Expressions researched:
"God consciousness"
Conversations and Morning Walks
1968 Conversations and Morning Walks
Interview -- February 1, 1968, Los Angeles: Interviewer: Utopian-like, where there is no harm, no..., all is good, and...
Prabhupāda: Yes. Now, this our process is chanting. It is very innocent. If you sit down and chant with us, you have no loss, no harm, but there is great gain. You see? By chanting, you gradually cleanse your heart and you can realize what is God. That is the greatest gain. Human life is meant for knowing God. The animals, they cannot know, although the bodily demands of the animal and the human being are the same. The animals, they sleep; man also sleeps. Animal, they eat; man also eats. The animal, they are also afraid of some enemy; man is also afraid of some enemy. The animals, they mate with the opposite sex, and men also do that. But what is the special significance of man? He can understand about God, but the animal cannot. Therefore if a man does not take to this understanding, he is no better than animal. A man who has no God consciousness or Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he is no better than animal because he has no other business than the four principles of bodily demands. So that is also prevalent in animal kingdom. Therefore this is a privilege for human being, to understand about God, and as such, in every human society there is some sort of religious principle. This religious principle means to understand God. Either you take it, Christianity or Judaism or Hinduism, every religion is trying to understand God according to their capacity. So without this understanding, means Kṛṣṇa consciousness, human life is as good as animal life.
Interview -- September 24, 1968, Seattle: Prabhupāda: There is no conflict at all. The conflict is between persons who are godless, who does not believe in God. Conflict is there. The conflict is not between East and West; the conflict is between the atheists and the theists. We are preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness, not that we are trying to replace something by Indian method to Christian method or Jewish method. That is not our policy. This is... In one sense, Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is the post-graduate study of all religions. What is the method of religion? To accept the authority of God. That is the primary principle of every religion, may be Christian religion or Hindu religion or Mohammedan religion. It doesn't matter. But people are becoming godless. That is the problem. They are thinking that "There is no God. Nature is everything." That is their foolishness. They are unhappy for this godlessness. And as a result of this godlessness, the Communist party have sprang up, the hippies have sprang up and so many other things will gradually spring up. So there is no check. It is... The only check is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if people are taught that he can be happy only by reestablishing his eternal relationship with God. So our test of religion is how one has developed his God consciousness or love of God.
Talk During Prasada After Kirtana -- November 8, 1968, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: That's all right. It is Kṛṣṇa's grace. I was telling the same thing to Dayānanda, that he should present this case to the higher officer. That's all. We are preaching God consciousness. We should be given... That was the Vedic law. Saintly persons, they should be given all protection. If somebody insulted a saintly person, there was a special punishment for that. That's all right. So you take that house, that is Hollywood quarter? Hm. Give him more. No. I have got. You take. Oh, Nandarāṇī is outside? Why she is outside?
Woman: It's the baby.
Prabhupāda: Baby was not disturbing. I have received one letter from San Francisco. They are shortage of men. So Dinadayal is going back?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh no. We need more men here. (Prabhupāda laughs) We are so short. That is the problem. We have too few people here. Dīnadayālu is so essential. I was just going to ask you if we could have some more men. Jayarāma...
Prabhupāda: Create men. Bring some men.
1969 Conversations and Morning Walks
Discussion with Guests -- December 23, 1969, Boston: Guest (1): But I don't think I'm thinking of myself as matter but I'm also not thinking of myself as...
Prabhupāda: No. You are not matter. You are spirit. Your body is matter. You are also one of the energies. You are spiritual energy and your body is material energy. And because you are spiritual energy, therefore your intimate relationship with the spirit soul or the Supreme Soul... That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness or God consciousness. The body will change, but you, as spirit soul, you will not change. You are eternal. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). Body being changed, that is not changed. That is eternal. So we have to pick up our eternal relationship with God. That is missing.
Discussion with BTG Staff -- December 24, 1969, Boston: Hayagrīva: Thank you. There's so many... That causes a headache for everyone.
Prabhupāda: No. It is better to make everything sound but slow. We want to create this position of Back to Godhead as very authorized representation of the science of God. In future people may refer to it, so we should very cautiously and very nicely do it. It is very important thing, Back to Godhead. If our movement is going to be recognized as scientific, God consciousness movement, then this Back to Godhead will be referred as authorized scripture. So therefore we have to prepare in such a way, nothing non-conclusive can be introduced in this. That should be our policy. And actually it is the position of Back to Godhead.
1971 Conversations and Morning Walks
Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow: Prabhupāda: Because we are... Any orthodox Hindu may come, but we have got our weapons, Vedic evidences. So nobody has come. But even Christian priest... Even Christian priests in America, they love me. They say that "These boys..., our boys... They are Americans. They are Christians. They are Jews. And these boys are so much after God, and we could not deliver them?" They're admitting. Their fathers, their parents, come to me. They also flatly offer their obeisances and say, "Swamiji, it is our great fortune that you have come. You are teaching God consciousness." So on the contrary, I have got reception from other countries. And India also, as you inquired of India, all other sects, they're admitting that before me many hundreds of swamis went there, but they could not convert to Kṛṣṇa consciousness a single person. They are admiring that. And so far I am concerned, I don't take any credit, but I am confident that because I am presenting the Vedic knowledge as it is, without any adulteration, it is being effective. That is my contribution. Just like if you have got a right medicine and if you administer to a patient, you must be sure that he'll cure.
Television Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville: Interviewer: Oh yes. He is the one who came back five hundred years ago to India?
Prabhupāda: Yes. So he is Kṛṣṇa Himself, and He is teaching how to love Kṛṣṇa. Therfore His process is most authorized. Just like you are the expert in this establishment. If somebody is doing something, if you personally teach him, "Do like this," that is very authorized. So God consciousness, God Himself is teaching. Just like in Bhagavad-gītā, Kṛṣṇa is God. He is speaking about Himself. And at last He says, "Just surrender unto Me. I take charge of you." But people misunderstand. So Lord Caitanya—Kṛṣṇa again came as Lord Caitanya to teach people how to surrender. And because we are following the footsteps of Lord Caitanya, the method is so sublime that even foreigners who never knew Kṛṣṇa, they are surrendering. The method is so potent. So that was my purpose. We don't say that "This religion is better than this religion," or, "My process is better." We want to see by the result. In the Sanskrit there is a word, phalena paricīyate. A thing is judged by the result.
Television Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville: Interviewer: Yes but more emphasis on that relationship than on the relationship between one individual and another individual. Am I right in that?
Prabhupāda: No. We have to establish first of all our lost relationship with God. You see? Then we can understand what is the relationship between one individual to another. If the central point is missing, then there is practically no relationship. Just like you are American. Another is American. Both of you, you feel American nationally because the center is America. So unless you understand God, you cannot understand what I am, neither I can understand what you are. So we have to first of all reestablish our lost relationship with God; then we can establish, talk of universal brotherhood. Otherwise there will be discrimination. Just like in your country, or any country, the national... National means a man born in that land. Is it not? But they do not take the animals as national. Why they have no right to become national? That is imperfect knowledge. There is no God consciousness. Therefore they think only the man born in this land is national, not others.
Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville: Prabhupāda: India, yes. So He is Kṛṣṇa Himself, and He is teaching how to love Kṛṣṇa. Therefore His process is most authorized. Just like you are the expert in this establishment. If somebody is doing something, if you personally teach him, "Do like this," that is very authorized. So God consciousness, God Himself is teaching. Just like in Bhagavad-gītā, Kṛṣṇa is God, He is speaking about Himself, and at last He says, "Just surrender unto Me, I take charge of you." But people misunderstood. So Lord Caitanya, Kṛṣṇa again came as Lord Caitanya to teach people how to surrender. And because we are following the footsteps of Lord Caitanya, the method is so sublime that even foreigners who never knew Kṛṣṇa, they're following it. The method is so potent. So that was my purpose. We don't say that "This religion is better that this religion," or "My process is better." We want to see by the result. In the Sanskrit there is a word, phalena paricīyate: a thing is judged by the result.
Interview -- July 29, 1971, Gainesville: Interviewer: Yes, but more, more emphasis on that relationship than on the relationship between one individual and another individual. Am I right in that?
Prabhupāda: No. We have to establish first of all our lost relationship with God. You see? Then we can understand what is the relationship between one individual to another. If the central point is missing, then there is practically no relationship. Just like you are American and another is American, both of you, you feel American nationality because the center is America. So unless you understand God, you cannot understand "What I am." Neither I can understand what you are. So I have..., we have to first of all reestablish our lost relationship with God, then we can establish, talk of universal brotherhood. Otherwise there will be discrimination. Just like in your country, or any country, the national... National means a man born in that land. Is it not? But they do not take the animals as national. Why they have no right to become national? That is imperfect of knowledge. There is no God consciousness; therefore they think only the man born in this land is national, not others.
Temple Press Conference -- August 5, 1971, London: Woman Interviewer: Yes, Your Grace, it seems to many people that there is probably more. There are probably more people in the world now who are seeking some kind of spiritual new light than probably ever before, or at least, there's more evidence of it. And I wonder if you agreed with that, and if so can you tell me why it is?
Prabhupāda: Yes, That should be the natural hankering with us. Because we are spirit soul we cannot be happy in material atmosphere. Just like you take out the fish from the water, it cannot be happy on the land, similarly, if we are without spiritual consciousness we can never be happy. So people after advancement of scientific knowledge and economic development, they are not happy. They are becoming hippies. So the cause is that they're in search of spiritual life and this is the proper delivery, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness.
Room Conversation Excerpt -- August 9, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: Therefore His teachings, crude, teachings, cannot be now applied to the modern advanced educated people. That was suitable for those people. Now people have advanced in science, in philosophy. Now God consciousness ...and should be presented on the basis of science and philosophy. Otherwise people will not accept.
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: We are preaching God consciousness. God is God. God is neither Christian, nor Hindu, nor Muslim. God is God. So everyone should be God conscious. That is our movement. We are preaching love of Godhead. So it doesn't matter what type of religion one is following. We simply want to see that he has love for God. Our bhāgavata-dharma defines: that is first-class religion following which one becomes a lover of God. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje (SB 1.2.6). That is first-class religion if by following that one becomes a lover of God. It doesn't matter what religion he is following, but the test will be whether he has become a lover of God. That is our...
Sister Mary: So you don't try to convert people from other religions.
Prabhupāda: No.
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: Everywhere. Everywhere. In Bombay, everywhere we go, "Hare Kṛṣṇa." In Montreal. They joke, they'll clap, but they'll chant. And that is wanted. I want to see that everyone is chanting. And if chanting has effect, then either he's chanting jokingly or seriously it will have the effect. Fire, if you touch either jokingly or seriously or cautiously, it will act. So our request is that you also preach this cult. Let us cooperate. The whole world is suffering for want of God consciousness. So it is the duty of all religious sects to teach this simple art of chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa or any other name which you have got. That's all.
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Revatīnandana: What should the mind be doing?
Prabhupāda: My mind should be absorbed in God consciousness. That is, that is the effect. He can think of God only, nothing else. That is the effect.
Sister Mary: It's very difficult to think of God.
Prabhupāda: No. It is not difficult. It is difficult for the sinners. Those who are not sinners, it is not difficult.
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: (people coming in) Oh. You come forward. Give him seat. Śivānanda, you come... You can sit there. Yes. So the God consciousness can be awakened if you stop sinful activities. Otherwise, it is impossible. You go on preaching for millions of years; there will be no God consciousness. There will be no God consciousness. That is the... in Bhagavad-gītā. (people sitting down) Why? You can come here, this side.
Haṁsadūta: You can sit here.
Prabhupāda: Yeṣāṁ tv anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ (BG 7.28). One who has finished sinful activities, he can be engaged in God consciousness. One who is engaged in sinful activities, he cannot. Devil citing scripture. A devīl cannot cite scripture. Angel can cite scripture. And according to our ācāryas, Sanātana Gosvāmī, he says that "Don't hear scriptures from the devīl." Avaiṣṇava-mukhodgīrṇaṁ pūtaṁ hari-kathāmṛtaṁ śravaṇaṁ naiva kartavyam." If a devīl's preaching about God, don't hear." If you say, "God is pure, so let me hear about God. It doesn't matter whether he is devīl or angel. It doesn't matter."
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: According to Bhagavad-gītā, there are four classes of men who deride at God and four classes of men who approaches God.
- na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ
- prapadyante narādhamāḥ
- māyayāpahṛta-jñānā
- āsuriṁ bhāvam āśritāḥ
- (BG 7.15)
Atheist class of men, who are always engaged in sinful activities, and therefore fools... They don't believe in the next life. Therefore they are fools. There is next life. They say, "Oh, we don't care for next life. Let us do whatever we like." That is a foolish proposition. Because there is next life. Just like a man he becomes irresponsible. He says, "I don't care for government or law. I can do whatever I like." That means he's risking his life. As soon as he'll be arrested, he'll be punished. Therefore he's mūḍha, rascal. Anyone who is defying the kingdom of God, he's a rascal. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). Narādhamāḥ, is lowest of the mankind. God consciousness is meant for human beings, and if a person defies God, then he's the lowest of the mankind. māyayāpahṛta-jñānā. His knowledge has been plundered by the illusory energy. He may be academically a very big title holder, but if he's not God conscious, then his knowledge has been taken away. Real knowledge has been taken away. Asuriṁ bhāvam āśritāḥ. These are the symptoms of the atheist class of men. So on the whole, at the present moment, God consciousness must be spread if actually they want peace and prosperity. And those who are in charge of religion, religion means God consciousness. Everyone should combine to spread God consciousness. That is the immediate necessity at the present moment.
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Devotee: Last, year, when we went to the police authorities for our procession here, and we wanted to make three rathas and the police officer, he was so envious, he said, "No. There is no law, we can put three rathas on the street." We said, "What is the harm? Won't you give us protection?" "So many people will be dying and killed under the ratha. If the ratha is so big and all that. People will be killed." I said, "They are big all over the world. This is for God consciousness."
Prabhupāda: So many people are dying by motor accidents, but do they stop motor car?
English guest: Do you think the situation will get better in London.
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Revatīnandana: It's fundamentally a God conscious attitude, that this body, this human body is meant for spiritual realization. The fact that the body has got sexual desire, therefore we make a concession for that. We use it for begetting good children. If one wants to marry, he can marry and have good children, and raise them to love God. But the real purpose of human life is not just to enjoy sex life like the cats and dogs. Human life has got a higher purpose. So therefore we believe that our human energy should be utilized in that way, for reducing the eating, the sleeping, the sex life. Reducing these things to the minimum, as much as necessary, rather than as much as possible. And having as much as necessary, that leaves most of our time and energy for cultivating our God consciousness. See what I mean? Therefore the idea is that sex life is the highest happiness for man, we don't subscribe to that. It's the biggest happiness in this material world. But spiritual life means unending happiness. A human being can experience this. The dog or cat can't. So for them there is eating, sleeping, sex life, defending themselves. But a human being can experience higher pleasure in God consciousness. So we think that... Therefore we use our energy in that direction.
Sister Mary: So it isn't a negation of pleasure, but it's a higher pleasure.
Guest (2): Can I ask...
Prabhupāda: This is very important point, that we are not negating pleasure, but we are trying to bring them to the highest pleasure.
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Sister Mary: Who controls, if one of the members becomes grasping, wants things for himself...?
Prabhupāda: No, what... We are therefore teaching. We are therefore teaching. Members are gradually learning how to sacrifice for God. So when he is completely trained up, he knows that nothing belongs to Him. Everything belongs to God. Therefore, whatever he possesses, it must be utilized for God's purposes. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness. We take it for granted, and that is a fact. Everything belongs to God. God, whatever God has given me for my use, so I must use it, first of all expressing my gratitude to God, "O God, You are so kind that You have given me this. So first of all you taste it. Then I'll eat." This is our philosophy.
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: Now, even there was no God's picture, one who is God conscious, he can see in the natural scenery presentation, he can see, "Oh, how God is artistic. How he has manufactured this flower, how he has painted, how He has made this tree." So that is higher intelligence. That is higher intelligence. Because without God, there can be nothing existing. So one has to learn how to see God in everything. That is another thing. That is higher status. Yes. But in the lower status of God consciousness one is advised that you should not see anything without God. But in the higher status, there is nothing in the world which is without God. But we should not imitate the higher status of life in the lower status of our position. Otherwise, one who has learned about God, he can see God in this flower. Actually, how God's hand has worked out this nice flower. Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā God says, raso 'ham apsu kaunteya (BG 7.8). Just like I am drinking water. In the taste of the water I'll see God. God says, Kṛṣṇa says, "I am the taste of the water." And actually, that taste cannot be created by man. The taste in the water, that is God's gift. So as soon as I taste the water, immediately I should remember, "Oh, here is God."
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: Not attitude. Development of my God consciousness. Attitude may be artificial. But it is actual development of God consciousness. God consciousness is there in everybody. It requires simply to be developed. Just like a child. A child has got love within her, within his heart. But when he is young, it develops. It develops. And the girl, boy, automatically becomes attached because that propensity has developed. It is not an artificial thing. It was already there. It has to be developed. So God consciousness is there in everyone's heart. Otherwise, how these boys are chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa? Unless Kṛṣṇa was there within. Artificially you cannot force them, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa twenty-four hours.
Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London: Sister Mary: Do you believe you (indistinct) people, if they hear it? If they hear this?
Prabhupāda: Yes. As they hear, they became purified, and that dormant consciousness becomes awakened. Yes. Awakened. That chance we are giving. We are chanting and others are hearing. By this process, chanting and hearing, both of us will be benefited, awakening our original God consciousness.
Revatīnandana: At the stage of awakening, when you're waking up, when you're becoming cured of the diseased condition, you sometimes have to restrict your diet. Later on, when you are healthy, you can take all kinds of foodstuffs in the proper way. But while you're getting over a disease you have to restrict your diet. Therefore we hear things that are directly concerned with Kṛṣṇa's name, form, activities. Later on, then we'll be able to see God in a flower, God in everywhere. Otherwise we'll see the flower however we enjoy a flower because we're not at that healthy stage. So therefore there are regulations that we follow for curing the disease. That means for a little while we restrict the diet. Then when we're healthy...
Prabhupāda: Just like these flowers. These flowers the devotees are bringing to their spiritual master, to God. They are not enjoying. Ordinary man, if he gets a flower, he'll put it in the pocket. How... You see? That is the difference of God consciousness. The flower is the same, but use is different.
Conversation with Journalists -- August 18, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: We are simply presenting the fact that everything belongs to God. God is the supreme friend and God is the maintainer of everyone, everything, and He is the supreme enjoyer. These three things, if we understand, then the whole problem is solved. Now, I say that God is the proprietor. Now you refute. Those who will not accept, that "God is not proprietor, I am proprietor," this requires discussion. How you become proprietor? Bhagavad-gītā says, God says, bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva-loka-maheśvaram (BG 5.29). I am not manufacturing this. It is stated in the śāstra. God is the supreme enjoyer. He is the proprietor. He should be enjoyer. Just like here, if I am the proprietor of a factory, so the profit should come to me, similarly, if God is the proprietor of everything then we cannot enjoy anything without the sanction of God. We therefore eat prasādam. We know that the fruit, flowers, or grains, or milk, whatever we are offering to Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa has given us. You cannot manufacture these things, nice oranges, in factory. You cannot manufacture rice or wheat. Actually, God has given. That is God consciousness.
Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London: Dr. Weir: No, because your illustration you gave of the light of the sun falling on one side and making that light, on the other side dark. But you can also have a body which is in the complete absence of any light anyway so there won't be any differentiation.
Prabhupāda: No. There is light. The light is now visible. Light is there. Just like we say that our relationship with God is there. One is conscious. Another is unconscious. Otherwise God consciousness is there. Therefore any process that awakens that consciousness, that is perfect process. The consciousness is there. That is stated in Caitanya-caritāmṛta, an authorized book. Nitya siddha kṛṣṇa bhakti.... This God consciousness is not something artificial. The God consciousness is there. Just like these European boys and girls, they're now devotees of Kṛṣṇa. Not that artificially we have imposed this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. The Kṛṣṇa consciousness was there, by under certain process of treatment that has been awakened.
Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London: Śyāmasundara: (indistinct) It's God consciousness.
Dr. Weir: That's what I say Unitarians apparently by having so much of this in their (indistinct) in quite a different way from a different philosophy. And, of course, you begin to feel that they must be very (indistinct) because they were so persecuted. If a person is no real menace to you, you don't have to persecute him. I think Socrates and Christ are perfect examples of that.
Prabhupāda: (indistinct)
Dr. Weir: I think that's been most fascinating, Swami, very kind of you, indeed.
Prabhupāda: Thank you.
Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: Our process of test is, how far he is advanced in God consciousness. That is our test. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇāḥ. It is said yasyāsti bhaktir bhagavaty akiñcanā (SB 5.18.12). If one has developed God consciousness all good qualities must develop in them. All good qualities. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇāḥ. And one who has not developed Kṛṣṇa consciousness or God consciousness, he cannot have any good qualities because his business is mental speculation, mano-rathenāsati dhāvato... By simply mental speculation, he'll be fixed up in this material world.
Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: For example, for example, our boys, Europeans, American boys, they were addicted with illicit sex life. They were addicted to meat-eating. They were addicted drinking. They were addicted to gambling. Now they've given up everything. There is no illicit sex in our society. There is no gambling. There is no meat-eating. There is not even smoking, or taking, drinking tea. How it is possible? They were addicted to all these things from beginning of their life. Now they have given up. If you take this as good qualities, then they have already developed, besides others. Why? Because due to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Sometimes in America the authorities they are surprised. They want to consult us on that: "How you people have given up this (indistinct)." They are spending so much money to stop this bad habit. How it is that your members used to (indistinct) Not only LSD, all kinds of intoxications. So if you take it as a good quality, that good quality is developing due to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Therefore this is a fact: one who has no Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness, he may go on speculating but he'll never come to the platform of goodness. That is our test.
Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London: Prabhupāda: One priest in Boston, he issued leaflet regretting that these boys, he saw our students. He appreciated that these boys are so much after God and they're our boys. We could not give them. Actually the same boy was, one year or two years ago, he was not going to church, was not interested in God consciousness, but now this same boy is mad after God. And he's twenty-four hours in God consciousness. They're chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra twenty-four hours. How they have become so...
Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London: Dr. Weir: This is what I've said earlier on that the whole of the...
Prabhupāda: Yes. So therefore if one comes to God consciousness, he becomes more active.
Dr. Weir: The whole evolution, I think I may have said it before you came in, the whole evolution to the human mind, is to become more and more in conscious control.
Prabhupāda: So mind, mind, activities of mind, activities of intelligence and activities of spirit, the spiritual activities more greater than the mind's mental activities.
Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London: Śyāmasundara: Just like you were saying a while ago that if you were in God consciousness, you need not wear a robe. That's also our philosophy. It's very practical. But your consciousness would be always serving Kṛṣṇa, always serving God in whatever status of life. It isn't necessary to put on a robe first and then do like that.
Dr. Weir: But it helps some people.
Mensa Member: The soul is a very interesting concept, the soul as well, the fact that the soul is quantifiable, that it exists in a smaller part in the larger animals, and a higher part in a higher animals.
Śyāmasundara: No. It's the same size in all entities.
Mensa Member: Oh, it is, is it? But when we reach a point when we don't know whether there are living things or not, you know, the amino acids, and things like that or...
Dr. Weir: Well, I would take up that straight away, fundamentally, that it's perfectly correct to say it's the same size in every (indistinct) has no size.
Prabhupāda: No. It has size. We cannot measure it.
Interview with Reporters -- November 10, 1971, New Delhi: Prabhupāda: Well, that professor wanted to hear, that's all right. So I... My conclusion was that "Your communistic idea has not very much improved from our idea, because you cannot do without surrendering. Our Kṛṣṇa philosophy is to surrender to Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, sarva dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇam (BG 18.66). So your surrendering process is there. You have not improved. You say God consciousness or Kṛṣṇa consciousness is not good, but you have not improved, because instead of Kṛṣṇa, you have surrendered to Lenin. That's all. So you have to surrender in any circumstance. Either you become communist or this 'ist' or that 'ist,' you have to surrender."
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Room Conversation Including Discussion on SB 1.5.11 -- January 19, 1972, Jaipur: Prabhupāda: If the whole thought is targeted to glorify the Supreme Lord, then nāmāny anantasya yaśo 'nkitāni yat gṛṇanti gāyanti śṛṇvanti sādhavaḥ. Then those who are actually sādhu, even in spite of all these defects, because the only attempt is to glorify the Lord, then those who are sādhu, those who are devotee, they hear it. Śṛṇvanti gāyanti gṛṇanti. Not only hear, they chant also the same thing. And not only chant, but gṛṇanti, they apply in their actual life. This is the Bhāgavata śloka. Is it clear now? Yes. Tad-vāg-visargo janatāgha-viplavo (
SB 1.5.11). If the thought is revolutionary for transcendental realization, even it is not properly composed from grammatical and literary point of view, because the attempt is there for glorifying the Supreme Lord, all devotees, all great sages, saintly persons, sādhavaḥ, gṛṇanti, they accept. Yes. Gṛṇanti śṛṇvanti, hear with attention, and gāyanti, and chant also. This is the principle. The only center is whether it is meant for awakening
God consciousness. That is the central point, not the language(?). But it does not mean that it should not be correctly written. Correctly or incorrectly, if it is spoken by realized soul, that is important. Śṛṇvanti gāyanti. Somehow or other, if the attempt is to glorify the Supreme Lord; otherwise, if the attempt is to kill the Supreme Lord... Just like Dr. Radhakrishnan, what is the value of such erudition? A rascal. That is called (Sanskrit), jugglery of words. It has no value.
Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura: Bob: That charity is ignorance.
Prabhupāda: Yes. There are three kinds of charities: goodness, passion, and ignorance. Goodness means charity where charity must be given. Just like this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. So if anyone gives charity to this movement, that is goodness. Because it is spreading God consciousness, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is goodness. And if one gives charity for some return, that is passion. And if somebody gives in charity, he does not know what he's going to do, just like the Bowery man, that is ignorance. So our Vedic principle is, Kṛṣṇa says, that yat karoṣi yaj juhoṣi dadāsi yat kuruṣva mad-arpaṇam. That "Give Me." There is no question of knowing what is going to happen. If Kṛṣṇa takes, that is the perfection of charity. Or anyone who is representative of Kṛṣṇa, he takes, that is perfection.
Room Conversation -- April 1, 1972, Sydney: Prabhupāda: Because in the Bhagavad-gītā we hear, mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanam that God is in everyone's heart as Supersoul. Now, I am thinking of getting something. So God knows immediately that "He wants to have this," so He gives me the necessary thing which appears to me as chance, without knowing God. The things are supplied by God because He is giving me all facilities to enjoy this material world to my heart's content by supplying all the ingredients. That is the material condition. So these foolish persons are taking as chance, but it is not chance. God is omnipotent. As soon as He understands that I want this, He gives me some facility so that I get it. So it is not chance. It is by arrangement of superior authority. But because they are atheists, they have no sense of God consciousness, they are taking as chance, that necessity creates that chance; automatically it is coming. Not automatically. Chance does not mean automatically. I cannot see something, but all of a sudden falls... Just like I am hungry, I want some food. So Kṛṣṇa knows it that you want some... Some way or other, the food comes to me. So it is the arrangement of Kṛṣṇa, but I see it is chance: "I was hungry and by chance the food has come." That is my less intelligence. It is not chance; it is plain. Otherwise you cannot adjust the meaning of chance in that way, that as soon as there is necessity, immediately the opportune chance comes before us.
Room Conversation -- April 18, 1972, Hong Kong: Prabhupāda: That's very natural. It is costly here. But these children and their parents also very much interested. So I think you should have a nice institution here to train the children in this country. And after their education, they may take to any line of livelihood. That doesn't matter. But the foundation... Just like in our Vedic system, first of all brahmacārī. That brahmacārī system is very nice. Even Kṛṣṇa, God Himself, He has nothing to learn. He is abhijñā. In the Vedas He is described as abhijñā: He knows everything. But just to teach us, He also became a brahmacārī in the Gurukula. Lord Rāmacandra, He also accepted a guru, Vasiṣṭha. So that is our Vedic system. Anybody may be anything, but the process is tad vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). In order to learn the value of life, spiritual value of life, one must go to a guru. Tad vijñānārtham. In order to understand the spiritual value of life one must go to a guru. Gurum evābhigacchet. What is that guru? Śrotriyaṁ brahma-niṣṭham: "He is well learned in Vedic literature," and brahma-niṣṭham, "and firm faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead." These are the two qualifications of guru. He must know all the Vedic conclusions, śrotriyam, not that he has to read, but he must hear from the authoritative sources. Just like Arjuna is hearing from Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is the most authoritative personality. So similarly, everyone has to hear either from Kṛṣṇa or from His bona fide representative. That is śrotriyam. And the result will be that after becoming student of such bona fide guru, one will be firmly fixed up in God consciousness.
Conversation with Dai Nippon -- April 22, 1972, Tokyo: Prabhupāda: Oh, that's nice. So Veda, Veda means knowledge. So every human being should be interested for advancement of knowledge. So our movement is not a religious movement. It is a movement for advancement of knowledge. And this knowledge, God consciousness, or Kṛṣṇa consciousness, is especially meant for this human body. Because knowledge cannot be given to animals. I cannot speak to the other animals about knowledge because they are imperfect. Their body is imperfect. They are not suitable for receiving knowledge. Only elementary knowledge for maintaining this body, they have got: where to secure food, where to sleep, how to have sexual intercourse, and how to defend. These knowledges are there in animals also. So human being requires further knowledge. That is special prerogative, gift by God, by nature. Whatever you say. So we should utilize this human body for furtherance of knowledge. And the first important knowledge is that we should know that there is life after death. That is the basic principle of knowledge.
Room Conversation -- June 14, 1972, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: Mission. That mission is God realization. Cats and dogs cannot do it; human beings can do it. Therefore in any civilized human society, there is a type of religion. May be Christian religion or Mohammedan religion or Hindu religion or Buddhist—there is religion. But you cannot find this religious system in the animal kingdom of life. That is the difference. If we give up this religious consciousness or God consciousness, then we are as good as cats and dogs. That is the only difference. You go anywhere, any part of the world, and civilized human beings, they have got a system, which you may call religion or philosophy, to understand God. That prerogative is especially for the human beings. But if you do not care for that special prerogative, then you are as good as animal. What is the difference between animal and human being unless he has got some method of understanding God? The animal eats and we also eat. The animals sleep; we also sleep. The animals have sexual intercourse; we have got also. They are also afraid of something; we are also afraid of something. Then what is the difference?
Room Conversation -- June 14, 1972, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: They have no God consciousness. They do not know what is God.
Marilyn: Somehow I always thought that...
Prabhupāda: Just like children, they do not know what is government. They are satisfied with their eating, sleeping, playing, that's all. They have no other concern. But when one is grown up, he knows what is government. He has to abide by the state laws. Now you are grown up, if you violate the law "Keep to the right," you'll be criminal. But a child, if he violates the law, animal violates the law, he has no... But if a adult person violates the law, he'll be criminal. You cannot say, "I'm free." No. Law will not excuse. But if a children commits something... Suppose you, if you take something from my table, it is for you criminal. But if a child takes something from my table, it is not criminal. In your country especially, if you enter my house or room without permission, that is criminal. Is it not? Trespass.
Room Conversation -- June 29, 1972, San Diego: Prabhupāda: In other life may not, but he is associating at the present. That's a fact.
Ātreya Ṛṣi: When you first came, Śrīla Prabhupāda, a lot of people probably presented you arguments such as If you call the movement God consciousness you'll be more successful. If you not wear tilaka and do not shave your head and do not wear robes and do not go on saṅkīrtana, you will be more successful. And people still tell us things like this, that You tell us the philosophy, we like the philosophy, but why do you go on saṅkīrtana? So what were some of the arguments you presented to these type of people?
Prabhupāda: This is the same argument, ardha-kukkuṭī-nyāya (Cc. Ādi-līlā 5.176). You cut the mouth of the chicken because it eats, it is expensive, and keep the back side because it lays down egg. You see? Intelligent man said, I am getting every day one egg. So that side, the back side, is very good. But this side is expensive, eats. Cut it. So he does not know, he is such a foolish, that if I cut the head, then the egg-giving business will also stop. Similarly, if you accept this philosophy, then you must accept this also.
Room Conversation -- July 4, 1972, New York: Prabhupāda: He cannot do that. That, that is real faith in Jesus, that he cannot do that. So "Why he has eaten meat, he knows, but he has asked me not to kill. I have to follow it." That is real Christianity. You are not Jesus Christ. You cannot imitate. He has sacrificed his life for God. Can you do that? So why you (indistinct) imitate Jesus Christ? You are imitating Jesus Christ for eating meat. Why not imitate Jesus Christ, sacrifice your life for spreading God consciousness? What do you think, Kīrtanānanda?
Devotee: (indistinct)
Prabhupāda: Yes. When you preach, you can say all these things with so-called Christians. So what you are doing for God? Tejīyasāṁ na doṣāya (SB 10.33.29). Just like sun. The sun is absorbing urine. Can you drink urine? If you want to imitate sun, "Oh, here is sun absorbing urine. Let me drink urine," can you? Tejīyasāṁ na doṣāya. He is powerful. He can do everything. Therefore we cannot imitate Him. We have to simply abide by His order. That is real Christian. You cannot imitate powerful man. That is wrong.
Room Conversation -- July 4, 1972, New York: Prabhupāda: Because I may require in the.... So, we don't want to enter into arguments, but we must know, but if somebody comes to argument, we have to say. What can be done? We say that "You follow Christianity in perfect order, you'll be benefited." That we say. Our test is whether you're advancing in God consciousness. That is our test. You follow Christianity or Muhammadanism, anything you follow, we don't mind. Whether you are developing your God consciousness, love for God, that is our test. But if your process has failed, then you can try this. And you'll see, in our process within so short time, how they are becoming God conscious. You have to admit. And they admit also.
Interview -- July 5, 1972, New York: Prabhupāda: That, that I have repeatedly said, that you Americans, you are..., you have already the grace of the Lord. According to our Vedic formula, when a man is born in rich family he is understood to be possessing the grace of the Lord. So you Americans, you have got sufficient riches, you are sons of rich men. So this is the grace of God, janma aiśvarya, to take birth in a high family, to possess riches; janmaiśvarya śruta (SB 1.8.26), to become learned scholar. Just like you are going to the moon planet. Your scientific knowledge is advanced. And śrī, śrī means beauty. So you are beautiful also. So considering all these four points, it is to be understood that you are in favorable condition, favorable consideration of the Absolute Truth Supreme Personality of Godhead. Now, if you take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness, then all your these material opulences plus Kṛṣṇa consciousness makes your life perfect.
Interview -- July 5, 1972, New York: Prabhupāda: We are teaching everyone how to love God. If he thinks that "I have learned to love God through some particular religion," we have no objection. Either he is Christian or Hindu or Muslim or whatever he may be, if by executing the religious principles which he is professing he has developed his love of God, then we have nothing to preach to him. The result is there. But because we don't find the love of God is there, that we are putting a simple formula that "Here is the way." By utilizing or by accepting that way he will very quickly love God. So if we agree, if we are convinced that to love God is religion, and that is our main business in the human form of life, then this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is the genuine scientific movement. Everyone should take it. This is the (indistinct). But if somebody thinks that "My aim of life is different. I don't care for God," that is a different case. But our philosophy is, this human life is especially meant for developing that God consciousness or to know the art how to love God. Because the animals, they cannot. I cannot preach Kṛṣṇa consciousness philosophy amongst the animals, because their consciousness is not so developed. But still, my movement is so perfect that I can do well even to the cats and dogs—by offering prasādam, by giving him chance to hear Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra. This vibration is transcendental. When it is chanted it is good for everyone, all living entities. Therefore we go to the street and chant so that everyone can hear the transcendental vibration.
Interview -- July 20, 1972, Paris: Frenchman: (indistinct) ...history of many masters and many great teachers such as Jesus Christ and many others... (indistinct) ...come to... (indistinct) ...message. (indistinct) ...today on the same level.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Because from God's side there is always an attempt to make the people right. As soon as they're wrongly directed, some messenger comes like Jesus Christ or Buddha or, before Him, Lord Kṛṣṇa. So what we are preaching that is not new. It is God consciousness. And all the great messiahs they came. But the thing is that people are changing in their different education mentalities. So we have to present things in such a way that intelligent person can accept the old teachings in the western countries. Like Lord Jesus Christ... Either they're not being followed or they're not properly understood because in London I saw hundreds of churches are vacant. That means that it's so practical that people have no more interest in Christianity or the Christian people could not convince them of the spiritual necessity of life. Many churches are for sale. That's not a good sign. That means people have lost interest in spiritual life but fortunately the younger generation, they are taking to this spiritual movement.
Room Conversation and Interview with Ian Polsen -- July 31, 1972, London: Prabhupāda: They wanted to satisfy Kṛṣṇa, not their father, brother. Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, "This is the highest worship." (Sanskrit) There is no greater, topmost example of worship than the gopīs did. Because their only purpose was to serve Kṛṣṇa, unalloyed, without being disturbed by any other consideration. That is highest perfection: How to serve Kṛṣṇa. How Kṛṣṇa will be pleased. So at the present moment the best service to render for Kṛṣṇa is that... Kṛṣṇa..., when I speak of Kṛṣṇa, means God, the Supreme Lord. The whole rascal world, they have given up God consciousness. They have become rascal. Therefore to teach them about Kṛṣṇa consciousness is the best service at the present moment. Because the whole world—the so-called politicians, so-called scientists, so-called philosophers—they're all rascals. They have forgotten God. We, we call them directly, they're all rascals, mūḍhā, duṣkṛtina mūḍhā. All sinful, all rascals, because they have no information of God, Kṛṣṇa. Ask any scientist, "Do you know anything about Kṛṣṇa?" "Oh, what is Kṛṣṇa? What is God? This is all foolish, humbug." They will say like that. And he's passing as great scientist. He's fool number one but he's passing as great scientist. (laughter) Ha! Our Śyāmasundara's daughter, little daughter, she preaches, "Do you know Kṛṣṇa?" If somebody says, "No, I do not," "The Supreme Personality of Godhead." (laughter) Actually that is nice preaching.
Room Conversation -- August 1, 1972, London: Devotee: Yeah. We're not wandering from village to village anymore. We're settled.
Prabhupāda: No. Even we wander from village to village, people are being impressed that we are doing something good. Actually it is so. I tell you it is so. One who cannot understand it, he is a fool. Actually we are doing the best work, God consciousness. And actually it is a fact: simply for want of God consciousness they are suffering, that's all. There is no other reason. The only reason is this. Just like this morning I said, "God is the proprietor. Why you are claiming proprietor? You may be manager, not proprietor." Actually that is our position. Just like I am head of this institution, but I am not dealing as proprietor. I am dealing as manager, head. Is it not?
Devotee: This is the only society where Kṛṣṇa is the owner of everything.
Prabhupāda: And all my assistants, they are also working in that capacity. If I would have been proprietor, then they would not have been interested.
Interview with the New York Times -- September 2, 1972, New Vrindaban: Prabhupāda: If one gets a diamond, he possesses something valuable. But in this civilization you are simply making plastic plates and plastic cups. Indeed, in Japan I have seen pasteboard homes. And everyone is thinking that he is advanced. Formerly people used to have golden and silver utensils, but now they have plastic ones, and still they are very proud to be so materially advanced. What is your position? You have a bunch of paper and think, "I am a millionaire." What is the value of that paper? Is that not cheating? However, if we possess gold or diamonds worth a million dollars, that is actual wealth. But we are educated in such a way that we think we are millionaires by paper only. As soon as there is some catastrophe, millions of such dollars could not buy bread. This actually happened in Germany; millions of marks could not purchase one piece of bread. All this is going on in the name of advancement of civilization, and the real purpose of life, God consciousness, is missing. So every thoughtful man should come forward to understand this movement and take it seriously. Why are the people being misled? We just have to try to understand this philosophy, the basic principles of God consciousness.
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Room Conversation with Indonesian Scholar -- February 27, 1973, Jakarta: Prabhupāda: Oh. He says mām. He says everything mām, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65), mām eva, everything mām, "I". So why you should bring Brahmā? Kṛṣṇa says everything "I". You are asking about Kṛṣṇa. That means you do not understand Kṛṣṇa. But it is clearly said mām, Kṛṣṇa. We have, therefore, given the name "Kṛṣṇa consciousness", nothing else, neither Brahmā consciousness, nor God consciousness. "Kṛṣṇa consciousness." The whole concentration is to Kṛṣṇa.
Scholar: Yes.
Prabhupāda: That is the fact.
Morning Walk -- April 25, 1973, Los Angeles: Svarūpa Dāmodara: So without God consciousness, there's no question of morality.
Prabhupāda: No. There is no question of morality. First of all, define what is morality? What is the definition of morality?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: The value of life in its proper perspective.
Prabhupāda: Value of life, everyone has got his own value of life. a drunkard, he has got his value of life. That "When I drink, it is value." Is that morality?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is the morality of the drunkard.
Prabhupāda: Therefore everyone has got his own morality. Then what is the standard morality?
Brahmānanda: Yeah. There must be a standard for everyone.
Prabhupāda: That is Ramakrishna mission's morality: yata mata tata patha. Whatever you think, that is your way. Yata mata tata patha.
Room Conversation with David Wynne, Sculptor -- July 9, 1973, London: David Wynne: Yeah.
Prabhupāda: Yes. At the present moment, the world situation is not very good. And it will deteriorate more and more if they do not take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness or God consciousness. When I speak "Kṛṣṇa," that means God.
David Wynne: Yeah.
Prabhupāda: What is your idea of God?
David Wynne: Everything.
Prabhupāda: Hm?
David Wynne: It seems... I, I mean I, I don't know. I've thought of it, of course, many times as every intelligent person has, but it's, my idea of God is on the consciousness of the whole world, of all that we could possibly envisage, its consciousness is, that's God, and we're the little bits of it. But would you tell me...?
Prabhupāda: Complete in everything. That is the conception of God. Complete in power, complete in knowledge, complete in beauty, complete in opulence... Everything complete. That is the conception of God. Everything complete. There is no scarcity. Everything complete, unlimited. So what is your idea of this material creation? Material means so much land, so much water, so much air, so much fire. So who created these things?
Room Conversation with Educationists -- July 11, 1973, London: Guest (1): No, I came as a Christian, not knowing anything. I still don't know really anything.
Prabhupāda: Our movement is to revive God consciousness. Just like a man is sleeping, and he has got some engagement, say, in the morning, at six o'clock. But still he's sleeping. So somebody is trying to awake him. "Get up, get up! You have got this engagement. You have..." Our movement is like that. The human society is sleeping. So we are just trying to awake them: "Get up. Get up. You have got this engagement." That is our business. It is not our manufactured business, but it is stated in the Vedic literature, uttiṣṭha jāgratā prāpta-varān nibodhata. "Now you be awakened." "Now" means "You have got this human form of life. You can now be awakened." In animal form of life there is no possibility. Therefore, in the human form of life, one should be awakened to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness. And if he sleeps, then he loses his business. This is our mission, to awaken him. And when a man sleeps, how he can awaken him? Simply by vibration of sound. The sleeping man can be awakened simply by this process, allowing the sound to enter the ear. By no other process. He's sleeping. If you show him a stick, "If you don't get up, I shall strike you," that will not be effective. Because sleeping. If you say... So many things... There are other senses.
Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: Yes. If he comes in contact with a servant of God, then he revives his old consciousness, original consciousness.
Devotee: Prabhupāda, what he was saying was is it possible for a spirit soul never to regain the state of God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: No, why never? He has got chance. When he comes in contact with a servant of the Lord, he revives his Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Then he begins his spiritual life. So how can you say...?
Father Tanner: But is it possible... You know, the world one day will end, and physical bodies will end...
Prabhupāda: No, that is not possible.
Father Tanner: The world will not end?
Prabhupāda: World will end. Yes.
Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: Give them prasādam.
Father Tanner: Thank you.
Prabhupāda: So our movement is we are training people to revive their original God consciousness and go back to home, back to Godhead.
Father Tanner: Can I eat this up, then?
Prabhupāda: Yes, take.
Father Tanner: Thank you.
Mrs. Wells: Is it fattening?
Devotee: No.
Room Conversation with Two Buddhist Monks -- July 12, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: The one thing is they take it. Others will not take it. That is the difference. If... There is a picture; my Guru Mahārāja has..., one man has fallen in a deep well, and he's crying "Save me!" So another man dropped a rope, that "You catch it. I shall carry you." Then he'll not catch it. Then how he can be drawn. So... (break) ...mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). "There is nothing more superior than Me." We are preaching the same thing, that "You are searching after God. You are, some of you are disgusted that 'There is no God,' but here is God. You take His name. You take His address. You take His daily activities. Everything is there." And that is our mission. And we started this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement in 1966. So when I registered this society, somebody suggested that "Why not make it 'God consciousness?' " And no, I want to give definitely what is God. God, they have got different conception. But here is God. Kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). That is the Vedic injunction. "Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead." And when He was present, He proved it, that He is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So we have not introduced any new system of religion. That is not a fact.
Room Conversation With David Lawrence -- July 12, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: ...I am relating. "That kaumāra age, from five years to fifteen years, that is the right age for educating Kṛṣṇa consciousness." This is the word of... kaumāra ācaret prājño dharmān bhāgavatān iha, durlabhaṁ mānuṣaṁ janma (SB 7.6.1). He says that "This human form of body is very rarely gotten, and it is a rare opportunity for awakening our Kṛṣṇa consciousness." Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness, is there in every human being, especially in civilized... So it is not an artificial thing. Just like my, all my students, they are Europeans, Americans. Four or five years ago, they did not know anything about Kṛṣṇa, neither they knew the name of Kṛṣṇa. But now you can see how they're absorbed in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So it is not an artificial thing.
Room Conversation With David Lawrence -- July 12, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: Kaumāra ācaret prājño dharmān bhāgavatān iha (SB 7.6.1). And this is the only opportunity of awakening our Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So if we do not give that opportunity to the human beings from the childhood, it is a jealous... Jealousy means that you have got some opportunity, but if I do not allow you to take that opportunity, this is called jealous. So every human being has got the potency of awakening his God consciousness, or Kṛṣṇa consciousness, in this human form of body. So if we do not give that opportunity, it is jealousy. Therefore students must be educated, and if you're writing such nice book, I think you will get, give a great service to your nation and to the human society in England. Because durlabhaṁ mānuṣaṁ janma, this human form of life... Unfortunately, people do not understand what is the distinction between this human form of life and animal form of life. That is another...
Room Conversation With David Lawrence -- July 12, 1973, London: David Lawrence: I was very interested this last week to be reading a book which really was trying to defend orthodox Christianity, and it was by a very devotional Christian writer, and he, in fact, was making exactly the same points as yourself about the God consciousness of Jesus. I read the Ratha-yātrā magazine, and saw how, I think it was a nun that asked you about the position of Jesus on this, and you quite rightly said, "Well, of course, Jesus never claimed to be God." I do wish that some Christians would realize that. He was God conscious, wasn't he?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
David Lawrence: The churches in this land seem to have forgotten that. He never claimed to be God.
Prabhupāda: No, how he could claim? He's a devotee of God, he's servant of God. How he can claim? Of course, there is no difference between God and His servant. Yes. That we say. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktas tathā bhāvyata... **. Because a devotee, like Lord Jesus Christ, means confidential servant of God, there is no difference between God and himself. Just like any political representative or business representative, he's, if he's a confidential representative, there is no difference between the king or the proprietor of the firm, so long he represents rightly. Similarly, anyone who represents God or the cause of God, he's not different from God.
Room Conversation with Dr. Arnold Toynbee, Famous Historian, at his home or office -- July 22, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: Bhagavad-gītā is the preliminary study of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.
Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes, yes, yes.
Prabhupāda: So we get ideas from Bhagavad-gītā how God consciousness can make the human society happy.
Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes, yes. (keeps saying "Yes" repeatedly throughout the conversation)
Prabhupāda: The aim of human society should be God realization. That is the distinction between an animal and a human being.
Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Yes.
Prabhupāda: So Bhagavad-gītā recommends that the whole society should be divided into four divisions: the brāhmaṇa, or the most intellectual persons, the kṣatriyas, the administrators, the vaiśyas, the mercantile agriculturists, and the śūdras, ordinary men, laborer or worker. Because this material world is conducted by three modes of nature, goodness, passion and ignorance, so according to the quality of the person, he should be listed in different categories. And it is the duty of the state to see that all these categories, divisions, they are working nicely.
Room Conversation with Dr. Arnold Toynbee, Famous Historian, at his home or office -- July 22, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: ...why not they? National. National means a living entity born in particular country. So at the present moment, the national means only human being. The animals are not nationals. They are being sent to the slaughterhouse. So this kind of sinful activities are going on. Therefore renunciation means to give up these sinful activities. That is real renunciation. Otherwise, you cannot renounce anything. You have to live. And that is allowed at the cost of God. Everything belongs to God. You are son of God. So you live. But don't encroach... Mā gṛdhaḥ kasya svid dhanam. That is the instruction of Īśopaniṣad. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvaṁ (ISO 1). Everything belongs to God. Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā. So you have got the right to enjoy what is allotted for you. Don't encroach upon others' right. This is renunciation. But they are encroaching upon others' right. Especially the human society. And that is the cause of all troubles. Because they have no God consciousness, they have no sense about God, and there is no sense about next life... What is your opinion about life after death?
Dr. Arnold Toynbee: My opinion is that an individual human being is, in life in this world, is temporarily separated from the whole of spiritual reality, and after death we rejoin the reality that we are separated from.
Prabhupāda: That is Christian idea.
Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: There it is stated
- sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya
- mūrtayaḥ sambhavanti yāḥ
- tāsāṁ brahma mahad yonir
- ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā
- (BG 14.4)
Lord Kṛṣṇa says that there are different species of life, yoni. According to Padma Purāṇa there are eight million, four hundred thousand species of different forms of life. So Kṛṣṇa claims that "All these living entities, in different forms of life, I am the seed-giving father of all of them, and the material nature is the mother." Just like father impregnates with the seed, and the mother gives the body, similarly God impregnates material nature with all kinds of living entities, not in different forms, but the original seed. And according to one's karma, he comes out in different types of bodies. The body is given by material nature, and the life is given by God. This is the sum and substance. And therefore God is one, and He's the father of everyone. As such, without the center point, God consciousness, we cannot substantiate the ideas of universal brotherhood. Because if the center is missing, then how we can think of universal brotherhood? If we accept God is the center point, father, then I can understand you are my brother. Because you are also son of God; I am also son of God. But I am missing the father, then we miss also our mutual relationship. Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). One who is learned, he does not make any distinction between a tree or a man or animal or a brāhmaṇa or a caṇḍāla because he sees that within the body there is the soul, and the soul is spirit, part and parcel of God. That is his vision. You can take Bhagavad-gītā and... Read the Sixteenth Chapter. So at the present moment, the world is missing God, or they are rejecting, demonic. There are two classes of men always. One is called devatā, godly, and the other is called demon, asura. Or satanic. Whatever you call, the two classes. So those who are God conscious, they are godly. And those who have no God consciousness, they are demonic, or satanic.
Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London: The nature is going on like that. And we are wandering in different species of life, in different planets. But our real purpose is God-realization. That we are missing. That chance is in the human form of life. So if people are not educated to this goal of life, that is not helping the country or the society or the human beings. If we simply engage them in the activities of animal life—how to eat, how to sleep, how to have sex life, and how to defend, no more—then it is simply advancement of animal civilization. But those who are thinking good for all humanity, they should note this defect, that simply giving him nice food, nice shelter, nice sex facilities and nice defense, his problem of life is not solved. He should be given enlightenment about God consciousness. And if he is educated in that way, if he, by next life, he can go back to home, back to Godhead. This education is lacking. So we are trying in our small endeavor. But if leading personalities like you of the society, they try to understand this philosophy scientifically, critically, and take it seriously, they can, there will be great benefit for the human society. The program we have got, but we are not leading personalities. You are all leading personalities. At least in England. Lord... This group, House of Lords is there. It was always there. In previous days also. They were called amātyas. All leading men of the society, they used to give advice to the king. And brāhmaṇas also. I think the knighthood means that. What is the meaning of this knighthood? Eh? Personal advisors to the king?
Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London: Lord Brockway: Yes. Very, very beautiful.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Now we can simply study the beautiful flower, and we can come to God consciousness. How it is made, so beautiful, unless there is brain? And what is that brain? Then you come to God. Parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate svā-bhāvikī-jñāna-bala-kriyā ca (Cc. Madhya 13.65, purport). Para, the Supreme, has got so nice brain that things are happening as if natural. But no, the brain is acting, brain is acting. But His energy and brain is so nice that He hasn't got to do it personally. As soon as He desires, immediately the energy works. Just like nowadays electronic. So simply by pushing one bud, a button, thousands of business is done immediately. So if it is materially possible, just we have to think how much it is great and possible by spiritual energy. Parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate, na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. These are the Vedic description. God hasn't got to do anything with His hands. Just like here also. A big man, he has got secretaries, officers. He simply directs, "Do this," everything is done. Similarly, the Supreme Lord, how much energy He has got, and spiritual energy, that as soon as He desires something, immediately it is done. But it is done by employing energy. Not that it has come for nothing. No. This flower, it grows. There is energy. First of all, it was bud. But we cannot see how it is growing. But the act, action is going on.
Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: So it has no brain behind? Simply explaining "nature." What is that nature? The nature is the brain of Kṛṣṇa. So those who can study, they can study even from this flower what is the greatness of God. This is
God consciousness, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Everything he sees the hand of God. That is
God consciousness. And when a man becomes God conscious, then he's qualified with all good qualities. That is
God consciousness. Yasyāsti bhaktir bhagavaty akiñcanā sarvair guṇais tatra samāsate surāḥ (
SB 5.18.12). If you train a person to become God conscious, then all the good qualities automatically becomes manifest in him. So why not try this? Make a school simply to make people God conscious. You'll find nice people are coming. All good character. And you can take any service from them, good service. This should be attempted. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇā mano-rathenāsati dhāvato bahiḥ (
SB 5.18.12). And without
God consciousness, there cannot be any good qualities. Just like President Nixon. He's exalted. He is occupying such exalted position, but public is criticizing like anything. Hm? And he's still not leaving that post. Unless he's forced. So harāv abhaktasya... Is that a very good quality? He's publicly elected president. If public (is) accusing him in so many ways, he should have (said), "All right, if you don't like, I resign." But no. So where is the good quality? There is no good quality. Because he has no sense of
God consciousness. So without sense of
God consciousness, nobody can possess any good quality. That is impossible. And a small man, like our students, because he's God conscious, you'll find so many good qualities in them in comparison to others.
Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: Hmmm. Then...
Lord Brockway: And therefore, in addition to God consciousness, you must have understanding, knowledge.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that understanding, that required. So that is needed. People have no opportunity to understand. Just like if you speak...
Lord Brockway: Yes.
Prabhupāda: ...they'll talk of universal brotherhood, but they'll send the poor animals to the slaughterhouse.
Lord Brockway: They...?
Prabhupāda: To the slaughterhouse.
Śyāmasundara: Animals.
Prabhupāda: Animals.
Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: But that is due to his lack of God consciousness. He'll talk very high words, but practically he cannot do it.
Śyāmasundara: No information.
Prabhupāda: Yes, no information. Just like the commu... Even in communist country. They, they are thinking that national, everything should be national. So what is the meaning of national? Means any living entity born in that country is national. So why the poor animals are not nationals? That is, means lack of God consciousness. He does not know. He thinks simply human being national.
Lord Brockway: Oh, I agree. I'm a vegetarian.
Prabhupāda: (laughs) Thank you. Hare Kṛṣṇa. So this is all due to lack of God consciousness. Therefore the only remedy is to make people God conscious, thoroughly, perfectly. Then everything will be all right.
Lord Brockway: That I don't accept. God consciousness plus understanding.
Prabhupāda: Now, God conscious means understanding. Without understanding, how there can be God consciousness?
Lord Brockway: And you, you may easily have a person who is very God conscious, beautiful in their own lives, beautiful to all the group around them, who have no understanding of the problems of the world at all.
Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: That is not perfect God conscious. That is partial. Perfect consciousness means full understanding also. That is perfect God consciousness. Yasmin vijñāte sarvam evaṁ vijñātaṁ bhavati (Muṇḍaka Upaniṣad 1.3). This is the Vedic injunction. If you understand only God, then you understand everything. But if he does not understand everything rightly, that means he's not fully understanding God. This is the... If, as you say, that a man is fully God conscious, but he cannot do this, cannot do that, that means his understanding of God consciousness is still lacking. It is not full understanding. A full understanding of God consciousness means he's a perfect man. He's a perfect man. He'll never commit anything mistake. Because he's guided. Teṣām... What is that? Bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam, buddhi-yogaṁ dadāmi tam... Find out. A God conscious person is getting direct instruction from God. How it can be defective? It cannot be. Practical. But if one is defective, he's not yet fully God conscious.
Room Conversation with Reporter from Researchers Magazine -- July 24, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: So frying pan. From frying pan to the fire.
Reporter: (laughs) Yes. Very true.
Prabhupāda: Everything is due to lack of God consciousness.
Reporter: Quite true. And therefore, nothing is working.
Prabhupāda: No. (pause)
Reporter: I'm not going by car, as you said. (everyone laughs)
Prabhupāda: Are you not plucking your hairs?
Reporter: I was plucking. Eighteen times, all these hair. Two times in the one year, plucking all hair.
Room Conversation with Mister Popworth and E. F. Schumacher -- July 26, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: That's all. And that God consciousness cannot be achieved without being pure. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān (BG 10.12). God is the supreme pure. You cannot approach God, you cannot understand God, in impure condition. And without God consciousness, there cannot be any purification. You try to understand this simple fact, that without God consciousness, you may prescribe so many things—they will be all failure, all failure. And God consciousness cannot be achieved without being pure. This is the problem. Now you can think over it.
Car Conversation after meeting with Cardinal Danielou -- August 9, 1973, Paris: Prabhupāda: The metaphysical search... Now metaphysically search out why do you deny soul in the human being, uh, in the animals? That is metaphysical. It is metaphysical question. What is your metaphysical study about the living, uh, animals that you say there is no soul? Come to the metaphysical then. You are thinking metaphysically. That's all right. But if you are still thinking like animal, then what is the use of your metaphysical studies? If you are thinking like the animals: "Where shall I get my food? Where shall I take shelter? Where shall I have sexual facility? How shall I defend?" If you are thinking like that, this is animal thinking. Metaphysical thinking means beyond this, beyond this thinking of eating, sleeping, mating and defending. That is metaphysical thinking. So what you are thinking beyond that? That is God consciousness. When a human being thinks about God, that is metaphysical. When he thinks like animals about eating, sleeping, mating and defending, that is not metaphysical. Metaphysical. What do you mean by metaphysical? How to define? What is the meaning of "meta"? Above physical. That means spiritual. So if you think spiritually, then you'll see. Just like Bhagavad-gītā, Kṛṣṇa claims: sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya (BG 14.4). "In all forms of life, the living entities are there, and they are My sons." So this is metaphysical, or if some third-class man says that there is no soul in the animal, that is metaphysical? Which one is metaphysical? Kṛṣṇa speaking will be metaphysical, or a third-class fool's statement will be taken as metaphysical? Which one is metaphysical? First of all say me.
Room Conversation with Cardinal Danielou -- August 9, 1973, Paris: Prabhupāda: And here the business is to again revive them to God consciousness.
Yogeśvara: (translates)
Cardinal Danielou: Yes.
Prabhupāda: So the process of enlightening the living entities, especially the human being, because in the animal form of life, one cannot be enlightened. Neither the animal can understand what is God.
Cardinal Danielou: Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Prabhupāda: It is only the human being who can understand. If he's trained, then he can come to God consciousness.
Cardinal Danielou: Yes, yes, yes, yes, It is so.
Prabhupāda: So this creation is meant for the forgotten souls to give them a chance for reviving their God consciousness.
Room Conversation with Cardinal Danielou -- August 9, 1973, Paris: Prabhupāda: Therefore from His side, that is constant endeavor to revive their God consciousness.
Cardinal Danielou: Yes, God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: Now this God consciousness can be awakened in the human form of life, not in other form of life.
Cardinal Danielou: Not in the...
Prabhupāda: Maybe very rarely, but the human being... (aside:) Where is the water?
Yogeśvara: She said she was coming with it...
Prabhupāda: Ācchā. The human being has got the prerogative to awaken his dormant God consciousness.
Yogeśvara: (translates)
Cardinal Danielou: Yes.
Prabhupāda: So the best service to humanity is to awaken their God consciousness.
Cardinal Danielou: Yes, it is true, it is true.
Prabhupāda: Best service.
Room Conversation with Cardinal Danielou -- August 9, 1973, Paris: Prabhupāda: Guru, yes. That is the very word used. Guru-kṛṣṇa-kṛpāya pāya bhakti-latā-bīja (CC Madhya 19.151). One revives his God consciousness by the mercy of God and guru.
Cardinal Danielou: Yes, in Christianity, we speak of spiritual fathers.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Cardinal Danielou: Spiritual father, spiritual father. We... He is a man who has a good experience of spiritual things and communicate his experience to others.
Prabhupāda: Yes, oh, yes. (etc.)
Cardinal Danielou: You know. We are in Christianity monks, monks. We live in monastery.
Prabhupāda: Ah, monks.
Room Conversation with Anna Conan Doyle, daughter-in-law of famous author, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle -- August 10, 1973, Paris: Guru-gaurāṅga: If our Kṛṣṇa consciousness is dependent on some material condition which we are in, then our material condition is superior to God consciousness. "Oh, I am a businessman. I cannot become Kṛṣṇa conscious." That means business is more than Kṛṣṇa.
Anna Conan Doyle: Yes, but I think that we have to have businessmen who are business conscious. Otherwise our world would come to a stand still.
Guru-gaurāṅga: Exactly.
Anna Conan Doyle: And even you people you have to have people donate like we have the Catholic church...
Prabhupāda: The difficulty is...
Anna Conan Doyle: ...is to make from the people are working, we are dependent on the materialistic man also...
Prabhupāda: No, the difficulty is that we are not satisfied with our living condition. Suppose I am, I have got this body. To maintain this body, I require my food, and for getting the food, I must have some money. I must have some occupation. This is one thing. But people are now... Suppose one thousand francs will provide his family, himself. He's not satisfied with one thousand francs. He wants ten thousand. That is the fault. Therefore he does not find time for Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor -- August 13, 1973, Paris: Professor: Oh, yes?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Everyone likes. Yes. Even Christian priests they also like. No, any sane man will like because... Somebody sends me money: "Sir, you are doing so nice work, spreading God consciousness. Here is my little contribution."
Professor: I see.
Prabhupāda: Yes. From your, these Western countries. Just week before, I got hundred dollars from one gentleman. Simply appreciated that I am spreading God consciousness. So actually we have no program of proselytizing or making Hindu from Christian, Christian... We have no such program. We simply want to see that everyone is God conscious. Never mind through which venue, he becomes a God conscious. It doesn't matter.
Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: Just like...
David Lawrence: You know the manifestations obviously of Kṛṣṇa consciousness and kīrtana and so on. Seems to be obviously you regard as a scurrilous or wrong-headed or a dull-headed field of people who regard His manifestations of God consciousness as verging on madness, or temporary madness. What would you say about that. Obviously you would reject it.
Prabhupāda: When a man is himself mad, he'll find others mad.
David Lawrence: Yes, true. (laughter) Yes, he sees a reflection of himself.
Prabhupāda: If one is himself deaf, he'll think others are deaf. So ātmavat manyate jagat, everyone thinks the whole world is like him. Therefore they think Kṛṣṇa also like him. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam (BG 9.11). That is condemned in the Bhagavad-gītā that "These rascals, because I come in human form to benefit them, they take Me as human being." That is mentioned. But these things are taken like that by the mūḍhas. Mūḍhas means rascals, asses.
Room Conversation with Indian Ambassador -- September 5, 1973, Stockholm: Prabhupāda: I was invited there to speak: "East and West." So I explained that so far we are concerned, we have no such thing as east and west. But still, there is difference between east and west that in the Eastern countries, especially in India, even in the remotest part of the village, a cultivator, poor cultivator, he'll understand God consciousness very easily. And so far in the West, I talked with Professor Kotofsky... Perhaps you know.
Ambassador: Yes. In Oriental Institute.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He said, "Swamiji, after this body's finished, everything is finished." You see? Such a big professor. He...
Ambassador: That is Marxist materialism.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Ambassador: It is Marxist materialism.
Prabhupāda: But Marxist materialism, does it mean a congregation of some fools and rascals?
Ambassador: I think so, true.
Interviews with Macmillan and various English Reporters -- September 12, 1973, London: Prabhupāda: (break) She's waiting? Then I shall come.
Reporter (3): Right, well (indistinct) some publicity.
Prabhupāda: No, every religion has got God consciousness. Without God consciousness, there cannot be any religion. But somewhere we find the degrees of consciousness. Just like every living entity has got consciousness. A child has got consciousness, dog has got consciousness, and a human being has got consciousness, but there are degrees.
Reporter (3): Do people lose this consciousness, the God...?
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Reporter (3): Do people lose God consciousness as they grow older?
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, unless a person comes to God consciousness, his consciousness is imperfect.
Interviews with Macmillan and various English Reporters -- September 12, 1973, London: Prof. Gombrich: No, I haven't, I'm afraid. No. And do you think that the message of Kṛṣṇa consciousness or Kṛṣṇa Caitanya is very different from the message of realizing God which is promulgated in other religions, for instance the Śaiva religion or...?
Prabhupāda: No I don't think so. Any religion, you follow nicely. Just Christian religion, there is God consciousness. So actually it is not this religion or that religion. People have given up religion. All over the world they have no more interest in religion. And especially I see that in your London that so many churches are vacant. Nobody's going there. So thing is that there is no more regular teaching of religious system. It has become a profession like. Neither the teachers are serious, nor the students are serious. So our principle is that not this religion or that religion. Whichever religion you may like, you can follow, but we want to see whether you are God conscious. If you are not God conscious, then we take it simply useless waste of time, these so-called religions. Śrama eva hi kevalam. You understand Sanskrit.
Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay: Prabhupāda: So those who will act as brain, they must possess these qualities. But who is being taught these qualities? This modern civilization is teaching people how to steal, how to cheat, how to satisfy your own sense gratification. You see? No tolerance, no complete knowledge. All fools and rascals, no knowledge. Knowledge means they must know what is the aim of life, what is God, what we are, what is this material world, why we have come here. So many things. This is called God consciousness. There is no such educational institution all over the world. Is there any institution where it is being especially taught what is God, what I am. Is there any institution?
Banker: Well, there are metaphysics departments in almost every university.
Prabhupāda: Metaphysics department is there. I was also a student of philosophy. That is theories only. Of course, they are trying, psychology, metaphysics, ethics. You were also a student of philosophy?
Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay: Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I think there is a lot of politics in it.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. As soon as you go against the standard rules and regulations, there must be some motive. That is politics. That is politics. All politicians, they are with motive. They are not for... Now, all these big, big political parties, they are fighting with one another. They are simply trying to keep their post and they are fighting for that. So where is the time for them to think of the general people, how they will be happy? There is no time. It is the Kṛṣṇa conscious people who are actually thinking of others. Para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. Kṛpāmbudhir yas tam ahaṁ bhajāmi. Para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. Vaiṣṇava qualification is he is unhappy by seeing others... (break) Let us enlighten them. Otherwise what is the use of working in this old age? (Aside:) Come on. Vaiṣṇava's qualification is para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. He is unhappy by seeing others unhappy. Because without God consciousness, without understanding "What I am, what is God, what is my relationship," everyone shall remain unhappy. There cannot be happiness. Without knowledge of God, nobody can be happy. Superficially they may try, so-called humanitarianism, this ism, that ism. Now, say for these Communists country, they have struggled for the last sixty years. They started from 1917. How many years?
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Seventy.
Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Seventy. Seventy. Yes, no, we were student at that time. So what they have done? They are changing, changing, changing. And I went to Moscow, I saw the people were not happy. There are so many things that is against one's psychological understanding. So many things. Therefore now they are going to hold some peace conference. Who told me? Oh, yes, Haṁsadūta. So without God consciousness, there cannot be any peace. That's a fact. Therefore our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is there. Tomorrow, when you are going?
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Me? Tomorrow night. I'll come here tomorrow also.
Prabhupāda: Yes, I will give you some letters for Bali Mardana.
Morning Walk -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: It is not that God consciousness, just like our Gaurasundara, to go to a solitary place, and do all rascals and rascaldom. Sell the temple and go to the solitary place. This kind of God-trust, rascaldom, hooliganism, is no trust. You see? This is all hooliganism, nonsense.
Prajāpati: There is no trust without obedience.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, yes. There is no... There is no question of trust. Yes. That is, that is the first requirement in the Bhagavad-gītā. "You surrender unto Me." That means: "You trust." I cannot surrender unto you if I do not trust you. That is trust. I don't believe you; how can I trust you? Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). That is full trust. "Yes, I must surrender to Kṛṣṇa.
Room Conversation with Latin Professor -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: So we don't make any propaganda to make one vegetarian. We make propaganda to make one devotee of God. One, if one becomes devotee of God, automatically all good qualities will come. That is the test. How one has become devotee of God, it will be tested that he is qualified with all good qualities. You cannot find fault with him. That is
God consciousness. A God conscious person having a bad character, it is incompatible. It is not possible. A God conscious person must be a very good man. A God conscious man cannot kill any animal because he knows the relationship that "This animal is as good as I am. He is also part and parcel of God, as I am. But fortunately or unfortunately, he has got a different dress." That you will find in the Bhagavad-gītā, vāsāṁsi jīrṇāni yathā vihāya (
BG 2.22). So you are gentlemen. You have got a different dress. I have got a different dress. He has got a different dress. That does not mean we are not human being because we have got a different dress. Similarly, all living entities—there are eight-million, four hundred thousands forms—they are all sons of God. That is described in the Bhagavad-gītā. So they have got different dresses only. But because they have got different dresses, they are not different from me. This is
God consciousness. So therefore, when one is God conscious, how he can kill another animal? He knows that "If I am killed, I feel pains and pleasure, pains, then why shall I kill him? And he's also son of God. I am also son of God.
Room Conversation with Latin Professor -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: One is useless, cannot earn anything. If the earning son says, "Father, he is useless, let him... Let me kill him," the father will agree? No. Father is kind to everyone. So similarly, when one is God conscious, if he kills animal, that means he has no sense of
God consciousness. He has no sense of God. That is the test. So our propaganda is that you make people God conscious. Then all good qualities will come. Instead of trying to qualify man in so many ways—"You don't become thief, you don't become murderer, you don't become this, don't become this, don't become intoxicant"—simply by becoming Kṛṣṇa conscious, he becomes everything, by one stroke. That is our propaganda, that if one becomes God conscious, then he is becoming perfect, not necessarily, materially and spiritually, both. And that is happening practically. Now these boys, these girls, they are Europeans, Americans. They were accustomed to so many bad habits and according to our standard, and now they have given up. They have no illicit sex, no gambling, no meat-eating, no intoxication, even up to smoking or drinking tea. Yes. We don't allow our students... Not allow. They become accustomed. Once I say, "Don't do this," they agree. They agree immediately. Intoxication. There were many students, they were habituated to this nowadays intoxican... Immediately gave up. And your government is making so much propaganda to give up this intoxication. They are failure. So a little
God consciousness helps so much. And what to speak of when one is perfectly God conscious? Then he's perfect man. Therefore a devotee is not of this material world. He's in the spiritual world. He's above this material world. Sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate (
BG 14.26). Find out this verse.
Morning Walk -- December 11, 1973, Los Angeles: Hṛdayānanda: If it is so important, I think perhaps I should stay here and help Rūpānuga.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Turn your whole nation, turn into God consciousness, because they've declared in the Constitution, "In God we trust." Now they must take it very seriously. What does it mean by "God"? What does it mean by "trust"? You take this propaganda. We are doing, actually. We trust in God; therefore we have sacrificed our whole life for God. This is trust in God. Not that smoking in the parlor, and you trust in God. Not that kind of trust. Real trust. Trust means first of all you know what is God. Suppose that if you say "Trust this man." But I must know what is this man. Then my trust will be convinced, that "He is very respectful man, he's rich man, he's able man..." Yes, I can trust. But simply trust in God, you do not know what is God, what is trust, and it is going on. Why this bluff? Ah? What you say?
Prajāpati: That that's right, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Morning Walk -- December 11, 1973, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: Not sectarian. You do not know. Why do you say sectarian? How it is sectarian?
Devotee (1): They say that it represents...
Prabhupāda: We are preaching God consciousness. So is it not for everyone? God consciousness is sectarian? Is it meant for certain sect? Or it is meant for human beings?
Hṛdayānanda: The difficulty is that nowadays every common man has his own God..., theory of God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: No, no, every common man he says "I got my mathematics." Will he be accepted?
Hṛdayānanda: No.
Prabhupāda: So why these things should be allowed? That is our proposition. Every man will say, "No, I've got my own mathematics." Will he be allowed? So we have to fight, otherwise what is the meaning of preaching?
Hṛdayānanda: Fight.
Morning Walk -- December 12, 1973, Los Angeles: Umāpati: ...I think that we were discussing the political possibilities of putting devotees into office, and we came up with the astounding discovery that we almost represent everything that is against western values. We represent austerity. We represent God consciousness. We represent restriction of sexual freedom, intoxication. All the four regulative principles are almost totally in opposite to western desires.
Prabhupāda: That means western people are all demons.
Umāpati: So the problem is trying to get into office under those circumstances, to make that known that "We stand for this," and to have anybody vote for you.
Prabhupāda: (laughs) Nobody may vote but we must go on preaching. That I have already explained, some of the university. The whole country is illiterate. Does it mean university should be stopped? University must be there. One who is fortunate will come and take education. It is not an argument that "People are illiterate. They don't care for it. Therefore let the university be closed." This is no argument.
Morning Walk -- December 13, 1973, Los Angeles: Svarūpa Dāmodara: They will say that proprietor stage is relative.
Prabhupāda: Yes, it is relative. Relative means you are servant. You must satisfy by your service to the proprietor and get your nice salary and be happy. Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā. Whatever He gives, you accept and be happy. That is Īśopaniṣad. You don't try to encroach upon others. You receive from the proprietor your emolution (emolument?) or your reward and be happy. That is Īśopaniṣad. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1). Everything is God's property. You take your share. You have got right. Just like a father and the son. There are ten sons. Everyone has got the right to share the property of the father, but as the father gives, not that I take away the whole property and others, brothers, may starve. That is not allowed. That is criminal. Here in the material world everyone has come to get the best profit, without considering profit for others. Others may go to hell. "Others, let them go to the slaughterhouse. I must satisfy my tongue." That is material world. "No, why you are slaughtering other living entities?" "I don't care. I want to eat. That's all." So you have to pay for that. You cannot put others into difficulty because God is equally merciful to everyone. But you don't care for God. Therefore you do whimsically whatever you like. So you are putting yourself in difficulty. This is the position. (break) ...mahad-guṇāḥ. Therefore without God consciousness, nobody is qualified.
Morning Walk -- December 20, 1973, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: Oh, so they are coming to consciousness. Why they are praying to God?
Prajāpati: Things get so bad, they have to turn to God.
Prabhupāda: Duḥkhe sab hari bhaje. When one is distressed, there is sense of God consciousness, but if they continue it even in their happiness, then it is all right.
Prajāpati: They must have knowledge though, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: But in happiness they forget. (aside:) Don't keep so near.
Prajāpati: Without knowledge their sentiment is just worthless.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Morning Walk -- December 20, 1973, Los Angeles: Prajāpati: ...the affair, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Oh, then the country could be...
Prabhupāda: No, no, I am already in charge, but who is following me? (laughter) That is the difficulty. (break) ...one who is to be followed, that is called ācārya. So who is following the ācārya? Nobody is following. Ācārya is there, but nobody is following ācārya. Ācaraṇa. Ācaraṇa means behavior. Ācārya. "This man is ideal. One should follow him." That is called ācārya. (break) ...to allow us one day to have chanting and speaking something about God consciousness.
Prajāpati: Very nice.
Prabhupāda: Yes. And I will go. I will speak and have kīrtana. (break) ...date.
Karandhara: April 30th.
Prabhupāda: April 30th. So on that date arrange a meeting of the senators. And I will go and speak and have kīrtana, what is actually life. Approach them that "We are spreading this. So why not arrange meeting?" Or any day, on 30th or any day. (break) ...office here in Los Angeles?
Karandhara: The local senator does. For this area.
Morning Walk -- December 20, 1973, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: So see him. You and you go and arrange, and explain to him that "This is our movement, simply how to make people pure, moral, sinless, and advanced in God consciousness." Just take this opportunity. "You come and see how God consciousness we are executing, and then arrange a meeting in the Senate. And try to understand, 'It is simply sentiment or how it will help me?' " (break) ...so much money, and still they are crying, "Degradation." So they should come to their senses. This kind of understanding will not help. They must understand scientifically.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Everybody is saying, not only politicians, but everybody is saying that we are degrading. Moral standard is degrading. But nobody acts. That is the difficulty.
Prabhupāda: So it is our duty to help them. Those who are... Just like here is an opportunity. Go, see them immediately, the person. It is our duty. (break) Sometime I can go and see. Who is the senator, local?
Karandhara: I'm not sure.
Morning Walk -- December 31, 1973, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: So how you'll present it? The cheating process is going on. Unless you become God conscious, the cheating process will not stop. So there is no solution.
Prajāpati: So therefore we introduce bill into the schools to introduce God consciousness to all the children there.
Prabhupāda: Yes. God consciousness. Then everyone will be honest, and everything will be adjusted. Everyone can understand this is pure cheating. I give you a hundred dollars, a piece of paper. That's all. And you accept it. You want to be cheated. You thought, that "I have got now daily, hundred dollars. So let me work very hard." He does not consider that "I am not getting a hundred dollars. I am getting a piece of paper." So people have no brain to understand even. "This is not hundred dollars. Give me cash, hundred dollars." Then everything, solution will be... There will be no inflation. Because I know that paying you a piece of paper, I can cheat you, therefore I am printing notes, to cheat so many people.
1974 Conversations and Morning Walks
Morning Walk -- January 18, 1974, Hawaii: Prabhupāda: Anyone else?
Satsvarūpa: In English when we say, "Goodbye," that means "God be with you." Some God consciousness.
Pradyumna: They say, "Good morning. Good morning to you."
Bali-mardana: Like one pig grunting at another pig.
Prabhupāda: "Good morning" means... Because it is English word... In England every morning is bad morning, because it is cloud. When they see one day that cloud is clear, they say, "Good morning." (japa) (break) ...similarly, a good soul means when there is no māyā, then he's good soul.
Bali-mardana: Or cloud.
Prabhupāda: Huh? Cloud. māyā is cloud. So what is that cloud?
Sudāmā: Forgetfulness of Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: That cloud is when a soul desires to become the master. That is cloud.
Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Ah, yes. More developed. Yes. In the śānta-rasa, simply this appreciation of the greatness of the Absolute. That is śānta-rasa.
Dr. Patel: Once upon a time the scientists of the world had considered this religion, belief in God to be bosh. Now the scientists have started thinking, and thinking very rightly that there is nothing else but God as you have said. That is the greatest thing that they are doing today.
Prabhupāda: Yes, so that I am explaining. The sound is there. God consciousness is there, sound as the God consciousness, but in different phases the development is there differently. That is the principle. Everyone has got God consciousness. There is no doubt about it.
Dr. Patel: We come to you, sir, to serve your disciples in the best way we can do because to serve a disciple is to serve God.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Then, that means it is being developed. That śānta-rasa is being developed to dāsya-rasa.
Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: Eh? Thirty years they are struggling for United Nations, big, big expenditure, so many humbug, bharam udvahato vimūḍhān, humbug program, and no result. Prahlāda Mahārāja said, "I am thinking, I am, only for these rascals. They're making humbug program, but there is no action. And for temporary, so-called happiness, without God consciousness. I am simply thinking of them. Otherwise, personally, I have no problem." This was spoken by Prahlāda Mahārāja to Nṛsiṁha-deva. Śoce tato vimukha-cetasa māyā-sukhāya bharam udvahato vimūḍhān (SB 7.9.43). (break) ...business has become like Prahlāda Mahārāja. We can chant anywhere. That's all right. Kṛṣṇa will provide everything. We have no business to do. But we have to take them because we are sympathizer, that so many people are being killed by this modern civilization. They had the opportunity to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, but by the set-up of this rascal civilization, they are being killed spiritually. Therefore we have to take it. (break) ...devotee, personally, he has no problem, but he pushes himself in this degraded society to teach them how to live, how to become gentlemen.
Morning Walk -- March 23, 1974, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Is pāpa. Either you accept as, a material body as Brahmā or as insignificant ant, it is pāpa.
Dr. Patel: Anything is pāpa. Anything is pāpa. Anything which you make removed from God consciousness is pāpa.
Prabhupāda: Just like outlaw. Outlaw means who does not care for the government laws. Similarly, dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). The law means dharma, law. Dharma means to accept the laws of God. And what is the law? Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). This is the law. If one cannot accept this, then he's outlaw. Immediately.
Dr. Patel: And that is pāpa.
Prabhupāda: That is pāpa.
Dr. Patel: Anything which makes you removed from God consciousness is pāpa.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.
Morning Walk -- April 18, 1974, Bombay: Prabhupāda: ...advised and all the ācāryas advised, Caitanya Mahāprabhu's advised. Why should we go somewhere else? Take shelter of His lotus feet. That's all. Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekam (BG 18.66). This is right conclusion. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). (break) Mahātmā, immediately by surrendering to Kṛṣṇa. Immediately. (break) A child, if he is informed, "God is everywhere," he will never understand what is God. He knows that God is there, that this God consciousness is there. So what is the use of educating him, "Oh, God is everywhere. You don't require to go to temple?" This is nonsense. It is kaniṣṭha-adhikārī. He must know, "Here is God." He goes there, offer respect. All the children come. (break) ...a man, military man like Arjuna.
Press Conference -- April 18, 1974, Hyderabad: Prabhupāda: In the śāstras we see that Ṛṣabhadeva, the father of Mahārāja Bharata, under whose name this planet is called Bhārata-varṣa, He taught His one hundred sons, "My dear boys, this human form of life is not meant for working hard like cats and dogs for sense gratification." Ultimate end is sense gratification, satisfying the senses. This is the business of the cats and hogs, or dogs and hogs. The hog is whole day working to find out stool: "Where is stool? Where is stool?" And as soon as he gets some stool, little strength, immediately sex life, without any discrimination whether she is mother or sister or daughter. This kind of life is described in the śāstras as hog civilization. So at the present moment, without any reference to God consciousness, people are being taught to satisfy the senses, work very hard, and ruin the chance of human life.
Morning Walk -- April 20, 1974, Hyderabad: Prabhupāda: Convention means they are partially good for the time being, that's all. They are not eternally... Just like in the Bible it is said, "Thou shalt not kill." (chuckles) But this is not, does not come within the category of eternal religion. People were so corrupted that they were forbidden, "No, don't do this." "Thou shalt not covet," a little moral instruction. That also, they could not follow. There is no religion. And little God consciousness, "There is God, kingdom of God," little idea for the persons who could understand. Otherwise, do you think that if somebody says, "Thou shalt not kill," is that any religious principle? It is ordinary thing. Where is the question of God?
Pañcadraviḍa: These things, they are also in (sic:) Manu-saṁhitā?
Prabhupāda: That is for... Manu-saṁhitā forbids completely. Manu-saṁhitā is not religion. It is moral principles for conducting society. Religion is how to become devotee of Kṛṣṇa. That is religion. That is natural. (break) "...shalt not kill," this is expectation. "Someday, in future, one may become religious." That's all. Because by killing, killing, they are going downer, down.
Morning Walk -- April 20, 1974, Hyderabad: Prabhupāda: So one must be intelligent enough to see God. Now, the bird I do not see, but I am hearing the sound. So one must know there is a nice bird. Because the varṇāśrama-dharma is lacking, nobody is being educated as a brāhmaṇa. They have lost all knowledge. Suppose in the society there is nobody educated as engineer; you don't find any engineers. So who will understand this? Unless one becomes brahminical qualified, they cannot understand. Therefore a class of men must be there, trained up as brāhmaṇa. Then the understanding of God consciousness will be there. Otherwise finished. So now this rascal civilization, they are simply creating śūdras. What they will understand? Simply śūdras. Factories and this, for technology. And because they are getting money, they are thinking, "Now we have got everything." On the money standard. Actually they have no knowledge. Just like we find a expert electrician and we pay him sufficiently, say hundred dollars, but does it mean that he has knowledge? He is expert in that śūdra's work, that's all. That does not mean, because he has got money, he has got all knowledge. But people accept, "Oh, he has money. His life is successful. He has got all knowledge." That's all. And if you go, if you speak about God, "Oh, these men are beggars. They have made a profession." That's all. So if the society does not accept the proposition of Kṛṣṇa, cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭam (BG 4.13), they will suffer because the God consciousness will be lost. It is already lost.
Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome: O'Grady: To be conscious of who you are yourself.
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. God consciousness includes self consciousness. But self consciousness is not God consciousness. God consciousness includes self consciousness, but self consciousness is not God consciousness.
O'Grady: Well, it may be.
Prabhupāda: No.
O'Grady: You may achieve recognition of the God that's in yourself, of that aspect.
Prabhupāda: When you are God conscious...
O'Grady: Without being pantheistic, you mean?
Prabhupāda: Just Like if you come in front of the sunlight, the sun consciousness is there, which includes your personal conscious... you also see. In the darkness you cannot see. At night you do not see even your hands and legs. But if you come in front of the sun, or light, then you see the sun and see yourself. So without the sunlight, without God consciousness, self consciousness is incomplete. But God consciousness makes self consciousness very clear.
Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome: Prabhupāda: The body is just like a machine, and the spirit soul is sitting on this machine, and God is there within the heart. So He is giving the direction. "You wanted to do this. Now you go and do this." This is the... So if you are sincere, "Now, God, I want You," then He will give you directions, "You go and get it." This is the process. But if we want something else than God, then God will give you direction, "You go and take it." He's very kind. Īśvaraḥ sarva... I want to have something and He is within my heart, and He is giving me, "Yes, you come here. You take this." So if that God can give direction to give you indication, "You go and take this," why not the spiritual master? First of all we must know, we must be eager to again revive our God consciousness. Then God will give us the spiritual master.
Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome: Prabhupāda: Oh. They want me to go there? Yes, I will go. It is my duty.
O'Grady: Just to pay a visit, meet the children.
Prabhupāda: Yes. It is my duty to enlighten people about God consciousness.
O'Grady: God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Yogeśvara: Thank you very much.
Michael Robert: Thank you all.
Atreya Ṛṣi: Please stay for one minute.
Prabhupāda: Please take prasāda. Stay one minute. So another, I give my request. You are a poet. You describe about God. You are expert in describing. So you just take this occupation, describing God. Then your life will be successful, and one who will hear you, his life will be successful. That is the injunction.
Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome: Richard Webster: Within the Christian religion there is a strong emphasis on possible failure and forgiveness.
Prabhupāda: No. Forgiveness is... I know that in church the confession program is there. Forgiveness... Suppose you are or I am an offender. I ask your forgiveness. So you can forgive me once, twice, thrice, not more than that. You cannot make it a profession that you go on committing sins and God will forgive you. No, that is not possible. That is misconception. That is mentioned in the Bhagavad-gītā, api cet sudurācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). This sudurācāraḥ, means offender, that is not willful offense. One person is accustomed to some bad habits, but he has taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness or God consciousness. But on account of strong habit, if he fails sometimes, that is excused, forgiveness, not that willful committing sin and ask for forgiveness. That is not allowed. In common affairs we do not see. I have got practical, I mean to say, experience. In my householder life I was proprietor of a big pharmacy. So my manager sold some morphia preparation to some unauthorized person. So the sales inspector, they noted it and made us a criminal. And the magistrate called me because I was the proprietor. So my statement was given that "I do not conduct the business directly. Of course, I am responsible for my manager's fault, but I shall be very strict in future. You can forgive me." Immediately I was forgiven. But next time, if I go, if I say like that, that is not forgiven. That is not possible. So this forgiveness is good for accidental fault. But it cannot be continued, that is a wrong philosophy.
Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome: Prabhupāda: You cannot eat anything, even grass, without the sanction of God, what to speak of fish and others. You cannot eat even a piece of grass. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvaṁ yat kiñca jagatyāṁ jagat, tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā (ISO 1). Everything belongs to God. You can simply enjoy after being sanctioned by God. Otherwise not. This is real philosophy. Everything belongs... Just like in this room, it is supposed that everything belongs to me. Even my students, they ask, "May I take this?" They have got right to take, but still, they ask. Similarly, you cannot touch anything—everything belongs to God—without His sanction. This is God consciousness.
Richard Webster: Yes, well, I wholly agree with that.
Prabhupāda: You cannot do anything...
Richard Webster: I entirely agree with that.
Prabhupāda: ...whimsically. It is not possible. Tena eva sa ucyate. If anyone does whimsically, then he becomes immediately thief. So you are a big philosopher. Kindly you spread...
Richard Webster: Very small philosopher.
Room Conversation with Richard Webster, chairman, Societa Filosofica Italiana -- May 24, 1974, Rome: Richard Webster: Very small philosopher.
Prabhupāda: No, that's all right. Anyway, if you spread this God consciousness, this knowledge of God consciousness, philosophy of God consciousness...
Richard Webster: Yes, well, I'm going to write an article on that.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dhanañjaya: Mr. Webster has your Bhagavad-gītā, and reads it very intently. And a few days ago he came back for another copy which he recommended to his friends.
Prabhupāda: That's nice. You kindly try to spread. Everything, whatever we speak, our philosophy, this is based on this Bhagavad-gītā. That's all.
Room Conversation with Catholic Cardinal and Secretary to the Pope -- May 24, 1974, Rome: Cardinal Pignedoli: You were.
Prabhupāda: No, not on the street. Some of the boys, they came to my hotel. So so far I saw, the people, they are very nice. They are very nice, but the government supresses their sentiments. Everyone has got religious sentiments. The people is as good as in other places. I don't find any difference. It is not that the whole Russia is atheist. It is not that. They are as others. They are like that. And our philosophy is that everyone is God conscious; simply it is being suppressed, either by the so-called leaders or by the influence of external energy, which is called māyā. We have got a verse in this Caitanya-caritāmṛta where it is said that nitya-siddha kṛṣṇa-bhakti sādhya kabhu naya. It is not an artificial thing. To make one God conscious is not artificial. God consciousness is there, even in the life of aborigines, most crude people. It has to be awakened by education. Śravaṇādi-śuddha-citte. One has to be educated. And he should be given chance to hear about God. And then, as soon as he becomes purified in his consciousness, he accepts and begins to love God. So it is not an artificial thing. Either in Russia or any place, any human being, he has got dormant love for God. It has to be awakened by processes. Therefore I began: That process which quickly awakens that God consciousness and engages him in the service of the Lord, that is first-class religious system. Paro dharmaḥ. Paraḥ means first-class. But a simply sentiment will not help.
Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva: Yogeśvara: Perhaps to make it clear for you, one of the natural results of this system is that a man that might be considered today impoverished, as you were mentioning for example some of the problems, a poor man, by our standards, is not necessarily poor if he is Kṛṣṇa conscious. For example, in the Vedic culture, we are learning that a man is considered to be wealthy if he simply has a small patch of land and a cow and God consciousness. Because his God consciousness will lead him to be satisfied by growing his own foods, taking milk from the cow. This is wealth, according to Vedic standards.
Prabhupāda: Therefore cow is specially recommended, go-rakṣya, because very important animal to the society. If those who are meat-eaters, they can eat the hogs and dogs, they can eat. The Vedic injunction is not prohibiting them. If you actually... Actually, a human being does not require to eat meat. He has got many other substitutes. But still, if he wants to eat, let him eat the less important animals. Just like dog, hog. From the social point of view it has no utility. But why killing cows? It is delivering such a nice nutritious food, milk. Not only milk. According to Vedic system, the cow is so important, even the urine, even the stool, of cow is important.
Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva: Prabhupāda: (laughter) But he could not defend that he has got brain, yes. So however these men may declare very, very big, we know that "You have no brain. You are as good as animal." Therefore Bhāgavata says, śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ: (SB 2.3.19) "These classes of men are no better than the dogs, hogs, camels and asses." Bhāgavata school will not approve of these rascals as human being. They are so strict. If one is not on the platform of God consciousness, he is not human being. He is animal. That's a fact. But we should not hate the animals because our mission is to bring them to the human consciousness. You cannot expect that your audience should be all highly brain. No. Preaching is required because they have no brain. Therefore your duty is to tolerate all difficulties and bring them to the sense of brain. Not that "These people are animals; we shall not mix with them." Then you have no missionary activities. Then you sit down in a place and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Then don't open centers. That is also dangerous. If we imitate Haridāsa Ṭhākura, "Let us all chant and do nothing," then the māyā, the women, they are very expert. They could not conquer over Haridāsa Ṭhākura, but she'll conquer upon you. And become victim. Therefore we have to be active. We cannot imitate Haridāsa. Anyone who has imitated the Haridāsa Ṭhākura, he has fallen down. He has fallen. He must fall down because imitating the highest personality, for which he is not fit. Therefore he's going to fall down. When by preaching, by chanting, we will be expert, then it is possible. So whether Bhagavān is coming or not?
Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva: Prabhupāda: Then why Christ recommend, "Thou shall not kill. Thou shall not covet. Thou shall not do this. Thou shall not..."? They are all false thing? Now let us talk of knowledge. We have talked so many outside knowledge. What is the real knowledge? The real knowledge is that everything is the property of God. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1). No land belongs either to the Americans or to the Swiss people or to the Indian people or to German people. No. Everything belongs to God. And all living entities are the sons of God. So everything produced out of God's land, either on the land or in the sky or anywhere, it is God's property, and all the sons, they have the right to share. So there is no scarcity in the God's kingdom. Simply due to our mismanagement we have created so much trouble. If we accept God as the center and all living entities sons of God, then we can actually live very peacefully in God consciousness. Therefore this is the recommendation, how we can live very peacefully, all of us, both men and animal and everyone. That is said here.
Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva: Prabhupāda: Sacrifice means to satisfy God. So you satisfy God. By God's mercy there will be sufficient rain. And when there is sufficient rain you produce sufficient food, food grains, and both the animals and men eat and live in God consciousness. Read the purport.
Yogeśvara: (reads purport in French)
Prabhupāda: So far I have studied... I am traveling all over the world. It is my calculation that we can produce food to give food ten times of the population if we properly utilize the whole planet according to this-produce food. Why because the milk is produced more, the cows should be slaughtered when there is a need of milk? It is so nice foodstuff. So on account of this false nationalism, "This is my land, this is my land, this is my land..." And why not take it as God's land and produce enough foodstuff. There will be no scarcity. There will be no skeleton. And distribute it. Where is that consciousness? There is so much land uncultivated all over the world, especially in America, in Australia, and in Africa, so much, huge land, no cultivation. They are keeping some cows and slaughtering them and exporting. What is this? Why don't you produce food?
Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva: Prabhupāda: So that knowledge is God consciousness, that just like in my body, your body, his body, what is the important thing? The important thing is the living force. So just like you are a person, I am a person, he is also a person. But what is the important thing in you, in me, and in him? What do you think?
Yogeśvara: (translates) Is that right? Did I translate?
Swiss Man (1): (French)
Yogeśvara: He says that... First of all he is very grateful that we are now approaching these higher spiritual questions. He says his understanding is that this living force inside all of us is the spirit of God that is in every one of us.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva: Yogeśvara: (translates) And in that situation, always thinking of God like that, our philosophy is that naturally these others things, charity, humanitarian works, they will all come naturally?
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Yasyāsti bhaktir bhagavaty akiñcanā sarvair guṇais tatra samāsate surāḥ (SB 5.18.12). As soon as you become a unalloyed devotee of God, all the good qualities will manifest in you. If the good qualities does not manifest in you, that means you are not yet perfect in God consciousness. Just like you European boys, American boys, why you have given... (break) ...one of the item is that good quality that "Why shall I give trouble, pain, to other animals?" This is within the God consciousness. Just like poor-feeding. This program we also follow. In our temple, especially in India, any man can come and take his food. Yes. We have got arrangement. In the U.S.A also, Los Angeles, New York, we invite anyone, "Come and take food." We don't want to see that anyone is hungry. We don't want to see. So God consciousness means all the good ideas we are manufacturing, they will be manifested in God consciousness automatically. Therefore our duty should be, if we want to make all human being well-behaved, then we must try to make every one of them God conscious.
Morning Walk -- June 6, 1974, Geneva: Prabhupāda: So I was giving lectures. They have churches. That means God conscious persons there. I never criticized church, mosque, never. Because whatever it may be, at least there is God consciousness. So they're good. In details... But when they disobey... I criticize only these rascals, disobey the commandments. Otherwise, we have no... We don't criticize.
Yogeśvara: We're not sectarian.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Yogeśvara: We're not sectarian.
Prabhupāda: Why? God is one. Why we shall be sectarian? According to his circumstances, he is doing. And that prayer is also bhakti, offering prayer. Śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ smaraṇaṁ pāda-sevanaṁ vandanam (SB 7.5.23). This vandana is prayer. So that is bhakti, one of the items of bhakti.
Morning Walk -- June 6, 1974, Geneva: Prabhupāda: Eh?
Yogeśvara: Everyone needs to be encouraged in their God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: Smaraṇaṁ pāda-sevanam arcanaṁ vandanaṁ dāsyaṁ sakhyam ātma-nivedanam. Bhaktiś cen nava-lakṣaṇā. Bhakti is demonstrated in nine different symptoms. So vandanam, offering prayers, that is bhakti.
Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Is it required for them to have a spiritual master to guide them?
Prabhupāda: Certainly. These rascals, the priest, they do not guide them. They are also fallen. Otherwise, Christian religion is very nice. If they follow. So many times they asked me. "Yes, if you follow your Christian religion, you'll be perfect." Caitanya Mahāprabhu proved devotional service from Koran. Yes.
Morning Walk -- June 6, 1974, Geneva: Guru-gaurāṅga: Their nice standard of living will be lost.
Prabhupāda: No, why? The standard of living should be one: plain living and God consciousness. That is the disease. Everyone wants to enjoy this material world to his best capacity. Therefore we divide. They don't want to live in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Material consciousness. Enjoyment of the senses. And that is the cause of their suffering. Only on account of this sense gratification, they're creating different mentality, and, after death, they're getting different body. That they do not know. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgaḥ asya sad-asad-janma-yoniṣu. One is trying to associate with the goodness, brāhmaṇa, brāhmaṇa qualification, he'll be promoted, and one who is trying to imitate, "I shall be as powerful as the tiger," he'll be degraded. It is nature's law.
Morning Walk -- June 10, 1974, Paris: Devotee (3): Everyone thinks in terms of their own relative position.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Even an insignificant bird, because he knows swimming, he knows swimming, so he can (indistinct). Because you do not know swimming, you cannot say like that. Even insignificant bird, just see how nicely he is swimming. He knows the art. Everyone, cent percent of the modern people, they do not believe in God and they do not know what is religion. That is the position. They think religion is sentiment, anyone can manufacture his own sentiment, there is no God. This is going on. So we are in fault. It is folly to be wise where ignorance is bliss. The whole world is under this conception; therefore we are at fault, we are preaching God consciousness.
Morning Walk -- June 14, 1974, Paris: Prabhupāda: That's all right. We are preaching Bhagavad-gītā. If you like, you take it. Otherwise, go to hell. Who cares for you? We have, we have started this institution, "Kṛṣṇa Consciousness." So if you do not accept Bhagavad-gītā, then why did you come here? Why do you come here? You go away. We are not hankering after you. If you go to hell, go to go. Go to that. Who objects? Go. But if you come here, then you must be Kṛṣṇa conscious. If there is some signboard that "Indian sweets, rasagullā is available," why do you go there for asking meat? What is this meaning? We, we, our Society, it is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So why do you come here for if you don't believe in Kṛṣṇa? Go to hell. Don't come here. If you want to understand Kṛṣṇa, then come here. That is the first principle. Therefore in New York somebody suggested that "Make this International Society of God Consciousness." That will be great havoc. They'll bring, rascals, so many gods. Make it clear, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. If you are interested in Kṛṣṇa, then come here. If you are interested in something else, you go there.
Room Conversation with devotees about Twelfth Canto Kali-yuga, and Conversation with Guest -- June 15, 1974, Paris: Prabhupāda: That I was discussing from Bhāgavatam, how people will degrade in this age. And this is due to lack of God consciousness. (French)
Yogeśvara: He says your lecture yesterday evening was very objectionable to many of the young people who made so much disruption. They found many of the things you were discussing...
Prabhupāda: Because the young people gradually degrading. They do not acknowledge authority. (French)
Yogeśvara: Yes. When they saw how much we were speaking authoritative, they rejected it. They reacted.
Prabhupāda: So that is their degradation, due to degradation. They cannot accept any authority. And knowledge cannot advance without authority. (French) But one thing I may say that the disobedience to the authority has begun from their fathers.
Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany: Prabhupāda: There is a verse. Nārāyaṇa-parāḥ sarve na kutaścana bibhyati (SB 6.17.28). If one is God realized soul, he is not afraid of anything. Svargāpavarga-narakeṣv api tulyārtha-darśinaḥ. So actually, if one is self-realized, he is no more fearful or concerned with the bodily necessities of life. That is liberation. Just like as you mentioned sleeping. Sleeping also, a bodily necessity. When you are tired, you sleep. That is bodily necessity. But it is not spiritually necessary. About the Gosvāmīs it is said, nidrāhāra-vihārakādi-vijitau: ** "Conquered over sleeping, eating, mating." That is also one of the symptoms of self-realization. These things are necessities of the body. So the more one is advanced in self-realization, these things will be minimized: eating, sleeping, mating and defending. And gradually it will come to nil because this is bodily necessities. Self, the active principle, that is different. The active principle necessity is different. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, God consciousness. But these are bodily necessities: eating, sleeping, mating. So, so long this body is there, of course, we must eat, we must sleep. That is required. But the more we advance, these necessities diminished. Yes. Bhaktiḥ pareśānubhavo viraktir anyatra syāt (SB 11.2.42). Then sleeping will be considered a waste of time. A self-realized man goes to sleep. He thinks that "I am going to waste so much time, because still I am subjected to the necessities of this body." He regrets.
Room Conversation -- June 20, 1974, Germany: Prabhupāda: Others, if they try for the same thing, then it is alright. Because that type of religion, that system of religion, is first-class which teaches people to come to the platform of God consciousness, to love God, then that is first-class religious system. It doesn't matter what is the designation. (indistinct)
Guest: The process of change of consciousness which is actually taking place in you under many influences, I think.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Guest: Under many influences.
Prabhupāda: No, influence should be only Kṛṣṇa or God. Kṛṣṇa, when we speak of Kṛṣṇa, God, but they have no clear idea what is God. How does He speak, how does He act. Where does He live. What is His form. What is his color. Nobody knows. Ask any religious people, "Do you know about all these?" (tape too faint to hear) (indistinct) If they think about it at all. First of all, generally they think of something impersonal or void. The Buddhists they think God is zero. And others they think God has no form. So, two classes. The Hindus they think God has not particular form, (indistinct). And you can imagine any of them(?) That is Śaṅkara.
Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany: Prabhupāda: (aside) You can sit on the chair if you like.
Guest: No, I like to sit, thank you.
Prabhupāda: Not only Christianity, everywhere, the people now do not love God, but they love dog. Yes. Therefore this movement is required, awakening of God consciousness. Not the Christians, they are only to be accused, but Hindus, Muslim, everyone. They are simply stamp, but no obedience to God. This is the position.
Pater Emmanuel: Can you say exactly the point where Christians are not obedient. Do you see any points here by your visit to the Christian countries and you like to say for us? It is a help for us to say exactly the point.
Prabhupāda: Yes. The first point is that your commandment is "Thou shalt not kill," and you are maintaining regularly slaughterhouse. The first commandment is disobeyed. Do you agree or not?
Pater Emmanuel: Um...
Prabhupāda: Or in my front the animals are being kept for being killed.
Pater Emmanuel: I personally agree.
Prabhupāda: That's it.
Room Conversation with Reverend Gordon Powell, Head of Scots Church -- June 28, 1974, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: You can see God in everywhere. But one must be Kṛṣṇa conscious, God conscious. Then he'll see every moment, everywhere God, nothing but God.
Reverend Powell: Is this part of the God consciousness, that in everything is the God?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Everything is made out of energy of God.
Satsvarūpa: Here are some sweetballs made out of milk and butter.
Prabhupāda: You can, you can pick up.
Reverend Powell: Made out of what?
Satsvarūpa: Mostly out of milk and butter.
Prabhupāda: Milk preparation.
Room Conversation -- June 28, 1974, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: I say it is very nice, immediately. Because he was embracing tree also. So that is God consciousness, advanced God consciousness. Because everywhere there is part and parcel of God. Any way, either materially or spiritually. In our childhood, actually what I am doing, it was all taught in our childhood by our parents, my family. We were taught, "There is a grain of rice on the ground, and if it is touched by your feet, you should pick up the grain and touch on your head." This was our training. The idea behind—that the grain of rice is not man-made. It is sent by God. "O God, give us our daily bread." So here is the bread. It is God's mercy. Just see how idea, great idea. What is given by God, that is also God. This is God consciousness. You are asking God's mercy. So God's mercy is also God, the Absolute. So how can you disrespect a thing which is given by God? You cannot produce rice. You cannot produce bread. It is given by God. Everything... Therefore Kṛṣṇa said, raso 'ham apsu kaunteya (BG 7.8). Just try to understand Kṛṣṇa from the beginning of drinking water. Therefore Kṛṣṇa said that "The taste of the water, I am." So water, or any liquid thing you are drinking, if you are feeling some pleasure, ānanda... Ānandamaya. That God is ānanda. So there is the sample of ānanda. So if we simply practice this, that wherever I derive some pleasure, that is God, then you become God conscious.
Reporters Interview -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: There is no second religion. There is only one religion. That is God consciousness. Now, as soon as you designate, "Christian," "Hindu," "Muslim," that is upādhi, designated religion. Just like you are here and you are in black coat. So if I say, "Black Mr. such and such," so to say, "Black Mr. such and such," there is no need. "Mr. such and such" is sufficient. But we have been accustomed to say like that, "Black Mr. such and such, white Mr. such and such." Similarly, religion is one, but due to our sophisticated mind, we call it "Christian religion," "Hindu religion," "Muslim religion." Why don't you come in? Why are you outside?
Devotee: I have my working clothes on, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Room Conversation with Bishop Kelly -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: Yes. That is stated in one of the Vedic literature, that:
- nitya-siddha kṛṣṇa-prema sādhya kabhu naya
- śravaṇādi-śuddha-citte karaye udaya
- (Cc. madhya 22.107)
The inherent principle is eternally a fact, his obedience to God. But artificially he has covered it, artificially. The God consciousness is there in everyone, but by so-called material advancement, he has forgotten. He has his obedience to God, natural. Even the aborigines in the forest, they also submit to the manifestation of God's different energies. As soon as there is some lightning and there is thunderbolt, they immediately... They offer obeisances. As soon as they see a big sea, ocean, they offer obeisances. So that is inherent. But due to the material association it is covered.
Room Conversation with Bishop Kelly -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: The more we advance in so-called material, what is called, amenities, we forget God. We forget God. So the inherent, dormant, propensity is to become servant of God, but material association is checking him. Therefore if he... Just like now psychological treatment—a crazy fellow, he goes to the psychiatrist and he talks with him. Gradually, talking, talking, he cures him—similarly, these men who have forgotten or these living entity, if they associate with devotees and they constantly talk and hear about God, then again he revives his God consciousness. Yes. So we are, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement or any other... We open many centers, and we talk, we sell our literature. His lordship has seen our books? You can show some of the books.
Room Conversation with Bishop Kelly -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: Yes. So by association with devotee, by hearing, hearing, śravaṇādi... Śravaṇādi means hearing... Beginning is hearing. If you patiently hear, then that dormant God consciousness again becomes revived. Yes. Then his life is successful.
Bishop Kelly: What would you hold about the, what you might term the revelation of God, the ongoing communication of God in revealing Himself and in further making known His will for man at different stages of his own life, say, in his spiritual life, and, of course, in different stages of history and in different cultures?
Prabhupāda: That is recommended. You see. Teṣāṁ satata-yuktānāṁ bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam, dadāmi buddhi (BG 10.10). Because the God consciousness is there, God is there, now God is prepared to give Him instruction always. He is giving you instruction. Now, how that dormant consciousness can be revived, that is stated. You read it.
Room Conversation with Bishop Kelly -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: I said that if one engages himself in the service of the Lord some way or other, then the revelation, the original dormant God consciousness and love of God, becomes revived. Exactly in the same way: the psychiatrists, they treat the crazy fellow by talking, talking, talking some way. So if we talk of Kṛṣṇa, then the original Kṛṣṇa consciousness is revived. That is also stated. You find out in the Bhāgavata, śṛṇvatāṁ sva-kathāḥ kṛṣṇaḥ puṇya-śravaṇa-kīrtanaḥ hṛdy antaḥ stho hy abhadrāṇi... (SB 1.2.17). Yes, purport. So this is very important thing. Therefore we have published so many books about Kṛṣṇa—to hear. Hearing, hearing, hearing, and... Just like man is sleeping. You talk loudly, and he will be awakened. Yes. That's it.
Room Conversation with Bishop Kelly -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne: Bishop Kelly: I hope that in some real way that the cause of God will be served the better for this meeting. I do wish you Godspeed in your work, and in that, of course...
Prabhupāda: Yes, we are trying our bit to educate people how to revive his original God consciousness. Then he will be happy. Our principle is how to make people happy. There is a verse about the gosvāmīs. Nānā-śāstra-vicāraṇaika-nipuṇau sad-dharma-saṁsthāpakau lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau. This word is very important, lokānāṁ hita-kāriṇau: "for the welfare of the people in general." People accuse sometimes—of course, foolish people do that—that these God conscious person they are escaping. No. Who are actually God conscious person is always thinking how to do well to the people in general. Yes. Sad-dharma-saṁsthāpakau. Give it to him. You can take.
Room Conversation -- August 12, 1975, Paris (with French translator): Yogeśvara (translating): He says because we have no Kṛṣṇa consciousness, no God consciousness, therefore we are responsible for not having been able to save them.
Prabhupāda: That is false. That I am saying. This is false responsibility. Actually you cannot become responsible. You have no power. Everyone is under the laws of nature. Just like some birds flying in the sky. The father, mother, and children, but nobody is responsible for anyone. When there is danger in the sky, you cannot give protection. Suppose one bird is hit, he is falling. The father, mother, and others, they cannot give any protection. He has to become responsible for himself. Just like the aeroplane. When the one plane is in danger, no other plane come and help it. Even if you see that the other plane is flying a few yards and if it is in fire, you cannot help. There is one nice story that one hunter was hunting birds and he spread his network. So when the children of the parent birds, they become victimized by the network. So when the parents came, they saw, "Oh, my children have been caught up by the net of the hunter." So mother became very overwhelmed. She went to rescue them and she also become victimized.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Room Conversation with three Trappist Monks, Psychologists from the University of Georgia, and Atlanta Lawyer, Michael Green -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta: Prabhupāda: So practically there is no religion. And without religion human society is animal society. Dharmeṇa hīnā pasubhiḥ samānāḥ. "Human being without any ideas of religion, God, he is no better than animal." That is the difference between animal and human being. Animal eats, we eat; animal sleeps, we sleep; animal have sexual intercourse, we have; animal also defends, we also defend. These are common features. And what is the special feature? The special feature of human being—that he can understand what is God. So if he does not understand God, he is animal, because the distinction between animal and man is being avoided. So far other activities are concerned, they are the same as of human being and as of animal. But what is the distinction? The distinction is that in the human society there is an endeavor to understand God, and the animal society, there is no such endeavor. So when the so-called human society becomes devoid of
God consciousness, it is animal society. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (
SB 10.84.13). So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is meant for raising the human society to the real platform of human society, not to keep them in the animal platform. Try to understand God and love Him. This is the substance of Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. So, yes?
Room Conversation with three Trappist Monks, Psychologists from the University of Georgia, and Atlanta Lawyer, Michael Green -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta: Guest (3) (Trappist monk): There's three of us here that are monks from Connear(?), Trappist monks, and you use Hare Kṛṣṇa as a way to God consciousness, while in our Christian tradition we use the name Jesus and we repeat it constantly and try to become conscious of him.
Prabhupāda: Jesus, did he say... Jesus Christ, did he say that Jesus is the name of God?
Guest (3): Well, that's what Christians believe, yeah.
Prabhupāda: No, is there anything mentioned in the Bible that Jesus is the name of God?
Guest (3): I'm not sure.
Room Conversation with three Trappist Monks, Psychologists from the University of Georgia, and Atlanta Lawyer, Michael Green -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta: Guest (3): This tradition of the names was a tradition that was developed for two thousand years, beginning with the monks, and which most Christians are really not aware of, that through this japa a man can come to consciousness of God.
Prabhupāda: Yes, when one comes to God consciousness. And the relationship is "God is great; we are subordinate." Just like the father is the maintainer, and the son is maintained. Although the father and the son of the same quality, still, the relationship is the father is the maintainer, and the son is maintained.
Guest (5): That's, of course, not the orthodox Christian interpretation, that's supposed to be. It's very clear by the time the decrees were worked out that Jesus is not a creature. He's incarnate God.
Guest (6): You say that we are creatures, and we are subordinate to God, and I can understand that. Christ was not created.
Prabhupāda: Yes, none of us are created. Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā...
Room Conversation with three Trappist Monks, Psychologists from the University of Georgia, and Atlanta Lawyer, Michael Green -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta: Guest (7): The young children also? What about young children?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Young children should be educated from the very beginning about God consciousness or the science of God. We had the opportunity in our childhood. My father taught. And then, when I was grown up, my spiritual master taught. So for that reason we have got some sense. Spiritual education should be given...
- kaumāra ācaret prājño
- dharmān bhāgavatān iha
- durlabhaṁ mānuṣaṁ janma
- tad apy adhruvam arthadam
- (SB 7.6.1)
This is statement of Prahlāda Mahārāja. He was a five-years-old boy and a devotee. So he was trying to preach amongst his classfellows. The classfellows said, "Why you are bothering about spiritual consciousness, God consciousness, now? We are young men. Let us play." He said, "No. The spiritual life should begin kaumāra, just at the beginning of five years." Why? Durlabhaṁ mānuṣaṁ janma: "This human form of life is very rarely obtained, and we do not know when we shall die.
Room Conversation with Tripurari -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta: Prabhupāda: That is good.
Doug: He always talked in terms of higher states of consciousness, in terms of cosmic consciousness, which I understand to be Brahman realization. Then he talked in terms of, after about the sixth state of consciousness was then God consciousness. And then Paramātmā. Then he talked of the highest state of consciousness, and he said it's Bhagavān realization. But he completely steers away from putting any type of limitation on people's sense control at all, and this is what I have a hard time understanding. Even though the more I was with him he suggested to his close associates to follow the principles of brahmacārī, and he made me one of his brahmacārīs, and he told us to read the scriptures every day, and we had a lot of association...
Prabhupāda: What is his personal character?
Doug: Pardon me?
Prabhupāda: He is observing celibacy or...
Room Conversation with Tripurari -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta: Rūpānuga: Physics, a doctorate in physics.
Prabhupāda: Hmm?
Balavanta: He has a degree, a Ph.D. in physics.
Doug: I don't think it's a Ph.D. I think it's just a masters degree.
Prabhupāda: In physics.
Doug: His master told him to finish school before he could join up with him.
Prabhupāda: He talks science about? No.
Doug: He does talk science, yeah. He tries to present Vedic ideas in scientific terms, so that the people of the West will understand. So originally he came out talking about God consciousness and so forth, but eventually he got more and more into this course he calls the science of creative intelligence, SCI, which is what he... (end)
Morning Walk -- March 4, 1975, Dallas: Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dayānanda: Is it also mentioned that in other places in our śāstra?
Prabhupāda: There are many places. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...is given for practicing God consciousness, and they have become advanced civilized, they are cultivating nudie-ism. Is it not? Nudie-ism. So the punishment is that "All right, you become nudie, you remain standing in one place, for five thousand years." (laughter) That is right. The trees live up till five thousand years. They live.
Viṣṇujana: Prabhupāda? But they argue that if God wanted us to wear clothes He would have made us with clothes. But He made us without clothes, so...
Prabhupāda: The thing is that here material world means that whatever you want, you have to work for it. That is material world. Things are there, but you have to work for it. In the spiritual world there is no need of working. You get all necessities. That is the difference.
Room Conversation with Canadian Ambassador to Iran -- March 13, 1975, Iran: Prabhupāda: Others, if they try for the same thing, then it is all right, because that type of religion or that system of religion is first-class which teaches for this thing, that "Come to platform of God consciousness and love God." Then that is first-class system of religion. It doesn't matter what is the designation. But where is that happening?
Ambassador: The process of change of consciousness which is actually taking place in the world under many influences, I think...
Prabhupāda: No. The influence should be only Kṛṣṇa, or God. Kṛṣṇa, when we speak of "Kṛṣṇa"—God. But they have no clear idea what is God. How does He speak, how does He act, where does He live, what is His form, what is His qualities—nobody knows. Ask any religious people, "Do you know about all this, about God?" They do not know. What do you think, Atreya? Have they any clear conception of God? They imagine something. If they think of God at all... First of all, generally they think of impersonal or void. Just like the Buddhists. They think God is zero. And others, they think that God has no form. The two classes.
Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran: Devotee: He's coming.
Prabhupāda: Yes. India... Formerly your country was part of India, and you belong to the same culture. So far I understand, Iran means Āryan? So Āryan culture was practically all over the world. Āryan culture is based on God consciousness. So amongst the Āryans there is some conception of religion, either Christian religion or Mohammedan religion, Buddhist religion, Vedic religion, based on conception of God. So according to time, country, the ways of understanding may be little different, but the aim is God consciousness. That is Āryan civilization. So God is one; God cannot be two. So the features of God or angle of vision of God may be different. So they have been summarized in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. (Aside:) You can come forward. One feature of God is impersonal. Just like the sunshine. Sunshine is spreading all over the universe. It is impersonal. But the quality of the sunshine is heat and light. The heat and light means energy. So as in the material calculation, the heat and light is the cause of all creation.
Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran: Young man: Are human beings the only creations that can have Kṛṣṇa consciousness?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa consciousness means God consciousness. The cats and dogs cannot be trained up. But a human being can be trained up. Especially the Āryans, they can be trained up. They are advanced.
Young man: More advanced than other races?
Prabhupāda: By birth they are advanced. They have got intelligence. But for Kṛṣṇa consciousness everyone can be purified, even the non-Āryans. It is without any check. Ahaituky apratihatā. Apratihatā means without any material check. It is not a disqualification that one is not an Āryan, therefore he cannot understand God. No. He can also be trained up. Because it is spiritual, and we are all spiritual identities, so it is not difficult. Even one who is not spiritual at the present moment, but by training he can also become spiritual.
Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran: Prabhupāda: Explanation.
Śrutakīrti:. "Purport." (break)
Prabhupāda: This is the summary of God consciousness. (Says something in Hindi)
Young man: I am from Ānanda-mārga. My name is Ācārya Sveta Kirtu Brahmacārī.
Prabhupāda: Sveta-kirtu. Sveta.
Young man: And the guru's name is Śrī Śrī Rādhā-Govindaji.
Prabhupāda: Hmm. You have got a branch here?
Young man: I have been here for about three months. I am trying to lead the practices and the sādhana of the people here and trying to set up a unit here.
Prabhupāda: So you follow Vedic principle?
Young man: We follow Tantric principle.
Prabhupāda: Tantric. Tantra, there are two kinds of tantras, sattvata, and there are sattvic, rajasic, anything. So your activity is on the material platform or spiritual?
Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran: Prabhupāda: If you simply speculate, it will never help you. You have to receive the favor of the Supreme Lord by your enthusiasm. Then it will be successful. Simply theorizing, speculation will not... Therefore it is said ciraṁ vicinvan. You can go on speculating for millions and millions of years. It will never be successful. Ciram. Ciram means perpetual. That will not help. This is the process, ādau śraddhā. By śraddhā, "Oh, here is
God consciousness, very nice. Let us come and see what they are doing." This is called śraddhā, faith, little faith. Then in order to increase that faith you have to associate with the persons who are executing devotional service. That is called sādhu-saṅga (
CC Madhya 22.83). The devotees are called sādhu. Therefore we are opening centers, why? To give chance people to make association with the devotees. Sādhu-saṅga. And then sādhu-saṅga, after sādhu-saṅga one who has properly made sādhu-saṅga, the next stage is bhajana-kriyā: how they are executing devotional service. Then anartha-nivṛttiḥ syāt. Then this anartha. Anartha means unwanted things. Just like illicit sex, meat-eating, intoxication, these are unwanted things. It is not necessary.
Morning Walk -- April 7, 1975, Mayapur: Prabhupāda: But the Englishmen never took that line and when...
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Did they teach God consciousness?
Prabhupāda: When our godbrother Acyuta Mahārāja and Bon Mahārāja was sent, Lady Willingdon, he derided them that "You Indian people you come here..." (break)
Rāmeśvara: ...say that Western civilization is very good for the world.
Prabhupāda: Yes, but they cannot teach their own children. They are becoming hippies. That is the effect of their education.
Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: You have to judge by the fruits.
Prabhupāda: Yes. You cannot teach your own people, and you are going to teach others. "Physician heal thyself." Hare Kṛṣṇa. (Greets someone.) You have failed to teach your own children, they are disappointed, and you are going to teach others. This is another cheating. It is not the question of... That is another fault—"our," "your." There is no question of "our," "your." Any culture, actually if it is culture, it is meant for the whole human society. Why do you say, "our," "your." We never say, "The Kṛṣṇa consciousness is meant for Indians," or "for the Europeans." It is meant for everyone. That is our proposition.
Conversation with Governor -- April 20, 1975, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: Ninety-five percent may remain non-brāhmaṇa. But this 5 percent, if they are strongly brahminical, then others will follow. Ekaś candras tamo hanti na ca tārāḥ-sahasraśaḥ. You have got millions of stars. Nobody cares for them. But people are looking after "When the moon will rise? When the moon will rise?" That one moon is sufficient than millions of stars. So this is the suggestion. Then?
Brahmānanda: "The propagation of mānava-dharma. Regarding propagation of mānava-dharma, mānava-dharma means the activities of the human beings. So the distinction between mānava-dharma and paśu-dharma is that in the animal society there is no idea of God consciousness. God consciousness can only be propagated in human society. In the animal society they may be physically stronger than the humans like the tiger and the elephant or many such animals, but they cannot be educated spiritually."
Prabhupāda: They may be very strong, our tiger and elephant, but they have no capacity to accept any education. Then?
Room Coversation with Psychiatrist and Indian Boy -- May 12, 1975, Perth: Paramahaṁsa: He says he just wished to meet you. Perhaps I should read a verse. Should I read a verse?
Prabhupāda: No. Our viewpoint is that in the material world, who has accepted this material body—anyone, but we specially take the human society—they require treatment, everyone. Everyone is mentally diseased, and therefore he is unhappy. Everyone. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahād-guṇa (SB 5.18.12). Anyone who has no sense of God consciousness, he is diseased mentally. He requires treatment. The whole human society, especially at the present moment, they have given up God consciousness. They are not interested. That is their disease. And everyone requires treatment. So the whole Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is the mass treatment of the materialistic persons who are mentally diseased. That is our proposition. It is... In India there was a case. A man committed murder, and he pleaded in the court that... His pleader, his lawyer, pleaded that he was mad at that time. We also accept unless one becomes mad, one cannot commit murder or suicide. So the civil surgeon was brought to give evidence whether this man is actually mad.
Room Conversation with Jesuit -- May 19, 1975, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa means all-attractive. That is great. You say, "God is great." We say God, Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa means all-attractive. Unless you are the great, you cannot be all-attractive.
Jesuit: When you speak of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, it means...
Prabhupāda: God consciousness, God consciousness. God is great and I am His eternal servant. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Two words: God is great and I am His eternal servant, I am small. This consciousness is called Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Jesuit: Do you know the prayer that the Russians use, the Jesus prayer?
Prabhupāda: Any prayer. God is one. Either you pray in a different way, I'll pray in a different way, it doesn't matter.
Jesuit: I know that but I want to know do you know what is known as the Jesus prayer which the Russians use?
Devotee: No, he doesn't know.
Jesuit: It seems to me that you chant, don't you, Hare Kṛṣṇa?
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Room Conversation with Jesuit -- May 19, 1975, Melbourne: Jesuit: Hm. Transformed, it changes.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So actually there is nothing material. When God consciousness is there, it is spiritual. This... In association with God, everything becomes spiritual. Just like there is a church and there is an ordinary house. People say, " This is church, God's place, and this is house." What is the difference? That is also made of bricks; that is also made of bricks. Why people go to the church? Why not to the house? So the conclusion is, when the atmosphere is surcharged with God consciousness, it is spiritual. Immediately. Otherwise, as soon as you forget God, then it is material. Material and spiritual means where there is no forgetfulness of God, that is spiritual. And where there is forgetfulness of God, that is material.
Jesuit: Hm. Sort of a figurative use of the word.
Prabhupāda: Not figurative, it is actual. Actually, God is all-pervading. Everything is God's energy. Therefore God is whole spirit. His energy cannot be material.
Room Conversation with Jesuit -- May 19, 1975, Melbourne: Jesuit: Well, I have kept you long enough. I...
Prabhupāda: No, you can keep me engaged whole day and night, (laughter) provided you have got time. We are meant for this purpose. If anyone can understand God consciousness, that is a great profit for us. Now our appeal is to everyone, every religious sect, that people are becoming godless generally at the present moment. So we should make combined effort to revive their God consciousness. Otherwise it is doomed. And there is no question of Christian God or Hindu God or Muslim God. God is one. So there should be no difference between the system. According to the time and circumstances, there may be little difference, but really if we can understand God, either through Christianity or through Hinduism or Muslim, that is our profit. That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje (SB 1.2.6). "That is first-class religion, following which, one becomes a lover of God". You become a lover of God. That we want to see. It doesn't matter whether you go through Christian religion or Mohammedan religion or Hindu religion or Buddhist...
Room Conversation with Journalist -- May 19, 1975, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: So practically the entire human society is now becoming godless. That is very dangerous position. And we have already come to that dangerous position. There are so many problems, and recently we have heard that New York City, the most important city in the world, they are in a problem, that they cannot keep the city very nicely maintained and clean, and they asked for help, some millions of dollars, and the federal government has refused. In this way the godless society will have to meet so many problems of life, and if they want solution of all these problems, they must take to God consciousness or Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So that is our sum and substance of the movement, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, the International Society for Kṛṣṇa Consciousness. So we are trying to... It is very simple method. Anyone can accept it by chanting and dancing and eating. And if one does not like this method—he wants to understand the philosophy—we have got fifty books of four hundred pages, you can see all these books.
Room Conversation with Dr. Copeland, Professor of Modern Indian History -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: They have got a spirit of sacrifice.
Dr. Copeland: But you ask a great deal of people. So why do you think they're willing to give?
Prabhupāda: No, I ask only four things: no illicit sex, no meat-eating, no intoxication, no gambling. That's all. But these four things are very, very, difficult for the Western people. That I know. Just see. God consciousness cannot be achieved by any third-class man. One must be the topmost first-class man. Then he can become God conscious.
Dr. Copeland: And who decides what is first class?
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is decided by Kṛṣṇa. Find out this verse. Yeṣāṁ tu anta-gataṁ pāpaṁ janānāṁ puṇya-karmaṇām. (Prabhupāda is coughing) Give me water. Te dvandva-moha-nirmuktā bhajante māṁ dṛḍha-vratāḥ (BG 7.28). Kṛṣṇa says who can become fully Kṛṣṇa conscious. That definition is there.
Room Conversation with Director of Research of the Dept. of Social Welfare -- May 21, 1975, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: Any, anyone. That is the position. For treatment we go to a physician, and the physician prescribes medicine, you reject it. So how you will be cured? That is the position. When the prescription is given you want to put it in the votes of other patients. What the patient will know about the prescription? They are patients. There is no question of...
Director: If I would come here and want to join your movement I would accept it.
Prabhupāda: No, you join or not join, you have come here to consult us if we can help your activities. But when we prescribe, you do not accept it. That is your position.
Devotee: He has to go now, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: Give him prasāda, just... So, to, actually to make the whole human society happy, this God consciousness movement must spread.
Director: Well, I'll certainly report back. Thank you very much for seeing me.
Prabhupāda: Just little wait.
Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne: Guest 1: I don't think anybody would disagree with that. I certainly don't.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that we want to do: one God, one state, one scripture, and one activity. That is the ultimate end of Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Just like we are from different countries. We don't think as nationalism, that "I am American," "I am Indian." No. We all think that "We are all servant of Kṛṣṇa." And they are working in that spirit. It is possible. If this idea is accepted in that United Nation, it can be done. But they will not accept. They are going go be united, but everyone is thinking, "First of all my interest." All cheating. They are outwardly, "Now we have come to the United Nation," but no one is going to be united. Everyone is thinking, "It is my first interest first. I must give veto if he's opposing." This is going on. Therefore for the last twenty years or more than that, they are trying to be united, but it is becoming disunited. The flags are increasing. In New York they have got their headquarters. When I pass through, I see that another flag has increased.
So this United Nations is a failure and it will be failure because there is no God consciousness.
Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: The advancement of knowledge in any department, that is very good. But what is the aim? The aim is to glorify the Supreme Lord. Just like you are lawyer. You gave us help in some difficulty time. Why? Because you wanted to continue glorification of the Lord, that "These men are doing nice. Why they should be harassed?" So that means you helped glorification of the Lord. So that's your success as a lawyer. So anyone who helps this movement, that "They are spreading Kṛṣṇa consciousness, God consciousness. They should be helped in all respect," that is the perfection. Everything is required, but it should be culminated in the matter of glorifying the Supreme. Then it is perfect. In another place... Find out this verse,
- ataḥ pumbhir dvija-śreṣṭhā
- varṇāśrama-vibhāgaśaḥ
- svanuṣṭhitasya dharmasya
- saṁsiddhir hari-toṣaṇam
- (SB 1.2.13)
Just like you have helped this institution in a difficult position. That means you have pleased Kṛṣṇa. That is your success. My devotees are in difficulty.
Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne: Prabhupāda: And above that, there is intelligent class of men, practicing some yoga. And spiritual platform means above that. First bodily concept, gross, then mental, then intellectual, then spiritual. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is on the spiritual platform, above body, mind and intelligence. But actually, we should come to that platform. Because we are spirit soul, we are neither this body nor this mind nor this intelligence. So one who is on the platform of spiritual consciousness, they have got everything, intelligence, proper use of mind, proper use of the body. Just like a millionaire, he has got all the lower grade possession. Ten rupees or hundred rupees or hundred pounds—he has got all, everything. Similarly, if we try to make an attempt to bring people on the platform of God consciousness, then he is possessing all other qualities: how to take care of the body, how to use the mind, how to use intelligence, everything. But it is not possible that everyone should become God conscious.
Garden Conversation with Dr. Gerson and devotees -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles: Jayatīrtha: On television they did a very bad story on Gurukula.
Prabhupāda: Yes, they're, they cheater. He wants to cheat and get some money. That's all. Because the whole so-called human society is combination of cheater and cheated. So anyone who is acting without Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he is a cheater. And anyone who is thinking himself advanced without Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he is cheated. This is the basic principle. I mean Kṛṣṇa consciousness, God consciousness, so when we speak of Kṛṣṇa-God. Without God consciousness, everyone is cheated. And because everyone is cheated, there must be cheater. This is correlative term. If I say, "I am cheated," that means there is a cheater. And if there is a cheater there must be cheated. This is relative term.
Garden Conversation with Professors -- June 24, 1975, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: Without God.
Peter: Well, I wouldn't say without God but without...
Prabhupāda: But without God, how there can be God consciousness?
Peter: So... I don't think that I experience differently than anybody here, but I think that I express that differently. So, what... If I believe in God in my own way, which is maybe expressed...
Prabhupāda: No, our proposition is that you believe or not believe, there is God.
Peter: Well, how can a person not believe? You have to believe.
Prabhupāda: Just like there are so many criminals. They do not believe in government. They don't care for the government. But that does not mean there is no government.
Room Conversation with the Mayor of Evanston -- July 4, 1975, Chicago: Viṣṇujana: According to national statistics, as far as curing drug problems and crime problems, it's seen that social organizations that are supported by the town councils, etc. are usually about 3% effective in cases cured of either drug addiction or crime. But as far as religious organizations are concerned, some of them are 70, 80% effective in cases that have been attempted cure. So it's, as far as percentage cured, the process of introducing God consciousness is much more effective than some social reform or rehabilitation work or something like that.
Prabhupāda: No, social reform will automatically come. The first-class reform, the brāhmaṇas, if their advice is taken, then the other classes the kṣatriya, vaiśyas, and śūdras, they become automatically.
Morning Walk -- July 5, 1975, Chicago: Prabhupāda: (in car) ...saṁsāre māyāra janeiya, moha janeiya, jīva ke karaye gadha. This māyāra vaibhava, this material advancement is advancement of māyā. Big, big building, nice road, nice motor car, nice... Surely it is material advancement, admitted. But this advancement is advancement of the illusory energy. So what is the wrong there? Suppose... The wrong is there that this material world is temporary. We have come here temporarily, say twenty-five years, fifty years or at most, hundred years. So we are already illusioned and we become more illusioned. Then we forget our real business. Mūḍha, we remain mūḍha. Supposing if there is next birth, so who is very much anxious to know what is our next birth? Nobody is. Blindly going on. māyāra vaibhava. (break) ...very nice church, but understand what for this church is, what is God, what is God consciousness. Just cultivate this knowledge. "No, big church finished." Live nice building, nice happy life, but don't forget Kṛṣṇa. Then what is the use of this life? And if you forget Kṛṣṇa, then the result will be crime, and you will be facing with problems, "Why and now what to do?" So many problems will be there. So the problems cannot be solved simply by possessing big, big buildings.
Morning Walk -- July 8, 1975, Chicago: Jaga-jīvana: Is everything done in our movement for preaching? Everything that is done in our movement is done for preaching?
Prabhupāda: Yes. To awaken their Kṛṣṇa consciousness. They are in dog consciousness; we have to raise them to God consciousness. Don't you see how much they are taking care of the dog? Because they do not know, blind, whether they will be God conscious or dog conscious. So the dog conscious people should be raised to the platform of God conscious. That is preaching. Mūḍha nābhijānāti. These rascals, they do not know the life is meant for understanding God. That they... Ask anyone. Nobody knows. They are so fool. They want to remain dog. The dog is also running; they are also running. And because they can run on by car, they are thinking they are civilized. But the business is running, that's all.
Room Conversation with writer, Sandy Nixon -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia: Prabhupāda: To understand God means one must be first-class civilized man. Just like university is meant for first-class student, similarly, God consciousness means meant for the first-class human being.
Sandy Nixon: O.K. This question's a hard one for me to ask because it shows ignorance on my part. But I'm not asking it in ignorance. I want your answer on tape, O.K.? Does all desire ultimately have to go, including the desire to attain Kṛṣṇa consciousness?
Prabhupāda: Without Kṛṣṇa consciousness, you will have simply rubbish desires. And when you are Kṛṣṇa conscious, then you desire rightly.
Sandy Nixon: The aim of many spiritual paths is to find the guru within.
Prabhupāda: Within?
Sandy Nixon: The guru within. Is this different...?
Prabhupāda: Who says that, to find guru within?
Sandy Nixon: Um...
Jayatīrtha: Kirpal Singh, he's one person who says that.
Guru dāsa: Krishnamurti says that also.
Prabhupāda: So why does he come to teach? (laughter) This rascal, why does he come to teach? This is the answer. These things are spoken by rascals. He has come to teach, and he says, "Find out guru within." Then why you have come to teach? Because people are not intelligent, they cannot catch him. He talks all nonsense, and they hear, that's all.
Press Conference -- July 16, 1975, San Francisco: Prabhupāda: We are the best social worker. People are fools and rascals. We are teaching them nice idea of God consciousness. We are the best social worker. We will stop all crimes. What is your social work? Producing hippies and criminals. That is not social work. Social work means the population must be very peaceful, wise, intelligent, God conscious, first-class man. That is social work. If you produce some fourth-class, fifth-class, tenth-class of men what is social work? We are producing that. Just see. Here is first-class man. They do not have any bad habit, illicit sex, intoxication, meat eating, or gambling. They are all young men. They are not addicted to all these things. This is social work.
Press Conference -- July 16, 1975, San Francisco: Prabhupāda: Everything will be polished if Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is taken. Yasyāsti bhaktir bhagavaty akiñcanā sarvair guṇais tatra samāsate surāḥ (SB 5.18.12). If this God consciousness is spread, then everyone will be brilliantly qualified. And without God consciousness, the so-called education as we were discussing in the morning, there is no value in it. Simply they are talking. What is the subject matter we were talking?
Bahulāśva: Psychology this morning.
Prabhupāda: The result is the students are falling down from the tower in disappointment. And they are protected with glass.
Bahulāśva: In the bell tower on Berkeley campus students in the 60's would jump from that tower to kill themselves. So they put glass there to stop the students from jumping. So Prabhupāda was explaining that is their education, that after getting their education, they have to jump to commit suicide. (laughter)
Prabhupāda: This is not education. Vidyā dadhāti namratā. Educated means he is humble, gentle, sober, full of knowledge, practical application in life of knowledge, tolerant, control of the mind, control of the senses. That is education. What is this education?
Press Conference -- July 16, 1975, San Francisco: Prabhupāda: The thing is that any system you take, without God consciousness it is zero. Just like hundreds and thousands of zeros, if you put together, the value is zero. But if you put one, the value increases immediately. That one is God. So either in politics or in sociology or philosophy, religion, everywhere, if there is no God sense, it is all zero. That is going on. Therefore, despite all advancement of education, economic development, people are in chaotic condition, they are not satisfied, and everything is being tried to make it very nice. The United Nation is there, working for the last thirty years, but there is no solution because it is all zero without God. Bring God and everything will be nice. Take any question, just like economic question. There is now very acute, especially in our country. Now, the God says that "Your economic problem will be solved like this." What is that? Annād bhavanti bhūtāni: (BG 3.14) "You produce sufficient quantity of food grains." Annād bhavanti bhūtāni: "Then both the animals and man will sufficiently eat, and they will be satisfied." What is the wrong there? You must have sufficient food. Then annād bhavanti bhūtāni. And anna, producing anna, you require cloud in the sky. And that is produced by yajña. So one after another. So people must be satisfied first of all by eating sumptuously. So instead of producing food grains, you are very much busy for producing motor tires. So motor tire will not make the hungry people satisfied. So everything is there, practical, whatever is advised in the Bhagavad-gītā.
Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach: Prabhupāda: God consciousness does not depend on distribution of food. It requires cultural education. It does not mean that one who has got enough food, he is God conscious. The food distribution is not one of the conditions for becoming God conscious. That is wrong project. "If people are given sufficient food, they will become God conscious"—that is not the fact. But people advance this theory, that "We are now economically distressed. We cannot turn our attention to God consciousness." That is a wrong plea. God consciousness does not depend on any material condition.
Ṛṣabhadeva: Śrīla Prabhupāda, earlier you had said that nature provides each species its foodstuff. But in other species other than man we see that it's immediately obtainable. But man has to work for it, and he has to wait for the fruits of his labor. Why is that nature's arrangement?
Prabhupāda: Nature's arrangement... In this material world you cannot eat without working. Even if you are lion-lion is considered to be the most powerful animal—he has to capture one animal. He cannot think that "Let me sleep, and the animal will come automatically in my mouth." It is not possible. You have to work; this is the material world. So that work is simple work. If you have got land... Everyone has got land. You just work little, and it will produce your food grains. And the food grains will give food to the animal and man. The animal, cow, he will eat the grass, and you will take the grains.
Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach: Prabhupāda: Nature's arrangement... In this material world you cannot eat without working. Even if you are lion-lion is considered to be the most powerful animal—he has to capture one animal. He cannot think that "Let me sleep, and the animal will come automatically in my mouth." It is not possible. You have to work; this is the material world. So that work is simple work. If you have got land... Everyone has got land. You just work little, and it will produce your food grains. And the food grains will give food to the animal and man. The animal, cow, he will eat the grass, and you will take the grains. Why should you kill the animal? You haven't got to arrange for his food. You produce paddy. The plant, when it is dried, it is good for animals, and you take the grains. Why should you kill him? And he will deliver you. If you protect his life, he will give you nice milk. So you keep animal, cows, and grow food grain; then your food problem is solved. So if your food problem is solved and your cloth problems is solved, then where is your economic necessity? Then you save time and cultivate Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So real business will be how to cultivate, how to become advanced in God consciousness. That the animal cannot do. You are claiming more intelligence than the animals, so use your intelligence in this way. Don't spoil day and night for your economic development. So-called economic development means as soon as you become stout and strong, then sense gratification. Then you cultivate the culture of nudism. That Los Angeles beach, "Beach for nudies." Is not written there?
Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach: Prabhupāda: So without God consciousness, when there is no cloth, then economic development, and when... (break) Refer these verses from Bhagavad-gītā: amānitvam adambhitvam ahiṁsā kṣāntir ārjavam... (aside:) Little water.
Press Conference at Airport -- July 28, 1975, Dallas: Prabhupāda: You want me to speak? I can speak. Shall I speak? Yesterday in San Diego one press representative met me. So I told that America is advanced in material civilization, all comforts of bodily concept of life. But why the American young men are becoming hippies and crazy. Yesterday, I saw, some of the girls came almost naked. So why they are dissatisfied in spite of so much material advancement? They have got enough food, enough shelter, enough clothing, enough cars and everything. There is no scarcity. Why they are disappointed? Can you answer, why they are disappointed? It means they requires spiritual fulfillment of desire. That is the nature. When in the primitive stage of life, a man is concerned about the bodily comforts. And when one is advanced or satisfied—not satisfied; advanced—in our bodily concept of life, the next question is about spiritual life. So America is in that point, specially. So unless you fulfill their spiritual needs, they will remain in such disturbing condition. So I compared it just like there are many zeros: one zero, two zero, three zero, or hundreds and millions of zero. All these zeros together—the value is zero. But if there is one, then one and zero, it makes 10. The ten times of one value increases. Another zero, it is hundred. Another zero, it is thousand. Similarly, this material advancement of America, if it is added with God consciousness, then the value will increase. Otherwise, it will remain zero. You may advance materially as far as possible. but if you don't take God consciousness or Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then the value of all this material advancement is equal to zero. Nobody will be satisfied.
Walk Around Farm -- August 1, 1975, New Orleans: Prabhupāda: Vegetables you are growing?
Nityānanda: Yes. We have a garden across the street. All these big trees are pecan trees. We have twenty. All this land across the road here that is cleared is ours, all the way up to the trees.
Prabhupāda: (reading sign?) "Cow protection and God consciousness. Visitors welcome." That's nice. So, which way we shall go now? Cow protection, they are surprised: "What is this nonsense, cow protection?" Huh? Do they say? "Cow is for eating, and you are protecting?" There are falls?(?)
Nityānanda: Falls?(?) No. This is our small garden.
Prabhupāda: Fruits and flowers. No, only fruits. What you are doing, flowers?
Nityānanda: This is okra.
Prabhupāda: Oh, okra.
Morning Walk -- August 12, 1975, Paris: Mādhavānanda: Everyone thinks in terms of their own relative position.
Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) Even an insignificant bird, because he knows swimming, he knows swimming, so he can challenge, and because you do not know swimming, you cannot say like that. Even insignificant bird, just see how nicely he is swimming. He knows the art. (break) ...one, cent percent of the modern people, they do not believe in God, and they do not know what is religion. That is the position. They think, "Religion is sentiment. Anyone can manufacture his own sentiment. There is no God." This is the position. So we are in fault. "It is folly to be wise where ignorance is bliss." The whole world is under this conception. Therefore we are at fault. We are preaching God consciousness.
Morning Walk -- September 30, 1975, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Even if we say "Mohammed," why not? Anyone who has preached Kṛṣṇa consciousness, maybe little differently according to time, circumstances, but anyone who has tried to preach the God consciousness, he is guru. Yei kṛṣṇa tattva vettā, sei guru haya (CC Madhya 8.128). That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's version. Anyone who preaches about the Supreme Lord, he is guru. Maybe in a different way, according to time, circumstances. The Mohammed also said Allah akbar.
Dr. Patel: Only the difference is that Mohammed is trying to worship nirañjana, nirākāra, and we...
Prabhupāda: No, no, not nirākāra. That is not...
Dr. Patel: Even Christianity considers His ākāra—"God has form."
Prabhupāda: No, Mohammed also has got... Caitanya Mahāprabhu argued in Koran. He proved there is kṛṣṇa-bhakti. He proved with the Pathans.
Morning Walk -- September 30, 1975, Bombay: Prabhupāda: I never criticized. I simply said that positive side, God consciousness.
Dr. Patel: Christ himself was drunk with God consciousness totally.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Dr. Patel: Christ himself was drunk with God consciousness in toto, absolute.... There cannot be a higher bhakta than that. It is said that Jesus Christ learned all these things in India. It might be a fact?
Passerby: (Hindi)
Dr. Patel: And he daily bhakta. (?) He came for pūjā, for guru. (break)
Prabhupāda: ...devatā bhaktāḥ, te 'pi mām eva kaunteya yajanty avidhi-purvakam. They give examples, as the gopīs worshiped Kātyāyanī. But that is not avidhi. They went to Kātyāyanī for getting the favor of Kṛṣṇa. They prayed to mother Kātyāyanī, "Please be favorable to us so that Kṛṣṇa may be pleased upon us." Others go to beg from Kātyāyanī some material benefits, but the gopīs, they did not ask for any material benefit. And therefore that is vidhi.
Room Conversation -- October 4, 1975, Mauritius: Prabhupāda: Why should you take the chance? You are perplexed with overpopulation. And why you want to stay? One side, you are perplexed with overpopulation. Let him die.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But they can use the argument that you're saying that human life is simply for Kṛṣṇa consciousness or God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: No, from his argument, why should you try to keep it? Let him die.
Cyavana: They are afraid of death. No one wants to die.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They are afraid someone will take them off the machine, too.
Cyavana: We want to live as long as we can.
Prabhupāda: Then you have to accept that your killing child, abortion, that is sinful.
Room Conversation with Bill Faill (reporter) -- October 8, 1975, Durban: Prabhupāda: Where is Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa? Kṛṣṇa means God. The word Kṛṣṇa means all-attractive. So unless one is all-attractive, he cannot be God. So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness means God consciousness. Our position, we all living entities, we are all small particles, equal in quality with God—small, just like gold and a small particle of gold.
Faill: The spark.
Prabhupāda: Spark. Yes. Fire, big fire and spark fire—both of them fire, but one is big and one is very small. So our relationship with God is eternal. At the present moment, on account of contact with this material energy, we have forgotten our relationship with God. Therefore our life is problematic. We are facing so many problems. So again, if we revive our original consciousness, then we shall become happy. So this is the sum and substance of Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Room Conversation with Bill Faill (reporter) -- October 8, 1975, Durban: Prabhupāda: This saffron robe is not very essential, or cut the hair, but it creates some good situation, mental. You see? Just like a military man, when he is dressed properly he gets some energy to feel like a military man. But it does not mean that unless you are dressed, you cannot fight. It does not mean. So God consciousness can be revived in any condition, without any check. But these conditions are helpful, helpful. Therefore it is prescribed that "You live like this," "You dress like this," "You eat like this," "You do like this." These are convenient. These are convenient. So they are not essential. At the same time, if we take to these processes, then it will be helpful.
Faill: Yes. One can be a student of Kṛṣṇa consciousness while going about a normal daily life.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Room Conversation with Bill Faill (reporter) -- October 8, 1975, Durban: Prabhupāda: Then? Why you are asking me? You do not know. So everyone does not know what is meditation, and they talk very much, "meditation." This is going on. These bluffers, they say "meditation," but what is the subject matter of meditation they do not know. Simply bogus propaganda. You see?
Faill: Not even beginning to get people thinking right?
Prabhupāda: No. Meditation means this dhyānāvasthita-tad-gatena manasā, mind saturated with God consciousness and thinking of God. But if you do not know God, then where is the meditation?
Faill: So it's a long...
Prabhupāda: No, it is very nice, but at the present moment in the name of meditation, simply cheating and bluffing going on. They do not know what is the subject matter of meditation. Besides that, in this age, mind is so agitated that you cannot concentrate. I have seen the so-called meditation. They are regularly sleeping and snoring. They do not know. Yes. This is going on. So unfortunately, in the name of God consciousness or this self-realization, so many not standardized methods are being presented by the so-called bluffers without any reference to the authoritative books and knowledge, Vedic knowledge. It is another type of exploitation.
Room Conversation with Bill Faill (reporter) -- October 8, 1975, Durban: Faill: Yes. If you begin dressing things up, they change. And the size of the movement now? Is it a growing movement, Kṛṣṇa consciousness?
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, it is very much growing. You will be surprised that we are selling these books... We have got about fifty books like this, and every library, college, professor, universities, they are very much appreciative of this, because there was no such literature existent. This is the new contribution to the world.
Faill: Now, this American, Alpert, he came to a state of God consciousness, but he was very, very heavy on drugs. This can't be right, taking a drug.
Prabhupāda: Alfred? Just speak.
Harikeśa: He was one of the associates of Timothy Leary.
Prabhupāda: Alfred Ford?
Harikeśa: No, no, no.
Prabhupāda: Then?
Harikeśa: What is his first name?
Faill: Alpert was his second name, and then he took on, you know, an Indian name.
Prabhupāda: Oh, then he is speaking of Alfred Ford.
Car ride from Durban to Johannesburg -- October 13, 1975, Durban: Prabhupāda: He has very much appreciated this effort. Everyone will do that. I am the single man, speaking of God. Nobody speaks. All big, big leaders, politicians, philoso..., who is speaking of God? We are stressing only, God consciousness. As soon as you speak of God, "Oh, it is old-fashioned to bring in God. These are primitive. Now we speak of science. There is no God. That is very nice." As soon as you speak of God, "Oh, you are useless. You have no advanced knowledge."
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They are challenging, then, the authority.
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They are challenging the authority.
Prabhupāda: There is no authority. And Vivekananda said, "You manufacture your own God, whomever you like. Even you can worship stool as God." They say like that.
Car ride from Durban to Johannesburg -- October 13, 1975, Durban: Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But now the Indian government—if this is true—they are giving visas to the devotees, and that means they are favorable towards the movement more and more.
Prabhupāda: Yes. It may be due to my interview with Indira Gandhi. I appealed to her that "No Indians are joining, and these Europeans, Americans, they are helping me. And if they are asked to go away, then how shall I maintain the establishment? Indians are not coming." So they might have studied that "They are not politician, and this movement... Everyone will appreciate God consciousness. They are doing something," this consideration. Otherwise it is surprising. They have given three years.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes. It is very surprising.
Prabhupāda: It is very, very surprising. (break)
Harikeśa: There may be some more information to come about that.
Prabhupāda: What is that other?
Harikeśa: I don't know, but...
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Harikeśa: Navayogendra is not the official source.
Morning Walk -- October 16, 1975, Johannesburg: Prabhupāda: So similarly, they are keeping men as dogs, and they want peace. How it is possible? They are educating general mass of people like cats and dogs, and they want peace. How it is possible? Make them first of all sober men. Then there is question of peace. (break) ...God consciousness, there is no question of peace. (break) If we know that the Supreme Lord, God, is our father, and He has..., everything belongs to Him, His property; therefore, instead of fighting, let us enjoy father's property peacefully. Then there will be peace. We are peacefully walking in this park because we know that it is commonwealth; it is government's property. I can walk, and the dog can also walk. Then there will be peace. And if I think, "No, it is my property," and you think your property, then there will be fight between you and me. So where is peace? Why you claim South Africa as your property? You are foreigner. You want peace. You are expert in keeping them subdued, the Africans. Otherwise, lawfully, it is African property. Why you have taken? Either you make it God's property, otherwise make it African property. You have no right to come here. If you say God's property, then everyone has got equal right. So they do not know what is the meaning of peace.
Morning Walk -- October 16, 1975, Johannesburg: Prabhupāda: Possess, you can possess. Tena tyaktena bhuñjithā (ISO 1). The real proposal is that everything belongs to God. Then God's representative, king, he gives you land. But you require for ten men's foodstuff. You calculate the ten men's foodstuff, for producing, you require so much land, so the king gives you land. You work and grow your food. And because it is God's property, you give some tax. Whatever you produce, twenty-five percent give to God or king, and balance, you enjoy. If there is no production—no tax. This is peaceful life. You work. You take land, God's land. You cannot... Why you have occupied so much land? Others, they are not allowed to enter; where there is overpopulation? How you can expect peace? Just like in China and India and other places they're overpopulation. Why don't you allow them, that "In Africa there is no sufficient population. Please come and toil and grow your food and live peacefully"? Where is that formula? Rascals, they are wanting peace. All rascal, rogues. And why they have become rascal, rogues? For want of God consciousness. They do not know that it is God's property, falsely thinking, "My property." And today I am thinking, "My property," and next day I become a dog on the same property. Hm? This dog loitering, who can say he was not formerly a Mr. Smuts? Who can say? Maybe he was Smuts; now he is dog. How can you take him? This is nature's process.
Morning Walk -- November 3, 1975, Bombay: Indian (8): After all, he is God's creation.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is sama-darśinaḥ. Sama-darśinaḥ means that every living being is part and parcel of God. So he is suffering for want of God consciousness, so let us teach something as far as possible. This is our mission. (break) ...dhīras tatra na muhyati. Therefore the human being's first business is how to become dhīra.
Dr. Patel: Dhīra does not exactly mean "sober," but something more than sober.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is only one part of it.
Dr. Patel: So many Sanskrit words cannot have translation into English.
Prabhupāda: Dhīra means one who is not disturbed by this bodily concept of life. He is dhīra because he knows that "I am not this body," even there is some trouble in respect of body. So Kṛṣṇa advised that titikṣasva bhārata.
Morning Walk -- November 21, 1975, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Islam is also...
Dr. Patel: History, it has spread. Even Bali Islands today are practicing Hinduism.
Brahmānanda: Aryan means change in consciousness to God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Brahmānanda: This means all over the world there can be an Aryan culture.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is right.
Dr. Patel: Today the world is dominated by Aryans, all over practically. Except in Central Africa.
Prabhupāda: Today the whole world is dominated by demons.
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Morning Walk -- January 4, 1976, Nellore: Prabhupāda: (break) ...started from here?
Indian man: It was started. Madras center and there in America.
Prabhupāda: (break) ...come from the other side. (break) ...registering this association, some friend suggested, "Why don't you make it 'God consciousness'?" And "No, 'Kṛṣṇa conscious.' If I bring God consciousness, they will bring so many gods."
Indian man: And another question reply was also very convin..., that all other are gods, but He is Godhead. That is very clinching expla.... Some of these things are really direct replies.
Prabhupāda: And actually that is fact.
Indian man: This was.... Even Acyutānanda said the other day. Somebody asked us that question, "Why not 'God conscious'? Why do you want 'Kṛṣṇa'?" He also said the same thing. (break) "What is the difference between thieving the butter and other things by Lord Kṛṣṇa and thieving by us?" I said "The thieving is thieving." I said, "How can there be theft of..." (break)
Prabhupāda: And if you steal, you will be beaten with shoes.
Morning Walk -- January 6, 1976, Nellore: Acyutānanda: Even socially, though, without religious, scientific, practical God consciousness, how can there be a civilization? How can anyone know that there's a difference between right and wrong or morality unless there is God consciousness, to know that someone is watching everything I do? If you avoid that.... Just like we say, they want Rāma-rājya without Rāma. But they want the rājya.
Prabhupāda: Now, the laws and legislative assembly there are, and there is punishment, there is court—everything there is. That we were discussing last night, that where is the honest men? Why? In spite of laws, legislative assembly, court and everything, the wholesale rogues and dishonest. Then what is the use of this? What is your answer? Why you are checked on the airport just like a culprit, criminal? They cannot trust even a gentleman, although he is educated, may be holding very good office, but still, he is not to be trusted. So this is the result of your so-called function, that there is no honest man throughout the whole world. Then, what is the use of such education? And what is the use of their living? Let them die. No hospital for them.
Morning Walk -- February 5, 1976, Mayapura: Prabhupāda: Hm? What is that?
Hari-śauri: A person already has the position where he doesn't have to experience birth, death, old age, like that. So if they argue like that, "Why doesn't God give us that position where we can enjoy without God consciousness...?"
Prabhupāda: God has given, giving you the position that "You obey Me, and you get the position," but because you are rascal—you are not obeying—you are suffering.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Just like a hog takes stool instead of sweetmeat. The hoggish mentality.
Prabhupāda: That is God's mercy that he wants to eat stool, and God has given you, "All right, you eat stool. Take this body."
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Not that God is not offering him sweetmeats, but the rascal won't eat them.
Prabhupāda: Yes. He has got such a body that he does not relish sweetmeat.
Morning Walk -- March 8, 1976, Mayapur: Prabhupāda: So it was not withdrawn. Then he resigned. Then he resigned. He became practically poverty-stricken, because he was earning fifty thousand rupees per month, and he had no practice, and he was not keeping any money in the bank. When he resigned, then some of his friend, Muhammad Ali... He was also one of the prominent members. He asked, "Mr. Das, what is your bank balance?" So he replied, "I do not know what is my bank balance, but I know I am debtor to the bank by two lakhs." The bank was giving him credit, so this was his position. So my point is that when the... He fought his best that "This resolution should be withdrawn, boycott of British court," but it was not done. But although he was very strong protester, still he had to do it. This is modern democracy. If the majority votes is in favor of something, even if I do not like it, I'll have to accept it. That is, of course, the so-called democracy. That..., we do not accept that. Our obedience is to the spiritual master. So in this way we should... If there is any misunderstanding, this should be adjusted and we should work wholeheartedly, because our responsibility is very great. We are trying to contribute something to the whole world. It is not a fashion. It is not a fashion. The whole world is suffering for want of God consciousness, so we are trying to give it to the world, God consciousness, in a systematic way, so that they may be highly benefited. So this is the purpose, but if there is some misunderstanding...
Morning Walk -- March 14, 1976, Mayapur: Prabhupāda: Men are such a great fool, they have been described as mūḍhas. That is perfect word. Na māṁ duṣkṛtiṇo mūḍhāḥ prapadyante (BG 7.15). Duskṛtino mūḍhāḥ, the most sinful rascal, he does not surrender. That is a fact.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: So for one who gives up sinful activities, does his sense of God consciousness become awakened?
Prabhupāda: Yes, there is chance. Sinful activities means covering intelligence. Just like animals. A tiger is always engaged in sinful activity, but he does not know it is sinful. There are so many animals. They're simply engaged in sinful activities. Therefore they are excused that "This tiger.... His business is to act sinfully." Therefore God has given him place in a jungle: "You live there, and your sinful activities will not be taken into account."
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yesterday this man was finding difficulty discriminating between good and bad.
Prabhupāda: Who?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The gentleman who came yesterday.
Prabhupāda: He is a rascal. He is another rascal. Everyone is like him. Therefore we call everyone rascal.
Morning Walk -- March 14, 1976, Mayapur: Prabhupāda: He said, this Mahesh Yogi. "My business is cheating because the rascals wanted to be cheated. So why shall I not cheat and get some money?"
Gurukṛpā: But he doesn't give the money to you, though. He knows you are real.
Prabhupāda: No.... Not.... That is another thing, but he knows that "God consciousness you can get there."
Mahāṁśa: Yesterday you said that one cheater takes from the other cheater; so he is a cheater, he is taking from other cheaters.
Gurukṛpā: You mentioned in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam that one cheater takes the money, another cheater takes it...
Prabhupāda: No, no, his business is cheating. His business is cheating. He said, "These rascals want to be cheated, so why not cheat?"
Madhudviṣa: So we shouldn't be so angry at him. Some people are serving coffee because people want coffee. Some people are selling bīḍīs because people want bīḍīs. So if some people want to be cheated, so he is simply performing a function of society.
Prabhupāda: That is the world. Therefore the whole world is the society of cheater and cheated. That is the version of my Guru Mahārāja. The whole so-called human society means a bunch of cheaters and cheated. That's all.
Morning Walk -- March 25, 1976, Delhi: Prabhupāda: Now, now, you see, try, understand. You are very good Bible quoter, but try to understand each and everything. Simply you go on quoting, but understand what is that quotation. It is by the will of God. You have committed sinful life by contraceptive method. Now you enter in the womb of another mother and be killed. That is Bible.
Cyavana: So what is described there was not actually God consciousness or...
Prabhupāda: No, it is God consciousness if you understand it, that "I am now being punished by the will of God. I have done sinful activities." That is God conscious.
Guru dāsa: God gives what everyone wants.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Guru dāsa: If they desire that, they get that.
Prabhupāda: You wanted this punishment; therefore you get it.
Conversation with News Reporters -- March 25, 1976, Delhi: Prabhupāda: We say that not only in India, everyone, you'll starve, because you are rebellious to God consciousness. You must starve. That is the punishment. Just like anyone who is a criminal, he must be punished. That is the law of nature.
Reporter (3): So by that, I suppose one would presume that people in India have been most rebellious to God.
Prabhupāda: Why India? Everywhere. Why you speak India?
Reporter (3): Because...
Prabhupāda: When you speak of God, don't take India, or America or Europe. Everywhere.
Reporter (3): No. Because the number of starving men here is much larger.
Prabhupāda: You are starving on account of your economic condition being bad or.... I cannot say anything. But they are also starving. You are poor by force, and they sometimes accept poverty voluntarily, just like the hippies. They have enough money. They are coming from very rich father and grandfather, but they lie down on the street, and the police comes and kick them, "Hey, get up! Get up!" Why? Why they have accepted this? So this kind of varieties we find everywhere-rich man, middle class man, and poverty-stricken man. Don't think that it is in India. I am traveling all over the world.
Conversation with News Reporters -- March 25, 1976, Delhi: Reporter (1): Swamiji, what do you suggest to your disciples to arouse what you call Hare Kṛṣṇa consciousness or God consciousness?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Hare Kṛṣṇa consciousness is the purificatory process. If you chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.... God is so kind. In this age.... It is meant for every age. Especially this age when we are so much fallen and so much suffering, and neither we are able to act very piously, therefore this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, if you chant, you gradually become purified. Then you come to your own consciousness.
Reporter (1): So how would you define sin? What is impurities or to sin?
Prabhupāda: You cannot understand impurities?
Reporter (1): I mean, give any clear-cut definition.
Prabhupāda: Just like when you are diseased and the doctor gives you some vaccine and injection to cure you, to make you purified. Is it not?
Morning Walk -- April 15, 1976, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Any prayer. If we become God conscious...
Dr. Patel: "Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom..."
Prabhupāda: Then it is all right. And without God consciousness there is no qualification. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇāḥ. There cannot be any good qualities. (break)
Dr. Patel: Then His kingdom can come on earth, not otherwise.
Prabhupāda: No, no. If one man becomes Kṛṣṇa conscious, he can deliver many millions. Not expected... You cannot expect all to become, but if one man is there, Kṛṣṇa conscious, he can deliver. (break) Kaścid yatati siddhaye, yatatām api siddhānāṁ kaścid... (BG 7.3). So it is not so easy thing, but if there is one Kṛṣṇa conscious person, he can deliver many millions. (break) ...ti śreṣṭhas ...lokas tad anuvartate. There must be one śreṣṭha, ideal man, and then everyone will follow. And there is no śreṣṭha. That is the difficulty.
Morning Walk -- April 15, 1976, Bombay: Dr. Patel: Indriyāṇi pramāthīni haranti prasabhaṁ manaḥ.
Prabhupāda: Yes, if your indriyas are engaged in Kṛṣṇa's activities, they are no more pramāthīni; they are controlled. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktaṁ tat-paratvena nirmalam, hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-sevanam (CC Madhya 19.170). When your indriyas are purified, then it will be only engaged in hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-sevanam. That is bhakti.
Dr. Patel: Rasa-varjaṁ raso 'py asya paraṁ dṛṣṭvā nivartate (BG 2.59).
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dr. Patel: Unless you have complete, I mean, God consciousness, paraṁ dṛṣṭvā, till then, the rasa does not go, the very sting of your indriyas. So it becomes sort of a vicious circle, sir, and it becomes very difficult to vacate from that.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Hṛṣīkeṇa hṛṣīkeśa-sevanaṁ bhaktir ucyate (CC Madhya 19.170).
Dr. Patel: By bhakti you can break.
Prabhupāda: Bhakti means when you engage all your senses in the service of Hṛṣīkeśa. That is bhakti. But that we cannot. We say, "Oh, I have got this duty, I have got that duty," not cent percent engaged.
Morning Walk -- April 15, 1976, Bombay: Prabhupāda: But that is all nonsense. That is...
Dr. Patel: (break) ...find fulfillment there only, God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: Bhaktiḥ pareśānubhavo viraktir anyatra syāt (SB 11.2.42). This is the sign of bhakti, that he has no more taste in anything material. That is bhakti. (Hindi)
Dr. Patel: And artha.
Prabhupāda: Dharma cannot be. Therefore Bhāgavata said, dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra (SB 1.1.2). Dharmārtha-kāma-mokṣa (SB 4.8.41, Cc. Ādi 1.90)—these are all cheating. These are all cheating. Yes. Dharma means you become... Generally people go to temple to get some material gains: "O God, give us our daily bread." That is the idea. Dharma is to get some material profit. And why material profit? For sense gratification. Dharma, artha, kāma. And when he's baffled in sense gratification, he wants to become one with God, mokṣa. These are all cheating. Therefore Bhāgavata says, dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra (SB 1.1.2). And Śrīdhara Swami says, atra mokṣa-vāñchām api nirastam. So long one is stuck up even up to mokṣa-vāñchā, he'll be.... He is in trouble. Therefore Kṛṣṇa, sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66). Beginning from dharma, artha, kāma, mokṣa (SB 4.8.41, Cc. Ādi 1.90), you give up everything. Then you'll become purified. Even if you have got mokṣa-vāñchā, then you are in the material world.
Morning Walk -- May 29, 1976, Honolulu: Prabhupāda: Why suffering? Where is suffering? What you are suffering? We are God conscious. We are suffering?
Devotee (2): No. No. Ah...
Hari-śauri: He means for approaching God consciousness.
Devotee (2): It is a prerequisite.
Prabhupāda: I do not under...
Devotee (2): So we see that, in other words, when someone goes to hell...
Prabhupāda: But he does not take it as suffering. Take it as enjoyment.
Hari-śauri: Once you understand it's, ah...
Prabhupāda: Unfortunate that they're taking suffering as enjoyment. This is called māyā. māyā vase yaccho vese kacho haba... Surfer, he is struggling against the waves, and they're thinking it is enjoyment. Chance of being drowned, being attacked by some sea animals. It is always risky and suffering. And still they're thinking enjoyment. But they're coming from far distant place to enjoy this.
Room Conversation with Reporter -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: Simply faith, blind faith we do not endure. And therefore they are becoming godless. And gradually, if we do not understand factually what is God, then the whole human civilization will be godless. To become godless means again animal. That is the difference between animal and man. In the animal society there is no question of religion, faith, God. These things are not there. The human civilization, if it becomes like that, without any faith in God, without any understanding of God, then where is the difference between cats and dogs and human beings? They must know God scientifically. That is the actual aim of human life. Suppose the dog is sleeping on the street without any care whether a car is coming and smash it. He's also sleeping sound sleep. And we are sleeping in a very nice apartment. So after all, sleeping. And he is also enjoying sleeping, I am also enjoying sleeping. So do you think to change the, I mean to say, circumstances of the sleeping? I am sleeping in a very nice apartment, he's sleeping on the floor. Does it mean this is advancement of civilization? Sleeping is sleeping. Eating is eating. Sex life—the male dog is enjoying with female dog. The sex pleasure is to him, and we are enjoying with a beautiful lover. The sex pleasure is the same. Therefore, you take some eatable, either on gold fork or an iron fork, the taste is the same. Simply like putting the foodstuff in the golden fork, does it mean the taste has changed? So, the test of eating, sleeping, mating and defending is the same for the human being as well as the animals. What difference, what is the difference between the animals and humans? The animal cannot know God. That is not possible. The human being can know. That is the opportunity of this human life. If we are missing that opportunity, then we are leading an animal civilization. This is not civilization. Animal life is not civilization. Civilized means not animal life. Something more than that. That is God consciousness.
Room Conversation with Reporter -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles: Reporter: Do you have programs developed to educate mankind towards this God consciousness?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Concrete education. Not fictitious. Concrete.
Reporter: How will you.... How would you get man to become aware of the situation so he could desire, even desire unconsciously?
Prabhupāda: There is a very simply fact. It you simply understand that one verse in the Bhagavad-gītā, there it is stated that
- sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya
- mūrtayaḥ sambhavanti yāḥ
- tāsāṁ brahma mahad yonir
- ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā
- (BG 14.4)
Very simply thing. Just like the art of the material nature. Everything is coming out of the material nature, beginning from the grass to the highest intellectual human being or more than that. Wherefrom they are coming? From this material nature: ether, earth, water, fire.
Room Conversation with Reporter -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: How they can? Do you mean to say dogs simply barking, they will come to a conclusion? (chuckles) It is not possible. There is no aim, what is the actual aim of life. So this is very important movement. At least the intelligent class of men, they must understand it thoroughly. Just like there is body. There are different parts, different sections of the body, but the most important section is the brain. Similarly, the important section of society means one who is fully in God consciousness. I.... You can cut my hands, I shall live. You can cut my legs, I shall live. But if you cut my head, (indistinct). So, at the present moment, there are big, big scientists, big, big technologists. That's all right; that is hands and legs. But there is no brain. Therefore in one sense, you can take it as dead society. So in my opinion, I like your country, America. Sometimes I call, "This is my fatherland," because these American boys, they are helping me pushing on this movement. I am very much obliged to these boys. Now, let us take it little more seriously statewise. And if America takes it seriously, other nations will follow. And there is the United Nations Organization in America. And make a nice organization to understand God. United Nations God Consciousness. People will benefit.
Room Conversation with Reporter -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles: Reporter: Do you see America getting more God consciousness?
Prabhupāda: At least I see majority of my disciples are Americans. Why not expanding?
Rāmeśvara: Prabhupāda, before Richard asked me a question: what is the difference between our movement and say another religion like the Sikhs or some other religion?
Prabhupāda: Don't misunderstand. It is.... Religion, it means a kind of faith. Just like you are Christian, I am Hindu. So you have faith in Christian religion, I have faith in Hin.... That is another thing. But this is.... We understand religion in a different way according to English dictionary. But real religion means the law given by God. This is the shortcut definition of religion. And if you do not know what is God, and if you do not know what is His law, then what is the meaning of religion? There is no meaning of religion. If blindly, if I have some faith in some dogmas and ritualistic ceremonies, that is not religion. Religion means the science by which you can understand God and the law of God. That is religion.
Room Conversation with Reporter -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles: Reporter: Right.
Prabhupāda: Yes. God, service to God means, just like you put foodstuff in the stomach. Then the service, supplying energy, is distributed automatically. The eyes get service, the ears get service, the hands get service, legs get service, everything. But if you put foodstuff in the eyes, instead of giving service, you make it blind. If you put foodstuff in the ear, instead of hearing, it is blocked. Then that is ignorance. You do not know where to give service. The knowledge, God consciousness, means to know where to give service, so that the service will be automatically distributed. You pour water on the root of the tree and the energy will be distributed to the trunk, to the branches, to the twigs, to the leaves, to the flowers, everyone. We are missing their point.
Garden Conversation -- June 9, 1976, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: Practically come to the... Suppose if you learn how to walk, or how to fly in the air. Nowadays they are flying, the big, big airplane flying. They have not learned this mystic power. By machine they are doing that. Suppose if you fly by mystic power from here, Los Angeles, to Bombay or Nairobi, and another man flys over by the plane. Then where is the difference? It is a question of pounds or dollars. So what benefit do we get? Why do you give so much importance, who is flying or walking on the water? Better utilize the time to realize God. Śrama eva hi kevalam (SB 1.2.8). This is called in the śāstra, that anything you do, if it does not awaken your God consciousness, then it is śrama eva hi kevalam. It is simply working for nothing, waste of time. Śrama eva hi kevalam. (aside:) Hmm, give him some prasāda. And others, what about? No, you can take this... Prasāda. Others, them also. (Hindi)
- dharmaḥ svanusthitaḥ puṁsāṁ
- viṣvaksena-kathāsu yaḥ
- notpādayed yadi ratiṁ
- śrama eva hi kevalam
- (SB 1.2.8)
If we do not awaken our God consciousness, anything you do, that is all waste of time. That is wanted in the human form of life, to revive our God consciousness. That is the most important business. So, any other questions?
Morning Walk -- June 9, 1976, Los Angeles: Prabhupāda: That is sinful. As soon as you irresponsible, you are sinful. (break) ...soon as you forget the simple truth that you are servant of God, you are irresponsible. Now your suffering begins. (break) ...kṛṣṇa-bahirmukha hañā bhoga vāñchā kare, nikaṭa-stha māyā tāre jāpaṭiyā dhare (Prema-vivarta). Just like as citizen of your state, you have to abide by the laws of the state. As soon as you disobey, you are irresponsible. That's all. You suffer. Good citizen means who abides by the laws of the state. And as soon as you break it, immediately you are irresponsible and you must be punished.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Practically, though, without God consciousness, isn't it that people see that whether they are moral or not moral, they still suffer?
Prabhupāda: Yes. This material world is meant for suffering. Duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam (BG 8.15). That is the description in the Bhagavad-gītā. This is a place for suffering. And that is also temporary. You cannot make adjustment: "Never mind, it is suffering; I shall remain here." No, that also will not be allowed. Duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam (BG 8.15).
Garden Conversation -- June 14, 1976, Detroit: Prabhupāda: Polluted.
Jayādvaita: But then they don't accept that Kṛṣṇa consciousness is the only process for understanding God. They want to maintain Christian religion, or.... Not Christian religion, but sense gratification and, at the same time, God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: Well we are not denying sense gratification. We want to regulate. That's all.
Mādhavānanda: Actually, we have the best sense gratification.
Prabhupāda: Hmm? Yes.
Mādhavānanda: On the radio program, one lady, she was asking questions. She was very envious. "And you are living in such a palace."
Prabhupāda: Why shall I not? Government servants, they live in the best place. We are Kṛṣṇa's servants, the supreme government. We must have the best car, best house, the best food, (laughter) everything. You are unfortunate, you are wretched, you cannot possess this. We are government's servants. Why the governor is living in the best house of the city?
Room Conversation with George Gullen, President of Wayne State University -- June 15, 1976, Detroit: George Gullen: We are much in ignorance about those matters, I understand that, and...
Prabhupāda: Yes. Complete ignorance, like animals. So the leaders of the society, if they are serious about advancement of human civilization, they must take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness; otherwise, they'll be baffled.
George Gullen: Well, we do not teach about these things...
Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the defect.
George Gullen: .... in public schools because we do not know.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Now whether still we shall remain in ignorance or we shall learn this science and teach, that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. It is not a sectarian religious movement. No, it is not that. This is science, scientific. So leading personalities like you, teachers, professors and other leading men, they should try to understand what is this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is and join. It is for the human society, it is not for a certain section.
Conversation with Clergymen -- June 15, 1976, Detroit: Prabhupāda: (break) ...habituated to sit cross-leg. They have learned also. Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa. So people in general, they are now out of God consciousness. Is it not?
Scheverman: Yes, I would agree that in our society, that the consciousness of God is definitely on the wane. There's no question about that. We find it very, very difficult, I think, even to speak about the Lord God in the presence of people, because the ears are closed or stopped. There's not a willingness to listen.
Prabhupāda: Why the people have come to this condition, that they are not prepared even to hear about God?
Scheverman: I think, I think that, perhaps...
Prabhupāda: One priest in Boston, he issued one booklet that "These boys, they're our boys, mostly they are coming from Christian or Jewish families. But before this movement, they were not coming even to the church, never inquired about God. Now they are mad after God." He issued one pamphlet like that. These boys.
Conversation with Clergymen -- June 15, 1976, Detroit: Prabhupāda: Here in your America.
Scheverman: America. I would like perhaps to hear some of your thoughts on the area of religious experience, God consciousness, how do you achieve that?
Prabhupāda: I wrote one letter to your secretary.
Mādhavānanda: The President?
Prabhupāda: Yes. (to devotee) What is the purport? You just explain.
Conversation with Clergymen -- June 15, 1976, Detroit: Prabhupāda: No, there must be proper training.
Kern: God consciousness..., would you explain something of the religious experience of God consciousness?
Prabhupāda: No, God consciousness is the highest level. It is not possible for everyone. But in whatever platform he is, if there is cooperation with God consciousness movement, then he gets the result. Just like in this body.... Same example: leg's duty is different and brain duty is different, hand's duty is different, belly's duty different, but when there is cooperation, all the parts of the body derive the same benefit.
Scheverman: Yes, I see. So if one has the experience of God in a cooperative, well, good and sound social body, then all will profit from that experience.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Room Conversation -- June 24, 1976, New Vrindaban: Prabhupāda: Naturally, if he's animal. They can understand that he's giving you food, he's my friend. The love, friendship, everything is there, even in animals.
Devotee: Except God consciousness.
Prabhupāda: That is possible in human life. But animal also can become God conscious by association.
Kīrtanānanda: Sometimes I've heard you say, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that love only exists between similar categories.
Prabhupāda: Similar categories, the love is very conducive. Otherwise, love is possible with any living entity. The central object of love is Kṛṣṇa. That is Vṛndāvana. The animals love Kṛṣṇa, the human beings love Kṛṣṇa, the trees love Kṛṣṇa, the water love Kṛṣṇa, everyone loves Kṛṣṇa-central point. That is the perfection of love. The Deity is kept in the same house?
Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban: Prabhupāda: Therefore they support this accident theory. Nowadays they have got the accident theory. Because ordinarily there is no good. There is no possibility. But by accident if some good comes, that's all. Otherwise, jagato 'hitāḥ, it is only fault. They are... But accidentally means good comes. Accidentally, Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement came. (laughs) Although it was going on in India. Nobody called Kṛṣṇa consciousness, the scientists, the philosophers, the politicians. But accidentally came. Accidentally, we got result. You cannot explain God, therefore you take it as accident.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: This is very interesting, very interesting. In a Vedic community everything is very ordered, and goodness prevails, therefore God consciousness seems very natural.
Prabhupāda: Go on.
Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban: Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: This very much describes modern civilization also. They are such aśuci-vratāḥ, they are given much respect in modern-day society. And the devotees, sometimes we go preaching and put into jail.
Prabhupāda: It is very fortunate they are not crucifying you. Putting into jail, but they crucified Lord Jesus Christ, they were so intelligent. Because he was preaching God consciousness, he was crucified. What was his fault? He was talking of God, therefore he was crucified.
Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: Hm. Find that verse. You can quote that "This Kali-yuga it is waning; therefore they are becoming animals." Man without religion means animals. That's all. This is the definition. In the human society, either you become Christian or you become Mohammedan or you become a Hindu or you become Buddhist. It doesn't matter. There must be some system of religion. That is human society. And human society without religion—animal society. This is plain fact. So why people are unhappy now? Because there is no religion. They are neglecting religion. That one gentleman, he has written me that Tolstoy said that "Unless one dynamite is put underneath a church, there cannot be any peace." That means they want... The Russians, the Communists, they are very strict against God consciousness. Because they think so, that this religion has spoiled the whole social atmosphere. It might have been misused, religious system.
Conversation with Prof. Saligram and Dr. Sukla -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.: Prabhupāda: Therefore we have concentrated on Gītā. This movement—when I registered this association, so when I wrote "Kṛṣṇa consciousness," some friend said, "Why don't you write 'God consciousness'?" But no, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We are particularly preaching Kṛṣṇa's teaching. Kṛṣṇa is God, kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). But if you think that there is another God then you may do your business. We are concerned with Kṛṣṇa. That's all. We cannot allow any interpretation of Kṛṣṇa. That is our (indistinct). (aside:) Yes?
Guest (2): There is a Swami, Gangesvaranandaji, (indistinct) Vedas (indistinct) books that Kṛṣṇa's name in the Vedas is mentioned.
Prabhupāda: Ah?
Devotee: Kṛṣṇa's name in the Vedas is already there.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.: Prabhupāda: That we already admitted. That I can see ten feet, let me credit, take credit for that. But why shall I say, "I can see the whole universe." What is this nonsense? Speak the truth. "Now we have manufactured machine, and this, I have calculation that..." All talking nonsense. I say it is not possible for you to see beyond ten feet. Why you are claiming that you can see the whole sky? That is our protest. You can see ten feet, take that credit, that much. If somebody manufactures the electric lamp, all right. Take this. But if he says, "I can manufacture the sun." Then he is to be beaten with shoes. Talking nonsense. You take this credit, that you have manufactured light in electric bulb, that's all right. But why you claim that, "I can manufacture the sun"? That is their claim, defying God. Because we are explaining God consciousness, therefore we have protest. Otherwise let them move(?), all nonsense (indistinct). But we cannot tolerate when they challenge God. We must (indistinct).
Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.: Prabhupāda: So this first, second, third, the intellectual class, the administrative class, and the productive class, these three classes must be there in the society. And those who cannot be grouped either of these three classes, they should generally help as workers. They are called śūdras. So the workers means... Suppose you require a sitting place: the carpenter is there. Suppose you require a knife: so the blacksmith is there. You require clothing: the weaver is there. In this way, four classes of men. First class, second class, third class, or the intellectuals, the administrators, the producers and the general workers. This is Vedic system of division. Brāhmaṇa... This is for our living condition, and then human life especially meant for spiritual realization, self-realization. For that purpose, again, another four divisions. Generally, the brahmacārī, student life; gṛhastha, married life; vānaprastha, retired life; and sannyāsa, renounced life. So at the end of life one should be renounced from all other responsibilities and completely devote his life for Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or God consciousness. In this way, when a person dies in God consciousness, his life is perfect. This is Vedic civilization. Eight divisions, varṇa and āśrama. And if you simply produce śūdras, working class, then you cannot have any happiness. That is not possible. And nowadays democratic, if you send some śūdras to act as kṣatriyas, they cannot do it. You have got practical experience. In Vietnam, what happened?
Room Conversation -- July 10, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: His picture is hateful.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It says "Profit without any honor." He quotes you in here. It says "Swami Prabhupāda, spiritual leader of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, and Bill Faill, Durban, South Africa, of the Natal Mercury Reporter, had the following dialogue: (reads from magazine) Bill Faill: 'Do you think that Transcendental Meditation is helping people?' Prabhupāda: 'They do not know what real meditation is. Their meditation is simply a farce, another cheating process by the so-called swamis and yogis. So everyone is talking about meditation, but no one knows what meditation really is. These bluffers use the word meditation, but they do not know the proper subject for meditation. They are simply talking bogus propaganda.' Bill Faill: 'But isn't meditation helpful in getting people to think straight?' Prabhupāda: 'No, real meditation means to achieve a state in which the mind is saturated by God consciousness.' "
Prabhupāda: Dhyānāvasthita-tad-gatena manasā paśyanti yaṁ yoginaḥ (SB 12.13.1). This is the Vedic version. When one man's mind is fully absorbed in the Supersoul, Viṣṇu, that is called meditation.
Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: Now you were referring to the Vedic principle, but that does not mean you have to open slaughterhouse. But these rascals are opening slaughterhouse. You think it is Vedic principle? Suppose it is recommended that animals should be sacrificed in the Vedic ritualistic ceremony. Does it mean that you shall open regular slaughterhouse? Just as the Christians say that Jesus Christ ate fish, therefore they are right in opening big, big slaughterhouse? Maybe Lord Jesus Christ ate fish in some awkward circumstance, but that does not mean that he is recommending to open slaughterhouse. In the Ten Commandments he says, "Thou shalt not kill." When there is absolute necessity, there is no other food, that is another thing, but if there is sufficient other foodstuff, why should you kill? They are not even human being, those who are animal killers. Vinā paśughnāt (SB 10.1.4). Those who are animal killers, they are not even human being, what to speak of religious system. Nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānād bhavauṣadhāc chrotra-mano-'bhirāmāt ka uttamaśloka-guṇa (SB 10.1.4). If you are animal killer, your God consciousness is finished. You'll never be able to understand what is God. Then your life is finished. This life is meant for understanding God, and if you are animal killer, then your God understanding is finished.
Morning Walk -- July 12, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: Just see, why this wood is dried up? Why?
Hari-śauri: There is no spirit soul in it.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It has been severed from the tree.
Prabhupāda: Yes, from the, it is out of touch from the original bark. Similarly, any civilization which is out of touch of God consciousness, that will dry up in due course of time.
Devotee (1): Yesterday, Svarūpa Dāmodara—we were speaking about the scientists—he said that they don't accept our proof that God exists as being any more conclusive than their proof that He doesn't exist.
Prabhupāda: Hmm?
Devotee (1): In other words, they don't accept that we have any proof that God exists. They say God doesn't exist.
Prabhupāda: God exists, we have given so many proofs. If the rascal cannot understand, what can be done? There is mother, there is children; where is the father? This is our argument. Mother, the earth is mother, and everything, these trees, we are all coming out of mother, mother nature. And who is the father? What is the answer? Now, what the atheist will say that there is no God? How they will say?
Morning Walk -- July 12, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: Dried up on account of being detached from the original bark. Similarly, as soon as any civilization detached from God consciousness, they'll dry up.
Devotee (1): Simply buildings and cement, that is their culture.
Bali-mardana: Except for India, no civilization has lasted very long.
Prabhupāda: No, cannot last.
Hari-śauri: And as soon as they started to give up their culture in India, they're also dried up.
Prabhupāda: They'll dry. That is the nature's way. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇāḥ. Anyone detached from God consciousness, he has no qualification. Manorathena. Their only qualification is mental concoction. That's all. Just see, how this... In America, such a wretched man. Willfully. Willfully.
Devotee (1): They've become useless.
Prabhupāda: This is due to excessive meat-eating, intoxication, sex. This is the result.
Interview with Newsweek -- July 14, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: No, at any stage of life, if one accepts the principles of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, he can make advance.
Rāmeśvara: She asked, "Is it more favorable for spreading Kṛṣṇa consciousness if there is some material problems, social problems? If there is a lack of God consciousness, then people become frustrated. Is that a more favorable situation for Kṛṣṇa consciousness to take root?"
Prabhupāda: Yes, if we arrange social, political and everything favorable for spiritual understanding, then it becomes easier.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda is saying the opposite than what you hypothesized. In other words, if everything is arranged socially, politically, everything, in a God conscious, Kṛṣṇa conscious manner, then it is easier to accept the principles of God consciousness, Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Prabhupāda: Just like... These are all discussed in the Bhagavad-gītā, what kind of social arrangement should be. That... It is called varṇāśrama-dharma. A brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha—these are different groups, and if they are favorably trained up then spiritual understanding becomes very easy.
Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: No, but there is no question of "better than others." It is the only thing.
Interviewer: It is the only way?
Prabhupāda: Only thing. It is not the question of better or superior. But Kṛṣṇa consciousness means God consciousness. So either you are Chinese or English or American, there is consciousness. When that consciousness is purified, that is God consciousness.
Interviewer: Yes. But is your way the only way?
Prabhupāda: No, that is only way. Because God is one and God consciousness is one, so when you are Chinese consciousness, that is foreign. Or either American consciousness, it is foreign.
Interviewer: Okay, I was speaking in an analogical way. There are different way to express oneself or different languages one can learn. Similarly, I would think there would be different ways to get to consciousness.
Prabhupāda: Different ways may be, but if you actually come to that consciousness, that different way is approved. Otherwise it is bogus.
Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: If you come to God consciousness, either through the Christian process or Chinese process or Indian process, it doesn't matter. But if you do not come to God consciousness, then it is all bogus.
Interviewer: But you can come to God consciousness through a variety of paths.
Bali-mardana: He's saying that. He's saying "if."
Rāmeśvara: He says, "But you can come to God consciousness by different processes."
Prabhupāda: No, different processes... Our...
Bali-mardana: Can do.
Prabhupāda: No, it is not that. The aim is to come to the God consciousness. And the means may be different. So that means is justified by the end. If at the end, you do not come to God consciousness, then whatever process you have, that is bogus. That is not bona fide.
Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: If it works, it is bona fide. If it does not work, then it is bogus.
Interviewer: And to your mind is it possible to come to God consciousness through other means than yours?
Prabhupāda: I say if it is possible, then it is all right.
Interviewer: Is it possible?
Prabhupāda: Yes, if it is possible.
Interviewer: Is it, though? (laughter)
Rāmeśvara: That you have to see.
Prabhupāda: No, thing is that...
Hari-śauri: That you have to see. You have to judge whether you are going to get that result.
Prabhupāda: Yes. People... Whether he is coming to God consciousness or dog consciousness, two things are there. Consciousness means when he understands that "I am part and parcel of God. I am servant of God." Then it is all right. But if he is thinking that "I am servant of dog," then it is not proper way.
Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York: Interviewer: Well, and they think how to sell literature and... Is that the way to God consciousness, by selling and soliciting? Is that...?
Prabhupāda: No, no, if you are...
Interviewer: How does that fit in?
Prabhupāda: If you are God conscious, naturally you give up all intoxication habit.
Interviewer: Yeah, but just going out and selling and accosting people on the street...
Hari-śauri: He's asking how does our saṅkīrtana activities relate to God consciousness, the selling of books and collecting of donations.
Prabhupāda: So if I sell a book to you, you read because you have paid for. Then you'll get benefit.
Interviewer: How does it benefit the seller?
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Interviewer: How does it benefit the person who works on the selling...
Prabhupāda: Unless you purchase, how you'll get reading?
Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: Not very much. Naturally women are after worldly opulence.
Interviewer: Was it difficult for you to give up what you had been doing in order to devote full time.
Prabhupāda: No, it is the Vedic system that at a certain age they should give up family connection and completely devote for God consciousness. In the beginning, twenty-five years, he should learn from guru about Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Then, if he is able, he does not become a family man, but if he is unable or circumstantially, he may become a family man. So he can remain a family man up to fiftieth year and then he retires from family life. He travels in holy places with his wife, and sometimes he comes home and sometimes he goes home. In this way, when he's practiced to give up family attachment, then the wife goes back home to the care of her elderly children, and the man takes sannyāsa, and he remains alone simply for spreading Kṛṣṇa consciousness. This is Vedic system.
Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York: Prabhupāda: That is his interest.
Interviewer: In terms of, you know, "This is for Kṛṣṇa. This is for developing God consciousness..."
Prabhupāda: No, if you are interested in Kṛṣṇa, you are interested for everyone. And if you are interested for a particular person, society, then you are not interested in Kṛṣṇa. The example I can give you. Just like if you supply food to your stomach, then you supply food to your eyes, ears, hands, legs, everything. But if you supply food to your eyes, then you become blind.
Bali-mardana: He wants to know that would you be justified in doing something that society would consider criminal, like, say...
Rāmeśvara: Like stealing for Kṛṣṇa, or killing for Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Killing?
Rāmeśvara: If it is... Something that is judged by, say, the US government as criminal, would be still do it if it was for Kṛṣṇa?
Prabhupāda: No, we do not do anything which is harmful to the society. We do not do anything, not only to the human society. To the animal society, to the tree society, to the aquatic society, we do not do anything. We do not support the slaughterhouse, killing the animals. Kṛṣṇa consciousness means to see every living entity on the same level. Paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). We are not cruel to anyone. Either he's a man or animal or tree or bird.
Evening Darsana -- August 9, 1976, Tehran: Prabhupāda: Yes. That is very important thing. That is important, yes. But love means two persons, there is exchange. Giving something, taking something, feeding something and to eat something, and speaking everything, no secrecy, and to know everything of the other person. When these things are transacted, then there is love. Dadāti pratigṛhṇāti bhuṅkte bhojayate caiva guhyam ākhyāti pṛcchati. If I love you and if I have got some secrecy, I don't disclose to you, that is not perfect love. I must deal with you open-hearted, you must deal with me open-hearted, then there is love. This is one of the basic principles. I shall invite you to eat with me and I shall accept your invitation to eat with me. I shall give you some presentation, you shall give me some presentation. In this way love develops. So if you want to love Kṛṣṇa, God, then these things must be there. Otherwise, where there is question of love? To appreciate God is great, that is not love. That is simply appreciation. But when we actually give everything to God and take everything from Him, you talk with Him of your mind, He talks with you. You give Him to eat and whatever He gives you eat. In this way there is question of love. Simply appreciation of the greatness of God, that is good, in God consciousness, but that is not love. The love stage is different.
Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- August 9, 1976, Tehran: Prabhupāda: Rascal, working, it is already being done, so what is your credit? We are working. You may work also, but what is your credit? Suppose if you become successful. What is your credit? It is already being done by the chicken. Why should you take the laureate title, Dr. such-and-such. Give it to the chicken. What they can do? Can they produce a seed of this, just like one seed produce so many things? Bījāhaṁ sarva-bhūtānām. Where is your credit? (break) Mines, as soon as it is national, nobody will take. In 1950, twenty-five years, twenty-six years ago, I was in Madras, Gauḍīya Maṭha, and there is a bus stop in front of the temple. So every bus was making some sound, huuuuuung, but when nothing was properly oiled. Machine is going to hell when it is managed by the government. As soon as there is government management, nobody wants. So long there is proprietorship, the proprietor takes care that "My machine will go bad if I don't take care." But who cares for that? That showing that so much oil purchased, who is going to check it? People have become dishonest. On account of godlessness, everyone is dishonest. He's dishonest to himself even. Doesn't take care of the body properly. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇāḥ. Therefore you cannot expect good qualities of the human society without injecting God consciousness. (break) ...in the mass of people amongst themselves. Do they fight very much amongst themselves?
Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- August 9, 1976, Tehran: Hari-śauri: They say that He's made for our enjoyment and it's for us to divide and enjoy.
Prabhupāda: No. Therefore you are rascal. Everything is done by somebody. Suppose if you organize one business. That is for your enjoyment. God has created anything, that is for His enjoyment. But you are sons of God, you can enjoy the property of the father as far as you require. Not more than, you cannot take more than that. Then other sons will claim and there will be fight. You live. You are son of God, you live at the expense of God. God has sufficient supply. But don't try to take more and stock. That is folly. You eat, you live very nicely. There is no prohibition. But you cannot take more than what you require. This is Bhāgavata communism. If you take more, you'll be punished. (break) ...our philosophy, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Tena tyaktena bhuñjīthā (ISO 1). The Indians are trained up like that. He is happy in whatever condition of life he is placed. He doesn't protest. Any Indian villager, he'll say "God has given me this position, that's all right." Therefore the modern man is complaining that in India, this God consciousness has made them lethargic. They do not do... They believe on the destiny. Actually they do. Actually they do. Therefore from the very beginning you'll find so nice philosophy, literature, but you won't find the modernized economic development. Big, big house, big, big road, no. There was no such attempt.
Evening Darsan -- August 10, 1976, Tehran: Prabhupāda: If when you see that he does not speak anything except Kṛṣṇa, that is tattva-darśi. If you are expert businessman in certain line, you have no other business than to talk with on that line. Suppose if you are to purchase some gold, then you have to go to the gold market for dealing with gold. Why should we go to the ice market? That is your ignorance. If you want to know Kṛṣṇa, then you have to know from the persons who are dealing with Kṛṣṇa. That's all. They have no other business. Our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement means we are dealing with Kṛṣṇa. That's all. We're writing books, so many books for Kṛṣṇa. We are preaching and going country to country. We simple deal with Kṛṣṇa. Therefore the movement is known as "Kṛṣṇa consciousness." Somebody suggested "Why don't you write 'God consciousness'?" No, if I say "God consciousness," they'll bring so many gods. It is very simple. If we take it seriously, then benefit is there. But if we hesitate, it is our misfortune.
Room Conversation -- August 10, 1976, Tehran: Prabhupāda: Anyway, that kind of interest is felt by the dog. It is not very astonishing thing. In that mentality you cannot bring in unity. That is not possible.
Dayānanda: But they accept that there is some good quality in humanity, they say that that is inherent in humanity, that we need to worship.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that good quality is God consciousness. So unless humanity comes to the position of God consciousness, unless he thinks that everything belongs to God, there is no question of humanity. That is "dognity," doggish mentality. Humanity means that he understands that everything belongs to God, I am servant of God. That is humanity. Otherwise, there is no question of humanity. If you think like dog, where is humanity?
Dayānanda: They think that everything belongs to humanity as a group.
Prabhupāda: But that is not practical. Everything belongs to the humanity, then why you are making divisions of nations?
Dayānanda: That's what they say, that that is the problem.
Prabhupāda: And the problem will continue because you are taking account a section of living entity. You, because you have no idea of dog and other animals, what they are, they are also sons of God. That is described in the Bhagavad-gītā. Find out. Sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya sambhavanti mūrtayaḥ yāḥ. Unless you come to this understanding, there is no question of humanity. This is the humanity understanding. Sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya sambhavanti mūrtayaḥ yāḥ.
Room Conversation -- August 11, 1976, Tehran: Nava-yauvana: Yes, Prabhupāda.
Prabhupāda: So because there is no other way... Suppose in the desert, what they'll do? They must eat something, but still there is sense of God, there is some regulative principle.
Ātreya Ṛṣi: There is also principle of sacrifice with very strict regulations.
Prabhupāda: So in this way God consciousness must be there. That is civilization.
Hari-śauri: You want to go down, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Prabhupāda: Hm.
Hari-śauri: Jaya. (devotees offer obeisances) (end)
Evening Darsana -- August 12, 1976, Tehran: Prabhupāda: That's it. This is greatness. So we should not simply be satisfied God is great. We must try to know how great He is. Then our God consciousness will be fixed up. It's all right?
Ātreya Ṛṣi: It's very beautiful.
Prabhupāda: That people are not interested. Only officially chanting "God is great," that's all. These are the... You try to understand. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. This is the Vedānta-sūtra. Go, inquire, be inquisitive. Jijñāsuḥ śreya uttamam. Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsuḥ śreya uttamam (SB 11.3.21). One should be inquisitive. That is human life. And as soon as you become inquisitive, you become aware of God more and more, then your devotion increases. That is wanted.
Evening Darsana (on night of arrival) -- August 16, 1976, Hyderabad: Prabhupāda: Communists are seeing this movement as a great danger.
Indian man (3): Yes, great danger for their...
Prabhupāda: And we are spreading God consciousness. (break) By the grace of Kṛṣṇa, we have no debts. We are (indistinct) simply find out... (?) Now in Bombay I am getting from my Book Fund seven lakhs of rupees per month regularly.
Indian man (3): Yes, ten lakhs per month is coming. Otherwise that work will not progress.
Prabhupāda: We have given them three lakhs of rupees. What is that?
Press Interview at Muthilal Rao's House -- August 17, 1976, Hyderabad: Prabhupāda: It is not exactly religious. You have taken by it because we misunderstand the meaning of religion. Religion generally understood as a kind of cult and faith. But in the Vedic literature, religion means the characteristic. Just like sugar is sweet, that is its religion. If sugar becomes pungent, that is not sugar's characteristic. Similarly, a human being must be God conscious. So that God consciousness is religion. Because in the human form of life one can understand what is God, and if he does not become, he remains an animal. Animal cannot understand. So therefore his business is how to athāto brahma jijñāsā. This is not our manufactured word, this is the Vedānta words. Atha, now we have got this human form body, based on that transmigration of the soul after millions and millions of years, bahūnāṁ janmanām ante (BG 7.19), you have got this human form of life, now it is your business to inquire about the Absolute Truth. This is the business of human life. And āhāra-nidra-bhaya-maithuna, how to eat, how to sleep, how to enjoy sex life and how to defend, that is animal business. If you remain busy with these four principles of bodily necessities of life, āhāra-nidra-bhaya-maithuna, then you remain on he animal platform. Beyond that, when you inquire about God, that is human life. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. So we are trying to raise him from this animal life to human life. This is our business.
Room Conversation About Blitz News Clipping -- August 21, 1976, Hyderabad: Prabhupāda: They may say. But we want to put forward a God's party also. Why not? Everyone is godless party. We must push forward a God's party. What is the wrong there?
Hari-śauri: It's not political.
Prabhupāda: Our whole movement is to educate this atheistic godless civilization to God consciousness. That is our movement. So if we set up a party, In God We Trust, what is the wrong there?
Gargamuni: In the same newspaper they print naked women. So we have God conscious party to stop this.
Prabhupāda: To stop illicit sex.
Gargamuni: Yes.
Prabhupāda: We are trying to elevate the demoralized human society to God consciousness.
Room Conversation About Blitz News Clipping -- August 21, 1976, Hyderabad: Pradyumna: The courts can take it up also. In Allahabad when they were doing about the Congress Party having the cow, they said this is of the nature... They were discussing what is God in the court to make a decision. Something, what is God, what is religion. We can bring it up in the court. That will make a case celebre. Case celebre, they call it, affaire celebre.
Prabhupāda: Yes. This case must be brought. Challenge them, "What do you know about God?" Explain. And we can prove God consciousness from every page of our books. That will be very interesting case. And we shall continue this unless this man is sufficiently fined.
Hari-śauri: This is a... That bit about... Some of it, there's the front page also. Thought you might like to read.
Prabhupāda: "Evidence of fraud"? No?
Hari-śauri: That's Sai Baba.
Pradyumna: One man is trying to prove Sai Baba is fraud. One professor.
Hari-śauri: He's a scientist. He says he can prove that Sai Baba's making things appear and disappear is just a trick.
Prabhupāda: He is a fraud. What is this paper?
Room Conversation -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad: Maṇihāra: "ISKCON has generated many community farms like New Vrindaban, providing the ideal atmosphere of a busy, yet peaceful village, fully devoted to spiritual progress. Swami Prabhupāda has also established the first Kṛṣṇa conscious gurukula in the West, a primary school in Dallas, Texas, for one hundred boys and girls between the ages of five and fifteen. Soon after its success, many such gurukulas have sprung up all over the world. Aside from teaching reading, writing, mathematics, geography, etc., the gurukula teaches the child how to cultivate God consciousness. Once a year members of ISKCON journey to the Society's international headquarters at Śrīdhāma Māyāpur, ninety miles north of Calcutta, and the birthplace of Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu. It is the site of a ten crore rupees international Vedic village comprised of community farming projects, high-class gurukula school, free medicinal facilities, and handloom weaving center. An institute of Vedic studies is proposed to be established at this site. Other major ISKCON centers in India are in Vṛndāvana, Bombay, and Kurukṣetra, the site of a three-crore rupee international Sanskrit university. This project will be sponsored by Alfred Ford, a nephew of Henry Ford. This will be the cultural..."
Prabhupāda: Nephew, nephew of Ford, that's a fact. Alfred is from the daughter's side. So the present Mr. Ford, his nephew, certainly, because daughter's side. His mother is the daughter, granddaughter of Henry Ford. Alfred's mother is the granddaughter of Henry Ford. Therefore the present Ford is the maternal uncle of Alfred.
Room Conversation -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad: Maṇihāra: There's just a few more sentences. "The Society has indeed set for itself a noble and laudable ideal, producing men and women of high character, sincerity, and God consciousness."
Prabhupāda: Send this rascal.
Gargamuni: Yes, this shall be sent. And also to Om Mehta.
Prabhupāda: You send. He knows you, Gargamuni. Yes. Say you have mentioned several times my name, so for your benefit, and to open your eyes, I am sending you one article. Please read what ISKCON is doing. Simply write this.
Gargamuni: I have to go to Delhi for my (indistinct). I will go to the office, the Blitz office, and bring them this personally.
Prabhupāda: That's all right.
Conversation with Seven Ministers of Andhra Pradesh -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad: Prabhupāda: So the human life is meant for tapasya, not for sense gratification. Sense gratification, the facility is there even in the hogs and dogs life. So the human life is meant for yajña. We have got this chance. And especially in your province there is Bālajī, and Bālajī has got sufficient income. That income should be utilized for satisfaction of Bālajī. Not otherwise. That is our request. People are suffering for want of
God consciousness. So everything should be spent for spreading
God consciousness all over the world. At least, people are contributing to Bālajī, so whatever Bālajī's property is there, that should be utilized for Bālajī's mission. The Bālajī's mission is... That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā:
- ya idaṁ paramaṁ guhyaṁ
- mad-bhakteṣv abhidhāsyati
- (Bg 18.68)
Garden Conversation -- September 7, 1976, Vrndavana: Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: "Dear Shri Modiji. Hare Kṛṣṇa. In Blitz issue of August 21, 1976, an article under the heading of "Blitz Tears the Mask of Ungodly Face of Kṛṣṇa Cult" appeared. This article appeared on page 3 of the issue and was written by A. Ragwan of Blitz Delhi Bureau. We beg to state that this was a mischievous article in which the newspaper accused us incorrectly. It is our firm opinion that the purpose of this article was simply to defame ISKCON because it is engaged in spreading God consciousness based on the Vedic scriptures. For your information, ISKCON is a registered society with the government of India. This society..."
Prabhupāda: For your information we beg to submit.
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No. For your information... Before that I have said. "For your information ISKCON is a registered society with the government of India."
Prabhupāda: No, no, "for your infor..." It is not completed. "For your information..." What is that?
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, this is a sentence.
Prabhupāda: Okay.
Room Conversation (Bullock Cart SKP) -- September 12, 1976, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: That's all... But what is that great? What is God you do not know. We know. Kṛṣṇa says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7). There is no more greater principle than Me. That is great. How you are great? Aham ādir hi devānām (Bg 10.2). "I am the origin of all the demigods." Next how you are great? Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate (BG 10.8). This is their ignorance. They have simply heard God is great, but how He is great, that they do not know. Here is the... God is personally speaking, "Yes, I am great in this way." Ahaṁ sarvasya. Vedānta says janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). That is greatness. The original source of everything. So we are presenting God, "Here is God." Kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam. Ete cāṁśa-kalāḥ puṁsaḥ (SB 1.3.28). There are other incarnations, but kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam. That's a fact. So try to present the real fact. It will be effective. If there is real reality, just like first class pure ghee... If one tastes, he'll hanker after. Without any advertisement, by the taste of the ghee, it will go on. Is it not? If you put little pure ghee on the rice, it will be so tasteful, that he'll want it again. But give the pure thing. Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Try to give Him to the people. And how to take it? Hare Kṛṣṇa. He hasn't got to pay anything. God has given him the tongue. Induce him, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. And that is the beginning. Sevonmukhe hi jihvādau (Brs. 1.2.234). It begins from the jihvā. So people will be surprised, "How God consciousness begins with jihvā?" That they do not know. Śāstra says sevonmukhe hi jihvādau. Jihvā, the tongue is the beginning of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. God consciousness. People are surprised, they think the mind, speculative mind is the beginning. No. Śāstra says tongue is the beginning. Muni, ṛṣi, muni. Muni means speculator. So they think speculative mind is the beginning of God consciousness.
Press Interview -- October 16, 1976, Chandigarh: Prabhupāda: I think so. Because there is a cultural department in the central government but they do not know what is culture. Just see.
Interviewer: What is the difference between God consciousness and Kṛṣṇa consciousness?
Prabhupāda: There is no difference. The same thing. Kṛṣṇa is God. (break)
Interviewer: What is, sir, the number of your disciples round the world?
Prabhupāda: Dedicated life—not less than ten thousand. And admirers, there are many millions. Recently one American politician has remarked in Houston, that "This Kṛṣṇa consciousness, Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is spreading like epidemic. So unless we take some steps it may take our government." (laughter)
Interviewer: Who was the man who said it?
Hari-śauri: A government official in Houston.
Prabhupāda: No, no, what is his name? You can give.
Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana: Dr. Kneupper: But your teaching, doesn't it offer a way of meeting these problems?
Prabhupāda: Yes. We are teaching people God consciousness. Then everything will be solved.
Dr. Kneupper: You say that man does not understand nature. The scientist studies nature but yet he doesn't really understand it.
Prabhupāda: Why they do not understand it? Why don't you understand that there is control over us? Where is the difficulty? Foolishly we do not try to understand. Do you admit it, that above us there is control? Do you admit?
Dr. Kneupper: Oh, yes.
Prabhupāda: No, anyone.
Dr. Kneupper: Some people do.
Prabhupāda: Why others? That means they are foolish.
Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: So these foolish rascals, because they have improved little, they are denying, "Oh, now there is no need of God. That is opiate." What is that? Opiate?
Jagadīśa: Opiate of the people.
Prabhupāda: "They make the man foolish, God consciousness," and so on, so on. These scientists, they declare, "What is God? This is all superstition."
Dr. Kneupper: But in the world there seem to be many different religions, many different faiths.
Prabhupāda: Religion you may have. Religion means to try to understand God. Any religion—you take Christian religion or Hindu religion or Mohammedan religion—there is little attempt to understand God. So any religion which gives you knowledge of God and you understand what is relation with God, that is perfect religion. We have no quarrel.
Dr. Kneupper: Do you think if all men, let's say, all the religions could try to come together...
Prabhupāda: Religion means to understand God and to follow God's order. That is religion. Just like government and government law. So if the citizen understands what is the law of the government and abides by it, then he's a good citizen. Similarly, any person who understands God and abides by the order of God, then he is religious. Why do you stand? You may be Christian; I may be Hindu; he may be Mohammedan. It doesn't matter. Everyone should understand God and the relationship with God and act accordingly. Then it is perfect religion.
Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: Ācchā? So this is our position. Now you are philosophers. You try to understand the whole philosophy and combine together. People have become all fourth-class, tenth-class, uncivilized men. They should be given the idea of God consciousness. I don't say only in Western country. Everywhere this is the problem, all fourth-class men. So there is possibility to bring the fourth-class men to the first-class. That is educational. It can be done. There is no difficulty. So this is the education, how to make fourth-class men or fifth-class men to come to the first-class standard. What is that? Which verse I wanted?
Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: That should be educated from the very beginning. Therefore we are opening gurukula, sane brain. Otherwise their brain is spoiled by so-called bad education. I inquired from your state secretary that "You write on the bills, 'In God We Trust,' so why not spread this God consciousness—what is God? You blindly say, 'God in Trust,' but what is God? Do you know? So why not spread this science?" I received no reply up to date. They might have said, "Here is a crazy fellow. Nobody has inquired like this." That's all. They do not like to enter into the controversy. Actually they do not believe in God, but they write, "In God We Trust," is it not?
Dr. Kneupper: That's what they write.
Press Conference -- December 16, 1976, Hyderabad: Devotee: In Hyderabad there is Muslim. He is a life member.
Prabhupāda: No, that, life member... God consciousness... Who will deny God? It is a science. So we are teaching the science, not the bigotry, "my God, your God." God is one. Gold is gold. Gold does not become Hindu gold, Muslim gold, or Christian gold. Anywhere gold is available, it is gold. That is our definition. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmaḥ. That is highest, topmost type of religion, yato bhaktir adhokṣaje, where one can learn how to love God, that's all. That is wanted. We are teaching that. There is no question of "this God, that God." God is one. You just practice how to love Him. Then your religion is first-class.
1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara: Rāmeśvara: Oh, that's big because you don't have to give up anything. I met some of my old friends in New York, and I debated with them. And their philosophy is that this Transcendental Meditation is based on natural process of God consciousness, and our effort is all artificial. We are giving up meat, giving up sex—this is artificial. Their philosophy is that "If you continue meditating, one day automatically you'll give up these things. So why do it prematurely?"
Prabhupāda: No, but if one day you have to give it up, why not prematurely?
Rāmeśvara: Give it up when you are... By the Transcendental Meditation, twenty minutes a day, automatically you are purifying yourself naturally. Therefore that is more perfect.
Prabhupāda: No, if I can purify immediately, what is the wrong?
Rāmeśvara: He said it creates stress. By doing it artificially you create too much stress.
Prabhupāda: "No, we don't feel any... We do not feel any stress. You feel because you are unable to do it. But we don't feel it. We have given up... Since our spiritual master has said, we have given up, immediately. But you cannot do it," say.
Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara: Prabhupāda: Yes. It is amusing.
Gargamuni: At least the newspaper article in the Statesman was very amusing. It did not criticize, because it mentioned that by wearing these suits we are able to distribute many literatures on God consciousness, which is the real meaning of Christmas. They wrote this in the States... So it was favorable.
Nanda-kumāra: In Los Angeles there was some controversy, some trouble. So they had big signs that said "ISKCON," and they had a thing printed up that they put on the bucket that they were collecting with. It said, "Help us put the real spirit of God back into Christmas." And people appreciated that. It stated who we were and stated that...
Hari-śauri: Whenever there's some controversy there's always somebody that was dead against and there's always someone who's for you, but the general public, they just observe.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: It makes a better point for them instead of making a better point for ourselves.
Prabhupāda: Against party, they take it.
Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara: Svarūpa Dāmodara: In open discussion they come around to this point, that they're lacking some fundamental knowledge.
Prabhupāda: Yes, that we have to prove. Therefore I am teasing you. Prove that they are passing on as very intelligent, very advanced, but all rascals. Let them admit that "We are rascals without God consciousness." That is my propaganda. (break) Let them understand that without God consciousness they are rascals. And why the rascals should pass on as very intelligent in the rascal society? Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ (SB 2.3.19). He's rascal, and some other small rascals, they are praising, "Oh, you are so great. You are so great."
Morning Walk -- February 2, 1977, Bhuvanesvara: Prabhupāda: The learned scholars, they used to live in the forest. Vyāsadeva was writing in śāmyaprāśa cottage. (chuckling) That is university. And no university can produce such scholar or student, not imperfect. They're all rascals. What are the values of these MA, Ph.D? (break) It is humbug. Māyā-sukhāya bharam udvahato vimūḍhān (SB 7.9.43). Actually they're vimūḍhān. Mūḍha means rascal and vimūḍhān means special rascals. (laughs) Māyā-sukhāya, for some sense gratification-big, big arrangement. And next life he's going to be a dog. That's all. So Prahlāda Mahārāja said, "I am thinking of these rascals, vimūḍhān, especially rascals, that they are arranging so gorgeous thing for material happiness and forgetting their spiritual identity." Śoce: "I am simply thinking of these rascals. For me there is no problem." Tato vimukha-cetasaḥ. "Because they are bereft of God consciousness, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they are doing, engaged in these big, big projects, although (they) live for twenty years or fifty years utmost, perhaps.
Room Conversation -- February 3, 1977, Bhuvanesvara: Prabhupāda: Such a great personality, son of God. He wanted to deliver God consciousness. And return, he was crucified. We don't take Jesus Christ very insignificantly. We give him all honor. He's representative of God. He tried to preach according to the time, place, circumstances, country, people. Otherwise he is representative of God.
Hari-śauri: Yeah. He only preached for three years too.
Prabhupāda: He could not preach even but still, in three years what he did is wonderful.
Hari-śauri: Yes, He's world famous for the last two thousand years.
Prabhupāda: Yes, not joke. Unless he's God representative, how he can be so famous? That we know. I told in Melbourne, "What is your idea of Jesus Christ?" And "He's our guru," I told. You remember that?
Hari-śauri: I don't... That was at one of those...
Prabhupāda: The priest meeting.
Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura: Prabhupāda: Just like a child's conception is different from the father. That means he has not developed the brain. That is only answer.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They don't accept that God consciousness is...
Prabhupāda: So then... They may not accept, but the fact is there. You can challenge this, that body's machine. Apart from what is the energy that is moving the machine, but it is machine, we accept. So you prepare a machine like that. Where is that machine?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They'll say that "You also cannot."
Prabhupāda: I do not say that we are very good brain. We are servant of God. We have nothing to show, any brain. Our brain will be shown by our master. Our position is God. So we are not very much anxious to show our... But you are godless rascals. You want to show your brain. Show me machine. We have all accepted that supreme brain is Kṛṣṇa and we are servant. That is our position. We don't say that "Independent. There is no God." We don't. You say that. We are working under superior brain. So the case has to be proved by you, not by us. What is called, onus? What is that, onus?
Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda (Member of Parliament) -- March 27, 1977, Bombay: Prabhupāda: Why not government make people God conscious? It is very simple thing. God personally is explaining how to become God conscious. Very simple thing. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). Four things. Even a child can do it. So why not leaders? Then their example should be followed.
- yad yad ācarati śreṣṭhas
- tat tad evetaro janaḥ
- sa yat pramāṇaṁ kurute
- lokas tad anuvartate
- (BG 3.21)
Why don't they do this, this God consciousness? Do it seriously. Then everything will be all right. They are defying the existence of God and reading Bhagavad-gītā. This is their position. And if I go to the details, it may not be very palatable. But big, big leaders say like that. We have got everything in India, and to become God conscious, to establish the Lord's kingdom, not at all difficult. But we manufacture our own ideas. But we want that rāma-rājya, but without Rāma, how rāma-rājya will be? So those who are leaders of the society, if they take it seriously, will there not be an ideal state? And you can make an..., set an example to the whole world. The whole world will be happy. But we must be very serious about it. That is our this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. We are trying, but we have no support from the government, from the leaders.
Morning Conversation -- April 11, 1977, Bombay: Prabhupāda: That means the rascals, they do not see it, that godlessness, godless education will be like that. The teachers who are suggesting, they are themselves blind, and they are leading. They do not know what is the defect. You can write to them, that "You are leaders, you do not know what is the cause. This is the cause. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahad-guṇā manorathenāsati dhāvato bahiḥ (SB 5.18.12). Without God consciousness, there cannot be any education. There cannot be any good qualities. You do not know this. Simply you are crying in the wilderness. You yourself do not know. All the education, its propaganda is how to make the world godless, although the most scientific knowledge of God is there in the Bhagavad-gītā." Write him. Give him a slap, that "You do not know." Introduce our Kṛṣṇa consciousness books in the educational department. "Yato mata tato patha. Transcendental meditation. God has given you senses. Why you should not enjoy?" This is his...
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Electronics complex for women entrepreneurs is being set up in Tamil Nadu."
Prabhupāda: Hm?
Room Conversation Varnasrama -- July 14, 1977, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: That's what I... Similarly, weaver, that cloth weaving, "kat, kat." The wife is spinning, her husband is weaving, the children is weaving, and combinedly at the end of the day there is a cloth. And people were satisfied with simple necessities. They would not charge very much for the labor. And one nice cloth requires half a pound cotton. Half a pound cotton means maybe one rupee. Another one rupee for the labor. So now they are paying twenty to thirty rupees. Unnecessarily he has to earn this money and pay to the millionaires, and he will keep three dozen motorcars, so another man will be engaged in motorcar industry. In this way time is being wasted without any search after spiritual realization. Time is wasted in such so-called technology advancement. And the real purpose of life, jīvasya tattva-jijñāsā, that is missing. And when you present that "This is the most important business of life," they say, "It is brainwashing." And they fight to check us, Communists and others, that "It is useless, God consciousness." (break) (long pause) So... Jāniyā śuniyā biṣa khāinu. Because they are missing the aim of life, they are committing suicide. And this varṇāśrama-dharma was planned in such a way that everyone would be spiritually advanced. The weaver will get, the potter will get, the blacksmith will get, the brāhmaṇa is already there, kṣatriya will get—everyone. For them, lower-class men, demigod worship. At least they are accepting there is some higher authority. Among the blacksmith there is viśvakarma-pūjā. One day they will wash all the instruments of blacksmith. Somehow or other, all are cleaned. And with the fruit, with flower, candana, they'll worship.
Room Conversation about Grhasthas -- July 17, 1977, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: Let me go this side and come back.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: All right. (break)
Prabhupāda: ...gentlemen who are... It is good suggestion. It is a Communist government plan to cut down. Communists think of God as a farce. And we are stressing on God consciousness.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Surabhī Swami sent some plan of the Bhaktivedanta Institute building, sent a blueprint.
Prabhupāda: Where is?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Should I bring it? (break) They sent also... (break)
Prabhupāda: ...they want people join together and protest. And what is the response from Caitanya Maṭha? And that Surendranath Das is with Caitanya Maṭha, or he's doing something independently? A remark by such a great officer, I.D., is not to be neglected.
Room Conversation -- October 27, 1977, Vrndavana: Prabhupāda: Bhaktivedanta Institute is doing something scientifically to understand God consciousness. That is proof. And it is well advertised. And we shall go on proceeding like that more and more. So many scientists, foreign and local, they participated, discussed. It is not ordinary thing. Hm?
Guest (2): Jaya.
Prabhupāda: The importance of Bhaktivedanta Institute is there, not that theory molecule. Come on. We are challenging. Discuss like scientist, not like sentimentalists.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda? It seems like we should... Next time we have a conference here, it should be done in the proper hall.
Prabhupāda: Yes, we have got enough place.
