Indestructable (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
"indestructible"

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Robert Gouiran, Nuclear Physicist from European Center for Nuclear Research -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupäda: That is, that is spiritual energy. Two energies. We accept two energies. One, this material energy, which can be cut into pieces, which can be dried up, which can be moistened, which can be burned. But another, spirit, that cannot be done so.

Yogeśvara: If I remember correctly from the little bit of studies that I did in physics, I think it's also the physical definition that material energy is also indestructible, that it's transformable, but not destructible. Is that correct?

Robert Gouiran: Exactly, that the, that the... I was telling the definition of the energy. And if we start from pure energy, absolutely immaterial, pure energy, this pure energy can transform itself in two parts. One is called matter and the other I call anti-matter. And these two parts, they can annihilate together, and then you have back the pure energy. That is definition, our definition, of anti-matter. The anti-matter is what is produced with the matter from pure energy, and what is annihilated by matter to produce again pure energy. You can't, you can't produce our matter, ordinary matter, from pure energy. It's impossible.

Prabhupāda: That I have already explained. That pure energy is spiritual energy, and from that spiritual energy the material energy comes out. That I have already said: From the soul the matter grows. So that is spiritual energy. The basic energy is spiritual. And because the spiritual energy is the cause and the material energy is the effect, therefore in one sense we can say there is no difference between material energy and spiritual energy. Because spiritual energy is the cause, and material energy effect. Effect may be presented in different forms. Just like cotton is the cause of thread. And the thread is transformed into cloth. But you cannot take cotton for cloth. The cotton is there in the cloth in a different, transformed, transform, but you cannot accept, when you require a cloth, you cannot take cotton. This is a crude example. So the cause of physical elements is spiritual energy, and the spiritual energy is... Both spiritual... Spiritual energy is coming from God.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

If we accept the soul's characteristics such as its having no beginning or end and its not being destroyed, annihilated, after the destruction of the body, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre [Bg. 2.20], then you can understand the soul is eternal.

Room Conversation with Russian Orthodox Church Representative -- June 13, 1974, Paris:

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa:

vedāvināśinaṁ nityaṁ

ya enam ajam avyayam

kathaṁ sa puruṣaḥ pārtha

kaṁ ghātayati hanti kam

"O Pārtha, how can a person who knows that the soul is indestructible, unborn, eternal and immutable, kill anyone or cause anyone to kill?" (French)

Church Representative: I have nothing to say against. But I cannot say that it is a definition. Do you say in English, definition?

Prabhupāda: Yes, definition.

Church Representative: I cannot say that it is a definition. It is a sort of creed, a profession of faith.

Prabhupāda: No, it is characteristic. Definition means you mention the characteristic. That is definition. Definition, you mention the characteristic. So that can be mentioned directly, or if it is not perceivable, then you can define in opposite way. Just like we have got experience: everything in the material world, it is beginning. There is a beginning. Anything of this—your body, my body, everything—it has got a beginning, and it has got an end. So it is stated, na jāyate na mriyate vā: "It has no beginning, no end." And nityaḥ, eternal, śāśvataḥ, very old, purāṇaḥ. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre [Bg. 2.20]. "It is not destroyed, annihilated, after the destruction of the body." So if we accept this definition, then we can understand the soul is eternal. Our characteristic, if we accept these characteristics, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre [Bg. 2.20], after the destruction of body the soul is never destroyed, then you can understand the soul is eternal. And it is clearly stated, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre [Bg. 2.20]. "After the destruction of the body, it is not destroyed." So, it means it takes another body. (French)

Just like you have no eyes to see the sun at night although it exists, it is your deficiency that you cannot see Kṛṣṇa although He is eternally existing.

Reporters Interview -- June 29, 1974, Melbourne: Guest (2): But supposedly, Kṛṣṇa is eternal or, that is, indestructible. So surely He must be existing today. Prabhupāda: Yes, Kṛṣṇa is existing. Just like at night the sun is existing, but you have no eyes to see him. That does not mean sun does not exist. It is your deficiency. You cannot see.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

The body's destructible, but the spirit soul is not destructible. When you understand this point, then we understand what is spirit, and then spiritual culture begins.

Evening Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Pradyumna:

antavanta ime dehā

nityasyoktāḥ śarīriṇaḥ

anāśino 'prameyasya

tasmād yudhyasva bhārata

[Bg. 2.18]

"Translation: Only the material body of the indestructible, immeasureable and eternal living entity is subject to destruction; therefore, fight, O descendant of Bharata."

Prabhupāda: Only the material body is subject to destruction.

Pradyumna: "Only the material body of the indestructible, immeasurable and eternal living entity is subject to destruction."

Prabhupāda: Yes, the body's destructible, but the spirit soul is not destructible. When you understand this point, then we understand what is spirit, and then spiritual culture begins. Without being convinced of this spirit soul, there is no question of spiritual culture. So the spirit soul is described as eternal. And the proof is given, eternity. Just like there are so many children. They'll grow up from childhood to boyhood, from boyhood to youthhood. The body is changing. This is very practical. But the spirit soul is there, the same spirit soul which was within the womb of the mother in a small body. Then coming out of the mother's womb, the same spirit soul is there, but the body is different. In this way, the body is being situated in different status, but we know that the proprietor of the body is the same. Is there any difficulty to understand? Anyone? The body is changing, that's a fact. You are young man. You'll have to become an old man like me. That means body will change. But so far you are concerned, you are the same. So, the body changes and the spirit soul remains the same. This is to be understood first of all. What is the difficulty? First of all, you must distinguish what is spirit, what is matter. Material culture means this body is there, it requires some necessities. The body must be given something to eat. Is it not? Eating? Then the body must be given some rest, sleeping, for which we require some apartment, some place. Not we, but also even the animals, birds, they have got their nest, or the animal has got some hole or something. So eating, sleeping, and some sense gratification, sex. These are bodily necessities. But when you understand what is spirit, then we must try to find out what the spiritual necessity is. That is spiritual culture. You cannot go on with the bodily culture as spiritual culture. That is a mistake. Spiritual culture is different from the bodily culture. And when we understand it, then there is no question of Iranian spiritual culture or Indian spiritual culture.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

This is the spiritual nature. This is material, within this universe, and that is spiritual. Paras tasmāt tu bhāvaḥ anyaḥ: [Bg. 8.20] "another nature, which is indestructible."

Morning Conversation -- April 30, 1977, Bombay: Prabhupāda: ...and millions of Vaikuṇṭhalokas, planets, and the topmost planet is Goloka Vṛndāvana. This is the spiritual nature. This is material, within this universe, and that is spiritual. Paras tasmāt tu bhāvaḥ anyaḥ: [Bg. 8.20] "another nature, which is indestructible." This is the whole situation. Now, how you show it, that you think over. This is only fragmental part of material creation. And each universe is floating in the..., like a football. Football floats in the water. It is like that. And each universe, half filled up with water, Garbhodakaśāyī. And the planetary system is hanging on that half filled-up water.