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Injunction (Conversations)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview -- September 24, 1968, Seattle:

Prabhupāda: Of course, faith is the basic principle of everything. If you have no faith, then you cannot make progress in any line of action. So in Kṛṣṇa consciousness is also... Faith is the basic principle. Just like I have come here. I started my classes in New York. So I was alone chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. Somebody came. Naturally, out of inquisitiveness, somebody comes. Somebody came and, "Oh, what this Indian swami is doing? Let me see." So he sat down. Some other came. He sat down. Then some of them took it, "Oh, Swamiji speaks very nice. Let me come again." He comes, he comes, and then he gets some faith: "Oh, Kṛṣṇa consciousness is very nice." Then next point is that he wants intimate relationship with the swami, or me: "Swamiji, I have heard you so many days. I think it is very nice. So I want to be your student." So faith is the basic principle. The next stage is that he wants to become a student. And as soon as he wants to become a student, the next stage is that I accept him a disciple if I think that he is suitable. Then as soon as he becomes a disciple, he follows my regulative principles, injunctions. Then gradually he becomes free from all misgivings and naturally he gives up that illicit sex life or gambling or meat-eating and so many other things. In that way he becomes fixed up. Then he develops a taste; he cannot give up the society, taste. Then attraction, attachment. He wants to do everything for the society. In this way he develops love of Kṛṣṇa. And in the final stage he loves only Kṛṣṇa and nobody else. And because Kṛṣṇa includes everyone, that means he loves everyone.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation With John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison -- September 11, 1969, London, At Tittenhurst:

Prabhupāda: He said, brahma-sūtra-padaiś caiva hetumadbhir viniścitaiḥ (BG 13.5). He refers that "This scientific knowledge, the Absolute Truth, is explained very nicely in Brahma-sūtra, Vedānta-sūtra." He refers to the book. Another place Kṛṣṇa says,

yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya
vartate kāma-kārataḥ
na sa siddhim avāpnoti
na sukhaṁ na parāṁ gatim
(BG 16.23)

"Anyone who does not follow the scriptural injunction, his attempt will be failure. He'll never be happy. And what to speak of being promoted to the spiritual world.?" These things are there. How you can say Kṛṣṇa has not recommended to read books?

1970 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) Muhammad, he also did not believe in the Vedic literature. But according to Vedic literature, anyone who does not believe in the Vedic literature, he is nāstika. Just like the Mohammedans, they say, "Anyone who does not believe in Koran, he is kafir." The Christians say, "Anyone who does not believe in the Bible, they are heathens." That is there everywhere. Similarly, Lord Caitanya said that veda na manīyā bauddha haila nāstika. He is giving the definition because we have to follow the great personalities, great ācāryas. That is our process. We do not make any research, or we do not make any statement made by us. We simply accept the injunctions given by great ācāryas. Ācāryopāsanam. That is the process of Vedic system. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). One must approach a spiritual master and learn from him. So whatever spiritual master says, that is accepted. Sādhu guru śāstra vākya. Real evidence is, it must be stated in the scriptures, it must be explained by the spiritual master or saintly persons. That is evidence.

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: Śāstra-vākya-pramāṇa. And it should be known through the spiritual master. Just like nowadays Bhagavad-gītā is being interpreted in so many foolish ways because they do not accept explanation from the authority. They become themselves authorities. Therefore misused. That is not explanation. Somebody is explaining that Kurukṣetra means this body, pañca-pāṇḍava means the senses. These are all nonsense. You have to accept Bhagavad-gītā as it is. When you cannot understand, you should get it explained by your spiritual master. Therefore one has to accept a spiritual master to understand. Tad-vijnanārtham. In order to understand that transcendental science one must approach a bona fide spiritual master. That is injunction. So here it is said that kānyakubje dvijaḥ. Dvijaḥ means he was offered the sacred thread. That means he was born in a brāhmaṇa family. Janmanā jāyate śūdraḥ. Everyone is born a śūdra, a foolish. Sudra means a foolish man who simply laments. That is the real meaning of śūdra. Anyone who has no intelligence, he is śūdra. We also generally say, gadāh, less intelligent. So brāhmaṇas, kṣatriyas, vaiśyas, they are called higher caste. According to their... Brāhmaṇa, first-class because his intelligence is first-class. Kṣatriya, his intelligence is second-class. Vaiśya, his intelligence is third-class. And śūdra means fourth-class. And less than śūdra, they are called pañcama, caṇḍāla.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 17, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: Maybe, but we do not know.

Guest (1): Therefore beyond that, you see, I came...

Prabhupāda: Just like Kṛṣṇa. We accept Kṛṣṇa the supreme authority. Kṛṣṇa says, mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja. Who is accepting this? We have accepted. Some others may have accepted but you have not accepted. So therefore even Kṛṣṇa's injunction is not accepted by everyone, what to speak of others? So therefore you cannot find out within this material world anything which can satisfy everyone. That is not possible.

Guest (1): We have not found that.

Prabhupāda: You may think, but we have concluded that there is nothing, such thing, which can satisfy everyone. It is not possible.

Guest (1): Until we hear all, we may do that...

Prabhupāda: That may be an ideal, but we take Kṛṣṇa as the highest authority. Even Kṛṣṇa's words are not accepted. That's a fact. Kṛṣṇa says, "You surrender unto Me." So a few persons might have surrendered to Him. Even Kṛṣṇa was present, only the Pāṇḍavas and the inhabitants of the Vṛndāvana and Dvārakā, some of them understood that Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme. But many did not accept Him. Many insulted Him. Just like Śiśupāla insulted Him. So even Kṛṣṇa could not be accepted.

Room Conversation -- January 17, 1971, Allahabad:

Guest (1): I did not take that...

Prabhupāda: No, no, I don't mean you. Anyone. Anyone. If for ordinary things we have to call for an expert, to understand God is it not necessary to approach an expert? What do you think, Manuel?

Manuel: Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: That is... Therefore the Vedas says, tad-vijñānārthaṁ: "In order to know that transcendental science," sa gurum evābhigacchet, "he must go to a guru. He must approach." A guru means not bogus guru. One who knows expert. But one has to do that. There is no other alternative. That is the injunction of every Vedic śāstra. And this order is from the Kathopaniṣad. Then, on the Bhagavad-gītā the same thing is said, tad viddhi praṇipātena (BG 4.34). Praṇipāta means surrender. Surrender where? Where to surrender? To a coolie? No, to a superior person, guru. Similarly, Bhāgavata says, tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsur śreya uttamam: (SB 11.3.21) "One who is inquisitive to understand the spiritual science," tasmād, "therefore," guruṁ prapadyeta, "must surrender to a guru." Just our, this morning prayer is guru, beginning of life, beginning of day's work, first worshiping guru.

Room Conversation -- January 17, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: He knows Sanskrit very well. Compulsory. Therefore it is said, gacchet-compulsory. Tad-vijñānārtham... Tat, the transcendental knowledge, vijñāna, that is science. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum eva niścayate (MU 1.2.12). Eva is niścayate. Eva means certainly. And again gacchet, "must go." Now, just like to be educated, one must be admitted in a school, must be. Now, what kind of school he has to select, that is another thing, but he must. That's a fact. Similarly, you have to accept a guru. Now, whom you will accept a guru, that is another thing. But you have to do it. That is the injunction of all śāstras. Vedic process is like that. This upanayana, the sacred thread, upanayana. Upa means near, and nayana means bringing. Anayanam, coming or going, like that, nayanam. So "to go near the spiritual master," upanayana.

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Prabhupāda: Now one thing... The other day I was speaking to some... Where I was? In Bombay, I think, I was speaking some respectable gentlemen that "Kṛṣṇa says:

māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya
ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ
striyo vaiśyās tathā śūdrās
te 'pi yānti parāṁ gatim
(BG 9.32)

Kṛṣṇa says, 'Even those who are low-born, pāpa-yoni—the striya, vaiśya and śūdra, they are also included—but by accepting Me, accepting my shelter, they are also elevated to the transcendental position.' Now, why the higher class of Hindu society, they neglected this injunction of Bhagavad-gītā? Suppose one is pāpa-yoni. Kṛṣṇa says that 'They can be elevated to the transcendental position if they accept Me.' Why this propaganda was not done by the higher class people so that the so-called pāpa-yoni could be elevated? Why you rejected them? The result was that the Mohammedans... Instead of accepting them, you rejected them, and they have partitioned, and they have gone away, and they have become eternal enemy of India." You see? So this is the first time that we are trying to elevate to the highest position of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, even one is in the pāpa-yoni. It doesn't matter because soul is pure. Asaṅgo 'yaṁ puruṣaḥ. The Vedas says, "The soul is untouched by any material contamination." Simply, temporarily, he is covered. This covering should be opened. Then he becomes pure. That is the mission of human life, to uncover ourselves from this material envelopment and come to the spiritual understanding, surrender to Kṛṣṇa. Life is perfect.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation Including Discussion on SB 4.13.48 to SB 4.14.11 -- January 18, 1972, Jaipur:

Prabhupāda: Henry, Henry, yes. So he revolted, not being controlled, revolted against being controlled by the priestly order. Here also we see, purohita amātya-suhṛd-gaṇādayaḥ. When the king left, then the priestly order, purohita, purohita means priestly order, amātya, amātya means ministers, and suhṛd-gaṇādayaḥ, suhṛt means those who are willing welfare of the state, they became very much aggrieved that the king has left.

alakṣayantaḥ padavīṁ prajāpater
hatodyamāḥ pratyupasṛtya te purīm
ṛṣīn sametān abhivandya sāśravo
nyavedayan paurava bhartṛ-viplavam
(SB 4.13.49)

So they were afraid of some political convulsion. So although the son was worthless, so they decided that "Let us make him king. Otherwise, without king, how the state can go on?" So

bhṛgv-ādayas te munayo
lokānāṁ kṣema-darśinaḥ
goptary asati vai nṟṇāṁ
paśyantaḥ paśu-sāmyatām
(SB 4.14.1)

Because there was no king, so people became always like..., almost like animals. Paśu-sāmyatām. Paśu means animal, and sāmyatām means equal. So when there is a political, less strong political situation, not very strong government, at that time a class of men take advantage. Just like in Calcutta. Because the government was very lenient, not very strong, a demonic class of men took advantage of it and they began to create atrocities and fearfulness in Calcutta city. We have seen, practically people are not going out after evening, they are always staying in the fearful state. Nobody knows whether he will come back home again when he goes out of his home on the street. People are so much disturbed. So in the absence of strong king, these people take advantage and create disturbances. That is always there. So that happened. The people became paśu-sāmyatām. Therefore, the sages called a meeting of all respectable ministers and saintly persons and brāhmaṇas and decided, "Let us make this boy king." So he was enthroned. But because he was demonic, he was very strong. So as soon as he became king, all the bad elements of the state, they stopped their nefarious activities. Śrutvā nṛpāsana-gataṁ venam atyugra-śāsanam. They knew that this king is very strong and for any little criminal action, he will strike very severely. So the bad elements, they subsided.

śrutvā nṛpāsana-gataṁ
venam atyugra-śāsanam
nililyur dasyavaḥ sadyaḥ
sarpa-trastā ivākhavaḥ
(SB 4.14.3)

Ivākhavaḥ. Just like the rats, they understand that the snake is there so they go inside the ground and they disappear. Sometimes rats, everyone knows, everywhere as soon as the house is very old, there are many rats. And as soon as there are rats, the serpent will come, the snake will come. So to keep the rats, that is also very dangerous. So one after another, the nature's arrangement is there. So the example is given that nililyur dasyavaḥ sadyaḥ sarpa-trastā ivākhavaḥ.

sa ārūḍha-nṛpa-sthāna
unnaddho 'ṣṭa-vibhūtibhiḥ
avamene mahā-bhāgān
stabdhaḥ sambhāvitaḥ svataḥ
(SB 4.14.4)

In this way, when he became very much powerful, he began to neglect the orders of the great sages, brāhmaṇas, and respectable gentlemen. He became very much upstart.

evaṁ madāndha utsikto
niraṅkuśa iva dvipaḥ
paryaṭan ratham āsthāya
kampayann iva rodasī
(SB 4.14.5)

So he became so strong that when he was traveling in the state, everyone was trembling. So very strong king. In this way, when he became too much powerful, then he began to preach atheism. That is the way. The rākṣasī, the demonic way is there. If a demon becomes powerful—just like nowadays it is going on—somehow or other if somebody becomes powerful, he doesn't care for the śāstric injunction or religion or God. They don't care for it. Just like there are many instances, Rāvaṇa, Hiraṇyakaśipu, like that. So he also became like that.

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Indian man: How to please God's representative?

Prabhupāda: You have to carry out his order. That's all. God's representative is guru. So he's asking you to do this, to do that. If you do that, that is pleasing. Yasyāprasādān na gatiḥ kuto 'pi. If you displease him, then you are nowhere. Therefore we worship guru. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktas tathā bhāvyata eva sadbhiḥ **. A guru should be accepted as God. That is the injunction of all śāstras.

Bob: The guru should be accepted as representative of God?

Prabhupāda: Yes, guru is representative. Guru is the external manifestation of Kṛṣṇa.

Bob: But different than, like the incarnations of Kṛṣṇa that come?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bob: In what way is the external manifestation of the guru different than the external manifestation of, let us say, Kṛṣṇa or Caitanya when They come to earth.

Prabhupāda: Guru is one, representative of Kṛṣṇa. So there are symptoms who is guru. The general symptoms are described in the Vedas. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ gurum evābhigacchet, śrotriyaṁ brahma-niṣṭham (MU 1.2.12). The first symptom is śrotriyam. Guru is in disciplic succession. One who has thoroughly heard about the Vedas through his spiritual master. This is general description.

Room Conversation -- April 1, 1972, Sydney:

Prabhupāda: Change, I say. How the changes take place? You are changing. You are changing from your childhood to boyhood, boyhood to youthhood. So there is a plan. Unless there is plan, why one child is not, by chance, becomes immediately old. What the nonsense will reply? Let the rascal reply this, that here is a chance, that one child immediately becomes old man, by chance. Why there is process? This is plan. So you should have depth of knowledge, otherwise you will be carried away by these rascals. We cannot be carried away by these rascals. We never so easily believed that they are going to the moon planet. You see? We have to scrutinize everything. Yes. That is brahminical qualification. A brāhmaṇa will not accept anything simply because it is said by some rascal. A śūdra will accept because he has no intelligence. That is the difference between brāhmaṇa and śūdra. It is not a caste system. It is classi..., guṇa karma vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13), division of high qualities and actual activities according to that quality. They misinterpreted. Because by the influence of Kali-yuga everyone is śūdra, so he does not know what is the actually brahminical qualification. Therefore there is, I mean to say, competition: "Why this man should be done?(known?) I am as good as he is, and why he should be called brāhmaṇa? He should be given greater facility?" So actually it has happened so. A so-called brāhmaṇa, caste brāhmaṇa, he is working his intelligence like śūdra, and he is claiming, by birthright, brāhmaṇa. There must be protest. This has happened. Otherwise, that division is perfect, guṇa karma vibhāgaśaḥ. Anyone who comes to that quality, he becomes brāhmaṇa. That is the injunction of the śāstra. Kṛṣṇa says guṇa karma vibhāgaśaḥ. You have no qualification, you do not work according to your quality, and why you are claiming a brāhmaṇa? That is self-evident. Guṇa karma vibhāga. He never said by birth, never said. Kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ. "In this age, Kali-yuga, all śūdras." Therefore they accept everything cheaply and at once, the śūdras.

Room Conversation -- April 20, 1972, Tokyo:

Sudāmā: Shall I save one for later for you?

Prabhupāda: No. No saving. (laughter) Give me immediately. (laughter) Give them.

Devotee (2): Prabhupāda? Your Divine Grace? I have a question. I was always under impression or understanding from your teachings, that one never eats in front of the Deities. Can you please explain that? Cause I understand you are pure devotee.

Śyāmasundara: He says that he always understood that one should not eat in front of the Deity. What is the difference?

Prabhupāda: Difference is generally we should not eat before the Deity. But there is another injunction, prasādaḥ prāptir mātreṇa bhoktavyaḥ. As soon as we get prasāda you should immediately eat (laughter. Sound of Prabhupāda eating prasāda.) Take this. So we shall have to go there?

Śyāmasundara: Yes. We can go now. Here is some water. You can wash out the window. It's dirt below.

Prabhupāda: Everyone got? Everyone? No, I shall go there. (end)

Morning Walk -- June 14, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Thieves, stealing from each other.

Prabhupāda: That's all. They don't want to see people very enlightened. "It is folly to be wise where ignorance is bliss." But at least how to become wise, that injunction has been given to you. Now you try to save the country, how to do it. These people will not be. You'll have to educate the people, and they'll vote you to the senators, president, and then your country will be nice. Just like by Kurukṣetra, Kṛṣṇa smashed all Duryodhana and company, and He posted Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja. That is the Kṛṣṇa's politics. He wanted to smash all these demons and have His own men posted on the royal throne. When Kali could not penetrate into the daily behavior of the people, he planned killing of Parīkṣit Maharaja. So, one Kali brāhmaṇa cursed him to death, for no fault practically. Therefore the brāhmaṇas of this age, they are condemned. The so-called caste brāhmaṇas, they're condemned. That is lamented by the father of the boy who cursed Parīkṣit Maharaja. (japa) (end)

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1972, San Diego:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the statement of the śāstra. Kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ: "In the Kali-yuga everyone is śūdra."

Guest (2): So only those who have independent means, then, would come in the...

Prabhupāda: They can be counted, yes. Because a brāhmaṇa is advised not to accept service at any circumstances. That is the injunction of the śāstra. He can take the profession of a kṣatriya or a vaiśya, but not the śūdra. That is brāhmaṇa.

Guest (2): So whoever cannot stand on his own legs as an independent businessman or landlord or whatever it be, he's a śūdra.

Prabhupāda: Yes. These are described in the Bhagavad-gītā. I have not manufactured these things. These are śāstra, that "He's brāhmaṇa,"—the qualification. "He's kṣatriya,"—qualification. "He's vaiśya,"—qualification. "He's śūdra—by qualification." And Nārada Muni says, but we have to judge by the qualification. Yasya yal lakṣaṇaṁ proktaṁ puṁso varṇābhivyañjakam, yad anyatrāpi dṛśyeta tat tenaiva vinirdiśet: (SB 7.11.35) "These are the qualities of different caste. If it is found in other place, you should designate him according to the quality." Just like a man born of a brāhmaṇa family, but if he has got the śūdra qualities, then he should be śūdra. And a man born of a śūdra family, if he has got the qualities of brāhmaṇa, then he must be designated as brāhmaṇa.

Room Conversation -- July 4, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: That you... Actually one is guided by Jesus Christ, he'll get liberation, certainly. But it is very hard to find out a man who is actually being guided by Jesus Christ.

Bob Cohen: What I think about is the Jesus freaks, the..., these people that, young people that have joined this Jesus movement, and they read the Bible very often, and they try to...

Prabhupāda: But to read the Bible, but violate the Bible injunction, injunction. How they can kill if they are following the Bible?

Bob Cohen: I asked one. They said..., he said he claimed that Jesus was also eating meat in the Bible. But I don't know.

Prabhupāda: But that's all right. He, he may eat anything. He's powerful. But he has ordered, "Thou shalt not kill." You must stop killing. He is powerful. He can eat the whole world. You cannot compare with Jesus Christ. You cannot imitate Jesus Christ. You shall have to abide by his order. That is your position. Then you are guided by Jesus Christ. That is actually obedience. You cannot imitate. That is explained in Bhāgavata, that those who are īśvara, those who are empowered, they will do anything, but we cannot imitate. We have to abide by his order. "What he says to me, that I will do." You cannot imitate. If you say that "Jesus Christ ate meat," admitting that, in what condition he ate meat, if you do not know, then Jesus Christ is contradicting his statement. He's eating himself meat, and he's advising others not to kill. Do you think Jesus Christ is contradicting?

Bob Cohen: No.

Interview with the New York Times -- September 2, 1972, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: That is because their purpose is not strong. That is due to māyā, forgetfulness. Just like darkness and light; if your light is strong, there is no darkness. But if you have no light, or if your light is not very strong, there is darkness. This is the principle: If you want to drive away darkness, you must bring light. That is the only medicine. You don't have to make a separate endeavor to drive away darkness. As soon as you bring light, darkness will go. The motto of our magazine Back To Godhead is: "Godhead is light, nescience is darkness. Where there is Godhead there is no nescience." This is also the Vedic

injunction: Don't remain in darkness; come to the light. How is this possible? When I flew to London from Los Angeles, there was no darkness, for we did not allow the sun to set, you remain always in light. This means that if you don't forget Kṛṣṇa, your life will be successful. If you aim your plane westward and don't stop, you will remain in sunlight all the time. Similarly, if you remain in Kṛṣṇa consciousness by the simple method of chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare, Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare, you will never see the darkness. This is because Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa's name are absolute; Kṛṣṇa is not different from His name. Kṛṣṇa is light, and if we associate with the name of Kṛṣṇa, we remain in light. Remaining in light is a very simple method; therefore you see all these boys with their beads chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare. In this way māyā cannot touch them.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Christ says that "Thou shall not kill." They are killing every moment, and still they say, "What we have done?" How nonsense they are, and they are heads of the Christian religion. They are violating in every step...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The leaders.

Prabhupāda: ...the injunction of the scripture, and still they say, "We do not know." So many drunkards priest, they are going to hospital for treatment ,and they are eating, and they are getting married man to man, and still they say, "We do not know what we have done." Just see how cheaters they are.

Jayatīrtha: In the last six years...

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Jayatīrtha: In the last six years in the Catholic church, 25,000 priests have left and taken up...

Prabhupāda: 25,000?

Jayatīrtha: 25,000 in six years.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Jayatīrtha: Have left the Catholic church, priests.

Morning Walks -- October 1-3, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: (Sanskrit) He makes everything, but He is not attached. (break)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: ...how do you know that guru is qualified, spiritual master is qualified? Then I said everything is written in the śāstras, so we have to follow according to the injunctions written in the śāstras. So all the qualifications of a pure devotee, of a bona fide guru, is written there. Just like you are a professor of physics in the university. Before you came, you had some qualification, degree of doctors. And then there is a committee to decide you whether you are qualified for the post. So it is selected by a committee of members and then they interview and then they find out your qualifications. If they find that you are qualified for the post, so you are selected as a professor. It's like that in the spiritual field also. There are revealed scriptures and there everything is written what will be the qualification of a guru and then how to choose a bona fide one. So everything is written, you should follow the injunctions of the revealed scriptures accordingly.

Prabhupāda: Committee is his spiritual master, he orders that you do this.

Jayatīrtha: The test is to see how much one is actually following the orders of his spiritual master.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 27, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: Utsṛjya, vidhim utsṛjya, yes. Find out that.

Devotee: Chapter Sixteen, verse twenty-three. Yaḥ śāstra vidhim utsṛjya vartate kāma-kārataḥ, na sa siddhim avāpnoti na sukhaṁ na parāṁ gatim (BG 16.23).

Prabhupāda: Translation. Translation, read.

Devotee: "He who discards scriptural injunctions and acts according to his own whims, attains neither perfection nor happiness nor the supreme destination."

Prabhupāda: That's it. (Hindi) ...bogus, bogus. This is statement of Kṛṣṇa. Can you give us the statement of Kṛṣṇa? I'll accept some foolish statement. So Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, He's also giving reference to the śāstra, yaḥ śāstra. He can say anything, everything, He's God Himself, still He gives reference to the śāstra. So anyone who's speaking against the injunction of the śāstra, (indistinct). There is another verse, find out, tasmād śāstra pramāṇaṁ te, tasmād, (indistinct).

Devotee: Tasmād.

Prabhupāda: Śāstra. (pause) Tasmād śāstra...

Devotee: I see, tasmād sarveṣu kāleṣu. (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: In the same Sixteenth Chapter, you will find, this verse, tasmād. (indistinct)

Devotee: It says t-a-s-m-ā-c, tasmāc...

Prabhupāda: It is really tasmād, it has become c, and by sandhi. Tasmāc-chāstra.

Conversation with Mr. Wadell -- July 10, 1973, London:

Mr. Wadell: No. But where does your perfect knowledge come from and how do you recognize it?

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is very important point, where to get the perfect knowledge. That is wanted. That is intelligence. Therefore the Vedas says, gurum eva abhigacchet: "You go to a guru." "Guru" means heavy, who knows better than you, or who knows perfect. That is injunction.

Mr. Wadell: But, you see, this is...

Prabhupāda: We have to find out, we have to find out who can give the perfect knowledge.

Mr. Wadell: How do you know that you know? May I ask this? (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Mr. Wadell: This is the point which, I would find, you know, without disrespect, this is something which is very difficult, whatever kind of faith you have.

Prabhupāda: It is not the question of faith. Faith may be wrong, belief may be wrong. That perfect knowledge can be received from the perfect source. So God is perfect. God is perfect. And one who follows the path of God, he is also perfect.

Room Conversation with Reporter from Researchers Magazine -- July 24, 1973, London:

Reporter: Hm. Hm. But then why there are three words, karma, vikarma, akarma? There are three.

Prabhupāda: That... Vikarma means..., karma means you act according to the injunction of the śāstra. That is karma. And vikarma means when you violate the injunction of the śāstra.

Devotee: Violate.

Prabhupāda: Violate.

Reporter: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. "You should not do this." Just like in the śāstra it is said that you should not indulge in sinful activities.

Reporter: Hm. That's the vikarma.

Prabhupāda: That is vikarma. If you act sinfully, against the injunctions of the śāstra, then it is sinful, that is vikarma. And akarma means which does not produce any other result. That is akarma. Karma, akarma, vikarma. Yes. But generally we act, we indulge in karma to get some result. And that is karma. That is not vikarma. Vikarma, when you act against the principles of sinful activities, no, no, when you act as sinful activity, just like striyaḥ sūnā (Sanskrit). Four kinds of sinful activities are described in the śāstras: illicit sex life. You can not indulge in sex life without marriage, that is illicit, that is sinful. So killing animals unnecessarily, that is sinful. Then intoxication, that is sinful. And gambling. These are sinful activities. So when you do not obey the orders of the śāstra and engage yourself in sinful activities, that is vikarma, you're becoming bound up being entangled. Therefore bhakti is the safest platform, because you do not produce any more karma. Whatever karma you have to act, it is finished in this life. Karmāṇi nirdahati kintu ca bhakti-bhājām (Bs. 5.54). Otherwise, beginning from ant, up to the Brahmā, everyone is bound up by the reaction of karma.

Room Conversation with Rosicrucians -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: But is there such rules and regulation or injunction from the society that "You do not kill." Just like Bible there is, "You shall not kill." So they have no such thing.

Yogeśvara: He says Jesus ate meat and furthermore there is a sect in the Orient that wears gauze over their mouth so as not to kill microbes while they breathe. But we are killing those microbes. We have killed these flowers.

Prabhupāda: So they are to satisfy everyone.

Yogeśvara: Don't you think we are killing other living beings?

Prabhupāda: That is another thing. (break)

Yogeśvara: ...study everything.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) They haven't got their own anything. Simply they are studying.

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor -- August 13, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: And another place, Bhāgavatam, there is statement of Nārada, advising Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira that yasya yal lakṣaṇaṁ proktaṁ puṁso varṇābhivyañjakam. There are symptoms, brāhmaṇa system, śamo damas tapaḥ śaucaṁ kṣāntir ārjavam (BG 18.42). It is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Yasya yal lakṣaṇaṁ proktaṁ puṁso varṇābhivyañjakam, abhivyañjakaṁ varṇa. Yad anyatrāpi dṛśyeta tat tenaiva vinirdiśet (SB 7.11.35). This is the injunction of Nārada, "The symptoms, brahminical symptoms, if it is found in the person who is born in a śūdra family, he should be accepted as brāhmaṇa. And if the śūdra symptoms are visible in a person born in a brāhmaṇa family, he should be accepted as śūdra." And in the Jābāla Upaniṣad, the Satyakāma Jābāla... So Satyakāma was born of a maidservant, but he wanted to become brāhmaṇa. So he went to Gautama Muni: "Sir, make your disciple." In those days, Vaidic brahminical culture, without becoming brāhmaṇa, he cannot be initiated. Initiation means to make one brāhmaṇa.

Room Conversation -- November 4, 1973, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: There are many instances but this is the injunction of the śāstra. And practically also. Suppose a man is a medical practitioner. He may be born in a brāhmaṇa family or śūdra family. Nobody wants to know to which family he belongs to. If he sees that he is a medical practitioner, he has passed the MD examination and that he is practicing then people accept him as doctor, medical man. Nobody asks him, "Are you a brāhmaṇa, then I make my treatment with you?" Nobody asks that. So, this is śāstric injunction. Then later on this caste brāhmaṇism, śūdraism made the whole thing, whole Hindu culture, Vedic culture spoiled.

Room Conversation -- November 4, 1973, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: So Nṛsiṁha-deva replied, "Don't be worried about your father. Not only your father, but your father's father, his father, up to 14 generations because a devotee like you, because you are born in this family, 14 generations they are also liberated." Best service. If your daughter can give best service to your family by becoming a devotee. She gives service to you, to your husband, to your husband's father, your father, that is the śāstric injunction.

Guest: What exactly is a devotee?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Guest: What exactly is a devotee?

Prabhupāda: Devotee means he does not know anything better than Kṛṣṇa, that's all.

Guest: But suppose a man who is working in life with always that consciousness, is he...

Prabhupāda: What is that consciousness?

Guest: That he knows nothing but Kṛṣṇa. (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: That his actions will prove.

Morning Walk -- December 4, 1973, Los Angeles:

Yaśomatīnandana: How can you convince that we are the real genuine people?

Prabhupāda: That you will have to learn, just like you have to go to school, there is injunction. But if you do not know what is school, go to a cow farmer(?), then that is your fault. If I say, "You go and purchase this from the market," suppose you have to purchase gold, but you go to a storefront, milk seller, how you will get the gold? That intelligence you must have, that where gold can be had. You must go to the person who is dealing really with gold. But if you do not know, then you will be cheated. That much knowledge you must have.

Hṛdayānanda: That is book distribution.

Devotee (2): Just like there are some good schools and some bad schools.

Prabhupāda: And because now they're so fallen, they do not go, neither they know; therefore we are canvassing, "Here is a school."

Morning Walk -- December 5, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: All clean, and you can walk very nicely. In Bombay.

Yaśomatīnandana: And lot of people can see you. And they bow down to you?

Prabhupāda: If they do not, what can I do?

Yaśomatīnandana: Well, no, if they do, then they will go to Vaikuṇṭha. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: That is our śāstric injunction, that as soon as you see a sannyāsī, you must bow down. Otherwise, you should fast one day. It doesn't matter, I or you. This is the injunction of the śāstra, that sannyāsī is supposed to be the guru of the society. So one must bow down.

Yaśomatīnandana: Prabhupāda, in our movement there are so many sannyāsīs. If we see the sannyāsī, same, so many times in one day, we should bow down every time we see him?

Prabhupāda: If you can, of course.

Śrutakīrti: It wouldn't hurt.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...this time He used to take His saṅkīrtana party for strolling all over the city.

Morning Walk -- December 6, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Especially not to kill cow. That animal is very, very important to the human society. According to the Vedic system, those who are meat-eaters, they are recommended to kill some goat or some other animal. Not cow.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Now, there's sometimes, Śrīla Prabhupāda, when these animals are sacrificed according to śāstric injunctions.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I think they are benefited.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they are benefited.

Karandhara: Also the animal also has the chance to come back in it's next life and kill the person that killed the animal.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- December 7, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes, I'll present you. So you have to take training from me. You have to make your eyes to see Him.

Dr. Wolfe: We want to.

Prabhupāda: That is the... Yes. But if you refuse to be treated, if you don't go to the physician, then how you'll be? You are blind now. There is cataract. Now you have to treat in a surgical operation. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). This is the injunction.

Karandhara: You see, that step requires faith.

Prabhupāda: Not faith, practical.

Karandhara: Initially it must be, there must be faith in the guru.

Prabhupāda: Practical. If you want to learn something, you must to go the expert. That is not faith; it is a fact. You cannot learn anything by yourself. That is not possible.

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prajāpati: But is it true, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that sometimes the spiritual master has to suffer if his disciples act in sinful ways?

Prabhupāda: The same way. Bodily suffering. Infection. The spiritual master accepts the all infection. So as the infection acts on the body, so there is little suffering. Kṛṣṇa says, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi (BG 18.66). Kṛṣṇa says, "All the sinful reaction of the surrendered soul..." So spiritual master is the representative of Kṛṣṇa. So he has also to accept. (break) ...the injunction is one should not accept many disciples. But for preaching work we have to do that. (break)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: ...to finish my thesis, so I won't be able to come every day in the morning.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. You do your duty. (break)

Prajāpati: Śrīla Prabhupāda, I'm so sorry that you have to suffer cause we're such rascals.

Prabhupāda: No, no. I'll not suffer.

Karandhara: Then don't be rascals.

Prajāpati: Thank you, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Morning Walk -- December 21, 1973, Los Angeles:

Jayatīrtha: To downtown Los Angeles and Hollywood.

Prabhupāda: In New York, everywhere, every town, our men go and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and sells books. That's it. (break) ...order. Yāre dekha tāre kaha kṛṣṇa-upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). Whomever you meet, you just deliver the instruction of Kṛṣṇa to him. That's all. This is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission. Yāre dekha tāre kaha kṛṣṇa-upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). (break) (Hindi) They have got a cultural department, but not for helping this. And then... (Hindi) This is my position. Just see. (Hindi) That is the śāstric injunction. Kīrtana means about Viṣṇu. But these Ramakrishna men will say, "Why not Kālī?"

Guest (1): No, no, no, they never say that.

Prabhupāda: But they say that.

Guest (1): No sir. I am attending their lectures, classes, and discussing with them.

Prabhupāda: Vivekananda's philosophy is yata mata tata patha: "Whatever you have got, your opinion, that is all right." They organize Kālī-kīrtana in competition to...

Guest (1): Yes, in their mandira. In the mandira. In the mandira their kīrtana is Kālī-kīrtana.

Prabhupāda: But that is not recommended in the śāstra. Śāstra is: śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ (SB 7.5.23).

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 3, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Karandhara: There are so many misrepresentations.

Prabhupāda: Because their folly is... They therefore do not take authority. Otherwise they'll be exposed. Yes. śāstra-cakṣusā. Yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya vartate kāma-kārataḥ (BG 16.23). These are the injunctions. (dog barks) Yes, come on. We have got your punishment. So there is an argument: pala bonatu hoya (?). "I'm not afraid of you. Although I'm, I'm going away, I'm not afraid of you. (laughter) Don't think that I am afraid of you." This is dog business. They'll go, "gow!" and go away, go away. They'll not come forward. Come on. (laughter) (break) Well, our every day is a New Year. Nava-navayauvana. Our Kṛṣṇa consciousness is so nice, the more you advance, you see new year, new year. That's all. Nothing is old. People are seeing that they are simply chanting the old slogan, Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Devotee: Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: But we are feeling new pleasure in every moment. Take any other chanting, you cannot chant more than few hours. But the Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra we can chant perpetually. So unless there is new enlightenment, how we can do that? (break) You can preach here, and then we are starting on the..., by the fourteenth. We shall go together to India. Is that all right? What do you think?

Karandhara: Are you bringing your boys over there?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Gurukṛpā: They're going separate.

Karandhara: Oh.

Morning Walk -- January 11, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes, if you love children for making them Kṛṣṇa conscious, then it is loving Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa wants sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). So if you help... What is our movement? Why I have come to your country? Because to make you Kṛṣṇa conscious. So there is love of Kṛṣṇa. Otherwise why what is the business, I have come to you? I have no business. Because I love Kṛṣṇa, I want to see all, everybody in the world to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. Otherwise why in this old age we are trying so much? Similarly, if you love your children to make them Kṛṣṇa conscious, then produce hundreds of children and make them. That is love of Kṛṣṇa. And if you make them cats and dogs, then one children producing is also sinful. That is also sinful. But if you can make them Kṛṣṇa conscious, then produce hundreds of children. That is Kṛṣṇa's love. The Bhāgavata says, pitā na sa syāj jananī na sā syāt. "One should not become father, one should not become mother..." na mocayed yaḥ samupeta-mṛtyum, "...if he cannot deliver the children from the imminent hands of death." That is the condition. So if you cannot make... Death cannot be avoided unless one becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious. So if you cannot make your children Kṛṣṇa conscious and stop their death, birth and death process, then don't become a father. This is the injunction. And if you can actually do that, then become father of hundreds children. This is the condition. If you cannot make your children... If you can make, that is love of Kṛṣṇa. Because unless you love Kṛṣṇa, why you should be interested to make others Kṛṣṇa conscious? Let them go to hell. Why you should be so much working hard to make them Kṛṣṇa conscious? Unless you love Kṛṣṇa? This is the sign of love." I love Kṛṣṇa, but I do nothing for Kṛṣṇa." That is nonsense. That is nonsense. Therefore I said that our Guru Mahārāja's brother, he criticizes Guru Mahārāja. But what he has done for Kṛṣṇa? And what my Guru Mahārāja has done? Unless my Guru Mahārāja had produced me, how this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is going all over the world? And what he has done? Simply criticizing is no use. We want to see practical. Do you understand or not?

Candanācārya: Yes.

Morning Walk -- January 22, 1974, Hawaii:

Bali Mardana: Is that an example of free will, that someone can choose Kṛṣṇa and then turn away? That example of free will?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because if you accept Kṛṣṇa, then you must follow what Kṛṣṇa says. If you don't follow Kṛṣṇa, then what is the use of talking of Kṛṣṇa? Kṛṣṇa says, satataṁ kīrtayanto mām: (BG 9.14) "Always chanting about Me." That is mahātmā. Satataṁ kīrtayanto māṁ yatantaś ca dṛḍha-vratāḥ (BG 9.14). Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ: (BG 9.13) "Mahātmā, those who are devotee, they are not under these material influence." Daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ: "the spiritual influence." So how he's accepted Kṛṣṇa? By his own concoction? He... If he accepts Kṛṣṇa, he must abide by the injunction of Kṛṣṇa. (break)

Bali Mardana: ...that the disciple should not let outsiders touch the feet of his spiritual master.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Bali Mardana: In the Caitanya-caritāmṛta, in the purport. But in India so many people try to touch. Should they be restrained?

Prabhupāda: No, that is... Spiritual master should be respected. Where it is said that?

Nitāi: The Seventeenth Chapter, one purport where it talks about a brāhmaṇa woman who came to touch the feet of Lord Caitanya; immediately He went and jumped in the Ganges. You remember that section?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. That is... He's not a devotee. He's not a, he was not a disciple.

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Guest (2): (Hindi) (break)

Prabhupāda: ...there is human form of life. If you do not know, then you remain animal. Āhāra-nidra-bhaya-maithunaṁ ca samānam etad paśubhiḥ narāṇām: "Eating, sleeping, sexual intercourse, and defense—this is there in the animals." And if you remain in that jurisdiction only—eating, sleeping and sexual intercourse and defense—you are animal, no more than animal. Why you are thinking that you are more than animal? You are animal. This is the śāstric injunction. You are no better than animal because your business is eating, sleeping, sexual intercourse and defense. Whole world is busy.

Guest (1): And then, Swamiji, this birth control, that means going against the...

Prabhupāda: They are more than animals.

Guest (1): No, no, that just means going against the will of the God.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, yes.

Morning Walk -- March 6, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: ...the practice is that you should simply desire what your spiritual master says. Don't desire yourself. Yasya prasādād bhagavat-prasādaḥ **. If you fulfill the desires of your spiritual master, then Kṛṣṇa will be pleased." Because he's the representative, the immediate representative, boss, if you satisfy him, the master, supreme master, is also satisfied. If he gives report, "This clerk is doing nice," that is sufficient. Yasya prasādād bhagavat-prasādaḥ **. This is the injunction.

Jayapatākā: So human life was no advantage. Only because you have come, now it can be advantage.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Jayapatākā: Human life is no special advantage. Only if you come, the spiritual master comes, then it can be some advantage.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore Vedic injunction is gurum eva abhigacchet: "You must go to a bona fide spiritual master if you want to make your life perfect." There is no question whether I shall go or not. "You must!" That is the beginning of human life. Otherwise animal life. He has no spiritual master. He's not going to obey anyone. He's working in his own whims. That is animal life. Real life here begins.

Morning Walk -- March 27, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, no.

Guest (1): ...because my wife is staying there. Because Prabhupāda has also created something, good thing. (break)

Dr. Patel: I'm very sorry that... You have misunderstood me. I said this is the strict injunctions. You did it under a command, but that...

Prabhupāda: But this cannot be carried.

Dr. Patel: And then people were so...

Prabhupāda: If you make some injunction which is impossible to carry...

Dr. Patel: Now! Kāla-dharma. That was a different kāla. That was a different time. Now they have also made some, so many... (break) ...they talk also, emergency, they talk also. In the Emergency Room, they talk also with the ladies. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...still going on.

Morning Walk -- March 27, 1974, Bombay:

Guest (1): The more we try to stop, it is increasing.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (1): That is the principle. (break)

Prabhupāda: That is the injunction, that is in śāstra:

mātrā svasrā duhitrā vā
na viviktāsano bhavet
balavān indriya-grāmo
vidvāṁsam api karṣati
(SB 9.19.17)

Mother, sister, daughter. Even with them one should not... In solitary.

Dr. Patel: That is what Swami Nārāyaṇa says. He says from the same Manu-smṛti. (breaks)

Prabhupāda: ...seven years. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Dr. Patel: (talking constantly in background to somebody else) And these boys are very good students because they are... (break) ...this dating business. I hate this word date itself. Eh?

Prabhupāda: Well, this hating... You hate for something, he hates for something else. That is going on.

Dr. Patel: But this dating... That is why I to... I mean, I did not see my wife before I married her. And we were very happy all the life. (break)

Prabhupāda: That is not happening nowadays. Now, when... One girl is visited many times, and she becomes pregnant. Then marriage takes place.

Morning Walk -- March 27, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: This is maintained by Vedic injunction. Just like people are very much attached to fruitive activities. They are attached to that. They do not want to go beyond. The karmīs. Karmīs, their whole ambition is how to go to these heavenly planets. He does not know that what is the benefit of going to the heavenly planets? He does not know. Therefore he is amazed by the chandāṁsi, Vedic chandāṁsi. Yām imāṁ puṣpitāṁ vācam, veda-vādinaḥ. So they are especially attached to these Vedic...

Chandobhai: Injunctions of action.

Prabhupāda: Fruitive activities. They do not accept this: ā-brahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ punar āvartino 'rjuna (BG 8.16). They'll not. "No, no. We shall go to..." Just like these rascals are going to the Candraloka. Candraloka. (laughter) Now other rascals supporting them: "Oh, now we are..." (laughter)

Dr. Patel: The Americans rascals are going there.

Prabhupāda: No, many other rascals are going also. And Indian rascals are supporting that, "Oh, now science is so advanced. Now there is no question of this Bhagavad-gītā. Now we have to go to the moon planet."

Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: You can manufacture your own way...

Dr. Patel: I'm not manufacturing, I'm not manufacturing. Nowhere Veda say you kill the animals, and eat them away. They, our forefathers were so clever as to kill them and bring them living again.

Prabhupāda: Every sacrifice, every sacrifice there is written in injunction of Vedic...

Dr. Patel: Sacrificing means you're sacrificing your own...

Prabhupāda: You may mean something, but actually, that is not the meaning. That is the difference. You may mean something. The point is that you may follow. In the Vedas there are different ways, but you cannot decry the authority of the Vedas. That is the point.

Dr. Patel: The ideal Vaiṣṇava will not say this. The ideal Vaiṣṇava. Even Vedas say to kill an animal anytime, I won't. I won't kill it, I won't eat it. I'll not eat even in England as a student of London University-meat.

Prabhupāda: I'm recommending you to eat meat?

Dr. Patel: No, you eat the..., indirectly so.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That's all right, they came to talk with me, representing Swami Narayan.

Dr. Patel: I represent Swami Narayan. Let us talk.

Prabhupāda: It is difficult to do it. You say something, he says something...

Dr. Patel: He's wrong... What Swami Narayan has written is right or wrong. That is his own handwriting. His own writing. Kṛṣṇa... (break) That is the injunction. Those fools are right or I am right?

Prabhupāda: Avaiṣṇava muhur jnena puta harir gatam. (?)

Dr. Patel: Mm, that's it.

Prabhupāda: Śravaṇaṁ na kartavyam. (?)

Dr. Patel: Śravaṇam, same thing. Don't hear anything we...

Prabhupāda: A Vaiṣṇava does not like to kill, but Kṛṣṇa Himself killed so many demons.

Indian man (3): But Kṛṣṇa has got the right to kill. (everyone laughs)

Prabhupāda: He induced Arjuna to kill, His devotee.

Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: But that is not śāstra. Why you are accepting that śāstra? (laughter) He's nonsense. If he accepts something nonsense śāstra, he becomes nonsense. Our plea is let us learn from the standard book, Bhagavad-gītā, and study, not bring anything else. That will give us proper guidance.

Dr. Patel: (break) ...that is completely verse.

Prabhupāda: No, no, I said that in the Vedas there are so many injunctions for different men, because the population, the sattva, rajo, tamo-guṇa, some of them are śūdras, some of them are kṣatriyas, some of them are vaiśyas, some of them are brāhmaṇa; therefore different ways of inducing them is there. But because something is there for inducing the śūdras in the Vedas, you cannot say, "No, this is not required." That is also required, for the śūdras, not for you.

Indian man (4): No, but then he...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Vedas means helping everyone. Traiguṇya-viṣayā vedāḥ. Traiguṇya-viṣayā vedāḥ.

Indian man (3): It is the māyā.

Prabhupāda: By killing, yes. Nistraiguṇyo bhavārjuna. Your aim should be to go above this qualities of material.

Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: But Vedas are describing... When Vedas are describing something for the benefit of the śūdras, because it is meant for the śūdras, you cannot condemn it.

Dr. Patel: But then you should not take part in it.

Prabhupāda: No, no, that is all right. My point is that something is meant for the śūdras.

Dr. Patel: No that's right, but he has not condemned the yajña, he has made the injunction that you must not take part...

Prabhupāda: That's right... Just like in a drug shop, there are... (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. There are many kinds of drugs. So something is not meant for a certain patient. But he cannot say, "I don't like this drug."

Dr. Patel: Right. (Sanskrit)

Prabhupāda: That is also drug...

Dr. Patel: Right.

Prabhupāda: For certain persons, for a certain patient.

Morning Walk -- March 29, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: This thing is being done, I know, in a big temple in Mathurā. When there is big crowd, they put off the electric, and the rascal goes within the woman. I know that. In Vārāṇasī also, in Viśvanātha Temple. They do like this.

Indian man (4): I know, I have seen. That is why this injunction... So now you are satisfied that these injunctions are right.

Prabhupāda: No, you... My point was that because something is not meant for me, and it is in the law...

Dr. Patel: We don't want to proscribe it, we want to... That is what he meant. My followers, Vaiṣṇavas, will not partake into such things. Let others do what they do.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that's it.

Dr. Patel: But then you became fiery.

Prabhupāda: No, we can preach... No, my point was that because it is not applicable to me, I shall condemn.

Morning Walk -- March 31, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...Kṛṣṇa. Definitely. (break) ...not independently. (break)

Guest (5): ...why the Jesus says you offer the other cheek? Which is better? Is the choice of us to be violent or nonviolent?

Prabhupāda: Yes. The persons to whom Jesus Christ taught, they were already fighting. Therefore his first injunction is "Thou shalt not kill." They were already killers. You see? And Arjuna is a gentleman. He was thinking before killing. Therefore he has to be induced, "You kill like this." But they were already killers. Otherwise why Jesus Christ said, "Thou shalt not kill"? That means that society was accustomed to kill. (break) Yes, that (indistinct) circumstance.

Mr. Sar: Different persons on different occasions. Only the main occasions on which they serve. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...lence is violence. But Kṛṣṇa has got two business: paritrāṇāya sādhūnām vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām (BG 4.8). So those who are duṣkṛtā, there is necessity of violence. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...surgical operation. Yes. When the...

Guest (6): Yeah, I was disturbed in the early morning. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...to have surgical operation, if the doctor says, "No, no, no, I have taken to non-violence. I cannot touch with knife," that is foolishness. (break) ...you, one must know. That, you take instruction from Kṛṣṇa; then you'll know when one thing should be used and one thing not be used.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Lord Śiva is Lord Śiva. He is very powerful demigod. He can give. He has got the power. But in spite of being favored by Lord Śiva, in spite of his becoming the great devotee of Lord Śiva, why he is described as rākṣasa? That is the point. So therefore if I say Rāvaṇa a rākṣasa, according to the śāstra, another devotee may be angry. So what can I do? It is stated in the śāstra, rākṣasa. Similarly, in the śāstra it is stated that na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ: "If one is not surrendered to Kṛṣṇa he is duṣkṛtina, the most sinful, mūḍhā, rascal, naradhāma, lowest of the mankind, māyayā apahṛta-jñāna." These things are there. But if we quote the śāstra, that "This man has not surrendered to the Supreme Lord; therefore he is a rascal," then what is wrong with us? It may be very strong words, but it is stated in the śāstra. Just like about Rāvaṇa, it is stated that he is a rākṣasa. So it may be very insulting and strong words, but this is the statement of the śāstra. And if one quotes from the śāstra, what is wrong on his part? Suppose in the court a big man has done something criminal, and the judgement is that he should be punished. So can you accuse the court, "Oh, such a big man?" Just like... For the time being let us understand. Mahatma Gandhi was put to jail in so many times. So nobody could say because according to law there was civil disobedience. So if the law puts you in the jail, so can you protest against that? Then you will be also put into jail, contempt of court. Although everyone respects Mahatma Gandhi, but why he was put into jail? According to law. It may be it is man-made law, it is wrong, but the principle is that whatever is judgement of the śāstra, we have to take. It doesn't matter who is that man and how great he is. That is... Yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya vartate kāma-kārataḥ, na siddhim sa... (BG 16.23). The śāstra is given stress always. So you cannot go beyond the verdict of the śāstra. That is the injunction. (break) ...about Guru Nanak's statement that...

Indian man (4): Rāma gao rāvaṇa gao.

Prabhupāda: You just explain that.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Indian man (4): He is not a paṇḍita. He is a pukka businessman.

Prabhupāda: Mean, I say this is going on. But śāstra says if one is engaged in a particular type of occupation, he should be called that. Yasya hi yal-lakṣaṇaṁ proktaṁ varṇābhivyañ-jakam. To designate into certain type of varṇa, there are symptoms. That symptoms, yadi anyatra vidhiṣyeta, if it is found somewhere else, tat tenaiva vinirdiśet (SB 7.11.35), one should ascertain by the symptoms. This is the sastric injunction.

Indian man (5): According to the work it is known.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Even a man is born in the brāhmaṇa family, but if he is working as something else, so he should be... Practically also... Just like somebody is paṇḍita, brāhmaṇa, but if he is doing the work of an engineer or doctor, he is addressed as "Doctor Saheb." That is practical. "Doctor Saheb. Engineer Saheb." Not "Paṇḍitji."

Indian man (5): By birth he may be brāhmaṇa like that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. No. By birth, there is no brāhmaṇa. By saṁskāra. Saṁskārād bhaved dvijaḥ. That is...

Indian man (4): Birthright is not brāhmaṇa. No birthright.

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Morning Walk -- April 12, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That's it. (break) ...Viṣṇu. That is the injunction. Of Viṣṇu. In the Pañjikā, you will find in the Bengali Pañjikā, when there is some auspicious sign, they have recommended, "Chant the name of Viṣṇu." Have you seen in the Pañjikā? Yes. (break)

Girirāja: "...and persons who are still following the Vedic ways, especially householders, keep at least one dozen cows and worship the Deity of Lord Viṣṇu..." (break)

Prabhupāda: In Indian villages—I have seen in Bengal—they keep cows, and they have got Viṣṇu śilā, especially in the house of a brāhmaṇa, all high caste (?). Yes. (break) Prahlāda Mahārāja, his father was a demon, but he was never afraid of Him. He was challenging, "Oh, my father..." He never said, "Father." He said, asura-varya: "the best of the demons." Tat sādhu manye asura-varya dehinām. When his father asked him, "My dear Prahlāda..." After all, he was child. "What you have learned best?" So he said, tat sādhu manye asura-varya. He is addressing his father, asura-varya, "the best of the demons." Tat sādhu manye: "I consider it very nice thing." Tat sādhu manye 'sura-varya dehinām.

Morning Walk -- April 22, 1974, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: They are fools, all set of fools. Useless. See one thing and write one thing. Then you are not perfect. Bhrama pramāda. You commit mistake. Therefore your instruction is useless, useless. Because you commit mistake, therefore your instruction is useless. And that actually they are doing. As it is suitable, they are changing the words of Bible. They are useless. Things which are changeable, that cannot be accepted as scripture. Scriptural injunction means you cannot change. Just like we accept the Vedic scripture but don't change it. That example I have given many times. Because Lord Buddha wanted to change Vedic literature, therefore he is rejected. Although Lord Buddha is so... We worship him as incarnation of..., but he was rejected. You cannot change. Immediately you are rejected. (break)

Pañcadraviḍa: ...Christians, they were arguing with me they said, "God has given us the pig to eat."

Prabhupāda: It is said in the Bible?

Pañcadraviḍa: No.

Prabhupāda: Then where is this nonsense? How he can say? Actually, Christians cannot eat any meat because the word is "Thou shalt not kill."

Morning Walk Excerpts -- May 1, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Dr. Patel: These Christians, during the Christmas, they buy a turkey one month before...

Prabhupāda: But that is not the injunction of Christ. They have made it.

Dr. Patel: No, no. That cannot be injunction of a saint like that.

Prabhupāda: No. He says, "Thou shall not kill," general order.

Dr. Patel: Christ was a great bhāgavata-bhakta.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Dr. Patel: He was a bhakta.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I said in many lectures that Christianism means Vaiṣṇavism. Where is the Christian?

Dr. Patel: Vaiṣṇavism. Totally Vaiṣṇavism.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.

Dr. Patel: Christianity it is really Vaiṣṇavism, but they, unfortunately... The church...

Prabhupāda: Mohamedanism... Mohammedanism...

Dr. Patel: The church has spoiled it.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Dr. Patel: Church has defaced it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Everywhere.

Dr. Patel: It is the church, Christian church, which has defaced Christism.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Everywhere the followers make the whole thing bungled. Hm. Go on.

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

Atreya Ṛṣi: Please stay for one minute.

Prabhupāda: Please take prasāda. Stay one minute. So another, I give my request. You are a poet. You describe about God. You are expert in describing. So you just take this occupation, describing God. Then your life will be successful, and one who will hear you, his life will be successful. That is the injunction.

idaṁ hi puṁsas tapasaḥ śrutasya vā
(sviṣṭasya) sūktasya ca buddhi-dattayoḥ
(avicyuto 'rthah) kavibhir nirūpito
yad-uttamaśloka-guṇānuvarṇanam
(SB 1.5.22)

There are poets, there are scientists, there are religionists, philosophers, politician, so many other leaders of the society. Avicyuto 'rthaḥ kavibhir nirūpitaḥ. To those who are expert, they are given this decision that the duty of all these men, avicyutaḥ arthaḥ, means the perfection of their occupational duty will be completely done when they are engaged, yad-uttamaśloka-guṇānuvarṇanam, when they are engaged in describing the glories of the Supreme Being.

Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome:

Richard Webster: Well, I don't know about that, you see. I'm only...

Prabhupāda: No, there have been so many charges against president Nixon. So no, whatever it may be, we are not concerned. But this is the Vedic principle, that the king or the executive head of the state, the brāhmaṇa and the public leader must be very clean. Otherwise society will be spoiled. That is the injunction.

Richard Webster: Yes, well, of course, I agree.

Prabhupāda: At the present moment there is all over the world... We are touring all over the world. It is very hard to find out ideal class of men. That is the defect. In the Vedic culture the ideal class of men were the brāhmaṇas. Their qualification was: truthful, self-controlled, mind and the senses, and then tolerant, very simple life, full of knowledge, practical application of knowledge in life and full faith in God. These are ideal character. But such men are not available at the present moment. So therefore the social idealism is defective. Just like in your body, there are four divisions. The head, the arm, the belly and the leg. If the head is spoiled then you are a madman. In spite of possessing hands and bellies and legs, you cannot work properly. So at the present moment the heads are spoiled. Therefore the whole world is in chaotic condition. People, advanced in education, still they are inimical, one man to another. If you are passing on in the street, the gentleman's house there is a signboard, "Beware of the dogs. Don't come in," because he cannot believe anyone. You go to the airport, any high-class standard man. They search out the pocket. So nobody is believable. So this is the result of modern education. You cannot find out an ideal character man.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

C. Hennis: ...a valid... That's a valid point, because it has always been found in every society that there is a need for a priestly class or a class of philosophical leaders of one kind or another. And the fact of this is recognized in the whole of the world society. I think not only in the West, but in the East, too, there's a need for the religious...

Prabhupāda: Now the so-called, the priestly society, priestly society, they are amending the Biblical injunction according to their whims. Just like in the Bible, the injunction is, "Thou shalt not kill." But the priestly class and all classes, they are simply killing. So how they can guide? They are keeping regular slaughterhouse for killing. So how they can guide? I have asked so many Christian gentlemen, including priests that "Your injunction is that 'Thou shalt not kill.' That is Lord Jesus Christ's order. Why you are violating this?" They give me vague answers. Directly it is said, "Thou shalt not kill." And the whole world is simply killing poor animals, and keeping up-to-date slaughterhouse.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: But enjoy does not mean that you enjoy sinfully. Did God give that document, that "You enjoy as you like, sinfully." Enjoy. There is prescription. You enjoy to the prescription. God says, tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā mā gṛdhaḥ kasya svid dhanam (ISO 1). You simply enjoy what is allotted to you. Don't encroach upon other's property. This is God's injunction. You enjoy. As human being, you enjoy life. You have got food grains, fruits, flowers, milk. Enjoy life. Offer to Kṛṣṇa. Enjoy life. Why should you kill animal? That is God's... Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā. He says patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam (BG 9.26). Why do you go to kill animals? That is not enjoyment. That means you suffer, therefore you are suffering. You are creating suffering. So this man is at least informed that they have no brain.

Room Conversation with Prof. Regamay, Professor of Sanskrit at the University of Lausanne -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: That's it. But there is higher mathematics. Not one plus two or two plus three, no. There is still higher mathematics. So that is not meant for them. That will be explained, explained in the Bhagavad..., ye yathā māṁ prapadyante tāṁs tathaiva bhajāmy aham (BG 4.11). Those who are expert, or sufficient, insufficient knowledge, they cannot understand the Supreme Absolute. That is also confirmed, bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate: (BG 7.19) "After many, many births, when one is actually in full knowledge, he can understand Kṛṣṇa and surrenders unto Him." Vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). So Vedas and scriptures are there, differently, according to different conditions. Now, what Jesus Christ was teaching the people? You can understand. The first injunction is "Thou shalt not kill." So what class of men they were, just you can understand. Otherwise, why he is first of all telling "Thou shalt not kill"? The Mohammed also said, "From this day, there is no sex with your mother." So just see what class of men. So according to class of men, there should be teaching. Similarly, Buddha also, Lord Buddha said, "No, no, there is no God. Just try to understand me. You obey Me." "Yes, sir." It has to be done like that.

Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: The first commandment is "Thou shall not kill." But they are killing. The first point is disobedient. Then where is love of God?

Pater Emmanuel: (German) It is in the relation of man. "Don't kill," it says, the Christianity understands...

Prabhupāda: Why they understand like that? That means that Lord Christ was not sufficiently educated to use the right word, "murder"? Does it mean so? There are two words, killing and murder. Murder is especially meant for the human being. So do you think that Christ was not learned enough to use the word murder instead of "killing"? "Killing" means any kind of killing, especially animal killing. Otherwise you should have frankly openly used the word, "Thou shall not murder." Even if it is meant like that, so does it mean that he was preaching amongst the murderers? They are very first-class men? They are all murderers? Therefore the injunction. This kind of interpretation does not appeal to us.

Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: So we offer Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa wants: "Give me this foodstuff," so we offer the foodstuff to Kṛṣṇa, and we take it. Therefore, if for killing this patraṁ puṣpam there is sin, that is Kṛṣṇa's sin, not my sin. (German) But Kṛṣṇa, God, apāpa-viddham, sinful reaction cannot take place to Him. Apāpa-viddham. Pāpa means sinful. Just like the sun is powerful. It can absorb urine, but you cannot drink urine. (German) So the injunction is tejīyasāṁ na doṣāya (SB 10.33.29). One who is very powerful... Just like a king. He orders, "Kill this man. Murder." He commits murder regularly, chopped up. But he is not under the law, being hanged, because he is very powerful. But an ordinary man, if he commits murder, he will be hanged. When there is fight the commander in chief says, "You kill them," and the soldier kills and he gets gold medal. But the same soldier, when he kills a single person at home, he is hanged. Therefore this injunction, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam (BG 9.26), "This vegetables give Me. I shall eat, and you take the prasādam." So we are not sinful.

Room Conversation with Bhurijana dasa and Disciples -- July 1, 1974, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: That's it. As soon as the discipline broken, then everything is lost. Now you can dance like a dog. That will not affect. Nobody can do that unless there is spiritual strength. Now, last night Madhudviṣa Mahārāja was singing, and so many men became enthused to dance. So unless there is spiritual strength, it cannot be done. Others cannot ask and dance. No, that is not possible. That is not possible. Unless there is spiritual strength, you cannot enthuse others. So we should have to acquire spiritual strength by following the regulative principle. Sanātana Gosvāmī has therefore forbidden. Avaiṣṇava-mukhodgīrṇam pūta-hari-kathāmṛtam śravanām kartavyam: "Those who are not following Vaiṣṇava principles, one should not hear from him." Why? It is Kṛṣṇa-kathā, Kṛṣṇa's. Now sarpocchiṣṭa-payo yathā: "Milk is very good, but as soon as it is touched by a serpent, it is no more good. It is harmful." So one must be Vaiṣṇava. Unless one is Vaiṣṇava, there is injunction, "Don't hear from him. It will be poisonous." So one who is not following Vaiṣṇava principle, he cannot speak about Vaiṣṇava principle. It is harmful. That is forbidden by ācāryas, Sanātana Gosvāmī. If somebody says, "What is the harm? He is chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa..." He cannot chant.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Guest (1): But Swamiji, while the family norm here in the western countries is 2.3 children per couple, we still have a family norm of about six children per family. You know I think there are a lot of cultural factors that are...

Prabhupāda: No, that shastric injunction is, that is spiritual restraint. Therefore one should train himself when to have sex life or when to become father, when not to become. That education... Not to become like animal, dogs and cats, whenever there is sex desire, we must have. Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā, it is said, dharmāviruddhaḥ kāmo 'smi. Find out this, dharmāviruddhaḥ.

Guest (1): Swamiji, do you recognize that India does need some method at this point...

Prabhupāda: Why you are speaking of India. Everyone needs, all over the world.

Guest (1): Because we are the most unfortunate one that with only...

Prabhupāda: You are unfortunate because you are now following misleaders. You do not follow the real leader.

Morning Walk -- March 4, 1975, Dallas:

Prabhupāda: "Poor Christ, he has to suffer for all the sinful activities, and he wanted to save us from sin, gave his injunction. That we shall not care." This is Christian religion. And therefore they have to close down this hypocrisy. (break) That Melbourne meeting, some of you were with me? No. In Melbourne I was invited by some, many priests. Twice I was invited. The first meeting I am speaking. So there was a good meeting, all respectable priests. So they asked me that "Why Christian religion is dwindling? What we have done?" So I asked them that "What you have not done?" (laughter) So they were not very much pleased. But I, in the open meeting, I said, "What you have not done? You have done all sinful activities. Therefore you have to close down this hypocrisy now." That was my answer, "What you have not done?" Now they are sorry, "What we have done?" That is called ignorance. They have done everything all sinful. They do not know that is sinful. (break) ...Bible, "Thou shall not kill," and they will not obey. That is sinful. Everything is there clearly, Ten Commandments, but they will not do that. Willful sinners. One may act sinfully, unaware. But they are willfully sinners. They know this is sin, and still they are doing.

Interview with a German Girl and Assorted Devotees -- March 30, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Jaya. (aside:) Stop that also. (break) ...kṛpana bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ, yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham (SB 7.9.45). This gṛhastha life is a concession for sex life. Otherwise, there is no need of gṛhastha life. But everything can be used to make the best use of a bad bargain. That is another thing. Actually, to become free from all responsibility and anxieties, if one remains a brahmacārī, that is very good. That is the recommendation of śāstra. But if you cannot... Because the material world is going on under sex impulse, by nature the sex impulse is there. He will agitate you. But if you can control by becoming a rigid brahmacārī, that is better. But it is difficult. Therefore this concession is given. But what is this concession? The concession is sex life. That's all. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi sukhaṁ hi tuccham kaṇḍūyanena karayor iva duḥkha-duḥkham. It is an itching sensation. And after satisfying the itching sensation, there are so many responsibilities and trouble. But tṛpyanti neha kṛpanāḥ. Those who are kṛpanāḥ, does not know how to utilize this life... So once I have taken to sex life and I am suffering so many after... Of course, now to stop the suffering, the have invented this contraceptive method. He knows there is suffering, but they, in order to avoid this suffering, they're taking this contraceptive method. And that is also suffering. That he does not know. Bhrun hatyā. Contraceptive method means killing the embryo. So that is also another sinful. He's taking so much responsibilities. So either you take contraceptive method or do not take contraceptive method... If you do not take, then the child is born. Then you have to take responsibility. Now they're killing the child, in this way becoming implicated. But if one is trained up to remain a rigid brahmacārī, there is no trouble. Therefore it is said,

tṛpyanti neha kṛpanā bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ
kaṇḍutivān manasi yaḥ viṣayeta dhīraḥ
(SB 7.9.45)

I know if I satisfy this itching sensation, I'll be put into so much trouble after it, so if one is dhīra, little sober, he'll better suffer this itching sensation than to take the responsibility. This is the sastric injunction.

Morning Walk -- April 2, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Yes. This is their philosophy. And as they pass laws in the Parliament, similarly, these churches approve: "Yes, homosex is all right." Then it is all right. This cheating system is going on. Similar cheating system is the Hindus also. You'll find in Calcutta, in College Street, so many butcher house. And they have kept one goddess Kālī that "We are eating Mother Kali's prasāda." That's it. This is going on.

Brahmānanda: Kali eats meat.

Prabhupāda: Kali does not eat meat, but it is the śāstra's injunction that those who are unable to give up meat-eating, they may sacrifice one goat, not cow, one small animal before the goddess Kali, on amāvāsya (new moon) day, night, not day, and they can eat it.

Pañcadraviḍa: If it's offered, though, who accepts it? Whose prasādam is it? Who takes it?

Prabhupāda: The prasādam is not... That meat is not taken by Kali, but it is taken by the witches and others, associates of Kali.

Brahmānanda: In Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, you write that goddess Kali takes the prasādam of her husband, Lord Śiva.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- April 5, 1975, Mayapur:

Tripurāri: They say that our enjoyment is subtle sense gratification. We feel we're saving the world. Therefore we get some pleasure from that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. If you say sense gratification, senses are there, and senses want satisfaction, but you can know the proper way of satisfaction. That we are teaching. We do not say that "Make your senses blunt." But you enjoy properly. That is stated, tapo divyaṁ yena śuddhyet sattva hy asmad brahma-saukhyam anantam (SB 5.5.1). You are wanting sense gratification, but it is being checked up on account of your diseased condition of life. Therefore you purify yourself. Then you enjoy senses perpetually. This is the injunction. We are not stopping sense gratification. But you are trying to gratify senses in your diseased condition. Just like if you are feverish, you cannot enjoy to eat a rasagullā. It will be not tasteful. So cure yourself and enjoy rasagullā. That is our program.

Rāmeśvara: We are sometimes accused of being very puffed up because we are, they, we, we think that we can have a direct relationship with God, that God will speak to us. So we are accused of being very puffed up for thinking that we can have a direct relationship with God.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that is natural for the fools because they cannot think of it, that one can talk with God. But God says, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti: (BG 4.9) "After giving up this body, the devotees come to Me." Then where, what you will do there? He'll talk or not talk?

Rāmeśvara:: There he'll talk.

Conversation with Governor -- April 20, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: If you give up this varṇāśrama-dharma, then where is your bhāratīya sanskṛiti? But they are trying to give it up, abolish this. Then where is bhāratīya sanskṛiti? Then?

Brahmānanda: "Six: Injunctions of śāstras regarding charity and how it should be practiced in the present conditions. So the mutual relationship of dharma and politics in the light of our history and tradition can only be revived when we observe the system of varṇāśrama. It is actually like this: the brāhmaṇa is like the head, and the kṣatriya is like the arms, the vaiśya is the stomach or the abdomen, and the śūdra is like the legs. Similarly, spiritually, the brahmacārī is the trained-up disciple, the gṛhastha is the trained-up householder, the vānaprastha is experienced as a retired gentleman, and the sannyāsī is completely in the renounced order of life for spiritual advancement. There is no question of the head being in an exalted position without the cooperation of the leg. When there is a pin-prick in some part of the leg, the head immediately takes it very seriously and takes out the thorn in some part of the leg. Similarly, whenever there is some outside attack, the arms or the hands spread to protect the whole body. In the same way, within the abdomen there is the machinery of digesting foodstuffs, and after digestion the secretion turns into blood and it is infused throughout the whole anatomical structure of the body. Similarly, the cooperation between the head, arms, stomach and legs is the perfect situation of the human society."

Governor: Coordination.

Prabhupāda: Coordination. As head is also trying to maintain the body nicely, this arm is also. Now this has been nationally centralized. So that is the idea. Not that "Because I am head, brāhmaṇa, oh, here is a śūdra. Oh, don't see his face." Why? Śūdra is also required. Leg is also required. Head is also required.

Conversation with Governor -- April 20, 1975, Vrndavana:

Brahmānanda: "The injunctions of śāstras regarding charity and how it should be practiced in the present conditions. The injunction of the śāstra about charity is that charity should be given to qualified brāhmaṇa or sannyāsī because they will spend it for the benefit of the whole human society. This is called charity in goodness. In the śāstras there..."

Prabhupāda: Just like we are getting charity, crores of rupees, but we are spending for this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, not for drinking. And if charity is given to a drunkard, what he will do? He will drink only. Therefore charity is recommended to be given to the brāhmaṇa and the sannyāsī, no other else. Then?

Governor: The apatra-dana.

Prabhupāda: Ah? Apatra-dana, that is third-class. Go on.

Brahmānanda: "This is called charity in goodness. In the śāstras there is no recommendation for giving charity to the unqualified men. In this connection I am enclosing a copy of one chart reproduced in our Back to Godhead, 'Charity in ignorance.' "

Prabhupāda: She has written one article in our Back to Godhead. I am quoting from that.

Conversation with Governor -- April 20, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Y-a-h. Yaḥ śāstra.

Brahmānanda: Yaḥ śāstra-vidhim.

Prabhupāda: Ah, that verse. This index has been done by them. Yes.

Brahmānanda:

yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya
vartate kāma-kārataḥ
na sa siddhim avāpnoti
na sukhaṁ na parāṁ gatim
(BG 16.23)

"But he who discards scriptural injunctions and acts according to his own whims attains neither perfection, nor happiness, nor the supreme destination." "As described before, the śāstra-vidhim, or the direction of the śāstra, is given to the different castes and orders of human society. Everyone is expected to follow these rules and regulations. If one does not follow them and acts whimsically according to his lust, greed, and desire, then he never will be perfect in his life. In other words, a man may theoretically know all these things, but if he does not apply them in his own life, then he is to be known as the lowest of mankind. In the human form of life, a living entity is expected to be sane and to follow the regulations given for elevating his life to the highest platform, but if he does not follow them, then he degrades himself. But even if he follows the rules and regulations and moral principles and ultimately does not come to the stage of understanding the Supreme Lord, then all his knowledge becomes spoiled.

Room Conversation with Dr. Copeland, Professor of Modern Indian History -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Dr. Copeland: Ah, that's why. Ah! Pretty! Are you a brāhmaṇa? By birth you're a brāhmaṇa, right?

Prabhupāda: No. I am brāhmaṇa yes. Yes. But we are not... We do not recognize brāhmaṇa by birth. Brāhmaṇa by these qualities. Anyone who has got... This is the shastric injunction, that if the qualities are found somewhere else—that means one who is not born in a brāhmaṇa family but he has the qualities of the brāhmaṇa—then he should be accepted as a brāhmaṇa. That is shastric injunction. Yasya hi yal lakṣaṇaṁ proktaṁ varṇābhivyañjakam, yad anyatrāpi. Anyatra means elsewhere. Tat tenaiva vinirdiśet (SB 7.11.35). "He should be accepted as such." Similarly, if a man, born in brāhmaṇa family but he has the qualities of the śūdras... Paricaryātmakaṁ kāryaṁ śūdra-karma svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). Paricarya means service. To accept... (break) So therefore, according to Bhagavad-gītā, nobody is brāhmaṇa. A brāhmaṇa should remain independent. He should live by his qualities. People will honor him. Just like we are training. We do not serve anyone, but we are maintaining big establishment.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: ...lunch time.

Siddha-svarūpa: Yes. (break) ...the location also. That's a very good location they have, on the main road.

Prabhupāda: Japanese?

Siddha-svarūpa: Yeah. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...injunction, apāṇi-pado javano grahīta, is, "He, the God, has no leg, no hand, but He accepts gift." "Accepts gift," means He has got hand, but why it is said, "No leg, no hand"? That means He has no material hand and leg. He has His hands and legs, but that is spiritual. That is the meaning. Sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ (Bs. 5.1). His body is made of spiritual eternity... This body is not eternal. But God has got His eternal body. There is no question of God's becoming old. Because His body is eternal. It is the material body which is not eternal. That is subjected to old age, disease, birth, death. What is this big house? (break) ...stated that he came to cheat the atheists. They did not believe in God, but God came as Buddha.

Siddha-svarūpa: Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: And he said, "Yes, you are right. There is no God."

Morning Walk -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Then Jesus is a fool, and he has taken contract to suffer, and these people are free to commit sin.

Dharmādhyakṣa: Jesus actually said...

Prabhupāda: And they are so clever that they can make God's son also fool. Over-clever.

Dharmādhyakṣa: (break) ...always said, "Your sins are forgiven you, go and sin no more." He always gave that injunction, "Go and sin no more." (break)

Prabhupāda: ...is no description of sins in Bible? What are the sins?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Killing, adultery, stealing. They mention it.

Jayatīrtha: There are Ten Commandments.

Prabhupāda: That is.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: Yes, why not?

Mrs. Wax: Glad to hear it.

Prabhupāda: But because women are less intelligent, they should remain dependent on first-class father, first-class husband, and first-class son. Then she is first-class. That is the injunction. Woman should remain dependent in childhood upon first-class father, in youthhood upon first-class husband, and in old age upon first-class son. Woman is never independent. If she becomes independent, her life is not very good. She must agree to remain dependent on first-class father, first-class husband, and first-class son-three stages.

Mrs. Wax: She must become dependent on her son because her husband would ideally become a sannyāsī. Is that...?

Prabhupāda: Yes. You will find that Kapiladeva is instructing mother. That picture you can show her. Third Canto? You see the picture in the cover? The first-class son is instructing mother. Her husband has taken sannyāsa and gone away. The son, first-class son, is instructing mother. That is the book. You will find full instruction to the mother. You can read one of the passages. You can read, Nitāi, what He is instructing to His mother. The mother is questioning, and son is answering.

Morning Walk -- August 29, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: ...man is convinced, then our printing of books shall be success. Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu (BG 7.3).

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: We have thousands of people convinced. (break)

Prabhupāda: Ācāryopāsanam. In the Bhagavad-gītā: "One should worship ācārya." This is the beginning of spiritual life. Amānitvam adambhitvam ahiṁsā kṣāntir ārjavam ācāryopāsanam (BG 13.8). Ācāryavān puruṣo veda. These are the injunction. Without taking shelter of ācārya, nobody can understand anything. (break)...wants prasāda, it is not given?

Akṣayānanda: Yes. Given.

Prabhupāda: Not given. (break)

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: ...women's,(?) they try and harass us, they try and cheat us.

Prabhupāda: Ācchā?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes. Nirnayika just wanted to use their scale, and they would try and cheat him. They would ask him for money just to let us use their scale to weigh the vegetables we buy. So I intervened one day, and then he got so angry that he abused Kṛṣṇa also. These are such big demons, these people. They live in Vṛndāvana but...

Prabhupāda: So give them prasāda; they will be all right. Yes. Give them prasāda.

Morning Walk -- September 6, 1975, Vrndavana:

Brahmānanda: But not one's own wife.

Prabhupāda: No. Para-dāreṣu. Mātravat para-dareṣu. That is the injunction of the śās... Other's wife. Not that "Oh, my wife is also my mother." Just see. This lunacy is going on, and this lunatic man is taken as incarnation of God. This is going on. This homosex propaganda is another side of impotency. So that is natural. If you enjoy too much, then you become impotent.

Brahmānanda: They are trying to make that more and more accepted in America, homosex.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The churches accept. It is already law.

Nitāi: This women's liberation movement, the leaders are also homosexual. They're lesbians.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Just see. Hare Kṛṣṇa. The whole world is on the verge of ruination. Kali-yuga. (break)

Brahmānanda: ...become ruined. The world is on the verge of ruination, but it doesn't become ruined; so therefore they think, "Oh, it doesn't matter. We can go on."

Prabhupāda: They do not know what is the meaning of ruination. (break) ...so many problems. Still it is not on the verge of ruination?

Brahmānanda: It's on the verge.

Morning Walk -- November 2, 1975, Nairobi:

Prabhupāda: (break) ...given by God. Mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanam. You have no intelligence even, so that is given by God. (Hindi) Let them become devotees. Why these old men, they are not coming? They are still after money? Amara ajñaya guru hana tara ei deśa (CC Madhya 7.128), Caitanya Mahāprabhu says. So you have come to this country. Do something good for these Africans. Let them become devotee. Where is that attempt? The white men, they also came to exploit them, and you have also come to exploit them. But Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, "No-para upakara." Upakara kara. That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's... They are not so advanced; make them advanced. That is real cooperation. (Hindi) (break) Just like every one of them is attached to remain in Africa, continuing to... But they are being forcefully driven away: "Go away." Attachment must be there. The Englishmen, they have got attachment, but they were forcefully driven away. Similarly, this conditioned soul, he has got attachment. And śāstra and śāstra... These people were driven away by śāstra,, by weapon, knife. That is śāstra. And śāstra is the same thing, but it is books. Therefore it is called śāstra. The original word is coming from śās. Sas means ruling, śās-dhātu. Śāstra, śāstra, śāsana, śisya. Śisya. Śisya means voluntarily accepting ruling. That is called śisya. The word is the same, śās. From śās, śisya. From śās, śāstra. From śās, śāstra. From śās, śāsana. These are. So sometimes by force, sometimes by voluntarily... So just like guru-śisya. The guru, he gives enlightenment, and śisya voluntarily accepts. That is guru-śisya. Similarly śāstra means weapon: "If you don't follow, then I shall cut your throat." Similarly śāstra. So śāstra says that "Now you must leave your family life." That is called vānaprastha. So that is not being carried out, although the śāstra injunction is there. Brahmacari, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. So brahmacārī is the beginning of life, how to become controlled life. Then he is allowed the concession for sense gratification. This is gṛhastha. Then śāstra says, "Now you have done up to fifty years. Now get out." But nobody is following. They are not prepared to get out unless death forces to get out. That Kṛṣṇa does. Mṛtyuḥ sarva-haraś cāham (BG 10.34). He is not willing. He has got attachment. He doesn't want. Then, at last, Kṛṣṇa comes as death: "Now get out." Kick out. "Oh, I have got so many things. I have got my sons, daughters, and this, that." "Get out. No question." And whatever you have accumulated, that is forfeit. That's all. The same process, just Africa government: "Get out." And what you have attained? All taken away. The same śāstra, śis, śās-dhātu.

Morning Walk -- November 8, 1975, Bombay:

Yaśomatīnandana: Guru is there. Why don't they come?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Guru is there, but they won't come. They won't come.

Dr. Patel: That jagat guru is, you are, sir.

Prabhupāda: It is injunction of the śāstra. Tad-vijñānārtham sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). But who is coming to guru? Guru is canvassing whole world, "Please come to me."

Dr. Patel: (Hindi) (break)

Prabhupāda: ...I am in Bombay, but how many Gujaratis are my chela? There is only one Gujarati.

Dr. Patel: One is sufficient. He represents the whole Gujaratis.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. (laughter)

Brahmānanda: And Prabhupāda had to rescue him from America. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: That is the difficulty. I will have to preach, bringing men from America and Europe. Nobody is coming here. Everyone is talking big, big.

Morning Walk -- November 10, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Kīrtanīyaḥ sadā hariḥ (CC Adi 17.31). That is the injunction, sadā. Sadā means always.

Devotee (3): Well, if one is not able to do that in the beginning... For instance, if during twenty-four hours...

Prabhupāda: Therefore we are constructing temples. At least you will think, "We are constructing Kṛṣṇa's temple." Because you are habituated to work, work for Kṛṣṇa. Go to sell books. Print books. Type for Kṛṣṇa. This is also the same thing. Because you are accustomed to all these things, so nirbandhe kṛṣṇa-sambandha. When it is connected with Kṛṣṇa it is as good as chanting. Therefore we are so much eager. Otherwise there is no need of temple; we can chant anywhere. But that stage is not so easy, like Haridāsa Ṭhākura we can sit down and chant anywhere. That is not possible. Then you'll sleep. Therefore these things are required. Everyone, we are working for this temple. Every one of us, we know that "This temple not for my sense gratification: This is for Kṛṣṇa." So that is important. The police commissioner is thinking, "It is nuisance." Huh? Police commissioner is thinking it is nuisance. But we are not thinking it is nuisance. We are not so fool. The politicians, the police commissioner, they'll think of, "He is my enemy; he is my friend." That is their occupation. They'll never think of Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- November 14, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then can you say there is no star? Then? That means what you cannot see, that is not final. Therefore our Vedic instruction is śāstra cakṣusāt: You should see through the śastra, not you these useless eyes. These are useless. Tad-vijñānārtham sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). In order to know perfectly, one should go to the guru. And Bhagavad-gītā has said,

tad viddhi praṇipātena
paripraśnena sevayā
upadekṣyanti tad jñānaṁ
jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ
(BG 4.34)

"One who has seen, go there and learn it." That is the injunction. Don't try to see yourself. That is foolishness. This very word is used, tattva-darśinaḥ, "one who has seen." You have to go there and see through his eyes, through his instruction. That is real seeing.

Morning Walk -- December 7, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the duty.

Aksayānanda: And he is also very intelligent. He's not just doing it out of sentiment. Very nice man. Older man.

Prabhupāda: If a sannyāsī is not offered respect, the punishment is that he should fast one day. That is śāstric injunction.

Gunarnava: What is the punishment if one doesn't fast?

Prabhupāda: You must go to hell. (laughter) (break)

Aksayānanda: ...also come two or three times before over the months, so I know he is serious.

Prabhupāda: Let him come.

Aksayānanda: Yes, he's very nice.

Prabhupāda: What is his age?

Aksayānanda: I think he's about... He's getting on. He's fifty, sixty.

Prabhupāda: That is all right. Then he should retire.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 3, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Guru. Therefore we go to guru. Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsuḥ śreya uttamam (SB 11.3.21). One who is actually serious about inquiring, he must go. Guruṁ prapadyeta. Must surrender to guru.

Śāstrījī: Śābde pare ca niṣṇātam.

Prabhupāda: Ah. That is... Therefore there is guru. Ādau gurvāśrayam. If you know, want to know, first of all take shelter of guru. That is the injunction.

Bhavānanda: Then we will ask, how do we know who is really guru?

Prabhupāda: That is another rascaldom. You see how others are taking guru, paramparā system. You are rascal. You will place so many questions. But the answers are already there. Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam (BG 4.2). Guru is he who knows Kṛṣṇa, who explains Kṛṣṇa. That is guru. Otherwise he's not guru.

Dayānanda: Samit-pāṇiḥ śrotriyaṁ brahma-niṣṭham (MU 1.2.12).

Prabhupāda: Ah. Anyone who is Kṛṣṇa conscious, who knows Kṛṣṇa, he is guru. Otherwise all rascals. Why should you go to a rascal? Immediately you can understand he is guru who has fully surrendered to Kṛṣṇa. He is guru. Others? They are all rascals. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). Who has not surrendered to Kṛṣṇa, he is under these four groups: duṣkṛtina, mūḍha, narādhama, māyayāpahṛta-jñāna. They may talk of so much knowledge, but they are rascal fools because they have not surrendered to Kṛṣṇa. All the Māyāvādīs, they are all rascals. They have not surrendered. This is the test. Why don't you take lesson from Bhagavad-gītā? He is guru. One who has surrendered to Kṛṣṇa, one is servant of Kṛṣṇa, he is guru. That is the test. If you want to select a guru, you have to see "Whether this person is fully surrendered to Kṛṣṇa?" Then he is guru.

Morning Walk -- March 14, 1976, Mayapur:

Mahāṁśa: In the spiritual world the living entity is full of knowledge, so does he...

Prabhupāda: That is enjoined, ordered, "You should not become guru if you cannot save him. You should not become father if you cannot save him." This is sastric injunction. First word is gurur na sa syāt pitā na sa syāt (SB 5.5.18). Why you are claiming? Just like.... We are not going to become guru like that.... What is that rascal? Yogi...?

Gurukṛpā: Guru Mahārāja.

Revatīnandana: Which one? There's many rascals.

Prabhupāda: That big rascal, transcendental meditation.

Madhudviṣa: Maharishi.

Prabhupāda: Maharishi. He is giving assurance, "If you practice this yoga, then you'll be very able to do your business nicely. Your..." These things are.... And he is guru.

Room Conversation -- April 20, 1976, Melbourne:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The activities inside.

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is the activity which concerns. In the university there is only activity of education, learning. And here, all the criminals are violating the laws, they are put together. But superficially they look the same room, same food, same office, same typewriter. So it is the question of understanding why it is called criminal department and why it is called university. So as soon as it is university department, that is good. The same building, the same dictaphone, the same typewriter, same table, same chair, when they are used for Kṛṣṇa, it is spiritual. The same money, everything, it looks like that. Therefore they cannot understand. The nirviśeṣavādī and the śūnyavādī, they: "Spiritual means these things should be zero." They say it should be zero. "No table, no chair, no house, no, no, no, no..." But that is (laughs) ignorance. Prāpañcikatayā buddhyā hari-sambandhi-vastunaḥ. The things which are usable by Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, if we give up them, prapañcikā, as material, that is foolishness. That they do not know. They have yet to learn. It is Rūpa Gosvāmī's injunction. Prāpañcikatayā buddhyā hari-sambandhi-vastunaḥ, mumukṣubhiḥ parityāgaḥ. Parityāga means giving up: "Oh, it is material." So we are not such fools, śūnyavādī and nirviśeṣavādī. We are not such fools. Arjuna, he thought that not killing is better than killing, but Kṛṣṇa convinced him, "Yes, killing is better than not killing."

Morning Walk -- April 26, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: You don't imitate. You follow the rules and regulations. Don't try artificially to be anxious. When you are purified, then you'll get that anxiety, not artificially. Then you are sahajiyā.

Devotee (1): I don't mean to hanker for the anxiety, but to...

Prabhupāda: No, anxiety, that is.... That will come, the perfectional stage. Don't try to be perfect artificially. Perfect stage, we have to follow strictly the regulative principle, the injunction of the spiritual master, śāstra. Then you come to that stage. Don't artificially imitate.

Devotee (1): What if one keeps falling down from following the regulative principles?

Prabhupāda: He's falling down? If he's falling down from regulative principles, that means he's falling down to the material world. Falling down means falling down.

Devotee (2): (break) ...from the regulative principles and feels anxiety, then that anxiety is material anxiety.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- April 26, 1976, Melbourne:

Devotee (1): So if we're performing the Deity worship and we get in anxiety, how to make it nice...

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is Kṛṣṇa anxiety. That is Kṛṣṇa anxiety. If you become anxious how to worship Deity, how to dress Kṛṣṇa nicely, how to do, if you remain, that will develop your anxiety for Kṛṣṇa. Therefore Deity worship essential. Exactly in time to get up, to offer maṅgala-ārati, to dress, this anxiety is the beginning of Kṛṣṇa anxiety. Then, when you become perfect, you'll always be anxious for Kṛṣṇa. And that is perfectional stage. Therefore, by the injunction of the śāstra, regulative, it is a way of creating that anxiety. So we must follow. Then we'll come to the real anxiety.

Guru-kṛpā: Not artificially.

Devotee (1): So therefore it is good that we have so much Deity worship to do that we're very, very busy and we do not have any time?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Devotee (1): We practically do not have enough time, but that is very good?

Prabhupāda: Enough time?

Devotee (1): To worship the Deity. We have so much to do.

Prabhupāda: So what enough time you want? To go to the cinema? (laughter) Then? Your time has to be occupied by Kṛṣṇa anxiety. That's all. And as soon as you go to other anxiety, then it is māyā.

Room Conversation with Mother and Sons -- June 13, 1976, Detroit:

Satsvarūpa: Sometimes there's a question that I'm asked, that we say we're imperfect so we have to receive perfect knowledge, but they say if you're always imperfect, then how can you know that it's perfect, what you're hearing?

Prabhupāda: Yes, we are receiving knowledge from the perfect. Just like a child does not believe, a boy, he has not seen his father. He does not believe that there is father. But if the mother says, "Yes, my dear child, there is father," so then his knowledge is perfect. With his imperfect knowledge, he was disbelieving that there is father, but when the mother says, he has to accept it. Then his knowledge becomes perfect. He has not seen who is father. That's a fact, maybe. And, but the mother is authority. She says, "Here, my dear child. There is father." Then his knowledge perfect. So we may be imperfect, the child is imperfect, but when he gets the knowledge from the perfect source, mother, then it is perfect. Similarly, we, we never say that we are perfect. If you are perfect, then why you are learning? You are trying to become perfect. So our process is that we are receiving knowledge from the perfect. Therefore whatever we say, it is perfect. A child does not know, "What is this, father?" The father says "My dear child, it is called microphone." So after that, if he takes it and declares to anyone, "This is microphone," that is perfect, although he's a child. Because he's learned it from the perfect father. This is our process. We don't speculate. We don't speculate whether there is father or not. That is not our process. We ask from the mother, "Mother, they say I have got father. I have never seen." So mother says, "Yes, my dear child, you have got a father." Then finish. Knowledge is perfect. And the child cannot challenge, "I have never seen my father. How can I believe you?" This is nonsense. Your mother says, that is fact. That's all, finished. You cannot challenge mother: "Mother, I have never seen my father; how can I believe?" That is nonsense! This is going on. "I have never seen God. Can you show me God?" This rascaldom is going on. First of all you must know you are a rascal. How can you see God? You hear from the authority who knows God. That is the injunction.

Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Not arbitrarily. It is given by Kṛṣṇa. It is not arbitrary. By the supreme order. How they can say it is arbitrary? Then what is the use of referring to Bhagavad-gītā? Things may not be arbitrary, whimsical, therefore we have to take reference from Bhagavad-gītā. Lawbook. When a judge gives his judgement, he does not give it arbitrarily. There is lawbooks. So there is no question of arbitrary. The reference is there. How you can say it is arbitrary? That is not a fact. Śāstra-vidhi. Rather, if you don't care for śāstra-vidhi, then he'll never be successful. Yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya, in this chapter you'll find.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna:

yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya
vartate kāma-kārataḥ
na sa siddhim avāpnoti
na sukhaṁ na parāṁ gatim
(BG 16.23)

"But he who discards scriptural injunctions and acts according to his own whims attains neither perfection, nor happiness, nor the supreme destination."

Prabhupāda: We do not give anything arbitrary.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: The authority will give. Just like Caitanya Mahāprabhu. He is giving authority. The śāstra is giving authority. But in this age, Kali-yuga, it is full of faults, the ocean of faults. And Śukadeva Gosvāmī is giving direction,

kaler doṣa-nidhe rājann
hy asti eko mahān guṇaḥ
kīrtanād eva kṛṣṇasya
mukta-saṅgaḥ paraṁ vrajet
(SB 12.3.51)

So although in this age there are so many faults, it is like the ocean of fault, but still there is one very great advantage, that simply by chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, one becomes purified. So this smṛti injunction we should take up, and actually we see all over the world how it is purifying all section of people. So take this, then śruti smṛti... Ah...

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Purāṇadi?

Prabhupāda: Yes, everything will be fulfilled. The easiest method. Kīrtanād eva kṛṣṇasya mukta-saṅgaḥ paraṁ vrajet (SB 12.3.51).

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That is also tapasya. That is also tapasya. Just like we are prohibiting meat-eating. So in your country this is little troublesome. From the very beginning of his life he is, I mean to say, habituated to eat meat. The mother purchases powdered meat and mix with... I have seen it. And by force. So he has been trained up eating meat, and I say, "Don't eat meat." So therefore that is troublesome. And if he's serious, he must accept the order. That is tapasya. Tapasya means in diet, in practice, in behavior, in dealing, and so on, so on. Everything there is tapasya. That is all described. Mental tapasya, bodily tapasya, and what is called? Word? Just like vāco-vegam, this is tapasya. You cannot talk nonsense. You want to talk something nonsense, but according to... So they don't talk nonsense. Sa vai manaḥ kṛṣṇa-padāravindayor vacāṁsi vaikuṇṭha-guṇānuvar... If you talk, you must talk about Kṛṣṇa. That is tapasya. "Śāstra has ordered me not to talk loosely anything, only talk of Kṛṣṇa." So if he does that, that is tapasya. Tapasya in the matter of words. Tapasya in connection with body. Tapasya in connection with mind. Vāco-vegaṁ krodha-vegam. One has become angry and he wants to express it by beating or something doing very..., but tapasya will restrict him. "No, don't do it." "I want to kill you." Tapasya will restrict. Vāco-vegaṁ krodha-vegaṁ manasa-vegam udara-vegam. "I am sexually inclined, but I cannot do it. This is not the time." That is tapasya. I am restricted. In this way, tapasya in every way, bodily, mental, words, practice, dealing. So these have to be learned. That is called tapasya. And that is human life. Tapo divyam (SB 5.5.1). If you want to make progress in spiritual life and you are human life, human being, you must act according to the sastric injunctions. That is called tapasya. Brahma, before creation he had to undergo tapasya. Is it not stated? Yes. So tapasya is essential. You cannot avoid. Yes.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: The minumum possible way. Just like to make him a brāhmaṇa. So to become a brāhmaṇa these four things are essential: no illicit sex, no meat-eating, no intoxication, no gambling. This must be there. You cannot avoid wholesale.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Cannot avoid?

Prabhupāda: Wholesale. You must avoid at least sinful activities.

yeṣāṁ tv anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ
janānāṁ punya-karmaṇām
te dvandva-moha-nirmuktā
bhajante māṁ dṛdha-vratāḥ
(BG 7.28)

You cannot become a devotee unless you are completely sinless. So to become completely sinless you have to begin with these four prohibitory injunctions, or avoid sinful activities like illicit sex, meat-eating, smoking, intoxication and gambling. Then you'll be gradually completely sinless. One side, to practice things, and another side, to engage yourself in devotional service. To engage oneself devotional service under the order of spiritual master and the śāstra means to remain on the transcendental platform. Transcendental platform means there is no sinful activity. It is above. Sinful.... Pious and sinful activities are there so long you are on the material platform. Good and bad. Piety and sinful. But when you are on the transcendental platform, then you are automatically without sin.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The next question, Śrīla Prabhupāda, fifteen. "Hinduism has been defined as a way of life."

Prabhupāda: Yes. Actually it is the way. That, I have already described it. It is not a sectarianism like Muslimism, Christianism or "Thisism..." Hinduism also now one of them. Actually, it is a way of life, varṇāśrama-dharma, how to become elevated to the spiritual platform. So that begins by the varṇāśrama-dharma, to select persons according to his capacity to different varṇas. Some of them selected, trained as brāhmaṇas. Some of them trained as kṣatriya, some of them as vaiśya, some of them as, remain... Those who cannot take any training, they are śūdras. So in the ways (indistinct) there must be social division not by birth, but by education. Cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). That we have lost. The so-called Hinduism they have lost. And because they did not follow real varṇāśrama-dharma, therefore India, so many renegades, Muslim became... Once they become Muslim, there was no reformation. But according to Vedic principle, even one is fallen, he can be raised to the highest standard. Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ (BG 9.32). One may... Saṁskārād bhaved dvija. And Sanātana Gosvāmī says that

yathā kañcanataṁ yati
kaṁsyaṁ rasa-vidhānataḥ
tathā dīkṣā-vidhānena
dvijatvaṁ jāyate nṛṇam

As by chemical process the bell metal can be turned into gold by adding with the mercury.... This is a chemical process. If you can add in the bell metal proportionately mercury, then it will turn into gold. Here is the process given in the śāstra. If you are able to do it, you can do it, turn gold some of these bell metals. So the example is given that as the bell metal, base metal, can be turned into gold by chemical process, similarly, by dīkṣā-vidhānena, by proper initiation by the bona fide spiritual master, everyone can be turned into dvija, twice-born. Dvijatvaṁ jāyate nṛṇam. Nṛṇam means all men. It is not there is no discrimination, that only the Hindus, only the Indians, or only the so-called brāhmaṇas can be turned. Everyone can be turned. That is the injunction. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is trying to do that, trying everyone to become a bona fide brāhmaṇa. Without becoming a brāhmaṇa you cannot become Vaiṣṇava. So this reformatory process is recommended in the śāstras.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Hari-śauri: Sve sve karmaṇi. "A man can become perfect by doing his prescribed duty."

Prabhupāda: Yes, it's a fact. If you work as a brāhmaṇa, if you are thinking yourself as a brāhmaṇa, then you act as brāhmaṇa. You cannot act as a śūdra. As a brāhmaṇa you cannot accept anyone's service, then you become śūdra. You deviate from your own position. Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, they'll never accept anyone's service, only the śūdra. Paricaryātmakaṁ karma śūdra-karma svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). When you live at the mercy of others, this is called dog's business. Just like a dog lives at the mercy of the master. So it is strictly prohibited for the brāhmaṇas. Even in very difficult position, you can act as a kṣatriya, you can act as a vaiśya, but never accept the position of a dog, a śūdra. This is the injunction. Sve sve karmaṇi, you stick to your own business. If you claim as a brāhmaṇa, then you must act as a brāhmaṇa. Then you'll become successful. You cannot remain a brāhmaṇa and accept the business of a dog, that is not sve sve karmaṇi. So everything, what is stated there in the Bhagavad-gītā, that is perfect. People at the present moment, they are living at the mercy of others. That is dog's business. Therefore (in) the śāstra it is said kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ. In the Kali-yuga everyone is a śūdra. There is no brāhmaṇa, no kṣatriya, no vaiśya. That is generally accepted. Because at the present moment education means to get some service.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: So you don't take simply Jagannātha temple. There are many other temples, they allow. It is a particular management body, they do not allow. But that is not the sanction of the śāstra. That is not the sanction. Suppose in your private house you make some private law. That is your business. But actually temple is open for everyone. That is stated. Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ (BG 9.32). Even one is born of low-grade family, he can accept. There is no injunction. That is śāstra. But there are rascals who do not follow. They have their own imagination. That is another thing. Kṛṣṇa never said that "Only the brāhmaṇas or Indians or Hindus can take shelter of Me." Kṛṣṇa never said. Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ, whatever he may be. There is no restriction. Just like Ganges water, anyone can take bath. It is not that only a particular person or particular community can take bath. Anyone can take, and he becomes purified. There is an example, na hi harate jyotsnā candraś caṇḍāla veśmani.(?) When there is moonlight, there is no discrimination that here is a bhaṅgi's house, caṇḍāla's house, there should be no moonshine. The moonshine is open in the palace of the king or in the house of a caṇḍāla, na hi harate jyotsnā candraś caṇḍāla veśmani. So Kṛṣṇa's mercy is for everyone. It is not restricted to a certain community or class of people, no. Anyone can take advantage of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And that is, practically they are doing. Therefore in India, so they say that I am killing Hindu dharma, the Māyāvādīs, that Bhaktivedanta Swami hindu-dharma ka naṣṭa.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Otherwise, how he can arrange salvation for others? So he hasn't got to seek for salvation.

Dr. Sharma: How these devotees are finding salvation for others?

Prabhupāda: That means they are already in the platform of salvation.

Dr. Sharma: Through them, you are working for the salvation of others.

Prabhupāda: Janma sārthaka kari' kara para-upakāra (CC Adi 9.41). That is the injunction, that first of all you become perfect, then try to make others perfect. So anyone is actually trying to do perfection for others, he is already perfect.

Dr. Sharma: The devotees are working for the salvation for everyone.

Prabhupāda: He's already perfect. Sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (BG 14.26). The one who's trying for others' salvation... That is a devotee's business. Ordinary man cannot do it. Because he's doing that, it is to be understood that he's already on the platform of... Because salvation means to remain his own position. Muktir hitvānyathā-rūpaṁ svarūpeṇa vyavasthitiḥ (SB 2.10.6). Svarūpa is to serve God. So if one is serving on behalf of God, then he's in svarūpa, mukti. Others are acting for his own benefit, but a devotee is acting for others' benefit. Therefore he's already on the platform of liberation.

Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Therefore we shall keep it dusty. If our heart is full of dust, cleanse it. That is intelligence. What is this, "My heart is dirty, let it be kept as dirty"? No, if it is dirty, cleanse it. It is the duty of every Indian to understand Kṛṣṇa and preach Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement to others. That is real Indian business. That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission, that every one of you become Kṛṣṇa conscious and preach this Kṛṣṇa consciousness to others who are unaware of Kṛṣṇa. That is the injunction; that is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission. He said bhārata-bhūmite manuṣya-janma haila yāra (CC Adi 9.41). Anyone who has taken birth in India as a human being—not as dogs manuṣya, manuṣya means human—his duty is to become Kṛṣṇa conscious and preach to the other people for welfare activities. Bhārata-bhūmite manuṣya-janma haila yāra (CC Adi 9.41). We should mark this point, manuṣya-janma. He's not requesting the cats and dogs. So in other words, that those who are not taking, Indians... Bhagavad-gītā is known to everyone, every Indian knows. But if he does not preach this Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then he is not to be counted as human being. Because He says manuṣya-janma haila yāra. If we claim to be human being, born in India, it is our duty to understand the value of life from Bhagavad-gītā and preach this cult to others to do real welfare activities. This is the duty of every Indian. Why Indians are lacking in their duty? They do not understand Kṛṣṇa and they do not understand how to do good to others. Now whatever is done is done. It is time, now that Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is here, the temple is here, you come, you understand the whole philosophy and distribute. That is your duty. In New York City we can open many temples, provided you come.

Room Conversation -- July 17, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: "Great" means great fool.

Indian man: Yes. In Third Chapter where Kṛṣṇa is saying, "Renounce your everything to Me." Okay? And the word matam is used, matam. Now Swami Chinmayananda is saying, "That's my opinion," that's what Kṛṣṇa is telling, and they will be freed of all the work. And you have written matam means scriptural injunctions. And I tried to show the students who come to the class that "This is the difference. Look at this, very big difference," because if Kṛṣṇa is only giving His opinion, then He's talking like a diplomat, not talking like God. But if He says, "This is the law..." And I explained to them that like Bible has got ten commandments...

Prabhupāda: And another thing, even Kṛṣṇa says, giving His opinion—that's taking it as it is—Kṛṣṇa says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). So He's the supreme authority. So supreme authority's matam is a high-court judgment. There is no argument anymore. The judgment is given by the high-court. Final decision. So if Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme, then who can give him better opinion than Him? For argument's sake, even if He says... Any gentleman will say like that, that... Just like Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja: (BG 18.66) "You do it." He is Supreme Lord, He can force you, but He does not do that. So although His matam is the Supreme, but as a gentle preacher, He says, "That is My matam." But if you are sane, if you know that Kṛṣṇa is the supreme authority, then His matam is final.

Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: This is the position. Unless one feels like that and asks somebody, a superior, accepts him as guru, there is no use talking. It will not be useful. This is the position. If the injunction is tad vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12), if anyone is interested to know about the transcendental subject matter, he must approach a guru, and unless one approaches a guru, he cannot understand, and if by force I become guru, he may not be interested. This is the position. But still, for a preacher, he has to do something against all odds. That is preaching. You cannot expect favorable position. Your question was that we go and they say like this, but you cannot expect that wherever you are going you'll find favorable situation to talk. That you must understand. But you have to preach, you have to create favorable situation. That is your duty.(?) You cannot expect. If they are not prepared to take good instruction. Where is that fan?

Hari-śauri: He's bringing it.

Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Nava-yauvana: Everything you say, Prabhupāda, makes sense. Everything you say makes sense.

Prabhupāda: Yes, our preaching should be sensible, then people will accept. After all, they are human being. There is sense, but by force they are covering the sense. So we have to awaken them by handling carefully, that's all. Caitanya Mahāprabhu, jīv jāgo, jīv jāgo gauracānda bole. Who are... Uttiṣṭhata jāgrata prāpya varan nibodhata. They are sleeping. We have awaken them, that's it. That is preaching. Even the animal-killing, where it is absolutely necessary... So according to any religious principle, there is God. Just like who was telling me? You were telling me about the lamb killing? The injunction is the mouth(?) should be toward Mecca. Is it like that?

Nava-yauvana: Yes, Prabhupāda.

Conversation with Seven Ministers of Andhra Pradesh -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad:
Prabhupāda: As there are different educational system, there must be an educational institute where these things are taught: how to become truthful, how to become self-controlled, how to become full in knowledge, how to become full believer in the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Āstikyam. In this way, as there is necessity of engineer, as there is necessity of medical man, as there is necessity of so many other departmental chiefs, similarly, a department of brāhmaṇa, a department of kṣatriya—that education must be given. But in this age, because nobody is interested, so everyone is śūdra. Kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ. Paricaryātmakaṁ karma śūdra-karma svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). Everyone, all over the world, they are being educated to seek after some good service. Paricarya: he must have a good master; then his education will be... He cannot act independently. So therefore in the śāstra it is said that everyone is anxious to get a good job, therefore, kalau śūdra-sambhavaḥ, in this age almost everyone is śūdra. So if śūdras are there only, if there is no brāhmaṇa, no kṣatriya, no vaiśyas, that society will not prosper very much. If we accept the injunction of the śāstra, yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya vartate kāma (BG 16.23). So this brāhmaṇa, or kṣatriya, vaiśya, it is not by birth. It is by qualification. Guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). Guṇa. One must acquire the quality of brāhmaṇa and he must act as a brāhmaṇa. Then he is brāhmaṇa. Guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ. Even in śūdra family, if one is born śūdra, but he has attained the quality of a brāhmaṇa, he must be accepted as brāhmaṇa. That is the śāstra injunction.
Morning Walk -- August 23, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: About birth control. So birth control means the father and mother, the father and mother should not become father and mother unless they take full responsibility for the children to save them from the repetition of birth and death. This is the śāstric injunction. Pitā na sa syāj jananī na sā syāt na mocayed yaḥ samupeta-mṛtyum. The, everyone is, in this material world, is going on in the cycle of birth and death. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). Transmigrating from one body to another. And after many millions of years he gets the chance of becoming a human being. Now in this life he can stop the birth and death. Punar janma jāyate. That is Vedic culture. How to conquer over this process of repetition, birth and death. That is only possible in the human life. A chance is given, and if he misses this chance then again he'll be cycle... Therefore the father and mother's duty is to train up the children in such a way, that this is the last birth. No more birth. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). And that training, that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. But the things are different. Both the parents and the children, all of them are going again in the cycle of birth and death and wasting the opportunity of getting a human body. This is modern civilization. They do not know this science. They are kept in darkness. This is so-called education. Mūḍho 'yaṁ nābhijānāti mām ebhyaḥ paramaṁ mama (BG 7.25). Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi... They do not know what is the destination of life. In darkness. There is no education practically.

Morning Walk -- December 25, 1976, Bombay:

Guest (1): Unfortunately, he has... There are not very silent...

Prabhupāda: Take for example satyagraha. Satyagraha... What is the satyagraha? That is the child's play. Just like a child, he wants something. You are not giving him. He'll cry. He'll force you. So is there any śāstric injunction? Now these things have become popular. Real thing rejected, and some false thing presented by childish attempt, that is accepted.

Guest (1): But sir, would you not agree that in order to appeal to the masses or to make masses into any movement...

Prabhupāda: No, it is... You see... It is not... If you want to become an educated man or if you want to give first-class education, it is not for the mass. It is for the leader. Yad yad ācarati śreṣṭhas tat tad evetaro janaḥ (BG 3.21). If the leaders are educated, then others will follow. But if the leaders are not educated, what the others will do? That is the difficulty. And the so-called leaders, without being educated, they become leader.

Room Conversation -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Hari-śauri: When we go out and preach and we just repeat or try to repeat whatever we've heard from the spiritual master, but we may not have fully realized what we're speaking about, does that somehow or another reduce the potency of the Gītā or the Bhāgavatam or...

Prabhupāda: Yes, realization takes time. Therefore there is no question of realization. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says you simply repeat as Kṛṣṇa says. That will save you. The so-called political leaders, they have no realization, but they manufacture their ideas. That is dangerous. Mislead themselves and others. In Bhagavad-gītā it is clearly said, ācāryopāsanam. Amānitvam adambhitvam. This is the process of knowledge. These so-called scholars and politicians, they have no ācārya. Instead of being amānitvam, they're mani... "I have become a leader, so whatever I shall say, it will be accepted." This is going on. Very bad. It is clearly said, as soon as you give up the ācārya system it is rotten. Sa kāleneha yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa. So things which is rotten, what you'll get benefit? That is going on. Therefore in spite of so many Gītā commentators, big, big leaders, scholars, not a single person is converted into a devotee. Not a single person amongst their followers. It's useless talking. Therefore it is forbidden. Avaiṣṇava-mukhodgīrṇaṁ pūtam... Because they are not Vaiṣṇava, politicians and—reject them immediately. Immediately. That is the injunction. I wrote Mahatma Gandhi that "You are so respectful. People have got... Now you have got your svarāja. Please take Bhagavad-gītā seriously and let us preach."

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with C.I.D. Chief -- January 3, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: This education is lacking throughout the whole world, and we have started this movement to give this education, and people are against. That means they have become so fallen that they cannot even take up right knowledge. The same proverb: "It is folly to be wise where ignorance is bliss." So we have to struggle against this darkness, but we have to do it. This is our mission. We cannot stop it. It is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission, para-upakāra. People are kept in darkness, and... That is not Caitanya Mahāprabhu... Kṛṣṇa's mission actually. Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata (BG 4.7). "When people are misguided," tadātmānaṁ sṛjāmy aham, "at that time I come down." So the whole world is misguided on this bodily concept of life, and this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means Kṛṣṇa has come down in the shape of this movement. That is the real fact. Nāma-rūpe kṛṣṇa kali-kāle avatāra. "In the Kali-yuga Kṛṣṇa is incarnated in the form of His name, Hare Kṛṣṇa." Therefore in this age... That... Kīrtanād eva kṛṣṇasya mukta-saṅgaḥ paraṁ vrajet (SB 12.3.51). This is the injunction of the śāstras. Kīrtanād eva kṛṣṇasya. Simply by chanting the holy name of Kṛṣṇa, mukta-saṅga, he becomes free from all this material contamination, and he paraṁ vrajet, he goes back home, back to... So this name is not different. Because Kṛṣṇa is absolute, there is no difference between His name and Himself. And that is confirmed in the śāstra, and Caitanya Mahāprabhu recommends, śāstra recommends. We're just following their footprints, that's all. Kaler doṣa-nidhe rājann asti hy eko mahān guṇaḥ. This Kali-yuga is the ocean of faults. So... But there is one great opportunity in this ocean of faults. What is that? Kīrtanād eva kṛṣṇasya mukta-saṅgaḥ param... (SB 12.3.51). That is a great facility to these rascals, that if they chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra they become free from all contamination and become fit for going back home, back to Godhead. So this is a authorized movement. It is not a concoction, manufactured idea. So we are doing that.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Therefore there is certain age, that "At this age no more such ambition, material. Lead simple life and advance." That is after fiftieth year. This is our Vedic system. In the beginning it is not possible, but by practicing... So if one lives for hundred years, fifty years' extravagancy, "Now stop. Now be regulated and try to be mukta." This is the system. But they don't want even up to the point of death, even men like Gandhi and others. They do not want. This morning Indira Gandhi said that "I am for the mass of people." And Vivekananda, "My country." The same feeling as a person, individual person thinking of his family, these people are thinking of his country, a big family, not for the whole living entities, jīva. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Nobody is interested in the śāstric injunction. They've lost them all... Temporary... This is an institution to elevate people gradually. (break) If we follow our own... (microphone moving)

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: It is not very difficult. I don't find it very...

Prabhupāda: Not at all.

Evening Conversation -- January 25, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: ...there the injunction of the śāstra, kṛṣi-go-rakṣya. Go-rakṣya. Cow should be protected. Kṛṣṇa said, kṛṣi-go-rakṣya. Kṛṣṇa did not say chāgala-rakṣya or hog-rakṣya. Go-rakṣya. So it is the duty of the king or the state or the government to give protection to the cows. This is śāstric injunction. But nowadays neither the state or government is giving protection to the cow. They are becoming implicated with so many problems. I heard that India again is now slaughtering cows. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...perception. That is experience. Why do you give on seeing only? By seeing one mango you cannot understand what quality it is, but you have to touch with your tongue. Therefore in chemical laboratory the characteristics are there: "This is the color. This is the taste. This is the reaction." So you have to gather experience like that, not by simply seeing. That... I gave the example. Now you take one egg. What is there? Some white and some yellow substance. So you make one egg with white and yellow and bring life. So what is the power of your seeing? A small egg. Take a small egg. The covering, some celluloid, within, some white substance, some yellow substance. Or make further analysis and give some chemicals of the same taste, same color, same characteristic—now bring life. But the same thing. You put under the feather of the chicken. Within five days it will bring life. So what is the credit of these rascal doctors, D.H.C.? That a small chicken is better than these D.H.C. Why don't you see practically?

Gargamuni: The chicken is simply sitting, and he is...

Prabhupāda: He is bringing life. What is the answer of these rascal scientists?

Satsvarūpa: No good answer. Bluff.

Room Conversation -- January 28, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Always in danger because they are neophytes, just like a child is always in danger. So how you can save them? He's always in danger. So as far as possible, let us try. He's going to the fire. He's going to the water. He's going to the animal. He's eating some poison. So always in danger. That childish age is dangerous. Therefore mother takes care. Danger is already there because he's neophyte, kaniṣṭha-adhikārī. Therefore we have to abide by the injunction of the śāstra and guided by guru. That's all. That is our secure position. And otherwise danger always.

Pṛthu-putra: One boy in Paris, he had a visit...

Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be, this is the position. Those who are neophyte, they are always in danger. Therefore their duty is to be guided by sādhu-śāstra-guru. That's all. That is our... Now, I'll say from my practical life... It is not pride. Actually everyone knows that my Guru Mahārāja had thousands of disciples. So out of thousands of disciples, practically I am little successful. That everyone knows. Why? Because I firmly believed in the words of my guru. That's all. This is the... There may be many other Godbrother, maybe very learned and very advanced, whatever it may be, favored, and... Everyone claims that "I am the most favorite." And practical point of view... So I think sometimes that "Why this wonderful thing has happened to me?" So I search out. I search out only that I cent percent believe in the words of my spiritual... That's all, nothing else. Guru-mukha-padma-vākya, cittete koriyā aikya, āra nā koriho mane āśā **. Don't think of any nonsense. Simply execute what your guru has said. That is success. You are daily singing, guru-mukha-padma-vākya **. You know the meaning?

Morning Walk -- February 1, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Child cannot see. He's a rascal. He should be beaten with shoes. Then he will see. The child cannot see. Putraṁ ca śiṣyaṁ ca tāḍayen na tu lālayet: "Sons and disciples should be always chastised." That is Cāṇakya Paṇḍita. "Never pat them. Lālane bahavo doṣās tāḍane bahavo guṇāḥ... "If you pat, then he'll be spoiled. And if you chastise him, he'll come out a very nice person. Therefore, either disciple or son, they should be always chastised." This is the injunction of Cāṇakya Paṇḍita. There is no question of patting them.

Gurukṛpā: People want to be flattered. They don't want to be told very strongly.

Prabhupāda: And that is the position of disciples. Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, guru more mūrkha dekhi' (CC Adi 7.71). Caitanya Mahāprabhu was God Himself, and He said that "My Guru Mahārāja saw me a fool rascal number one." Chastisement. That is required. Cāṇakya Paṇḍita, a great moral instructor. He has advised, tāḍayen na tu lālayet: "Always chastise them. Otherwise they'll be spoiled."

Room Conversation -- February 10, 1977, Mayapura:

Arundhati: Pradyumna just gave me a tape. It must have been from the other night?

Prabhupāda: Ācchā?

Arundhati: So...

Jayapatākā: It's a very...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just to give them protection. So when we avoid envious persons, that is the injunction of the śāstras. This man wrote to the chief minister or prime minister complaining about them?

Jayapatākā: About his electric connection.

Prabhupāda: Who?

Jayapatākā: That Mahesh Pandit. You're talking about the man of Mahesh Pandit?

Prabhupāda: No, no. This Dāmodara Mahārāja.

Jayapatākā: The chief minister.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Room Conversation -- February 16, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That cannot appeal to the higher educated person.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa:There's nothing to it. Not giving knowledge of God.

Prabhupāda: And their behavior...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Is abominable.

Prabhupāda: The injunction is "Thou shall not kill." They are simply killing. How it will be effective?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The priests are doing all rascal nonsense. Homosex.

Prabhupāda: They announced that...(?) There is a hospital for drunkard priest.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Alcoholic priests.

Prabhupāda: And they have introduced gambling.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And homosex.

Prabhupāda: Homosex, what is that religion? And they're passing to homosex, religion. They're getting married man to man. Most degraded.

Hari-śauri: There's no difference between the behavior of a priest and the behavior of a gross atheist...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: You are argue your point, but our argument is here. You are arguing from your point of view, and we shall argue from our point of view. Unless the father releases the son from the cycle of birth and death, he's not father. This is our formula.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In order to accept this, they will have to rewrite the laws.

Prabhupāda: This is the actual... Now, apart from the scriptural injunction, if one comes to the argument, then such kind of father is there in the animal society also. Cats and dogs, they also beget children, but they cannot relieve the child from the cycle of birth and death. And Bhagavad-gītā says, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). First of all you have to see what is the actual distress in this material life. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). So in this life you are my father, and next time I become a cat or dog, so who cares for this father? I get another father. So who knows this law? Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā (BG 3.27). The laws of nature is going on, and everything is happening. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur dehopapattaye (SB 3.31.1). We are getting a type of body according to karma.

Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Ādi-keśava: Most of the work that we can do doesn't have much to do with someone being taken, one person. It has to do with dealing with the whole issue. When we make...

Prabhupāda: No, how is this American law is allowed that anyone can be kidnapped?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, that's the whole point...

Ādi-keśava: We have gotten in some states injunctions from the court so that people cannot be taken. For instance in California they have an injunction. In Massachusetts...

Prabhupāda: If this injunction is there, why don't you take steps and...?

Ādi-keśava: They took them from other states. So we're trying to extend it now to the other states. But in some places there are new laws, so we have to find a new way to go against it. We have just defeated the law in the state of Vermont. They proposed one law...

Prabhupāda: That law, but is what can I say?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, no, I mean he wasn't asking for any statement. I was just giving it as information.

Prabhupāda: That they have already taken. (converses with man in Bengali) (break) When there is fight, fight is fight. They'll take their tactics; we shall take our tactics.

Room Conversation -- March 22, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That purport is very clear.

Prabhupāda: So the sum and substance is that I have got the opportunity of human form, everyone, and they should not be kept in the same animal consciousness. This is civilization. They should be raised to the standard of inquiring. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. That is civilization. This, civilization? To keep them in darkness? Hm? Sanātana Gosvāmī went to Caitanya Mahāprabhu. The first question is ke āmi kene āmāya jāre tāpa-traya. "Sir, I was prime minister, and I was very much eulogized by the people as paṇḍita." Grāmya-vyavahāre paṇḍita tāi satya māni. "These village people, they call me paṇḍita, and I also, such a fool, I accept, 'Yes, I am paṇḍita. Yes.' But factually, if I inquire, 'What kind of paṇḍita'? then āpanāra hitāhita kichui nā jāni: 'I am such a learned paṇḍita that I do not know what is the ultimate goal of my life. I am such a paṇḍita.' Therefore I have come to You, Caitanya Mahāprabhu. You say what is my ultimate goal of life." This is approaching guru, not that "I am paṇḍita, I am brāhmaṇa, or minister. Why shall I go to learn? I can teach everyone whatever nonsense I know. Let them..." What is that injunction? That emasculation? That Sanjay Gandhi became?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Sterilization.

Room Conversation -- May 8, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: ...that "Once you eat and then do not eat for sixteen months." Is there any such restriction? This is encouraged.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Chanting.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But as soon as there is restriction, that means, "Don't do it." Otherwise naturally they have got sex desire. What is the use of giving shastric injunction? That means to control him. The meat-eating... So everyone has got tendency to eat meat, but why śāstra should agree? Restriction means stop. The government's opening liquor shop—so much restriction in a heavy duty. The government charges excise duty. The liquor is produced, utmost, one rupee, eight annas, per gallon. This I know. I know. And government charges excise duty, sixty rupees. So it becomes sixty-one rupees spoiled. Then they have got to make profit. Huge profit government... They haven't got to do anything. The liquor manufacturer, he has to maintain the establishment, and everything he has to do. But when the actual liquor comes, it is there. This is the working system. The excise inspector is there. So unless the... When he takes liquor out of stock, that excise inspector shall come. He has his own key, just like bank, such custody. So in this way... And you have to pay duty first. Suppose stock is there, liquor, hundred gallons, say, thousand gallons. If you want to take ten gallons, so the excise inspector will see whether you have paid duty for hundred gallons. Then you'll be allowed to. So government, for nothing, has... They make huge profit. This is Kali-yuga government. They think that "To condone these are very common practice. Let them be drunk. Let them drink." They encourage them. And government means big ministers, secretaries. They get the profit and divide amongst themselves. So who cares for public? Similarly cloth. What is the cost of one...? One rupee per pound. But if you weigh one cloth, what is the weight? Not even one pound. And they charge twenty rupees.

Room Conversation with Alice Coltrane -- July 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So why did you need? That means you do not read.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I didn't spell yaḥ properly. I spelled it y-a.

yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya
vartate kāma-kārataḥ
na sa siddhim avāpnoti
na sukhaṁ na parāṁ gatim
(BG 16.23)

Translation: "But he who discards scriptural injunctions and acts according to his own whims attains neither perfection nor happiness nor the supreme destination." Purport: "As described before, the śāstra-vidhim, or the direction of the śāstra, is given to the different castes and orders of human society. Everyone is expected to follow these rules and regulations. If one does not follow them and acts whimsically according to his lust, greed and desire, then he never will be perfect in his life. In other words, a man may theoretically know all these things, but if he does not apply them in his own life, then he is to be known as the lowest of mankind. In the human form of life, a living entity is expected to be sane and to follow the regulations given for elevating his life to the highest platform, but if he does not follow them, then he degrades himself. But even if he follows the rules and regulations and moral principles and ultimately does not come to the stage of understanding the Supreme Lord, then all his knowledge becomes spoiled. Therefore one should gradually raise himself to the platform of Kṛṣṇa consciousness and devotional service; it is then and there that he can attain the highest perfectional stage, not otherwise.

The word kāma-cārataḥ is very significant. A person who knowingly violates the rules acts in lust. He knows that this is forbidden, still he acts. This is called acting whimsically. He knows that this should be done, but still he does not do it; therefore he is called whimsical. Such persons are destined to be condemned by the Supreme Lord. Such persons cannot have the perfection which is meant for the human life. The human life is especially meant for purifying one's existence, and one who does not follow the rules and regulations cannot purify himself, nor can he attain the real stage of happiness".

Prabhupāda: So you do that. Read carefully and execute that. Then you'll be perfect.

Room Conversation -- October 26, 1977, Vrndavana:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: It is not absolutely necessary.

Prabhupāda: Those who are engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service, they have no necessity for all this. Sarvātmanā yaḥ śaraṇaṁ śaraṇyaṁ parihṛtya kartam.

devarṣi-bhūtāpta-nṛṇāṁ pitṟṇāṁ
na kiṅkaro nāyam ṛṇī ca rājan
sarvātmanā yaḥ śaraṇaṁ śaraṇyaṁ
gato mukundaṁ parihṛtya kartam
(SB 11.5.41)

Anyone who is fully engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service, he has no other duty. He has finished all other duties. Tepus tapas te (SB 3.33.7). This is the injunction of the śāstra. He's no more anyone's servant, or he has got any duty to do-śaraṇaṁ śaraṇyam—because he has taken the shelter of the ultimate Supreme Person. This is the injunction of the śāstra. So this śrāddha ceremony is not required for a devotee fully surrendered to the lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa. Gato mukundaṁ śaraṇaṁ śaraṇyam. Śaraṇyam: He is the only shelter. And who has taken shelter of Kṛṣṇa, he has no other duty. This is the śāstra. Yes. (break)... You now give. (drinks) (break)

Bhavānanda: Prabhupāda just asked where it was.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh. Locked in the almirah. Locked in your almirah.

Prabhupāda: Why?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, because it's valuable. I wanted to make sure it was not lost or anything. I mean, this medicine is going to save your life, Śrīla Prabhupāda, so I consider it most valuable.

Prabhupāda: Bring one...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You want some more medicine?

Bhavānanda: He wants to see the color. (break)

Prabhupāda: Bruises are here, but this is not? You see there.

Page Title:Injunction (Conversations)
Compiler:Visnu Murti, Mayapur
Created:25 of Mar, 2012
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=112, Let=0
No. of Quotes:112