Mr. Koshi: There are scholars from other religions also.
Prabhupāda: Then you do not understand the standpoint. We have to understand the active principle of life. So why other scholars will disagree? Then he is not a scholar. Let us come to the scientific point of view. We have to understand what is the active principle within this machine. It is equally important to all scholars. That we have to preach. They may say that "Your Kṛṣṇa; our this." No. That knowledge Kṛṣṇa is giving for everyone. And it is accepted by everyone. They are Christians. How they are accepting? I am not bribing them.
Mr. Koshi: They are all nationalities?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Everyone. Any scientific man, any advanced in education...
Mr. Koshi: Have you put any conditions?
Prabhupāda: No conditions. You try to understand. Within this body the active principle is there. Where is condition? You try to understand if you have knowledge.
Mr. Koshi: But a renunciation of something?
Prabhupāda: Again why you are coming to renunciation? First of all come to the knowledge. First of all accept that within this body there is the active principle. Then whether it is required renunciation, no renunciation, that we shall discuss later on. First of all, we have to understand, as Kṛṣṇa says in the very beginning, that asmin dehe dehī. Within this body, there is the owner of the body. First of all try to understand. He is speaking on that subject matter. Dehī. Not on the deha. People should understand first of all this science. Then talk of other things. When we say "Two plus two equal to four," no scholar will deny it. "Yes, it is four." Nobody, no rascal will say, "No, it is five or three." Nobody will disagree, if it is science, if it is mathematics. Similarly, Kṛṣṇa says within this body, the owner of the body. Who will deny it? Let them accept it. Then we shall discuss what is that owner, what is the nature of that owner. First of all let them accept it. They are accepting the machine as everything. Do you agree or not?
Mr. Koshi: Yeah, but who is the owner?
Prabhupāda: Ah. Yes. Machine, if you take the importance of the machine and not the machine driver, then what is your knowledge? If a dog is thinking "I am a bulldog, gow gow," and if a man is thinking "I am Indian, gow gow," what is the difference? He is embarrassed with the machine body, and he is also embarrassed with the machine body. The dog is jumping, monkey is jumping with a machine body, and if we also imitate jumping like the dog and the monkey, so what is the difference? The human being is to understand that "I am not this body." That is the first knowledge. That is the first principle.
- brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā
- na śocati na kāṅkṣati
- samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu
- mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām
- (BG 18.54)
That is brahma-jñāna. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. So these things are here in India. Instead of distributing, understanding these things, we are jumping like cats and dogs, like the Western civilization. Anthill and four-wheel dog race. These big, big buildings, they are like anthill. You know anthill? The ant also can make a big stack of earth. Does it mean it is civilization to compete with the ant? Or run with the dog? Sometimes if a car is driving, and dog is running, it is a competition and the dog running. Is that civilization? Without understanding, the whole thing is going on, running on like that. Why India should imitate? India has got so much great exalted knowledge given by Kṛṣṇa. India should learn it and teach it to the whole world. That is India's business. Paropakāra. And that is being done in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Very important movement, very scientific movement. So do not neglect it. Come and join, learn it and give it to the whole world. This is the perfect knowledge, paropakāra. Not to imitate there and jump like monkeys and cats and dogs. This is not good.