Prabhupāda: Yes. There is no happiness. (pause) Nobody can remain lazy, because he will be hungry. So how he will remain lazy? He'll have to go somewhere, begging food, and he'll say, "First of all work. Then get your food." He'll work. So there is no question of remaining lazy. Just like the hippies. They do not work, but when they do not get food from anywhere, they go and work. Is it not? So he will be obliged to work.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: That is the incentive, then.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Devotee (2): Some of them steal. Instead of working, they steal their food.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Steal... When he is arrested, then he has to work in the prison. That's all.
Harikeśa: Chopping rocks.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Otherwise whipping. In Bhagavad-gītā it is recommended that instead of keeping yourself lazy without working, better to steal. Better to steal.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: How is that?
Prabhupāda: Huh? That is there. Stealing is bad work, bad work. It is also working, but bad work. So Kṛṣṇa recommends that instead of keeping yourself lazy, better do bad work.
Harikeśa: "Action is better than inaction."
Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Yes.
Harikeśa: A man cannot even keep his own body in shape.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So stealing is still better than keeping oneself lazy.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: "It is better to perform one's duty, even though it may be imperfect, than to perform another's duty"?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. (laughter)
Harikeśa: I've always wondered... The food will be taken care of in a perfect varṇāśrama society; government is taken care of...
Prabhupāda: Government means you, like rascal fools like you. So how you will take care?
Harikeśa: When it is properly set up.
Prabhupāda: First of all you see the government, what is government? Government means a pack of rascals and fools. That's all. This is modern government. All these thieves and rogues are voted to be government men. So how you expect good government? It is not possible. "People's government." All people are rascals. That means government rascal. People's government.
Harikeśa: How would the other necessities of life be taken care of, like medical things? If actually they have no knowledge, and they have to require to build these gigantic hospitals...
Prabhupāda: The brāhmaṇas, the brāhmaṇas will give you medical help. Āyur-Veda. They will read Āyur-Veda. They will give help.
Harikeśa: So the Āyur-Veda possibly can work nowadays.
Prabhupāda: Why not?
Harikeśa: Some people were telling me that the herbs had lost all their effectiveness in the Kali-yuga.
Prabhupāda: Then die. (laughter) Do you mean to say this modern medical treatment is guarantee for your living?
Harikeśa: No.
Prabhupāda: Then? That is also not guarantee. If you see the herbs and plants are no more effective, then if there is no guarantee in your modern medical, there is no guarantee. So why should you spend so much money? As soon as I go to a doctor, immediately twenty dollars. As soon as go to purchase some drugs, immediately twenty. If I have no money... And still that is not guarantee, so why shall I spend so much money?