Prabhupāda: Now, after negativating my identity with this false identification, when I come to the right point, then I understand that I am Kṛṣṇa's. I am Kṛṣṇa's. Then your attachment for Kṛṣṇa increases because you transfer the attachment. Just like a child. A child is attached to play. But when he grows up, his attachment is transferred to study. That does not mean he gives up the attachment for playing, that attachment is lost. No. Attachment must be there, but that is transferred or purified. So Kṛṣṇa consciousness means purified consciousness, real consciousness. And the next stage, after being freed from misgivings—attachment for the real identity, ruci. Then āsakti, greater attachment. Then an ecstasy. That means I am coming nearer to God. Because I am God's... In the beginning I told you that we have forgotten our relationship with God. So when we are out of misgivings, we come to the platform of increasing attachment for God. So this attachment, when it is perfectional stage, it is called love of God. Love is here also. Instead of loving God, we are now loving dog. Love is there, but when you are out of misgivings, you transfer your love from dog to God. These are the different stages to come to the... How do you attain Kṛṣṇa consciousness? These are the stages.
Greater (Conversations 1968 - 1975)
Expressions researched:
"greater"
Conversations and Morning Walks
1968 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Just like all these animals, these birds, they have no question how to live, how to eat, how to mate, how to defend. This is already there. They're eating, they're sleeping, they're mating, and they're defending as far as required. Just see the birds, as soon as they see us they go away, take defense. (laughs) So the defending propensity is there. How you can say the man is greater intelligence? There is intelligence. They were here, and as soon as they saw, "Here are come all the men. They can eat us. Let us fly there." The man cannot come in the water. So don't you see the defensive propensity is here? You may, according to your intelligence, you may discover defensive weapons, nuclear weapons, and aeroplanes, and bombs, and so many things. Because you have got higher intelligence. That the... But the ultimate conclusion: that the defensive propensity is there in you also. There is no difference in the material existentional propensities. So whatever does he find? (break) ...from history point?
Prabhupāda: I have to thank Jadurāṇī for nice pictures. She is giving us light about spiritual understanding. So Kṛṣṇa will bless her with greater energy for Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Thank you. So this picture, Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa, with His associates just joined into the picture... Rādhā-kṛṣṇa-praṇaya-vikṛtir hlādinī śaktir asmād ekātmānāv api bhuvi purā deha-bhedaṁ gatau tau (CC Adi 1.5). It is a very great science. The Absolute is one, but in order to enjoy transcendental bliss... (end)
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Certainly. That is the first condition to accept one as my disciple, because there are some restriction. I don't allow illicit sex life. I don't allow intoxication. I don't allow meat-eating and gambling. So I build up their character. So naturally my followers are very restricted. (chuckles)
Interviewer: Well, now, I'd like to go over in some greater detail what the disciples may and may not do. I think that's where... I just wanted to get some of the factual background before we went into that. Now, your, the sexual abstinence does not include marriage, I gather.
Prabhupāda: No. Marriage allowed.
Interviewer: Marriage is allowed.
Prabhupāda: I say, "illicit sex." Without marriage, sex relation is forbidden.
Prabhupāda: Yes. (reading letter:) "This can be made extensive by your team of followers from America arriving in..." They are greater. So Indian and American combined kīrtana, oh, it will be very nice. Big kīrtana, and every city will receive. And we shall preach that "Here is the common platform for everyone. There is no distinction of nation or religion or anything. Come to the platform." So the Mohammedans also will join. The government will appreciate that here is something secular, real secular; at the same time, God is there. Actually, it is that. All religious people, so-called religious, come here. And religion means this, to love, I mean to say, develop love of God. That is religion. What is this formularies? Simply formula that "I keep this, I copy that." That is not religion, simply by dressing in different way or sitting in a different way. Where is your understanding? You have no understanding of God. You simply formally attend some church or mosque or temple for some material benefit or for some, make some show, but where is your love of God? That is the test of religion, Bhāgavata says. A religious person means he has got complete love of God. Then he is religious. All right.
Prabhupāda: This Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is composed of four different stages. The first stage is to understand the relationship with Godhead, or Kṛṣṇa. Because the conditioned souls at the present moment, they have forgotten self. They have forgotten their relationship with Kṛṣṇa. Actually the relationship is there, eternal, but under the influence of māyā he is thinking that "I am something of this material world," identifying himself with this body. So we have to awake them from that illusory existence, what he is not. The whole mistake of the modern status of life... I don't say modern civilization. This is coming up since the creation of this material world. Sometimes it is in greater degree and sometimes in lesser degree. In Satya-yuga the same condition, but in lesser degree. But in Kali-yuga the condition is in greater degree. So the first business is to awake the conditioned souls from their illusory position, that he is thinking, "I am this body and anything in relationship with this body is very important." Janasya moho 'yam ahaṁ mameti (SB 5.5.8). This is illusion. We speak of illusion, māyā.
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dr. Weir: Far more acceptable to every type of Christian than any of the specific creeds or sects, you know, the Church of England, Anglicans, Roman Catholics, every other form of prophecy. And you have that greater universality. (indistinct) And you've got Tibetans (who) will accept your places in the same way as a westerner could.
Prabhupāda: What is that?
Dr. Weir: A Tibetan could accept your position.
Prabhupāda: Tiberian? Tibetians? What is their philosophy?
Dr. Weir: You've heard of the Dalai Lama?
Prabhupāda: Yes. What does he say?
Prabhupāda: Mind is instrument. The mind's position is accepting and rejecting. Intellect helps the mind what to reject and what to accept. And that intelligence is of the soul. That ground of intelligence is the soul. First of all bodily concept is gross life, ordinary, like animals, they do not know except the body. Higher than bodily concept of life, the exercise of the mind, mental speculation. That mental speculation is adjusted by intelligence and that intelligence belongs to the soul. Therefore soul is the ultimate and soul is the part and parcel of God. Therefore God is the supreme. So the mental speculation or the evolution of mental exercise when it comes to the summit, that is God realization. Vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti, sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). When one realizes "God is everything," that mahātmā, that great soul is very rare. That is the statement in Bhagavad-gītā. Mahātmā means whose mind is great. The mind is great. He's not thinking ordinary things. He's thinking of greater subject matter. They are called mahātmā, broader minded, broad-minded.
Dr. Weir: That merely means, you might say, if you're going to be very thorough and precise, that the, it could be explained in greater detail, but it's easier to do it with a master. But you can go to a foreign language by reading a book, although it's much easier if you're...
Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like here is the medicine, diabetic. So I have accepted this medicine through a bona fide doctor. Although it is meant for diabetes, I have not accepted this medicine, neither it is advised that this medicine should be accepted by a bona fide physician. So I cannot see properly whether it is good for me. But when the physician, qualified physician, says, "Yes, it is bona fide. You can use it in this way." That is right.
Prabhupāda: Of course, when you accept the... That is not fear. That is obedience, respect. Respect. That's not fear. Just like my students—they are not fearful of me. Because I came from India so what business they have got to be afraid of me. Neither I'm very..., a greater man, but they receive the philosophy, they understand the philosophy, therefore they have got respect for me. The teacher should be offered due respect. That is not fear. That is not out of fear. It's out of love.
Dr. Weir: I was saying that fear prevents it.
Prabhupāda: No. There's no prevention. There's no fear because they are quite at liberty to ask me question and they're asking and the answer is there. I receive so many letters daily. So they have no... They are not afraid of me. But, out of affection, they offer respect.
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is historical. Mahābhārata. Mahābhārata means the history of Greater India. Mahābhārata.
Dr. Weir: Mahābhārata.
Prabhupāda: This Mahābhārata means, mahā means greater. Formerly 5,000 years ago, the whole planet was called Bhārata, India. India it is now called. Actually the name is Bhārata. Bhārata is the name given after the reign of Mahārāja, one King Bhārata. He was the ruler, emperor, of the whole world. After his reign this planet is called Bhārata, this whole planet, Mahābhārata. Mahābhārata is Greater India or Greater Bhārata. The headquarter was in India but it was greater, according to Mahābhārata history and this Bhagavad-gītā is given there in the Mahābhārata. Therefore it is history. And actually it is historical because the battlefield is still existing...
Prabhupāda: Well, if you say like that, the majority of living entities, they are eating without this knowledge of enzyme and other things. So if you take votes the votes are greater. Just like human being, a few human beings are interested in analyzing this enzyme. But the human beings are very small quantity. There are 8,400,000 species of life. They're eating with a natural way and they're quite healthy.
Mensa Member: Knowledge of the process is comparatively important. If you want to enjoy it more you don't have to know about enzymes and proteins, you have to know about the right sort of wine so that...
Śyāmasundara: Enjoyment is the standard.
Prabhupāda: That is stated in the Veda. (Sanskrit verse) God is greater than the greatest and smaller than the smallest.
Dr. Weir: You're using materialist words, Swami. You're using materialist words, greater and smaller.
Prabhupāda: What you meant spiritual?
Dr. Weir: No, but I say you are using materialist words to describe them.
Prabhupāda: What do you mean by spiritual? No speaking?
Dr. Weir: What I say is... (laughter)
Prabhupāda: If I say greater and smaller in this way and you say this is material. Then what is a spiritual expression of this? Can you give me? That means stop talking?
Dr. Weir: Ah, yes, but I mean, then you have a, if somebody else who's sweeping faster and better, you say that he's greater spiritually even if he's doing it...
Śyāmasundara: No.
Prabhupāda: No, the purpose must be spiritual, the purpose must be for Kṛṣṇa.
Śyāmasundara: So if we're speaking about Kṛṣṇa then our words become spiritual.
Dr. Weir: Yes, but I think if you're talking about spiritual things you mustn't try and quantify it.
Prabhupāda: Spiritual means it has no material qualification. Nirbandhaḥ kṛṣṇa-sambandhe yuktaṁ vairāgyam ucyate.
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Change, I say. How the changes take place? You are changing. You are changing from your childhood to boyhood, boyhood to youthhood. So there is a plan. Unless there is plan, why one child is not, by chance, becomes immediately old. What the nonsense will reply? Let the rascal reply this, that here is a chance, that one child immediately becomes old man, by chance. Why there is process? This is plan. So you should have depth of knowledge, otherwise you will be carried away by these rascals. We cannot be carried away by these rascals. We never so easily believed that they are going to the moon planet. You see? We have to scrutinize everything. Yes. That is brahminical qualification. A brāhmaṇa will not accept anything simply because it is said by some rascal. A śūdra will accept because he has no intelligence. That is the difference between brāhmaṇa and śūdra. It is not a caste system. It is classi..., guṇa karma vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13), division of high qualities and actual activities according to that quality. They misinterpreted. Because by the influence of Kali-yuga everyone is śūdra, so he does not know what is the actually brahminical qualification. Therefore there is, I mean to say, competition: "Why this man should be done?(known?) I am as good as he is, and why he should be called brāhmaṇa? He should be given greater facility?"
Prabhupāda: "To support this statement there are many authoritative assertions by the learned scholars of bygone ages. According to their general opinion, a person may become governed by certain convictions derived by his own arguments and decisions. Then another person, who may be a greater logician, will nullify these conclusions and establish another thesis. In this way the path of argument will never be safe or conclusive. The Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam recommends, therefore, that one follow in the footsteps of the authorities.
"Here is a general description of devotional service given by Sri Rupa Gosvāmī in his Bhakti-rasāmṛta-sindhu. Previously, it has been stated that devotional service can be divided into three categories-namely devotional service in practice, devotional service in ecstasy and devotional service in pure love of God. Now Śrī Rūpa Gosvāmī proposes to describe devotional service in practice. Practice means employing our senses in some particular type of work. Therefore devotional service in practice means utilizing our different sensory organs in service to Kṛṣṇa. Some of the senses are meant for acquiring knowledge, and some are meant for executing the conclusions of our thinking, feeling and willing.
Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Now people will say, "Oh, fighting, killing is Kṛṣṇa consciousness?" Yes, if Kṛṣṇa wants it. To... Therefore our business is not in the estimation of this material world to become a good man. Our estimation is how Kṛṣṇa will accept me as good man, that's all. We don't care for this world. Just like gopīs, they left their husbands, they left their father, went to Kṛṣṇa. What is this philosophy? They wanted to satisfy Kṛṣṇa, not their father, brother. Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, "This is the highest worship." (Sanskrit) There is no greater, topmost example of worship than the gopīs did. Because their only purpose was to serve Kṛṣṇa, unalloyed, without being disturbed by any other consideration. That is highest perfection: How to serve Kṛṣṇa. How Kṛṣṇa will be pleased. So at the present moment the best service to render for Kṛṣṇa is that... Kṛṣṇa..., when I speak of Kṛṣṇa, means God, the Supreme Lord. The whole rascal world, they have given up God consciousness. They have become rascal. Therefore to teach them about Kṛṣṇa consciousness is the best service at the present moment.
Jayatīrtha: (indistinct) as man progresses, the mark of his progression is his ability to use tools to a greater extent. Like there was the Stone Age. In the Stone Age, they used stones for tools. Then there was the Bronze Age, so they made weapons out of bronze, knives and so on. Then they invented the wheel.
Prabhupāda: Modern age.
Jayatīrtha: So as their science progressed, then they progressed and were able to utilize nature.
Prabhupāda: So what is that progress? The caves are still there, somebody is living here. Then where is the progress? As the caves are still there and somebody is living here and skyscrapers, they are also, similarly, when you (indistinct) the cave (indistinct), there were palaces(?) but we could not see them. Both things are existing, but you studied only one side. Here is your history, see. Kṛṣṇa has sixteen thousand palaces and there was no need of light. Jewels, all jewels. Everything is existing side by side.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Yes. The woman population is greater everywhere, and if they have no husband, they're very sorry. I have studied in this country. They're very unhappy without husband. Therefore I introduced this marriage in our society. Now in our society see all the women with children, how happy they are.
Brahmānanda: Oh yes.
Prabhupāda: They have got Kṛṣṇa, they have got husband, they have got children. Now, happy they are. They're working hard for beauty of the home, for the temple. And now last night that Mukunda's cousin sister came. How unhappy she is.
Brahmānanda: Yes. You could also see the child.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: It was explained that he had a better, great mission, so he should not join, "You should do your..." By that time he was started, fighting for freedom. So he was not allowed...
Prabhupāda: So what was that greater mission?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: For independence, fighting.
Prabhupāda: No. Why he wanted to join Ramakrishna mission? What is the attraction of Ramakrishna mission? What they have done? Ramakrishna mission, what they have done? The Ramakrishna mission is working here in your country... (end)
Mr. Wadell: Could we go back to the relationship between you or all of us and God? What my own experience has suggested to me is that the language which I use and the language which has been used by others to describe what we think Him to be is not really capable of accomplishing this very difficult task. It is an impossible task in fact because we are describing something which is so immeasurably greater, more difficult to understand fully. We can have a relationship, but I find it, the language which we use, is of...
Prabhupāda: Insufficient.
Prabhupāda: Intelligent, this is intelligent.
Guest (3): "...if there's a greater association." And that really led me to India, and say, "Well, in India I would have more of these spiritual things and more of that atmosphere, environment." And, well, you know, that particular incident really struck me.
Prabhupāda: No, you can attend here. You remain here.
Guest (3): And, you know, it was the first time she saw a sat-saṅga, first time in her life.
Prabhupāda: No, no, the wonderful thing is that this is a method of spiritual realization which attracts even a child. Unless one denies to be attracted, everyone is attracted. Even a child, even a dog. This is the... Therefore it is universal. Unless you deny to accept it, attraction is for everyone. If the child is innocent, he immediately exhibits his attraction.
Prabhupāda: Vidura was neutral. He left home when he understood that "Fighting is now inevitable. They'll fight. Why shall I remain here?" He left home. And Kṛṣṇa also said that "I will not fight. I'll not fight because this is family quarrel. I am known to every one of you. We are related. So I cannot take this side or that side. I may be..." He divided... He, by tricks... His soldiers one side, and He Himself one side. So Duryodhana preferred, Duryodhana preferred His soldiers, that "Why shall I take this one man. I'll take His soldiers." And Arjuna said, "No, I want Kṛṣṇa." So Kṛṣṇa said, "Although I'm going to your side, but I'll not fight. Mind that." And, "Never mind, You don't fight." Mahābhārata is very nice. "Greater India." Mahābhārata means "The History of Greater India." Mahābhārata. Mahā means "greater."
Pradyumna: Six-twenty-two.
- yaṁ labdhvā cāparaṁ lābhaṁ
- manyate nādhikaṁ tataḥ
- yasmin sthito na duḥkhena
- guruṇāpi vicālyate
- taṁ vidyād duḥkha-saṁyoga-
- viyogaṁ yoga-saṁjñikam
- (Bg. 6.20-23)
"Established thus, one never departs from the truth, and upon gaining this, he thinks there is no greater gain. Being situated in such a position, one is never shaken, even in the midst of greatest difficulty. This, indeed, is actual freedom from all miseries arising from material contact."
Prabhupāda: Purport.
Prabhupāda: Heaven is in the material world. Heaven is in the material world. You can get greater standard of life, greater duration of life, that's all. Higher standard of life. Just like Brahmā. Brahmā's one day you cannot calculate. He's so powerful, how he's created this universe. But he is in the material world. He's also a living entity like us, but very exalted. So he cannot get the post of Brahmā. But he can get life in higher planetary system. That is certain. That is explained in the, find out that verse. That is explained in the...um. That verse, yoga-bhraṣṭo 'bhijāyate śucīnāṁ śrīmatāṁ gehe (BG 6.41). But he did not understand Bhagavad-gītā, that's a fact.
Guest (1): But what about this position of Vālmīki or Rāmāyaṇa?
Prabhupāda: (Hindi)
Guest: Greater productions is one of the keys to lower prices.
Prabhupāda: This is one of the businessman's tricks. When there is new harvest they purchase and keep it and they keep the stock.
Lady Guest: Store it.
Prabhupāda: And when the prices are high they sell it. Now the same process suppose if I want to hold stock, say 100 tons of rice, so I have no money, if I have got 25% price the bank will advance me 75% so I hold the stock.
Guest: Now it is an offense to hold the stock.
Prabhupāda: That is going on in black.
Prabhupāda: That is their argument. Then what is the standard of that aspect? Just like in the material world we see, somebody richer than others. This is also aspect of material situation. So if one is millionaire, he is better than a person who has got a few coins. So similarly, your realization of God and my realization of God, different. So I may be greater realized than you. What do you say, theologian?
Prajāpati: Well, today, Prabhupāda most of the literature is written on subjects of death of God, an eclipse of God, the fact that the people in general, it's a secular society and no one is even discussing God.
Prabhupāda: That means they have failed. After discussing when they could not find out actually what is God, they have given up the idea. Failure.
Prabhupāda: No no, what is their value? When they are sanctioning abortion, homosex, now they are finished. They have no value.
Karandhara: Well, most or a greater proportion of the traditional Christians condemn homosex and abortion. A good quantity of the traditional Christians, they condemn abortion and homosex.
Prabhupāda: Yes, they are good, but mostly, as you were telling me that, that Pope is disgusted... Yes. Nobody cares for the Bible or the Pope. That is everywhere, not only Christian. Actually there is no religion at the present moment. All animals. We don't blame only the Christians. The Hindus, Muslim, everyone. They have lost all religion.
Prabhupāda: Eh? Yes. Because... Therefore acintya. How great He is, how great fortunate He is, that you cannot think of, you cannot estimate. That is called acintya. Acintya means I cannot conceive, I cannot estimate. Not only I, any big personality within this universe. Just like Brahmā says, "The others may say that he knows you, but so far I am concerned, I do not know you." That is inconceivable. Brahmā, the greatest personality within this universe, he also admits that "Others may say that he knows what You are, but from my personal experience, I say I do not know anything." We can simply partially see. Parāsya śaktiḥ. Just like we are seeing this material nature, partial exhibition of His potencies. This is one of the potencies, but He has got many potencies. Parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate (Cc. Madhya 13.65, purport). This material nature is only... This is also inferior potency. Apareyam. Bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ (BG 7.4). This material nature is made of earth, water, air, fire, ether, mind intelligence, ego. All these eight elements are separated inferior energy, and how much superior energies He has got. The superior energy is supposed to be the spiritual world, manifestation of the spiritual world. So if in the inferior material energy there are so many wonderful things, just imagine how much greater important wonderful things are there in the spiritual energy, which is called superior.
Prabhupāda: Far, far greater.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, far different. It can be immediately on the...
Prabhupāda: Just like Kṛṣṇa says, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti (BG 4.9), "Immediately comes to Me." So just see the velocity. Tyaktvā deham. As soon as he gives up this body, immediately goes to Kṛṣṇa. So see... Where is Kṛṣṇa? You cannot estimate even this material world. And then you enter the spiritual world. And then you go to the highest planet of the spiritual world, Goloka Vṛndāvana. So you cannot calculate how far it is, neither by driving your aeroplane of mind and vāyu, you can reach there. But the soul is so powerful that immediately goes there. Just like mind. You are here, many thousand miles away, 25,000 miles away in somewhere, immediately goes, mind goes.
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: ...to understand Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa says mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7), there is no more greater truth than Me. Bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva-loka-maheśvaram (BG 5.29), I am the Lord of all the planetary systems, sarva-loka. So why should you go to others if you think that Kṛṣṇa is God, there is no greater personality than Kṛṣṇa? Take the instruction from Kṛṣṇa. It is very easy.
Guest (1): Where is Kṛṣṇa?
Prabhupāda: Huh? To take instruction from Kṛṣṇa.
Guest (1): Of course. As much as He allows me.
Prabhupāda: So, He allows everything. What is the difficulty? Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66), you give up everything just surrender unto Me. So if you surrender (indistinct), but if you don't that is your business.
Prabhupāda: ...follower of yours.
Dr. Patel: O.K., I am follower.
Prabhupāda: You are, but, I mean to say, majority.
Dr. Patel: Majority, greater majority of we follow. But there is a smaller majority followers minor...
Prabhupāda: That is a...
Dr. Patel: Minority follow big number. That is where our question is. And come what may, you may say anything. If you open a single temple... (break) ...ancient religion, even though they are Muslims.
Prabhupāda: And Java.
Prabhupāda: Oh, so do it. (break) ...bhakti's, as I explained, apratihatā. Any condition, bhakti can be executed. The example is given: Just like Rūpa Gosvāmī and Rāmānanda Rāya. Rāmānanda Rāya was gṛhastha and governor, and he was very comfortably situated. And Rūpa Gosvāmī was living underneath a tree every night. And both of them were equally... Rather, Rāmānanda Rāya was accepted in greater position than Rūpa Gosvāmī. Caitanya Mahāprabhu was in renounced order of life, but He gave even better position to Rāmānanda Rāya than Rūpa Gosvāmī. And Rāmānanda Rāya was a gṛhastha. He was not even a brāhmaṇa. And governor, very opulent. Very comfortable situation. You know this?
Guest (2): Yes.
C. Hennis: Well, I think that the International Labor Organization is devoted to the reduction of inequalities between the different classes of men with a view to getting them all a better share of the good things of life, and by that, they may begin to reach a greater degree of human happiness, as they understand it, as the people themselves understand it. It may be that they don't understand it well.
Prabhupāda: No. Nature's way is not better share, but equal share. Just like when you take foodstuff, put it in the stomach, and when it is easily digested and transformed into different secretion and comes to the heart and becomes blood, there is equal distribution. Not that because brain is first-class, therefore the blood transformation to the brain should go more. No. Then it will be blood pressure, high blood pressure. This is nature's way, that... But when the energy goes to the brain, it acts differently. When the energy goes to the hands, it acts differently. The electricity energy is the same, but sometimes by working on the dictaphone, sometimes on the microphone, sometimes in electric heater, sometimes in refrigerator... The different apparatuses are there, but the energy is the same, equal. In that sense, the communistic idea that whatever energy is there, whatever resources are there, they should be equally distributed, that is nature's way.
Nitāi: "The general mass of people, unless they are trained systematically for a higher standard of life in spiritual values, are no better than animals, and in this verse they have been particularly put on the level of dogs, hogs, camels and asses. Modern university education practically prepares one to acquire a doggish mentality to accept the service of a greater master. Like the dogs, after finishing so-called education, the so-called educated persons move from door to door with applications for some service,..."
Prabhupāda: At least, we have got this experience in India. There are so many unemployed, educated. Because they have been educated as dog, they must find out a master. Otherwise, they have no independent power to work. Dog, unless he finds out a very nice master, it is street dog, loitering in the street.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Yogeśvara: He says: But that's not a proof, just to say that there are greater number.
Karandhara: He was trying to submit it as a proof just a minute ago.
Prabhupāda: Now, sometimes he is going this side, sometimes goes that side. Sometimes he says, "Mass of people," and again he says, "Not the number of people." What is mass of people? That is the number of people. (French)
Pṛthu Putra: He says, for example, he can see the mass of people in Italy, they are Catholic. But that doesn't mean he's going to be impressed by the Catholic philosophy.
Prabhupāda: Now, now, we have to... He was comparing that the mass of people, they take to Ramakrishna. That I have proved. They're not, the mass of people, not at all interested... That I have proved. That is my answer. (French)
Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: The example is that this body, there is a living force within the body which is causing it to move and to work, and that living force is the soul. And when the soul leaves this body, then the body is no longer moving and eating and talking and hearing and seeing. So in the same way in this universe there is a greater spiritual person, and His body, in a sense, is this whole universe, and it is moving on the same principle because He is the supreme consciousness.
Deshimaru: But what do you know about the soul leaving the body? Maybe when the body leaves the soul, the soul also dies.
Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: The point is that body and soul are two things.
Deshimaru: I think it is same thing.
Prabhupāda: You think, but how you can prove?
Deshimaru: How you can prove that the body...?
Prabhupāda: Yes, you cannot prove. When the soul is gone...
Prabhupāda: No, no. The dog has no greater intelligence. Therefore he sleeps under some bush very comfortably. But man has made very nice building, and another man destroys it by bombing. So the dog's intelligence is better or the man's intelligence is better? (German) (break)
Pṛthu: So she says that the man, by his intelligence, will go on, go on inventing some things which will destroy, and...
Prabhupāda: So is that very good intelligence? (German)
Pṛthu: So she says that this intelligence is actually not good. She says this intelligence...
Prabhupāda: Then what is the use of getting better intelligence than the dog? (German) (break)
Prabhupāda: That's all. Everything stated. Find out that verse. Raso 'ham apsu kaunteya prabhāsmi śaśi-sūryayoḥ. (pause) Who will not respect Jesus Christ? He sacrificed everything for God, even his life. So who is that rascal that he'll not respect to Jesus Christ. What did he do wrong to the human society? He did everything for the good of the human society. Oh, I have got very, very, great respect for Lord Jesus Christ. Not only... Every, I mean to say, God conscious man, he must have respect for Jesus Christ. There is no doubt about it. My Guru Mahārāja had very great respect for Muhammad, Jesus Christ... We pray Lord Buddha. Although he preached atheistic philosophy, but we know that he's incarnation of God. Keśava dhṛta-buddha-śarīra jaya jagadīśa hare. So a Vaiṣṇava is godly. He is qualified with all good qualities. That is Vaiṣṇava. That is Vaiṣṇava. He knows the value of each and everything. Therefore he's godly. And therefore to offer respect to Vaiṣṇava is also a great qualification. Even to offer respect to the Vaiṣṇavas is greater qualification than one who simply offers respect to God.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: No, no, there is proof. It is not emotion. What you say, you have no proof, but what I say I have got proof. What you say, you become your own authority. But what I say, I have got greater authority. Just like two lawyers speaking before the court—the lawyer who gives quotation from the authority, he gains the case.
Professor: Do you have any evidence?
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.
Professor: Would you tell us your experiences in that field?
Prabhupāda: Yes, that, of course, it will take time for you to understand. Because unless you are lawyer, you cannot understand while the other lawyer is giving quotation. But the court will accept.
Rāmeṣvara: Prabhupāda, in the Ādi-līlā, you wrote that the Communist movement is greater than the capitalist movement because there are more śūdras than vaiśyas so that in a war between Communism and capitalism, the Communists would win.
Prabhupāda: Naturally. They are in greater number.
Rāmeṣvara: But these modern wars are fought with missiles and bombs more than armies.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Formerly, also, there were brahmāstra, fire, firearms, brahmāstra. (break) ...problems that we are facing, they were also in the past under different name, different form.
Nalinī-kānta: (break) ...Communists win, that will not stop our preaching?
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Jagajīvana: Was this during a lecture?
Prabhupāda: Yes. I was not... One of my old brother, he, he wanted to speak something. So I leaned my... I immediately became... (laughter) So he chastised him more than me.
Devotee (2): When Lord Caitanya chastised someone more than Advaita Ācārya, Advaita felt that He had been neglected 'cause he had not received a greater chastisement.
Prabhupāda: He wanted to be chastised, so Caitanya fulfilled His desire.
Prabhupāda: Brahman means the greatest, so as the sky, to our experience the sky is greater. What is the sky? The sky is a combination of small atoms. Do you know that? So if the sky is Brahman, then it is a combination of small atoms, then the small atoms are also Brahman? Just like a huge stack of rice, they are called rice, and a small grain of rice, that is also rice. So therefore there are two kinds of Brahman—the component parts of the Brahman they are also Brahman, and whole Brahman is also Brahman. Do you follow?
Kim: I hear the words.
Prabhupāda: Why don't you understand?
Kim: I follow the analogy of the rice.
Prabhupāda: But God can swallow millions of mountains. That is God. Your conception is: mountain is very great. But our conception is: God is so great that He can swallow millions of mountains. So whose greatness is greater, the mountain's or God's?
Jesuit: Well it's a different order altogether, one's...
Prabhupāda: "God is great," means whatever greatness, just as sky is the great, there are millions of sky, that is God's...
Jesuit: That's all in the material world.
Prabhupāda: Material and spiritual, we both speak. "God is great," means He's materially great and spiritually great. That is His greatness. If you think that He's spiritually great and materially small, that is not great. That is not greatness.
Sabhāpati: So who is the greater rascal, the material scientist or the...
Prabhupāda: Yes, everyone. Everyone who... That is the statement. Mūḍha. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). This class of men, they do not recognize God. Who? Those who are sinful, rascals, lowest of the mankind. Such people do not recognize God. Mūḍhas. (indistinct) educated. No, that education means false education. Real education is taken away by māyā. Real education means to understand God. Vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyaḥ (BG 15.15). If one does not understand what is God, his education is useless. It has no meaning. What is that education? Will that education save him from death? Then what is the value of his education? Your real problem is birth, death, old age, and disease. Can this material education stop it? Is the scientist able to stop one's old age? And does anyone, man, any man, wants to become old? No, nobody wants. Everyone wants to keep himself youthful. But can the science stop this, that he will not become old? He must become old.
Prabhupāda: But there is austerities.
Paramahaṁsa: Yeah, actually they end up performing greater austerity.
Prabhupāda: You have to earn money with so much labor and spend it for nothing.
Paramahaṁsa: Billions of dollars. Some of them are working like madmen.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Paramahaṁsa: They work all day and most of the night. (break)
Prabhupāda: ...expedition is exposition of the scientists: useless. But these materialistic persons will be cheated again and again. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). The scientists will propose something else and they will accept. They will never say that "You are failure in your moon expedition. Why you are proposing again something nonsense?" They will never ask. They will pay me, "Yes."
Prabhupāda: ...which is fact? The dreams and phases of different life while passing through, they are facts or I am fact? What is your answer? We are teaching that, you take care of the fact, not of the dreams. That is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. That is the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā, dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). We are changing circumstances. The circumstances are not fact but the whole world is taking care of the circumstances not of the sheer fact. This is the defect of modern civilization. We are very much serious about the passing on circumstances, but we are not serious about the person who is going through the circumstances. This is the whole defect of modern civilization. And that is the beginning of real life. If we take care of the circumstances, that is being done by the cats and dogs and hogs, everyone. Where to find eatables, where to find sex, where to find shelter for sleeping, and how to defense—these circumstances are understood by the animals. There is no need of education. Just like this morning I pointed out. The bird is catching a small fish, "Fut!" He knows where to find out his eatable. And that you cannot do. You also eat fish, but you jump over and take a fish. You cannot do that. But he can do that. He is more expert than you. (guests chuckle) Yes. In the troubled water, he is flying. He can see a small fish and immediately pick it up. Can you do that? So he is more advanced in civilization. (laughter) He knows his techniques. He is greater scientist than you. You cannot do this.
Prabhupāda: So in this way if you read simply Bhagavad-gītā and separating the word Kṛṣṇa, it is God's word. All factual. So why should you not take the science of God?
Dr. Judah: Yes.
Prabhupāda: God can say that there is no more greater principle than Me. Is it not? You may accept anyone God, but God can say that. So that is the statement in Bhagavad-gītā:
- mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat
- kiñcid asti dhanañjaya
- mayi sarvam idaṁ protaṁ
- sūtre maṇi-gaṇā iva
- (BG 7.7)
Every word is God's word. You may accept Kṛṣṇa God or not, the words are God's words. That is Bhagavad-gītā. (break)
Bahulāśva: ...statements like that in the Bible, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: Hm? Hm?
Prabhupāda: ...Kṛṣṇa, his all sinful reactions stopped. Kṛṣṇeti varṇa-dvayam. Rūpa Gosvāmī says, "What nectar is there in these two alphabets, kṛṣ-ṇa!" Kṛṣṇeti varṇa-dvayam. (break) ...greater enthusiasm you go on with book distribution. They will be benefited, and distributors also will be benefited. Kṛṣṇa says, ya idaṁ paramaṁ guhyaṁ mad-bhakteṣv abhidhāsyati (Bg 18.68). Na ca tasmān manuṣyeṣu kaścin me priya-kṛttamaḥ (BG 18.69). If you want to become quickly recognized by Kṛṣṇa, then make propaganda, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. And once recognized by Kṛṣṇa, then your going back to home, back to Godhead, guaranteed. (break) ...took from London to here come?
Ghanaśyāma: How many hours?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Ghanaśyāma: One the plane it took about ten hours.
Prabhupāda: Ten hours. From London to Chicago. Not much, ten hours. (break) ...staying at Bhaktivedanta Manor? No.
Prabhupāda: Why do they not understand, by nature's discrimination the woman is put into greater difficulty by bearing child?
Brahmānanda: That is the one thing they cannot avoid. They cannot escape.
Prabhupāda: Why this arrangement is by nature? How they can change it?
Brahmānanda: Someone was telling me that there have been many instances that when women are being taken to the hospital to give birth to their children—they're in the ambulance, and they are experiencing the pains—that they are cursing their husbands, "Why you have given me this pain?"
Prabhupāda: Yes, because birth pain is very severe.
Brahmānanda: They vow never to have sex again at that time.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Anything genuine is easy. Anything hodgepodge, that is not good. We don't recommend hodgepodge.
Prof. Hopkins: So the advantage then, or the greater value is that it is focused and clear rather than a hodgepodge where the goal and the activities are not clear.
Prabhupāda: The hodgepodge has killed the whole world, that so many pseudo-religious systems. People are misled.
Prof. Hopkins: So the truth may be there somewhere...
Prabhupāda: Truth is everywhere.
Prof. Hopkins: But you can't find it.
Prabhupāda: Just like there is butter in the milk but the milk is not butter. You churn it and then the butter will be there. Similarly, in every religious system... Every milk there is butter, but churning the milk and giving direct delivery of butter, that is the Śrīmad Bhagavad-gītā and Bhāgavata.
Prabhupāda: Purport.
Satsvarūpa: "Every man everywhere is trying to obtain the greatest amount of sense enjoyment by various endeavors. Some of them are busy engaged in trade, industry, economic development, political supremacy, etc., and some of them are engaged in fruitive work to become happy in the next life by attaining higher planets. It is said that on the moon the inhabitants are fit for greater sense enjoyment by drinking soma-rasa, and the Pitṛloka is obtained by good charitable work. So there are various programs for sense enjoyment, either during this life or in the life after death. Some are trying to reach the moon or other planets by some mechanical arrangement, for they are very anxious to get into such planets without doing good work. But it is not to happen.
Prabhupāda: And all the oceans? Here is the highway, and there is the ocean. Which is important? (laughter) You might have created these highways, but another engineer has created that ocean, side by side. So who will get the greater credit?
Devotee (4): They say that there's a limited amount of resources here on this planet, that unless we use these resources wisely, then they will all be used up. They say that there's very limited amounts, so therefore they must be careful.
Prabhupāda: But this... Who supplied the resources of this ocean? They say that water is combination of hydrogen and oxygen, so wherefrom this hydrogen-oxygen supply came?
Devotee (4): There is another group. They call themselves Zero Population Growth. So their idea is that there's too many people on this planet. So therefore either they want... What they want to do is that they want to increase the number of deaths...
Prabhupāda: Death.
Prabhupāda: "Money means happiness." This is the civilization. And after getting money, drink wine and topless, bottomless, and go to hell." That's all. This is their position, mūḍha, rākṣasa, thinking that "I am living this fifty years or hundred years so luxuriantly. That is the fulfillment of life." Because he does not know the life is eternal, one spot he is taking very important. The meaning of life, what is the aim of life—"Don't bother. Enjoy." And what is that enjoyment? Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukham (SB 7.9.45). Is that enjoyment? (break) ...used in the Bhagavad-gītā, mūḍha, it is very appropriate. No knowledge. Not only here, throughout the whole universe, even in the upper planetary system, they are also engaged in the same foolishness. Greater fool and a smaller fool. (break) ...sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye. That part is Canada?
Ambarīṣa: Over here where the lights are, that is Canada.
Prabhupāda: So in my absence you read the books. What I talk, I have written in the books. That's all.
Indian Man (2): Personally, we think more greater.
Prabhupāda: That's all right. But still, you can associate with me by reading my books.
Indian Man (2): I am reading books Prabhupāda. That books are your very, very good and most blessful to us. It is the biggest good will upon whole of universe at present, I think. By that knowledge, from dog to, I have become... I feel like I have something in my property of your books in my home. That's the only property I feel that I have, this one. I was misled, misguided in this country.
Prabhupāda: It is not duty? This is the main duty. This is the main duty. Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām (BG 18.66). We have taken responsibility for Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. We are doing. Why we are traveling all over the world thrice in a year? We have taken the responsibility. Otherwise, who is, an old man, he'll take such responsibility? That is a greater responsibility. When you become a big officer of the government, it means you overburdened with responsibility, not this flickering resp... Here the material respons... means it has no use. You are simply wasting time. And here is real responsibility and real life. That I explained to that lady, that "Even if you take respons... what can you do? You cannot do anything." The example I gave, that "You have taken responsibility for your son's disease. He is suffering. You have brought good physician, you have brought good medicine, everything, but what can you do? In spite of your all responsibility, your son dies. Then where is the value of your responsibility?"
Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore Kṛṣṇa has imposed death, that "You may make your plan as free man, but you'll not be allowed to stay. I'll kick you out." These poor men, they did not think of it, that "I am making so nice plan, but at any moment I'll be kicked out. So where is my freedom?" Dull brain does not think of it. A prisoner, if he thinks that he is free to act, is it not foolishness? A prisoner, in prison, and if he thinks that he is free to act, is it not foolishness? So that they do not think. Therefore Kṛṣṇa has grouped them: mūḍha, these rascals, mūḍha. They conduct freedom movement. Just like in our country also, before this British Empire or this Mohammedan Empire there was no knowledge about this freedom. Indian people never thought of freedom. They know that "We are not free. Where is the question of freedom?" These things have come from the foreign countries, freedom movement. What is freedom? Where are you free? You are completely under the laws of nature. Where is your freedom? So they were thinking of greater freedom, to get out of the clutches of the laws of nature. That is real freedom. What is this freedom? From frying pan to the fire? (chuckles) Now we have freedom means from frying pan to the fire. Formerly there was one viceroy. Now in each state three dozen viceroys, and you have to maintain that.
Prabhupāda: (break) ...create another danger. Just like airplane. It is comfortable. You can quickly go from one place to another. But as soon as on the plane, immediately your life is at risk. There is no certainty. So this is the way of material world. You create some comfort and you create some greater danger also. Side by side. It cannot be unhampered comfort. That is not possible. You create a motorcar—the same thing—you drive very speedy and you meet accident. Railway, the accident. There was no need. You produce your food locally and produce your milk. Then eat, drink, and live comfortably. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. That is wanted. Make your life successful. Yad uttama-śloka-guṇānuvarṇanam (SB 1.5.22). And if you have got education, then describe the glories of the Lord by your scientific and educational qualification. (break) The rain is coming. We can go this way. Yad uttama-śloka-guṇānuvarṇanam (SB 1.5.22). (break)
Prabhupāda: No question of creating. They have destroyed themselves. Save yourself from destruction. Then you talk of destruction. You destroy. That's all right. But you will be destroyed by some other greater power. What you are going to do that? What you have done for that purpose? You destroy. That is going on, nature's way. I am killing somebody, somebody is killing me. That is nature's way. So what is your special credit? There is no credit. There is no credit. You save yourself not to be destroyed by others. "I can destroy others but nobody can destroy me"—that Hiraṇyakaśipu tried. But that is not possible. Ultimately he was destroyed. That's all.
Devotee (2): They don't seem to care too much about the future.
Prabhupāda: That is foolishness. Therefore we call them rascals. Therefore we have given this position, rascal, that's all. Talk too much, do nothing—that is rascal. (bugles sound in background) Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa... Hm?
Dr. Patel: The great-grandfather of modern science, Einstein, did he not believe in God? He made darśana of God everywhere. Even in explosion of atom he saw it. Even in his theory of relativity, he finally said it was wrong. "All things are relative to God." That is what he said. And I don't think there is a greater scientist than Einstein in the modern times.
Prabhupāda: There are some scientists...
Dr. Patel: If other fellows say any damn thing, that does not mean... Even though he may be a Nobel Prize winner, that does not mean that he is really a true scientist. He may be all right. He is looking through a long narrow tube in his own subject, a specialist. I have my definition about a specialist is a one who sees through long narrow tube and he got this much vision of the horizon. Such a man may be saying like this to you. I don't think we should deride that science... Scientists are trying to approach God through their own way, sir. That is what I think.
Prabhupāda: That is rascaldom.
| Page Title: | Greater (Conversations 1968 - 1975) |
| Compiler: | Visnu Murti, RupaManjari |
| Created: | 09 of Nov, 2012 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=61, Let=0 |
| No. of Quotes: | 61 |