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Male, his (Kali's) feature black, and dressed like a king. Black means ignorance. And similarly the scene is also blackish

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"Male, his feature black, and dressed like a king. Black means ignorance. And similarly the scene is also blackish"

Conversations and Morning Walks

1967 Conversations and Morning Walks

Male, his feature black, and dressed like a king. Black means ignorance. And similarly the scene is also blackish.

Discourse on Lord Caitanya Play Between Srila Prabhupada and Hayagriva -- April 5-6, 1967, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: The first scene is that people passing on with saṅkīrtana movement as we have, as we usually do, very nice procession with mṛdaṅga, karatālas and that bugle, all people, just in the ordinary way. We have to make a nice procession. The second scene is that Kali, the personified Kali, a person should be decorated blackish. A blackish man with royal dress and very ugly features. And his queen, another ugly featured girl or lady. So they are disturbed. They'll talk between themselves that "There is saṅkīrtana movement now and how we shall prosecute our business of this Kali-yuga?" There will be, in that scene, in some corner somebody is drinking. Two or three persons drinking. The scene will be like that. They are sitting in the center. In one corner somebody taking part in drinking, and another part somebody is illicitly talking of lust and love with woman. In another section there is slaughtering of a cow, and another section gambling. In this way that scene should be adjusted. And in the middle, the ugly man, black man, and the ugly woman will talk that "We are now in danger. The saṅkīrtana movement has been started. What to do?" In this way you have to finish that scene.

Hayagrīva: Now Kali is depicted as a male. As male?

Prabhupāda: As male, yes.

Hayagrīva: Because sometimes I know he's depicted as female.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Male, his feature black, and dressed like a king. Black means ignorance. And similarly the scene is also blackish.

Hayagrīva: Yes.

Prabhupāda: These things should be ascertained(?). Then, it is mentioned there, exhibit illicit sex, slaughterhouse, intoxication, gambling. Then the third scene is very nice. Rāsa dance.

Hayagrīva: Uh... Just before this... I'm not going to make this I don't believe either eastern or western, but I think this can apply for the whole world in the sense that the names may be Indian names, but I think the exhibition of the assembly of Kali and his consort sin and the exhibition of illicit sex and slaughterhouse, this can all be, it can be from western type prototype.

Prabhupāda: That may be. No, why should you... It may be sometimes misunderstood that western people are only under the influence of Kali. Because the world is under the influence of Kali. Not that in your country only this intoxication, illicit sex. No, everywhere it is.

Hayagrīva: I realize that.

Prabhupāda: More or less. More or less.

Hayagrīva: Not only in that scene. My point is that I don't want to make this an Indian play.

Prabhupāda: That you may do. That you may do. I have no objection. But people may not misunderstand that here a scene is depicted simply criticizing the western way. That is my point. Yes.

Hayagrīva: Yes. Now that other person, that other Lord Caitanya... Roy? Who wrote the other Lord Caitanya? That other play?

Prabhupāda: No, nobody...

Hayagrīva: I showed you that other play.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that Dilip Kumar.

Hayagrīva: Yes. That's what I had in mind. I thought it was strictly an Indian type of play.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that was Indian type. Yes, that was Indian type. Or if you like... I have no objection. If you present the characters in European style. But Caitanya Mahāprabhu...

Hayagrīva: No, no. They wouldn't be presented in a western style, but there wouldn't be neither an eastern nor a western flavor.

Prabhupāda: That will be very nice. That will be very nice.

Hayagrīva: In other words, it could be anywhere.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Hayagrīva: The situation could be... Because it's transcendental. It's not here, it's not there.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. No, the Kali is not transcendental. Kali is material.

Hayagrīva: Yes. The earth, the whole world is affected, so it's not just one section.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Not only earth, this earth. It is whole universe.