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Honor (Conversations)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1967 Conversations and Morning Walks

Discourse on Lord Caitanya Play Between Srila Prabhupada and Hayagriva -- April 5-6, 1967, San Francisco:

Hayagrīva: He's 24 now.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Renunciation. So one day it so happened that instead of chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, Lord Caitanya was chanting, "Gopī, gopī, gopī, gopī, gopī," instead of chanting "Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa." So He had a small school. The brāhmaṇas, generally they keep a small school which is called catuṣpaṭhī. (spells out) C-c-h-a-a-t-u-s-p-a-t-h-i. Catuṣpaṭhī, catuṣpaṭhī means a school where up to the four Vedas are taught. Grammar and religion and everything is taught there. In every village that was system. The brāhmaṇas should keep up a school like that. Students were all almost they were also of the same age. Some of them were fifteen years old, sixteen years old. So students came and saw Lord Caitanya was chanting "Gopī gopī," so they objected. They said, "Oh, why You are chanting 'gopī gopī'? Why should You not chant 'Kṛṣṇa'? 'Hare Kṛṣṇa'?" So Caitanya Mahāprabhu was in His ecstasy because He was... In the beginning, His appearance is in the form of gopī, to love Kṛṣṇa. So He became very much angry, and because they were students, He wanted to chastise them. He took a stick. "You nonsense! What you are speaking? Go away!" So they fled away, but after that they organized. "Oh, how is that? Caitanya, He is... How He has become so big that He wants to beat us?" In this way they practically they were talking ill of Him. So He decided that "If I remain a householder, these people will not honor Me." Because in those days a sannyāsī was honored in the society very much. If a sannyāsī comes to your village or to a householder's house it was very... Still it is going on, although not so widely. But still 80% of the population in India, if they find out a sannyāsī they give all honor. So He decided that "Now I shall become a sannyāsī." So He happened to see Keśava Bhāratī, a sannyāsī of the Śaṅkara sampradāya, and He requested him that "You give Me sannyāsa." So He took sannyāsa from Keśava Bhāratī and He was assisted by Nityānanda, Murāri Gupta, and some other people. So this is His renunciation decision and acceptance of sannyāsa.

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Questions and Answers -- Montreal, August 26, 1968:
Prabhupāda: So Caitanya Mahāprabhu had all these facilities. He was learned, very honored young man in His country; He had many followings. In one incidence we can understand how beloved leader He was. The Kazi challenged His saṅkīrtana movement and first times warned Him not to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, and when He did not care for it, then he ordered that, er, that mṛdaṅga should be broken. So the constables came and broke the mṛdaṅgas. This information was given to Lord Caitanya, and He ordered civil disobedience. He was the first man in the history of India who started this civil disobedience movement. It is not Gandhi who is the originator of civil disobedience; it was Caitanya Mahāprabhu. He said that "Defy the order of the Kazi." Kazi means magistrate. So "This evening we shall go at the Kazi's house in hundreds of thousands, with mṛdaṅga and kīrtana." So simply by His order many hundreds of thousands young men—not young men; young, old, all kind of men-gathered, and... The point is just how popular leader He was. Even in His young age, when He was only twenty years old, how popular He was. So..., and because He was a learned brāhmaṇa, people would send Him many presentation. A brāhmaṇa is not expected to work. That is dhana pratigraha. Pratigraha means accept offerings from others. Just like you offered so many things to me-money, clothing, food—so a sannyāsī, a brāhmaṇa, can accept. Not others. A gṛhastha cannot.
Room Conversation -- October 27, 1968, Montreal, With First Devotees Going to London On Evening of Their Departure:

Prabhupāda: Virāṭa rūpa, yes. That is also nice, right, that through fire He eats, yes, or through the mouth of the brāhmaṇas and devotees. Two things are there. Therefore, according to the Vedic religion, the brāhmaṇas or Vaiṣṇavas, devotees, are invited to take food in some ceremonies. In śraddhā ceremony they are especially invited with great honor. In pilgrimage somebody goes to Vrndavana, Prayag, Mathura. They invite the brāhmaṇas and Vaisnavas so that through them Kṛṣṇa is eating. They have come to satisfy Kṛṣṇa in a place of pilgrimage. These are the systems. So for the purpose of eating, so many brāhmaṇas have sprung up. Because brāhmaṇas are invited, so so many so-called brāhmaṇas there. They'll be present when eating, and when there is chanting of Vedas they are not present there. (break) Baby has also tilaka. (chuckles) She is very happy. You see? I never seen such small child not crying. That means she is always happy. She's not crying means... Because baby cries when there is discomfort. And with her face shows that she is very happy. (laughs)

Press Interview -- December 30, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: They are not interested in religion. It is simply a makeshow, showbottle. Then how they can be happy? If you do not follow the regulative principles, then where is your religion?

Journalist: I'm not arguing with you. I couldn't agree with you more. I'm in total agreement. It doesn't make any sense. "Thou shalt not kill," "Thou shalt worship no other Gods before Me," "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's ass," "Thy shall honor thy father and thy mother," those are beautiful ethics, but they're not obeyed.

Prabhupāda: "Thou shall not kidnap your neighbor's wife."

Journalist: Wife, covet.

Prabhupāda: So who is following this?

Journalist: No one. Very few.

Prabhupāda: You see? So how you can expect they're religious. And without religion, human society is animal society.

Journalist: All right, but let me ask you this. Along this line... Now I'm not asking you...

Prabhupāda: Take it. Take it.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Maṭha commander means the, everything of that place under his command.

Hayagrīva: That's not good. Then advisor is better. Advisor would be better.

Prabhupāda: Advisor means his advice will be final?

Hayagrīva: Advice final? That means the advice would be depending on the president.

Prabhupāda: Confirmed by the president. So honorary advisor. Advice gratis?

Hayagrīva: Yes.

Prabhupāda: (Chuckling) No. Another thing is that, as I suggested, that Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja, being sannyāsī, he should be given the top post to give honor to the position of a sannyāsī. Otherwise in our society there is no meaning of a sannyāsī.

Hayagrīva: So you want him to be president?

Prabhupāda: I think he should be, like that. You become secretary, and Śyāma dāsī become assistant secretary. Of course, everything should be decided in a meeting, and president may be have as a casting vote, but the decision of the meeting will be actually the decision. Not that president autocracy, no. Or he may be president, you may be vice president and others, Śyāma dāsī, secretary, and treasurer he is. From sampradāya point of view, sannyāsī has to be given the top post. Do you think he will overrule you? (Laughs)

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Yes. You finish it and give me. I will get it printed, and then he goes. In the meantime you... So he remains as consultant. Your proposal, that you remain president, he is secretary, and treasurer, and he is consultant so long he is here and when he comes.

Hayagrīva: So he can be... He'll be general supervisor?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Naturally when he comes, he becomes overhead everyone, when he comes, because he is a sannyāsī. Just like here, when I am present, you take all final decision from me, so that should be the honor of the sannyāsī. But he should actually... He is not in charge of this place. Just like in other centers the president, secretary, are in charge.

Hayagrīva: So that's not called maṭha commander. That's called general supervisor.

Prabhupāda: He will be, for the time being, the superintendent of the society. He will go everywhere and see and report me what, how things are going on. And then we are going to make a central committee gradually. Everything will be done. Let us work very seriously and sincerely. Everything will come out.

Hayagrīva: So then Śyāma dāsī is our treasurer..., secretary.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And he is treasurer, Hṛṣīkeśa?

Room Conversation With John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison -- September 11, 1969, London, At Tittenhurst:

Prabhupāda: Oh, very glad to see you. Be happy and make all others happy. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Sarve sukhino bhavantu. That is Vedic idea. Everyone be happy. That is the benediction. Sarve sukhino bhavantu. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says also the same thing, that let this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement be preached in every village, in every town of the world. People will be happy. That is His foretelling. So any missions, any high ideals, should be preached just to make everyone happy. Because in the material existence, there is no happiness. That is a fact. There cannot be any happiness. This place is not meant for happiness because in the Bhagavad-gītā you'll find the Lord Himself says this is a place, duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam (BG 8.15). It is a place of miseries, this material world. And aśāśvatam, and temporary. Everything is temporary. Even if you accept, "All right. Whatever miserable is there, I'll accept this," that is also, has no value. Even if you accept, nature will not allow you to accept it and remain there. Aśāśvatam. You have to leave. So Kṛṣṇa says, mām upetya kaunteya duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam nāpnuvanti mahātmānaḥ saṁsiddhiṁ paramāṁ gatāḥ: (BG 8.15) "If somebody comes to Me, then he hasn't got to return back to this miserable condition of life which is not only miserable but temporary." So we should understand that. Nature is so cruel. In America, President Kennedy, he was thought to be the most fortunate man, happy man, young man, was elected President, nice wife, children, honor all over the world—(snaps finger)—within a second, finished. Temporary. Now what is his condition? Where he is? If life is eternal, if living entity is eternal, where he has gone? What he is doing? Is he happy or he is distressed? Or he's born in America or China? Nobody can say. But it is a fact that as living entity, he's eternal, he's existing. That is the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā philosophy. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). After destruction of this body the living entity is not destroyed. He is there. That we can understand. Just like in your childhood, you had a small body. That body is no more, but you are existing. So it is natural, when this body will not exist, I will exist in another body. It is not very difficult to understand. So this theory that body is eternal..., soul is eternal and body is temporary, that's a fact.

1970 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1970, Indore:

Haṁsadūta: Ten lakhs. They can give the full amount?

Prabhupāda: Yes, why not? This man... It is to be very carefully tackled. This king is going to die very soon. And as soon as the king dies, the queen's position is very precarious, almost finished. So if she becomes our president, she'll continue to keep her honor and prestige. That's a fact. She's a good lady. We have no objection to make her the president of the local center. And she is American. She will be able to tackle these American boys and girls with motherly affection. And we shall keep her always in good respect so that throughout her life she shall be honored all over as she was, as she was honored with her husband. This is a fact. So you have to convince her. And I think if the other ladies who are..., her daughter-in-law and granddaughters, like that... Because her son is dead. He was the king. This old man being invalid, his son was king. And I think that middle-aged woman was there. You have marked this? She might be her daughter-in-law and the young girls might be grandchildren. One of them, one of the daughters, girl, was very beautiful. So it appears that she comes from the royal family. Rāja-kanyā King's daughters are very beautiful. That is fabulous in India, king's daughter, rāja-kanyā. In India if anybody gets a good dowry and a beautiful wife it is said, arddhe rajatva eka rāja-kanyā(?) Actually we have seen in..., when Devaki was married to Vasudeva, how much dowry. Can anyone imagine now? So many thousands of horses, chariots, elephants, maidservants, all decorated with gold ornaments. One cannot imagine even at the present moment. Therefore they talk of "legends." But actually such dowries were given when a king's daughter was married. Not only royal family, even in ordinary family still, those who are rich, they spend lots of money to be married, either son's marriage or daughter's. When one spends lots of money during the marriage of one's daughter and son he is considered to be really rich man. That is the proof that he is rich man. So we can begin. He cannot rise, this, what is called, Muktananada? That's all right. Where he is?

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Discussion with Indians -- January 18, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: Then you are liberated; you have nothing to go. If you are liberated, then you have nothing to seek, knowledge.

Guest (5): Thank you for listening. Time and place. He's already said that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. If you are liberated, you have nothing to go anywhere because you know everything.

Guest (2): May I again submit with the honor that you have bestowed on me of having said that I am already liberated according to the version of Gītā...

Prabhupāda: If you have understood Kṛṣṇa, then you are liberated.

Guest (2): I still feel... I still feel...

Prabhupāda: Then you haven't got to seek knowledge.

Guest (2): I still feel that...

Prabhupāda: You be satisfied with yourself. You are liberated.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1971, Gorakhpur:

Prabhupāda: Therefore you are, we have prescribed rules for chanting. You must finish sixteen rounds, then go to sleep, whole day sleeping. You finish that sixteen rounds and sleep whole day. I have no objection. (laughter)

Devotee: But then...

Prabhupāda: There is no then. Don't talk nonsense. If you are so much addicted to sleeping, you simply chant sixteen rounds and whole day sleep. But don't take food also. (laughter) Don't get up taking prasādam. "Now I have to honor prasādam. Let me eat sumptuous, then again sleep more."

Devotee: Is there some order of priority in service then? I mean, sixteen rounds is more important than anything else. And then following that, there's something else.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. If you cannot do anything else, you simply chant sixteen rounds, take prasādam, and sleep. (laughter) It is special prerogative for you. There is no then. This is, this is order for you.

Devotee: In a situation where there's a choice between say chanting and reading. Is chanting a better activity than reading?

Prabhupāda: Yes, chanting and reading is the same thing.

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Yes. If they are actually following strictly the principles of Jesus Christ, then sometimes when he meets some pure devotee, he will accept. The groundwork will be nice for accepting farther advancement. Just like Jesus Christ says, "Thou shall not kill." So if anyone follows this principle, "No, I shall not kill," then he becomes purified. But who is that Christian who is not killing? So where is follow? Amongst the Christians the more killing process is going on very strongly. So who is a Christian? In that, if you disobey the first principle of Christianity, then where is your Christianity? Why you falsely claim that you are a Christian? "Thou shalt not covet." What is that next?

Devotee: "Thou shalt not kill."

Devotee: Honor thy mother and father?

Devotee: There is one about no adulteration.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So adulteration is going on, killing is going on. So many disobedience to Christian principles. So where is the possibility of becoming a Christian?

Devotee: "Honor thy mother and father" is not being respected.

Prabhupāda: Not... So many things. So, if you do not follow the principles of Christianity, simply by stamping yourself as Christian, will that do? So why Jesus Christ will be responsible for you? Simply by stamping yourself that "I am Christian." Is that very reasonable proposal?

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Gaurachand Gosvami At the Radha-Damodara Temple (Mostly Bengali) -- March 11, 1972, Vrndavana:

Indian man (2): Kṛṣṇa Caitanya dāsa.

Prabhupāda: So differences are there, there will be always. So how one's opinion should be taken as...

Indian man (2): Yes. No, but you see, this kind of writing does create sort of a... It does give rise to...

Prabhupāda: So Vṛndāvana is the breeding ground for such things.

Indian man (2): No, it's not Vṛndāvana. That man doesn't live here, he lives in Calcutta. The book was brought here. It was sent by him to some people, and one copy was directed to me also. Five copies were sent here, and I have the honor to be the recipient of one of them. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: How big it is?

Indian man (2): A small thing, small thing, about eighty, ninety pages. So I was just going through it, I have been, and I will call a gentleman at two o'clock today with whom I shall discuss the matter. He belongs to that party.

Prabhupāda: Which party?

Indian man (2): The author.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Indian man (2): The author, author's party.

Prabhupāda: Author's party. They have got a party here?

Indian man (2): No party here, but this gentleman has given the foreword. He is the author of Ṭhākura Haridāsa, that big volume.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Conversation with Bajaj and Bhusan -- September 11, 1972, Arlington, Texas, At Their Home:

Prabhupāda: Yes. February. Yes. I was there. I saw him. I saw Mr. Raja Gopala Acarya with him. So he is a dead body, living dead body.

Guest (2): Raja Gopala Acarya has also written a lot of books.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Not lot of. Some books he has written. So our request is to the Indians especially that we have got something to give to the world. Simply don't beg. Give something. Then you will be honored. You cannot compete with them by technology, by learning here. That is not possible. If you can give them something, that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Guest (2): How far is saṁskāra powerful like...?

Prabhupāda: Well, saṁskāra you can change in a second. Saṁskāra may be powerful. (indistinct) Kṛṣṇa assures you, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi. He will give you protection. Saṁskāra means you did some sinful activities and you are suffering. But He gives you protection. Sarva-pāpebhyo. Then what is the meaning of saṁskāra? You can change your saṁskāra immediately by surrendering to Kṛṣṇa. Why you are so much concerned with saṁskāra? He says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ... (BG 18.66), ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣa... The saṁskāra as effects of sinful activities, that is troublesome. So He gives you protection. Mā śucaḥ, "Don't worry." Why don't you take this? You don't want to change your saṁskāra, and who can help you? That is a different thing. You don't want to change. Otherwise Kṛṣṇa is ready to give you all help. How their saṁskāra is changed? From the very beginning of their life they are addicted to these principles: illicit sex, meat-eating, intoxication, gambling. How they have changed? They don't touch it. How it has become possible?

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversations with Sannyasis -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That we are discussing. That was not a very (indistinct).

Śyāmasundara: The whole thing is that we're sort of at a crisis in India, in terms of our presence here. Our prestige has hit an all-time low simply because of our conduct, that's all. Not because of our teaching, or because we are white, or anything like that. It's just because of our conduct. It's been so bad. Abominable. We don't in any way compare with the Indian sannyāsīs in our conduct. So how can we expect to honor Śrīla Prabhupāda if we conduct ourselves like that? So it's part of our responsibilities as the leaders not to avoid it, not to avoid the other devotees, but to train them now, begin training them.

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is the Vaiṣṇava training. Now we should have our routine work. Just like here, punctually, as soon as I see seven, I ask, "When is he coming?" (indistinct). As soon as (indistinct), immediately I ask. So there may be more (indistinct), but the routine work must be followed. If somebody is slipping, the kīrtana is going on (indistinct) morning, (indistinct) is going on. So he maybe said that if you sleep like that then you cannot do it.

Morning Walk -- April 21, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: He was our professor. So he was explaining the different ages of archaeologist, anthropology.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: This is in philosophy, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No, history.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh, history.

Prabhupāda: In my honors class, I had history. He was teaching us history.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: What is the standard of Calcutta University, Śrīla Prabhupāda, at the time when Śrīla Prabhupāda was in the University? How was the...

Prabhupāda: Oh, it was nice. Very nice students were coming out.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The moral standard was very good?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. We respected our professors like our fathers. The relationship between the student and the professors was very good. I had one Scottish professor, Dr. W.S. Urquhart. He was my nice friend. He was professor of philosophy, psychology. Later on he became vice-chancellor.

Room Conversation with Dr. Arnold Toynbee, Famous Historian, at his home or office -- July 22, 1973, London:

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Change for good. Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And your article showed that you are also for change for good.

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So our movement and your honor, we can cooperate for the good of the general people.

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes.

Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: This boy is American boy, but he has learned Sanskrit very nicely.

Pradyumna:

tejaḥ kṣamā dhṛtiḥ śaucam
adroho nātimānitā
bhavanti sampadaṁ daivīm
abhijātasya bhārata

"Translation: The Blessed Lord said, fearlessness, purification of one's existence, cultivation of spiritual knowledge, charity, self-control, performance of sacrifice, study of the Vedas, austerity and simplicity, nonviolence, truthfulness, freedom from anger, renunciation, tranquility, aversion to faultfinding, compassion and freedom from covetousness, gentleness, modesty and steady determination, vigor, forgiveness, fortitude, cleanliness, freedom from envy and the passion for honor, these transcendental qualities, O son of Bhārata, belong to godly men endowed with divine nature."

Prabhupāda: Then the demonic nature?

Pradyumna: Then,

dambho darpo 'bhimānaś ca
krodhaḥ pāruṣyam eva ca
ajñānaṁ cābhijātasya
pārtha sampadam āsurīm

"Arrogance, pride, anger, conceit, harshness and ignorance, these qualities belong to those of demoniac nature, O son of Pṛthā."

Prabhupāda: Then characteristics of demonic people?

Pradyumna: Uh...

Prabhupāda: Pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ ca...

Pradyumna:

pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ ca
janā na vidur āsurāḥ
na śaucaṁ nāpi cācāro
na satyaṁ teṣu vidyate
(BG 16.7)

"Those who are demoniac do not know what is to be done and what is not to be done. Neither cleanliness nor proper behavior nor truth is found in them."

Prabhupāda: Then? Next verse.

Pradyumna:

asatyam apratiṣṭhaṁ te
jagad āhur anīśvaram
aparaspara-sambhūtaṁ
kim anyat kāma-haitukam
(BG 16.8)

"They say that this world is unreal, that there is no foundation and that there is no God in control. It is produced of sex desire and has no cause other than lust."

Prabhupāda: This is the opinion of the demoniac people, that the, there is no God, there is no controller, it has come into existence by chemical reaction, just like a child is born by sex intercourse, reaction of some chemicals. This is the demonic theory.

Room Conversation with Reporter from Researchers Magazine -- July 24, 1973, London:

Reporter: But today's kings...

Prabhupāda: Today's no... I'm speaking... Today's good and tomorrow is bad, that is not.

Reporter: Yeah, yeah.

Prabhupāda: I'm speaking the principle. The king must be representative of God. Therefore we offer so much honor to the King. Exactly like God. Why? Because King is supposed to be representative of God. Our Vedic conception is cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. This catur-varṇa. It is the king's duty, government's duty, to see that a person claiming to be brāhmaṇa, whether he's acting as a brāhmaṇa. Nowadays that... Such supervision is not there. Therefore a man acting as śūdra, but he's claiming to be brāhmaṇa.

Reporter: Yeah, yeah, yeah. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: Isn't it?

Reporter: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: So it is the king's duty. Just like the king, it is the government's duty to see that nobody cheats. If a person without any medical qualification, if he writes "Doctor, Medical practitioner," he should be punished. Similarly, if one is claiming to be brāhmaṇa, he must act as brāhmaṇa. If one is claiming to be kṣatriya, he must act as a kṣatriya. Now, what are the qualifications of brāhmaṇa, what are the qualifications of kṣatriya, they are there already in Bhagavad-gītā.

Room Conversation with Mister Popworth and E. F. Schumacher -- July 26, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: There is one moral instruction by Cāṇakya Paṇḍita. Cāṇakya Paṇḍita was a great minister during the time of Mahārāja Candragupta. So he was honorary Prime Minister in the empire. So he has a book of moral instruction. So he says in that moral instruction, who is a learned man. So he gives the description of a learned man, that: mātṛvat para-dāreṣu. Mātṛvat. "Just treat all other women except your wife as your mother." Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu, para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat. Loṣṭa means as there are so many pebbles lying on the street, you don't care for it, similarly, others' property, others' money you should treat just like these pebbles lying on the street or the garbage lying on the street. Don't touch it. So mātṛvat para-dāreṣu para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat, ātmavat sarva-bhūteṣu. And treat all living entities as you want to be treated. If one has got these three qualifications, he is learned man. He does not say, one who has got this BAC, DAC degrees, and so on, so on, so on. No. The result of his education is to be seen by three manifestations: treating all women as mother; treating others' money, property, as garbage, as rubbish in the street; and treating all living entities as you want to be treated yourself. If one has attained these three development of knowledge, he is learned. There is no question of literary education. Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat. So if we covet other's wife, if we eat meat, if we indulge in intoxication, if we indulge in gambling, we are polluting the whole society. So how we can expect purification unless we accept these principles? You cannot ignite fire, at the same time pour water on it.

Room Conversation with Indian Ambassador -- September 5, 1973, Stockholm:

Prabhupāda: But they think... Familiarity breeds contempt. "Oh, Kṛṣṇa, we know. What you have got to teach us?" Although he doesn't know anything, because he, he belongs to the country where Kṛṣṇa appeared, therefore he knows everything. That... You know that Hindi. (Hindi)

Ambassador: Poetic. "The prophet is not honored in his own country."

Prabhupāda: Yes. (Hindi) That is this position. So do you think I shall submit some name?

Ambassador: Certainly, Your Grace, and I will look into it and if I have got right, I will do it, or I will send...

Prabhupāda: No. You are... Why you have not right? Because...

Ambassador: Yes, I've got, there are discretions.

Prabhupāda: Then, then it will be useless. Because as soon as you send to Delhi, they'll refuse. So then don't try for it. If you can, if you can help personally, then we'll submit the names. Otherwise, if you go in official channels, I don't expect.

Interviews with Macmillan and various English Reporters -- September 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: I do not know what is Jesus Movement. If you can explain, then I can speak. What is that Jesus Movement, I do not know.

Reporter (1): Well, do you know very much about Jesus?

Prabhupāda: Jesus, I know.

Reporter (1): Tell me about him.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Jesus, the son of God, he's representative of God. So we have got all respect and honor for him. We worship him. But I do not know what is about Jesus Movement.

Reporter (1): Tell me a little bit about Kṛṣṇa consciousness, will you?

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa consciousness means the same, Bhagavad-gītā as it is, which was spoken five thousand years ago by Lord Kṛṣṇa Himself, we are preaching the same Bhagavad-gītā. Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā, Kṛṣṇa is accepted, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So we are preaching that "Here is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Kṛṣṇa."

Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, everyone should work. Our Vedic philosophy is that everyone must work. But there must be division of work. Just like in your body there are different parts. The head department, the arms department, the belly department, and the legs department. These are different parts. So all these departments must work for the total benefit of the body. That is our philosophy. Nobody should sit idle. But he must work according to his capacity. Brain must work for giving direction. Hand must work for giving protection. Belly must work for supplying food, energy. And leg must work for carrying the body. So similarly the society must be divided: the brain of the society, the arms of the society, the belly of the society and the legs of the society. That will make perfection. The brain will give direction That is the brāhmaṇas. The arms will give protection. That is the kṣatriya. And the belly will give energy, food, that is vaiśya. And the legs will carry the body. That is śūdra. This is... Whole society should be divided into four divisions, the brāhmaṇas, the kṣatriyas, the vaiśyas and the śūdras. And they should work cooperatively for the total benefit of the body. This is perfect life. Not that everyone should be brain. Then who will carry me? Just like in your bank, the manager is the brain. The secretaries and assistants are the hands, clerks. And ordinary worker, they are legs. Anywhere you go, you must find out these four divisions. Therefore the human society must be divided into four divisions. But there is no such plan. Now the plan is that everyone is being educated to learn technology, how to... In your country, especially. How to make economic development. So they have no brain. Therefore there are hippies. There is no brain actually. Now, the President Nixon, he is in the topmost post. He has no brain. Therefore he is being ridiculed. Neither he has honor. He is not resigning the post. He has been ridiculed by the people, but still, he is sticking to his post. So this is the defect. You have got in your country only the vaiśyas, the belly and the legs. I am just giving a crude example. Not only in your country, every country nowadays. There is no brain. Brain is finished. Therefore everywhere you will find chaos and confusion. There is no brain. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means we are creating some brain.

Morning Walk -- December 8, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: He's śūdra, paricaryātmakaṁ karma śūdra-karma svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). As soon as one accepts service of a master, immediately śūdra.

Yaśomatīnandana: True brāhmaṇas even didn't care for kings.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Yaśomatīnandana: They didn't care for the honor from king or they didn't, they would...

Prabhupāda: They would give advice to the kings but never accept the post of a king.

Hṛdayānanda: So every kṣatriya had to have something to manage?

Prabhupāda: Yes. There was a regular advisory committee, privy council, composed of high learned brāhmaṇas and saintly persons.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I think people who say like this they are jealous.

Prabhupāda: Ha?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They are jealous of the other people who are coming up higher than them. So, seeing them, they are quite jealous.

Prabhupāda: Who?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: These so-called brāhmaṇas.

Prabhupāda: They must be jealous because if simply by taking birth in a brāhmaṇa family he can become brāhmaṇa and if somebody protests then he, he becomes jealous... (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya.

Morning Walk -- December 15, 1973, Los Angeles:

Karandhara: But that's an authority we have imposed upon ourselves.

Prabhupāda: Yes, because there is need, therefore you have done it. There is necessity.

Karandhara: Well, some of them say, because people are generally ignorant, therefore we need this idea of God.

Prabhupāda: But you are less than ignorant. You are less than ignorant. You are less than rascal. If I call you a rascal, then I give you some honor.

Karandhara: Lenin said that God is just opiate of the people, just to keep them intoxicated.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no, no. That means Lenin wanted to become God. That's all. The God idea is there, but he cannot be God. Because he was under the laws of God, he died. He died. He could not save himself from death. Therefore he is not supreme authority. He accepted supreme authority, but he wanted himself to become the supreme authority. Now, when he died, he is not supreme authority. He is forced to die. Then there is another supreme authority.

Karandhara: Well, then they can say ultimately death is meaningless anyway.

Prabhupāda: Why meaningless? Then why you are afraid of death when I come to kill you?

Karandhara: Well, that it's meaningless doesn't mean I can't place some value on it at any given point.

Prabhupāda: Why meaningless? It has meaning. Then why you are fighting? Why you fought for Russian Revolution?

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 10, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Then if he cannot, then he is cat and dog. He is not a human being. Why he should accept initiation? Let him remain a cat and dog. He promises to follow, and if he cannot follow, then he is nothing but cat and dog. In the court, they take promises, that "In the name of God," "In the name of Bible." So that means he will speak the truth. Similarly, before the fire, before Deity, before guru, before devotees, he is promising something, and if he does not follow, then he is cat and dog. He cannot advance. It is not possible. That is the distinction between cat and dog and human being. Cat and dog, they cannot promise. It is not possible. But a human being can promise. And if he keeps his promise, then he is human being. Otherwise cat and dog. Word of honor. The cats and dogs, they have no sense of honor. Either you kick him or pat, he does not know what is the difference. That is cat and dog. He does not know the distinction. A human being knows what is promise, what is word of honor.

Room Conversation -- February 13, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That's impossible. So this is a wrong theory. Because I am a living entity, I have got my activities. I can remain void for few seconds, for few minutes. (Guests enter and pay obeisances) Very glad to see you. (indistinct—break)

Dr. Kapoor: As I understand (indistinct). The export minister (indistinct). (indistinct) C. D. Gupta, the old chief minister, you see. He is coming and I take they have arranged a program in his honor. I don't know how they will make this program fit in. I don't think..., huh? (break)

Prabhupāda: In the road they are announcing that Śrī Bhaktivedanta Swami American śiṣyas...

Dr. Kapoor: I heard the announcement but that was on the (indistinct) hari-nāma-saṅkīrtana (indistinct). You have your (indistinct)?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Kapoor: The other program is on behalf of...

Prabhupāda: But we don't want.

Morning Walk -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Rascal civilization, rascal government. And people are transferred into rascals. (Hindi) Annād bhavanti bhūtāni (BG 3.14). Without anna, how they can live? There is no arrangement for anna. They're simply passing resolution, legislative laws. And no anna. Just see what kind of wretched government it is. Everywhere. There is no anna. Annād bhavanti bhūtāni. The first duty of government is to see that everyone is happy, without any anxiety. These preliminary necessities of life, āhāra-nidra-bhaya-maithunam, there must be sufficient arrangement for these preliminary necessities of life. One must eat sumptuously. Not over-eating, indulgence. No. But he must have sufficient food to keep up the health. Similarly, he must have place to sleep. We, we are prepared to offer everything. And be Kṛṣṇa conscious. This is our mission. Not by eating and sleeping, become rogues and thieves and rascals. That we will not allow. That is varṇāśrama-dharma. (Hindi conversation for a few sentences) Why unemployment? There is no scarcity (of) water. Just have a big well. Electricity pump water. Oh, immediately, it will be all green. Immediately. (Hindi for a while) Jayo! Hare Kṛṣṇa! (break) ...all round, for the benefit of the human society. You'll be honored everywhere. Everywhere, any part of the world. And automatically these bogus avatāra, incarnations, God, and yogis and swamis will be all doomed. You see? These rascal society, avatāra, "Bhagavān," incarnations, yogis, these rascals will be doomed.

Morning Walk -- March 17, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: I may be whatever I am. That's all. But this is the definition of gosvāmī. Besides that, there are other, many things.

nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-nipuṇau sad-dharma-saṁsthāpakau
lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau tri-bhuvane mānyau śaraṇyākarau
rādhā-kṛṣṇa-padāravinda-bhajanānandena-mattālikau
vande rūpa-sanā(tanau raghu-yugau śrī-jīva-gopālakau)

So nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇa. One must be very conversant, all kinds of śāstras. And what for? For establishing real religion. Real religion is this: sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). Why there are other religions existing? That means there is no gosvāmīs. Gosvāmī... If there is gosvāmī, he should stop functioning all other rascal religions. Simply this: mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja, that religion. That is religion. And all bogus thing. A gosvāmī has to prove that. Nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-ni... lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau. Why? For the benefit of the whole human society. Therefore they should be honored. Tri-bhuvane mānyau. Not that within some neighborhood. All over the world. Tri-bhuvane. That is gosvāmī. What is this gosvāmī? Tri-bhuvane mānyau śaraṇyākarau. He is fit to take shelter of. A cheating gosvāmī, cheating gosvāmī is no good.

Room Conversation -- March 20, 1974, Bombay:

Guest: That I've been telling Tamāla Kṛṣṇa also, that you should have some Indians.

Prabhupāda: No, should have, but no Indians are coming.

Guest: No, but then you should appoint somebody, you know.

Prabhupāda: No, we cannot appoint. That is not. That is not possible. We cannot appoint. That is useless. Paid men is useless.

Guest: Paid... Appointed does not mean that you pay them. Appointing can be honorary also. I don't say that you pay them.

Prabhupāda: So who is honorary coming. They are also honorary, but who is dedicating...

Guest: So you should have in India those people...

Prabhupāda: "I should have" means you, if you become "should have." Otherwise...

Guest: I don't mind becoming, or you can have somebody...

Prabhupāda: Nobody is taking seriously, Indian. So many years we are here. How many Indian-educated youths are coming? They are not interested.

Morning Walk -- April 7, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Not liberal. He was truthful. He used to bring all the sons as soon as born to Kaṁsa, and he was killing.

Girirāja: "Kaṁsa knew the value of Vasudeva's word of honor and he was convinced by his arguments. For the time being he desisted from the heinous killing of his sister. Thus Vasudeva was pleased and praised the decision of Kaṁsa. In this way he returned to his home. After due course of time Vasudeva and Devakī gave birth to eight male children as well as..." (break)

Prabhupāda: Demons are known as sura-dviṣām, sura-dviṣām, those who are envious of the demigods, sura-dvisa. Sammohāya sura-dviṣām (SB 1.3.24). This word is used in the Bhāgavata: "just to cheat the demons," sammohāya sura-dviṣām. (break) That is the instruction of Nārada. You see? Then?

Girirāja: "Within the prison, shackled in iron chains, Vasudeva and Devakī gave birth to a male child year after year. Kaṁsa, thinking each of the babies to be the incarnation of Viṣṇu, killed them one after another."

Prabhupāda: Yes. He killed his brother. He was merciful upon the father only, kept him in the prison. Otherwise he killed the whole family—brother, brother's son and everyone. (break) ...present kings, such incidences are very many in the history, killing everyone. There is another story that Pana, Pana?

Morning Walk -- May 9, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Science means...

Dr. Patel: Science means knowledge. And knowledge is there. Knowledge means God.

Prabhupāda: Practical...

Dr. Patel: But we are trying to honor the knowledge which we have not now known...

Prabhupāda: That knowledge is described in the Bhagavad-gītā. Vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). When one understands, "Oh, here is the original source of everything," vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19), that is greatest scientist. And how this knowledge comes? Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante (BG 7.19). They are struggling for the ultimate knowledge. So struggling many, many births after births, when, by the grace of Kṛṣṇa, he comes to the real knowledge, then he admits, vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19).

Indian Man (3): (Hindi conversation) (break)

Prabhupāda: ...and police is controlling by beating them. Now they will go to the office, and again they will come in that way. And coming home for two cāpāṭis. You see? That's all.

Room Conversation -- May 20, 1974, Vrndavana:

Indian man (2): I told him about the drafts, you see, that you made the other day. I said, "Prabhupāda has only agreed. It was so magnanimous of him, so magnanimous."

Prabhupāda: Yes, I told you Friday, you write, I shall sign it. And why they are agitating and stopped such a function? And that is very regrettable. Gosvāmī means vāco vegaṁ krodha-vegaṁ viṣaheta. If there is some krodha, you should tolerate. Now here is a Vaiṣṇava, he has done so much for Caitanya Mahāprabhu, and the reception was there, and he stopped. How he is gosvāmī? He expressed his krodha in that very moment, just to take retaliation. It is not gosvāmī. What do you think? Krodha-vegam. It is a krodha, but he could not tolerate that krodha-vegam. He retaliated at the right moment and to a person, fit person who was to be honored. Just see. And he claims to be gosvāmī. The first business is vāco vegaṁ krodha-vegam. The Vaikuṇṭha mentality is that if one is serving—I have read it in Bhāgavata—Kṛṣṇa better than somebody else, he would simply appreciate that "Kṛṣṇa has so much favored him. Oh, how fortunate he is. When I shall be able?" That is Vaikuṇṭha mentality. And the material mentality is, "Oh, he has advanced so much. How to come down him?" That is material. This is the difference between Vaikuṇṭha mentality. So his business is how to come down. So he is not a gosvāmī. At least I will not accept. What do you think? Am I right or wrong?

Indian man (2): (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Indian man (2): What shall I say? (chuckles)

Prabhupāda: This is the definition of gosvāmī. Vāco vegam krodha-vegam udaro-vegam pastha-vegam etān manasaḥ vegam, etān vegān viṣaheta dhīraḥ pṛthivīṁ sa śiṣyāt. So he has not proved to be very dhīra. Dhīrādhīra-priyau priya-karau nirmatsarau. So that is my regret, that these people cannot appreciate the service of a Vaiṣṇava. They are simply personally interested. Personally interested is materialistic way of life. Everybody is personally interested.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: If there is no opposite elements, there is no need of weapons. If I am not your enemy, there is no fear. We are preaching this philosophy, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā: (BG 18.54) "As soon as you become Kṛṣṇa conscious, you become jubilant." So where is your enemy? Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu. Then where is your enemy? Formerly, a man might have become enemy of another man. But this demonic civilization has created nation to nation, country to country, community to community, all enemies. And on account of this communistic enemy, so many innocent people are killed. I have seen in Calcutta during the partition days. So many innocent Hindus and Muslims were killed. Any (indistinct), very quickly this Communistic feeling is aroused, and they fight, like cats and dogs. "Oh, here is another dog! Here is another dog, coming from another neighborhood." So this is demonic civilization. If you want to go to some country, you have to take visa, permission, this, that, so many. Why? Vedic civilization is "You come to my country. Welcome. You are my guest." Gṛhe śatrum api prāptaṁ viśvastam akutobhayam: "Even one is enemy, when he comes to my house, he is my honorable guest." And here, they are so much afraid that you keep dogs. The dog is kept here.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

C. Hennis: The International Labor Organization has as one of its major aims to promote social justice, and that means that every class of worker, if you like to accept the four categories that you mentioned—the intellectual, the productive, the protective, and the laboring classes-should each have their proper place in society, should each have a full measure of human dignity, and should each have a proper share in the rewards for labor, both clearly material rewards and honors and dignity and leisure and time for, free time for meditation and so on. In the International Labor Organization, we are not like UNESCO devoted to the more philosophical and cultural and educational aspects for the intelligentsia, but I would draw your attention to the fact that the UNESCO is very much concerned with looking after the head part of society.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So that is my request to you.

Room Conversation with Prof. Regamay, Professor of Sanskrit at the University of Lausanne -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Not yet seen Bhagavad-gītā?

Guru-gaurāṅga: He has seen, but he will get today.

Prof. Regamay: And perhaps, some questions I could put to you?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Prof. Regamay: But first I would like to express my thanks that you gave me this honor to receive me. So I have different questions because I'm in such a difficult situation that I have many Indian doctrines, and there was some difficulty because I know them only through the books, without (indistinct). And, for instance, one of the first questions I want to put: Viṣṇu Purāṇa, it's very similar and very coincidental to the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes, Viṣṇu Purāṇa.

Prof. Regamay: Is that... Practically, can it be considered that it's the same kind of...

Prabhupāda: Yes, Viṣṇu Purāṇa is Vaiṣṇava literature. There are eighteen Purāṇas. Out of eighteen, six are sāttvika, and six are rājasika, and six are tāmasika. The sāttvika Purāṇas, they are Vaiṣṇava literature. Viṣṇu Purāṇa, Brahmāṇḍa Purāṇa, Bhāgavata Purāṇa, Padma Purāṇa.

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Give him chair.

Yogeśvara: Yes, he's... Satsvarūpa Mahārāja. Monsieur Douant is the president of the Protestant Center of Geneva. Monsieur Roche-dieu who is the...

M. Roche-dieu: Former, former Honorary Professor of History of Religions on the faculty of theology, Protestant theology.

Yogeśvara: Mr. Roche-dieu is a specialist in Hindu religion.

Prabhupāda: Ah. (French)

Yogeśvara: Mr. Morrel, who is the Dean of the Theology University in Geneva and who directs all of the religious activities for the university.

Swiss Man (2): (French)

Yogeśvara: Theology student. Our spiritual master, A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: So you have shown our books?

Yogeśvara: (French)

Prabhupāda: Sixty volumes of these books.

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: A girl is pregnant, suppose, then, during her pregnancy period, ten months, there is no sex, and unless the child becomes six months old, there is no sex. The thing is that in the modern world, sex life has become the only pleasure. They do not know anything else. Therefore everything is discredited. And another thing is they are afraid of keeping more than one wife for population. But if they produce sufficient food, where is the question of overpopulation? Another thing they have made, especially in the western world, they don't want to produce food because they know, "We shall kill one animal and eat. Why take so much trouble? Let me increase industry, and I shall push my button. Money will come. And the slaughterhouse there. We shall eat." So they are getting money. By money, they are getting women to the choice. They are getting food, meat, and they're enjoying drinking. So money has become the whole thing. "Bring money some way or other and enjoy." This is the purport of civilization. They do not care what is God, that human body is meant for God realization. They have no such ideas. "There is nothing after death. So so long I am living, let me enjoy by the tongue, by the genital and by the belly. Use the tongue for eating anything which is palatable, which I like. Never mind what it is. And then genital also. Bring as many women..." This is civilization, modern. There is no question of sinful life or pious life, next life. (laughs) Another, their theory is that only on this planet there is living entities... (break) If there is sufficient rain in the desert, it will be also hot. (break) ...tells us in the śāstras how to live comfortably and advance in spiritual life. And they should give advice to others. That is the business of the Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau. Nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-nipuṇau sad-dharma-saṁsthāpakau. Lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau tri-bhuvane mānyau śaraṇyākarau. This is the description of the Gosvāmīs. They are well versed in all different types of Vedic scriptures just to establish a peaceful society sad-dharma, very nice gentleman, peaceful society. Lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau, for the benefit of the whole human society. Therefore they are honored all over the world. This is gosvāmī business, not to exploit (indistinct) live like irresponsible man, eat, drink, be merry and enjoy.

Room Conversation with Christian Priest -- June 9, 1974, Paris:

Priest: It's like the Indian Catholic priest dressing like a (indistinct) priest or like a European priest. I mean, they look as if they had a disguise with them.

Prabhupāda: No, no, just like when the English were ruling, English national. So the Englishmen never said that "You dress like Englishmen," but they automatically dressed. You know very well. They do like that. The Englishmen, they went there to get some money by trade, by politics. But they never went there to change their dress. But they thought that "If I dress myself like Englishman, I will be more honored." That is their point. Similarly, we never preach that "You dress like this." But the student, they like this dress. That's all right. What is the wrong there?

Priest: It's not wrong. It's funny.

Prabhupāda: Rather these girls, when they dress in Indian way, they look more beautiful. That you will have to admit. Yes. The same girl will dress in your...

Priest: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: So the girls, the women, they like to be more beautiful. So if by dressing in other way they look beautiful, why should you ask them not to do it?

Morning Walk -- June 11, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: So we are not sorry that minority. Where is the...? Insignificant. Don't talk of minority. But we are not sorry. Minority, majority, all these are foolishness. The whole platform is mistaken. (pause) Rūpa Gosvāmī was a minister. He was in the majority. But voluntarily, he accepted minority. He went to Vṛndāvana and living alone, underneath a tree. He was enjoying so much honor. Tyaktvā tūrṇam aśeṣa-maṇḍala-pati-śreṇīm. His associates were big, big zamindars, big businessmen, politicians. Because he's minister. But he preferred to resign that post and become a minority, to live alone in Vṛndāvana underneath a tree. Why he preferred this? And remaining there alone, he has given you the Bhakti-rasāmṛta-sindhu. So we have to see how much service we are going to give Kṛṣṇa. This minority, majority, these are all material conception of life. If you can give major service to Kṛṣṇa, that is your success of life. I started this movement alone, minority. Is it not?

Yogeśvara: Yes, one.

Room Conversation with Mr. Tran-van-Kha, and President & Members of the Society of Buddhists in France -- June 15, 1974, Paris:

Pṛthu Putra: Mrs. Basti (sp?), she is the president of the Society of Buddhists in France. And,...

Guest (1): Thomas Dhu (?).

Prabhupāda: Sit down.

Pṛthu Putra: He's the president, (indistinct) honor of honors. Mr. Tran-Van-Kha was ambassador from Vietnam...

Prabhupāda: Vietnam.

Pṛthu Putra: ...in America twenty years ago, and he's now president of the society of Buddhists in France.

Prabhupāda: If... Vietnam (indistinct)? No?

Yogeśvara: Vietnam what? Well, they say.

Prabhupāda: So Vietnam, they profess Buddhist religion?

Pṛthu Putra: (translates into French)

Guest (1): (French)

Pṛthu Putra: Eighty per cent.

Prabhupāda: So the Buddhist religion so far we know, they are nonviolent.

Morning Walk -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Haṁsadūta: That doesn't happen anymore today.

Prabhupāda: See the tiger has got its nails and teeth and jaw. So there was no firearm. He will challenge the tiger with a..., and he will take a sword and kill him. And then the tiger would be brought in procession, giving all honor, military honor.

Haṁsadūta: To the tiger.

Prabhupāda: That was the kṣatriya's practice, how to combat his enemies. Fighting should be on the equal level, not that "I take all shelter, and you are open to be killed by enemy." (break) ...understood the process of transmigration.

Haṁsadūta: Yes. (break)

Mādhavānanda: Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā (BG 2.13). Could it be said, then, that we are transmigrating even while in this life?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Mādhavānanda: From boyhood to youth.

Prabhupāda: Yes. What is transmigration? Transmigration means the first body you lose; you enter a second body, a third body, fourth. So your childhood body is not existing. Therefore you are in different body.

Morning Walk -- June 21, 1974, Germany:

Professor Durckheim: All the night or do you at the day sometimes?

Prabhupāda: No. At night I get up at one, at half past one, sometimes half past twelve. But I take a little rest, one or two hour in the daytime. So two hours at night, two hours at day, or three hours at night, two hours in day. In this way, altogether five hours, not more than that. Our predecessor gurus, Gosvāmīs, they were taking rest not more than two hours or 2-1/2 hours. So we should come to that standard, yes. Nidrāhāra-vihārakādi-vijitau **. About them this description is: they reduced their sleeping, nidra. Nidra means sleeping. And āhāra. Āhāra means eating and collection. Collection is also āhāra. Yes. So they were mendicant. They had no collection. And they had no preaching mission. They were simply writing books. Nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-nipuṇau, very expert to study different scriptures just to get the essence of scripture and give to the people. Lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau. So their life was engaged for the benefit of the whole human society. What these people are talking philanthropy and humanitarian? They dedicated their life for... Just like we are doing. It is not for any sect or any person. For the whole human society. So that should be the mission. Lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau tri-bhuvane mānyau. Therefore their literature is honored all over the world, all over the universe. Just like our books. We are selling all over the world, all universities, all school, all colleges, all gentlemen. It is not sectarian. Lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau tri-bhuvane mānyau śaraṇyākarau. This was their hard labor, and rādhā-kṛṣṇa-bhajanānandena mattālikau, and they were very much pleased in worshiping Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa Deity. All the Gosvāmīs established a Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa temple. In Vṛndāvana each and every Gosvāmī established one temple in the beginning. Then others followed. Rūpa Gosvāmī established Govindajī's temple. And Jīva Gosvāmī established Rādhā-Dāmodara temple.

Room Conversations -- September 10, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Same enviousness. Nirmatsarata(?). Yayā sammohito jīva.

bhakti-yogena manasi
samyak praṇihite 'male
apaśyat puruṣaṁ pūrṇaṁ
māyāṁ ca tad-apāśrayam
(SB 1.7.4)

Yayā sammohito jīva. Vyāsadeva, by bhakti-yoga, he saw two things: the Supreme Personality of Godhead and the māyā on the back side. Which māyā? Māyā... Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, has many māyā features. Yayā sammohito jīva. That māyā by whom the whole material world and living entities are captivated. Yayā sammohito jīva, ātmānaṁ tri-guṇātmakam (SB 1.7.5). And being captivated by this maya, although he is pure spirit soul, he is thinking, "I am material. I am this body." Ātmānaṁ tri-guṇātmakam, manute, tat-kṛtaṁ cābhipadyate. In this way he thinks, and influenced by māyā he acts. This is the position he saw.

So this is called anartha, a position which is false. Anarthopaśamaṁ sākṣād bhakti-yogam adhokṣaje (SB 1.7.6). In order to deliver him from this illusory position, anartha upaśamaṁ bhakti-yoga. Bhakti-yogam adhokṣaje lokasya ajānataḥ. The whole world does not know it. Vidvāṁś cakre sātvata-saṁhitām. Therefore, Vyāsadeva, the most learned, he compiled this Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Anarthopaśamaṁ sākṣād bhakti-yogam adhokṣaje. These things are there in the Bhāgavata. Same process. Vyāsadeva did for the benefit of the whole world, the Gosvāmīs did for the benefit of the whole world, and we are also trying to do the same thing.

anarthopaśamaṁ sākṣād
bhakti-yogam adhokṣaje
lokasyājānato vidvāṁś
cakre sātvata-saṁhitām
(SB 1.7.6)

This is paramparā system. The Gosvāmīs also did it. Nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-nipuṇau sad-dharma-saṁsthāpakau lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau, for the benefit of the (indistinct). We are pushing this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement for the benefit of the whole world, not that for our individual person. Vaiṣṇava, whatever he does, he does for the whole world, not for his person. Bhukti-mukti-siddhi-kāmī, they do for their own person. Karmīs, jñānīs, yogis, for their personal benefit. That is also materialism. Vaiṣṇavism, lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau tri-bhuvane mānyau. Therefore, honored all over the three worlds, their activities and their person. Tri-bhuvane mānyau śaraṇyākarau. Therefore, they should be taken shelter of. Vande rūpa-sanātanau raghu-yugau śrī-jīva-gopālakau. Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura confirmed, ei chaya gosāñi yāra, tāra mui dāsa, "One who has taken shelter of the six Gosvāmīs, I am his servant, nobody's servant."

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- May 10, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: What benefit is there? A soldier has died. So what is the use of having a tree, having a plate?

Amogha: This will make us remember how much our countrymen...

Prabhupāda: What benefit is there by remembering?

Paramahaṁsa: Well the family feels honored that there is a tree here for a son of their's.

Prabhupāda: What benefit do they derive?

Paramahaṁsa: Well, they can come and see it.

Prabhupāda: Do they think that man who has died is still there?

Amogha: Next time when there is a war, then they will feel more inclined to fight, knowing that there may be a tree for them.

Prabhupāda: It means, this is government deceiving. The man is not there. And even if he is there, suppose the soldier after dying for his country has become a tree, is it a very good reward? (laughter) How foolishly they are thinking. We have to point out their foolishness. That is our business. They are working very hard, undoubtedly, but they are working foolishly. Śrama eva hi kevalam (SB 1.2.8). The result is simply they are becoming tired. That's all. Because they are not working intelligently, like monkey, he is busy all day. What is the value of your busy? You'll find the monkey is never sitting idle. He's always busy, "eḥ, eh, eh." (imitating monkey) So what is the result of that busyness? He's a monkey. And they claim to be coming from monkey, these rascals. So we can see that your monkey's quality is already there. (laughter) You have not improved more than monkey, because you are working uselessly. They are theorizing that they have come from monkey, and as soon as you say that you are monkey, they become angry. Just see. They are claiming that we are coming from monkey. And if you say you are monkey, no better than monkey, then they are angry. Just see.

Room Coversation with Psychiatrist and Indian Boy -- May 12, 1975, Perth:

Paramahaṁsa: He says he just wished to meet you. Perhaps I should read a verse. Should I read a verse?

Prabhupāda: No. Our viewpoint is that in the material world, who has accepted this material body—anyone, but we specially take the human society—they require treatment, everyone. Everyone is mentally diseased, and therefore he is unhappy. Everyone. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahād-guṇa (SB 5.18.12). Anyone who has no sense of God consciousness, he is diseased mentally. He requires treatment. The whole human society, especially at the present moment, they have given up God consciousness. They are not interested. That is their disease. And everyone requires treatment. So the whole Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is the mass treatment of the materialistic persons who are mentally diseased. That is our proposition. It is... In India there was a case. A man committed murder, and he pleaded in the court that... His pleader, his lawyer, pleaded that he was mad at that time. We also accept unless one becomes mad, one cannot commit murder or suicide. So the civil surgeon was brought to give evidence whether this man is actually mad. The civil surgeon said that "So far my experience is concerned—I have treated so many persons—in my opinion everyone is mad. So if on account of madness one should be excused from the law, then it is Your Honor's discretion, but so far I have studied, more or less, everyone is mad." Similarly, our study is that unless one is mad, he cannot remain in this material world. So everyone is mentally diseased, and they are concocting their ideas, different ideas. And they are overlapping, my idea, your idea overlapping. Therefore there is clash, unhappiness, violence, individually, socially, familywise, nationwise. This is going on. Therefore everyone requires a treatment, psychiatrist's treatment. And the best treatment is to induce a person to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. Then everything will be all right. Otherwise, a person who is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, or God conscious, he is basically a mad man and requires treatment. (pause) Ghostly haunted man... You have experienced ghostly haunted man?

Room Conversation with Dr. Copeland, Professor of Modern Indian History -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Dr. Copeland: Ah, that's why. Ah! Pretty! Are you a brāhmaṇa? By birth you're a brāhmaṇa, right?

Prabhupāda: No. I am brāhmaṇa yes. Yes. But we are not... We do not recognize brāhmaṇa by birth. Brāhmaṇa by these qualities. Anyone who has got... This is the shastric injunction, that if the qualities are found somewhere else—that means one who is not born in a brāhmaṇa family but he has the qualities of the brāhmaṇa—then he should be accepted as a brāhmaṇa. That is shastric injunction. Yasya hi yal lakṣaṇaṁ proktaṁ varṇābhivyañjakam, yad anyatrāpi. Anyatra means elsewhere. Tat tenaiva vinirdiśet (SB 7.11.35). "He should be accepted as such." Similarly, if a man, born in brāhmaṇa family but he has the qualities of the śūdras... Paricaryātmakaṁ kāryaṁ śūdra-karma svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). Paricarya means service. To accept... (break) So therefore, according to Bhagavad-gītā, nobody is brāhmaṇa. A brāhmaṇa should remain independent. He should live by his qualities. People will honor him. Just like we are training. We do not serve anyone, but we are maintaining big establishment.

Room Conversation with Yogi Bhajan -- June 7, 1975, Honolulu:

Yogi Bhajan: Yeah, that's right. (laughter) So what I told him was that "It is a good idea." So we are carrying that good idea now, and Muni Sushila Kumar is coming from India, then Swami Chittananda is leading that tour. And they have sent a list of sixteen other religious people who are coming. They are going to U.N.O., where the peace presentation this year is happening. I think we should participate in that. Then there is a vegetarian congress. There the participation is happening. And all this has been done just to lay the platform and honor the idea of that man Kirpal Singh Sant. Just he wanted that way. So we thought it is a better idea to be in the West and with the arrangements that everybody can come, participate, talk to each other. I would like you to be in New Mexico in one of the presentable cabin, and not let anybody of these devotee of you be around but to ask other people to come and talk to you, learn from you, share with you, share your wisdom, share your conviction, share your experience...

Prabhupāda: That's a good idea, very good.

Yogi Bhajan: And I like all these guys to come and talk to me and when they will listen me talking Gītā, perhaps they will understand, "Well, Yogiji knows little bit about what we know about." So when they pronounce certain words, I just sometime correct in between, but I don't tell them anything because they know...

Prabhupāda: Where is your headquarter?

Yogi Bhajan: Los Angeles. We are neighbors.

Prabhupāda: Oh. Los Angeles.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Siddha-svarūpa: It's like these so many gurus. They're not actually enemies. They're actually individually working to exploit the people. And if they get in each other's way, if one person tries to take the other person's followers, then there's some clash or something. But as long they can leave each other alone and don't fight and work independently, exploiting, then they live peacefully.

Bali-mardana: Honor among thieves.

Prabhupāda: "Thief, thief, cousin brother." Cora cora, pasura bhai. So far our position is that we are not concerned with anything with this universe. We are concerned with Kṛṣṇaloka. So whatever one may say, one other may say, we don't care for that. We are not going to the moon planet, Jupiter(?) planet.

Siddha-svarūpa: There's a danger that we become overly concerned with debating on them.

Harikeśa: So our preaching platform should be is that "You don't know." We can say, "You don't know" or "We don't know. Why shouldn't one accept what we say over what you say?" We should just prove that we...

Prabhupāda: No, accept or not accept, the whatever is description there, in Bhāgavatam, we are accepted.

Room Conversation -- June 26, 1975, Los Angeles:

Satsvarūpa: But our society is going nicely. It's not...

Devotee (2): In some respects it's going fine. But these are problems which can be dealt with amongst us, and they are affecting all of us. And for some people these are problems though they may not be for you. I think, as far as I know, your conduct has always been very honorable. But for some people who it's not and where these misconceptions apply, it's a real problem and we're trying to deal with it because it affects our lives.

Upendra: The strength to deal with those problems comes from following sādhanācāra.

Devotee (2): We are also attempting to follow sādhanācāra. And if we are imperfect...

Prabhupāda: Anyway, if he has said so, that is wrong.

Devotee (1): But is that then applying to everyone. Does someone who is in the adminis... (end)

Room Conversation with the Mayor of Evanston -- July 4, 1975, Chicago:

Mayor: Well, I think I probably should be getting on. Well, thank you very much for taking the time to talk to me this morning.

Prabhupāda: And I also thank you for your kindly coming here, taking...

Mayor: It's an honor to meet you.

Prabhupāda: So you can keep his card. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. (break)

Śrī Govinda: ...to your wife.

Mayor: My wife may take it away from me. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: So you can take another for your wife.

Mayor: No, this is fine. Thank you very much. We'll see you all.

Prabhupāda: (laughing) Hare Kṛṣṇa. (mayor leaves) Now, try to get this house from the... He can... If he likes, he can do it.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Jayatīrtha: It's called "Raise Your Hand if You're an Eternal Spirit Soul."

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Mrs. Wax: Thank you. It's an honor to be here. Because I wrote the article about Gurukula, I'm interested in what has happened there. I was there last summer. Do you have plans for other schools? And what is happening with Gurukula now? Is it standing?

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Jayatīrtha: She wants to know what our plan is for Gurukula, whether we want to start other Gurukulas in other places... (child noises)

Prabhupāda: (Aside:) Hmm, this child... So you can explain what is the idea of Gurukula.

Jayatīrtha: (indistinct) ...talking of other things. Generally he likes to address more philosophical questions.

Mrs. Wax: All right.

Jayatīrtha: Because the questions about the future of the society. Others devotees can answer this. Well, the philosophical questions that are not daily (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: We want to raise first-class man. Try to understand. The present society, we are creating fourth-class men. Therefore we are not in very happy condition. We want to raise the fourth-class man to first-class man. First-class man means with qualification who can control the mind, control the senses, always very cleansed and truthful, very simple, full of all kinds of knowledge, practical application in life, then to have full knowledge of God, these are the characteristics of first-class man. So at the present moment everyone is a fourth-class man. So we want to get some first-class men. That is required. Because there is no idea, first-class man, therefore people are becoming full of crimes. You have seen the article in the Time? "Crime, Why and What to Do?" That is the concern of the materialistic society. So we are trying to raise a group of men who will be ideal. Just like our devotees. You will find their characters different from all others, at least in your country. They do not have illicit sex, they do not eat meat, they do not have any intoxication, even smoking or taking tea, they do not indulge in gambling, they chant holy name of God, lead very simple life. So we are creating first-class men. There is need. It is not that everyone will become first-class man, but at least a section of man must be first-class so that others can see that what is the ideal character of man. So this Gurukula means from the childhood age we are training them so that in future it will be easier. That is the purpose of Gurukula.

Car Conversation -- August 3, 1975, Detroit:

Brahmānanda: Ah, they would come face to face.

Prabhupāda: Yes, face to face. Yes. Where there is tiger, a kṣatriya, would meet him with a sword. That's all. "Come on. You attack and be killed." Even twenty years before, the king of Jaipur, every year he should go in the forest and kill one tiger personally. And the dead tiger will be brought in procession. He'd be given... Just like a prince or king dies—his body is taken in procession-tiger would be brought that way. Both of them, kṣatriyas... So the tiger should be given the honor of a prince. (break) ...means enemy is going out of fear of life and showing his backside, then he will not be killed. (break) ...into Canada?

Brahmānanda: No, that's Detroit.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that is Detroit.

Brahmānanda: This part is Canada, there.

Prabhupāda: In Canada they grow large quantity of wheat?

Jagadīśa: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Morning Walk -- September 26, 1975, Ahmedabad:

Prabhupāda: You cannot see? Who are they if they are not...

Indian man (2): Yes, yes, yes. We are very much... We take a pride. Actually we take a pride that Your Holiness like you had gone for America and the world and spread our message of our Indian philosophy. We are very much proud about it. Though we do not give much response to your mission here or in India because it's our home. Home is for the neighbor only(?). That is the difficulty. Tulsi das has written (Hindi). Swami Vivekananda went there, and he was honored there, and thereafter our people honored him because other people honored him.

Prabhupāda: All right. Let us go. Jaya. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Just... (Hindi) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. (Break) (Hindi conversation)

Kartikeya: We have not seen father.

Prabhupāda: You have not seen.

Kartikeya: The body is not father, and what is father, what is in the father, we have never seen.

Prabhupāda: That you have not seen. You have no eyes to see.

Kartikeya: I have not seen my father. Even I have not seen myself. I see my hand. When you say "I see my hand," I see my body, but have I seen my self?

Indian man (2): He is my friend. He is my friend Mr. Urbana, and he is an architect, prominent architect in Gujarat, eh?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Press Conference -- October 2, 1975, Mauritius:

Guest (4): Swamiji, can I ask a question? How old are you, or, maybe I should say, how young are you?

Prabhupāda: Eighty years old. Eighty.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Here is one black American, a sannyāsī in the renounced order of life. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...the bodily concept of life, he is no more African, no more American. He is spirit soul. (break)

Guest (2): ...Swamiji, a very personal question. How would you react when people give you a godly reception?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Brahmānanda: He asks, "When you get a godly reception, when you come to a place, how does your..., receive it?"

Prabhupāda: Because I am representative of God, therefore they must give me godly reception. It is reception to God. Just like if you receive one ambassador from a country, then that means giving honor to that country. It is not my personal reception; it is acknowledging the glories of the Lord. Yasya prasādād bhagavat-prasādaḥ **. It is said, "If you please God's representative, then God is pleased."

Guest (2): Thank you, Swamiji.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (end)

Morning Walk -- October 3, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: Prized post only. Governors, the embassies, this is... These are invented to satisfy the agitators, politicians, because the opposite party will agitate.

Brahmānanda: So give them some house and some post.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Give them some. That's all. It has no use. They do not do anything. Simply hold that post and get nice house, nice salary, servants, honor, and sometimes they are called and make some speech. That's all. And whatever nonsense he may be, if he is governor, then everyone will respect him. That's all. And as soon as the same man is not governor, nobody goes to kick on his face. I have seen so many governors. When they retire, nobody... (aside:) Where is that cap? Nobody cares.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Is this desire for material happiness the cause of material attachment?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa bhuliya jīva bhoga vāñchā kare. When they forget to serve Kṛṣṇa and wants to enjoy this material world... Don't you see that these Māyāvādī philosophers are trying for liberation, and still, they are expecting to become God. That is another desire. Daridra-nārāyaṇa. The high ambition, to become God or equal to God, that is going on, struggle for existence.

Room Conversation with the Rector, Professor Olivier and Professors of the University of Durban, Westville -- October 8, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: What is that lecture?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The students have been invited to hear kīrtana and lecture, Prabhupāda, at another place.

Prabhupāda: Kīrtana?

Prof. Olivier: Might I just explain. I don't know whether we will have an audience. May I first of all say thank you very much for coming to the university. We are very honored also, sir, that you have been able to come, also that your guests have come, and that you have been able to come. Thank you very much for visiting the university. I unfortunately have a committee of my council meeting this afternoon, and the chairman is coming over shortly. So I will unfortunately not be able to attend your lecture. Thank you very much for coming. Some of you have been here before. We have this week a student break for a week before they start their examinations, so I do not know whether Professor Oosthuizen will have an audience at all. Maybe a few members of staff.

Professor: I told Mr. Bhoola when he asked me about the lecture, I told him that this would be a problem.

Prof. Olivier: Thank you very much for coming.

Prabhupāda: If there is no audience, what is the use of holding class?

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: No, I didn’t know that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And they brought tea from India and other places and sell it in America. Their whole policy was they exploit the whole world and bring money in London. That's all. And one who will do that, he will be honored by the state, given Earl of some small village. It has no value. Earl of this whole…, this man…, place, Lord of this. (laughter) A few acres of land and he is Lord of Chelmsford. And they will be given big, big post, governor, viceroy.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Why did Nehru, though… He was so closely associated with Gandhi, and Gandhi was for getting the foreign products out. Why did Nehru go so much against that policy? Why did Nehru?

Prabhupāda: No, Nehru, he was searching after some big post. That's all. All these political agitators, they want the big post, that's all. You give them big post, and they will be satisfied. They will no more agitate. Political agitators means they want some prize post from the government. That's all. Make them some minister, and they will be no more agitator.

Morning Walk -- October 28, 1975, Nairobi:

Prabhupāda: This is the... This is the process. So this is the process. So now, when he will say, "All right, you can say what you want to say," then, he sādhava: "You are a great personality, nobleman." He may be a loafer class, (laughter) but give him all honor: "You are so great and so exalted," he sādhava, "and so honest." He sādhava. "My only submission is that whatever you have learned, you forget. Whatever nonsense you have learned..." Don't say "nonsense." (laughter) But we must know that he is a pakkā, rascal, nonsense. (laughs) So don't say directly, "nonsense." Say, "You are the great personality. So kindly, whatever you have learned, forget." "Then what shall I do?" He sādhavaḥ sakalam eva vihāya durāt: "Kick out whatever you nonsense learned." "Then what shall I do?" Now, caitanya-candra-caraṇe kurutānurāgam: "Kindly be submissive to Lord Caitanya, and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa." This is our program. No argument. Because he is a rascal, what is the use of arguing with him? He's a rascal number one. You know that. You cannot expect any good argument from the rascals and fools. Where is the logic? Their logic is to beat them with shoes. That is the only logic. But that, if you do that, then you'll not be able to preach. But otherwise that is the only logic, to beat them with shoes. Argumentum vaculum. You know this logic? In logic we have read. There is one logic, argumentum... You know this?

Cyavana: That is Latin.

Morning Walk -- October 28, 1975, Nairobi:

Prabhupāda: Yes. You know? What is that? Argumentum vaculum? Hm? With fools and rascals, with animals, there is no logic. Take the stick and beat them. The dog, if he is a dog, what is the argument with him? Take the stick and beat him; then he will go away. That is called argumentum baculum. That is, Sanskrit logic, also said, murkhasya laṭau śādhi (?) "One who is a fool, his only remedy is beating him with stick." This is material. But we are not doing anything material. It is all spiritual. Therefore, especially in this age, Caitanya Mahāprabhu,

tṛṇād api sunīcena
taror api sahiṣṇunā
amāninā mānadena
kīrtanīyaḥ (sadā hariḥ)
(CC Adi 17.31)

So we should preach like this, any rascal, because anyone who has no information of Kṛṣṇa, who is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he's a rascal. That's all. That we must know. That is definite. There is no mistaking it. But if you say that "You are rascal. There is no mistaking it," then you cannot preach. If you directly call a rascal a rascal, he'll be angry. Murkhāyopadeśo hi prakopāya na śanta...: To give good instruction to a fool rascal will increase his anger, that's all." Then you'll not be able to preach. So you have to become very humble, tṛṇād api sunīcena, humbler than the grass. Just like everyone is trampling over the grass. It doesn't protest, "Why you are going, keeping your leg on my head?" But that is the... Tṛṇād api sunīcena. Go on trampling. Hundreds' and hundreds' people are trampling over the grass; they don't protest. Tṛṇād api sunīcena taror api sahiṣṇunā. The tree is standing. You sit down. When there is scorching heat, you take pleasure by sitting down under the shade. But the reward is that you cut the branches. That is their reward. He gives you shelter, and you cut the branch. You cut the whole tree. This is your gratefulness. You see? Because we are rascals, we do not know what is gratefulness. They are taking milk from the cow and killing. This is our proposal. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu advises, taror api sahiṣṇunā-tolerant, humbler than the grass. Amāninā mānadena. Don't expect any honor for your person, but to the others give honor: "Oh, you are most exalted person," although he's a rascal. What can be done? Otherwise you cannot preach. If you call a rascal a rascal, immediately your preaching will be stopped. So you have to say that "You are the greatest intelligent man, sādhu, most honored. The only request is that you forget what you have learned. That's all. And take this." In this way preaching practical. Otherwise it is not possible. Everyone is thinking he is the most exalted personality, scientist, philosopher, great man. That is material disease. Actually he is being kicked every moment by the urges of the senses, and he is thinking he is very great man. Go-dāsa. Go means senses. He is always, I mean, curbed down by the sense urges, and he is thinking, "independent." Independent means servant of the senses. This is going on. So you have to understand the real position of the world, and if you want to preach, then you have to (be) humbler than the tree, humbler than the grass, tolerant than the tree and... We know everyone is rascal; still, you have to give him honor. Then it will be possible to say something. Otherwise it is very difficult. We have to deal with all rascals, fools, rogues, ruffians, all good qualificat..., like. This is... You must know these things. You are dealing with all rascals. So if we call them directly "rascal," they will be angry. Your preaching will not be successful. So follow the principles enunciated by Prabodhānanda Sarasvatī and Caitanya Mahāprabhu.

Morning Walk -- November 14, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: māyayāpahṛta jñānā. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Indian man (4): Honor...

Prabhupāda: Thank you very much. Unless one understands Kṛṣṇa... Vedais ca sarvair aham eva vedyaḥ (BG 15.15). Veda means knowledge. So all kinds of knowledge, they are aiming at the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So if one does not understand what is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, then māyayāpahṛta-jñānā—he has no knowledge. Knowledge means ultimately he must know what is God. That is knowledge. Ye kṛṣṇa tattva vetta sei guru haya. Anyone who knows Kṛṣṇa, he becomes guru. Otherwise not. The first test is you may be scientist, philosopher, educationist, whatever you may be, but ask him, "Do you know Kṛṣṇa?" If he says, "No," then he is a fool. That's all. This is the test. (chuckles) Hare Kṛṣṇa. So Ambarisa Mahārāja, do you agree?

Ambarīṣa: Yes. It's a good test.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) Goldsmith, they take a stone, black stone. Do you know? And they rub the gold on the stone, and they can immediately say whether it is gold or not. So our, that stone, is Kṛṣṇa. If anyone knows Kṛṣṇa, then it is gold. (laughter)

Morning Walk -- December 19, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That also a human being does. You know in concentration camp in second war they had to eat their stool.

Dr. Patel: But the British army had a regulation that they could drink urine but not stool. They cannot eat.

Prabhupāda: You may make regulation, but necessity has no regulation.

Dr. Patel: I.... because I happen to be.... I, I was holding the honorary position of a colonel in the army...

Prabhupāda: Just see, "I am making law: you can drink urine." Just see what is the position. (laughter)

Dr. Patel: In difficulty if there is no water, you can drink your own urine, but you cannot eat your stool. It is very difficult.

Prabhupāda: If I drink urine, still I will have to be punished. By the law. I'm drinking urine, and because I have violated law, I will have to be punished. This is God.

Dr. Patel: There is, sir, one matter in Ayurvedas, svayāmbu cikitsā, wherein people are drinking their own urine, because urine is not only water and waste products but there are certain broken, I mean what you call important articles, of body maintainence.

Prabhupāda: So those.... You are advising your patients to go and drink...?

Dr. Patel: No, I don't say. But that is not so bad, because it contains those hormones.... (Prabhupāda breaks in laughing) It does contain the hormones, I mean it has been analyzed like that, scientifically. It is not to be joked about.

Prabhupāda: No. It is analyzed. And stool is full of hydrophosphites. Yes, that is another.... Stool is full of hydrophosphites.

Morning Walk -- December 24, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: But your how..., ask a question puzzling with me. So I...

Prabhupāda: No, I ask you, that how this experiment with truth can be?

Dr. Patel: The experiment with sciences, we are making experiment with biological sciences and abstract, I mean sciences of physics and chemistry, and that those who are truths already, we are trying to honor. We cannot make truths. Truths are there already settled by God. God, we try to find out what is exactly, and how it is being done. But we are not trying to find out who is doing. That is your point. I understand.

Prabhupāda: No. If the truth is there, there is no question of experiment.

Dr. Patel: We are experimenting to find out the truth. Truth is there. My house is there, sir, but you may go this way or that way, that way. We are making experiment to go to my house.

Prabhupāda: So that means you do not know what is the truth.

Dr. Patel: Truth is there, but we do not know the truth. That's a fact.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that's a fact.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 4, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda, I think your dhoti is pulling...

Hṛdayānanda: (break) ...that the people against us were trying to prove that we're not actually a real religion. So the judge became very angry at the other lawyer and stood up on his bench. The judge stood up and said, "Are you trying to say that these people are not a bona fide religion?" And the lawyer said, "No, your honor. No." (laughter)

Hari-śauri: In Sydney they spent ten thousand dollars, the council, compiling a case against us. Every day they used to come and film us and take names. And we didn't contest the case but just carried on saṅkīrtana, and the judge threw them out of court. They spent ten thousand dollars—it was a big scandal—and lost the case. The judge said, "Why not let them go on the streets? They add a lot of color to the city."

Hṛdayānanda: (break) People are always asking about you, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Hm. (break) No, I shall go now. Is it direct flight? No.

Hṛdayānanda: It is very far away. Everyone is... Even the guests, everyone is always asking about Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I was wondering whether—I was speaking with Sudāmā Mahārāja—whether it would be possible for him to come and be in the boat program with Sudāmā Mahārāja. (end)

Morning Walk -- March 11, 1976, Mayapur:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Very strict.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. "You have fallen down? You must commit suicide. No more My association."

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Is that the same as in the Bhagavad-gītā where Kṛṣṇa says, "For one who is honored, dishonor is worse than death"?

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is another thing. Caitanya Mahāprabhu personally taught this. To be victimized by māyā is possi.... There is possibility.... Just like Jaya and Vijaya. They were gatekeepers in the Vaikuṇṭha. They also fell down, Hiraṇyakaśipu. So this falldown, there is possibility in any moment because we are very small. We can be captivated by māyā at any moment. Therefore we shall be very, very careful. And if you fall down, then punishment is you make suicide. That's all. Then next life we shall see.

Morning Walk -- March 12, 1976, Mayapur:

Yaśodānandana: (break) Our Deity is not beggar.

Prabhupāda: No. He is bestower. He gives everything. If anyone voluntary gives, that's all right. You should not ask. (break) ...instead of doing this. (Bengali) He said like that. "By showing the Deity to earn livelihood is condemned. Better become a sweeper, municipal sweeper, and sweep the road and earn money." He said like that. That is better, honorable. He is working and getting money, instead of making a good show of Deity and earn money. This is not required. If you want to earn money, go, work according to your capacity and earn money. Don't cheat people. That is Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī.

Pañcadraviḍa: There was a big fight or difference of opinion, wasn't there?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Pañcadraviḍa: There was trouble in Nabadwip, wasn't there, when he advised the pilgrims not to pay money to go into the temples?

Prabhupāda: Yes. He was fight against it. All, Nabadwip, Vṛndāvana. Vṛndāvana is not so... But still, they have got rate. One thing, it is a question of heart, that a man should come and visit the temple—he must give something. Why he is to be asked? Voluntarily he should give that.

Morning Walk -- April 21, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: That story, that some thieves stolen. Now, when they are dividing, they say, "Please honestly, religious divide." The things are stolen, and now it is to be divided religiously. The foundation of the thing is stealing, and they are dividing in.... Now they are making laws, morality.

Devotee (1): They have a saying, "Honor among thieves."

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) This has been named by father, kaitava, simply cheating. Dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra (SB 1.1.2). The duplicity, hypocrisy, is there completely rejected.

Guru-kṛpā: Kṛṣṇa is a better cheater, though. He will cheat them in the end.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is not cheater. The Kṛṣṇa's energy is so powerful that anyone who is a cheater, he will be cheated, that's all, automatically. (break) If you infect some disease, you'll have to suffer, automatically. It is not that the disease has to be injected. No. Because you have infected, you'll suffer. The same law is there. You have done this sinful. You'll suffer that. That is the cycle of birth and death. You have created mentality. You'll become the same animal, and you suffer. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya (BG 13.22). (break) ...we have. We have seen this cloud, extraordinary.

Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:

Guest (2): Well, he's trying to say that the Mormons overeat meat. And all I'm saying is, well, the scripture which was revealed to the modern-day prophet Joseph Smith was that "Whoever.... Who does abstained from meat is not ordained of God." And I have no intentions to get contentious about it. So all I'm saying is I'm honored to be here, and it's good to be here.

Prabhupāda: No, no, the point is that in the Commandment it is clearly said, "Thou shall not kill." So what does it mean? That unless there is absolute necessity, we shall not kill.

Guest (2): I think that's right, and I feel that way.

Prabhupāda: So when.... At least in America or any civilized country, there is ample food for human being. Why they should kill? If you can live without killing cows, if you can utilize cows in a different way.... Just like we are maintaining a farm—not one, many. They are maintaining cows and we are getting enough milk. And from milk we can prepare varieties of palatable, vitaminous, nutritious food. And that is very, very enjoyable. So let the animal live and take the milk, and just like we.... None of us, we take meat, but we are not dying. We are having so many nice preparation from milk, from grains, from fruit. Besides that, our another principle is that we offer to God.

Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (3): It's been a very enjoyable experience.

Prabhupāda: No, you can give one book, Īśopaniṣad.

Guru-kṛpā: Can you take one of our books?

Guest (3): Fine. It would be an honor.

Guru-kṛpā: We'll read this. We promise to read this if you promise to read that.

Guest (3): Fine.

Prabhupāda: No, there is no question of...

Guru-kṛpā: Because he has read.

Prabhupāda: So you can read one of the best portion from this book.

Guest (3): Pardon me?

Prabhupāda: Recite the best portion. Of course, everywhere is best. Still...

Guest (3): All right. Let me think for one moment. (pause) Let me read just a couple verses here, and then I'll read a few more here. "Believe in God..." (to other Mormon:) Would you read this?

Guest (4): I'm tired and my voice is tired.

Guest (3): These two verses.

Guest (4): "Believe in God, believe that He is and that..."

Prabhupāda: "Believe that"?

Guest (4): "That He is."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Also here is. Here is the Deity.

Guest (2): No, that's an angel called Moronai.

Prabhupāda: "Angel," but you cannot dishonor him.

Guest (2): It's in honor of him.

Prabhupāda: You honor him.

Guest (2): No.

Prabhupāda: Then why you put this?

Guest (4): It's just a picture.

Prabhupāda: Oh, you don't honor him.

Guest (4): Don't honor him.

Prabhupāda: Then what is the use of picture? (laughter)

Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Just like here is the picture of God. As you say, this picture is not important, but we say it is important because it is picture of God. Because it is important, therefore you have given the picture.

Guest (3): Well, we say that that picture is important because it's in commemoration or something of...

Prabhupāda: Anyway, you offer some honor. Otherwise why do you give this picture?

Guest (2): Honor, not worship.

Guru-kṛpā: They put this on the top of their temples.

Guest (2): On one, two of them.

Guru-kṛpā: I have seen in Salt Lake City.

Guest (2): Salt Lake City and...

Prabhupāda: No, no, anywhere, top of.... Here you are giving a particular picture. That means...

Guru-kṛpā: Gold and silver.

Guest (2): That's right.

Prabhupāda: Stop. That means you have got respect.

Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: It is very good reason that, "Because the flies cannot be checked, and the crows should be allowed to pass stool?" At least you stop the crows. If you cannot stop the flies, but you can stop the crows. We have done that. We don't allow the crows to come.

Guest (2): That's good. That's very good. We have taken a lot of your time, Your Grace, and we are very honored and thank you very much.

Prabhupāda: No, we are talking frankly. That's nice. Our point is that.... That is our philosophy, that if we want to be God conscious, we must abide by His order, just like here it is very nicely written. I very much appreciate this thing. But we must practically do that. And what is that? "Again I say unto you as I have said before, that as ye have come to the knowledge of the glory of God." Now, it is conditional. "You have come to the knowledge of the glory of..." Now, what is that knowledge, glory of God?

Guest (2): Well, that is to know that He lives and that He loves you, and that one day you can live with Him again.

Prabhupāda: That's nice. Very good.

Morning Walk -- June 6, 1976, Los Angeles:

Rāmeśvara: "Covet thy neighbor's property, steal. Dishonor the mother and father, the cow, the earth, God."

Prabhupāda: Cows?

Rāmeśvara: Well, there's one of the Ten Commandments is "Thou shalt honor thy mother and thy father." But the mother is one of the cows, the earth. I mean the earth is the mother, the cow is the mother.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: So they dishonor.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They have no eyes to see that actually we are following strictly the teachings of Jesus.

Rāmeśvara: And they always say that Jesus ate fish. They always use that as an argument.

Prabhupāda: Jesus ate fish, therefore we shall eat our sons? Is that any reason? Jesus ate fish, therefore I shall eat my son.

Room Conversation with Ambarisa and Catholic Priest -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Not park, there is a pier, pier (pronounces "pire") what do you call?

Ambarīṣa: Oh, pier, pier. Oh, yes, it is near there, Prabhupāda, that's where you landed.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (laughs)

Ambarīṣa: Yes, it is not far. We're having Ratha-yātrā in Boston for the first time this year, and we're going to take the Ratha carts down to Commonwealth Pier in honor of your arrival.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (laughs) There is one A.P. store?

Ambarīṣa: A P?

Prabhupāda: A-P, A-P store.

Ambarīṣa: Market? Yes, it's still there.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that I saw first. (laughter) I remember.

Ambarīṣa: So there are many nice projects going on in Boston. We are hoping that maybe sometime you can come. That would be very nice.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. From New York it is not...

Ambarīṣa: No, it is very close to New York, half-hour airplane ride.

Prabhupāda: So it is ready?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: We were talking about different names for the restaurant yesterday.

Room Conversation -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: You may read that.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: "One of India's biggest and most ancient religious festivals, Ratha-yātrā, the festival of the chariots, which has been enacted in several Western cities in recent years, is to be staged in South Africa in July. The festival in honor of Lord Kṛṣṇa is planned to be held in Durban next month by the local branch of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, widely known as the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement. Based on the thousands-of-years-old annual parade of the three main deities of the Jagannātha temple on huge chariots through the streets of Purī, Orissa, the festival has been staged by devotees of Lord Kṛṣṇa in major world cities such as London, Paris, New York, Washington, Philadelphia, Los Angeles, Chicago, Montreal and Melbourne, following the spreading of Kṛṣṇa consciousness amongst thousands of Westerners in the decade since the founding of the movement in 1966 by Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda. Almost a million devotees participate in the chariot festival held every summer at Purī, where they offer oblations to Lord Kṛṣṇa; lend a hand, tugging the ropes, to pull the huge chariots; line the grand route; or simply attend to see the color and pageantry from high vantage points. Jagannātha-The three colossal chariots from which the term Jagannātha is derived carry the three Jagannātha Deities of Lord Balarāma, the Lord who gives spiritual strength and pleasure; Lady Subhadrā, one who is the auspicious one; and Lord Jagannātha, the Lord of the universe,"—with a capital L—"on the three-kilometer journey symbolizing Lord Kṛṣṇa's visit to the town of His childhood pastimes. This year ISKCON will sponsor Ratha-yātrā festivals in ten cities worldwide. Durban, however, is not amongst them, as the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is fairly new and has not yet established itself on a firm basis and increased its following in Durban. Branch members are enthusiastic and are hoping to organize a procession of their own through the streets of Durban to coincide with the festivals which will be held in several major cities."

Prabhupāda: They are arranging like that or not? Our branch there?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They want to. I told them that better to wait until they have some more local support, because they would have to have Deity worship, and I don't think they're ready for Jagannātha deities there. There's only eleven devotees in Durban. So when they have some more local support, they can start holding.

Prabhupāda: No, this Jagannātha festival will be participated by all the Indians. There is no doubt about it. So our few men, and with the cooperation of the local Indians, it can be successful.

Interview with Professors O'Connell, Motilal and Shivaram -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Prof. O'Connell: Swamiji, it may be time for us to take your leave. It was a great pleasure and honor to...

Prabhupāda: Thank you very much for your coming. Now my request is that you take up this movement. It is actually a great contribution to the human society. Yad yad ācarati śreṣṭha (BG 3.21). Those who are leaders of the society, if they take it, it is easily understood and easily distributed. So there is no question of sectarian thought. It is the necessity of the human society to understand God. The other day in Detroit, two father priests came to see me. I also requested that we require a set of first-class men that is not there at the present moment. There is no head. They are thinking simply arms wanted, defense, and fight amongst themselves. That's all. Everyone is thinking simply arms wanted. And what they will do with the arms? Fight between themselves, that's all. So one asura was given one thousand hands by Lord Śiva. But he could not find any enemy. So he was fighting with hills and mountains and making him smashed. So he came to Lord Śiva: "Sir, you have given me one thousand hands, but there is no enemy for me. I cannot fight." So Śiva said, "Yes, you just wait for the day when your enemy will come who will smash you into pieces." (laughs) So we are simply equipping with arms and finding out to whom we'll fight. That is going on. So everyone is manufacturing the atomic weapons. So there must be some fight, so that all the nations will be ruined. (end)

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: This is the authoritative source, that you are not master, you are servant. Cultivate this knowledge. Don't try to become a master, falsely. That will never be successful. Remain servant of Kṛṣṇa, you'll be happy. That is the business of spiritual master. He gives the right information; therefore he is respected so much, because he does not cheat. "You can become master, even God you can become"—this is cheating. The real spiritual master says that "You can never become master. You are always servant." And therefore he's worshiped. He gives the right information. Therefore he is honored so, because he does not cheat. The so-called spiritual master is cheating, that "You take this mantra and give me some money and you become God." This cheating is going on. Spiritual master is to be worshiped. Why? Because he does not cheat. He gives the right information. That is his credit. Guruṣu nara-mati. Therefore one should not take guru as ordinary human being. Ordinary human being, he'll cheat you, or he'll give some information, he's cheating. But a guru, real guru, he'll not cheat you. Therefore he should be worshiped as good... God does not cheat you. Therefore guru should not be taken as ordinary human being. Guruṣu nara-mati. "I see that he is like ordinary man. His son is calling him 'father.' His wife is..." That's all right, but because he's giving the right information, he is not ordinary human being. Therefore he should be worshiped as good as God. He does not cheat. That is the test of guru. He'll never say that "You give me some bribe and you'll become God by meditation, transcendental." He'll never say that. This is cheating. Why father is respected? Because he never cheats the son. Father is also a man, another man. Why father is...? Because he's always wishing welfare of the son, he does not cheat, sincerely teaches him the reality.

Prabhupada Inspects New BTG -- June 24, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: What is this article? Ah. "Kṛṣṇa Consciousness-The Spirit of '76." "Curing the Crimes of a Lifetime." Vibhavatī. "Curing the Crimes"—read it.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: (reads) "Adapted from Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, translation and commentary by His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda." In the middle there is a picture of Arjuna piercing the target, and Draupadī. "With the recent disgrace of an American president still fresh in our minds, it is interesting to read of a similar case in ancient times. Five thousand years ago a blind king named Dhṛtarāṣṭra dishonored his high post and caused the death of millions. This story is of special importance even today, because he found an antidote to the crimes of a lifetime and in his old age became self-realized. King Dhṛtarāṣṭra was the acting monarch of Hastināpura, the capital of the Vedic kingdom of Bhārata, which five thousand years ago, according to the Vedic literature, spread over most of the planet. Hastināpura was on the banks of the Yamunā River at the present-day site..., at the site of present day Delhi. As its name indicates-hasti means elephant—it was a city full of opulently decorated elephants. Noble men rode elaborate chariots past marble palaces inlaid with glittering jewels. The sweet smell of incense drifted out of lattice windows. Trees bearing fruits and flowers lined the wide streets, which were sprinkled with scented water. There was no hint of poverty or distress. Hastināpura was the crown jewel of the abundant Vedic civilization. From the beginning, Dhṛtarāṣṭra's position as king was never legal, for he was blind, and Vedic law ruled that a blind man cannot be king. Thus the throne went to his younger brother Pāṇḍu. But when Pāṇḍu died in his young manhood, Dhṛtarāṣṭra began ruling on behalf of Pāṇḍu's five sons, who were still children. In an age of great and honorable kings, Dhṛtarāṣṭra was an exception. Swayed by his eldest son Duryodhana's ruthless lust for power, Dhṛtarāṣṭra began to abuse the guardianship of the Pāṇḍavas by closing his already blind eyes to the planned and purposeful efforts of Duryodhana to destroy the boys. As the descendant of a great royal dynasty, Dhṛtarāṣṭra had the lineage and rearing of a proper monarch, but it seemed that he was as blind spiritually as he was physically. Although he admired and even loved the five fatherless princes, he began to contemplate taking away their kingdom, and even their lives."

Prabhupāda: At seven o'clock we shall go there?

Kīrtanānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: What is time now?

Kīrtanānanda: Six. Six o'clock, five past six.

Prabhupāda: Oh. All right. (exits room) (end)

Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: "Performance of sacrifice, study of the Vedas, austerity and simplicity, nonviolence, truthfulness, freedom from anger, renunciation, tranquillity, aversion to fault-finding, compassion and freedom from covetousness, gentleness, modesty and steady determination, vigor, forgiveness, fortitude, cleanliness, freedom from envy and the passion for honor—these transcendental qualities, O son of Bharata, belong to godly men endowed with divine nature." (purport) "In the beginning of the Fifteenth Chapter the banyan tree of this material world was explained. The extra roots coming out of it were compared to the activities of the living entities, some auspicious, some inauspicious. In the Ninth Chapter also the devas, or godly, and asuras, the ungodly or demons, were explained. Now according to Vedic rites, activities in the mode of goodness are considered auspicious for progress on the path of liberation, and such activities are known as daivī prakṛti, transcendental by nature. Those who are situated in the transcendental nature make progress..."

Prabhupāda: The defect of modern civilization is that they have no idea about liberation. Neither they have any idea about transmigration of the soul. From the very root, they are defective. They are thinking... Just like animals. Dog is thinking, "I am this dog. I am born dog and I'll die, that's finished, everything." He cannot think that "I can become also man." He cannot think that. So the modern civilization, they cannot think even that there is next life and we can go... They have got the tendency to go to the higher planetary system, moon. Artificially, they are trying, but they do not know. Just like they can go to any planet, sarvaga. Yānti deva-vratā devān pitṛn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ (BG 9.25). They do not know this, although they have got the tendency to go. But they do not know how to go, positively what are the position of the different planets or Vaikuṇṭhaloka or liberation or next life, transmigration—nothing of the sort. Simply like dogs. Now consider this point, whether I'm speaking right or wrong. I know I am speaking the right thing, but if you deny, then you talk amongst yourselves.

Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: We even see that among the so-called God conscious communities in the world, still there are such horrible activities going on, fighting.

Prabhupāda: No, no, we don't say that fighting will stop. We are distinguishing demons and rogues, uh, demigods. If you fight, demon, I must defend myself. What can I do? If you start war, you are demon, shall I stop: "No, no, I am demigod, I'll not fight. You kill me"? Is that intelligent? I'll have to fight. But the war starts by the implication of the demons. The Kurukṣetra war, it was not started by Arjuna. It was started by Duryodhana. (long pause) All right, go on.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna:

kāmam āśritya duṣpūram
dambha-māna-madānvitāḥ
mohād gṛhītvāsad-grāhān
pravartante 'śuci-vratāḥ

"The demoniac, taking shelter of insatiable lust, pride and false prestige, and being thus illusioned, are always sworn to unclean work, attracted by the impermanent." Purport. "The demoniac mentality is described here. The demons' lust is never satiated. They will go on increasing and increasing their insatiable desires for material enjoyment. Although they are always full of anxieties on account of accepting nonpermanent things, they still continue to engage in such activities out of illusion. They have no knowledge and cannot tell that they are heading the wrong way. Accepting nonpermanent things, such demoniac people create their own God, create their own hymns, and chant accordingly. The result is that they become more and more attracted to two things—sex enjoyment and accumulation of material wealth. The word aśuci-vratāḥ, 'unclean vow,' is very significant in this connection. Such demoniac people are only attracted by wine, women, gambling and meat-eating; those are their aśuci, unclean habits. Induced by pride and false prestige, they create some principles of religion which are not approved by the Vedic injunctions. Although such demoniac people are most abominable in the world, still, by artificial means, the world creates a false honor for them. Although they are gliding toward hell, they consider themselves very much advanced."

Prabhupāda: There are so many religious systems: "Yes, you can do whatever you like, you can eat whatever you like," and still it is religion. This is demoniac. That will be explained further. Huh? Pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ ca na vidur āsurāḥ janā (BG 16.7). No, not in the beginning.

Garden Conversation -- June 27, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Then? It is the same thing. Suppose Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja has brought this car, so he says, "All of you can come." So I go, you go, does it mean that you and your spiritual master is equal? Do you think like that? It is same thing. Everyone can go to Godhead, there is no doubt, but still there is difference between brāhmaṇas, kṣatriyas, śūdras. So far going into the car, the equal right is there, but it does not mean that your spiritual master or the next group, they are not greater than you. Don't think like that. The same car, Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja is driving, I am also there, you are also there. Does it mean that we are all equal? There must be gradation. The right is given to everyone. It does not mean that immediately they become all one. It is Kṛṣṇa's mercy that He accepted everyone, "Come on." But the distinction is there. We are inviting everyone to partake Kṛṣṇa prasādam. That does not mean that immediately all of them have become of the equal rank. Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He was so kind, but still there was distinction. When He was taking prasādam, personal associates, they were sitting with Him. Is it not? So this is called maryādā. Maryādā means honor. That must... Varieties must be there. Otherwise we become Māyāvādīs—everything is equal, all one. This is Māyāvāda philosophy. No varieties. There must be variety. That is Vaiṣṇava philosophy. And as soon as you make it varietyless, all equal, that is Māyāvāda. Just see even in this flower, this is also flower and this is also flower. Does it mean they are of the same rank? This is understanding. Together they look very beautiful, but if you take separate value, then it is valuable than this flower. That distinction must be there. If somebody says "I am accepting even the leaf in this garland," then what to speak of rose? It is like that. Kṛṣṇa says that. That does not mean leaf and rose have the same value. One is making a beautiful garland, "I am accepting everything." Mixed together it looks very nice, but individually the leaf has value, the rose has value, the flower has value. Not that because they are put together they have equal value. This is Vaiṣṇava philosophy.

Garden Conversation -- June 27, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Answer.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Desire for false prestige? First of all, ceto-darpana-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). The heart is full of so many dirty things, and basically all of these revolve around the bodily concept of life—I think I'm this body. Therefore we're desiring honor, we don't like to be dishonored; and looking for so many gains, we don't like to lose something. So there are so many dualities that exist: respect and disrespect, honor and dishonor. So when you become purified, freed from the bodily concept of life by chanting, then naturally honor and dishonor, they are not very important; they are only in relationship to the body.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Now argue, whether you are satisfied with his answer. If not, say it. In this way, discuss. Are you satisfied with his answer?

Devotee (2): Yes, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Kulaśekhara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, it says that the Caitanya-caritāmṛta is the postgraduate study of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

Prabhupāda: Hmm, hear him. What does he say?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is the postgraduate study...

Devotees: Caitanya-caritāmṛta, postgraduate study.

Kulaśekhara: So if we're very attracted to reading Caitanya caritāmṛta now, but we haven't finished Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam as yet, should we wait until we have studied Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam thoroughly?

Prabhupāda: It does not mean that one who is not postgraduate, he cannot read other books. Spiritual life is not a stereotype like that. But one who is not postgraduate, it is little difficult for him to understand the statement of... Just like in the beginning of Caitanya-caritāmṛta, it is said, na caitanyāt kṛṣṇāj jagati para-tattvaṁ param iha, that there is no superior truth than Caitanya Mahāprabhu. So if you have not studied Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, you'll not understand this statement. If you understand, "Yes, Caitanya is the supreme truth," then it is to be understood that you have graduated. And if you are not, then it will be difficult for you to understand.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Arjuna is rectifying this because people may say, "Arjuna was Kṛṣṇa's friend, he is accepting Him as guru." No, Arjuna says, "Not only I, but other authorities, they also accept." So it is..., everything is clear, that Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and He should be accepted as guru or His representative should be accepted guru. Then it will be... So our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is that we are presenting Kṛṣṇa as the supreme guru. You take instruction from Him and be benefited. But one who is carrying this message, he is also authorized. Just like one money order, it is coming through the post office, but an ordinary peon is handing over the money. But he is representative of post office. Actually, the money order is being delivered by the post office, general post office. But it is coming through an ordinary peon. But because he is authorized to deliver you, he is also post office. He's as good as the post office. Just you have got a letter box, a small box, but if you put your letter there, your letter will surely go ten thousand miles away. Therefore, although it is a small box, you don't think it is small box. It is whole post office. Similarly, anyone who is carrying the message of Kṛṣṇa, don't think that he's ordinary man. If you imitate one box like that post box and put your letter, for thousand years it will lie down there. Because it is not authorized. So if somebody says this small box, red box, is as good as the post office, one may say, "Huh, this is small box. How it can be as good as the post office?" But you see. You post your letter, it will go. Therefore, sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktas tathā bhāvyata eva sadbhiḥ **. Guru is directly the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Why? Because he is presenting the words of Supreme Personality of Godhead without any deterioration. Therefore he is so honored. So therefore the conclusion is guru is necessary and guru is he who is representative of Kṛṣṇa. Otherwise he's bogus.

Garden Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Dhana means money. So if you have got money, then everyone will respect you. Personally you may be less than a dog, but because you have got money, people will respect you. Is it not? (laughs) In England I was guest in John Lennon's house. He has taken a photograph, naked. And he's a big man. He gives opinion to the newspaper reporter. People go there to take his opinion about some serious subject, and he speaks, and the man is so shameless that he is standing naked, and he's important man—because he has got money. Especially in the Western countries this is very prominent. If you have got money, then you have got everything. Therefore they are after money only, that "If some way or other, if I get money, then I get everything. I get respect, I get honor. I get everything. Bring money somehow or other." This is the attempt. Therefore there is so much hard struggle. From early in the morning, four o'clock, they are going to the office to get money. To get more money, more money, that is the Western civilization. Now in India they have also learned. And our philosophy is "Don't try to get money." Tasyaiva hetoḥ prayeteta. "You should simply engage your life for advancing your Kṛṣṇa consciousness." So who will hear us? We say, "There is no need of working so hard for money." Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke kaṣṭān kāmān arhate viḍ-bhujāṁ ye (SB 5.5.1). This kind of working hard is done by the hogs and dogs, so why a human being should work so hard simply to get the necessities of life? (break) ...and dogs, they are getting necessities of life in that way. (break) This association, this meeting, this talking, is meant for the human body; it is not for the cats and dogs. This is human civilization. Naimiṣāraṇya meeting going on, all the big, big learned brāhmaṇas, sages, they are talking how to do welfare activities to the human society. What is this civilization? Simply money, money, money, money, money. And as soon as you get money, then you begin all nonsense, illicit sex, meat-eating, drinking, gambling. What you will do with the money? You do not know how to spend it. Hm. Dhana-māna-madānvitāḥ.

Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Mistri.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: What is that?

Prabhupāda: Any craftsman, we say mistri.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh, yes.

Prabhupāda: So mistri has no position. Maybe correct. In our Vedic civilization a learned brāhmaṇa is honored, not a mistri. Is it not?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: A learned brāhmaṇa, is not expected to manufacture a watch, but he's more honored than one who is actually... This modern age is: if he manufactures watch he is honored. Not the learned brāhmaṇa. That is Kali-yuga. That is Kali-yuga. They do not know whom to honor. That is the Kali-yuga going on. You kill so many souls, and if you have a great big skyscraper building, then you are successful. And those who constructed the skyscraper, they are going to become dog, never mind, the skyscraper building is there. That's all. That is success. This is modern civilization. After they constructed the skyscraper building all the mistris are going to hell, that doesn't matter. The building is there. Is it not?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Purport.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: "The real constitutional position of the living entity is that of subordination to the Supreme Lord, who is pure knowledge. When one is deluded into separation from this pure knowledge, he becomes controlled by illusory energy and cannot understand the Supreme Personality of Godhead. The illusory energy is manifested in the duality of desire and hate. Due to desire and hate the ignorant person wants to become one with the Supreme Lord and envies Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Pure devotees, who are not so deluded or contaminated by desire and hate, can understand that Lord Śrī Kṛṣṇa appears by His internal potencies. But those who are deluded by duality and nescience think that the Supreme Personality of Godhead is created by material energies. This is their misfortune. Such deluded persons symptomatically dwell in dualities of dishonor and honor, misery and happiness, woman and man, good and bad, pleasure and pain, etc., thinking 'This is my wife, this is my house; I am the master of this house, I am the husband of this wife.' These are the dualities of delusion. Those who are so deluded by dualities are completely foolish and cannot understand the Supreme Personality of Godhead."

Prabhupāda: So even in the Vaikuṇṭha, if I desire that "Why shall I serve Kṛṣṇa? Why not become Kṛṣṇa?" I immediately fall down. That is natural. A servant is serving the master, sometimes he may think that "If I could become the master." They are thinking like that, they are trying to become God. That is delusion. You cannot become God. That is not possible. But he's wrongly thinking.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Dr. Sharma: Sarva-bhūtānām.

Prabhupāda: No, I have no, I mean to say, grudge against. If Kṛṣṇa wants... In old age I was living a retired life in Vṛndāvana. He asked me "Get out, go to America." So I came. At the age of seventy years, actually nobody goes out of home. But Kṛṣṇa asked me, "Get out and go." So I came. And although I have got the best temple in Vṛndāvana, I cannot live there. But a fighting soldier is honored by the government. He maybe dies, he is recognized by the government, "Here is a soldier, laid down his life by fighting." So we prefer that life. We shall die fighting with māyā.

Devotees: Jaya.

Dr. Sharma: It is said in śāstra that it is better to go out and find salvation for others than to find salvation for yourself.

Prabhupāda: One who seeks salvation for others, he's already salvation.

Devotees: Jaya.

Prabhupāda: Otherwise, how he can arrange salvation for others? So he hasn't got to seek for salvation.

Room Conversation -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: It is available.

Dr. Sharma: Yes, but these few questions only, the answers, that these are from you and these are there, then it will be a point of jump in the movement. It will be a big jump in the movement. And what can we do...?

Prabhupāda: So come and join us and help us.

Dr. Sharma: I would be most honored to do it, and I am trying from the outside.

Prabhupāda: No, you are in Washington?

Dr. Sharma: Yes, I am in Washington.

Prabhupāda: So organize here. Talk with the scientists and everyone here.

Dr. Sharma: I come two or three times a week for the temple, and I will be coming more.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Sharma: Your idea of the Institute is possibly the most magnificent idea, because that will bring all the scientists...

Prabhupāda: Yes, actually it is. At least those who are Indians, let them join. It is Indian culture.

Room Conversation -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Royal College of... That... What is is called?

Dr. Sharma: Royal Institute of Chemistry, London. And I have a law degree. And I am in computer information and control engineering.

Prabhupāda: (laughing) You are such a big man. Kindly join us and help us.

Dr. Sharma: I would be most honored, and I'm slowing trying to work it out in such a way that I can...

Prabhupāda: No, the formula is all given in this Bhagavad-gītā.

Dr. Sharma: I find your Bhagavad-gītā most illuminating as compared to other Gītās I have read, the translations.

Prabhupāda: We are presenting Bhagavad-gītā as it is, that's all.

Dr. Sharma: How can we best serve the movement? By joining it? I have joined it in a...

Prabhupāda: Prāṇair arthair dhiyā vācaiḥ: "By life, by money, by intelligence, by words." Either four or three or two, at least one. Then it will be all right.

Dr. Sharma: I'll be writing...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: But he can write. He give you.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh, yes, he can furnish it in so many ways, and we are going to need Dr. Sharma's help, because he's in the government agency in the scientific field, so...

Prabhupāda: Yes. If he wants to help us, he can help us in so many ways.

Dr. Sharma: Yes, I'll be very much honored to help.

Prabhupāda: And he's convinced. He's not an ordinary person. He's convinced. So let us take his help and...

Dr. Sharma: I'll see what the government and the foundations... I can go to the foundation to help it. Once the Institute is formed, I can go to the foundations to get the money from them both to support the movement or the Institute for education.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.

Dr. Sharma: Once we get started on that... You must be very tired now. You have...

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Room Conversation -- July 10, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Who's name?

Devotee (1): Gansfield. They say the Gansfield effect.

Prabhupāda: Who is Gansfield, somebody know?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's an article about Maharishi. You want to read it? There's some points in here, it says "Profit without honor." This man hates Maharishi, says he's completely bogus.

Prabhupāda: His picture is hateful.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It says "Profit without any honor." He quotes you in here. It says "Swami Prabhupāda, spiritual leader of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, and Bill Faill, Durban, South Africa, of the Natal Mercury Reporter, had the following dialogue: (reads from magazine) Bill Faill: 'Do you think that Transcendental Meditation is helping people?' Prabhupāda: 'They do not know what real meditation is. Their meditation is simply a farce, another cheating process by the so-called swamis and yogis. So everyone is talking about meditation, but no one knows what meditation really is. These bluffers use the word meditation, but they do not know the proper subject for meditation. They are simply talking bogus propaganda.' Bill Faill: 'But isn't meditation helpful in getting people to think straight?' Prabhupāda: 'No, real meditation means to achieve a state in which the mind is saturated by God consciousness.' "

Prabhupāda: Dhyānāvasthita-tad-gatena manasā paśyanti yaṁ yoginaḥ (SB 12.13.1). This is the Vedic version. When one man's mind is fully absorbed in the Supersoul, Viṣṇu, that is called meditation. And Bhagavad-gītā confirms,

yoginām api sarveṣāṁ
mad-gatenāntarātmanā
śraddhāvān bhajate yo māṁ
sa me yuktatamo mataḥ
(BG 6.47)

These are the Vedic version. These rascals, some light, some this, some that.

Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Wrongly, wrongly. Kṛṣṇa says, cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). So according to quality and work... That is fact. If you have got engineering qualification and if you can work as engineer, people will call you engineer-sāheb. Is it not? So there may be a class of engineer, but that depends on quality and work. But if you have no quality, no work, how you become engineer? If you have no qualification of becoming an engineer, and you do not work, you work as a clerk, and if somebody addresses you "Engineer-sāheb," he is a fool, you are a fool. (laughter) So if he's not a brāhmaṇa, if you call him a brāhmaṇa, then you are fool and he is also fool. So that is going on, fools' paradise. A rascal who is not in qualification a brāhmaṇa, if he's addressed and given honor of a brāhmaṇa, he's sees, "Oh, for nothing I am getting this honor, that's right, very nice." And who is giving him honor as brāhmaṇa, he's also rascal. But it is not that. Cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). Not by birth. One must acquire the quality of a brāhmaṇa.

Morning Walk -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Hmm? No. This is ventilation. (laughter) You are feeling cold? Mister? You are feeling cold?

Child: No.

Devotee (1): It's that same lady again.

Ādi-keśava: Śrīla Prabhupāda, we went to one other part of the park down there, and we found they have a big statue of a dog there, and it says "In honor of the dogs." Some sled-dogs that came and saved some people in Alaska in 1926, a big statue of a dog.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: (break) ...cold.

Prabhupāda: He has got some? Children are not affected. Old men are affected. For children, if there is diarrhea, it is good, but old man, if there is diarrhea he is going to die. (break) ...evolution of man, what about the trees?

Bali-mardana: Trees?

Prabhupāda: Trees and plants and aquatics and insects.

Interview with Religious Editor Of the Associated Press -- July 16, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: He should know that he is different from the car. That is real knowledge. And if he identifies himself with the car, then he's a fool.

Interviewer: Well, can he, is he supposed to care about and honor the body in the physical world...

Prabhupāda: That is already taken.

Interviewer: ...and to see that, see the physical world as important?

Prabhupāda: Suppose if you are utilizing this coat, you are taking care of it, but if you think that you are coat, then you are doomed.

Bali-mardana: If you use the body you should take care of it but if you think that you are the body, then you are doomed, then it is foolishness. But you naturally you take care of the body, but you should still don't identify with it.

Interviewer: Well you know, Your Grace, the spiritual quality is an important part of life of course...

Prabhupāda: Yes, otherwise the animal. If the man does not understand the value of his spiritual quality then he's no better than the dog. The dog does not know.

Interview with Religion Editor of The Observer -- July 23, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: That is my Guru Mahārāja's blessing. He ordered me, I tried my best, so there is little success. When I see so many boys and hundreds of centers, they are living very peacefully in a nice house, getting good prasādam, having good knowledge in the books, and reforming their character, and getting some good home, that is my success. Otherwise, they are loitering, no home, no character, no peace of mind. So at least this is my success. I have given so many boys a life. That is my success.

Cline Cross: Well, I'm very honored to have met you. I've read some of your work. I intend to read more.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So we are trying to give the best service to the humanity, human society, and this is the only service. People should come forward and cooperate with us. It is not a sectarian sentimental religious system. It is a scientific understanding of the value of life.

Cline Cross: Well, thank you very much indeed, sir.

Prabhupāda: Thank you. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. (end)

Room Conversation -- July 26, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: Read. What does it say?

Pṛthu-putra: (translating) (sic:) "The classical induries(?) based on sacred scriptures from which the eighteen great Purāṇas has a central place. These vast poems, their character give theologic teaching is giving all the knowledge of the Veda, and in the substance of the Purāṇa there is the face of the Indian populations. While reciting them in the temples and the preacher are giving commentaries in the assembly of devotees, which is called sankīrtana. This teaching read to the chant and dancing on the glories of the Lord Bhagavān. Amongst all these Purāṇas, the most famous is the Bhāgavata-Purāṇa, called Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, because this literary form is achieved the most beautiful, and also because it's the poem which is expressing the best the doctrine of the faith that Sri Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Person, Purusottama, the principle of everything, the absolute unique without second, advaitam-brahman. Like in the Śrīmad Bhagavad-gītā, the Lord reveals His majesty in plain. Much more than an avatara of Visnu, He appears in our eyes like the unique God. Towards Him all devotion is due. The French people are honored to have, from the beginning of the nineteenth century, to have the first edition of Bhāgavata-Purāṇa, but from long time already this work of the great Beurnuf"—that's the man who translated Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam in nineteenth century in French—"is the reason why we have to thank very much the association, the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, to give us that very big text, one of the master book of the humanity. This book is very benefic, and with the translation of the Sanskrit there is a commentary, the majestical commentary, which is given verse after verse by the master, A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda, founder of the association. As he did it with the Bhagavad-gītā, which was published in French in 1975 with the preface of a Professor Harvi Delacombe, Swami Prabhupāda explains word by word each mantra -stanza or sacred text-before to give a signification. Then the reader can judge every pieces, what is the meaning of the teaching of the master by confrontation with the text itself..."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Evening Darsan -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: So ritualistic ceremonies, Vedic ritualistic ceremonies. Everywhere there are some ritualistic ceremony. So when you go above this... Just like Kṛṣṇa says in another place, vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyo. By performing the Vedic ritualistic ceremony, the ultimate goal is to understand Kṛṣṇa. So if you understand Kṛṣṇa, then you may not perform this ritualistic ceremony. Because you have come to the objective. Not before that. That is sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66). Vedic ritualistic ceremony is that if you perform this yajña, then you go to the heavenly planet and there you'll get so long life, ten thousands of years, you get nice woman, and so on, so on. People are after that, karma-kāṇḍa. So this karma-kāṇḍa is required so long one is unaware of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. When one understands this karma-kāṇḍa elevation is not the aim of our life, our real aim of life how to go back home, back to Godhead, then these things are not required. Just like we have no ritualistic ceremony, we have simply devotional service. We have no ritualistic ceremony. There are so many things ritualistic. And we are performing only this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, mahā-mantra. Therefore the smārta brāhmaṇas, they misunderstand. They do not admit that they have become elevated. The Jagannātha temple does not allow. But when one becomes a pure Vaiṣṇava, then tepus tapas te juhuvuḥ sasnur āryā (SB 3.33.7). He has performed all the ritualistic devotion. There are many statements in the śāstras, that when you come to the devotional platform, you haven't go to perform these ritualistic ceremonies. Because the end of ritualistic ceremony, you have come to the point. That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Dharmaḥ projjhita kaitavo 'tra (SB 1.1.2). Kaitava means cheating. Cheating type of dharma is rejected here. This karma-kāṇḍa, by performing some ritualistic ceremony you may go to a heavenly planet, but what benefit you will have? That one has to understand. You can enjoy there materialistic, highest type of materialistic civilization means eating, sleeping, mating. These things you can get, but you have to come back again. Kṣine punye martya-lokaṁ viśanti (BG 9.21). So what benefit there is? No benefit. Just like in British period, some Englishman was made viceroy of India. Then after five years they sent to London, again with his bag, marketing in the street. This has been seen practically. Lord such-and-such, he's traveling in a third-class compartment with a bag for marketing. But so long he was viceroy, oh, so much honor, so much prestige. So where is that prestige now? These ritualistic ceremonies are like that. For more years you become viceroy, and then again fall down. That is your Nixon. What is the position of Nixon now? He is ordinary man. That's all.

Room Conversation -- August 14, 1976, Bombay:

Indian Doctor: (laughter) By any way.

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is modern civilization. Big man, big rich man means bring money some way or other. This is big man. This is Kali-yuga. Because if you have got money, you have got respect, you have got honor, you are recognized. So therefore they are after money. Bring money, that's all right. When I shall get money, I may have done black money, force money, this money, nobody will remember it. Bas. This is modern civilization. Bring money and enjoy sense. Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma (SB 5.5.4). What for it is, struggle so much working hard? Yad indriya-prītaya. Only for the satisfaction of the senses. They have no other ambition. Because most of them, they do not believe there is next life. Most of them, 99.9 percent, they do not believe. Big, big professor, I have talked with so many big, big men in Europe. They have no... Our leaders also. The Munshi, he did not believe in the next life.

Room Conversation -- August 21, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Tatpur is educated?

Jayapatākā: He's got a B.A. or something.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Jayapatākā: He doesn't write himself. He writes in old fashion. But he corrects for double-checking philosophy. Editing. And this Kiśora, he was a M.A. and he previously used to write. He was an honor student at Calcutta University, and he used to freelance write in Bengali. So his style is very nice.

Prabhupāda: Why not engage him in simply...

Jayapatākā: He is translating now our...

Gargamuni: That's all he does.

Jayapatākā: That and he greets the guests. He's also good at membership.

Prabhupāda: Gītār Gān has become popular.

Gargamuni: Yes. That name has become very popular. Everyone is asking, "Where is this Gītār Gān?"

Prabhupāda: So you can register the name so that others may not...

Jayapatākā: Yes, otherwise they'll cash in on it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. You can register it the name. Patron registration. Copyright registration.

Morning Walk -- September 2, 1976, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: They are also devotees.

Lokanātha: But their devotion is mixed devotion.

Prabhupāda: No. Just like Lord Brahmā. We belong to the Brahmā-sampradāya. Brahmā is the original spiritual master after Kṛṣṇa. Brahmā, then Nārada, then Vyāsadeva-like that. So all of them are gurus, ācāryas. So why spiritual master is honored as good as the Supreme Lord? Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstraiḥ. Why? That should be his question: Why spiritual master is given the supreme post than all others? Sākṣād-dharitvena—as good as God. Why? Is it not? It is clear, his question. First of all, is this his question?

Caraṇāravindam: Yes, this is the question.

Prabhupāda: So what is the answer?

Lokanātha: The spiritual master is very much concerned about our personal welfare. They are the present ācāryas in the paramparā...

Prabhupāda: He gives direct knowledge of Kṛṣṇa; therefore he's as good as Kṛṣṇa. Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa... Hmm?

Hari-śauri: I was just telling him to fan just when there's flies just to scatter.

Prabhupāda: You are tired now? No?

Indian man: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: You can climb on the tree? No. Let me see. (children laughing) It is better than that path.

Press Interview -- October 16, 1976, Chandigarh:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Could we just take two minutes of your time? This is a review from Śrī Baradraj, Principle of Government College for Men, Chandigarh. He says, "Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is one of the great classics of India. This commentary is a significant contribution to the religious literature of this country. Many of the conflicting views on certain ślokas have been beautifully resolved by Swamiji. I congratulate the members of the Society for bringing out this wonderful work in such a lucid form. I shall be looking forward to the other publications." This is a review from Dr. Varsneya (?), senior professor and Head of Hindi Department, Dean and Curator of Arts, honorary librarian, Allahabad University, Allahabad. "Śrī A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda has really done a great service to Indian philosophy, religion and culture by translating Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam into English, with learned commentaries, and has thus provided source material to the Western world. Other philosophical and religious works published by the Bhaktivedanta Book Trust also present a golden opportunity to the Western philosophers and scholars to drink deep at the celestial fountain of ancient Indian philosophy and spiritual wisdom." I'm just reading a few very quick ones. There's one from a leading professor in Chandigarh who you must be knowing. Dr. Jagadish Sharma, M.A., (indistinct) Delhi? He's from Punjab University. Author of nineteen books including Encyclopedia of India. So here is what Dr. Sharma says. "India's contribution towards the revivalism of the Hindu civilization culture by way of printing the Harvard Oriental Series was tremendous. But the work done by A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda is unsurpassable." He says it's even greater. "His Holiness has done a great service to the Indian culture by re-interpreting the concepts enshrined in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. This edition of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam will go a long way to help the scientists in rediscovering phenomena of the universe which is yet to be discovered. The printing and the get up of this book is excellent. The thoughts of the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam radiate to anyone who sees it. This book helps to brighten the gloomy and dark clouds which are covered by the nuclear fear and apprehension of society."

Prabhupāda: Where is that book, Scientific Basis of Kṛṣṇa Consciousness? Some of my students, they are Ph.Ds in science. They have written this book, Scientific Basis of Kṛṣṇa Consciousness. And we are going to publish another book, Life Comes From Life.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: First of all friendship, and that established them. And then they began to create enmity. Hindus against Muslim, Muslim... They wanted to stay. When they forgot this idea that if they wanted to stay for the benefit of the people, nobody could drive them away. But their policy was for the benefit of the English people. Therefore they failed. Lord Curzon, he says a statement that, "If you want to stay in India, rule India for the benefit of Indian people. You can keep control over India. They are fond of kings, so one member of the royal family can become king here and they'll earn respect and honor (from) these Indian people. But rule for their benefit. Then British Empire will stay." Very good advice, but his advice was not taken. You have seen Lord Curzon's statue near the, in front of the Victoria Memorial Hall?

Haṁsadūta: Hm.

Prabhupāda: He was a very good governor-general. Many gentlemen came, they wrote very conscientiously and the last one, that rascal Chelmsford (chuckles), he created havoc.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That's all right, positive.

Hari-śauri: And then this is Dr. Stillson Judah.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Hari-śauri: He's a graduate from University of Washington, majoring in oriental studies, graduate from University of California with a Ph.D in Sanskrit and Indian Languages, and he received an honorary degree from Chapman College, Southern California. And he has various posts as professor of history of religion. etc....

Prabhupāda: He has written about us, the big book.

Hari-śauri: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: Big book. Bring that, bring that book. After 5 years scrutinizingly studying, statistics, graphics, and he has put my picture in it.

Haṁsadūta: Looks like your book.

Devotee: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: (Bengali)

Hari-śauri: Dr. Stillson Judah says, "The Hare Kṛṣṇa movement and more formally the International Society for Kṛṣṇa Consciousness, ISKCON, is a western representation of an important Hindu sect, Vaisnavism."

Prabhupāda: He says, "Important Hindu sect." How they can say whether it is a genuine? Important, not only genuine but important, Vaisnavism.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Rāmeśvara: Because they say that the Ten Commandments says... One of the Ten Commandments, the fourth one, says "Thou shalt honor thy mother and thy father."

Prabhupāda: Yes, we honor.

Rāmeśvara: But that means by birth, the mother and father also. That's what it refers to.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: So they say, "By your teaching they are spitting on their mothers and fathers."

Prabhupāda: No, not spitting. Who is spitting? Everyone... Just like you have got a father and mother. You are not spitting. Whenever father, mother, comes, he honors. That is your version, but his version is different. He loves his father and mother. He teaches him Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Evening Conversation -- January 25, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: He is bringing life. What is the answer of these rascal scientists?

Satsvarūpa: No good answer. Bluff.

Prabhupāda: Challenge them like this, that "First of all do it. You are less than the chicken. Why you are claiming so much honor? We treat you, you are fig. You are less important than the chicken. Prove that you have got some power; then claim that you are scientist." Hm? Is that argument all right? What will be the counterargument?

Gurukṛpā: A sane man would accept.

Prabhupāda: They're all rascals. They do not know anything; still, they are claiming very high position.

Gurukṛpā: I heard one scientist on the airplane. There were three scientists sitting behind me, and they were speaking that they hope they are living in the year 2000. One man said, "I become so excited when I think how advanced we will be in the year 2000 that I just hope I do not die before then 'cause I want to see how everything will be then."

Satsvarūpa: By then they think they will be doing this, creating life.

Prabhupāda: That any insane man can say. Any crazy man can say. "Trust no future, however pleasant." "You are rascal. You are believing in the future. You have not show us, because in the past you could not do. There is no history. In the present you cannot do. So how shall I believe that in future you'll do?" So any rascal promises like that, so we take him as a rascal. That's all.

Room Conversation -- February 2, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: And now they're getting two vans for book distribution.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And now Gargamuni is asking to purchase this van and with that money they will purchase Indian van. That will solve the problem. Those who are coming... (break) Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyāsī (BG 6.1). Kṛṣṇa says. Anāśritaḥ, now you are working so hard not for your benefit, personal, and that is sannyāsī. That is sannyāsī. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryam. "Oh it is my duty to serve Kṛṣṇa." And he is sannyāsī. Anyone who has got this consciousness that "It is my duty to serve Kṛṣṇa. I must serve Him with my life and soul and everything," he's a sannyāsī. Not the dress. So you are doing that. Now fix up. Go on doing this. Life is successful. That's all. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyāsī. Find out this verse. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalam. It is so nice to work for Kṛṣṇa without any personal profit. This is Vṛndāvana. The gopīs, they sacrificed everything for Kṛṣṇa, their position, their honor, their prestige. So do like that. I am very glad to see when you work so hard for Kṛṣṇa. That gives me much pleasure.

Room Conversation -- February 3, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Just see Jesus Christ-crucified. What was his fault? He was crucified. Of course, he was not crucified. Nobody can crucify him. But the people are so thankless...

Hari-śauri: That they wanted to do that.

Prabhupāda: Such a great personality, son of God. He wanted to deliver God consciousness. And return, he was crucified. We don't take Jesus Christ very insignificantly. We give him all honor. He's representative of God. He tried to preach according to the time, place, circumstances, country, people. Otherwise he is representative of God.

Hari-śauri: Yeah. He only preached for three years too.

Prabhupāda: He could not preach even but still, in three years what he did is wonderful.

Hari-śauri: Yes, He's world famous for the last two thousand years.

Prabhupāda: Yes, not joke. Unless he's God representative, how he can be so famous? That we know. I told in Melbourne, "What is your idea of Jesus Christ?" And "He's our guru," I told. You remember that?

Hari-śauri: I don't... That was at one of those...

Prabhupāda: The priest meeting.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We have to educate them.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Vidvāṁś cakre sātvata-saṁhitām (SB 1.7.6). Anarthopaśamaṁ sākṣād bhakti-yogam adhokṣaje, lokasya ajānataḥ. The rascal people, they do not know how life is going on, and they are creating anarthas. Therefore vidvān, Vyāsadeva, vidvāṁś cakre sātvata-saṁhitām. So this is the position. Mūrkhāṇām upadeśo hi prakopāya na śāntaye. "If you try to advise rascal, he'll be angry."

upadeśo hi mūrkhāṇāṁ
prakopāya na śāntaye
payaḥ-pānaṁ bhujaṅgānāṁ
kevalaṁ viṣa-vardhanam

So this is the position. Still, we have to do our business. What can be done? Difficult task. Therefore, if you want to please Kṛṣṇa very quickly, you should struggle for preaching.

ya idaṁ paramaṁ guhyaṁ
mad-bhakteṣv abhidhāsyati
na ca tasmān manuṣyeṣu
kaścin me priya-kṛttamaḥ
(Bg 18.68)

So we have got our business, to please Kṛṣṇa. That is our mission. So despite there are so many inconveniences, we have to do this business. Mūḍhaḥ nābhijānāti mām ebhyaḥ paramam avyayam. They are all mūḍhas. So we have been engaged to teach them some lesson. Caitanya Mahāprabhu did also. He sacrificed all personal comforts, home life. He was learned scholar, very honored in Navadvīpa. He had no grievances with family: His wife, Viṣṇupriyā; affectionate mother, Śacīdevī. But still, He gave up everything for the benefit of the whole world.

Room Conversation -- March 26, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Recruit them. And speak in such societies. We have now our prestige and preaching. It will be very nice honor everywhere. So Kṛṣṇa has given you some talent. Utilize it. These rascals are misleading. Although the instruction is there, they are misinterpreting in their own way, misleading themselves and misleading others. They say the name of God. They do not know what is God, although God is explaining Himself. Such a rascal. God is explaining, "Here, I'm God." He is accepted, and they do not... When you ask them what is God: "That we do not know. Our God is (indistinct)." Such things are there. So they have to be convinced that these half-educated leaders cannot make you happy. It is not possible. They do not know the basic principle of life. Take guidance from Kṛṣṇa. That is our movement. You'll be happy. And don't be carried away by the whims. This is an important chance, human life. These motorcars are running, they are running just like the flies come, phut phut phut phut. That is described in the Bhagavad-gītā, Eleventh Chapter. Blind. Expedite death, that's all. There is no solution. The solution is here, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So recruit first of all. Just like these doctor friends. First of all get some friends.

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda (Member of Parliament) -- March 27, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. I can give him... (break)

Girirāja: So I told him I would meet him at the rally. They are hawing a rally at Shivaji Park. And he invited me to sit on the dais, but I don't know if this is a good idea for us.

Prabhupāda: Why not? He is honoring you.

Girirāja: Yes. So he said that he would ask the organizer that he should speak early in the program so that he can be free and come here as early as possible. So he is very serious. I don't think there will be any delay.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What is his name?

Girirāja: Ratan Singh Rajda.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What is his exact position?

Girirāja: He is a member of parliament from Bombay South, which is the most prestigious district, from Kalabha up to (indistinct), something like that.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He formerly helped us?

Girirāja: Yes. When Mattrey was, did that demolition attempt, so he was one of the leaders in the corporation. So he fought for us. In fact today also he asked if there was any trouble, because he still is also maintaining his position in the municipal corporation. So I think when he gets back from Delhi in a week, I might bring up some of our little problems.

Prabhupāda: That plan sentence.(?)

Girirāja: Yeah. And that road, that ten feet.

Prabhupāda: What benefit they will get?

Girirāja: No, only harassment, they have... They have nothing to gain actually. And everyone knows it. But they are just so weak and political minded that they don't want to stand up against Mattrey, the officers. Anyway, I think I should go now then.

Room Conversation with Scientists, Svarupa Damodara, and Dr. Sharma -- March 31, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That should be propagated now. Yasmin vijñāte sarvam idaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavati. If you know simply Kṛṣṇa, then everything. Why I am challenging, from the very beginning, all these rascal scientists? Because I believe in Kṛṣṇa. That's all. Otherwise I am not a scientist. I cannot challenge the scientists. But yes, I can challenge. Because I know my knowledge is perfect.

Dr. Sharma: You sound like... You know when at the time of Yudhiṣṭhira rājasūya-yajña, there was Śiśupāla and the other people who objected. And then Sahadeva, who was to do agra-pūjā of Kṛṣṇa, he said,

keśavaṁ keśī-hantāraṁ
bhajireda purakramam
pūjyamānaṁ mayāyoga
kṛṣṇa na sahata vipra
sarveṣāṁ balinam modye
mayedaṁ niyataṁ padam
keśavaṁ keśī-hantāraṁ
bhajireda purakramam
pūjyamānaṁ mayāyoga
kṛṣṇa na sahata vipra

"You kings who does not tolerate Kṛṣṇa, who is killer of Keśī, and Keśava, if you don't honor, I am putting my foot over your head."

Prabhupāda: That's it. "I kick you on your face with my boot."

Dr. Sharma: So that's what ācārya is saying. "If you don't recognize on the scientists, my foot to you."

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Kick the scientists in the face. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: So this should be stopped. These rascals, these fools, they are passing on as scientists and misleading others. That business should be stopped. Then they cannot answer wherefrom the fish came. What is the answer?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: You ask him to answer.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It also shows that actually she had no value, because one who is actually great doesn't lose his value simply by losing an election.

Prabhupāda: Vidvān sarvatra pūjyate. Vidvatāṁ ca nṛpatyāṁ ca naiva tulyaṁ kadācana.(?) She is not a learned man. She occupied the royal seat. That honor was so long there, the royal seat. And who will be honor her?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Her rule was "Might makes right."

Prabhupāda: And anyone who is vidvān, then that will be honored everywhere.

vidvatāṁ ca nṛpatyāṁ ca
naiva tulyaṁ kadācana
sva-deśe pūjyate rājan
vidvān sarvatra pūjyate

Sarvatra means everywhere, without any condition. Just see how she is suffering now mental agony.

Room Conversation -- April 13, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So "The Honorable S.D. Chawan, Chief Minister of Maharastra. Dear Sri Chawan, kindly accept my greetings and extend the same to your good wife. I am so much obliged to you that you have lauded our activities throughout the world. This Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is based on deep science of the laws of nature. This human life is a boon for the conditioned soul to understand this science. I do not wish to take much of your valuable time, but I would have been very much pleased that persons like you, without any political prejudice, come and take up his movement seriously and benefit the whole human society with this knowledge. At least in India, where this knowledge was generated, there must be some institution to know it perfectly and distribute it throughout the world. That will glorify India's prestige. To broadcast India's glorification is the duty of every Indian without any political differences. I wish that you may take some active part in this movement and thus magnify the prestigious position of India. Thank you very much for your coming here today and speaking so nicely about this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Your ever well-wisher, A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami."

Girirāja: Nice letter.

Prabhupāda: So yes, no, he...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He couldn't say yes, and he couldn't say no.

Prabhupāda: Position is tottering.

Conversation with Yadubara (after seeing film) -- April 17, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Simply barking. So I told it frankly that these are association of barking dogs.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He was a little surprised to hear such a strong statement.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And actually it is a fact. Some dogs barking. "I am bulldog." "I am this dog," "I am that dog." And they waste so much energy, money and time, simply for barking. The result is nothing, no United Nations. Every day a flag is coming. Bambharambhe laghu-kriya.(?) Bharam Prahlāda Mahārāja says, bharam udvahate vimūḍhān. These rascals, they are making simply big, big arrangement. The result is nothing. Bharam udvahate vimūḍhān. And they remain rascal. But attempt is very gorgeous. "Oh, United Nations. Three hundred thousand flags in the..." Just see! Honorable flags. They offer obeisances to the flag, not to God. Kṛṣṇa says, māṁ namaskuru. "No. Flag namaskuru." Just see how rascal they are. What he will gain by offering obeisances to the flag?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Born as a cockroach in that country.

Prabhupāda: And then by flit(?) he will be killed. "No, no, sir, I am your countryman, I am countryman. I belong to the same nation." "Who cares for you, flies, cockroaches? Kill them. American flies, who cares for you?" "I was a staunch nationalist. Now I have become fly. Don't kill me." "Who cares for you?" Will they excuse American flies, American cockroaches? But dehāntara-prāpti. That you cannot avoid. Then where is your nationalism? Nation means one who has taken birth in that land. The cockroach, the flies, the animals, they also born in that land, but who cares for them? Dehāntara-prāpti. So you are great nationalist. But the body is changed. How can you save yourself, not become a cockroach? Because the body is changing. That is in other's hand, Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa (SB 3.31.1). By superior supervision. It is not your choice. Here is dehāntara-prāpti. "Make me president body." "No, no, that is not your choice. You have to accept what I will give you. It will be just by your work, infection of the modes of nature." Daiva-netreṇa. This is a great science.

Talk with Svarupa Damodara -- April 18, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Karttikeya's house?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, today. They came yesterday. He's very learned, and he had a number of degrees.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How many degrees did he have?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: He said he had, honorary, about some fourteen, fifteen Ph.D. degrees.

Prabhupāda: Ph.D. Genuine?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Some are honorary, but he is from Oxford and Cambridge, very renowned scholar.

Mādhava: He's a chemist.

Prabhupāda: He's a chemist.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. So he's very old. He's about seventy-three years old. And he had a genuine desire to be engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So he'll be a devotee. So he invited us to come and speak to him today on... I'm going to speak on science and Kṛṣṇa consciousness today.

Prabhupāda: A good opportunity.

Talk with Svarupa Damodara -- April 18, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is very good qualification, to remain humble and try to do something.

Dr. Sharma: And I've made this statement because knowing the word modesty. I do not know what it is.

Prabhupāda: Tṛṇād api sunīcena... Caitanya Mahāprabhu has given this slogan, tṛṇād api sunīcena taror api sahiṣṇunā, amāninā mānadena. One should not claim honor for himself, but he should give honor to everyone. Amāninā mānadena kīrtanīyaḥ sadā hariḥ (CC Adi 17.31). So that book, small book, Easy Journey to..., is it interesting?

Dr. Sharma: It is interesting. It has been very well received.

Prabhupāda: Ācchā.

Dr. Sharma: It's a very well written book.

Prabhupāda: Then that translation you have to...

Dr. Sharma: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: So encourage him to translate more books. (background conversation with Dr. Sharma) In Russia, if they allow us to speak, then we can convert many. There is no doubt about it. But they have restriction for outsider. Now, here is a scientific man. They'll not hear?

Dr. Sharma: Because this Vaiṣṇava is controversial to them.

Prabhupāda: Controversial for them, not for the scientists.

Conversation: Vairagya, Salaries, and Political Etiquette -- April 28, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Vairāgya... Caitanya Mahāprabhu says clearly that niṣkiñcanasya bhagavad-bhajanonmukhasya. The bhagavad-bhajana, to become devotee of the Lord, means he's disgusted with this material world. For him, bhagavad-bhajana. Just like if I become disgusted with something, I require some change, similarly, bhagavad-bhajana is for him who is absolutely disgusted with this material world. And anyone who has got little interest in material enjoyment, he's not fit for bhagavad-bhajana. He'll have to accept again this material body, either he becomes Brahmā or becomes an ant in the stool, according to his karma. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur deha-upapattaye (SB 3.31.1). He'll have to develop certain type of body according to his desire of enjoyment. This is nature's law. Then where is the question of going back to home, back to Godhead? Why so many varieties of life? There is Brahmā, and there is ant in the stool. So vairāgya-vidyā-nija... Vāsudeve bhagavati bhakti-yogaḥ prayojitaḥ (SB 1.2.7), janayaty āśu vairāgyam. And vairāgyam means jñānam ca. When one is in full knowledge that "To remain in this material world is useless for me"—jñānam—"I am simply wasting my time by repetition of birth and death," then he can have vairāgya. "Stop this!" If this sense is not awakened, there is no bhakti. It is not so easy. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati (BG 18.54). That is vairāgya. So vairāgya-vidyā... Otherwise why big, big persons, they renounced everything? Bharata Mahārāja, young man, the emperor of the whole world, gave up everything. Caitanya Mahāprabhu personally teaches, young man, good, beautiful wife, young wife, so affectionate mother, so much honor in the society, Nimāi Paṇḍita, so beautiful body... Tyaktvā sudustyaja-surepsita-rājya-lakṣmīm (SB 11.5.34). Surepsita. Caitanya Mahāprabhu's position was, even the demigods, they desired such family life. But He still gave up. That is teaching.

Conversation: Vairagya, Salaries, and Political Etiquette -- April 28, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is not respectful.

Girirāja: No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Not at all respectful.

Prabhupāda: Then he does not know how to honor a saintly person. It is useless to meet him. If he has no respect for saintly person, if he thinks greater than saintly person, then he's useless.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Then nothing will come of it, anyway. And if we give this opportunity, that he come in the morning, if he...

Prabhupāda: No, no, apart from that, if he has got that sense, that "I am very big man, so everyone should come here," he's useless. We cannot do anything with him.

Girirāja: That's what I thought.

Prabhupāda: Very beginning is...

Girirāja: On the wrong foot.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, he has to come to see you, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Oh, there's so many examples in the śāstra of great personalities.

Prabhupāda: Even Caitanya Mahāprabhu refused to see, what to speak of going there.

Short Dissertations -- May 24-25, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That is backside. (Hindi conversation)

Guest (3): I don't want to talk with the tape recorder. I come to honor my Swamiji and my elder brother...

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We tape everything Prabhupāda says. Everything he says, we tape, whether you're here or not here.

Guest (3): No, I don't want to talk on the machine.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We're not taping for any other purpose, but our Guru Mahārāja's words are very sacred to us, so we tape all the time, whether you're here or not here.

Prabhupāda: No, he has objection to the tape...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I'm just explaining that it's not any, er,... (break)

Bhavānanda: ...never leave the boundaries of our land and never go down the road to his place, but I...

Prabhupāda: No, they admit. He is Mādhava Mahārāja's man.

Bhavānanda: Fifteen-twenty men maybe, at the most. And when you go by there, it's like ghost town. (Prabhupāda chuckles) Now no action. You don't see anyone. You don't hear any sound. Therefore all the people, they walk right by and come right in our gate, where the taktaki is going, the boys are...

Prabhupāda: Here also, Mādhava Mahārāja temple, nobody goes.

Short Dissertations -- May 24-25, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: They like?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh, yes. They are very hopeful that this is the only thing that we can give to the world. Personally I talked with the man who synthesized this DIN molecule, the DNA part. We were invited to M.I.T. for honors there, and they showed us the whole lab. And the fifth floor, the whole floor, belonged to this professor. So I was taken in all the secret rooms, saw what they are doing, and I was just acting as a scientist, so they told me all the secrets that they were doing. So I was very satisfied that they...

Prabhupāda: They received well.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. Well and... It was actually the Indian who arranged this group, from the Federal Government, United States.

Prabhupāda: You gave him good reception?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, good reception.

Prabhupāda: Hm. So what is your news?

Harikeśa: Everything's going on, Prabhupāda. The Russian book is now a textbook.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Harikeśa: The Russian booklet, Russian Easy Journey, is now being used as a textbook in the Catholic university in Lublin(?) by one professor. They liked the Russian so much and they liked the subject matter so much, they're using it in the school. (Prabhupāda chuckles)

Prabhupāda: And your Kṛṣṇa is... Present now scientifically. They'll not receive?

Srila Prabhupada Vigil -- May 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Bring some fruits.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "I remembered Śrīla Prabhupāda's introduction to the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, and I began to speak further. 'Although mankind has made great material advancement in so many spheres, we can factually say that there is a fault in the social body at large. People are not happy with their day-to-day activities, and there is an increasing disturbance of drug addiction, prostitution, violence and crime. The root of the problem is lack of God consciousness. People are unaware of the actual purpose of life.' The judge, intrigued by this sound philosophy coming from the witness box, relaxed his judicial appearance, sat back, and took a sip of water from his glass. Encouraged, I asked, 'Your honor, with your permission I would like to read a short passage which appeared in the London Observer in October, 1972. It is an excerpt from an article written by the eminent English historian Sir Arnold Toynbee. "The cause of it, the world's malady, is spiritual. We are suffering from having sold our souls to the pursuit of an objective which is both spiritually wrong and practically unattainable. We have to reconsider our objective and change it, and until we do this, we shall not have peace either amongst ourselves or within each of us." ' Then the devotee continued. " 'As devotees of the Lord, we strictly follow four principles, cultivating the qualities of human life: mercifulness, truthfulness, cleanliness and austerity. The absence of these qualities means the degradation of society. So the spreading of spiritual understanding amongst humanity at large is the highest welfare work, and an essential part of this program is the distribution and the congregational chanting in the street of the holy names of God.' 'Is that all?' inquired the judge. 'Yes, sir,' was the reply. 'Then you may step down,' he instructed. Adjusting his spectacles and regarding the devotees, who were once more assembled in the dock, he said in a very firm yet amicable manner, 'In legal terms you are guilty of obstruction, although it is of a very minor degree. Taking this into consideration and because of your obvious sincerity, I have decided to dismiss the case.' We smiled jubilantly and, thanking the magistrate, were about to step down when Kṛṣṇa prompted me to say, 'Sir, we were wondering if you had a court library here, in which case we would like to present a book for addition to the collection.' 'Thank you,' replied the judge. 'I am quite sure we can accommodate it.' Giving a copy of Śrīla Prabhupāda's Śrī Īśopaniṣad to one of the clerks, who promised to pass it on to the judge, we left the courtroom, thanking Lord Nityānanda for His mercy." Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda

Guest (1): (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: And that judgment is still wrong.

Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- June 21, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: "Here is the book."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Still, he's very brave.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This boy is very nice. He graduated top honors from Princeton, president of his class.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He was the president of his class at Princeton University. When he graduated, he was top man in the school. In the Ivy League that school is as good as Harvard. He's an extraordinarily intelligent... I stayed with him for some time. He sleeps three or four hours, maximum, a day. He eats practically nothing. Very austere. Very, very austere. And humble, very humble. Very saintly person. But when he sells your books, he becomes completely different then. It's like Tripurāri. When Tripurāri is... Normally in the temple he's very humble, quiet. But when he's out there selling... He has a new system now. When he was here he told me. He goes to these spiritual fairs, where there's many thousands of people come to learn about spiritual subjects. So he stands there, and he... In the normal fairs in the United States, they have a man, they're called carnies. What they do, they stand around—this is the normal-type person—and they gather a big crowd by talking very quickly, and they throw everyone some object for free-say a, some cheap thing, whatever it may be..., a pen, a fountain pen... They'll pass out twenty of them for free. So that... Hundreds of people gather around, 'cause they all want to get a free thing. So then after that, he says, "Now everybody who got a pen give me $2 and I'm going to give you something better." So they all put $2 down. Then he says "Now anyone who wants to get that thing that's better, but you didn't get a pen, you put down $5," and many people put down money. And like this he takes them along, giving a little bit and taking so much money, until eventually people are putting down $50 at a time. I saw this when I was travelling with our buses. We would go to these fairs. Tripurāri, he studied this, and now he's doing it also, but with your books. See, he sells sometimes fifty and sixty books at a time, big books. He knows how... He gets people to put down money, telling them that he'll give them something. First he gives out some small thing, then they all put down finally $5, and then he gives everyone a Bhagavad-gītā. (laughing) So he's learned how to do this, but he's..., sometimes he's selling two and three hundred books in a day, huge quantities of books. He's figured out a new system. So these men, they become very much empowered by you, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Conversation: 'How to Secure Brahmacaris' -- June 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That is required. But it will be a failure unless they are taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That... Gandhi's failure was there. He did not take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Because the material civilization means pravṛtti-mārga, and spiritual civilization nivṛtti-mārga. Pravṛttir eṣā bhūtānāṁ nivṛttis tu mahā-phalām. So pravṛtti... Suppose he is in the village. He has to work with plow. And in the city, Goodyear Tire Company offering him twenty rupees per day. So he'll see that "What is the use of working with this plow? Let me go to Goodyear Tire." Then here the business will be finished. That is the position of India. So much land is lying vacant because there is no worker, and all the rascals have gone to New Delhi or big cities. And overpopulation? "Give them sterilization." Here there is no men to work and they're sterilization... How the leaders... And who is leader? Another debauch number one, Gandhi, Mrs.... And she has produced a Sanjay Gandhi. Very precarious si... So there will be no scarcity of simple living and eating. We shall give nice food, milk, and place. So bring student and teach them. Then gradually increase. They will preach throughout the whole world. The defect of the society, modern—the rascals are worshiped. Cāṇakya Paṇḍita has given all in his moral instructions. He said, mūrkhā yatra na pūjyante: "Where rascals are not worshiped..." But at the present moment rascals are worshiped. And he says. He was experienced politician. He said, mūrkhā yatra na pūjyante dhānyaṁ yatra susañcitam. "In the society where rascals are not worshiped and food grains are properly stocked..." Mūrkhā yatra na pūjyante dhānyaṁ yatra susañcitam... Another... Dampatyo kalaho nāsti: "And where there is no quarrel between husband and wife," tatra śrīḥ svayam āgatāḥ, "all fortune will come there automatically." Svayam āgatāḥ. You haven't got to pray, "Mother Lakṣmī, please come to my house." She'll come. Three things wanted. You should not give unnecessarily honor to rascals, and you should keep your food grains very nicely, and don't quarrel, husband and wife. Then you become fortunate. Just see. Check how these instructions are there.

Room Conversation-Recent Mail -- July 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: I shall remain your personal guidance, physically present or not physically, as I am getting personal guidance from my Guru Mahārāja.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says, "Arjuna was a great, powerful devotee, and he could overcome the shock. But we are most fallen and cannot endure such a shock of having you leave us. We are already mortified by such a thought. Your movement is just now being accepted, and we want you to remain to lead all your devotees towards successful spiritual life. Despite our offenses, all of us deeply have great love for Your Divine Grace, and our world will become dark without your presence. Materially you have provided all of your devotees with everything: big temples, money, prestige, and honor, nice prasādam." (chuckles) That's not material. "But I would relish more being with you without all of these things..." He says, "But personally I would relish more being with you without all of these things, as we began at 26 Second Avenue. Simply hearing you chant and talk for hours is my only solace. I don't want anything else. We left all these material things to be with you only, so please have mercy with your devotees by allowing us to have your personal appearance as long as..."

Prabhupāda: He was from very beginning. Brahmānanda. He has worked very hard from the beginning.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says "I may also come to cook and clean for you."

Prabhupāda: Yes, you are welcome.

Room Conversation Gaurasundara, Dr. Kapoor -- July 26, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: High place. There is no need of big see.(?) Deity is small Kṛṣṇa or big Kṛṣṇa, the same thing. When Kṛṣṇa was child on the lap of His mother, the same Kṛṣṇa killed Pūtanā. And when He was killing other demons in His young age, the same. Avyaya. He does not change. Acyuta. These are the names of Kṛṣṇa, you'll... So it does not make any difference. So you have got small Deity. Very nicely... So you can bathe them nicely, decorate them nicely, give Them... And big Deity will be difficult to handle. Better keep this Deity and increase the devotional. That will be... More time devoted for taking class, for cleansing the... About Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam consider. That is main business.

arcāyām eva haraye
pūjāṁ yaḥ śraddhayehate
na tad-bhakteṣu cānyeṣu
sa bhaktaḥ prākṛtaḥ smṛtaḥ

If you simply worship the Deity in gorgeous way and do not preach, see to the interest of devotees and other common men, then you'll remain in the prākṛta state, material stage. You should go further, see the interest of ordinary people, how they are understanding Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Tad-bhakteṣu. To give worship to the guru and honor them. Simply to worship Deity is material platform. Gṛhasthas, we want, this preaching. And not like ordinary. Big Deity worship... (indistinct-too much background noise) Govinda dāsī is not willing to live with you?

Gaurasundara: No. I think she's... I have heard that she's married again. But anyway, she has not been in touch with me.

Prabhupāda: Oh. Never mind. These are all material things. It should be more than that. Kṛṣṇa consciousness means forgetting material things, coming to Kṛṣṇa. Now forget your past misdeed and take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness gradually. Deity worship is the first work, step. How many dresses you have prepared for the Deity? What is the name of?

Room Conversations Bangladesh Preaching/Prabhavisnu Articles by Hamsaduta -- August 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: He's giving very strong argument.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says, "The Oxford Dictionary defines empirical as 'based on observation and experiment.' Observation and experiment is conducted with limited senses. Therefore the conclusions are naturally limited and imperfect. So in fact, the soul and the existence of God is quite beyond the power of Kovoor's observation. Why be so obstinate? This is common sense, a point anyone can understand. He says, 'It is the unique ability of man to engage in creative thinking that has made him succeed in his fight against the laws of nature.' This is a preposterous claim only a fool would make. Nature forces everyone to become old, diseased, and, lastly, die. Even the most powerful conquerors of the world are helplessly dragged off the stage of life by nature in the shape of all-devouring death. But perhaps Dr. Kovoor will be the first living being in the history of the world that will conquer over death. That remains to be seen. And lastly he says, 'Some of the marvelous achievements of mankind in recent years are the liberation of atomic energy, radio telescopy to reach millions of light years in space, landing on the moon, etc.' Everyone knows that the first thing scientists did when discovering atomic energy was to manufacture the atom bomb and promptly drop two of them on Japan, Hiroshima and Nagasaki, thus annihilating millions of innocent victims in a flash. It is certainly marvelous. (Prabhupāda and Tamāla chuckling) At the expense of untold billions of dollars and years of research and hard labor, scientists have gone to the moon, snapped a few blurry photos, and brought back a handful of rocks, declared to the world that 'There was nothing there, so now we will try to go to Mars.' What is so marvelous about this? It is completely lunacy, if anything. On our earthly planet, millions of people are without food, shelter, and simple education. Instead of spending billions of dollars to bring rocks from the moon, science would be more credible if they would rather spend the hard-earned taxpayer's money for improving his own lot on earth. Rocks are rocks, whether from the Moon, from Mars or from China. Or is it that science can turn the rocks into bread and cheese by applying some chemicals? Now, to get to the main article, in answer to Kovoor's question of what objective evidence I have made the fantastic statement that life comes from life and matter also comes from life, and that there is soul, rebirth of the soul, and Supreme Soul, God, they say fight fire with fire, and so I have taken advantage of three scientists who happen to be members of the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement and, I dare say, more qualified than the so-called Dr. Kovoor, who is only an honorary doctor..."

Prabhupāda: Ah!

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Ah. He's exposed now. "...whereas these men have actually qualified themselves in bona fide institutions of learning by submitting their theses for Ph.D. degrees. Dr. Kovoor boasts that for over twenty years he has challenged holy men to show him God or the soul, and no one has ever dared to take up his challenge. But now someone has come forward to challenge him. I have rented the Ramakrishna Mission Hall on the 20th of August, Saturday, 6:30 PM, and invite him to accept my challenge on the stage before the public to produce life from chance biochemical combination. All are invited to attend. Admission free. Bring some chemicals if possible." He rented a hall. He's put out a challenge in the newspaper. Now we'll hear what the public is saying. I think he gave a good reply.

Prabhupāda: Very good. This is preaching.

Room Conversation -- October 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Akṣayānanda: Yes. It's all right.

Prabhupāda: Go on. (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...no greater honor than to be called your son, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Where is that Dr. Sharma?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dr. Sharma. Oh, yes. Where is he? He's here. Did that milk give you any mucus, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's good.

Prabhupāda: It is very, very good.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Really fresh.

Prabhupāda: If I drink this milk twice, morning and evening, I think I can avoid any food.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You can what?

Prabhupāda: Avoid any food.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You don't like fruit juice?

Prabhupāda: I mean to say, I can drink in the meantime, but by simply drinking this milk, I can live healthy. I think so.

Room Conversation -- October 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. (kīrtana begins) (Bengali conversation) Who is here?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Tamāla Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Have kīrtana. (pause) So after my passing away, these, all the temples, they should receive some money for holding utsava.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In your honor.

Prabhupāda: Yes, in the temple.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, Prabhupāda.

Gurukṛpā: Jaya Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Who is he?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Gurukṛpā Swami.

Prabhupāda: Go on kīrtana. (kīrtana begins)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Closed? Open? (break)

Prabhupāda: (Bengali)

Bhakti-caru: (Bengali) (break)

Hari-śauri: Bhavānanda? Prabhupāda said that somebody was saying that Bhavānanda was coming.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Bhakti-caru telegrammed to Bhavānanda and Jayapatākā and Śatadhanya Swami to come immediately. That all right? (break)

Bhakti-caru: (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: (Bengali conversation)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He wants to see a paṇḍitajī from there. So can you get that paṇḍitajī? You want to see him tonight, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) And Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja, he'll come tomorrow?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He'll come when we... Tonight could he come? You think that's too late?

Bhakti-caru: I think he'll come, if we go and pick him up.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If we pick him up, he might come tonight.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Vrindavan De: If it works, then we have no...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It must work, because they have to honor the power of attorney. I'll give you the copy of the power of attorney. It's completely bona fide.

Vrindavan De: You arrange everything, write down all these and signing, put your signature on the letters?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, I'll do that.

Vrindavan De: But I may not come back in a very short time, if I have to come within a month. For this work I may not find out any time to come over here.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, you won't have to come back for this business. This business will be done properly.

Vrindavan De: But I must see my father, after all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That you may come every day. But from this business, this will work. We'll give a letter to the bank...

Vrindavan De: For the little later the work should not be hampered. I want that.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, it won't be hampered.

Prabhupāda: You give me. He'll go.(?)

Vrindavan De: Because I came, spending so many money...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, it won't be hampered. I promise.

Page Title:Honor (Conversations)
Compiler:Visnu Murti, Mayapur
Created:26 of Mar, 2012
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=128, Let=0
No. of Quotes:128