Prabhupāda: Asura-buddhi and sura-buddhi, due to our little independence. Just like we are talking. So we do not agree; therefore we are talking. So one of us may be asura and one may be sura. Therefore we do not agree. Otherwise, there is no use of talking. So that is natural. That is the conditioned stage. Because we are conditioned by the material nature, some of us are asuras and some of them are suras. Dvau bhūta-sargau loke 'smin daiva āsura eva ca (BG 16.6). There are two kinds of men: daiva, devatā, and asura. Viṣṇu-bhaktaḥ smṛto daiva āsuras tad-viparyayaḥ (Padma Purāṇa). Those who are devotees of the Lord, they are devatā, and just opposite number is asura.
Who does not recognize the authority of God, he is asura. He himself becomes God foolishly. That is not God. Yasyājñayā bhramati saṁbhṛta-kāla-cakraḥ (BS 5.52). Yac-cakṣur eṣa savitā. This, about the sun, description in the Brahma-saṁhitā. Yac-cakṣur eṣa savitā sakala-grahāṇāṁ rājā samasta-sura-mūrtir aśeṣa-tejāḥ. Aśeṣa-tejāḥ, unlimited potency, energy, heating energy. Such a powerful planet. Yasyājñayā bhramati saṁbhṛta-kāla-cakraḥ. Still it is carrying out the order of somebody. Govindam ādi-puruṣaṁ tam ahaṁ bhajāmi: "I offer my obeisances to Govinda." But if I say I am equal to Govinda, I can stop sun, "Don't bother me by heating. Stop," will it become . . .? Then how I become all-powerful? Let me stop the activities of the sun. Or at night there is no sun, can I ask the sun, "Get up. I want light immediately"? Is it possible? Then how I become the God? Nobody cares for my order.
Mr. Malhotra: They say those who know their Bhāgavata, they call themselves Bhagavān.
Prabhupāda: That anyone can say, that "I know my Bhāgavata." Nobody knows. I am Bhagavān but nobody cares for me. What kind of Bhagavān? It is rascal Bhagavān.
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: When Bhagavān has a toothache he goes to the dentist.
Prabhupāda: Yes, when there's a toothache he goes to the doctor. These kind of nonsense has to be stopped. Otherwise people become atheists. "Anyone can become God, anyone can become Bhagavān."
Mr. Malhotra: This Rajneesh, I tell you, he has . . .
Prabhupāda: I don't say about Rajneesh because I have no acquaintance with him, but anyone says that he is Bhagavān, he can do anything.
Mr. Malhotra: Somebody asked him, "Why you claim to be God, or Bhagavān?" He clarified that "It is not the creator or the equal Bhagavān. I know by . . . I have realized by . . ."
Prabhupāda: But God says "I am the creator of everything." Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate (BG 10.8). This is Bhagavān.
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: We can go, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Prabhupāda: Yes. We will go to the car. (break) (in car) . . . to the sun planet, beginning is the sunshine.
Mr. Malhotra: Yes, beginning is the sunshine.
Prabhupāda: Similarly, to go to the Absolute Truth, you begin with impersonal Brahman. Just as sunshine is impersonal, but everyone can see the sunshine is coming from the sun surface. Everyone knows that. Therefore the sunshine is not so important as the sun globe. Similarly brahma-tattva-nirviśeṣa, nirākāra-brahma is there, but more important than is the localized aspect. Īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe 'rjuna (BG 18.61). God is all-pervading. The sunshine is all-pervading, and as Paramātmā He is also all-pervading. But if you can enter into the sun globe, you will meet with the sun-god. Just like Kṛṣṇa says in Bhagavad-gītā, imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1): "I spoke this philosophy to the sun-god." So there is sun-god. Sun-god and the sun globe and the sunshine, they are one, but different stages of understanding. Similarly, Brahman understanding, Paramātmā understanding, then the Supreme Personality of Godhead understanding. Advaya-jñāna. Brahmeti paramātmeti bhagavān iti śabdyate (SB 1.2.11). But if you stop simply in the sunshine, that means you have no knowledge of the sun-god or the sun globe. If you have simply knowledge of the sun globe, then you are not aware of what is the sun-god. But if you know sun-god, then you know what is sun globe and the sunshine. That is wanted. That is perfect knowledge.
Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). When, after many many births, when one is actually in knowledge, he surrenders to Kṛṣṇa. Vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). When one surrenders to Kṛṣṇa, understanding that Kṛṣṇa is everything, that mahātmā is sudurlabha, very rare. Somebody knows only impersonal Brahman, the jñānīs. Somebody knows the Paramātmā, īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe (BG 18.61). And one who knows Kṛṣṇa, he is perfect. (break) . . . this stage of understanding Kṛṣṇa, your knowledge is imperfect. (break) . . . śāstras, but unfortunately we do not refer to the authority of the śāstras. We manufacture our own way.
Mr. Malhotra: No, actually what has happened is that there has been too many interpretations.
Prabhupāda: There cannot be interpretations.
Mr. Malhotra: No, there are certain people . . .
Prabhupāda: That is foolishness.
Mr. Malhotra: That is what I said, huh. So there are so many interpretations that you get confused. Because of the same thing, some interpret, say, a different way.
Prabhupāda: One thing is that you have to become intelligent. Just like Bhagavad-gītā it is said, dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre samavetā yuyutsavaḥ (BG 1.1). Now why I shall accept interpretation on these plain words? That is my foolishness. If somebody says, "Dharma-kṣetra means this body and Pāṇḍava means the five senses," why this nonsense interpretation? If you are not intelligent, then you will accept such rascals interpreting unnecessarily. Interpretation is required when things are not very clear. But when the things are clear, why you should accept interpretation? That is my foolishness. There is no need of interpretation. (break) . . . is it still there? Why, if the rascal interprets, "Kurukṣetra means this body," why shall I accept it? Kurukṣetra is still there. There is no difficulty to understand. And if somebody interprets . . . (break) . . . interpretation, in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said that as soon as you interpret, the whole thing is lost. So why shall I be so foolish, I shall accept something which is lost?
Mr. Malhotra: No. Rather, Kṛṣṇa had His own interpretation.
Prabhupāda: That may be, but why shall I accept?
Mr. Malhotra: . . . had His own interpretation rather. All the people who share . . .
Prabhupāda: You have, interpretation, you have to refer to the Bhagavad-gītā. Bhagavad-gītā says as soon as you accept interpretation, it is lost.
Mr. Malhotra: Then the meaning is lost.
Prabhupāda: Bās. So under the circumstances . . . That means I am also foolish. Any rascal gives any interpretation—I accept. That is my foolishness. So why should I become foolish? Radhakrishnan may be very big man, but if he does something wrong, he will be hanged.