Civil (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"civil" |"civilian" |"civilians" |"civility" |"civilly"

1967 Conversations and Morning Walks

Discourse on Lord Caitanya Play Between Srila Prabhupada and Hayagriva -- April 5-6, 1967, San Francisco:

Hayagrīva: Yes. All right. I can't think of anything there. That leads into the next scene, third scene.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Then the next scene is that some constables came and during the Hari-saṅkīrtana, they broke the mṛdaṅgas that "You have disobeyed the magistrate order that... So you cannot do it." So as the constables, they do some violence or assault, so they did that. And after the constables went away Caitanya Mahāprabhu was informed. He came. He saw that the mṛdaṅgas are broken and everything is strewn away so Caitanya Mahāprabhu saw. He decided, "All right. Now we shall organize a civil disobedience movement. Now tomorrow we shall organize thousands and thousands of people with mṛdaṅgas and we shall approach the magistrate house." So He... Next scene... What is that next scene?

Hayagrīva: Now the constables broke up a saṅkīrtana carried on by Caitanya's friends. Any location here particular?

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is called the Śrīvāsa house.

Discourse on Lord Caitanya Play Between Srila Prabhupada and Hayagriva -- April 5-6, 1967, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: Chanting, and it was mitigated, and he allowed. First of all, there was objection, then there was civil disobedience, then when they compromised, the Chand Kazi allowed the movement. This is the whole idea.

Hayagrīva: The fifth scene is renunciation of household life.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Hayagrīva: This is at age...? This is considerably later then. This is about ten years later.

Prabhupāda: No. Renunciation... Now this Chand Kazi, he was... This movement when He was about 20 years old. Do you follow?

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Questions and Answers -- Montreal, August 26, 1968:

Prabhupāda: The Kazi challenged His saṅkīrtana movement and first times warned Him not to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, and when He did not care for it, then he ordered that, er, that mṛdaṅga should be broken. So the constables came and broke the mṛdaṅgas. This information was given to Lord Caitanya, and He ordered civil disobedience. He was the first man in the history of India who started this civil disobedience movement. It is not Gandhi who is the originator of civil disobedience; it was Caitanya Mahāprabhu. He said that "Defy the order of the Kazi." Kazi means magistrate. So "This evening we shall go at the Kazi's house in hundreds of thousands, with mṛdaṅga and kīrtana." So simply by His order many hundreds of thousands young men—not young men; young, old, all kind of men-gathered, and... The point is just how popular leader He was. Even in His young age, when He was only twenty years old, how popular He was. So..., and because He was a learned brāhmaṇa, people would send Him many presentation. A brāhmaṇa is not expected to work.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Lord Caitanya Play Told to Tamala Krsna -- August 4, 1969, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes. You have got nice ideas. You can do very nicely. Yes. This is required, creative ideas.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Maybe... About Lord Caitanya's civil disobedience. That is with the Kazi? His civil disobedience?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That is the Kazi.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I read the introduction. There is a lot of material on it. Maybe some other things that we can...

Prabhupāda: You can make scene that people, His disciples, are performing kīrtana and one scene you can make Kazi, Muslim magistrate, is sitting, and the brāhmaṇas, they come. "Sir, you are our protector. You are Kazi. You are magistrate. And this Nimāi Paṇḍita, young boy, He is creating so much disturbance." "What is that?" "He has begun this chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. This is not our Hindu religion. He is chanting so loudly. Now this is the time God is sleeping. So He'll be disturbed. So the whole society will be vanquished if God becomes angry. So He'll be disturbed." So Kazi... After all, Hindus are complaining. So Kazi said, "All right, I am taking steps."

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview with Reporters -- November 10, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because you are (indistinct), it is better to surrender and be peaceful. (break) ...here, there, here, there, here. Kṛṣṇa says, "No. That surrender will not help you. Just surrender to Me, you will be happy." So intelligent person will feel that "If I have to surrender, why not to Kṛṣṇa? Why surrender to some foolish man? Let me surrender to Kṛṣṇa. If my business is to surrender, I cannot do without surrender." That is intelligence. That Kṛṣṇa says,

bahūnāṁ janmanām ante

jñānavān māṁ prapadyate

vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti

sa mahātmā su-durlabhaḥ

(BG 7.19)

Therefore who surrenders to Kṛṣṇa, he is mahātmā. It is very rare mahātmā, su-durlabhaḥ. So anyone who has surrendered to Kṛṣṇa, they are mahātmā. They are not ordinary men. So mahātmā su-durlabhaḥ.

Reporter: Sir... (break)

Prabhupāda: We have to surrender, that's a fact. But we refuse to surrender to Kṛṣṇa. That is our disease. He is not free, just like in a state, just like in Mahatma Gandhi's time, so many started civil disobedience, but the government brought them all into prison, and they obliged them to obey. Similarly, our position is that... (end)

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with the GBC -- May 25, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is the point. Our advancement means the more we meet opposing elements, "Oh, that is alright." Therefore preacher is the best devotee because he is a soldier. Just like government gives all importance to the fighting soldier. When there is war, all comforts for the soldier first, then the civil people. There was no butter in Germany, there was no butter. But the soldiers were profusely supplied with butter. And sometimes when the enemy attacks, they throw it away and go away and go to another shelter and still there is butter. That my Godbrother (indistinct) when he first came to India I asked him that, "I heard that you German people are very robust, stout and strong, why you are so thin and weak?" So he replied me in this way that, "In my childhood when I was eight years old weekly I was getting butter for (indistinct)". Everything was controlled, even for children. But the soldiers, there was no control. So that is, my point is, that those who are soldiers, fighting on behalf of Kṛṣṇa, they are brave soldiers. Na ca tasmān manuṣyeṣu kaścin me priya-kṛttamaḥ (BG 18.69).

Room Conversation -- July 4, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Not preset. That you can do, because you have got little independence. It is not natural to commit suicide. It is unnatural. So, because we have got independence, we can go from nature to unnature, and we shall be prepared for that. Just like a prisoner cannot go out of the prisonhouse naturally, but somehow or other he arranges to jump over the wall and goes away. Then he becomes again criminal, for farther (indistinct). Naturally, the prisoners cannot go out of the prisonhouse. Somehow or other, he manages to go out. That means he becomes again criminal. He will be again arrested, and his term of imprisonment will be increased, or he will be punished more. So naturally we cannot violate the destiny, but if we do it, then we suffer(?). But our destiny can be changed by Kṛṣṇa when we are Kṛṣṇa conscious. That we do not do, but Kṛṣṇa will do. Kṛṣṇa says, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi: (BG 18.66) "I shall give you protection." So that change takes place for my protection by Kṛṣṇa. There are two stages: nondevotee and devotee. The nondevotee is under the control of material nature, and devotee is under the direct control of Kṛṣṇa. Just like a big man. In the office there are many employees, they are controlled by different departmental superintendent. But the small man at home is controlling his children directly. The controller, he is controller both in the office and factory and home, but at home he is controller directly; outside home he is controller indirectly. But he is controller always. Similarly, God is controller always. When one becomes devotee, he is controlled directly by God. When he is nondevotee, he is controlled by His agent, māyā. But he has to be controlled. Just like every citizen of America is controlled by the government. When he's all right, his civil department controls him. When he's not all right, then the criminal department controls him.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversations with Sannyasis -- March 15, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So, not offense (?). There is no question of making. We should behave ourself very nicely. Offending or pleasing that is (indistinct). You cannot offend everyone, neither you can please everyone. That is not possible. You keep to your standard. You keep to your standard. Then everything, everybody will see, "Oh, that is nice." Offending, you cannot please everybody. That is not possible. Even if you hear very nicely. Caitanya Mahāprabhu could not please everyone. He had to start civil disobedience. Even Gandhi was killed. That is not possible. You cannot please everybody. But you must stick to your own principle, and behave nicely. That's all. All right.

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1973, New Delhi:

Brahmānanda: Well, it means... I thought it had something to do with civil servants, where they all live in a dormitory and eat in a large hall.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Brahmānanda: And they all contribute...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Brahmānanda: ...part of their salary.

Prabhupāda: So if you make that association, that will not help you. Joint mess, dormitory. Or joint family. Just like in India. There are five brothers. They're earning. Father and mother is the leader. They're handing over the money, and the father, mother managing. That is Indian system, a joint family. So joint family or joint mess, the same thing. So if you make like that, a center, then it is no good. You must get spiritual strength. Karmī strength will not help you. What they are doing in Babar(?) Road, these girls?

Morning Walk -- December 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So what does...? But that means they do not understand what is meant by religion. They are thinking religion means some fanatical faith. They are meaning that. That is the whole world conception of religion. But actual religion we are now preaching, actual, what is religion. Religion means... Just like Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekam: (BG 18.66) "Give up all rascal religion. Surrender unto Me." So who is a sane man who will deny, "No, I don't surrender to God"? Who is a sane man? He must be insane. Anyone who says that "I don't like God, I don't like to surrender unto Him," then he must be insane. He has already surrendered. He is going on under the condition of surrender, but it is not done very... Just like a prisoner. He is already surrendered to the government. Still, he says, "I don't care for government." This is the position. He's a madman. The state arrests him, kicks him, and puts him in the jail. Still, he says, "I don't care for government." So what can be done? "We don't care for the government." Just like Gandhi started civil disobedience movement, disobedience to the government laws, but all the whole stock was put into jail and they were beaten with shoes. But still, they said, "No, we are..."

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- March 16, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Toast. And they will, the (indistinct) will be stopped. As soon as the belly is loaded... But they are accustomed. After eating they are (indistinct) not easily. (break) ...for sevait say (?) is for the Kanpur wala. (break) ...then there is no question of fighting, otherwise we shall take criminal and civil (indistinct—break) ...seven hundred.

Gurudāsa: Seven hundred. (break)

Devotee: ...renovate these rooms, or just in general?

Prabhupāda: Huh? General.

Devotee: General.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That veranda, that, whatever he likes we shall, we will spend.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Lord Śiva is Lord Śiva. He is very powerful demigod. He can give. He has got the power. But in spite of being favored by Lord Śiva, in spite of his becoming the great devotee of Lord Śiva, why he is described as rākṣasa? That is the point. So therefore if I say Rāvaṇa a rākṣasa, according to the śāstra, another devotee may be angry. So what can I do? It is stated in the śāstra, rākṣasa. Similarly, in the śāstra it is stated that na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ: "If one is not surrendered to Kṛṣṇa he is duṣkṛtina, the most sinful, mūḍhā, rascal, naradhāma, lowest of the mankind, māyayā apahṛta-jñāna." These things are there. But if we quote the śāstra, that "This man has not surrendered to the Supreme Lord; therefore he is a rascal," then what is wrong with us? It may be very strong words, but it is stated in the śāstra. Just like about Rāvaṇa, it is stated that he is a rākṣasa. So it may be very insulting and strong words, but this is the statement of the śāstra. And if one quotes from the śāstra, what is wrong on his part? Suppose in the court a big man has done something criminal, and the judgement is that he should be punished. So can you accuse the court, "Oh, such a big man?" Just like... For the time being let us understand. Mahatma Gandhi was put to jail in so many times. So nobody could say because according to law there was civil disobedience.

Morning Walk Excerpts -- May 1, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Britishers were maintaining the British Empire at the cost of India. Soldiers, money...

Dr. Patel: Indian Army was Indian Civil totally. Even today it is so. Indian Army fought... (break)

Prabhupāda: Pathans, Sikhs, they fought so nicely.

Dr. Patel: This Mount Hazenot(?) battle, which I read very...

Prabhupāda: (break) (laughter) Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Girirāja: "Śukadeva Gosvāmī has used the word śraddhānvita for one who is trained in the spiritual life. Śraddhā, or faith, is the beginning. One who has developed his faith in Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the supreme spirit soul, can both describe and hear." (break)

Prabhupāda: Why?

Devotee: They're in the hospital.

Bhāgavata: Caranaravinda was the hospital.

Morning Walk -- June 6, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: So that means it was attacked?

Guru-gaurāṅga: Probably defending banks or things like that. Civil.

Prabhupāda: Two wars, 1914 to 1918.

Swiss Devotee: They have big military poems. Yes.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Swiss Devotee: Many, many.

Guru-gaurāṅga: We read in the papers, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that they did a survey among the Capucine priests and fifty percent felt that their spiritual life was hampered by the fact that they could not have intimate relations with women. And forty percent felt that they were not allowed enough freedom and that obedience was not good.

Prabhupāda: Not allowed in...?

Guru-gaurāṅga: Enough freedom.

Prabhupāda: What is that freedom?

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: No. We are teaching... Of course, we do not defy this modern advance of material civil... We don't say that. But this is our main business, that is, jīvasya tattva-jijñāsā, to inquire about the Absolute Truth.

Prof. Pater Porsch: So can you not say that this knowledge is an ātma-vidyā, that we are trying to come to the knowledge of the ātman.

Prabhupāda: Ātmine?

Prof. Pater Porsch: Ātmā, self.

Prabhupāda: Oh, ātmā, yes. Tattva-jijñāsā means ātma-jijñāsā.

Prof. Pater Porsch: That is why it is also correct to translate the term kṛṣṇa-arjuna-saṁvara (?) as a kind of metaphysical knowledge, philosophical knowledge.

Prabhupāda: (aside:) No, not now. No, not now. No, whole knowledge. Metaphysical, physical, everything is there.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- (World War III) -- April 4, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Yes. The farm project... Even some hundreds of years, it was so nice. Even there was war, they would not attack the farmers. Rather, they would ask, "Where the other party has gone?" So they will say: "Oh, we have seen some soldiers going this way." That's all. They were not affected. That was the principle. Farmers were not attacked, just like at the present moment, the law is the civilians are not attacked. The military target is attacked. That is the law. But they do all nonsense. Even at the present moment civilians are not attacked. Just like Kurukṣetra Battle. It was taken far away from the civilian inhabitation.

Haṁsadūta: Some field.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is civilization. "Why these innocent civilians should be killed? Let us fight, military to military. That's all." That is honest fighting. We have to settle some things by fighting. So fighting may be, I mean to say, limited within the fighters, not with the civilians.

Morning Walk -- (World War III) -- April 4, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Why not? Yes. But they, they are so rascals, they throw bomb anywhere.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Especially atom bomb.

Prabhupāda: But one thing is that because civilians are also responsible for declaring war, because the parliament is the representation of the people...

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Karma.

Prabhupāda: Therefore, now the war is between people to people, nation to nation. They support with men and money. So therefore they are also killed by nature's law. (break)

Rāmeṣvara: Prabhupāda, in the Ādi-līlā, you wrote that the Communist movement is greater than the capitalist movement because there are more śūdras than vaiśyas so that in a war between Communism and capitalism, the Communists would win.

Prabhupāda: Naturally. They are in greater number.

Room Coversation with Psychiatrist and Indian Boy -- May 12, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: No. Our viewpoint is that in the material world, who has accepted this material body—anyone, but we specially take the human society—they require treatment, everyone. Everyone is mentally diseased, and therefore he is unhappy. Everyone. Harāv abhaktasya kuto mahād-guṇa (SB 5.18.12). Anyone who has no sense of God consciousness, he is diseased mentally. He requires treatment. The whole human society, especially at the present moment, they have given up God consciousness. They are not interested. That is their disease. And everyone requires treatment. So the whole Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is the mass treatment of the materialistic persons who are mentally diseased. That is our proposition. It is... In India there was a case. A man committed murder, and he pleaded in the court that... His pleader, his lawyer, pleaded that he was mad at that time. We also accept unless one becomes mad, one cannot commit murder or suicide. So the civil surgeon was brought to give evidence whether this man is actually mad. The civil surgeon said that "So far my experience is concerned—I have treated so many persons—in my opinion everyone is mad. So if on account of madness one should be excused from the law, then it is Your Honor's discretion, but so far I have studied, more or less, everyone is mad."

Room Conversation with Journalist -- May 19, 1975, Melbourne:

Journalist: Civil what, sir?

Prabhupāda: In the civilized human society there is some system of religion. So that system of religion means try to understand God. Religion means the law given by God. So civilized human beings, they are trying to understand God and His laws. That is called religion. Now the difference between dog and me is that I can try to understand what is God, what is my position; the dog cannot understand. Dog means the animals. They cannot understand. So that is the difference between a human being and a dog. If we give up religion or the method to understand God and our relationship with Him, then we will remain dog. Then we remain dog. We are not human being. So at the present moment the so-called human society, civilized human society, is giving up the conception of God, understanding God, especially the Communist party. They are openly declaring that "We don't believe in God." But those who are not Communists, they, lip sympathy, they say that "Yes, we believe in God," but actually they do not believe.

Room Conversation with Lt. Mozee, Policeman -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: No civil state wants this criminality. That's a fact. But they do not know how to stop it. That we can suggest. We are good advisor. Now, the government is the executor. So if they take our advice and execute it, then things will be done nicely.

Lt. Mozee: There are countless numbers in the United States of large facilities of the Christian faith, and, like you, they give the refreshment of the holy communion. Why does this not work? Why is this not cleansing the heart?

Prabhupāda: The answer is... Then we come to the details. So you say, "Christian," and I find to find out a Christian. I find difficulty to find out one Christian. I must frankly say, because the so-called Christians, they do not abide by the Bible's order that in the Christian's Bible it is said, "Thou shall not kill." and where is a Christian who does not kill? So this can be effective only persons who are practicing religion. So these persons, they are trained to practice. So their chanting of the holy name of God and others' are different. (break) It is not simply a rubber stamp position. It must be practiced, realized. This chanting of holy name by our men who are trained up and the same chanting by others will be different. Of course, if you... (break) ...your Hindu principle. That is secular state, not to remain callous: "Whatever you like you can do. We have no concern to see." That is not government's duty.

Morning Walk -- July 29, 1975, Dallas:

Prabhupāda: ...of people, they do not care for these political things. Even in Gandhi's strong civil disobedience movement, out of the whole population of India, only sixty-thousand men joined. What is the India's population?

Brahmānanda: Six hundred million.

Prabhupāda: Six hundred million, and out of that sixty-thousand joined, and it became successful. Sixty thousand joined by statistics. Actually worker, I don't think more than ten thousand people. Exactly like Indian village. Here there is no business. They simply reside.

Brahmānanda: Yes. (break) (outside:)

Satsvarūpa: ...it's over there somewhere. He's one of the world's richest men, H. L. Hunt. He's a Dallas oil millionaire. Some devotees tried to approach him, but at his house he has servants and... At least the servant took a Bhagavad-gītā. They couldn't see the man himself.

Dayananda: He died. A few months ago. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...otogrika? (?) Similar like that. (break) ...dollars?

Morning Walk -- October 6, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: Our professors, they came from missionary, but there were other officers in government service, I.C.S., Indian Civil Service. They were also. In the province where they were employed he must learn the provincial language. Their administration was excellent, undoubtedly, British administration. Nobody in the world, so far administration... But their crooked policy ruined them; otherwise good administrator, good politician, good diplomat.

Harikeśa: They made those nice buildings in Delhi, too.

Prabhupāda: Huh? Yes, and everything good. Simply heart was not very good.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Heart.

Prabhupāda: "Only for Englishmen," "Only for Englishmen." Still that policy is going on here. That is not good. When one takes shelter of you, you must give him proper protection. That liberality is not there.

Morning Walk -- October 21, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: General consensus of opinion... Let them say that there will be no more death, and how it will act? General consensus of opinion... Let them vote, "We do not want death anymore." Will it be accepted?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: No.

Prabhupāda: Then? What is the value of your vote? You are madmen. Just like Gandhi made civil disobedience here, and government did not accept it. What could he do? (break) ...truth. If the majority says, "No, it is truth," it will be truth?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: No.

Prabhupāda: Then untruth is untruth.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 27, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Eh? Doctor's land, Dr. Durgacaran Bannerjee Road, they belonged to very respectable family of that quarter, Bannerjee family. And Surendranath Bannerjee was the first I.C.S. I.C.S. He passed I.C.S. examination, Indian Civil Service, but he did not accept it. Aurobindo Ghosh was made by Surendranath Bannerjee. He was born in London. Aurobindo Ghosh's father, Manmohan Ghosh, he was a medical man in London. He was born... He's English birth. Well, later on, he became English-hater.

Jayapatākā: French-lover.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Jayapatākā: Lover of the French.

Prabhupāda: He?

Jayapatākā: Aurobindo?

Room Conversation -- May 4, 1976, Honolulu:

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: China has achieved great material strides in the last twenty years. There is no prostitution. They have wiped out flies, no more flies causing disease. There is.... And they look to a very bitter past of exploitation at the hand of foreigners and internal civil war and great suffering and starvation. So when they look back over twenty years they see, "Oh, we have advanced greatly." So they are very satisfied.

Prabhupāda: No, if they actually progressing, they will have to come to that point—that is natural—where, placing your service, you can serve everyone. That is the right conclusion. But we have got that right conclusion. If you take from us you can make immediately. But if you want to wait by your research work, then you can waste your time. But you have to come to this point. That is a fact. Just like you have to give food to the mouth. If you do not know, out of rascaldom you experiment here, you experiment here, you experiment here, you experiment.... There are so many holes. You go on experimenting, and waste your time.

Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa will give all facilities if we are sincerely serving Kṛṣṇa. The government gives all facilities to the government servant. The government gives all facilities to the soldiers. When there is fight, there is scarcity of commodities in the civil life, but there is no scarcity among the soldiers. The first consideration, soldiers. Similarly, those devotees who are fighting against māyā, their facility is first concern. They're fighting, trying to save the people from the onslaught of material energy. That will be explained. What is next verse?

Nalinīkaṇṭha: Tat prayāso na kartavyo yata āyur-vyayaḥ param, na tathā.

Prabhupāda: What is previous verse before that?

Nalinīkaṇṭha: Sukham aindriyakaṁ daityāḥ.

Prabhupāda: We have discussed this.

Morning Walk -- June 13, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: There is possibility of another civil war?

Ambarīṣa: Yes. Possibly some sort of a race war or something. In Boston, they have a lot of trouble because of this bussing. They bus the black children into the white neighborhoods to go to school to achieve equal education, and the white communities do not like this. In Boston there has been a lot of violence between the black people and the white people. Very much hatred, very much hate each other.

Prabhupāda: So only remedy is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Ambarīṣa: Yes. About a month ago there was a black lawyer, and he was walking out of the City Hall in Boston, and some white people beat him with an American flag. They beat him with an American flag and hurt him very badly, and this caused very much...

Prabhupāda: Commotion.

Conversation in Airport and Car -- June 21, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: There are many medical practitioners. I have, I learned that British people, they like Indian physicians.

Hari-śauri: Oh, yes, they're very popular.

Prabhupāda: They have got faith that these people treat carefully. One civil surgeon(?) is a Bengali in London. Civil surgeon(?). You have heard this Aurabindo? His father was a medical practitioner in England, and he was born there.

Hari-śauri: His mother was Indian also or...? No. (break)

Prabhupāda: Indian families, they are living for two, three generation. (break) ...teaching them how to make home comfortable, they'll be trained up to become prostitutes. How to kill time.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: So immediately it develops a particular type of desire, "Yes, come here, sit down." First class, second class, third class, fourth class is already there. As you pay, "Yes, come here." It is not evolving; it is already there. He is transferred from one apartment to another. This has to be convinced. We don't find that monkey's body became a human body. That is not in the experience, anyone. The monkey is there, the human being is there. But the soul is going from monkey's body to human's body, or monkey's body to another body. That is by superior administration. Their theory is the body is evolving and some body is missing. Nothing is missing. Every body is there. The soul is being transferred from one body to another. Asatims caturam caiva laksams jīva jātiṣu.(?) Jāti means the form of the body. So the form of the body is already there, and the living entity is being transferred from one body to another. This is called transmigration. We have come here, not that that room developed. This room is here, that room is there, but I am transferring. Because they have no idea of soul, they are thinking that this nice room, now transform into this room or this room, transform... This is foolishness. A civil man transferred into jail—not that his civil house becomes jail. They are thinking wrongly like that, Darwin's theory. Body becoming changed. No. The different types of bodies are already there. The living entity is being transferred from one body to another. Just try to explain. So evolution you take that this apartment is better than that apartment, that apartment better than, and a living entity's going from one after another. So this is evolution. That you are now getting salary, one thousand dollar, now you get fifteen hundred dollars. So according to your qualification, you are getting.

Evening Darsana -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Devotee (1): I have a feeling it could be just like with the Chand Kazi. When he was... Lord Caitanya made a civil disobedience mood, perhaps if we chant loudly enough...

Prabhupāda: No, by hearing this transcendental vibration they will benefited.

Devotee (2): The actual presidential candidates will be there.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Devotee (2): Presidential candidates, the candidates for the president of the United States, they'll be there.

Satsvarūpa: They'll all be there tonight.

Prabhupāda: All right, go ahead chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- July 17, 1976, New York:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The Constitution of the United States gives great deal of protection for civil rights, religious freedom.

Prabhupāda: Therefore they are so advanced.

Kīrtanānanda: But there's a lot of talk now that they aren't, so far as income tax is concerned.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Kīrtanānanda: So far as our collecting money, they are going to maybe change some laws. There's a lot of talk about that now.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They've done that in India.

Hṛdayānanda: The religious leaders have become such cheaters that the governments are thinking "Why shouldn't they pay taxes? They're just ordinary people."

Prabhupāda: Best thing is collect and spend, that's all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Don't bank a lot of money.

Prabhupāda: No. Best buildings are on this Fifth Avenue, huh?

Room Conversation -- July 19, 1976, New York:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: " 'It's surprising that you find this right in New York City. It's our way of life,' said Nagan Patel, a civil engineer from Jersey City, who immigrated from Bombay. 'We love New York City and America. It's the most beautiful place in the world. No other country will give such freedom for our own ceremony.' "

Prabhupāda: That's a fact, that I say always.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "But the Kṛṣṇa people were not entirely free of harassment. Along the parade route three men, including one who said he was an Evangelical Christian minister, jeered at the parade and called on parade watchers to become Christians. 'Idol worship. This is absolutely ridiculous. Read the Bible,' cried one man who would identify himself only as a normal Christian. There was a brief scuffle when an Indian immigrant tried to tear a large placard out of the hands of another heckler. The placard read 'Turn or Burn.' The police broke things up but made no arrests. 'They are insulting us,' said the Kṛṣṇa follower who declined to identify himself. 'I'm a devotee of Kṛṣṇa and Christ. These people who are doing this in the name of Christ are criminals.' " Very strong statement.

Morning Walk -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: ...I.A.S. civil service examination before one man is posted in some responsible office. Similarly, to be recognized by Kṛṣṇa, as He says na ca tasmān manuṣyeṣu (BG 18.69), one has to pass examination, severe test of examination. All the big, big devotees we see. Nārada Muni, before becoming Nārada Muni, he had to pass through severe examination, test. That chance is there in the human form of life, to pass the examination, test. But they are passing this human life with ordinary animal propensities. They are not trained up to pass the examination and be recognized by God. That civilization is lost, Vedic civilization, to prepare the human beings for passing the test, examination for being recognized by God.

Room Conversation -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: To be quickly recognized by Kṛṣṇa, this is the short-cut process. He never says those who are sitting in a secluded place meditating or chanting, doing nothing. He never says that "They are My very dear devotees." But those who are preaching-na ca tasmān manuṣyeṣu kaścin me (BG 18.69). Just like government takes more care for the soldiers, especially when there is fighting. They are giving life for the state. So their comfort-first consideration. In the warfield, enough supplies. Anything the soldiers require. Enough supplies. Sometimes the store is blown out. And again another store is ready. Therefore in the wartime they control. (break) ...destroy them. And still another store. So therefore supply is sufficient. Civil supplies become controlled. Whatever they want, supply is there. The Britishers, British time. I have seen, in the village they will let loose the soldiers to rape anyone.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1976, Vrndavana:

Hari-śauri: Hm. "They effected through devious means to have 2 members of the New York Hare Kṛṣṇa centers to be arrested. Therein lies the infection(?) of the injustice. To compound it, a judge and a grand jury agreed with their charges of unlawful imprisonment and brainwashing, a charge which is unheard of to my knowledge in civil legal proceedings, and ordered the devotees to be jailed. As a citizen I am appalled by the over-reaction, the lack of understanding, and the hate that finds wrongdoing, not only by the people that make the charges but by the court as well."

Haṁsadūta: He says the same thing.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Haṁsadūta: That this charge is unheard of in the legal history, brainwashing, and what was it? Brainwashing what?

Hari-śauri: Brainwashing.

Morning Walk -- November 17, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Why you should take two cars? (break) Where you are staying?

Mahākṣa: Some of us stayed in Anand Ashram. There is one āśrama there called Anand Ashram in the civil lines.

Prabhupāda: So what is that āśrama? Anand Ashram?

Mahākṣa: They have got Deities of... They have got... In the main bhavana they have got Lord Śiva and Pārvatī in the center, big deities. And then they have got Rādhā and Kṛṣṇa at the side and Rāma and Sītā on the other side. They also told me to go. After some days they said we had to go. They did not like us. And we did not do anything wrong.

Akṣayānanda: After how many days?

Mahākṣa: After about one week.

Akṣayānanda: Usually three days.

Prabhupāda: They were feeding you?

Morning Walk -- December 25, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: But that program was also failure because India is so poor that there was no possible to noncooperate, because Gandhi's civil disobedience movement only 60,000 men joined, and we have 600,000,000. So what is the percentage?

Guest (1): Not even one percent.

Prabhupāda: And that also, when they came back from the jail life, they decided not to do it again. Therefore Gandhi did not recommend mass civil disobedience next time. He recommended individual... (break) ...but (indistinct) 19l7, and we got svarāja in 1947. So it was not due to civil disobedience or noncooperation. It was due to Subash Bose's INA. He thought that when he organized soldiers, and.

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- December 26, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then why don't you do that now? God will take care. It is called, my Guru Mahārāja used to say, "civil suicide." Civil suicide. Just like if you commit suicide, that is criminal. But this is voluntarily committing suicide. Now I am dead. Whatever you like, you do. So we have to commit civil suicide if we are actually attached to Kṛṣṇa. Sarva-dharmān parityajya... (BG 18.66). That is gṛha-dharma. But Kṛṣṇa says, "Give up that." But that attachment is there. I do not think... Suppose I die immediately. Who will take care of my daughter? At that time we say "God." And why not now?

Guest (1): That feeling of attachment one has to give up gradually.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore we cannot do because the attachment is there. That is the symptom.

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- December 26, 1976, Bombay:

Guest (1): Civil suicide is a good thought.

Prabhupāda: That is the thought only. Oh, Doctor comes.

Dr. Patel: I asked him where you were and he said that you are on the roof.

Prabhupāda: Jaya. (Hindi) (break) I do not know. (break)

Dr. Patel: You agreed, huh? (indistinct) is coming.

Prabhupāda: I am going within four days.

Dr. Patel: You go, find out what you... and then communicate with you. Huh?

Prabhupāda: No, you asked me to stay at least a few days.(?)

Dr. Patel: But you must stay, if you don't stay, you can't stay, I have got not power to keep you. If you will stay, well and good. If you can't even, well I will try our best to inform you what should be done in four days. Hm?

Prabhupāda: Let God do whatever He likes.

Room Conversation -- December 26, 1976, Bombay:

Jagadīśa: All these... Kīrtanānanda Swami was there and a boy who was kidnapped, Vasu Gopāla, as well as Dr. Harvey Cox, the Civil Liberties Attorney who is defending us, and Dr. Stephen Corover, a psychologist, Jack Colley, who's a renowned religious scholar, and Dr. Eck, a lecturer in Sanskrit and India studies at Harvard. The public was invited and they had questions from the floor and all of the members of the panel, important people, were all in our support. It's very long...

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Hari-śauri: There's one interesting statement in there from one of these men. He's lived in Vṛndāvana for about two years. And he says how when he first went to Vṛndāvana, all the people there, they would chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Rāma, but it was kind of a derogatory thing because they had seen this film, Dum-mada-dam. So whenever they saw a Westerner they thought, "Oh, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Rāma," implying, "Oh, you're a hippie, you're a drug addict." Like that. But he said in the last two or three years since we established our temple, now that is completely changed. They're still saying, "Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Rāma," all the children shout it, but now they expect us to shout "Haribol" back and that it's a sign of, it's a friendly gesture now. So he's an outsider, but he's noticed the change in the Indian people's attitude, especially in Vṛndāvana.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 3, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: If they decide that... There are many other court judgments in our favor. Then we must adopt civil disobedience. There is no other, second way. "Capriciously you cannot impose anything against the law, against the judgment. If you do, then we shall also disobey." That should be the last resolve.

Hari-śauri: I remember when we were first beginning in Melbourne we were harassed very tremendously by the Council.

Prabhupāda: Yes, I know that.

Hari-śauri: And they were putting us in jail and everything. And actually every court decision was against us too. But somehow or another, we just went out on saṅkīrtana, every day distributing. We were getting booked, then fined. Then we wouldn't pay the fines, so they would come and they would raid the temple at two o'clock in the morning and try and take us away to jail. And... It went on for months. And then in the end there was so much publicity about it... When we went to jail we were fasting. So there was so much publicity that the Council became very embarrassed that they couldn't get rid of these boys and girls. They became so embarrassed that they stopped their harassment, and we carried on with our saṅkīrtana activities. So actually, if we just determine just to stick with it, then there's nothing they can do. What can they do to us unless they kill us? I don't think they can do that.

Morning Walk -- January 4, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: I don't say that I am liberated. I am conditioned. But because I am following the instruction of Bhaktisiddhānta, I'm liberated. This is the distinction between conditioned and liberated. When one is under the direction of a liberated person... The same thing: Electricity. The copper is not electricity, but when it is charged with electricity, if it is touched, that is electricity. And, similarly, this paramparā system, the electricity is going. If you cut the paramparā system, then there is no electricity. Therefore it is stressed so much. Sa kāleneha mahatā yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa. The electricity is lost. These people, they do not know. Now at the fag end of life, they are thinking, if intelligent person, that "What I have done actually?" If one has sense, he should come to this understanding. By cutting some, what is that? Dead trees? The civil disobedience began by cutting dead trees. Is it not? Vinoda Bhave, he began his leadership forty years ago by cutting... Gandhi also, civil disobedience. So this kind of leadership might have been little enthusiasm for the time being, but actually what people gain by that, such leadership?

Letter to Russian -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: War. Civil war?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, between... Not where Kenya is but between Rhodesia and Zambia, in that area.

Hari-śauri: Whites and blacks.

Prabhupāda: That is inevitable. The whites cannot...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Rhodesia has rejected...

Prabhupāda: ...cannot kill them, repress any more. That is not possible. The other blacks will join.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: And it appears that even President Carter of America is more soft on the blacks now. He is more sympathetic. So if they get American support...

Prabhupāda: Nowadays you cannot be a suppressor of any particular foreigner. That is not possible.

Evening Darsana -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Everyone is very worried. That is described by Prahlāda Mahārāja. When Hiraṇyakaśipu... After all, they are father and son. He inquired from the son, "My dear son, what best thing you have learned?"S So he said, "My dear..." He did not say "My dear father." He said "The best of the asuras." He addressed his father, "The best of the asuras." Tat sādhu manye asura varya dehinam. "My dear the best of the asuras..." He was the best of the asuras. "So I think that is best education..." Tat sādhu manye 'sura-varya dehinām. Dehināṁ sadā samudvignam asad-grahāt. (break) We have got good rooms like this, not that one has to go to the forest. Even in the Vṛndāvana we have got very good room, but nobody's coming. This is the position. After fiftieth year, voluntarily one must commit civil suicide—no family. And that is Vedic. But he will think of family up to the point of being killed by this revolver. This is going on. Even Gandhi, what to speak of others. He presented himself as very tyāgī, but unless he was killed, he did not give up his ambition. "How my sons, how my countrymen will be happy?"

Room Conversation -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No. Train, first-class is very comfortable.

Dr. Patel: But you see, after all, it takes upon the health, twenty-four hours.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Rather, doctor, your doc..., civil ser..., man, he said that, "Avoid plane." For me he had said.

Trivikrama: Yes, because the atmosphere changes.

Dr. Patel: But pressurized plane, no. On nonpressurized plane, not.

Trivikrama: He is the knower of his body.

Dr. Patel: All right. I had gone to Allahabad by train. (laughs) I had a very bad experience myself.

Prabhupāda: No, first-class is... We reserved whole room, so no outsider there; will be very comfortable. We'll leave at..

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yesterday, when I came from Manipur, there was one Bengali engineer, civil engineer, who was working in Manipur, Mr. P. K. Sanyal.

Prabhupāda: Hari-śauri? You close this part of the door. Yes That's all. That's all.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Mr P. K. Sanyal from Balliganj.

Prabhupāda: P. K. Shah?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Sanyal. Sanyal. He's in late sixties or early seventies, very old. We became very good friends. He's a very nice man.

Prabhupāda: On the plane?

Conversation on Roof -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: And give him hint. This is wanted.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This man is not simply a businessman because in his...

Prabhupāda: We want that.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He was taking up on his own so many civil rights cases. He's a fighter for individual freedom.

Prabhupāda: Not only that. He should be convinced that "Here is a good mission for the human society."

Evening Darsana -- February 15, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes. I know. In England they like Indian doctors. And last time, when I was in London, the Civil Surgeon, he was a Bengali. This Aurobindo's father, he was a medical practitioner. Aurobindo was born in London. He was English-born, yes. His father, Dr. Monmohan Ghosh, he was medical man there. So although he was British-born, he became enemy of the British. (drinks medicine?) Very bad medicine. (laughs)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That means good. I know when I was going to get that operation I didn't want to go to America. I would rather have gotten it here, even though the machines may not have been so modern, the fact that the Indian doctors were here was more reassurance than the Americans. They are very.

Room Conversation -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That should be done.

Hari-śauri: We fought with demons once or twice before that have attacked the temple. We ought to give 'em a good hiding.

Prabhupāda: There is civil war. Why not this?

Hari-śauri: Yes. This is... This is a big fight now.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Hari-śauri: (laughs) You're the world's greatest revolutionary.

(Prabhupāda laughs) (break)

Hari-śauri: Now that we're being attacked like this physically...

Prabhupāda: So we must attack them also.

Evening Darsana -- February 25, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: So our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is para-upakāra, how to bring them in peaceful condition, in normal mental condition, and make this life successful by chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. So we have to do it very carefully. It is para-upakāra. So always remember this fact, that they are..., the whole world is being controlled by āsuraṁ bhāvam āśritāḥ, atheist class of men, and people are suffering everywhere. But Kṛṣṇa also descends when such condition prevailing. Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati (BG 4.7). So now Kṛṣṇa has descended in His name. Nāma-rūpe kṛṣṇa-avatāra. So try to do some good to the society. You have got a great mission and don't deviate. Try to... And Kṛṣṇa will give you all help. So, but always keep in mind that this civilization is a wrong civilization. Wrong civilization. It is not quite civil. What do you think? In Hong Kong I have seen. People are living so wretchedly.

Room Conversation -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No Indira Gandhi's news?

Bhakti-caru: (continues to read news articles) No... Indira Gandhi... "Infighting with Civic Congress Party leads to more powers for laborers." "Civil judge regrets motives against magistrates." (reads more headings and newspaper articles) " 'The revolutionary work of eliminating poverty and unemployment in the rural areas can be accomplished by a considerable extent through the khādi and village industries. To achieve these objectives modern technology must be used to rise to the extent possible.' He hopes the new commission would take steps in this direction." (continues reading news articles; Prabhupāda is silent)

Prabhupāda: Hm. Hm. That's all.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That should be confirmed(?). Caitanyera dayāra kathā karaha vicāra. Don't accept it blindly. We have not accepted Caitanya cult blindly. This is practical. The purpose was to separate from India to become happy. Where is the happiness?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Civil strife.

Prabhupāda: And that is real happiness?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No.

Prabhupāda: Not they are. And this was the British plan: "So they are driving away? All right, make such arrangement. They'll perpetually remain unhappy."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They knew they were losing, so they thought, "Let everyone lose along with us. No one shall..."

Prabhupāda: That is natural. "If you become my enemy, I shall be your enemy." That is everywhere. Material world means that.

Room Conversation With Son (Vrindavan De) -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, no, it is waste of time. Don't write such book.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. He says, "In addition, I plan to write on other highly regarded welfare workers such as the American Civil Rights worker Martin Luther King." Boy, if he does that, every black person in America will hate us. It'll create many enemies. This book will be the biggest enemy-creator. We already have enough enemies.

Prabhupāda: That will be embarrassment. Yes, I said, "I do not know this." Bas. Finished. And that means it is not so important that I should know it.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Right.

Prabhupāda: Unless something is important, why shall I try to understand it? It is all useless. Actually that is. Our criterion is, as soon as we see one is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he is rejected. He is nothing. He has no value. That is our criterion. Just like the other day he was opening that book of geography.

Room Conversation -- October 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Dr. Kapoor: What I mean to say is ask him to treat Prabhupāda or not. But there should be some qualified doctor who stays here permanently for the purpose of checking him out from time to time, because you are all laymen. If there is any complication, you don't understand it. So if there is doctor by his side always, he can check up and say, "This is so and so." You can call any other doctor afterwards and treat him. In the present condition of Prabhupāda it is necessary that you always have some good medical advice available here. So if you had one of the disciples of Prabhupāda... There was one Dr. Batnagar, I think, who retired as civil surgeon of Mathurā, who was here for some time I saw. If he can be help, you can call him, I think.

Girirāja: Dr. Batnagar?

Dr. Kapoor: I don't remember his name, but perhaps Dr. Batnagar. He's perhaps a disciple of Prabhupāda. He at least stayed here for quite some time, and he told me that once he proposed that he would stay here permanently and treat the devotees.

Prabhupāda: Sometimes they recommend hospitalization, and I don't like that.