Prabhupāda: There is a verse in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, etad īśanam īśasya (SB 1.11.38). This is the, what is called, īśanam, means controlling power of Kṛṣṇa, that when He comes in this material world, He is not infected.
Dr. Patel: That is all the Vaiṣṇava ācāryas' teaching.
Prabhupāda: That is īśanam.
Dr. Patel: Even though we see Him as an ordinary physical body or a human body, but that is divya body, and it is not contaminated by any guṇas.
Prabhupāda: And because it is not contaminated, therefore it is not ordinary body. Therefore anyone who thinks of Kṛṣṇa as possessing ordinary body, he is described as mūḍha. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhāḥ mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritāḥ (BG 9.11). In the ordinary human, this material body, nobody can be controller of the laws of nature. That is not possible. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. Unless one has got spiritual body, it is not possible to be unaffected by this material world. Kṛṣṇa never became old, although He lived for 125 years. He never became old. Now, how you can say . . .?
Dr. Patel: He was the controller of māyā, but we are being controlled by the māyā.
Prabhupāda: No, no, anyway, a 125-years-old and looking like a young man of twenty years old, how it is possible in a material body?
Dr. Patel: So all the avatāras of God, they come with a controlling . . .
Prabhupāda: Ātma-māyā.
Dr. Patel: Controlling.
Prabhupāda: Sambhavāmy ātma-māyayā (BG 4.6). They do not come under the control of this mahāmāyā. They have got their own spiritual potency. Āhlādinī-śakti. Ātmanaṁ sṛjāmy aham. Ātmanam: "Myself, I advent." How it can be like ordinary man? We are . . . Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa (SB 3.31.1). We get body. But He says . . .
Dr. Patel: And it is by His own free will.
Prabhupāda: Yes, as He likes. He likes to appear as fish, that's all. Not that . . . ordinary fish, it is forced to take the body of a fish.
Dr. Patel: We are controlled by māyā and its actions . . .
Prabhupāda: Yes.