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Disciple of the victorious party

Expressions researched:
"disciple of the victorious party" |"disciple of the winning, victorious party"

Lectures

Srimad-Bhagavatam Lectures

So Sārvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya was defeated by Caitanya Mahāprabhu. He was elderly person. There may be talks on philosophy, but if one party is defeated, the defeated person, he must be disciple of the winning, victorious party. But at the present moment we'll go on talking for years together, and nobody is defeated; nobody is going to be disciple. Then what is the use of talking like that?
Lecture on SB 6.1.22 -- Honolulu, May 22, 1976:

So a person like Rūpa Gosvāmī, why he will waste time talking with a nonsense? No. Actually teaching is for the student, not for outsiders. All these talks should be between... So student means who has surrendered. That, he is student. Otherwise what is the use of wasting time? There is no use. Therefore Kṛṣṇa said that tad viddhi praṇipātena (BG 4.34). Praṇipātena means fully surrendering. If you have still doubts to surrender, then don't waste time. Don't waste time. That is not the way. Tad viddhi praṇipātena paripraśnena sevayā. Guru has to be given service, that nīcavat. That nīcavat. Nīcavat means menial servant. Whatever guru says... Guru says, "Just brush my shoes." "Yes, sir." You cannot think, "Oh, I am coming from such a respectable person, I am so much learned, and my guru is asking me to 'Brush my shoe'? No, I am not doing it." No, then you are not disciple. Nīcavat. That is the training. So praṇipāta, if you find out somebody where you can fully surrender, then accept guru. Don't make guru a fashion, just like you keep a dog, fashion, pet dog. People, they generally do that, that "Everyone has a guru. Let me collect. Let me pick up some guru who will be dancing dog." That kind of guru will not help you. You must be convinced that "Here is a guru where I can surrender." So then you can make praśna, or question. Then the question will be answered. Otherwise it is waste of time. That is not the Vedic system, simply waste of time. And if there is really talk between one philosopher to another philosopher... Just like Sārvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya and Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Sārvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya was a great scholar, and Caitanya Mahāprabhu...? Who can speak about scholarship? So Sārvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya was defeated by Caitanya Mahāprabhu. He was elderly person. There may be talks on philosophy, but if one party is defeated, the defeated person, he must be disciple of the winning, victorious party. But at the present moment we'll go on talking for years together, and nobody is defeated; nobody is going to be disciple. Then what is the use of talking like that? So this kind of things will not do. We have to follow the Vedic principle that either remain without guru... And if you want to make a guru, first of all be convinced that "He is fit to become my guru." But generally people, they don't want transcendental knowledge. They want some material profit. So if the guru can give him some gold, not all, then he accepts him guru or the God or something like that. So this way will not help us.

So here this Ajāmila... Ajāmila was trained up, the son of a brāhmaṇa. Dvija, this very word is used. Kānyakubje dvijaḥ kaścid āsīd dāsī-patir ajāmilaḥ. But unfortunately he became the husband or keeper of a prostitute. Dāsī-pati. Pati means husband, or pati means the chief. So dāsī-pati. Dāsī-pati means... Formerly, if one is prostitute-hunter, then the maidservant... Still in India the lower class, the servant class, they become prostitute. First of all no gentleman is prostitute-hunter, but if he is... He cannot make in the society a innocent girl a prostitute. That is a... There is no possibility in India still, because no respectable man's daughter will mix with any unknown young man, still. So how he (she) can become prostitute? There is no possibility. So if anyone wanted prostitute, there is this professional. The prostitute... Even in Kṛṣṇa's time there were prostitute. We have seen. When Kṛṣṇa came from, came back from Hastinapura, many prostitute devotee went to receive Him. So that means in the Vedic society prostitutes are allowed. Those who are not satisfied with one wife or legitimate wife, they can go to the prostitute. But they cannot intermingle in the society and spoil the society. So this rascal became a prostitute-hunter, dāsī-pati. Therefore it is called dāsī-pati. Dāsī means śūdra, śūdra, fourth class. The first class, brāhmaṇa; second class, kṣatriya; third class, vaiśya; and the śūdra, the fourth class, the servants, they are women.

Sri Caitanya-caritamrta Lectures

Sanskrit scholars would come in such celebrated places, and they would challenge for arguing on the śāstras. So the rule was that two parties will argue, and the defeated party will become the disciple of the victorious party. That was the system.
Lecture on CC Madhya-lila 21.62-67 -- New York, January 6, 1966:

Now, India was united on the strength of religious culture and Sanskrit language. All over India the lingua franca, or the language, common language, at least for the scholars, not for the common man... The common man could speak any language—Hindi, Parsi, or Bengali, Oriya, Telegu, so many. There are so many languages. In every district you will find some language. But that was not taken into consideration. When education is concerned, every student all over India, they would take education in Sanskrit. Sanskrit language was the... So our present government, they have introduced a state language as Hindi. There are so many protests and so many quarrels. They would have done better if they would have introduced Sanskrit language as it was previously. So the Sanskrit language was one, and the culture was Vedic. Therefore there was no disunion. Every part of the country in India, the same system. He may be a Bengali, he may be a Maharastrian, he may be a Gujarati, or he may be Oriya—there were so many provinces—but the culture was the same. Another unity was that sacred places were distributed all over India. Just like Gayā, a sacred place, it is situated in Bihar. And sacred place, Benares, it is situated in Uttar Pradesh. Vṛndāvana is situated on the border of Uttar Pradesh and Punjab. Similarly, Kashmir, and Punjab also; in South India, Rāmeśvaram; in Himalayan province, Haridwar. In this way all these provinces were distributed, and still it is going on. The provincialism is amongst the educated circle. So far the mass of people are concerned, they don't know what is province. They travel from one province to another. They don't require any visa. They don't require any passport. So that was very nice.

So this Sanskrit scholar, Keśava Kāśmīrī, he came from Kashmir to challenge the learned scholars in other parts of the country. There were four celebrated places where highly educated scholars were there. One was at Benares. Benares still, it is considered to be the center of Sanskrit scholars place. Similarly Navadvīpa, where Caitanya Mahāprabhu was born. And in Bihar there was a place, Darbhanga. That is also a scholarly. So Benares, and Berhampur (?), Berhampur in East Bengal near Dacca. So some of the places in India, they are very famous for learned scholars. Still they are continuing. So Sanskrit scholars would come in such celebrated places, and they would challenge for arguing on the śāstras. So the rule was that two parties will argue, and the defeated party will become the disciple of the victorious party. That was the system. So Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu, when He was sixteen years old, this Keśava Kāśmīrī came to Navadvīpa to challenge. In other places he was victorious. He became champion. And then, at last, he came to Bengal, Navadvīpa. So that scholarly discussion will take place.

Now notice is already given that "Keśava Kāśmīrī has come here," and he had an umbrella, and the four sides was covered with gold, and the one side is remaining. As soon as he becomes victorious in Navadvīpa, that side also will be covered with gold. So the people of Navadvīpa, learned scholars, they first of all thought that Nimāi Paṇḍita... Caitanya Mahāprabhu was known as Nimāi Paṇḍita because He was boy, sixteen-years-old boy, very learned scholar, especially in logic He was very learned scholar, logician. He was so... Even in His sixth year, with His class friends He will establish one theory; again He will cut it; again He will establish; again He will cut it; again the same, in His own way. He was so learned scholar, logician. So the elderly scholars of Navadvīpa, they designed that "This Nimāi Paṇḍita should be forwarded first to talk with Keśava Kāśmīrī because He is a boy. But He is a very nice boy. He is a very learned boy. If He becomes victorious, then our Navadvīpa will be glorified, that 'Keśava Kāśmīrī was defeated by a sixteen-years-old boy in Navadvīpa.' And if Nimāi Paṇḍita is defeated, then we shall go forward. We shall say, 'Oh, you have defeated a boy. Let us..., come to us.' So we get second chance." So that was the plan, Bengali plan, second chance: first chance, second chance. So it was arranged like that, that Lord Caitanya, Nimāi Paṇḍita, would talk, would discuss with Keśava Kāśmīrī.

Page Title:Disciple of the victorious party
Compiler:Visnu Murti
Created:14 of Feb, 2012
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=2, Con=0, Let=0
No. of Quotes:2