. This rejection of the Vedas by Lord Buddha was adopted..."
Prabhupāda: Just like, you said that in the Vedas there is animal killing, therefore... (break) That was not killing. So, instead of wasting his time he said "I don't care for your Vedas. It is my order that you stop if you love me." You cannot open slaughterhouse giving reference to the Vedas, or any sacrifice either. The Jews, and everyone, the Muhammadans, they also make sacrifice. One day in the year they sacrifice. It's not that they recommend open a slaughterhouse. This is all nonsense, rākṣasa. That sacrifice also recommended in this sense, that you cannot stop animal killing, there will be a class of men who will eat meat—to give them some concession. So this is recommended, "All right, if you want to eat meat, you sacrifice."
Morning Walk -- July 11, 1976, New York:
Prabhupāda: After all, you cannot protect. Why you give trouble at the time of death? You cannot protect; your foolish attempt will not help him. This is the same philosophy, that the animal is suffering, to kill him. Mercy of killing, what is called?
Morning Walk -- July 11, 1976, New York:
Rāmeśvara: Also the Eskimos, when a man gets old, if he is an Eskimo, then he has to go out into the icelands and wait for some animal to kill him. He cannot stay at home and be supported by the family.
Morning Walk -- July 13, 1976, New York:
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: This man Theodore Roosevelt, he was one of the presidents. He was a big hunter, he used to kill animals. And in front it says that he was famous for being a natural conservationist, protecting nature.
Prabhupāda: By killing.
Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York:
Prabhupāda: Physical life, so you must keep yourself fit to execute Kṛṣṇa consciousness. It is not our desire that you become sick and you cannot chant. But our purpose is to chant and we require the physical necessities just to keep ourselves fit, not more than that. Eating is necessary. Without eating, I will die. So we take Kṛṣṇa prasādam, not in the restaurant or hotel anything, no. We take nice vegetables, nice food grains, rice, wheat, sugar, milk, all vitaminous, full of vitamins. So there is no deficiency of food. Even from food value it is very nice. We do not unnecessarily kill animals.
Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York:
Prabhupāda: No, we do not do anything which is harmful to the society. We do not do anything, not only to the human society. To the animal society, to the tree society, to the aquatic society, we do not do anything. We do not support the slaughterhouse, killing the animals. Kṛṣṇa consciousness means to see every living entity on the same level. Paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). We are not cruel to anyone. Either he's a man or animal or tree or bird.
Interviewer: Does that take on a positive aspect as well so that by not only do I not kill animals and I don't kill men, do I, am I obliged under your system, am I obliged to actively help...
Prabhupāda: Yes, suppose if you are coming to kill me, then I must take advantage of killing you first.
Room Conversation -- July 26, 1976, London:
Prabhupāda: Nuts and bolts, tire tube, gas, this, that.... Where is food? (laughter) "So just kill the animals. That's all. You'll get food." And how long you'll go on? The animals will.... And no more animals die? Then what they'll do? Animal, after all, they live on grains and grass, but one set or two set or three set you can kill and eat. The next...? Then you have to eat dry grass. It is a wrong civilization. Duṣkṛtina. There is no water. They are flying to the Mars planet. What is the Mars planet news? Any news?
Conversation with George Harrison -- July 26, 1976, London:
Prabhupāda: It is the sinful activities of the populace. That is real problem. They are all engaged in sinful activities. Especially this innocent animal killing. These are the all reaction.
Radio Interview -- July 27, 1976, London:
Prabhupāda: Most of our preparations are made from milk products. Therefore we are so much fond of cow protection. It gives the basic principle of palatable foodstuff. But these people, they do not know. They simply cut the throat of the cow and boil it and with salt. (laughter) They do not know how to keep the cow and take milk from it and prepare hundreds and thousands of nice preparations. That is a lack of civilization. Just like all the, what is called, aborigines, they find an animal, kill it and eat. They do not how to utilize the animals. Most aboriginal. We keep cows, we take milk, and from milk we make yogurt, we make ghee, and from ghee we prepare so many things.
Room Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:
Prabhupāda: Wrong, one thing is wrong in my country, and that is right in your country. Just like animal slaughter is wrong according to our Vedic civilization. Unnecessary animal slaughter is forbidden. But in your country or in other Western countries, they kill so many animals. So what is wrong, what is right? Who will decide?
Moustafa: That's the reason I don't kill animals and I don't eat meat. For three years now.
Prabhupāda: That's very good, very good idea. When we want God, to understand, we must try to understand what is God. What do you mean by God? The God definition is given in the dictionary, what is that? "Supreme being, supreme controller." So how do you understand that supreme controller? What do you mean by supreme controller? In this way we should try to understand what is the idea carried by the word God. We have got, in our Vedic language, we have got definition of God, that
Evening Darsan -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:
Jñānagamya: You cannot kill all the chickens.
Prabhupāda: No, even they kill, they are killing, but killing facility will be there if there is chicken. Just like a tiger in the jungle. They are very expert, but they do not get food daily. Because the other animals, they also know, that part of the jungle there is tiger. They avoid going there. So he doesn't get daily food. He kills one animal and keeps it hidden and takes little, little. He cannot... They are always hungry, although they have got good strength, but where is the opportunity? And there is one small animal, he's called feow.(?) As soon as the tiger gets out to find out some prey, this small animal warns, "feow." The other animals will understand the tiger is coming. So despite getting good strength, good jaws, good nails, there is no food. He's dependent. If God supplies him, then he'll get opportunity. Otherwise, these nails and jaws and strength are useless.
Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:
Prabhupāda: So if by your brute force you want to kill the poor lamb, then you'll be punished. This is natural. You have got your food, you produce your foodgrain and you eat. Why should you eat another animal? God says that annād bhavanti bhūtāni (BG 3.14), you must eat to become strong. But that does not mean you'll eat another brother. Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā (ISO 1), whatever He has designated, you eat like that. You are human being, you can produce food. You grow foodstuffs, rice, wheat, fruit, flowers, vegetables. That is allowed. Annād bhavanti bhūtāni, you produce anna, why should you kill an animal? And offer it to Kṛṣṇa, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam (BG 9.26). He never says that "You give Me an animal." Patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam. So you produce patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalam, and offer to Kṛṣṇa, and then take.
Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:
Prabhupāda: If you cannot produce your food, uncivilized animals, they cannot produce their food. But you are given the chance of becoming human being, if you cannot produce your food, if you do not know how to cook food, how to offer it, then you are not human being. You are animal. When the uncivilized man in the jungle, they did not know how to produce food, they used to kill animals. So if you want to remain in the same uncivilized status of life, then where you are human being? You have got greater intelligence, you produce your food. Why should you kill animal like the uncivilized jungle men? Your action is just like jungle man, and you are claiming to be civilized man.
Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:
Prabhupāda: There is sense, but by force they are covering the sense. So we have to awaken them by handling carefully, that's all. Caitanya Mahāprabhu, jīv jāgo, jīv jāgo gauracānda bole. Who are... Uttiṣṭhata jāgrata prāpya varan nibodhata. They are sleeping. We have awaken them, that's it. That is preaching. Even the animal-killing, where it is absolutely necessary... So according to any religious principle, there is God. Just like who was telling me? You were telling me about the lamb killing? The injunction is the mouth(?) should be toward Mecca. Is it like that?
Morning Walk -- August 14, 1976, Bombay:
Dr. Patel: The non-monsoon countries can produce more food than the monsoon countries. The monsoon comes only three months in a year. Those people get rain all year 'round, they can grow better crops. This is how so many parts of North America and Europe, they can have sufficient crops all the year. We can't have it here.
Prabhupāda: No, there is scarcity of water also. They are killing the animal premature. They cannot do it. It has come to this point.
Dr. Patel: (indistinct) in favor of vegetarians. We are fools raising fodder and this thing and again raising animals on that and feeding on that. Why can't we directly feed on poor animals? I think the human race will survive more that way than by eating animals, but economically it is more sound.
Prabhupāda: Certainly. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is recommended, annād bhavanti bhūtāni (BG 3.14). Kṛṣṇa never said māṁsād bhavanti bhūtāni. Kṛṣṇa never said. This is artificial. In the lower stage of human civilization when they cannot produce food they do not know how to do it, so the animals are killed. What can they do? But actual food is anna, food grains. Even for the animals.
Room Conversation -- August 16, 1976, Bombay:
Prabhupāda: Avyabhicāriṇī, yes. Māṁ ca yo 'vyabhicāreṇa bhakti-yogena sevate. Avyabhicāreṇa. Sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26). He is above three guṇas. So if I am still under the modes of material nature, that means I'm not in avyabhicāriṇī-bhakti. This is the warning. Therefore Lord Buddha rejected Vedas.
Dr. Patel: Because, sir, in the name of Veda people were misbehaving.
Prabhupāda: Vedas, when Lord Buddha wanted stop animal killing, these rascals came with Vedas. "Vedas there is sacrifice, there is animal killing." So he thought that these rascals will create botheration. By bringing Vedas, there is... He said, "I don't care for it."
Morning Walk -- August 23, 1976, Hyderabad:
Prabhupāda: One animal is eating another animal. That is another thing. But that does not mean species finished. That is nonsense.
Harikeśa: No, I didn't mean. So the human being, the animals can't kill off the human being so that the people have to do it.
Prabhupāda: Huh? What is that?
Harikeśa: The people have to do it to maintain the population level. We have to kill some of the children so that it doesn't become out of control, like the animals do it.
Prabhupāda: You are less than animal. You are greatest animal. You want to kill your children.
Vāsu Ghoṣa: But they have no life. There is only you know an amoeba in the womb.
Prabhupāda: Don't talk nonsense, waste time. All rascals proposal. Don't indulge in this rascal theory.
Indian devotee: Now there is a society for prevention to the cruelty to animals. At the same time they are killing the animals also.
Room Conversation on New York court case -- November 2, 1976, Vrindaban:
Prabhupāda: When men are uncivilized, they do not how to grow food, they kill animals in the jungle and eat. When they are civilized, they know how to grow food now and the nice food grains, fruit, flowers, now why should say, "You eat the meat." The meat-eating is meant for the most uncivilized persons. That means they do not know even how to eat. They do not know how to eat. How to eat, how to sleep, how to have sex. Nothing.
| Page Title: | Killing animals (Conversations, 1974-1976) |
| Compiler: | Labangalatika, Shyamasuhagini |
| Created: | 17 of Jan, 2011 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=164, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 164 |