Prabhupāda: Authorized. That people will refer to our books. So we have to very cautiously print our literatures. It is not ordinary literature, fiction, or something, story. Just like Bhagavad-gītā and Bhāgavata. They are not ordinary. literature. Without any four defects of human frailties. Bhrama, pramāda, vipralipsa, also... We are following those literatures. So our writing should be so authorized that in future one may not find any fault, contradiction. We shall have to, cautiously. The ideas are given there now... In future of course, it requires that we shall increase (indistinct). But for the present, we have to push on this movement with positive, I mean to say, conviction, that here is God. God is neither dead, nor every one of you is God, nor is He imperson. God is a person and we give you His name, address, father's name, activities. Here is God. So, we have to (indistinct). So if you have got any doubt about it, then you cannot do it. If you have got any doubt that whether Kṛṣṇa is positive God or (indistinct) then you cannot do it. That is the first qualification. If you are yourself not convinced, how you can convince others?
Four defects of conditional life (Conv and Letters)
Conversations and Morning Walks
1972 Conversations and Morning Walks
Svarūpa Dāmodara: So this is the symptom of Kali-yuga.
Prabhupāda: Not Kali-yuga. This is the symptom of conditioned soul. It is very prominent now in this age. Conditioned soul means these four defects—to commit mistake, to become illusioned, to cheat others, and imperfectness of the senses. The scientists say that we do not know, that means imperfectness of sense. I am trying to see but the cloud is checking me, and I am considering beyond this cloud there is nothing. That is imperfectness of my seeing. Not... It is not a fact that beyond the cloud there is nothing. So these things are going on—cheating, illusion, mistake, and imperfect. And they are trying to come to a right conclusion. Just like somebody was telling that there is going to be a big conference of the Catholics to consider what wrong they have done. They can see that the people are rejecting the so-called Christian religion. So now they are thinking (indistinct). But it is also another cheating. They are deliberately violating the principles of Christian religion, and still they say, "What we have done?"
1973 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: They know. Because they have full knowledge, "He knows here is God. Although he is four-handed, I am four-handed, but here is God." Because there is full knowledge. That is the difference. Here we are selecting some rascal as God, because we have no full knowledge. There, in the Vaikuṇṭha planets, although the common citizens and God is of the same feature of the bodily, but they know, "Here is God, the Supreme." He has got special signs in the... Yes, that's all. Just like the king or the president, we may make mistake. We may accept somebody as "Here is president." No. But the associates of the president, he knows. They know that "Here is president." Similarly, there is no question of mistake there. Four kinds of defects of material life—to commit mistake, to become illusioned, to cheat, and imperfection of the senses—these things are not there. Everyone's senses are perfect. When he sees God, he sees perfectly. He does not mistake. He is not illusioned. And there is no cheating and there is no imperfection of the senses. There is no mistake. These are spiritual life.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: So consciousness is also subject to body's changes, change of body.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Body's circumstances association. Saṅgāt sañjāyate kāmaḥ. According to association, atmosphere, circumstances, the desires changes. So that is, desire means consciousness. Just like our boys, they had different consciousness before coming to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Just like you are also scientist, there are other scientists. But your consciousness is different from theirs. Therefore you could challenge him like that. If you can create life by accumulation of these facts. He says that I do not know. He is not confident in his science.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: He is not experienced. He has not seen yet.
Prabhupāda: He is not above the defects, four defects of conditioned life. You know these four defects?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.
Prabhupāda: Illusion, mistake, cheating, imperfectness. They are aware of the imperfectness of the senses. Still they are proud of their knowledge. This is illusion.
Professor: Well, one has to acquire knowledge.
Prabhupāda: Eh. Yeah. Therefore, if we have to acquire knowledge, we must go to a person who does not commit mistake, who is not illusioned. There are four defects in the conditioned soul: to commit mistake, to become illusioned, to cheat others, and imperfectness of senses. One may declare himself that he's perfect in knowledge, but his senses are imperfect. So how he can call himself that he has got the perfect knowledge by speculative method?
Professor: Hm.
Prabhupāda: The instrument which he is using for speculation, that instrument itself is imperfect.
Prabhupāda: Because it has began from imperfect. Therefore conclusion must be imperfect.
Dr. Hauser: Yes.
Prabhupāda: But if we begin from the perfect, the conclusion will be perfect. What are the four defects? Explain.
Haṁsadūta: Uh, four de... Every conditioned soul, you or I, anyone, born in this material world, he's defective by four things. He has got imperfect senses. Just like you don't see what's happening beyond the wall. So this is imperfection of the senses. There are so many examples. The next thing is you're subjected to be illusioned. You may accept a thing for real which is not real. Just like we accept the body as self, but we are not the body. The body is a lump of matter. We are simply witnessing the changes of the body, but we are not the... So this is illusion. Then...
Prabhupāda: Mistakes.
Haṁsadūta: He's subjected to make mistakes. He'll make a mistake. Everybody knows. To err is human, right? And he...
Prabhupāda: Cheating.
Haṁsadūta: Has a propensity for cheating. Propensity for cheating means that although he's imperfect senses, subject to make mistake and he's illusioned, he will write books giving...
Prabhupāda: Instructions.
Haṁsadūta: Instructions. Because... But he's not qualified. So he's cheating.
Dr. Hauser: He's cheating.
Haṁsadūta: Yes.
Dr. Hauser: He's also cheating himself.
Haṁsadūta: Yes. Cheating himself and...
Prabhupāda: Cheating others.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: They use these terms to explain their proposed theory. This terminology.
Prabhupāda: Which terminology?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Like "mistake" and all these things.
Prabhupāda: Mistake, There cannot be... That is the difference between God and ourself. We are living entity, God is also living entity. But He has no four defects. We have got four defects. We commit mistake, we are illusioned, our senses are imperfect, and we cheat. God does not do all these things. That is the difference between God and ourselves. He does not commit mistake. He is not illusioned. He does not cheat, and His senses are perfect. Vedāhaṁ samatītāni (BG 7.26).
Prof. Wolfe: No real reform.
Prabhupāda: No.
Prof. Wolfe: Because they all want to go on cheating.
Prabhupāda: Yes. You see? That is the qualification of conditioned soul: To become a cheater, and to become cheated. This is the condition. To become a cheater is one of the conditions of material life. The four defects: He must commit mistake, he must be illusioned, and he must cheat, and his senses are imperfect. These are the four qualifications of the materialistic person.
Dr. Wolfe: Śrīla Prabhupāda, wouldn't it be more sincere if these people, these scientists said, "We don't want to be taken out of this dream, that with our senses and with all the machines built on senses we will be able to make it"? But they don't want to be taken out of that dream.
Prabhupāda: But that is their foolishness.
Dr. Wolfe: They don't want to admit it even.
Prabhupāda: Why not? They have to admit Just like I gave you the example that you cannot see how many stars are there, but there are. If you say, "I don't see it, I don't believe it," that is your foolishness. That is your foolishness. You have to admit that your senses are limited. They are not perfect. That is the four defects of the conditioned soul: he commits mistake, he is illusioned, he cheats, and his senses are imperfect.
Prabhupāda: This is the policy. "Cheat him. Without giving money, give him paper, and get his labor, and produce goods." This is modern economy. Is it not? A laborer, a worker, is given high salary, high wages. So what he is getting? It is paper. And he is very enthusiastic to give his labor. So production is more. And when you go to purchase the products, then you have to pay again. Whatever you have earned, you have to pay everything, pay to the bank or pay to the man. Simply cheating process is going on. There is no solution. People are cheaters. They have been taught how to cheat. Everyone has got a cheating propensity. That is conditioned life. Four defects: to commit mistake, to become illusioned, to cheat and imperfectness of the senses. So cheating propensity everyone has got. So that cheating propensity is being encouraged more and more. Instead of minimizing it or stop it, it is being encouraged.
1975 Conversations and Morning Walks
Varūpa Dāmodara: "Defects and Errors in Scientific Research," it will be a title and we will find out all the mistakes that normally found in scientific research. That will be written by Mādhava Prabhu.
Prabhupāda: And add "and how to make it perfect." Find out the defects. Don't be, what is called...?
Rūpānuga: Negative.
Prabhupāda: Negative only.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, we want to bring the, our four defects in our sense perception.
Prabhupāda: Sense perception is defective.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, there are four defects.
Prabhupāda: And if you go beyond the sense perception, that is perfection.
Svarūpa Dāmodara: That will be Mādhava Prabhu's duty.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Guest 1: One thing I wondered about. In our terms sometimes you can find a person that you admire or who you believe does good, but he professes to be an atheist. I'm thinking about a person like Bertrand Russell.
Prabhupāda: No, our ideas are standard. We are not manufacturing any idea. Just like whatever we speak, immediately we give evidence from the śāstra. That is our standard. We accept standard idea, and the standard idea means the ideas given by God. That is standard. There is no mistake. There is no cheating, There is no illusion. Any idea we form, that is prone to these four defects. One defect is that we are prone to commit mistake. We are prone to be illusioned. And our senses are imperfect. So being subjected to mistaken idea, illusioned idea, our senses being imperfect, if we want to give some law, that is cheating.
Ravīndra-svarūpa: The same criticism that you made of induction was also made by John Stuart Mill and Bertrand Russell, but they became skeptics. They said, "Therefore there's no knowledge at all."
Prabhupāda: That is another nonsense. That is also speculation. (laughter) "Because I have failed, therefore there is no knowledge." This is also imperfect because how I can conclude like that? I am imperfect. I cannot decide this way or that way. So that is also. Vedic knowledge says that a conditioned soul has got four defects: illusion, mistake, imperfectness and cheating. Any conditioned soul. Even Brahma, he is receiving knowledge from Kṛṣṇa. Tene brahma hṛdā ya ādi-kavaye (SB 1.1.1). Ādi-kavi means Brahma. He is the most perfect person within this universe, Lord Brahma. So he is also receiving knowledge from Kṛṣṇa. Any conditioned soul, beginning from Brahmā down to the ant, they are defective in four ways: illusion, mistake, imperfectness and cheating. They know that "I am imperfect." Just this Darwin. He knew that he is imperfect, and he cheated so many persons—by false theory, which he cannot explain. He simply gives, "Perhaps millions of years' gap...," this, that. That is not knowledge. So the imperfect person is prone to become a cheater. So we should not take knowledge from the cheaters. What do you think?
Svarūpa Dāmodara: We should take knowledge from Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
1976 Conversations and Morning Walks
Ātreya Ṛṣi: And in this modern age, this cheating is very prominent...
Prabhupāda: No, no. Modern or old, anyone who is a conditioned soul, he has got cheating propensity, four defects. One of them is the cheating propensity.
Prabhupāda: (break) ...there's no such thing. "I believe." Immediately.... What Kṛṣṇa says, that's true. That is our movement. Kṛṣṇa consciousness. What I believe? I'm a nonsense. I am.... I have got four defects in my life: illusion, mistake, cheating, insufficiency. What is the meaning of my belief? A cheater saying, "I believe," I have to accept if I know that he's a cheat?
Prabhupāda: So here is definitive knowledge, in our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. There's no question of "I believe" or "You believe." No. What you are, your belief? You may believe wrongly. You are not perfect. They do not accept this, that every one of the conditioned souls is imperfect with four defects: illusion, committing mistake, cheating, and imperfectness of senses. Who will say it is not? It is. If you have got imperfect senses, then what is the use of your belief? If the child says "Oh, there is no father. I have never seen my father," does it mean there is no father?
Devotee (1): They've convinced us that these machines are accurate.
Prabhupāda: How it is accurate? It is manufactured by you. You are a fool.
Devotee (1): But some things they say, like the rays...
Prabhupāda: They say, they may say, but first of all, what is the position of the conditioned soul? Four defects. You must commit mistakes, you must be illusioned, his senses are imperfect, and he's a cheater. These are the four defects of conditioned souls. So how the conditioned soul can give perfect knowledge?
1977 Conversations and Morning Walks
Prabhupāda: Everyone must make mistake because a conditioned soul are liable to four defects. One of them is to commit mistake. One of them is to become illusioned. One of them, he is a cheater. And one of them, his senses are imperfect. So every conditioned soul who has got this material body, he is defective in these four things. Therefore he has to take knowledge from a person who has no defects. Then his knowledge will be perfect. Just like a small child, he is defective, but he receives the knowledge from the father: "This is called pencil." A child does not know what it is, but the father says, "My dear child, it is pencil." And if he says, "It is pencil," then it is correct, although he's a child, because he has received the knowledge from the person who knows it. Similarly, our principle is—that is Vedic principle-evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). The knowledge has to be taken from the superior, liberated person.
Prabhupāda: Everything is cheating because so long you are a conditioned soul, out of four defects, one of the defects is cheating propensity, kāraṇa pāṭava, er, vipralipsa.(?) That is a qualification. And in this material world, the more you are expert cheater, you are considered very able man. All over the world, so many expert cheaters are going on.
Correspondence
1973 Correspondence
Your fifth question is, "Bhagavad-gita says that the conditioned soul is subjected to four defects. Does that refer to the body or the soul?" The defects are there in the living being when he is acting on the material platform. As stated in Bhagavad-gita chapter 15 verse 17: "dvavimau purusau loke, ksaras caksara eva ca, ksarah sarvani bhutani, kutastho 'ksara ucyate:" "There are two classes of beings, the fallible and the infallible. In the material world every entity is fallible, and in the spiritual world every entity is called infallible." So the defects are there only on the material platform. One who is acting in Krsna Consciousness is beyond those defects.
| Page Title: | Four defects of conditional life (Conv and Letters) |
| Compiler: | Labangalatika, Alakananda |
| Created: | 02 of Feb, 2010 |
| Totals by Section: | BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=19, Let=1 |
| No. of Quotes: | 20 |