Going to the moon (Conversations 1968 - 1975)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview -- March 9, 1968, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: There are different grades of life. So we get information from authoritative books that there are 8,400,000's of different grades of life, and there are 900,000's of aquatic life, two million species of plants and trees, about eleven hundred thousand species of life of birds, three million types of species of beast, and 400,000 species of this human body. Out of that 400,000's, different kinds of human bodies, the civilized body is a great boon. At that time we can make further progress. Either we can transfer to other planets... The standard of living, comforts, are many, many thousands times better than this planet. But in this book, Bhagavad-gītā As It Is, we get information that within this material universe, wherever you go, either you remain in this planet or you go to the moon planet or to the sun planet, or there are millions and trillions of planets... The highest planetary system is called Brahmaloka. There the duration of life is very, very great. You cannot calculate even twelve hours of their days. These are described in this book, Bhagavad-gītā As It Is.

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Reporter: Yes. I told Dan that was what I was interested in. I have background information on the movement, for instance, and yourself.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So far the movement is concerned, it has nothing to do with the moon planetary journey, it has nothing to do. But in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, the authoritative Vedic scripture which we generally follow, in that scripture there is statement that for promoting oneself to the moon planet, one has to accustom himself to the different kind of worshiping process. Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā it is stated that yānti deva-vratā devān (BG 9.25). Those who are worshiper of the demigods, they are promoted to different planets of the particular demigods. Yānti deva-vratā devān pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ. And those who are worshiper of the pitṛs, or forefathers, they go to that planet. Similarly, one who is engaged in worshiping the Supreme Lord, he also goes to the supreme planet. These informations are there in the Bhagavad-gītā. And so far moon planet is concerned, that is within this material world. Those who are pious actors, those who are engaged in pious activities according to Vedic rituals, they can go to the moon planet. That is stated in the...

Reporter: Those who are engaged in what activities?

Prabhupāda: Pious. There are two kinds of activities: vicious and pious.

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Pious. There are two kinds of activities: vicious and pious.

Reporter: Pious and...

Prabhupāda: Vicious.

Reporter: Vicious?

Prabhupāda: Yes. So those who are engaged in vicious activities, they cannot go to that moon planet. And it is also stated that if somebody goes to the moon planet he gets duration of life very, very long period.

Reporter: If someone goes to the moon planet...

Prabhupāda: Yes. He has a long duration of life there in that moon planet.

Reporter: I guess I didn't understand.

Prabhupāda: Just like we are living here at most hundred years, but they can live there ten thousand years. Do you follow? Just like different forms of body have got different duration of life. A dog lives for six years or a cow lives for twenty years, a man lives for hundred years. Similarly, the residents of moon planet, they live for very, very long time, ten thousands of years.

Reporter: The residents of the moon live for a long time? Thousands of years?

Prabhupāda: Thousands of years.

Reporter: Now are you talking about...

Prabhupāda: This information we get from Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, this book. I have rendered into English.

Reporter: Which book is this?

Prabhupāda: Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Leave there and reach there also. Reach.

Reporter: Reach, I see. But would the flight that was just completed, that doesn't contradict with anything in this book? I mean they were within, I don't know, so many miles...

Prabhupāda: But so far we have got information, no flight has been successful to land there till now. So I do not think how they are going to be successful in the future. This process, just like we are going from one place to another by motor car or by airplane, this process will not help us to go to the moon planet. The process is different as described in the Vedic literature. One has to qualify.

Reporter: What would be, when you say impossible for one to land or to reach the moon's surface.

Prabhupāda: Just like why you speak of moon? Suppose in the ocean, in the ocean you can land by some artificial means for some time, but it is not suitable for human being to live on the ocean. Apart from moon planet, you take the ocean, water, ocean.

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Reporter: If the space program, either the Russian or the American program, which have plans to try to land on the moon and return safely, if this is successful, do you think this accomplishment would hurt the Kṛṣṇa movement in the United States? It would contradict Vedic...

Prabhupāda: Why? First thing is even they are successful, according to our principle, it is simply waste of time. Because we are not concerned even with the moon planet. We are trying to go to the planet of Kṛṣṇa from where nobody returns back to this wretched condition of life. So the wretched condition of life is as good in moon planet as it is in this earth planet. And do you know what is the wretched condition of life? Yes. The birth, death, old age and disease. This is the wretched condition of life. So you cannot avoid this wretched condition of life in the moon planet also. There is birth, death, old age and disease. But where we are trying to go by Kṛṣṇa consciousness, there is no birth, death, old age and disease. So even there are, people are successful to go to the moon planet, what connection we have got there? We are not at all concerned with any planet where there is birth, death and old age and disease. Even in the highest planet of this universe.

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Reporter: If I think the spacesuit is suitable and, say, if I am an astronaut and I land there, I can land there?

Prabhupāda: If it is suitable. First thing that if it is suitable you can land. But to my opinion it is not suitable. Therefore you cannot land.

Reporter: Well... So then you are not saying then that it would be impossible for...

Prabhupāda: That I never say. I say in the beginning that in order to enter moon planet you have to get a suitable type of body. That suitable type of body is not that spacesuit. Therefore the conclusion is that you cannot enter with this spacesuit. Is it clear?

Reporter: That part is clear, but not if other questions are asked.

Prabhupāda: Other questions you may ask. Other, that is future hope. That is not a fact. You are trusting in future that with this spacesuit you will be able to enter there. That you are believing. But similarly, I have got my belief from the authoritative scripture that you cannot.

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Hayagrīva: He has some doubts about the means they're using to go there. He doesn't think that the...

Reporter: I think what... I think we have to carry it further enough so that we can tell whether, for one thing whether I have a story or not. If it's felt if you have doubts that it can be done, that's one thing. But if you have great confidence that it can never be done except by changing one's body...

Prabhupāda: No, I don't say that. I say that in order to enter into the... Just try to understand me clearly. In order to enter the moon planet you have got to prepare yourself for a suitable body. Is that clear? If you, by some way or other, you make that suitable body you can enter. But the present body which you have manufactured, the spacesuit, is not suitable.

Reporter: Okay, then when I try to carry it further, if they use the present body and do, are successful...

Prabhupāda: That they could not do till now. That is future contemplation. Because even going up to sixty miles off they could not. Therefore this is not suitable. Now you say also, just like they didn't have the ticket. The further arrangement is still waiting. That means this is not suitable. This is... We just try to convince you.

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No. Danger... When the scientists said that 1965 they would go. Did not happen. What danger has happened?

Reporter: The danger to the faith of those who felt, say, in jehovah's Witnesses, those who believed that the jehovah's Witness knew and nothing happens. They say, "Well..."

Prabhupāda: But they're still believing. First of all, they say that 1965 they're going to the moon planet. That has not happened. Now you say 1975. So they are still believing. So a class of men will always be cheated like that. A class of men. So there will be no danger of cheating such persons.

Hayagrīva: I don't think Swami Bhaktivedanta's students would be swayed one way or the other because their faith is in Kṛṣṇa and in the spiritual master and it wouldn't be swayed by man going to the moon or not going to the moon. These are very incidental.

Reporter: No, but ...only if say a spiritual master of a faith made very definite statements about what man could or could not achieve, if a spiritual master were to say man cannot achieve this-period. And then man went ahead and achieved it, there would be a crisis.

Prabhupāda: The spiritual master does not say such nonsense things. Man can achieve in a suitable body. Why don't you say that? But that suitable body is not...

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Reporter: Yeah, well that's... When I talk to you, I find that the way you say it, if after the events are achieved, there could be explanations for it and there would be no crisis in faith.

Hayagrīva: He never came out and said that it's absolutely impossible.

Reporter: Right. Okay. Well thank you very much. I appreciate your tolerance of all my questions and everything.

Prabhupāda: You take this orange.

Hayagrīva: Do you want to take this, read these booklets? This one's just a running history of the Society and this is the magazine. So if you'd like, you can take it.

Reporter: Okay. Fine.

Prabhupāda: Our Kṛṣṇa... You should kindly note it that our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement has nothing to do with this moon planet. But we are not aiming to go to the moon planet.

Reporter: I realize that. Yes. Your name was Howard...?

Hayagrīva: Wheeler.

Reporter: Wheeler? Thank you very much. Okay. Thank you.

Prabhupāda: Thank you very much. (end)

Press Interview -- December 30, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Now for our disciples, we don't give anything cheap. Our first condition is character, moral character. You see? So unless one is accepting moral character, we don't initiate, don't allow him in this institution. And this Maharishi was, "Oh, you do whatever you like. You simply pay me thirty-five dollars and I'll give you some mantra." You see. So people wanted to be cheated, and so many cheaters come. They do not wish to undergo some disciplinary action, you see? Anything. They have got money. They think that "I shall pay," and immediately he'll get the money.

Journalist: Instant heaven.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is their position. Just like people are trying to go to the moon planet. I have given my opinion. You have seen in the Los Angeles Times? This chance is very remote.

Journalist: Oh?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Why not? Suppose in your country, you have got some quota for immigration. Within this planet, if somebody comes, without your immigration department's order, nobody can enter. How do you expect in that planet where the people are more advanced, they are called demigods, they are living for ten thousand years, how you expect that you go and you are immediately enter into the moon planet? And they are selling tickets, reservation. You see? Everything, they make a fun of it, you see?

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg -- May 12, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: Absolute Truth means one. So the knowledge of the Absolute Truth is one. Vadanti tat tattva-vidas (SB 1.2.11). Tattva-vidas means those who are in knowledge of the Absolute Truth, they say that Absolute Truth is one. But He's realized in three phases. Brahmeti paramātmeti bhagavān iti śabdyate. Brahman means impersonal, and Paramātmā is localized, and Bhagavān, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So these are different stages. Just like the sun. The first experience of sun is this impersonal effulgence all over the sky. But that is not very important than the sun globe. Because it is from the sun globe the effulgence is coming. So anyone will understand that this sunshine is not so important as the sun globe. And if you approach the sun globe and if you penetrate into the sun, if you have got strength to go into the... Just like you are trying go to the moon planet. If you have got really scientific strength to go within the sun planet, then you'll find there is sun-god. That information we get from Bhagavad-gītā. Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1). "I told the sun-god Vivasvān first." So therefore there is a person. And why not a person? Your imagination is not ultimate truth. We get information from Kṛṣṇa, there is a person, Vivasvān. So there is a person, he's sitting there. Person, globe, sun, sunshine. Which is important? Which is important?

Allen Ginsberg: The person, the globe or the sunshine?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation With John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison -- September 11, 1969, London, At Tittenhurst:

Prabhupāda: So this theory that body is eternal..., soul is eternal and body is temporary, that's a fact. Therefore this life, this present life, is meant for manufacturing the next body. That is Vedic knowledge. We are creating... Just like a boy. He is studying very nicely. So he's creating next body, a very educated young body. By education he can get nice job, nice place, nice position. So he's creating his next body. Similarly, we are creating our next body according to our karma. So Kṛṣṇa says that "You create a body so that you can come to Me." Mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām. The whole Vedic philosophy is that if you want to go to some planet—just like people are trying to go to moon planet. So you have to create a body like that. You cannot go in this body. They're attempting to go with this body. That will be failure. It will be not possible. In every planet the atmosphere, the..., everything is different. So you have to create a different body to go to a particular type of planet. There are millions and thousands of planets. Moon planet is one of them.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Therefore, simply for decoration of the body, that is not human civilization. (indistinct) civilized activity is going on on the basis of keeping this body in comfort. Yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke (SB 10.84.13). (indistinct) everywhere attempt is being made how to keep this body comfortable. The karmīs, they are trying to elevate themselves to the heavenly planet. Enjoying here nicely, but they are performing great sacrifices, ritualistic ceremonies, and pious activities to elevate themselves to higher planetary system according to Vedas. Everywhere we go, material... These people are trying to go to the moon planet. But wherever you go, you cannot be any way comfortable. Therefore, Bhagavad-gītā says that janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). Intelligent person will see that "However comfortable I may be, I have to meet death." And in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, mṛtyuḥ sarva-haraś cāham (BG 10.34), "I am death." Death means to take away. Whatever you create, it will be taken away.

Room Conversation -- December 10, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: So if some man from a poor family becomes, wants to become a citizen of America, a rich man, it is not so easy. You have to undergo through so many things to get the citizenship. There are so many, that your country, yes, they have got big immigration department simply to consider this application of different countries for citizenship, or to immigrate. I have seen, in Montreal, people applying for citizenship or immigration, big line, very big line, and a similar immigration department in Canada, there is no problem. So people very much anxious to become citizens in America, because it's a rich country. So as there is restriction here in this place, in this planet, that you cannot enter any other country... If you think their country is very nice, actually, in comparison to other countries, there are so many facilities in America. At least, one can earn money like anything. So people are inclined to become citizen. But that is not easy, even within this planet. So how you will easily enter moon planet and other heavenly planets without being competent? It is not possible.

Room Conversation -- December 11, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: The same example: just like so-called scientists, Russian and American, for so many years they're trying to go to the moon planet, nearest planet. But here is no shelter. Actually, I do not know whether they have gone, but why they are coming back? Let them remain there, construct house there, there is everything. If there is no such possibility, why these rascals are going there? Practically, if it is full of dust only, why these rascals are going to see the dust every time? (laughter) Ask these rascals that "What benefit? You're spending so much money and going to the moon planet and touching, 'Now my flag is on the dust,' (laughter) and go back with little pebbles, 'Oh, we have gone.' " No. Moon-reaching day, holiday. Nixon, another rascal. Great rascal. Holiday. And what do you want there? Patanty adhaḥ. After so much endeavor, trying to go to the moon planet, they are failing. And what to speak of other planets? What to speak of the Brahmaloka, Tapaloka, Jana...? They are there. We are seeing every day, at night, there are so many. Who is going there? The nearest planet, which is about 200,000 miles, I think it is so, from here, the moon planet, and they cannot go. And what to speak of other planets? There are many. They do not..., cannot calculate how far they are, but we see every night there. So how imperfect knowledge they are. That is my point. And still they are going as scientists. Lokasya ajānataḥ. They are so fools and rascal, still they are passing on as scientists, big men, learned men. No. None of them. This is our challenge. None of them. And who is learned? Learned is Vyāsadeva. Learned is Kṛṣṇa.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- April 1, 1972, Sydney:

Prabhupāda: Change, I say. How the changes take place? You are changing. You are changing from your childhood to boyhood, boyhood to youthhood. So there is a plan. Unless there is plan, why one child is not, by chance, becomes immediately old. What the nonsense will reply? Let the rascal reply this, that here is a chance, that one child immediately becomes old man, by chance. Why there is process? This is plan. So you should have depth of knowledge, otherwise you will be carried away by these rascals. We cannot be carried away by these rascals. We never so easily believed that they are going to the moon planet. You see? We have to scrutinize everything. Yes. That is brahminical qualification. A brāhmaṇa will not accept anything simply because it is said by some rascal. A śūdra will accept because he has no intelligence. That is the difference between brāhmaṇa and śūdra. It is not a caste system. It is classi..., guṇa karma vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13), division of high qualities and actual activities according to that quality. They misinterpreted. Because by the influence of Kali-yuga everyone is śūdra, so he does not know what is the actually brahminical qualification.

Room Conversation -- April 1, 1972, Sydney:

Prabhupāda: At once. Yes. The newspaper said that "Mr. such and such went to moon planet." Oh, immediately believe. See? A newspaper, ten cent worth newspaper. And in the Bhagavad-gītā Kṛṣṇa says, yānti deva vratā devān: (BG 9.25) "One who can... One can go to the demigods planets by worshiping them. You can go, yānti deva vratā devān, as others. Similarly, one can come to Me by worshiping Me." Mad yājino 'pi yānti mām. So they never worshiped Chandra, and how they can go to the Chandra planet, or moon planet? Then Kṛṣṇa is false. Kṛṣṇa is imperfect. They become perfect. They are defying Kṛṣṇa's instruction. They have gone to moon planet. Then our whole propaganda, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, becomes bogus. Therefore I always protest.

Sudāmā: They have not gone.

Prabhupāda: They have not gone. We have got our tests. I am speaking from the very beginning, "They have not gone." And practically you see, even if you have gone, what utility you have made? They are simply planning, again planning. "We shall get petrol from there. We shall have defense from there." Simply bluffing, simply bluffing. The Americans will go to the moon planet to defend his country from the Russians. Just see. And we have to believe all these nonsense proposals. What defense they will do from there? Is it not the proposal? Yes.

Śyāmasundara: This morning you were saying that civilization means peace. So this is not civilization.

Prabhupāda: This is no civilization.

Interview -- July 5, 1972, New York:

Guest (2): What can appreciation of Kṛṣṇa do for the Americans (indistinct)?

Prabhupāda: That, that I have repeatedly said, that you Americans, you are..., you have already the grace of the Lord. According to our Vedic formula, when a man is born in rich family he is understood to be possessing the grace of the Lord. So you Americans, you have got sufficient riches, you are sons of rich men. So this is the grace of God, janma aiśvarya, to take birth in a high family, to possess riches; janmaiśvarya śruta (SB 1.8.26), to become learned scholar. Just like you are going to the moon planet. Your scientific knowledge is advanced. And śrī, śrī means beauty. So you are beautiful also. So considering all these four points, it is to be understood that you are in favorable condition, favorable consideration of the Absolute Truth Supreme Personality of Godhead. Now, if you take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness, then all your these material opulences plus Kṛṣṇa consciousness makes your life perfect.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Jayatīrtha: When I was in Chicago, the one section where the temple is close by, more than sixty percent of the people were heroin addicts in this one section. They were so much degraded. (indistinct conversation) I was reading in the newspaper that the astronauts that are going to the moon, they wanted to take wine with them, so that when they got to the moon they could celebrate their victory.

Prabhupāda: There is a story, (Sanskrit). One man said to his friend, "Oh, you are drinking. You will go to hell." "Oh, my father is also drinking." "Oh, he will also go to hell." "My mother is drinking." "Oh, she will also go to hell." "My brother is drinking." "Oh, he will also go to hell." In this way, the last fellow was, "Oh, everyone is going to hell, then hell is heaven. Why do you say hell? We shall live together and drink. Why do you call hell? This is heaven." (laughter)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is why association and company is so important.

Prabhupāda: So ignorance... It is folly to be wise, so ignorance is bliss. So drinking is heaven. Even they go to moon planet, there must be wine. Otherwise, how it is heaven? That is called punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30), chewing the chewed. If your wine is heaven, then why do you take so much trouble? Why don't you drink here? Such rascals they are. Why you spend so much money? No, the heaven will be taken in bottle.

Jayatīrtha: If they were actually going to the moon planet then they could enjoy the soma juice there (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: These rascals are... I'm doubtful whether they are going to moon planet or some hell planet. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇā (SB 5.18.12). Our only formula is anyone who is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he has no good qualities—we reject him, whatever he may be. He is rejected from the list of good men, immediately. He may be president or he may be this or that, it doesn't matter. Because he is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he is a third-class man, that's all. This is our certification. (break) These skyscraper buildings are no better than caves. They live here, and here is bathroom, here is kitchen, here is (indistinct) room, three inches. (laughter) Is that advanced civilization? Advanced civilization means every man must have sufficient space to live. Why do you create this path? People will recreate, they will feel repressed, so space is required for refreshment. So what is this civilization? Three inches room.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So due to a lack of morals, they cannot see the real side.

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, they are seeing only the caves. Just like they are going to the moon. They are going to the desert of the moon and they are concluding the moon is a desert. That's all. The other side is prohibited.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So they cannot go.

Prabhupāda: They cannot go because according to Vedic description, moon is a planet for demigods. So they have got better brain. So they saw that "These rascals are coming here. All right, let them go to desert side." They have got their machine also. If they have got better brain, they can divert you. Why not think in that way? Their theory is that all other planets there is no life. Only this planet is favored by God, there is life. We say even in the sun planet there is life. (break) (indistinct) Here is your transport(?). We are trying to send back to home, back to Godhead. This is real transport.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- April 28, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So here is water, here is desert. Why don't you do it? You cannot do anything. They are going to the moon planet, the dusty planet, to make it fertilized. Why don't you do here? Sahara desert, Arabian desert, or Rajasthan desert. And the sea water is there. Bring it, and make it fertile, fertilize. "Yes, in future." That's all. "We are trying." And immediately (indistinct): "Yes, yes, they are trying. Take all money. Take all money."

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They do not give up hopes.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They do not give up hopes.

Prabhupāda: Even hope, there is no hope.

Morning Walk -- April 28, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: What is the next line of that verse? Anyone remembers? No.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yesterday's?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (pause) This research work is kāma-karmabhiḥ. This, in the laboratory, research work, that is kāma-karmabhiḥ. They're planning something. That is kāma-karma. He, he does not take the planning of Kṛṣṇa. He makes his own plan. That is kāma-karma. Kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.20). In another place, it is said: When one is engaged in the matter of these unnecessary desires, he becomes lost of all intelligence. Kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.20). (pause) It is like the child's crying. The child is crying, asking mother: "Give me that moon." The mother gives a mirror. "Here is moon, my dear son." He takes the mirror. He sees the moon. "Oh, yes..." He has got the moon. It is not story. Now these rascals are going to the moon planet. Why they have stopped talking anymore?

Morning Walk -- April 28, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They're very curious to know what is going on there.

Prabhupāda: That means for their childish curiosity they're spending so much money. Just see the fun. To satisfy their curiosity, they're spending so much money. And when they're asked that: "There are so many poverty stricken countries. Help them." "No. No money."

Nīlakaṇṭha: Some people are very happy and they think: "Oh, my country has done this. They have gone to the moon. I am happy. I'm satisfied. I'm glad to be an American."

Prabhupāda: What's that?

Nīlakaṇṭha: Some people are very, the public, they're very satisfied: "Oh, I am an American, and we have done this. We have gone to the moon. We are so good."

Prabhupāda: Why don't you say: "We have gone to Kṛṣṇa-loka, Vṛndāvana, which you have no information"?

Brahmānanda: Then all their curiosity will be satisfied.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course -- May 17, 1973, Los Angeles:

Kṛṣṇa-Kāntī: They made a spaceship that they wanted to orbit around the earth so that they could send men and ship an outpost.

Karandhara: A house, station.

Kṛṣṇa-Kāntī: So they sent it up and it failed. It cost two billion dollars or something, squandered.

Prabhupāda: Just see why they are wasting time in that way? Money.

Kṛṣṇa-Kāntī: They were criticized in the paper.

Prabhupāda: Fool. Simply childish. Bālaka. What are they gaining? For the last, how many years they are trying? For going to the moon planet?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Russia started in 1957. First sputnik where Gagarin was there...

Prabhupāda: Twenty-five years. So they could not get anything, not a single farthing even. Still, they are doing. Just see, obstinacy. Punaḥ punaś carvita. This is called chewing the chewed. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). They will never be successful. So I am a layman. When I wrote that Easy Journey? In 1950, 67. How many years?

Karandhara: Six years.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Not 67, 57. Sixteen years before. They are all childish. I am a layman. It will never be successful. It is already written there in my Easy Journey to Other Planets. Here also, that, some press reporter asked me in San Francisco, when I landed, "What is your position about this moon planet?" "It is simply a waste of time and energy. That's all. You cannot go there."

Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London:

Lord Brockway: I wouldn't say it has convinced me one has to think...

Prabhupāda: No... Yes, one has to think, one has to consider. But this is the fact, that I have changed so many bodies, I remember them, but the bodies are not existing, I am existing. This is very simple philosophy. And it is stated, confirmed in Bhagavad-gītā, and it is accepted by all the ācāryas, learned scholars. So there is change of body or transferring from one body to another. That's a fact. Under the circumstances, we should consider what kind of body will be nice next. That is also stated in the Bhagavad-gītā.

yānti deva-vratā devān

pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ

bhūtāni yānti bhūtejyā

yānti mad-yājino 'pi mām

(BG 9.25)

Just like people are trying to go to the moon planet. So if you prepare yourself, you haven't got to take a machine and go to the moon planet. You can go to the moon planet. That is stated in the śāstras. You can prepare yourself. That means transfer your, yourself to a body in the moon planet. You transfer yourself for a body in the sun planet. So there are innumerable planets. And there is a planet where Kṛṣṇa lives, or God lives, also. So if you like, you can transfer yourself to a body in Kṛṣṇa's planet. These are explained here. Simply you have to adopt the prescribed method. "By following this method, you transfer to such and such planet." "By following this method, you can transfer..." There is no need of taking this mechanical... That is not possible also. It is futile attempt. You cannot go by force.

Room Conversation -- November 1, 1973, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: ...gatvā duḥkhānusaṅgaminaḥ. There is misery. Even you go to the Moon planet... This is Bhāgavata. Before going to your Moon planet here is the information: "Anywhere you go rascal these things will follow, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi (BG 13.9) and inconveniences. You'll have to suffer." So one's who's, one who is intelligent, then: "Where shall I find real happiness?" That is Kṛṣṇa. Therefore one requires to be very, very intelligent to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. Sarva, sarvatra bhasananvita (?). The Śrīdhara Svāmī gives note, sarvatra lokāntare 'pi. Even if you go to other planets... Now these rascals are going now, trying, not going. And in the Bhāgavata says, lokāntare 'pi. Even in other planets. That means they were going in other planets. Otherwise how it is stated, lokāntare, "in other planets also"? From the statement it appears that people used to go. And here, Arjuna went to heavenly planet. And there the heavenly prostitute came to Arjuna. She's prostitute. So when Arjuna refused, that... His father is Indra...

Brahmānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So Arjuna said that "You have connection with my father. Therefore you are my mother."

Morning Walk -- December 7, 1973, Los Angeles:

Dr. Wolfe: Śrīla Prabhupāda, they are foolish enough to try it.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But they are going to make houses on the moon now. On the surface of the moon they'll make houses in a few years.

Prabhupāda: What is the benefit?

Karandhara: There's plenty of space on the earth. Why do they have to go to the moon?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because it was not done before, so they want to show it to the people. They want to show the power of science.

Prabhupāda: Power of science means imitating the barking of the dog. That's all. Dog is already barking, but they imitate and they become scientists. That's all. This is their power. How to imitate. That's all.

Morning Walk -- December 8, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the difference. Svalpam apy asya dharmasya trāyate mahato bhayāt. Therefore a little, if you act in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, it will never be lost and it will save you from the greatest danger. Svalpam apy asya dharmasya trāyate mahato bhayāt. Kartum avyayam. Susukhaṁ kartum avyayam (BG 9.2). And whatever you have done, that is your permanent asset. It will never be lost. So nowadays the theologicians do not talk of God?

Prajāpati: Not so much, no.

Prabhupāda: That means they are failure.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They are interested in politics now.

Prabhupāda: Just like nowadays they are not talking of going to the moon planet. There is no newspaper news.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They have a bigger plan.

Prabhupāda: That is another bluff. Now the small plan they could not make successful. Now they are thinking of bigger plan. You see?

Morning Walk -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Mars. You see? But the rascal government does not... You could not become successful about the moon expedition. Why you are asking money again?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They say they are successful.

Prabhupāda: What is that successful?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because they have gone to the moon. So that was a direct...

Prabhupāda: That you are not successful. You live there. What is the use of going there?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They wanted to know what is going on there.

Prabhupāda: Oh. That is another rascaldom. What is going on... There are so many things going on. So you have to spend money for going all to the planets, what they are doing, or... Only for that?

Karandhara: They haven't taken care of business here.

Prabhupāda: Eh? Just see...

Morning Walk -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They're called technolo... (heavy waves)

Prabhupāda: They may call whatever they like. But we are sane man. We cannot take the... We can say only that "You are all defeated." They may say. A fool will never agree that he's a fool. He'll always say, "I am very intelli..." That is another foolishness. After spending millions of... for one coat for going to the moon planet? Forty-thousand dollar? What is that?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh. Billions of dollars were spent.

Prabhupāda: That coat?

Śrutakīrti: No, coat.

Brahmānanda: Spacesuit.

Karandhara: Oh yes. Millions of dollars.

Prabhupāda: Just see how they are spending, squandering public money. You see? But nobody is to stop this.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Time stops... Anyway, nobody has gone. They have gone to the nearest planet, they say. I do not know whether they have gone at all.

Yaśomatīnandana: You don't think, Prabhupāda, they have reached the moon?

Prabhupāda: No. There are so many invisible planets. Not that all the stars and planets, you can see, just like Rāhu planet. That is not seen. And when the Rāhu planet passes through, that is eclipse, but they describe in a different way. Actually, it is the Rāhu planet which passes before the sun and moon and there is eclipse. There are so many questionable things of the theory that, the eclipse theory of the modern view. That is not correct according to Vedic theory.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 9, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Don't remain in this darkness. Come to this consciousness." That is our preaching. Tamasi mā jyotir gama. (break) ...experienced the sunshine, bright day, and this gloomy day. So when you are in darkness, we must have to admit, "There is light." Because darkness means absence of light. So as we are in the darkness of this material existence, there must be something life of light. That is spiritual world. That is reality. (break) ...ahaṁ brahmāsmi. "Oh, I don't belong to this darkness, darkness atmosphere. I belong to the light atmosphere." That is self-realization. Ahaṁ brahmāsmi.

brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā

na śocati na kāṅkṣati

samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu

mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām

(BG 18.54)

This is brahma-bhūta (SB 4.30.20) stage. Just like this is a cakra. I am walking on this wheel. But I am thinking I am advancing. What is this advancement? It is already there. Just like they are advancing in science and they must remain here. They are trying for so many years to go to the Moon planet, and no result. (laughs) The same, same thing. "Now we are going to the moon planet." But coming again. That's all. So saṁsāra-cakra. Just like the dog. Dog is sometimes barking: "Gata-gata-gata-gata!" The master says, "Come on." Immediately come. He thinks that "I have got freedom. Let me jump over." You see. So we are thinking like that. We are under the māyā's clutches. "Come on, come on here." Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). He's under the reins of prakṛti. He cannot go anywhere. (pause) (break)

Morning Walk -- January 22, 1974, Hawaii:

Prabhupāda: ..."Unless we see." But you see, but you cannot go. Your argument is, "Unless we see," but you are seeing there is another planet, so many hundred and thousands, millions of planets. But you cannot go there. That is your inefficiency. How can you say? Because your theory is "I must see," but you cannot go there. First of all, admit your inefficiency. Why you conclude, what is it called, abruptly, without seeing. Because seeing is your experience. But you cannot go and see. Why you are trying to go to the moon planet? Just to see. Similarly, there are so many other planets, but you are not efficient to go and see. How can you conclude?

Nitāi: Well, they don't conclude. They say, there may be possibility of higher life.

Prabhupāda: So that's all right. Maybe...

Satsvarūpa: Agnostic, "There may be; we don't know."

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Satsvarūpa: "There may be God, but we don't know."

Prabhupāda: That you don't know, but if somebody knows... That is not a proof, that because you cannot see. That is not proof.

Morning Walk -- January 22, 1974, Hawaii:

Satsvarūpa: They would say for you to see everything yourself you'd have to become a trained up scientist.

Prabhupāda: Similarly, similarly, you have to become like me also to see God. You cannot say that in my case you are authority, and your case I am not authority. How can you say? If you oblige me to accept you as authority, you must accept me also authority. Otherwise, why shall I accept you? Why you are obliging me which I do not see? So many rascals says that he has gone to moon planet, but I have not gone with you. Why shall I believe you?

Satsvarūpa: They think that their documentation is something that's more acceptable for...

Prabhupāda: So acceptable to someone. My documentation is acceptable to so many. Why not my many? We have got many followers of the documentation of Vedic literature. As you have got your own ways of documentation, I have got my own ways of documentation. If you do not believe my documentation, why shall I believe without seeing your documentation? And if you set aside your documentation, my documentation, then come to reason. Eh?

Morning Walk -- March 6, 1974, Mayapura:

Viṣṇujana: Prabhupāda, they say they've already done so much. The scientists will say...

Prabhupāda: What they have done? What they have done? Why people are starving? What you have done?

Viṣṇujana: But they'll say we have created so much machineries and gone to the moon.

Prabhupāda: You cannot eat machine. You produce. You produce rice, wheat in the machine. What you have done? You have simply misled the people that instead of tilling the ground, they have come to machine, and there is no food.

Morning Walk -- March 18, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Stars? They are planets like this planet. Like moon planet, the moon planet. Nakṣatrāṇām ahaṁ śaśī. The stars, they are so many moons, not suns. They say "sun." And we say, "No, it is moon." Sun is only one. In each universe there is one sun, but there are many planets like moons.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Reflections.

Prabhupāda: Reflection. We get it from Bhagavad-gītā. Nakṣatrāṇām ahaṁ śaśī. (heavy wind noise) (break) ...due to the sun, reflect.

Guru dāsa: Why does the moon reflect? They say the moon is sandy, but this sand here is not reflecting.

Prabhupāda: That... They are not going to the moon planet. They are going to some other planet, Rahu planet.

Guru dāsa: Rahu?

Prabhupāda: Yes. There are many planets invisible. So there is a Rahu planet which comes in front of the moon planet, and that is called eclipse. So there is a planet rotating. I think they are going to that Rahu planet, not to the moon planet.

Morning Walk -- March 27, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Fruitive activities. They do not accept this: ā-brahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ punar āvartino 'rjuna (BG 8.16). They'll not. "No, no. We shall go to..." Just like these rascals are going to the Candraloka. Candraloka. (laughter) Now other rascals supporting them: "Oh, now we are..." (laughter)

Dr. Patel: The Americans rascals are going there.

Prabhupāda: No, many other rascals are going also. And Indian rascals are supporting that, "Oh, now science is so advanced. Now there is no question of this Bhagavad-gītā. Now we have to go to the moon planet."

Dr. Patel: That, that... I told you that story? Those astronauts who have gone on... (break) I have read it.

Prabhupāda: The astronautics...

Chandobhai: It is so said like that. The astronauts, they were all talking of philosophy only and nothing else, after coming from Moon.

Prabhupāda: The astronautics... That Russian... Even Nehru went to receive. Just see, such a rascal minister we have. An astronaut is to be received. (break)

Morning Walk -- April 8, 1974, Bombay:

Mahāṁsa: This śloka is... Where is that śloka, Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: It is in the Tenth Canto. Bhavāmbudhir vatsa-padam. Just like this ocean, if it becomes a small pit, then don't require a big ship to cross over. You just... Like this. It can be reduced. By Kṛṣṇa's desire, it can be done so. Just like at the present moment... Formerly, people used to go to London from India, from Bombay, at least, in fifteen days. Now it doesn't take even fifteen hours. It takes only nine hours. How it has been reduced? Because there is a process to reduce. Similarly, the supreme spiritual process is like that. It can be reduced to any quantity. Aṇi... This is called aṇimā-siddhi. It can be expanded also, to the greatest length. Mahimā-śakti. All-powerful means not that "I cannot do, I cannot, I can do this only." No, anything He can do. That is all powerful. Aṇimā, laghimā, mahimā. Just like all these big, big planets, they are floating in the sky. This is called laghimā, weightless, no weight. Those who are going to the moon planet, they are finding out weightlessness. How it has become weightless? Such a big, huge... Just this planet. With so many seas and mountains and cities and buildings. But it is floating. That's a fact. It is floating like a swab. How it is floating? You can say something nonsense, but the actual fact is this.

Room Conversation with Prof. Regamay, Professor of Sanskrit at the University of Lausanne -- June 4, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: So you cannot understand the goloka-nāmni nija-dhāmni tale ca tasya, the Goloka-nāmni planet, where it is. We do not know where is or how many planets are in this material world. (break) ...seeing very, very distant, ninety-three million miles away. But we have got little heat and light, we are satisfied. You see. But if you have got the capacity to run on..., just like they are trying to go to the moon planet, go to the sun planet... Actually it is a fact, this planet is in your front. Where can you go? Why? Why is it impossible to go? It is material. So you cannot go even the material planets, what to speak of the spiritual planets. So for them, this, this much knowledge, "Sunshine is light." That's all. Nothing more. They cannot understand with their poor brain.

Morning Walk -- June 22, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: There are so many planets, so many different standard of life. Nothing. They do not know anything. (German)

Guest (1) (German man): But the other planets has a more spiritual form than our planet.

Prabhupāda: No. Material forms. Just like in the water, the fish is there. That is also material form. But you cannot live within the water. Neither the fish cannot live on the land. So in different planets there are different types of atmosphere and different types of body also. You cannot go to the sun planet. You cannot go to the moon planet because that is a different atmosphere. But there are living entities. They have got their suitable body.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Woman Sanskrit Professor -- February 13, 1975, Mexico:

Prabhupāda: But he does not belong to the water, but he takes some pleasure.

Professor: He needs the pleasure.

Prabhupāda: Therefore he's seeking pleasure. That is the real aim. Therefore he's going into the water. He has no business to go to the water, but because he is seeking pleasure—"Let me see if there is some pleasure. Experiment." That's all. But he does not get... Just like they are going to the moon planet, moon planet: "Let us see." Because there is no ānanda, he is seeking another type of ānanda. And now they have failed. Now they're going to Venus or what?

Devotees: Mars.

Prabhupāda: Mars. This is going on. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). He's not seeking after where is eternal happiness. He's... Temporarily, he's seeking here, there. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate. In this way his life is finished, seeking ānanda, and he gets another body, another term. So his intelligence is not coming to the point that "What is this ānanda? I am eternal. I am seeking eternal ānanda. Why this ānanda? Sometimes this body, sometimes this position, sometimes that position—what is this?" That is intelligence.

Conversation with Devotees -- April 14, 1975, Hyderabad:

Devotee: But they will say only a select few are interested in that Hare Kṛṣṇa song.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Not select few. They're increasing the number, many thousands. Cannot say select few. Select few was beginning (indistinct) ...I was chanting (indistinct). And now that it is not select few and it will increase. But the song is the same. That is our credit.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Going back to science again...

Prabhupāda: Going back... Where is science? Going back to hell again. Say "going back to hell again". Say like that. (chuckles) Because that is not science. That is our charge. You can say like that: "Going back again to hell."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We wanted to talk to you about the moon. We have read your statement that you say that man has not gone to the moon, but we have seen...

Prabhupāda: Not only now, I've said long, long years ago. That this is all childish.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. But how can you say this when we have so much proof that we have gone to the moon?

Prabhupāda: But that proof is with you. I have not gone with you. I don't believe you because, according to you, unless you see, you don't believe. I have not seen so I don't believe.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You have not seen the North Pole but you believe it.

Prabhupāda: Ah ha. You materialistic people say that "We have not seen God, therefore don't believe." Therefore I say, "I have not gone with you, that you have gone to moon, I don't believe." That's all. Finished. How can I believe? You say that you have gone. But I have not gone with you. So how can I believe. That's all. That is my argument. You did not take me with you. How can I believe?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Pictures.

Prabhupāda: Why I shall believe pictures? I have not seen it. This is false picture. As you say that you could not saw God therefore don't believe. Therefore I say that I did not go with you, I don't believe.

Morning Walk -- May 10, 1975, Perth:

Amogha: There's a pathway up here that goes up... Śrīla Prabhupāda? Sometimes when we are speaking, people say, in the questions they say, "Why do you say this is a science? It seems that this must be belief. Because science..."

Prabhupāda: Your so-called science is also belief. You believe in one way, we believe in another way. And if you call it science, then it is also science. If you call your belief as science, then why shall I not call my belief as science? Your is also belief. You have never gone to the moon, and you are talking of so many things about moon. That is your belief.

Amogha: But they say with science they can prove so many things.

Prabhupāda: We can also prove. You cannot prove. Just like you say the life is made of chemicals. You prove it. Take chemicals and make a life, then it is true. Otherwise it is a humbug. Why do you say like that, that life is made of chemicals? You cannot prove it.

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: (in car) They have not gone to the moon planet.

Paramahaṁsa: Really?

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is far, far away. Their calculation is wrong. They are going to a wrong planet.

Paramahaṁsa: It must be the Rahu planet.

Prabhupāda: Yes, or something else. Not moon planet.

Paramahaṁsa: How many...

Prabhupāda: It is above the sun planet.

Paramahaṁsa: Moon planet is further?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Paramahaṁsa: Oh. Because they say that the moon planet is the closest planet to the earth. That is their calculation. And they say that it orbits around the earth, and then that the earth orbits the sun.

Prabhupāda: All wrong. What is the... According to them, what is the distance of sun planet?

Paramahaṁsa: Sun planet is 93,000,000 miles.

Gaṇeśa: They say the moon planet is only 250,000 miles.

Prabhupāda: It is wrong thing.

Paramahaṁsa: Is their calculation for the distance of the sun wrong also?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Paramahaṁsa: 93,000,000? It says in the Bhāgavatam exactly what the distance?

Prabhupāda: The whole universe, diameter, is pañcaśat-koṭi-yojana. One yojana equal to eight miles, and one koti is ten miles, er, ten million. So pañcaśata, fifty into 10,000,000 into eight.

Paramahaṁsa: Yeah. So it's fifty crores yojana. Fifty crores yojanas?

Prabhupāda: Yes, fifty crore yojanas, pañcaśat. So one yojana equal to eight miles, one crore equal to ten million.

Paramahaṁsa: That's eighty million.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Paramahaṁsa: Eighty million times fifty.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- May 14, 1975, Perth:

Amogha: Miles from the earth.

Prabhupāda: 459,000?

Amogha: 250,000 miles from the earth. They say it is very near the earth and that the sun is very far away.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...circumstances, it is now doubtful whether they are going to the moon planet.

Amogha: Yes. (break)

Paramahaṁsa: Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Paramahaṁsa: In the newspaper yesterday there was an article about New York City. The city government is going bankrupt because they... They have asked the President for 1,500 million dollars in emergency aid. Because of crime and dirtiness and noise, all the rich people are leaving New York, and they can't get any taxes from the poor people. So they don't have money to pay to run the city.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I have seen. New York is very dilapidated, many quarters. And especially Second Avenue, those are very dirty. The... On the Fifth Avenue, that Central Park is also very dirty. This civilization will collapse. It cannot be run on. Fourth-class men, I tell. Because it is conducted by the fourth-class men. Ask that gentleman why they are asking. Are they not fourth-class men? They could not manage?

Morning Walk -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) If you write 1975 it will become so big. (laughter)

Śrutakīrti: Yeah. Some twenty letters.

Prabhupāda: This "Sunday, Monday," means first sun, then moon. Where they are going? They are going to hell, not in the moon. This Vedic description is right. Because first study, Sunday... That, we offer gāyatrī to the sun. So the moon is after the sun—this is the proof, first Sunday, then Monday. So if their calculation is 93,000,000 miles from here, and moon is (sic:) one million, six thousand still farther, then where they are going? If they simply follow strictly this moon expedition and they admit they have not gone, then the whole civilization will change. All wrong conclusion. But they will have to admit now. Now they are serious, and they will have to say that they've never gone to the moon. And they will have to continue this. Otherwise they will be farce before the world. They will have to continue it. Now they are in such a position.

Morning Walk -- May 18, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: First of all whether you have gone there. That is our charge, "You have not gone there."

Amogha: That's what we are trying to do. In a few years we will find out.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They might have gone to some hellish planet, where there is only sand, only, and very hot, and the culprit is pushed through that deserted place to the Yamarāja. And before going to Yamarāja he has to suffer so much. There are places, copperlike, you see. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. So hot, and the criminal has to go on that copper land. There are mentioned for many millions of miles simply copper, and one has to pass through that to Yamarāja. So, they might have gone to some such place, not to the moon planet, who is the source of vegetation even throughout the whole universe—and in his own planet there is no vegetation. Now I am sure they have not gone to moon planet. How they will go? It is beyond the sun. I was protesting that they have not gone; now I am convinced that they have not gone. The Russian scientists and the American scientists joined on the platform, "Don't expose me, I don't expose you." (laughter) (Bengali) "You have to do your business and same I have to do my business. Let us support one another." In all other case, they are inimical, and the scientific field they are friends. That means that if a scientist, another scientist, opposes me, then my attempt will be futile, so let us don't do it.

Morning Walk -- May 21, 1975, Melbourne:

Madhudviṣa: The demons are trying to go to the heavenly planets by building their skyscrapers higher and higher.

Prabhupāda: Rāvaṇa's, Rāvaṇa's staircase for going to the heaven. He promised that "Oh, what is the use of austerity? I shall make a staircase directly. You can go." As their... It is the same, Rāvaṇa's staircase and the modern attempt to go to the moon planet, the same thing. They will never be able to go, but imagining that "We shall do it." The same process, Rāvaṇa's process. For how many years they are going? Since 1950?

Devotee: To the moon expedition?

Prabhupāda: Yes, moon expedition.

Devotee: Maybe 1955.

Madhudviṣa: 1955.

Devotee: The first moon landing was 1961.

Prabhupāda: That is beginning. First of all they sent dog. (laughter)

Madhudviṣa: Space dog. Space mouse.

Prabhupāda: Huh? Space mouse.

Devotee: Space monkey also.

Prabhupāda: So since 1955 even. So twenty years, what they have done?

Devotee: Spent billions of dollars.

Prabhupāda: Yes, simply they have brought little dust, that's all.

Madhudviṣa: Now they have found that that same dust is here on the earth.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Simply propaganda. They are not going. Now the Russian scientist and American scientist are combined. Because both of them thieves, so one thief is asking, "Don't expose me. I will not expose you, so that our business will go on." This is the way. "Let us combine together and cheat these rascals, and otherwise, if you expose me, then I will expose you. Then our business will stop."

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Oh. Grapes are sour.

Guru kṛpā: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Jackal. Jackal and the grapes. The grapes were high. First of all jumped, jumping. Then, when he could not get it, "This is useless. It is sour."

Devotee (1): They didn't reach moon at all.

Prabhupāda: At all. Jumping, jumping, the jackal says, "Oh, it is no use. It is sour."

Devotee (1): I've seen those rocks, moon rocks. They didn't seem much different than our rocks.

Prabhupāda: No, no, it is all bogus propaganda. I told it in 1968. No, no, not '68-'58, in my book, Easy Journey to Other Planets. All childish. Then I told in San Francisco in 1968, like that. They asked me, the press reporter, "What is your opinion?" "It is all useless waste of time and energy."

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1975, Honolulu:

Guru kṛpā: The all-American family. If the moon is illuminating the earth at night, then how come you have brought back dull pieces of rock. They should have also been shining.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is a common sense.

Devotee (2): Did they actually land on the moon, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No, they cannot go there. What is the question of landing? They cannot go there. It is far, far away. What you calculated? 1,600,000 miles away, up the sun planet. 1,600,000 miles above the sun. According to your calculation, the sun is away from this planet by 93,000,000 miles. And above that, 1,600,000 miles. Then you go to the moon. How it is possible?

Guru kṛpā: How is the moon behind the sun?

Prabhupāda: Not behind, above.

Guru kṛpā: It is a bigger planet?

Prabhupāda: No.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is meant for the monkeys, not for any sane gentleman. Sane gentleman will think that "I have become now... By evolution I have come to this stage human being. What is next? And that is sane.

Guru kṛpā: That is a good argument.

Prabhupāda: He will think, "What is next? Is it finished here?" The rascal says, "No, after finishing, everything is finished." What is this? If there is evolution—you have come to this stage —then what is the next stage? That is natural. That is answered in the Bhagavad-gītā. Yānti deva-vratā devān (BG 9.25). Now you can go to the moon planet if you try. Moon planet, sun planet, Venus and so many. If you become serious. And you can go to God's planet, mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām. Now you select where will you will go. But there is spiritual planet. But what is their theory? That after finishing this body, everything is finished.(?) They do not believe in the next life.

Morning Walk -- June 2, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: (break) ...are going to Venus, Americans and Russians combined together?

Ambarīṣa: This summer.

Prabhupāda: Oh, in the summer. Venus is very cold? Why they have selected summer season? (laughter) (break) ...could not go to the moon, and Venus is far above moon. How they will go?

Bali-mardana: They're not going to Venus, are they?

Paramahaṁsa: Are they going to Mars?

Bali-mardana: No, they're just going around the earth, right?

Ambarīṣa: Yeah, they're linking up in space.

Devotee (3): Prabhupāda, when they said they went to the moon and they showed films of them landing and walking on the moon, was this all a bluff?

Prabhupāda: Yes, here they... All laboratory work, that's all.

Devotee (3): They all made it up?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 2, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: No, that also we cannot agree. If there are lower species, there must be higher species. As we see here is dog also, man also, higher species, lower species, why not there? They can talk all nonsense, but a nonsense will believe. No sane man will believe. (break) ...going to meet in the space?

Ambarīṣa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: What is the idea?

Ambarīṣa: It's a diplomatic move. They feel it will make friendly relationships between the two countries.

Indian man: They cannot meet on the earth and they are going to meet on the... (laughter) (break)

Prabhupāda: So I am the only man in the world challenging that "You have not gone to the moon planet." Eh?

Harikeśa: Is it possible there's some difference as to the definition of what the moon planet is? They will say that the moon planet is that planet out there. Do we agree? At night?

Prabhupāda: What is your definition? First of all let me hear.

Harikeśa: I'm still wondering myself.

Prabhupāda: We have got our definition.

Morning Walk -- June 2, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: What is the argument? You have stopped. That is your failure, that's all. You can argue to the laymen, foolish men, but we will say you have stopped; therefore it is failure. All bogus propaganda is now stopped.

Devotee (3): They are saying the moon isn't worth develop...

Prabhupāda: Now they cannot say anything because they are failure. Anything they say, that is all foolishness. They cannot say anything. Once you are failure, you have no value, anything you say.

Harikeśa: I've heard the argument that when they are going to the moon, they are always in contact, bouncing off these sonar waves and radar waves off the moon's surface, and when they are coming near, they can even see from their little portholes the moon's surface, the same moon that they see on the earth.

Prabhupāda: They say all nonsense. That's all. (chuckles) Why the earth is not brilliant at night like the moon?

Bali-mardana: It depends on where you are. It depends on where you are looking from.

Prabhupāda: "Where you are" means?

Harikeśa: They have pictures from the moon taken of the earth.

Prabhupāda: Pictures? First of all you see. Then take picture. You cannot see.

Harikeśa: They use all these things to argue that they actually did go to the moon.

Prabhupāda: What is the meaning of argument if they have stopped? That is failure. Don't talk nonsense anymore. Phalena paricīyate. By the result we have to understand. Your result is you are failure. Then what is the use of talking nonsense? Stop this nonsense.

Morning Walk -- June 2, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all my conviction: they have gone nowhere. They have simply stayed in their laboratory, that's all.

Indian man: Anyone can do that, bring some pictures and bring a rock.

Paramahaṁsa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, I think somebody might have told you before, but there was a big scandal right after the moon shot when they said they went to the moon and..., that it was all staged in the desert of Arizona, that they...

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the fact.

Bali-mardana: When Puruṣottama heard that, he blooped. (Devotees continue laughing.)

Prabhupāda: Yes. In 1968 I was questioned by the reporters, "What is your opinion about this moon?" "It is simply a waste of time and energy, that's all. It is all false propaganda." I told to the reporter.

Harikeśa: Actually, these scientists and philosophers, they become very famous and popular by coming up with some brand new theories. So why don't we widely publicize our theories?

Devotee (3): (break) ...real information about the moon from the Bhāgavatam?

Prabhupāda: Veda. Veda means knowledge. What is this? Some animal?

Morning Walk -- June 2, 1975, Honolulu:

Harikeśa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, do we say that they've gone to Rahu simply to placate them?

Prabhupāda: No, accidentally they went to Rahu. Maybe. That is also not...

Indian man: (break)...gone at all outside this atmosphere of earth.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...haven't gone to moon planet, that is my... (break) ...why they will give it up? That is the proof. America was found by Columbus. So many people came from Europe and utilized it. So if they would have gone to moon planet, they would have utilized it. But they have not gone. That is the fact.

Paramahaṁsa: That was their original proposal, that they can utilize it, make colonies there.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Yes.

Devotee (3): The moon exploration, because they thought that we cannot use the moon like Columbus, they used America.

Prabhupāda: That is your excuse.

Paramahaṁsa: They say it's too much like the desert.

Harikeśa: That's cause they were in the desert. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: (break) ...grow so many nice dates, you know that? You cannot say in the desert there is no...

Paramahaṁsa: Oh, yes. Arabia they grow.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. (break) ...desert nice watermelon will grow. Yes. Nice dates. So people go there, take the dates and take the watermelon. Kṛṣṇa has provided food even there. (break)

Morning Walk -- June 2, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Yes. They might have gone to that hellish planet. That's all.

Bali-mardana: No wonder they left.

Paramahaṁsa: That seems more befitting them.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes!

Bali-mardana: They were not qualified to go to the moon, so Kṛṣṇa sent them there.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they are not qualified. Even in this planet, unless one is bona fide, he is not allowed to enter America. How you can go to the moon planet? That is demigods' planet.

Harikeśa: Some of the astronauts became very religious after they supposedly went.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they are intelligent, that "This is all nonsense. Real thing is God." That is... They come to their senses. They are intelligent. (break) (In car:) ...real business is to enhance your Kṛṣṇa consciousness. These people, they are wasting time simply to know something else. There is no limit. Kliśyanti ye kevala-bodha-labdhaye. What is moon planet? What business you have got to know the...? Whatever is stated in the śāstra, accept it, that's all. What is the use of experiment and going there and then again say, "Oh, it is all failure." Simply waste of time. The arrangement is there by God. That's all. Spending so much money, hard-earned money, unnecessarily and then say, "Oh, it is failure."

Morning Walk -- June 2, 1975, Honolulu:

Paramahaṁsa: They have some relief, though, because they think that the scientists will be able to protect them.

Prabhupāda: This is their position. This is their position. Just like we are in this car, but we know it, that any moment there can be accident. So how we can be without anxiety? In the material world, on account of this material condition, we are not going to stay here. There must be anxiety. But if we close our eyes, that is different thing. Otherwise it is full of anxiety. (break) "... be free from anxiety, then surrender to Me. What I say, do it." That he will not do. They will manufacture their own way of life. They must be in anxiety. They will never hear what Kṛṣṇa says. And our propaganda is that "Just you become Kṛṣṇa conscious, and you will be happy." This is our... That they will not do.

Ambarīṣa: ...'60, 1960. When did they start to go to the moon?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ambarīṣa: I think President Kennedy started the program in 1960.

Prabhupāda: Sending dog first of all?

Ambarīṣa: Yeah, mice and then monkeys and...

Prabhupāda: (break) ...desert. But here we find, within the desert, petrol. Why not get petrol there and solve your power problem. Can I not raise this question?

Ambarīṣa: How would they get it back from the moon?

Prabhupāda: There will be petrol. You take it.

Ambarīṣa: How would they get it back here?

Prabhupāda: As they are coming. They are going and coming. So let them go, and if the surface is desert, then find out oil within.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Rascal, fool. Therefore it is difficult for you.

Harikeśa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: You should not... You understand or not understand, you have to accept it.

Harikeśa: That is why we are asking so many questions about the moon and the planets.

Prabhupāda: Yes, so where is the doubt? It is a fact that they did not go to the moon. That's a fact.

Harikeśa: I'm just trying to understand for preaching purposes.

Prabhupāda: Why do you try to understand?

Harikeśa: Because I have a hard time explaining about the make up of the universe as far as...

Prabhupāda: That make up is all right, what they say?

Harikeśa: What they say?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: No. You should... Śukadeva Gosvāmī says. You have to believe that. It is an idea. If you believe or not believe, it doesn't matter. But you can get an idea about the planetary situation. That's all. Neither you can go there; neither you can see it. An idea is given, that is all. But there is no argument.

Harikeśa: No.

Prabhupāda: No.

Siddha-svarūpa: Did the people who said they went to the moon, did they go to another planet?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Or they did not go anywhere. They were in the desert... What is that?

Devotees: Arizona.

Prabhupāda: Arizona. That's all. That is possible.

Siddha-svarūpa: Yes, it's possible. I wouldn't put anything beyond them.

Prabhupāda: They are all doing this nonsense here on this planet and showing and advertising that.

Siddha-svarūpa: Yes, they made big propaganda that they would get there, and then they had to succeed. And then they showed that they succeeded, they stopped the program.

Prabhupāda: That one film?

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: King Kong. It was made in laboratory.

Bali-mardana: Yes.

Harikeśa: Also 2001 was very expertly made like that. There is one movie, 2001, which looked even better than the moon shots.

Devotee: Someone was arguing with me that if, like Russia and America both are enemies, if Russia achieves something great like going to the moon, America will immediately try to expose it. But on the contrary, America accepted all those things. And because...

Prabhupāda: Then there is also... Both of them are thieves, they have made agreement, "Don't expose me. I'll not expose you."

Devotee: So that is their agree... But they are enemies...

Prabhupāda: No, no, enemies, they are not enemies. They are simply rogues and thieves, that's all.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Bali-mardana: Honor among thieves.

Prabhupāda: "Thief, thief, cousin brother." Cora cora, pasura bhai. So far our position is that we are not concerned with anything with this universe. We are concerned with Kṛṣṇaloka. So whatever one may say, one other may say, we don't care for that. We are not going to the moon planet, Jupiter(?) planet.

Siddha-svarūpa: There's a danger that we become overly concerned with debating on them.

Harikeśa: So our preaching platform should be is that "You don't know." We can say, "You don't know" or "We don't know. Why shouldn't one accept what we say over what you say?" We should just prove that we...

Prabhupāda: No, accept or not accept, the whatever is description there, in Bhāgavatam, we are accepted.

Harikeśa: So we should not try to meet these scientists on any scientific platform? Rather, on...

Siddha-svarūpa: Why not on the platform of not being the body? Why should you...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Siddha-svarūpa: The materialists, they want to argue on the platform of material arrangements, and there's...

Prabhupāda: That is useless.

Siddha-svarūpa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: What he will gain by such argument? You are not going there neither you are interested for going to the moon planet. For knowledge sake it is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, and everyone is... Just like when we speak of the hell, everyone is little anxious, "Where are the hell?" So that is described. In the down this universe there are lokas.

Harikeśa: So, in other words, it would make no... It would be not a very good program to get some understanding from Vedic astronomy, like, say, some expert Vedic astronomers.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 16, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: But why do you teach us? We do not see whatever you say. We do not, so why do you place upon us? If seeing is evidence, then we don't see what nonsense you are talking.

Siddha-svarūpa: We don't see their atoms. We don't see their sputniks flying and landing or anything.

Prabhupāda: Why do you talk?

Bali-mardana: They want to put themselves in the place of the supreme authority.

Prabhupāda: No, no, that's all right. If that is your reason, that you don't see God, but we don't see that you are going to the moon planet. Why you make us believe that you are going to moon planet?

Harikeśa: They might also say that we don't have the eyes to see the atoms and things like that.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Then you take our formula. Why do you expect to see God with your eyes? That means they are shameless atheist. Other atheists, they have got little shame, but these people have no shame even. (break) ...ādhamāḥ, lowest of the mankind. māyayāpahṛta-jñānā. (break) Where? The zoo?

Morning Walk -- June 16, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: That is the problem. Because they have cheated people for so many years and drawn high salaries, now they are finding out: "How to cheat these rascals and continue our business?" This is the problem. Because they have nothing to research. Everything, whatever, are finished. And all failure. Simply big, big words, that's all. Word jugglery, that's all. They could not do anything. What exactly they have done, something which is not done by God? They competition with God, so what they have done? What is their contribution?

Bali-mardana: Only negative; nothing positive. (break) ...easier to kill people.

Prabhupāda: That's it. That much they have done, yes. (break) ...diverting the attention of the people from going to the moon planet, they are meeting in the sky. So what will benefit we shall derive by their meeting in the sky?

Siddha-svarūpa: They have scientists now that are proposing and they have grants on how to develop a city in outer space or on the moon. They already have it how they're going to send people, how they're going to get their...

Prabhupāda: This is another bluff. You see? And these rascals are believing them.

Siddha-svarūpa: Especially they're making, trying to make people feel that their problems will be solved, that when it gets too bad they'll just be able to go to the moon. So there's no real problem even if you ruin the earth because you can always escape.

Prabhupāda: No, no, that mean... What about their moon planet going? That is stopped?

Morning Walk -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Dharmādhyakṣa: Actually at the University of Southern California around three or four members of the religion department want to come, including the chairman.

Prabhupāda: So let them come. (break)

Bahulāśva: ...yesterday that Indian gentleman, Dr. Singh? He had become very doubtful when you told him they didn't go to the moon. He was saying, "Do you think they really didn't go?" (laughter) He never thought of that before, that they might have just made a show.

Prabhupāda: No. If we believe in our Bhāgavata, they have not gone. It is above the sun planet, 1,600,000 miles above. How they can go?

Bahulāśva: Śrīla Prabhupāda, at night, when we see in the sky that moon, that is the same moon that is above the sun?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bahulāśva: Yes? So their miscalculations are due to their imperfect senses.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: And how you can go to the moon planet? Independently, without going through the process. (break) ...nineteen hundred fifty-eight, I said, "This is all childish." So I am not a scientist. How did I say? On what standing?

Indian guest: There is a difference in nomenclature. Just to resolve the conflict in my mind and (Hindi conversation).

Brahmānanda: You said it was a waste of time, and now they have stopped. They are doing it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So how I predicted? I am not a scientist. How did I say it?

Bahulāśva: On the strength of Bhagavad-gītā.

Prabhupāda: That's it. Vedic science.

Dharmādhyakṣa: First the scientists told the political leaders that "You let us go to the moon, and we will give you all sorts of benefits." Now they have not produced any benefits, so the political leaders won't give them any more money.

Prabhupāda: That is good. They have come to their senses. All the so-called scientists, they should be dismissed, kicked out.

Morning Walk -- June 23, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Our science is stated in the Vedas, yasmin vijñāte sarvam evaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavanti. Just try to understand Kṛṣṇa, and everything will be understood. So try to understand one, Kṛṣṇa, and then you understand everything. Yasmin vijñāte sarvam evaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavanti. (break) ...philosophy is, it is said, that bhaktim... śreya-sṛtiṁ bhaktim... śreya-sṛtiṁ bhaktim upasya, ye kliśyanti kevala-bodha-labdhaye. Kevala-bodha means just trying to understand this, that, this, that, this, that, this, that. In this way they are wasting time and giving up devotional service to the Lord. So what is the result? Bhaktim udapasya te vibho kliśyanti ye kevala-bodha-labdhaye. Kevala-bodha. The duration of life is very short, and he is gathering knowledge by going to the moon. In this way he is wasting his time. So the result is that waste of time. That is their gain and nothing more. Just see that these people instead of teaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they wanted to study, go to the moon planet to understand. The result is, their only result is, that they have labored so much, and that is their gain, nothing else. What other thing they have made. Teṣāṁ kleśala evāvaśiṣyate nānyad yathā sthula-tuṣāvaghāṭīnām. Just like you beat the skin of rice paddy. You will not get rice. Simply your labor, "Gad, gad, gad, gad," that will be your gain. So their only gain is that they have learned that in the moon there is dust like here, that's all. This is their... (laughs) As if we are very much eager to know that there is also dust in the moon. (laughs) And they bluff people selling ticket for going to moon planet. Pan American?

Devotees: Yes.

Prabhupāda: This is going on. This is science. bambhārambhe laghu-kriyā. So our Rāmeśvara Prabhu, where is? You have got now machine arrangement, such nice—you can produce daily one book. (laughter) And if you cannot do so then it is like that moon planet. Bambhārambhe laghu-kriyā. It is very nice to see that so many machines are..., but what is the result? If you produce one book daily, then these machines are properly utilized.

Morning Walk -- June 25, 1975, Los Angeles:

Dharmādhyakṣa: So, Śrīla Prabhupāda, all these social problems, then, in society are basically caused by them denying God. That is the ultimate...

Prabhupāda: No, because they are asses. Why don't you say like that? (laughter) Because they are big asses and people are following them. That is the misfortune. They are simply bluffing that "We are very great." Just like these scientists, they simply bluffing that "We went to the moon planet. We are doing this, doing that," and taking large salaries, but they are asses. And people are also asses. Therefore they accept, "Oh, he is a big man, cheating us very nicely."

Bahulāśva: Śrīla Prabhupāda, theologians also say that God is the... (break) ...person He is.

Prabhupāda: So we can describe. (break) Let them take it. If they cannot describe, then take the description from us. We can give. That is knowledge. Nīcād apy uttamā vidyā strī-ratnaṁ duṣkulād api. Why they should hesitate, "No, no, why shall I take from him? He is a Hindu." Or "He is a Muslim." What is this? Knowledge has to be taken wherever it is available.

Morning Walk -- June 25, 1975, Los Angeles:

Dr. Judah: Like the rays of the sun.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And Śaṅkarācārya's... Not Śaṅkarācārya. His followers have interpreted, "Because God has become all-pervading, then where is God person? He is finished." But they do not see the sun, that although the sun is all-pervading, still, he is maintaining his identity.

Dr. Judah: Yes. That's the bhedābheda philosophy.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Bhedābheda philosophy, that is actual philosophy. Acintya-bhedābheda.

Dr. Judah: God is both one and dual.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Simultaneously. The same example. The sunshine and the sun one, light and heat. But still, the sun is different from the light. (break) ...them about going to the moon planet?

Dr. Judah: What happened, do you say, to the...

Brahmānanda: To the program of going to the moon.

Dr. Judah: I don't know. But they've stopped it.

Brahmānanda: Why?

Dr. Judah: I don't know. One of the problems has been probably the criticism of the American people that so much money was being spent on going to the moon when there were so many other needs for the money to be used.

Brahmānanda: With such little result coming from it.

Dr. Judah: Yes. The amount, the expense, whether the expense could actually be justified to continue on in the way that they had. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...to Venus? They say they are going to Venus?

Brahmānanda: The Russians have sent a spaceship to Venus.

Revatīnandana: It's unmanned. There are no men in it. They are going to Venus but there is no man in the ship.

Prabhupāda: Now, why they are going to Venus? They have failed to achieve anything by going to the moon. Now why another attempt, to go to the Venus?

Dr. Judah: Well, the usual explanation that they have given, as I recall, is that these explorations give man more of a knowledge about how the world was created, our universe was created.

Prabhupāda: That is another speculation.

Morning Walk -- July 3, 1975, Denver:

Prabhupāda: That is a Frankenstein? (laughter)

Yadubara: They're very persistent, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: That is the foolishness. Fools are very persistent.

Brahmānanda: I was reading that in order to go to the moon, it took ten years and the cost was 25 billion dollars.

Prabhupāda: Just see how foolish they are. And again they are trying. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). Chewing the chewed. This is their business. Horrible civilization.

Kāśīrāma: Mistaking suffering for happiness.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ambarīṣa: They are always trying to look for the bright side, but there is no bright side.

Prabhupāda: Just like north of Sweden, there is no sunrise?

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: Sun is situated in the middle from this circumference, two billion up and down. And the moon is situated above the sun, 1,600,000 miles. How they can go to the moon?

Devotee: They think the moon is closer than the sun.

Prabhupāda: They may think, but we are thinking in this way. Who is right?

Devotee: We are right, the Vedas.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...thinking is right because they could not go to the moon. They say they went, but actually they could not. Now they are disappointed. (break)

Devotee: ...Prabhupāda? He had some question whether Lord Nityānanda ever took sannyāsa.

Prabhupāda: No. (break) ...went with the sannyāsīs as brahmacārī. (break) ...philosophy?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Philosophy book.

Harikeśa: Philosophy book is waiting until...

Brahmānanda: No, Hayagrīva is editing it now.

Harikeśa: Oh, now? Jaya.

Satsvarūpa: We're going to do some of the chapters in installments in Back to Godhead. We're going to do Darwin as soon as possible, in a month or two. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...philosophy is the ultimate, Vedānta. Vedānta philosophy. And Bhāgavata is the commentary on the Vedānta philosophy. (break) ...Darwin's theory. Wherefrom he begins?

Room Conversation with writer, Sandy Nixon -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: That may not be māyā. That is my discretion. But that is also māyā in another way, indirect way. So one must be strong in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Then he is not a victim of māyā.

Devotee: Prabhupāda, on the news it's talking about the hook-up of the Soviets and Americans, in their (?) capsules. And a large hook-up of these space ships in outer space for planning their moon project. And we were wondering what your feelings are and your views are on all of this.

Prabhupāda: What is he wondering? You are making plans to go to back to home, back to Godhead, and if they go to the moon planet, so your plan is bigger or his plan is bigger? (laughter) Whose plan is bigger?

Devotee: Our plan is much bigger.

Prabhupāda: This is...

Woman: As a mother, I do wish to thank you. My daughter found Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Prabhupāda: Oh, who is your son?

Ravīndra-svarūpa: Daughter.

Prabhupāda: Where is?

Morning Walk -- July 21, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: No, we say in the sun there is life. Otherwise how Kṛṣṇa says, imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1). "I spoke this Bhagavad-gītā science to the sun-god." So? Sun-god is dead stone, and Kṛṣṇa spoke to him?

Bahulāśva: They're very convinced, though, that they went to the moon, the scientists.

Devotee (3): I was going to ask you, Prabhupāda, is that the moon planet that we see, is that the same moon planet that's mentioned in the śāstras? The same planet?

Prabhupāda: Yes, same one. But the moon planet where they went, that is a dark planet. That is not moon planet.

Kṛṣṇa-dāsa: My father is a graduate of Berkeley and he majored in astronomy and chemistry. And he's an atheist. And his logic is is that—it's very empirical—is that if there's other life, they have to have bodies similar to ours.

Prabhupāda: Why?

Paramahaṁsa: So it's impossible to have a life on the sun because we could not live there. That's the empirical way of...

Prabhupāda: You cannot live there; therefore there is no life.

Morning Walk -- July 21, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: They say? It is simply cheating. They found this in Arizona, somebody... (laughter) And laboratory work.

Bahulāśva: I have been trying to arrange a meeting between Your Divine Grace and that astronaut. He was going to come to Rathayātrā, but he had to go to Florida for some space project.

Prabhupāda: What does he say, astronaut?

Bahulāśva: He says that... His name is Edgar Mitchell, and he was one of the men who went to the moon. But we talked, and he said... He thinks he has gone to the moon. But he said that when he was there, he had a religious experience, and he felt that there was a God. When he went to the moon, he had this experience. So when he came back, he was telling all his scientist friends what his experience was. So they became very afraid, and they kicked him out of the space project. They thought he had become a fanatic, religious sentimentalist, so they kicked him out. So now he has opened up an institute for noetic sciences or... It is some Greek word. It means like spiritual sciences. He wants to prove to the scientific world that there is God.

Prabhupāda: That's nice. He is good.

Morning Walk -- July 24, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: How they can see?

Paramahaṁsa: That was my question.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda says how can they see?

Prabhupāda: No, they take all these stars as sun. But that is not fact. Sun is one. In each universe there is one sun in the middle. In this universe in the middle, from the circumference, 200,000,000,000's, no, two billion.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Two billion.

Prabhupāda: And above the sun there is moon. Then Mars, then Venus, like that. 1,600,000 miles above, above, above.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So the moon is further away than the sun.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore I say they have never gone to moon. Never gone.

Hṛdayānanda: What is that? Rahu. (break)

Nalinī-kaṇṭha: They say that they can see stars trillions of miles away.

Prabhupāda: But they cannot go. That's a fact. According to their estimation, the moon is the nearest. So they cannot go there. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. (break) ...deva-vratā devān. Moon is one of the heavenly planets. So unless one is very advanced in karma-kāṇḍa, offering sacrifices, nobody can go there. It is not so easy. Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthāḥ (BG 14.18). Those who are more and more higher status of goodness, they are promoted in the highest planet. Not by drinking wine and driving a sputnik one can... (laughter) It is not so easy. (break) ...also drink soma-rasa. The residents of the moon, they live for ten thousand years.

Morning Walk -- July 24, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: The vetta gora. These are vetta gora, horses with (remedy?).

Satsvarūpa: But they can point to progress, not that they're all drowning.

Prabhupāda: What is that progress?

Satsvarūpa: Well, people never thought they could reach the moon. Now they think they have.

Prabhupāda: So that is not progress. Progress means when you conquer death. That is progress.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Why is that the only progress?

Prabhupāda: Because whatever you do, death will come and take it. So where is guarantee that you will enjoy?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Relatively we can enjoy.

Prabhupāda: Relatively everyone... The ant also thinking, "I am also some important..." That is Kṛṣṇa's proposal, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi duḥkha-doṣānu... (BG 13.9). You are trying to get out of all kinds of miserable conditions, but here is your real misery, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi: birth, death, old age... First of all conquer them. Then talk of advance. You cannot conquer even on disease. There are so many persons suffering from disease. You cannot stop it, and you're making progress? What is that progress? It is all rascaldom.

Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach:

Prabhupāda: Purport.

Satsvarūpa: "Every man everywhere is trying to obtain the greatest amount of sense enjoyment by various endeavors. Some of them are busy engaged in trade, industry, economic development, political supremacy, etc., and some of them are engaged in fruitive work to become happy in the next life by attaining higher planets. It is said that on the moon the inhabitants are fit for greater sense enjoyment by drinking soma-rasa, and the Pitṛloka is obtained by good charitable work. So there are various programs for sense enjoyment, either during this life or in the life after death. Some are trying to reach the moon or other planets by some mechanical arrangement, for they are very anxious to get into such planets without doing good work. But it is not to happen. By the law of the Supreme, different places are meant for different grades of living beings according to the work they might have performed. By good work only, as prescribed in the scriptures, one can obtain birth in a good family, opulence, good education and good bodily features. We see also that even in this life one obtains a good education or money or bodily beauty. Similarly, in our next birth we get such desirable positions only by good work. Otherwise, it would not so happen that two persons born in the same place at the same time are seen differently placed according to previous work. But all such material positions are not permanent. The positions in the topmost Brahmaloka and in the lowest Pātāla are also changeable according to our work. The philosophically inclined person must not be tempted by such changeable positions. He should try to get into the permanent life of bliss and knowledge, where he will not be forced to come back again to the miserable material world, either in this or that planet. Miseries and mixed happiness are two features of material life, and they are obtained in Brahmaloka and in other lokas also. They are obtained in the life of the demigods and also in the life of the dogs and hogs. The miseries and mixed happiness of all living beings are only of different degree and quality, but no one is free from the miseries of birth, death, old age and disease. Similarly, everyone has his destined happiness also. No one can get more or less of these things simply by personal endeavors. Even if they are obtained, they can be lost again. One should not, therefore, waste time with these flimsy things; but one should only endeavor to go back to Godhead. That should be the mission of everyone's life."

Prabhupāda: So this is our mission. We are propagating this. Do you think it is all right?

Mr. Surface: Do I think it's all right? Well, it's a point of view.

Prabhupāda: No, what we are doing... We are teaching people that "Don't bother about your economic condition of life. It will come automatically, what you are destined to obtain. You better utilize your energy how to get out of this condition of life, birth, death, old age and disease."

Morning Walk -- October 9, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: Yes. And why these rascals say there is no life? We see underneath the water there is life, and in the moon planet there is no life? We have to believe this?

Indian man: So there is life on the moon, Swamijī?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Indian man: But can you see them? Do they have bodies?

Prabhupāda: First of all you go there. Then see. I don't admit that they have gone to the moon planet.

Indian man: You don't believe.

Prabhupāda: It is 1,600,000 above the sun, the moon.

Indian man: One million six hundred...

Prabhupāda: Thousand miles above the sun.

Morning Walk -- October 9, 1975, Durban:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes. But it appears at least for... It appears that the moon is so close.

Prabhupāda: "It appears"—that is another thing. As soon as you say "appears," that means you have no knowledge.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: But we say on the authenticity of the description in the Vedic literature. Therefore it is authentic. This proves that they did not go to the moon planet. If it is above, 1,600,000 above, then it is impossible. So this is bogus propaganda, they have gone to the moon.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: It's a very reasonable proposition because going to the moon, they simply come back with some rocks. Rocks they can get on the earth also.

Prabhupāda: They are all nonsense. Some sand and some rocks, and we have to believe they have gone to. The fools may believe, but we cannot believe. We have got other information. Why shall I believe?

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Prabhupāda: No, at least… We … just like we challenge, they cannot give answer. This should be proved. Then they will be proved that they are rascals.

Harikeśa: The whole scientific craze seems to be settling down anyway. It seems to be dying down.

Prabhupāda: It must die. The scientists, they admit now, "What we shall do? We have bluffed in so many ways. Now what is the next bluffing?" Their bluff, last bluffing, was going to the moon planet, and everything is failed. Then what is next bluffing? That is their problem, how to keep their big, big post?

Harikeśa: There's nothing left to do.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They have finished all their theories. Still, they could not do anything. This is their position. (break) Margarine is also another bluff. It is oil; it is taken as ghee, er, butter.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1975, Johannesburg:

Harikeśa: And they have earth dust as if it came from the moon.

Prabhupāda: And the other scientist says this kind dust can be had here. So what is the proof they went there? It can be collected here.

Harikeśa: And their dust does not reflect. They say the moon is reflective, but the dust and the pictures, it was all dark gray. No reflection.

Prabhupāda: So therefore if I say that they did not go to the moon, how they can support?

Harikeśa: They cannot prove. They are so clever and sophisticated with their nonsense, they can even make the astronauts believe...

Prabhupāda: Therefore I asked you to ask them, "Why Sunday first and Monday next?"

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: Therefore I asked you to ask them, "Why Sunday first and Monday next?"

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: It's very conceivable that they could have tricked everyone. They simply have a video. They go up in a space ship around. They simply show a film from the space ship back to the earth, how they were practicing in the Arizona desert and they collected some rocks and took it with them. It's very easy.

Harikeśa: Sanka dāsa, you know, in Bombay? He was in the CIA. And they..., when he was in Vietnam, they knocked him out one day and they brought him to a dentist and they took out three of his teeth, and they put in these little transistors. And these little transistors were connected to his brain. And they would talk to him and make him do things by speaking into these transistors into his brain. And if he ever said anything wrong..., like he was not supposed to reveal secrets. And if he ever revealed a secret, they would try to kill him by making a signal go to his brain, and they can explode his brain. So conceivably they can trick the astronauts completely like that by putting things and making them think like they went to the moon.

Prabhupāda: Śaṅkara dāsa?

Harikeśa: Yes. He was saying... And when he got out of the Army he had so much pain in his teeth he went to a dentist, and he took out all of his teeth. That's why he has no teeth, because all of his teeth had these little things inside them. And one...

Prabhupāda: He is in Bombay now?

Morning Walk -- October 25, 1975, Mauritius:

Devotee: Śrīla Prabhupāda, should we call all the women "mother"?

Prabhupāda: Yes. And treat it like mother. Not only call, but treat it like mother.

Harikeśa: Actually we have not even any idea how to treat mother.

Prabhupāda: Learn it. At least mother should not be proposed for sex. This much you can learn. Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat, ātmavat sarva-bhūteṣu. (break) ...two questions, that they have not gone to moon planet and they cannot make even a chicken egg, you make great propaganda.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: The rascals will be proved that they're really rascals.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They're saying, "To make human being." First let them make an ant or an egg.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just see. Then? (Bengali) "You cannot catch even nonpoisonous snake, and you are telling that 'I shall now catch cobra.' "

Morning Walk -- November 13, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So... (break) ...taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, the greatest fortune. Thousands of young men joining, but here in India nobody is coming.

Dr. Patel: Because they have already joined.

Prabhupāda: All unfortunate, now they are. They have been so much trained badly. They say frankly, "Oh, this Hare Kṛṣṇa we have seen." In America when they chant... The Americans are chanting on the street, and the Indian students, "Oh, this we have done much. We have nothing to..." Here also they are thinking like that: "What is this Hare Kṛṣṇa movement? Eh? A beggars' movement." śāstra says, harer nāma harer nāma harer nāmaiva kevalam (CC Adi 17.21), and these rascals are thinking, "Oh, Hare Kṛṣṇa we have seen." You see? They have become so greatly intelligent, these rascals. They do not believe in śāstra, in sādhu, in God. All these "incarnations" and big, big men, they say, "Oh, what is the use of śāstra?" Even this Ānandamāyā says that "In higher advancement there is no need of śāstra." He is above śāstra. He, she says like that. And Kṛṣṇa said, yaḥ śāstra-vidhim utsṛjya vartate kāma-kārataḥ, na sa siddhim avāpnoti (BG 16.23), immediately condemned: "If you don't believe in śāstra, you are rascal." Kṛṣṇa said. And they say, "Oh, there is no need of..." And he's an incarnation of Kṛṣṇa. This Bal-yogi rascal is doing that: "There is no need of śāstra." This is going on. Now he's finished, of course. His activity is finished. (break)...strength of śāstra we are challenging that "You have never gone to the moon planet." Who can do so? The whole world is accepting they have gone to moon planet, and we are challenging, "You have never gone to moon." Hare Kṛṣṇa. Thank you very much. (end)

Morning Walk -- November 14, 1975, Bombay:

Brahmānanda: "The greatest contribution of the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is its authorized translations of Vedic literature." Oh, "The greatest contribution to scholars." No. "The greatest contribution of the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is that it is providing to scholars authorized translations of these Vedic literatures."

Prabhupāda: That is the remark of a very big professor.

Devotee (3): Śrīla Prabhupāda, how do we support our challenge that they have not gone to the moon?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Devotee (3): How do we support our challenge to the scientists that they have not actually gone to the moon?

Prabhupāda: First proof is that they say that there is no life. That is foolishness. There is life. Because we find everywhere life, why not in the moon planet? And there are many others. The first challenge is this.

Devotee (3): They say that they have not seen the life, though.

Prabhupāda: But what you can see, rascal? Therefore we say you are rascals. Why do you believe your eyes? You cannot see so many things. We don't find any living entity in the ocean. Does it mean there is no living entity? So what is the value of your seeing? That is the defect. They believe in too much their eyes. Although eyes are... Every sense is imperfect. You can see here: "Oh, we don't find anything. It is all zero." Does it mean the sky is zero? There are millions of planets and millions of living entities. So that is their rascaldom. They think that they are perfect. Whatever they see, that is perfect. That is their mistake. If I say, "No, there is no life. I cannot see," is that very good statement? And in the..., externally you don't find any living entity, but is it void of living entities?

Morning Walk -- December 20, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Suppose if you come from other side and you land on Arabian desert, does it mean that you have gone...

Indian man: They have gone on earth, some other part of the place...

Prabhupāda: And I say they have not gone to moon, that is my point. (laughter)

Dr. Patel: They have become "moonies."

Prabhupāda: The might have gone to some hell, that is, I have no objection.

Indian man: Or the moon or anything.

Prabhupāda: Huh? (laughing) This is a little revolting (revolutionary). But I am speaking from the very beginning. Yes, I wrote that Easy Journey to Other Planets in 1958, and you'll find this statement in my book. It is all childish.

Dr. Patel: You have to be yogi for that.

Prabhupāda: I am yogi because I am taking lessons from the yogis...

Page Title:	Going to the moon (Conversations 1968 - 1975)
Compiler:	Visnu Murti
Created:	04 of Jul, 2012
Totals by Section:	BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=87, Let=0
No. of Quotes:	87