Mr. Dwivedi: There is no question of cooperation. We fully believe what you say. Cooperation means by just not...
Prabhupāda: Cooperation means what we say they must do.
Mr. Dwivedi: We have firm faith in what you say.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Then we can take any...
Mr. Dwivedi: Cooperation can come even from a person who may not understand a whit.
Prabhupāda: No, cooperation means that.
Mr. Dwivedi: In our own small way we try to live to what Your Grace has been telling me. We live actually in life.
Prabhupāda: Don't try to... That is cooperation. Don't try to amend the instruction of Bhagavad-gītā. That is cooperation. The rascals, they amend. And what can I do? I can use this strong word. This is used in the Bhagavad-gītā, mūḍhāḥ, narādhamāḥ, duṣkṛtinaḥ. So it is not my manufacture. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). Why we should amend Kṛṣṇa's word? Surrender and do. That is cooperation. All these swamis who...
Mr. Dwivedi: Are we even one millionth of what Kṛṣṇa was? If we are even one millionth of what Kṛṣṇa was, we...
Prabhupāda: No, you are. You are. Kṛṣṇa says. You are sample of Kṛṣṇa.
Mr. Dwivedi: We are sample of Kṛṣṇa. Correct.
Prabhupāda: But... So your duty is to cooperate. Mamaivāṁśo jīva-bhūtaḥ (BG 15.7). Living entities, Kṛṣṇa says, they are part and parcel. Just like this finger is part and parcel of my body. It's duty, primary duty, is to cooperate what I say. I say the finger, "Come here." Immediately... That is the duty. That is cooperation. And I say the finger, "Come here," and finger goes anywhere, that is not cooperation. Similarly, whatever Kṛṣṇa says, you do it. That is cooperation. Then it will be successful. If you manufacture your own meaning, amendment, and your scholarship, nonsense, then you spoil. In politics, nonviolence? Hm? Just see. Do you think Gandhi became successful by nonviolence? Do you think? Violence. When Subhas Bose organized this I.N.A. it was successful. Otherwise he failed in South Africa; he failed in India.
Mr. Dwivedi: I had the privilege of being fairly nearly with Subhas Bapu. The last I met him was just some time before his going when he wrote a message...
Prabhupāda: He was... He was for...
Mr. Dwivedi: ...for my paper for all India. I do not know whether it was Subhas Bapu's influence or I do not know my own karmas, but at least in Gandhi...
Prabhupāda: That it is a fact.
Mr. Dwivedi: I could not appreciate him.
Prabhupāda: No, it is a fact. When Subhas Bapu... He was always pleading, "Gandhiji, these people are not to go by your nonviolence, and we have to take to violence." Gandhi would say, "I will not fight. Sva-rājya ." Then Subash went outside India. Somehow or other, he organized. And when the Britishers saw that "The military force, they are joining national movement. Now it is no hope..." Because the Gurkhas and the Sikhs and other military races, they were cooperating with the Britishers, therefore they were maintaining. They could not bring soldiers from their country. And when they saw, "The soldiers are joining Subhas," they left. "Now independence." This is a fact. Otherwise Gandhi he was patting, "Mahatmaji, you are such a great man."
Mr. Dwivedi: In the... I used to meet him more frequently there in northly country in the late 20's, 1929 and '30, when Mr. Jawaharlal Nehru found League for Independence of India. Subhas Bapu was the second.
Prabhupāda: I was present in that meeting.