Prabhupāda: There are descriptions. There are descriptions of these things. There is description of another nature which is called spiritual nature. This is material nature. The sky, as far as you can see, this is one universe. Similarly, there are millions of universes. And all these together, that is material sky. And beyond that, there is spiritual sky, which is far, far greater than this. And there are spiritual planets. So this information we have got from Bhagavad-gītā, what to speak of other Vedic literatures. Bhagavad-gītā, it is daily read by practically all over the world, but they do not understand it. Simply they become student of Bhagavad-gītā, or simply just to think falsely that "I am God." That's all. But they don't take any particular information. There is a verse in the Eighth Chapter, paras tasmāt tu bhāvo 'nyo 'vyakto 'vyaktāt sanātanaḥ (BG 8.20). There is another nature beyond this material nature which is eternal. This nature is coming into existence, again dissolution.
Greater than... (Conversations)
Conversations and Morning Walks
1968 Conversations and Morning Walks
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate na tasya samādhikaś ca dṛśyate. This is from Upaniṣad. Parasya saktir vividhaiva sruyate svabhaviki-jnana-bala-kriya ca (Cc. Madhya 13.65, purport). It is said that nobody is seeing... This is called research. You are accepting any nonsense as God, and they do not have any information from the..., that God means na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate na tasya samādhikaś ca dṛśyate: "God has nothing to do, no responsibility. Nobody is found greater than Him." So if this Vedic injunction is followed, if somebody is claiming, "I am God," we have to see whether he has nothing to do and whether nobody is greater than him. And these two tests will make him false immediately. He has to prove that nobody is greater than... Even contemporary... Suppose I am claiming I am God. So I have to show that at the present moment, throughout the whole world, apart from universe, nobody is greater than me. Then I am... Will these pretenders be able to show that nobody is greater than him?
Prabhupāda: That's all right. He is American. He is human being. In so many qualities you are one. But you cannot claim for that, you are President Nixon. You should understand in that way. In so many respect, qualities, you are one with God, but that does not mean you are God. God is one. That means you have no complete understanding. Just like in spite of your becoming American or human being, you deny to identify yourself with President Nixon because you have full knowledge of President Nixon and yourself. And as soon as you say, "I am God," that means you have no full knowledge of God. You are insane. You do not know what is God. That very thing immediately asserts that you are unknown factor about God. God is said, "Great," but you are claiming that greatness. That means you do not know how great He is. A tiny factor, you are claiming that "I am God," without having that greatness. That means insane, insanity. The same way: if you claim that "I am President Nixon," that is insanity. Similarly, God is, how great He is, how much greater than President Nixon. You deny to become one with President Nixon, and you accept to be one with God? How much insane you are. Just try to understand. Yes?
Prabhupāda: "The whole material existence is simply a partial manifestation of My energy." Ekāṁśena. Viṣṭabhyāham. Aham. "I have entered into this whole material creation and that is My partial manifestation of energy." Just like what is your, this body? The body is the, a manifestation of your energy. The seed, living entity, is put into the mother's womb and he expands. This body is expanding. But because you are limited, so much. That's all. Three feet or six feet. That's all. No more. You cannot expand more than that. This is crude example. But He's unlimited. He's expanding. Bṛhatvad bṛṁhaṇatvad iti brahma. Brahman means nothing is greater than Him and nothing can expand like Him. Bṛhatvad bṛṁhaṇatvad iti brahma. So everything is there scientific. Simply we have to administer. We have got authoritative scripture, description, answers, everything is there. It is not blind following. It is not religious fanaticism. It is actually solid ground. Simply one has to understand nicely. That's all. And there is no difficulty. So simple.
Prabhupāda: There is a version by Rāmānujācārya. Rāmānujācārya, he was a great ācārya of this Vaiṣṇava sampradāya. His spiritual master gave him mantra: "My dear boy, you chant this mantra silently. Nobody can hear. It is very..." So then he asked, "What is the effect of this mantra?" He said, "By chanting this mantra, by meditation, you'll get liberation." So he immediately went out and in a public, big meeting he said that "You chant this mantra. You'll be all liberated." (laughter) So he came back to his spiritual master, and his spiritual master was very angry that "I told you that you should chant silently." He said, "Yes, I have committed offense. So whatever punishment you like, you can give me. But because you told me that this mantra will liberate, I have given it publicly. Let everyone hear and be liberated. Let me go to hell. I don't mind. I have disobeyed your order. Let me go to hell. I am prepared. But by this chanting mantra, if anyone is liberated, let it be publicly distributed." His spiritual master embraced him: "You are greater than me." You see? So if a mantra has so power, why it should be secret? It should be distributed. People are suffering. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, "Chant this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra. Anyone who will hear... Even the birds and beasts will hear and they will be liberated." That's all.
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. Soul is changing body. Why you are talking of merging? You are changing body, you are individual. I am changing body. I may change to a dog's body, you may change to a demigod's body. That is going on. According to one's karma, he is changing body. Now, when you are Kṛṣṇa conscious fully, this change of body will take place also, but that body will be spiritual. So long you get material body, you have to change, one after another, one after another, one after another. Just like if you have a cheap thing, it goes wrong, you have to purchase another new thing. But if you purchase a real, nice thing it will go, continue for good. Similarly, so long you are getting this cheap body, material body, you have to change. And as soon as you get the most valuable body, spiritual body, there will be no more change. Why don't you understand like that? So that you have to get. That is very simple. Kṛṣṇa says, janma karma me divyam yo jānāti tattvataḥ. One who does not know what is Kṛṣṇa, he thinks that somebody is greater than Kṛṣṇa. But anyone who knows Kṛṣṇa as he is, immediately he gets that permanent body. Simply by knowing Kṛṣṇa. Janma karma me divyam yo jānāti tattvataḥ, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mam eti (BG 4.9). Is it clear? Yes. So you have to do that. You have simply to understand Kṛṣṇa. The whole problem is solved. (Prabhupāda is pounding on the table, stressing points.)
Prabhupāda: So mind, mind, activities of mind, activities of intelligence and activities of spirit, the spiritual activities more greater than the mind's mental activities.
Śyāmasundara: The other day we were discussing Socrates. And Socrates' method was to bring the self under control by inspecting oneself, "Know thyself," and thereby be able, lead a moral life with self-respect and self-control. But Prabhupāda was saying that this is not an ordinary thing. Not many men can achieve this rational control. So by simply cultivating spirit, nourishing spiritual life, any man can control his senses.
Śyāmasundara: ...I am the smallest of the small.
Prabhupāda: That is stated in the Veda. (Sanskrit verse) God is greater than the greatest and smaller than the smallest.
Dr. Weir: You're using materialist words, Swami. You're using materialist words, greater and smaller.
Prabhupāda: What you meant spiritual?
Dr. Weir: No, but I say you are using materialist words to describe them.
Prabhupāda: What do you mean by spiritual? No speaking?
Dr. Weir: What I say is... (laughter)
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Guest: Money god is greater than Brahma and Śiva and Viṣṇu, just about, unfortunately. The people have made an idol of gold and silver and letter of paper, paper making the promises of government...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Guest: ...which are never kept. (laughter)
Prabhupāda: I was going to say, it is a fraud.
Guest: Fraud.
Prabhupāda: Māyā.
Prabhupāda: Who has created the brain of Professor Einstein? You have not created. You are trying to make a xerox copy, that's all. But the original is already there. Now who has created the original brain? Then you have to go to God. But you have not created. It is not my men(?). If man could create such brain, then, "Ah, never mind, the professor has died. We create another person like." That you cannot. So even if you are able to imitate, you are not the supreme scientist. First of all it is doubtful. So accepting that you will be able to copy or xerox copy of Einstein's brain, that does not give you the credit. The credit is already there, God's credit. At least we shall not give you any credit. We shall speak that the original brain is created by God. You cannot create. If you had the power to create, then there was no necessity of copying. You could create better brain. That you haven't got. You are trying to take xerox copy from that brain. Just like big, big aeroplanes are flying, but their, the shape is made after the bird. The original shape bird is created by God. He has got the same type of machine even within an insect, small insect flying. You can create a small aeroplane like that. That is not possible. Then what is your credit? Here is God's credit, a small fly, near water. You create it. You see? You can create a big, but you cannot a small. Therefore you are incapable. But God can create the biggest and the smallest. Aṇor aṇīyān mahato mahīyān. He can create the greater than the greatest and the smaller than the smallest.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Devotee: "The conditioned souls in the clutches of the illusory energy are all anxious to attain peace in the material world. They do not know the formula for peace which is explained in this part of the Bhagavad-gītā. The greatest peace formula is simply this. Lord Kṛṣṇa is the beneficiary in all human activities. Men should offer everything to the transcendental service of the Lord because He is the proprietor of all planets and the demigods thereon. No one is greater than He. He is greater than the greatest of the demigods, Lord Śiva and Lord Brahmā. In the Vedas the Supreme Lord is described as param īśvarānāṁ paramaṁ maheśvaram. Under the spell of illusion, living entities are trying to be lords of all they survey. But actually they are dominated by the material energy of the Lord. The Lord is the master of material nature and the conditioned souls are under the stringent rules of material nature."
Prabhupāda: That is the defect. Lord is the master of material nature, and we are conditioned by the material nature and still we are claiming, "I am God." Then?
Prabhupāda: Because always women population is greater than the man. So those who are kings, they could maintain more than one wife. So not only one wife, another three dozen maid-servants. They are freely mixing with king. They got also children. But they were not, I mean to say, eligible for throne. Only the married wife's son. This is, this was the system. Just like Vidura. Vidura happened to be a son of such maid-servant. So she had, he had no claim on the throne. Dāsī-putra. They were called dāsī-putras. They were maintained. Just like in royal family, but they have no claim on the throne. (pause)
Svarūpa Dāmodara: There are two scientists working on how to make...
Popworth: I wonder if I could put the point which Dr. Schumacher has made somewhat more forcefully if possible. I am surprised that in the exchange the point he made was not taken and answered. What is at issue is that in your beliefs you are saying it is wrong to kill an animal. It is possible, I don't say this to justify the killing of animals. But it is possible for an animal to be killed by a man in a way that involves far less suffering to the animal than it would die in its natural state. But what seems to be such an infinitely greater evil, an infinitely greater crime against the natural order is, for example, to take one chicken and put it in a cage the size of a shoe box, and then add more two more chickens to it, and then keep them there for the whole of their short natural life, unnatural life. But it seems to me, and, I think, to Dr. Schumacher, that this is an abomination of the spirit far greater than the mere killing of animals. But if it... It seems to be an insult against creation to treat the animal life in this manner. And yet, you do not appear to be shocked by it as you are shocked by the mere fact of killing.
Prabhupāda: It is more shocking than killing?
Prabhupāda: That is another trick, it may be. Or he did not like. It may be. Because he was so great, what is the presidency? Presidency elected post for five years. But he was recognized all over the world as a great leader. That is greater than any president's post or prime minister's post. So that is not much. But the thing is that if he was actually aware of the importance of Rāma, that he did not. He took it, "Rāma" as some means for his political purpose. But still it effected. At the time of death he said, "Rāma." So...
Guest (1): So you think he has gone to heaven or some, what is his position?
Prabhupāda: No... But because he did not understand Rāma, therefore he cannot go to the kingdom of God. But he'll get very high position.
Dr. Hauser: But the interest... The religious interest in Russia is, is greater than in any other country in Europe. But not the, the leaders are not...
Prabhupāda: I say the leaders. Not only in Russia. Everywhere. The leaders, the rascal leaders spoiling the whole world situation. In India also. In India, by nature, they are aloof from these four principles of sinful life. Eighty percent of the population, by nature. But government, at the present moment, the leaders, they're inducing them to eat meat, to drink. And gambling also. Introducing. Gambling. Government is issuing that gambling cards. Because government means some rascal just like Nixon has gone to the power. Now he's proved he's a rascal. So everywhere the government leaders means all rascals.
Prabhupāda: No, the greater power is Kṛṣṇa. If you take shelter of Kṛṣṇa, they cannot do anything. Just like Prahlāda Mahārāja, he was a five years old boy. He took shelter of Kṛṣṇa and his father was a great demon, very powerful. He wanted to chastise his boy. He could not. This is the proof. So you take shelter. Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pape... (BG 18.66). "I give you protection." So people have no faith although He's God. He thinks God is less powerful than Hitler. That is his nonsense. If he takes actually shelter of Kṛṣṇa, what this rascal, Hitler, can do? But he has no faith in God. He thinks Prabhu Hitler is greater than Lord. Prabhu Hitler. That is the difference between the crows and the swans. The crows think that we have got food in the garbage. And the swans think that we have got food in nice garden, in the clear water. And that is difference even in the birds kingdom. That is explained in the previous verse. Na yad vacaś citra-padaṁ harer yaśo, jagat-pavitraṁ pragṛṇīta karhicit, tad vāyasaṁ tīrtham (SB 1.5.10). Read that, previous to this verse.
Prabhupāda: How can be all Gods then? That is practical. If everyone is God, then what is the meaning of God? If... Do you think everyone is president, everyone is Indira Gandhi? Indira Gandhi is one. The Prime Minister cannot be many. It is a common sense. How everyone can be God? This is nonsense. Anyone thinks that there are many gods, he does not know what is God. Aiye. God is one. Ekaṁ brahma dvitīyaṁ nāsti. Therefore there is no education what is God. Kṛṣṇa says in the Bhagava... Mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat: (BG 7.7) "Nobody else superior than Me." That is God. Asama-ūrdhva. God is described in the Bhagavad-gītā as asama-ūrdhva. You can come this side? Let them come forward. You sit down... (break) ...equal to God. And nobody can be greater than God. That is "God is great." If somebody becomes equal to you, how you can be great? Or if somebody is higher than you, then how you can be great? So there is no equal to God, nor greater than Him. That is God. And that is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā: mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). (break) "...anyone greater than Me." That is God. There are so many Gods, false gods, nowadays. Can anyone say that "Nobody is greater than me"?
Prabhupāda: All these rascal Gods, can he say? Can anyone say? Immediately... He feels some sickness. Immediately he has to call greater God, physician. And he's claiming, "I am God." We don't want such kind of God, manufactured God. We want real God. When we see nobody is greater than Him, that is God. (break) ...We accept so many pseudo, pretender as God. But we do not know how to test him, whether he is greater than everyone? Whether nobody is greater than him? Then he's God. Can you find out any, so many gods, who has no greater than him, or equal to him? You are claiming You are God, I am also claiming, God. Then we are equal. Then how you can be God or how I can be God? We are equals. As soon as you find there are equals, or as soon as find there is greater, then you are not God. God—the great. He must be greater than everyone. Therefore śāstra has concluded, īśvara, God; parama, the Supreme; Kṛṣṇa. Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1). And why? Sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ (Bs. 5.1).
Prabhupāda: "Those who are devotees, to show them special favor, I remove the ignorance." So Māyāvādīs, māyayāpahṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.15). They are Māyāvādīs. Māyā does not allow them to see the cause of all causes, Kṛṣṇa. But if Kṛṣṇa reveals Himself, who can check it? Otherwise He is not Brahman. Brahman means the greatest. Brahman means the greatest, and He is Para-brahman. There are greatest demigods like Lord Brahmā, Lord Śiva, but He's greater than them. He says, aham ādir hi devānām (Bg 10.2). Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavaḥ (BG 10.8). Brahmā and Śiva, they have come out from Kṛṣṇa, Viṣṇu. So Brahmā, Śiva may not know, but that does not mean Kṛṣṇa does not know. So we are receiving knowledge from Kṛṣṇa. We are not receiving. Or we are receiving knowledge from Kṛṣṇa's representative, who knows Kṛṣṇa. So that is our position. We are not as good as Kṛṣṇa, just the Māyāvādī rascals say. No. We are nothing. We have no value. But we accept what Kṛṣṇa says. That is our qualification. A child is ignorant, but if he speaks what he has learned from his father, that speaking is perfect. Similarly, we admit we are in illusion. But what we are speaking, because that is spoken by Kṛṣṇa, that is not illusion. That is not illusion. That is perfect. (pause) (break)
Prabhupāda: No, I can't say? Why I cannot say? I am saying, that this man is richer than this man. This man is richer than this man. You go on, go on, go on, studying. But if you cannot study, you cannot approach, that is your inefficiency. But there is existing actually. This man is greater than this man, this man is greater than... That's all. But who is that highest educated... That you do not see. That does not mean He is not existing. There must be, because the step is going on. How can you deny this?
Bali Mardana: We cannot see, but someone else can see.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Satsvarūpa: Kṛṣṇa says He's not manifest to the foolish.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He is... You may not have seen something, but I have seen.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, he also said, Prabhupāda, that "God, the heavenly father, who is greater than me, He has sent me here."
Prabhupāda: Yes, there is Bible. Yes. Here is. Practically nowadays there is no Christian. All heathens. Yes. Because they are... Therefore we are purchasing so many churches. And there are so many for sale. Nobody is going to. In London I have seen. Hundreds of churches are... some neighbor. Nobody goes. Only the churchtaker and the so-called one or two neighboring old women, that's all. So it is gone. Christian religion is now gone.
Yaśomatīnandana: Also, Prabhupāda, Christ never said himself that he's dying for their sins. But this is the later disciples of Christ, they claim that Christ has died for their sins.
Prabhupāda: Ācchā? This is the fact?
Prabhupāda: Yes. So what is the conception of "Supreme"? That you have to define. What is the conception of Supreme? How do we accept here in this world, a person supreme? What is the conception of supreme? No...
Prajāpati: No one equal to or greater than.
Prabhupāda: No, that you cannot find here in this material world. Anyone has relative position. Everyone will find somebody is greater than him, somebody is lower than him. He's not absolute, nobody. A rough estimate of supremacy: if one man has got, is very rich, he's considered great. If he has got influence, if he has got bodily strength, bodily beauty, wisdom, or renunciation... These are the six items for calculating a man's greatness. Therefore when you speak, "God, the Supreme," He must possess all these things. That is the definition given by Parāśara Muni. The other day we were discussing. Somebody said, "This is all imagination." Why imagination? Who was telling?
Prabhupāda: She must go to the same destination as Yaśodā Mā." Just see. That is His enmity. And that is absolute. In our relative world, we can see so many differences in the dealings of God, but He is absolute, one. That is conception of God. Advaita. Advaita. Advaita means absolute. And... Brahmeti paramātmeti bhagavān iti śabdyate. Vadanti tat tattva-vidas tattvaṁ yaj jñānam advayam (SB 1.2.11). Again advayam. You may conceive God as impersonal or localized Paramātmā or Bhagavān—the same thing. But due to our, I mean to say, meager knowledge, we are thinking, somebody's thinking that His personality is greater than impersonality and somebody's thinking impersonality's greater than personality. This is our conception. He's the same. Vadanti tat tattva-vidas tattvaṁ yaj jñānam advayam (SB 1.2.11). Not different. Not different. But one who has reached to the conception of personality, he has got all the others. That is the difference. So you write. You are theologician. You write about God so that people may understand how our students are enlightened.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.
Candanācārya: Guru is greater than śaktyāveśa-avatāra.
Prabhupāda: No, guru is considered as Kṛṣṇa Himself. Guru-rūpa kṛṣṇa hana avatāra. Just to teach the conditioned soul, guru comes himself, er, Kṛṣṇa comes Himself in the form of guru. Therefore we sing in the Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura's prayer, sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstraiḥ: "In every śāstra, guru is accepted as directly Kṛṣṇa." Sākṣāt. Sākṣāt means directly. Sākṣād-dharitvena: As Kṛṣṇa, is accepted in every śāstra, sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktaḥ **, it is said, uktas tathā bhāvyata eva sadbhiḥ **, and this statement is accepted by advanced devotees. It is not only statement, but it is accepted. But the next question is: "Does it mean that guru is Kṛṣṇa? Therefore no more Kṛṣṇa wanted?" No. Kintu prabhor yaḥ priya eva tasya: "Guru is exalted because he is very confidential servant of Kṛṣṇa." Here it is clear. Not that he is respected as Kṛṣṇa, therefore he has become Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: No, no, no. He may say nonsense. The fact is this. That if he is sama-darśinaḥ, equal, then why he is particularly aiming to the lower class? That means he is not sama-darśinaḥ. He has not come to the stage. He is simply talking nonsense. Sama-darśinaḥ means he is equal to everyone. That is sama-darśinaḥ. Sama-darśinaḥ does not mean to get a cheap adoration, popularity, I go to the poor. That is their Ramakrishna Mission. They also are doing that same thing. Daridra-nārāyaṇa-sevā, like that. Why daridra? Why not real Nārāyaṇa? Just like this morning we read nārāyaṇa-pade. Never said daridra-nārāyaṇa-pade. To the great. Surrender does not mean to the lower. Does it mean surrender? Surrender, this relationship means that to whom I surrender, he is greater than me. And to the lower, mercy. These two words. One who is lower than me, I may show my mercy, but one who is greater than me, there is the question of surr... (break) (end)
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: If he has read Bhagavad-gītā, that he cannot say, because Kṛṣṇa says brahmaṇo ahaṁ pratiṣṭhā, I am the resort of Brahman. So He is greater than Brahman. Mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate, even Brahman emanates from Me, and actually it is so. Just like the sunshine (indistinct) sun globe. Although the sunshine is universe(?), but still dependent on the sun globe.
Guest (1): Of course that's true. There's nothing beyond Kṛṣṇa, of course.
Prabhupāda: That's good(?).
Devotee: Very nice (indistinct).
Guest (1): (indistinct)
Prabhupāda: No, I am speaking on the principle of śāstra. śānta-bhakta, dāsya-bhakta, sākhya-bhakta, vātsalya-bhakta, mādhurya-bhakta.
Dr. Patel: You see, I can...
Prabhupāda: It is not that mādhurya-bhakta is greater than the dāsya-bhakta. The example has been given: just like sound. Sound is generated from the ether, sky. You are scientific man. You will understand.
Dr. Patel: Yes, yes.
Prabhupāda: But that sound is existing in all other five elements, four elements.
Dr. Patel: Right.
Prabhupāda: That is avatāra. So nobody can compare. In the Vedic literature it is said, na tasya kāryaṁ kāraṇaṁ ca vidyate na tat-samaś cābhyadhikaś ca dṛśyate. Nobody can be equal to Him. Sama, sama means equal. Na tat-samaś cābhyadhikaś ca dṛśyate: "Nobody is greater than Him, nobody is equal to Him." That is Kṛṣṇa. So as soon as one claims that "I am also Kṛṣṇa," he is a bogus immediately.
Dr. Patel: Shall I go further?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Prabhupāda: "That's all right, we have got our society. But we are also preaching, and we have got many countries, we have got devotees, Christians. Number of Christian is greater than your number of Vaiṣṇava devotees."
Akṣayānanda: So we are only requesting you to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: That is a process only. You are requesting chant Hare Kṛṣṇa; we are requesting prayer, 'Give us our daily bread.' That's all. That is also prayer. This is chanting and that is prayer. So there is no difference."
Akṣayānanda: But when we chant Hare Kṛṣṇa we are praying to God, "Please let me serve you."
Prabhupāda: That is already settled. We are also serving. We are preaching Christianity.
Prabhupāda: No, no. This Anthropomorphism cannot be applied.
Satsvarūpa: Their activities were not so great.
Prabhupāda: Well, nobody's activities can be greater than God's activities.
Yogeśvara: There was that lady who came to see you yesterday who asked that "Lord Jesus performed so many miracles. So what miracles did Kṛṣṇa perform?" So your reply was so many miracles, killing Putana and so on. But that was five thousand years ago. Kṛṣṇa's not here today. And people will ask, "Well we cannot see these miracles. So how can we accept Kṛṣṇa?"
Bhagavān: Well they can't see Jesus's miracles either.
Prabhupāda: (laughs) They can see the miracles of Jesus Christ?
Paramahaṁsa: There's a verse in the Bhāgavatam that says that one moment's association with a pure devotee is greater than liberation from the material world or than innumerable...
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Paramahaṁsa: ...years of enjoyment on heavenly planets.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Paramahaṁsa: My question is: A pure devotee, when he comments Bhagavad-gītā, someone who never sees him physically, but he just comes in contact with his commentary, explanation, is this the same thing?
Prabhupāda: Yes. You can associate with Kṛṣṇa by reading Bhagavad-gītā. And these saintly persons, they have given their explanations, comments. So where is the difficulty? Everyone is helping you.
Prabhupāda: Greatness should be understood, comparing my position. We can understand, "This man is greater than me. He is superior than me." That we can understand. Similarly, we can understand. Just like we human being, we are floating, flying one biggest airplane, 747, and we are thinking we are very wonderful, but that great is floating millions of planets in the air. But the foolish man cannot see the process. He can see that a pilot is floating this airplane, so there must be one big pilot who is floating all these things. But he cannot see. Therefore he says, "Nature." So he cannot see. Just like a child he cannot see that within the plane there is a pilot (pronounces pee-lot, French pronunciation of "pilot") or pilot. He is thinking that the plane is moving automatically. So one who is foolish, he sees the cosmic wonderful work only. He does not know there is a pilot. And in the absence of that knowledge he is thinking that I am also being moved in that way. So so long I do not see the pilot of the cosmic movement, I am fool. Therefore Bhagavad-gītā says, na māṁ duṣkṛtinaḥ mūḍhāḥ. (laughs) Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ, māyayāpahṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.15). His knowledge is lost.
Prabhupāda: "Worship of God, Viṣṇu, is the highest, topmost method of worship. And greater than the topmost worship is to worship Viṣṇu's paraphernalia. Viṣṇu's devotee, Viṣṇu's temple, Viṣṇu's dear..." Just like we worship tulasī. Why? Because it is very dear to Viṣṇu. Tadīyānām. Viṣṇu likes, Kṛṣṇa likes. When, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam (BG 9.26), the tulasī leaf is offered to Kṛṣṇa, He becomes very pleased. Therefore we love tulasī. Because He likes. In common word they say, "If you love me, love my dog." I have seen people do that. One man is going with his dog. His friends meet, and if the friends pat the dog, the man becomes pleased. Is it not?
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is not meant for the Hindus, but Kṛṣṇa appeared in Hindustan. Therefore it is the duty of all Hindus to know Kṛṣṇa first. And they also conscious. Every Hindu knows Kṛṣṇa. Every Hindu observes the Janmāṣṭamī, Kṛṣṇa's birthday. But they are not very serious to understand Kṛṣṇa as a follower. Just like Christian. They admit they are Christian but don't follow the Christian principles. So that Hindus are also like that. Nobody is following Kṛṣṇa's instruction. Kṛṣṇa says, "I am God." Mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat: (BG 7.7) "There is no more superior person or superior position than Me," Kṛṣṇa says. And "God" means that. In the dictionary "God" means the Supreme Being. Supreme Being means nobody is greater than Him; nobody is equal to Him. That is called supreme. So here God personally says that mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7). But this rascal will not accept. They will say, "No, here is another dini-kṛṣṇa." They will bring one competitor. That is going on. "God" means there cannot be any competitor. Nobody is equal to Him; nobody is greater than Him. But they will bring so many competitors. "Why Kṛṣṇa alone will be God?"
Prabhupāda: Therefore, now the war is between people to people, nation to nation. They support with men and money. So therefore they are also killed by nature's law. (break)
Rāmeṣvara: Prabhupāda, in the Ādi-līlā, you wrote that the Communist movement is greater than the capitalist movement because there are more śūdras than vaiśyas so that in a war between Communism and capitalism, the Communists would win.
Prabhupāda: Naturally. They are in greater number.
Rāmeṣvara: But these modern wars are fought with missiles and bombs more than armies.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Formerly, also, there were brahmāstra, fire, firearms, brahmāstra. (break) ...problems that we are facing, they were also in the past under different name, different form.
Prabhupāda: You are less than the nature, that you have to accept. Nature has already done. So either you say "nature" or "God," doesn't matter. But you are not bigger. You cannot take the credit.
Paramahaṁsa: No, we are sons of nature, so nature is greater than us.
Prabhupāda: "Sons of nature," that's all right. But why do you take credit, why do you want to take credit more than nature?
Paramahaṁsa: But we'd just like to understand how to use nature, how to work with nature.
Gurukṛpa: No, it says, if you follow the Bible, it says that there was a... God created...
Prabhupāda: Na satyaṁ teṣu vidyate. This is the whole population. They do not know... There are big, big nation, big, big philosopher, big, big scientists and all very big, but what kind of life they should live, they do not know. What is the accurate destination of our life, that they do not know. And all humbug, big, big scientist, philosopher, theologist, and so on, so on, politician, sociologist, welfare. But real thing, they are rascal. They do not know which way we have to go. So what is the use of these big, big words? They do not know which way to go. Suppose we are walking. If we go to the this side without knowing that "This is water; we should not go," then what is the use? That is their defect. Pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ ca na vidur āsurāḥ janā. Na śaucaṁ nāpi cācāro (BG 16.7). (chuckles) Śaucam, cleanliness, they do not know, neither behavior. Nāpi cācāro. Jagad āhur anīśvaram; (BG 16.8) "Oh, there is no God. It has come out out of the sand." This is the whole population. Jagad ahur anīśvaram (BG 16.8). Which way we shall go? (break) Therefore we require vigorous propaganda to make these fools to understand what is the real aim of life. That should be our propaganda. Idam adya mayā labdham imaṁ prāpsye punar dhanam. They have simply calculated, "Now today the bank balance is now three millions dollars, and tomorrow it will be four million." Simply, they say. Idaṁ prāpsye punar dhanam. And everyone is proud, "Who is greater than me?
Brahmānanda: ...will say that nature has created such a...
Prabhupāda: Then nature is greater than you. Then you are rascal. He knows, You have to accept, somebody is greater than you. He knows, you do not know. Learn from him.
Brahmānanda: Well, they say that they can control nature.
Prabhupāda: Again foolishness. That irritates me. When they speak like that, rascal, that irritates me. (laughter) Therefore I simply call them rascal. (break) Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇaḥ. They are claiming very, very, big man, but as soon as we see that he is not a devotee of Kṛṣṇa, we reject, "He is a foolish." (break) There is... That is a fact, one case was going on, and the judge was dozing, like that. So his clerk warned, "You are dozing. Big, big lawyers, they are talking." "So let these rascals go on talking. I have already concluded my..., (laughter) what judgment I shall give. Let them..." (laughs) So our is like that. We don't hear these rascals. Our judgment is already there. They are rascals. That's all. Let them talk whole day and night. The judge said to the clerk that "I have already made my judgment, so let these foolish men go on talking." (break) ...minister of Orissa, he has promised a land in Jagannātha Purī. So if we get that land, is it not possible to construct another Jagannātha temple? You'll earn the American money here.
Reporter (4): That's beside the point. I am asking the Swami who is God.
Prabhupāda: God is great. "Great" means, "who is greater than you in every respect." We understand a rich man as very great, a wise man as very great, a strong man is very great, beautiful man is very great. In this way there are six opulences: riches, strength, wisdom, beauty, education... In this way the six opulences, when you find in somebody in full, in complete, without any competition, that is God.
Reporter (3): You listed five.
Jayatīrtha: The sixth one is renunciation.
Prabhupāda: Another, renunciation.
Prabhupāda: But since 1920 to up to date in the history, there have been many great personalities or very prominent personalities, but where is the history that women are greater than the man or are equal to the man in the history?
Satsvarūpa: They have a standard answer to that that the women have always been oppressed, that the women could have become great philosophers and writers and politicians, but they were always kept in the home. So now they're going to change this, they say. It's only due to the man's oppressing them and keeping them down.
Prabhupāda: So this pregnancy is also pressing. The man has pressed to become pregnant? This is man's pressure or nature's?
Brahmānanda: Of course, they will try to stop that. Through contraceptive methods and abortion, they will try to stop having children.
Prabhupāda: Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā you'll find, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7), "Nobody or no principle is greater than Me." Then who can be God? God is great. Here the great says, "There is no more greater principle than Me." Then who can be God? People generally know God is great. Kṛṣṇa says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). Not only He says but it is confirmed by great authorities like Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, Viṣṇu Svāmī, all the big, big ācāryas, Caitanya Mahāprabhu, Vyāsadeva, authorities. Kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). So how you can deny?
Prof. Hopkins: You refer to Rāmānujācārya as an important person. Where does he... Where does he fit into your, the Caitanya tradition? He's accepted as an authority. His, the Śrī Bhāṣya is studied, accepted...
Prabhupāda: Rāmānujācārya has written comment on Bhagavad-gītā. You know that?
Prof. Hopkins: No.
Prabhupāda: The example is also very simple. Just like a child is crying and somebody is offering some milk, somebody is offering something but he is still crying. Could not find any cause. Then when the child goes to the mother's lap, immediately (claps)-stops. He understands immediately, "Now I am on the lap of my mother, then everything is all right." Yaṁ labdhvā cāparaṁ lābhaṁ manyate nādhikaṁ tataḥ. Everyone is hankering after making some profit, this way, that way, this way, that way. But when one becomes, gets that supreme thing then he thinks, "Oh, I don't want anything." That is happiness. Unhappiness due to want. So the karmīs, jñānīs, yogis, they are all in want. They want something. Bhaktas are also sometimes in want. They want Kṛṣṇa. And in absence of Kṛṣṇa they are very unhappy, but that unhappiness is greater than happiness.
Prof. Hopkins: The gopīs in Vṛndāvana.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is greater than happiness. And the Māyāvādī, karmī, jñānī, they cannot understand. They will say, "Your gopīs are also crying for Kṛṣṇa, for want of Kṛṣṇa." But they do not know that this want is different.
Prof. Hopkins: So you have been extremely generous with your time and your wisdom.
Prabhupāda: I enjoy(?) that. And that is what the whole human society (indistinct).
Prof. Hopkins: Well I... I have been a friend for many years now. I suspect... I suspect sometimes that I may end up as a sannyāsī among your line at some point. (laughs)
Prabhupāda: Sannyāsa does not mean change of dress. Sannyāsa means everything for Kṛṣṇa. That is sannyāsa.
Devotee (1): Śrīla Prabhupāda, modern philosophy is teaching that the forces of greed and lust and these things are greater than man, that actually... This concept that we are eternal, full of knowledge and bliss, they cannot accept that or understand that. They're thinking that the powers of evil are much greater, and we're just controlled by these things.
Prabhupāda: Therefore they are fools. When a man's lusty desire is very strong, he commits, what is called, rape, and he becomes complicated in criminal activities. Kāma eṣa krodha eṣa rajo-guṇa-samudbhavaḥ. Why one is forced to do that? The cause is lusty desires, anger, greediness. So we are thinking we are master of this material world, but actually you are servant of these desires, kāma, krodha, lobha, mohaḥ. And that is māyā. He is acting as servant, but he's thinking, "I am master." That is māyā, which is not the fact. Just like yesterday we were discussing that the women, they are acting as instrument of men, and they are thinking, "We have equal rights." A man is utilizing her for his own purpose, and she is thinking "I am equal."
Prabhupāda: Every living entity has a particular type of intelligence which is greater than the other.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, in the evolutionary cycle. Talking about the...
Prabhupāda: No, evolutionary, cycle, the body may change, but every living entity has got a special advantage upon the others.
Ravīndra-svarūpa: What is the advantage of a tree, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Prabhupāda: You see how they are standing there for five thousand years. You cannot do it. You cannot do it even for five minutes.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Actually the trees are absolutely necessary for the survival of animals.
Prabhupāda: Lord Rāmacandra worshiped His devotees. Just like sometimes Kṛṣṇa worships Rādhārāṇī and touched His feet..., Her feet. That does not mean that Kṛṣṇa... Just like Kṛṣṇa was tolerating ear pulling by Mother Yaśodā. That does not mean that Mother Yaśodā is the Supreme. Hm? Kṛṣṇa was carrying the wooden shoes of Nanda Mahārāja. So that does not mean Nanda Mahārāja is greater than Kṛṣṇa. It is Kṛṣṇa's pleasure. Just like sometimes a father takes the son on the shoulder, carries. Does it mean the father is inferior than the son? So this is third-class man's conclusion. They do not know what is Kṛṣṇa, what is Rāma. Kṛṣṇa says that aham ādir hi devānām (Bg 10.2). So He is the origin of Lord Śiva. So how Śiva can be the Supreme? We have to consult śāstra. Kṛṣṇa does not say that Śiva is Supreme. So if a third-class man says Śiva is Supreme, we have to accept it? We are preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Whatever Kṛṣṇa says, that is Supreme, not a third-class man's version. Is it clear? Yes.
Prabhupāda: No, formerly, three hundred years, you had some water; therefore the water is coming out. This is all nonsense. Seven generation before my great-grandfather ate some ghee, and still I have got the smell. (laughter) It is that argument. Huh? This kind of argument has no value. Water is... You can create water from your body. What is there? You are a doctor. What is your...? Eh? Medical men they are. No? Water is created. How the blood is created? He did not drink blood. This is nonsense argument. How we create blood? It is becoming. You do not know how it is, but you have got such potency that blood is being created. You even do not know how the blood is being done, but it is being. That is inconceivable energy. There are so many secretions. They are coming within the body. So everything is there. By God's supreme energy they are being automatically. Svābhāvikī jñāna-bala-kriyā ca. Parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate (Cc. Madhya 13.65, purport). God has got multi-energies. Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. This is the description. He hasn't got to do anything. Just like so many things are being manufactured within my body. I haven't got to directly work for it. So similarly, the God's gigantic... Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. He has nothing to do. Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. Na tat-samaś cābhyadhikaś ca dṛśyate. Nobody is found equal to Him or greater than Him.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That disease... Brahma... Lord Śiva also, he was attracted to the Mohinī. So they are īśvara. They are controllers. So the instruction is that even such personalities may be sexually attracted, so how much we shall remain careful. This is the instruction. (break) ...like the other rascal. Who was saying that "Kṛṣṇa was killed by a hunter; therefore hunter is greater than Kṛṣṇa"?
Indian man: Raja Gopalācārya, he has written in Mahābhārata that Kṛṣṇa was killed by a hunter.
Prabhupāda: Therefore the hunter is...
Indian man: "Kṛṣṇa Passes Away," the heading of his chapter.
Harikeśa: You said about a couple of years ago that "What ordinary man would be killed if he was shot in the arrow by a heel," I mean, "shot in the heel by an arrow?" No ordinary man dies that way.
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Hṛdayānanda: Aṇor aṇī...
Śāstrījī: Aṇor aṇīyān anusmared yaḥ.
Prabhupāda: Aṇor aṇīyān mahato mahīyāt. So He is greater than the greatest. Yaśodāmāyī thought that "My child are eating earth? So show." She saw all the planetary system within His mouth. So she thought, "What is this? All right, don't do this." (laughs)
Hṛdayānanda: So to accept a spiritual master means that one has to learn everything again.
Prabhupāda: What is that?
Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be, greater than you, you admit it, demigods or God or anything. But why you are thinking yourself so big? That is your fault. That is foolishness. I am a big man amongst a small, tiny living entities. But why you are thinking you are biggest of all, you can understand everything? That is your fault. This is the folly of the conditioned soul. He is nothing. He has no value. Still, he is thinking he is very great. Everything is big and small relatively. Just like here if one man has got 100,000 rupees, he's a big man. But what is 100,000 rupees in America? Nothing.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: One year's salary for an average man.
Prabhupāda: Eh? No. Living entity is also atom. One class of atom is matter, and one class of atom is the living entity. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā.... Bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ khaṁ mano buddhir eva ca (BG 7.4). These are... This material, matter, everything is combination of atom, atomic particles. Either you take earth or take water or air or fire, everything is combination of atom. That's a fact. But we know that these atoms are coming out as the energy of Kṛṣṇa. Bhinnā. Bhinnā means the quality different; not of the same quality. Apareyam: "This is inferior quality, but there is another, superior quality, jīva bhuta, and that is living entity." So two kinds of atoms are coming from Kṛṣṇa. One is the spiritual atom, and the other is the material atom. So spiritual atoms, they are many, many times greater than the material atoms. And these material atoms is this universal, innumerable universes. Some of the spiritual atoms, when they want to enjoy independently, they are given the chance of enjoying this material atom.
Prabhupāda: Yes. You cannot change your position. That is science. Kṛṣṇa has said that mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). So nobody has become greater than Kṛṣṇa up till now. That is science. Can anyone challenge Kṛṣṇa? No. And He has said, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). So that is scientist.
Dr. Patel: No, but the scientists try to unearth the secrets of Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Dr. Patel: Scientists, the modern science, is trying to unearth the secrets of Kṛṣṇa only.
Prabhupāda: Trying to?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. You take my sins and be crucified. Then I shall know that you are real (unclear). Take all my sins and I crucify you.
Rāmeśvara: In the Caitanya-caritāmṛta, you wrote that Vaiṣṇavas like Vāsudeva Datta, they're even greater than Jesus Christ.
Prabhupāda: Did I say?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. You said that Jesus only gave shelter to his few followers, but Vāsudeva Datta prayed that the whole sinful activities of the whole universe...
Rāmeśvara: "Be on me, I'll take them."
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You said, I think it said, he was a thousand times greater. You wrote that in the purport.
Prabhupāda: The prisoners.... Haridāsa Ṭhākura was very well known, so all of them assembled and offered him respect. Haridāsa Ṭhākura blessed them, "Stay in this condition." (laughs) So they were surprised, that "We offered respect, and the blessing is that 'Stay in this....' " Then they were explained, " 'Stay in this condition' means your attitude to offer respect to a Vaiṣṇava." That was the intent, not that "You stay in the prison house." Viṣṇu, Vaiṣṇava, offering respect.... (break) ...ārādhanam. When Pārvatī inquired from Lord Śiva what is the best form of worship, he advised, viṣṇor ārādhanaṁ param: "Oh, to worship Lord Viṣṇu is the best form of..." Then he said, tasmāt parataraṁ devi tadīyānāṁ samarcanam: "And greater than viṣṇor ārādhana, Viṣṇu worship, is to worship tadīyānām, anything in connection with Viṣṇu." Anything.... That is Vaiṣṇava. Just like we are worshiping tulasī, tulasī plant. Why tulasī plant? It is a plant only, not even human being. Tadīyānām. Because tulasī is liked by Kṛṣṇa. Similarly, anything in connection with Viṣṇu, to worship, that is better than Viṣṇu worship.
Prabhupāda: You do not understand it?
Devotee (1): I do not understand how they are greater than the lower person who surrenders.
Prabhupāda: Suppose you have got your spiritual master and you, if somebody says that you can come into the..., any one of you can come in this car. So spiritual master goes, you also go. Does it mean that spiritual master is not greater than you? Do you think like that?
Devotee (1): No.
Prabhupāda: Then? It is the same thing. Suppose Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja has brought this car, so he says, "All of you can come." So I go, you go, does it mean that you and your spiritual master is equal? Do you think like that? It is same thing. Everyone can go to Godhead, there is no doubt, but still there is difference between brāhmaṇas, kṣatriyas, śūdras. So far going into the car, the equal right is there, but it does not mean that your spiritual master or the next group, they are not greater than you. Don't think like that. The same car, Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja is driving, I am also there, you are also there. Does it mean that we are all equal? There must be gradation. The right is given to everyone. It does not mean that immediately they become all one. It is Kṛṣṇa's mercy that He accepted everyone, "Come on." But the distinction is there. We are inviting everyone to partake Kṛṣṇa prasādam.
Prabhupāda: Every scripture, just like in Bible it is said "God has created this universe." So if you come to me and accept me as God, why don't you test whether I have created another universe like this? Why you accept a cheap God who hasn't done anything? Simply he's bluff, and he says that "I am God." So why do you accept such God? Hmm? Why should we accept a cheap God? Everything requires intelligence. If you are not intelligent, then every transaction you may be cheated. Everyone has heard God is great. So great means there should be nobody equal to Him and nobody greater than Him. That is greatness. So test that man whether he has no competitor, another God. Nowadays there are so many Gods. So God is great, why there is another competitor? This is intelligence.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa:
- yad advaitaṁ brahmopaniṣadi tad apy asya tanu-bhā
- ya ātmāntaryāmi puruṣa iti so 'syāṁśa-vibhavaḥ
- ṣaḍ-aiśvaryaiḥ pūrṇo ya iha bhagavān sa svayam ayaṁ
- na caitanyāt kṛṣṇāj jagati para-tattvaṁ param iha
- (CC Adi 1.3)
"What the Upaniṣads describe as the impersonal Brahman is but the effulgence of His body, and the Lord known as the Supersoul is but His localized plenary portion. He is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Kṛṣṇa Himself, full with six opulences. He is the Absolute Truth, and no other truth is greater than or equal to Him."
Prabhupāda: This is the beginning of Caitanya-caritāmṛta. So will anyone be able to understand this verse? Hmm? Everything is stated there, what is Caitanya. Will everyone be able to understand it? That is the proof that he's not graduate. If he is graduate, then he should understand. Therefore it is postgraduate.
Vipina: Many people have horses in the neighborhood. They have horse shows, Śrīla Prabhupāda. They spend lots of money on fancy horses, and in this way, one becomes greater than another by showing his horses. (break)
Prabhupāda: ...slam the door. The door is secure or not? (break) ...trying to find out that happiness from this body, that is mistake. That happiness is there in the spirit soul, not this body. Happiness is our right. Ānandamayo 'bhyāsāt (Vedānta-sūtra 1.1.12). By nature, we want happiness. Mistaking, where is the happiness. The living being, he is to enjoy happiness. But they are trying to give happiness to the body, which is dead. Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ (BG 2.11). The body is dead from the very beginning, but they are trying to draw happiness from the dead matter.
Hari-śauri: Chewing the chewed.
Prabhupāda: Not great power, but greatest power. Nobody is greater than Him. That is accepted by the direct listener of Bhagavad-gītā, Arjuna. And he is giving evidences of Vyāsadeva, Asita, Devala, Nārada, they are authorities. And in the recent years, the ācāryas Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, Nimbārka and Caitanya Mahāprabhu, they have all accepted. And He speaks also. Then where is doubt? Where is doubt?
Guest (2): No, I just want to clear this thing, that thing I accept, sir, this thing that it is a great power, the supreme power.
Prabhupāda: Not a great, the great power. Mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). There is no more greater power than Him. That is His position.
Prabhupāda: So God is great. Now we have to analyze what is the greatness. A man is supposed to be great when he is very rich. A man is supposed to be great when he is very wise, man of knowledge, strength, reputation. So item by item, you analyze and see, you'll see Kṛṣṇa is the greatest. By reasoning. Therefore He is God. They have been analyzed. You'll find in The Nectar of Devotion, the Gosvāmīs have analyzed the characteristics of Kṛṣṇa, and they found Him the greatest. So if God is great, and He is the greatest, then He is God. How can you deny it? At least, we can see in the Bhagavad-gītā, the little knowledge given by Kṛṣṇa, it is still standing as the greatest. Five thousand years past, nobody could give such a book of knowledge throughout the whole world. The Bhagavad-gītā is studied not only by the Indians and Hindus but by all scholars of the world. Even such persons who think that there is somebody greater than Kṛṣṇa, they also read Bhagavad-gītā and they recite from the Bhagavad-gītā. Even Śaṅkarācārya, the leader of the Māyāvādīs, he says Bhagavad-gītā kiñcid adhītā. Is it not? Does he not say?
Prabhupāda: No.
Devotee (2): Therefore a chicken, he is greater than you.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Chicken can do. What do you think?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. The very best way to... I want to use that as an example next time when we preach.
Prabhupāda: But a chicken is better than you. Don't talk nonsense. (laughter) Chicken is already doing in his way. You'll see he's laying down, chemical egg, and fermenting, and within week come. So he's better than you.
Yadubara: They'll say that we can also do that, we can also produce child.
Prabhupāda: I may not show, but as I give you example, that you have manufactured 747 and God has manufactured mosquito. You do that. We are... I am layman, but I see there is another, better manufacturer than you. I may be layman, but I can see that you cannot do it. If you say you can do it, then you are rascal. I must say that you are rascal. First of all do, then speak. You take your credit, as much as you have done. But if you want to take the place of God, then we must slap you right and left. (laughter) We cannot give better credit than God to anyone. That is our business. Asamordhva. There is nobody equal to God, nobody is greater than God. This is our preaching. So you cannot claim equal to God. No question of becoming greater than God. You cannot become even equal to God. You are always under. You admit it, then we have no quarrel with you. You admit that "Yes, we are under God," then we are friends.
Prabhupāda: Therefore in Vedic civilization they keep, they have more than one wife. So what is the use of killing? Why one should kill? We find from the history, Dhruva Mahārāja's mother and stepmother, there were some critical words, and Dhruva Mahārāja became very, very angry. So the critical words and wives, different wives, that may be, but why one should cut off the head? Dhruva Mahārāja's mother said when Dhruva Mahārāja began to cry before the mother, mother said "My dear child, what can I do? How can I help you? Your father does not care for me, even as maidservant, what to speak of I am queen, I am the senior queen. So this gentleman does not care of me even as maidservant. How can I help you? If God helps you, then..." That was her statement. So that does not mean because the king did not like, she should be beheaded. What is this nonsense? If he is,(?)... may be... After all, he is king. He may not like first wife. Actually, there was no scarcity of comfort, but liking may not be, but that does not mean that she shouldn't be accepted as wife. Kings were allowed to marry more than one wife. Why to accept another wife means another wife should be killed? What is this? Everything nonsense. King can marry more than one wife. And at the time of marriage they were given so many woman. Because the woman population is greater than the man, always.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Hari-śauri: "As stated in Brahma-saṁhitā, Lord Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Lord. No one is greater than Him; He is the cause of all causes. Here it is also stated by the Lord personally that He is the cause of all the demigods and the sages. Even the demigods and great sages cannot understand Kṛṣṇa. They can neither understand His name nor His personality, so what is the position of the so-called scholars of this tiny planet? No one can understand why the Supreme God comes to earth as an ordinary human being and executes such commonplace and yet wonderful activities. One should know, then, that scholarship is not the qualification necessary to understand Kṛṣṇa. Even the demigods and the great sages have tried to understand Kṛṣṇa by their mental speculation, and they have failed to do so.
Prabhupāda: Opportunists. Useless. They have no value.
Indian man: Thirty percent of the Indian families, they are Ārya-samājīs, and twenty percent are South Indian Śaivaites. I get a lot of argument that "Rāmacandrajī did the pūjā of Śivajī at Rāmeśvaram, so Śiva is greater than Rāma." I said, "Consider this, that Rāma was so humble to do the pūjā of Śivajī, but in Rāmastotrāṇi it says rāma rāmeti rāmeti ramerama manorane, shastranama tat tulyam sri-rama-nama ramarame.(?) That is what Śivajī is telling Pārvatī. Śivajī is telling Pārvatī in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya, vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti (BG 7.19)." I say, "Why does Śivajī say that? Why is Śivajī sitting in samādhi? Why not Kṛṣṇa sitting in samādhi? Why not Rāma sitting in samādhi? Why not Mahā-Viṣṇu sitting in samādhi? Because Śivajī's position is to serve Kṛṣṇa. But Kṛṣṇa as Rāma is so humble that He came and even did His devotee's pūjā."
Prabhupāda: Paraṁ brahma. They are anxious to realize Brahman, that I... ahaṁ brahmāsmi. Ahaṁ brahmāsmi does not mean that "I am Paraṁ Brahman." "I am individual part and parcel of Brahman." Similarly, ātmā, Paramātmā; īśvara, Parameśvara. We should understand this distinction between ātmā, Paramātmā: Brahman, Para-brahman; īśvara, Parameśvara. So in the Vedic literature it is said, īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1). Īśvara. Īśvara means controller. Every one of us, we are controller, either I control over my family or in my office or in my country. In this way everyone is a controller. I may be a controller. Not may be. In my limited jurisdiction I am also controller. You are also controller. So I may be a little greater controller, you may be a smaller controller and somebody may be greater than me. So in this way, if you study controllers, different types of controllers, you'll find there is junior and senior. The same person is senior controller in the family, but in the office he's a junior controller.
Prabhupāda: The dog is also thinking. From three miles he begins to bark, "Why you are coming here? Don't come here. I am protecting my interest." That mentality is there in the dog, so how you are greater than the dog?
Nava-yauvana: But the devotee is thinking that the proprietor is protecting his interest.
Prabhupāda: Anyway, that kind of interest is felt by the dog. It is not very astonishing thing. In that mentality you cannot bring in unity. That is not possible.
Dayānanda: But they accept that there is some good quality in humanity, they say that that is inherent in humanity, that we need to worship.
Prabhupāda: (loud chanting from mosques and singing in background) These words, aja, what is the meaning of this?
Ātreya Ṛṣi: Allah, "God is great, God is great, God is great." "God is greater than can be ever described. I accept and witness that God is one and there is no other partner, or any..."
Prabhupāda: Competitor.
Ātreya Ṛṣi: "...competitor to Him. I witness that Muhammad is the prophet of God, is the..."
Prabhupāda: Representative.
Prabhupāda: Yes, if I understand that he is rich, I may consider, "Well, I have got one thousand dollars, so he may have one hundred thousand dollars," that's all. But if you understand that he has got millions and millions of dollars, then you'll appreciate, "Oh, so rich!" Then your regard for him will increase. That is not being done. Stereotyped, "God is great." How He is great, to what extent He is great, what is His greatness activities, if you know more and more, then your regard for God will increase. But that they are not doing. Simply officially, "God is great, God is great," finished. No jijñāsā, no inquiry. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. One should be inquisitive. Jijñāsuḥ śreya uttamam. Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsuḥ śreya uttamam (SB 11.3.21). One who has become inquisitive of the uttamam, the most exalted subject matter, he requires a guru. Otherwise, who will answer his inquiries? Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsuḥ. If he's not jijñāsuḥ, what is the need of guru? And where is the question of advancement? He must be jijñāsuḥ. That is, people are not interested. Officially, go to church, go to mosque, go to temple and do something. Then drop it and go to your own business and do whatever you like. No discrimination. They're not serious. Not very serious. One who is serious, he'll inquire. Otherwise, the formula is all right, "God is great, there is no more greater than Him." But inquire, "How He is great?"
Prabhaviṣṇu: There is one verse in the Bhagavad-gītā, in Chapter Seven,
- icchā-dveṣa samutthena
- dvandva-mohena bhārata
- sarva-bhūtāni saṁmohaṁ
- sarge yānti parantapa
- (BG 7.27)
The meaning of this verse is that all living beings in the material world are born into delusion, overcome by the duality of desire and hate. So the fact is that the living entity, he desires to become great. Just like God is very great, so the living entity wants to imitate God, and therefore he comes in this material world, and he tries to become great and very powerful. This is desire. He tries to enjoy himself. And also icchā-dveṣa. He becomes envious of the Lord. Many people in the material world, they don't like to admit that God exists or that there is someone greater than themselves because they think themselves to be the greatest. This is the disease of material life. But the cure for this disease that we have to accept...
Prabhupāda: You know that? There are so many rascals, they say, "I'm God." You know that? That is the problem. If somebody says, "I am God," is it a fact? But he says like that. He's such a rascal. That is the point.
Lokanātha: You have to understand the position of Vaiṣṇava. Vaiṣṇava's position is far far greater than the demigods. Demigods, they shower flowers on the Vaiṣṇavas. So they are very exalted personalities, especially the spiritual master. There's no comparison of the spiritual master with any entities in the universe or brahmāṇḍa. As Prabhupāda's purport has said many places: "The spiritual master is the external manifestation of the Supersoul, Paramātmā within your heart." Paramātmā is Kṣīrodakaśāyī Viṣṇu, and He becomes manifest before you in form of a guru or spiritual master. So you cannot compare a spiritual master or guru with any other...
Prabhupāda: No, his question is why the demigods... Just like Lord Brahmā, he is the original spiritual master. So why the demigods should not be equal to the spiritual master. That is his question. Is it not?
Caraṇāravindam: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Everything.
Harikeśa: All kinds of economic systems.
Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa says mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7)."There is nothing greater than Me." How anything can exceed Kṛṣṇa? You present Kṛṣṇa right, then Kṛṣṇa will exceed anything. Any department of knowledge, any department of activity. Anything. Supreme, Parataram. Para-taram. Tara is used—superlative. If our men become serious to distribute... Of course it is not possible that the whole world will be Kṛṣṇa conscious, but at least they will know that there is such a thing. I may know at least there is diamond. I may not be able to purchase. That everyone can know. There is a very valuable jewel. Even though he has not seen it, still he'll appreciate that there is a very valuable jewel known as diamond. That much will also help. When he has got money he can purchase it. (break) Because gentleman will come you have to break this wall. What is this nonsense?
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) That is God is great. Nobody can defeat Him. Nobody can go beyond Him. Asama-ūrdhva. Nobody is equal to Him. Asama, ūrdhva. Nobody is greater than Him, nobody is equal to Him. That is God. And after there are so many Gods, everyone God. So what kind of God? If God has a competitor, then what is the God? God has no competitor. Asama-ūrdhva. Everyone is down. Asama. Not equal, not ūrdhva. Then down. Two things, three things are there. Equal, level, upper and lower. So there is no upper and there is no equal. Then all lower. Then He's the supreme controller. Īśvara parama. In the lower level there may be īśvara. But they are not parama. Subordinate.
Prabhupāda: Do you accept Sai Baba as God?
Guest (7): No, no, not at all.
Prabhupāda: Then why do you speak all this? That's...
Guest (7): Not even greater than me. I don't think like that. He is also a human being like me.
Guest (6): In the Bhāgavatam it is said that (quotes Sanskrit verse). (indistinct)
Guest (7): And he could not do his siddhi before (indistinct). If it is real siddhi he could have showed all his powers even before (indistinct).
Prabhupāda: Go to the standard of knowledge. Bhagavad-gītā is accepted by the the ācāryas, Madhvācārya, Rāmānujācārya, Viṣṇu Svāmī, Lord Caitanya. So take that standard. Why do you go to the rascals and fools? Unless you are rascal and fool, you cannot go to the rascal and fool. Why? You take. If you want to know God, take the standard knowledge which is accepted by the... Ācāryopāsanam. You take the knowledge through the ācāryas. Why from a rascal? That is not knowledge.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Nityānām, nityo nityānāṁ cetanaḥ... (Hindi) Jīvera svarūpa haya nitya-kṛṣṇa-dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109). (Hindi) That is his foolishness. And foolish person will accept. Kṛṣṇa says mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7). Therefore He shall remain the Supreme always. We have to refer to the Vedic śāstras. Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. This is description of Bhagavān. That He has nothing to do, na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. (Hindi) (Explains in Hindi that Kṛṣṇa does not need or show any magic, when He was just a child He killed Pūtanā. Not that by meditation He became God. Bhagavān is always Bhagavān.) Either he is three months old or three years old or three hundred years old. Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate na tat-samaś cābhyadhikaś ca dṛśyate, nobody can be equal or greater than Him. If someone is equal to Him then how He is Bhagavān?
1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Guru is there. Kṛṣṇa. Why don't you find? Why you are blind? Kṛṣṇa says, yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata (BG 4.7). Paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya (BG 4.8). He has come. Why don't you take Him? Why do you go to a cheater? Because you want to be cheated. Guru is there. Śiṣyas te 'haṁ śādhi māṁ prapannam (BG 2.7), Arjuna said. Why don't you surrender to Kṛṣṇa? That means I don't want guru. I want somebody, my order supplier. So how you can be... Because you want to be cheated, you'll get cheater. Ye yathā māṁ prapadyante tāṁs tathaiva bhajāmi (BG 4.11). Why don't you accept Kṛṣṇa as guru? What is the difficulty? Is there anybody greater than Kṛṣṇa? Do you think like that? What is your idea?
Guest (2): He is the ultimate. There's nothing more.
Gargamuni: No. I told him "Actually Prabhupāda, he has done more work than Vivekananda in helping to spread India's dharma all over the world." I had to very careful because there were many other people sitting around, including the manager, and I didn't want to start a fight. So I said, "Actually Prabhupāda has done greater work." He said (in shocked tone), "What have you said? You have said that your guru is greater than Vivekananda?" I said, "He has done more work." And he started, "No. You cannot say that." Then two other men who were sitting there stood up and said, "No! He has done more work. I was at the Olympic games, and I heard the whole thing was chanting in Montreal. Last year I was at the Olympic games, and I saw them all chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. He has done more work." Two men, they came. So I just sat there and let those two men argue.
Prabhupāda: It is Kṛṣṇa's grace.
Prabhupāda: That is their philosophy, but everything taken together means that is a partial manifestation of Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is still greater.
Bhavānanda: If Kṛṣṇa says that "Everything material and spiritual is coming from Me."
Prabhupāda:"Coming from Me." Therefore He is greater than both material...
Bhavānanda: Does that mean Kṛṣṇa is beyond even spiritual?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He said greater than the other ācāryas.
Satsvarūpa: Yes. Greater than Rāmānuja and Madhva.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And he's a big man.
Prabhupāda: He is very big man. Very good scholar also. He goes outside for lecturing.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Practically all the devotees feel your presence through these books.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Their life is sustained with these books, these books and chanting and the Deity worship, sustaining all the devotees in the world and bringing new devotees. Everyone we ask who joins this movement, "Before you joined, did you get a book?" "Yes." In every case I have seen that the first thing was the book.
Prabhupāda: Hm.
Prabhupāda: Dhīra means who is restful, not restless; dhīra, whose brain is cool, sober. Just like a high-court judge. He is sitting simply, and the cāparāsī, he is busy. The cāparāsī gets, say, two hundred rupees, and he gets five thousand rupees. But he is doing nothing, a dhīra, 'cause his importance is many, many times greater than the cāparāsī. So dhīra means sober. If we become sober, not restless, then it is possible to understand. Dhīras tatra na muhyati. There are two classes: dhīra and adhīra. Adhīra means always foolishly busy, and dhīra means sober. He's trying to understand what is God. That is dhīra.
Guest (1): That is actually what we have always taught, you know, to do it. Karmaṇy evādhikāras te.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Karmaṇy evā...
Prabhupāda: Then he does not know how to honor a saintly person. It is useless to meet him. If he has no respect for saintly person, if he thinks greater than saintly person, then he's useless.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Then nothing will come of it, anyway. And if we give this opportunity, that he come in the morning, if he...
Prabhupāda: No, no, apart from that, if he has got that sense, that "I am very big man, so everyone should come here," he's useless. We cannot do anything with him.
Girirāja: That's what I thought.
Prabhupāda: Very beginning is...
Prabhupāda: No, there is no question of.
Girirāja: Yeah. No, I agree completely. I mean, you're millions and billions of times greater than anyone, so there's no question...
Prabhupāda: No, apart from that, if one has no proper respect for a saintly person, he's useless man. You cannot have any benefit. Or neither he can derive any benefit.
Girirāja: Yeah.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: From all sides.
Girirāja: Because he'll think he has nothing to learn, that he is already in the best position.
Prabhupāda: There is a... Asamaurdhva. There cannot be anyone equal to God or greater than God. Then He is God.
Jayapatākā: Many young men, both Hindu and Muhammadan, will join, I'm quite sure. Right now we're getting the society registered and getting a place. Before we actually...
Prabhupāda: So did you not get? Finish that. Get the place and society registered.
Jayapatākā: Well, I was there with Prabhaviṣṇu, and he joined me after ten days, and I instructed him what to do, everything. Then I was called back to Māyāpur. But there'll be no difficulty. I can go any time within a week. The Bengal government is giving me re-entry visa, so I can go and come back without difficulty.
Prabhupāda: Do this seriously.
Prabhupāda: And those who are able, you can keep more than one wife. Just see Kṛṣṇa-sixteen thousand wives. God. That is God. Come on, if there is anyone to compete. Sixteen thousand palaces, sixteen thousands wives, each wife, ten sons. That is God.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No one is equal to or greater than Him.
Prabhupāda: All queens are happy. Whatever she desires from husband... Satyabhāmā... And Kṛṣṇa went to the heaven and brought the pārijāta flower to satisfy. This is husband. Wife has asked for something: "All right."
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He even had to fight.
Prabhupāda: Nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-nipuṇau.
Brahmānanda: Śrīla Prabhupāda? I was thinking that the religion of Jesus Christ has spread all over the world, and you are much greater than Jesus Christ. Your teachings are far, far greater, and your power is far, far greater. So if you remain here more, more years, then certainly this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement will spread all over the entire world.
Prabhupāda: I am willing.
Brahmānanda: Actually we can make this whole world Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is not difficult.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You say that you still want to see the world overflooded with Kṛṣṇa consciousness. You said you wanted to see that happen.
Prabhupāda: We can do that.
| Page Title: | Greater than... (Conversations) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, RupaManjari |
| Created: | 24 of Aug, 2012 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=86, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 86 |