Black (Conv. 1976 - 1977)

Expressions researched:
"black"

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 4, 1976, Nellore:

Indian man: Ah, that is what he reminds me, because I said the incident which I had with him.... On Kṛṣṇa Jayantī day I did not go there. But on that day it was being read out. That was the silly part of it.

Yaśodānandana: So Prabhupāda, these same people that...

Prabhupāda: So what is the wrong there? What was the wrong?

Indian man: No, he said that "This movement has got these black sheep, and they have been banned in Japan. Everywhere they will be banned."

Prabhupāda: But there is something in Japan which is banned. But what you have got in Japan?

Indian man: Nothing.

Yaśodānandana: First of all, we are not even banned in Japan. The center is still there.

Prabhupāda: No, no, that's all right. Banned means we had something. But what proof you have got that you have done something in Japan?

Morning Walk -- February 19, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Cāṇakya is authority. Otherwise, why you have named "Cāṇakya Purī"? He's as good as Gandhi and other big, big men. So it is said, viśvāso naiva kartavyaṁ strīṣu rāja-kuleṣu ca.(?)I am innocent. I am quoting authority.

Acyutānanda: Yes. Yes, you can say that is the statement of Cāṇakya. One foolish man... I was saying, "Some...," in my lectures, "some foolish scholar has written that because Kṛṣṇa is black, He is a scheduled caste." So there was a scheduled caste man in the audience who became educated. So he took offense. "Well, maybe Kṛṣṇa was the leader of the scheduled caste." So I said then, "that is the statement of some scholar. You cannot criticize me. I am quoting a scholar." The audience shouted him down too. (break) Śūdras and yavanas may become brāhmaṇas, but many of them don't.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Acyutānanda: So many born śūdras are śūdras, many times.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- March 5, 1976, Mayapur:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: ...for getting a big display inside. And I got him to agree to only seventeen point five percent commission, which is very reasonable.

Prabhupāda: All right. Let them send. (break) ...is compared with a rose flower without flavor. Man with education is compared with the koi. (cuckoo bird) Kokilānāṁ svaro rūpam. The bird, koi, is very black, but his sound, sweet, so sweet, everyone likes. Kokilānām svaro-rūpaṁ vidyā-rūpaṁ ku-rūpanam, nārī-rūpaṁ pati-vrataḥ. And woman's beauty is how she is chaste and devoted to the husband. That is beauty, not personal beauty. Vidyā-rūpaṁ ku-rūpanam. And education is the beauty for the brain. And the beauty of the koi is her sweet voice. Kṣamā-rūpaṁ tapasvinaḥ. And those who are saintly person, they should be simply forgiving. That is their beauty.

Morning Walk -- March 7, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Jaya. (break) ...ṣata-doltena malenatvaṁ na muñcyati.(?) If you take a coal and wash it, one who has... Still black.

Jayapatāka: And he does not allow himself to be washed. He never comes to the temple.

Prabhupāda: No. If he... A coal, however you go on with soap and other things, go on washing, it will never become clean. Aṅgarasya śata-doltena malenatvaṁ na muyati.(?) What is the defect? Why the...? The window is becoming black.

Jayapatāka: The lids are... We purchased some new lids yesterday. The lids have been damaged. Therefore the smoke is leaking.

Prabhupāda: So why damage cannot be repaired?

Jayapatāka: No, we purchased yesterday. They're going to install today. (break)

Hariśauri: ...has painted for your books. So he must be fairly good.

Prabhupāda: If he has painted for my books, then he should be first class.

Jayapatāka: He says he'll finish the one painting in five days.

Morning Walk -- March 8, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Black and white frame.

Guru-kṛpā: Salt and pepper.

Prabhupāda: Actually our, this society is united nations. And if we become disunited, then it is very difficult to adjust. (break) Yes. Linguist.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hindi also?

Prabhupāda: I don't know. (break)

Yaśodānandana: Parikrama

Prabhupāda: Parikrama?

Yaśodānandana: Acyutānanda Mahārāja just went to Calcutta to arrange everything.

Prabhupāda: What is to arrange in Calcutta?

Yaśodānandana: Well, all the devotees are coming, and they will be going to Śantipur, and when they come back, they will... We're working a schedule to take all the devotees to the various parikrama spots.

Prabhupāda: No, that's all right. I mean to say, if we make a procession, then first of all... That is my suggestion. Make the devotees first, chanting, all the devotees. And then the Deity, carrying. And then my carriage, my car, and then all the buses. So devotees who become tired, they can sit down in the bus and again go on. And keep one big pot of halavā so that others may be distributed, and the devotees, when they are hungry, they can also eat. In this way make.

Morning Walk -- March 9, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Sixty years, they could not do any of these books. And still they are envious. Within sixty years they could not attract any foreign student or any book published. And still, they are proud. They have got all the blessings of Bhaktisiddhānta.

Yaśodānandana: They cannot even attract Indian students.

Prabhupāda: Just see, how black snakes they are.

Yaśodānandana: They do pretty good with old widows, however. (laughter)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Getting a lot of flowers here, it seems.

Prabhupāda: Yes. There must be always all full of flowers.

Morning Walk -- March 12, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Of course, their vision, mahā-bhāgavata... Hare Kṛṣṇa. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (laughs) That is very beautiful.

Revatīnandana: You mean the music?

Prabhupāda: No, no. That black.

Revatīnandana: Yes, it's very nice. He has blue eyes and big black body.

Devotee: Blue eyes?

Revatīnandana: Yes. It's amazing. If you look closely you will see...

Pañcadraviḍa: The gopīs, they didn't like very much being instructed by Uddhava?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. That was dry for them. They asked Uddhava, "Bring Kṛṣṇa. We don't want you any more..." (break) What is his name? That...? Tapomāyā. Tapa... He never sees whether it is watered. He is in charge of agricultural department? Where is Jayapatāka? He never sees. One man should be in charge to see things are being done.

Room Conversation With Radha-Damodara Sankirtana Party -- March 16, 1976, Mayapur:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: No index. First chapter?

Prabhupāda: No, how you'll find it? Give me. Unless you have an index, list.... The purport of the verse is that even Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu—He is God himself, Kṛṣṇa Himself—He felt, alone, unable to do this task. He felt. So this is the position. You are cooperating; therefore I am getting the credit. Otherwise alone what could I do? Ekākī āmāra nāhi pāya bolo. Caitanya Mahāprabhu Himself wanted our cooperation. He is God, Kṛṣṇa. And therefore cooperation is very important thing. Nobody should think that "I have got so great ability. I can do." No. It is simply by cooperation we can do very big thing. "United we stand; divided we fall." This is our.... So be strong in pushing on Kṛṣṇa consciousness, and Kṛṣṇa will help. He is the strongest. Still, we must be combined together. Saṅkīrtana. Saṅkīrtana means many men combined together chanting. That is saṅkīrtana. Otherwise kīrtana. Saṅkīrtana. Bahubhir militvā kīrtayeti saṅkīrtana.(?) Bahu. Bahu means many, many combined together. That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission, combined together. All nations, all persons they should combine together. There is hope in our society, combination. There are Hindus; there are Muslims; there are Christians; there are black, white. Combine them. That looks very beautiful, just like combination of many flowers. There is black flower also.

Morning Walk -- March 19, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Ādi-puruṣam. Govindam ādi-puruṣam, that puruṣa. Govindam ādi-puruṣaṁ tam ahaṁ bhajāmi. We are worshiping that supreme and original person. And the women are declaring, "independent." They are begging door to door to a man, "Please give me shelter. Give me a child," and they're independent. One American woman, was.... She was speaking that "In India the woman are treated as slave. We don't want." So I told her that it is better to become slave of one person than to slave of become hundreds. (laughter) The woman must become a slave. So instead of becoming slaves of so many persons, it is better to remain satisfied, a slave of one person. So she was stopped. She was the secretary of that Dr. Miśra. You know that? And our Vedic civilization says, narī-rūpaṁ pati-vratam: "The woman is beautiful when she remains as a slave to the husband." That is the beauty, not the personal beauty. How much she has learned to remain as a slave to the husband, that is Vedic civilization. Kokilānāṁ svaro rūpam. The cuckoo, it is black bird, but why people love it? Because of the sweet voice. Kokilānāṁ svaro rūpaṁ vidyā-rūpaṁ kurūpaṇam. A man may be ugly, black, but if he's learned, everyone will respect him. And narī-rūpaṁ pati-vratam. And the beauty of woman is how much she is devoted and obedient to the husband. So it is very difficult.

Morning Walk -- April 7, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That is another concoction. The sacred thread is not used like that, in the hand.

Akṣayānanda: I thought it was wrong. It seems like some kind of fashion or something, concocted fashion.

Hari-śauri: (break) ...small black beads that the devotees are wearing from Rādhā-kuṇḍa. They have a string of beads made of clay from Rādhā-kuṇḍa. Are they...?

Prabhupāda: Rādhā-kuṇḍa clay is not bad.

Hari-śauri: So it's all right to wear them?

Prabhupāda: Not very constantly.

Room Conversation -- April 20, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Everything. That is proved scientifically. Sir Jagadish Chandra Bose has proved. There is a part(?). What is that? Spi...? Begins the word, the machine, the record?

Devotee (2): Spirograph.

Prabhupāda: Yes, the word begins with s. Spirograph or like that. You do not know? They smear with black, what is called, carbon, and the fine...

Devotee 2: Cardiograph.

Prabhupāda: Cardiograph, like that.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Cardiograph.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: The down side of the pan remains black. But if you take some dirt and rub it nicely, it become glisten.

Hari-śauri: Dirt is very first-class for cleaning.

Prabhupāda: Utensils for cooking purpose must be very, very clean. The.... If the black portion remains, in India they will not touch.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Even on the bottom?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: On the outside?

Prabhupāda: They'll not touch: "Oh, it is still dirty." But our going on. What can be done? Where there is no cleanliness, little rubbed with soap, that is sufficient. What can be done? But that is not cleanliness. If there is a black spot on the..., it has to.... It will immediately be cleaned. My mother used to see every utensil, whether there is any spot. The maidservant had to surrender. Examine. Then it is no spot. Then it is finished. Otherwise she has to do again. Everything should be neat and clean. The kitchen should be very neat and clean, washed twice daily, opened nicely and smeared with water and gobar. And if you see the kitchen, immediately you'll feel comfortable. It is very cleanly prepared, then offered to the Deity. Then you take. Automatically your mind becomes cleansed.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Brian Singer: Well, how do you see the person? By understanding? By...

Prabhupāda: Yes, by analysis, analysis. Now you.... I say that you are not this body. Now you say, "No, I am.... I am Mr. John. I am this body. I am American," "I am Australian." That is ignorance. You are neither Australian, neither American, neither white, neither black. That you have to understand. Neither coat, neither pant. You are different from all these things. That is the first understanding. If we analyze our body and if we at least theoretically understand that "I am not this body," then you are..., you come to the spiritual platform.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Then we discuss other things. This is the primary education of spiritual life. First of all you have to understand that you are not this body. You are living entity, different from the body. Just like you are different from the shirt-coat. But the difficulty is, the person who is in a different type of shirt-coat, he is identifying with the shirt-coat, and they are fighting. You have got black coat. You have got white coat. You have got yellow coat. But they do not understand, none of us belong to the coat. We are different from the coat. That is ignorance. The whole world is going on under this impression that "I am this body." So how there will be peace? That kind of thinking is there in the dogs, in the cats. So our point is that if you remain like cats and dogs, how you can attain peace? You are endeavoring for peace. It is not possible. First of all you understand yourself. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati (BG 18.54). These things are discussed there.

Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:

Guest (4): That's what.... We agree.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like you are young man. You had a body of a child. That child's body.... You remember that you had a body of a child, but that body is no longer existing. But you remember; therefore you, the owner of the body, is existing. Otherwise how do you remember, "I had a body like, like this," measurement? But that body is no longer existing, so you are remembering. So you are the owner of the body. Just like you have now black coat. Say after two days you may put on another color coat, but you remember that "I was putting on one black coat on that day." So you are existing; the coat is changed. Similarly, the soul is existing; the body is changed. Therefore it is natural that I am old man. When I change this body, I get another body. This is resurrection, if you say.

Room Conversation -- April 30, 1976, Fiji:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: "Now I am confused about my duty and have lost all composure because of weakness. In this condition I am asking You to tell me clearly what is best for me."

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā. So because he accepted discipleship, so He immediately chastised him that "You rascal, you are talking like a very learned man, but you are on the platform of bodily conception of life, the platform of the animals." Yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke (SB 10.84.13). Anyone who accepts this body as self, he's animal. He's not even a human being. So the whole world is on this bodily concept of life. That is going on. "American," "European," "Hindu," "Muslim," "black," "white," this, that. They do not know what is education. That is the first education, that "You rascal, you are not this body. You are within the body." So who understands this? And they're declaring that "We are student of Bhagavad-gītā. We have studied Bhagavad-gītā." Hmm? Even Gandhi, he takes photograph with Bhagavad-gītā, but his fighting is for nationalism. The others are doing that. So what is the use of taking Bhagavad-gītā? The Pakistanis are also doing that. But you have taken Bhagavad-gītā, you are doing the same work. So what is your credit? This is going on. So nobody is learning Bhagavad-gītā. It is first time that we are teaching Bhagavad-gītā as it is. Otherwise, everyone is misled. The subject matter is that the soul is different from this body.

Room Conversation -- May 4, 1976, Honolulu:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It is bound to fail.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Unless you voluntarily give, it will be failure. You will try to find out ways how you can take everything.... Just like income tax. The government is trying to take more money from the public, and public is hiding them in black market. This is going on. Nobody is.... Even your Nixon, he also hidden some money from the income tax. Why? He is the head of the government. So one side, he is head of the government, try to take money from the public, but he personally himself, he is hiding. Why this defect?

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: They will say that the system encourages man's greed, whereas their system...

Prabhupāda: No, no, system.... If the.... You cannot change the mind. If you have got mind to enjoy more, by force if I try to force you not to enjoy more, give to the state, this is a struggle. This is not perfect process.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Not should, but must as far as possible.

Guru-kṛpā: I've heard that in Russia the people are so eager to read imported literature that any literature appears they immediately buy it.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's a black market going on in Russia, particularly black market on books. Books are smuggled into the country and sold and they're very dearly read. People are very anxious.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They must be because they are keeping in darkness.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: These nasty countries, in the name of giving them material facility, they'll kill them, even they're independent. Such a horrible country. How people can tolerate loss of independence? It is very horrible. I am sitting here 24 hours, this is another thing, but if I understand that I cannot go out, I have to sit down here, oh it is horrible. It is a horrible condition. Simply this impression that I have to keep myself within this room, although I am keeping myself, I am not going, only for walk maybe. But if the impression is that I cannot go out from this room, then my life is lost. This is psychology. So, they are keeping their young men. They are not allowed to go out of the country, in Russia. Similarly in China.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: In this way if possible print in Russian language, in black market.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, that's possible and they'll be eager.

Devotee: The young people are dissatisfied, young student.

Prabhupāda: Small books print first of all, see. How the black market takes it, and then big books.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There is also all of the eastern European countries.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they have got black market. There must be intermediate man who deals in black market.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There is.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Get them. Let them make good profit. We want to put up, that's all. And let them take money, we don't mind. Śaṭhe śaṭhuṁ samācaret. When there is trickery, you become trickery. Śaṭhe śaṭhuṁ samācaret. Kṛṣṇa's play, those who are plain, Kṛṣṇa is very kind and plain. Those who are tricky, "All right, I am also tricky." We shall adopt all the means of the materialistic persons, simply for Kṛṣṇa. (break) Just like Kṛṣṇa's rāsa dance, any materialistic person at the dead of night will be glad to dance with young girls, what is the difference? (break) But because it was Kṛṣṇa's dancing, so this association of the woman and Kṛṣṇa is taken by Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu as the first class worship. ramyā kācid upāsanā vraja-vadhū-vargeṇa yā kalpitā. Kṛṣṇa should become a little tricky with the gopīs, "Oh, you have come in dead of night, what your husband, father would think, and there are so many (indistinct) and saintly (indistinct), please get out immediately."

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: And the gopīs were thinking "What this rascal says, say?" (chuckles) They are so sorry that, "We have come leaving everything and this rascal is giving us moral instruction." This is love, they can chastise Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...somehow or other, black market, white market, red market. Let them make... And as soon as there is taste, there will be very good demand. And this black marketeer will make profit and they'll do. This Chinese policy or the Russian policy will not stand. Simply we require to make ourselves strong. As soon as we become stronger than the communist movement, we shall finish it.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In black market.

Prabhupāda: Ah yes, if there is demand, then you will make good profit also. And there will be demand.

Hari-śauri: They'll be big demand for your books.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Very big, very big.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) They sent one translation of Tulasi dāsa's Rāma-caritra-mānasa. It was sold, all, in a week. And therefore they have stopped now.

Morning Walk -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Then you are not perfectly Kṛṣṇa's aṁśa. Kṛṣṇa has got independence. You see one son is born, even a father has got a black spot here, sometimes the son has got black spot.

Rāmeśvara: But if it's not good for me, if I will misuse it, why would Kṛṣṇa give it to me anyway?

Prabhupāda: Yes, therefore the demand is "You surrender, rascal. You are suffering, you surrender. That is your good..." Therefore He comes, He loves His sons, "You rascals, why you are creating plans? You come here. Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). I shall give you all comforts."

Rāmeśvara: Kṛṣṇa knows everything in the past, and everything in the future.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: So when Kṛṣṇa.... Kṛṣṇa knows that I will misuse my independence, but still He gives me independence.

Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa's mercy.

Garden Conversation -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Gopavṛndapāla: Even in this life they begin to take on the qualities of their next life. Like the surfers, they put on a black suit that is very smooth so that they can go through the waves very swiftly like the fish do. So they even look like the fish. And they shape their surfboard the same shape as the fish are.

Prabhupāda: They have to imitate. Otherwise, they cannot struggle. Just like they have made the 747 airship. But the shape is like a bird. You cannot make other shape. That you cannot do. If you make the shape of the 747 airplane like a man, it will finish. So you have to take knowledge from God's creation. You cannot create independently. That is not possible. Just like ships and boats, they are shaped like fish, the same shape; otherwise, you cannot run on water. That is not possible. The original design is made by God, and you have to follow.

Room Conversation -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Trivikrama: In La Cienega?

Prabhupāda: No, no, La Cienega, later on. I was staying near Pico, is that Pico? There was a... I think Washington Boulevard? Near there. I forgot that quarter. It is black quarter. And this boy—who is he now? Aniruddha? What is his name?

Devotee: Gurukṛpa?

Prabhupāda: No, no. Aniruddha.

Devotee: Gaurasundara?

Prabhupāda: No, Aniruddha.

Devotee: Oh, Aniruddha.

Prabhupāda: Yes, he was taking care of me here in Los Angeles. And they used to come from San Francisco. First of all, I came to San Francisco from India. Then I came to Los Angeles, to start a center here. I think Dayānanda took charge of this center.

Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: In 1942 I have seen when war was going on, so, these Britishers wanted soldiers, so they created artificial famine. The people became in need of money, so they enrolled them as soldiers. I have seen it. There was no other way to get money to get commodities at higher price. Artificial famine. There was no food grains available, but black market it is available. Black market means more price, but they had no money. So to get this money, they enrolled as soldiers. This was Mr. Churchill's policy.

Rādhāvallabha: That's going on now in America. Previously they had to force men to join the Army because they had such a shortage. Now, because there are so few jobs, it is harder to get into the Army. Even volunteers, there are so many volunteers just to get a job that they have too many practically.

Prabhupāda: Even in Army there is no service? They don't want?

Rādhāvallabha: Now they want because they can't get a job.

Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Johannesburg. From the downtown, the Indian quarters about ten miles or fifteen miles away. Indian.... African, black quarters, they are not allowed even to enter the city. They require a pass. If any black man enters the city without that passport, he will immediately be taken to police. The bus for the black man is different from the white man. I think Indians also they have got separate bus. But the bus in which the white men travel, the Indians and the black men are not allowed. Gandhi tried to adjust this injustice, but he failed. Then with determination he went to India, that "I must drive away the Englishmen." These South African white men, mostly they are Englishmen and Dutchmen. Originally, they were Englishmen and Dutchmen.

Morning Walk -- June 11, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: They're all selling their property. They cannot maintain. Even the Queen cannot maintain her establishment, but because it's government.... The Buckingham Palace was not repaired for many years. Last time, when I went there, I saw it is repaired now. Before that, three, four times I went. It is blackish. The stone.... It is made of stone. The stone had become black. That means many years it was not repaired.

Hari-śauri: What they do now if they have some big house in the country and they want to keep it, they have to put it on show during the summer months. They allow people to come, and they charge them so much money to come and look around.

Prabhupāda: The Parliament and that.... What is that church?

Hari-śauri: Westminster Abbey?

Prabhupāda: Yes. They charge.

Morning Walk -- June 11, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: In Germany.... Just like Germany was finished. The American planes bombed in such a way that Germany was finished, very heavily bombed. One lady in Hamburg, she was showing me one wall, big wall building dismantled, and it has become black on account of bombing. She was showing me how far injustice they have been done.

Rāmeśvara: So then after the war, nothing will change. System of government, the industries, everything will just be rebuilt.

Prabhupāda: They'll try at least. Just like after the Second World War, Germany or England finished. They could not recoup. They are now poverty-stricken.

Rāmeśvara: Germany?

Prabhupāda: Germany is little recouped, but England is finished. Therefore I say India got independence not due to Gandhi. It is due to Hitler. That is my opinion. I have got reason. The Hitler fighting with England made them smashed, so their political power became nil almost, and on this opportunity, Hitler helped Subash Chandra Bose, one of the leaders of India, to organize Indian National Army. This Indian National Army, when attacked, at least made a show of attack from Imphala(?), especially on Calcutta dropped bombs, and the whole Calcutta became vacant. Perhaps myself and a few others remained. I sent my sons.... Of course, daughter was married, but they sent to Navadvīpa, Śrīdhara Mahārāja's āśrama. My wife refused to go out of Calcutta. She said, "I'll be bombed maybe, but I'll not go out." (laughs)

Interview with Jackie Vaughn (Black Congressman) -- July 12, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is black and we worship Him. (laughter) You have seen our Deity? Yes. Kṛṣṇa is from your community. (Prabhupāda laughs) There is no question of black and white. Kṛṣṇa consciousness is above the skin—the soul which is there. Either he's black or white or yellow, it doesn't matter. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe (BG 2.13). This is the first education, that do not take the body, but the living force within the body. That is important; we have to understand that. We are talking from that platform. Therefore sometimes it is little difficult, because people are very much absorbed with bodily concept of life. But our philosophy begins from that platform where there is no more bodily concept of life. Therefore it is little difficult. (pause) So any question also?

Śrutakīrti: You've been reading from Prabhupāda's books?

Jackie Vaughn: Yes. I continue to search.

Śrutakīrti: If you have any questions you can ask him.

Jackie Vaughn: The last time I was here you were kind enough to address to the basic point-we're in the world and yet how can we not be a part of the world.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Hari-śauri: He says we're in the world, but how can we be aloof from it? How can we not be a part of it?

Prabhupāda: It is knowledge. Just like we are moving with this body, but still we know perfectly well that we are not this body.

Interview with Jackie Vaughn (Black Congressman) -- July 12, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Everyone tries. That is not a particular job for you. Everyone is trying; the cats and dogs, they are also trying. The cat also very much anxious to give protection to the cubs, innocent, helpless. The dog also giving. The birds, they're bringing food for the offspring, and as soon as the mother comes, they become very much engladdened, "Oh, here is food, here is food." And they, with the mouth, they.... So this kind of sentiment is there even in the cats, dogs, animals, birds, beasts. That is natural. But we do not know how to do actual welfare activity. Somebody's engaged with his family. Somebody is engaged with his own body. Somebody.... This is only development of consciousness. The animals, they are interested with the body, himself. The human being, they are interested with the extension of the body. Just like I am alone now. Now when I become, you young men, then I have got my wife, then my interest is also for my wife. The wife's interest is for the husband. In this way, children, then interest extended, husband, wife, children. Then, this is family-wise. Then little advancement, of the society. Little advancement, community. Just like in your country, the sense of black community, white community. Then, above that, for the nation. When there is war between America and other nation, then you black and white people forget the small interest for national interest. You advance to fight, to lay down your life. So in this way we can make progress, but such progress is not perfection. Such progress is not perfection.

Interview with Jackie Vaughn (Black Congressman) -- July 12, 1976, Detroit:

Jackie Vaughn: I suppose we could use the same analogy for black and white getting together. Ofttimes, we all become impatient because of the progress appears to be so very, very slow.

Prabhupāda: Slow, but sure, that is wanted. If you are slow, it is not bad, but it must be sure. But if you become very busy without any surety, then what is this? Simply waste of time. Slow, there is English word, "Slow but sure."

Jackie Vaughn: Slow but sure.

Prabhupāda: Sure. So what we are proposing, that is sure success. And all other things, they are very busy but no success. This is the difference. So what is the use of that business if you are going to be failure? So we see from the history these attempts have always been failure. Now this man who constructed this house, he never thought that I shall come here to preach Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So his attempt is failure.

Interview with Jackie Vaughn (Black Congressman) -- July 12, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: The institution is already there. We are conducting Kṛṣṇa consciousness. But if the government cooperates that a certain number of students must be trained up scientifically what is the meaning of God, that will be very much beneficial to the state or to the country. We can give solution for any problem. "We" means Kṛṣṇa. We are simply preaching Kṛṣṇa's message. Kṛṣṇa means God. Kṛṣṇa means black also. Kṛṣṇa, this word, (chuckles) means black also. He is following?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Another meaning of kṛṣṇa is blackish.

Interview with Jackie Vaughn (Black Congressman) -- July 12, 1976, Detroit:

Jackie Vaughn: Black is beautiful?

Prabhupāda: Why not? He's the most beautiful. Otherwise, why people are attracted? There is a verse in the Brahma-saṁhitā: kandarpa-koṭi-kamanīya-viśeṣa-śobham (Bs. 5.30); barhāvataṁsam asitāmbuda-sundarāṅgam. He has got one peacock feather on His head and He's blackish, but wonderfully beautiful. These words are used. Kandarpa-koṭi-kamanīya. He's so beautiful that thousands of Cupids cannot be compared with His beauty. Cupid is understood to be the most beautiful person within this universe. You know Cupid? Yes. He enchants by beauty. But Kṛṣṇa's beauty is so great that millions of beauty, kandarpa or Cupid, cannot be compared with Him. Kandarpa-koṭi-kamanīya-viśeṣa-śobhaṁ govindam ādi-puruṣaṁ tam ahaṁ bhajāmi (Bs. 5.30). It is a question of attraction. It is not a question of black and white. Attraction. So unless Kṛṣṇa is beautiful, why He has got so many millions of devotees? This very word is kandarpa-koṭi. Barhāvataṁsam asitāmbuda-sundarāṅgam. His blackness is compared with the black cloud. Asita-ambuda, ambuda means the cloud. The black cloud is full of water. When there is black cloud in the sky, you can be sure that the rain is going to fall down. Not the white cloud. White cloud means no water. Is it not? So you understand this philosophy and add water to the suffering humanity. They are suffering in the burning, blazing fire of material existence.

Morning Walk -- June 13, 1976, Detroit:

Devotee (1): I think you won the heart of that government official yesterday by saying that Kṛṣṇa's black and we worship Him. (laughter) He liked that.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Ambarīṣa: Yes, Detroit River, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Big, big ships, they pass under this bridge?

Ambarīṣa: No, on the other side of this island, there's a channel, a freighter channel. That's Canada over there, and this is a small island, Belle Isle.

Morning Walk -- June 13, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: ...storefront building?

Devotee (1): Yes, this is a black area. The black people move in...

Ambarīṣa: This used to be actually the best street in Detroit. About maybe seventy-five years ago, all the wealthy people lived on this street, Jefferson Avenue, and then the black people moved in and took over, and then all their businesses, they went out of business, and now it's all boarded up. Very dangerous place. All the white people in the suburbs, they live in fear of all the black people in the city.

Prabhupāda: The government cannot manage?

Ambarīṣa: No. The mayor is black. The police they cannot do anything.

Devotee (4): The police force is also becoming black. He's putting black men in charge of every department of the city, and they're mismanaging everything.

Prabhupāda: There is possibility of another civil war?

Ambarīṣa: Yes. Possibly some sort of a race war or something. In Boston, they have a lot of trouble because of this bussing. They bus the black children into the white neighborhoods to go to school to achieve equal education, and the white communities do not like this. In Boston there has been a lot of violence between the black people and the white people. Very much hatred, very much hate each other.

Prabhupāda: So only remedy is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Morning Walk -- June 13, 1976, Detroit:

Ambarīṣa: Yes. About a month ago there was a black lawyer, and he was walking out of the City Hall in Boston, and some white people beat him with an American flag. They beat him with an American flag and hurt him very badly, and this caused very much...

Prabhupāda: Commotion.

Ambarīṣa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: There is hatred within. Artificially they have given equal rights.

Room Conversation with Mother and Sons -- June 13, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Now if the child is.... If the father puts the seed in the black wife, the child may come in black body. In the white body, the child may come in white body. So the body is different according to the mother, but the soul is the same. One gets the body according to the body of the mother. But either in the black body or the white body the soul is the same. Paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). This simple truth they cannot understand, common sense. In one minute it can be understood. The father..., mother is there and the child is there. So there must be father. How one can deny?

Guest: Do we have any other goal in life than this...

Prabhupāda: Well, the first thing is that you must know what you are. You should know that the mother is nature and the father is God. I am the child. Then you try to understand the father and the son obedience to father. Then you have to learned how to become obedient to the father. Then father will be pleased. And this father is not a poor father. He has created the whole material world.

Room Conversation with Ambarisa and Catholic Priest -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: So how long can this civilization go on, simply producing automobiles, like this? So the situation is that the people are always in a state of poverty. Just like the black people here in Detroit. Even they are making sufficient money, still they are always in a state of poverty because they don't know how to live. Prabhupāda related one story that the capitalist and the worker, both of them, they went to the goddess of fortune appealing for a benediction. So the capitalist asked, "Give me such money that I will be able to work one day and it will last me for six months." And then the worker, he went and he said, "Give me one thousand dollars I have every day to spend."

Prabhupāda: No, he said that "Give me the same money as the capitalist will spend in six months. I shall spend every day. I shall get that money every day and I shall spend it." So this worker class, there is no culture. You may pay them heavy amount of money, but they will spend it and remain a poor man. Because he has no culture.

Stansky: This is true.

Prabhupāda: You see this black men. They earn sufficient money, but see their home. See their home. You America, you have given them equal rights, they are getting money, but they have no culture. Therefore you may pay them as much as you like, but still poverty-stricken. In Africa also I have seen that they have got their own kingdom, independence, but if we go to the African slums, they are poverty-stricken, wretched. So this civilization will not endure. If there is no culture, simply by money you cannot maintain a standard of civilization. That is not possible. Now the American leaders they are thinking, "Let us have money, then everything..." Of course, by money you are covering all the defects of the social culture. But this will not endure. Day will come and everything will be exposed. Therefore culture required.

Room Conversation -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: You keep this. We shall have to show to the Indian government authorities.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: " 'Just as it has dealt with black marketers and smugglers, it is high time the government took immediate action to round up all those who claim supernatural powers.' While he was happy that Bangalore University has already established a committee to investigate miracles and superstitions, he cautioned them to be very careful, as even the scientists were not infallible."

Prabhupāda: How many scientists?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They are also fallible, they can also make mistakes. "Experts Misled: For instance, investigators in universities in the West were known to be misled by tricksters who claimed para-psychological powers." Like ESP.

Prabhupāda: They invent some big, big words (laughter). Aparkalasvena-vargolas-double-wakundali-gondolais (gibberish). (laughter)

Room Conversation -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Same thing here. Nobody would purchase it on account of this black quarter. Nobody was purchasing, ready to purchase.

Hari-śauri: So Kṛṣṇa is saving some very nice places for us.

Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa's trick. Everyone talks of the "We Eastern, we believe in this," and "We Western, we believe in this." You remain peaceful, everyone. Everyone is thinking like this. We have no such thing, Eastern, Western. It is fact. For everyone, it is good. Eastern, Western, we don't take. Several times, this question.... I talk, I spoke in the American Embassy in Calcutta. They gave me the subject matter, "East and West." So I, in the beginning, I began to speak that we have no such dual..., East and West.

Interview with Kathy Kerr Reporter from The Star -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Kathy Kerr: So that means then that our society then gives certain people certain status just because of their job, that's not correct.

Prabhupāda: Yes. We must come to the correct position of our spiritual life, then it is perfection of life. Otherwise, they're ignorant. If the husband comes at home and the wife calls him by the name, "John, come here." "Oh, you are not addressing 'my lord,' " it will be ridiculous. He might be "my lord," in the court, but when he's in the family, the wife calls by the name. So our, with the change of dress we are changing our name, circumstances, thoughts, and everything. Therefore we find differentiation. American, Indian, Hindu, Muslim, black, white, this, these are all designation of the dress. And therefore we do not agree. As soon as I accept, identify myself with the dress, there will be disagreement. And as soon as we, everyone of us, we know that this is superficial, this is dress, I am spirit soul, then there will be agreement. Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu, find out this verse. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu (BG 18.54). So without this understanding they have opened United Nations, keeping them cats and dogs. And they are simply barking, that's all. This is going on. For the last forty years simply they are barking. What achievement is there? In your country, who is the president gave the black man same liberty? Jayādvaita: Lincoln. Prabhupāda: Lincoln. Equal right, but actually, there is some tension, black and white. Because they are not on the spiritual platform. Viśvakarmā: In Canada, Prabhupāda, it's the French and the English. Prabhupāda: Everywhere, some tension. The Catholic, the Protestant; the black, the white; the Hindu, the Muslim. That must go on because if we accept on the platform of dress, of body, then there must be ignorance.

Interview with Kathy Kerr Reporter from The Star -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: Equally disposed. As soon as he knows that I am not this body, I am spirit soul, then there is no distinction. Just like two American goes to India. So when they understand that "We are Americans," immediately their interest becomes one, although they are in the foreign country. That is psychology. Similarly, as soon as we come to the spiritual platform, there is no such distinction as black, white, Hindu, Muslim, Christian. Everything finished.

Room Conversation -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Jagadīśa: Eighty percent of the people in the city are black.

Prabhupāda: And the white men, they are very much afraid of these black men. They have to be afraid.

Jagadīśa: They've taken over the city.

Prabhupāda: Without them, the factories cannot go on. That's all. The white men cannot work so hard. How they...? No gentleman can do that. This kind of work is meant for the fourth-class, fifth-class men. Therefore they cannot say anything. They require. And they know that their money will be taken away again by supplying them wine. They'll pay, and next moment, the wine merchant will take away. And the government will get huge profit without doing anything. And excise tax. Excise tax, government hasn't got to invest or do anything—simply take the tax.

Room Conversation -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: And addicted people, they, they're after the.... Get money some way or other. Beg, borrow or steal. So these black men especially, they are expert. They are not expert in begging, but borrowing and stealing.

Jagadīśa: Is it possible, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement will, in the future, turn the tide and gain predominating influence? Change...

Prabhupāda: Thing is that if the leaders of the society, they come to their consciousness, that this way the society cannot be peaceful, the way they are now conducting.... If they have brain.... Just like the other day, the Christian priest. He was speaking of disabled men. You were present? I challenge you: what do you mean by disabled man? If one man has lost his arm, can you supply it? Then he stopped.

Interview with Professors O'Connell, Motilal and Shivaram -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: There is no distinction between man and woman. That is clearly said in the Bhagavad-gītā. Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpā-yonayaḥ striyo śūdrās tathā vaiśyāḥ (BG 9.32). The first is mentioned, striya. Striyaḥ śūdrās tathā vaiśyāḥ. These classes are understood to be less intelligent-woman, śūdra, and the vaiśyas. But Kṛṣṇa says, "No, even for them it is open." Because in the spiritual platform there is no such distinction, man, woman, or black, white, or big or small. No. Everyone is spirit soul. Paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). Vidyā-vinaya-sampanne brāhmaṇe gavi hastini śuni caiva śva-pāke ca paṇḍitāḥ (BG 5.18), one who is actually learned, he is sama-darśinaḥ. He does not make any distinction. But so far our material body is concerned, there must be some distinction for keeping the society in order.

Conversation in Airport and Car -- June 21, 1976, Toronto:

Hari-śauri: Control wheat?

Prabhupāda: Yes. They purchase from here and there all rejected wheat, and they supply it. There is no ghee, no milk, no proper food grain. Everything black market. Any necessary commodity you cannot have in the open market; you have to purchase in black market. Just like for the building purpose, cement. In your country you can purchase any amount of it. You cannot purchase. You have to purchase black market, and that cement also mixed with some... What is that? And unless you give some bribe, it is not possible. (break)

Viśvakarmā: ...for the balcony in the church in the other room? How can we... (announcement being made)

Prabhupāda: ...fit for sitting. That is very nice. And next time when I come the seat should be just Deity altar, so that all balcony can see.

Conversation in Airport and Car -- June 21, 1976, Toronto:

Kīrtanānanda: I think it was just ten years ago when I first met you.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I never said that "You have to give up this, you have to do this." Never said. Then gradually ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). When the heart becomes cleansed, then little. There is no hopelessness. So many people have come, and they are coming. Both black, white, everyone is coming. There is no question of (indistinct). But you cannot expect that cent percent people will come; that is not possible. But even, even one-fourth percent people come to this, then it will be successful. Compared to the American population, what percentage we have got? Still they have made some impression, the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement. Literatures are selling, they are appreciating, learned circle.

Room Conversation -- June 24, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: So how you make this double color. Twice printed?

Kulaśekhara: Three times. Red, black and yellow.

Prabhupāda: Vṛndāvana-candra? No.

Kīrtanānanda: Vṛndāvana-natha.

Prabhupāda: Where?

Kīrtanānanda: He is at the original farm where you stayed. This is the pūjārī. Very, very nice boy. He also makes that nice sandesh. Rādhānatha.

Prabhupāda: And who makes the singara?

Kīrtanānanda: Kuladri.

Hari-śauri: Kuladri makes those, he's doing some special thing to them.

Prabhupāda: They are not giving me. (laughter)

Room Conversation and Reading from Srimad-Bhagavatam Canto 1 and 12 -- June 25, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: (microphone rattling) Just like common business. Bring that black (indistinct) Bhāgavata. Five thousand years before Bhāgavatam was written, and so many foretelling are there. (microphone rattling-indistinct) If you like, you can keep...

Devotee: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Twelfth Canto, Third Chapter.

Pradyumna: Tataś cānu-dinaṁ dharmaḥ?

Prabhupāda: Hmm, before that.

Pradyumna: That is first chapter.

Prabhupāda: Read it, tataś cānu-dinam, it is third chapter.

Room Conversation -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: So far, there was no disturbance.

Hari-śauri: No, not while we were there.

Prabhupāda: No, before that.

Hari-śauri: No, they haven't reported any disturbance.

Prabhupāda: And the black men, they come also?

Hari-śauri: Yes, I think they are...

Prabhupāda: Sympathetic.

Hari-śauri: Yes, because the devotees are not prejudiced in any way. We have white devotees and we have black devotees also. And if the neighbors want to come and see the place, then they are allowed in and shown around. We are about the only ones who could possibly live there.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Hari-śauri: We are the only ones that could live there.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (long pause) What is the reason they are given equal facility, still they are so wretched, poor, ruffian?

Hari-śauri: Just low class. There's no intelligence how to utilize their wealth correctly.

Prabhupāda: Same thing in Africa.

Room Conversation -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: The black men.

Hari-śauri: No, just the people in general, for happiness. Because they understand that if there are so many different groups, then there will always be fighting and dissent. So they are always looking for some compromise how to get the groups to live together.

Prabhupāda: This is equal—Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Otherwise not.

Hari-śauri: No. Materially speaking, they've tried so many ways to integrate the black with the whites here in America, but what has actually happened is, through those efforts, they've created a worse situation. By deliberately forcing black children and white children to go to the same schools... Sometimes they have what's called here bussing. It's a big major issue in politics now. Because they take all the black children and they take them to a white area just so that they can go to the school there. They actually take them further away from their local schools to another school, where it is all white children, so that they'll integrate and mix. So it's very controversial.

Prabhupāda: The parents won't like.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: This is a questionnaire which was sent to us by one journal, a cultural and religious journal in Bombay. It's called Bhavan's Journal. And they are questioning different religious leaders, especially in India, trying to get the answers to some of these important questions which are perplexing especially the Indian public today. So there's a list of about 21 questions, and we can go through them one by one for Śrīla Prabhupāda to answer. The first question, "Is the influence of religion over the masses on the wane?" Is the influence of religion over the masses decreasing?

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is predicted in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Tataḥ anudinam. Bring that black book, Bhāgavata. Tatas cānudinaṁ dharmaḥ satyam. This is Kali-Yuga, the age of waning of these things. Religiosity, truthfulness, memory, bodily strength, duration of life, mercifulness.

Hari-śauri: Pradyumna's just going to come with it.

Prabhupāda: These are, will be declining. These are the, I mean to say, human assets which makes a human being distinct from the animals. But these things will decline. There will be no mercifulness, there will be no truthfulness, the memory will be shortened, duration life shortened. Similarly religion will vanish. So that means gradually they will come to the platform of animals. And especially when there is no religion, it is simply animals.

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Hari-śauri: They get the lobsters sometimes alive, and they throw them in boiling water, and they can hear them screaming. But now they're speculating whether it's actually the lobsters screaming because it's being boiled alive or whether it's just air that's coming out from its body and making a squeaking noise.

Prabhupāda: No, that is, apart from that, they import lobster from India, Cochin. They are exporting lobster alive. I have seen. The same ship, they load it with lobster fat, and black creepers, and cashews, they exported. The big, big business firms are exporting. So these lobster, although they are kept in ice and so on, so on, they become decomposed. I've seen in the port, that Commonwealth Pier. There is store of lobster, and the lobster has become yellow and almost melted by decomposing. They are selling that.

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Everything should be utilized. Instead of drinking water, you can drink whey. It is very good for digesting. Whey, put little salt and black pepper, it is good digestant. You can avoid water, drink whey. You can use it for cāpāṭi.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Making dough?

Prabhupāda: Cāpāṭi, just like you dip the cāpāṭi, dāl, you can dip whey. You can save dāl preparing expenditure. Nothing of milk product can be wasted. You should learn it.

Hari-śauri: Yes. That's what I thought, that's why I was asking.

Prabhupāda: Up to the last drop, it can be utilized.

Arrival Room Conversation -- July 2, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: But they are simply interested with the pots. External. Bahir-artha-māninaḥ. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ durāśayā ye... (SB 7.5.31). They are thinking by changing the pot the advancement of civilization will increase. And that is going on. Just like America. You have got very big, big roads, nice cars, everything. You are changing the pot, but the eatable is the same.

Vipina: I heard a nice example given the other day about how living entities are suffering. A black widow, male and female black widow spiders, have sex life. After the sex life the female spider consumes the male spider, eats him alive.

Prabhupāda: What's that? Spider.

Vipina: Black widow. She will eat him after sex, kill him.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) So we are also killing by and by, and she kills immediately. That is the difference.

Conversation with Prof. Saligram and Dr. Sukla -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

It is a machine manufactured by the material nature under the order of Kṛṣṇa. So actually it is not my body, it is Kṛṣṇa's body. Kṛṣṇa has given us. He has given you a particular type of body, He has given me a particular type of body, so many. Yantra, machine. Just like on a machine, motorcar, we sit down and travel here and there. So we wanted to travel in a certain way so we require some machine, and Kṛṣṇa has given us this machine manufactured by material nature. Mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ suyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). So Kṛṣṇa is within the core of heart of everyone. He knows what I want. He's giving us facilities. We wanted to enjoy this material world, and He's still giving direction, "All right, you want to get this facility, sit down on it and travel as you like." So we are getting different machines. Sometimes the human body machine, sometimes dog machine, sometimes cat machine, sometimes demigod machine. We are desiring all these things. American machine, Indian machine. When you are in Indian machine you are thinking "I am Indian. My business is to satisfy Indian interests." You Americans are thinking "This is American machine; it should be used for America's benefit." These are upādhi. Upādhi means designation. Neither I am Indian nor American nor cat nor dog. But as soon as I get a particular type of body, I think that I am cat, I am dog, I am Indian, I am America, I am black, I am white, this. This is our position. And people are struggling on this understanding, "I am this body." So long we think like that, "I am this body," we are no better than cats and dogs. He is also thinking "I am this body." Is it not? What do you think, Mr. Sukla? If I think I am this body, the dog is also thinking "I am this body," then where is the difference between the dog and me?

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: That is very simple. Spiritual understanding, that is, I was speaking... This is beginning of Bhagavad-gītā. Spiritual understanding is that I am not this body. (to devotee) You move it this way. This is spiritual understanding. So long I am under this bodily concept of life, that "I am this body," "I am American," "I am Indian," "I am Hindu," "I am Christian," "I am white," "I am black" and so on, so on, these are all bodily concept of life. So long we keep ourself on this platform, then we are on the material platform. When we understand that "I am not this body..." That is the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe (BG 2.13). Deha means this body, and dehī means the owner of the body. So unless we distinguish the owner of the body and the body, there is no spiritual knowledge. So long we identify with this body, that is material knowledge. And when we understand that "I am not this body, I am a spirit soul, I have been entrapped by this body," that is spiritual knowledge.

Arrival Comments in Car to Temple -- July 9, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: This is Second Avenue?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think Third Avenue. Next comes Lexington Avenue.

Prabhupāda: This is black area?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Puerto Rican and black. This city has as many people Puerto Ricans as Puerto Rico does. So many Puerto Rican people come here, because part of it's a possession of the United States. So the East Side is Puerto Ricans and the West Side...

Prabhupāda: Generally they are worker class.

Morning Walk -- July 10, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: His name is Bon Mahārāja, and my Guru Mahārāja used to say banamānuṣa. Banamānuṣa means the gorilla. (laughter) He is black also like gorilla. He has given so much trouble to Guru Mahārāja.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So we should go now, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Called him back: "Call this rascal back." Every month he was being sent seven hundred rupees. That, in those days seven hundred rupees is a big amount. So at least ten time value has gone up. Seven hundred means seven thousand. He was spending for nothing, and he was publishing report, "Swamiji is playing on harmonium." And photo. This is first year, second, like that.

Room Conversation -- July 10, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: He says about me that "Bhaktivedanta Swami has smeared the black carbon of all other swamis." (laughter)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Black carbon. You know Sadajivitlal from Bombay.

Devotee: Oh, yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He used to get very angry. He said, "I like your Prabhupāda very much, but why does he have to criticize all of our gurus?"

Prabhupāda: Now he is realizing.

Room Conversation -- July 10, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Actually she does?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes, that's the meditation. They put the ping-pong ball, and then it describes, "She will feel peaceful and serene. At the same time she may not be able to tell whether her eyes are open or closed. She will see neither white nor black nor any shade in between. She will have the experience of not seeing. At that point, which the subject in this kind..."

Prabhupāda: With the eyes closed, then not seeing is there already. (laughter) What is the use of meditating?

Hari-śauri: You aren't going to see very much with two ping-pong balls over your eyes, are you? (laughter)

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1976, New York:

Hari-śauri: Very infamous?

Prabhupāda: Yes, means notorious. They say that black men, they capture white women.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes, I've seen it. When I was very young I saw it. I was playing in the park, because I lived next to Central Park, and this, these... We were playing with my friend and his sister, and this black man jumped and grabbed her and raped her right in Central Park. I was only about six years old.

Prabhupāda: And what was the age of the girl?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: About twelve. So I have personal experience. Especially in the upper part of this park, about Eighty, Ninetieth, Hundredth Street, there it's very dangerous. Where we are on Fifty-ninth street, it's not very dangerous. And on the east side down here it's not that dangerous.

Prabhupāda: Just see these black men living in such a highly rich country, and civilized men, but their nature is not changed. Angara satatau tena(?), but they can be changed only in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. No other way. Kirāta-hūṇāndhra-pulinda-pulkaśā... (SB 2.4.18).

Morning Walk -- July 12, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: But I was residing there.

Rāmeśvara: That was where the typewriter was stolen?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Tape recorder, typewriter.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, from up here.

Prabhupāda: It was stolen by that caretaker, a black man. He expected some monthly remuneration.

Morning Walk -- July 12, 1976, New York:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And that boy was keeping meat in his refrigerator?

Prabhupāda: No, that is another boy, Yeargen.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: John Yeargens?

Prabhupāda: He's black.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You were staying with him?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Wow. Your Godbrothers could never believe this. (laughter)

Devotee (1): So at that time you did not think that anyone would accept your philosophy.

Prabhupāda: That I was certain. At the beginning I was...

Rāmeśvara: Prabhupāda was certain that they would accept.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think, Prabhupāda, that your exploits here are no less great than Lord Caitanya going into the Jhārikhaṇḍa forest and making the animals dance.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Yes.

Morning Walk -- July 18, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: "Afro-American Art." What is this?

Hṛdayānanda: I think it means art by American black persons.

Rāmeśvara: Afro-American means people with dark-skinned bodies, they have painted these paintings.

Hari-śauri: One of the big problems that you read about a lot now is how parents are confused about how to educate their children, because there are so many different standards, and they don't know how their children will turn out anymore.

Prabhupāda: Here is our standard—to make him devotee.

Conversation with George Harrison -- July 26, 1976, London:

Hari-śauri: Fifty years old. It's very solid, though, very good condition as well.

Prabhupāda: And on the house on bottom, there is river. Not directly, but an offshoot of river. People come, rowing. A very nice situation, and because it is black quarter, nobody was purchasing. So I said that "For us, what is black or white? Purchase it." So we got very cheap. At that time I paid them hundred and fifty thousand, and (indistinct). So we purchased.

George Harrison: Did they find a temple in Hamburg? In Hamburg. I was there once, but they just had a little tiny house, and they were trying to get another.

Prabhupāda: Hamburg, I think closed?

Jayatīrtha: They have a place in Frankfurt, where the devotees are.... Just outside Frankfurt.

Room Conversation -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: There will be great catastrophe. The unemployment will increase, and people will be very dissatisfied with the.... Especially the black. They will create havoc. This is artificial. They are increasing the production of tire tube and lid. So who will purchase? Nobody lives in the tire tube. Therefore unemployment. So therefore reduce production. You cannot go on increasing. You very much trade this tire tube and so many artificial.... It is very artificial civilization. If you produce.... (break) Here so far milk and food grains are concerned, whatever sumptuously you want to eat, eat. Balance you can keep stock. The milk can be converted into ghee, then keep stock, and the grains can be stocked. Whenever you like, you just grind the grains and have to eat, halava.

Room Conversation -- August 2, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: Indian system is, the bridegroom... So when the man went to see the girl, the father called his son, bridegroom's father, "My dear Gauracand, please come here." So he came. He was just like a black negro. And gauracānda means fair complexion. So one of the party came to see. So, "This is in your country gauracānda, so where is kālacānda, can you bring him?" So that is the respectable gentleman, and what is debauch?

Harikeśa: Kālacānda means black, very black. Gaura means fair.

Prabhupāda: When Gauracand was called, a black negro came. So if Kalacand is called, who will come then? (laughter)

Harikeśa: There seems to be such an amazing repertoire of stories and analogies in the Bengali language, isn't there? So many.

Prabhupāda: In Bengal the, just like here, so many, black mixed up with white. In Bengal and Madras, so many Dravidian have been mixed up with the Āryan. Therefore in Bengal and Madras you'll find many black.

Room Conversation -- August 2, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: Dravidian culture. Dravida. They are non-Āryans. Just like these Africans, they are not Āryans. Now they are mixing up with Europeans and Americans. In India, it was, one from the higher section, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, they will be fair complexion. Śūdras, black. So if a brāhmaṇa becomes black, then he's not accepted as brāhmaṇa. Kāla bahu (?). And if a śūdra becomes fair, then he's to be know that he's not pure śūdra. Although we do not take very, but, this brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, by birth, but still, we have seen, those who are coming purely from high caste family, their behavior and śūdras behavior is different. The family culture. And the spiritual culture lost, still, the family culture keeps them separate.

Meeting with Italian Printer -- August 5, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Yogeśvara: He finds it difficult to accept that the truth is something that you can put down in black and white. He seems to feel that it's more something you can realize through meditation.

Prabhupāda: How you'll realize? Unless you learn ABCD, how you can realize truth?

Translator: He's saying that we believe in the spiritual truth, but does that mean that our material truth does not exist?

Prabhupāda: It is conditional. Just like your body exists for a certain days only. But it is not eternal. But you, soul, you are eternal.

Translator: For the truth, since each one finds the truth in himself, does that mean that the truth is different for each person? Each person has his truth.

Prabhupāda: Yes, he's truth, he's soul, but he thinks as untruth, he thinks he's body.

Evening Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: That was my policy from the very beginning, that if the Americans accept, then my mission will be successful. And that is being done gradually, and I am insisting that, preach in America vigorously. If America accepts, then whole world will accept. That's a fact. Anywhere, although America may be fallen, the ideal is American, everywhere. Because they have got money. Kali-yuga means money. If you have got money, then you have got culture, you have got education, you have got everything. That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Formerly, they were attached, family, aristocracy, culture, education. Nowadays there is no such thing. Get money and you get everything. It is not? Somehow or other, if you have got control over money then you have got everything. Bring that black Bhāgavatam. What is that sound coming? There is goat?

Parivrājakācārya: I think a lamb, sheep.

Prabhupāda: Lamb.

Parivrājakācārya: Yes.

Evening Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: That's all. After heating, put little ghee, very little, and mix it with black pepper and salt.

Atreya Ṛṣi: We mix it or you mix it.

Prabhupāda: I can mix.

Atreya Ṛṣi: We'll bring it separately.

Prabhupāda: But this is good.

Atreya Ṛṣi: And also we can bring some fruit?

Prabhupāda: No. More salt, pepper. So this is nice.

Room Conversation -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: This is always, Western disease. It is a Western disease. Vairanga-roga (?). In the Ayur Veda it is called vairanga-roga. Fairanga, ferengi, ferengi, the Westerners are called ferengi, the vairanga-roga. So this syphilis disease was imported in India by these Europeans. Before, it was not there. There is a medicine called (indistinct) injection. Fifty years ago it was one rupee, four annas, price. But during the wartime the same medicine was selling at nineteen (ninety?). On black market.

Arrival Conversation -- August 13, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Hari-śauri: This silver loṭā has become very black. You can get it polished.

Prabhupāda: See if there is...

Hari-śauri: If there's?

Prabhupāda: If there is worms.

Hari-śauri: I was looking in the corner where some spiders have been, and there's some signs again of worms. Some powdered remains and things like that. So I think if we do it once more then it should be finished.

Room Conversation -- August 14, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Kleśada āsa dehaḥ. Kleśada, as soon as you get a body, kleśada. May have good doctor friend, but I'll have to suffer. We can get some relief, but suffering is there. Therefore na sādhu manye. It is not good. So people are being trained up to become mad, pramattaḥ. And do anything, bring money. This is the modern civilization. Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma (SB 5.5.4). Things which are forbidden, they are doing that. Why? Indriya-prītaya āpṛṇoti, only for sense gratification. They have no other ambition. Bring money and gratify senses. This is modern civilization. This is the exact explanation-nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma (SB 5.5.4). Black money, white money, this money, that..., never mind, bring money.

Indian Doctor: (laughter) By any way.

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is modern civilization. Big man, big rich man means bring money some way or other. This is big man. This is Kali-yuga. Because if you have got money, you have got respect, you have got honor, you are recognized. So therefore they are after money. Bring money, that's all right. When I shall get money, I may have done black money, force money, this money, nobody will remember it. Bas. This is modern civilization. Bring money and enjoy sense. Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma (SB 5.5.4). What for it is, struggle so much working hard? Yad indriya-prītaya. Only for the satisfaction of the senses. They have no other ambition. Because most of them, they do not believe there is next life. Most of them, 99.9 percent, they do not believe. Big, big professor, I have talked with so many big, big men in Europe. They have no... Our leaders also. The Munshi, he did not believe in the next life.

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Anyway, he'll collect. That's all.

Jayapatākā: Your program everyone is appreciating. When the newspapermen came out, at that time the black development officer he came there, and when the newspapermen were there he sat down with all the poor people and he took also and said, "This is very good. This is our national service." And they photographed.

Prabhupāda: "National Service"?

Jayapatākā: Yes, he mentioned.

Gargamuni: Still, though, because of these articles, it has been a little bit hard to secure money from people now because the people who are giving us money, they are under investigation also, the rich people. So when they see we are under investigation, oh, then they get afraid. They don't want to give.

Prabhupāda: Why?

Gargamuni: Because we're under investigation and they're also being investigated, so they don't want to endanger... The government is every day raiding the houses of the rich people.

Prabhupāda: Anyway, what is the investigation?

Jayapatākā: They are being investigated for income tax.

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Jayapatākā: I have never gone inside. I heard it is simply old English armor and some swords.

Prabhupāda: Yes, I have seen.

Gargamuni: And the marble is turning black.

Prabhupāda: Because they don't...

Gargamuni: They don't clean it.

Jayapatākā: How they can afford to maintain such a building?

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa will maintain. We can utilize it properly.

Jayapatākā: And we'll have British pūjārīs. For the glory of Queen Victoria.

Prabhupāda: Victoria. Let them send. Tell them that we shall bring. Victoria has... Let them send to worship Victoria with prasādam of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. That is real Victoria Memorial.

Room Conversation -- August 20, 1976, Hyderabad:

Hari-śauri: Most of them were wearing trousers.

Prabhupāda: No. Parsees are well known for saris.

Hari-śauri: In Iran, though, I saw most of the women wear... Under those black veils they were actually wearing trousers.

Prabhupāda: Not wearing saris? (pause) We have no problems except this immigration.

Hari-śauri: Yes. That's the main thing.

Prabhupāda: Otherwise we have no problem.

Room Conversation -- August 24, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Even though they're not... You cannot say not... They are clean. I have seen in Bombay even the poorest man, his house, and a Parsee gentleman, his house. Kitchen habits. A Parsee's kitchen is so nasty. And here you see this poor man's house, they are neat. Their utensils how much cleansed. I had been in Parsee kitchen. All the pots black. Nothing is cleansed. For eating they use this China. So clean or unclean cannot be understood. Simply washed. But so far the kitchen pots, all are... In our also, when it is handled by this European, American devotees, the black. Down, it is black. That should not be black. It must be cleansed.

Mahāṁsa: By the heat with these wood, it brings up a lot of soot.

Prabhupāda: But it must be cleansed daily.

Mahāṁsa: It should not come on your finger if you touch it. That black thing.

Prabhupāda: Not even you cannot see black, any black spots. Then it is clean. Otherwise not clean. If there's a single black spot, it is not clean. You can see from this poor class of men, how their utensils are cleansed. Before taking water the jug, the waterpot... You'll like to drink water. In our school days there were sweeper, they were a different quarter. So you like to sit down. So clean. The sweeper, cleansing the toilet, bangi. But when you come to his house, living quarter, oh, it is so clean. The bed, the room, the utensils. And they also will take twice, thrice bath, then they will eat. That is a Hindu culture. Even the sweeper class, lowest class. And I have seen one sweeper class who were in Allahabad, regularly worshiping Deity. Very nice worship.

Meeting With Member of Parliament, Mr. Krishna Modi -- August 31, 1976, Delhi:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Even in black Africa Prabhupāda has temples.

Krishna Modi: Yes, that is good.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I said even in black Africa you have temples and devotees.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Krishna Modi: You must circulate these all things. At least to our members.

Prabhupāda: Read it.

Lokanātha: Where is the verse?

Prabhupāda: Why don't you print the opinions? Several times...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: We have printed.

Prabhupāda: Where is that?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, I have it. We have printed the reviews in all, and the Kṛṣṇa Consciousness is Authorized.

Prabhupāda: That is a simple thing, but all the reviews you should print them in...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: In a book form.

Meeting With Member of Parliament, Mr. Krishna Modi -- August 31, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Black market.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. And one friend of ours told us what they do because all the cars belong to the state, a lot of taxis, the people...

Krishna Modi: The taxis are not independent.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, they all belong to the state. But the driver, if he makes extra money, that goes in his pocket and they have tipping also.

Prabhupāda: And they are always anxious to get extra. Buses are not very good. Third-class buses.

Meeting With Member of Parliament, Mr. Krishna Modi -- August 31, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: That is good. That is good. The psychology is that if you earn more and government will tax more, then the impetus for earning more is cut.

Krishna Modi: Therefore they have got no black money. And here the system is different. If you will earn more then you will have to pay more. It means people are not as interested in earning.

Prabhupāda: Therefore what is the use of earning? What is the use of earning?

Krishna Modi: That is true.

Meeting With Member of Parliament, Mr. Krishna Modi -- August 31, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: And this is the only platform where real United Nations can be made. That is practical. That is practical. That United Nation has failed. If this Indian culture... I have given this philosophy to the American students. Andha-paṅgu-nyāya. That a lame man and a blind man, separately, both of them are useless. But when they combine together, the lame man is taken on the shoulder of the blind man, and the lame man has got eyes but he has no legs. He gives direction and the blind man goes. So the, at the present moment I am trying to spread this movement all over the world. But we have no means. So let America supply the money, and let them take our direction for the culture. That will be United Nation. And actually it will become. How they are dancing, black, white, Indian, American, European, in Ratha-yātrā? There is no politics. It is out of really spiritual ecstasy.

Room Conversation -- September 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: He is very intelligent. He has said to a friend, that Bhaktivedanta Swami (Hindi) Kāla means, that he has made all other so-called sannyāsīs, yogis, black-faced.

Akṣayānanda: (laughs) Jaya. He is intelligent.

Prabhupāda: Bhaktivedanta Swami sata mukala.(?)

Akṣayānanda: It's true. It's true.

Prabhupāda: Now here is a big sannyāsī, Akhandanandan, or Bon Maharaja. They are supposed to be big, big sannyāsī.

Room Conversation -- September 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Kāla. Kāla means lajjita. Black face. Everyone should be ashamed. They may be envious on account of their failure, but if you come to the actual valuation, sata mukala. That's a fact.

Hari-śauri: Actually, that Bon Maharaja is very black anyway.

Prabhupāda: He's so black, there is no more black required. (laughter) A black snake. (Bengali) In Bengal it is said if a brāhmaṇa is black he is dangerous.

Akṣayānanda: If a brāhmaṇa is black?

Prabhupāda: That means he's not pure brāhmaṇa. Brāhmaṇa cannot be black. Just like a European, if he becomes black, that means he has mixture. European and American, if he's black, that means mixture. So brāhmaṇa family, how it has... Still, family, it must be very fair. Śukla. Brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya family must be very beautiful. If he's pure. Kāla brāhmaṇa prakāśa śūdra (Bengali) beki poṣya-putro pasaraila.(?) It is a slang language. Kāla brāhmaṇa. Brāhmaṇa should not be black and śūdra should not be white. And a Musselman should not be dwarf. Because formerly real Musselmen were coming from Kabul, Afghanistan. That is called (indistinct). If a Muslim is dwarf that means he is not real. (Bengali) Prostitute's son, and poṣya-putra, adopted son. They are all of the same class. How this selection? Black brāhmaṇa, white śūdra, dwarf Musselman, and prostitute's son, and adopted son. Adopted son, he gets money without any earning and spends like... I have seen so many adopted sons.

Room Conversation -- September 7, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: But not that willfully do something wrong. There is punishment. If one unconsciously, without any knowledge, does something wrong, that is excused. But they do willfully. They know it is wrong, still they do it. That is punished. Knowingly. Caitanya Mahāprabhu personally said, asat eka strī-saṅgī. Those who are habituated to illicit sex are punishable. Asat. It is very, very bad. And still if somebody does like that, he is punished. This is going on. "All right." Here illicit sex... The bābājīs, I heard, they say, "What is the wrong there? It is love." They say like that. They take it as love. "Gopī's love," they say. "Gopī's used to do that, used to have illicit mixing, intermingling with Kṛṣṇa. What is wrong?" They'll say. They get support from Kṛṣṇa līlā. Such rogues they are. Sahajiyās. There are many so-called gentlemen, they write books on Kṛṣṇa līlā, paint picture." This is very nice. Kṛṣṇa is advocating illicit intermingling." They take it as support of their sinful activities. I have seen personally. Anyone who is a woman-hunter, he's being addressed by his friend, "Oh, you are like Kṛṣṇa." They take Kṛṣṇa as a man. How they will take instruction of Kṛṣṇa? Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhāḥ (BG 9.11). Paraṁ bhāvam ajānantaḥ. We are teaching people to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, to become servant of Kṛṣṇa, and the so-called gentlemen, enlightened gentlemen, take Kṛṣṇa as a debauch. Black debauch. (break) ...Vaiṣṇava religion is sex. (break) There are aborigines in India. Santal, (?) they are called santal. Black men, live in the forest like the African aborigines. So I asked him that "You, jungle, do you meet the tigers?" "Oh, yes, yes. Why not?" "So how do you save yourself?" So he had a small axe in his hand. So he showed me that "So long I have got this axe, even the tiger will not dare to attack me." (Bengali or Hindi) After all, tiger is afraid of the axe. They are afraid of even stick. That immediately they understand, "He's superior." Actually man is superior with some weapon. I have got personal experience. He said, "He's a big tiger. But we treat them like dogs." One axe. They keep always. Just like we keep a stick, they keep one axe.

Room Conversation -- September 30, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: One boy, he was coming to me. In that hundred, about one hundred seventy-first street, all my things were stolen. My tape recorder, typewriter. Fortunately they did not touch my manuscript that I was typing, typing my books. So some money was stolen. Then one boy, he was coming to me, he told me, "Please come to my place." A loft. Bowery Street. I did not know the Bowery Street was not a good quarter. All bums and drunks. When I see there, one Jewish friend, he had electrical shop, he told me, "Swamiji, you have gone to Bowery Street? Oh, it is not your place." I did not know that it is full of drunkards. But they were lying down in front of my door, but they were very respectful. When I'd go, these drunkards comes and they respectfully give me ways. And they would lie down on urine and something like that, on water. Then the boy who took me there... He was Murray. His last title was Murray. And he was taking LSD. So since I went there he did not go to work. Otherwise, he was working and getting daily twenty-five dollars, in some dock he was working. Since I went, he stopped working, and I had to pay 125 dollars for the loft. One lady was the landlord. So I was going on. Some people were coming. That Mukunda began to come, his wife, and another black boy, half-black. Yeargen, Karlapati. I gave him name, Karlapati. He was coming. Then one day that boy Murray, he showed some crazy features.

Room Conversation -- September 30, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So I shifted there. And there I remained up to May 1967, I think. Then I got heart attack. Then I went to Stinson Beach. Then I could not improve my health. No, first of all, I went to San Francisco. There also I could not sleep at night. There was throbbing in the heart. Kīrtanānanda, he was serving me. So many difficulties. Then I came back to India in 1967 July. Here also not very much improvement. Then again I went to Los Angeles. There also one symptom developed. Always some sound in the ear, gongongongongon. It was so disturbing. Almost half-mad. And then Los Angeles. Then I think I went to Seattle. In this way, in the beginning there were so many difficulties. Montreal. I took Canadian citizenship. America I could not get. So one gentleman in the immigration department, he said, "Swamiji, you go to Canada and from there you try. It will be easier." Actually, it acted. The Canadian consulate general was a black man, American black man. So in the consulate I applied for immigration, and he was sympathetic. He saw my Teachings of Lord Caitanya and he became attracted. So he settled up. "This gentleman must be allowed." So he expedited the matter within three months. And then I became immigrant in the U.S.A. Then again I came back in Los Angeles, and then we took that house, La Cienega.

Garden Conversation -- October 9, 1976, Aligarh:

Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa conscious movement. We are giving equal chance everyone. It doesn't matter what he is. Kṛṣṇa says, māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ. Pāpa-yoni means low class, poor, uneducated, ugly, no education. That is pāpa-yoni. So they can be raised. Kṛṣṇa says. How? Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya. If he is engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Therefore it is the topmost welfare activities in the human society. Anyone can be raised. There are different grades of life all over the world. Some are black, some are white, some are ugly, some are poor. Varieties. Some are trees, some are plants, some are aquatics, some are birds, beasts, insects. Different varieties of life, 8,400,000. Some of them demigods, Brahmā, Indra, Candra. Very, very powerful. Just like this sun, that is also a planet, and the chief person is the sun-god Vivasvān. We get all this information. There is. These rascals, they do not know what are these planets, what are the arrangement. They are exactly like this planet. Just like here also, we have got president. It is expected, one president or one king in one planet.

Garden Conversation -- October 14, 1976, Chandigarh:

Prabhupāda: Brahma-bhūta (SB 4.30.20) means first of all you understand your identity. You are now identifying yourself as Indian, or as brāhmaṇa, or as kṣatriya, or white, or black, and so many things.

Indian man (4): My first identification is my own body.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is ajñāna. So long you are identifying with the body, you are no better than the animal. So we are doing that. We are fighting. "I am Indian. You are Englishman. You are this. You are that. You are..." Simply we are fighting, like cats and dogs, they fight. So that is ajñāna. How you can be prasannātmā? So when one becomes actually situated in spiritual life, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). That is the... In this way when you make further progress, when you actually understand that you are eternal servant of God, then you surrender. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). This situation takes many, many births to cultivate. And when he actually understands, jñānavān—not fools, rascals—then māṁ prapadyate, vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). That mahātmā is very rare to be found. So bhakti is not so easy. Sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ. It is not so easy. It takes many, many births to come to the understanding that vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti (BG 7.19). Sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ. Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ bhajanty ananya manasaḥ (BG 9.13). This is mahātmā.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1976, Vrndavana:

Jagadīśa: I think so. Balavanta... There was one man, a black man who was running for mayor at the same time that Balavanta was, for Atlanta. And that black man dropped out of the race and supported Balavanta.

Prabhupāda: He's a black man.

Jagadīśa: Yes. Then, later on, that man he was appointed Lieutenant Governor under Carter. So Carter and this man are close, and through this man Carter knows about Balavanta and the movement.

Prabhupāda: You have written one letter?

Jagadīśa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Balavanta is very intelligent boy. He can do that. Bring that spring water, little. You can type this?

Jagadīśa: On your letterhead?

Prabhupāda: Hm, yes.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: He was a politician. That you cannot blame. Politics require all these things. A politician cannot be a saintly person. That is not possible. For politics he has to do so many things. That is necessary. Just like Arjuna wanted to be a nonviolent. Immediately it was condemned by Kṛṣṇa, "What is this nonsense? You are a military man. Nonviolent." And similarly, politicians, they require all this. Businessman must deal in black market. It is inevitable. Otherwise he cannot improve. Because the world is bad, you, if you become honest, then you cannot make pros..., cannot become prosperous. Sate sārtham samācaret.(?) Brāhmaṇa's dealing must be very straight and honest. They are not meant for politics or business. They are for transcendental knowledge. Kṛṣṇa conscious person should be all-inclusive. He must be a politician, he must be a brāhmaṇa, he must be a kṣatriya, he must be a śūdra—everything. All-inclusive. Because he is transcendental. In otherwise he is neither a brāhmaṇa, neither a śūdra, neither a... Yes. Nāhaṁ vipro na ca nara-patir na yatir vā. Neither of these. In other side he is everything. That is Kṛṣṇa conscious. As Kṛṣṇa is sometimes cowherd boy, politician, sometimes dancing with, artist—He is everything, not one-sided. So all food is finished?

Devotee: Yes, Prabhupāda.

Room Conversation -- November 15, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: The black people, they are simple. They are not so (indistinct). If they are satisfied...

Jagadīśa: We gave them prasādam and a little chanting and they were satisfied.

Devotee: Actually the neighbors around here, all along here are businesses on either side.

Prabhupāda: Then they'll suffer?

Devotee: Then there's no... Actually even if we ask for rezoning, they cannot refuse us because according to their laws the only thing that this particular land can be rezoned for, number one on the list is churches and temples. But...

Prabhupāda: No, you do it, but if there is doubt you can say, "No temple."

Devotee: Right, right.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct-talking together) ...take the name of a temple.

Room Conversation -- November 20, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: They have given up meat-eating and illicit sex. Their life is spoiled, and so on, so on." So their theory is not without background. There is a background philosophy. And for Western countries, this is a completely new idea. Therefore they are charging, "brainwash." They are not to be blamed because they are, I mean to say, raised in that ideas. Hm? Is it not? Yes. "So this is simply brainwash movement. It has no factual standing." Even our country, what to speak of Western countries. Where the spiritual civilization has a strong background, they are also not believing. Nobody believes Kṛṣṇa is God. Even big, big leaders, what to speak of ordinary men. Especially the so-called educated men. "Bring money anyhow and enjoy life." Nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma (SB 5.5.4). And for money they are doing everything. Black money, white money, yellow money, this money. (laughs) "Bring money and enjoy. Bas. This is life. Why this nonsense Kṛṣṇa consciousness? No this, no this, no this. Ninety-nine per cent no and one per cent yes. What is the value of this movement?" Is it not? Our life is ninety-nine per cent no. No air even. (laughter) So what to speak of other thing. It is very difficult. Therefore in the beginning I was hopeless, that "Who will hear this movement? Simply no." And especially in this country, in Europe. So dull brain. (end)

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- December 7, 1976, Hyderabad:

Mahāṁśa: And the land is very good, this soil here, this black soil, very good for cotton. It is called black cotton soil.

Prabhupāda: So you grow. Cotton requires water?

Mahāṁśa: It requires water. We have to have at least...

Prabhupāda: Paddy and...

Devotee (4): Not as much as paddy.

Mahāṁśa: Not as much as paddy. And sugar cane can grow very well on this also.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Immediately grow sugar cane.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Everyone will throw a stone. Very tortuous death, stoning.

Hari-śauri: I remember my auntie's mother. She was Italian, and she used to wear black all the time. Just like the widows here, they wear white, so she was wearing black. She was a widow. So all the widows, even I saw some young women...

Prabhupāda: Here also, in Gujarat, they wear black, black sari.

Hari-śauri: Yes, right. And they wear black, and they don't dress attractively at all, and there's no question of marrying again.

Prabhupāda: And Russia also, respectable widows, they used to live in widow's home. They would never marry.

Hari-śauri: And they would wear black too.

Prabhupāda: I have seen that house when I was in Moscow. That was one of the... What is called...? They go to see, especially tourists.

Morning Walk -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Crows will never come to a nice place. They'll go to the filthy place, where everything rubbish is thrown out. The crow will take advantage of it: "Oh, here is enjoyable thing." Tad vāyasaṁ tīrtham. So we have been educated to become vāyasa, crows, useless black bird. There are other birds also, but these... Amongst the birds, these crows are most disliked by everyone. So our present literature and taste of literature is like that, crows. "Ka, ka, ka, ka." Even amongst the birds, they'll find swan, white swan. And they're black crows. Nature's division is so nice. Na yad vacaś citra-padaṁ harer yaśo pragṛṇīta karhicit tad vāyasaṁ tīrtham uśanti mānasā (SB 1.5.10). That is rejected by the mānasā. Mānasā means the birds who live in the māna-sarovara, just like ducks and swans.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Mr. Asnani: And taking share from the black market also.

Prabhupāda: How you can expect good wishes from such persons? Very precarious condition. Your son, you take care. Now, as soon as you make a committee to take care of your son, then everything is finished. Is it not? The committee members will finish the son and the son's maintenance and everything. But that is going on. Formerly there was one monarch. He was acting according to the Vedic instruction. So he was responsible. And if there are many votes, by vote a government, a combination of plunderers, what they will take care of the people? It is impossible. Otherwise why there was need of dragging down Nixon? He was elected, wrong elected. Wrong must be. The people are wrong. They do not know who is the right man. Any rascal makes some intrigue, and he gets vote. And then they detect, "Oh, he's the wrong man." Again another is taken. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). And what is the guarantee that another man is right? Because the process is wrong.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Pradyumna: "It is said here that the cows used to moisten the pasturing land with milk because their milk bags were fatty and the animals were joyful. Do they not require, therefore, proper protection for a joyful life by being fed with a sufficient quantity of grass in the field? Why should men kill cows for their selfish purposes? Why should men not be satisfied with grains, fruits and milk, which combined together can produce hundreds and thousands of palatable dishes? Why are there slaughterhouses all over the world to kill innocent animals? Mahārāja Parīkṣit, grandson of Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira, while touring his vast kingdom, saw a black man attempting to kill a cow. The king at once arrested the butcher and chastised him sufficiently. Should not a king or executive head protect the lives of the poor animals who are unable to defend themselves? Is this humanity? Are not the animals of a country citizens also? Then why are they allowed to be butchered in organized slaughterhouses? Are these the signs of equality, fraternity, and nonviolence? Therefore, in contrast with the modern, advanced, civilized form of government, an autocracy like Mahārāja Yudhiṣṭhira's is by far superior to a so-called democracy in which animals are killed and a man less than an animal is allowed to cast votes for another less-than-animal-man."

Prabhupāda: That's all (laughing) we have said. You can do one thing. You have got nim tree?

Devotee: Yes.

Morning Discussion about Kumbhamela -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Alpa-chidre. A small... White, white cloth and a small black spot, it becomes prominent.

Gurudāsa: So we won't do it. We can try and preach to them at other place. Because we're going out on saṅkīrtana many times. We're getting a list of all the other programs in the Mela, so we'll take our saṅkīrtana parties where it's going to be prominent and pass out literature. Now, for the meeting, for the resolution, I thought perhaps on the 16th or the 17th, because it is close to the big bathing day on the 14th and it won't conflict that much with other programs.

Prabhupāda: Meeting means all other sādhus, they will meet?

Gurudāsa: Yes. I'm getting invitations printed up, and then we can write their names in, and I want to make the invitation something personal, like "This is a meeting of utmost importance."

Prabhupāda: So that, some Swami Chand?

Hari-śauri: Chandra Swami, minister for Air India.

Morning Walk -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: And her controlling this younger generation. That is another point of...

Dr. Patel: They're putting black man without any penny in his pocket, like that.

Prabhupāda: In 1971 many papers astonished how one Indian is controlling so many white men. There, our paper became surprised. They cannot control even one white man.

Dr. Patel: This type of mental, sort of makeup, has been created after the industrial revolution, because...

Prabhupāda: These German people have accused that "The old man is sitting in Los Angeles and he has engaged all these young boys and getting money from them." The German propaganda. They're thinking that way, that I have some mind control power, I engaged these young men and they're getting money and I am enjoying.

Room Conversation -- January 10, 1977, Bombay:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: These covers I did in Bombay. These are books from the other covers. They came out very good. Ādi-rasa was telling me, in a week we'll also do the black and white in Bombay, because the quality is going to be better.

Prabhupāda: You make expert, on quality expert.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: We are doing all the Gujarati covers in Bombay now, and I wrote to Jayapataka. We can even do the Bengali printing here.

Prabhupāda: In India, Bombay is best. There are many offset printing houses.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Like in the Bengali Back to Godhead they did in Calcutta, they spent eight paisa more per copy printing than Bombay, and quality was much inferior. So now I said, "You compose over there..."

Prabhupāda: Typeset is Delhi good, but offset-Bombay.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: You take one paper, that black one there.

Jagadīśa: Do you want to take rest, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No.

Hari-śauri: (to child) Finished? It's too hot? He can't eat the samosa. It's too hot. He can't eat the samosa. It's too hot.

Prabhupāda: Oh. So is there any remaining in...?

Hari-śauri: Puffed rice is finished. But he can't eat the samosa.

Prabhupāda: So you can eat. He can take this thing. Hand. Keep that paper and apply it in service. (sweeping noise) Yes. (sounds of door opening, closing, train starts again) The bathroom is free?

Hari-śauri: Yes. (break)

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa consciousness is real religion. Religion cannot be "your religion" and "our religion."

Room Conversation -- January 19, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: When I was going to your country at Cochin, they loaded in the ship cashews, black pepper, and lobster, big, big cases. There are many American firms. They are export business. Lobster is very favorite food in USA. Although it is rotten, still, they take it.

Gargamuni: My father used to take at least once a week.

Prabhupāda: Lobster juice.

Gargamuni: Lobster and everything, the juice... He used to eat many lobster, King lobster.

Rāmeśvara: That's a big business. In the state of Maine, that is one of their main sources of income, lobster. Famous, Maine... That state...

Prabhupāda: They get lobster locally or...

Rāmeśvara: They fish. The waters...

Gargamuni: They farm them. It's become like farming. They raise them in scientific way now.

Prabhupāda: Like they grow chicken.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: They come to us.

Rāmeśvara: Yes. They come to us. "Whites and nonwhites attend with equal frequency." Not that the white people are more religious; black people are less. "People with a college background are more likely to go to church regularly than those who never went to college, but people who never went..." In other words, they're saying if you went to high school but you did not go to college, the chances are you will not go to church as much as if you went to college. But if people went to grade school and then they left without going to high school or without going to college... That means they left at, say, fifteen years old. Then they have the best chance for going to church. That means the less education you are given in America, the more religious.

Prabhupāda: That is everywhere.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Gargamuni: (laughs) Say that, yes. We're brainwashing, washing their brain.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And all these rubbish things we are finishing. "Yes, it is brainwashing, ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12), cleansing the core of the heart, all mistaken ideas." Speak in the court like that. "And see how we are being appreciated by scholarly section. Here is our book. Read if you have got time and see the opinion. It is really brainwashing, but for the good. Everything requires cleansing—for good. If bad impression, bad ideas, are washed, why do you protest? Let it be done. Give us freedom. It is brainwashing, but for the good, washing for good. Just like you wash your cloth. Do you think it is bad? Dirty cloth, if it is washed nicely with soap and water, who will protest against that? 'Oh, why you are cleansing your dirty clothes?' That is another foolishness. Everyone, every gentleman, every civilized man, washes his clothes with soap and water to become more refreshed. So we are giving this civilization... Actually it is brainwashing, but for the good. And see our example. The boys and girls whom you are charging, 'Brainwash,' just see after brainwashing, how gentleman they have become. They have become moralist. They have become God conscious. They are clean outwardly. Their fooding is so innocent and so nutritious. So why do you check it? Bring your plate and our plate. Now judge. Which is better? You taste. Halavā, puri, samosa, kachori, vegetable—one plate; and boiled meat with salt and black pepper... So taste now which is better."

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Rāmeśvara: I think you even said that "This unemployment will destroy your country." You once said that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. At least, the black men will spoil everything if they are unemployed.

Rāmeśvara: He'll simply become a thief.

Prabhupāda: Thieves, rogues and plunderers. That's all.

Hari-śauri: Detroit has the highest murder rate in the world, 'cause all the city population is black.

Prabhupāda: Therefore we could purchase that palace which costs six million dollars fifty years ago. And we have got for three hundred thousand. Why? Nobody was purchasing. Who will go to purchase there? I took it. "Yes it is..." I offered him... He was asking 350,000. So I told him, "I'll pay you cash, all three hundred." He immediately agreed. (laughs) I should have offered him less. He would have agreed. Nobody was purchasing.

Evening Conversation -- January 25, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: He has suffered too much. When I was in Los Angeles after coming back from India, in that black quarter, do you remember? No.

Gargamuni: Black order?

Prabhupāda: Black quarter.

Gargamuni: Oh. That was on West Pico Boulevard? That storefront?

Prabhupāda: Our temple was...

Gargamuni: West Pico Boulevard, right. I know that place. Yes. I was there. Yes, right, when you came back.

Prabhupāda: Before our La Cienega...

Gargamuni: Yes. It was in the black quarter. I can remember.

Prabhupāda: I was continuing my disease up to there.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: But when we tried to get immigration from Montreal, I got it within three months. Of course, the Consulate General was a black man, and he appreciated my books very nicely. He immediately he accepted.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: In my case, the university sponsored me saying that nobody in the United States that can do the job as I do, which is not true.

Prabhupāda: What is that job?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: My job, my work, chemist, the instrument I work. Saying that... Must be written to the Federal Government, to the Labor Department, saying that there's nobody who would be able to do my job in the United States, qualified. Then the second condition is that by being employed myself, then nobody will be displaced. Any U.S. citizen will not be displaced by my employment. So those two conditions. And it has to be written by the university sponsor.

Prabhupāda: So very difficult, that.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Nanda-kumāra: Black men.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Nanda-kumāra: Keśava was picking them up over his head and throwing them across cars. Ten men. He took all of them, only himself. Finished all of them. He didn't kill them, but he stopped them. He said he felt Lord Nṛsiṁha-deva helping him. But he was fearless.

Prabhupāda: He is robust also, like kṣatriya, Keśava, Karandhara's brother. All right, you may go. So that...?

Gargamuni: In this letter they have asked for six persons, five including yourself. I think if we send a few more by vehicle, by car, vehicles, then we can bring maybe ten or twenty more, and we can have big programs. Five men are not enough.

Prabhupāda: So do that. He'll do.

Conversation on Roof -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Black snake, yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You helped him so many times.

Hari-śauri: He's a known thief, anyway.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This man stole from his father, and it is clear now that he joined this movement only to get an American woman and to go to America. I think he never had much intention to worship Kṛṣṇa. He's eating meat, and his wife... Even when they came to America he ordered is wife, "Now you cook meat." He looks very different now. He looks like a rākṣasa.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Feature is rākṣasa.

Evening Darsana -- February 15, 1977, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Spicy, yes. The Western palate is bland food. They don't like too much spice.

Prabhupāda: No. They simply take boiled, little black pepper and salt. That's all. (laughter) And that is also stale meat. That is Western. And then they drink coffee and tea.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And liquor.

Brahmānanda: And cigarette.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And cigarette for digestion.

Prabhupāda: And their loaf, that is three hundred years old, (laughter) with little butter like...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually they are eating just like prisoners.

Prabhupāda: So from restaurant you have got good income there?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Ādi-keśava: It is their ignorance.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But you are rascal. You are bringing something which is not the fact. First of all find out the similarity; then you can say, "It is like that." Where is the similarity? This is false logic. Analogy means the points of similarity. Then you can make analogy. The moon is beautiful, and if one's face is very beautiful, you can say, "This face is as beautiful as the moon." But if it is ugly, black, then how you can make that "This face is as beautiful as the moon"? Where is the analogy?

Ādi-keśava: No analogy.

Prabhupāda: Analogy means points of similarity.

Room Conversation with Adi-kesava Swami -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: We can take help from Indira Gandhi if we bring recommendation from the embassy.

Ādi-keśava: Right. Another thing is sometimes the intellectuals, they are backing us, and the very low class people, they also like us very much because they feel... The black people feel, for instance, that we are being persecuted like they have been persecuted. But the middle class people, they are the ones who are against us, and they are by far the greatest number.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ādi-keśava: So I'm wondering what is the best way to influence them in our trial.

Prabhupāda: They will not. Because our all men are coming from middle class, so they are already against us because their sons have joined. How they can be in our favor?

Ādi-keśava: I don't see any way. (Prabhupāda chuckles) We go to the court and the judges always say...

Prabhupāda: But there are many fathers and mothers, they have... Mothers, they have appreciated our... So as far as possible, take... But because they are concerned, they have lost their children—they are against us.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- February 28, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: The fireman, Indian driver, the signal man, they are not very high class men.

Rūpānuga: In America the scientists are like the blacksmiths. They're like just blacksmiths. And in India the scientists may have some culture... Prabhupāda: Blacksmith or black snake? Rūpānuga: Both. (laughs) But at least in India... Prabhupāda: So organize in India. Make your headquarters in India. Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. Gopāla Kṛṣṇa already told me that he will give us two rooms. Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Two, three, as many rooms, you take. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That theater is very prominent. Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- March 26, 1977, Bombay:

Girirāja: They keep the money in black.

Śrīdhara: Oh, in black money.

Prabhupāda: And religiously-minded.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, I find almost everybody appreciates Śrīla Prabhupāda so much, especially in Bombay. Anybody who knows about Śrīla Prabhupāda, they highly appreciate, especially these scholars. But in Delhi it is very different. People are very close-minded.

Prabhupāda: And government servant. After all, they are servants. In Bombay, they are in big, big business. They are limited. The government servants, they are limited. They are important so long they are on the post. Otherwise, they have no importance.

Morning Talk -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: And if Upendra can do like Bhavānanda, then it is very nice. Let him he trained up. He can do. (discussing cleaning of floor) Now it is black.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It is starting to shine.

Prabhupāda: The more we do...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It is like shining one's heart.

Prabhupāda: This is, this is marble.

Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 23, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So our Gandhi's program failed because he could not attract the villagers to these activities. Everyone wants some attraction. That we were discussing, rasa, catur-vidhā-rasa, dharma, artha, kāma, mokṣa (SB 4.8.41, Cc. Ādi 1.90). So we have to educate them to be attracted by the mokṣa-rasa. Then they'll stay. Unless there is rasa... Just like if you put a little sugar, small black ants will come immediately. The rasa is there. Raso vai saḥ. If... If you cannot attract people to some rasa, they'll not stay. Just like these Americans, foreigners, they have tasted little rasa in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Therefore they are sticking. That we have to create. That is bhakti-rasa. So our first beginning is that the villagers may come, we have our temple, and they chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, and give them nice prasādam. And then, gradually, they will be attracted to this rasa. So that we want.

Morning Conversation -- April 29, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: You see this Tirupati, Tirumala. All the contribution by the villagers. By their hard-earned money they keep something for going. You have seen Tirupati, Tirumal...? Standing for hours to contribute in a line. Hundreds of people. They'll come, contribute something. Then they'll shave their head, see the Deity, have some bath in the adjoining lake. Then they'll take prasādam. That is very big tank. Everywhere. In India, wherever some famous temple is there, there is a tank. Now the haircutting, that lakhs of rupees are sold to foreign countries is hair. Heaps. These managers, they are selling the hairs. Very big business. The foreign countries, the black hair, they purchase it at good price for making wig. (pause) So that is written nice. He wanted to criticize me, but he could not do it very strongly. He did not like the idea that I am sticking to Bhagavad-gītā. That was his... But it has been shown that our sticking to Bhagavad-gītā, that is our mission. And it is a science. Why he called sectarian? When Kṛṣṇa says anything, that is science. "Two plus two equal to four" is acceptable by everyone. Why it is sect...? Actually all religion is going on under the plea, "We believe." What is this nonsense, "We believe"? If you believe "Two plus two equal to five," will it be correct? Their religion is "We believe." So our Bhagavad-gītā is not like that. It is fact. That is the difference. (break) ...of him. I was staying there in one big room. Crazy. Alone I am.

Evening Darsana -- May 13, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: This is the shastric, Vedic culture, that we have to purify ourselves from the bodily designation. That is called ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12), cleansing the dirty things within the core of the heart, that "I am this"—"I am Indian," "I am American," "I am brāhmaṇa," "I am sannyāsī," "I am gṛhastha," "I am white," "I am black." These are the dirty things. So these dirty things can be cleansed by chanting this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra. Śṛṇvatāṁ sva-kathāḥ kṛṣṇaḥ puṇya-śravaṇa-kīrtanaḥ (SB 1.2.17). This chanting and hearing is puṇya-śravaṇa. If you do not know anything about, if you simply chant and hear, you become purified, puṇya, because on account of dirty things, impious life, you have become covered by different bodies. Mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani. Different bodies means the way of birth and death. That you have to stop. And that is stopped when you get Kṛṣṇa; otherwise not. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, I think, in the Ninth Chapter... Find out this verse, aśraddadhānāḥ puruṣā dharmasyāsya parantapa, mām aprāpya (BG 9.3). You cannot get Kṛṣṇa. If you have no faith in Bhagavad-gītā, then you cannot get Kṛṣṇa. If you don't care for Kṛṣṇa, that is another thing, but if you want to get Kṛṣṇa, then what Kṛṣṇa says, you follow.

Conversation Pieces -- May 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: "Too thick. How shall I eat it?" Oh, it was so nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Satyabhāmā gave Prabhupāda this black cāpāṭi. He thought, "So thick. How will I be able to eat it?"

Prabhupāda: Very delicious and easily digested. They are living very happily. You had been there?

Rāmeśvara: No, I've just heard all the good reports.

Prabhupāda: Very happily. That is life. Eat very sumptuously nutritious food. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Bas. What is this nonsense life, from five o'clock in the morning driving big, big trucks, "Whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh..."? Is that life? In Berkeley... Berkeley? Or where is that? Where are our temple only?

Rāmeśvara: Yes, Berkeley.

Prabhupāda: So there is a road. Whenever you go, always trucks: "Whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoo, whoo, whoo..." The docks and ports filled up with all rubbish things. People are harassed. Is that life? And they are compensating by drinking, by illicit sex and meat-eating. Soul-killing civilization. Śīta ātapa bāta bariṣaṇa. You know this song? There is a song.

Discussions with Devotees and Conversation with Dr. Ghosh -- June 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) Begin. (Bengali conversation) (break) What is that?

Bhavānanda: Fruit juice and sabji, so much...

Dr. Ghosh: But you'll get your pomegranates? I'll get it.

Bhakti-caru: (Bengali) (Bengali conversation)

Dr. Ghosh: How you'll take care of him?

Upendra: Massage. He's cooking.

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) (Bengali conversation) We have got black cows.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We have black cows.

Dr. Ghosh: (Bengali) (Bengali conversation)

Prabhupāda: He said there is no fear. Everything is all right.

Room Conversation -- June 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: A man is working. Now he has got with him rice, ḍāl, āṭā. Now anywhere he can collect this dry gobar and set fire. And he has got his loṭā, and he's cooking. Very palatable and digestive.

Upendra: The balls, laktha, they're looking... I mean, when they are finished, they are looking brown or black?

Prabhupāda: No, brown. Brown and blackish spot.

Upendra: Black spots.

Prabhupāda: Then it is prepared, very... Just like loaf.

Upendra: Yeah, bread loaf.

Prabhupāda: Then put it into ghee. That according to your... Put it long time or keep it or take it, as you can digest.

Conversation with Surendra Kumar and O.B.L. Kapoor -- June 26, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Where is Tamāla? That boy? That black boy? What is his name?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, Ghanaśyāma.

Prabhupāda: Ghanaśyāma. About his activities?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You want me to read it?

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, it is very interesting, how they are fighting against odds to introduce our movement. There is a written description.

Conversation with Surendra Kumar and O.B.L. Kapoor -- June 26, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Dear Śrīla Prabhupāda..." This is a black devotee. "Please forgive me for my countless offenses against you and the entire Vaiṣṇava community. In desperation I beg that you accept my apology for being such an artificial devotee. My humble obeisances I quickly offer to you. I am simply praying every day for you to force me to become a true disciple. Otherwise I will be doomed."

Prabhupāda: How humble he is!

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Spiritual life means to please the Gurudeva..."

Prabhupāda: He was a principal somewhere?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This boy was the top of his class in Yale University. He's the president of the class, top man in the entire graduating class. (continues reading letter describing preaching activities and book distribution in Communist Yugoslavia) Sometimes my life is being threatened or sought after by the authorities. Still..."

Prabhupāda: It is very dangerous work.

Morning Talk -- June 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Incompetent government. America knows, "If there is a useful man, why should we not give?" I know, in Montreal there was a black man, what is called? Consulate?

Devotee (1): We have no limes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Where's Bhakti-caru?

Devotee (1): At the go-down. We have got lemons but no limes. Are lemons all right?

Prabhupāda: What is that lemon?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Lemon means like a light yellow, lemon.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, lemon.

Conversation with Bhakti-caitanya Swami-New GBC -- June 30, 1977, Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: He can give so cheap one lakh. Somebody gives you a black, what is called...? Berries, berries.

Upendra: Black pepper?

Prabhupāda: Black pepper.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So you'll take the milk of magnesia.

Prabhupāda: Yes, and little (indistinct).

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. (indistinct) Maybe you'll get immediately, I mean, if you take it before going...

Prabhupāda: No, before going, take out.

Room Conversation -- July 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Public will see how we can unite white and black by this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That will be very good result.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Lot of black people follow her. All of her followers are black people.

Prabhupāda: Introduce this Ratha-yātrā in every city. Great festival will attract people. When we first..., first or second year, Upendra was dancing like anything. (laughs) You remember?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That was the second year. Around the tree he would dance.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Do you remember that?

Upendra: Yes, Prabhupāda. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: Maddened with gladness. You were sitting by my side. That was very nice.

Room Conversation With Son (Vrindavan De) -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, no, it is waste of time. Don't write such book.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. He says, "In addition, I plan to write on other highly regarded welfare workers such as the American Civil Rights worker Martin Luther King." Boy, if he does that, every black person in America will hate us. It'll create many enemies. This book will be the biggest enemy-creator. We already have enough enemies.

Prabhupāda: That will be embarrassment. Yes, I said, "I do not know this." Bas. Finished. And that means it is not so important that I should know it.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Right.

Prabhupāda: Unless something is important, why shall I try to understand it? It is all useless. Actually that is. Our criterion is, as soon as we see one is not Kṛṣṇa conscious, he is rejected. He is nothing. He has no value. That is our criterion. Just like the other day he was opening that book of geography.

Room Conversation with Vrindavan De -- July 6, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That's all. And one tin box. (laughs) Give up this mistaken idea that "If we get some large sum of money from our father, then we shall be happy." That is not... That is wrong idea. Happiness depends on Kṛṣṇa consciousness. You can take advantage from your father that you may not live uncomfortably. That's all, that much. That I am making sufficient arrangement. In your present position you'll never be disturbed. Now try to become happy by advancing in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is required.

nūnaṁ pramattaḥ kurute vikarma

yad indriya-prītaya āpṛṇoti

na sādhu manye yata ātmano 'yam

asann api kleśada āsa dehaḥ

(SB 5.5.4)

Pramattaḥ. These persons are mad, pramattaḥ. Prakṛṣṭa-rūpeṇa mattaḥ. Mattaḥ means mad, and pra means still more, more than mad. Kurute vikarma. They are engaged in so many nefarious activities—black market, white market, stealing, burglaring, so on, so on. Vikarma. Idam adya mayā labdham idaṁ prāpsye punar dhanam. This is asuric thing. If one can squander away crores of rupees like Harendra Singh... Suppose if I give you each one lakh of rupees, how long it will take? You can squander away in one day. Take some regular income. Be comfortably situated. Advance in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Bas. That is happiness. In your whole life you'll never be disturbed for economic condition. That I am arranging. That's all. That "I am suffering for money." No. It will regularly. Is not that scheme? So what is next Mukherjee? Hyderabad (Hindi) It will be great service to Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation -- August 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Surabhī: And before I asked the question, he told me what my question was. So he said, "You have two questions." I said, "No, I have one." He said, "No, you have two." Because my question was how long you will stay. So he said, "No, you want to know about health and about life span." So he gave both answers. He also said that the medicine... The best thing for you to take is milk of a black cow and juice, fruit juice. That is the best to take.

Prabhupāda: Fruit juice.

Surabhī: Yes. Lot of juice and milk of black cow. And then tulasī.

Prabhupāda: That is not difficult.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That you're practically doing.

Prabhupāda: But he said "black cow."

Surabhī: He insisted on black cow.

Yaśomatīnandana: Śyāmala.

Surabhī: And if black is not... Bhagatji is looking for a black cow. He's been looking for the last two weeks. And also tulasī, he said. That is very important to take.

Prabhupāda: So you have? You can give me.

Room Conversation -- October 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Black cow.

Bhagatji: We will keep one cow ready

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, all the time. One cow. Bhagatji says one cow will be kept ready all the time, so when you say you want milk, immediately they will go and milk this cow. (chuckling)

Prabhupāda: Hm. (pause) That's all right.

Room Conversation -- October 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Anyway, things are going nice-slow but sure. You have got this Persian civilization and he has got the African civilization. (laughter) Black and white.

Bhakti-caru: Śrīla Prabhupāda? (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) (break) ...coming with the report of Persia and...

Hari-śauri: He's saying he's very much pleased when you gave the report of Persia.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: You should come and visit us, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: I am ready to go immediately.